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weezie
03-11-2008, 08:08 PM
http://abclocal.go.com/wtvd/story?section=news/local&id=6013517



Can Duke ever get a break?

BlueBlood112883
03-11-2008, 08:11 PM
I 100% agree. It was a student to student thing that was brought up by the DUKE STUDENTS!!!!! K didn't come up with it, but knuckle heads in the media, UNC fans, etc...starting whining, and crying about it. Now it's out in the media and he has to answer questions about it just like "the comment that wasn't a comment." Pathetic that this was even made out as a story and had enough legs as it did. I'd said a lot more than he did, and not been as nice about it. Especially after that last episode.

RelativeWays
03-11-2008, 08:20 PM
I think whats angering K the most is they are taking a gesture to honor someone who lost their life as yet another tit for tat in a college basketball rivalry. "our coach is better cause he wore a ribbon, K didn't, he's such a jerk" Give me a break. You could tell in that interview that he was almost in disbelief that his motives get questioned yet again even though he went above and beyond to honor Eve Carson. Its like he can't do anything to please the media at this point. They want to hate him, they want to call him a jerk, call him a hypocrite. Even some of the (more reasonable) UNC fans think this is going overboard. I have a few choice words for the media that would be frowned upon by the DBR terms of service, so instead I will virtually shake my fist at them.

FerryFor50
03-11-2008, 08:33 PM
Was there nearly as much vitriol when Roy Williams chased after Skip Prosser's recruits the week after he died?

Or how every good memory Roy mentioned of Skip was Prosser praising Williams?

Troublemaker
03-11-2008, 08:34 PM
You just have to shake your head at UNC fans sometimes. It's beyond absurd that Coach K would receive criticism for not wearing the ribbon when it was he and Duke that spearheaded the effort in the first place to honor Eve and provide her with a moment of silence as well as bring the two teams together for an embrace before the tip. I'm at a lost for words. I don't know what to compare it to. Is it like giving a gift of $10,000 to someone and having them turn around and criticize you for giving it in stacks of $20s instead of $100s? Actually, that's not even it. I can't even come up with a proper analogy for this level of hatred, for those UNC fans who dared to use Eve Carson to criticize Coach K and the coaching staff.

RelativeWays
03-11-2008, 08:38 PM
It makes me wish more UNC fans were dead to be honest. Okay, I kid. But it's absurd.

I won't go that far, but some of them have really lost touch with reality when it comes to Ewe NC basketball.

killerleft
03-11-2008, 08:43 PM
It takes a lack of integrity to even have a mind that could conjure up such a "controversy". In no way does such sleaziness reflect on the caring shown by real human beings for one another. Next play.

wumhenry
03-11-2008, 08:45 PM
So far, none of the UNC fans who've posted comments on the video have accused K of dissing Eve Carson. One calls it an inadvertent PR mistake; the others agree with K that he has nothing to apologize for.

RepoMan
03-11-2008, 09:00 PM
The whole thing is beyond mind-boggling. Implicit in the criticism of K is the suggestion that he deliberately decided not to wear a ribbon, which suggests that he deliberately intended to make some sort of insidious point by not wearing the ribbon. That is simply outrageous.

While, in this information overflow era, it may be true that some knuckleheads on fansites and elsewhere raise these issues, and while it may be true that, as the link suggests, come called the news to inquire, the media has an obligation, in my mind, not to treat everything as a "story" that must be disseminated yet more broadly. Just because "dozens" of people called or emailed the news station, doesn't mean they should bite.

What a world we live in. If K ever leaves early, it will be because of crap like this.

Troublemaker
03-11-2008, 09:07 PM
So far, none of the UNC fans who've posted comments on the video have accused K of dissing Eve Carson. One calls it an inadvertent PR mistake; the others agree with K that he has nothing to apologize for.

Actually, a couple of the replies so far have come from ***. One suggested that this controversy was K's fault and another suggested that he acted unclassy in the press conference. I mean, seriously. These people are certifiable.

weezie
03-11-2008, 09:10 PM
In Fantasyland, Roy would make another point of defending Mike.

Yeah, silly of me, I know....

Lavabe
03-11-2008, 09:16 PM
So far, none of the UNC fans who've posted comments on the video have accused K of dissing Eve Carson. One calls it an inadvertent PR mistake; the others agree with K that he has nothing to apologize for.

Sort of. In one of the comments, K's reaction on the clip is called into question:
"With that said, he should have conducted himself with class and courtesy during today's press conference instead of acting like everyone is out to get him."

Lavabe

RelativeWays
03-11-2008, 09:19 PM
Actually, a couple of the replies so far have come from ***. One suggested that this controversy was K's fault and another suggested that he acted unclassy in the press conference. I mean, seriously. These people are certifiable.

This is the reason why I generally don't attack Ol Roy for what he says in press conferences, I don't want to be one of those ***. I'm not going to say that everything he says is right or doesn't deserve some scrutiny (K deserves a bit as well) but I have better things to do with my life than twist every single quote by some basketball coach to fit my skewed worldview just because I don't like his team. I really hate it when people do that to K, so I don't really care to do that to do that to Ol Roy, Sweatin' Gary or anyone else. Also no a big fan of cognitive dissonance.

heyman25
03-11-2008, 09:20 PM
The UNC fanbase is why I could never cheer for their school even though my sister and brother graduated there. They are petty mean spirited people who show no class or respect for Duke. We honor their dead but thats not good enough. I have seen remarks at Foxsports comments and elsewhere and its reprehensible.Hopefully Danny Green and his teammates will fall short of a championship, just so their awful fans will suffer.

godukecom
03-11-2008, 09:32 PM
Hopefully Danny Green and his teammates will fall short of a championship, just so their awful fans will suffer.

AMEN! Do you know how many times people have asked me over the past few days why K wasn't wearing a ribbon? Come on, i know unc fans are not that smart, but do they really think K would DELIBERATELY dishonor the memory of Eve Carson by not wearing a ribbon? this is borderline ridiculous.

There is no greater feeling that wearing a Duke shirt the day after UNC's season has just ended.

OZZIE4DUKE
03-11-2008, 09:35 PM
AMEN! Do you know how many times people have asked me over the past few days why K wasn't wearing a ribbon? Come on, i know unc fans are not that smart, but do they really think K would DELIBERATELY dishonor the memory of Eve Carson by not wearing a ribbon? this is borderline ridiculous.

There is no greater feeling that wearing a Duke shirt the day after UNC's season has just ended.

K told the students not to use the GTHCGTH cheer. What more could he possibly do to honor Eve Carson other than throw the game? Me thinks it is time to tell Coach K about 9F so he can tell the media where they can go! We can call it 9FM - Go To Hell Media, Go To Hell!

captmojo
03-11-2008, 09:41 PM
This is just another case of the media trying to create a situation where none exists, hoping to goad an answer they can make to sound like they've made a scoop. I think the vast majority of those with interest, have full knowledge of what the facts are and know better than to take this as something controversial.

Devil in the Blue Dress
03-11-2008, 10:02 PM
This clip is from the Durham TV station. WTVD continues to lag behind WRAL in market share in the area. The promotion of this sort of manufactured crisis is typical of their strategies to try to attract viewers. The situation reflects the TV station's inability to cover news and attract viewers.

cspan37421
03-11-2008, 10:02 PM
The media thrives on controversy and it should not be surprising that one of them would stoop so low as to infer something that would serve their own interests, regardless of the context or truth. People see what they want to see, and forget the rest - it's called confirmation bias.

If Roy had any class he'd call a press conference to back up what K had to say about it, and put it to rest. Then the controversy can be over the media person responsible, or over widespread misconceptions of the Duke program.

dukie8
03-11-2008, 10:04 PM
The whole thing is beyond mind-boggling. Implicit in the criticism of K is the suggestion that he deliberately decided not to wear a ribbon, which suggests that he deliberately intended to make some sort of insidious point by not wearing the ribbon. That is simply outrageous.

While, in this information overflow era, it may be true that some knuckleheads on fansites and elsewhere raise these issues, and while it may be true that, as the link suggests, come called the news to inquire, the media has an obligation, in my mind, not to treat everything as a "story" that must be disseminated yet more broadly. Just because "dozens" of people called or emailed the news station, doesn't mean they should bite.

What a world we live in. If K ever leaves early, it will be because of crap like this.

he did deliberately decide not to wear one and it should have been abundantly obviously that he was going get slammed for it. shortly after the game was over, the subject came up on the chat and everyone was like "what was he thinking because he is going to get killed for it?" i don't care that he didn't wear one but i don't want to see him get slammed for it. that wasn't one of k's brighter moves.

cspan37421
03-11-2008, 10:12 PM
he did deliberately decide not to wear one

Do you have evidence for this claim?

Troublemaker
03-11-2008, 10:13 PM
he did deliberately decide not to wear one and it should have been abundantly obviously that he was going get slammed for it. shortly after the game was over, the subject came up on the chat and everyone was like "what was he thinking because he is going to get killed for it?" i don't care that he didn't wear one but i don't want to see him get slammed for it. that wasn't one of k's brighter moves.

I disagree completely. You're basically saying he should live life appeasing the fringe idiots and nutjobs, that he should be constantly aware of what fringe idiots and nutjobs might think about every one of his actions. Nobody reasonable could possibly turn the Eve Carson tragedy into criticism of Coach K, especially since he helped organize a touching tribute to her in the first place. It's absurd and disgusting that the fringe idiots and nutjobs would even bring it up; all it takes is a moment's thought to discount what they were suggesting. We shouldn't appease fringe idiots and nutjobs. We should search and destroy them.

cspan37421
03-11-2008, 10:17 PM
I can't help but wonder if K, who has made a point of reaching out to the media more this year, feels his hand has been bitten.

BobbyFan
03-11-2008, 10:17 PM
I think whats angering K the most is they are taking a gesture to honor someone who lost their life as yet another tit for tat in a college basketball rivalry. "our coach is better cause he wore a ribbon, K didn't, he's such a jerk" Give me a break.

Absolutely.

It's not about K having to defend himself despite using appropriate measures. It's about people selfishly using a tragedy to further their anti-Duke sentiment. Sick...

dukie8
03-11-2008, 10:23 PM
I disagree completely. You're basically saying he should live life appeasing the fringe idiots and nutjobs, that he should be constantly aware of what fringe idiots and nutjobs might think about every one of his actions. Nobody reasonable could possibly turn the Eve Carson tragedy into criticism of Coach K, especially since he helped organize a touching tribute to her in the first place. It's absurd and disgusting that the fringe idiots and nutjobs would even bring it up; all it takes is a moment's thought to discount what they were suggesting. We shouldn't appease fringe idiots and nutjobs. We should search and destroy them.

well he already does have to cater to the "fringe idiots and nutjobs" all the time. do you think he always says what he actually thinks in interviews? if he did, he would get slammed by those same people. other than bobby knight, i can't think of another coach who basically lets it fly in interviews.

nobody is turning the eve carson tragedy into a criticism of k. they are, however, criticizing his lack of a ribbon. like i said earlier, it didn't bother me, but it was abundantly obvious to the people in the chat room that it was going to bother a lot of other people and that it was very misguided on his part not to have popped one on.

Troublemaker
03-11-2008, 10:32 PM
well he already does have to cater to the "fringe idiots and nutjobs" all the time. do you think he always says what he actually thinks in interviews? if he did, he would get slammed by those same people. other than bobby knight, i can't think of another coach who basically lets it fly in interviews.

nobody is turning the eve carson tragedy into a criticism of k. they are, however, criticizing his lack of a ribbon. like i said earlier, it didn't bother me, but it was abundantly obvious to the people in the chat room that it was going to bother a lot of other people and that it was very misguided on his part not to have popped one on.

What is this hair-splitting? They are criticizing K because of a lack of a ribbon. Okay? The point is, the criticism is absurd and disgusting, and it's not right to expect Coach K to anticipate what ridiculous and disgusting criticism might come his way and how to avoid it. I would rather expect people to act like human beings instead. I don't think your interview analogy works here and I don't care what the chat room thought. You are all wrong if you all think this way.

RelativeWays
03-11-2008, 10:34 PM
Someone break out the "Jump to Conclusions" mat from Office Space, apparently its a tarhole fans favorite board game.

RepoMan
03-11-2008, 10:44 PM
he did deliberately decide not to wear one

How do you know this? And, assuming it is true, what do you surmise was his intent? He wanted to slight the deceased in some way? An attempt to tweak Carolina fans? He just hates ribbons? Seriously, what could possibly be the reason.

dukemsu
03-11-2008, 10:44 PM
well he already does have to cater to the "fringe idiots and nutjobs" all the time. do you think he always says what he actually thinks in interviews? if he did, he would get slammed by those same people. other than bobby knight, i can't think of another coach who basically lets it fly in interviews.

nobody is turning the eve carson tragedy into a criticism of k. they are, however, criticizing his lack of a ribbon. like i said earlier, it didn't bother me, but it was abundantly obvious to the people in the chat room that it was going to bother a lot of other people and that it was very misguided on his part not to have popped one on.

An example of a coach who does let it fly is Pearl from Tennessee, and that will last until the media tires of him and he overcorrects.

This whole thing is just pure nonsense, an example of everyone missing the big picture that Duke went above and beyond the call on this tragedy in favor of complaining about a ribbon.

Why Roy gets a pass (taping over the Duke on the chair, his petty sniping, his childish feuds with other coaches such as Donovan), I have no idea. I honestly think a big part of it is the specter of Jordan-I get the impression that national media do not like criticizing UNC due to Jordan's presence around the program.

That's just an aside, and just my opinion. But this short-sightedness to simply amp their hatred for K is infantile.

dukie8
03-11-2008, 10:45 PM
What is this hair-splitting? They are criticizing K because of a lack of a ribbon. Okay? The point is, the criticism is absurd and disgusting, and it's not right to expect Coach K to anticipate what ridiculous and disgusting criticism might come his way and how to avoid it. I would rather expect people to act like human beings instead. I don't think your interview analogy works here and I don't care what the chat room thought. You are all wrong if you all think this way.

thanks for telling me that i am wrong on a purely subjective matter with absolutely no support. it's just what the boards strive for. why is it not right to expect k to realize that if he and his staff are the only ones in the building who are on tv not wearing a ribbon it is going to cause some waves? you might not agree with the criticism, and i certainly don't, but your choice of calling it "disgusting" certainly is odd. i can think of a lot of things that are digusting and this isn't one of them.

dukie8
03-11-2008, 10:50 PM
How do you know this? And, assuming it is true, what do you surmise was his intent? He wanted to slight the deceased in some way? An attempt to tweak Carolina fans? He just hates ribbons? Seriously, what could possibly be the reason.

he either accidently didn't wear one or he deliberatively didn't wear one. if he accidently didn't wear one, once he walked onto the floor and saw everyone in the place with one on, he then deliberatively didn't put one on because he very easily could have had the water boy grab one for him.

i, as well as the other people on the chat, were perplexed why he didn't have one on because it was obvious he was going to get slammed for it. my guess would be that he felt he already had honored eve carson and that the ribbons were for the students. as i repeatedly have stated, it didn't bother me in the least that he didn't have one on.

RepoMan
03-11-2008, 10:52 PM
but your choice of calling it "disgusting" certainly is odd. i can think of a lot of things that are digusting and this isn't one of them.

It is disgusting because the only way that the story is of any interest and the only reason that anyone would comment upon the lack of ribbon is to suggest that K had some sort of bad motive. Surely its not just a question of fashion sense. So, to implicitly suggest that the man deliberately failed to wear a commemorative ribbon with the intent of screwing with people in the context of a memorial to a murdered UNC student--a memorial that he himself organized--is disgusting and irresponsible. It's really not debatable.

Troublemaker
03-11-2008, 10:55 PM
thanks for telling me that i am wrong on a purely subjective matter with absolutely no support. it's just what the boards strive for. why is it not right to expect k to realize that if he and his staff are the only ones in the building who are on tv not wearing a ribbon it is going to cause some waves? you might not agree with the criticism, and i certainly don't, but your choice of calling it "disgusting" certainly is odd. i can think of a lot of things that are digusting and this isn't one of them.

I'm not the only one calling it disgusting. To use this tragedy to score a point in the rivalry by leveling an absurd charge at K is disgusting. I don't know what else to call it. Also, no, you can't expect people to account for absurd reactions. K was dismayed in his press conference that anyone would even suggest what they suggested. It certainly did not cross his mind and unlike you, I don't EXPECT it to have crossed his mind. So, yes, you are wrong. And yes, that is my opinion, but I didn't think I had to sprinkle IMOs all over the place for you to realize that I am stating opinion.

RepoMan
03-11-2008, 10:58 PM
he either accidently didn't wear one or he deliberatively didn't wear one. if he accidently didn't wear one, once he walked onto the floor and saw everyone in the place with one on, he then deliberatively didn't put one on because he very easily could have had the water boy grab one for him.


Or, maybe he never gave a moment's thought to wearing a ribbon or not, and he certainly never dreamed that anyone would suggest he had some evil motive by his failure to do so.

gep
03-11-2008, 11:38 PM
I didn't know how to link 2 threads... so I copied from the "Ribbons" thread... this post from Dukefencer...

*****************
"Krzyzewski Addresses Duke's Honoring of Slain UNC Student"

http://www.wral.com/sports/story/2550702/

Quote: "Asked by WRAL about that Monday, Krzyzewski responded: “With the ribbons, the students wore those. That’s something the students were doing. We were going to honor [Carson] with what we were doing before the game. I thought overall everybody there, Duke, North Carolina, everyone was on the same page.”

Krzyzewski said the idea of ribbons came up when he talked to the Duke students the night before the game.

“I said that’s something that’s great. They did everything well. It shows what student to student would do…,” he said. “It wasn’t something we as a staff did. I thought it was appropriate to have that distinction.” (End Quote)
*****************

This seems like Coach K and the staff did not wear the ribbon for a reason... that he thought what the staff did and what the students did were both appropriate and distinctive.

I'm amazed that this came up again after the above quote...

cspan37421
03-12-2008, 07:00 AM
he either accidently didn't wear one or he deliberatively didn't wear one. if he accidently didn't wear one, once he walked onto the floor and saw everyone in the place with one on, he then deliberatively didn't put one on because he very easily could have had the water boy grab one for him.

with reasoning like this, who needs trolls?

Edouble
03-12-2008, 07:59 AM
he either accidently didn't wear one or he deliberatively didn't wear one. if he accidently didn't wear one, once he walked onto the floor and saw everyone in the place with one on, he then deliberatively didn't put one on because he very easily could have had the water boy grab one for him.

No he couldn't have easily had the waterboy grab one! When he walked onto the floor, I would argue, he didn't see "everyone in place with one on." When he walked out onto the Cameron floor, I doubt he even noticed that everyone had a ribbon on. Coach K has a level of focus on game day that none of us here have probably ever experienced. I'm sure it's something akin to a Zen-like trance. In any event, this is a man that (I am proud to say) won't do those stupid half-time interviews for a game in December against, say, San Diego State, because he is 100% invested in only the present game at hand. So think about the way that his brain must filter out all the noise and pandemonium of Cameron in order to focus on playing our archrival, the #1 team in the country, for a regular season ACC Championship. I'm sure a million different plays, scenarios, etc. were all simultaneously running through his head when he walked out onto the floor. He'd spent a good deal of time already planning for a moment of silence, so when it was game time, he had no need to, nor is it in his nature to invest even a shred of his attention in something as trivial as a dinky ribbon! I seriously doubt that his attention and focus on the game and his team even allows for something like people wearing tiny 2" ribbons to enter his head.

Devil in the Blue Dress
03-12-2008, 08:05 AM
he either accidently didn't wear one or he deliberatively didn't wear one. if he accidently didn't wear one, once he walked onto the floor and saw everyone in the place with one on, he then deliberatively didn't put one on because he very easily could have had the water boy grab one for him.

i, as well as the other people on the chat, were perplexed why he didn't have one on because it was obvious he was going to get slammed for it. my guess would be that he felt he already had honored eve carson and that the ribbons were for the students. as i repeatedly have stated, it didn't bother me in the least that he didn't have one on.
I was at the game in Cameron Saturday night. The words in bold are an overstatement of what actually took place. There were many people who did not have on ribbons. The ribbons were not even being handed out at each entrance. Some chose not to wear one, others didn't wear one because the ribbons ran out. The students bought and prepared the ribbons themselves, no one else.

The way the moment of silence was observed was very moving to all but the most cynical. In his post game comments Coach Williams praised all the things Duke did to honor Eve. Coach K was asked to comment in his post game remarks. He explained that the team's way of honoring Eve was in the moment of silence. He said that the ribbons were a student to student effort. Somehow trying to project what Coach K was thinking or feeling beyond what he said seems to be conjecture, not fact.

OldPhiKap
03-12-2008, 08:19 AM
No good deed goes unpunished.

DukeFencer
03-12-2008, 08:32 AM
I can't help but wonder if K, who has made a point of reaching out to the media more this year, feels his hand has been bitten.

Was just thinking this. I wasn't paying much attention whenever it was that K made the step back from the media, but I did read about it in articles every year (about how inaccessible he was, etc.) This, the whole injury report, everything, really do just seem like distractions to me. Would not blame him if he backed away again and left the responsibility of interviews with the assistants.

johnb
03-12-2008, 08:35 AM
Very, very few people have carped about the ribbons, and Roy has been quite gracious about Duke's handling of the tragedy.

I can imagine that the staff didn't wear ribbons for one of two reasons: a) they didn't pay attention to the ribbons (e.g., felt them relatively unimportant or were just so focused on the game that they didn't see that hundreds/thousands of people were wearing light blue to the Carolina game; there's no way that they couldn't have acquired a ribbon from someone if they'd been motivated--would you turn down Johnny Dawkins if he asked for your lapel ribbon?) or, b) they decided they'd honored the young woman's memory and didn't feel it necessary for the coaching staff to wear a representation of the opposing team on its lapel during the most important game, thus far, in the season. My hunch is that it's 'b,' but public figures like K recognize that explorations of ambiguity lead to sensationalism in the media.

As for K not catching any breaks from the media, puuhhhlleeze. Despite the fact that, over the past decade, he has made himself about as available as the Pope, Duke retains an image as the best basketball program in the country. Where do you think that image comes from? While it may feel like our rightful position, such images are created by the same media that sporadically goes after our coach and team.

CMS2478
03-12-2008, 08:58 AM
In Carolina's defense............Inside Carolina is usually nothing but one big "Duke bashing." However, each time this topic has come up on IC the last couple days, numerous posters have come back saying that Coach K has done nothing wrong this time and have thanked him for the respect he showed at the game. So yes there are some fanatical fans that are going to hate no matter what, but there are some classy UNC fans who have actually showed support to Duke and Coach K on this matter. I actually posted on IC and thanked them for their support in this difficult time. It is time we quit trying to make Coach K the "bad guy" and focus on actually finding the real "bad guy" and see proper justice for this awful crime he committed.

DukeDevil
03-12-2008, 09:14 AM
This whole situation is so incredibly ridiculous. Nobody is bashing Roy for putting tape over the Duke symbol on his chair, if it were reversed and we were visiting carolina and K did that, everyone would say he was being a hypocrite as he's saying he's reaching out to the rival with one hand while besmirching their symbol with the other.

To prevent possibly getting torn to shreds, I didn't see that the symbol had be taped over, I saw someone else mention it in a thread, so if this didn't happen, my bad.

bloodevil
03-12-2008, 09:15 AM
I had no idea that there was any such thing as a ďribbon controversyĒ until last night. Hell, I was at the game, and I donít remember seeing any ribbons. Of course, my vision was artificially blurred to a great degree.
Anyway, the wife of a friend of mine is a UNC graduate, and she assailed me over Coach K not wearing a ribbon. I explained that I was not aware of the issue, but she continued to let loose with a barrage of insults that would make a hooker blush. I told her to calm down, and I asked her whom she thought had organized the whole tribute in the first place. This did nothing to quell her anger and vitriol directed toward K. I am sure you all know the typical epithets. Well, I learned a few new ones last night.
Finally, I told her that I had no clue why K didnít wear a ribbon, but that I was glad he didnít. I said that I would not have worn one for the same reason that I would not wear a red, Aids ribbon, a pink, breast cancer ribbon, or a yellow, come home troops ribbon. Ribbons donít do a damn thing!
So 9F, and take your sissy-blue ribbons with you!

Devil in the Blue Dress
03-12-2008, 09:19 AM
Very, very few people have carped about the ribbons, and Roy has been quite gracious about Duke's handling of the tragedy.

I can imagine that the staff didn't wear ribbons for one of two reasons: a) they didn't pay attention to the ribbons (e.g., felt them relatively unimportant or were just so focused on the game that they didn't see that hundreds/thousands of people were wearing light blue to the Carolina game; there's no way that they couldn't have acquired a ribbon from someone if they'd been motivated--would you turn down Johnny Dawkins if he asked for your lapel ribbon?) or, b) they decided they'd honored the young woman's memory and didn't feel it necessary for the coaching staff to wear a representation of the opposing team on its lapel during the most important game, thus far, in the season. My hunch is that it's 'b,' but public figures like K recognize that explorations of ambiguity lead to sensationalism in the media.

As for K not catching any breaks from the media, puuhhhlleeze. Despite the fact that, over the past decade, he has made himself about as available as the Pope, Duke retains an image as the best basketball program in the country. Where do you think that image comes from? While it may feel like our rightful position, such images are created by the same media that sporadically goes after our coach and team.

During his post game comments, Coach K answered the question about why he and the team weren't wearing ribbons. Why people continue to try to interpret or extract something else is nothing but talk. It appears that even some Duke fans are unable to accept what the Coach says about what he was thinking or doing.

aimo
03-12-2008, 09:30 AM
I was at the game in Cameron Saturday night. The words in bold are an overstatement of what actually took place. There were many people who did not have on ribbons. The ribbons were not even being handed out at each entrance. Some chose not to wear one, others didn't wear one because the ribbons ran out. The students bought and prepared the ribbons themselves, no one else.


I was there as well and saw very few ribbons. The only thing they were handing out at my entrance was the 800 Win placard. From what I understood, they only had enough for about half of Cameron, and they were going to concentrate at passing them out in the student lines before the game. Anyone using this as an excuse to bash Coach K is low class.

ClosetHurleyFan
03-12-2008, 09:39 AM
http://abclocal.go.com/wtvd/story?section=news/local&id=6013517



Can Duke ever get a break?

I actually think he handled it really well, it would have been perfectly handled had he not gone at all down the "there going to always find something" path, but he is human and I think I would probably would have done the same thing. I did like the way that he kept referencing it in terms of an individual or "someone" and not UNC the institution that was taking him to task.

Frankly the better way to handle it might have been to give it absolutely no mind at all. No comment, move on, you are above some idiots petty BS..but again he is human and its hard not to defend yourself when you feel like you handled things the right way.

Guarantee you that most UNC fans agree with his take on this and found the whole game setting to be nothing but respectful...:D

BlueDevilBaby
03-12-2008, 09:45 AM
How ridiculous. FWIW, on the way home last night, I was listening to ESPN radio and a UNC fan called in to thank Duke and Coach K profusely and sincerely for what they did to honor Eve.

_Gary
03-12-2008, 10:00 AM
As for K not catching any breaks from the media, puuhhhlleeze.

Sorry, I totally disagree. Coach K and Duke have been ripped new ones for about 10 years now, but especially since our friends Packer and the sweaty one whined about the officiating back in '01. Since then I've seen far, far more hate for Duke on a national level than I have anything close to respect or admiration or love. And I'm sick and tired of it too. Every time I turn around I'm seeing or reading slights aimed at Duke. Some are subtle. Many are not. But make no mistake - Duke is the #1 most hated program in college basketball today. And this in spite of the fact that it's been 7 years since we won a national title and 4 since we seriously challenged for one. So I'm not buying the "everyone hates Duke only because we are good" spiel anymore. It goes deeper than that. There are many factors in play here, but being good is only one of them. Heck, if being good is the reason then UNC should be more hated than us at this point - but they aren't. No, they are loved by the national media and Roy Williams is deified. But not Coach K and Duke. It's very one-sided and it's getting really old.


Gary

devilish
03-12-2008, 11:09 AM
I was at the game in Cameron Saturday night. The words in bold are an overstatement of what actually took place. There were many people who did not have on ribbons. The ribbons were not even being handed out at each entrance. Some chose not to wear one, others didn't wear one because the ribbons ran out. The students bought and prepared the ribbons themselves, no one else.

The way the moment of silence was observed was very moving to all but the most cynical. In his post game comments Coach Williams praised all the things Duke did to honor Eve. Coach K was asked to comment in his post game remarks. He explained that the team's way of honoring Eve was in the moment of silence. He said that the ribbons were a student to student effort. Somehow trying to project what Coach K was thinking or feeling beyond what he said seems to be conjecture, not fact.

I was at the game and did not even know there were any ribbons until today. In fact, I did not know K told the fans not to chant 9F, which is probably why I was the only one in the place screaming it (oops!)

roywhite
03-12-2008, 11:18 AM
Coach K has demonstrated to more than one fanbase that he is hard to hate:

1. NC State---his care, concern, and friendship for Jim Valvano was noticed by many of the Wolfpack faitful
2. Wake Forest---the yellow tie demonstration of respect for the late Coach Skip Prosser was appreciated by many Demon Deacs
3. UNC---the silence and tribute on the occasion of Eve Carson's murder
4. Maryland---K and Gary seem to have a very good personal relationship (not all Terp fans have gotten the memo)

Coach K is a fine, decent man in addition to being a great coach. Those who believe otherwise have a difficult burden of proof.

Devil in the Blue Dress
03-12-2008, 11:26 AM
Hate can interfere with a person's being able to recognize or accept kindnesses from those they hate.

GopherBlue
03-12-2008, 12:11 PM
This entire 'controversy' is just absurd - bringing it up at this difficult time is disrespectful to the memory of Eve Carson and to the grieving family and friends. Coach K and the Duke community (as well as the UNC staff and team) have done the right thing in honoring Eve at the game - by all accounts she was a special person and deserved such. That anyone can even question the intentions of the Duke staff in light of this tragedy, particularly considering the extent to which Coach K and Duke went to honor Eve with the blessing of the UNC community, is unfathomable.

I've heard reference to the media synthesizing this controversy - is there a definitive starting point of this nonsense? Whomever started this should be called out - I want names!

jgflava
03-12-2008, 01:23 PM
I am a UNC grad and one of the people who posted a comment on the WTVD website. As I said in my comment, I commend Coach K and Duke for all that they did before and during last Saturday's game. I was especially moved my some of Coach K's comments before the game in which he was visibly emotional about what it would be like to lose one of his daughters. I was not upset that he did not wear a ribbon considering all of the other things he did. However, at the time I did not think carried himself particularly well in yesterday's press conference by saying that people will always look for him to do something wrong and call him out for it.

Looking back on it, I can see why he got angry because he had already answered the question at a previous press conference. The media and some fans are making a too much of a big deal about the ribbon and are ignoring all that was done by Duke and Coach K to honor Eve. As someone who knew Eve personally, thanks for all you did last week and I am sorry some people are making a big deal about the ribbon. There are obviously more important things to think about right now.

OldPhiKap
03-12-2008, 01:25 PM
I am a UNC grad and one of the people who posted a comment on the WTVD website. As I said in my comment, I commend Coach K and Duke for all that they did before and during last Saturday's game. I was especially moved my some of Coach K's comments before the game in which he was visibly emotional about what it would be like to lose one of his daughters. I was not upset that he did not wear a ribbon considering all of the other things he did. However, at the time I did not think carried himself particularly well in yesterday's press conference by saying that people will always look for him to do something wrong and call him out for it.

Looking back on it, I can see why he got angry because he had already answered the question at a previous press conference. The media and some fans are making a too much of a big deal about the ribbon and are ignoring all that was done by Duke and Coach K to honor Eve. As someone who knew Eve personally, thanks for all you did last week and I am sorry some people are making a big deal about the ribbon. There are obviously more important things to think about right now.


Well said, and thanks for bringing some sanity to the conversation.

Uncle Drew
03-12-2008, 02:12 PM
Call me an idiot, but as well meaing as wearing the ribbons were you don't wear the opposing schools colors especially when playing them. Just like wearing the "green" shirts earlier this year in support of the "going green campain". Wear Duke shirts and colors only. The moment of silence was appropriate, the black patches with EVE written on them the UNC players wore were much more appropriate.


All that being said (Go ahead and send me hate messages for my opinion on the previous paragraph.) Duke is NEVER going to get a fair shake in the media and by opposing fans. The anti-Duke tsunami thread listed 1000 ways Duke is hated and disrespected. But it isn't going away unless Duke goes away for ten years. Duke can hire a PR team and do everything they suggest. But the bias against Duke is so deeply engrained and spurred by MD, UNC, ESPN etc. Fans see Duke now seen as the evil empire much like the yankees in baseball and the USA in much of the world. It is NOT going away no matter how much things like this controversy tick us off. Every action and word a Duke player or coach does / says is put under a microscope and examined. It is going to continue and I for one say let them say what they want.


When Duke plays an away game the crowds are louder than they are all year. That shows the Duke hatred but it also shows Duke is seen as the team to beat and the school universities most want to be like. Their games on ESPN are the highest rated because non-duke fans tune it and hope they lose. That again shows the power Duke hatred has over this nation. Face it people Duke is hated because they are consistantly good, they have intelligent players, the school focuses on academics and 9 games out of 10 they beat those other teams. The hatred should be seen as applause in a way, to be hated is to be respected. Duke is NEVER going to please everyone, so why try. I know Coach K is sick of answering stupid media questions about stupid controversies. In fact if anything keeps him from breaking the all time wins mark I think it would most likely be disgust with the way Duke is perceived. But in truth there isn't a damn thing anyone can really do about it. If I were Duke I would close ALL media out of post game interviews. I wouldn't grant interviews or allow my players to talk to the media. I'd be willing to bet the ESPN's of the world would have less need for a few reporters. And as someone who hates the media in general the world would be a better place. (And less jobs for UNC grads.)

Lavabe
03-12-2008, 02:32 PM
I am a UNC grad and one of the people who posted a comment on the WTVD website. As I said in my comment, I commend Coach K and Duke for all that they did before and during last Saturday's game. I was especially moved my some of Coach K's comments before the game in which he was visibly emotional about what it would be like to lose one of his daughters. I was not upset that he did not wear a ribbon considering all of the other things he did. However, at the time I did not think carried himself particularly well in yesterday's press conference by saying that people will always look for him to do something wrong and call him out for it.

Looking back on it, I can see why he got angry because he had already answered the question at a previous press conference. The media and some fans are making a too much of a big deal about the ribbon and are ignoring all that was done by Duke and Coach K to honor Eve. As someone who knew Eve personally, thanks for all you did last week and I am sorry some people are making a big deal about the ribbon. There are obviously more important things to think about right now.

Unfortunately, about four commenters after you continue to go after K.

The Daily Tar H--l comment board seems particularly rampant with folks who are upset with K. Hopefully you will post your comments there once the paper is open after spring break.

Maybe things will pass as the process of mourning continues.

Lavabe

Devil in the Blue Dress
03-12-2008, 03:40 PM
I just got back from my annual tax prep meeting with my CPA. He's a UNC grad and a big Ram's Club member. The first thing he did was to ask me whether I had attended the game Saturday. I told him that I was there. He then spoke at some length to express thanks for the classy and compassionate way Duke recognized Eve Carson Saturday. He was truly moved by what was done wanted to express his appreciation on a person to person to person basis.....
I have received this sort of appreciation from many acquaintances who are Tar Heel fans.... people who were responding on a person to person basis. The people who complain in the newspaper or online I just choose to ignore.

fan345678
03-12-2008, 03:58 PM
Coach K has demonstrated to more than one fanbase that he is hard to hate:

1. NC State---his care, concern, and friendship for Jim Valvano was noticed by many of the Wolfpack faitful
2. Wake Forest---the yellow tie demonstration of respect for the late Coach Skip Prosser was appreciated by many Demon Deacs
3. UNC---the silence and tribute on the occasion of Eve Carson's murder
4. Maryland---K and Gary seem to have a very good personal relationship (not all Terp fans have gotten the memo)

Coach K is a fine, decent man in addition to being a great coach. Those who believe otherwise have a difficult burden of proof.

I was surprised he didn't wear a ribbon, simply because of his prior sartorial efforts at honoring people who have died. That said, those efforts were related to people within the basketball community, and not on the student-to-student or university-to-university (i.e.- black bands for VT and April 16) arena.

bjornolf
03-12-2008, 04:06 PM
...if Roy were a real man, he would have given K HIS ribbon. ;)

grit74
03-12-2008, 04:42 PM
You can be sure that, if K had a ribbon, some portion or all of those criticizing him for not wearing a ribbon would be criticizing anyway. They would accuse him of being a hypocrite who really didn't mean it, or find something wrong with the shade of blue, or read a big conspiracy into whatever he said about it. The loonies are loony. Their first thought is always bad and gets worse from there. Despite all that K has done for the community and outside the community, and for the coaching profession, and for basketball outside Duke, and despite how well he handles himself in 99.9% of situations, the loonies remain consumed with petty, stupid hatred. to borrow a phrase, call it KDS, Krzyzewski Derangement Syndrome.

Devilsfan
03-12-2008, 04:53 PM
Too many people talk the talk but don't walk the walk. For example, just because you attend a religious institution every Saturday or Sunday doesn't make you a good person. How you act unto others in your daily life is the true test. Coach K is a very good person, imho.

91_92_01_10_15
03-12-2008, 04:54 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rGaqI20WHyk

jgflava
03-12-2008, 04:59 PM
The whole controversy should be put to rest. The media and some fans looking for something to call K out on started the issue...it wouldn't have been a controversy in the first place if the media didn't hound him with these questions. As I said before, Coach K and Duke went above and beyond in making sure Eve was honored and it was absolutely not necessary for him to wear a ribbon.

As you are probably aware, the police got one of the murderers and the other guy is still at large. Focus on the life of a great person cut short and finding the person responsible for it instead of this silly ribbon controversy.

jgflava
03-12-2008, 05:22 PM
I'm sure the majority of UNC fans would agree that Coach K and Duke did a great job of honoring Eve...I'm certainly one of them. Sure, there was some initial reaction of surprise after the Duke coaching staff did not wear the ribbon, but after Coach K's explanation of it being a student thing in addition to all of the other things he did, most UNC fans would agree that while the ribbon would have been a nice touch, it was ultimately not necessary.

I was upset at Coach K's reaction at yesterday's press conference, but I can now certainly see why he was agitated after he had already answered the question and had done so much to make sure she was honored.

Again, the controversy was initiated by the media and it does not matter in the grand scheme of things.

Uncle Drew
03-12-2008, 05:29 PM
I'm sure the majority of UNC fans would agree that Coach K and Duke did a great job of honoring Eve...I'm certainly one of them. Sure, there was some initial reaction of surprise after the Duke coaching staff did not wear the ribbon, but after Coach K's explanation of it being a student thing in addition to all of the other things he did, most UNC fans would agree that while the ribbon would have been a nice touch, it was ultimately not necessary.

I was upset at Coach K's reaction at yesterday's press conference, but I can now certainly see why he was agitated after he had already answered the question and had done so much to make sure she was honored.

Again, the controversy was initiated by the media and it does not matter in the grand scheme of things.

I applaud your comments and common sense. And while we both agree this is all an attempt by some members of the media to stir up controversy, what is the biggest (and supposably best) journalism school in the state; in the country for that matter. Granted the media member(s) who initiated this mess may have graduated from Fuquay Varina Technical Institute. But when the words "journalism", "media", and "Carolina" are so tightly wound it's hard not to point a finger in the direction of Chapel Hill.

Troublemaker
03-12-2008, 07:01 PM
Duke is NEVER going to get a fair shake in the media and by opposing fans. The anti-Duke tsunami thread listed 1000 ways Duke is hated and disrespected. But it isn't going away unless Duke goes away for ten years. Duke can hire a PR team and do everything they suggest. But the bias against Duke is so deeply engrained and spurred by MD, UNC, ESPN etc. Fans see Duke now seen as the evil empire much like the yankees in baseball and the USA in much of the world. It is NOT going away no matter how much things like this controversy tick us off. Every action and word a Duke player or coach does / says is put under a microscope and examined. It is going to continue and I for one say let them say what they want.

I think it's tough to be hated. Ultimately, constant hatred can take a toll, and for some people, it detracts just a little bit from their enjoyment of the basketball season. Sure, they can train themselves to just ignore the hatred, but some people struggle to do that, and it's kinda unfair that they have to deal with it in the first place. Obviously, in the grand scheme of life, the universe, whatever, the complete enjoyment of the basketball season by the Duke faithful means little. But the hatred is still annoying to deal with.

JStuart
03-12-2008, 07:52 PM
You can be sure that, if K had a ribbon, some portion or all of those criticizing him for not wearing a ribbon would be criticizing anyway. They would accuse him of being a hypocrite who really didn't mean it, or find something wrong with the shade of blue, or read a big conspiracy into whatever he said about it. The loonies are loony. Their first thought is always bad and gets worse from there. Despite all that K has done for the community and outside the community, and for the coaching profession, and for basketball outside Duke, and despite how well he handles himself in 99.9% of situations, the loonies remain consumed with petty, stupid hatred. to borrow a phrase, call it KDS, Krzyzewski Derangement Syndrome.

Besides, those critical of K are undoubtedly close, personal friends of the slain Student Body President at UNC, am I right?

diesel
03-12-2008, 08:20 PM
Iíve been thinking of the reasons for the Duke hatred as evidenced most recently in this ribbon thing. I didnít follow the Duke Hatred Tsunami thread, but I have an observation on the phenomenon based on things like reading the Duke/UNC threads at blogs like that of Sporting News.

What strikes me is the basic illiteracy of some of the anti-Duke postings. And no, I donít think this reflects the quality of a UNC education! This is a class thing: I think these postings are from wannabes in the underclass for whom higher education is another world. And what better way to express this jealousy than by hating a private university where tuition is nearly $50k? These people watch Duke play on TV and itís as though they have their moist noses pressed against glass in the window of a room they can never enter.

And some of our attitudes may serve to rub salt in this wound. We joke about Maryland not having graduated a player in five years. And I recall when Duke played UNLV in 1991-92. One of the comments was how interesting it was to hear our players speak as if their main cultural contact wasnít just Much Music.

Yitb1296
03-12-2008, 09:49 PM
Am I the only one who saw this and immediately flashed on Seinfeld episode where Kramer is accosted for not wearing a ribbon while doing the AID's walk?
If it weren't so absurd, it might be funny.

BigTedder
03-12-2008, 10:50 PM
You tell em big daddy K!

BigTedder
03-12-2008, 10:53 PM
I'm sure the majority of UNC fans would agree that Coach K and Duke did a great job of honoring Eve...I'm certainly one of them. Sure, there was some initial reaction of surprise after the Duke coaching staff did not wear the ribbon, but after Coach K's explanation of it being a student thing in addition to all of the other things he did, most UNC fans would agree that while the ribbon would have been a nice touch, it was ultimately not necessary.

I was upset at Coach K's reaction at yesterday's press conference, but I can now certainly see why he was agitated after he had already answered the question and had done so much to make sure she was honored.

Again, the controversy was initiated by the media and it does not matter in the grand scheme of things.

I was there for the DUKE/unc game and thought it was very appropriate and classy. They tried to make it as respectful as they could because she was a very classy girl obviously. This whole controversy is a bunch of childish b.s. just like when Obama didn't wear a flag pin...OMG! he's a terrorist!.....STFU. Grow up.

Nesto
03-13-2008, 12:46 AM
Jerry always has the answer...

So, what's it going to be? Are you going to wear the ribbon?
K: No, never.
But I am wearing the ribbon. He is wearing the ribbon. We are all wearing the ribbon! So, why aren't you going to wear the ribbon?!
K: This is America, I don't have to wear anything I don't want to wear!
What are we gonna do with him?
I guess we are just going to have to teach him to wear the ribbon!

:cool:

91_92_01_10_15
03-13-2008, 09:18 AM
Am I the only one who saw this and immediately flashed on Seinfeld episode where Kramer is accosted for not wearing a ribbon while doing the AID's walk?
If it weren't so absurd, it might be funny.

See above. Post # 63. ;)

Troublemaker
03-13-2008, 09:51 AM
Iíve been thinking of the reasons for the Duke hatred as evidenced most recently in this ribbon thing. I didnít follow the Duke Hatred Tsunami thread, but I have an observation on the phenomenon based on things like reading the Duke/UNC threads at blogs like that of Sporting News.

What strikes me is the basic illiteracy of some of the anti-Duke postings. And no, I donít think this reflects the quality of a UNC education! This is a class thing: I think these postings are from wannabes in the underclass for whom higher education is another world. And what better way to express this jealousy than by hating a private university where tuition is nearly $50k? These people watch Duke play on TV and itís as though they have their moist noses pressed against glass in the window of a room they can never enter.

And some of our attitudes may serve to rub salt in this wound. We joke about Maryland not having graduated a player in five years. And I recall when Duke played UNLV in 1991-92. One of the comments was how interesting it was to hear our players speak as if their main cultural contact wasnít just Much Music.

*Nods*. I've been saying the same for years now. It's not coincidence that our most hated players are our white players. The haters project onto our white players qualities such as pampered, arrogant, snooty, etc that they stereotypically associate with wealthy people, whom they hate. That's why guys like Paulus, Redick, Wojo, etc receive the brunt of the hate.

DukeDevilDeb
03-13-2008, 10:26 AM
thanks for telling me that i am wrong on a purely subjective matter with absolutely no support. it's just what the boards strive for. why is it not right to expect k to realize that if he and his staff are the only ones in the building who are on tv not wearing a ribbon it is going to cause some waves? you might not agree with the criticism, and i certainly don't, but your choice of calling it "disgusting" certainly is odd. i can think of a lot of things that are digusting and this isn't one of them.

... in CIS not wearing a ribbon. Apparently they were not only student driven... I saw several Iron Dukes wearing them and, when asked, they said the ribbons were handed out at an Iron Dukes' event.

BUT... no one was handing them out that I saw.

Give me a fripping BREAK here. With students being killed and war in the Middle East and poverty and world hunger... why do these criticisms even arise... and why are we Dukies even wasting energy on this thread?!?!

I'm gone...

cspan37421
03-13-2008, 10:53 AM
The Duke and UNC murders are apparently connected, so a two-tone blue ribbon should be handed out to the Charlotte fans. Anyone refusing to wear the ribbon will be interrogated thus: "aren't you against murder?" If they can't be "taught to wear the ribbon," they shall be escorted from the building and their seat given to someone who will wear the ribbon. Who doesn't want to wear the ribbon?

dukegirlinsc
03-13-2008, 11:50 AM
I'm glad Coach K addressed this in the media, instead of letting it slide. The whole situation disgusts me, and the fact that people would even THINK that about Coach K is ridiculous.

Slurpie King
03-13-2008, 11:59 AM
This whole controversy is ridiculous in the first place. Coach K has been around the game for so long and yet people are still questioning his respect for his opponents. He is arguably the best coach ever in college basketball history and deserves more credit than this.

spcwhitley
03-13-2008, 12:00 PM
I'm a UNC fan but i will say it was very classy on the part of the students and K to remember Eve Carson. Before anyone starts reading too much into whether K wore a ribbon or not, please remember that K from what i've heard did most of the work in setting up the memorial service for Carson. It wouldn't have happened without him or the students. Let's quit taking the basketball rivalry off the court. Coach K and Coach Williams are 2 wonderful men and probably the two classiest coaches in college basketball. Duke fans and UNC fans are one community who respect each other a lot more than we all would care to admit.
The important thing is that we all (well most of us at least) can all come together when it matters. Thank god those 2 evil men are behind bars. What's even better is that the January slaying of the Duke graduate student is now finally receiving justice also. Let's leave the rivalry on the court. God bless you all.

DukePA
03-13-2008, 12:17 PM
I'm a UNC fan but i will say it was very classy on the part of the students and K to remember Eve Carson. Before anyone starts reading too much into whether K wore a ribbon or not, please remember that K from what i've heard did most of the work in setting up the memorial service for Carson. It wouldn't have happened without him or the students. Let's quit taking the basketball rivalry off the court. Coach K and Coach Williams are 2 wonderful men and probably the two classiest coaches in college basketball. Duke fans and UNC fans are one community who respect each other a lot more than we all would care to admit.
The important thing is that we all (well most of us at least) can all come together when it matters. Thank god those 2 evil men are behind bars. What's even better is that the January slaying of the Duke graduate student is now finally receiving justice also. Let's leave the rivalry on the court. God bless you all.


Thank you for this post. As a Duke grad/fan who grew up in Orange county, I have often been tempted to get caught up in the Duke-Carolina hate thing, but I try very, very hard to remember that we are talking about 2 fantastic universities with more in common than not. Thank you to all the UNC supporters who have acknowledged the efforts of the Duke community to pay our respects to Eve Carson. Thank you too for recognizing the loss of our student.

heyman25
03-15-2008, 03:55 AM
Only 1 Carolina Fan on this board acknowledged the loss of life of the Duke student, but all Duke fans acknowledged Eve Carson's tragic death and the loss of Mahatao (sic). I may have misspelled his name, but that to me shows the difference in the two schools fan base. This ribbon BS makes me realize why I will never give UNC Chapel Hill any complements again.I know I am beating a dead horse, but the unmitigated gall of their fans really irritates me. I really hope we get another crack at those arrogant pr#%$*.