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jma4life
04-05-2008, 11:35 PM
Does anyone ever question how we can root so strongly against a team.

When UNC loses, the happiness does not last nearly as long as after a Duke wins nor is it as strong a level of happiness but it's still a great feeling.

Obviously, most Carolina fans feel the same way but sometimes I question how I can be this happy that a bunch of 18-22 year old kids just lost a basketball game.

I know it's part of the rivalry and honestly, the main reason is because of Heel fans rather than the actual players but still. Plus, I'm not even near a lot of Heel fans at the moment and I really shouldn't let internet bragging bother me.

That said, not gonna lie, I was definitely relieved to see Carolina not complete the comeback and one of the main things I watched for after Duke went down was a Carolina loss. But sometimes, I feel guilty that I get this happy to see a team lose when I should just worry about seeing the team I love win.

freedevil
04-05-2008, 11:37 PM
I almost ALWAYS feel bad when you see a guy like Hansbrough lose because (1) Duke saw it fit to recruit him and (2) these kids are kids.

HOWEVER, I believe most on this Board are delighted because of the opposing fans, they're so obnoxious. It's worth the trade-off.

geraldsneighbor
04-05-2008, 11:38 PM
Its not that I hate the players. I hate the fans. I hate the coach. I hate the throw-up blue. And, I hate the Duke Haters fans who tell me how good Carolina is.

geraldsneighbor
04-05-2008, 11:39 PM
I like Ellington, he lives near me and him and Henderson are best friends. I like to see him do well, but I'm not going to lose any sleep though that UNC won't be playing Monday.

BlueintheFace
04-05-2008, 11:42 PM
Very few of us here root against the kids. We root against "that which is Carolina Tarheel Basketball." We root against fans, coaches, a few rotten apple players here and there, but mostly we root against a rival team because that is what a rivalry is all about.

jma4life
04-05-2008, 11:44 PM
Yea, I know it's mostly about the fans but some times I do feel bad about having to root against the players. Especially when for the most part there aren't any bad kids on the team.

CameronBlue
04-05-2008, 11:45 PM
I like Ellington, he lives near me and him and Henderson are best friends. I like to see him do well, but I'm not going to lose any sleep though that UNC won't be playing Monday.

In my more immature years I would have come here to gloat, post something stupid like BCE or Roy has yet to win a championship with his own players (well I kindof did that on another thread) but Carolina should be congratulated on their season. They took the lead back from Duke in #ACC Tourney championships and flirted with the greatest FF comeback of all time. I truly detest Hansbrough and have no feelings whatsoever about Will Graves. That says something about the guy. Congrats on a successful season Toolie fans.

Lavabe
04-05-2008, 11:48 PM
Does anyone ever question how we can root so strongly against a team.

No. Never gave it a second thought.

9F Cheers,
Lavabe

jma4life
04-05-2008, 11:50 PM
The other thing is I am usually more upset when they win than I am happy when they lose.

Coballs
04-06-2008, 12:05 AM
Unless you know them or are related to them, who cares about the Carolina players? Some of them chose to go there over Duke. Someone has to win and someone has to lose. And I'd rather that a young man who has chosen to to play for Carolina go home unhappy, than any other basketball player in the NCAAs. That is the nature of a rivalry. Of course, I wish no personal harm against any of them. But when it comes to basketball, when the game ends I always want the Carolina players and fans to be emotionally crushed.

Cameron
04-06-2008, 12:07 AM
I'm not going to lie, the 40-12 opening tonight was the happiest I've been all season long. Our win in Chapel Hill, when we were at a truly elite level earlier in the year, comes in at a tie, but tonight was amazing. I would have been devastated to see Tyler/Roy win tonight. Absolutely crushed.

Have to love what is going on over in Carolina land...

Thread Title: Is Roy Overrated?

Thread Creator: Heelfan8189

:)

eddiehaskell
04-06-2008, 12:35 AM
I wish I could create an alternate reality where UNC did win. My family members are UNC fans and I hated seeing the look on their faces.

Yeah, they did rub it in all year about how good Carolina was and I rubbed it in for about an hour after they lost, but ehh....it's a hollow victory. If UNC won atleast I would've gotten to see some happy people.

elvis14
04-06-2008, 12:42 AM
I don't feel bad at all for rooting against the tar holes and their players. I'm happy they lost. I don't like the way their fans act and talk about the game, don't like the coach, hate that color blue, etc, etc.. All the crap I've taken from TarHole fans of late has just solidified the way I feel. I really don't like Hansblahblah at all and frankly I don't care that they are kids, they wear that ugly puke blue, screw them I'm glad they lost!

Is that clear enough? I could go on and on....

Cameron
04-06-2008, 12:43 AM
I wish I could create an alternate reality where UNC did win. My family members are UNC fans and I hated seeing the look on their faces.

Yeah, they did rub it in all year about how good Carolina was and I rubbed it in for about an hour after they lost, but ehh....it's a hollow victory. If UNC won atleast I would've gotten to see some happy people.

No, you have it all, all wrong. Doom and gloom is the new excitable. It's very metro right now. All the Carolina fans are doing it:D

Coballs
04-06-2008, 12:46 AM
I wish I could create an alternate reality where UNC did win. My family members are UNC fans and I hated seeing the look on their faces.

Yeah, they did rub it in all year about how good Carolina was and I rubbed it in for about an hour after they lost, but ehh....it's a hollow victory. If UNC won atleast I would've gotten to see some happy people.

Happy relatives are overrated. Happy Duke fans are underrated.

loran16
04-06-2008, 12:59 AM
Dude, the entire world laughs and seems to get a sadistic glee out of us losing. I feel i deserve some pleasure in seeing them lose.

More important to me truthfully is the fact that they didn't win, cuz then we wouldn't hear the end of it.

Bostondevil
04-06-2008, 01:31 AM
Bob Ryan in the Boston Globe today compared Hansbrough's game to Mitch Kupchak's. Thanks for bringing up nightmares from my childhood, Bob. I still hate Kupchak!!!! Hey, gives me more reason to dislike the current crop of Heels. Whew.

Ha, ha, apparently there's been some Hansbrough backlash lately to the point of some sportswriters advising folks to lay off him and Kevin Love. Sorry, ain't gonna happen, if you're the best player on a Final Four team and you're white, well, it just comes with the territory. Get used to it.

Coballs
04-06-2008, 02:14 AM
Bob Ryan in the Boston Globe today compared Hansbrough's game to Mitch Kupchak's. Thanks for bringing up nightmares from my childhood, Bob. I still hate Kupchak!!!! Hey, gives me more reason to dislike the current crop of Heels. Whew.

Ha, ha, apparently there's been some Hansbrough backlash lately to the point of some sportswriters advising folks to lay off him and Kevin Love. Sorry, ain't gonna happen, if you're the best player on a Final Four team and you're white, well, it just comes with the territory. Get used to it.

Was Kupchak that good?

davekay1971
04-06-2008, 08:12 AM
Does anyone ever question how we can root so strongly against a team.

When UNC loses, the happiness does not last nearly as long as after a Duke wins nor is it as strong a level of happiness but it's still a great feeling.

Obviously, most Carolina fans feel the same way but sometimes I question how I can be this happy that a bunch of 18-22 year old kids just lost a basketball game.



It's not the kids...well, except for the select tarhole players who deserve loathing (suffer Psucky T, suffer). It's the fans. I live in NC, and the tarhole fans deserve every bit of scorn and ridicule that can be heaped upon them. It's too bad that seemingly decent guys like Ellington and Lawson have to suffer in the process.

Lavabe
04-06-2008, 08:19 AM
Its not that I hate the players. I hate the fans. I hate the coach. I hate the throw-up blue. And, I hate the Duke Haters fans who tell me how good Carolina is.

I actually agree with most of your first point. It's not hatred against most of the players. Then again, there are a few player antics that bring me to that level (shirt-popping, dancing Danny, lizard-dancing, etc...).

As for the rest of your statement, agreed 100%. The celebration after the VCU game last year still exists on youtube.

Cheers,
Lavabe

fogey
04-06-2008, 08:36 AM
Dude, the entire world laughs and seems to get a sadistic glee out of us losing. I feel i deserve some pleasure in seeing them lose.

More important to me truthfully is the fact that they didn't win, cuz then we wouldn't hear the end of it.

I'm pretty much a balanced, calm, controlled guy in all other aspects of life, but I am pleased to confirm I have HATED the tarholes since submitting to four years of agony while an u/g at Duke in the late sixties... an inevitable result of watching Carolina with Miller, Lewis, Scott, Clark, et al begin to dominate the Devils (thanks again to Freddy L for one shining moment there...) and smug Dean getting his machine oiled to new levels...
All Dukies must share this, cultivated by four years of intensity, regardless of when you were an u/g. Doesn't leave you. The passion that is Tarhole hatred is healthy and to be valued!

miramar
04-06-2008, 09:22 AM
Was Kupchak that good?

Kupchak was really good in college and in the pros. As a pro he got himself into a perfect position in 1981 as a center for the Showtime Lakers, but unfortunately blew his knee out. To his credit, he came back as a valuable reserve (he wasn't the same player he was before) for at least one championship team. Also to his credit, he got his MBA at UCLA and is now the Laker general manager.

I don't think this is the kind of guy you would dislike.

rsvman
04-06-2008, 09:29 AM
I don't really dislike any of the Carolina players with the possible exception of Danny Green. Hansbrough annoys me with all the flops, fouls, and travels that don't get called or get called wrong. Ellington seems like a nice kid, but he plays for the wrong team. I've got nothing against Lawson. I could name the rest and I don't have strong feelings one way or the other.

But since it's a rivalry, how can you not be happy when their team loses? You think anybody over at IC was second-guessing their excitement when Duke lost to West Virginia?!?

weezie
04-06-2008, 10:06 AM
You think anybody over at IC was second-guessing their excitement when Duke lost to West Virginia?!?

Yeah, why is everybody so angst ridden about having actually,acutely and finally watched Carolina GO TO HELL?


I could eat this with a spoon, it's so damned tasty!!!!!!!!!:D

Buckeye Devil
04-06-2008, 10:09 AM
I would have never heard the end of it from my nephew who while attending Ohio State is a huge UNC fan. I took pleasure in watching the 'Holes lose and in particular their inept play in the first half. Seeing Hanstravel blocked and knocked was especially gratifying.

But then I thought that it would have been preferable to have made it to the Final 4 and lose by 18 than to lose in the second round. In watching the Final 4 it also seemed to me that Duke has quite a ways to go before they get back to the level of the teams there. The athleticism, talent, and quickness was impressive. The best 4 teams made it with UCLA a notch lower than the rest.

davekay1971
04-06-2008, 10:29 AM
In watching the Final 4 it also seemed to me that Duke has quite a ways to go before they get back to the level of the teams there. The athleticism, talent, and quickness was impressive. The best 4 teams made it with UCLA a notch lower than the rest.

I agree with part of that post. I think Duke could have played their best basketball and been nowhere near Memphis or Kansas last night. However, Duke could very easily have played with Carolina or UCLA. Keep in mind that Duke played Carolina very evenly this year. Kansas and Memphis, however, both had tremendous athleticism at all positions. Duke has one great athlete (G), some good athletes, and some very intelligent ball players (Singler and Scheyer stand out). Duke doesn't have the horses at several positions as we have had at times in the past...but we do have an extremely good core of players coming back next year, and enough components to overcome some deficiencies in pure athletic prowess.

RelativeWays
04-06-2008, 10:31 AM
Yeah, why is everybody so angst ridden about having actually,acutely and finally watched Carolina GO TO HELL?


I could eat this with a spoon, it's so damned tasty!!!!!!!!!:D

Duke fans are better people than UNC fans. Sometimes moral ambiguities and conflicts come with better taste and higher intelligence. Its a small price to pay.

CrazyCat
04-06-2008, 11:17 AM
I don't hate the players. They are kids who are doing what they love to do, and that is shooting hoops. Let me put it this way. If that was us last night, what do you think the Tarholes would be doing right now? Round about is fair play. I stand by my motto, I root for Duke and anyone who plays the Tarholes. It will be a very quiet ride home to Chapel Hell that is for sure.

Edouble
04-06-2008, 11:22 AM
Ha ha ha... I'm so glad Carolina lost, and I don't feel one smidgeon of remorse. Have you been to their campus? It's hideous. That horrible powder blue is everywhere--case in point, they sell powder blue Santa Claus figurines in the gift shop. I don't like their brand of basketball, I don't like their fans, I don't like their players, and I don't like that awful building that they play in.

I have no problem rooting against the players. OK, so they're 18-22 year old kids. But when I started rooting for Duke and against the Tarheels, I was still in diapers. By the time I was old enough, a teenager, to have the disdain really ingrained into my persona, the 'Heels players were still older than me and seems like a bunch of mean men: King Rice, JR Reid, 'Sheed, Stack, McGinnis, et al. When I was at Duke, the players were my peers, fellow college students down the road, and I never considered for a moment that it was wrong to root against them. VC, Haywood, and Ngiaye were such jerks, as a Duke student, how could I not pick them out specifically and individually out to root against? Especially when Shammond Williams came over to K-ville and started talking smack!

Now that I'm older than the players, I don't see a need to change the way I see the rivalry. The players are younger than me, but it's not like they're 10 years old or anything. They're pretty much adults in the eyes of the law and society, plus it's not like they're actually hearing me root against them. The rivalry has become more "gentlemanly" recently with Dean's retirement, but I for one, will not be lulled into good neighbor relations with the evil people down the street.

Yeah, this collection of kids may not have the classic a**es of some UNC squads, but they're definitely not angels. We all know about Danny Green. Hansbrough seems like less of a jerk, and more of a big dumb mouth-breathing oaf. Lawson is so sloppy with the ball it just kills me. Roy is so two-faced that I can't see why anyone would like him... and I'm not even talking about the Kansas thing. I can't stand how he tries to present this "Dudgum, I'm just a old laid back, Coke-lovin', likes-to-go-a-fishin'-and-a-golfin' Southern boy" when he yells and screams and carries on just as much as any other coach. I could go on, but my gut tells me that the 'Heels are hiding what jerks they are a little better as of recent to try to fool us all over in Gothic Wonderland.

It's always great when Carolina loses.

devildeac
04-06-2008, 11:49 AM
Kupchak was really good in college and in the pros. As a pro he got himself into a perfect position in 1981 as a center for the Showtime Lakers, but unfortunately blew his knee out. To his credit, he came back as a valuable reserve (he wasn't the same player he was before) for at least one championship team. Also to his credit, he got his MBA at UCLA and is now the Laker general manager.

I don't think this is the kind of guy you would dislike.

He wanted K as his coach-he can't be that bad a guy:D

Bostondevil
04-06-2008, 12:30 PM
Was Kupchak that good?

Kupchak played at Carolina when I was a kid, when it's easier to see the world in black and white, when Duke was an ACC cellar dweller, when the kids at school would salivate to talk to me on Monday mornings because I was the only Duke fan in my class.

I don't hate any of the players today like I hated Kupchak and then Yonaker and O'Koren. But yes, Kupchak was that good. (And like Hansbrough, no national championships.)

The Slamming Butcher
04-06-2008, 12:49 PM
I could eat this with a spoon, it's so damned tasty!!!!!!!!!:D


+1

I don't know that it could have been any sweeter, given all that has transpired this season.

NYC Duke Fan
04-06-2008, 01:03 PM
Why do you hate Roy ? Did you hate him when he coached Kansas or just because he coaches Carolina do you hate him.?

I would venture to say that around the country more people hate Coach K than Roy...I am not talking about disliking Duke basketball.

Did people hate Coach Wooden when he was winning all those championships?

freedevil
04-06-2008, 01:34 PM
I dislike Roy Williams, NYC Duke Fan, because he:

1) Always talks in the third person. Huge strike one.
2) Always talks about events in relation to himself. He never, ever, can talk about the importance of something without including his own role in the event. For example, check out his comments after the passing of Gary Prosser - the man found a way to mention his own National Championship, a la Gary Williams, in relation to how good of a friend Prosser was to him.
3) Wears hideous ties.

Buckeye Devil
04-06-2008, 01:43 PM
with the tie comment. The one last night was deserving of a loss in and of itself.


I dislike Roy Williams, NYC Duke Fan, because he:

1) Always talks in the third person. Huge strike one.
2) Always talks about events in relation to himself. He never, ever, can talk about the importance of something without including his own role in the event. For example, check out his comments after the passing of Gary Prosser - the man found a way to mention his own National Championship, a la Gary Williams, in relation to how good of a friend Prosser was to him.
3) Wears hideous ties.

OZZIE4DUKE
04-06-2008, 01:58 PM
Why do you hate Roy ? Did you hate him when he coached Kansas or just because he coaches Carolina do you hate him.?


I don't hate Roy Williams. I was thrilled when he took the reins at carolina because it was always been so much fun to beat him when he coached at Kansas. It is even more fun to beat him now, although it hasn't always worked out that way the last couple of years.

Indoor66
04-06-2008, 02:11 PM
Did people hate Coach Wooden when he was winning all those championships?

Many people disliked Wooden and the dominance of UCLA for a number of reasons. Not the least of which was the belief that the players were paid.

eddiehaskell
04-06-2008, 02:13 PM
My dad said he didn't like how easily they got into the tournament every year whereas ACC schools had to fight it out. I wonder how many championships UCLA would've won if they played in the ACC.

dukemsu
04-06-2008, 02:30 PM
Many people disliked Wooden and the dominance of UCLA for a number of reasons. Not the least of which was the belief that the players were paid.

Good point. The name Sam Gilbert (the alleged sugar daddy through the Wooden years) makes many UCLA people seethe.

Wander
04-06-2008, 02:32 PM
If you need to question being happy after watching UNC get humiliated then maybe you should quit being a sports fan and go play Chutes and Ladders or something.

Lavabe
04-06-2008, 02:39 PM
I dislike Roy Williams, NYC Duke Fan, because he:

...
3) Wears hideous ties.

Judging from Roy and Sylvia, apparently poor fashion sense is a coaching requirement in Tacky Blue Land.;)

I turn the question back to NYC Duke Fan: What's there to like about Roy Williams?

Cheers,
Lavabe

freedevil
04-06-2008, 02:49 PM
Judging from Roy and Sylvia, apparently poor fashion sense is a coaching requirement in Tacky Blue Land.;)

I turn the question back to NYC Duke Fan: What's there to like about Roy Williams?

Cheers,
Lavabe

Am I wrong, or did Roy's tie from last night make an appearance in 2005 as well? Maybe he thought it would bring him good luck...

Edouble
04-06-2008, 04:50 PM
If you need to question being happy after watching UNC get humiliated then maybe you should quit being a sports fan and go play Chutes and Ladders or something.

I don't know. Some of these people might feel bad if someone has to go down that really big chute.

captmojo
04-06-2008, 05:55 PM
Some losses are better than others. Last night's was particularly sweet in that hopes were crushed. I like a hole loss better when they drop one in that style. If they get whupped by 30 or more, their fans forgot the game was going on.

When they cut the big margin down, that's where hopes got on the rise. It's like losing that close 1 or 2 point game, only better. The same, only different. :)

kinghoops
04-06-2008, 07:27 PM
No. Never gave it a second thought.

9F Cheers,
Lavabe

hell lavabe i didnt give it a third ,fourth , or fifth thought

Lavabe
04-06-2008, 07:47 PM
Am I wrong, or did Roy's tie from last night make an appearance in 2005 as well? Maybe he thought it would bring him good luck...

You mean Roy's amazing technicolor dream tie? Check out the guy (http://www.latimes.com/sports/printedition/la-sp-ncaa6apr06,1,6275652.story) behind him too!

You know ... that game still feels good nearly 24 hours later.
9F Cheers,
Lavabe

Edouble
04-06-2008, 11:52 PM
You mean Roy's amazing technicolor dream tie? Check out the guy (http://www.latimes.com/sports/printedition/la-sp-ncaa6apr06,1,6275652.story) behind him too!

You know ... that game still feels good nearly 24 hours later.
9F Cheers,
Lavabe

That's Steve Robinson. He used to be a head coach at his own ACC school (FSU). Kinda sad that he's reduced to dressing up in Roy-wear so he can sit on UNC's bench and keep track of assists in whatever weird wear the 'Heels chart them.

wilko
04-07-2008, 12:39 AM
I got a bud (Duke fan) who took another Bud (UNC fan) of to the Caines game. As payback for a favor... Anyways.. Bud #2 went out of his way to bud # 1 and mentioned that "he was saving rubbing my nose in the WVa loss until the Heels won it all" ... needless to say im loaded for bear with BOTH barrels..

Almost EVERY time I watch a Heels game they look great. I pretty much stopped earlier this year. So I flipped on the game and watched Kansas and UNC tip it off... I figured I'd give it a min or 2 and switch it off once UNC took a lead... UNC played a PERFECT game for the 1st half. Thats what I want out of them every time they suit up. I hardly ever get to relish something like that. Thing of beauty.

Now some folks say thats a tuff spot to put an 18-22 yo with all the pressure and such; we recruited some of those guys and to cut them some slack. I buy it to a point. I kinda equate them to public figures... or very least regional celebrities. Its part of going to a high profile school. If you cant stand the heat get out of kitchen... and if these guys were so FAB, why are they wearing the wrong shade of Blue?

No that was GREAT TV last nite. I only wish wish Duke could have administed that colonoscopy and beat them 2x in the same game. Bully for KU!! Thanks Guys and good Luck!

As for my Heel buddy that I know is creeping around the bend..
Im gonna lay low... but WHEN I do connect with him... I plan to lie. Im gonna tell him that I was pulling for UNC ... ACC pride and all that... let him know Im disappointed. He wont expect that.. Im banking that Dukes good fortunes will return at some point... and when they do. I will admonish him MOST heartily for not reciprocating and backing Duke. I'll make him feel like the Heel he is and that will be most delicious.

glutton
04-07-2008, 04:01 AM
Why do you hate Roy ? Did you hate him when he coached Kansas or just because he coaches Carolina do you hate him.?

I would venture to say that around the country more people hate Coach K than Roy...I am not talking about disliking Duke basketball.



No, I didn't hate Roy when he coached Kansas (kind of felt sorry for him, although he made picking my brackets a lot easier).

Why do I hate him now? "Hate" may be too strong a word. I dislike Roy for the following reasons.

1. The Southern Good Ol' Boy routine. It's all very modest and self-effacing, with the "aww shucks" and "dadgumit"s, but I don't think it's genuine. And false modesty isn't really any better than flat-out arrogance.
2. Talks about his feelings more than any self-respecting coach should. The second the Kansas-UNC matchup was set, you just knew you'd be subjected to sob stories about how having to play Kansas was "weighing heavy on his heart" and makes him want to cry, etc, etc.
3. In the post-game press conference, compared playing basketball to curing cancer. For real. And that kind of goes back to the whole taking-himself-too-seriously, world-revolves-around-Roy business.
4. The tie. There's just no excuse for that.

Devilsfan
04-07-2008, 05:58 AM
Ingenuine maybe, country bumkin probably, millionaire K-Mart dresser, for sure, tremendous recruiter definitely, outcoachable absolutely.