It's Official - Flu Bug Has Hit Duke

[Udaman]

I know the family of one of our coaches. Right now, Coach K, Coach Collins, Singler, Nelson, McClure and King have the flu (or a really bad respiratory illness), over the past few days Paulus, Scheyer and Zoubek had it.

As DBR pointed out (and as I saw with him during the game), Nelson was coughing pretty bad throughout the game and during the post-game interview.

Of course this is terrible timing. The good news is that we have today off, and didn't have to play the late, late game yesterday. The doctors can give everyone saline IV's today to help them stay hydrated, and we can rest a ton.

The bad news is that 41 hours isn't really enough time to fully recover. We should feel stronger - but not 100%....and Henderson could catch this as well.

West Virginia plays a slow tempo kind of game. That might be a good thing for us. Then again, they don't turn the ball over, and this will likely come down to a half court game with the winner being whoever hits their shots. The frustrating thing is that if we do win on Saturday, then come next Thursday our team will feel like supermen (that wonderful feeling when you are back from being sick and feel like you can fly - mainly because you feel so much better than you did). We would be a force the first game of the Sweet 16. We just need to get there.

Hope they heal quickly. Got a bad feeling though. West Virginia is healthy, they will have the crowd supporting them, and our team is far less than 100%. Trouble.

[rsvman]

Only one thing to do........



Go spend as much time with the TarHeels as possible.:eek: :)

[Shammrog]

Only one thing to do........



Go spend as much time with the TarHeels as possible.:eek: :)


Perhaps an inter-squad game of Spin the Bottle would be in order?...

[Saratoga2]

I know the family of one of our coaches. Right now, Coach K, Coach Collins, Singler, Nelson, McClure and King have the flu (or a really bad respiratory illness), over the past few days Paulus, Scheyer and Zoubek had it.

As DBR pointed out (and as I saw with him during the game), Nelson was coughing pretty bad throughout the game and during the post-game interview.

Of course this is terrible timing. The good news is that we have today off, and didn't have to play the late, late game yesterday. The doctors can give everyone saline IV's today to help them stay hydrated, and we can rest a ton.

The bad news is that 41 hours isn't really enough time to fully recover. We should feel stronger - but not 100%....and Henderson could catch this as well.

West Virginia plays a slow tempo kind of game. That might be a good thing for us. Then again, they don't turn the ball over, and this will likely come down to a half court game with the winner being whoever hits their shots. The frustrating thing is that if we do win on Saturday, then come next Thursday our team will feel like supermen (that wonderful feeling when you are back from being sick and feel like you can fly - mainly because you feel so much better than you did). We would be a force the first game of the Sweet 16. We just need to get there.

Hope they heal quickly. Got a bad feeling though. West Virginia is healthy, they will have the crowd supporting them, and our team is far less than 100%. Trouble.

Good post, I had no idea the flu was so wide spread. Wouldn't you think that with all the players out there coughing up a storm that other teams might also pick it up. Could teams from the Washington games wind up at a big disadvantage?

[dukie8]

can we stop with the excuses? the team has been in a funk the past month (really since unc1) and the flu was a non-issue for all of those games. it's not like the team had been playing its best basketball and the belmont game came out of nowhere.

[Saratoga2]

I am getting to be an old timer and of course every year have a flu shot. In all the years I have done that, I have never had the flu. I am wondering if the team and coaches are encouraged to have a flu shot?

[Windsor]

Only one thing to do........



Go spend as much time with the TarHeels as possible.:eek: :)

Lets cozy up to West Virginia first, then we infect the Heels

[billybreen]

Where can I mail Henderson one of these?

http://us.movies1.yimg.com/movies.yahoo.com/images/hv/photo/movie_pix/touchstone_pictures/bubble_boy/jake_gyllenhaal/bubble.jpg

[SMO]

can we stop with the excuses? the team has been in a funk the past month (really since unc1) and the flu was a non-issue for all of those games. it's not like the team had been playing its best basketball and the belmont game came out of nowhere.

Personally, I'm glad this string was started. Last night I was wondering why Nelson looked sick. Now we know he is. I don't think we'll hear anyone on the team use it as an excuse but clearly it impacted their performance.

[DukePA]

can we stop with the excuses? the team has been in a funk the past month (really since unc1) and the flu was a non-issue for all of those games. it's not like the team had been playing its best basketball and the belmont game came out of nowhere.

Isn't it possible that both issues were factors last night? If so, props to Duke for playing as well as they did last night and pulling out the win despite the flu/respiratory illness/slump.

DukePA

[The Gordog]

I am getting to be an old timer and of course every year have a flu shot. In all the years I have done that, I have never had the flu. I am wondering if the team and coaches are encouraged to have a flu shot?
I never get a flu shot and never get the flu either. And I have a kindergardener and a preschooler at home.

Wash you hands and use that germ-X stuff often,
Take your vitamins every day,
Drink ginsing tea every day,
Strive for 5.

That's what works for me anyway.

[gus]

I am getting to be an old timer and of course every year have a flu shot. In all the years I have done that, I have never had the flu. I am wondering if the team and coaches are encouraged to have a flu shot?

When I was at Duke, athletes were given flu shots. It wasn't required, but was strongly encouraged. I can't imagine that's changed...

[aimo]

It's not the flu. They'd all be in bed, not running down the court. Just a nasty virus, possibly RSV, though that can come pretty close to being as bad as the flu. RSV has been widespread around the area this winter.

Whatever it is, they need to get as much rest as possible (yeah, right) and plenty of fluids. Keep your fingers crossed for Saturday.

No wonder K kept telling Gerald to take over.

[Udaman]

Just a fact.

I don't think it's fair to say, "Nelson played horribly, and let us down," when in reality the guy was out there playing sick. It's an explanation, not an excuse.

It's also bad timing.

No, it doesn't change the fact that we have played tired down the stretch. But it does explain a little why Nelson was a shadow of himself out there.

[SMO]

Just a fact.

I don't think it's fair to say, "Nelson played horribly, and let us down," when in reality the guy was out there playing sick. It's an explanation, not an excuse.

It's also bad timing.

No, it doesn't change the fact that we have played tired down the stretch. But it does explain a little why Nelson was a shadow of himself out there.

Well said. It's up to the team to overcome it and they know that. Now we do too.

[DukeFencer]

When I was at Duke, athletes were given flu shots. It wasn't required, but was strongly encouraged. I can't imagine that's changed...

Still strongly encouraged but not required, don't know if it's different on the basketball team. But the flu strains that were most rampant this year were mostly resistant to the vaccine (about a month ago it was big news all over the east coast.)

[Raleighfan]

Good post, I had no idea the flu was so wide spread. Wouldn't you think that with all the players out there coughing up a storm that other teams might also pick it up. Could teams from the Washington games wind up at a big disadvantage?

Somehow I doubt that these guys had/have respiratory flu; with that kind of flu (for which we take flu shots), you can hardly get out of the bed much less play a game like basketball. I had a flu shot and didn't get flu, but I did get some kind of crud---some form of bronchitis---which caused lots of coughing and generally made me feel lousy. If our guys had the stuff that I did, I salute them for playing through it.

[wisteria]

While it certainly looks like built-in excuse, the truth is none of the coaches/players mentioned anything about sickness. At least I didn't hear any. Fans and certain media got the idea from the way their voices sounded and from all the coughs and running noses. While the sickness seems like a fact, whether the poor performance could be justified by the sickness is another issue. I'm gonna go ahead and say, no, the team has to play better and play through whatever diseases that are going around.

[Scorp4me]

can we stop with the excuses? the team has been in a funk the past month (really since unc1) and the flu was a non-issue for all of those games. it's not like the team had been playing its best basketball and the belmont game came out of nowhere.

Excuses? Most people stay home from work when they get a stuffy nose and I can guarantee most jobs aren't as demanding as an NCAA Tournament game. Some of you are unbelieveable! I for one am darn proud of the kids!

[AtlDuke72]

Excuses? Most people stay home from work when they get a stuffy nose and I can guarantee most jobs aren't as demanding as an NCAA Tournament game. Some of you are unbelieveable! I for one am darn proud of the kids!


Best post of the year. Those guys play their hearts out every game. Injuries and illnesses are not imaginary and they do affect how people play. Sometimes players even have a bad game when they are well - it is the nature of sports not a personality disorder. Some of the whining and comments were very offensive. Demarcus has been an unbelievable leader and player this year. To turn on him after a bad game is unbelievable. Go to Inside Carolina.

[BD80]

If this happened to Ol' Roy, he would appear in hospital gown with an IV in place and gasp into the microphone how his kids were so brave and that the refs shouldn't be so hard on kids who are so sick.

For Duke, it is next play. I just wish I had known about this before making the picks :(

This does explain why the energy level was so low on the bench. For those who are suggesting that there is something that the team could have done to resist this virus or prevent its transmission have absolutely no concept of the level of contact and exertion (sweat) that occurs in practice at this level. As lovely as ginseng tea sounds, I doubt any of us have that level of infectious contact in our daily lives. Once one of the players had it, transmission to most of the players was inevitable.

[killerleft]

I have heard no one at Duke making excuses. I AM glad we have found out about it, though. It explains a few things. Markie has played great defense against many of the better players around. But he just couldn't keep up last night.

That Duke tries to make lemonade out of lemons instead of crying about every hangnail, like Ol' Roy, is something that I appreciate very much.

Belmont played their hearts out and deserve the accolades they are getting.

And our guys reap the benefit down the road.

[buddy]

I am getting to be an old timer and of course every year have a flu shot. In all the years I have done that, I have never had the flu. I am wondering if the team and coaches are encouraged to have a flu shot?

This year's flu vaccine turned out to be only about 40% effective. I had the shot and the flu. There is also a bronchitis-like virus infection going around. Both are very debilitating. Even though these guys are young and in fabulous shape, these illnesses will stop you dead in your tracks. We can only hope that they are on the road to recovery. We need a strong effort from everyone tomorrow, and especially the healthy players. K doesn't believe in excuses, which would explain why this hasn't been mentioned in the press. Hopefully some reporter will pick up from Markie's interview that maybe the Devils are understrength.

[_Gary]

Count me in as one that's glad to have gotten this report. Thanks Udaman. What bugs me most is that it was darn clear after the game, during the presser, that Coach K was sick as a dog. Yet not one reporter asked about it? You'd have thought one guy could/would have figured it out and at least asked the question. Even though Coach would have blown it off (no pun intended) it still could have been reported. Anyone want to bet that if this was UNC it would have been reported and a running scroll on ESPN would have kept the nation informed of it 24/7?

My apologies for coming down a little hard on Markie last night. Hope he and the other guys can recover quickly. I agree with Udaman that *if* we can somehow get by WV we will actually be in good shape for a Sweet 16 game next Thursday. A big "if" to be sure.

[ajtrublu]

can we stop with the excuses? the team has been in a funk the past month (really since unc1) and the flu was a non-issue for all of those games. it's not like the team had been playing its best basketball and the belmont game came out of nowhere.

There's a difference between an excuse and an explanation. It doesn't give them a pass on playing below their capabilities, but it does give a little insight into why they might have. I, for one, appreciate knowing the facts.

[ajtrublu]

Best post of the year. Those guys play their hearts out every game. Injuries and illnesses are not imaginary and they do affect how people play. Sometimes players even have a bad game when they are well - it is the nature of sports not a personality disorder. Some of the whining and comments were very offensive. Demarcus has been an unbelievable leader and player this year. To turn on him after a bad game is unbelievable. Go to Inside Carolina.

I vote yours the best post of the year. Well said.

[UrinalCake]

The effects of the flu on the coaches should not be overlooked either. While they may not be running up and down the court, there is still an enormous physical and mental toll required of managing a game, not to mention the days of preparation beforehand. I don't know too many 60+ year-olds with the physical capacity to do these things while dealing with the flu, all the while taking crap from the media who are anxious to proclaim that they've lost their "edge."

[blazindw]

Alright, everyone, dig in your kitchens. First, we need lots of chicken soup. We also need orange juice and vitamins, along with some cold medicine. Send it over to the team hotel immediately.

Secondly, quarantine all the sick players and coaches so the sickness doesn't spread. As much rest as possible.

Finally, we need everyone with tickets to come out in force to the Verizon Center tomorrow. The entire arena will once again be against us, since the Xavier-Purdue winner will be facing the winner of our game. Everyone cheering against us means that they don't want to see us in the next round. Let's do our part in trying to energize our team just like we do in Cameron. When the team's playing well, we're loud. When they need a pick-me-up, we encourage them. The team feels us, so let's let them (and everyone else) know that we're behind them. Let's bring the noise and cheer loud for Dear Old Duke!

[Jumbo]

It's not the flu. They'd all be in bed, not running down the court. Just a nasty virus, possibly RSV, though that can come pretty close to being as bad as the flu. RSV has been widespread around the area this winter.

Whatever it is, they need to get as much rest as possible (yeah, right) and plenty of fluids. Keep your fingers crossed for Saturday.

No wonder K kept telling Gerald to take over.

Exactly. People have a tendancy to refer to any viral illness as the "the flu." That's why the term "flu-like symptoms" is appropriate. The actual flu -- influenza -- is a lot more debilitating than what's been going around.

[g4orce]

This year's flu vaccine turned out to be only about 40% effective. I had the shot and the flu. There is also a bronchitis-like virus infection going around. Both are very debilitating. Even though these guys are young and in fabulous shape, these illnesses will stop you dead in your tracks. We can only hope that they are on the road to recovery. We need a strong effort from everyone tomorrow, and especially the healthy players. K doesn't believe in excuses, which would explain why this hasn't been mentioned in the press. Hopefully some reporter will pick up from Markie's interview that maybe the Devils are understrength.

I remember reading that the flu vaccine is always based upon what type of strain(s) that they expect to spread, and that the reason that so many people have caught the flu/whatever bug it is is that the strain was different than what was projected.

I'm proud of the guys for playing through whatever they have, and I believe it is obvious that they have something. Everyone seemed so off of their game from the effects of this, so to still get a W despite the inspired play of Belmont is great.

Yeah, we've had a slump, but I think the combination of Singler hitting the wall, injuries, general fatigue from being beaten up and then also trying to reintroduce Zoubek and Smith into the lineup have all contributed to it. I have faith in K and how we will handle this.

[throatybeard]

Exactly. People have a tendency to refer to any viral illness as the "the flu." That's why the term "flu-like symptoms" is appropriate. The actual flu -- influenza -- is a lot more debilitating than what's been going around.

Where do the ubiquitous "flu-like symptoms" fall in this spectrum?

And do anyone but athletes suffer from "flu-like symptoms?"

[greybeard]

Excuses? Most people stay home from work when they get a stuffy nose and I can guarantee most jobs aren't as demanding as an NCAA Tournament game. Some of you are unbelieveable! I for one am darn proud of the kids!

The team has to play well enough to win. They did. End of story.

[Devil in the Blue Dress]

Coach K's voice had the raspy sound for a while before the final game of the regular season. DeMarcus has been coughing for weeks. If the upper respiratory infection the players and coaches are experiencing is anything like what's been going around in various parts of NC, it certainly may be an influence on how the team has played for the past 3-4 weeks. (I speak from firsthand experience how this crud makes one feel!) Getting rest and plenty of fluids along with OTC medications intended to treat the symptoms is what it takes to get past the stuff. It runs its own course. Since some of them have been bothered by this problem for 2-3 weeks, they may begin to pull out of it during the tournament. We've got to think positively and expect that the medical staff traveling with the team knows what to do to help them feel as well as possible.

[rsvman]

Where do the ubiquitous "flu-like symptoms" fall in this spectrum?

And do anyone but athletes suffer from "flu-like symptoms?"

Influenza symptoms are generally more severe than symptoms caused by other respiratory viruses, but there's a fair bit of overlap. Real influenza typically causes an illness that has a rapid onset and that is marked by fever, shaking chills, headache, fatigue, cough, congestion, and overall body aches. Common cold, on the other hand, has a slow onset and usually starts with a little bit of scratchy or sore throat, and then progresses to runny nose/congestion, occasional cough, and usually does not include fever.

Any illness that has the symptoms of influenza but without PROOF of the diagnosis can be referred to as "flu-like" or "influenza-like illness." Plenty of people get these symptoms. Again, this would mean FEVER, usually chills, body aches/headache in addition to respiratory symptoms such as cough and nasal congestion. Illnesses that do NOT include fever should not be called "flu-like."

There are obviously lots of respiratory illnesses that are slightly worse than the "common cold," which I described above, but not as severe as influenza. These illnesses can be caused by a variety of viruses (but not usually RSV, as an earlier poster suggested; you can probably tell by my screen name that RSV is a virus I know a lot about).

[Troublemaker]

I'm chuckling. I can't believe some of you are so petty as to actually reject Duke's sickness as an "excuse." Either you think Duke is faking sickness, or you don't know what sick is.

When you're sick, you feel sick. That's why they call it sick.

[Madrasdukie]

Alright, everyone, dig in your kitchens. First, we need lots of chicken soup. We also need orange juice and vitamins, along with some cold medicine. Send it over to the team hotel immediately.


Without getting into the details, and empirically speaking, pomegranite juice (100%) does wonders both as a prophylactic and recovery tool to address flu-like symptoms.
I just wish our guys know of this and could get some.
I would definetly send some to the team hotel, if I knew how to do so.

[dukestheheat]

Exactly. People have a tendancy to refer to any viral illness as the "the flu." That's why the term "flu-like symptoms" is appropriate. The actual flu -- influenza -- is a lot more debilitating than what's been going around.

It sounds like the guys have some type of upper respiratory infection and NOT the full-blown influenza virus. Thank goodness for pointing out what is going around and I'm relieved that it doesn't appear to be (at least reading this) the bad guy.

Certainly, with the upper respiratory stuff, you can't breathe well and you also lose energy, but it's nothing near the full blown flu!

We can recover much more quickly from that and play like we plan to play versus West Virginia.

LET'S GO DUUUUUUUUUUKE!

we can do this! no excuses at all.

dth.

[Mike Corey]

With all due respect to the original poster, I'm told that it is not true that such a preponderance of members of the team is under the weather.

[norduck]

http://www.wral.com/sports/story/2613840/

[dukie8]

There's a difference between an excuse and an explanation. It doesn't give them a pass on playing below their capabilities, but it does give a little insight into why they might have. I, for one, appreciate knowing the facts.

except that the facts are that it was announced that k is sick (not any of the players). i have no idea why so many people on here have interpreted that as meaning that the entire duke roster of players is deathly ill with the flu and now feel better about what went on last night.

[phaedrus]

except that the facts are that it was announced that k is sick (not any of the players). i have no idea why so many people on here have interpreted that as meaning that the entire duke roster of players is deathly ill with the flu and now feel better about what went on last night.

then maybe you should read the first post in the thread.

the irony of all this - when flu (er... flu-like symptoms) season hits at duke, there's no better scapegoat than those hundreds of students who spend the winter sleep-deprived and out in the cold in k-ville.

[ricks68]

I was lucky enough to come to NC for a week to see us play the BC and Maryland games. During my stay I contracted whatever you want to call it---the "flu", URI, "flu-like symptoms", or whatever. I began feeling achiness in my joints, slight chills, a low-grade fever (Now I expect to see a debate over what that means), and general malaise the last 2 days of my trip. During my last evening in Durham, just before the Maryland game, I knew what was going on, but I was not going to miss out and be prevented from enjoying the experience. I still yelled my guts out for our team. The next morning, after getting up in the air, I had the most excruciating pain (almost like an ice pick was sticking in my ear and my head was being crushed from the air pressure difference on my sinuses) during my entire flight back home.

After arriving back home, my hearing was basically reduced by about 90-95% for two straight days and my sinuses appeared to be totally stuffed up. My first night and early morning back found me in an emergency room until in the largest medical center in the world because I thought I might die from my lungs filling with fluid. I had big-time breathing gurgling sounds coming from my lungs upon inhaling [U]and[U] exhaling. That has never happened to me before.

I am relating this to all of you because I am a health care professional that has a better understanding of these things than most of you out there, and even I thought this time that some kind of "bug" had maybe crossed the line in this case. I had a fear of actually suffocating before I could seek medical attention.

There are a bad series of "bugs" going around that are not covered by the flu shot this year. I had my flu shot. I had never contracted the "flu" since I have been getting the shots every year for over a decade. The CDC reported that they had missed on this one, and that the flu shot would be ineffective I think about 40% of the time. I was very concerned after returning from NC that this would happen to the team since I had probably contracted it sometime during my visit.

Well, it did. Coach K, the other coaches, and the team members do not make excuses for their actions. They always take full responsibility for whatever happens. They do state facts when asked, however. Since no one asked, they didn't tell. They have the "flu", people. And it is a very debilitating strain this year. I was unable to return to work for a full two weeks, and I believe I have a fairly easy job. Some people I have talked to have had symptoms persisting for up to 6 weeks, and I still have some residual symptoms. No amount of hydration or medication is going to appreciably affect them enough in a few days to allow a significant number of them to return to normalcy. It doesn't look good for us.

By the way, I was at the FF in College park over 40 years ago when Bob Verga was sick and unable to play anywhere near his potential. He had trouble even standing up, let alone play. I felt so badly for him and the team. We would have won that game with Kentucky if he was healthy. I know it. And we matched up better with Texas Western. Such is life. Even though I have regrets about that situation a lot even today, because I am a Duke fan through-and-through, reality is still reality.

Let's continue to give our team the support it deserves, and hope for the best.

ricks

[sundown]

except that the facts are that it was announced that k is sick (not any of the players). i have no idea why so many people on here have interpreted that as meaning that the entire duke roster of players is deathly ill with the flu and now feel better about what went on last night.

In case you somehow missed this thread's original post: people are basing their conclusions not on news reports, but on the report of the original poster. Now, you may be skeptical about that poster's report, and prefer to stick to the "facts" as they're "announced," but you can't seriously think that people are "misinterpreting" news reports.

Moreover, you've twice accused others here of using the team's possible illness as an excuse for their recent play, despite the fact that the only statement in this thread that even approximates excuse-making is the observation that Nelson sure looked sick last night, and maybe he didn't play well because he is sick. That's a far cry from the "AHA! That's why Duke's not playing well: they're deathly ill!" explanation that you somehow perceive. (And anyway, the observation about Nelson wasn't made until after you first harangued "people" for making excuses about Duke's recent decline.) It seems that you would like a moratorium on any discussion about possible illnesses on the Duke team for fear that that discussion might distract us from our duty to complain and blame.

[Atlanta Duke]

K definitely had more than the sniffles last night

Duke Coach Mike Krzyzewski said he had a temperature of 104 degrees :eek: during the second-seeded Blue Devils’ narrow victory against No. 15 Belmont on Thursday.

“I still don’t have my voice. That’s the thing that’s frustrating during the game, because you can’t communicate as well, even to where last night there were a couple of times I wanted to call a timeout. You’re trying to get the official and he didn’t hear me.

http://thequad.blogs.nytimes.com/

Any doctors in the house confirm my understanding a 104 fever is pretty high for someone in their 60s?

[BCGroup]

http://thequad.blogs.nytimes.com/


Thanks for the link--the expanded version of what you quoted--I love what he said about the officials!

“I still don’t have my voice. That’s the thing that’s frustrating during the game, because you can’t communicate as well, even to where last night there were a couple of times I wanted to call a timeout. You’re trying to get the official and he didn’t hear me. And then — they did a good game and everything. And one of them said, Just tap me, if you need one. I said, Oh, yeah, that will look good. You’ll throw me out of here and I’ll never coach another N.C.A.A. game for touching an official.”

[DukePA]

K definitely had more than the sniffles last night

Duke Coach Mike Krzyzewski said he had a temperature of 104 degrees :eek: during the second-seeded Blue Devils’ narrow victory against No. 15 Belmont on Thursday.

“I still don’t have my voice. That’s the thing that’s frustrating during the game, because you can’t communicate as well, even to where last night there were a couple of times I wanted to call a timeout. You’re trying to get the official and he didn’t hear me.

http://thequad.blogs.nytimes.com/

Any doctors in the house confirm my understanding a 104 fever is pretty high for someone in their 60s?

I'm a physician assistant and a fever of 104 is incredibly high for anyone.

[nczephdog]

I can't verify that this story is true, because it came to me secondhand, but it still cracks me up anyway.

Many years ago, when Kevin Salvadori was still playing for the Holes, I was attending an academic conference in Cincinnati the same weekend that the Holes were playing an early-ish round of the NCAA tourney--in fact, the Holes were staying at our hotel during the tourney (this part is definitely true). My supervisor at the time was in the hotel elevator with Kevin, and some people asked him how he and the team were doing, whether they were excited for the games, etc. Kevin replied that he had been battling illness. When people expressed concern, Kevin said with a tone of total seriousness that the illness was apparently worse than he'd originally thought: "Yeah, at first I thought it was just the flu, but it actually turned out to be influenza."

I work with Duke undergraduates, and I, too, can vouch for the tales of a flu epidemic on campus. RSV, too. The unfortunate thing is that most undergrads who got sick did so in early-mid February...how I wish that if our guys had to get the crud, they could have gotten it then with the rest of their fellow students!

[BD80]

except that the facts are that it was announced that k is sick (not any of the players). i have no idea why so many people on here have interpreted that as meaning that the entire duke roster of players is deathly ill with the flu and now feel better about what went on last night.

Prone to hyperbole are we?

Many of us actually wish the team well, and were relieved to find that there was a medical reason which may explain the team's lethargy in general and Markie's sub par performance in particular. The better question is why are you so unwilling to accept that there might be a medical reason for "what went on last night?"

"Deathly ill." Your snide attitude aside, a 104 temperature isn't far from deathly ill.

[mgtr]

I don't know if the team is deathly sick, or just has the sniffles. Regardless of the facts, I believe they will give 100% of what they have, and I will support them 100%. Go Duke!!!

[gep]

Thanks for the link--the expanded version of what you quoted--I love what he said about the officials!

“I still don’t have my voice. That’s the thing that’s frustrating during the game, because you can’t communicate as well, even to where last night there were a couple of times I wanted to call a timeout. You’re trying to get the official and he didn’t hear me. And then — they did a good game and everything. And one of them said, Just tap me, if you need one. I said, Oh, yeah, that will look good. You’ll throw me out of here and I’ll never coach another N.C.A.A. game for touching an official.”

A question... is the head coach the only one that can call a time out from the sidelines? The assistant coaches cannot? If the head coach doesn't have his voice, can he "designate" one of the assistants and "check him in" like players check in and out?

[dukie8]

Prone to hyperbole are we?

Many of us actually wish the team well, and were relieved to find that there was a medical reason which may explain the team's lethargy in general and Markie's sub par performance in particular. The better question is why are you so unwilling to accept that there might be a medical reason for "what went on last night?"

"Deathly ill." Do you think before you type? Your snide attitude aside, a 104 temperature isn't far from deathly ill.

I know the moderators would scold me for saying what I think of your trolling and negative and destructive attitude, so I will end with a simple plea. Please change your moniker to something devoid of Duke; you do not seem to like Duke as much as you enjoy baiting Dukies.

this post is so typical of the ones that assume that, if someone doesn't gush with praise about the team at all times then, the poster must somehow be "anti duke." i have 2 degrees from duke and very much hope the team does well. however, if the news report is that k is sick, i don't make this massive jump to conclusion that it necessarily means that the entire team is sick too. apparently that's what people on here have done and i find it strange. just to be clear, the 104 degree temperature was k's -- not that of anyone on the team -- and, yes, it is pretty serious.

the reason why i am "so unwilling to accept that there might be a medical reason for 'what went on last night?'" is that there is nothing to suggest this other than some posters guessing it. i'm all ears if someone can provide something more than mere conjencture. until then, i think that it is pure balderdash.

[Jumbo]

this post is so typical of the ones that assume that, if someone doesn't gush with praise about the team at all times then, the poster must somehow be "anti duke." i have 2 degrees from duke and very much hope the team does well. however, if the news report is that k is sick, i don't make this massive jump to conclusion that it necessarily means that the entire team is sick too. apparently that's what people on here have done and i find it strange. just to be clear, the 104 degree temperature was k's -- not that of anyone on the team -- and, yes, it is pretty serious.

the reason why i am "so unwilling to accept that there might be a medical reason for 'what went on last night?'" is that there is nothing to suggest this other than some posters guessing it. i'm all ears if someone can provide something more than mere conjencture. until then, i think that it is pure balderdash.

Did you read the original post? It came from someone who knows one of the coaches' families. Stop. Now.

[BCGroup]

This is...surprising...negative...not sure what I'm looking for here. First, the original poster was very clear as to the source of his/her information. There was never any indication of looking for excuses...so folks, how about backing off a bit? The world isn't over. We play tomorrow. Here's hoping that everyone is feeling better.

[SMO]

This is...surprising...negative...not sure what I'm looking for here. First, the original poster was very clear as to the source of his/her information. There was never any indication of looking for excuses...so folks, how about backing off a bit? The world isn't over. We play tomorrow. Here's hoping that everyone is feeling better.

So we've got sick coaches and players. My wife just had a similar illness from what it sounds like and you'd be amazed how much better she was after 24-48 hours of antibiotics. If it's the same type of bacterial respiratory infection, these guys might feel much better Saturday. Also, this is a deep team and WVU plays a relative slow game. Let's pull hard for Duke to get through Saturday with a W. If they do, I think we'll see a much improved engergy level next week.

[Troublemaker]

however, if the news report is that k is sick, i don't make this massive jump to conclusion that it necessarily means that the entire team is sick too. apparently that's what people on here have done and i find it strange. just to be clear, the 104 degree temperature was k's -- not that of anyone on the team -- and, yes, it is pretty serious.

Besides the fact that you're now pretending that you didn't read Udaman's post, I'm actually amused at how stupid you think the rest of us are. I'm calling you out on some dishonesty here. See if you can follow.

The WRAL story "announcing" that Coach K has a 104 degree temperature and quoting him thusly -- "Better that I'm sick than one of my players" -- was posted at 4:36 pm today. Check the link. While that quote slightly reassures me about the team's health, there's still contradicting evidence in the form of Markie's interview. But that's not even the point. The point is, your post railing against "excuses" came at 10:57 AM today. Meaning, you didn't even know about that "announcement" when you posted that. All you knew at that time was what you read from Udaman and also possibly what you read about Markie's interview, both suggesting that players are sick, but you decided anyway to make a mean-spirited, haughty post about "excuses" -- I mean, how dare anyone suggest that a team that's sick could possibly be affected by the sickness. Only YOUR reasons for why the team didn't fare well could possibly be right.

Clearly, you've thought it over some since then and decided that indeed your post this morning was a bit unbecoming, so now you're trying to revise history a bit and cover your tracks. You're going to pretend that you read a 4:36 pm "announcement" at 10:00 am. Right. Whatever. No big deal in the grand scheme of things, and I almost didn't want to mention it, but I am a bit amused.

[SMO]

Alright, so who's ready for tomorrow? Let's hope the team got a lot of rest and a lot of fluids. Let's also remember that while watching the game that several of these guys are under the weather but they can overcome it.

Mr. Positive
:)

[mgtr]

I'm pumped for Duke to come out and play their game. If we have three sick players, we still have another seven arrows in the quiver.
Lets support Duke 100%, since they always (always!!!!) give 100%. It is the least we can do.

[elvis14]

I just want to say thanks to the original poster for a little information on something we were all suspecting. I was listening to coach K's post game on the way home last night and he sounded awful. Saw some of it after I got home and he looked even worse! Hearing about the team having the "flu" doesn't make me want to make excuses, it makes me even more proud of this team.

[feldspar]

Did you read the original post? It came from someone who knows one of the coaches' families. Stop. Now.

Jumbo,

While I disagree with many of Dukie8's points and the way they were put across, I believe understand where he was coming from in his original post.

The game we saw last night was very reminiscent of what we have seen from this Duke team over the past month or so. Lethargic at many times on defense, failure to put together a complete 40 minutes, etc etc.

I think the point dukie8 was trying to make was that, ok, the team was sick. So what? It's not like it made us play any worse than we did against, say, NC State or in the first half against UNC.

I too think it's a bit illogical to buy into the "the team was sick, so that's why we almost lost" mentality. I think that's what he was trying to say, and if not, it's what I'm thinking.

[Troublemaker]

Jumbo,

While I disagree with many of Dukie8's points and the way they were put across, I believe understand where he was coming from in his original post.

The game we saw last night was very reminiscent of what we have seen from this Duke team over the past month or so. Lethargic at many times on defense, failure to put together a complete 40 minutes, etc etc.

I think the point dukie8 was trying to make was that, ok, the team was sick. So what? It's not like it made us play any worse than we did against, say, NC State or in the first half against UNC.

I too think it's a bit illogical to buy into the "the team was sick, so that's why we almost lost" mentality. I think that's what he was trying to say, and if not, it's what I'm thinking.

Why would it be illogical? It's perfectly valid to think that sickness could affect a player's ability. If someone had said, "the ONLY possible reason for the team playing poorly is sickness," then THAT would be illogical. But, as far as I know, no one has said that. As someone suggested above, maybe it was a combination of "slump" AND "sickness." They're not mutually exclusive.

Which viewpoint is more agreeable: (a) "it could be sickness" or (b) "it definitely isn't sickness. stop making excuses."

[wumhenry]

I work with Duke undergraduates, and I, too, can vouch for the tales of a flu epidemic on campus. RSV, too.
So can I. My daughter contracted the flu while tenting in Kville on a very cold night last month, and the flu eventually got complicated with pneumonia.

[feldspar]

Why would it be illogical? It's perfectly valid to think that sickness could affect a player's ability. If someone had said, "the ONLY possible reason for the team playing poorly is sickness," then THAT would be illogical. But, as far as I know, no one has said that. As someone suggested above, maybe it was a combination of "slump" AND "sickness." They're not mutually exclusive.

Which viewpoint is more agreeable: (a) "it could be sickness" or (b) "it definitely isn't sickness. stop making excuses."

How about a fun analogy, hmmm?

So, I'm a supervisor at my place of employment. I have an employee who is a great employee, does great work and is a value to the company, but over the last month or so has been showing up late on a constant basis. Not just a few minutes late, but seriously late.

This goes on for a few weeks and it comes to a point where I have to have a talk with him. I tell him that his tardiness is a problem and if he shows up late again tomorrow, I have no choice but to fire him.

The next day, he shows up late again. His coworker, who is also a friend, comes into my office and says, "Don't fire him, he was sick."

A rational person could absolutely determine that this friend was making an "excuse" for his co-worker, whether he legitimately was sick or not. He may or may not have been sick, but it doesn't explain away a pattern of behavior that must be dealt with.

Duke has struggled with the same exact types of things they struggled with last night over the course of the last half of the season. I realize that no one is necessarily writing a blank check to Duke for last night's performance based on the reported illness, but there is a certain sense of "oh, ok, well that's why we lost" going on on the board over the last 24 hours. What dukie8 was trying to express, I think, was that yeah, they were sick, but it's not like it made that much of a difference in the way we've been playing lately.

Many people feel a sense of comfort in the fact that the team was reportedly sick last night. What I'm saying is that it doesn't comfort me all that much. This team has a lot of things to work through other than a flu-bug if it's going to win tomorrow night.

[jipops]

Driving home from work, Dave Telep on 850 the Buzz mentioned that he had heard rumblings from sources close to Duke that much of team has been battling sickness. Whether or not this had something to do with Duke's performance vs. Belmont is ofcourse up for debate (I feel like it's fairly obvious at this point), but it certainly couldn't have helped.

It's nice that nobody on the staff or the team has made any kind of excuses. Wouldn't be right to somehow cheapen the great effort Belmont put on the floor last night.

[arydolphin]

This thread has become pretty interesting. You can tell that a lot of us are trying to find things to talk about between last night's game and tomorrow's game, because no one on the team will use illness as an excuse if they play badly. Thus, I don't think that we should use illness as a crutch to lean on if the team doesn't play well.

Second, you can test for the flu pretty easily, the results are back in 30-60 minutes, so everyone on the team could know if they have the flu, or if their infection is due to something else. About the flu this year: I'm a medical professional in SC, and we had a horrible time with flu in February. I actually had 1 patient die from complications due to flu, and I have another patient that almost died from it. At the time, our infectious disease specialist said that another wave of flu would be coming later in the season, so I think this may be it.

Sickness or not, I'm optimistic because Duke won on Thursday night. Last year's team lost that type of game against VCU. This team gets 40 minutes for a shot at the Sweet 16, and I'm sure they'll come out ready to play.

[mgtr]

Many people feel a sense of comfort in the fact that the team was reportedly sick last night. What I'm saying is that it doesn't comfort me all that much. This team has a lot of things to work through other than a flu-bug if it's going to win tomorrow night.

I have no way of knowing for sure whether some players were sick or were just malingering. It really doesn't matter -- either you win and advance or lose and go home. The team that played last night (exceptions: Henderson and Scheyer) didn't look a whole lot like the Duke team I have seen this season. Nelson in particular performed well below par.
I believe, to the depth of my very soul, that Duke will bring 100% of whatever they have to the game. If we have a lot of sick players, that may not be enough -- yet it will still be 100% of what they have. If we have a lot of healthy players, we will run WV into the ground. Either way, I will be proud of the way Duke plays. Period.

[Troublemaker]

feldspar, I think you're mis-reading the vibe of this board. From what I've seen, it's more "we have to play better but being sick definitely does not help" NOT "things are fine and dandy; we just need to get over this sickness." I seriously doubt anyone is feeling too much "comfort" right now after that game.

But let's use your analogy. I don't think the Belmont game was just a case of your employee showing up late again. The behavior was different. It was more like he showed up late, brought a knife with him, and started threatening co-workers. The Belmont game was more a "What the heck!" situation than something that was extremely similar to previous behavior. You've mentioned our struggles over the past month or so but how exactly did losing road ACC games and playing competitive games with UNC and Clemson prepare you for almost losing to a 15 seed? I think some people were reasonably very surprised by that game, and they believed that there had to be SOMETHING more going on than just a slump. Then, lo and behold, we get news that the team is sick and so everyone's like "Ahh, that could be it." They feel the sickness reasonably explains some of the poor play, and I don't see why you would begrudge them that thought process.

Again, I don't see anyone that's completely happy with Duke's play over the past month or so. They just believe that okay, Duke has struggled, AND Duke might be sick right now. Which is perfectly valid. I certainly hope these sources are wrong, of course. I hope we're completely healthy because we'll need that against WVU. I just hate seeing snarkiness about "excuses" when that's not what's going on and certainly the players and coaches themselves have not used sickness as an excuse.

[Pam]

Coach K's comment about tapping the official on the shoulder if he needed a time out was really great. Even running a 104 fever, he maintains a sense of humor. I am very proud of K and the team for praising Belmont's outstanding play and not using the excuse of illness to take anything away from what Belmont was able to do. Had the team been well, I still think Belmont could have given them a game. That team was quite simply better than advertised!

[feldspar]

feldspar, I think you're mis-reading the vibe of this board. From what I've seen, it's more "we have to play better but being sick definitely does not help" NOT "things are fine and dandy; we just need to get over this sickness." I seriously doubt anyone is feeling too much "comfort" right now after that game.

But let's use your analogy. I don't think the Belmont game was just a case of your employee showing up late again. The behavior was different. It was more like he showed up late, brought a knife with him, and started threatening co-workers. The Belmont game was more a "What the heck!" situation than something that was extremely similar to previous behavior. You've mentioned our struggles over the past month or so but how exactly did losing road ACC games and playing competitive games with UNC and Clemson prepare you for almost losing to a 15 seed? I think some people were reasonably very surprised by that game, and they believed that there had to be SOMETHING more going on than just a slump. Then, lo and behold, we get news that the team is sick and so everyone's like "Ahh, that could be it." They feel the sickness reasonably explains some of the poor play, and I don't see why you would begrudge them that thought process.

Again, I don't see anyone that's completely happy with Duke's play over the past month or so. They just believe that okay, Duke has struggled, AND Duke might be sick right now. Which is perfectly valid. I certainly hope these sources are wrong, of course. I hope we're completely healthy because we'll need that against WVU. I just hate seeing snarkiness about "excuses" when that's not what's going on and certainly the players and coaches themselves have not used sickness as an excuse.

First of all, excellent post, and I appreciate your thoughts.

Second, I agree that snarkiness about Duke's illness problems is unwarranted and unnecessary.

I think that, as happens VERY often, the lines of communication have been scrambled somewhat in this situation. Dukie8 was trying to make a certain point, and did it in the wrong way. He's been punished for it, so I don't think we need to dwell on that.

I also don't know that anyone is accusing the coaching staff of making excuses. I certainly haven't read that in anything I've perused over the last 24 hours.

That being said, it's perfectly acceptable for you and I to read the "vibe" of the board differently. I suspect that perhaps we do and you know what? That's perfectly okay.

I don't begrudge anyone for their thought process. But I think much of the reverse has been happening as well (much of it due to dukie8's snarkiness, but still), when there is, I feel, a legitimate argument to be made.

Cheers.

[BD80]

I have no choice but to fire him.

... "Don't fire him, he was sick."

... but it doesn't explain away a pattern of behavior that must be dealt with.

...Duke has struggled with the same exact types of things...

OH NO, PLEASE DON'T FIRE COACH K BECAUSE HE WAS SICK!!!!! :rolleyes:

Actually, I agree with your point that we need to seriously step up our level of play. I just found some COMFORT in the thought that some of the lethargy could have been illness.

My problem is with Dukie(h)8 and his unrelenting pessimism. We could say that he just can't express his thoughts as well as you, but wouldn't that be belittling his "two degrees from Duke?"

I'm not a psychologist, but I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express - such pessimists enjoy the attention they get from being so negative and can say they enjoy the times when they are wrong (Duke winning) and can revel when they are "right" (Duke losing). The worst party guests one can have.

[dyedwab]

For me, discovering that Demarcus was sick explained the weird thing I saw last night - that he looked like he was running through quicksand and was two steps slow on the defensive end. For all of our defensive problems we have had recently, Demarcus Nelson being slow wasn't one of them.

[Papa John]

I'm not a psychologist, but I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express - such pessimists enjoy the attention they get from being so negative and can say they enjoy the times when they are wrong (Duke winning) and can revel when they are "right" (Duke losing). The worst party guests one can have.

Okay... Since you stayed at a Holiday Inn Express, I nominate you to serve as dukie8's therapist... I recommend the Stuart Smalley treatment: "I'm good enough, I'm smart enough, and, gosh darnit, people like me." We need to inject some positive vibes in this multi-degreed cynic... :D

[and, to be clear, dukie8 -- I jest... I actually enjoy reading your views, though I personally would enjoy them more with slightly less vinegar every now and then... ;) ]

[Rich]

Anyone know how the team's feeling today or how they dealt with the situaton yesterday in terms of practice and/or medical assistance?

[Udaman]

No new news about the team. My "contact" information came from my spouse who talked with the spouse of a coach (we know them both, but obviously he's been pretty busy lately, thus haven't spoken with him in a few weeks).

As others have said, this thread was never meant to be one that made excuses. But rather, to try and explain why Nelson seemed so out if it, and maybe why some of the other guys seemed so lethargic. I agree that this team hasn't played like it did earlier in the season (since early Feb), and obviously it isn't because they've all been sick. But against Belmont, the flu-like symptoms certainly played a role.

Here's hoping they all feel better today.

[DeepBlue70]

I don't have any word on how the team is feeling today, but I do have the flu, in spite of having gotten my flu shot this year. Don't know if they have the brand of flu that I have but I can tell you this - if Coach K's philosophy of defense is built on communication, it is incredibly difficult to communicate when you have laryngitis! Could that have been part of the reason for defensive lapses vs Belmont?

[_Gary]

Thanks again, Udaman. I'm in full agreement with what you've said. No one is using sickness as an excuse for the sub-par play we've seen in most games since February. But the team, and DeMarcus in particular, was so "off" against Belmont it really does help to know that he and a few others were battling flu-like symptoms. Fatigue can make cowards of us all. And if sickness is the cause of that fatigue then as a fan I want to know that, because one thing that I don't ever want to see is Duke lose a tournament game because they seemed to lack emotion and will. I want to see this team fired up and never, ever get outworked.

I was seeing them get outworked at times on Thursday with loose balls and such. Especially DeMarcus. There was a point late in the 2nd half when he was guarding a Belmont player who lost control of his dribble and went down to a knee to regain control. DeMarcus just stood there. Didn't dive for the ball. Didn't even lunge for it. I was incensed, and at the end of the game when the jump ball scenario came up the only thing I could think of was that the jump ball possession arrow should have been pointed in our direction. Markie should have created that jump ball earlier and created a switching of the arrow. But finding out he was sick made a huge difference for me, because I just couldn't figure out why he didn't make a play for that loose ball earlier. Now I know.

Thanks again for the report!

[dkbaseball]

I don't ever want to see is Duke lose a tournament game because they seemed to lack emotion and will. I want to see this team fired up and never, ever get outworked.

I was seeing them get outworked at times on Thursday with loose balls and such. Especially DeMarcus. There was a point late in the 2nd half when he was guarding a Belmont player who lost control of his dribble and went down to a knee to regain control. DeMarcus just stood there. Didn't dive for the ball. Didn't even lunge for it. I was incensed, and at the end of the game when the jump ball scenario came up the only thing I could think of was that the jump ball possession arrow should have been pointed in our direction. Markie should have created that jump ball earlier and created a switching of the arrow. But finding out he was sick made a huge difference for me, because I just couldn't figure out why he didn't make a play for that loose ball earlier. Now I know.

To take the discussion to a broader context -- whenever Duke loses in the post-season, in whatever round, it generally appears to be due to fatigue. They've lost their legs, and to some extent their hearts. I have often thought that K's insistence on maximum effort at all times, and getting his team hyped up for every game, might be contributing factors.

I know this sounds heretical, but in days gone by it was an article of faith in coaching circles that players should never expend energy unnecessarily. You never saw one of John Wooden's players diving for the ball, or playing with the sort of frantic effort characteristic of Duke teams. He wanted them on an even emotional keel at all times, never getting too high or too low. Some of the great college football teams in days past used to stroll languidly into the stadium, and lie down during timeouts, the idea being to preserve as much energy as possible.

K, OTOH, demands maximum effort and a high emotional pitch all through the season, especially since he returned in '95. It's consistent with his military background -- both the tendency to reduce as many things as possible to resounding principles, and the need to cultivate a bunker-charging mentality. It's possible this can lead to weakened resistance to bugs. Certainly, it's an article of faith with older people that over-exertion leads to lowered resistance. While 20-year-old bodies can be pushed much harder, there is a line even for them that shouldn't be crossed.

I know that K is aware of the problem of keeping his players' legs, because I've heard him discuss it. I was rather disappointed though to hear Johnny D shove the issue under the rug two years ago. The interviewer pointed out to Johnny that a ref in the '86 title game against Louisville had observed that Duke had no legs at the end of the game. Johnny denied it perfunctorily, answering in a way suggesting that the party line on the Duke staff is that they have all the bases covered, including appropriate conditioning, and nothing remains to be learned on the subject. A couple weeks later Duke lost to LSU, and JJ looked like he was running through quicksand.

But this is an issue for after the season. As for today's game, I fear this Duke team is running on fumes, and I've got WVU and 3 1/2, a bet I'd be happy to lose. If this team can find the legs and heart to pull out this game, when they're obviously under the weather, I'll be hugely impressed. Winning by three would be perfect.

[grossbus]

i hope EVERYBODY feels better. let's play.

Go Duke!!

[battierfan]

I agree with your assessment. I think they're emotionally drained and they don't seem to enjoy the game. As I've said in another post, I think they can't relax - they are playing not to lose instead of to win. I think K needs to further reassess the psychology of this team.