Let me be the 1st...Nolan or Greg?

[DukeHoopsGuru]

I know this is becoming more and more of a hot button issue, but it really is something that should be discussed intelligently. I don't know if people paid attention to it tonight, but Duke played much much better when Nolan is on the floor. Greg is tough as nails and is a very good shooter. But the fact remains he has physical limitations that are apparent and are exacerbated in March.

Greg's experience may give him the nod, but it's pretty apparent that Nolan's upside come March call for him to start. K would have to handle that delicately, but your best players play. Late in the game w/ a minute to go and Nolan banged up, Paulus wasn't even on the floor. Think about that. He didn't even come in until Singler fouled out.

[Indoor66]

I know this is becoming more and more of a hot button issue, but it really is something that should be discussed intelligently. I don't know if people paid attention to it tonight, but Duke played much much better when Nolan is on the floor. Greg is tough as nails and is a very good shooter. But the fact remains he has physical limitations that are apparent and are exacerbated in March.

Greg's experience may give him the nod, but it's pretty apparent that Nolan's upside come March call for him to start. K would have to handle that delicately, but your best players play. Late in the game w/ a minute to go and Nolan banged up, Paulus wasn't even on the floor. Think about that. He didn't even come in until Singler fouled out.

A rediculous point to debate. Each will contibute about equally. They bring different talents and each has great skill.

[Duvall]

Why "or"?

Play them both. Whoever has the hot hand gets the lion's share of the minutes, but both should play plenty. Having multiple lead guards is an asset, not a problem.

[Mike Corey]

I'm not sure that it's an "either or" situation.

We have two great point guards that bring different styles and different strengths. No need to choose, IMO.

I'm just thrilled we have them both for another year. They'll both continue pushing each other, which will make them--and this team--better.

[freedevil]

I have been one of the hardest people on Greg on this board, but I think he is still the clear starter for these reasons: (1) Greg just had a bad night tonight (and Nolan had what had to be hist best game of his career, right?), (2) the match up with Vasquez really favored Nolan's athleticism.

[pamtar]

Both. Period.

[DukeHoopsGuru]

A rediculous point to debate. Each will contibute about equally. They bring different talents and each has great skill.

Why is it ridiculous to debate? Nolan's minutes now will play a major role in March. It's obtuse to think otherwise. Your best players should play.....period. It's not a knock on Greg. Nolan has ACC athleticism.

[Indoor66]

Why is it ridiculous to debate? Nolan's minutes now will play a major role in March. It's obtuse to think otherwise. Your best players should play.....period. It's not a knock on Greg. Nolan has ACC athleticism.

Read the next 2 sentences.

[jzp5079]

A rediculous point to debate. Each will contibute about equally. They bring different talents and each has great skill.

Nolan gets more experience now in ACC play - has a higher ceiling - is improving more and more with every game - ie. the more he plays - the better he'll get - the farther Duke will go in March.

[The1Bluedevil]

In 3 years has anyone see Greg hit one pull up? He over drives and his conversion rate on layups is poor. He needs to work on his mid range.

[Duvall]

Why is it ridiculous to debate? Nolan's minutes now will play a major role in March. It's obtuse to think otherwise. Your best players should play.....period.

What do you mean, his minutes now? Smith is getting at least 20 minutes a game in ACC play. That's more than enough to get him ready for March, and a number that will continue to rise as Smith shows that he's ready for this level.

It really is amazing. For years - years! - people complained about not playing the bench. Now Duke has a deep team, and people are complaining about the time-sharing arrangements. Unbelievable.

[Taco]

This is retarded. We have two point guards with complementary strengths who share minutes, each an excellent change of pace from the other.

What is there to be upset about?

[Duvall]

In 3 years has anyone see Greg hit one pull up?

Aside from the one he hit tonight to tie the game? No, not really.

[Jumbo]

Both. Next question?

[dukestheheat]

We need them both; this is a good 'problem' to have! I love Nolan's athleticism and Greg's shooting.

dth.

[jzp5079]

don't know whos upset. its just a discussion. its obviously something some Duke fans are pondering. It's good to hear stuff from both sides.

[jzp5079]

Aside from the one he hit tonight to tie the game? No, not really.

There is a huge difference between pulling up on a fast break and pulling up mid-range in traffic.

No knock on that shot - it was huge - Smith probably wouldn't have hit it.

[loran16]

Seriously, the arrangement is perfect as of now. They're essentially splitting time, which leads to two well rested point guards.

My problem with K in the past has been him playing players too much, as 40 minutes is hard to do. 20 min Each allows for both our point guards, the most important position at setting up our O, to be fully rested.

[DukeHoopsGuru]

It really is amazing. For years - years! - people complained about not playing the bench. Now Duke has a deep team, and people are complaining about the time-sharing arrangements. Unbelievable.[/QUOTE]

Why can't Duke's bench still work w/ Paulus being the one coming off the bench? People, I'd take a Greg Paulus any day, but he has athletic limitations. Just think back to VCU and Eric Maynor. Greg shot greg, but the fact remains Duke had to have John Scheyer guarding him on the most crucial play of the game. Smith, Nelson, and Henderson gives Duke arguably its most athletic 1, 2, and 3 in a long long time under K..............maybe ever.

[dukelifer]

I know this is becoming more and more of a hot button issue, but it really is something that should be discussed intelligently. I don't know if people paid attention to it tonight, but Duke played much much better when Nolan is on the floor. Greg is tough as nails and is a very good shooter. But the fact remains he has physical limitations that are apparent and are exacerbated in March.

Greg's experience may give him the nod, but it's pretty apparent that Nolan's upside come March call for him to start. K would have to handle that delicately, but your best players play. Late in the game w/ a minute to go and Nolan banged up, Paulus wasn't even on the floor. Think about that. He didn't even come in until Singler fouled out.

Clearly Smith is rapidly improving- but Freshman should not play that much or they can hit a wall. I expect both will play and continue to contribute. Paulus is a smart guy- he knows his limitations and having Smith come in and not letting him have to play all game is helping him to be fresher at the end. In the last few games, Paulus has played very well in the closing minutes.

[DukeUsul]

What do you mean, his minutes now? Smith is getting at least 20 minutes a game in ACC play. That's more than enough to get him ready for March, and a number that will continue to rise as Smith shows that he's ready for this level.

It really is amazing. For years - years! - people complained about not playing the bench. Now Duke has a deep team, and people are complaining about the time-sharing arrangements. Unbelievable.

Agreed Duvall.

I love the way we're bringing guys in and out, and allowing Nolan to assist with the PG duties... including sometimes having both him and GP in at the same time.

Do people who want Nolan to start at PG want GP to become a role-player?

All I know is that when it comes down to crunch time, I want Greg handling the ball down the stretch of close games.

[DukeHoopsGuru]

Clearly Smith is rapidly improving- but Freshman should not play that much or they can hit a wall. I expect both will play and continue to contribute. Paulus is a smart guy- he knows his limitations and having Smith come in and not letting him have to play all game is helping him to be fresher at the end. In the last few games, Paulus has played very well in the closing minutes.

Ya Carmello Anthony really hit the wall when it mattered most. And Kyle's hitting the wall too right? You can make some decent arguments for Greg starting, but a freshman hitting the wall is not one of them.

[DukeBlood]

I posted this in the Post-Game thread.

Smith had 21 minutes and Paulus had 20 minutes. Does it really matter who starts when Smith is getting his fair share of minutes??

I think this is a better discussion for next year. Right now I love it the way it is. Next year though(when Smith has the experience under his belt and the off-season to improve).. Then its a discussion worthy of DBR :)

[Jumbo]

It really is amazing. For years - years! - people complained about not playing the bench. Now Duke has a deep team, and people are complaining about the time-sharing arrangements. Unbelievable.

Why can't Duke's bench still work w/ Paulus being the one coming off the bench? People, I'd take a Greg Paulus any day, but he has athletic limitations. Just think back to VCU and Eric Maynor. Greg shot greg, but the fact remains Duke had to have John Scheyer guarding him on the most crucial play of the game. Smith, Nelson, and Henderson gives Duke arguably its most athletic 1, 2, and 3 in a long long time under K..............maybe ever.[/quote]

That post made no sense. "Greg shot Greg?" Huh? Who is "John" Scheyer? What's wrong with his guarding Maynor? He's an oustatanding perimeter defender. Duke's had plenty of deep teams before. Duke's had plenty of athletic perimeter trios before. Methinks you haven't been a Duke fan all that long -- and certainly not a guru.

And why are you even starting this debate tonight? Can't you enjoy a great win? Who cares who starts? As long as K puts both of thos guys in situations to help the team, and Duke keeps winning, who cares how many minutes each guy gets, or who starts?

[Jumbo]

Ya Carmello Anthony really hit the wall when it mattered most. And Kyle's hitting the wall too right? You can make some decent arguments for Greg starting, but a freshman hitting the wall is not one of them.

Who is "Carmello" Anthony?

[mapei]

I think Smith is playing better than Greg right now, but I'm totally comfortable with the way K's lineups are working - *exactly* because he is playing the bench. And who's to say that Greg won't be playing better than Smith again soon? A week ago, I thought Scheyer was all-world; tonight he looked slow and unworthy of being on the floor. It happens.

[pamtar]

Nolan gets more experience now in ACC play - has a higher ceiling - is improving more and more with every game - ie. the more he plays - the better he'll get - the farther Duke will go in March.

Remember what happened last time we went into March with a freshman starting point guard?

[mr. synellinden]

First, yes, we are lucky to have two extremely talented players to handle the PG duties. We are also fortunate that we have four other players (Singler, Henderson, Nelson, Scheyer) who are comfortable handling the ball.

BUT, I believe strongly, and have since the ACC season started, that we are a better team offensively and defensively with Smith on the court. I think he is currently a better drive/draw/dish passer, penetrator, finisher and defender than Greg. That's my opinion based on the games since 2008 started. I see Smith getting better and better each game. I thought he was outstanding tonight - even better than against VT.

What we have lacked for the past few seasons is a PG who can create offense by breaking down a defense and Nolan can do that.

[DukeHoopsGuru]

And why are you even starting this debate tonight? Can't you enjoy a great win? Who cares who starts? As long as K puts both of thos guys in situations to help the team, and Duke keeps winning, who cares how many minutes each guy gets, or who starts?

Tonight's the perfect night to debate it. After a game when Duke makes runs b/c Nolan Smith is the point guard. He gets hurt, Greg comes in and commits a turnover. Greg had 1 good play tonight in 20 minutes.......a 3 pointer.

People get so defensive with this issue, and it's comical. Sometimes you're so involved you can't see the forest through the trees. So just ask other people who watch and are knowledgeable on college basketball. Ask them about Greg. You'll get this. "Great shooter, gutsy, too slow. Not an top tier college point guard."

[shadowfax336]

Most teams wouldn't view it as a problem to have 2 McDonalds all american PGs...
Do you think any other team in the ACC wouldn't mind having Paulus or Nolan added to their roster. They bring different strengths and weaknesses, complement each other perfectly, and provide insurance against injury or having a bad game.

We would have been in serious trouble tonight if when Nolan went down (was it cramps?) we didn't have an experienced PG (Paulus) to come in. We would have been in trouble when Greg got in foul trouble if we didn't have a future-star PG to bring off the bench.

Let Greg start as the upperclassman and the leader unless Nolan completely blows him away (which he hasn't if you look at the numbers, he may be flashier but the numbers tend to say they're at worst equally effective), but then go by matchups and by who's playing well. Its pretty simple and aa really good thing for Duke

[bbar7502]

Nolan= 2001 Duhon

[jzp5079]

I posted this in the Post-Game thread.

Smith had 21 minutes and Paulus had 20 minutes. Does it really matter who starts when Smith is getting his fair share of minutes??

I think this is a better discussion for next year. Right now I love it the way it is. Next year though(when Smith has the experience under his belt and the off-season to improve).. Then its a discussion worthy of DBR :)

its plenty worthy right now.

[DukeHoopsGuru]

BUT, I believe strongly, and have since the ACC season started, that we are a better team offensively and defensively with Smith on the court. I think he is currently a better drive/draw/dish passer, penetrator, finisher and defender than Greg. That's my opinion based on the games since 2008 started. I see Smith getting better and better each game. I thought he was outstanding tonight - even better than against VT.

What we have lacked for the past few seasons is a PG who can create offense by breaking down a defense and Nolan can do that.

Thank you.

[heath_harshman4]

I think the point that the original poster was trying to make was not just how nolan did, but how the team did with Nolan in. I don't have the numbers in front of me, but I would bet the point differential would be higher with Nolan in the game.

I am in a dilemma right now personally. I have loved Greg ever since he got to Durham. But while Greg makes some spectacular plays in big moments, he also makes very very frustrating ones in big moments as well. And I know everyone loves Greg's shooting, but Nolan's aint too bad either.

This is a GOOD problem to have, and I think K will make the right decision. Whatever that decision may be.

[DukeHoopsGuru]

Let Greg start as the upperclassman and the leader unless Nolan completely blows him away (which he hasn't if you look at the numbers, he may be flashier but the numbers tend to say they're at worst equally effective), but then go by matchups and by who's playing well. Its pretty simple and aa really good thing for Duke

You can't look at the numbers. Nolan was learning how to play a position he never played before. Just look at the last 5 games, and I'm not talking from a #s point of view. Just watch the games.

[Johnny B]

Easy...Greg Smith....

...or maybe Nolan Paulus?

We are very fortunate to have both.

[dukestheheat]

I watched in horror as Nolan seemed to be in some great pain; does anyone know what happened to him!?? He played so well tonight and I'm going to start his fan club for Duke. Why did he have to go out?

thanks,

dth.

[jzp5079]

Remember what happened last time we went into March with a freshman starting point guard?

um... wasn't that point guard Paulus... Paulus and Smith are two completely different players. Smith played at Oak Hill. Don't forget that. Do you know who he played against every day in practice? Can any point guard do anything (freshmen or not) when your best player shoots 3-17 (didn't look that up but I believe JJ shot close to that)?

[Karl Beem]

Both.:p

[RelativeWays]

I like Gregs toughness and Nolan's athleticism, its a luxury we didn't have last year. I would like to see Greg tighten up a bit on some of the mistakes he is still making as a junior, Nolan needs to be a little more consistent on offense, both have made improvements and still need to improve in other areas. I say you start whoever based on matchup

[dukelifer]

Ya Carmello Anthony really hit the wall when it mattered most. And Kyle's hitting the wall too right? You can make some decent arguments for Greg starting, but a freshman hitting the wall is not one of them.

Sure you can find exceptions- but many Freshman hit the wall. The way Kyle plays - he may literally hit a wall if he is not careful.

[Devil in the Blue Dress]

I concur with what you've said, Jumbo. What a great win.... we have more guys in foul trouble than Maryland, but we've got the bench to keep going and win. We've wanted a strong bench for YEARS and now we seem to have it. I don't feel the least bit slighted that Coach K is the one deciding who plays the point! This is one team I love to watch!

[loran16]

You can't look at the numbers. Nolan was learning how to play a position he never played before. Just look at the last 5 games, and I'm not talking from a #s point of view. Just watch the games.

Actually, #s tell a good bit of the story you miss. Nolan is a flashier player. When he plays well, you think he plays a ton better than Paulus due to the flash. But the #s prove differently. Smith is a better scorer for sure, but as a pure PG, at the moment they're pretty equal. And thus they split time. Who cares who plays what 20 minutes then?

[rthomas]

In Coach you should trust.

[Saratoga2]

This is retarded. We have two point guards with complementary strengths who share minutes, each an excellent change of pace from the other.

What is there to be upset about?

I think the thread is out of line and I agree with you, we have two really valuable players and both will get a lot of PT this year. Nolan is looking excellent and Greg has his really good games as well. Let's celebrate having two point guards that can play!

[Jumbo]

Tonight's the perfect night to debate it. After a game when Duke makes runs b/c Nolan Smith is the point guard. He gets hurt, Greg comes in and commits a turnover. Greg had 1 good play tonight in 20 minutes.......a 3 pointer.

People get so defensive with this issue, and it's comical. Sometimes you're so involved you can't see the forest through the trees. So just ask other people who watch and are knowledgeable on college basketball. Ask them about Greg. You'll get this. "Great shooter, gutsy, too slow. Not an top tier college point guard."

I see forest, the trees and the lake they surround -- the one in which you are slowly drowning. This is a remarkably stupid thread. There is no reason to "choose" between one. Play the hot hand, let them both develop, and enjoy a great win. Why create controversy for the sake of creating controversy.

[DukeHoopsGuru]

Actually, #s tell a good bit of the story you miss. Nolan is a flashier player. When he plays well, you think he plays a ton better than Paulus due to the flash. But the #s prove differently. Smith is a better scorer for sure, but as a pure PG, at the moment they're pretty equal. And thus they split time. Who cares who plays what 20 minutes then?

Do your numbers tell you who the better on-the-ball defender is? Or does that not count, because you can't quantify it? Just watch the games. If anything Smith's style of play suits this team better to begin with. The college game is changing. It's becoming more and more of an athlete's game. K realized this, hence Henderson, Smith, Williams, and hopefully Boynton.

This is an up tempo team w/o a great frontcourt that feeds off of pressure defense. So which one of Duke's point guards fits that style? Watch the freaking games people. It's not a knock on Greg. Nolan suits this team's style better. Yes he's still raw, but you let him work that out now by giving him the lion's share of the point guard minutes.

[heath_harshman4]

I see forest, the trees and the lake they surround -- the one in which you are slowly drowning. This is a remarkably stupid thread. There is no reason to "choose" between one. Play the hot hand, let them both develop, and enjoy a great win. Why create controversy for the sake of creating controversy.

Controversy is always gonna be there when a young guy comes in hot and out-plays (which he has) the starter for a few games.

I don't think its big enough to where Greg has to worry about his job, but its definitly a debateable subject. Especially when you're in ACC play and cannot afford to give away games.

[DukeHoopsGuru]

I see forest, the trees and the lake they surround -- the one in which you are slowly drowning. This is a remarkably stupid thread. There is no reason to "choose" between one. Play the hot hand, let them both develop, and enjoy a great win. Why create controversy for the sake of creating controversy.

I see. You can only start a good thread after a defeat. You often learn about your team during wins as well. I guess the "I watched the tape of so and so, and I can't wait to see this guy in a Duke uniform!" threads on a Tuesday afternoon are better. If anything, this game is a perfect time to intelligently ask the question.

[Jumbo]

Controversy is always gonna be there when a young guy comes in hot and out-plays (which he has) the starter for a few games.

I don't think its big enough to where Greg has to worry about his job, but its definitly a debateable subject. Especially when you're in ACC play and cannot afford to give away games.

The premise is idiotic. Both guys are playing a lot. Who cares who starts? Nolan was playing great tonight and -- guess what -- K went with him down the stretch until he got hurt. That's all that matters.

[Jumbo]

I see. You can only start a good thread after a defeat. You often learn about your team during wins as well. I guess the "I watched the tape of so and so, and I can't wait to see this guy in a Duke uniform!" threads on a Tuesday afternoon are better. If anything, this game is a perfect time to intelligently ask the question.

Thanks, chief. That's exactly what I said. I love analyzing the team after the loss. I have a thread in mind that I want to start tomorrow. Tonight, I want everyone to enjoy it, rather than debating whether Nolan Smith should play 25 or 20 minutes.

I'd also probably wait more than five posts to start a thread debating who Duke's starting point guard should be. That, and your brilliant analysis of "athleticism" (Singler and Scheyer aren't "athletic") and your awesome spelling has made this a can't-miss thread.

[rthomas]

I think Dukehoopsguru is yanking our collective chains.

[shadowfax336]

Especially when you're in ACC play and cannot afford to give away games.
Well then lets worry about it when the issue is showing any tendency to "give away games"
I certainly wouldn't say that Paulus has been causing us to give away games...
Unless you've been watching some losses (or even close games) that I haven't
This team has been finishing people out on a consistent basis this year. Paulus has always been the PG in the game at the end of the game when we've done that. The man is not costing us games...

[dukelifer]

Tonight's the perfect night to debate it. After a game when Duke makes runs b/c Nolan Smith is the point guard. He gets hurt, Greg comes in and commits a turnover. Greg had 1 good play tonight in 20 minutes.......a 3 pointer.

People get so defensive with this issue, and it's comical. Sometimes you're so involved you can't see the forest through the trees. So just ask other people who watch and are knowledgeable on college basketball. Ask them about Greg. You'll get this. "Great shooter, gutsy, too slow. Not an top tier college point guard."
Paulus has 12 points in 19 minutes and Smith has 14 points in 20. Smith pulled down 6 boards and they both hit all their throws. Both played pretty well. Paulus did his damage in the first few minutes and at the end- Smith in the middle. I am not advocating Paulus over Smith- Smith gives something Paulus does not- but both played well tonight at different moments.

[DukeHoopsGuru]

I rarely post on message boards. When I do post it's to start an interesting debate. And you can always count the spelling police. Just ask people who aren't Duke fans. You'll get your answer. And I wasn't attacking you for the usual posts. That is why I don't post. You post to spark a debate, but not just to flame. Tonight's game was an appropriate time for this post. Ease up message board police.

[jzp5079]

The premise is idiotic. Both guys are playing a lot. Who cares who starts? Nolan was playing great tonight and -- guess what -- K went with him down the stretch until he got hurt. That's all that matters.

I think its been pretty clear to me its more of a debate of:

1) Has the younger aprentice over taken the 'master'?

and

2) Who should assume responsibility as our #1 man at the point?


arguing that there should be no change (and no one should care) is just one side of the spectrum.

[CAT Blue Devil]

I am starting to think that there is some merit to leaving Paulus to a shooting guard role, especially if Nolan continues to set himself apart with penetration.

With Duke's emphasis on spacing on three legit threats off the dribble (Henderson, Nolan, and DeMarcus), I really like this team's chances.

Not to mention the upcheck on on the ball pressure that Nolan brings.

This is probably a bad thing to say, but I almost was glad Paulus got his fourth foul!

[killerleft]

Haven't time to read this whole thread tonight, but the question asked misses the whole point of this team. We need them BOTH... along with the rest of the guys!

This team will win by committee. I see no egos to bruise, so they continue to improve and help each other to get better.

What fun! Coach K must be having a ball!!

[elvis14]

Great thread, thanks so much for starting it. As this season has gone on Nolan Smith has gotten better and better. Having both of these guys is great for the team. The question to me isn't just who starts but who should be playing the most minutes, and who should be playing in crunch time. Another way of asking the same question is should the roles of Nolan and Greg change?

Everyone has their own opinion so I'll give mine by answering those questions. Starter, Nolan. Most minutes, Nolan. In at crunch Time, whoever is having the best game. Roles, not only should they change but they already have and continue to change. We have brought Nolan along slowly (and I'm glad) and he has shown he is ready to take his game to the next level. Tonight Nolan and Greg had about the same number of minutes. In the past, Greg played more. I hope we see Nolan's minutes steadily eat into Greg's until we have about a 2/3 Nolan, 1/3 Greg split come tournament time. We just need Nolan on the floor, especially on the defensive end of the floor.

I'm not saying I don't support Greg, I just think his role going forward is to support Nolan the way Nolan has supported him up til now. That doesn't change the amount of depth we have, it just adjusts minutes.

I'm really geeked about our road win tonight. Off to read the post-game thread....

[DukeUsul]

Do your numbers tell you who the better on-the-ball defender is? Or does that not count, because you can't quantify it? Just watch the games. If anything Smith's style of play suits this team better to begin with. The college game is changing. It's becoming more and more of an athlete's game. K realized this, hence Henderson, Smith, Williams, and hopefully Boynton.

This is an up tempo team w/o a great frontcourt that feeds off of pressure defense. So which one of Duke's point guards fits that style? Watch the freaking games people. It's not a knock on Greg. Nolan suits this team's style better. Yes he's still raw, but you let him work that out now by giving him the lion's share of the point guard minutes.

http://www.goduke.com/ViewArticle.dbml?DB_OEM_ID=4200&ATCLID=1376558

TOT-FG 3-PT REBOUNDS
## Player Name FG-FGA FG-FGA FT-FTA OF DE TOT PF TP A TO BLK S MIN
12 Kyle Singler........ f 2-10 1-5 2-2 1 2 3 5 7 1 3 0 2 31
42 Lance Thomas........ f 2-3 0-0 2-4 1 1 2 4 6 0 1 0 0 18
03 Greg Paulus......... g 3-7 2-3 4-4 0 1 1 4 12 2 1 0 4 19
15 Gerald Henderson.... g 9-12 1-2 4-6 1 4 5 2 23 1 2 2 1 33
21 DeMarcus Nelson..... g 10-19 1-2 6-8 3 4 7 3 27 4 1 1 4 38
02 Nolan Smith......... 4-6 1-2 5-5 3 3 6 0 14 1 2 0 1 20

My numbers show me Greg had 12 pts, 4 steals, 2 assists, 1 TO. Nolan had 14 pts, 1 steal, 1 assist and 2 TO.

That's with roughly equal time (I know Nolan had more PT time tonight but it was close enough). And that is one of Greg's "bad" nights and apparently there's a number of people who think Nolan had one of his best performances tonight.

I'm not sure why there's an argument.

Like I said above, I love both these guys and I love them both playing PG for us. But I think Greg's the kid who like DeMarcus has the capability to will us to a long drive in the tourney. And Nolan is a fantastic PG who can come in and give us a huge spark off the bench with his speed, and can spell any of our perimeter defenders. And Nolan will be even better over the next 3 years.

[heath_harshman4]

The premise is idiotic. Both guys are playing a lot. Who cares who starts? Nolan was playing great tonight and -- guess what -- K went with him down the stretch until he got hurt. That's all that matters.

thats not my point. my point is no matter what there is gonna be controversy. If David was to have 4-5 games of 10-15 pts and 6-8 rebs we would be talking about him taking over for Lance, which is much more realistic, but i was just trying to make an example.

and your right, coach K is gonna go with who is playing better down the stretch. Just like usually Scheyer is in down the stretch but tonight Hendo was. Its all in the flow of the game.

[Jumbo]

I rarely post on message boards. When I do post it's to start an interesting debate. And you can always count the spelling police. Just ask people who aren't Duke fans. You'll get your answer. And I wasn't attacking you for the usual posts. That is why I don't post. You post to spark a debate, but not just to flame. Tonight's game was an appropriate time for this post. Ease up message board police.

You're still missing the point, chief. This isn't an issue of who is better. I think Duke fans and non-Duke fans can formulate intelligent opinions on the topic. Your entire premise was about choosing one over the other. You haven't allowed for an alternative: Playing both guys, and distributing minutes based on who is playing more effectively on a given night, is the best move. Plus, isn't it great to be able to, you know, have multiple options and depth in a given game?

[heath_harshman4]

Well then lets worry about it when the issue is showing any tendency to "give away games"
I certainly wouldn't say that Paulus has been causing us to give away games...
Unless you've been watching some losses (or even close games) that I haven't
This team has been finishing people out on a consistent basis this year. Paulus has always been the PG in the game at the end of the game when we've done that. The man is not costing us games...


If you read my post you'll see that I never said he was costing us games. That would be stupid considering we are undefeated in ACC play.

Like you said THIS TEAM is finishing off teams this year, and as far as I can tell, lately THIS TEAM plays better with Nolan in. Not enough to where Greg should lose his starting job, but as I said earlier, Coach K will make the right decision based on how the game is going.

[Jumbo]

thats not my point. my point is no matter what there is gonna be controversy. If David was to have 4-5 games of 10-15 pts and 6-8 rebs we would be talking about him taking over for Lance, which is much more realistic, but i was just trying to make an example.

and your right, coach K is gonna go with who is playing better down the stretch. Just like usually Scheyer is in down the stretch but tonight Hendo was. Its all in the flow of the game.

Uh, Scheyer and Henderson were both in down the stretch -- just like almost every game this year. Coach K has finished virtually every close game with the small lineup of Paulus-Scheyer-Nelson-Henderson-Singler. Tonight, Nolan would've finished, but he got hurt. And Singler fouled out, so Thomas was in for him.

[allenmurray]

Maybe if Smith was starting instead of Paulus we'd be ranked in the top 4 in the country. Or be atop the ACC standangs. Or we'd be 16 - 1.

What? I can't hear you. Oh, we are number 4 in the country, in first place in the ACC and have a 16 - 1 record. Right. I guess our rotation is okay after all.

[heath_harshman4]

I think its been pretty clear to me its more of a debate of:

1) Has the younger aprentice over taken the 'master'?

and

2) Who should assume responsibility as our #1 man at the point?


arguing that there should be no change (and no one should care) is just one side of the spectrum.

EXACTLY!

[dukie8]

Clearly Smith is rapidly improving- but Freshman should not play that much or they can hit a wall. I expect both will play and continue to contribute. Paulus is a smart guy- he knows his limitations and having Smith come in and not letting him have to play all game is helping him to be fresher at the end. In the last few games, Paulus has played very well in the closing minutes.

why should freshmen "not play that much or they can hit a wall?" what was ohio state thinking playing all of their freshmen to the finals last year? why did duhon start as a freshman in '01? grant in '91?

[Tappan Zee Devil]

Boy, this is a tough group. You guys are spoiled rotten.
We just go to 17-1 and you-all are ready to crucify the point guard (and it isn't even yet Lent yet - we still wore green vestments this morning).

The box score shows Greg with 12 points 2 assists 1 turn over and 1 rebound, Nolan with 14 points, 1 assist 2 turn overs and 6 rebounds. Other than rebounds - a wash. They both played well - we got 26 points from the PG position - neither does that by themselves.
Loosen up and enjoy the season. Greg and Nolan are both assets with different strengths that K can use as he sees best at the time.

Dammit - can't you just enjoy the season?????????????????????????????
This thread is completely uncalled for!!!!

Jim
T '70

[heath_harshman4]

Uh, Scheyer and Henderson were both in down the stretch -- just like almost every game this year. Coach K has finished virtually every close game with the small lineup of Paulus-Scheyer-Nelson-Henderson-Singler. Tonight, Nolan would've finished, but he got hurt. And Singler fouled out, so Thomas was in for him.

Henderson played 33 mins while Scheyer had 28 and I think we can both agree K wanted the offense going through Nelson and Hendo down the stretch.

[dukie8]

Paulus has 12 points in 19 minutes and Smith has 14 points in 20. Smith pulled down 6 boards and they both hit all their throws. Both played pretty well. Paulus did his damage in the first few minutes and at the end- Smith in the middle. I am not advocating Paulus over Smith- Smith gives something Paulus does not- but both played well tonight at different moments.

i don't know how you can describe paulus as having played well last night. he took several bad shots down the lane where he was completely out of control and at least 2 of his fouls were very ill-advised (the foul on a break for a 3-point play and the foul on vasquez when vasquez went to the floor). moreover, due to his defensive deficiencies, nelson too often has to cover the other team's pg (like tonight), which takes him away from the basket where we need him rebounding. this was not one of his better nights.

[DukeHoopsGuru]

Maybe if Smith was starting instead of Paulus we'd be ranked in the top 4 in the country. Or be atop the ACC standangs. Or we'd be 16 - 1.

What? I can't hear you. Oh, we are number 4 in the country, in first place in the ACC and have a 16 - 1 record. Right. I guess our rotation is okay after all.

I guess playing for March isn't important? You're right, Duke is 16-1 so does it reall matter right now? No it doesn't. But giving the starting nod and some more minutes will make this team that much better come March. That is my point. I never said Greg shouldn't play. I never said Greg sucks. What I asked was do you think Nolan should start to take some of Greg's minutes along w/ the starting point guard spot?

By no means do I think Nolan is a finished product. Hell, the kid didn't even play the PG position in high school. But you can't teach his athleticism. And unfortunately for Greg, he doesn't have Nolan's athleticism.

In my opinion, this team will be better off come tourney time if Nolan starts becoming the team's #1 PG. That is it.

[dukelifer]

why should freshmen "not play that much or they can hit a wall?" what was ohio state thinking playing all of their freshmen to the finals last year? why did duhon start as a freshman in '01? grant in '91?

Duhon started 10 games as a Freshman. As for Ohio State- if not for their senior against Tenn- their season would have ended well before the final four. Oden had 2 buckets that game.

[dukelifer]

i don't know how you can describe paulus as having played well last night. he took several bad shots down the lane where he was completely out of control and at least 2 of his fouls were very ill-advised (the foul on a break for a 3-point play and the foul on vasquez when vasquez went to the floor). moreover, due to his defensive deficiencies, nelson too often has to cover the other team's pg (like tonight), which takes him away from the basket where we need him rebounding. this was not one of his better nights.

Sure he had a tough time guarding a bigger Vasquez - but c'mon- 12 points- 2 assists - 4 steals! and only 1 turnover against a very good defensive team and 4 for 4 down the stretch ain't stinking up the joint.

[houstondukie]

We're 17-1, 1st place in the ACC, #3 in the country...why fix it if it ain't broke?

And why does everyone think Paulus had a bad game tonight? The turnover at the end of the game was a bad play, but that was his only turnover. He had 12 points (2/3 from 3pt) and 4 steals.

Each player knows his role on the team and I feel changing them this far into the season could only hurt our team.

In my opinion, the question of who starts at point next year is more intriguing.

[dukie8]

Duhon started 10 games as a Freshman. As for Ohio State- if not for their senior against Tenn- their season would have ended well before the final four. Oden had 2 buckets that game.

i'm not sure if you are serious because you are not making much sense. duhon played 1085 minutes as a freshman. to give you some idea how many that was, he played 1229, 1188, 1311 his next 3 years. all of duhon's minutes his freshman year makes your belief that a freshman can "hit a wall" if he "plays too many minutes" look silly.

ohio state had conley starting at pg the entire season and oden starting every game he wasn't hurt but, according to you, freshmen hit a wall when they play too many minutes. ohio state rode those 2 all the way to the finals. btw, the fact that someone else had a good game during the season is completely irrelevant to the fact that, according to you, those 2 should have hit a wall. you didn't either bother responding to the grant example. if you want more, there are plenty. ever hear of a guy named carmelo?

just to be clear, there is no such thing as a freshman hitting a wall because he played too many minutes.

[dukie8]

We're 17-1, 1st place in the ACC, #3 in the country...why fix it if it ain't broke?

And why does everyone think Paulus had a bad game tonight? The turnover at the end of the game was a bad play, but that was his only turnover. He had 12 points (2/3 from 3pt) and 4 steals.

Each player knows his role on the team and I feel changing them this far into the season could only hurt our team.

In my opinion, the question of who starts at point next year is more intriguing.

that mentality is the same mentality that people had at the end of december last year when we were in the top 5 and clearly there were things wrong with the team. don't get me wrong, there are A LOT of things going well for this team and iit has been a true pleasure watching it develop. however, it definitely isn't perfect and everyone wants to minimize the chances for an early exit in march. how to handle the pg position with nolan coming on is a legitimate issue to bat around on message boards at this point.

[dukelifer]

i'm not sure if you are serious because you are not making much sense. duhon played 1085 minutes as a freshman. to give you some idea how many that was, he played 1229, 1188, 1311 his next 3 years. all of duhon's minutes his freshman year makes your belief that a freshman can "hit a wall" if he "plays too many minutes" look silly.

ohio state had conley starting at pg the entire season and oden starting every game he wasn't hurt but, according to you, freshmen hit a wall when they play too many minutes. ohio state rode those 2 all the way to the finals. btw, the fact that someone else had a good game during the season is completely irrelevant to the fact that, according to you, those 2 should have hit a wall. you didn't either bother responding to the grant example. if you want more, there are plenty. ever hear of a guy named carmelo?

just to be clear, there is no such thing as a freshman hitting a wall because he played too many minutes.

You asked why did Duhon start- and I simply said he started only 10 games.

As for the Freshman Wall- well I guess we have a difference of opinion- I say some players hit it- and I have seen it with Duke players- but maybe it is independent of the number of minutes- I am not sure how you know that- though. If Nolan Smith is Carmelo Anthony then I think K is making a huge mistake not playing him more.

[devildeac]

This is kind of unbelievable. We just got 7/13 FG, 3/5 3PT, 9/9 FT, 4 rebounds, 3A, 3TO, 4 PF and 5 Steals from our point guard(s) combined in an incredible comeback W and folks are complaining. Those are JWill type #s and I would be ecstatic with stats approaching those game after game. I guess the A:TO was not good enough:rolleyes:. Sheesh.

[dukelifer]

i'm not sure if you are serious because you are not making much sense. duhon played 1085 minutes as a freshman. to give you some idea how many that was, he played 1229, 1188, 1311 his next 3 years. all of duhon's minutes his freshman year makes your belief that a freshman can "hit a wall" if he "plays too many minutes" look silly.

ohio state had conley starting at pg the entire season and oden starting every game he wasn't hurt but, according to you, freshmen hit a wall when they play too many minutes. ohio state rode those 2 all the way to the finals. btw, the fact that someone else had a good game during the season is completely irrelevant to the fact that, according to you, those 2 should have hit a wall. you didn't either bother responding to the grant example. if you want more, there are plenty. ever hear of a guy named carmelo?

just to be clear, there is no such thing as a freshman hitting a wall because he played too many minutes.

As for Duke Freshman point guards who played a lot possibly hitting a wall- check out Hurley's performances in late March in his Freshman year. 0-9 against UConn, 0-2 against Arkansas and 0-3 against UNLV. So maybe at least 1 Freshman in the history of college hoops hit a wall because he played too much.

[Exiled_Devil]

I guess playing for March isn't important? You're right, Duke is 16-1 so does it reall matter right now? No it doesn't. But giving the starting nod and some more minutes will make this team that much better come March. That is my point. I never said Greg shouldn't play. I never said Greg sucks. What I asked was do you think Nolan should start to take some of Greg's minutes along w/ the starting point guard spot?

By no means do I think Nolan is a finished product. Hell, the kid didn't even play the PG position in high school. But you can't teach his athleticism. And unfortunately for Greg, he doesn't have Nolan's athleticism.

In my opinion, this team will be better off come tourney time if Nolan starts becoming the team's #1 PG. That is it.

So, I can agree that Nolan is better than expected. I can even see a plausible argument for him being better than Greg - but you haven't made that yet, except for saying "look at the game" I saw an experience point gaurd start strong and finish strong, take away 4 times, and score close to the points of a freshman phenom. Paulus may not be as spectacular, but he produces.

Here are two things to consider: first, leadership is important, and as far as I can see, Demarcus and Greg are the leaders of this team. They are the most seasoned starters, and Coach K has a strong history of valuing experience.
Second, I don't have the numbers, but look at the cumulative +/- regarding Nolan and Greg - that could tell you who makes the rest of the team better.

Finally, I'm excited about Nolan's progress. And excited about Greg's steady play. I think that pitting them up against each other in our fantasy-fan discussions is useless and unfortunate. We are playing incredibly well. They are both contributing well, and fairly equally. UGh. I can't believe you are bringing this up as anything other than an interesting idea.
Exiled

[heath_harshman4]

As for Duke Freshman point guards who played a lot possibly hitting a wall- check out Hurley's performances in late March in his Freshman year. 0-9 against UConn, 0-2 against Arkansas and 0-3 against UNLV. So maybe at least 1 Freshman in the history of college hoops hit a wall because he played too much.

there's no doubt freshman, or any player, but probably freshman more often, hit a wall.

but because of too much playing time? I think that could be a factor, but the only one? Pinning hitting a wall on too much playing time alone is not a good enough argument to prove your point.

[dukelifer]

there's no doubt freshman, or any player, but probably freshman more often, hit a wall.

but because of too much playing time? I think that could be a factor, but the only one? Pinning hitting a wall on too much playing time alone is not a good enough argument to prove your point.

The wall is probably more mental than anything else. But playing a lot suggests that the player is being asked to do a lot- and if that is in pressure games day in and day out- it can take a toll. So it is likely related but not the only factor. It is also very player dependent. It just goes to show that you have to be very careful about what you say on these boards- as one little overstatement can get blown up.

[MikeS]

We need both of them to produce meaning even if Smith shows that he is better player by season's end we stick with Paulus as the starter because you don't want to shake his confidence and need him to be successful.

[Cameron]

I agree with most here, Greg and Nolan sharing the time will do just fine.

One thing is certain, however, I think we have found our next point guard great at Duke (not trying to take anything away from Greg here, just saying). That is if Nolan sticks around until he is a junior (I'm confident he will, but I guess you never know...) Nolan has been such a LIFT for us in the backcourt, both offensively and defensively. I don't even think we can put it into words how great he has been for us this season.

Last season, when Greg was really struggling, there was so much talk about Nolan perhaps coming in and taking Greg's spot. Many weren't quite sure how Nolan would do primarily handling the point guard slot, since he was more of a shooting guard at Oak Hill. Even though we didn't need him to take Greg's spot over, I think Nolan has answered that question.

He could be our next in line for Defensive Player of the Year honors. Maybe as early as next year.

[Jumbo]

Henderson played 33 mins while Scheyer had 28 and I think we can both agree K wanted the offense going through Nelson and Hendo down the stretch.

What are you talking about? We were talking about who was in the game at the end. Both of them were -- just as they both are in every close game. Have you watched many Duke games this year?

[micah75]

My numbers show me Greg had 12 pts, 4 steals, 2 assists, 1 TO. Nolan had 14 pts, 1 steal, 1 assist and 2 TO.

That's with roughly equal time (I know Nolan had more PT time tonight but it was close enough). And that is one of Greg's "bad" nights and apparently there's a number of people who think Nolan had one of his best performances tonight.

I'm not sure why there's an argument.

It's amazing, isn't it? Greg gets crapped on for his lone turnover; meanwhile, the rest of his contribution is overlooked by the thread-starter. I agree with Jumbo, can't we savor the win for say... 12 hours or so before starting a controversy about PT?

I'll tell ya, I'm gonna sic (sic) my Momma on the next person who trashes Greg Paulus, and you ain't gonna like it none too much.

[Jumbo]

As if this thread weren't silly enough, let's see what happens when I throw some stats into the mix: http://www.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/showthread.php?t=6368

[Devilsfan]

It's clear we need both of our guards as each one brings something different to the table. Paulus playing limited minutes gives him fresh legs to hit his threes, not to mention standing up to bullies like Va Tech's Washington. Smith brings something missing in guards like a Wojo and a Paulus; speed, athleticism and natural instinctiveness for the game. Paulus is the present and Smith is Dukes future, especially with the new up tempo offense that's so much fun to watch.

[SilkyJ]

I'm not sure that it's an "either or" situation.

We have two great point guards that bring different styles and different strengths. No need to choose, IMO.

I'm just thrilled we have them both for another year. They'll both continue pushing each other, which will make them--and this team--better.

I'm late to the party, but I see it as not even a question to me that Nolan should be starting and playing more, and I think its illustrated in what you said above, though I disagree with it: "two great point guards." I see greg as an adequate to good PG, he's not amazingly quick or have a great handle, but he's a very good passer a very good open shooter. I see him like wojo (who is one of my favorites of all time) where he can get the job done and get it done well.

But nolan has the capability to be truly GREAT one day. greg will never be an all-american. Nolan will be, i think. I admit that I'm talking about nolan being great in the future, and the main argument in favor of greg is that he is a vet and his experience vs. nolan's inexperience, but nolan is playing with such maturity and under complete control that I think greg's "steadying influence" argument is now negated b/c nolan is just as steady, is a solid shooter and a way, way, way better scorer overall and a way better defender. we need to start this guy, imo and have him play more minutes than greg.


In 3 years has anyone see Greg hit one pull up? He over drives and his conversion rate on layups is poor. He needs to work on his mid range.

he started to last year, but has stopped trying that. i agree he should look to try that move more.

[Mike Corey]

SilkyJ,

As a long-time lurker on this board, I've come to respect your opinion a great deal with regards to basketball. (I'm sure I'd respect it elsewhere, too, I'm just unfamiliar...but I digress).

I certainly agree with you that Nolan Smith has the potential to be a "great" at Duke. I don't agree that Greg will never be a "great." How many of us would have surmised that DeMarcus Nelson would be having this kind of a senior year prior to what has transpired thus far?

Make no mistake: Knowing that Smith and Paulus are in the backcourt makes me exceedingly happy. I am enamored with what Smith brings to this team, in all the areas you and so many others have mentioned. Knowing that he's a young man of tremendous leadership skills and character makes me all the happier.

And yet, I'm not convinced that he is infinitely better than his backcourt mate, Greg Paulus, at least not to the degree that a demonstrable difference ought to exist in terms of their playing time. I'm very happy to disagree on this point, of course.

[Matches]

I like the platoon situation we have now, but I do think as the year goes on Nolan will get more and more minutes (as seems to be happening). I love Greg to death - he's a huge part of the team - but IMO Nolan is the better playmaker and clearly the better defender.

I really wouldn't mind seeing them on the floor together more often, either, particularly late in games when we are trying to protect a lead.

[CDu]

It's amazing, isn't it? Greg gets crapped on for his lone turnover; meanwhile, the rest of his contribution is overlooked by the thread-starter. I agree with Jumbo, can't we savor the win for say... 12 hours or so before starting a controversy about PT?

I'll tell ya, I'm gonna sic (sic) my Momma on the next person who trashes Greg Paulus, and you ain't gonna like it none too much.


To be fair, Paulus has received more than his fair share of accolades for his "timely" great plays during some really bad performances. See the Davidson game and (I believe) the FSU game. Paulus' one turnover came in crunch time last night. If he can be the beneficiary of being overpraised for a bad game with a good couple of minutes, he can be the recipient of undue criticism for a good game with a bad few minutes.

Also, unrelated, I have a beef with the poster who posed the "this was a bad game for Paulus and a great game for Smith yet their stats matched" argument as evidence that Paulus is better. It was actually one of his better games this year.

Regardless, my answer to the thread is it doesn't matter who starts. The system is going to work as is - the guy who's playing better will get more minutes. They'll both be given every chance to prove themselves though, and they'll both get a fair amount of playing time.

[heath_harshman4]

What are you talking about? We were talking about who was in the game at the end. Both of them were -- just as they both are in every close game. Have you watched many Duke games this year?

There are only a couple things that bug me alot. One is when someone who doesn't know me AT ALL questions my fanhood. Yes, I have seen many Duke games this year. All except the Eastern Kentucky game. So, please, when someone disagrees with you/ presents a difference of opinion, don't question whether or not they are a fan.

My point was, Coach K is going to put in who he thinks is playing the best at the end of the game. Which, is my whole argument about Nolan and Greg (which is what this thread is about). Gerald and Demarcus were obviously the focal points of the offense late in the game, and of course Jon is going to be in there because he is a great FT shooter. You cannot deny that Jon was secondary offensively down the stretch of the game because of how well Markie and Gerald were playing and they, with the flow of the game, were the focal points. That is the point I was trying to make, I thought it was obvious and that I wouldn't need to explain it.

[kydevil]

In 3 years has anyone see Greg hit one pull up? He over drives and his conversion rate on layups is poor. He needs to work on his mid range.

The ones against FSU were pretty clutch... lets not forget against Davidson either?

[wumhenry]

Starting with the premise that Coach K knows his *ss from his elbow, I deduce that it was in the team's best interest to start GP up to now and for NS to come off the bench. Even if SilkyJ and other DBR correspondents think otherwise. I also deduce from the same premise that if and when it will serve the team's best interest for Nolan Smith to start instead of Paulus, that's what will happen. And if what happens, or has happened, doesn't jibe with what SilkyJ et al think should happen, perhaps SilkyJ et al are missing something.


I'm late to the party, but I see it as not even a question to me that Nolan should be starting and playing more, and I think its illustrated in what you said above, though I disagree with it: "two great point guards." I see greg as an adequate to good PG, he's not amazingly quick or have a great handle, but he's a very good passer a very good open shooter. I see him like wojo (who is one of my favorites of all time) where he can get the job done and get it done well.

But nolan has the capability to be truly GREAT one day. greg will never be an all-american. Nolan will be, i think. I admit that I'm talking about nolan being great in the future, and the main argument in favor of greg is that he is a vet and his experience vs. nolan's inexperience, but nolan is playing with such maturity and under complete control that I think greg's "steadying influence" argument is now negated b/c nolan is just as steady, is a solid shooter and a way, way, way better scorer overall and a way better defender. we need to start this guy, imo and have him play more minutes than greg.



he started to last year, but has stopped trying that. i agree he should look to try that move more.

[Papa John]

There is no reason to "choose" between one. Play the hot hand, let them both develop, and enjoy a great win. Why create controversy for the sake of creating controversy.

And, to take it one step further... I like K's wisdom in starting his experienced veteran PG, then forcing his opponent off balance by spelling him with the more athletic, rapidly improving freshman... This is a wonderful dilemma to have as a coach... Just like using Scheyer as a 6th man--nothing like bringing a top-flight marksman off your bench to get your opponent sweating bullets... This is like playing chess with a couple of queens in reserve to pull out whenever you want...

And then there's King... And McClure ... Holy moly! We're deep, and [I]using that depth!

...Now... What were we complaining about again?

[mr. synellinden]

And, to take it one step further... I like K's wisdom in starting his experienced veteran PG, then forcing his opponent off balance by spelling him with the more athletic, rapidly improving freshman... This is a wonderful dilemma to have as a coach... Just like using Scheyer as a 6th man--nothing like bringing a top-flight marksman off your bench to get your opponent sweating bullets... This is like playing chess with a couple of queens in reserve to pull out whenever you want...

And then there's King... And McClure ... Holy moly! We're deep, and [I]using that depth!

...Now... What were we complaining about again?

I think the whole point of this thread is getting lost on people. And I think part of the reason is because there are a lot of people with heightened sensitivities to any criticism of Duke basketball - players, coaches, program, recruiting, etc. (which I understand and respect) - and itchy trigger/posting fingers to staunch such criticism.

I don't think this thread was started as a means to criticize GP nor say that we should have to chose one PG vs another. The simple point, which may have been slightly obscured by the title of the post, is the exact same thing that I bet a lot of fans were thinking during the MD game and perhaps also during several of our games since the ACC season started. And that is simply this, do we think we are a better team when Nolan is in the game versus when GP is in the game (making the assumption that they rarely play together). That is what I've been thinking during the last several games. I don't see anything wrong with bringing that up on the board following a game where NS played his best game of the season. It doesn't mean anyone is complaining about Coach K's decision-making, or about Paulus's play or about anything else. It is not a suggestion that one player should start and the other should never see the court. It was a simple question about people's reactions to Nolan's progression. For me, it's reached the point where I am thinking that I like our team better when he is in the game. That doesn't mean I don't like our team when GP is in the game. It just means that as a fan I like the way the team plays offensively and defensively better with NS.

I understand why there are sensitivities about any perceived negativity, but some of the reactions on this thread make me think there is perhaps too much sensitivity and too much of a propensity to interpret things as negativity/criticism.

Repeating what I posted previously, regardles of whom starts and however the minutes get split, we are lucky to have two top flight point guards with complementary skills.

[jzp5079]

completely agree with the above post.

[stickdog]

Duke is 17-1 and 5-0 in ACC play. Since the Pitt game, Paulus has notched 21 assists, 10 steals and 2 blocks to just 7 turnovers. That's an incredible 4.4 assist+steal to turnover ratio. Paulus has hit 23 straight free throws, including 14-14 in ACC play. Paulus has now hit at least one three pointer in 17 of his last 18 games. Over his last seven games, Paulus has averaged 10.4 points, 3 assists, 1.6 steals and 0.3 blocks against just 1 turnover in less than 25 minutes of play per game.

[JBDuke]

This thread has served its purpose and is degenerating into player bashing, which is not allowed.

This thread is CLOSED.