Hansbrough to Enter Without Agent [Archive]

CameronBornAndBred

04-22-2008, 08:00 AM

I'm actually surprised. I hope they all come back, they are more fun to beat when they are at their best.

This is what Roy said about what he thinks will happen, and the chance of him being wrong.

"I don't think I've ever been drastically surprised," Williams said. "I don't think I've ever been mildly surprised. In '05, we won on Monday, get back on Tuesday, on Wednesday night Sean [May] calls and had changed his mind. He had continually said all the way through that he was going to come back, so that was a little of a surprise until you sat back and thought about it -- [it] wasn't a big surprise."
http://www.heraldsun.com/sports/unc/42-943807.cfm

That's a whole bunch of making no sense.

billybreen

04-22-2008, 08:25 AM

I'll believe it when there's more confirmation. How accurate is that source?

dukelion

04-22-2008, 08:31 AM

The site isn't your average draft site.......

http://www.draftexpress.com/aboutus.php

freedevil

04-22-2008, 08:55 AM

The site isn't your average draft site.......

Which isn't saying much, in my opinion.

Edouble

04-22-2008, 09:36 AM

I am very impressed that Dukelion even knows about this site, but I'll believe the information when Hansbrough himself, and not just a source close to the situation, actually verifies this.

Chicago 1995

04-22-2008, 09:50 AM

I am very impressed that Dukelion even knows about this site, but I'll believe the information when Hansbrough himself, and not just a source close to the situation, actually verifies this.

Is the guy that runs Draft Express any more credible than he was when he was writing for Draftcity and got fired for trashing an agent?

IIRC, he was just a college kid at the time, and he took a bunch of shots at the guy that represented Kelenna Azuibuike, and arguably misread the situation completely (forgetting that Azuibuike's father was in a world of legal trouble, and needed cash).

Not saying he's necessarily wrong here, but a pretty website doesn't make this guy connected or a long time player in the NBA or anything.

billybreen

04-22-2008, 10:03 AM

Not saying he's necessarily wrong here, but a pretty website doesn't make this guy connected or a long time player in the NBA or anything.

Also, this site isn't pretty. :)

Icarus09

04-22-2008, 10:15 AM

I'm still floored that people (including Ellington himself) are/were thinking that Ellington would enter the draft.

Troublemaker

04-22-2008, 10:53 AM

Even if true, nothing matters until an agent is hired. A player could be 100% committed to returning to school and it would still be the sensible thing to declare and "test the waters" to learn about the draft process and the professional evaluations of his game before pulling out. Especially if he's a junior like Hansbrough or Green. Or a sophomore looking to leave in a year like perhaps Lawson or Ellington.

BD80

04-22-2008, 11:18 AM

To do well at the Orlando camp. Yech. I feel so cheap. And when a lawyer says that, it means something.

I hope he does well enough to move up to #18 to get selected by the Washington and compete against Brenda - currently cast in these Wizards of Oz as the Cowardly Lion. No wait, he is the one with no heart. I get so confused.

I would rather he not play for the heels, because I always root for the heels to lose every game (except maybe against UCon) and the chances of the heels losing improve if they lose Hans. I am also so tired of hearing about Hans from every announcer (probably like heels got tired of hearing about Battier or Redick).

Look Roy, no Hans!

rtnorthrup

04-22-2008, 11:36 AM

shadowfax336

04-22-2008, 11:43 AM

This still isn't being carried by anyone legitimate...

Lets take it with a grain of salt, k?

slower

04-22-2008, 11:59 AM

I'm actually surprised. I hope they all come back, they are more fun to beat when they are at their best.

they will be damn hard to beat if they all come back, IMO. I hope they ALL go.

jimbonelson

04-22-2008, 12:25 PM

they will be damn hard to beat if they all come back, IMO. I hope they ALL go.
They will be hard to beat if they stay or if they all go

BD80

04-22-2008, 12:32 PM

What is the downside for any junior who wants to test the waters without an agent? It gives you the chance to see where your game is, where you might be taken and then to make an educated decision. I would think all juniors who have a legitimate NBA shot would take this route.

Exposure. Let's say Hans goes to the pre-draft camps and work with coaches and scouts who identify certain issues that can generally be fixed with coaching and work. Oh, let's say issues like not shuffling one's feet with the ball or not falling down so much on defense. If these issues are identified and before his senior season and not corrected, then the scouts have to question whether they can ever be fixed, making him more of a risk. If he waits until next year to go to the camps, the scouts will think their own team can fix the problems and his shortcomings won't damage his draft status as much..

Another potential downside is if he does not do well in the camps in individual match-ups and it starts a negative perception of Hans being limited. Then, his entire senior season is played with the pressure of demonstrating a face-up game or an outside shooting touch or a greater shot-blocking presence or whatever. However, demonstration of these facets of his game may not be in the best interests of the team, who needs him to continue with his junk around the hoop and flopping on D. His game suffers and the team suffers. I can't come up with a specific example off the top of my head, but I generally recall a couple of instances where this type of thing has happened. I suspect Arizona would have a few examples, maybe Miles Simon?

The biggest downside is that it would give the coaches and scouts twice the opportunity to get to know Hans and hate him!

1Devil

04-22-2008, 12:47 PM

Danny Green has no shot at the first round this year or next year. He'll be back.

Classof06

04-22-2008, 01:16 PM

Until I see or hear different from multiple sources, I fully expect UNC to return everybody and I expect them to be the crystal clear-cut favorite to take down the nets next year.

They didn't have much of an excuse not winning it all this year and they will have absolutely no excuses if they return everyone and don't win it all next year.

gvtucker

04-22-2008, 01:40 PM

Danny Green has no shot at the first round this year or next year. He'll be back.

Having no shot at the first round doesn't necessarily mean he's coming back. See "Randolph Shavlik" or "McRoberts, Josh". Boozer also was a 2nd rounder but at least he had a shot at the first round.

grossbus

04-22-2008, 01:42 PM

"I hope they all come back"

crazy talk

shadowfax336

04-22-2008, 01:46 PM

McRoberts was projected first round. Most people had him going to Utah with the 25th pick or so.

UrinalCake

04-22-2008, 01:47 PM

What is the downside for any junior who wants to test the waters without an agent?

In addition to the previous poster's response, if a player wants to retain college eligibility he must pay his own way through all of the pre-draft camps and workouts. This might not be an issue for Hans as I believe his family is fairly wealthy, but travel costs and what-not could be a factor for some players. I could see a player getting frustrated by how much money is out there and the fact that he's not seeing any of it, and thus being persuaded to go ahead and declare.

Also there's the message it sends to your teammates. If you test the waters and then come back, you've made it loud and clear that your focus is elsewhere. Maybe this isn't such an issue for a returning senior, but I have to believe that this would impact team chemistry.

Edouble

04-22-2008, 02:40 PM

I'm still floored that people (including Ellington himself) are/were thinking that Ellington would enter the draft.

There have been many less talented players to declare early for the draft. Not that I think Ellington is ready, but it is hard to be suprised anymore when anyone declares.

Twigmas

04-22-2008, 04:13 PM

In addition to the previous poster's response, if a player wants to retain college eligibility he must pay his own way through all of the pre-draft camps and workouts.

Not anymore. The NBA teams can now pay for a player to workout for them.

http://www.draftexpress.com/article/New-NCAA-Rule-Permits-NBA-Teams-to-Pay-for-Underclassmen-Workouts/

godukecom

04-22-2008, 04:27 PM

Yawn

Hansbroguh will be in north carolina next year.
My sources confirm it.
I mean, seriously, evne if he went pro he would still be here because the charoltte bobcats/tar heels would draft him anyway ;)

on the serious side, I won't believe this until i hear it straight from his mouth. Regardles, why fret over something you have no control over? Whether Hans is wearing a bobcats or unc jersey next year, none of us can influence his decision one way or another.

JasonEvans

04-22-2008, 04:55 PM

2 things--

1) I am surprised the Carolina guys would enter but not hire an agent. Roy specifically said they would not do that about a week ago because he was getting enough information so they would know all they needed to know. His words were something like, "if they go in, they are staying in." So, if Hasbro goes then (according to what Roy said a week ago), he stays.

2) Anyone putting down Danny Green's draft stock does not know what they are talking about. I know many NBA scouts consider Green to be the best prospect on the team. He has the size and inside out ability to play on the wing in the NBA. I am not saying he would be a 1st rounder this year but he would get a looong look from NBA teams and I would not be shocked if someone took him late in the first or early in the second. He will make NBA money someday, mark my words.

--Jason "I do agree that any rumors from DraftExpress or NBADraft.net are to be taken when big time grain of salt" Evans

dcarp23

04-22-2008, 05:30 PM

How many people have entered the draft without an agent and then returned to school? Randolph Morris is the only one I can remember, and his situation did not end up being the best. It seems to me that once you put yourself out there, it would be nearly impossible to not have your amateur status threatened.

DukieBoy

04-22-2008, 05:54 PM

Brandon Rush did it last year i think....and plus, what's up with all these UNC players who aren't starters on the team but get drafted high (i.e. Marvin Williams)

BD80

04-22-2008, 06:13 PM

2) Anyone putting down Danny Green's draft stock does not know what they are talking about. I know many NBA scouts consider Green to be the best prospect on the team. He has the size and inside out ability to play on the wing in the NBA.

Green is a long and athletic 6'5", but is still almost too small for a 2 guard. Frankly, I question whether OJ Mayo and Eric Gordon will make it in the NBA because they don't have point guard skills and aren't quite tall enough to play the wing.

While there are always exceptions to the rule, I think it is considered a better risk to gamble on the untapped potential of a prospect that has the desired size and athleticism rather than to gamble on a tweener beating the odds.

There are not a lot of good "upside" shooting guards in this draft, and I think Green would look good in workouts against the top SGs (Gordon, Mayo, CDR)

I think Green is at least a good possibility to go. Green's shooting stroke will have a place at the next level, and he is likely to have a long career in the NBA. In that respect, Green is a "safe" pick in the draft - something clubs consider when first round contracts are at stake.

Channing

04-22-2008, 06:29 PM

didnt singletary enter his name last year then come back? Im pretty sure Dominic James did as well. It is not uncommon at all.

What was different about Morris' case is that he stayed in the draft without an agent, didnt get drafted, and was then able to go back to school.

dcarp23

04-22-2008, 06:31 PM

What was different about Morris' case is that he stayed in the draft without an agent, didnt get drafted, and was then able to go back to school.

Good point...I forgot that extra step

1Devil

04-23-2008, 07:58 AM

Green is a long and athletic 6'5", but is still almost too small for a 2 guard. Frankly, I question whether OJ Mayo and Eric Gordon will make it in the NBA because they don't have point guard skills and aren't quite tall enough to play the wing.

While there are always exceptions to the rule, I think it is considered a better risk to gamble on the untapped potential of a prospect that has the desired size and athleticism rather than to gamble on a tweener beating the odds.

There are not a lot of good "upside" shooting guards in this draft, and I think Green would look good in workouts against the top SGs (Gordon, Mayo, CDR)

I think Green is at least a good possibility to go. Green's shooting stroke will have a place at the next level, and he is likely to have a long career in the NBA. In that respect, Green is a "safe" pick in the draft - something clubs consider when first round contracts are at stake.

I just don't see it. He's definitely a good shooter. But I don't see all the athleticism, I don't see NBA speed, I don't see ballhandling. I don't see the ability to carry a team (that's not his role). Why exactly would he be a great prospect?

BD80

04-23-2008, 08:45 AM

I just don't see it. He's definitely a good shooter. But I don't see all the athleticism, I don't see NBA speed, I don't see ballhandling. I don't see the ability to carry a team (that's not his role). Why exactly would he be a great prospect?

You are so correct about the ballhandling. That is the danger of Green returning, such flaws are more likely to be revealed. I haven't yet seen him demonstrate an ability to break down a defense off the dribble. I don't know about speed, but I believe he is NBA quick so that he can stay in front of guards on D and can get separation for his shot.

Look at some of the premier shooting guards, Rip Hamilton, Michael Redd, Peja Stoyacovich (sp?), Manu Ginobli, Hedo Turkoglu, not fast or overly athletic, but they can shoot. No, Green isn't on a par with Kobe or Lebron or Wade or McGrady, nor do I think he is a top 15 pick, but I could see him going in the first round.

TheDuke11

04-23-2008, 10:24 AM

shadowfax336

04-23-2008, 10:26 AM

I think you're either underrating Hansbrough or overrating their freshmen.
Losing the national player of the year is not something you just shrug and move on from! (Unless you're Texas apparently)

TheDuke11

04-23-2008, 10:55 AM

oh it'll be a transition for them no doubt but think about it

They go from hansbrough to davis/zeller/stepheson/thompson

or

They go from Lawson/Ellington to drew/and that other guard who's name always escapes me.

I'd take scenario #2 10 times out of 10.

MChambers

04-23-2008, 11:01 AM

the problem here is that hans is replacable. they have davis and zeller along with thompson and stephenson there. lawson and ellington are NOT replacable.

I'd rather those 2 leave, but looks like that is wishful thinking.

If they have Hansbrough, Thompson, Stephenson, Zeller, and Davis, they're going to have minutes issues. If Green is back, it gets even worse, because UNC played small quite a bit last year.

dukelion

04-23-2008, 11:06 AM

I find it funny that when I first posted Lawson is staying based on sources from DraftExpress.com many were overly skeptical but now that Hoopsworld.com has reported everyone accepts it as fact.........ESPECIALLY considering Hoopsworld.com is using DraftExpress.com as their source!

So no.......Hoopsworld.com isn't the first to break the news.....not sure why the front page had to go out of its way to make that statement???

I know this is a bit nitpicky but this site holds itself to a high standard in giving people the proper credit for news and this should be no different.

BlueintheFace

04-23-2008, 12:53 PM

Yah, draftexpress is a pretty proven site. They are correct more often than not.

shadowfax336

04-23-2008, 12:59 PM

yeah the front page article was incorrect, but who said everybody is accepting this as fact now?

Clipsfan

04-23-2008, 01:11 PM

Look at some of the premier shooting guards, Rip Hamilton, Michael Redd, Peja Stoyacovich (sp?), Manu Ginobli, Hedo Turkoglu, not fast or overly athletic, but they can shoot. No, Green isn't on a par with Kobe or Lebron or Wade or McGrady, nor do I think he is a top 15 pick, but I could see him going in the first round.

Those aren't necessarily the best comps for Green, given that Peja and Hedo are both 6'10", Manu is actually quite athletic and VERY wily, Rip is not only one of the best mid-range shooters in the league but is probably the guy in the best shape in all the league. Green has the abilities to fit into the league, but not because those other guys have been able to thrive.

BD80

04-23-2008, 03:39 PM

...Peja and Hedo are both 6'10"

Wow! I always thought they were in the 6' 7" range. No wonder guys under 6' 5" won't get any consideration as a shooting guard. If Kevin Durant plays the SG for Seattle, there is quite a group of SGs that are 6' 9" or taller: LeBron, Durant, Peja, Hedo, McGrady, Dunleavy/Granger, and Rudy Gay. Half of the remaining starting SGs are 6' 7" or taller. The guys under 6'7" include Kobe, Wade, Manu, Vince Carter, Ray Allen, Michael Redd, and Jason Richardson.

Maybe Green is not athletic enough to make it as a shooting guard at the next level.

shadowfax336

04-23-2008, 03:44 PM

Turkoglu is not a SG....
neither are Lebron, Peja or Dunleavy

superdave

04-23-2008, 04:20 PM

I think Raja Bell and Bruce Bowen would be the best comps for Green - they are guys who learned to knock down the three and play big time D in order to stick around. Green could pull this off, but he's otherwise a 3 in a 2's body.

He'd definitely have to concentrate on a skill on each end that would enable him to stick around.

wilson

04-23-2008, 04:29 PM

Clipsfan

04-23-2008, 05:45 PM

Turkoglu is not a SG....
neither are Lebron, Peja or Dunleavy

I thought about making that point as well. Orlando has Turkoglu and Lewis playing the 3/4, for instance.

As for comparing Green to Bell and Bowen, until he shows that he's one of the top defenders in the league that comparison holds little water. I think he'd like to turn into a Kevin Martin, for example.