FB: Virginia Tech 38, Duke 31

[Bob Green]

Duke is a 10.5 points underdog with the Over/Under at 51.5 points. Discuss the game here...

[rtnorthrup]

Weirdly, we have had some success against Va. Tech, even when we arent very good.

That's about all I got.

[devildeac]

Duke is a 10.5 points underdog with the Over/Under at 51.5 points. Discuss the game here...

You're a brave, brave soul, Bob, for starting game threads two weeks in a row. :eek:

[peloton]

Weirdly, we have had some success against Va. Tech, even when we arent very good.

That's about all I got.

I'm afraid that's not going to be enough 😏. I'll be watching of course but seeing what they did against the Pack...it's not going to be pretty at all. No bold/foolish prediction from me this time as I'm no longer drinking (the kool-aid).

[duke2x]

Weirdly, we have had some success against Va. Tech, even when we arent very good. That's about all I got.

Duke-VT @ VT since 2004: 3-6.
Duke-VT @Duke since 2005: 0-7.

Note there was a quirk in the 2012 and 2013 schedule because VT did not want to host BC and Duke in the same year to even out ticket sales. We got Miami at home twice.

[tteettimes]

Duke football???......really????......still???........m ore like an oxymoron!!!......we should be playing junior colleges only.......or girls teams.......Duke football......what an embarrassment

Sorry....lm just not able to keep the faith any longer......I will always pull for the Duke Blue Devils....this really hurts

[jimsumner]

Duke football???...really????...still???....more like an oxymoron!!!...we should be playing junior colleges only....or girls teams....Duke football...what an embarrassment

Sorry...lm just not able to keep the faith any longer...I will always pull for the Duke Blue Devils...this really hurts

Deep, cleansing breath, Repeat as needed.

Just curious but were you around in the Franks/Roof days?

[Devilwin]

Deep, cleansing breath, Repeat as needed.

Just curious but were you around in the Franks/Roof days?
Not Roof bad yet, but it's heading that way. But I know we have talent, and hopefully we can get it together. QB is a big issue now...Get that issue settled we can still be ok..I have a feeling we can reverse fortunes Saturday.

[jimsumner]

Not Roof bad yet, but it's heading that way. But I know we have talent, and hopefully we can get it together. QB is a big issue now...Get that issue settled we can still be ok..I have a feeling we can reverse fortunes Saturday.

Methinks we need to get a lot closer to a winless season than 0-3 to even remotely compare this team to the worst teams of the Franks/Roof era.

[Acymetric]

Methinks we need to get a lot closer to a winless season than 0-3 to even remotely compare this team to the worst teams of the Franks/Roof era.

I don't know, I think 7 turnovers just about does it.

[CameronBornAndBred]

Not Roof bad yet, but it's heading that way. But I know we have talent, and hopefully we can get it together. QB is a big issue now...Get that issue settled we can still be ok..I have a feeling we can reverse fortunes Saturday.

That is something that is particularly maddening. We ARE more talented than we were when Cutcliffe took over, yet we are not progressing. It's one thing to lose when we have "the fattest and slowest" team, but those days are long gone. One could argue that we are more talented now than we were when we won the Coastal, at least on paper. We should be consistently be competing in ACC, and we obviously aren't even close to doing so.

[jimsumner]

I don't know, I think 7 turnovers just about does it.

I'm talking about a season not one game. Apples and oranges.

As an aside, anyone who wasn't around for Carl Franks' last game is not arguing from an informed perspective.

[Im4howdy]

That is something that is particularly maddening. We ARE more talented than we were when Cutcliffe took over, yet we are not progressing. It's one thing to lose when we have "the fattest and slowest" team, but those days are long gone. One could argue that we are more talented now than we were when we won the Coastal, at least on paper. We should be consistently be competing in ACC, and we obviously aren't even close to doing so.

I wonder if someone needs to ask Coach Cutliffe again, "Do they play football at Duke." That seemed to get his juices flowing the first time.

[Acymetric]

I wonder if someone needs to ask Coach Cutliffe again, "Do they play football at Duke." That seemed to get his juices flowing the first time.

It feels like I haven't seen Cut fired up about anything in years. Early on in his tenure I loved listening to his interviews (pre-game, post-game, midweek, whenever).

[arnie]

I'm talking about a season not one game. Apples and oranges.

As an aside, anyone who wasn't around for Carl Franks' last game is not arguing from an informed perspective.

Yea, they should have fired me at halftime for continuing to sit through it. The other problem, unless Charlotte is able to play, we stand a chance at going winless. Strangely, our best chance at a W may against hapless FSU. If they keep losing, that new coach is likely gone.

[Bob Green]

Jim Sumner article on front page:

https://www.dukebasketballreport.com/2020/9/29/21459461/michael-carter-casey-holman-on-dukes-0-3-start-virginia-tech-on-saturday-blue-devils-football

Michael Carter II and Casey Holman met with the media.

Virginia Tech ran for 314 yards against State. Job 1 will be stopping the Hokies ground attack.

[peloton]

I don't know, I think 7 turnovers just about does it.

Acymetric, 7 turnovers is downright awful, I agree. However, and I don't remember under whose watch it was, but I've been to at least one game in the past where the ball was hiked over our punter's head. Granted, we're bad but we're not that level bad right now (I realize that's little consolation as we all ponder which team we'll get our first win against).

I would love nothing more than to see both Coach Cut and the team display some emotion this weekend and grab this victory vs the Hokies.

[jimsumner]

Yea, they should have fired me at halftime for continuing to sit through it. The other problem, unless Charlotte is able to play, we stand a chance at going winless. Strangely, our best chance at a W may against hapless FSU. If they keep losing, that new coach is likely gone.

Then you know how pathetic that team was. For those who don't Wake led 42-0 at the half. Jim Grobe played his backups the entire second half. He did not call for a single pass, did not call for a run outside the tackles, maybe outside the guards, did not blitz.

Without putting too fine a point on it Jim Grobe FELT SORRY FOR A DUKE FOOTBALL TEAM and TOOK PITY ON THAT TEAM.

When that starts happening to Cutcliffe then Duke will have reached the depths of Carl Franks last game. But we are a long, long, long way from that point.

I think Duke's late-game collapses may have distorted our perceptions. Duke was down 17-13 at Notre Dame in the fourth quarter. Duke didn't really fall apart against BC until Charlie Ham missed a chip-shot field goal that would have made it 10-9 in the second half. And Duke led Virginia in the fourth quarter.

Duke is doing a terrible job of finishing close games and they have to fix that. Have to. But Franks and Roof rarely had that opportunity and that's why I find the comparisons of this team to the teams of Cut's two most immediate predecessors to be overwrought.

[DU82]

Then you know how pathetic that team was. For those who don't Wake led 42-0 at the half. Jim Grobe played his backups the entire second half. He did not call for a single pass, did not call for a run outside the tackles, maybe outside the guards, did not blitz.

Without putting too fine a point on it Jim Grobe FELT SORRY FOR A DUKE FOOTBALL TEAM and TOOK PITY ON THAT TEAM.

When that starts happening to Cutcliffe then Duke will have reached the depths of Carl Franks last game. But we are a long, long, long way from that point.

I think Duke's late-game collapses may have distorted our perceptions. Duke was down 17-13 at Notre Dame in the fourth quarter. Duke didn't really fall apart against BC until Charlie Ham missed a chip-shot field goal that would have made it 10-9 in the second half. And Duke led Virginia in the fourth quarter.

Duke is doing a terrible job of finishing close games and they have to fix that. Have to. But Franks and Roof rarely had that opportunity and that's why I find the comparisons of this team to the teams of Cut's two most immediate predecessors to be overwrought.

Interesting you brought up Jim Grobe (and I stayed through the end of that game; I wish he had allowed his walk-on QB a chance to throw a pass in what might have been his only game on the field.)

I see some parallels between Grobe and Cutcliffe. Grobe came to Wake, lit a fire, made it to the championship game (and won!) and took Wake from a doormat to a contender. However, over his 13 seasons, he peaked in season 6, had two more good seasons, then basically went back downhill. He wasn't able to capture the same lightning again and he ended up "retiring" rather than being fired (although he came back to be the interim coach at Baylor a couple seasons later, as they needed a clean, decent person to pull them out of the crap they got themselves into.)

Do you see similar patterns with Cut?

[sagegrouse]

Jim Sumner article on front page:

https://www.dukebasketballreport.com/2020/9/29/21459461/michael-carter-casey-holman-on-dukes-0-3-start-virginia-tech-on-saturday-blue-devils-football

Michael Carter II and Casey Holman met with the media.

Virginia Tech ran for 314 yards against State. Job 1 will be stopping the Hokies ground attack.

I attended a game played against The Citadel in 2004. At the beginning of the second half, we lateraled into our own end zone for a Citadel touchdown to get within four points.

We put the game away only when our big, lumbering tailback Justin Boyle ran for for 83 yards -- it turned out he was the fastest man on the field.

[jimsumner]

Do you see similar patterns with Cut?

There are some similar trend lines.

[chrishoke]

I attended a game played against The Citadel in 2004. At the beginning of the second half, we lateraled into our own end zone for a Citadel touchdown to get within four points.

We put the game away only when our big, lumbering tailback Justin Boyle ran for for 83 yards -- it turned out he was the fastest man on the field.

I will never forget that game or that run.

[duke2x]

Do you see similar patterns with Cut?

Although the question was not directed at me and it has nothing to do with VT, I'll post some stats:

Grobe 77-82 (42-62). Grobe had quick success in 2001 as he was 2 years removed from a bowl game. He only went to 1 bowl in the last 5 years of his tenure.
Cut 72-82 (34-64). Cut had a bigger rebuild but has done better later in his tenure. We've had bowls 2 of the last 4 years, which probably matches the admin's goals.

[budwom]

Although the question was not directed at me and it has nothing to do with VT, I'll post some stats:

Grobe 77-82 (42-62). Grobe had quick success in 2001 as he was 2 years removed from a bowl game. He only went to 1 bowl in the last 5 years of his tenure.
Cut 72-82 (34-64). Cut had a bigger rebuild but has done better later in his tenure. We've had bowls 2 of the last 4 years, which probably matches the admin's goals.

Fair point on administration goals, but we are definitely on a trajectory where frequent bowls are not going to be happening. ACC wins are going to be like hen's teeth for us.

[rtnorthrup]

Fair point on administration goals, but we are definitely on a trajectory where frequent bowls are not going to be happening. ACC wins are going to be like hen's teeth for us.

Maybe we can keep scheduling the University of Alabama and say its like a bowl game.

[budwom]

Maybe we can keep scheduling the University of Alabama and say its like a bowl game.

Yeah, it's a scene when those guys visit...after the last time their (amiable) fans visited, I had my customary chat with the ambulance/first aid crew over on the visitor's side, and they told me that beyond the shadow of a doubt, more Bama fans succumbed to the WW heat (and apparently alcohol) than any group they'd ever encountered. It didn't affect their amiability, but it did affect their verticality.

[rtnorthrup]

Yeah, it's a scene when those guys visit...after the last time their (amiable) fans visited, I had my customary chat with the ambulance/first aid crew over on the visitor's side, and they told me that beyond the shadow of a doubt, more Bama fans succumbed to the WW heat (and apparently alcohol) than any group they'd ever encountered. It didn't affect their amiability, but it did affect their verticality.

Maybe we should try LSU for a 1:00pm game in WW.

[whereinthehellami]

Duke is going to get VTs best on Saturday. Their coaches, players, and fans are really fired up after the Duke blowout exposed them for being soft last year. VT really toughened up after that game and finished strong.

A lot of their fans are not happy with Cut faking the punt after being up by over 20 in the 4th. Word is that the coaches are working that angle pretty strong and to look for a very motivated VT effort on Sat.

[budwom]

former players Wray and Koppenhaver not pleased with the recent efforts, this via their Tweeters...

[jv001]

former players Wray and Koppenhaver not pleased with the recent efforts, this via their Tweeters...

Wray Carlton? :cool:

GoDuke!

[chrishoke]

former players Wray and Koppenhaver not pleased with the recent efforts, this via their Tweeters...

Link?

[budwom]

Link?

it's over on the Devils Den, I'm personally not a Tweeter.

[PDDuke85]

it's over on the Devils Den, I'm personally not a Tweeter.

11561

[jimsumner]

11561

"Ya'll?" Why wouldn't he use "we?"

Seems a bit suspicious to me. Twitter accounts get hacked all the time.

[PDDuke85]

"Ya'll?" Why wouldn't he use "we?"

Seems a bit suspicious to me. Twitter accounts get hacked all the time.


11563

[jimsumner]

11563

Maybe I could have read that at one time in my life. Maybe. But in 2020. Not even close.

[AustinDevil]

It feels like I haven't seen Cut fired up about anything in years. Early on in his tenure I loved listening to his interviews (pre-game, post-game, midweek, whenever).

This. And the team reflects it, frankly.

[jimsumner]

This. And the team reflects it, frankly.

Cutcliffe wasn't a rah-rah guy in 2013 or 2014 or 2015 either. He's always maintained that fiery pregame speeches wear off too quickly to have any real impact. If you're looking for fire and brimstone, you're looking in the wrong place. It's just not in his DNA.

[Acymetric]

Cutcliffe wasn't a rah-rah guy in 2013 or 2014 or 2015 either. He's always maintained that fiery pregame speeches wear off too quickly to have any real impact. If you're looking for fire and brimstone, you're looking in the wrong place. It's just not in his DNA.

I'm not talking about yelling/screaming or anything "fiery", I just mean having any detectable amount of pep, zest, or enthusiasm in his voice at all. I'm also not talking about how he talks to the team (how would I know about that, I'm not on it?) I'm talking about how he talks to the media/fans. I would describe his tone/demeanor as much more subdued the past 5 years than the 5 before that. Yes he has always been pretty even keeled, but I think there has been a change.

[jimsumner]

I haven't seen him in a non-Zoom context since the beginning of spring ball, back in early March. So, I can't compare. What some people see as a lack of energy others see as trying to stay calm under trying circumstances. It is my understanding that the team has been challenged in practice in recent days. Whether they respond to that challenge is something we'll find out down the road.

Sometimes a team just stops listening to a coach. Not saying that has happened to Duke and Cut. But it is not an unheard of phenomena.

[duke2x]

Per Goduke, VT has cancelled its volleyball game with Duke due to COVID-19. Remember the VT football game last week barely happened. This game probably gets cancelled if it does not go on this weekend.

[AustinDevil]

Cutcliffe wasn't a rah-rah guy in 2013 or 2014 or 2015 either. He's always maintained that fiery pregame speeches wear off too quickly to have any real impact. If you're looking for fire and brimstone, you're looking in the wrong place. It's just not in his DNA.

What acymetric said. He is subdued in a way he was not before, and it’s not a 2020 change.

[hustleplays]

What acymetric said. He is subdued in a way he was not before, and it’s not a 2020 change.

Whether Cut give fire and brimstone pre-game speeches isn't the issue. Effective coaches have widely divergent personalities. What counts is the motivational intensity [and focus] of the players. Many of the most successful coaches have been quite subdued in their personal style. I think of Tom Landry, Bill Bellichick and Brad Stevens. Their teams came/come ready to play, fully intense.

Whatever his style, Cut has to do a better job of preparing his players to begin with intensity [and focus] and sustain it for the entire game.

And this, of course, isn't the only issue affecting Duke's ability to win games.

[Acymetric]

Whether Cut give fire and brimstone pre-game speeches isn't the issue. Effective coaches have widely divergent personalities. What counts is the motivational intensity [and focus] of the players. Many of the most successful coaches have been quite subdued in their personal style. I think of Tom Landry, Bill Bellichick and Brad Stevens. Their teams came/come ready to play, fully intense.

Whatever his style, Cut has to do a better job of preparing his players to begin with intensity [and focus] and sustain it for the entire game.

And this, of course, isn't the only issue affecting Duke's ability to win games.

Nobody is talking about Cut's pregame speeches to the team. We are talking about his demeanor when addressing media/fans, as a possible window into his frame of mind.

[chrishoke]

Uniform for the game will be white helmet with a Blue stripe down the middle, black D, blue jersey and pants, white shoes.

[AustinDevil]

Nobody is talking about Cut's pregame speeches to the team. We are talking about his demeanor when addressing media/fans, as a possible window into his frame of mind.

Nor is anyone begging for fire-and-brimstone stuff. You guys are arguing with a straw man. There is a noticeable difference in Cut now and Cut just a few years ago. Frankly, since hustleplays brought up Landry and I'm a Dallas guy, the difference in Cut that we are talking about is a *lot* like the difference between 1982 Landry and 1987 Landry.

[budwom]

Nor is anyone begging for fire-and-brimstone stuff. You guys are arguing with a straw man. There is a noticeable difference in Cut now and Cut just a few years ago. Frankly, since hustleplays brought up Landry and I'm a Dallas guy, the difference in Cut that we are talking about is a *lot* like the difference between 1982 Landry and 1987 Landry.

I note this because Tom Landry's son was a classmate of mine at Duke...fine young lad...

[chrishoke]

Keys to the game from our friends at the Chronicle.

https://www.dukechronicle.com/article/2020/10/third-and-goal-duke-football-virginia-tech

[Bob Green]

This seems a bit redundant...

Keys to the Game:

1. Turnovers - eliminate them
2. Offense - get ahead of the sticks, score TDs
3. Defense - don’t allow VT to establish rhythm

[devildeac]

This seems a bit redundant...

Keys to the Game:

1. Turnovers - eliminate them
2. Offense - get ahead of the sticks, score TDs
3. Defense - don’t allow VT to establish rhythm

Prediction;)?

[Bob Green]

Prediction;)?

Well I wasn’t going to make one but seeing as you’re putting me on the spot:

Virginia Tech 34, Duke 20

Hope I’m wrong.

[devildeac]

Well I wasn’t going to make one but seeing as you’re putting me on the spot:

Virginia Tech 34, Duke 20

Hope I’m wrong.

Ha! I knew you liked predictions ;).

VT-31
Duke-13

[Bob Green]

Ha! I knew you liked predictions ;).

Predictions are a complete waste of time but a lot of fun. :cool:

[chrishoke]

VPI 41
Duke 16

[Acymetric]

VPI 41
Duke 16

16 has got to be one of the most depressing football scores. Up there with 5, I would argue worse than 9 or 12.

[arnie]

Well I wasn’t going to make one but seeing as you’re putting me on the spot:

Virginia Tech 34, Duke 20

Hope I’m wrong.

Hope we keep it that close.

[peloton]

Prediction;)?

No more from me (for now).

[LegoBatman]

16 has got to be one of the most depressing football scores. Up there with 5, I would argue worse than 9 or 12.

I'm trying to figure out what it would look like to lose a game in which you score 8 safeties....

[jimsumner]

I'm trying to figure out what it would look like to lose a game in which you score 8 safeties...

Or make 16 extra points.

[devildeac]

16 has got to be one of the most depressing football scores. Up there with 5, I would argue worse than 9 or 12.

Not if our opponents only have 15. :p

[devildeac]

I'm trying to figure out what it would look like to lose a game in which you score 8 safeties...

LOL.

Or win the game scoring 8 safeties and "allowing" 5 FG. :eek::rolleyes:

[camion]

Not if our opponents only have 15. :p

That gives us the recipe for the win.

Avoid turnovers - punt on first down and back them up.
Get 8 safeties - 16 pts
Hold them to 5 field goals - 15 pts.

Seems doable. I hope the defense is ready to play 50 minutes.

Okay, change in strategy. Kneel down on 1st and 2nd down to run clock. Punt on third down.

[DU82]

16 has got to be one of the most depressing football scores. Up there with 5, I would argue worse than 9 or 12.

A touchdown and three field goals, the last one coming as time expires for the win.

[Bob Green]

16 has got to be one of the most depressing football scores. Up there with 5, I would argue worse than 9 or 12.

The New York Jets disagree.

[jimsumner]

Not if our opponents only have 15. :p

Why wouldn't 0 be the most depressing football score?

[devildeac]

Why wouldn't 0 be the most depressing football score?

Concur, especially if we lost on a walk-off extra point, 0-1. :rolleyes:

[jimsumner]

Concur, especially if we lost on a walk-off extra point, 0-1. :rolleyes:

I wonder how often Canadian Football League games end 1-0.

[devildeac]

I wonder how often Canadian Football League games end 1-0.

(shrugs)

I guess it's been decades since I've watched any Canadian Football League games/scores.

[OZZIE4DUKE]

16 has got to be one of the most depressing football scores. Up there with 5, I would argue worse than 9 or 12.
The Miami Dolphins won Super Bowl VII 16-7. Would have been 16-0 is Garo hadn’t tried to throw a pass on a botched field goal attempt!

[devildeac]

A touchdown and three field goals, the last one coming as time expires for the win.

Yes, indeed:

https://www.espn.com/college-football/recap?gameId=243180150

"Matt Brooks kicked a 53-yard field goal as time expired Saturday to lift Duke over Clemson 16-13."

At the future Brooks Field.;)

[Bob Green]

The Miami Dolphins won Super Bowl VII 16-7. Would have been 16-0 is Garo hadn’t tried to throw a pass on a botched field goal attempt!

Your memory fails you Ozzie, Miami won 14 - 7. Jets won Super Bowl III 16 - 7.

[Bob Green]

Back to today’s game:

https://richmond.com/sports/college/virginia-tech/virginia-tech-remembers-last-years-smackdown-by-duke/article_900a9468-8f4a-5a56-b579-e7f29f1a0f9b.html

Coach Fuente advised his players don’t make this year about last year.

Still a lot of unknowns about who is available to play and coach for the Hokies.

[Bob Green]

Virginia Tech did not commit a turnover last week. They have only gone back to back weeks without a turnover once in last two years:

https://roanoke.com/sports/college/va_tech/2020-game-day-preview-virginia-tech-vs-duke/article_4d9fa07c-052c-11eb-b70b-bfcd0c8d7ff1.html

Duke must win the turnover battle today!

[chrishoke]

Game day! Despite our poor start to the season and our miserable winless record it's killing me that I can't be in Wallace Wade today to support my Devils. Hope springs eternal in my Duke Blue soul. Bring it on Hokies. Lets go Devils! Kick butt today.

[peloton]

Game day! Despite our poor start to the season and our miserable winless record it's killing me that I can't be in Wallace Wade today to support my Devils. Hope springs eternal in my Duke Blue soul. Bring it on Hokies. Lets go Devils! Kick butt today.

To hell with the Hokies! Let's go Duke!

[PDDuke85]

I wonder how often Canadian Football League games end 1-0.

Don forget abooot a rouge, eh.

[chrishoke]

Chronicle Sports
@chroniclesports
Duke's opponent, Virginia Tech, will be without 21 players and two full-time coaches this afternoon.

[-jk]

DBR Chat (http://forums.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/misc.php?do=cchatbox) is open!

If it gets a bit slow, refresh the page. If you're on a mobile device, you'll need to select "Blue" at the bottom.

If it's running too fast for you, you can always check out the chat archive (https://forums.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/misc.php?do=ccarc) to catch up.

As always - please follow the DBR Posting Guidelines.

Let's Go Duke!

-jk

[arnie]

Heck of a punt - our best weapon?

[chrishoke]

Right now I'd rather be lucky than good.

[arnie]

Right now I'd rather be lucky than good.

You have your wish.

[Acymetric]

Keys to the game:

1) Special teams touchdowns

2) There are no second or third keys

3) The first key again

[SavDukeGrad]

Inexcusable penalty. Even if the QB did sell it.

[SavDukeGrad]

And the roughing the QB penalty leads to a touchdown.

[LegoBatman]

Not quite clear what happened from the ESPN play by play. It says returned for a TD, fumbled, recovered for a TD.

I assume we punted into the end zone, they fumbled, and we recovered for a TD?
Or did they actually return the punt for a TD but end up fumbling and we recovered and ran the length of the field to score?

[arnie]

Not quite clear what happened from the ESPN play by play. It says returned for a TD, fumbled, recovered for a TD.

I assume we punted into the end zone, they fumbled, and we recovered for a TD?
Or did they actually return the punt for a TD but end up fumbling and we recovered and ran the length of the field to score?

Great long punt, VT returner dropped it while backpedaling, ball got kicked backwards couple of times and we picked up on the VT goal line.

[SavDukeGrad]

Great long punt, VT returner dropped it while backpedaling, ball got kicked backwards couple of times and we picked up on the VT goal line.

Best play of the season!

And since then, our penalties have bailed them out.

[YmoBeThere]

More or less sloppy than last week?

[SavDukeGrad]

More or less sloppy than last week?

Can’t say yet. But a roughing the passer call on 3rd and long when their QB had run out of bounds directly led to their TD.

[YmoBeThere]

Can’t say yet. But a roughing the passer call on 3rd and long when their QB had run out of bounds directly led to their TD.

Plus two other penalties and the interception all in the 1st quarter.

[arnie]

Can’t say yet. But a roughing the passer call on 3rd and long when their QB had run out of bounds directly led to their TD.

D is keeping us in the game, but unless we get many more breaks, don’t see us getting to 20 points. Afraid the D will wear down again.

[SavDukeGrad]

D is keeping us in the game, but unless we get many more breaks, don’t see us getting to 20 points. Afraid the D will wear down again.

Yes the D has looked good so far, except for the penalties.

[Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15]

Wait.

Just catching up here. Are we losing to a team that is missing 21 players?

[UrinalCake]

Why is this game even being played? VT has 21 players who are COVID positive - what are the odds that none of the players on the field also have the virus?

[chrishoke]

Wait.

Just catching up here. Are we losing to a team that is missing 21 players?

Go back to your quilting. VPI was missing 21 players last week and clobbered NC State. But yes, our offense is monumentally bad!

[Bob Green]

We had 91 yards offense in 1st half. That must improve in 2nd half. Virginia Tech gets the ball to start 2nd half, our D needs to shut them down to set the tone.

[peteandpete]

Chase can't move. Put one of the other guys in. We can't use the whole playbook with him. Some weak situational play calls, Coach. Stupid roughing penalty. And how many times is Chris going to jump off sides (what's the over/under for the season)? Derrick also.

[SavDukeGrad]

Unfortunately, our offense seems like it has regressed each week. And Chase seems to have lost all his confidence.

Defense playing well, except for the stupid penalties. D did a good job holding VT to that field goal when they had 1st and goal.

But the offense needs to move the ball so the defense gets a break and doesn’t get gassed in the 4th. Again.

[rsvman]

The special teams giveth and the special teams taketh away.......

[heyman25]

Just tuned in and see Brice can't make easy plays.

[chrishoke]

Just tuned in and see Brice can't make easy plays.

Brice has been just awful. He is regressing.

[richmclean]

All of a sudden we’re in Twilight Zone, 8 is a real QB and we march and score on a TD pass to gray.

Go Duke.

[rsvman]

This is just a bad football team. That is all.

[SavDukeGrad]

Folks, for as many things as we have done wrong this game, we are only 3 points down. Now, if our defense isn’t too gassed...

[PDDuke85]

Brice has been just awful. He is regressing.

Despite the last drive, I want to publicly apologize to Quintin Harris for last season’s rants

[YmoBeThere]

We still have life in this game...

[arnie]

We still have life in this game...

Yep and the fans in the end zone are gonna stay till the end😀

[SamHouston]

Wow. I hope the team reads this stuff. This Duke team does not play smart enough or hard enough to win. The KO Return coverage, unbelievable. I love Duke. I love Duke Sports. I just did not see more that three or four winning plays today. Play hard to the whistle on every play. No more posturing after an average play.

[bundabergdevil]

There's the break we need (hopefully).

[SamHouston]

Yes. Way too slow. Clemson had stars at every position so he was perceived as OK. I cant understand why Duke doesn't have a QB.

[Bob Green]

We have a chance to pull this out.

[Bob Green]

And we promptly go 3 and out.

[bundabergdevil]

Welp

[PDDuke85]

And we promptly go 3 and out.

Going out on a limb but I suspect Coach Cut will say this is 100% on him

[Devilwin]

I had hopes for this year,,no longer.

[heyman25]

Brice is really not clutch.No decent plays. Wretched but better than last game.

[heyman25]

Going out on a limb but I suspect Coach Cut will say this is 100% on him

Cutcliffe got them better but not enough to win a game .

[duke09hms]

UVA, Pitt, VT now 17-1 against Cut the last 6 years.
UNC, GT, WF toss-ups now with coaching upgrades.
The days of aiming for 3 wins in the weakest Power 5 division now seem to be a stretch.
Evolve or die, Cut.

[devildeac]

Well, we won the turnover battle today but lost the penalty battle and the ToP stat and the total yardage stat and only lost by 7. Progress!!

[SavDukeGrad]

The TD we gave up in the first half, when we gave them new life with a roughing the passer call after we had their drive stopped, ends up being the winning margin.

[duke09hms]

Well, we won the turnover battle today but lost the penalty battle and the ToP stat and the total yardage stat and only lost by 7. Progress!!

Yay we only lost by 7 against a team without 21 players!

[rsvman]

The TD we gave up in the first half, when we gave them new life with a roughing the passer call after we had their drive stopped, ends up being the winning margin.

Not to mention the 85-ish yard kickoff return we gave that put them in scoring position. Honestly it looked like he should have been tackled after about 5-10 yards; there were a lot of players around him, but none of them was in a good enough position to actually make a play.

[richmclean]

UVA, Pitt, VT now 17-1 against Cut the last 6 years.
UNC, GT, WF toss-ups now with coaching upgrades.
The days of aiming for 3 wins in the weakest Power 5 division now seem to be a stretch.
Evolve or die, Cut.

It’s 16-2 but carry on...

Strike anyone else as Bush league to kick the FG at the end? Kicking team need the practice more than the O?

[SamHouston]

UVA, Pitt, VT now 17-1 against Cut the last 6 years.
UNC, GT, WF toss-ups now with coaching upgrades.
The days of aiming for 3 wins in the weakest Power 5 division now seem to be a stretch.
Evolve or die, Cut.

My gut tells me this will be Cut's last year. Kevin White can work with the new anointed AD. As much as I love Cut, at this stage of his career, he is more QB whisperer. Need young, vibrant, creative energy of the highest order to compete. The entire college sports landscape resets post Covid. Perfect time to transition.

[4Gen]

Coach Cut brought Duke football back from the brink of extinction and he did that admirably. I think even he knows that at his station in life he cannot now raise Duke up to championship level football. I have been guilty over the decades of thinking Duke football is what it is and that is mediocrity. But, the Duke brand is known and respected world wide at every level. I now believe that Duke athletics has every resource necessary to field championship football and a coaching change is a necessary step, with much thanks to Cut for a job well done.

[SavDukeGrad]

Not to mention the 85-ish yard kickoff return we gave that put them in scoring position. Honestly it looked like he should have been tackled after about 5-10 yards; there were a lot of players around him, but none of them was in a good enough position to actually make a play.

Yes, that definitely swung the momentum back to them when we had finally gained some. Clean up either of those 2 plays, and there could have been a different outcome.

[sagegrouse]

And we promptly go 3 and out.

This when I was able to tune in. Had high hopes, but... ugh!

[LegoBatman]

I kept checking the score at the most inopportune moments: hit refresh, see we've scored again, and get excited/hopeful only to have the page immediately refresh with another VT touchdown.

[peloton]

This game as others this season was most discouraging in that if we don't commit some very inopportune penalties and momentum swings back our way, who knows what the final outcome would have been? Of course, missed tackles on kickoffs and running plays from the line of scrimmage when the defense is gassed certainly doesn't help our cause either. I won't comment on the offense, I'm too frustrated. I agree though...it's pretty depressing when you realize we lost to a team that has a good number of players unavailable right now.

We could've...should've - not sure about would've though...sigh.

[killerleft]

The TD we gave up in the first half, when we gave them new life with a roughing the passer call after we had their drive stopped, ends up being the winning margin.

Hard to put into words how deflated I felt when our guy did that... but it was the defining play of the game from our point of view. The touchdown that followed seemed inevitable.

And still we had our chances...

[SamHouston]

Coach Cut brought Duke football back from the brink of extinction and he did that admirably. I think even he knows that at his station in life he cannot now raise Duke up to championship level football. I have been guilty over the decades of thinking Duke football is what it is and that is mediocrity. But, the Duke brand is known and respected world wide at every level. I now believe that Duke athletics has every resource necessary to field championship football and a coaching change is a necessary step, with much thanks to Cut for a job well done.

Spot on. Perfect time for a reset following Covid 19. Duke Football needs youth, vigor, boundless energy and creative leadership. I love Cut. A change is merited.

[devilirium]

VT played 36 players if the participation report is correct. For Cut to state that he was on an 0-5 Tennessee team that went 11-0 really speaks to the notion that he had thoughts of conceding this game well before it tipped off. And apparently next week’s as well as we are just 0-4. Duke Football is akin to a big boulder that requires constant exertion. I’ll always remember 2013-2015, the 3 bowl wins, etc—much to admire there. However, the large ACC slate exposes Cut’s fundamental weaknesses in losing nearly twice as many ACC games as his teams have won—predictable playcalling, lackluster recruiting, excuse making—it all comes home to roost at some point.

[killerleft]

VT played 36 players if the participation report is correct. For Cut to state that he was on an 0-5 Tennessee team that went 11-0 really speaks to the notion that he had thoughts of conceding this game well before it tipped off. And apparently next week’s as well as we are just 0-4. Duke Football is akin to a big boulder that requires constant exertion. I’ll always remember 2013-2015, the 3 bowl wins, etc—much to admire there. However, the large ACC slate exposes Cut’s fundamental weaknesses in losing nearly twice as many ACC games as his teams have won—predictable playcalling, lackluster recruiting, excuse making—it all comes home to roost at some point.

There has always been little margin for error, even in our best Cut years. We just don't match up physically to most opponents. But excuses? I've always thought that Cutcliffe has made remarkably few, even when there was low-hanging fruit available. His comments seem upbeat to me.

Concluding from his postgame comments that he was conceding any future chances of victory is a real stretch. We've got enough issues without conjuring some out of thin air.

[Bob Green]

Jim Sumner recap on front page:

https://www.dukebasketballreport.com/2020/10/3/21500482/duke-falls-to-virginia-tech-now-0-4

There are some positive takeaways from the game:

1. 319 yards offense in 2nd half
2. Jarret Garner with 3 catches for 84 yards
3. Running game started clicking in 2nd half
4. Long TD drives - 86 and 75 yards

The not so positives are stupid penalties and Chase Brice being sacked seven times. He was constantly under blind side pressure. Left tackle performance was abysmal.

[jv001]

Jim Sumner recap on front page:

https://www.dukebasketballreport.com/2020/10/3/21500482/duke-falls-to-virginia-tech-now-0-4

There are some positive takeaways from the game:

1. 319 yards offense in 2nd half
2. Jarret Garner with 3 catches for 84 yards
3. Running game started clicking in 2nd half
4. Long TD drives - 86 and 75 yards

The not so positives are stupid penalties and Chase Brice being sacked seven times. He was constantly under blind side pressure. Left tackle performance was abysmal.

In the Chronicle report, Brice commented on the sacks. He said when Duke was in an empty backfield, there wasn't a running back to help with the protection. He also commented on VT's tight coverage on Duke's receivers. That VT secondary was without 3 of it's starters. Does that say something about our receivers not getting separation?

GoDuke!

[budwom]

Our OL should be blocking better than they are.

I'd like to see Cut and White work on a succession plan, sooner rather than later...no, Cut won't be fired, but it's not at all clear how we extricate ourselves from our current status.

[SamHouston]

Our OL should be blocking better than they are.

I'd like to see Cut and White work on a succession plan, sooner rather than later...no, Cut won't be fired, but it's not at all clear how we extricate ourselves from our current status.

Perfect word choice. Perfect time.

[TheDevilMadeMeDoIt]

A night of sleep allows better reflection. This same VT teams slaughtered State. The second half was our best offensive half this season. Turnovers were not as costly. Did our team actually spend less time back at campus this summer? If so, maybe we’re just now catching up. I refuse to quit on this team. We should talk about Coach after the season. After all it is 2020!!!

[sagegrouse]

A night of sleep allows better reflection. This same VT teams slaughtered State. The second half was our best offensive half this season. Turnovers were not as costly. Did our team actually spend less time back at campus this summer? If so, maybe we’re just now catching up. I refuse to quit on this team. We should talk about Coach after the season. After all it is 2020!!!

I feel bad for the team. They have been competitive in every game. Chase Brice seems to be coming around. I don't especially worry about the sacks -- weren't many of them at the end of the game, when we were pressing to score?

[arnie]

A night of sleep allows better reflection. This same VT teams slaughtered State. The second half was our best offensive half this season. Turnovers were not as costly. Did our team actually spend less time back at campus this summer? If so, maybe we’re just now catching up. I refuse to quit on this team. We should talk about Coach after the season. After all it is 2020!!!

Next Saturday’s game could better define this team as Syracuse isn’t very good and our talent level should be comparable. Our O played better yesterday so maybe this can be a W. For me, it’s a “no excuse” opportunity - if we’re ACC competitive we win the game.

[CameronBornAndBred]

Jim Sumner recap on front page:

https://www.dukebasketballreport.com/2020/10/3/21500482/duke-falls-to-virginia-tech-now-0-4

There are some positive takeaways from the game:

1. 319 yards offense in 2nd half
2. Jarret Garner with 3 catches for 84 yards
3. Running game started clicking in 2nd half
4. Long TD drives - 86 and 75 yards

The not so positives are stupid penalties and Chase Brice being sacked seven times. He was constantly under blind side pressure. Left tackle performance was abysmal.

I bet that stat is pretty deceptive since our best drives came in the latter half of the 4th quarter when the game was essentially over.

[jimsumner]

I bet that stat is pretty deceptive since our best drives came in the latter half of the 4th quarter when the game was essentially over.

Those long drives made the score 24-21 and 31-28 respectively. And neither came in the latter half of the fourth quarter.

[Papa John]

Spot on. Perfect time for a reset following Covid 19. Duke Football needs youth, vigor, boundless energy and creative leadership. I love Cut. A change is merited.

... you need to find someone who is looking at the Duke program as a long-term gig rather than as a stepping stone. Cut had just departed ND (due to health issues) prior to landing at Duke, and—clearly understanding that he was in the twilight of his career—viewed it as a long-term opportunity to build up a once-proud program that had been mired in the trash-heap of D1 football for far too long before riding off into the sunset. My guess is that he'd happily ride off into the sunset if (1) he felt his job of building up the program felt largely accomplished and [and I can't emphasize this second one enough] (2) he felt that there was someone he could hand the reigns to who was young, accomplished, and dedicated to the Duke program for the long haul. Whether folks care to admit it or not, he's built something at Duke (sure, it's not as consistently successful as we'd all like it to be) and doesn't want to see it come crashing down under a series of coaches merely seeking a platform for the next gig. It's a good bet that's ultimately where we'll land once he decides to retire, but I'm personally happy to let him ride it out on his own terms. He's a good coach.

[CameronBornAndBred]

Those long drives made the score 24-21 and 31-28 respectively. And neither came in the latter half of the fourth quarter.

Might be wrong then, but looking at the stats on GoDuke it said we had 68 rushing yards and 137 passing yards in the 4th, for a total of 205, which is 2/3rds of the second half output.

Either way, that game was disappointing.

[jimsumner]

... you need to find someone who is looking at the Duke program as a long-term gig rather than as a stepping stone. Cut had just departed ND (due to health issues) prior to landing at Duke, and—clearly understanding that he was in the twilight of his career—viewed it as a long-term opportunity to build up a once-proud program that had been mired in the trash-heap of D1 football for far too long before riding off into the sunset. My guess is that he'd happily ride off into the sunset if (1) he felt his job of building up the program felt largely accomplished and [and I can't emphasize this second one enough] (2) he felt that there was someone he could hand the reigns to who was young, accomplished, and dedicated to the Duke program for the long haul. Whether folks care to admit it or not, he's built something at Duke (sure, it's not as consistently successful as we'd all like it to be) and doesn't want to see it come crashing down under a series of coaches merely seeking a platform for the next gig. It's a good bet that's ultimately where we'll land once he decides to retire, but I'm personally happy to let him ride it out on his own terms. He's a good coach.

A few years ago Duke alum Scottie Montgomery was viewed as a possible long-term replacement when Cut retired. But his tenure at ECU was an unmitigated disaster.

Matt Guerrieri is viewed as a future head coach. But he's barely in his 30s and has never been a head coach.

I understand the desire for a long-term, non-stepping-stone answer and there may well be someone out there who fits the bill.

But there will always be some structural impediments to making Duke a consistent football power. Duke is an academically-elite private school, which limits the recruit pool. And it's also a school with a small student body and a small, geographically-dispersed alumni base. Duke only fills Wade if the opponent brings half the fans. And Duke will always be surrounded by two large, state-supported universities who are going to get a disproportionate amount of media attention and casual fan interest in the Triangle.

This applies to all Duke sports of course. But basketball, golf, lacrosse, baseball, et. al. don't have stadiums that seat 35,000 people or rosters that hit triple figures. Any veteran coach who comes to Duke is going to have some baggage or else they wouldn't be on the market and any young up-and-comer who comes to Duke and succeeds is going to be in demand by schools that don't have those impediments and who are willing to pay more and go all-out in the facilities wars.

[Acymetric]

I understand the desire for a long-term, non-stepping-stone answer and there may well be someone out there who fits the bill.

I understand why people would want this, but I don't understand why people seem to think we need it.

[budwom]

I understand why people would want this, but I don't understand why people seem to think we need it.

yup, we should recognize who we are, we aren't Alabama or Ohio State. Spurrier used us as a stepping stone (absolutely fine by me) and that was a good experience. Our problem thereafter is we couldn't afford to pay anyone (we got Spurrier for a relative song, he wasn't a super hot prospect back then).

[CameronBlue]

Might be wrong then, but looking at the stats on GoDuke it said we had 68 rushing yards and 137 passing yards in the 4th, for a total of 205, which is 2/3rds of the second half output.

Either way, that game was disappointing.

Further they came in the 2nd half and late enough in the game when depth, or lack thereof tends to reveal itself. Duke ran up 319 yards of Total O in the 2nd half against a team short 21 players? Meh.

[jimsumner]

Further they came in the 2nd half and late enough in the game when depth, or lack thereof tends to reveal itself. Duke ran up 319 yards of Total O in the 2nd half against a team short 21 players? Meh.

Move the goal-posts much?

[CameronBlue]

Move the goal-posts much?

My first post in this thread. One week is not like the next. Show me a team that doesn't repeat the same mistakes week to week but rather learns from them and you'll see the devotion of a fan and alumni who has followed Duke since his much older sister matriculated in 19 frickin 64. In my last post about DFB I commented about lack of awareness of game situations and why I thought that reflected upon the Coach. Recognize anything similar about Shelton's RtP call in the first half? No need to move the goal-posts when they are exactly in the same place they were the week prior.

[jimsumner]

My first post in this thread. One week is not like the next. Show me a team that doesn't repeat the same mistakes week to week but rather learns from them and you'll see the devotion of a fan and alumni who has followed Duke since his much older sister matriculated in 19 frickin 64. In my last post about DFB I commented about lack of awareness of game situations and why I thought that reflected upon the Coach. Recognize anything similar about Shelton's RtP call in the first half? No need to move the goal-posts when they are exactly in the same place they were the week prior.

Sorry. I conflated an earlier post from Cameronbornandbred and CameronBlue. Mea culpa.

But Duke's offense actually did not repeat the same mistakes. Duke committed only one turnover against VT, which isn't repeating the same mistakes. Duke is hitting some explosives, much more so than earlier in the season.

The big mistakes from yesterday, IMO, were the penalties, some sloppy (fatigue-created, IMO) tackling and the inability of the offense to stay on the field in the first half, which led directly to the defensive fatigue in the second half.

Duke has had a chance to win each of its first four games well into the fourth quarter. Anyone who's been following Duke football since 1964 has seen many Duke teams that weren't competitive in most of their games. In a way, this is what makes it more frustrating than getting blown out. A handful of plays here and there and those losses become wins. There is a coach-speak cliche that the other team made more plays than we did. Pretty self-evident. The trick is figuring out why that is happening. Talent? Schemes? Effort? Depth? Cohesion? Something else?

I've seen enough bad stuff this season to share everyone's disappointment in the 0-4 start. But I've also seen enough good stuff to see reasons for optimism that I rarely if ever saw during most of the Goldsmith (post-'94), Franks and Roof teams.

[CameronBlue]

Sorry. I conflated an earlier post from Cameronbornandbred and CameronBlue. Mea culpa.

But Duke's offense actually did not repeat the same mistakes. Duke committed only one turnover against VT, which isn't repeating the same mistakes. Duke is hitting some explosives, much more so than earlier in the season.

The big mistakes from yesterday, IMO, were the penalties, some sloppy (fatigue-created, IMO) tackling and the inability of the offense to stay on the field in the first half, which led directly to the defensive fatigue in the second half.

Duke has had a chance to win each of its first four games well into the fourth quarter. Anyone who's been following Duke football since 1964 has seen many Duke teams that weren't competitive in most of their games. In a way, this is what makes it more frustrating than getting blown out. A handful of plays here and there and those losses become wins. There is a coach-speak cliche that the other team made more plays than we did. Pretty self-evident. The trick is figuring out why that is happening. Talent? Schemes? Effort? Depth? Cohesion? Something else?

I've seen enough bad stuff this season to share everyone's disappointment in the 0-4 start. But I've also seen enough good stuff to see reasons for optimism that I rarely if ever saw during most of the Goldsmith (post-'94), Franks and Roof teams.

Good post. Sent you a PM. LGD!

[6th Man]

I've seen enough bad stuff this season to share everyone's disappointment in the 0-4 start. But I've also seen enough good stuff to see reasons for optimism that I rarely if ever saw during most of the Goldsmith (post-'94), Franks and Roof teams.

Well said...I have followed Duke football since the early 80’s...remember Ben Bennett playing QB anyway. Despite this 0-4 start, I agree that it is nothing like the era you referenced. Those games were over before kickoff.

I’ve been lurking and reading the posts as I have been a HUGE Cutcliffe fan and marveled at the difference he made upon his arrival at Duke. Along with his arrival Duke did make a much bigger commitment to playing competitive football. Something Goldsmith, Franks and Roof did not have, but they also didn’t seem to be made of the same ilk as Coach Cut.

I’ve been hugely conflicted on my feelings as to whether or not it is time for Duke to make a move as I know we have been trending downwards over the last couple of seasons. This one appears to be even worse to this point. I know Cut gets a big salary and along with that salary are expectations of winning ACC football games. On the other hand, with all of the chaos and uncertainty surrounding COVID, it feels like Cut deserves better than to be let go (“retired”) during one of the most bizarre times in our history. I know other schools and coaches are navigating the same waters, but it just feels like we are lucky to even be watching college football this season. I find myself in the camp of letting some semblance of normalcy in our world occur and then see if Cut can right the ship. I know he made me excited about Duke football and hope he can do it again.

[jimsumner]

Well said...I have followed Duke football since the early 80’s...remember Ben Bennett playing QB anyway. Despite this 0-4 start, I agree that it is nothing like the era you referenced. Those games were over before kickoff.

I’ve been lurking and reading the posts as I have been a HUGE Cutcliffe fan and marveled at the difference he made upon his arrival at Duke. Along with his arrival Duke did make a much bigger commitment to playing competitive football. Something Goldsmith, Franks and Roof did not have, but they also didn’t seem to be made of the same ilk as Coach Cut.

.


There's a direct correlation between Duke committing more resources to football and Cutcliffe becoming coach. There were a number of high-rollers who told Duke they were sitting on money that they would commit if and only if Duke demonstrated a willingness to compete at the highest level.

Hiring Cut demonstrated that and the spigots opened. Yes, the Yoh Building was finished before Cut showed up but everyone knew it had to be the beginning of an infrastructure upgrade not the end.

And of course Cut only accepted the job offer after being assured that these upgrades were going to happen. Being able to practice inside on a full-length field when it's raining actually is a big deal.

Don't get me wrong. I hope Duke never goes down the Clemson road of turning the football building into a luxury playground. But Duke had fallen so far behind the rest of the ACC in facilities that it was laughable.

[4Gen]

But there will always be some structural impediments to making Duke a consistent football power. Duke is an academically-elite private school, which limits the recruit pool.

So you're a kid with a 3.5 GPA and a 1250 on the SAT, and you wanna go to Duke. It's just not happening, my brother. You have no shot. On top of that, if you do get in (and you absolutely will not with those credentials), it'll cost your parents about $60K a year.

But if you happen to play football at a high level and you have those credentials, you probably will get in, and it won't cost your parents a dime.

And this, my friends, is why Duke can and should be able to recruit 20 or so damn good football players a year. Just getting admitted is such a rare rare privilege for any applicant. Who gets admitted to Stanford, Duke, Harvard, Princeton? The cream of the crop. Selling this to those twenty kids (and especially their parents) should be so easy it's nearly criminal.

[jimsumner]

So you're a kid with a 3.5 GPA and a 1250 on the SAT, and you wanna go to Duke. It's just not happening, my brother. You have no shot. On top of that, if you do get in (and you absolutely will not with those credentials), it'll cost your parents about $60K a year.

But if you happen to play football at a high level and you have those credentials, you probably will get in, and it won't cost your parents a dime.

And this, my friends, is why Duke can and should be able to recruit 20 or so damn good football players a year. Just getting admitted is such a rare rare privilege for any applicant. Who gets admitted to Stanford, Duke, Harvard, Princeton? The cream of the crop. Selling this to those twenty kids (and especially their parents) should be so easy it's nearly criminal.

If it's so easy than why have none of Stanford, Northwestern, Rice or Vanderbilt been able to sustain long-term football success? Those types of recruits can go to a school like Michigan or Florida or Texas and get a first-rate education, play in front of much bigger crowds, surrounded by a host of talented teammates who cannot get into elite private schools but end up on NFL rosters.

Notre Dame is the only private school able to maintain a place in the college-football-elite over a long time span and Notre Dame has advantages other private schools don't have. Your belief that this should be "so easy" flies in the face of decades of evidence to the contrary.

[OZZIE4DUKE]

deleted
Jim, not commenting on your comments but a more general observation/question. I expect that with Chase Brice's performance in the 2nd half, he's earned the right to start Saturday's game vs. Syracuse. But when (which week, if not this week) would you, if you were the head coach, give either Gunnar or Chris (or Luca!) an opportunity to run the team while there's still a chance to win the game if Chase doesn't get it done? Maybe Chase has truly turned the corner and will lead us to victory this week and nothing would make me happier! Well, that's not true. I'd like to win a big lottery jackpot this week and that would make me happier :rolleyes:http://www.crazietalk.net/ourhouse/images/smilies/devil9f.gif

[jimsumner]

Jim, not commenting on your comments but a more general observation/question. I expect that with Chase Brice's performance in the 2nd half, he's earned the right to start Saturday's game vs. Syracuse. But when (which week, if not this week) would you, if you were the head coach, give either Gunnar or Chris (or Luca!) an opportunity to run the team while there's still a chance to win the game if Chase doesn't get it done? Maybe Chase has truly turned the corner and will lead us to victory this week and nothing would make me happier! Well, that's not true. I'd like to win a big lottery jackpot this week and that would make me happier :rolleyes:http://www.crazietalk.net/ourhouse/images/smilies/devil9f.gif

Duke (maybe) has a week off after this Saturday. If Duke is going to shake up the lineup--note the qualifier-that would be the time to do it, IMO. Extra practice time and all that. But I get the very strong impression that Cut feels like he's made a sizable investment in Brice that will pay off eventually.

[SamHouston]

So you're a kid with a 3.5 GPA and a 1250 on the SAT, and you wanna go to Duke. It's just not happening, my brother. You have no shot. On top of that, if you do get in (and you absolutely will not with those credentials), it'll cost your parents about $60K a year.

But if you happen to play football at a high level and you have those credentials, you probably will get in, and it won't cost your parents a dime.

And this, my friends, is why Duke can and should be able to recruit 20 or so damn good football players a year. Just getting admitted is such a rare rare privilege for any applicant. Who gets admitted to Stanford, Duke, Harvard, Princeton? The cream of the crop. Selling this to those twenty kids (and especially their parents) should be so easy it's nearly criminal.

With the exception of the top ten football powers, every school is recruiting the smart players from the good families because they are (generally) low risk and low maintenance. Let's be honest, playing FB at Duke and doing well in the classroom requires a hell of a lot of work. A hell of a lot of work. It is easier at, for example, Florida. Additionally, just because your parents and my parents had vision, not all parents are on-board with making a forty year decision. Another factor is travel distance. If a kid from Texas wants to play FB at Duke, can his parents get in the car and drive to see him play? I think this is a huge factor. This is one reason so many kids from metro Atlanta are on the Duke roster year after year under coach Cut.

[arnie]

Duke (maybe) has a week off after this Saturday. If Duke is going to shake up the lineup--note the qualifier-that would be the time to do it, IMO. Extra practice time and all that. But I get the very strong impression that Cut feels like he's made a sizable investment in Brice that will pay off eventually.

Actually, I believe we play the Pack the Saturday after Syracuse and then the open date. We’re 2.5 pt favorites against Syracuse🤔

[jimsumner]

Actually, I believe we play the Pack the Saturday after Syracuse and then the open date. We’re 2.5 pt favorites against Syracuse🤔

Correct. Brain fog.