Heisman

[A-Tex Devil]

Since all the other college football threads are on topic, I assume this is.

Bradford winning is a joke. Any other year, I understand his stats are overwhelming, but consider he was a little over half of OU's total offense and Colt and Tebow were well over 60% (Colt was 70%), plus UT burying him in the turf, and I give up on the national media. I could throw for 3000 yards with those OU's offensive weapons. Stats and hot teams is all that matters for trophy that no longer matters. Seriously. Other than Tebow last year (who had a uniquely excellent season), every winner from the last 8 or 9 years played in the BCS championship and has not necessarily been the best player (or close... Reggie Bush). Every Heisman voter should have to write a 500 word essay explaining their vote. Otherwise, I assume they are sheep, following the press and the stats. Take their vote away.

OU gets over on UT twice this year for nothing more than good timing. Stupid land thieves. At least at the end of the day, they have to live in Oklahoma. Anyway, rant over....

[devilboomer]

Since all the other college football threads are on topic, I assume this is.

Bradford winning is a joke. Any other year, I understand his stats are overwhelming, but consider he was a little over half of OU's total offense and Colt and Tebow were well over 60% (Colt was 70%), plus UT burying him in the turf, and I give up on the national media. I could throw for 3000 yards with those OU's offensive weapons. Stats and hot teams is all that matters for trophy that no longer matters. Seriously. Other than Tebow last year (who had a uniquely excellent season), every winner from the last 8 or 9 years played in the BCS championship and has not necessarily been the best player (or close... Reggie Bush). Every Heisman voter should have to write a 500 word essay explaining their vote. Otherwise, I assume they are sheep, following the press and the stats. Take their vote away.

OU gets over on UT twice this year for nothing more than good timing. Stupid land thieves. At least at the end of the day, they have to live in Oklahoma. Anyway, rant over....

Disclaimer: self professed OU fan.

UT buried Bradford in the turf? Really?

Sam Bradford threw for 387 yds and 5 TDs against Texas, in a game where OU's running game was non-existent. OU may have lost the game, but it certainly wasn't a result of Bradford's play.

I wouldn't have been surprised if either of the 3 candidates won the trophy. All were deserving. To be honest, I would have voted for Colt, Bradford, then Crabtree, in that order. But to state that Bradford winning is a joke is a bit too much. Perhaps Billy Simms yelling "boomer" incessantly was a joke, but Bradford was not.

A lot of Heisman voters actually do explain their votes in their media outlets. David Mayo explained his vote for Bradford 1 and Tebow 2:

"Oklahoma's 45-35 loss to Texas was a study in frayed defensive, special-teams and rushing performances. The Longhorns scored on six of 10 drives, not including the one when all they needed was a kickoff return.

The Sooners were held to 48 rushing yards, their second-worst total of the year (TCU held them to 25), which put the entire game on Bradford, who threw for all five touchdowns, along with two interceptions. One interception led to a Texas field goal. The other came on the last play of a decided game.

The difference, to me, is that Tebow had a chance to alter the Mississippi outcome and didn't, while Bradford gave his teammates every opportunity to alter the Texas outcome and they didn't.

That may sound like nit-picking, but we're trying to decide a slice of Americana here."

[dukemomLA]

I agree with the poster. The Heisman Trophy this year... and maybe a few more in this decade have become a joke... and a media hype. Bah Humbug. Does anyone care anymore? Quarterbacks every year? Again, bah humbug.

[miramar]

Since the Big XII chose OU over UT, Bradford had a big advantage over McCoy (as long as Oklahoma won the title game of course). If the Big XII had chosen based on the head-to-head matchup that UT won, then McCoy would have likely been the winner.

So in a sense the computer decided the Heisman this year.

You could also argue that McCoy hurt himself by scoring the go-ahead TD against Texas Tech too quickly, which gave them about a minute and a half to win the game (which they did with one second left). So ironically Colt could have won the Heisman as the only QB of an undefeated team if he had been a little less efficient.

[RelativeWays]

I'm glad Tebow lost, he's the Tyler Hansbrough of college football ("oh what effort, what heart, he's the greatest, yay!). Tebow IS a great player but a) he won it last year, b) Bradford had a great season too c) I'm tired of him...not that this has any bearing on the Heisman ballots. I wonder if Tebow will come back to UF next year? Like Hansbeaker, there are a lot of people who question whether Tebow will hack it in the NFL. I wonder if "heart and "effort" that these announcers go on and on about are euphemisms for "no discernible pro caliber skills"

[A-Tex Devil]

Disclaimer: self professed OU fan.

UT buried Bradford in the turf? Really?

Sam Bradford threw for 387 yds and 5 TDs against Texas, in a game where OU's running game was non-existent. OU may have lost the game, but it certainly wasn't a result of Bradford's play.

I wouldn't have been surprised if either of the 3 candidates won the trophy. All were deserving. To be honest, I would have voted for Colt, Bradford, then Crabtree, in that order. But to state that Bradford winning is a joke is a bit too much. Perhaps Billy Simms yelling "boomer" incessantly was a joke, but Bradford was not.

A lot of Heisman voters actually do explain their votes in their media outlets. David Mayo explained his vote for Bradford 1 and Tebow 2:

"Oklahoma's 45-35 loss to Texas was a study in frayed defensive, special-teams and rushing performances. The Longhorns scored on six of 10 drives, not including the one when all they needed was a kickoff return.

The Sooners were held to 48 rushing yards, their second-worst total of the year (TCU held them to 25), which put the entire game on Bradford, who threw for all five touchdowns, along with two interceptions. One interception led to a Texas field goal. The other came on the last play of a decided game.

The difference, to me, is that Tebow had a chance to alter the Mississippi outcome and didn't, while Bradford gave his teammates every opportunity to alter the Texas outcome and they didn't.

That may sound like nit-picking, but we're trying to decide a slice of Americana here."

I was being hyperbolic. But that was certainly the only game where Bradford's jersey was crimson and green instead of crimson and cream at the end of the game. Orakpo cost Phil Loadholt about $2MM in that game.

Bradford deserved the trophy -- let's just say Austin is a bit angry this year. OU and UT were equally deserving of 2 things now (I'll argue all day not, but let's be fair), and lost both in an arbitrary (but admittedly defined) manner. Hopefully 3 out of 4 will turn into 9 out of 10.

The fact is, Bradford had one game that was close, and he was stopped in the 4th quarter. He couldn't drive his team down to win the game and was stopped 3 times in the second half on drives that mattered (4 total). To me that's telling. But it was 2 months ago, I guess.

[duke74]

I'm glad Tebow lost, he's the Tyler Hansbrough of college football ("oh what effort, what heart, he's the greatest, yay!). Tebow IS a great player but a) he won it last year, b) Bradford had a great season too c) I'm tired of him...not that this has any bearing on the Heisman ballots. I wonder if Tebow will come back to UF next year? Like Hansbeaker, there are a lot of people who question whether Tebow will hack it in the NFL. I wonder if "heart and "effort" that these announcers go on and on about are euphemisms for "no discernible pro caliber skills"

Just a couple of things...

I would have voted for for Tebow...whether or not he will be a great (or good) pro is irrelevant for the Heisman. Watching him over the course of this year, I can't imagine anyone being better at running the offense and leading a team. The others had great seasons, and were worthy of the votes they received (and winning, in the case of Bradford), but Tebow was unreal (to me).

And, while this too is irrelevant for the decision, he seems like a wonderful young man - the third world work with his folks, his outlook, his personality. Just a great representative of Gator-land. (Again, I am not damning the others by faint praise, here - I'm just commenting on him. Bradford, McCoy, Harrell may all be saints...I just don't know enough about them)

So...I have no issues with the winner (or any of the final 3). I just would have voted for Tebow in consideration of the overall package. I for one am not tired of him...and wish him the best.

[rockymtn devil]

Whether fair or not, Tebow was being judged not only against the other candidates this year, but also Tebow-2007 and Archie Griffin. That's a steep hill to climb. The advantage he had was that the other candidates all came from the same region and, therefore, had the potential to split votes.

If I were voting:
1. McCoy
2. Bradford
3. Crabtree (who, along with Beanie Wells, is the most NFL-ready skill player in the country)

[ricks68]

I watched the three players in question during the season and had a tough choice, myself. I leaned towards McCoy. I say lean because I really feel that he had the best receiving corps overall. That certainly can make any quarterback look very good. In the loss to Texas Tech, the receivers dropped passes they usually had not dropped in the past.

McCoy's receivers just seemed to catch just about everything that was thrown their way this year. The big question is, however, whether or not the receivers were given a better opportunity to catch balls thrown to them due to very accurate throws by the quarterback. The answer to that question is a resounding yes in the case of McCoy. He seemed to know where the receiver was going to be and could put it there almost all of the time.

I thought that Bradford threw a better quality pass, however, in the OK game. It was a tighter spiral, and looked like it had more zip, even on the long passes. His accuracy was excellent, also. His awareness of where his receivers would be was not as polished as McCoy, however. So, with quarterback IQ in mind, I would have to give my lean to McCoy.

Oh, and that guy McCoy is really smart when he runs, also.

ricks

[Stray Gator]

Congrats to Sam Bradford and the Sooners. I believe any of the three candidates--and several others who were not invited to the ceremony--would have been deserving. Needless to say, as a concededly biased Gator fan peering through orange-and-blue glasses, I would have loved to see Tebow win the award again. And because I've been fortunate enough to enjoy the experience of being both a Gator and a Blue Devil for decades, I can understand the growing antipathy towards Tebow--we've seen the same attitude develop among opposing fans towards great Duke basketball players who were perceived as "media darlings."

For us Gator fans, there might be a silver lining--maybe even two layers. First, based on reports I've read this morning about the reactions of Tebow and his defensive teammates, I believe the Gators will use this "loss" as additional motivation for the BCSCG against OU on January 8th. Around the SEC, there's a common perception that the Big XII quarterbacks ran up video-game type passing stats this season because Big XII defenses are relatively weak. Around the Big XII, conversely, the conventional wisdom seems to be that the SEC, except perhaps for Alabama and Florida, consists of teams that are just weak overall. So now we'll have both the Gator defense and Tebow extra fired up to prove their merit against the team rated #1 and the player voted #1.

Second, I suspect this will tip the balance in favor of Tebow deciding to come back for his senior year. Whether you believe as I do that he chooses to stay because he still wants to lead UF to an undefeated season and compete for a second Heisman, or you prefer to believe that he's afraid he won't be good enough to play in the NFL, I hope that Tebow stays for the very selfish reason that I'd appreciate the chance to watch him play another season in the Swamp. And that's not just because I'm a Gator who is fortunate enough to have season tickets. It's because I am convinced--and many experienced observers evidently agree--that Tim Tebow might very well be the greatest college football player of this generation. I want to see Tebow come back for the same reason I wanted Shane Battier and Jason Williams and guys like that to come back--their presence makes the game more fun to watch.

[adam]

It's because I am convinced--and many experienced observers evidently agree--that Tim Tebow might very well be the greatest college football player of this generation. I want to see Tebow come back for the same reason I wanted Shane Battier and Jason Williams and guys like that to come back--their presence makes the game more fun to watch.

I absolutely agree. In my opinion, Tim Tebow is to college football as to what Shane Battier was to college basketball.

[rockymtn devil]

I'll be shocked if Tebow doesn't comes back. While I have no doubt that he has a strong drive to go unbeaten and do all sorts of other great things, those are all moot. Nobody comes out early to be a non-first round pick and he likely won't be a first-rounder. The former Texans GM (the guy who picked Mario Williams over Reggie Bush and Vince Young, which looks smart today) that gives analysis on CBS just said a few minutes ago that, in his mind, Tebow is day-two draft pick. He'll be back.

In terms of the greatest of this generation, I might agree there. But, what is "this generation" in terms of a time line?

[BlueintheFace]

As a current resident of Austin and non-OU fan, even I must say...

YOU CANNOT DENY THE HEISMAN to the Quarterback of the highest scoring offense since 1904.

You just can't... consider the job of the quarterback- to run the offense. Consider the magnitude of the aforementioned accomplishment.

-If you want to go by throwing numbers, give it to Harrell.

-If you want to give it to the most skilled, NFL ready player, give it to Crabtree

- and if your argument is that the media gave it to him, I strongly disagree. Colt was the frontrunner for the media and voters going in to championship week at which point most commentators became obsessed with the idea of Tebow going back to back.

-If you ask me, being the most important offensive player on the best offense in 104 years is the best argument here.

[Ben63]

I was pulling for McCoy to win, but I cannot disagree with the choice of Bradford, or any of the candidates for that matter. I could not argue against any of them.

But one guy who has not been mentioned was Shonn Greene of Iowa. Not saying he was better than the 3 QB's, but he rushed for at least 100 yards in EVERY game and failed to score only once (Mich State). He carried his team in the upset of Penn State, who would be in the National Championship if they had beaten Iowa. Against Penn State Greene had 28 carries for 117 yards and two touchdowns. Thats 4.2 yards/carry against a GREAT defense. For the season he rushed for 1729 yards and 17 touchdowns and ZERO fumbles in 278 carries. Not saying he should have won it, but certainly should have gotten more recognition than he did.

[jimsumner]

I found the whole thing to be so over-the-top that it was almost a caricature. A casual observer who just wandered in would think these guys had found a cure for cancer or a way to circumvent the speed of light. "Which part of Sam Bradford's life do you find most extraordinary?"

The Nobel winners aren't subjected to that kind of purple prose.

And I guess the ESPN talking heads assume that none of the viewers recognize that a substantial number of Heisman winners disappear into obscurity. Any Eric Couch sitings recently? How'd that last Oklahoma Heisman winner work out in the NFL?

It's an award for skill-position players at top-15 schools who are on TV a lot. Nothing else.

[Stray Gator]

As a current resident of Austin and non-OU fan, even I must say...

YOU CANNOT DENY THE HEISMAN to the Quarterback of the highest scoring offense since 1904.

You just can't... consider the job of the quarterback- to run the offense. Consider the magnitude of the aforementioned accomplishment.

-If you want to go by throwing numbers, give it to Harrell.

-If you want to give it to the most skilled, NFL ready player, give it to Crabtree

- and if your argument is that the media gave it to him, I strongly disagree. Colt was the frontrunner for the media and voters going in to championship week at which point most commentators became obsessed with the idea of Tebow going back to back.

-If you ask me, being the most important offensive player on the best offense in 104 years is the best argument here.

The Heisman Trophy is supposed to be awarded to the "Most Outstanding College Football Player in the United States" each year. Not the quarterback of the highest scoring offense (which, of course, can depend on the relative strength of the defenses he faces and the willingness of the coach to leave the first team on the field after the outcome of the game has already been decided), or the player who has the most NFL potential (which has nothing to do with being the outstanding college football player in that year). I don't deny that Bradford was deserving; but no more so, IMO, than McCoy or Tebow.

I would point out that, in the Big XII Championship Game, Bradford was going against a defense that is ranked 99th of 119 FBS teams in the country; yet with under 5 minutes left in the 4th Quarter, and Oklahoma nursing a 34-point lead, Bradford was still in the game throwing (and completing) passes. In the SECCG, Tebow was going against the defense ranked 3rd nationally; although his team entered the 4th Quarter trailing on the scoreboard and being physically dominated on the field, Tebow rallied--some say willed--his team to victory with two strong TD drives. I'm not suggesting those two games should be the decisive comparison--especially since McCoy didn't have the opportunity to play in a conference championship game--but I do find it mystifying that, after the SECCG, 170 voters could in good conscience leave Tim Tebow entirely off their ballot of top 3 college football players.

Like many Gator fans, I'm eager to see how Bradford and OU fare against UF's defense, and how Tebow, Harvin & Co. manage against OU's defense.

[Wander]

The Heisman isn't really an individual award. It's an individual/team combo award, with the added caveat that the winner must be an offensive skill player. Usually when a quarterback wins it, it says just as much (sometimes more) about the offensive linemen than it does about the QB.

I would have voted: Myron Rolle, Colt McCoy, Michael Crabtree

[BlueintheFace]

The Heisman Trophy is supposed to be awarded to the "Most Outstanding College Football Player in the United States" each year. Not the quarterback of the highest scoring offense

You are certainly confused on a number of fronts.

First, I didn't say that should be the sole criteria... what a silly idea. I simply said that the fact that he is the leader of the most prolific offense in a century on arguably the best team in the nation (TBD) seems to be the strongest point for any of the candidates.

Second, don't you think your second sentence here might be a strong indicator of the first... think about it.

However, the argument is really about what "most outstanding" means.

It could mean:

Most Valuable
Most Talented
Best Numbers
Most Impressive individual performance over a season

I believe the first three are subsumed in the fourth and history of the award would indicate that the fourth option here is how the winner is chosen. If you ask me, leading the most prolific offense in a century is far and away the most impressive...

[Gunnar Kaufman]

I absolutely agree. In my opinion, Tim Tebow is to college football as to what Shane Battier was to college basketball.

With all due respect to Tebow, I think this is unfair to Battier.

[A-Tex Devil]

Here's the deal.

If Blake Gideon cathes the INT against Tech, if Baylor holds on against Texas Tech, or if neither of the combo of Nebraska's 57 yard field goal against Colorado and KU's last second pass to beat Mizzou happen, UT is in the BIG XII championship, and assuming (reasonably) that they win, Colt (or perhaps Tebow) wins the Heisman and OU isn't the most prolific offense of all time.

None of those events have anything to do with Tim Tebow, Sam Bradford, or Colt McCoy, but each was crucial to him winning it.

But I concede, Sam Bradford was a worthy winner. Just not the worthiest