Kelvin Sampson Suspended

[shadowfax336]

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/news/story?id=3243325

maybe somebody should just keep Kelvin Sampson away from telephones...

any bets on how long it takes somebody to point out that this would never have happened with Bob Knight?
I'm giving an over/under of 2.5 posts...

of course wouldn't it be nice if Indiana could find a coach that just didn't embarrass the program and still won games?

[BlueintheFace]

This would never have happened with Bob Knight... there. haha

[mgtr]

One would think that a coach who had suffered NCAA sanctions would never be hired by a second or third school -- yet it happens all the time. Makes one wonder about the integrity of certain colleges/universities. Anybody want to hire the Herricks?

[BD80]

This would never have happened with Bob Knight... there. haha

Is it a coincidence that he became available just as it becomes public that IU may have reason to part ways with its bb coach?

[lmb]

Is it a coincidence that he became available just as it becomes public that IU may have reason to part ways with its bb coach?


I can't imagine Indiana offering Knight the job again. It would be even less likely, in my opinion, for Knight to accept. I think there's an awful lot of bad feelings remaining in that situation.

[ugadevil]

maybe somebody should just keep Kelvin Sampson away from telephones...


What in the world does he have to talk to them about? I heard on ESPN Radio that it was over 500 phone calls at OU that he was caught for. 500 phone calls!?! What is so important that you need to make over 500 calls?

[BlueintheFace]

Bob Knight would sooner have Myles Brand kick him in the crotch (not figuratively this time) than he go back to Indiana...

[Sir Stealth]

I think that to many Indiana supporters, this feels the same way as it would to us if it had happened at Duke. My uncle is an IU alum and big supporter and every time I've talked basketball with him since Sampson was hired, he has talked about how much he opposed the hire because of the previous violations and voiced his concern to whoever he could reach about it. Knight may have been controversial, but Indiana has taken pride in having a historically clean program, and I'm sure that IU people who didn't want Sampson because of his past are in serious "I told you so" mode right now and have to be really ticked off. If a school takes pride in being above this kind of crap and doing things the right way, then it simply cannot roll the dice with who it hires to run its program.

[SilkyJ]

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/news/story?id=3243325

any bets on how long it takes somebody to point out that this would never have happened with Bob Knight?
I'm giving an over/under of 2.5 posts...


well you just did point it out, so how about an over/under of 0.5

seriously tho, this guy is ridiculous. i hate dirty coaches. and dean smith.

[BigTedder]

This would never have happened with Bob Knight... there. haha

yeah, he would have hit 'em with the phone...haha

[BigTedder]

well you just did point it out, so how about an over/under of 0.5

seriously tho, this guy is ridiculous. i hate dirty coaches. and dean smith.

what's the difference?

[slower]

Not really sure you can call Dean a "dirty" coach. Irritating and whiny, yes. And as much as I hate Carolina BB and disliked Dean as a coach, I respected the hell out of him as a human being.

[Dukiedevil]

I think that to many Indiana supporters, this feels the same way as it would to us if it had happened at Duke. My uncle is an IU alum and big supporter and every time I've talked basketball with him since Sampson was hired, he has talked about how much he opposed the hire because of the previous violations and voiced his concern to whoever he could reach about it. Knight may have been controversial, but Indiana has taken pride in having a historically clean program, and I'm sure that IU people who didn't want Sampson because of his past are in serious "I told you so" mode right now and have to be really ticked off. If a school takes pride in being above this kind of crap and doing things the right way, then it simply cannot roll the dice with who it hires to run its program.

I absolutely agree with this. Both my parents are IU alums and I grew up in Indiana as a fan. Almost everyone loved Bob Knight (despite some of his issues) and hated to see him go. When Sampson was brought in, there was quite a bit of outrage about the hire because of the pride in the program. I recall Bob Kravitz of the Indy Star absolutely ripping IU for the hire. I would say I'm surprised, but I always thought Sampson was a jerk. I'm very sad for the IU alums/fans right now, but the administration is going to get what they deserve (I hope).

[RelativeWays]

This would never have happened with Mike Davis... there. haha

Variety is the spice of life.

[DukeDude]

I'm glad we never even interviewed Rick Neuheisel.

[dynastydefender]

Bob Knight would sooner have Myles Brand kick him in the crotch (not figuratively this time) than he go back to Indiana...

Didn't he make a motion back in like 01 to get rid of intercollegiate athletic competition?

[gofurman]

Didn't he make a motion back in like 01 to get rid of intercollegiate athletic competition?

this can't hurt us with plumlee if IU was one of his top choices. I am not out there hoping other schools get in trouble but since Sampson dug his own hole... Wasn't Plumlee looking at IU?

[dukemsu]

Gut check time for IU. Any guts at all and this clown is gone by the weekend.

Problem is, this is IU's best team since 02 at the absolute minimum (probably longer). Legitimate Final 4 threat. They'll probably try and drag it out under the auspices of "due process" to see how far they can ride Gordon before he goes pro.

I remember Knight suspending Alford for the Kentucky game over a charity calendar he posed for. Hard to see Kelvin doing something like that.

IU basketball has fallen a long, long way. Hope Kelvin's ready for his remaining trips on the road this year. Izzone will be particularly brutal. College basketball needs this guy gone.

dukemsu

[A-Tex Devil]

Rumor is Sampson is gone on Friday. Indiana wants him gone before he takes this talented team deep and has a harder time firing him. (Doesn't make sense to me. cheating is cheating... but that's the rumor).

[mgtr]

I agree this is a very, very good IU team, but there is no excuse in holding on to Sampson (except, of course, PC!). If they could dump the best coach, they can certainly dump a cheater.

[dukie8]

Gut check time for IU. Any guts at all and this clown is gone by the weekend.

Problem is, this is IU's best team since 02 at the absolute minimum (probably longer). Legitimate Final 4 threat. They'll probably try and drag it out under the auspices of "due process" to see how far they can ride Gordon before he goes pro.

I remember Knight suspending Alford for the Kentucky game over a charity calendar he posed for. Hard to see Kelvin doing something like that.

IU basketball has fallen a long, long way. Hope Kelvin's ready for his remaining trips on the road this year. Izzone will be particularly brutal. College basketball needs this guy gone.

dukemsu

why are they a legitimate final 4 threat? until they beat ohio st on sunday, they had not beaten an rpi top 50 team. now they have a win against bubble ohio state and illinois st just crept into the top 50 at 49. they are a paper tiger.

i just don't get why sampson would risk his entire career over telephone calls. are they that critical in recruiting? especially when they are kind of creepy 3-way calls. it makes you wonder what went on to get gordon pried away from illinois.

[Duke79UNLV77]

A colleague and friend of mine was friends at Michigan with some of the Wolverine players during the dirty years. They were getting free SUVs, groceries, and on and on for years, and it was pretty open and notorious for a long time before it all came crumbling down. To paraphrase Fletch, you din't have to be Sherlock Holmes to figure it out. Heck, you didn't even have to be Larry Holmes. Stuff like that resonates with me a lot more than too many phone calls, which seems more cheesy than anything else. I think the NCAA could use fewer technical rules but be more aggressive on fundamental ones like payoffs and miniscule academic progress rates.

That being said, lying to the university and the NCAA is more significant. This could be a case of the cover-up being worse than the crime.

[BD80]

How about the t-shirt and the drawstring bag the IU assistant coach gave a recruit???? That's about the same as the Escalade the UM player's mom "found".

The real issue for me is that Sampson did these things while on probabation and that he lied about it. It sounds like they have him nailed:

http://www.indystar.com/assets/pdf/BG99679213.PDF

Sampson's defense is that the transgressions were not intentional. He's toast.

[weezie]

Why is Sampson such an idiot? And obvious question with some obvious answers, I know, but he's a pretty decent coach and a good recruiter (wouldn't that many phone calls drive recruits crazy?)
And to have the prestige of IU in his grasp and yet boot it away for what?
Pitiful.

[ugadevil]

Is the penalty from the NCAA going to be tougher because this is Sampson's second offense? For IU, this is the first time they've had any major problems in forever. Yet, I think because of Sampson's recent history, that is going to hurt them a lot. I guess that's the risk you take in hiring someone with baggage.

[Carlos]

I remember Knight suspending Alford for the Kentucky game over a charity calendar he posed for. Hard to see Kelvin doing something like that.


Not to pick nits here, but Alford was suspended by the NCAA, not Knight. Knight in fact was outraged over the irony that Alford would be suspended when they were playing Kentucky, saying:

"In taking of his time to help unfortunate people, he eventually becomes
penalized. I thought it was a tremendous irony, with all that garbage that
has gone on at Kentucky over the years."

[Dukiedevil]

As I mentioned before, Bob Kravitz is not amused... Can't say I disagree with this at all.

http://www.indystar.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080214/COLUMNISTS01/802140501/1247/SPORTS

[BD80]

The published list of violations (linked via the Indy Star above) only redacts one recruit's name, apparently because it is a current IU player. Could that be Eric Gordon - 1 of IU's 4 freshmen - who Sampson sleazed out from under Illinois? Justice would be served for him to be punished somehow for that.

The timing is great for us for Sampson's character being revealed, the Kravitz article says it well:

The damage to this program will be irreparable, and it will make future recruiting impossible. The NCAA hearing will continue throughout the summer, throughout recruiting season, and recruits will have questions: Will Sampson still be the coach in the future? Will the program be sanctioned, maybe subjected to a postseason ban? What player in his right mind would come to Bloomington?

Things seem to be falling in place for us for Plumlee, with the K Center unveiling, our team excelling at a style perfectly suited for Plumlee's style, a couple of recent misses leaving a big spot open for playing time, and now the Sampson news. I hope Coach K made Mason an offer he can't (won't) refuse.

[dukie8]

what i don't get and what nobody is talking about is how did the ncaa come across the violations? did someone rat him out? the ncaa doesn't have subpoena powers so it can't get phone records on demand. did sampson voluntarily turn over the incriminating phone records? i also believe that a lot of the calls were made by someone else so how did the ncaa find out about them?

[Summie444]

I believe IU's internal compliance department uncovered the violations and turned them over to the NCAA.

[TheDukeCreed]

http://msn.foxsports.com/cbk/story/7824932?MSNHPHMA

Can't say I am sorry to see this happen.

[ugadevil]

I wonder if Indiana called Kelvin to tell him he was fired?:rolleyes:

[BD80]

I wonder if Indiana called Kelvin to tell him he was fired?:rolleyes:

They tried, got a busy signal.


SEEEEEEEEEYAAAAAAAA!!!

[Devilsfan]

Wonder if he got a gold i-phone when he "retired"?

[FerryFor50]

I wonder if Indiana called Kelvin to tell him he was fired?:rolleyes:

Yes, 577 times. :D

[RelativeWays]

They tried, got a busy signal.


SEEEEEEEEEYAAAAAAAA!!!

Heeeeeeeeeyoooooooo!

[mgtr]

Instead of post of the day, this is thread of the day. Now lets start the pool about how soon he gets hired by another school.....

[JasonEvans]

Instead of post of the day, this is thread of the day. Now lets start the pool about how soon he gets hired by another school.....

I think he is just too tainted. Sorta like Jim Harrick after UGA.

Then again, Tark got another shot at Fresno St., so who knows.

--Jason "so, will it be Skiles as the new head coach?" Evans

[TheDukeCreed]

Here is Sports Ills reporting along the same line.
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2008/basketball/ncaa/02/21/sampson.ap/index.html

ESPN claiming he isn't on the breadline as yet.
http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/news/story?id=3257218

[rthomas]

Instead of post of the day, this is thread of the day. Now lets start the pool about how soon he gets hired by another school.....

Sampson did the exact same thing at two different schools and THEN lied about it. Lied! Who would touch him at this point?

[mgtr]

I agree, but there always seems to be some desperate AD who will hire just about anybody (except maybe the Herricks).

[devildeac]

Sampson did the exact same thing at two different schools and THEN lied about it. Lied! Who would touch him at this point?

now who was it that hired neuheisel...

don't think they need a BB coach now, however...

[SilkyJ]

They tried, got a busy signal.


SEEEEEEEEEYAAAAAAAA!!!

ziiiiiiiiiiiiiiiing! potd!

[devildeac]

Yes, 577 times. :D

even better than the busy signal reply...

[billybreen]

Well, that's no surprise. Good riddance.

[billybreen]

I think he is just too tainted. Sorta like Jim Harrick after UGA.

Then again, Tark got another shot at Fresno St., so who knows.

--Jason "so, will it be Skiles as the new head coach?" Evans

Robert Montgomery Knight

[davidjlee]

This a move that had to be made. Sampson does not get it. My true opinion is that does not care about the rules. He is a disgrace

[ArkieDukie]

Wally Hall (AR Democrat-Gazette sports editor/host of "Sports Wrap, a local sports radio show) doesn't understand why Kelvin Sampson was fired: "It wasn't like he was paying his players or anything; he was only making phone calls." Which he lied about. Wally Hall can be a complete bozo sometimes.

Kelvin Sampson is not exactly the sharpest knife in the drawer. Dude, you got caught for the same thing at Oklahoma. You gotta know the NCAA is going to have you under a microscope. If in doubt, see Tarkanian, Jerry. Or Harrick, Jim. Buh-bye.

[dukegirlinsc]

Am I the only one that thinks of Half Baked every time they hear his name?


...I probably am. :rolleyes:

[billybreen]

Am I the only one that thinks of Half Baked every time they hear his name?


...I probably am. :rolleyes:

No, I'm sad to say you aren't.

Sampson Simpson!

[dukegirlinsc]

No, I'm sad to say you aren't.

Sampson Simpson!

You have smoked yourself retarded. :o

[BD80]

CBS's Gary Parish is reporting that the current team has threatened to boycott if Sampson doesn't coach the rest of the season.

http://www.cbs.sportsline.com/collegebasketball/story/10659277

[billybreen]

CBS's Gary Parish is reporting that the current team has threatened to boycott if Sampson doesn't coach the rest of the season.

http://www.cbs.sportsline.com/collegebasketball/story/10659277

Please do!

[dukegirlinsc]

CBS's Gary Parish is reporting that the current team has threatened to boycott if Sampson doesn't coach the rest of the season.

http://www.cbs.sportsline.com/collegebasketball/story/10659277

Isn't that a shame?

[ugadevil]

CBS's Gary Parish is reporting that the current team has threatened to boycott if Sampson doesn't coach the rest of the season.

http://www.cbs.sportsline.com/collegebasketball/story/10659277


I find this whole situation to be absolutely ridiculous. Sampson broke the rules and should suffer the consequences of his actions. Also, I think the players should understand the consequences of Sampson's actions and see that he has a problem with following the rules. I'm not some old guy who's looking down on young people making questionable decisions. I'm the same age as these IU players and think that they should have more of a comprehension of this problem. Their coach is dishonest and manipulative with the system, and I think they are endorsing it by demanding that he remain their coach.

[FerryFor50]

I find this whole situation to be absolutely ridiculous. Sampson broke the rules and should suffer the consequences of his actions. Also, I think the players should understand the consequences of Sampson's actions and see that he has a problem with following the rules. I'm not some old guy who's looking down on young people making questionable decisions. I'm the same age as these IU players and think that they should have more of a comprehension of this problem. Their coach is dishonest and manipulative with the system, and I think they are endorsing it by demanding that he remain their coach.

My money says it was Mr. One and Done, Eric Gordon, who said they won't play without Sampson.

Of course he'd say that. This is his only season with the team.

[Stray Gator]

The IU administration may view the situation differently, but from my perspective the players' threat to boycott actually forecloses any option to let Sampson stay on as interim coach. If the administration doesn't dismiss Sampson now, it will convey the impression that IU caved in to the players' ultimatum.

[Carlos]

Sampson did the exact same thing at two different schools and THEN lied about it. Lied! Who would touch him at this point?

This didn't stop Rick Neuheisel from getting a job and being a popular candidate for other jobs (ahem).

Sampson will need to go a few years and do his penance as either a broadcaster or a professional assistant and then he'll resurface somewhere.

In the meantime, if the guy had any kind of style at all he would work out some sort of endorsement deal with Verizon or Alltel.

[BD80]

The IU administration may view the situation differently, but from my perspective the players' threat to boycott actually forecloses any option to let Sampson stay on as interim coach. If the administration doesn't dismiss Sampson now, it will convey the impression that IU caved in to the players' ultimatum.

Amen. But will the admin ask the players for input as to the next coach? Their threat does not speak well of the players' feelings for Dakich.

[Channing]

to add insult to injury - wasnt Sampson the head of the coaches compliance committee or something like that while he was at OU?

[BD80]

The decision has been made, but not yet published.

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/news/story?id=3258506

Why is it so important for them to say the decision wasn't made until this morning? Sounds like legalese CYA to me.

[BD80]

Justice?

It appears that at least some of the illegal (Per NCAA rules) calls were to Eric Gordon, the recruit Sampson stole from Illinois after Gordon had announced he would attend Illinois. This per a source of Skip Bayless on ESPN First and Ten.

It would then seem that the illegal calls improperly benefited Indiana. Would Sampson have been able to convince Gordon to renege on his commitment if he had limited his contact to what the NCAA permits?

[JG Nothing]

to add insult to injury - wasnt Sampson the head of the coaches compliance committee or something like that while he was at OU?

I'm not sure about any compliance committee, but he was president of the National Association of Basketball Coaches while violating the rules at OU.

[BD80]

SI's Luke Winn is reporting that Indiana players don't want to play for Dakich, but will play for Ray McCallum.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2008/writers/luke_winn/02/22/indiana/index.html?eref=T1

[Carlos]

What about Mike Davis.... will they play for him? He'd be a good choice.

[JasonEvans]

SI's Luke Winn is reporting that Indiana players don't want to play for Dakich, but will play for Ray McCallum.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2008/writers/luke_winn/02/22/indiana/index.html?eref=T1

Indiana needs to tell the players "thank you very much for your input. It will be taken into account when we make our decision," and then make whatever decision the University thinks is best. If the players "revolt" then Indiana reminds them that they either play for IU or they can sit out a year after transferring.

--Jason "only minutes until we know how this all turns out" Evans

[socaldukie]

for the rest of the season. With a pink slip awaiting him at the end.


http://cbs.sportsline.com/collegebasketball/story/10661089

[billybreen]

for the rest of the season. With a pink slip awaiting him at the end.


http://cbs.sportsline.com/collegebasketball/story/10661089

What's the rationale for not firing him now? Does it placate the players to some extent, or would that even have entered the equation?

[Devil in the Blue Dress]

What's the rationale for not firing him now? Does it placate the players to some extent, or would that even have entered the equation?
A suspension makes sense since this situation is one involving allegations. The university and the NCAA need to do thorough investigations during the suspension. While a decision to fire Sampson is likely, it's more appropriate to fire after an investigation which demonstrates wrongdoing sufficient to merit firing.

[wtsnap]

What's the rationale for not firing him now? Does it placate the players to some extent, or would that even have entered the equation?

It might help the university if Sampson filed a lawsuit against them ala Jim O`Brien at OSU.

[billybreen]

A suspension makes sense since this situation is one involving allegations. The university and the NCAA need to do thorough investigations during the suspension. While a decision to fire Sampson is likely, it's more appropriate to fire after an investigation which demonstrates wrongdoing sufficient to merit firing.

Makes sense, as does wtsnap's point. Probably better safe than sorry, and they've just completed another litigious separation with a coach (one RMK).

[TwoDukeTattoos]

for the rest of the season. With a pink slip awaiting him at the end.


http://cbs.sportsline.com/collegebasketball/story/10661089

He just screwed himself out of a career. Great to see Capel kicking butt with OU now!

[Shammrog]

What's the rationale for not firing him now? Does it placate the players to some extent, or would that even have entered the equation?

As I understand it, it is in his contract that he be suspended and have 10 days to appeal before being dismissed for NCAA violations. I think IU is trying as best it can to avoid having to pay the $2.5M due on the contract (though - while Sampson deserves to get the boot - IU may well still be in a precarious position by not letting the NCAA process go through in 90 days before it takes action.)

[Classof06]

It might help the university if Sampson filed a lawsuit against them ala Jim O`Brien at OSU.

Sampson's not in position to sue them. This is why Indiana took a week to look into their options. O'Brien sued OSU and won because OSU fired him before the NCAA hearing. IU will suspend Sampson until the hearing then fire him to avoid any lawsuit. It's basically a technicality.

[FireOgilvie]

He's officially gone. 750k paid as a settlement as long as he doesn't sue. Dakich is the coach immediately.

[dukie8]

He's officially gone. 750k paid as a settlement as long as he doesn't sue. Dakich is the coach immediately.

how could indiana have signed a contract with him that didn't give them a clear out if any sampson committed any ncaa violations? katz is reporting that 550K of the 750K came from an anonymous donor. indiana shouldn't have paid him a cent. also, the ncaa better not go light with indiana because they issued a preemptory firing. if violations were committed in getting gordon, then the school should suffer some severe penalties.

[-bdbd]

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/college/mensbasketball/bigten/2008-02-14-indiana-top-recruit_N.htm

Apparently a very highly recruited (top-10, class of 08) PF from NYC, Devin Ebanks, who'd signed with IU is now reconsidering.

Hmmmm....

Anybody know of any great college baketball programs that might be interested in a top-10 PF recruit for the 08 HS class??

Seriously, what are the rules of the road in terms of engaging with a recruit who had previously committed/signed with another program, but then decommits due to coaching change/scandal, etc.? Would love to see another "big" in Royal Blue next Fall.... Was he ever on Duke's radar?

Thoughts?

-BDBD :rolleyes:

[BD80]

Since the sides reached agreement, you wonder how much of the blame for the infractions Sampson has agreed to take, thus tending to absolve IU of the "lack of institutional control" issue.

Ray McCallum has been promoted to assistant head coach, but has been the lead recruiting assistant. How much was he involved in the phone calls?

How much input into the next coaching search does $550,000 buy one at IU?

[Johnny B]

I'm not going to defend Sampson's actions, however, I need some clarification. Are the NCAA infractions proven or alleged? Is the investigation completely concluded with all parties having the opportunity for defense?

As Duke fans, we don't need reminded that due course should be followed prior to conclusions. This is not a criminal investigation and is an order of magnitude less than the LAX case, however, shouldn't similar principles apply? Of course, due process may have been followed and the allegations completely followed through to conclusions.

I don't have enough information. Anyone?

On another note, it's a sad day for IU and I hope they get their house in order soon.

[billybreen]

By the title of this thread, I thought you were going to defend him. I was curious to see how that was possible, and I agree it isn't.

[jimsumner]

I'm not a lawyer but I don't see how the NCAA could touch his salary.

IU? There's a story about a flood in the woods. A scorpion (sometimes a snake) talks himself onto a boat of rabbits by promising it's not going to eat anyone it just wants to avoid drowning. When the boat safely reaches shore, the scorpion starts eating a rabbit. The rabbit screams "but you promised you wouldn't eat us." The scorpion responds, "oh, stop crying. You knew what I was when you let me on the boat."

IU knew they were letting a scorpion on the boat.

[RelativeWays]

Its actually a scorpion asking a frog to carry him across the river. The frog agrees, on the condition that the scorpion won't sting him. However when they cross, the scorpion stings the frog. The frog says "you idiot, now we are both going to die. Why did you do that" To which the scorpion replies, "because I'm a scorpion"

Isn't that in Kill Bill?

[ArkieDukie]

Its actually a scorpion asking a frog to carry him across the river. The frog agrees, on the condition that the scorpion won't sting him. However when they cross, the scorpion stings the frog. The frog says "you idiot, now we are both going to die. Why did you do that" To which the scorpion replies, "because I'm a scorpion"

Isn't that in Kill Bill?

Actually, I heard that story on "Gilmore Girls." Lorelai compared herself to the frog and her parents to the scorpions IIRC.

[jimsumner]

I've heard the story a dozen different ways. But I confess, the Gilmore Girls telling of it is new to me.

[dukie8]

I'm not going to defend Sampson's actions, however, I need some clarification. Are the NCAA infractions proven or alleged? Is the investigation completely concluded with all parties having the opportunity for defense?

As Duke fans, we don't need reminded that due course should be followed prior to conclusions. This is not a criminal investigation and is an order of magnitude less than the LAX case, however, shouldn't similar principles apply? Of course, due process may have been followed and the allegations completely followed through to conclusions.

I don't have enough information. Anyone?

On another note, it's a sad day for IU and I hope they get their house in order soon.

you only have the right to due process with respect to the government. indiana had no legal obligation to give it here. the school did its investigation and concluded it had enough info on sampson. he may or may not have been able to argue his side but it is immaterial.

jason, the answer to your question is pond scum. i stated earlier that the ncaa should throw the book at both indiana and sampson. he should be banned for 5 years and the school should be banned from the post season for at least 2 years. after seeing harrick get re-hired by georgia when it was clear he was a crook, it wouldn't surprise me if sampson eventually surfaces somewhere.

[BD80]

I still think IU needs to be punished. It was reported that the redacted name on the report is Gordon's and thus the impermissible calls directly benefited IU by giving IU's staff additional contact with a recruit they stole from Illinois.

IU has greatly benefited from Gordon, and thus from Sampson's illegal conduct. Indiana would not be having such a good season but for the illegal conduct. Indiana hired a coach who had already been found guilty of the same conduct. Indiana should have suspected something when such a high profile recruit reneged on an oral commitment to a rival school. Indiana made a deal with the devil and should pay the price.

IU has 5 seniors and Gordon that will not be back. 4 HS seniors have signed LOIs. I think those kids should be allowed to have the schollies they have been promised. Limiting IU to 4 or 5 schollies over the next 2 years as well as some serious probation sounds right to me.

[Dukiedevil]

I don't think IU's punishment will be as bad as some of you have intimated. The school self-reported their initial findings and Sampson lied to them and the NCAA during that process. The NCAA furthered the investigation and uncovered some untruths. Keep in mind that these weren't bags of money in the mailbox or stealing a committed recruit (I don't think Gordon was one of the ones he called). It was more of a parole violation because of his previous problems with phone use.

Also it doesn't hurt that Miles Brand (previous IU AD) is the current president of the NCAA.

[mgtr]

Earlier on this thread I tried to start a pool as to when Sampson would get hired as a BB coach. Any takers now?

[billybreen]

Earlier on this thread I tried to start a pool as to when Sampson would get hired as a BB coach. Any takers now?

I'm guessing no sooner than 18 months.

[YmoBeThere]

I would say a little more than 13 months. He'll spend next season out of the picture and but will land something at a small school shortly after postseason play of next year. I guess that is why he needed the $750k.

[mpj96]

I'm not a lawyer but I don't see how the NCAA could touch his salary.

IU? There's a story about a flood in the woods. A scorpion (sometimes a snake) talks himself onto a boat of rabbits by promising it's not going to eat anyone it just wants to avoid drowning. When the boat safely reaches shore, the scorpion starts eating a rabbit. The rabbit screams "but you promised you wouldn't eat us." The scorpion responds, "oh, stop crying. You knew what I was when you let me on the boat."

IU knew they were letting a scorpion on the boat.

A scorpion eating a rabbit? Must be a pretty big scorpion. :o

You are right that the administrators at IU should have known better. Not everything that is the opposite of Knight is good. I do feel sorry for those IU fans who were suspicious of this move from the beginning and for the direction that this great program has taken.

[mpj96]

Isn't that in Kill Bill?

I can't remember if it's in Kill Bill, but I'm pretty sure there is a version in Natural Born Killers.

[BD80]

I don't think IU's punishment will be as bad as some of you have intimated. ... Keep in mind that these weren't bags of money in the mailbox or stealing a committed recruit (I don't think Gordon was one of the ones he called). ...

Also it doesn't hurt that Miles Brand (previous IU AD) is the current president of the NCAA.

I think Brand was the IU President. He would not have hired someone on probation. I don't think he will hesitate to spank IU's basketball program, if only to put it in its place. He thinks basketball received too much emphasis compared to education.

There was one name redacted on the published version of the NCAA letter to IU detailing the major violations, it is understood that the redacted name is a current IU freshman as the unredacted names are recruits that did not choose IU. Skip Bayless reported that a source of his told him that name was Gordon's. Of this year's freshmen, which was most likely to be the target of the illegal calls, the ones that had already committed or the one who had to be convinced to renege on his commitment to Illinois?

This is a case of stealing a committed recruit. IU applauded something that appalled the rest of the nation. IU is sorry the coach was stupid enough to get caught, but the coach simply did what IU knew he had done before. It won't be a slap on the wrist.

[throatybeard]

By the title of this thread, I thought you were going to defend him. I was curious to see how that was possible, and I agree it isn't.

The title's been changed a few times to keep up with events.