Hope Andre gets back into the flow of things...

[Lord Ash]

I've been a bit disappointed that Andre Dawkins has really not gotten much playing time recently, or played well when he did. I never really expected him to get many minutes against a pressing team like Clemson given that he is not the strongest dribbler or defender, and is a freshman, but still, I'd love to see him get back into the flow of things; I really did expect him to contribute this year, and I think we, as a team, would be better if he did get back to his early-season offensive form.

Does anyone with any real information know what is going on with Andre's situation? Has there been any media stories about him of late?

[moonpie23]

what ash said...


i think it will be only a matter of setting him up for some good plays to get his shooting back. that said, i think his D needs a LOT of work and hopefully, he can get some minutes to work on that in non-critical stretches.

[RelativeWays]

He got decent PT against WF, but he also twisted his ankle in that game. My guess is that limited his effectiveness the past two games. He's going through a slump like a lot of shooters do. Coupled by the fact that he's an inexperienced freshmen means he's getting some limited minutes.

Consider this before you guys fear that he or Kelly will transfer. They get time in about EVERY game, if he did not trust them or think they could play at all, they'd never sniff the court. I think he sees the talent in both guys, they just need some experience. I think they'll both be great players for Duke and I don't think either will leave.

[BlueintheFace]

The problem is that he is our least effective scoring threat on the team. He only has value on the offensive end when he is open for three on a broken play or running the break. He is not a good ball handler and so he cannot create his own shot. Additionally, there are the defensive issues.

I too hope he can get back in the flow of things, but I do not have a lot of hope.

[PhillyDuke]

The problem is that he is our least effective scoring threat on the team. He only has value on the offensive end when he is open for three on a broken play or running the break. He is not a good ball handler and so he cannot create his own shot. Additionally, there are the defensive issues.

I too hope he can get back in the flow of things, but I do not have a lot of hope.

What makes you think "he's not a good ball handler"? Rather the sets we run restrict him to cruising around the 3-point line looking for jump shots all the time. In HS and AAU he used to take people to the hoop. I think he can contribute more than we're currently getting from him. He needs to play a lot, so that when the tournament begins he'll be "seasoned"; instead of looking like a deer caught in headlights when he gets in the game. The same can be said for Kelly and Mason.

[BlueintheFace]

What makes you think "he's not a good ball handler"?

He looks about as comfortable dribbling the ball up the floor as Zoubek on the few occasions he has done so. Additionally, when he receives the ball on the perimeter, he does the traditional big-man "take two dribbles and pick up the ball to hand off to a guard" move. Just callin it like I see it.

[roywhite]

What makes you think "he's not a good ball handler"? Rather the sets we run restrict him to cruising around the 3-point line looking for jump shots all the time. In HS and AAU he used to take people to the hoop. I think he can contribute more than we're currently getting from him. He needs to play a lot, so that when the tournament begins he'll be "seasoned"; instead of looking like a deer caught in headlights when he gets in the game. The same can be said for Kelly and Mason.

I've watched Andre play this year, and wouldn't say he's a good ballhandler for a college guard at this point. He also tweaked his ankle recently and lost some time due to the death of his sister.

Hope Andre is working hard; he'll get his chances. Remember that Elliot Williams made progress in practice and started playing a lot in February last year.

[chadlee989]

I really hope that Dre gets it together and averages around 15 mins a game come tourny time. He has been through a lot this year with all that has happen to him. It would be really nice to see him bounce back and become the player that we think he can. Plus i think we really need him to get going and give are big three a break in mins and points.

[-bdbd]

It's the old argument re playing our bench depth.

I think the team as a whole will be better in the end if we play more players in the rotation. Last night we had 4 guys play 35+ minutes (incl two at 40!). Only three bench players saw action, and none more than 14 minutes. Dawkins got 0. I get the argument - I really do - that in close games you want your "best 5" on the floor, but how much real negative impact is there from resting Scheyer for a couple minutes, letting Smith be the primary ball handler, and letting Dawkins, or Mason, have some more time on the floor? Obviously you don't have your best player on the floor those few minutes, but how much of a drop is it really -- Dawkins in his first 3 minutes of action vs Jon playing 37th - 40th minutes? And in that NCAA game in March when Scheyer gets into serious foul trouble, I'd really like Dawkins and Mason and Ryan to have the experience to be effective. Ho-hum. I know, an old argument, but I think these guys are good enough to play, and we WILL need them at some point. I too have been noticing/concerned the Dawekins drop in time at a supposedly already thin position.




Duke Blue Devils
Player POS MIN FGM-A 3GM-A FTM-A O D T AST PF ST TO BS PTS
Kyle Singler F 40 5-12 1-3 1-2 2 0 2 1 0 2 5 0 12
Miles Plumlee F 23 1-3 0-0 0-0 1 7 8 0 0 0 0 0 2
Lance Thomas F 35 5-9 0-0 3-3 1 6 7 1 0 1 1 0 13
Nolan Smith G 37 8-13 2-4 4-4 1 2 3 2 0 2 0 1 22
Jon Scheyer G 40 5-13 1-5 0-0 0 3 3 3 0 1 3 0 11
Mason Plumlee 8 0-0 0-0 0-0 0 0 0 0 0 1 2 1 0
Ryan Kelly 3 0-1 0-1 0-0 0 0 0 1 0 0 0 0 0
Brian Zoubek 14 0-1 0-0 0-2 1 1 2 1 0 1 1 1 0
Total 200 24-52 4-13 8-11 10 22 32 9 14 8 13 3 60
Percentage 46.2% 30.8% 72.7% Team Rebounds: 7

[scottdude8]

I'm pretty sure that this is more of an injury problem, and not another issue. At the NC State game, there was one possession mid-way through the first half, when the Wolfpack were really getting aggressive with their press, that Andre turned the ball over by going out of bounds under our own basket, but in doing that he seemed to go down very awkwardly... he immediately limped over to the sideline and was replaced. Now he did come back and play in the 2nd half, but he was moving very deliberately and certainly didn't seem like himself. I'm betting that his injury was a little more than it seemed, and K didn't want to exacerbate it, especially in such a hostile environment. I just don't see a reason why (besides injury) he would go from 12, 17, 12 and 9 minutes in the last four games to not getting off the bench.

[mehmattski]

Like Eliot Williams and Taylor King before him, I'm certain that Dawkins lack of playing time and hope of increasing said PT is related to one thing only:

Defense.

Coach K is simply not going to play someone, especially a freshman, if he does not believe the player shows what it takes on the defensive side of the ball. Hopefully it will "click" for him in practice the way it did for E-Will last year, and Dre will be back on the floor soon!

[Tim1515]

This was a terrible matchup for Andre. He isn't a great ballhandler that we know of...but add the fact that we're on the road AND against a team with the best press in the ACC.

Duke used 4 players to beat the Clemson press...2 seniors and 2 juniors. All 4 played a big role. If Andre is is, Clemson would force the ball into his hands and try to turn him over. That is a lot to expect from a freshman.

If Andre came in for the 5th player who wasn't involved in the press then we would have Jon, Nolan, Kyle, Andre and either LT and Mason in the game making us extremely small.

I hope Dawk gets more time...this game did not shock me and it could've made the different in Duke winning or not. the 13 to 9 point lead never felt comfortable to me and 1 or 2 bad turnovers from Andre couldn't not only hurt his confidence but it could've completely changed the game.

[dukebballcamper90-91]

I'm sick of this playing matchup stuff. It ain't like we going against a south paw on the mound. Put the kid and let him get comfortable or he will be doing it for another team just like King and EWill, and both of them are playing very well for their teams.

[ChicagoCrazy84]

I'm sick of this playing matchup stuff. It ain't like we going against a south paw on the mound. Put the kid and let him get comfortable or he will be doing it for another team just like King and EWill, and both of them are playing very well for their teams.

I kind of agree. Andre didn't necessarily have to be breaking the press if he was in. Besides, the way we were getting past the press yesterday was by our LACK of dribbling and just methodically passing the ball into the offenisve zone. Heck, Clemson was probably wishing someone would dribble too much because they like to trap. Coach K needs to make time for Andre Dawkins. The kid wasn't a 5 star recruit for nothing. Make him run wind sprints and agility drills in the defensive stance and boom, you got yourself a defender. A BIG part of being a good defender (for a guard) is being in great shape and just being relentless. I'm guessing he is still getting in shape to play in an ACC backcourt. But until then, give him 10 minutes, run some plays for him and let him do his thing. He is more polished offensively than EWill was and that should earn him ~5 shots a game and >10 minutes.

[MChambers]

I'm sick of this playing matchup stuff. It ain't like we going against a south paw on the mound. Put the kid and let him get comfortable or he will be doing it for another team just like King and EWill, and both of them are playing very well for their teams.

Do you realize that Dawkins has a bad ankle, as several folks have pointed out in this thread?

And that through a week ago he had played in about 41% of Duke's minutes, more than Leslie McDonald or Dexter Strickland at UNC?

Or that Elliot Williams transferred to be closer to his ill mother?

Or that King got the message after he left Duke and got in shape?

[roywhite]

I'm sick of this playing matchup stuff. It ain't like we going against a south paw on the mound. Put the kid and let him get comfortable or he will be doing it for another team just like King and EWill, and both of them are playing very well for their teams.

Hmmm...where to start?

1. We don't know for sure why Andre didn't play at all yesterday? Could be injury related
2. If he was available, we have to assume the coaches didn't believe he could perform better than the players on the court, or didn't deserve the time.
3. This was a very important game for Duke to win. I'm not a believer that we should voluntarily reduce our chances to win such a game by playing for the future development of one or more players.
4. The reason Elliot Williams left related to his family situation and not unhappiness at Duke.
5. Taylor King was not a good fit at Duke, and decided to go elsewhere; such things happen, and I wish him well.

The playing time argument is a regular feature here, but I believe the coaches are handling Andre's development well.

[Devilsfan]

Hope he gets into the flow of things but he looked lost out there against state. That said I think he and Mason are the two freshmen that look like they could turn into effective D-1 ACC players the quickest. Kelly is a very good passer, imo, but at 6'10" has a frail looking body for the physical ACC play (compared to Booker, Smith etc.). Maybe a couple of months in the weight room with our strength coaches will do him wonders. He and Mason were rated similar coming out of high school but there seems to be a world of difference in their play at this time at this level. Again they're freshmen so a year or two should also help.

[scottdude8]

Again guys I really wouldn't freak out too much about this. Yes Andre hasn't played as much as many would like, but I am confident that yesterday was (much) more about a nagging injury and the environment in Littlejohn than anything else.

[Mcluhan]

Last night's game strikes me as unique in that beating a well-oiled full-court press on an opponent's home court was the number one priority, the pre-requisite to anything else we needed to do. If healthy, I would put Dawkins' DNP down to a very specific strategic issue, kind of like how Zoubs' size simply doesn't work in certain types of games.

Even if you've successfully beat the press all game long, the potential for sudden panic is great. And this game was closer than the final score indicated.

There are games when I support bringing guys in to remind our them of what's demanded of them in real games-- a high-level of defensive awareness and intelligence, and the art of playing tough without fouling-- but I'm not sure this was that game.

[RoyalBlue08]

With the talent we got, nobody should have to play 30+ and be tired as crap come sweet 16. We don't use our bench enough during the season. Dawkins and Kelly both look at the scores' table every time the horn sounds, even if they ain't in the game, use to it I guess.

You realize that if we are playing in a sweet 16 game, we have had anywhere from 3-5 days off before hand, right? Do you really think that minutes played in January are going to effect a 20 year olds tiredness at the end of March? Have you ever decided you were too tired to exercise because you went hard two months ago? I am so tired of hearing this argument stated like a fact with nothing to support it other than personal opinion.