Lost: Ben's Flashback Episode

[JasonEvans]

Worth a read: http://www.beggingtodiffer.com/2007/...nd-the-curtain

[dukeblueyes]

-If the smoke monster summons you, that might explain why Juliet was so freaked out by it when she was handcuffed to Kate.
-Maybe the gunpowder was a fence to keep Jacob *IN* and he is trapped, hence the "Help me"... I'm thinking "Field of Dreams" style, something happens to him when he steps over the line?
-Remember how Danielle said the people in her party got sick something like 17 years ago? Maybe that was the same time the hostiles gassed the Dharma hippies?

[JasonEvans]

-Remember how Danielle said the people in her party got sick something like 17 years ago? Maybe that was the same time the hostiles gassed the Dharma hippies?

I dunno-- remember when Ben first arrives on the island, he sees everyone being given some kind of shot/innoculation. Clearly there is some "sickness" that the Dharma folks were worried about and that Rousseau thinks drove some of her people crazy. It is a story-line that has mostly been ignored but it has cropped up enough so that I am sure it will someday be explained.

-Jason "Rousseau is going to be part of the Lostaways battle with The Others-- I think" Evans

[JasonEvans]

Another image of Jacob:



-Jason "I am thinking more and more that Ben is somehow keeping Jacob a prisoner with the gunpowder/ash/whatever that is surrounding Jacob's shack" Evans

[dcarp23]

I think people are looking too much into Richard not aging. Maybe there is something there, but my guess is they simply wanted to use the same actor as a younger man and a more middle aged man (see Locke, who is ridiculous looking as a "young man"). When Ben met him, he could easily have been 14 and Richard, judging by his clothing and harircut, could have been 21. Now, Ben could be 35 and Richard 42, which isn't that unrealistic. The question vis-a-vis these guys is how Ben became the leader of this crew.

My other question is why Ben took Locke to see Jacob in the first place? Obviously, it's a television show and plot devices are necessary, but I don't see his rationale in doing so.

[Jfrosh]

I got a definite "Psycho" vibe from the scene in the cabin with Locke, Ben, and maybe Jacob. I was ready for Ben to start calling the invisible person in the chair "Mother." Definitely creepy.
This was my favorite episode probably of any show ever.
I think Jason's right, the last scene of this season will be a healing Locke looking up out of the pit saying "Jacob, I presume."

[BlueDiablo]

Worth a read: http://www.beggingtodiffer.com/2007/...nd-the-curtain

Thanks, Jason.

[JasonEvans]

Get ready for it...

The hot theory is that Jacob is Locke.



Ok, maybe Jacob is not actually Locke, but perhaps Jacob is Locke from some alternate timeline? Or maybe Jacob is Locke's brother (his "Bad Twin" if you will)? The other hot theory is that Jacob is the captain of the Black Rock who has never died (Richard would be one of the shipmates from the Black Rock under this theory) and that he is one of Locke's ancestors.

It is interesting that whoever Jacob is, he is pretty clearly partially or fully bald and has a forehead that is pretty darn similar to Locke's.

--Jason "is it possible that Locke could not see Jacob because they are the same person?" Evans

[Son of Jarhead]

Looks alot like Locke with a beard and hair

That's exactly what I thought when I first saw the picture. I've tried thinking how that would work, if Jacob is Locke, but I can't get anything to make sense, so I'll spare everyone my nonsense.

I think Locke will definately be rising from the grave. Seeing him in the mass grave reminded me about his comment to Paulo: "Things on this island never stay buried long", or something like that. Who would of thought anything from that episode might prove to foreshadow future events, but if Locke lives on, well... I guess on the island, nothing is trivial or unimportant.

Is anybody ever truly dead on the island? The whispering could be people who are supposed to be dead, but are trapped. Maybe Jacob, too, but Ben has confined him even more with that mystery powder.

What happened to Ben's girl, Annie? Did he gas her, too? Will we see her again? They never showed her body.

Roger seemed to age on the island (& Ben certainly did), but Goodspeed didn't seem any older when they showed him dead on a park bench. Do some people age, while others do not?

Is it Wednesday yet?

[JasonEvans]

This next post is going to contain some speculation that some folks might consider to be spoilers, so I am going to put it all in hidden text. This is not something that I have heard from a source or any inside info, it is just speculation that I have based upon looking at some pictures from the preview for next week's episode.

I don't think anyone would consider this sleuthing to be some huge spoiler. It is a plot point that I think most see coming anyway. Still, I'll hide it as best I can.

Ok, here is the spoiler: I think Charlie is toast. I know, hardly a surprise, but here is my evidence.

Have a look at this picture: http://bp3.blogger.com/_RrObyQ3XzcY/...s1600-h/07.jpg

It is a picture from the previews for next week. That would appear to be Charlie's funky "DS" ring laying in Aaron's crib. I think Desmond tells Charlie that the time has come for Charlie to die and Charlie accepts it. Charlie then makes a list of all the things he has enjoyed about his life (shown here: http://bp3.blogger.com/_RrObyQ3XzcY/...guidemay07.jpg), then he gives away his ring to Aaron and kisses Clarie goodbye http://bp1.blogger.com/_RrObyQ3XzcY/...s1600-h/05.jpg and then he goes off on his mission that will result in his death.


Like I said, not a huge spoiler but that is a lot of evidence in my mind.

--Jason "when will the show get back to Locke? I fear we may not see him again this season" Evans

[Exiled_Devil]

--Jason "when will the show get back to Locke? I fear we may not see him again this season" Evans

Unfortunately, I think that this is the most likely prediction anyone has made yet. They made us wait for Locke's fate at the beginning of the season, and again at the end his fate will be in question.

Couching the rest in my personal belief that I can't theorize worth crap regarding television plots, here are thoughts I have had:

Locke's not dead, that scene is Schmuckbait.

I am in the school of 'Jacob uses the smoke monster to communicate/control things'

I rented a room from a guy who was on a Native American shamanic path, and when I was there he did a ceremony to guard the house from unwanted influences. In the ceremony he poured a ring of powder around the house and yard. I was reminded of that when I saw the powder on the trip to Jacob's house.

I wonder if there is some sort of valuable resource on the island that enables them to have so much access and capability off the island. Or does the 'magic box of whatever you want' have power that extends to the mainland? That would explain Juliette's ex-husband getting the bus.

I think that Mikhial, the communication building and the 'quarantine' are components that can build a decent argument for why Dharma is still supplying the island - some of us survived, but the disease is still around. Send food but stay off the island. It's not bombproof, but it is viable.

The Hostiles were apparently the reason for the fence...but I don't buy it. I don't know why, but I think the fence is still for something more significant.


Tonights episode seems to me to be evidence that the 'Others' have always been part of the overall story. These people are essential to unravelling the mystery of the island. Speaking of, here are the outstanding mysteries as far as I can tell:

Who is Jacob?
What caused the quarantine? Was it ever real?
What about the Dharma initiative agendas: the six research streams ( I can't find them online anymore)
Pregnant ladies? What does that have to do with everything?
Does Rich Alpert have four toes?
Giant foot?
Where are Micheal and Walt?
What year is it, really?
How does Desmond see the future?
How did the plane crash?
Rousseau's story is still a mystery.
What about the old couple - wife with cured cancer - are they going to do anything more? Or even be seen?
Penny's ordeal
Hanso? What does he have to do with all this?
Mittelwerk? What does he have to do with all this?
Smoke monster?

As I made that list, I realized that they have given answers to a lot of questions, but almost none with clarity.

I am really looking forward to reviewing old seasons in order to catch hints forward and back.

Exiled

[A-Tex Devil]

Another theory to think about --- the ashes/gunpowder, whatever around Jacob's cabin was Smokey at rest.

[JasonEvans]

Yes, I am crazy...

I watched a few key scenes over again tonight... often with my TIVO set on slo-mo to catch everything I could. Among the stuff I saw...

- When teen-aged Ben first encounters Richard in the woods, Richard's clothes are not just dirty, they are ancient clothing. The buttons do not look machine made. The stiches are large and obvious. They appear to be clothes made hundreds of years ago, like the kind of thing a sailor in the 1800s would have worn. Yes, I am probably just looking for some more proof for my "Richard is a member of the Black Rock crew" theory, but this really stuck out to me.

- Strangely, when Richard meets Ben again at the Dharma camp some years later after the gassing, Richard is now wearing a modern watch and somewhat more modern looking clothes. Other member of The Others appear more modernly dressed at this point too. For some reason Richard is no longer unshaven and unlempt-- his hair is recently cut and neat and he appears to have showered that morning. I have not figured this part of it out yet.

- When Ben is giving his final speech to Locke before shooting Locke into the mass grave, Ben says, "I was one of the people smart enough to make sure I did not to end up in that ditch." He is talking about members of the Dharma group here and is clearly talking in the plural. There are other Dharma people who survived the purge, I am convinced.

- When Locke is startled by Jacob coming to life, the lantern Ben carried into the room is thrown to the floor and it breaks. A fire bursts out on the floor and beings to spread. Suddenly, the fire is gone, as if by magic. Also, when Ben walks out of the shack after Locke has fled, Ben is carrying the lantern. It is no longer broken.

I'll watch it some more in coming days to see what else I notice.

-Jason "I am eager for a Richad flashback episode-- which probably comes a loong time from now, maybe not until the final season" Evans

[OZZIE4DUKE]

That's exactly what I thought when I first saw the picture. I've tried thinking how that would work, if Jacob is Locke, but I can't get anything to make sense, so I'll spare everyone my nonsense.

Both James T. Kirk and William Riker were split into two people in transporter accidents, and in Riker's case it wasn't discovered until years after it happenned, almost like a parallel universe thing. Would it really surprise anyone for Dahrma/the island to have a transporter? I think not...

[BCGroup]

http://losteastereggs.blogspot.com/

[johnb]

Annie is critical to Ben, and they didn't show her in the purge. To my mind, they have to show her later, at least in terms of a flashback. Given his preoccupation with women who die in childbirth, the frequency of recurring motifs, her maternalism, and his doll playing, my bet is on her having died in childbirth on the island, perhaps even before the purge, which might make for some sort of explanation that would make him less of a Charles Manson figure. It would take some heavy lifting to make him somewhat heroic, but, if it can happen anywhere...

[Dukerati]

I agree with John that Annie is critical. My first thought after watching the show was that Ben gassed the Dharma Initiative in part due to some traumatic event with Annie. As the only person (so far) who has shown Ben any kindness, she would appear to be the most important person in his life. I can't wait for the flashback episode when we find out what happened with her! (Hmm, Ben's mom died seven months into her pregnancy, isn't that when pregnant women die on the island? Coincidence? I think not...)

I also subscribe to the theory that Jacob is trapped in the house by Ben. It would explain why Ben is upset that Locke can hear Jacob (he poses a threat) and also how Ben got to be above Richard on the totem pole (controlling others by keeping captive their leader). As for the deference and fear that Ben showed towards Jacob, could that all be a ruse?

[Jarhead]

I liked the fact that they closed the loop on the VW van with the skeleton. Ben left his dead father in it only to be found untouched years (?) later by Hurley for his historic joyride down the hill. Who would've thunk at the time that that was Ben's father!

Deserves repeating. These guys (the producers) are good.

[365Duke]

[QUOTE=Dukerati;20372]I agree with John that Annie is critical. My first thought after watching the show was that Ben gassed the Dharma Initiative in part due to some traumatic event with Annie. As the only person (so far) who has shown Ben any kindness, she would appear to be the most important person in his life. I can't wait for the flashback episode when we find out what happened with her! (Hmm, Ben's mom died seven months into her pregnancy, isn't that when pregnant women die on the island? Coincidence? I think not...)


I think that Julie said that no one has made it to their 3rd trimester, that some made it to the middle of their 2nd. Would the 7th month not be in the 3rd? Good theory though