Georgetown - Sleeping In This Morning/Season?

[mus074]

Apparently, JTIII (you know you're good when people refer to you by initials and everyone knows who it is) decided to take it slow starting off this season. And the media/pundits don't seem to mind.

So far, Georgetown has played a cream puff schedule: W&M, Michigan, Ball State, ODU and Fairfield. Granted there is some name recognition in the bunch but the actual talent-level is less than stellar, as shown in Pomeroy Ratings (253, 129, 201, 100, 220) and RPI (250, 166, 291, 113, 225). Georgetown's SOS so far ranks 222nd (Pom) and 319 (RPI). Granted, it is still early, and they have only played five games so far, while many teams have played 8 or 9. However, their next three games are Alabama (148 Pom, 149 RPI), Jacksonville (187, 196) and Radford (331, 284). They will finally get tested on 12/22 by Memphis (28, 6). Then they wind up Nonconf play with American (204, 268) and Fordham (176, 153).

So what gives? Georgetown made it to the Final Four last year and returns three seniors and a junior who all play more than 22 minutes each. Yes, Jeff Green is gone, but come on. The team is far from undeveloped. In fact, they are ranked 5th in AP and 4th in the Coaches polls. Moreover, they received a first place vote in each poll. Clearly, the pundits think they're pretty good. And that can't be based on this season's dispatching of mediocre opponents.

Which leads me to this: why the heck are they ranked 4th/5th with first place votes? By this point in the season, the polls should be about what you have done and not what you might do. This weak nonconf SOS will haunt them for sure come bracket time. Memphis is a very good team, but less impressive than I expected last night against USC. (Street ball would get decimated by a disciplined, perimeter shooting team. Memphis' weak conf schedule will likely not let them improve significantly over the course of the season.)

Georgetown may or may not feel some performance impact of their soft start, but the poll voters have decided to give them a pass so far.

[greybeard]

Georgetown could emerge as the runaway most impressive team in college basketball this season. Sports writers know that.

The college basketball season is too long. Period. The only reason at this point to put kids with the talent and experience Georgetown possesses under early season pressure is MONEY. I applaud JTIII's choices. Let the guys go to school, glide into stride easily, and have the stamina, mentally and physically, to perform on the court and in the classroom in what promises to be an exciting run for the big ring.

If Georgetwon comes anywhere near to reaching its potential during this season JTIII will have nothing to worry about come tournament time. Other teams will; all of them.

Nope, that is not a prediction that Georgetown will win it all. What I am saying is that, if they develop as they might (and that importantly includes Maclin), when they are "right," no team will beat them no matter how good they play.

Being "right" through the tournament in games that you must will take luck, as will surviving those games when you are not "right."

The sportswriters got this call right, which in my opinion is no great accomplishment.

[uncwdevil]

I don't think G-town is a top 5 team this year. Green was a big part of their team and I think they will lose 7-8 games, maybe even starting tonight.

[Nugget]

JT III is continuing his father's long tradition of starting the season with very easy non-conference games. So, no surprise there.

Given the strength of the Big East (it will, again, likely have 7 or 8 NCAA teams), Georgetown is undoubtedly counting on its conference schedule to help its computer ratings enough to offset the weak non-con schedule. Indeed, last year, despite a similarly weak non-conference schedule, Georgetown ended up #9 in the RPI and a 2 seed in the tournament.

As for the polls, there is nothing less meaningful than college hoops rankings at this poin t n the season.

Other than determining whose highlights get shown on SportsCenter, the polls serve absolutely zero purpose until (possibly) the final rankings at the end of the year, which usually end up roughly corresponding to NCAA tournament seedings for the teams in the Top 20.

So, to spend even a second questioning why a team is ranked where they are at this point in the season is a complete waste of time.

[merry]

Georgetown needs to shoot FTs better down the stretch than they did against Alabama tonight. If Alabama could have hit the broad side of a barn in the final 2 minutes that game could have had a different outcome.

[Reisen]

No offense, but I'm going to respectfully completely disagree with Greybeard and Nugget. And this is coming from a (new) Georgetown fan, as I just started grad school here, and have season tickets having gone to every home game so far... I just finished watching the Alabama game, and I admit that they played far better than I expected.

First, Greybeard, I totally disagree with your first statement, and I really wish it was true, as it would be exciting to watch in person. Georgetown has really shown nothing yet to give any expectation that they should be THE top team in college basketball, or even one of the top teams... mus074 is completely correct in their schedule, and more importantly, they've really struggled against the likes of William & Mary, Fairfield, etc. Fairfield is a 2-6 team, and yet Georgetown really struggled to put them away, with the final margin of 12 being nowhere near indicative of how tight a game it was, as most of those points came on trash buckets in the last minute.

Yes, they looked very good against Michigan, but remember that this Michigan team recently lost to Harvard, and is almost sure to be a cellar-dweller in the Big 10.

Georgetown is being ranked completely off their run last March and play last season in the Big East. I predict the loss of Jeff Green is going to be a much bigger deal than most expect.

That's not to say that Georgetown won't be good, I fully expect them to improve as the season goes on, especially among their freshmen, who will be very important (particularly Wright) come March. I just think they would lose against most of the top 10 right now, and get run off the court by a team like Carolina... Hopefully I'm wrong.

Nugget, while I agree with you that Georgetown's rating is pretty meaningless, I beg to differ for teams like Duke and Texas, who have played big games, and, more importantly, looked constantly good against the competition. IMO, that SHOULD be rewarded, and thus those rankings do hold value...

[mus074]

Indeed, last year, despite a similarly weak non-conference schedule, Georgetown ended up #9 in the RPI and a 2 seed in the tournament.

Last year Gtown played Oregon (Pom 18, RPI 21) and Duke (11, 15) by 12/2. The season before, they played Vandy (49, 72), Oregon (36, 147) and Illinois (11, 14) by 12/8. The season before that, Illinois (1, 2) on 12/9.

Their record in those early contests? 1-5. Perhaps they just wanted to start off winning for once? I agree that they have the potential to go far. But you have to prove it out on the court.

Early polls may be "meaningless," but 103 people vote, innumerable media outlets report and thousands upon thousands of people follow them. In fact, the only poll that truly matters is the de facto one in April. And really, college basketball itself is admittedly meaningless, even in March, when compared to some of the more significant events going on in the world. In the end its just amateur sports. Some of us like to follow it, even the peripheral rankings in December.

[greybeard]

Georgetown's offense did not begin to meaningfully show last season until the middle of The Big East and then just got better and better. I think that it will be the same this year.

JTIII's style is develop decision-makers and to tweak what his team's do to allow his players to out-clever the opposition with the skills they possess and the organization that they collectively with their coach develop over time. That doesn't happen overnight. It makes the game, playing for JTIII, extremely interesting, challenging and empowering.

Sure they will miss Green. I never said otherwise. Nor did I say that they presently are the best team in the nation, whatever that might mean. What I said was, and I was quite careful about this throughout, is that if this team comes near to reaching its potential, and is right on a given night, then there is nobody who will be able to beat them on that night.

Hibbert is far and away the best center in the college game. If Maclin develops as he should and becomes more proactive offensively, he is one heck of a backup. Soo quick off his feet, long, competative, strong for his frame, etc. Watching Sumner shoot this summer the guy has scary range, scarrrry. He does everything well except give it up quickly which is a problem. PEII has his father's fierceness and plays with great joy. There are tinges of loseness in his game, but the guy can play. He will on the next level, if not in the NBA immediately then surely in Europe.

The guards, and there are five of them, counting the 6'4" kid from DeMatha who can and will play a lot of the 3, are terrific and experienced, including the two new guys. Wallace is terrific, Sapp is a tough, tough kid or finds the ball and makes plays, Rivers is one of the best defenders around and has improved his shot in the off season, and the two new guys are special.

Like K, on any given night JTIII has to look for only two or three of these guys to be on and ride them. Then you have to contend with Hibbert who takes almost all your prep work or he will hurt you bad, and even then he is likely to hurt you bad.

Give them some time. This is the beginning of the semester for basketball development at Georgetown and once they pick up momentum the learning curve excelerates. Like I said, a lot depends on Maclin in my mind, and this team figuring out the way that they will play.

Not including them high in the rankings would in my mind be a misstake.

[Reisen]

Greybeard, I really hope you're right! I'm just not sure I'm buying it quite yet, especially considering Georgetown is one of the most experienced team in the nation, starting what, three seniors, a junior, and a sophomore? To me, that means they should be gelling a lot more quickly, and not struggling against inferior opponents as they have been.

I think we're agreed on the talent level, both of the players and the coach. They definitely have the potential to dominate the Big East and make a run in March, but they're going to have to see a whole lot of improvement before then.

Obviously, Hibbert will be key, but I've been pretty underwhelmed thus far, to be honest. I suspect it might be strength or conditioning, but he's not really dominating games the way he should, or the way, say, an Emeka Okafor did. He's definitely looked gas coming out of the games at times, and he's getting pushed around a bit too much for his size/weight in the low post.

Take the Fairfield game I went to last Saturday. Hibbert had 7 points on 2 of 3 shooting in 25 minutes, with 3 turnovers, 4 fouls, 7 rebounds, and a block.

Yes, the foul trouble limited his minutes, but he should be getting way more than 3 shots in 25 minutes. Maybe the problem is just getting him the ball, or the fact that he's doubled so much in the post, but if that were the case, you'd think he'd have more than 2 assists.

I guess I can see it going either way, and I really hope they're a top 5/10 team all season and win the Big East, but I have a funny feeling last seasons fortunes of my two teams (Duke and Georgetown) might be reversed...

[mepanchin]

I don't think there is too much to be concerned about for Georgetown, to be honest. Last year their biggest problem was turnovers, which they have improved so far this year. They are continuing their ability to get very good shots, Roy Hibbert is looking like a NPOY and has stepped up to cover the offense that Georgetown has missed with Green leaving. He is changing games with his ability to block shots, he's rebounding at the same rate he was last year on both sides (a little better), shooting north of 63% from the field, and not turning it over often.

Wallace and Sapp are shooting well from behind the arc to balance Hibbert's presence, and Ewing is having a good year so far too.

There's a couple reasons why people are critical of Georgetown. First of all, they aren't playing as well as they can offensively - and that is mainly a function of their team not attacking the offensive glass as hard as last year (and Green was not a huge contributer - Hibbert was - so it's up to Summers to step it up), and because they are only shooting 52.7% from the free throw line, which is fairly embarrassing. If this continues, Georgetown will lose games as a result. Last year they shot 71%, so I don't see a reason for this to continue all year. The second reason is just an issue of perception. Georgetown is not a fast paced team, so even if they dramatically outplay their opposition, they will not win by 40 like Duke or UNC will.

Against Ball State, Georgetown left 9 points at the line. Against Fairfield, GT left 13 points at the line. Against Alabama, GT left 9 points at the line. These weren't really games where Georgetown played that badly (they didn't play great, sure, but not that bad), they just allowed teams to stay close by missing tons and tons of free throws.

Now, where are the threads about Memphis? Here's a team that went 33-4 last year, lost just 1 player, who wasn't that important, and added Derrick Rose, who is without question one of the most talented freshmen to enter college basketball in years - yet people aren't talking about them struggling like they are Georgetown (mostly because of pace - Memphis is playing just as unimpressively, but they play much faster, so they win by more on average).

Memphis' offense is based on a drive/kick game that is a lot like Duke's - except they can't hit their 3s. They have almost no post offense, and take a lot of 3s (38.3% of their shots are 3s - which a higher ratio than even Duke's this year), but they shoot only 33.3% from 3. Oklahoma sat in a 2-3 zone against them and they only managed to beat them by 10. They struggled with Connecticut. They struggled with Richmond. They struggled with Austin Peay for a bit. They should have lost to USC if Hackett could make free throws under pressure. Memphis is excellent defensively, but they struggle to score the ball.

I think Memphis' outside shooting will be their downfall - as for Georgetown, if they can pick up the free throw shooting and attack the offensive glass a bit harder (they certainly have the size to be as successful as last year) - they will once again contend for the Big East in a stacked league.

[Bob Green]

Prediction: Georgetown will not return to the Final Four this year. I expect them to lose in the Sweet 16. Jeff Green will be sorely missed this season.

But I must be candid and admit my bias upfront as Georgetown is prominently upon my short list of despised college programs.

[greybeard]

Nothing you guys have said has any holes in it. Solid takes.

My take, in JTIII's style, it is not freshman who have to "fit in" or develop; it is the team that has to develop an approach to the game, an ability to understand one another and the dynamics that will be most effective for them, and that that is new each year. Also, the ability for the group to develop as an offensive unit increases over time. Thus, game by game adaptations, ie, coming out to out score NC because it was, as JTIII said the week before repeatedly, impossible to slow them down, becomes possible for a team that didn't look to outscore anyone in that way all season.

The one real problem that I see for Georgetown is, when I think about, very much related to the loss of Green. Key to the Princeton is playing through a high post "pivot." In the Princeton, that demands someone who is a great decision maker, who can and will make those special looking back door passes when they are there and know when they are there, who can and will take the shot unless the defender is up on him, and who can and will beat the defender off the dribble in a controlled fashion that will usually end in a hook shot finish that will be reliable and will not leave the shooter all banged up or injured. I have been troubled by who will fill that role.

PEII, maybe. But there is a looseness to his game, particularly his put-it-on-the-floor game, that makes me skeptical. Summers has all the tools, but just does not seem to see the game as a passer. Not that he can't make good passes, but everybody has their own perspectives and his do not seem to allow him to see the game as the pivot in the Princeton. I am not sure that perspectives of this sort can be coached; learning to see things differently is difficult for all of us and we rarely are willing, I mean really willing, to try. If Summers has this ingrediant in him and it is nurtured over time, Georgetown will be a dangerous club.

Otherwise, Georgetown also has the kid from DeMatha, who is three inches to small but otherwise has all the tools, and Hibbert himself who I do not think has the shot and who you really don't want up their more than a few moments in a possession. It probably will be done by committee, with PEII and Summers playing the major roles. Each are capable of attuning to that role but less than consistently. And then there is that wildcard, as I mentioned earlier and throughout; his name is Maclin.

[mus074]

First, and just to be clear, the purpose of my post was not to deride the Hoya's inconsistent performance this year. It is plainly still early December.

My beef is with the seemingly inexplicable soft nonconf scheduling for a seasoned team starting three seniors and a junior fresh off the Final Four run. We just don't know how good this team is. Last year's team was very good, yes. But this is a different team without Green and incorporating a good freshman class. A team is not the sum of its parts (see, e.g., Texas 2006-07 vs. 2007-08, or recent US national basketball "teams" versus international teams). A basketball team is a lot like neural activity - its not the size of the brain's respective parts but rather the number and complexity of its interconnections. Georgetown has a great brain on paper, but we don't know how smart it will prove to be unless they take some grade-level appropriate tests. They will, but not until third or fourth period after starting the day in a several hour study hall.

My core concern then is that ranking them so high with first place votes must be a hangover from pre-season beliefs. Those beliefs may in fact remain but they have yet to be supported by empirical data - not because of their inconsistent or yet sometimes mediocre play in getting six wins, but because they have not yet taken an age appropriate test. There is obviously no hard and fast rule for when preconceived notions must give way to actual evidence, aside from taking a team down when they lose and promoting a team above losers for having won. Georgetown may not lose until much later and stay top five all season long, they're just starting their day/season a little later than everyone else.

Here is another prime cause for concern - to me. Georgetown is hosting a first round site for March Madness. That excludes them from playing there. If they get a one or two seed, they'll get proximity preference for their pod - which will likely be the RBC Center in Raleigh. Conventional wisdom says UNC will earn and receive a higher seed than Duke, giving them priority as well. That means Duke, if they earn a two-seed or better, would lose the opportunity to play in Raleigh and would likely travel up the road to the Verizon Center. If it plays out this way and Georgetown gets its preferential site (RBC) over Duke, it could well be on the back of a Boeheim-esque first third of their schedule. That leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

Of course, this is really nothing more than adding another heavy layer on to the lilly. It will come down to who plays the best and earns their way through no matter the obstacle. Duke has regained street cred on its merits on the court. Let that always be the case. And thank god this isn't football.

[mus074]

Joe Lunardi agrees in his comments that we just don't know how good they are yet.

[Classof06]

I agree that we don't know how good Georgetown is yet. That being said, they always seem to start the year off slow. Last year (almost exactly a year ago), we beat them early in the year but if would've played them again in March, we would've gotten rolled...

[merry]

My beef is with the seemingly inexplicable soft nonconf scheduling for a seasoned team starting three seniors and a junior fresh off the Final Four run.

How different is this from years past? I haven't paid that much attention to Georgetown's early/non-con schedule the past 10 years or so but in the old days they were famous for their soft schedule.

Also, what do people here expect to see from Georgetown-Memphis? They seem to be such completely different teams from the little I have seen.

[BacchusBlue]

I've got no idea how good Georgetown will be either, and I think November basketball is a terrible way to judge anybody. But for whatever it's worth, Georgetown is playing 4 road games early--at Ball State, at Old Dominion, at Alabama, and at Memphis. That'll probably help them as they get into conference play. And a Jim Boeheim schedule involves never even leaving your own state. This is no Jim Boeheim schedule.

[mapei]

Damn - get away from the board for a few days because of time conflicts, and look what happens. Fortunately someone pointed me to the thread.

Bob, you have absolutely no reason to despise Georgetown - maybe when the gruff pops was coaching, I can understand that. But JT3 is a classy, understated guy who runs a program in his image. His players are polite and soft-spoken almost to a man, certainly his stars (Green, Hibbert, and Wallace) have been.

I go to all their home games, watch the away games that I can on TV. And, while I agree the Hoyas may be a little overrated at #5, I have no doubt they can be very good, good enough to compete with the Dukes of the world. (A loss in the sweet 16? I hope for more, but I see no disgrace in that. How many times has Duke gotten out of the sweet 16 - or even into it - since 2001?)

Mainly I'm glad that my two favorite teams, Duke and Georgetown, don't play each other this year, which inevitably sends my stomach into knots.

The schedule has been incredibly soft so far. But everyone was expecting Alabama to be better when that game was scheduled, and no one expected Michigan to be quite so awful as they apparently are. ODU *beat* the Hoyas last year. Memphis will be a beast and probably a loss this year. I hope the softness is an aberration this year, since they actually had been scheduling better the last few years in the pre-conference run. I've heard that Duke is back on for next year (confirm?).

Greybread's assessment of the individual players is mostly accurate. They will definitely miss Jeff Green in the high post and in any number of other pivotal (heh) roles. But the others, especially Jeremiah Rivers, have improved, and they do indeed have stud freshmen (if a notch behind Duke's). Greybeard's "kid from DeMatha," whose name is Austin Freeman, already is really, really good. Hibbs, Wallace, Summers, and Sapp will all be fine. Macklin still has a way to go, but he has gotten better and, as GB points out, he has great athleticism. The only one I have been disappointed in so far is Ewing Jr., who seems to have reverted to his mistake-prone ways of early last season.

I can't defend the high rankings, or the rankings of any team, really. But they are going to be a good team, I hope a very good one.

[mapei]

p.s. Duke beat Michigan by 28, Georgetown beat them by 22. You have to really reach to find a big difference there.

p.p.s. The free throw shooting has been absolutely horrid. I can't disagree on that one. :(

[Indoor66]

Damn - get away from the board for a few days because of time conflicts, and look what happens. Fortunately someone pointed me to the thread.

Bob, you have absolutely no reason to despise Georgetown - maybe when the gruff pops was coaching, I can understand that. But JT3 is a classy, understated guy who runs a program in his image. His players are polite and soft-spoken almost to a man, certainly his stars (Green, Hibbert, and Wallace) have been.

I go to all their home games, watch the away games that I can on TV. And, while I agree the Hoyas may be a little overrated at #5, I have no doubt they can be very good, good enough to compete with the Dukes of the world. (A loss in the sweet 16? I hope for more, but I see no disgrace in that. How many times has Duke gotten out of the sweet 16 - or even into it - since 2001?)

Mainly I'm glad that my two favorite teams, Duke and Georgetown, don't play each other this year, which inevitably sends my stomach into knots.

The schedule has been incredibly soft so far. But everyone was expecting Alabama to be better when that game was scheduled, and no one expected Michigan to be quite so awful as they apparently are. ODU *beat* the Hoyas last year. Memphis will be a beast and probably a loss this year. I hope the softness is an aberration this year, since they actually had been scheduling better the last few years in the pre-conference run. I've heard that Duke is back on for next year (confirm?).

Greybread's assessment of the individual players is mostly accurate. They will definitely miss Jeff Green in the high post and in any number of other pivotal (heh) roles. But the others, especially Jeremiah Rivers, have improved, and they do indeed have stud freshmen (if a notch behind Duke's). Greybeard's "kid from DeMatha," whose name is Austin Freeman, already is really, really good. Hibbs, Wallace, Summers, and Sapp will all be fine. Macklin still has a way to go, but he has gotten better and, as GB points out, he has great athleticism. The only one I have been disappointed in so far is Ewing Jr., who seems to have reverted to his mistake-prone ways of early last season.

I can't defend the high rankings, or the rankings of any team, really. But they are going to be a good team, I hope a very good one.

Take it to the G-town board. :)

[greybeard]

Went to the Georgetown/Jacksonville game this afternoon. You want to know an awful lot of what Georgetown will be looking like on offense this year, at least from what I saw today, take a look at Duke. Did not see a high pivot Princeton. Saw alot of wing penetration initiating inside out play.

[mapei]

It was great to see Freeman break out like that, and even Wattad got some impact on the stat line!

[dukie8]

now that the rpi is starting to make a little sense, i noticed that gtown has not played a top 100 team yet. i know that michigan and alabama have been particularly terrible, but that's some pretty disgraceful scheduling on their part for a consensus preseason top 10 team.

[mus074]

now that the rpi is starting to make a little sense, i noticed that gtown has not played a top 100 team yet. i know that michigan and alabama have been particularly terrible, but that's some pretty disgraceful scheduling on their part for a consensus preseason top 10 team.

word

[Sleepyjackson]

JT3 is not his father when it comes to scheduling. He wants to play a tough schedule to get his team ready for conference play and has done so in the past. Unfortunately, this year's schedule hasn't turned out the way it was supposed to with most of the teams underachieving or going through some serious rebuilding. JT3 likes to play road games in what he calls the preseason. @Old Dominion is supposed to be a tough game. ODU has only lost a handful of games at home in the past 5 seasons. Memphis is away and Alabama was played in Birmingham. When the Alabama game was scheduled, Bama was considered a top 15 team. Unfortunately, Ronald Steele got hurt and Bama falls from top 15 to bubble team. Ball State is a mess right now and that game was on the schedule as a favor to JT3's brother who used to be their coach. Jacksonville is on the schedule because JT3 is good friends with their coach. Michigan was supposed to be better as well but they are young and learning a new system.

The other thing you have to remember is that the Big East plays 18 conference games. That's 2 more major conference games. If we played only 16 conference games and added say @NC State and at home against Texas Tech, the nonconference schedule would look alot better. Memphis, Bama, @ODU, Texas Tech, NC State and Fordham. Fordham was supposed to be a top A-10 team this season. They finished fourth last season and returned all 5 starters. Unfortunately, they too are underachieving.

Finally, and this is a big reason why Georgetown's schedule is weak, is that unlike Duke they share their homecourt with the Washington Wizards. The Wizards get priority over the Hoyas and they take up alot of prime weekend dates. Notice that Georgetown has zero marquee home games. They tried to schedule home games with two different Big 12 teams but couldn't find a suitable date and they were already going on the road to face Memphis, Bama and ODU. It's very tough for Georgetown to add a game on quick notice.

[dukie8]

JT3 is not his father when it comes to scheduling. He wants to play a tough schedule to get his team ready for conference play and has done so in the past. Unfortunately, this year's schedule hasn't turned out the way it was supposed to with most of the teams underachieving or going through some serious rebuilding. JT3 likes to play road games in what he calls the preseason. @Old Dominion is supposed to be a tough game. ODU has only lost a handful of games at home in the past 5 seasons. Memphis is away and Alabama was played in Birmingham. When the Alabama game was scheduled, Bama was considered a top 15 team. Unfortunately, Ronald Steele got hurt and Bama falls from top 15 to bubble team. Ball State is a mess right now and that game was on the schedule as a favor to JT3's brother who used to be their coach. Jacksonville is on the schedule because JT3 is good friends with their coach. Michigan was supposed to be better as well but they are young and learning a new system.

The other thing you have to remember is that the Big East plays 18 conference games. That's 2 more major conference games. If we played only 16 conference games and added say @NC State and at home against Texas Tech, the nonconference schedule would look alot better. Memphis, Bama, @ODU, Texas Tech, NC State and Fordham. Fordham was supposed to be a top A-10 team this season. They finished fourth last season and returned all 5 starters. Unfortunately, they too are underachieving.

Finally, and this is a big reason why Georgetown's schedule is weak, is that unlike Duke they share their homecourt with the Washington Wizards. The Wizards get priority over the Hoyas and they take up alot of prime weekend dates. Notice that Georgetown has zero marquee home games. They tried to schedule home games with two different Big 12 teams but couldn't find a suitable date and they were already going on the road to face Memphis, Bama and ODU. It's very tough for Georgetown to add a game on quick notice.

i agree with some of your color on their schedule but i don't fully buy it. wasn't it gtown that booted duke off the schedule? if so, that was fully in their control. michigan was NOT supposed to be good. alabama was NOT supposed to be good. neither of those teams even made the ncaat last year. odu on the road isn't a cupcake but they weren't an ncaat team last year either. fordham was 18-12 last year in the lowly a-12 and, like the other teams, wasn't an ncaat team last year. memphis is the only legit game they scheduled. they also avoided any and all pre-conference tournaments that might have some legit teams.

the bottom line is that for a final 4 team that returns a slew of starters, including hibbert who was a pre-season 1st team aa, and brought in a great freshmen class, that is a disgraceful schedule. i don't want to hear about how some teams that didn't even make the ncaat last year were "supposed" to be good this year. they weren't good last year and gtown knew that they were going to be soft this year.

[Sleepyjackson]

Dukie8, the schedule is weak so i can't really defend it but you have some of your facts screwed up. First, ODU did make the NCAA tournament last season losing to Butler in the first round. Prior to losing to the Hoyas, ODU had lost only 4 home games in 3 1/2 seasons. Alabama was considered a top 15 team despite not making the NCAA tournament. That team is completely different with Ronald Steele in the lineup. Additionally, that matchup was made by ESPN. They thought Alabama was going to be one of the favorites in the SEC and that was their choice for the Big East - SEC Challange. Fordham definetly was supposed to be better. They were 4th last season with everybody back. Regardless, the schedule should be better. I think we both can agree on that.

[mapei]

Sleepy is correct on his facts and also on the scheduling challenges at the Verizon Center.

It's a weak schedule, but it wasn't planned to be as weak as it has turned out to be.

And why the heck does the Duke board care about Georgetown's schedule anyway? I care, because I'm a Georgetown fan. And I care about Duke's schedule because I'm a Duke fan. But I have no interest at all in the schedules of, say, Memphis, UCLA or Tennessee. Their worth (or lack of it) will prove itself over the course of the full season.

[merry]

the bottom line is that for a final 4 team that returns a slew of starters, including hibbert who was a pre-season 1st team aa, and brought in a great freshmen class, that is a disgraceful schedule. i don't want to hear about how some teams that didn't even make the ncaat last year were "supposed" to be good this year. they weren't good last year and gtown knew that they were going to be soft this year.

Not to disagree but don't we have this debate about Duke's schedule about every other year, too? Michigan and St. John's were good when we origninally set up those series, somebody lost early in a preseason tournament so we ended up playing a lower seeded team instead of an early season challenge game, UCLA won't come to Cameron anymore, whatever...

[mus074]

Here is another prime cause for concern - to me. Georgetown is hosting a first round site for March Madness. That excludes them from playing there. If they get a one or two seed, they'll get proximity preference for their pod - which will likely be the RBC Center in Raleigh. Conventional wisdom says UNC will earn and receive a higher seed than Duke, giving them priority as well. That means Duke, if they earn a two-seed or better, would lose the opportunity to play in Raleigh and would likely travel up the road to the Verizon Center. If it plays out this way and Georgetown gets its preferential site (RBC) over Duke, it could well be on the back of a Boeheim-esque first third of their schedule. That leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

Well, crap.