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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
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    Hot'Lanta... home of the Falcons!

    Poker fans will love this

    http://www.bodog.com/sports-betting/poker.jsp

    -Jason "me love my poker!" Evans

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Goldsboro, NC

    Me too...

    I love me some Texas Hold em'

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Southern Pines, NC
    I didn't see any odds on who would go to the john most often.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
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    Hot'Lanta... home of the Falcons!
    Quote Originally Posted by CMS2478 View Post
    I love me some Texas Hold em'
    I actually perfer hi-low Omaha. Many more possibilities. More stuff to analyze and calculate. It is a better game because you don't find as many people who do not know what they are doing. Play it pot-limit for a really good time

    I find Hold-em to be a strange game when playing with fools. I cannot even tell you how many people there are out there who think A-5 is a good hand in early position at a 10-handed table. It really is a chore sometimes to figure out how to play against the idiots. Of course, once you figure out which ones are fools, you can just torch them-- especially in no-limit or pot-limit, but the totally illogical play of some of them makes it harder for me to enjoy.

    -Jason "I love Hold-em against good players-- that's fun!" Evans

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Hot'Lanta... home of the Falcons!
    Quote Originally Posted by Jarhead View Post
    I didn't see any odds on who would go to the john most often.
    What would be the over-under on how late Phil Helmuth will be... I'd think 90 minutes would be a good over-under for that, but maybe 2 hours is more like it.

    -Jason "I'd like to see more wagering on the 50k H.O.R.S.E. tourney... that's the real championship if you listen to what the pros say" Evans

  6. #6
    The problem with PL Omaha 8 is that it's tough to play conservatively (too many possibilities) and even tougher to calculate the correct odds on the hands (again, too many possibiltiies).

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
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    Hot'Lanta... home of the Falcons!
    Quote Originally Posted by pacificrounder View Post
    The problem with PL Omaha 8 is that it's tough to play conservatively (too many possibilities) and even tougher to calculate the correct odds on the hands (again, too many possibiltiies).
    Exactly, it is more of a "feel" game and less a game for mathematics. I like that.

    -Jason "it does not have the 'thrill' of NL though" Evans

  8. #8
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    Feb 2007
    Quote Originally Posted by JasonEvans View Post
    I find Hold-em to be a strange game when playing with fools. I cannot even tell you how many people there are out there who think A-5 is a good hand in early position at a 10-handed table. It really is a chore sometimes to figure out how to play against the idiots. Of course, once you figure out which ones are fools, you can just torch them-- especially in no-limit or pot-limit, but the totally illogical play of some of them makes it harder for me to enjoy.
    Except on those rare occasions when a guy like Chris Moneymaker just gets on a super lucky run. He was never a solid champion (unlike a guy like Greg Raymer who does know his stuff), and got so lucky playing crappy hands that it's not even funny. This is why he's never made a sound in the tournament since then.

    Gary

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Hot'Lanta... home of the Falcons!
    Quote Originally Posted by Gary View Post
    Except on those rare occasions when a guy like Chris Moneymaker just gets on a super lucky run. He was never a solid champion (unlike a guy like Greg Raymer who does know his stuff), and got so lucky playing crappy hands that it's not even funny. This is why he's never made a sound in the tournament since then.

    Gary
    Of the "unknowns" to win the main event in recent years, the best is not Raymer but Hachem. He's a great player and really made a lot of noise at the Series this past year. David Williams is also a very good player (the guy who lost to Raymer).

    I am of the belief, after watching Jamie Gold, that he will be a lot more like Moneymake than Hachem/Raymer.

    -Jason "Jamie Gold made some of the worst calls/bets ever at the Series final table-- his luck was absurd" Evans

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    New York City
    Quote Originally Posted by JasonEvans View Post
    Of the "unknowns" to win the main event in recent years, the best is not Raymer but Hachem. He's a great player and really made a lot of noise at the Series this past year. David Williams is also a very good player (the guy who lost to Raymer).

    I am of the belief, after watching Jamie Gold, that he will be a lot more like Moneymake than Hachem/Raymer.

    -Jason "Jamie Gold made some of the worst calls/bets ever at the Series final table-- his luck was absurd" Evans
    I disagree with a couple of things there. First, Gold did have fantastic luck but from what I saw he played outstanding big stack tournament poker. He consistently put pressure on other players and created opportunities to knock out other players. I know we only see bits and pieces, but from what I saw and read about the final 3 tables, I think he played very well with the chip position he had - but he did have a great run of cards as well. You HAVE to be lucky to win that tournament - the fact that a guy like Moneymaker could win in a 2000 person field is the best proof of that.

    Also, I have watched many hours of Jamie Gold playing high stakes poker on the game show network. If you like no limit hold 'em poker, this is by far the best poker show out there. It is not only entertaining but it is like getting a crash course on how to play cash no limit poker from the best players in the world.

    The players are playing with their own money and typically cash in for anywhere from $100,000 to $1,000,000. The blinds are $300 / $600 and there have been some monstrous pots (several hundred thousand dollars) and some very sick hands. Two of note: Barry Greenstein had AA against Sammy Farha's KK. There was a bet a raise by Greenstein, an all in by Farha and a call by Greenstein. The pot was over $350,000 and a K hit on the flop giving Farha a set.

    Another one involved Daniel Negreneau and Gus Hansen. Negreaneau raised with 66 and Hansen called with 55. The flop came 569. Negreneau bet and Hansen raised. Negreneau called. The turn was a 5 giving Hansen quads and Negreneau a boat. They both checked. The river was a blank and Hansen went all in. Negreneau called and lost about a $600,000 pot. He had cashed in for $1M and at one point was down over $700,000.

    Secondly, I disagree about Raymer and Hachem. I think Hachem is a very solid player and I like his game but I think Raymer has proven himself to be one of the best tourney players in the world. The year after winning he came in around 30th and only got busted because a guy made a very stupid call on a flush draw (after the turn) and sucked out by hitting his flush on the river.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Wow, you read my mind Mr. Synellinden. I was just about to come back with the same comments about Raymer vs. Hachem. While I think the Aussie is a very solid player, I believe Raymer is just a tad better. He did follow up his championship with another solid run and should have advanced even further than his 30 or so position. But we all agree Moneymaker was truly the luckiest of the lucky within the last 5 or so years. He had no business being at the final table, much less beating the savvy Farha.

    Gary

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Baltimore
    Moneymaker got very lucky, no doubt, but not half as lucky as Robert (Queen-Ten is the best hand ever and I can never lay it down wow did I just flop another boat) Varkoni. And I also agree that while Hachem is a very good player, in my opinion what Raymer did in the main event 2 consecutive years was incredible.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
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    Hot'Lanta... home of the Falcons!
    You guys are aware that Hachem, after winning his bracelet in 2006, has since won a WPT event (the Five Diamonds Classic-- $2.1 million first prize), came in 5th at a Series circuit event, and then at the Series this past year he made 2 more final tables (coming in 2nd and 4th-- both in NLH events) before making a nice run and cashing as he tried to defend his title in the Championship.

    Since winning 7.5 million in the 2005 Championship, Hachem has won another 2.5 million+ in other events in the past year and a half.

    By comparison, since winning his 5 million dollars in the 2004 Championship, Raymer has "only" collected another 700-grand in other tournament winnings.

    Hachem - 2.5 million in 1 year vs. Raymer's $700k in 2 years.

    Are you guys still sold on Raymer being the better player?

    -Jason "a lively poker discussion... I am in heaven!!" Evans

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Hot'Lanta... home of the Falcons!
    As an aside, I played in my monthly game last night and again cleaned up at Omaha 8. I was having a pretty bad night (down about $30-- we play small stakes in this game... buy-in is just $20 and bet limit is $1 on most games, sometimes $2) taking beatings at "silly" games like 7-27. I also got killed because I went "hi-low" twice in 7-card stud and won the high but lost the low each time meaning I got nada!! That hurt.

    Anyway, by the time we got done with an hour or so of Omaha, I had not only won back my $30, but I was up another $30... sure it is chump change but it was fun.

    -Jason "loving me some Omaha!" Evans

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Baltimore
    Quoting wikipedia:

    "In 2005 Raymer also entered the inaugural British Poker Open which was filmed in London and was the UK's biggest live poker event in history. As a firm favourite Raymer made the final table to come 3rd in a live final and collect around 20,000."


    "In March 2006, Raymer (as "Fossilman") took 2nd place in the first quarterly $1,000,000 guaranteed tournament on PokerStars, winning over $180,000 in a field of over 1500 tournament players."


    "Aside from the World Series, Raymer plays few tournaments, choosing to spend time with his wife Cheryl and daughter Sophie instead of immersing himself in the poker circuit and the constant travel it requires."

    I think Raymer has done better in the "big events". No knock on Hachem, who is without a doubt a very good player. I just think Raymer is better (Or maybe they're tied and I'm annoyed with the whole Aussie Aussie Aussie Oy Oy Oy cheer).

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Quote Originally Posted by toughbuff1 View Post

    I think Raymer has done better in the "big events". No knock on Hachem, who is without a doubt a very good player. I just think Raymer is better (Or maybe they're tied and I'm annoyed with the whole Aussie Aussie Aussie Oy Oy Oy cheer).
    Again, I have to agree with every word in this paragraph. I'd put the two players on a close to equal basis, giving Raymer a slight edge. And like tough, I too may be basing my impressions on the fact that I'm tired of the cheer. I'll own up to the fact that I also prefer Greg's demeanor to Joseph's. Not that Hachem is in any way a bad guy (that's reserved for Matusow, who I truly despise), but I just prefer the image and complete class that Greg plays with.

    Gary

  17. #17
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    Feb 2007
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gary View Post
    I'll own up to the fact that I also prefer Greg's demeanor to Joseph's. Not that Hachem is in any way a bad guy (that's reserved for Matusow, who I truly despise), but I just prefer the image and complete class that Greg plays with.
    No argument there. Hachem can be a bully at the table (from what I have seen on TV, obviously, I've never played with him). He is famous, he has money, and he certainly has a rep as a great player-- and he uses all that to his advantage as much as he can. I am not sure any of us can blame him for taking advantage of this, but there are other guys who DO NOT act this way... and Raymer is among the best in this regard.

    -Jason "the Series began today... $5000 mix P/NL hold'em... I REALLY, REALLY, REALLY, REALLY wish I was there!!" Evans

  18. #18
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Baltimore
    I found a really good poker blog a couple of years ago while trying to keep updated on the WSOP.

    www.taopoker.blogspot.com

    The guy who writes for it, Dr. Pauly, is quite a character. The bloggers aren't allowed to do live updates anymore, but its still a pretty entertaining read about the behind the scenes stuff that goes on. If you want live updates, I think they are running them at Pokernews this year, not cardplayer.

  19. #19
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Hot'Lanta... home of the Falcons!
    Worldseriesofpoker.com is also doing live updates. Cardplayer.com has some, but they are not as up-to-date as usual. Cardplayer.com is also doing some professional playter blogs where the pros post comments on their hands and what is going on at their tables during breaks in the action. It is sorta interesting.

    The event I am really watching right now is the $5000 (w/rebuys) Pot-Limit Omaha 8 tournament. Because the rebuys/add-ons make this such an expensive tournament to enter (most players have rebought to the tune of at least $25k) it is mostly only being played by the elite pros and really rich amateurs. As a result, you have situations like Doyle and Todd Brunson playing at the same table together and a table that featured Daniel Negreanu, Eric Lindgren, John D'Agostino, Toto Leonidas, and Andrew Black... damn!!I'd love to sit at that table but I think my money would be gone FAST!

    Here is the leaderboard: http://www.worldseriesofpoker.com/to...34&groupID=309

    Also of note, the final table of the mixed Omaha/7-stud Hi-Lo event is set and it features a few of the best known names in the game. Annie Duke is 2nd in chips and Chris "Jesus" Ferguson is 3rd. David Benyamine is 5th. It would be great to see Annie win her 2nd bracelet or Jesus take his first bracelet since 2003.

    -Jason "I really, really, really wish I was in Vegas right now!" Evans
    Last edited by JasonEvans; 06-05-2007 at 01:25 PM.

  20. #20
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    New York City
    Wow -- the players on that chip count list are a who's who of poker. John Juanda with a chip lead is in great position in a pot limit event. But I also like Andy Black and Johnny Chan has a shot at an 11th and record bracelet.

    Although I hate his antics, Humberto Brenes seems to be in the mix in a lot of tourneys.

    The names of the players who have busted out is even more impressive - Hellmuth, Cunningham, Lederer, Vos, Mizrachi.

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