Doug Gottlieb

[DavidBenAkiva]

Did anyone hear Doug Gottlieb say that Princeton had absolutely no right to be in Maui? Ouch. Way to throw them under the bus. Sure, they fell down by 30, but they didn't pack it in.

Time flies like an arrow
Fruit flies like a banana

[feldspar]

More like Doug Gottleib = blithering idiot.

Pay no attention to the man.

[ugadevil]

More like Doug Gottleib = blithering idiot.

Pay no attention to the man.

I agree. He tried to rip the Alabama football team and couldn't even get that right. If you're going to make fun the Crimson Tide for losing on Saturday, make sure you name the right school that beat them. La. Monroe, not Louisiana-Lafayette. Smooth Doug, smooth.

[Duvall]

He's right, though. There *are* too many preseason tournaments, and this Princeton team didn't belong in one.

[DavidBenAkiva]

Who cares who is and is not in the preseason tourneys? When's the last time Princeton went to Hawaii for basketball? Never! That's when. I think that Chaminade proved today that you never know what your going to get.

Maybe because there are so many, teams like Princeton have to play. Or maybe they just didn't forsee having a bad team a couple years ago when they signed up for Maui Invitational...

Time flies like an arrow
Fruit flies like a banana

[Troublemaker]

Yeah, it's not like we're talking about the BCS or the NCAA tournament where teams have to be at a certain level to get in. Too many preseason tournaments? According to what? There are as many preseason tournaments as the amount of money and venues dictates.

[SilkyJ]

More like Doug Gottleib = blithering idiot.

Pay no attention to the man.

but he used to be the big 12 assist leader in assists!

well played by our boys. our first time goin 11 deep so i'm pleased.

[dukemomLA]

Doug Gottlieb is an idiot. Has been for a long time, will always be, should not be on the air, and no one cares what he says.

He has no knowledge from which he speaks. He has no experience which warrants him to express any thought or opinion. Let's see what we can do to get this unqualified duffus fired.

[mr. synellinden]

I'm glad someone brought this topic up because I was thinking the same thing last night when Gottlieb was saying that Duke was a better team without Paulus. And Brennan basically told him he was an idiot for saying that.

Gottlieb is a blithering idiot and there is no question he has an anti-Duke bias. This goes back a while but I distinctly remember feeling it a lot last season. I wouldn't be surprised if he was the type to cheer when Duke lost to VCU (remember reports of sportswriters cheering against Duke in the press room?).

[ugadevil]

I'm glad someone brought this topic up because I was thinking the same thing last night when Gottlieb was saying that Duke was a better team without Paulus. And Brennan basically told him he was an idiot for saying that.



I'm curious as to what Gottlieb's colleagues think of him. It seems like he would not be one that would be highly respected by his peers, especially the guys who have ESPN radio shows. It would say ESPN radio has a number of individuals who are highly opinionated, so Gottlieb tries to play along and throw out his own ridiculous opinions for his show.

[bdh21]

I'm all for 2nd chances and against beating dead horses but I will now ignore my principles: this must be mentioned...

"However during Gottlieb's freshman year at Notre Dame, he stole credit cards from a roommate and fraudulently charged over $900 to those cards. Subsequently, he was kicked off the Notre Dame basketball team and eventually convicted of misdemeanor fraud."

[Jaymf7]

He's right, though. There *are* too many preseason tournaments, and this Princeton team didn't belong in one.

Perhaps there is too much coverage of early season college basketball and Gottlieb has no business getting a stage?

Who is to say which teams "belong" in a tournament. Princeton has one of the more storied histories in college basketball. They have a proven track record of success employing an unconventional strategy. Their inclusion no doubt would provide an interesting conflict of styles. In fact, I had fun previewing their style (and how it so opposed our new approach) for my wife before the game. Based on their pedigree alone, I think they should get a ticket to early tourneys.

Moreover, how can anyone say they are terrible? This was the third game of the season. Yes, our initial burst made them look bad, but so did Illinois' burst against ASU. Did ASU deserve to be there? For 3/4 of the game, Princeton played right with us. I wish them much success this season -- the season is young and there are many games to be played before we can really evaluate them. Maybe we just can be very, very good when we play with great effort and focus (let's do that for 40 minutes tonight).

[Nittany Devil]

I'm curious as to what Gottlieb's colleagues think of him. It seems like he would not be one that would be highly respected by his peers, especially the guys who have ESPN radio shows. It would say ESPN radio has a number of individuals who are highly opinionated, so Gottlieb tries to play along and throw out his own ridiculous opinions for his show.

I remember seeing an ESPN News piece a little while back when Andy Katz and Doug Gottlieb were giving opinions on various college basketball issues. This was before Gottlieb was getting as much face time on ESPN. Anyhow, Doug just dominated the discussion, and Andy could not get a word in edgewise. Andy was visibly frustrated. I thought it was kind of amusing, and that's my first memory of Doug Gottlieb. I'm not sure how Andy Katz feels about him now, but he definitely seemed annoyed by him on that day.

[MIKESJ73]

Duke is ranked from 9th to 13 on all the ballots for ESPN's Power 16 poll, with the exception of Dougs ballot. He doesn't have Duke ranked at all, but does have Davidson and NCSU. I guess according to him, were number 4 in NC.

[mus074]

Duke is ranked from 9th to 13 on all the ballots for ESPN's Power 16 poll, with the exception of Dougs ballot. He doesn't have Duke ranked at all, but does have Davidson and NCSU. I guess according to him, were number 4 in NC.

Yes, he also lists Kentucky at 15, after the Gardner-Webb tragic unmasking. The more blatant a bias, the easier it is to be discredited. I regard him as purely provocative. No real substance, just shock jock attitude. Unfortunately, its contagious at ESPN.

[sundown]

Everything about Gottlieb is odd and off-putting. He's consistently and aggressively dumb. As a player, he was perhaps the worst shooter ever to play guard for a D-1 program. He couldn't shoot at bit, yet somehow managed to be a decent guard. He also used to wear shoes that were two sizes too small; he liked the feeling of pain in his feet while he played. Just a weird dude.

I don't generally join with the "their out to get us" crowd, but it does seem like he dislikes Duke. If so, it may be because his career ended at the hands of Duke in a game that had some crucial controversial calls. He seems like someone who would still be noticeably bitter a decade later about something like that.

[Jumbo]

Everything about Gottlieb is odd and off-putting. He's consistently and aggressively dumb. As a player, he was perhaps the worst shooter ever to play guard for a D-1 program. He couldn't shoot at bit, yet somehow managed to be a decent guard. He also used to wear shoes that were two sizes too small; he liked the feeling of pain in his feet while he played. Just a weird dude.

I don't generally join with the "their out to get us" crowd, but it does seem like he dislikes Duke. If so, it may be because his career ended at the hands of Duke in a game that had some crucial controversial calls. He seems like someone who would still be noticeably bitter a decade later about something like that.

Where have you been? Haven't seen a post from you in ages.

[sundown]

Where have you been? Haven't seen a post from you in ages.

Elsewhere on The Internets, mostly. I'm excited about this team, though, and have decided to start posting here again. I also like the new board (well, it's new to me).

I've been lurking for a few weeks, though, and am glad to see you're still at it. :)

[77devil]

Duke is ranked from 9th to 13 on all the ballots for ESPN's Power 16 poll, with the exception of Dougs ballot. He doesn't have Duke ranked at all, but does have Davidson and NCSU. I guess according to him, were number 4 in NC.

I was going to make the same observation but the above poster beat me to it. Al Featherston's new book arrived last night and in the chapter on Wojo he mentions the Duke win over Gottlieb's Ok. State team in the 1998 NCAA tournament You think that might be influencing his attitude toward Duke? Hmmm.

Buy Al's book by the way. What a great trip down memory lane expressed, in part, in the words of many of the players who made Duke basketball what it is.

[rthomas]

Doug Gottlieb is just one of many really bad things about ESPN basketball coverage - many have been mentioned previously.

Last night, for example, there was not enough time between the end of the UCLA-Md game and the beginning of the Duke game. We had to watch free throws and our game was basically over by the time they switched over. Fox Sports Net games on their ACC coverage take into account that games last mmore than 2 hours. How many years does it take for ESPN to learn that college basketball games usually take more than two hours? Apparently, they will never figure it out.

The second thing we found out last night while having to watch the free throws of the Md game is that Dick Vitale is no better this year than the previous years.

So IMO, ESPN should get rid of the Dicks (Vitale and Gottleib) and give games more time.

[DavidBenAkiva]

Wow, I guess that I really touched a nerve here. I guess that we can add Doug Gottlieb to the "pay no mind" list. Like they say, the worst form of torture is silence.

Time flies like an arrow
Fruit flies like a banana

[captmojo]

Gottlieb definitely has a Duke chip on both shoulders and has for a long time. ESPN radio is only worth a night listen to pick up on scores during the Sportcenter cut-ins every twenty minutes.

[dkbaseball]

In making the case that the SEC is stronger than the ACC this year, Gottlieb just adduced as evidence the fact that Florida State is improved. He did correctly identify Kentucky and Arkansas as being in the SEC, but does anybody else seriously think they will be much good?

[pamtar]

What are you guys talking about?! Gottlieb is the man! After watching him tonight I learned so much. For instance, did you know that Florida State plays in the SEC? Also, State is going to struggle this year because they lost their best point guard Engine Atsur to graduation. I'm telling you Billy P. doesn't hold a candle to this guy!

[Buckeye Devil]

but he is right that there are too many tournaments at this time of the year. That is not to say that he should have thrown Princeton under the bus. It seemed like when it was primarily the Great Alaskan Shootout and Maui, that there were a lot of quality teams in those two tournaments and a high level of competition in nearly every contest. Now it seems kind of watered down with teams like Columbia and Delaware State playing in the pre-season NIT. But eventually, we still get good match-ups like Duke/Illinois, UCLA/MSU, OSU/Syracuse, etc.

[greybeard]

I think that Gottlieb really, really knows and understands the game. And, he does have some daring in him. I mean, a Jew from California going to a morribund program at, hello, Notre Dame, to play point guard? Only more daring thing would have been to have gone there to play quarterback.

Gottlieb's old man was a complete basketball junkie, and made it pretty high in the coaching ranks before he stubbed his toe big time. Came from the South Shore of Long Island; a contemporary of Larry Brown's. Went to Ohio State and played for a year with a couple three or four guys you might have heard of--Lucas, Havlecheck, Knight, and Siegfred (sorry for the spelling). Used to coach kids in Harlem after graduating college, and take white boys to the Rucker to play with his club and let them taste what the game is all about. Got as far as being the head coach at Jacksonville before badly tripping up.

Anybody who is the son of Bobby Gottlieb has got to know ball and, listening to Doug on radio (TV it's hard to tell for me) more than convinced me that he did.

Besides, Doug once sent a very polite and throughtful message in return to an e-mail I sent him. More than most talking heads do.

My point, the kid knows ball and has got some manners. As for the rest of your criticisms, I got no opinion.

PS Bob's first college coaching job was at Creighton, under the guy Doug ended up playing for at Oklahoma State. Bob coached a kid at Creighton in freshman ball who was the toughest guy to guard I've ever seen. A crazy kid from Queens who scored 39 a game to lead freshman in scoring nationwide. No freshman eligibility at the time and Jay road off into the sunset on the motorcycle before stepping foot on the court as a varsity player. Just telling basketball stories is all. A big part of life, I think, telling stories.

[Wander]

Doug Gottlieb is an idiot. Has been for a long time, will always be, should not be on the air, and no one cares what he says.

He has no knowledge from which he speaks. He has no experience which warrants him to express any thought or opinion. Let's see what we can do to get this unqualified duffus fired.

My god, did he shoot your dog or something?

[Wander]

Moreover, how can anyone say they are terrible?

Because they're, um, terrible. Really, really terrible.



Did ASU deserve to be there?

Probably not. The Maui field was awful this year.

[3rd Dukie]

I avoid ESPN like the plague except to watch specific games. Therefore, I am not sure I know who Gottlieb is. However, judging from the posts in this thread, I am not feeling compelled to rush right out and add him to my buddy list. Sounds like quite an interesting fellow.

As to the question about whether there are too many preseason tournaments: It strikes me that the economics of the situation will rule, as in post season bowl games. Assuming these events are funded by rational business people, when the fans quit buying tickets and the networks no longer need content fill their band width, the tourneys will start to contract. Theoretically, that should happen when the quality of the competition is sufficiently diluted as to not create further interest from the potential viewers or ticket buyers. If a game is a weak match up, I simply choose not to watch, but that's just me.

[Slant]

ESPN's Power 16 out today. Devils jump to #4. Fraschilla even picked us #2 ahead of Heels!

But can you believe it! Doug Gottlieb still doesn't have us picked in the top 16. Such blatant anti-Duke bias. This guy is a total jerk and idiot. What the hell is he doing on TV?

[VaDukie]

Wow, I'm pretty shocked by that. DG has never been a big Duke fan (98 game still sting a little?), but he had some pretty favorable things to say during Maui. At least we're getting respect from everyone else.

[Duvall]

That pretty much has to be some kind of error. I mean, Kentucky at 14?

[Schleimer24]

I am not denying him being an idiot but I would have to think he didn't submit his ballot the past two weeks if you look more carefully at his picks/omissions:

Tennessee @ #5 after they were blown out by Texas who is #10 on his ballot
Louisville @#7 after they lost both Padgett and to BYU last week

And most ridiculous: NC State @ #13 after last night's shalacking by Michigan State by 23 points, which is not even anywhere to be found in the Power 16.

Obviously we deserve to be in the Power 16, probably b/n 4-7 where everyone else has us but I wouldn't hold Doug "Where are my credit cards" Gottlieb's opinion with any regard.

[Slant]

It's not an error. Gottlieb has been doing that all season so far. He hates Duke and his bias is crystal clear. ESPN should fire him.

[EarlJam]

It's not an error. Gottlieb has been doing that all season so far. He hates Duke and his bias is crystal clear. ESPN should fire him.

Slant, just to clarify: Are you saying you do NOT care for Doug Gottlieb? :D

-EarlJam

[Slant]

EarlJam, you got it, baby! Every time I seem him on the preview show, I just want to gag! I'll take tar Heel Hubert Davis over him any day. Gottlieb makes Digger look like a genius.

[CDu]

ESPN's Power 16 out today. Devils jump to #4. Fraschilla even picked us #2 ahead of Heels!

But can you believe it! Doug Gottlieb still doesn't have us picked in the top 16. Such blatant anti-Duke bias. This guy is a total jerk and idiot. What the hell is he doing on TV?

Who cares what Doug Gottlieb thinks about Duke? Does Gottlieb's rating have any impact on our chances of beating UNC? of winning the ACC tourney? of winning the NCAA tourney? The answer to all of these things is a resounding "no." So why worry about what Gottlieb says?

I've never understood the complaining about where Duke is ranked. Rankings in college basketball are meaningless - and that's even the "official" rankings. We were the #1 team in the final AP how many times from 1998-2006? And how many championships did we win? Ultimately, the powers that be will seed us somewhere from a 1 seed to a 4 seed, and we'll have to beat a few solid/good teams to get to the Final Four. It'll wind up depending upon matchups and how well we play in those games. It will not matter one bit whether or not some analyst had us rated in his Power 16.

[Cameron]

The best part of the whole equation is that little adolescent Doug grew up cheering his head off for a team that later denied his services, the iconic Duke Blue Devils :D

Loser.

[3rd Dukie]

I had never really paid any attention to who said what on ESPN and had never even identified Gottlieb with the talking head.
Now that I have, the little pencil neck geek is really horrid. Someone brought this up a few days back and I made a point to find out this villain was. I wish I hadn't. Is that the smallest size shirt he can find? He really is a buffoon. Try not to let it get to you and just consider the source and the folly of it all.
Like the majority of sports guys, he thinks he is an awful lot more important than he is.
At least Hubert Davis proved it on the court.

[dukeENG2003]

In fairness, he WAS a decent college player. . .

I actually like Hubert Davis, and he IS far more knowledgeable than Gotlieb. Yeah he's a heel, but if all heels were like him (Davis), I don't think i'd hate them as much

[pratt '04]

If you look at the previous Power 16 lists, Gottlieb's picks have been exactly the same since the 1st week. So, either Gottlieb hasn't been turning in new picks or there is some type of clerical error. I think that even Doug would have us in his top 16 after our past several performances.

[Slant]

3rd Dukie, I agree completely with your point. It's just these completely biased guys on TV continue to poison the Duke hatred movement out there, I can't go out to a bar to watch a game in peace with friends without some jerk wanting to make a case.

[dukediv2013]

At least Gottlieb has NC State, who lost by 23 to MSU last night, at 13, and Davidson, who lost to someone last week, at 16. I hope that he just overlooked Duke, because if he didn't... He is a freaking idiot. Did he watch Duke in Maui or against Wisconsin?

[EarlJam]

Who cares what Doug Gottlieb thinks about Duke? Does Gottlieb's rating have any impact on our chances of beating UNC? of winning the ACC tourney? of winning the NCAA tourney? The answer to all of these things is a resounding "no." So why worry about what Gottlieb says?

I've never understood the complaining about where Duke is ranked. Rankings in college basketball are meaningless - and that's even the "official" rankings. We were the #1 team in the final AP how many times from 1998-2006? And how many championships did we win? Ultimately, the powers that be will seed us somewhere from a 1 seed to a 4 seed, and we'll have to beat a few solid/good teams to get to the Final Four. It'll wind up depending upon matchups and how well we play in those games. It will not matter one bit whether or not some analyst had us rated in his Power 16.


To me it all falls under the category of "Basketball Talk" and therefore it's perfectly okay to be ticked off at Gottlieb or get excited about rankings. We're fans. That's what we do. It's all part of the entertainment package. I mean, if you only want to talk about what's meaningful, then you should only tune in a few times a year to watch UNC games, the ACC Tourney and the NCAA Tourney. You should never visit this board or talk about anything else. In fact, the argument can be made that pulling for a basketball team is meaningless itself.

I enjoy all the banter and welcome it. And I love talking rankings. It helps to hype up games, get high seeds in the tournament.

Just my two cents.

Oh yeah, and Doug Gottlieb's feet smell like molded chicken.

-EarlJam

[dukediv2013]

Looks like Gottlieb forgot to fill out his list as all of his teams are the same. Still and idiot though.

[VaDukie]

In fairness, he WAS a decent college player. . .

I actually like Hubert Davis, and he IS far more knowledgeable than Gotlieb. Yeah he's a heel, but if all heels were like him (Davis), I don't think i'd hate them as much

I agree - Hubert Davis is a great analyst. He and Bilas have good chemistry when they do the Gameday stuff together.

[SilkyJ]

I agree - Hubert Davis is a great analyst. He and Bilas have good chemistry when they do the Gameday stuff together.

I think he's solid, but Jay's is better. I do agree that they have really good chemistry on gameday. Its funny b/c I think digger is the worst now.

Also, jay is a very good color commentator, and certainly much better than hubert in that regard. I really like putting him with raftery, that trio instead of a duo thing works well with them.

[VaDukie]

I think he's solid, but Jay's is better. I do agree that they have really good chemistry on gameday. Its funny b/c I think digger is the worst now.

Also, jay is a very good color commentator, and certainly much better than hubert in that regard. I really like putting him with raftery, that trio instead of a duo thing works well with them.

I agree with Jay on the color commentary - the trio working Maui was great.

[blazindw]

I agree - Hubert Davis is a great analyst. He and Bilas have good chemistry when they do the Gameday stuff together.


Also, jay is a very good color commentator, and certainly much better than hubert in that regard. I really like putting him with raftery, that trio instead of a duo thing works well with them.

I think Jay Bilas is good at whatever he does. Period.

[freedevil]

I think Gottlieb actually thinks every team in the country is terrible.

He called Kevin Love the greatest offensive post player to enter college basketball in quite some time the other night. I am disgusted at saying this, but has he never seen psychotic tyler play?

[3rd Dukie]

3rd Dukie, I agree completely with your point. It's just these completely biased guys on TV continue to poison the Duke hatred movement out there, I can't go out to a bar to watch a game in peace with friends without some jerk wanting to make a case.

I know how you feel. Let's look for a different bar! :)
Or maybe switch from beer to scotch...

[loran16]

Actually i believe this to be an error. Each of the 3 weeks listed gottleib is listed as the same top 16.

I doubt even a biased duke hater would have that top 16....it's Got to be a mistake and they forgot to change his picks since week 1. Or he hasnt turned in his picks since week 1.

Anyhow #4, woohoo

[mr. synellinden]

Say what you will about Gottlieb - he is awful and has an anti-Duke bias no question, but let's focus on the positive - #4 in the rankings and how about this quote from the poll (which I happen to agree with):

and the Blue Devils have the best killer instinct in college basketball.

That is what we were lacking to a great degree last year. Not this year - we are taking it at people, not backing down and responding when necessary. When Illinois made a run at us early in the second half, we didn't get rattled and came right back at them. When Marquette came back and tied the game, we didn't lose our composure and turn the ball over, we ran good possessions, played great defense and looked like a veteran team that expected to win. All of these things have been Duke hallmarks over the years, and we somehow lost it last year. I don't care why, I just care that it's back. Marquette ties the game, Henderson makes a great move to the basket and scores. We get a crucial stop and Singler nails two clutch free throws.

By the way, I'd have to say that Singler is the most directly responsbile for this change in team demeanor. He doesn't back down, doesn't get rattled, shows his fire when necessary and leads by example - it's all Laettner-esque as has been pointed out elsewhere. I love the "Singler is Iron" thread. If I were starting a band, I might name it that.

[Classof06]

I think Gottlieb actually thinks every team in the country is terrible.

He called Kevin Love the greatest offensive post player to enter college basketball in quite some time the other night. I am disgusted at saying this, but has he never seen psychotic tyler play?

ESPN definitely made a mistake because that's the same Power 16 Gottlieb has had since the preseason.

That being said, I think Kevin Love is much more polished in the post as a freshman than Hansbrough was, especially offensively. And I was two rows from the court when Hansbrough came to Cameron his senior year. Tyler was still very good his freshman year but Love is way ahead at this point.

[VaDukie]

Looking past Gottleib's slight (have to believe he just hasn't updated his list):

Franschilla has us at #2! It is only one man's opinion and means nothing in the big picture, but I think it's recognition of the fact that if you scrapped preseason rankings, we've played the 2nd best basketball of anyone in the country. Kudos to him for recognizing we're playing much better basketball than the team down the road.

[dukeENG2003]

By the way, I'd have to say that Singler is the most directly responsbile for this change in team demeanor. He doesn't back down, doesn't get rattled, shows his fire when necessary and leads by example - it's all Laettner-esque as has been pointed out elsewhere. I love the "Singler is Iron" thread. If I were starting a band, I might name it that.

+1, the way he reacts, as opposed to the way McRoberts reacted to those sorts of situations is very telling, and a good sign for our team.

[Carlos]

Assuming the teams got 16 points for a first place vote and 1 point for a 16th place vote, here's the listing for the poll positions and way the totals appear without Gottlieb's votes:

1. UCLA - 139
2. UNC - 133
2. Memphis - 131
4. Duke - 105
5. Kansas - 109
6. G-town - 103
7. Texas - 82
8. Washington St. - 83
9. Texas A&M - 80

Assuming that he voted UCLA first (like almost everyone else) you would take their total to 155. UNC and Memphis both had significantly more points than Duke did and it's safe to think that Gottlieb would have one of the two somewhere in the top 3, but they would have to be two places apart. At the same time, Duke picked up 5 points on Kansas and maintained at least a 1-point lead over Georgetown. It's just a guess on my part (there are obviously several possible permutations) but I think Gottlieb's Power 16 starts out like this:

1. UCLA
2. Memphis
3. Duke
4. UNC
5. Georgetown
6. Texas
7. Washington State.
8. Texas A&M
9. Kansas.

Maybe he's not an idiot...

[VaDukie]

Assuming the teams got 16 points for a first place vote and 1 point for a 16th place vote, here's the listing for the poll positions and way the totals appear without Gottlieb's votes:

1. UCLA - 139
2. UNC - 133
2. Memphis - 131
4. Duke - 105
5. Kansas - 109
6. G-town - 103
7. Texas - 82
8. Washington St. - 83
9. Texas A&M - 80

Assuming that he voted UCLA first (like almost everyone else) you would take their total to 155. UNC and Memphis both had significantly more points than Duke did and it's safe to think that Gottlieb would have one of the two somewhere in the top 3, but they would have to be two places apart. At the same time, Duke picked up 5 points on Kansas and maintained at least a 1-point lead over Georgetown. It's just a guess on my part (there are obviously several possible permutations) but I think Gottlieb's Power 16 starts out like this:

1. UCLA
2. Memphis
3. Duke
4. UNC
5. Georgetown
6. Texas
7. Washington State.
8. Texas A&M
9. Kansas.

Maybe he's not an idiot...

3 points to you for taking the time to do the math unlike the rest of us. His list is definitely wrong - he has NC State listed but on the main page they're not under receiving votes.

If your guess is right (and I think it is) and he of all people has us 3rd - wow.

[slower]

I agree with Jay on the color commentary - the trio working Maui was great.

Except for McDonough's insane pro-Sox, anti-Yankees ranting. He seems like somebody that would kick his dog when nobody was looking.

[Turtleboy]

That being said, I think Kevin Love is much more polished in the post as a freshman than Hansbrough was, especially offensively. And I was two rows from the court when Hansbrough came to Cameron his senior year.Of course, that was after the flu pandemic of '08. Hardly a fair comparison.

[77devil]

Assuming the teams got 16 points for a first place vote and 1 point for a 16th place vote, here's the listing for the poll positions and way the totals appear without Gottlieb's votes:

1. UCLA - 139
2. UNC - 133
2. Memphis - 131
4. Duke - 105
5. Kansas - 109
6. G-town - 103
7. Texas - 82
8. Washington St. - 83
9. Texas A&M - 80

Assuming that he voted UCLA first (like almost everyone else) you would take their total to 155. UNC and Memphis both had significantly more points than Duke did and it's safe to think that Gottlieb would have one of the two somewhere in the top 3, but they would have to be two places apart. At the same time, Duke picked up 5 points on Kansas and maintained at least a 1-point lead over Georgetown. It's just a guess on my part (there are obviously several possible permutations) but I think Gottlieb's Power 16 starts out like this:

1. UCLA
2. Memphis
3. Duke
4. UNC
5. Georgetown
6. Texas
7. Washington State.
8. Texas A&M
9. Kansas.

Maybe he's not an idiot...

Can't argue with the math, kudos for the analysis, but just can't believe that Gottlieb would put Duke anywhere close to # 3. I suspect there is a differenent explanation, though I don't have one to offer, other than it's a mistake.

[jacone21]

Of course, that was after the flu pandemic of '08. Hardly a fair comparison.

Well played. *golf clap*

[VaDukie]

WE NEED TO CHANGE THE THREAD TITLE:

DOUG GOTTLIEB: Closet Duke Homer?

Here's the real list

1. UCLA
2. Memphis
3. Duke
4. North Carolina
5. Georgetown
6. Kansas
7. Texas
8. Washington State
9. Texas A&M
10. Marquette
11. Butler
12. Clemson
13. Tennessee
14. Michigan State
15. BYU
16. Vanderbilt

Gottlieb has us ahead of UNC.

[gotham devil]

WE NEED TO CHANGE THE THREAD TITLE:

DOUG GOTTLIEB: Closet Duke Homer?

Here's the real list

1. UCLA
2. Memphis
3. Duke
4. North Carolina
5. Georgetown
6. Kansas
7. Texas
8. Washington State
9. Texas A&M
10. Marquette
11. Butler
12. Clemson
13. Tennessee
14. Michigan State
15. BYU
16. Vanderbilt

Gottlieb has us ahead of UNC.:D

Now, he'll get angry, well thought out e-mails from Kentucky, UNC-Chapel Hill, and OK St. fans complaining about pro-Duke bias.

[heath_harshman4]

A lot of respect here. Kind of surprising seeing how they are above Kansas and Georgetown.

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/powerranking?season=2008&week=4

[heath_harshman4]

lookin at who voted duke where in their personal Power 16... Fran Fraschilla has them at #2!!!

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/news/story?id=3131857

[Grey Devil]

lookin at who voted duke where in their personal Power 16... Fran Fraschilla has them at #2!!!

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/news/story?id=3131857

Seems that something has changed. Look at what Gottlieb has Duke at now at this same link (in the quoted text above). #3!

Here's his top 10:
1. UCLA
2. Memphis
3. Duke
4. North Carolina
5. Georgetown
6. Kansas
7. Texas
8. Washington State
9. Texas A&M
10. Marquette
Grey Devil

[Slant]

When I first posted this thread, the latest ESPN Power 16 had just been released and it looks like it did not have Gottlieb's updated rankings. Do you think he didn't vote originally or that his personal ranking was just not updated?

In the prior weeks of the Power 16 rankings, Gottlieb didn't have Duke ranked, which i found unfounded. So today, Gottlieb goes from not ranking Duke in prior weeks to now #3 - quite a shift. I wonder if someone at ESPN or his fellow rankers said something to him?

Regardless, I am glad Doug has awakened and smelled the coffee!!

[CDu]

When I first posted this thread, the latest ESPN Power 16 had just been released and it looks like it did not have Gottlieb's updated rankings. Do you think he didn't vote originally or that his personal ranking was just not updated?

In the prior weeks of the Power 16 rankings, Gottlieb didn't have Duke ranked, which i found unfounded. So today, Gottlieb goes from not ranking Duke in prior weeks to now #3 - quite a shift. I wonder if someone at ESPN or his fellow rankers said something to him?

Regardless, I am glad Doug has awakened and smelled the coffee!!

If I had to guess, I suspect that he voted originally and then did not do so subsequently. I think this is his first update of his original rankings (which explains the big shift). As was noted in several other posts, he had many anomalies, including other teams that clearly shouldn't have been there as of last week (such as Kentucky. I think the Duke omission was merely a case of Gottlieb not having entered data at all recently, and not an intended slight at Duke. It would not have been unreasonable at all to have Duke outside the "power 16" as of preseason.

[feldspar]

Gottlieb is clearly the anti-Christ. He should be hanged by his lips with fishing hooks from the scoreboard in Cameron and flogged with two-by-fours filled with rusty nails.

[greybeard]

Everyone had a slightly different list of hoped for improvements for different players coming into the season, not to mention high expectations for Singlar et al. How many seem to have been met? Pretty remarkable, if you ask me. None, by itself, is particularly surprising (except for the changes in the K man his ownself). But all of them? Together?

Who would have thunk it?

[BigTedder]

well, even ESPN needs a good douche....who cares what he thinks anyway, he's about as useful as binoculars in Cameron

[NovaScotian]

http://deadspin.com/sports/doug-gottlieb/doug-gottlieb-does-not-like-your-taunts-330803.php

[dball]

Don't be silly, not everyone knows Doug Gottlieb :D

[feldspar]

Wow. Those chat questions are obnoxious, but Gottleib's answers are even more childish.

[Cameron]

Don't be silly, not everyone knows Doug Gottlieb


Lol.

[Cameron]

Only 54 more posts and I'll be JJ. It's all I ever wanted for Christmas from 2002 to 2005:) Maybe this year!

[EarlJam]

This question nearly made me spew Sprite....

Mike Indiana: How did your mediocre basketball career prepare you for a mediocre broadcasting career?

Awesome.

-EJ

[Cavlaw]

This question nearly made me spew Sprite....

Mike Indiana: How did your mediocre basketball career prepare you for a mediocre broadcasting career?

Awesome.

-EJ
It's too bad they don't allow rebuttals from questioners. I would have been terrifically amused by a Mike Indiana response to the "which one of us works at ESPN?" crack if "Mike" turned out to be like, a VP at Eli Lily & Co. or somesuch.

[EarlJam]

It's too bad they don't allow rebuttals from questioners. I would have been terrifically amused by a Mike Indiana response to the "which one of us works at ESPN?" crack if "Mike" turned out to be like, a VP at Eli Lily & Co. or somesuch.

Indeed. What an a&& bag. I've got a friend, by the way, who started off as a Domino's pizza delivery boy, worked his way up, and now owns several stores and is quite successful. Loves his job.

Doug needs to be careful. Statements like that will alert the Karma police to render justice. And you don't want the Karma police to render justice on yo person.

-EJ

[SilkyJ]

This question nearly made me spew Sprite....

Mike Indiana: How did your mediocre basketball career prepare you for a mediocre broadcasting career?

Awesome.

-EJ

the edits to your new avatar almost made me spew my, uh, sprite.



And you don't want the Karma police to render justice on yo person.

-EJ

word?

[rthomas]

Who is the other I'm a real wanker for saying this.I'm a real wanker for saying this.I'm a real wanker for saying this.I'm a real wanker for saying this.I'm a real wanker for saying this.bag writer that this reminds me of? I think he used to write for CBSSportline but can't remember anything other than he used to insult people like that. I can not think of his name but we used to discuss his rants against Duke. Oh well...I can't remember. Probably won't remember Gottleib's name in a few years either.

[SilkyJ]

Who is the other I'm a real wanker for saying this.I'm a real wanker for saying this.I'm a real wanker for saying this.I'm a real wanker for saying this.I'm a real wanker for saying this.bag writer that this reminds me of? I think he used to write for CBSSportline but can't remember anything other than he used to insult people like that. I can not think of his name but we used to discuss his rants against Duke. Oh well...I can't remember. Probably won't remember Gottleib's name in a few years either.

Doyel. gregg doyel.

DBR had a great nickname for him, but I am forgetting it. i know it had the word "black" in it somewhere.

[rthomas]

Doyel. gregg doyel.

DBR had a great nickname for him, but I am forgetting it. i know it had the word "black" in it somewhere.

It's amazing how soon we forget. But you are right!. Doyel, what a piece of s&^t. Doyel = Gottleib.

[juise]

Duke is #5 the latest ESPN power rankings. It's funny the way the experts voted (http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/news/story?id=3152845); we got three #2 votes, a #5 vote and seven #6/#7 votes. I guess you're either sold on Duke... or still waiting to see.

[VaDukie]

Duke is #5 the latest ESPN power rankings. It's funny the way the experts voted (http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/news/story?id=3152845); we got three #2 votes, a #5 vote and seven #6/#7 votes. I guess you're either sold on Duke... or still waiting to see.

Interestingly enough, two of the three 7 votes are from Vitale and Bilas, those reliable providers of Duke bias.

*I will not be posting for awhile as I soak in the glory of being the Landlord.

[Jumbo]

Just on College Gamenight:
Q: Who is better, Duke or Carolina?
Gottlieb: "You know, I think I have to say Duke. Their ability to win close games, to will themselves to win -- remember, they won the Maui Invitational, the EA Sports Maui Invitational, much a similar way. Hard-fought game against Marquette and then they create offense off of their defense. Nelson and the boys kind of willed themselves to victory. I think they're a difficult matchup because they beat you with so many smalls and then you can't beat them on the offensive boards. It was even offensive boards -- 10 to 10 -- tonight."

[billybreen]

Just on College Gamenight:
Q: Who is better, Duke or Carolina?
Gottlieb: "You know, I think I have to say Duke. Their ability to win close games, to will themselves to win -- remember, they won the Maui Invitational, the EA Sports Maui Invitational, much a similar way. Hard-fought game against Marquette and then they create offense off of their defense. Nelson and the boys kind of willed themselves to victory. I think they're a difficult matchup because they beat you with so many smalls and then you can't beat them on the offensive boards. It was even offensive boards -- 10 to 10 -- tonight."

He's trying to make us overconfident. It's a sinister plot.

[4decadedukie]

I'm with Billy . . . his well-established long-term record speaks for itself, although I appreciate his perceptiveness in this instance.
:D

[captmojo]

He's trying to make us overconfident. It's a sinister plot.

I don't trust it either. Let's see if he lavishes any praise come late February.

[greybeard]

The skinny: his appreciation for what Duke is currently doing might well be due to special secret uninvited lengthy e-mails about basketball philosophy with Duke as an example from one former Bluejacket (that's what Hewlett High School teams used to call themselves, Bluejackets) to another. The recipient of said communications is dude's father. Then again, maybe he just likes what he sees and calls it like he sees it. One's fanciful wishful thinking might make it the former. :eek:

If he starts talking soccer influences we will know for sure.

[77devil]

The skinny: his appreciation for what Duke is currently doing might well be due to special secret uninvited lengthy e-mails about basketball philosophy with Duke as an example from one former Bluejacket (that's what Hewlett High School teams used to call themselves, Bluejackets) to another. The recipient of said communications is dude's father. Then again, maybe he just likes what he sees and calls it like he sees it. One's fanciful wishful thinking might make it the former. :eek:

If he starts talking soccer influences we will know for sure.

Huh? http://kimsal.com/rabbit_pancake.jpg

[tbyers11]

Huh? http://kimsal.com/rabbit_pancake.jpg


Just to make it even more clear

http://kimsal.com/rabbit_pancake.jpg

[Jumbo]

Just to make it even more clear

http://kimsal.com/rabbit_pancake.jpg

I think it was pretty clear -- Greybeard is friends with/went to the same high school as Gottlieb's dad. He's been e-mailing him about Duke.

[billybreen]

I think it was pretty clear -- Greybeard is friends with/went to the same high school as Gottlieb's dad. He's been e-mailing him about Duke.

Oh dear god no. Well, that explains why Gottlieb hates us.

[ArtVandelay]

My favorite part of that quote is that Gottleib had to correct himself to make sure he mentioned that it's the "EA Sports Maui Invitational," not just the Maui Invitational. He really avoided some angry phone calls there. Whew.

[greybeard]

I think it was pretty clear -- Greybeard is friends with/went to the same high school as Gottlieb's dad. He's been e-mailing him about Duke.

Not friends. When I was in high school, Bob Gottlieb was laying the groundwork for a successful, but short, coaching career that took him to coach under the coach at Creighton (I'm blocking) who his son played for at OSU, among other reknown coaches, before getting head gigs at Jacksonvilee (where he stubbed his toe big time) and another place I can't remember. Bob would come to chat with our hgh school coach during the summers when the high school was opened evenings and brought many old timers back for runs. Sometimes he'd change from his suit right there on the floor to run with the kids and, in the process, impart what he knew. He was coaching a team of Harlem kids in the Rucker, and took several of my team/classmates to run with his guys. I learned alot just watching and playing with the guy.

Googled him recently (I guess when I "got" that his kid was personna non gratta here) and saw that he runs a program in SoCal to train bubble kids and help them land scholarships. Sent him a riff of e-mails one week about some of my takes about the game, relating some of them to concepts that I saw in his style, etc, and talked alot about creating pivot play by littles penetrating to the interior and kicking for that purpose, instead of looking to create inside-out play through the pass, since the vision around the penetrating passing game seems a lost art at both ends in today's game. Talked a lot about Duke to exemplify a lot of my ideas about this and other matters (pictures always help). Nope, he didn't, and I doubt that Doug got any input from me, but stranger things have happened.

I had an e-mail exchange with Doug several years ago, when I wrote to comment what I thought was a very insightful point I heard him make on the radio (I just happened to catch him riding home late at night). The kid e-mailed me back; I think that he really knows the game. Bob I know does.

[BigTedder]

Just on College Gamenight:
Q: Who is better, Duke or Carolina?
Gottlieb: "You know, I think I have to say Duke. Their ability to win close games, to will themselves to win -- remember, they won the Maui Invitational, the EA Sports Maui Invitational, much a similar way. Hard-fought game against Marquette and then they create offense off of their defense. Nelson and the boys kind of willed themselves to victory. I think they're a difficult matchup because they beat you with so many smalls and then you can't beat them on the offensive boards. It was even offensive boards -- 10 to 10 -- tonight."

Since when do we give a bum what Gooberlieb thinks? hes a donkey.

[greybeard]

Did Doug say something particularly opprobrious on one or more occasions, or is it that he generally underrates Duke? I don't listen to talking head basketball shows in general; I do listen to football talking head shows on occasion, because I do not actually watch the sport and like to be able to participate in conversation. Since I don't know jack about football, I don't mind if they don't actually say anything meaningful because I'll never know.

[Clipsfan]

Oh dear god no. Well, that explains why Gottlieb hates us.

That made me laugh...

[77devil]

I think it was pretty clear -- Greybeard is friends with/went to the same high school as Gottlieb's dad. He's been e-mailing him about Duke.

I think not.

[greybeard]

I think not.

Actually, here is a quote from my lst e-mail to Bob which was sent just after New Years:

Another word about soccer ball: Duke is playing it.

1. The use of the high, high screen near the mid court and towards the sideline. It is designed to create space for the point guard without his having to work for it, conserving moves and speed for later. He then penetrates towards the middle and sees the defense. He usually will decide based upon how the defense reacts to give it to one of the wing players, who is the initiator, not the point.

In this regard, the point is like a defensive midfielder, who gets the ball on the far side of the mid field line with space, the dimensions of the field dictate that he have space most of the time, and brings it towards the attack zone, usually passing it wide to another midfielder who can then initiate.

2. The wing attacks the middle off a lateral dribble, looking for a shot off the crease, or a kick if that is not there. The wing can continue with the dribble and, if he sees it, attack the basket. This attack is for real, his intent is to finish. He will give it up for something easier, but his job is to score the ball if he goes.

3. The high screen at the top is used again to free the point, this time for a shot, or a slight penetration which draws the defense. His principal purpose is to kick, even to the point of leaving his feet aka Nash and twisting in unconventional ways.

Pass soccer ball along to Doug. Kornheiser just laughs at me. But what does he know about soccer? Hell, he can't stand the sport!

Later, Bobby, it has been a pleasure. I hope these perspectives might prove of value.

[mus074]

Gottlieb does rank us ahead of UNC, 4 vs. 5. Overall, Duke ranks 2nd in a tight bunch between Duke, UNC and Kansas for 2-4.

However, Gummy Davis ranks us seventh, as follows:

1. Kansas
2. Memphis
3. UNC
4. UCLA
5. Michigan State
6. Georgetown
7. Duke

You don't have to think Duke is second or even third to be objective. But seventh? Come on. (Ever see the remake of Father of the Bride?: The seventh door on the left. Second? Seventh.) At least give Duke the love before the UNC game so whatever the outcome, the Heels look better.

I am starting to find his blatant bias both predictable and humorous.

[_Gary]

Who cares where they rank us. I love playing the underdog and don't care if the majority of writers keep us out of the top 10 for most of the year. All that matters to me is that we are first after the NCAA tourney is done!

Gary

[Clipsfan]

Who cares where they rank us. I love playing the underdog and don't care if the majority of writers keep us out of the top 10 for most of the year. All that matters to me is that we are first after the NCAA tourney is done!

Gary

Don't you know that they only rank us higher so that they can make it that much bigger of a deal when we lose? :D

[SilkyJ]

Just on College Gamenight:
Q: Who is better, Duke or Carolina?
Gottlieb: "You know, I think I have to say Duke. Their ability to win close games, to will themselves to win -- remember, they won the Maui Invitational, the EA Sports Maui Invitational, much a similar way. Hard-fought game against Marquette and then they create offense off of their defense. Nelson and the boys kind of willed themselves to victory. I think they're a difficult matchup because they beat you with so many smalls and then you can't beat them on the offensive boards. It was even offensive boards -- 10 to 10 -- tonight."

I've heard him give us praise before but i hear more stupid/uninformed/flat out wrong negative comments from him than I do insightful praise. or any praise for that matter. this does nothing for me. I aint no day trader. long term averages baby.


He's trying to make us overconfident. It's a sinister plot.

hahaha, potd (a couple days ago)


I think it was pretty clear -- Greybeard is friends with/went to the same high school as Gottlieb's dad. He's been e-mailing him about Duke.

I figured that out as well, but only after reading it several times. his way of putting it was very convoluted.


Oh dear god no. Well, that explains why Gottlieb hates us.

haha, he's heating up!


My favorite part of that quote is that Gottleib had to correct himself to make sure he mentioned that it's the "EA Sports Maui Invitational," not just the Maui Invitational. He really avoided some angry phone calls there. Whew.

i noticed that too! how ridiculous is it these days that commentators have to do that kind of crap (i dont know, but i'm guessing espn and others at least ASK their commentators to make sure they get the full name in cause otherwise they might get a tongue lashing or something...its as bad as calling the Orange Bowl the "Fed Ex orange bowl" its just so ridiculous...


Actually, here is a quote from my lst e-mail to Bob which was sent just after New Years:


i believe 77devil was merely saying that he didn't think you're email was clear (which is what jumbo said), not that he didn't believe you were friends with gottlieb's father.

[SMO]

Did anyone catch Gottlieb's Paulus comment when he was calling the VCU/GMU game the other night? Eric Maynor of VCU created a nice shot and nailed it, at which point Gottlieb quipped, "Greg Paulus has seen that before." His co-commentator immediately replied, "Lay off Greg Paulus". Gottlieb still can't get over that he could never play PG at Duke and that Paulus can. He has grown-up moments such as the one Jumbo pointed out but I still think he's an angry child inside.

[greybeard]

Silky,

I'm not friends with Gottlieb's father, and wrote to him in the main for the same reason I write here, except with Bob, if my perspectives had proved of value, they were designed to perhaps have lead to something. Very long shot, out of my range I fear. Thought that you guys might be interested to know that you are not the only ones I plague with my inarticulate "takes" on the game, and its relationship to a sport that shall be unnamed and to certain perspectives on how people learn, yadayadayada. ;)

[77devil]

i believe 77devil was merely saying that he didn't think you're email was clear (which is what jumbo said), not that he didn't believe you were friends with gottlieb's father.

Correct.

[dukemomLA]

Do any of us really care what Doug G thinks or says?? I don't think so.

[dukegirlinsc]

I'd like to hug him.

[greybeard]

Correct.

Oh, maybe if you had been more clear about that. ;)

By the way, I thought that I recognized Gottlieb's voice in the VT game, but only caught a bit of it and wasn't sure. What I did notice was his commenting that Duke created inside-out play, not through penetrating passes, but by dribble penetration that had a kick out option once the penetrator touches "the paint." Hmmm. Read my two initial posts again and you might understand the seeming vagueness in different terms. Or not.

[Jumbo]

Do any of us really care what Doug G thinks or says?? I don't think so.

Dukemom,
Don't you think that by virtue of the fact that this thread is being discussed, some people actually care about Gottlieb's opinion?

[Indoor66]

I'd like to hug him.

Now, Now. This is a family board....:)

[77devil]

Read my two initial posts again and you might understand the seeming vagueness in different terms. Or not.

Not.

[greybeard]

Not.

How am I not surprised. :)

[billybreen]

Now, Now. This is a family board....:)

Lolz

[Indoor66]

Lolz

Lolz ??????????????????????????????

[billybreen]

Lolz ??????????????????????????????

It means it's funny.

[dukegirlinsc]

It means it's funny.

lollllllllllz@lollllzzzzz

or is that too much? :confused:

[billybreen]

lollllllllllz@lollllzzzzz

or is that too much? :confused:

That is perfectly acceptable. Hopefully the old people will catch up eventually.

[dukie8]

gottlieb just said that nelson is the acc poy so far. who would have thought that he even would be in the conversation before the season started? enough with all the bs that gottlieb hates duke. he's no hubert or packer.

[dukemomLA]

Hey, Jumbo -- I guess you're right and I'm wrong. It's amazing to me....but people do seem to care with Doug G has to say. Go figure.

On another note, I'm much happier when Duke is 'downplayed' by the media --perceived as Paper Tigers, living far beyond their abilities. And I'd be happier if our ranking was lower and lower.

More fuel for the fire. (And I think a lot of DBR posters are right. It's a ploy....waiting for the mighty Duke to fall, so folk can say, "I told you so.)"

NO ONE except Duke fans ever want to see Duke win. We should accept that as a compliment. Is there any other team in the country, where it matters? (except when your/their team is playing)? Annoying at times, but mostly fun.

[wilson]

The halftime dig at Coach K ("Everyone else does halftime interviews. Why can't he?") was bad enough, but he's made a number of abrasive, inappropriate comments throughout ESPN's coverage today. He is a schmuck of the highest order.
And did he somehow miss the fact that halftime interviews are a recent, highly annoying invention, and that coaches never say anything substantive during them anyway?

[TheDuke11]

Coach K takes Mastercards at halftime for those halftime interviews. I'm sure gotdweeb can figure out a way to get his hands on one.

[SharkD]

I guess I should be thankful that I'm watching the Raycom feed, for once.

[hurleyfor3]

What Gottlieb is saying is he can't get enough of Coach K.

[Chitowndevil]

I've actually always thought it was kind of cool that K has assistant coaches do the interviews. I'm proud to have guys like Dawkins, Collins, and Wojo as assistants and glad to see them get media exposure.

[phaedrus]

where is earljam with the gottlieb face when you need him?

[devildeac]

Wonder if we could get Knight to choke him or throw a chair at him?

[CarterTheGreat]

Gottcreep is an idiot. Did you hear what Collins said? We need to play better defense and the offense will work out. That is a cliche, it's what you get no matter if it's K, one of the assistants, or one of the towel boys. You are getting cliches. Once again the talking heads say something negative about our boys.

[asbcheeks]

The halftime dig at Coach K ("Everyone else does halftime interviews. Why can't he?") was bad enough, but he's made a number of abrasive, inappropriate comments throughout ESPN's coverage today. He is a schmuck of the highest order.
And did he somehow miss the fact that halftime interviews are a recent, highly annoying invention, and that coaches never say anything substantive during them anyway?

He's just still sore that Coach K wouldn't give him an interview back in high school.

[VaDukie]

He's just still sore that Coach K wouldn't give him an interview back in high school.

Hit the nail on the head.

[BlueHeaven]

I heard the same thing and couldn't believe my ears. Couldn't it be that he's giving the assistants some airtime, grooming them to handle the press and be head coaches? Does it always have to be something negative? I should just turn the sound off and listen to my XM feed. I was so annoyed. I feel better knowing you all felt the same way. Carry on.

[4decadedukie]

I guess I should be thankful that I'm watching the Raycom feed, for once.

Me, too, but I'm not particularly thankful (visual coverage is poor).

[dukie8]

The halftime dig at Coach K ("Everyone else does halftime interviews. Why can't he?") was bad enough, but he's made a number of abrasive, inappropriate comments throughout ESPN's coverage today. He is a schmuck of the highest order.
And did he somehow miss the fact that halftime interviews are a recent, highly annoying invention, and that coaches never say anything substantive during them anyway?

do you expect gottlieb, as a member of the media, to say something positive about the fact that k is the only coach that i can think of who doesn't do halftime interviews? k is free to do whatever he wants but, when he decides to thumb his nose at the networks and not do something that more or less is expected of him, he kind of should expect some digs about it.

i agree that the 20 second blurbs are usually a complete waste of airtime and it's not like a coach is going to tell the world what adjustments he is going to make at halftime.

[barjwr]

Remind me again why Coach K would want to cooperate with the media in any fashion? (see ". . . unlike other schools, . . ." debacle and "Coach K angry about ribbon controversy" thread for further details on the idiocy of the collective media)

[jjasper0729]

I may be mistaken on the timing, but this has gone back for many years now (to when Coach started cutting back his schedule). He said at the time (and perhaps if Mr. Brill or Mr. Featherston can corroborate) that he didn't do the halftime interviews and delegated that to his assistants so that he could focus with his team for one and 2) give his assistants the exposure and 3) they were all a "team" so the assistants were qualified to speak.

[dukie8]

i think that it is kind of a chicken and egg thing -- the media is relatively harsh and critical of duke/k and k is relatively inaccessible and distant from the media. i'm not sure which came first but my guess is that it started from nothing and then slowly escalated over the years to this rather unique situation that exists today that isn't exactly warm and fuzzy.

[DevilWolf]

I wish Roy would do less interviews.

[oldnavy]

I don't think that Coach K is very comfortable in front of the media. This is just my opinion, but he isn't the most polished or charismatic speaker. That coupled with the way the media is just waiting to pounce on him for things he says, doesn't say, does or doesn't do.... I don't blame him I would avoid it as well. The problem is that the media will read into that and claim (with no evidence) that he is arrogant or smug... can't win!

[jimsumner]

I'm sure we all remember the physical problems that K had in 1994/5. He felt that he was doing too many things, spreading himself too thin, and that overexposure was a contributing factor to his problems.

So he resolved to cut back. One part of that resolution was cutting back on media access. He does the post games, of course, talks to the media at Operation ACC basketball in the fall, and two or three times during the season, usually before the Carolina games. But he doesn't do a weekly meet-and-greet.

K has made a bit of an effort at becoming more accessible than in the past but it's not like you can just drop by the office and shoot the breeze. It is hard to get an interview with the man. So, yes, there is some resentment from some people. Many of you know that Greg Doyel wrote a book about Duke hoops a few years back and didn't get the kind of access to the program that he thought he deserved. Fill in the blanks. But I do think some of the kvetching on this issue is an off-shoot of the larger issue.

A second variable is that he is trying to help groom his assistants for head-coaching jobs and letting CC do this half-time interviews may be part of the process. Look at much he much time he gives his assistants on his TV show.

Or maybe he just doesn't want to waste thirty seconds on a totally pointless exercise. How likely is it that any coach is going to say anything of substance in this context? "Well, Erin, we need to focus on defense and take better care of the ball."

There are several ways to look at this. One is that K is very active, coaching internationally, involved with Coaches v. Cancer and the Jimmy V Foundation, and the Emily Krzyzewski foundation, and lots of other stuff, so rationing his time is and should be a high priority.

Others would suggest that if he has time for commericals or paid speaking engagements, then maybe he isn't all that pressed for time.

I think K is as comfortable in front of the media as other coaches. But he doesn't suffer fools gladly and I've seen him eviscerate media who asked him stupid questions. His intensity during a game is palpable and I think it's asking a lot of any coach to ratchet that down in a few minutes and meet with the media or anyone else after a hard-fought game. Then again, that is part of the job description.

I understand the frustration felt by some members of the media but my take is that the man has earned a fair amount of latitude in this area. And the specfic issue of the half-time interview seems to me to be awfully petty. But I thought I would put that in some context.

[Mudge]

In addition to very little of substance ever being uttered in these inane halftime interviews (which were never done 25 or even 15 years ago), it might have been instructive for ESPN to pair Jimmie Dykes' analysis of the way Duke handles in-game timeouts (Duke's players all sprint over to their huddle to maximize their time together in the timeout, providing an extra 15-20 seconds per timeout vs. teams with less focused, disciplined players), and then realize that maybe the biggest reason that Coach K doesn't do these interviews is that they are a useless distraction that take precious seconds and minutes away from his limited time to speak to his team during halftime.

Of course he doesn't do them, and he probably wouldn't even have Dawkins, Collins, or Wojo do them either (they are important members of Duke's halftime routine, as well), if he wasn't compelled to do so by some league agreement with the networks, but given he has to provide someone, it's probably pretty smart that the most important member of Duke's coaching staff has the full amount of halftime to actually spend time COACHING his players, rather than filling airtime with platitudes for the networks.

[dukemsu]

i think that it is kind of a chicken and egg thing -- the media is relatively harsh and critical of duke/k and k is relatively inaccessible and distant from the media. i'm not sure which came first but my guess is that it started from nothing and then slowly escalated over the years to this rather unique situation that exists today that isn't exactly warm and fuzzy.

This situation is funny, since when K was on the rise (before the win in 91) he was a favorite of the media. In many ways he has filled the role Dean used to-the guy at the top of the hill to take shots at.

K has certain media members that he gives access to (even though those are relatively limited, both in number and access given). In this way, he is a bit like his mentor, RMK. Of course, where he is not like RMK is that he does not put himself in situations where he might make himself or his university look bad, at least not often.

The national media is fabulously fickle. Their favorite go-to quote right now is Bruce Pearl, because he is a colorful quote who says things that make the press feel they are insiders, while in truth he is keeping them at a safe distance and using them for exposure for both his team and himself (he will listen if Indiana comes a-calling this offseason). He plays them like a piano. Once the media discovers this, they will find new people to fill this role. It is all the same, only the names have changed. Yes, I just quoted Bon Jovi.

Long story short, this is just the natural order of things. K was once an up and comer, he is now the target. It says a lot about both him and the state of his program that he has been the target for this long.


dukemsu