Nolan Smith and Taylor King

[DukeBlood]

Both have improved their games, TK was mainly scoring from the just shooting now rebounds better then Maui and other things. Smith well has improved mainly in his confidence. I believe he was capable of all of those things but now just looks like he is comfortable doing them.

Could they start for most other programs? Obviously couldn't start for UNC or Memphis. Just curious if they are good enough to start for most top-25 teams.

[jimbonelson]

they are freshman, they are only going to get better, and if they can play at duke they can play anywere

[CDu]

Both have improved their games, TK was mainly scoring from the just shooting now rebounds better then Maui and other things. Smith well has improved mainly in his confidence. I believe he was capable of all of those things but now just looks like he is comfortable doing them.

Could they start for most other programs? Obviously couldn't start for UNC or Memphis. Just curious if they are good enough to start for most top-25 teams.

It would obviously depend on the specific team and that team's needs. But yes, King and Smith could start on most men's college basketball teams, including many top-25 teams.

King's "problem" is that he's stuck behind Kyle Singler, and Smith's "problem" is that he's not yet a true point guard and Duke has many very talented wing players. I use the quotations to suggest that they aren't really problems so much as simple reasons as to why they don't start at Duke.

We are LOADED with talented wing players. Scheyer would probably start on nearly any team in the country, and is certainly one of our four best players (along with Singler, Henderson, and Nelson in no particular order), but has been relegated to 6th man duty due to our depth at wing.

[Classof06]

These two kids are quickly become two of my favorite kids on the team. I say that because you're seeing their development progress in each game which is so exciting to watch. It's to the point where I think they should always be getting more playing time just because I love watching them develop as college ball players.

I think King's problem is indeed that he's stuck behind Singler but I think Nolan Smith has shown that he is definitely capable of playing point guard. I think Nolan's problem is that he's stuck behind Paulus not that he's not yet a true PG. With Eliot Williams on the way, my guess is that Nolan's long term role for Duke will be at the 1.

[Ben63]

I love Taylor King and I think he would start for most D-1 programs. The flaw I see is when he gets the ball, he rarley looks to pass, he just shoots. Don't get me wrong he can flat out shoot, but it can get out of hand. For the record I saw that pass to Nelson(? Henderson?) cutting to the hoop against Cornell(?)

[Olympic Fan]

I love Taylor King and I think he would start for most D-1 programs. The flaw I see is when he gets the ball, he rarley looks to pass, he just shoots. Don't get me wrong he can flat out shoot, but it can get out of hand. For the record I saw that pass to Nelson(? Henderson?) cutting to the hoop against Cornell(?)

I'm not sure about the comment about King rarely looking to pass. He has 10 assists in 192 mninutes -- one assist every 19.2 minutes. Singler, who is praised for his all-around game, has 21 assists in 370 minutes -- one every 17.6 minutes.

Not that much difference (and both much, much better than Lance Thomas, who has four assists in 222 minutes).

As for the pass to press row against Cornell ... yeah, that was a bad one. But overall, King has 12 turnovers in his 192 minutes -- one every 16.0 minutes. That's a better rate than Singler (one every 11.6 minutes), Nelson (one every 13.6 minutes) or Henderson (one every 11.7 minutes).

King is blocking shots at the second-best rate on the team (slightly behind Zoubek, slight better than Henderson). He is rebounding at a better rate than Lance Thomas (TK is one rebound every 5.0 minutes; LT is one every 7.4 minutes). He is grabbing steals at a better rate than Singler or Henderson.

He's also scoring at the fastest rate on the team (one point every 1.4 minutes ... Henderson is second at one point every 1.9 minutes), while shooting a solid 47.5 percent from the floor and 43.8 from the 3-point line.

I'm just saying that the numbers show more than a one-dimensional player.

[SilkyJ]

Just glanced at Nolan's stats and something popped out at me: he's shooting a woeful 28.6% from 3 (seems like was doing better earlier but has slumped recently) but is shooting 47.6% overall.

I am excited about him as our future PG as he can really get to the rim and finish, and I think he's an OK shooter and will improve during the course of the year and especially going into next year.

(also, just to note: the sample size is small. he's only taken 21 3pt shots and made 6 of them, so if one miss rattles home thats 7 out of 21 which is 33%, so he would get basically a 5% jump from just one shot)

[Jumbo]

I'm not sure about the comment about King rarely looking to pass. He has 10 assists in 192 mninutes -- one assist every 19.2 minutes. Singler, who is praised for his all-around game, has 21 assists in 370 minutes -- one every 17.6 minutes.

Not that much difference (and both much, much better than Lance Thomas, who has four assists in 222 minutes).

As for the pass to press row against Cornell ... yeah, that was a bad one. But overall, King has 12 turnovers in his 192 minutes -- one every 16.0 minutes. That's a better rate than Singler (one every 11.6 minutes), Nelson (one every 13.6 minutes) or Henderson (one every 11.7 minutes).

King is blocking shots at the second-best rate on the team (slightly behind Zoubek, slight better than Henderson). He is rebounding at a better rate than Lance Thomas (TK is one rebound every 5.0 minutes; LT is one every 7.4 minutes). He is grabbing steals at a better rate than Singler or Henderson.

He's also scoring at the fastest rate on the team (one point every 1.4 minutes ... Henderson is second at one point every 1.9 minutes), while shooting a solid 47.5 percent from the floor and 43.8 from the 3-point line.

I'm just saying that the numbers show more than a one-dimensional player.

OF, that's a red herring. Are you really going to tell me Taylor King looks to pass much right now? Are you really going to say he's not pretty much a designated shooter right now?

Assists are one very, very small measure of passing. You watch as much Duke ball as I do, and I know you'd agree with me that despite Singler's low assist totals, he is a gifted passer with excellent vision. I also know that you've seen King enough to realize that every time he catches the ball he's looking to shoot (which is a good thing) and that he generally struggles when he puts it on the deck. He doesn't see the floor well yet and he's not "looking" to pass. He's looking to score. Passing is the next option if he can't.

[wilko]

I loved watching them against UVa.

The more I watch Smith them more he reminds me of J Dawkins. The natural grace, the decision making.... that sick reverse. He is really rounding into shape. He adds a new dimension to the backcourt we havent seen in a while. I welcome it and hope he continues to improve. He adds ALOT to this team.

King. I love his shot... Every kid playing HORSE in the back yard is going to be calling his name when he shoots. He has some things to work on for his overall game. Defense, decision making, creating his own shot off the dribble.

I'd really like for JJ to pay this guy a visit over the summer. Slide him a copy of his training DVD. If King makes conditioning a priority and works on taking folks off the dribble he might get close to being Chris Mullen clone. that wouldnt be so bad..

[jimsumner]

Hmm. Johnny Dawkins and Chris Mullin. Well, since Henderson is Grant Hill, Singler is Larry Bird, Scheyer is J.J., Paulus is Bobby Hurley, and Zoubek is Mike Gminski, we might as well.

[vango]

As good a place as any to inject a funny scouting report statement on King (think I heard G-man quote it):

"Won't shoot the ball unless he has it in his hands."

[wilko]

Hmm. Johnny Dawkins and Chris Mullin. Well, since Henderson is Grant Hill, Singler is Larry Bird, Scheyer is J.J., Paulus is Bobby Hurley, and Zoubek is Mike Gminski, we might as well.

Well thats quite a Fantasy team. :)

But I think some of your casting is off. Henderson could be Dantay. Singler is between Alarie and Dunleavy, not really Bird YET in my mind. Scheyer reminds me of a better Billy McCaffrey. I think Paulus is more Wojo than Hurley but he could have some Marty Clark mixed in for good measure. Im not sure who Zoubek is yet... Hopefully he can be Ala A. Effective but not great. Cook conference season until boiling . Then serve for Tournament. I think we have the ingredients for a nice season in hoops.

OK .I think I get your larger point. I can agree on one hand thats its silly to label these players as types and create undue hype they may not be able to live up to.... but hey, OTOH, its gotta be fun for us on some level when they arent on the court. If the guys couldnt handle the heat of playing College Ball they wouldnt be here. I think its to be expected somewhat.

A fans prerogative if you will.

Just trying to remain upbeat and encouraged about our team.
As Im sure you've noticed some folks like to find fault with everything.

I just cant bring myself to do that all the time. I have to get worked up for it.

[SilkyJ]

As good a place as any to inject a funny scouting report statement on King (think I heard G-man quote it):

"Won't shoot the ball unless he has it in his hands."

haha. i remember that from the UVA game. no one else watching the game with me got it at first though, maybe it was jim sumner's joke

(i kid i kid...i just read the "leslie mcdonald/williams thread)

[dball]

Well thats quite a Fantasy team. :)

But I think some of your casting is off.


I believe Jim was referencing previous comparisons both here and elsewhere...not his casting. But you're right it would be a real Dream Team.

[gw67]

Sorry, but King doesn’t remind me of Mullen. About the only thing they have in common is that they both shoot left handed. They are/were different body types and different type players. Mullen was a very good all around player who could put the ball on the floor and was an adept passer. The only ACC player who King reminds me of is Dennis Scott as a freshman. Dennis was stocky and, during his freshman year, he rarely put the ball on the floor. Like King, he came ready to shoot, positioned himself and launched some of the longest shots in my memory during his career.

As I have pointed out in another thread, Smith reminds me of Daniel Ewing as a freshman. They are the same size and body type and, seemingly, as freshmen, it appears that have/had the same strengths (good shooter, above average defensively, aggressive on both offense and defense, and fearless going to the hoop). Their freshmen stats are remarkably similar. While Smith has some of the same characteristics as Dawkins, Johnny was a star from day one.

gw67

[wilko]

Sorry, but King doesn’t remind me of Mullen. About the only thing they have in common is that they both shoot left handed. They are/were different body types and different type players. Mullen was a very good all around player who could put the ball on the floor and was an adept passer.

Tru enuff. But you forgot that they are comperable in height and apparently have the same barber. I didnt mean King was comperable to Mullen today... I was trying to say that with work and dedication he could take his game in that direction. There are worse players to attempt to emulate.


Smith reminds me of Daniel Ewing as a freshman. They are the same size and body type and, seemingly, as freshmen, it appears that have/had the same strengths. Their freshmen stats are remarkably similar. While Smith has some of the same characteristics as Dawkins, Johnny was a star from day one.gw67

There are some players when they look to shoot and you say "yes" and others where you say "no".. For me Ewing was a "Noo" particularly in the 2nd half of a game. There was one shot vs UVa maybe it was the camera angle.... but it was a yes and it looked like Dawkins' stroke. Could have be my eyes seeing what they want to see... Johnny was a star from day one. Tom Emma wasnt going to beat him out of a spot. Nolan enjoys better teammates around him and doesnt HAVE to be a star right now.

[chadlee989]

Nolan and Taylor will both be great players for Duke and hopefully when they leave us they will have a championship or two.

[jimsumner]

For the record, I trust we're talking about King emulating Chris Mullin and not Tim Mullen.

I would be delighted (and surprised) to see TK end up in the same zip code as Chris Mullin. Jeff Mullins would be nice too.

Tim Mullen? That's lowering the bar a good bit.

[Jumbo]

Pet peeve -- it's Chris Mullin, not Mullen.

[Devil in the Blue Dress]

For the record, I trust we're talking about King emulating Chris Mullin and not Tim Mullen.

I would be delighted (and surprised) to see TK end up in the same zip code as Chris Mullin. Jeff Mullins would be nice too.

Tim Mullen? That's lowering the bar a good bit.

If Taylor King's career becomes comparable to that of Jeff Mullins, we're talking GREAT! (I think I read somewhere that Jeff scored in double figures for every one of his college games.... quite a feat for anyone!)

Taylor's shooting style reminds me of Bob Verga's, especially the way he squares his shoulders as he faces the basket.