MBB: Duke v Michigan St (Tue, 12/3, 9:30pm, ESPN) Pre-Game and In-Game Thread

[JBDuke]

The Blue Devils draw Sparty in the ACC-Big Ten Challenge this year. The game will be at 9:30 pm EST on ESPN.

[scottdude8]

Biggest key to the game (that will likely go under the radar), IMHO: who does Xavier Tillman guard? Michigan State is young and unproven in the paint after him, and even Tillman is a bit undersized to guard a guy of Vernon’s stature. Whomever Tillman doesn’t guard will have an exploitable matchup all game (especially if that’s Vernon). Whoever Tillman does guard has the chance to attack him and possibly get him in foul trouble, and Izzo has already shown this year that he will stick to the 2 fouls and you’re out policy in the first half (see Cassius Winston vs. Va Tech).

Tillman leads MSU with 10 boards a game. No one else averages more than 4. Taking Tillman away from the glass by getting him in foul trouble (Carey) or drawing him away from the basket (Hurt) could open up a ton of opportunities on the offensive glass. I hope this is a BIG part of the game plan.

People are going to be down on this team after this week, and rightfully so. But MSU isn’t looking so hot themselves: Maui showed that this team is lost without Winston, and even with him there isn’t anyone who can consistently create their own offense besides Winston (which is why the Langford injury was so debilitating). I think we’re the more talented team, but we’ll have to come out firing from the start to prevent them from feeding off of home court. The matchups exist, especially down low, to do that though.

[jv001]

If Joey Baker can shoot well in a hostile environment like Michigan State, it should do wonders for his confidence going forward. This is a big game and I think our guys will step up. I hope to see Wendell get back on track because he was almost invisible tonight. His lack of a consistent outside shot hurts him. Teams can play off him to try and stop his drives to the basket. He then becomes a black hole along with White, Goldwire, and Javin. Speaking of Javin, I thought he played better tonight and I hope he can build off that effort. However he did make me laugh on one play where he fumbled the ball then ran into another Duke player and knocked him backward causing a turnover.

GoDuke!

[Saratoga2]

If Joey Baker can shoot well in a hostile environment like Michigan State, it should do wonders for his confidence going forward. This is a big game and I think our guys will step up. I hope to see Wendell get back on track because he was almost invisible tonight. His lack of a consistent outside shot hurts him. Teams can play off him to try and stop his drives to the basket. He then becomes a black hole along with White, Goldwire, and Javin. Speaking of Javin, I thought he played better tonight and I hope he can build off that effort. However he did make me laugh on one play where he fumbled the ball then ran into another Duke player and knocked him backward causing a turnover.

GoDuke!

Well, Javin, Jack, Jordan, Tre and AOC have all played against MSU but not perhaps in such a hostile place. maybe they can provide some stability.

[CDu]

This is not - at the moment at least - last year’s MSU team. They are not as experienced or as talented, at least not without Josh Langford. They still have a stud PG and some nice role players, but the floor is a good bit lower right now. Which is good, because we need all the help we can get at the moment.

They are a terrific offensive team thanks to their PG, to a low TO rate, and to a tenacious offensive rebounding group. They hit their free throws but have not their threes yet. They play a middling tempo and don’t force TOs, which in theory should play to our benefit relative to recent matchups. They are stout at challenging shots inside, with one of the highest block rates and one of the lowest 2pt fg% allowed in the country. It is another team built in Izzo’s image, so expect this to be an ugly game.

Centers: Xavier Tillman (6’8”, 245lb junior) is the starting center. Tillman is the quintessential Izzo big. He grinds and grinds. He isn’t superlatively athletic, but gets everything out of what he has. On offense, he is great at setting screens and making timely rolls/cuts to the rim. That makes him a great partner with their superstar PG. The majority of his FGs are assisted buckets at the rim. While he can shoot a little bit, it really isn’t a major part of his game. He also is absolutely tenacious on the glass. Defensively, he is more disruptive than game-changing. He is positionally alert, and very physical. He doesn’t get a lot of blocks or steals, but does a lot of pesky things that make post players uncomfortable. I would expect him to guard Carey a lot, and he will make things tough for Carey. Behind Tillman is Marcus Bingham (6’11”, 215lb sophomore). Bingham is long, lean, and a shot blocking machine. Like Tillman, Bingham can shoot it a little. But that isn’t what he does best. Bingham is an elite rebounder and shotblocker. He has the potential to be a game-changing interior threat on defense. Offensively, he relies on the PG to get him shots and complements that with putbacks. Bingham is still a bit green though, and has played sparingly mostly as a backup to Tillman.

Forwards: Thomas Kithier (6’8”, 225lb sophomore) is the starting PF. Like Tillman, Kithier appears to be yet another in the long line of Izzo grinders inside. Though he can shoot a bit, he does almost all of his work at the rim, and usually via an assist. Aside from that, it is a heavy dose of the little things. Just a classic dirty-work role player. Alongside Kithier is Aaron Henry (6’6”, 210lb sophomore). Henry is a physical specimen on the wing. Long arms and terrific athleticism to go along with a strong frame should have him on NBA radars. But he isn’t just an athlete; Henry is a very good shooter from 3 and FTs. Henry is a straight-line driver who finishes well at the rim. About the only knock I can see is that he takes to many 2pt jumpers. But overall he is a highly efficient scorer and one of few Spartans who can create for himself. Malik Hall (6’7”, 215lb freshman) is the first forward off the bench. Hall is a bit of a do-everything shooter, who hits shots at a high percentage all over the floor. He doesn’t create his own shot too much, but man does he hit shots when fed open looks.

Wings: I guess Henry qualifies here, though he is kind of a hybrid wing forward like Winslow was. The first wing off the bench is sixth man Gabe Brown (6’7”, 210lb sophomore). Brown is a lefty who can really shoot. He is also a sneaky offensive rebounder. But the majority of his work is as a catch-and-shoot wing. Can’t lose track of him. The other main wing off the bench is Kyle Ahrens (6’6”, 210lb redshirt senior). Ahrens is basically a poor man’s Joey Baker: a catch-and-shoot guy who brings little else to the table.

Guards: The Spartan world revolves around Cassius Winston (6’1”, 185lb senior). There aren’t enough superlatives about his game. He makes everything work for MSU. Winston is not athletic, but incredibly crafty. He just knows how to play. A terrific shooter from anywhere on the court, he also has an uncanny ability to create shots out of nothing either for himself or for others. He is especially devastating in the screen and roll game, which is one of the ways Tillman absolutely feasts. The ball is on a string and he is just a magician. Tre Jones and the entire defense will have their hands full. Alongside Winston is the other playmaker for the Spartans is Rocket Watts (6’2”, 185lb freshman). Watts, as his nickname suggests, I’d a terrific run/jump athlete. The kid can fly. Unfortunately for them, he doesn’t have nearly the feel for the game that Winston does. Where Winston gets the most out of his physical tools, Watts leaves a lot on the table. Despite being the second-worst shooter (min 1 attempt per game) he has taken comfortably the second most 3s. If you are gonna leave someone open from 3, he is the guy. Still, athletically he is a dangerous weapon.

[dukelifer]

Well, Javin, Jack, Jordan, Tre and AOC have all played against MSU but not perhaps in such a hostile place. maybe they can provide some stability.

In the end- these guys will need to be better for this Duke team to have success. By the eye test- Goldwire seems a much more confident and effective player this year. He is capable of giving Tre a breather- I think more than he has. He is not a 3 point shooter but he can apply pressure, get steals and layups, and get guys the ball. There is more and more evidence that Baker has the best shooting form from deep on the team. He is a tall kid and gets the shot off quickly. He clearly is not a defensive stopper but he can be a weapon. Always nice to have a zone buster. The player that needs to get going is a AOC. I hope it is just a slump- but he has not had a good stretch of games. Duke needs him to be much better. Maybe with Stanley out he will find his mojo. He is a key.

[DavidBenAkiva]

Rob Dauster of NBC Sports has an interesting YouTube channel this year and did a breakdown of what is ailing Michigan State so far this season. It's worth a watch. Duaster makes the point that the bigs for MSU aren't shooting the ball well enough for the team to play up to its potential. Kenny Goins was a good shooter that made enough shots and passed the ball enough to make it all work for the Spartans last year. They haven't found that guy this season.

Malik Hall is probably the best option in the long run, but he's a year away at best. Hall has hit 4 of 8 3's on the season, 3 of which he sank in one half against Seton Hall. Thomas Kithier, Xavier Tillman, and Marcus Bingham have not shot well or taken many shots.

In the frontcourt, Rocket Watts has been abysmal on offense. If he is on the court for long stretches with 2 bigs, the Spartans are essentially playing with 2 shooters at most.

The team relies heavily on Winston, getting the ball to the hoop with Tillman or the other bigs, and the wings, sophomores Aaron Henry and Gabe Brown. Henry has been pretty good and will probably be the best player on their team next season. Brown has been a bit up and down. Containing them if Duke elects to double Winston will be one of the key challenges for the game. I would have felt better about that if Cassius Stanley was available. Alas, he will not play for the next few weeks.

Hopefully, Duke can get good minutes from Alex O'Connell and Joey Baker in this one. I expect to see a lot of Jordan Goldwire as he and Tre Jones can disrupt the offense of MSU, especially when Rocket Watts is on the court. Duke lost the effectiveness of its press the last week. Regaining it will go a long way, as will knocking down shots.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ArOqE5ftXxo

[jipops]

9:30pm start times are just gross (yes I realize that is a more palatable 8:30 time for the Central folks). I’ll be watching the replay the next day.

[Bluedog]

I'll be driving during the game. Anybody know a good way to listen to the audio/radio? I checked ESPN radio's schedule and it doesn't list the game. I'll be in the Midwest (mostly Indiana) so hoping I can find it playing somewhere or else stream the audio.

If I stream 99.9 the fan, do they actually broadcast the Duke game via internet?

[Sluggo]

I'll be driving during the game. Anybody know a good way to listen to the audio/radio? I checked ESPN radio's schedule and it doesn't list the game. I'll be in the Midwest (mostly Indiana) so hoping I can find it playing somewhere or else stream the audio.

If I stream 99.9 the fan, do they actually broadcast the Duke game via internet?

If you don’t find a radio station, you could stream the game from ESPN or YouTube and just listen to the audio and keep your eyes on the road.

[OldPhiKap]

9:30pm start times are just gross (yes I realize that is a more palatable 8:30 time for the Central folks). I’ll be watching the replay the next day.

Yup. Me too.

[hallcity]

I'll be driving during the game. Anybody know a good way to listen to the audio/radio? I checked ESPN radio's schedule and it doesn't list the game. I'll be in the Midwest (mostly Indiana) so hoping I can find it playing somewhere or else stream the audio.

If I stream 99.9 the fan, do they actually broadcast the Duke game via internet?

You can get the broadcasts via WDNC on the radio.net app.

[DukieInBrasil]

I wouldn't be surprised to see J-Bake get the start vs MSU, and to see J-Gold back in the starting lineup. Losing Cassius changes things for Duke, and one of the things that really took a dive with Wendell in the starting lineup was the defense. It's hard to say how much, if any, of that is on him individually or if other teams just figured out how to attack the Duke defense. J-Gold really gives Duke the chance to pester the opponent's backcourt, which Duke did so well vs. Kansas and in the second half vs Winthrop. It's hard to quantify how much J-Gold helps Tre by giving him some time away from the ball, but that also seems to be a big benefit.
Joey's shooting is a weapon that Duke needs, particularly if J-Gold plays more now that Cassius is out. It'd be great if he can also use his size to get some rebounds and/or continue to do sneaky things on the weak side defense. He hasn't really shown much knack for the former, but has picked up some charges and steals in the latter.

[fuse]

I’d advocate the biggest key for the game is for our returning players (particularly Tre) to focus on playing this game instead of trying to overcome memories or mistakes from last season.

[TheOldBattleship]

Tons of interesting individual matchup issues in this game (as others in the thread have pointed out, the question of how effectively Tillman guards Carey is a big one), but none are bigger than the obvious one: the Jones/Winston showdown. Winston is responsible for SO MUCH of the Spartans offense running smoothly this year that, if Tre can disrupt him to an significant degree one-on-one, I like Duke's chances despite our own obvious difficulties on offense. That said, part of makes Winston so good is how undisruptable he is. His patience is just so impressive.

More generally, I'm just hoping to see a team that's a bit more poised and organized than what we've seen in the past couple of games. Mich St. is a very tough place to go and steal a win (K's historic success against Izzo generally notwithstanding), but I think we do match up reasonably well with this team. Should be fun regardless!

[DavidBenAkiva]

Tons of interesting individual matchup issues in this game (as others in the thread have pointed out, the question of how effectively Tillman guards Carey is a big one), but none are bigger than the obvious one: the Jones/Winston showdown. Winston is responsible for SO MUCH of the Spartans offense running smoothly this year that, if Tre can disrupt him to an significant degree one-on-one, I like Duke's chances despite our own obvious difficulties on offense. That said, part of makes Winston so good is how undisruptable he is. His patience is just so impressive.

More generally, I'm just hoping to see a team that's a bit more poised and organized than what we've seen in the past couple of games. Mich St. is a very tough place to go and steal a win (K's historic success against Izzo generally notwithstanding), but I think we do match up reasonably well with this team. Should be fun regardless!

While I expect to see Tre Jones on Cassius Winston a lot, I really doubt that it will be a one-on-one matchup for the majority of the game. In the game against Kentucky, Calipari threw Ashton Hagans, considered an elite defender, and either Immanuel Quickley or Tyrese Maxey at Winston, forcing the MSU PG to give up the ball to his teammates. That resulted in just 12 FG attempts for Winston to go along with 4 assists and 3 turnovers. In the second half of against Seton Hall, it was the same thing. Winston took a good number of shots, mostly in the 1st half, but finished with just 4 assists and 4 turnovers. In that game, Malik Hall was the savior, taking and making a number of open jumpers to keep MSU in the lead. Against Virginia Tech, Winston shot a season-low 8 field goal attempts and had just 2 assists and 3 turnovers. VA Tech elected to double Winston throughout and it totally disrupted the MSU offense. In all 3 of those games, Winston got into foul trouble.

Against Duke, I think a lineup of Tre Jones and Jordan Goldwire will be used to double Winston off the screen. This is what Kentucky and VA Tech did to great effect. MSU screens with their bigs a lot, including Thomas Kithier, Xavier Tillman, and either Malik Hall or Marcus Bingham. None of those guys are threats to score from the perimeter. You can leave the screener for a few moments to double Winston, forcing him to pass the ball to the open screener. They like to keep the wings and their guards along the baseline, which is where I hope we'll see Wendell Moore, Joey Baker, and Alex O'Connell. They can use their height and length to run the MSU wings off the line or prevent swing passes from Winston.

One of the big keys for the game will be seeing if Matthew Hurt and Jack White can help off the screen. If they do that, while not allowing an open lane to the rim, I think Duke can seriously stifle MSU's elite offense. Lesser coaches have already had success slowing down the Spartans. The blueprint is out.

[UrinalCake]

I haven’t watched much of MSU this season, but it sounds like they are kind of similar to us. Star point guard with some nice pieces around him. Agree that the Jones/Winston matchup will be great to watch and a key to the game. I was also really looking forward to Cassius Winston and Cassius Stanley squaring off in the battle of who gets to be called just “Cassius” for the remainder of the season, but that won’t happen.

I expect to see an ugly, physical game with poor shooting percentages and a lot of turnovers. I actually think the turnovers will determine the game, as we’ve been really bad about committing them and not generating them over the last two games. It was also probably the biggest reason for our loss in the E8 last season. So for us to win we’ll have to protect the ball and grind it out in a hostile environment.

[kAzE]

I'm not sure this will happen, but I'd like to see Jones, Carey, Hurt, Moore, and Baker start the game, and see how it plays out. I think Baker has proven enough to earn a start. The only other guy I could see fill in for Cassius in the starting lineup is possibly Goldwire. I think it will be either him or Baker. Even though Wendell has had a couple of bad games in a row, I don't think we can afford to bring him off the bench, as he's pretty much the only thing resembling a two-way wing that we have left on this roster.

The only downside is that we have almost no offense coming off the bench, with Javin/Jack/Jordan. I have no confidence at all in O'Connell, but he tends to have a blow up game every once in awhile, which is probably why Coach K puts him in for 4-5 minutes a game to see if he has it that night. It would be nice if he could heat up right about now.

[AZLA]

Baker deserves a lot of credit for his hustle and enthusiasm whether on the bench or on the floor. I can remember him last year when Duke was down big against Louisville motivating and cheering the loudest from the bench even before the comeback seemed possible. And in the last game he had no problem diving on the floor and being physical. Whereas I noticed a few freshman watching the ball on the floor rather. Might sound corny, but those are the characteristics Coach wants. Duke might be a little outmatched in a few positions on Tuesday against MSU; and Izzo will bring the intensity; I'm hoping Duke matches that level on the boards and in the paint -- and on diving for loose balls and forcing turnovers like they did against Kansas. Cutting off the passing lanes and forcing turnovers against the bigs is how they beat Kansas and how Duke can gain an advantage against most opponents (despite struggling the last few games). Might seem odd to say but Duke does better against bigger opponents and struggles against a smaller lineup. The difference between Kansas and MSU is how effective Winston is on the high pick and roll. I saw a post earlier talking about not trying to right the wrongs from the game last year. The reality is if there's one thing about MSU is that there is no secret sauce -- Izzo's recipe is as well known and as consistent as In N' Out burger -- nothing changes. Duke struggled against the high pick to open up space with Winston and basically get Tre off of him. Once that happens and he has space to stop and pop, or if Duke switches and the screener gets space -- to throw the oop -- or to kick it out to the open 3. 100% guaranteed nothing changes in terms of offensive strategy for Izzo from last year. That and being tenacious on defense which includes holding jerseys; hooking post players; and banging hard in the post. I think Carey is actually going to really enjoy flexing his muscle in the paint as will Javin who actually played well against Spartans last year.

[TheOldBattleship]

While I expect to see Tre Jones on Cassius Winston a lot, I really doubt that it will be a one-on-one matchup for the majority of the game. In the game against Kentucky, Calipari threw Ashton Hagans, considered an elite defender, and either Immanuel Quickley or Tyrese Maxey at Winston, forcing the MSU PG to give up the ball to his teammates. That resulted in just 12 FG attempts for Winston to go along with 4 assists and 3 turnovers. In the second half of against Seton Hall, it was the same thing. Winston took a good number of shots, mostly in the 1st half, but finished with just 4 assists and 4 turnovers. In that game, Malik Hall was the savior, taking and making a number of open jumpers to keep MSU in the lead. Against Virginia Tech, Winston shot a season-low 8 field goal attempts and had just 2 assists and 3 turnovers. VA Tech elected to double Winston throughout and it totally disrupted the MSU offense. In all 3 of those games, Winston got into foul trouble.

Against Duke, I think a lineup of Tre Jones and Jordan Goldwire will be used to double Winston off the screen. This is what Kentucky and VA Tech did to great effect. MSU screens with their bigs a lot, including Thomas Kithier, Xavier Tillman, and either Malik Hall or Marcus Bingham. None of those guys are threats to score from the perimeter. You can leave the screener for a few moments to double Winston, forcing him to pass the ball to the open screener. They like to keep the wings and their guards along the baseline, which is where I hope we'll see Wendell Moore, Joey Baker, and Alex O'Connell. They can use their height and length to run the MSU wings off the line or prevent swing passes from Winston.

One of the big keys for the game will be seeing if Matthew Hurt and Jack White can help off the screen. If they do that, while not allowing an open lane to the rim, I think Duke can seriously stifle MSU's elite offense. Lesser coaches have already had success slowing down the Spartans. The blueprint is out.

Definitely agree that we'll blitz Winston off screens whenever possible to force the ball out of his hands and make others make plays to beat us. That's something that Carey isn't amazingly good at at this point in his career, so it'll be really interesting to see how we handle the Winston/Tillman p&r. I'm also very interested to see if we end up having switching on the perimeter in the scheme at all, or if Tre (or, when he's not got the assignment, Goldwire) get tasked with fighting through contact and staying attached. That latter would be my guess. I think that we'll try to keep Tre on Winston at all times, even if that bends other parts of the defense, again with the goal of making someone else playmake to beat us.

[English]

Tons of interesting individual matchup issues in this game (as others in the thread have pointed out, the question of how effectively Tillman guards Carey is a big one), but none are bigger than the obvious one: the Jones/Winston showdown. Winston is responsible for SO MUCH of the Spartans offense running smoothly this year that, if Tre can disrupt him to an significant degree one-on-one, I like Duke's chances despite our own obvious difficulties on offense. That said, part of makes Winston so good is how undisruptable he is. His patience is just so impressive.

It also helps that his go-to move is an offensive foul that the refs refuse to call. He's the absolute king of the push-off, and yet, is impervious to referees' whistles. It'd be impressive if it wasn't so kick-you-in-the-pills annoying and frustrating.

[jv001]

It also helps that his go-to move is an offensive foul that the refs refuse to call. He's the absolute king of the push-off, and yet, is impervious to referees' whistles. It'd be impressive if it wasn't so kick-you-in-the-pills annoying and frustrating.

You are correct that their Cassius is the king of the push-off and I'm dumbfounded why the refs refuse to call it. Michigan State teams(Rizzo) play a rugged style of basketball that sometimes resemble football or rugby. Their moving screens bother me the most. But I forgot, Duke get's all the calls. With Winston sure to run the picknroll with their center, I hope Carey doesn't get into foul trouble. Maybe Javin can get it going and play good defense without getting into foul trouble, Something tells me he'll be needed in this tough battle and I hope he's up to the task.
GoDuke!

[TheOldBattleship]

It also helps that his go-to move is an offensive foul that the refs refuse to call. He's the absolute king of the push-off, and yet, is impervious to referees' whistles. It'd be impressive if it wasn't so kick-you-in-the-pills annoying and frustrating.

Ugh, too true. Though I'll never be able to be tooooooo critical of that "move" after watching Greg Paulus handle the ball against pressure for four years.... Still, while it could be just self-justification, I do feel like Winston uses that off-arm push it to gain advantage in a way Greg never did. Greg just wanted space to breathe; Winston actively deploys it in the half-court.

[AZLA]

You are correct that their Cassius is the king of the push-off and I'm dumbfounded why the refs refuse to call it. Michigan State teams(Rizzo) play a rugged style of basketball that sometimes resemble football or rugby. Their moving screens bother me the most. But I forgot, Duke get's all the calls. With Winston sure to run the picknroll with their center, I hope Carey doesn't get into foul trouble. Maybe Javin can get it going and play good defense without getting into foul trouble, Something tells me he'll be needed in this tough battle and I hope he's up to the task.
GoDuke!

Winston doesn't push off, he's controlling his space, much like James Harden. Y'all need to brush up on understanding the regulations. Especially in how the rule of verticality extends to the rule of horizontally. This rules video provides a good overview (https://youtu.be/ABxsf9jhuEA).

[jwillfan]

Winston doesn't push off, he's controlling his space, much like James Harden. Y'all need to brush up on understanding the regulations. Especially in how the rule of verticality extends to the rule of horizontally. This rules video provides a good overview (https://youtu.be/ABxsf9jhuEA).

Nice deadpan - I watched the video :cool:

[WVDUKEFAN]

I’m definitely watching Michigan and Louisville, and at least the first half of our game. Both are supposed to be very good. I’ve watched Carolina, and I’m not overly impressed. People are making a big deal about Michigan “upsetting” them. I don’t see it as an upset.

[scottdude8]

Interesting development: Izzo says he’s not expecting Langford back this season. Could be gamesmanship, but it’s looking like this is the MSU team we may see all season.
https://www.freep.com/story/sports/college/michigan-state/spartans/2019/12/02/michigan-state-basketball-joshua-langford-injury-update/2589585001/

[OldPhiKap]

Interesting development: Izzo says he’s not expecting Langford back this season. Could be gamesmanship, but it’s looking like this is the MSU team we may see all season.
https://www.freep.com/story/sports/college/michigan-state/spartans/2019/12/02/michigan-state-basketball-joshua-langford-injury-update/2589585001/

Really sorry to hear this. Langford is a warrior, and I hate to see any kid injured.

Best of luck with recovery.

[Spanarkel]

This has no direct bearing on the action on-court, unless Draymond gives Nutcracker pointers to current MSU players. GSW HC Kerr and several teammates(incl. Klay but not Steph) of Green's are supposed to attend.

https://www.freep.com/story/sports/college/michigan-state/spartans/2019/10/28/michigan-state-basketball-draymond-green-number-retired/2486325001/

[Jeffrey]

Really sorry to hear this. Langford is a warrior, and I hate to see any kid injured.

Best of luck with recovery.

As usual, I strongly agree. A lifetime of hard work can be destroyed in a split second. Probably the saddest event in sports.

[Music man55]

It would be nice to see Duke get hot from three point land tonight. Hope K gives Hurt and Baker a lot of minutes and it wouldn't bother me to see AOC contribute mightily to the cause either. Go Duke!

[SkyBrickey]

It will be really interesting to see who steps out in the starting lineup tonight.

After Hurt's strong last game against Winthrop, I expect him to join Tre and Vernon. That's 3 scorers on the floor, so I'll go with Goldwire and Moore as defensive starters with Tre+Goldwire+Moore working to make Cassius Winston as uncomfortable as possible. Do we do some doubling on the high screen and roll to get the ball out of his hands and make other players beat us?

But I wouldn't be that surprised to see either Baker or White in the starting lineup as others have predicted. I would be surprised to see AOC start, but I hope he gets a chance this game or next to play his way back into the rotation.

[budwom]

It will be interesting to see which of our young guys among the trio of Hurt, Baker and O'Connell contend well with MSU's physicality.

[53n206]

MSU 6-6.5 favorite. About what I'd expect after seeing us play at home. We are weak defending inside, and no too good on inside offense. Seems like not enough strength there.

[sagegrouse]

MSU 6-6.5 favorite. About what I'd expect after seeing us play at home. We are weak defending inside, and no too good on inside offense. Seems like not enough strength there.

According to one article, Michigan State's weaknesses has been lack of inside scoring. Could it be a "resistible force" versus a "Movable object?"

[scottdude8]

According to one article, Michigan State's weaknesses has been lack of inside scoring. Could it be a "resistible force" versus a "Movable object?"

That's correct. The only one of MSU's top six scorers who operates in the paint is Xavier Tillman. But Tillman doesn't create his own offense: he largely gets his points off of Winston's creation and the occasional putback.

Should we be concerned about MSU on the offensive glass? Absolutely, it's a Tom Izzo team after all, and Tillman is a veteran. Do we need to worry about a big man creating his own offense, like Nick Ward could do in the post for MSU last year? In all likelihood, no.

[Billy Dat]

Tonight is a game for men, older men, one which will require incredible verve.

I don’t expect us to win, but it would be a lot cooler if we did.

I am mostly interested to see who shows up and doesn’t play scared. That arena and crowd will be loaded for bear, a great test for our youngins.

[HereBeforeCoachK]

According to one article, Michigan State's weaknesses has been lack of inside scoring. Could it be a "resistible force" versus a "Movable object?"

HAH, I asked the very same question in FB about Syracuse's defense and Duke's offense.....

[Pghdukie]

Can we get Carey active tonight? He seems to disappear at times. The earlier the better

[sagegrouse]

HAH, I asked the very same question in FB about Syracuse's defense and Duke's offense....

Yeah, I copied it, but I didn't remember who wrote it.

[Jeffrey]

Can we get Carey active tonight? He seems to disappear at times.

I doubt he will disappear, if we put the ball in his hands. Tre has had two relatively bad games (mild injury?). Hopefully, Tre is 100% tonight, has a great A/TO, and plays very solid D.

[luvdahops]

HAH, I asked the very same question in FB about Syracuse's defense and Duke's offense....

Hope the results are more favorable for us tonight!

[weezie]

Vitale is chatting away during the mi-looville game and Eades is wearing out his whistle in bc.

So, we'll likely get Roger the ref, nope, correction: there he is over in Ann Arbor. So Bilas for us some other ref I'll be fuming at soon.

Ehhhh, looville looks very very good. Yikes good actually.

[-jk]

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Let's Go Duke!

-jk

[Tripping William]

Twitter sez Tre, Moore, Jack, Hurt and Carey are our starters.

[Steven43]

Unfortunate pass from AOC. He should have just shot the ball.

[kAzE]

It's becoming the same routine every game:

-O'Connell comes off the bench, plays about 3-5 minutes
-O'Connell is just atrocious on both offense and defense
-Baker comes in for O'Connell
-O'Connell sits the rest of the game

[Dub]

Team is just incredibly raw as is stands. Talent is there but roles haven’t been defined (Carey Jr. and Tre being the exceptions). Likely won’t see a refined product until March (if ever). Will be a season long roller coaster. Let’s go
Duke!

[Steven43]

Joey Baker, nice shot. I like this kid.

[kAzE]

Javin is playing excellent this game. He's just playing freely, instead of overthinking it. You love to see that.

[scottdude8]

Tillman foul trouble is huge. Great game plan to force that early. I wonder if anyone called that on the board here... ;)

[SavDukeGrad]

Javin’s best game so far this year. Nice to see.

[rsvman]

Still can't believe that banked three from the corner for Michigan State.

Looking pretty good so far, though. Creating turnovers again, which is good to see.

[arnie]

Javin’s best game this year. Been great on D and converted both fantastic passes from Tre.

OTOH, O’Connell has been O’Connell.

[scottdude8]

Go away Draymond. There’s a game on. Geezus ESPN.

[devildeac]

Tillman foul trouble is huge. Great game plan to force that early. I wonder if anyone called that on the board here... ;)

Yea, but what's your call on when/if he finally gets his 5th PF? :rolleyes:

[AtlBluRew]

Enough of the Draymond interview!

[scottdude8]

Also that was a great outback by Javin, but should’ve been Tillman’s third on Tre’s initial shot. I would’ve rather had that haha

[hallcity]

Enough of the Draymond interview!

That ought to be illegal. By all means interview the guy but not on split screen with the game going on!

[scottdude8]

Only Tom Izzo could be winning the fouls by DOUBLE and still complain this much. And be never gets a T. Never.

[SavDukeGrad]

Tillman May have gotten 2 early. But total fouls very one-sided

[scottdude8]

Tillman May have gotten 2 early. But total fouls very one-sided

It’s the Izzo and home effect. Refs are scared of him like no other coach. It’s even worse in B1G play. Arghhhhh it infuriates me!!!

[CrazyNotCrazie]

That ought to be illegal. By all means interview the guy but not on split screen with the game going on!

Winston flailing his off arm (usually his left) ought to be illegal. It is really ridiculous watching him. I had to encourage flopping but one of our guys needs to take one of Winston's push offs and fall down so the refs have to recognize what he does.

On a happy note, Carey is a man among boys out there. And I love Javin's activity level. We just need to be more careful about fouling. Refs are calling it tight so we have to adjust.

[SavDukeGrad]

Only Tom Izzo could be winning the fouls by DOUBLE and still complain this much. And be never gets a T. Never.

Totally agree. Also, he is running up and down the sideline while we are on offense, often on the court. He could reach out and touch our guys. Just like Buzz.

[FerryFor50]

Winston flailing his off arm (usually his left) ought to be illegal. It is really ridiculous watching him. I had to encourage flopping but one of our guys needs to take one of Winston's push offs and fall down so the refs have to recognize what he does.

On a happy note, Carey is a man among boys out there. And I love Javin's activity level. We just need to be more careful about fouling. Refs are calling it tight so we have to adjust.

You'd think that Winston clearing out Goldwire a few feet for a wide open layup on a drive would have been enough. But I guess not.

It boggles my mind how Duke has doubled up MSU in total fouls, given MSU's physical play and reputation.

[rsvman]

Did they call a foul on that last Winston layup? Nobody was within three feet of him. Maybe they didn't, but I thought I heard a whistle.

We already have three on Jack and three on Moore.

[Steven43]

Totally agree. Also, he is running up and down the sideline while we are on offense, often on the court. He could reach out and touch our guys. Just like Buzz.

Ahhh, Buzz. I’m not going to miss that guy.

[devildeac]

Only Tom Izzo could be winning the fouls by DOUBLE and still complain this much. And be never gets a T. Never.

and........

on the court repeatedly

:mad:

[SavDukeGrad]

They’re still at 5 fouls this half. Which I believe they had at the 10 minute mark.

[scottdude8]

The foul differential and the bonus is all that’s kept this game in arm’s reach. I can’t describe how infuriating this is.

[FerryFor50]

Bingham runs clumsily out of control down the lane into two Duke defenders. Foul on Duke. :rolleyes:

[J4Kop99]

Izzo seems unhinged

[SavDukeGrad]

How could that not be a foul!!! When the guy takes down Tre.

[Acymetric]

So are they just going to replay the goaltend 40 times and not show Tre getting tripped up even once?

[CrazyNotCrazie]

and....

on the court repeatedly

:mad:

I have proposed before the idea of an electric fence around the court and all coaches having to wear a shock collar. I would brand it the "Buzz."

[Kjeffrey]

Izzo seems unhinged

Are the five fouls against his team upsetting???

[FerryFor50]

Bingham runs clumsily out of control down the lane into two Duke defenders. Foul on Duke. :rolleyes:

MSU player runs over Tre Jones. No foul. :rolleyes:

[scottdude8]

I have proposed before the idea of an electric fence around the court and all coaches having to wear a shock collar. I would brand it the "Buzz."

There are a hundred thousand people in Ann Arbor who would help fund that project.

[Dub]

And this is the same team that lost to SFA?!? Absolutely mind boggling...

[FerryFor50]

So are they just going to replay the goaltend 40 times and not show Tre getting tripped up even once?

Honestly, I thought Bingham's block on Carey was close enough to a goaltend to take another look.

[FerryFor50]

And this is the same team that lost to SFA?!? Absolutely mind boggling...

I think freshmen have to learn that veteran teams, no matter what school they go to, won't roll over just because they're playing Duke at Cameron.

They've played well against teams that have name recognition and rank, but have gotten sloppy against smaller schools.

Luckily they're learning these lessons now rather than in the first 2 rounds of the NCAAs...

[devildeac]

So are they just going to replay the goaltend 40 times and not show Tre getting tripped up even once?

Or any of winston's stiff arms? :mad:

[ncexnyc]

So this is a very surprising start. Unfortunately the Alex and Wendell horror show continues. Javin must have taken a peak at DBR, because he's really playing well tonight.

[SavDukeGrad]

That foul differential is unbelievable. Hope we have enough guys to finish the game.

But how great has Javin played! And Goldwire’s D. And I think Hurt has played pretty good D too. And Vernon - I think the boos made him mad.

Really good half, especially considering the calls. Hope we can keep it up.

[Music man55]

Man, am I glad we have that 16 point lead at the half, we're gonna need every single point of it to survive having most of our guys foul out the way this is going! HOLY MOLEY!!!

[FerryFor50]

So this is a very surprising start. Unfortunately the Alex and Wendell horror show continues. Javin must have taken a peak at DBR, because he's really playing well tonight.

I don't think Moore's been in the game long enough to be a horror show - he's been called for two ticky tack perimeter fouls and was the unfortunate recipient of a foul on a rotation after Jack and Javin unsuccessfully chased a loose ball.

O'Connell is pressing - probably because he knows he's on a short leash and has to make plays to hold off Baker for PT. So far, it's backfiring on him.

[Skydog]

Why y’all complaining - both teams have made 8 ft’s! :)

DeLaurier having an amazing game. Hurt with 3 blocks. Carey 6-6 from ft line. Tre playing like old Tre. I’ll take it!

[SavDukeGrad]

Well you knew this run was coming. And we can’t play aggressive D with 2 guys in with 3 fouls.

[bluedev_92]

I really wish Jay didn’t cover our games..

[arnie]

Why y’all complaining - both teams have made 8 ft’s! :)

DeLaurier having an amazing game. Hurt with 3 blocks. Carey 6-6 from ft line. Tre playing like old Tre. I’ll take it!

Bilas and Packer are coauthoring a book: Duke Gets All the Calls. Forward written by Len Elmore.

[Son of Mojo]

I really wish Jay didn’t cover our games..

Would have taken Vitale and all of his histrionics over bilas.

[Sixthman]

Playing with house money; a great first half that this team
can build on.

[rsvman]

That was a really deep three. Momentum has definitely shifted.
I hope K has a plan.

[rsvman]

Surprised he stuck with his starters. Moore hasn't done anything.

[scottdude8]

Man, it’s nice having the biggest guy on the floor.

[scottdude8]

Bilas and Packer are coauthoring a book: Duke Gets All the Calls. Forward written by Len Elmore.

Don’t evoke Len Elmore’s name! He and his “Greg Zoubek” can go away forever.

[yootheman]

Cassius Stanley = Bruce Leroy

[devildeac]

4-0 PF this half-Izzo might need heavy sedation

[Skydog]

All the great big men we’ve had in recent years but (tonight) this team is having a block fest? Didn’t predict that but love it.

[rsvman]

Stanley looking pleasingly bookish on the sidelines.

[bluedev_92]

Would have taken Vitale and all of his histrionics over bilas.

Me too for sure!

[Sixthman]

Two Defensive fouls against Duke forced by illegal screens.

[scottdude8]

IT HAPPENED! A T for Izzo. Miracles do exist!

[Skydog]

Baker awesome offense but no discipline at all on defense. Seems to like chasing the ball rather than stay with his man. I can see K’s dilemma.

[SavDukeGrad]

Finally! Did you like that T, ScottDude? :D

[scottdude8]

Finally! Did you like that T, ScottDude? :D

I liked it. Just a little tiny bit.

[rsvman]

The foul situation is getting serious, with Stanley unavailable. Robinson may see some court time if this keeps up.

[devildeac]

The foul situation is getting serious, with Stanley unavailable. Robinson may see some court time if this keeps up.

7 MSU PF this half; Duke with 4; waiting for the turn around to get them back in the game.

I agree though that we're still in trouble with 4 guys.

[ChrisP]

I really wish Jay didn’t cover our games..

Allow me to VEHEMENTLY 2nd that sentiment!

[scottdude8]

Gotta admit Tillman is proving me wrong in this second half. He’s creating his own offense in the post. That’ll be key if MSU is gonna rebound from this performance for the rest of the year.

[InSpades]

Let's just forget that SFA game happened...

This team is a ton of fun to watch. Love Tre Jones. Vernon Carey is a beast. Everyone plays super hard.

#10 in the country? I dunno about that one.

Get better soon Cassius Stanley. We're gonna need you but not tonight.

[follyblue]

What is wrong with Jay Bilas. Taking it to next level.

[BlueandWhite]

Here’s a statement by Jay that I’ll agree with: “Tre Jones has been outstanding!”

[Double Standard]

What is wrong with Jay Bilas. Taking it to next level.

If Duke’s playing, he’s unlistenable. Worse than Dickie V, for very different reasons.

[Sixthman]

Jay forgot to mention the fouls by MSU not being called.

[Son of Mojo]

MSU really can't run any offense without doing moving screens on the arc or inside for drives. With no calls......benedict won't mention that during the game, but Duke sure is guilty of a bunch, huh?

[4Gen]

If Duke’s playing, he’s unlistenable. Worse than Dickie V, for very different reasons.

His incessant yapping about basketball minutiae really drains the life out of the visual game. Please just go away.

[follyblue]

I thought commentators generally follow an unspoken rule to not criticize officiating. Jay seems to be drawn to criticizing calls more than any other commentator I can think of.

[quahog174]

Uh-oh. Carey limping.

[devildeac]

I thought commentators generally follow an unspoken rule to not criticize officiating. Jay seems to be drawn to criticizing calls more than any other commentator I can think of.

Especially if they favor Duke :mad:.

[SavDukeGrad]

Having been in DC for the heartbreak of the Elite 8 game last spring, can I just say how much I’m enjoying this game. And Izzo’s T.

[hallcity]

Breslin Center starting to empty out.

[Acymetric]

Ew. Why are we getting a Cole Anthony interview during the Duke-MSU game?

[follyblue]

But anyways great game by duke so far. Really impressed with defense, rebounding and hustle.

[rsvman]

I don't know what is wrong with Vernon. I hope it's just a cramp or a muscle bruise or something. The last thing this team needs is a Vernon Carey vigil.

[duke2x]

I thought commentators generally follow an unspoken rule to not criticize officiating. Jay seems to be drawn to criticizing calls more than any other commentator I can think of.

But those pro-Duke Big 10 refs! :rolleyes: (I guess Maryland can't get away from pro-Duke refs.)

What is the criterion to start a Vernon Carey leg vigil?

[devildeac]

Ew. Why are we getting a Cole Anthony interview during the Duke-MSU game?

bilas probably requested it :mad:

[Son of Mojo]

Ew. Why are we getting a Cole Anthony interview during the Duke-MSU game?

espn knows during a Duke game that Duke fans watching just can't get enough unc...

[scottdude8]

If Joey keeps playing like this I’m gonna have to make the “Baby Grayson” nickname my wife coined stick. Gotta love to see him diving on the floor like that.

[Sixthman]

Why did Tre get only one throw when we’re in double bonus?

[quahog174]

8 mile

[devildeac]

Why did Tre get only one throw when we’re in double bonus?

espn says msu has 9 PF this half

[duke2x]

Vernon just has a cramp. No vigil required.

[FerryFor50]

But those pro-Duke Big 10 refs! :rolleyes: (I guess Maryland can't get away from pro-Duke refs.)

What is the criterion to start a Vernon Carey leg vigil?

It's a good thing Bilas got a law degree and went into broadcasting. He'd be an awful ref.

[duke2x]

It's a good thing Bilas got a law degree and went into broadcasting. He'd be an awful ref.

If you can't play, you coach. If you can't coach, you ref. If you can ref, you practice law? ;) Extension of Van Gundy's game from a ESPN crossover game many years ago (Curry/Davidson?).

[SouthernDukie]

Jay’s been particularly awful tonight with his “I’m not a Duke homer so I’ll go to the other extreme” shtick.

[downeastdad]

It's a good thing Bilas got a law degree and went into broadcasting. He'd be an awful ref.

As opposed to how he does as a broadcaster.

[J4Kop99]

Tre has been $$ all night. Seems like he took that loss last year ALMOST as hard as some of us...

[FerryFor50]

As opposed to how he does as a broadcaster.

He's actually not terrible in non-Duke games. But his idea of what a foul is or is not is.... bad.

[BigZ]

What a game. Joey Baker has arrived

[devildeac]

MOTM vote should be a fun, non-controversial exercise...