Lawson Dunk = No Class

[drion97]

Gutty, gutty effort bu State today. UNC got ahead, and got bored. They seem to have a pretty weak mental team.

Lawson's dunk at the end just riled me up. When you're playing a team with much worse talent who stays with you from pure heart, it's just not sportsmanlike to dunk there.

In the rare times I've seen a Duke player score in the last minute when it was not 100% necessary with the shot clock, I've always thought "Oh, he's going to get it from Coach K." Somehow I doubt the Heels ever have that worry.

On a side note, NC State may not have 'earned' their way into the field this year, but wow, they could've fooled me this weekend-- they looked like a 3 seed. (Which also makes me feel better about our loss to them Thursday)

[feldspar]

Lawson's dunk at the end just riled me up. When you're playing a team with much worse talent who stays with you from pure heart, it's just not sportsmanlike to dunk there.

As if anyone is surprised.

[dukelifer]

Gutty, gutty effort bu State today. UNC got ahead, and got bored. They seem to have a pretty weak mental team.

Lawson's dunk at the end just riled me up. When you're playing a team with much worse talent who stays with you from pure heart, it's just not sportsmanlike to dunk there.

In the rare times I've seen a Duke player score in the last minute when it was not 100% necessary with the shot clock, I've always thought "Oh, he's going to get it from Coach K." Somehow I doubt the Heels ever have that worry.

On a side note, NC State may not have 'earned' their way into the field this year, but wow, they could've fooled me this weekend-- they looked like a 3 seed. (Which also makes me feel better about our loss to them Thursday)

Remember Roy plays every possession. UNC once was able to score 8 pts in 17 sec against Duke. Anything can happen. I am sure State had a big run left with a second left. Of course he did try that with no one under the hoop.

[stingy]

Totally agree about the Lawson dunk being unnecessary. I don't think we'd ever do that, probably just throw the ball up in the air, if that even. Anyway, I wanted to ask if anyone has saved that image of Hansbrough made to look like either the Stay Puft Marshmallow Man or the Pillsbury Doughboy (I forget which it was). It was posted on the old board but it's gone now. Thanks!

[rsvman]

Poor sportsmanship, pure and simple. Nobody guarding you; game conceded. Not only did he have to make a basket, but he had to make show-boating basket, followed by screaming "F#*# yeah!" as plain as day so my kids could see it.

Thanks for the nice display of class.:mad:

[dukelifer]

Poor sportsmanship, pure and simple. Nobody guarding you; game conceded. Not only did he have to make a basket, but he had to make show-boating basket, followed by screaming "F#*# yeah!" as plain as day so my kids could see it.

Thanks for the nice display of class.:mad:

We all know now how spoiled and privileged Duke players and the Coach K should apologize in public for every mistake a player makes- regardless of intent. But I am sure Roy will not even be called on it by the Media and this will even make Sportcenter as a highlight without even a mention.

[Cameron]

Costner's a pretty big guy. Hopefully, he beat the sh** out of him in the tunnel. Only kidding, but it was a sad display of zero class from Lawson. Dribble the ball down the court and throw it into the air like every other team in the nation does to end a game they've clearly won. I don't mean to sound like we are above everyone else or anything but you would never see one of our players drive in for a showmanship dunk in the final seconds of a clear win. Never.

BTW, I believe I saw Roy fist pumping after Lawson slammed it, as if to say, "take that, bit**es." Good ole Roy at his best.

[gannon4429]

When I saw Lawson's in your face dunk I thought to myself that it was pretty bush. Didn't know how many other people would agree. It's just typical. You dribble the game out at that point and you shake hands. "Act like you've been there before" Tarholes".

[Stray Gator]

Come on, people, be reasonable. I think the Tar Heels should be forgiven for not knowing how to act when they win an ACC Championship game. After all, it's been 9 years since they experienced the thrill... :D

Stray ~~~;~~;~ http://mudlizard.com/users/icons/emoticons/chomp.gif

[drion97]

I've only watched the end of about 3 UNC games this year, and in two of them they show questionable sportsmanship in trying to score in the very closing seconds. Does anyone have a sense if they've done this before? Is it a pattern? Is it Roy? Or was it just that Hansblahblah is a tool and Lawson is a short guy desperate to prove he can dunk?

I do wonder had it been a Duke player if it'd be on PTI tomorrow-- the smallest little things about Duke have just been blown so out of proportion...

[dukelifer]

UNC is in the elite 8 trying to go the final four. Winthrop is up 1 with 5 seconds left and at the line. Heels have no time outs. Winthrop misses the throw- Lawson breaks for the hoop. Hansblah throws the outlet. Lawson goes for the dunk instead of the layup- hits it off the front iron- he falls to the floor and Winthrop advances. I wonder what he would be saying then.

[rthomas]

You are correct. You guys are blowing a small thing out of proportion. Let's nitpick all the little things we can find about UNC. I thought that their coach was pretty gracious toward Coach Lowe for the job he's done.

[Chard]

Come on, people, be reasonable. I think the Tar Heels should be forgiven for not knowing how to act when they win an ACC Championship game. After all, it's been 9 years since they experienced the thrill... :D

Stray ~~~;~~;~ http://mudlizard.com/users/icons/emoticons/chomp.gif

Amen!!!!!!!

[Tappan Zee Devil]

ah - irony
is lost on the holes

Jim

[Tappan Zee Devil]

It is not small!

It is respect for the game and for the other team.
If K condone that, I would lose respect for him.

Jim

[drion97]

I realize that it can be easy to nitpick other teams and protect Duke on this board, but I disagree that this is something small. A dunk like that is says much about sportsmanship.
I guarentee you a guy who gutted it out like Costner didn't like it. And I think anyone who has played sports and who is competitive would be rubbed wrong by it.

It's not about unwritten rules, or what a team should do, it's just about respect for the opponent and the game.

[dukelifer]

You are correct. You guys are blowing a small thing out of proportion. Let's nitpick all the little things we can find about UNC. I thought that their coach was pretty gracious toward Coach Lowe for the job he's done.

Everyone is a bit sensitive about the circus around Henderson and a play that was generated by a UNC player deciding that trying to score in the last 8 seconds was a better decision than holding the ball. Lawson's dunk was another such play. Duke an K are publicly criticized for not suspending Henderson for his unintentional foul for more games while UNC can show little respect for an opponent at the end of game without even a mention. This is really just blowing off steam because this will not be discussed at all by Doyle or others who enjoy nitpicking everything a Duke player does.

[Tappan Zee Devil]

Yeah but -


He doesn't yell at at opposition players as he rubs their nose in the fact that they have just been beaten

Jim

[dukelifer]

deleted post

Well at least he does not use the language in end of game interviews on National TV.

[devildownunder]

we sound like a bunch of whiney little brats on this thread. C'mon, so some jerk from 8 miles down the road dunked on somebody when it was irrelevant. Seriously, who cares? Go watch the awesome Big 12 champ. game going on and leave this irrelevant "incident" alone.

[rthomas]

All I can say is that along the range of all cases of classless sportsmanship with Chaney using a goon to hurt someone in a game at the higher end of classless things I've seen, that dunk was at the lower end.

[grossbus]

"K is not exactly the model of class if the use of foul and abusive language is classless."

wooden was the worst, and it WAS directed at the opposing players.

[Drebly1]

"K is not exactly the model of class if the use of foul and abusive language is classless."

wooden was the worst, and it WAS directed at the opposing players.

Interesting. Irrelevant, but interesting.

[gep]

I didn't see the play, and basing this on the posts.

Was Lawson ever mentioned as going to the NBA next year? If so, maybe he was padding his NBA resume...

[pfrduke]

You should see what the State fans are saying (http://www.thewolfweb.com/message_topic.aspx?topic=465679&page=23) about Lawson. It starts with "I would seriously take a baseball bat to Lawson's face right now" and just gets a whole lot worse from there.

Internet fan boards (with DBR being an exception) never cease to amaze me with the depths to which they sink.

[throatybeard]

That's a highly student-driven board. Most of their boards aren't like that.

[pfrduke]

That's a highly student-driven board. Most of their boards aren't like that.
Fair point.... I meant to say some State fans, not all State fans. All the same, it's pretty bad stuff, and I'm not sure whether the fact that those comments are mostly coming from NCSU students makes it better or worse.

[phaedrus]

student board? are you sure it's not a KKK hangout?

[RelativeWays]

We're talking about a freshman player who put an exclamation on his team's first conference championship since 98. Was it unnecessary? Sure but not really classless. I believe he got caught up in the excitement and joy of winning, if NC State were in the same situation, and say Costner or MaCauley hits a dunk to seal an emotional win, this wouldn't be an issue. Lets put away the soapboxes, it wasn't that bad.

[captmojo]

Don't you folks realize that Coach Lowe has a design for a 7 point - 1 second left play?

[allenmurray]

TH is a college student, a kid, an exciteable basketball player.
Ty Lawson is a college student, a kid, an exciteable basketball player.

TH went up for a dunk over a walk-on after a game had already been decided. Ty Lawson makes a showy dunk after the game has already been decided. I have no problem with either of them. They're kids.

Roy on the other hand is not a kid. He is an experienced and respected coach. What is he teaching these guys? I can remember being at a Duke game with my son. Duke had 99 points, and the ball, with about 15 seconds left. Sam was excited because he thought they would score 100. I told him, "no way will they score 100. They will pull the ball out and run out the clock". Of course, they did just that.

If it doesn't come in the natural course of a game, and the game has already been decided, it is just being showy. Th and TY may not know better. Roy does. I think it is the Bojangles biscuit mentality. Score 100 points get gree biscuits. Free biscuits have taken the place of sportsmanship. I hope that when other coaches decide to sell out they gets a better price than a free sausage biscuit.

[aro24]

I didn't see the play, and basing this on the posts.

Was Lawson ever mentioned as going to the NBA next year? If so, maybe he was padding his NBA resume...

I was actually told last week from a pretty reliable souce that both Brandon Wright and Ty Lawson stopped going to classes weeks ago. I anticipated that Wright was 1 and done, but I am surprised by Lawson.

Anyone else heard this as well ?

ARo24

[RelativeWays]

Man, that State board is close to ESPN board territory, worse actually. Wow just wow at some of those comments. I am so relieved that at least DBR is more civilized even when we disagree.

[RelativeWays]

I was actually told last week from a pretty reliable souce that both Brandon Wright and Ty Lawson stopped going to classes weeks ago. I anticipated that Wright was 1 and done, but I am surprised by Lawson.

Anyone else heard this as well ?

ARo24
Supposedly Lawson said from the get go the only reason he was at UNC was due to the 1 year rule. Not surprising he would leave.

[dukeENG2003]

There's no written rule that says you need to run the clock out when the game is decided. There are a LOT of players and a lot of teams that would handle thigns the same way TH and TL did. To expect everyone to handle end of decided game situations the way Duke does is a bit unreasonable. Afterall, these are some of the many things that make us Duke. They are also the sorts of things that make us loathe UNC, but is it really anything new?

[CMS2478]

but it may have bothered me more if it had been against Duke, I don't know. But what I do know is that it may not be a written rule to run the clock out and not rub it in, but I play in a church basketball league and even a bunch of old guys who are not really basketball players know not to try and run the score up. I totally agree with what someone said earlier in this thread. He was just trying to prove that he is a little guy who can dunk and you need to save that for some charity game and not in the ACC tournament. Did I lose any sleep worrying about it - NO. Did I think it was totally classless and typical from everything I hear about Lawson - YES.

[RelativeWays]

Things I learn from the Doookbasketballreport.com message board.


Meh, I'm a Duke fan and I didn't think the play was that bad. I'll reserve that if a UNC player (or any other player) does some low class taunting after a dunk that would make TO proud.

[Twigmas]

I wasn't particularly happy that Lawson decided to dunk the ball. But are we really still arguing this?

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/playbyplay?gameId=270562599&period=2
ESPN.com - NCB - Play-By-Play - Duke at St. John's
http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/playbyplay?gameId=253440251&period=2
ESPN.com - NCB - Play-By-Play - Duke at Texas
http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/playbyplay?gameId=260260259&period=2
ESPN.com - NCB - Play-By-Play - Duke at Virginia Tech


I can't imagine too many people enjoyed watching Dahntay do his pushups either.

[feldspar]

Meh, I'm a Duke fan and I didn't think the play was that bad. I'll reserve that if a UNC player (or any other player) does some low class taunting after a dunk that would make TO proud.

Like, say, screaming "F*** YEAH!!" at the top of his lungs at the crowd and camera right after said dunk?

[alteran]

Things I learn from the Doookbasketballreport.com message board.
Wow-- I can just FEEL the class.

I thought it was pretty unsportsmanlike, but certainly nothing I'd put in the classless hall of fame or anything.

[RelativeWays]

Like, say, screaming "F*** YEAH!!" at the top of his lungs at the crowd and camera right after said dunk?


I was thinking more along the lines of running out to center court and striking a superstar pose on the other team's emblem. I know its UNC and we're quick to point out their flaws to UNC fans who love to wear the albatross around their necks, but I think we're reading into this a bit much.

[RelativeWays]

Actually Redick did make a superstar pose during last years ACC tournament after making a 3 against BC. You have to watch out condemning one player for said action when one of your own can be just as guilty. Reminds me of how Chicago Bears fans jumped on Reggie Bush's case for taunting during that TD run but conveniently ignored that Hester had dome the same crap earlier in the season.

[oli-p]

For those of you comparing Henderson's "hard" foul to Lawson's dunk at the end of a game, get a life.

[vsmkch]

You are correct. You guys are blowing a small thing out of proportion. Let's nitpick all the little things we can find about UNC. I thought that their coach was pretty gracious toward Coach Lowe for the job he's done.

Thanks for your reasonable comments. Come on guys, give Lawson a break. He isn't 7 feet tall and just want to prove he could dunk. He had been called out on his ability to do it and probably wanted to prove he could. Also, he was a freshman elated to win his 1st ACC Tournament. Maybe not the smartest thing he could have done, but is it any more classless than the posters on here that call Carolina "Tarholes" and say we lack class and sportsmanship? I have seen K have his starters in late in games that Duke was winning by 20-30 points. That is his decision to make......would you call K classless for it?

[vsmkch]

Like, say, screaming "F*** YEAH!!" at the top of his lungs at the crowd and camera right after said dunk?

If you think that is so awful, you better talk to your coach about his potty mouth captured by the tv cameras.

[Cavlaw]

If you think that is so awful, you better talk to your coach about his potty mouth captured by the tv cameras.
I'm guessing that's why he's had a hand strategically placed over his mouth about 80% of the time he's been on the sidelines for, oh, about the past decade.

[Wheat/"/"/"]

You guys are killing me....
We have a freshman, all fired up in the late stages of a good game for an ACC championship, and he gets a wide open look to dunk on the big stage to put the final nail in the coffin of a bitter rival. He doesen't posture, or taunt, or otherwise make any overt attempt to disrespect State, he simply played hard 'till the buzzer sounded.
Just the day before during the BC game, I seem to remember a UNC walkon showing just the respect you accuse UNC of not showing, holding the ball and not attempting a shot as time expired in a game that was really over....when you know the kid would have loved to be in the books as scoring in an ACC tournament game.
If we had kept trying to score there, you guys would have had something to talk about.
Lawson was in a bang-bang play late, (as was the Hans/G play,BTW)... he didn't premeditate dunking on a team that had their hands in their pockets, while waiting for the clock to expire as people are trying to make it seem. State was still playing hard.
It would have been fine if he pulled it back out too, no big deal either way.
Lets move on and just play...nothing to see here.
Wheat/"/"/"

[allenmurray]

He doesen't posture, or taunt, or otherwise make any overt attempt to disrespect State, he simply played hard 'till the buzzer sounded.

Wheat/"/"/"

Rare to find myself disagreeing with Wheat, but TL did scream into the crowd after his dunk a word that the DBR filters won't allow me to print. I find that both disrespectful and taunting. What made it surprising is not that it happened, that stuff happens all to often in college Bball. What makes it surprising is that it happened by a member of UNC's team - a team that is usually above such stuff.

[Wheat/"/"/"]

AM,
I didn't see Lawson do anything after the dunk....I was watching on crappy espn360 on the computer since it was blacked out around here and I could have missed it. But if he did do as you say, I have no doubt that Roy will point out that is unacceptable behavior and will deal with it internally.
I stand by the account of the play as being bang-bang and and not a premeditated show of disrespect.
Wheat/"/"/"

[365Duke]

I often see your side of things wheat, but please stop calling this a "bang bang" play. A so-called bang bang play is a almost a split second, or reaction. TL got the ball at 1/2 court and set himself up with skips and positioning as if he was in a slam dunk contest. With no one in pursuit. :rolleyes:

[Wheat/"/"/"]

The steal followed by the quick outlet took less than 5 seconds before the conclusion of the dunk...call it what you will....I maintain it was more of a reaction situation and not a deliberate attempt to show up State.
Wheat/"/"/"

[dukelifer]

AM,
I didn't see Lawson do anything after the dunk....I was watching on crappy espn360 on the computer since it was blacked out around here and I could have missed it. But if he did do as you say, I have no doubt that Roy will point out that is unacceptable behavior and will deal with it internally.
I stand by the account of the play as being bang-bang and and not a premeditated show of disrespect.
Wheat/"/"/"

One might argue that it was youthful exuberance and not knowing what to do at the end of a big win- but it was not bang bang. I would also suggest that TH's play was also not bang bang. He grabs the ball, bends and dips between the two Duke players before elevating. That took 1.5-2 seconds. That might seem bang-bang but that is a long time to consider options like kicking out to a wide open teammate above the three point line with no defender within 15 feet- to dribble out the time.

The TL play was not awful but it was done with the intent to celebrate with something short of a chest thump. It did generate some ugly racist responses on some wolfpack websites though which are totally unacceptable. I doubt that Roy will do much about this or have to apologize for it.

[FewFAC]

Meh, I'm inclined to be significantly pleased by this action by Ty Lawson. All it does draw unnecessary fury and anger into a one-sided rivalry. Perhaps it will motivate NCSU to defend themselves. Or just be pwned by UNC.

[Battery]

whatever. if i was a freshman point guard on a team favored to win it all and was about to win the tournament of the best friggin' conference in the land i would totally dunk at the end of the game. it has nothing to do with class. it has everything to do with the adrenaline and testosterone of a TEENAGER!

[d1jones]

Costner's a pretty big guy. Hopefully, he beat the sh** out of him in the tunnel. Only kidding, but it was a sad display of zero class from Lawson. Dribble the ball down the court and throw it into the air like every other team in the nation does to end a game they've clearly won. I don't mean to sound like we are above everyone else or anything but you would never see one of our players drive in for a showmanship dunk in the final seconds of a clear win. Never.

BTW, I believe I saw Roy fist pumping after Lawson slammed it, as if to say, "take that, bit**es." Good ole Roy at his best.

UNC did the same in season final vs Duke- kept scoring when game was in hand- last shot of game leading by 16- under 4 secounds was a 3 pointer- Roy Williams has no class

[feldspar]

If you think that is so awful, you better talk to your coach about his potty mouth captured by the tv cameras.

I've never condoned K's potty mouth.

I think it's his worst attribute and I wish he'd quit. Josh, too.

[CMS2478]

I'm no saint, but I've heard a couple of coaches talking about going to his clinic and they said they couldn't hardly bear it because there was so much profanity.

I love Coach K, but if he preaches class..........practice what you preach. You can get the point across without all the GD's and FBombs.

[feldspar]

I'm no saint, but I've heard a couple of coaches talking about going to his clinic and they said they couldn't hardly bear it because there was so much profanity.

I love Coach K, but if he preaches class..........practice what you preach. You can get the point across without all the GD's and FBombs.

For goodness sake he said the F word when I was at his camp.

Not his adult camp...his YOUTH camp. I don't mind the guy using a little bit of profanity here and there (in the locker room, in practice), but to do it in public and on national TV is inexcusable.

[CMS2478]

I'm really not trying to harp on him here............but I wonder if realizes that the tv camera is glued to face during ever deadball situation. Therefore, every time he says to the ref......." That's BS" it goes directly into the living room of who knows how many people. I am a coach and I know how frustrated I get during games sometimes, but if I were Div.1 coach and knew my games were being televised I would at least try and keep it in check. Ol' Roy over in the DeanDome ain't much better. (since we're on the topic);)

[mph]

I think it is the Bojangles biscuit mentality. Score 100 points get gree biscuits. Free biscuits have taken the place of sportsmanship. I hope that when other coaches decide to sell out they gets a better price than a free sausage biscuit.

I'd Chris Paul a teammate for a cajun filet biscuit.

[rsvman]

You guys are killing me....
....and he gets a wide open look to dunk on the big stage to put the final nail in the coffin of a bitter rival.
Sorry, Wheat, but the coffin was not only already nailed closed, it was in the ground and had several shovelsful of dirt on it already.

.....he simply played hard 'till the buzzer sounded.
This was no "playing hard." He wasn't even playing the GAME. The game was already over. It was an overt display of disrespect to the NC State program and its fans.

It would have been fine if he pulled it back out too, no big deal either way.
It would have been the right thing to do to pull it back out. It would have displayed respect for the game of basketball and for their opponents in the ACC championship game. JMHO. YMMV.

[Clipsfan]

I'm really not trying to harp on him here............but I wonder if realizes that the tv camera is glued to face during ever deadball situation. Therefore, every time he says to the ref......." That's BS" it goes directly into the living room of who knows how many people. I am a coach and I know how frustrated I get during games sometimes, but if I were Div.1 coach and knew my games were being televised I would at least try and keep it in check. Ol' Roy over in the DeanDome ain't much better. (since we're on the topic);)

From what I've seen on TV, most players and most coaches swear on the court. I agree that it's bad that they do so, and wish that they would stop, even though it doesn't bother me personally. I am on the side of the many who bring their children to the games or watch it on TV with them. However, I also understand how they swear in the heat of the moment, as I do it while playing as well (although more often when surprised than because I did something well).

On that note, I have always liked that Duke doesn't try to get the last basket when they're up at the end of a game, and think that Lawson should have just dribbled out the clock. However, he is young and his team was clinching the #1 seed in the ACC tourney by beating their rival for the season sweep. I can understand his desire to celebrate.

[RelativeWays]

Apparently the State thread (linked here previously) made the local news (Greensboro-Triad area). I'm guessing people were more than just taken aback by all the racial slurs and threats of lynching Lawson and there's talk about investingating some of the posters. Hopefully nobody quoted any scenes from American Psycho :rolleyes:

[Wheat/"/"/"]

rsvman,
I'm sorry guys, but this high road of respect and we're better than you because we wouldn't do it attitude just doesn't pass the smell test here.
If the game was considered over on the court, somebody forgot to tell State to stop attacking the basket when the steal occured. How come no-one seems to mention that State could have held the ball those last ten seconds and the steal/dunk would have never happened?
I'm a competitor, and if I am in that same situation, a quick surprise steal from a driving opponent and kick out pass with an open look at the goal...hyped up in my first ACC Championship game..roaring crowd....I'm dunking it too. (If I could:)
And I would expect my opponent, State, Duke, whoever... to do the same in that situation if they can create the opportunity.
It's not about lack of respect, it's about competition. I think its been pretty clear from Roy and numerous player quotes State had their respect. And they have mine for the way they played this year.
This is really a non issue, or should be, IMO.
If the dunk makes them mad in that situation, so be it. It's a game and thats why we have rivalries. My attitude is try to bring it into the lane again... and when we steal it again, I'll go for the off the backboard tomahawk windmill 360 lovetron special next time to close it out...if I could:)

Wheat/"/"/"
"Will not defend the foulmouthed scream"

[mgtr]

No, it is just a matter of class, or lack thereof. I think UNC and Roy Williams lack class. Period.

[gep]

Sorry I didn't see the NCState game... but maybe, this uproar on Lawson has as much to do with his "antics" in the camera after the dunk... (my $0.02)

[Wheat/"/"/"]

'Ol Roy quotes....
..."You also have to be really proud of NC State and admire and respect what they did. Coming to play for four days was phenomenal..."

"...somebody will really have a hard time telling me there are 65 teams in the country better than the five lowest seeded teams in this league when you watch what North Carolina State did. If they have Engin Atsur the whole year, they're probably an NCAA Tournament team themselves. They beat North Carolina, Virginia Tech three times, Duke once, Virginia ... so they're good."

Reyshawn Terry..."Coming into the game we knew they were a little tired, but we knew they weren’t going to give up and it was going to be a dog fight."


Wheat/"/"/"

[jason b gone]

...please!