Stephen Curry would get my vote...

[captmojo]

...for player of the year. Who's left to stop him?

[TexasDevil]

That kid is my new hero. He saved my bracket.

[DukeDevilDeb]

PLEASE let it be Davidson.... I would LOVE to see them take it to Carolina. After all, they only lost by 4 earlier in the year.

Hooray, Wildcats!

[captmojo]

Who would win a game of one-on-one, Curry or Beaker? If they were to play make-it/take-it, I'm not convinced that Mr. Beaker would ever get possession.

[freedevil]

It would be truly amazing to see them beat UNC.

[EarlJam]

When was the last year a player "hijacked" the NCAA Tournament so much?

This has been his coming out party - and that's an obvious over-statement.

I hadn't heard of him prior to the year.

Now he's arguably the most popular player in the nation.

Amazing. Roll on Curry!

-Mr. EarlJam

[Wander]

Damn. I thought this was going to be about voting for him for president...

On a quasi-related note, I think Curry is what Scheyer could be with a little improvement and more of taking-over-games mentality. Kinda.

[jipops]

The bank shot and the reverse scoop were amazing plays. I know it's a cliche' but he is one of those guys where the game comes a little easier. This kid just plays at a higher level than anyone else on the floor.

[jipops]

Damn. I thought this was going to be about voting for him for president...

On a quasi-related note, I think Curry is what Scheyer could be with a little improvement and more of taking-over-games mentality. Kinda.

Even if Scheyer scored 30+ in 3 straight games, he still probably wouldn't get the credit he deserves around here.

[doctorhook]

Jon has a lot of the same skills, but Curry is much quicker and his shot release is much faster than Jon's. I hope it would not affect his shot too much, but I would love to see Jon speed up his shot release. Doc

[OZ]

... and to quote Coach K after we played them, "This (Davidson) is a well coached team!"

[wisteria]

When was the last year a player "hijacked" the NCAA Tournament so much?

This has been his coming out party - and that's an obvious over-statement.

I hadn't heard of him prior to the year.

Now he's arguably the most popular player in the nation.

Amazing. Roll on Curry!

-Mr. EarlJam

He was pretty brilliant already last year.
But yeah, national recognition wise, this is his coming out party.

[Ben63]

When does he accept the Most Outstanding Player Award. They dont have to win another game and I would still vote him.

Dont think thats how the award works but what do I know.

[kydevil]

When was the last year a player "hijacked" the NCAA Tournament so much?

This has been his coming out party - and that's an obvious over-statement.

I hadn't heard of him prior to the year.

Now he's arguably the most popular player in the nation.

Amazing. Roll on Curry!

-Mr. EarlJam

He did play a really great game vs Md. last year in the NCAA tourny if my memory serves right?

[wiscodevil]

to the hoops experts:

disclaimer - i have curry on my fantasy squad, so i am rooting for him. AND I love watching what he does on the court.

why wouldn't you just double team him non-stop for a whole game? As soon as someone else has the ball you put two guys on him, one watching the front of his jersey, one watching the back.

Are the rest of the Wildcats going to score 50-60 points without him?

Discuss.
P.S. I said this before tonight's game.

P.P.S What happened to Hughes? Did he get hurt?

[kydevil]

They have other players that are capable- Richards, Big man down low can't recall his name. I saw Wisc. attempt to double up on him and he made some really nice passes for easy hoops.

I do agree though, if I wasp playing davidson I wouldn't let Curry beat me... if thats possible?

[SupaDave]

He's a lottery pick right now. He reminds me eerily of Kobe with a chance to go to college. He's got the pedigree like Kobe. Fiesty skills. Good handles. Reggie Miller type game with some of his dad mixed in.

I wouldn't doubt it if he stayed in school though. Once he gains a few pounds and maybe even another inch or two - look out. Davidson could easily be pre-season ranked next year off the strength of him alone.

There are a lot of player's sons coming along nowadays but this kid could be the best incarnation yet.

With Gerald Henderson coming in second - especially if he gets a post-up game.

[sundown]

to the hoops experts:

disclaimer - i have curry on my fantasy squad, so i am rooting for him. AND I love watching what he does on the court.

why wouldn't you just double team him non-stop for a whole game? As soon as someone else has the ball you put two guys on him, one watching the front of his jersey, one watching the back.

Are the rest of the Wildcats going to score 50-60 points without him?

Discuss.
P.S. I said this before tonight's game.

P.P.S What happened to Hughes? Did he get hurt?

So you want to double him before he has the ball? Davidson would score every time down the floor if they were allowed to play 4-on-3. Unless you're playing against a middling YMCA team, you can't win by employing a defensive strategy that always leaves someone wide-open.

[mgtr]

I would expect (and hope) that Curry stays in school until he graduates. Assuming we continue to schedule them, they could give us fits for the next two years. Davidson is a fantastically good school, and I wish them nothing but the best. Curry is great, but they have other wonderful players. McKillop must have one of the best eyes for talent in the country.

[mgtr]

So you want to double him before he has the ball? Davidson would score every time down the floor if they were allowed to play 4-on-3. Unless you're playing against a middling YMCA team, you can't win by employing a defensive strategy that always leaves someone wide-open.

Hey, I played on a middling YMCA team many, many years ago, so I resent that putdown. Actually, you are right, and I was the guy who benefitted from bunnies because the other team doubled the good guys. Consequently, I was wide open for easy layups. So, I guess you are right. Hurts, though.

[dukebdx12]

i could not see curry coming out of college. Going to a school like davidson i can see him graduating. Plus my opinion he needs to put on a few pounds. great player this year and ncaa tourney and i think 4 of there 6 loses came from duke, n.c, ucla, and nc state. Thats a hell of a schedule for a team such as davidson...or any team. i had davidson winning but not this far. I hope they continue and i am sure im not alone.

[mcdukie]

I agree that it would be worth it to try and double team him because not only is he good but he is playing out of his mind. The problem I see is that he moves so well without the ball he makes that notion harder than you think.

[sandinmyshoes]

Rather than double team him all the time, if I had the depth I'd just try to wear him down by being very physical with him. Nothing dirty, but make him run through some rough screens on defense. Step out hard when they're trying to screen for him on offense. You'll get some fouls called on you, but you just might take his legs away from him by the mid point of the second half.

Wisconsin was a team that could have done that, but they were just way too slow to pull it off. Curry was gone by the time any player tried to get near him. :D

[JasonEvans]

A few comments--

First of all, Stephen will not get any Player of the Year or even All-American awards this year as all the notable ones are voted on prior to the NCAA Tourney making his recent exploits null-and-void when it comes to getting those honors. Of course, his performance in the Tourney will likely give him a big leg up on awards for next season, should he decide to stay.

Secondly, regarding the draft, Curry does not need the money, that's for sure. Even though his father was never a big NBA star, being a solid bench player for a decade plus makes you a pretty decent living. Dell Curry made over $20-million from his NBA salary over the years. The Curry family has no need for money.

It is also worth noting that Stephen is not a lottery pick right now and it would really take a lot for him to become one. Yes, he will likely be a first rounder when he does come out, but he is a 6-3 (looks like he might be smaller than that) shooting guard who is not an elite athlete nor is he physically dominant with his strength. He is not a wizard passing/handling the ball either. What he is is an elite shooter, and those are valuable, but I'd be very surprised if any NBA team used a lottery pick on a shooter like him. He will struggle to find a position in the NBA (most NBA 2-guards are more like 6-5). Look no further than JJ Redick, who is a superior shooter/scorer to Curry and who has better size but who is likewise struggling to get much playing time.

It will be interesting to see how McKillop is able to parlay Davidson's run into some recruiting success. After Gonzaga made a couple tourney runs, it was able to begin getting top 100 recruits and sometimes even Mickie Dee-level talent. That is how the Zags have remained an elite team for the better part of a decade and show no sign of slipping back (unlike many other mid-majors who rise and then fall back). McKillop should go out right now and find a kid or two who want to play with Curry right away and bring those kids in or Davidson could slip back. McKillop has always recruited really well overseas and his only current recruit is a 6-8 kid from Greece. McKillop needs to get someone else, preferably someone with some size, as Davidson graduates two of their top frontcourt players in Thomas Sander and Boris Meno. They also graudate Curry's backcourt mate, PG Jason Richards. The loss of those three players could impact Curry's decision a bit as Davidson will be hard-pressed to be nearly this good next season and Curry may want to leave with a bang, not a whimper.

We'll see... I hope he has multiple games left to play!!

--Jason "as an aside, he has now scored over 900 points this season, if they make the NCAA finals he could go for 1000 in a season, which is really something amazing" Evans

[davekay1971]

to the hoops experts:

disclaimer - i have curry on my fantasy squad, so i am rooting for him. AND I love watching what he does on the court.

why wouldn't you just double team him non-stop for a whole game? As soon as someone else has the ball you put two guys on him, one watching the front of his jersey, one watching the back.

Are the rest of the Wildcats going to score 50-60 points without him?

Discuss.
P.S. I said this before tonight's game.

P.P.S What happened to Hughes? Did he get hurt?

Jimmy V would go to a box-and-one. Gotta love the junk defenses.

Curry would get my vote as POY. He probably should have been in the conversation before the tournament, but, of course, the national media doesn't pay attention to small conference schools. I'm sure they thought he wouldn't be scoring that well against big time competition. Gonzaga, G'Town, and Wisconsin would probably attest otherwise. I certainly think he's more deserving of the award than Hansbrough, who has NBA level talent around him, and owes part of his success to the Carolina refs sending him to the line if someone breathes close to him, while allowing him to camp in the lane, stroll with the ball, and climb over backs.

[moonpie23]

GOOOOOOOOOOOOO davidson......!!!

[Jumbo]

He's a lottery pick right now. He reminds me eerily of Kobe with a chance to go to college. He's got the pedigree like Kobe. Fiesty skills. Good handles. Reggie Miller type game with some of his dad mixed in.

I wouldn't doubt it if he stayed in school though. Once he gains a few pounds and maybe even another inch or two - look out. Davidson could easily be pre-season ranked next year off the strength of him alone.

There are a lot of player's sons coming along nowadays but this kid could be the best incarnation yet.

With Gerald Henderson coming in second - especially if he gets a post-up game.

There is no chance Curry will be a lottery pick. None. I love the kid, and I think he has a shot to make the league. But Randolph Childress was an incredible college player and he bairly sniffed the league.

[Jumbo]

to the hoops experts:

disclaimer - i have curry on my fantasy squad, so i am rooting for him. AND I love watching what he does on the court.

why wouldn't you just double team him non-stop for a whole game? As soon as someone else has the ball you put two guys on him, one watching the front of his jersey, one watching the back.

Are the rest of the Wildcats going to score 50-60 points without him?

Discuss.

It sounds nice, in theory. Here's part of the problem -- some of Curry's most magnificent work comes off the ball. He shoots so well coming off screens, and with such a quick release, that takes doubling him out of the equation. So, you're left with two options. One would be double-teaming him all the time OFF the ball and if you did that then, yes, Davidson has enough good players to burn you. The other is trapping him hard as soon as he puts it on the floor. I have no problem doing that. But Davidson is a really good team, even beyond Curry.

[Jumbo]

Damn. I thought this was going to be about voting for him for president...

On a quasi-related note, I think Curry is what Scheyer could be with a little improvement and more of taking-over-games mentality. Kinda.

I see very few similarities between Curry and Scheyer. Curry is a small (there's no way he's 6'3") guard with a quick release and a deadly shot who shoots extremely well off the move and looks to score first and second.

Scheyer is a big guard (6'5") who has an all-around game to die for. He is a superior defender, passer and rebounder. Of course, he doesn't shoot it nearly as well as Curry, although he's very clever putting the ball on the floor and getting to the rim for a bucket or a foul. I think the biggest thing Jon needs to improve (other than gaining some strength) is his jump shot. He is a good shooter who needs to become a great shooter, which means quickening his release, learning to shoot off screens, etc.

[freedevil]

but he is a 6-3 (looks like he might be smaller than that) shooting guard who is not an elite athlete nor is he physically dominant with his strength. He is not a wizard passing/handling the ball either. What he is is an elite shooter


I may have taken this quote out of context, but I completely disagree that he is not an elite ball handler. Did you not see his crossovers that absolutely shredded Gonzaga's full court pressure? Did you not see him dominate G-Town late by dribbling out time on the clock?

He is not just an elite shooter. Check out the lay-up he made last night - and LeBron's reaction.

[doctorhook]

Jumbo,

As I mentioned earlier in the thread, Jon's slow release on his shot is his greatest liability. His quickness is adequate ( less than Curry ), but he overcomes much of that with his savvy. A big question is do you change a guy's shot/release at this stage of his career and risk a prolonged shooting slump due to the change. Jon might be better off focusing on increasing his strength which would help him quite a bit. Freedevil, you are right, Curry is an extremely good ball handler, he just does not showcase it as much since Richards has the ball the majority of the time. Doc

[Troublemaker]

He's a lottery pick right now. He reminds me eerily of Kobe with a chance to go to college. He's got the pedigree like Kobe. Fiesty skills. Good handles. Reggie Miller type game with some of his dad mixed in.

I wouldn't doubt it if he stayed in school though. Once he gains a few pounds and maybe even another inch or two - look out. Davidson could easily be pre-season ranked next year off the strength of him alone.

There are a lot of player's sons coming along nowadays but this kid could be the best incarnation yet.

With Gerald Henderson coming in second - especially if he gets a post-up game.

Whoa there. Kobe and Curry aren't on the same planet talent-wise. I love Curry, I think he'll definitely be an NBA player, but he's not going to be anywhere close to being an MVP candidate and perhaps the best player in the game like Kobe.

Also, I suspect Davidson goes away next season. They'll still be a good team but they graduate Jason Richards, who is 1B to Curry's 1A as far as importance to the team. He's a VERY good point guard.

[Jumbo]

Jumbo,

As I mentioned earlier in the thread, Jon's slow release on his shot is his greatest liability. His quickness is adequate ( less than Curry ), but he overcomes much of that with his savvy. A big question is do you change a guy's shot/release at this stage of his career and risk a prolonged shooting slump due to the change. Jon might be better off focusing on increasing his strength which would help him quite a bit. Freedevil, you are right, Curry is an extremely good ball handler, he just does not showcase it as much since Richards has the ball the majority of the time. Doc

The easiest thing to fix in basketball is a shot, especially in college, given that the offseason is about eight months long. Much of Jon's shot is structurally sound. We're not talking about a major overhaul. He can learn to quicken his release a bit without losing accuracy. That's why these guys work so hard all summer.

If Bruce Bowen could learn to knock down open threes from the corner, anyone can become a solid shooter. Jon's already a good shooter. I have no doubt he can become great.

[Troublemaker]

Look no further than JJ Redick, who is a superior shooter/scorer to Curry and who has better size but who is likewise struggling to get much playing time.

I agree with 99% of your post, Jason. About this specific line, ooooh, I dunno. I think when you factor in that Curry is only a sophomore, I think I'd take him over JJ **ducks lightning bolts** as a shooter/scorer. He's certainly ahead of where JJ was HIS sophomore year but, of course, JJ did improve a lot as an upperclassman. It's a close call but I think I like Curry just a smidge better because to me, he looks like he scores inside the 3-pt line better.

[sagegrouse]

A few comments--

Yes, he will likely be a first rounder when he does come out, but he is a 6-3 (looks like he might be smaller than that) shooting guard who is not an elite athlete nor is he physically dominant with his strength. He is not a wizard passing/handling the ball either. What he is is an elite shooter, and those are valuable, but I'd be very surprised if any NBA team used a lottery pick on a shooter like him. He will struggle to find a position in the NBA (most NBA 2-guards are more like 6-5).

Jason:

Regarding "elite athlete" designation: While he isn't obviously strong and can't jump out of the gym (Like Gerald), I thought he was a blur on the court and extremely quick besides. I also suspect he is a lot stronger than he looks, so with 15 pounds, he could survive in the NBA and be a real force on offense.

sagegrouse

[captmojo]

Other than his shot, watch closely when opponents try to steal the ball, off the dribble, from him. Impossible. If he gets a hand on it, it stays with him. Reaction time is catlike. He's probably got the fastest hands in the college game. He'll be a pro.

[sagegrouse]

Other than his shot, watch closely when opponents try to steal the ball, off the dribble, from him. Impossible. If he gets a hand on it, it stays with him. Reaction time is catlike. He's probably got the fastest hands in the college game. He'll be a pro.

Guys that are really fast are usually strong. He looks like a 15-year-old, but I suspect he is pretty wiry.

sagegrouse

[doctorhook]

Jumbo,

If the easiest thing to fix is a shot, why did someone not fix Demarcus's shot? Doc

[Wander]

I see very few similarities between Curry and Scheyer. Curry is a small (there's no way he's 6'3") guard with a quick release and a deadly shot who shoots extremely well off the move and looks to score first and second.

Scheyer is a big guard (6'5") who has an all-around game to die for. He is a superior defender, passer and rebounder. Of course, he doesn't shoot it nearly as well as Curry, although he's very clever putting the ball on the floor and getting to the rim for a bucket or a foul. I think the biggest thing Jon needs to improve (other than gaining some strength) is his jump shot. He is a good shooter who needs to become a great shooter, which means quickening his release, learning to shoot off screens, etc.

Curry's all-around game is very good. He's hardly just a spot up shooter, although shooting is obviously his strength. Just like Scheyer, he's a good passer, a good rebounder for his size, a decent enough defender, and is capable of making tough shots in traffic. I'd say Curry is a little bit of a better rebounder and Scheyer is a little bit of a better passer. Obviously it's a pretty rough analogy but Scheyer's all-around game isn't as superior as you make it out to be, if it's even better at all.

[Jumbo]

Jumbo,

If the easiest thing to fix is a shot, why did someone not fix Demarcus's shot? Doc

A very good question, indeed...

[Jumbo]

Curry's all-around game is very good. He's hardly just a spot up shooter, although shooting is obviously his strength. Just like Scheyer, he's a good passer, a good rebounder for his size, a decent enough defender, and is capable of making tough shots in traffic. I'd say Curry is a little bit of a better rebounder and Scheyer is a little bit of a better passer. Obviously it's a pretty rough analogy but Scheyer's all-around game isn't as superior as you make it out to be, if it's even better at all.

I never said Curry was just a spot-up shooter. He has a tremendous knack for scoring in a variety of ways (at the college level). But what separates him right now is his ability to shoot on the move and with little space.

I don't know what else to say about the comparative all-around games other than to tell you that I think you're way off. Obviously, I watch every Duke game, and I'd seen Curry extensively even before this Tourney started.

Rebounding: Curry averaged about half a rebound more than Scheyer, but that's really deceiving, given the quality of competition in the Southern Conference, the position Davidson puts Curry in, the fact that he plays way more minutes, and the fact that Scheyer is on the floor with at least one other strong rebounding guard (Markie or Gerald) at all times. Would Steph Curry grab 12 boards against Pitt?

Passing: Scheyer is clearly superior. Curry gets assists because the ball is in his hands so often. He also is a turnover machine. Sure Curry had 101 assists. He also had 92 turnovers -- including 8 against Duke. Scheyer sees the floor much better. His A/TO split was 83/37. Scheyer sees the floor much better and if you're into geek stats, his ORtg (per Pomeroy) was ridiculous -- 127.4 (13th in the country). Curry's is 120.2.

Defense: Curry gambles a lot, which leads to two steals per game. But he's hardly a stopper. Scheyer is one of the most underrated wing defenders in the country. His denial ability is extraordinary. And, despite not gambling nearly as often as Curry, he aveaged 1.4 spg in fewer minutes.

Look, Curry is an incredible college player and a fantastic scorer. My original point was that he and Scheyer are in no way similar, and I stand by that.

[Wander]

I highly doubt Curry would grab 12 boards against Pitt. I also highly doubt that Scheyer would grab 12 boards against Pitt if we played them again. At the least, I don't think one is clearly superior to the other.

As for passing, I think you're way off. Curry does have the ball in his hands a lot, but I also think he has great vision. He does turn it over more than Scheyer, but I think it's an exaggeration to call him a turnover machine. He did have 8 against Duke but that's the exception, not the rule. Also, keep in mind how much attention Curry gets from opposing defenses as opposed to how much attention Scheyer gets. That offensive geek rating you quote for Curry is very, very good.

As far as defense, that's part of my point - both Scheyer and Curry are viewed by the common fan as offensive players, but they're also both underrated on defense because they're quicker than most people give them credit for. I think Scheyer's underrated on defense but I don't think he's as good as you do and I think Curry's better than you do.

They're both shooting guards, decent rebounders for their position, underrated on defense, very good scorers, can score on circus shots inside, good passers, very good free throw shooters, and very efficient overall. The differences in their numbers (specifically, turnovers and points) I think can be largely attributed to the fact that Curry's clearly the superior player on his team - meaning that a) he's expected to carry the scoring load for his team, and b) opposing defenses key in on him, which results in more turnovers. But other than Curry's clearly superior shooting, their games are fairly similar.

[SupaDave]

You guys can doubt me but if I was a NBA GM I'd be salivating at the chance to draft him - especially if I had a first round pick to spare.

Did you guys see that look away - pause - then shoot? Yes!! That is not only Kobe like - but that's also McGrady like.

He's got the poise and that can take you a long way. I think he hits 6'5 before it's all said and done. Curry is a problem.

For the record I feel the same about Jon - he's got a "Thunder" Dan Majerle about him that I really like. He's gonna get stronger and like Dunleavy the NBA light bulb will turn on.

[JasonEvans]

You guys can doubt me but if I was a NBA GM I'd be salivating at the chance to draft him - especially if I had a first round pick to spare.

Did you guys see that look away - pause - then shoot? Yes!! That is not only Kobe like - but that's also McGrady like.

He's got the poise and that can take you a long way. I think he hits 6'5 before it's all said and done. Curry is a problem.


If Curry grows to 6-5, it would be most unusual. It is pretty rare for guys to put on an extra 2-3 inches at this age. Curry is already 20 years old. As I mentioned and others agreed, he is likely a bit shorter than his Davidson listed height of 6-3. In fact, I think he is closer to 6-1 than 6-3. At that size he is pretty much forced to go PG in the NBA. We have not seen PG-like skills out of him very much so far. Granted, he may have them and I may be wrong about him being an elite ballhandler, but the jury is certainly still out on that.

SupaDave, as for your comment about picking him up "if I was a NBA GM" and " I had a first round pick to spare."-- I don't think anyone is saying he is not a first rounder. I certainly think he is worth a 1st round pick and that he will be a decent NBA player. I just don't think you'll see teams spending anything higher than a late-lottery pick on him. My point was that NBA teams will not be salivating to get this kid-- he'd be a nice addition to many clubs but not an instant starter by any means and probably a kid who struggles a bit to get meaningful minutes his first few years until he gets stronger.

--Jason "I say all this and I am a very big Curry fan who will be rooting for him to keep on winning and to stay in school" Evans

[ForeverBlowingBubbles]

I think Curry has an NBA ready handle. He is terrific shooting off the screen - but he also looks like he usually has no trouble creating his own shot even when double teamed. He's also been incredible in the tournament in his passing ability after being double teamed. It happens at the top of the key and his excellent quickness with the ball allows him to explode for 1-2 steps and get his pass off.

I think he is much more well rounded the Redick - and he is obviously much better at handling pressure in the clutch (this performance in the NCAA tourney is far past anything Redick did - sorry to have to use him as a comparison so negatively). He can create his own shot much easier, and is a much better on ball defender.

Scheyer and Curry really are not too similiar. Curry is at the same stage of his career and giving a POY esque performance night in and night out.

What a story it will be if he takes his team to the final four...

[davekay1971]

From what I can tell via his interviews and quotes, Curry isn't thinking about coming out after this year. I think he will eventually play in the NBA, and he will probably have a nice career (maybe similar to his father's). But I'm sure he's getting good advice right now, and he doesn't have an overriding financial reason to rush out of college. I suspect he's going to want to develop his game in college to the point where he thinks he can get game time when goes to the next level.

[mgtr]

I presume that he may learn something from JJ's experience in the NBA. It is not inconceivable that they talk -- there are a lot of similarities.

[ForeverBlowingBubbles]

interesting comparison from another Duke poster


Here are JJ's senior stats:
37.1 mpg, 26.8 ppg, 42.1% 3PT, 47% FG, 1.4 SPG, 2 RPG

Here are Curry's sophomore stats:
32.7 mpg, 25.5 ppg, 45% 3PT, 49.1% FG, 2 SPG, 4.7 RPG

[Channing]

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/news/story?id=3321332

Looks like he is returning to Davidson - no great surprise there.