Unbelievable - Spanish BBall Team

[brumby041]

Did anyone else see this?

http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2008...olympics20081

I can't believe that a company would create an ad like this or that a publisher would actually print it.

Can the IOC impose sanctions?

[killerleft]

I'm unusually slow this morning. I had to read the story to figure out just what they were doing.

Yeah, how could a whole group plus a photographer and admen not figure out they were playing with stupid fire?

[billybreen]

Did anyone else see this?

http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2008...olympics20081

I can't believe that a company would create an ad like this or that a publisher would actually print it.

Can the IOC impose sanctions?

As the article points out, Spain has a pretty atrocious recent past on race relations. In that light, this isn't surprising, though you would think they might have learned their lesson by now.

[studdlee10]

I'm not the most racially sensitive Asian American around, but this is plain ridiculous and offensive. How can this be interpreted in any way other than negatively? I don't see a single scenario where this gesture would be appropriate, especially during the Olympics in China.

Now I hope the USA just destroys Spain.

[Johnboy]

Now I hope the USA just destroys Spain.

Too bad China didn't beat them.

[Diddy]

I have lived abroad and traveled extensively in Europe, and the Continent is the most racist area on earth, and I am from the South. Such attitudes are accepted and even encouraged in these nations. Europes fanaticism with Soccer is not about the game. It is merely an acceptable outlet for racism whereby the fans are allowed, nay, encouraged to be as racist as they like. Watch the stands at a soccer pitch in Europe (Not Great Britain) and you will be truly horrified.

[COYS]

It is too bad that racism blots the European soccer landscape. It's such a great game and the Champions League is such a great competition. A shame that it is tarnished by groups of bigoted idiots.

Anyway, it is just unbelievably appalling that the Spanish team did this. Can you imagine what would have happened if the games were in Nairobi and a European team had taken a picture of themselves wearing black paint? This is on the same level of idiocy.

[sagegrouse]

It seems as though "honestidad politica" is not as well developed in Spain as in the US. I wonder if the multi-racial societies in Latin America are more circumspect.

sagegrouse
'urogallo de salvia'

[miramar]

I have been to Spain 15 times since I spent a year studying at the University of Barcelona in the 1970s.

As the article notes, it would not even occur to most Spaniards that anyone would find this gesture offensive (or ridiculous, silly, etc.), which is a shame. Ironically, Spain is a remarkably tolerant society with a large and growing Chinese community.

Football fans are something else again. In many cases they will say absolutely anything to get inside the opponents' heads, so that means that race, religion, the players' sisters, and just about anything else is fair game. They can be quite crude, but fortunately nothing compared to many of their English counterparts. Spanish fans actually use the English words supporters and hooligans, and understand the difference between the two.

Finally, the buildup to the Olympic Games in Spain during the month of July was actually far greater than anything here in the US. Newspapers and TV had a tremendous amount of coverage of Spain's largest Olympic delegation ever, and much of that attention was centered on the basketball team. After that buildup, the OT win over China had to be a letdown, but it's early.

[wisteria]

as a matter of fact, this didn't really cause much trouble. Most Chinese do not really understand the potential racial message behind the photo. (I still don't understand. What does it mean? meaning that Chinese, or Asian in general, have small eyes? ) I saw some people trying to distribute this photo on Chinese websites, but no one was really paying much notice with so much going on in the games.

[roywhite]

as a matter of fact, this didn't really cause much trouble. Most Chinese do not really understand the potential racial message behind the photo. (I still don't understand. What does it mean? meaning that Chinese, or Asian in general, have small eyes? ) I saw some people trying to distribute this photo on Chinese websites, but no one was really paying much notice with so much going on in the games.

Well, I suppose such things are in the "eye of the beholder", but the ad seems to be making fun of a "slant-eyed" appearance. Certainly, "slant-eyed Japs" and "slant-eyed gooks" were derisive, racially tinged labels applied during wartime.

[miramar]

According to the NYT, it seems that the main sensitivity at the Olympics is air quality.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/08/13/sp...l?ref=olympics

[sagegrouse]

Well, I suppose such things are in the "eye of the beholder", but the ad seems to be making fun of a "slant-eyed" appearance. Certainly, "slant-eyed Japs" and "slant-eyed gooks" were derisive, racially tinged labels applied during wartime.

Is it OK to request "round-eyed" spices at a Thai restaurant?

sagegrouse

[studdlee10]

Your experiences in Spain were far different than mine, though I will fully admit Barcelona is an exception.

I call BS when you say that Spaniards have no clue what that gesture means. I spent 3 weeks in Madrid and cannot tell you the number of times I had people pull their eyelids at me or make Bruce Lee kung fu sounds and motions at me. They even went so far as to throw food at me while taunting "chino" when I attended a bull fight with my girlfriend (also asian). The countless stares on the subway were the most uncomfortable I have ever felt in my life, and have been to my fair share of places around the world, so please excuse me when I don't cut the Spaniards some slack, especially given their long history of racism. Was it just in good fun when they made monkey noises at Thierry Henry or when they taunted Lewis Hamilton so mercilessly, that they had to be reprimanded by F1?

I have been to Spain 15 times since I spent a year studying at the University of Barcelona in the 1970s.

As the article notes, it would not even occur to most Spaniards that anyone would find this gesture offensive (or ridiculous, silly, etc.), which is a shame. Ironically, Spain is a remarkably tolerant society with a large and growing Chinese community.

Football fans are something else again. In many cases they will say absolutely anything to get inside the opponents' heads, so that means that race, religion, the players' sisters, and just about anything else is fair game. They can be quite crude, but fortunately nothing compared to many of their English counterparts. Spanish fans actually use the English words supporters and hooligans, and understand the difference between the two.

Finally, the buildup to the Olympic Games in Spain during the month of July was actually far greater than anything here in the US. Newspapers and TV had a tremendous amount of coverage of Spain's largest Olympic delegation ever, and much of that attention was centered on the basketball team. After that buildup, the OT win over China had to be a letdown, but it's early.

[miramar]

Your experiences in Spain were far different than mine, though I will fully admit Barcelona is an exception.

I call BS when you say that Spaniards have no clue what that gesture means. I spent 3 weeks in Madrid and cannot tell you the number of times I had people pull their eyelids at me or make Bruce Lee kung fu sounds and motions at me. They even went so far as to throw food at me while taunting "chino" when I attended a bull fight with my girlfriend (also asian). The countless stares on the subway were the most uncomfortable I have ever felt in my life, and have been to my fair share of places around the world, so please excuse me when I don't cut the Spaniards some slack, especially given their long history of racism. Was it just in good fun when they made monkey noises at Thierry Henry or when they taunted Lewis Hamilton so mercilessly, that they had to be reprimanded by F1?

I don't think you understood my previous comment. Obviously the basketball players knew the meaning of the gesture since they used it in the context of the Olympics in Peking.

What I said is that it is a shame that most Spaniards would not realize that the gesture is offensive. I certainly did not indicate that I consider any of this in good fun.

As far as "their long history of racism," they are certainly not alone.

[hc5duke]

As far as "their long history of racism," they are certainly not alone.

I'd agree with this point. What happened to studlee could have happened in just about any other country, and not just within Europe. Just about any mono-ethnic country (or a country with a clear majority ethnicity) is guilty of this. I'd also add that this is especially true where there is alcohol involved, like at the bull fight (they do serve alcohol right?).

[dkbaseball]

I have lived abroad and traveled extensively in Europe, and the Continent is the most racist area on earth, and I am from the South. Such attitudes are accepted and even encouraged in these nations. Europes fanaticism with Soccer is not about the game. It is merely an acceptable outlet for racism whereby the fans are allowed, nay, encouraged to be as racist as they like. Watch the stands at a soccer pitch in Europe (Not Great Britain) and you will be truly horrified.

I'm very much a Europhile and often compare the U.S. quite unfavorably to Europe, sometimes to the exasperation of family and friends, but it was quite a revelation to me to read How Soccer Explains the World and learn of the race-baiting that goes on in European soccer. E.g., a crowd in Hungary would make a hissing sound as if gas were seeping into a chamber when their team was playing a largely Jewish squad. We've got a lot to learn from the Continent about public policy matters and culture in general, but I'm afraid they may have a tough road ahead on this issue as they become more racially diverse.

[billybreen]

I'm very much a Europhile and often compare the U.S. quite unfavorably to Europe, sometimes to the exasperation of family and friends, but it was quite a revelation to me to read How Soccer Explains the World and learn of the race-baiting that goes on in European soccer. E.g., a crowd in Hungary would make a hissing sound as if gas were seeping into a chamber when their team was playing a largely Jewish squad. We've got a lot to learn from the Continent about public policy matters and culture in general, but I'm afraid they may have a tough road ahead on this issue as they become more racially diverse.

Say it with me, dkb: USA USA USA!

[wisteria]

oh lord... Just when I was thinking this photo isn't really making much noise, apparently the major media outlets are now picking up the report. That has to promote the controversy. I doubt there would be any official responses unless the media reporters really push the question. But if it gets major attention of the Chinese on internet...

[billybreen]

oh lord... Just when I was thinking this photo isn't really making much noise, apparently the major media outlets are now picking up the report. That has to promote the controversy. I doubt there would be any official responses unless the media reporters really push the question. But if it gets major attention of the Chinese on internet...

I hope it becomes a full scale international incident. Would be nice to have home court advantage against Spain.