2019 NBA Draft discussion

[JasonEvans]

This will be the collector thread for conversation about the draft and trades made prior to/during the draft.

We begin with news that the Nets have traded their 2019 and 2020 first round picks (lottery protected) along with Allen Crabbe to the Hawks for Taurean Prince and a 2020 2nd rounder. This deal is clearly a move by Brooklyn to clear cap space as Crabbe is owed $18.5 mil next season and the Nets want to be in position to get 2 max free agents. This move gets them there. Plus, getting back Prince, who is on the last year of his rookie deal and could be a nice backup wing is a good deal.

All it really costs them is two picks, one of which will be #17 in a middling draft and the other of which is likely to be in the bottom third of the first round in 2020. I like this deal from their standpoint.

That said, this deal is a win for the Hawks too. Crabbe's cap hit is meaningless to Atlanta as they have tons of space and do not expect to be contenders in 2019-20. If Crabbe had 2 years left on his deal, there is no way the Hawks make this deal, but sucking up another bad contract in 2020 doesn't bother them at all (the Bazemore and MiPlumlee contacts are also in their final years in 2020). Prince was ok, a decent player, but certainly not irreplaceable and he is going to get a lot more expensive in 12 months. Don't forget that Prince played 4 years at Baylor before coming into the NBA, meaning any notion that he has potential to grow and get a lot better is pretty much gone at this point. He's already 25 and most of the Hawks starters are going to be less than 20 next year.

-Jason "this is probably a sign that the Hawks are dead-set on taking a SF in the draft (and I suspect they are going to trade up to get the one they want, RJ Barrett)" Evans

[JasonEvans]

Odds that the Hawks keep 3 first and 3 second round picks... zero. They are making a deal.

In my deepest fantasy, they are going to trade all these picks plus the Nets 2020 pick to Nawlins for Zion... not gonna happen but I can dream, can't I?

[cato]

Odds that the Hawks keep 3 first and 3 second round picks... zero. They are making a deal.

In my deepest fantasy, they are going to trade all these picks plus the Nets 2020 pick to Nawlins for Zion... not gonna happen but I can dream, can't I?

Who do you think the most likely actual targets are? RJ. Who else?

[Steven43]

Odds that the Hawks keep 3 first and 3 second round picks... zero. They are making a deal.

In my deepest fantasy, they are going to trade all these picks plus the Nets 2020 pick to Nawlins for Zion... not gonna happen but I can dream, can't I?

I’m with you. Zion to the Hawks would have been sweet. I visit Atlanta fairly often and would have tried to catch as many Hawks games as possible had Zion been on the team. Bummer.

[BD80]

Odds that the Hawks keep 3 first and 3 second round picks... zero. They are making a deal.

In my deepest fantasy, they are going to trade all these picks plus the Nets 2020 pick to Nawlins for Zion... not gonna happen but I can dream, can't I?

That would be a great outcome for Zion!

[JasonEvans]

Ok, serious question...

Would the #8, #10, #17 plus John Collins get you the #1 pick and Zion? I don't think it would but I also think New Orleans would be a little bit crazy to pass on that.

[CrazyNotCrazie]

Ok, serious question...

Would the #8, #10, #17 plus John Collins get you the #1 pick and Zion? I don't think it would but I also think New Orleans would be a little bit crazy to pass on that.

Of all of the sports, basketball is by far the one where accumulating a number of picks really isn't that helpful. The roster is so small that you aren't going to fit a number of new guys onto the team. In football, the roster is about 4 times larger so you need a lot more players and to a point, gathering picks is good. So, for example, in this case the marginal value of the 17th pick is really minimal (though I guess you can draft and stash). Getting a potential max salary guy is the key to success in the NBA. I know there are many max salary guys who went later in the draft, but theoretically your odds of getting one are a lot better at the top.

[DukeTrinity11]

Ok, serious question...

Would the #8, #10, #17 plus John Collins get you the #1 pick and Zion? I don't think it would but I also think New Orleans would be a little bit crazy to pass on that.

The Pelicans would probably laugh at that offer. You're not getting a generational superstar like Zion who's probably the most hyped prospect since LeBron for anything less than a superstar.

The Pelicans would hang up the phone even if the Hawks offered #8, #10, #17 plus John Collins AND Trae Young.

[brevity]

Ok, serious question...

Would the #8, #10, #17 plus John Collins get you the #1 pick and Zion? I don't think it would but I also think New Orleans would be a little bit crazy to pass on that.


The Pelicans would probably laugh at that offer. You're not getting a generational superstar like Zion who's probably the most hyped prospect since LeBron for anything less than a superstar.

The Pelicans would hang up the phone even if the Hawks offered #8, #10, #17 plus John Collins AND Trae Young.

From a business standpoint, New Orleans almost can’t trade the #1 pick. That surge of season ticket sales after the lottery was based on the understanding that Zion will be in a Pelicans uniform. Accept no substitutes (though I could be persuaded by, say, New York’s #3 pick and 2-3 of their young players).

Also remember that NOLA does have another superstar on the trading block. Atlanta has a much better chance there.

[scottdude8]

Agree with most everything above. In football a trade like that (3 first rounders for the #1) would be more likely, and analogous things actually have happened in the recent past. But unlike football, basketball is a game where 1 player can take a team from bad to good (the theory in the NFL is that QBs can do that, and indeed most of the trades like this have involved going after a QB, but more often than not having more picks to get a complete team ends up being better in the long run). Zion being a potential generational talent also means that deal is unlikely. But for the #3 pick and RJ? That most definitely could happen if the Knicks aren't sold on him... considering after the Top 3 picks the consensus is the next 10-20 players are very similar caliber (good, not great, prospects) the Knicks might prefer to take 3 shots on getting a contributor rather than going all-in on RJ. I think we all know what RJ brings to the table, so I think that'd be quite a bad move, but it can at least be justified (unlike trading Zion).

[BD80]

Of all of the sports, basketball is by far the one where accumulating a number of picks really isn't that helpful. The roster is so small that you aren't going to fit a number of new guys onto the team. In football, the roster is about 4 times larger so you need a lot more players and to a point, gathering picks is good. So, for example, in this case the marginal value of the 17th pick is really minimal (though I guess you can draft and stash). Getting a potential max salary guy is the key to success in the NBA. I know there are many max salary guys who went later in the draft, but theoretically your odds of getting one are a lot better at the top.

NBA trades are nearly always judged by who gets the better player in the deal, particularly when you are talking All Star level players.


On a semi-related note. Supermax contracts that depend on All-NBA voting, does that depend on whether the player is All-NBA at the time of the new contract or within a certain time preceding the contract? Will that change how the voters vote? Will it become a popularity contest as to who the voters want to have supermax contracts? This just bit Klay Thompson, costing him $30 million over 5 years.

[flyingdutchdevil]

Ok, serious question...

Would the #8, #10, #17 plus John Collins get you the #1 pick and Zion? I don't think it would but I also think New Orleans would be a little bit crazy to pass on that.

Interesting, but given how weak the draft is outside of the top 5-6 and given that Zion is a potential future top 5 player, absolutely no dice.

Zion WILL be a Pelly. That's non-negotiable. There is little any team can legitimately offer outside of a superstar to get that pick off the Pellies.

[Indoor66]

"Pellies", now isn't that just too cool for school.

[nmduke2001]

I know the contracts don't work, but if you're LA, do you call New Orleans and see if they would be willing to trade the #1 for Lebron? I think if you're LA, you have to at least consider trading Lebron. Unless they are able to get some max guy to join Lebron, they aren't winning anything during his contract.

[superdave]

That's probably enough to trade up for #3 with the Knicks.

But would NYK, or any team for that matter, want to bring in 3 rookies? Typically with that many picks, you'd either want to draft a guy to stash overseas or you'd roll one of those picks into next year's draft via trade.

The Celtics have the same dilemma with 14, 20, 22. What the heck do you do with three picks!? You cannot pay, much less play, them all so you have to move some.

[JNort]

What makes a draft weak? Is it the amount of top tier talent? If so maybe I can get behind that but this draft has a bunch of guys I think will be on NBA rosters for years to come. Maybe 5 or 6 potential all stars and a bunch of good roll players.

[Steven43]

From a business standpoint, New Orleans almost can’t trade the #1 pick. That surge of season ticket sales after the lottery was based on the understanding that Zion will be in a Pelicans uniform. Accept no substitutes (though I could be persuaded by, say, New York’s #3 pick and 2-3 of their young players).

Also remember that NOLA does have another superstar on the trading block. Atlanta has a much better chance there.

Who are New York’s young players who you think are potentially desirable enough to entice New Orleans to give up Zion?

[UrinalCake]

I think the Pelicans would consider that trade. I agree that the league is built around superstars, but on the other hand having players on rookie contracts who can contribute is also really valuable. And let’s not undersell Collins, he looks like a promising prospect. There’s no guarantee Zion will becomes a superstar (although he’s as likely to become one as anybody) so hedging your bet by bringing in four young players might make some sense.

[brevity]

From a business standpoint, New Orleans almost can’t trade the #1 pick. That surge of season ticket sales after the lottery was based on the understanding that Zion will be in a Pelicans uniform. Accept no substitutes (though I could be persuaded by, say, New York’s #3 pick and 2-3 of their young players).


Who are New York’s young players who you think are potentially desirable enough to entice New Orleans to give up Zion?

Kevin Knox, Mitchell Robinson, and Dennis Smith Jr. (all under contract) plus the #3 pick (presumably RJ Barrett) is a solid trade for Zion in an internal, best-for-the-organization kind of way, which is how I would look at it. Externally (in terms of selling tickets and community relations), it's a harder sell.

Also, it's a giant hypothetical without basis in reality, because why would New Orleans trade Zion at all when they still have a dissatisfied Anthony Davis? Most people here would say that Zion shouldn't be traded, but EVERYONE here would say he shouldn't be traded before Davis.

[superdave]

Kevin Knox, Mitchell Robinson, and Dennis Smith Jr. (all under contract) plus the #3 pick (presumably RJ Barrett) is a solid trade for Zion in an internal, best-for-the-organization kind of way, which is how I would look at it. Externally (in terms of selling tickets and community relations), it's a harder sell.

Also, it's a giant hypothetical without basis in reality, because why would New Orleans trade Zion at all when they still have a dissatisfied Anthony Davis? Most people here would say that Zion shouldn't be traded, but EVERYONE here would say he shouldn't be traded before Davis.

I was reading this morning that teams like the Lakers, Knicks and Celtics will likely have to get a third team involved to give NOP what they want. If they want an All-Star plus young prsopect plus picks, no team can accommodate that except for maybe Boston if they includes Hayward or Horford.

So the recipient of AD would have to send some of its young players to a third team in order to get an All-Star into the mix. For example, LA could send Ingram and Hart to the Wizards, then Beal, Ball and Kuzma would go to the Pelicans and AD would go to the Lakers. Seems to make a deal much more complicated.

[budwom]

I was reading this morning that teams like the Lakers, Knicks and Celtics will likely have to get a third team involved to give NOP what they want. If they want an All-Star plus young prsopect plus picks, no team can accommodate that except for maybe Boston if they includes Hayward or Horford.

So the recipient of AD would have to send some of its young players to a third team in order to get an All-Star into the mix. For example, LA could send Ingram and Hart to the Wizards, then Beal, Ball and Kuzma would go to the Pelicans and AD would go to the Lakers. Seems to make a deal much more complicated.

I saw that...what was complicated before becomes significantly more so...

[JNort]

Kevin Knox, Mitchell Robinson, and Dennis Smith Jr. (all under contract) plus the #3 pick (presumably RJ Barrett) is a solid trade for Zion in an internal, best-for-the-organization kind of way, which is how I would look at it. Externally (in terms of selling tickets and community relations), it's a harder sell.

Also, it's a giant hypothetical without basis in reality, because why would New Orleans trade Zion at all when they still have a dissatisfied Anthony Davis? Most people here would say that Zion shouldn't be traded, but EVERYONE here would say he shouldn't be traded before Davis.

That trade would get laughed out the room... Only valuable asset there is maybe the 3rd pick and to a lesser degree Mitch Robinson.

[superdave]

Has anyone seen rumors of what the Wizards would want for Beal? After seeing them salary dump Otto Porter for Jabari and Bobby Portis, I would be calling the Wizards every half hour if I were the Lakers, Celtics and others.

Would Lonzo and Josh Hart work? That leaves Ingram and the #4 for Davis.

Would Marcus Smart and Jaylen Brown work?

If Beal is available, he's got to be a more interesting deal than over-paying for AD, right?

[Truth&Justise]

Has anyone seen rumors of what the Wizards would want for Beal? After seeing them salary dump Otto Porter for Jabari and Bobby Portis, I would be calling the Wizards every half hour if I were the Lakers, Celtics and others.

Would Lonzo and Josh Hart work? That leaves Ingram and the #4 for Davis.

Would Marcus Smart and Jaylen Brown work?

If Beal is available, he's got to be a more interesting deal than over-paying for AD, right?

The first problem is the Wizards still don't have a GM. So there's no one to accept the call at the moment.

After that, the new GM needs to decide on one of two courses with Beal:

1) Trade him now, when his value is very high and he has two years left on his contract.

2) Keep himl until the Wizards get a look at how John Wall returns from injury.

In my opinion, the second option makes more sense. The Wizards can't just trade Beal and gun for a full rebuild--the four super-max years on John Wall's contract would inhibit any rebuild in that time. Can't clean slate until that contract is nearing completion. So IMO you might as well wait a year, see if there are signs Wall can return, and try to play them together in the last year of Beal's contract. If it works then the Wizards can compete for the playoffs in 2021 and go from there. If Wall's return isn't looking good, then you can make the Beal trade (and admittedly get less in return because Beal is closer to being a free agent), but you're also shortening your wait time on Wall's contract by a year.

That's how I would handle it. But if forced into scenario 1 of trading Beal now, I would want to maximize assets for 3-4 years from now. That means guys with only a year or two on their current contract are not as attractive. Sign & trades work better, as would a stockpile of draft picks for 2021-2023.

[budwom]

^ bad teams get to be bad teams (e.g. Wizards) by being poor at assessing talent...so I question if they can somehow become excel the trade front, but we'll see. Yeah, if I were looking for a deal (e.g. Beal) calling the Wizards might be fruitful.

[Wahoo2000]

^ bad teams get to be bad teams (e.g. Wizards) by being poor at assessing talent...so I question if they can somehow become excel the trade front, but we'll see. Yeah, if I were looking for a deal (e.g. Beal) calling the Wizards might be fruitful.

To be fair, I think most all of the Wiz issues can be traced to their now ex-GM Ernie Grunfeld who was woeful (at best) from a drafting standpoint. I can't recall a guy besides Wall or Beal who has worked out (and you could certainly argue that Wall *hasn't* worked out as he's really only had one all-nba caliber season and now the team is locked into paying him like a all-nba player for multiple years).

If they bring in the right guy, and can leverage Beal into multiple expiring contracts and compile draft picks looking towards the end of Wall's contract, they could be set up for success........ in about 4-5 years.

[superdave]

To be fair, I think most all of the Wiz issues can be traced to their now ex-GM Ernie Grunfeld who was woeful (at best) from a drafting standpoint. I can't recall a guy besides Wall or Beal who has worked out (and you could certainly argue that Wall *hasn't* worked out as he's really only had one all-nba caliber season and now the team is locked into paying him like a all-nba player for multiple years).

If they bring in the right guy, and can leverage Beal into multiple expiring contracts and compile draft picks looking towards the end of Wall's contract, they could be set up for success.... in about 4-5 years.

Add Otto to players that worked. But then they salary dumped him? It seemed like a panic move post-Wall injury.

So the question presents itself: Are they going to continue the fire sale and trade Beal for young assets?

If so, I would think the price would be at its highest right now, with two years left on his contract and pre-draft. I'd offer him up for guys on rookie deals and draft picks. Might as well develop talent while John Wall holds you hostage.

Wiz fans have largely given up on Wall returning to All-Star form. Too many injuries to his lower body and too little growth in his game. He peaked in 2016 or so and they recognized it (but ownership didnt).

[Acymetric]

Has anyone seen rumors of what the Wizards would want for Beal? After seeing them salary dump Otto Porter for Jabari and Bobby Portis, I would be calling the Wizards every half hour if I were the Lakers, Celtics and others.

Would Lonzo and Josh Hart work? That leaves Ingram and the #4 for Davis.

Would Marcus Smart and Jaylen Brown work?

If Beal is available, he's got to be a more interesting deal than over-paying for AD, right?

Is a team with Davis, LeBron, and absolutely nobody else (ok, Kuzma I guess) a playoff team? They need to keep at least one of Ingram or the #4...ideally both.


The first problem is the Wizards still don't have a GM. So there's no one to accept the call at the moment.

After that, the new GM needs to decide on one of two courses with Beal:

1) Trade him now, when his value is very high and he has two years left on his contract.

2) Keep himl until the Wizards get a look at how John Wall returns from injury.

In my opinion, the second option makes more sense. The Wizards can't just trade Beal and gun for a full rebuild--the four super-max years on John Wall's contract would inhibit any rebuild in that time. Can't clean slate until that contract is nearing completion. So IMO you might as well wait a year, see if there are signs Wall can return, and try to play them together in the last year of Beal's contract. If it works then the Wizards can compete for the playoffs in 2021 and go from there. If Wall's return isn't looking good, then you can make the Beal trade (and admittedly get less in return because Beal is closer to being a free agent), but you're also shortening your wait time on Wall's contract by a year.

That's how I would handle it. But if forced into scenario 1 of trading Beal now, I would want to maximize assets for 3-4 years from now. That means guys with only a year or two on their current contract are not as attractive. Sign & trades work better, as would a stockpile of draft picks for 2021-2023.

One/two year contracts would be attractive if they want to have some cap freedom in a couple years.

[millerecu]

Interesting trade for Duke fans!

https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/26981805/lakers-reach-deal-pelicans-davis

[-jk]

Brandon to the Pelicans (https://twitter.com/wojespn?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ct wgr%5Eauthor)?

What advice does K give 'em, besides ignoring the Big Bawlers...

-jk

[follyblue]

Ingram Ball and 4th pick in this years draft to pelicans for Anthony Davis.

[dukelifer]

Ingram Ball and 4th pick in this years draft to pelicans for Anthony Davis.

Lakers keep Kuzma and can get another player for a Max contract. Could get interesting.

[millerecu]

Now trade Lonzo, Hart, and number 4 and get number 2 or 3 for Barrett. Zion number 1.... Would be worth flying to New Orleans multiple times a year!

[sagegrouse]

Brandon to the Pelicans (https://twitter.com/wojespn?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ct wgr%5Eauthor)?

What advice does K give 'em, besides ignoring the Big Bawlers...

-jk

Woj says Lakers made a deal to get Anthony Davis. Brandon Ingram to Pelicans with other players and many draft picks -- including the #4 this year.


Sources: Lakers reach deal for Pelicans' Davis
4:39 PM MT

Adrian WojnarowskiESPN

The New Orleans Pelicans have agreed to a deal to trade Anthony Davis to the Los Angeles Lakers for Lonzo Ball, Brandon Ingram, Josh Hart, and three first-round picks -- including the No. 4 overall selection in next week's draft, league sources tell ESPN.

The deal represents a monster haul for the Pelicans and David Griffin, their new executive vice president of basketball operations, who maximized the Davis trade without the need to include a third team.

[Acymetric]

Seems like too much to me, I guess the proof will be in the pudding next season.

[AGDukesky]

Seems like too much to me, I guess the proof will be in the pudding next season.

Way too much!

[sagegrouse]

Seems like too much to me, I guess the proof will be in the pudding next season.

Well, Davis has only one more year on his contract. I suppose the Lakers have some assurance that he will sign a max deal with them -- they are allowed to pay more than any other team.

[Billy Dat]

Well, Davis has only one more year on his contract. I suppose the Lakers have some assurance that he will sign a max deal with them -- they are allowed to pay more than any other team.

It certainly helps to have LBJ's best friend as the agent. LBJ runs the NBA...amazing.

[brevity]

Interesting trade for Duke fans!

https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/26981805/lakers-reach-deal-pelicans-davis


Ingram Ball and 4th pick in this years draft to pelicans for Anthony Davis.

Link to the Woj Bomb (https://twitter.com/wojespn/status/1140023139142971392).


The Pelicans have agreed to a deal to trade Anthony Davis to the Lakers for Lonzo Ball, Brandon Ingram, Josh Hart, and three first-round picks – including the No. 4 overall in 2019 Draft, league sources tell ESPN.

This is bittersweet. I finally get to root for Brandon Ingram, but it feels wrong separating an overrated, mostly irrelevant player (Lonzo Ball) from an equally overrated, mostly irrelevant franchise (LA Lakers). Lonzo, keep all Big Baller shoe samples out of the Pelicans locker room. I don't want those anywhere near Zion.

[Furniture]

Zion, The Oak, Jackson and Ingram....looks like I will be rooting for the Pelicans.....

[Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15]

Zion, The Oak, Jackson and Ingram...looks like I will be rooting for the Pelicans....

If they can somehow get Barrett, I have anew favorite team. Probably do anyway.

[Wahoo2000]

What a deal for the Pelicans. They were never going to be able to keep Davis anyway, and this seems like a solid core going forward -

Guards:
Holiday, Ball, Josh Hart, Frank Jackson
Wings/Forwards:
Ingram, Zion, Randle
C:
Okafor

They also have the #4 pick in this draft to use. If they keep it, I'd assume they take Culver or Hunter. I could also see them trading down to add assets and try to land somewhere that they could pick up another athletic big like Jaxon Hayes. Or maybe even a guy like Bol Bol.

If Zion develops into a legit All-NBA superstar, that's a roster that could contend in a couple years.

[mkirsh]

Zion, The Oak, Jackson and Ingram...looks like I will be rooting for the Pelicans....

I assume they will take Culver at 4, but maybe they like Cam there. Don’t think RJ slips past 3 but I guess it’s possible too. It’s certainly worth call with the Knicks to see what they want to swap #3 for #4.

[JetpackJesus]

Brandon to the Pelicans (https://twitter.com/wojespn?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ct wgr%5Eauthor)?

What advice does K give 'em, besides ignoring the Big Bawlers...

-jk

"Just be you. You is enough."?

[subzero02]

What a deal for the Pelicans. They were never going to be able to keep Davis anyway, and this seems like a solid core going forward -

Guards:
Holiday, Ball, Josh Hart, Frank Jackson
Wings/Forwards:
Ingram, Zion, Randle
C:
Okafor

They also have the #4 pick in this draft to use. If they keep it, I'd assume they take Culver or Hunter. I could also see them trading down to add assets and try to land somewhere that they could pick up another athletic big like Jaxon Hayes. Or maybe even a guy like Bol Bol.

If Zion develops into a legit All-NBA superstar, that's a roster that could contend in a couple years.

I heard on the radio that they are looking to trade the #4 pick for a veteran player. They have a lot of options and a much brighter future than they had a few months ago.

[budwom]

I heard on the radio that they are looking to trade the #4 pick for a veteran player. They have a lot of options and a much brighter future than they had a few months ago.

Yeah, a number of other teams covet Garland, for example, and would be willing to trade a decent player in exchange for that number four pick...Pelicans really do have some nice pieces now.

[budwom]

I assume they will take Culver at 4, but maybe they like Cam there. Don’t think RJ slips past 3 but I guess it’s possible too. It’s certainly worth call with the Knicks to see what they want to swap #3 for #4.

Taking Cam and number four would be a horrible move, IMO...just don't see that happening.

[CameronBornAndBred]

Woj says Lakers made a deal to get Anthony Davis. Brandon Ingram to Pelicans with other players and many draft picks -- including the #4 this year.


Seems like too much to me...

Lonzo is in the trade. That means they traded away LaVar, too, upon which no cost can be placed.

[subzero02]

Lonzo is in the trade. That means they traded away LaVar, too, upon which no cost can be placed.


Lavar will be a fixture in the NBA for a while. Lonzo's youngest brother, LaMelo, has grown to 6' 8" and is projected as a top 5 pick in the 2020 draft. It's hard to imagine him not being a high lottery pick a year from now.

https://www.nbadraft.net/2020mock_draft

[Furniture]

Lonzo is in the trade. That means they traded away LaVar, too, upon which no cost can be placed.

Priceless indeed.

[YmoBeThere]

The Spurs had Marques in this week. They have the 19th, 29th, and 49th picks in the draft.

[CDu]

The Spurs had Marques in this week. They have the 19th, 29th, and 49th picks in the draft.

Fair to point out here that teams also regularly bring in guys that they have no intention of drafting. Guys that could play on their summer league team and/or G-League affiliate, or potentially compete in training camp. This is a time of casting a WIDE net.

[Furniture]

The Spurs had Marques in this week. They have the 19th, 29th, and 49th picks in the draft.

I heard he’s going to Utah (53rd pick).

[Neals384]

This is bittersweet. I finally get to root for Brandon Ingram, but it feels wrong separating an overrated, mostly irrelevant player (Lonzo Ball) from an equally overrated, mostly irrelevant franchise (LA Lakers). Lonzo, keep all Big Baller shoe samples out of the Pelicans locker room. I don't want those anywhere near Zion.

Oh, Brevity. Don't you see that Lonzo will be a great fit for Zion? Here's LaVar explaining how Lonzo will mentor Zion in the NBA game:


"Lonzo could be with Sara Lee, and she gonna be good," LaVar said. "Lonzo with anybody. Lonzo going to groom him, letting him know that when you get open, you're going to get the ball. He's going to make him so much better than what everybody's thinking. So everybody doubting him and saying, 'You know what? You don't have these post moves. You're not polished, just a good runner and athletic,' Lonzo will fine-tune him."

https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/26983392/lavar-ball-lonzo-trade-lakers-worst-move

[JasonEvans]

Lavar says: (Lonzo's) going to make him so much better than what everybody's thinking. So everybody doubting him and saying, 'You know what? You don't have these post moves. You're not polished, just a good runner and athletic.'"

Who is saying that about Zion? I've never heard anyone say Zion is just a runner who is athletic. I've never heard anyone question Zion's ridiculously good post moves. I can already tell that when Zion comes in and is as good as everyone expects, Lavar is going to take credit for it (via Lonzo).

[JetpackJesus]

Who is saying that about Zion? I've never heard anyone say Zion is just a runner who is athletic. I've never heard anyone question Zion's ridiculously good post moves. I can already tell that when Zion comes in and is as good as everyone expects, Lavar is going to take credit for it (via Lonzo).
Lavar. He's the only one saying anything that Lavar says.

Edit: Lavar is a bad person who puts himself above his own children.

[budwom]

It's also possible that the Pelicans trade Ball which would solve the daddy problem.

[JasonEvans]

It's also possible that the Pelicans trade Ball which would solve the daddy problem.

I hope they don't as I think he could be a really good fit with Zion and I really like his defensive abilities. He and Jru are going to be one of the better defensive backcourts in the NBA. I suspect his stock is far below his actual play at this point. No reason to sell low on a kid with this much potential.

-Jason "Nawlins is not a big media market with a large appetite for Lavar's antics. Plus, I suspect the media has tired of Lavar's nonsense and he won't get nearly as much attention" Evans

[bundabergdevil]

I hope they don't as I think he could be a really good fit with Zion and I really like his defensive abilities. He and Jru are going to be one of the better defensive backcourts in the NBA. I suspect his stock is far below his actual play at this point. No reason to sell low on a kid with this much potential.

-Jason "Nawlins is not a big media market with a large appetite for Lavar's antics. Plus, I suspect the media has tired of Lavar's nonsense and he won't get nearly as much attention" Evans



I hope we get there but I don't think we're there yet. His response to Lonzo getting traded was landing page material for both ESPN and BleacherReport. BleacherReport even had a video up of Lavar on the phone claiming it was just after the trade was announced. The video was of Lavar. On the phone. And that was it. All that tells me, he's still commanding hits ---- because it won't be the media that tires of him, it'll be a noticeable downtick in the attention the public pays to him that finally gets him less attention.

Lavar has been a smidge quieter since the news broke that Lonzo severed ties with BBB after Alan Foster was found to have embezzled $1.5M from him. You'd think that creating the circus that led to your son getting ripped off big time would humble a man...

[UrinalCake]

[Ball] and Jru are going to be one of the better defensive backcourts in the NBA.

It was always interesting to me how Holliday and Davis were both elite defenders yet as a team the Pelicans were terrible on defense. The other three starters must have been an abomination. The notion of adding Zion into the mix would have made for a really exciting team defensively (if such a think is even possible). Alas, I totally agree with you that Ball is a great fit for Zion. He’s a pass-first point guard who defends well, not unlike Tre Jones.

[scottdude8]

I hope they don't as I think he could be a really good fit with Zion and I really like his defensive abilities. He and Jru are going to be one of the better defensive backcourts in the NBA. I suspect his stock is far below his actual play at this point. No reason to sell low on a kid with this much potential.

-Jason "Nawlins is not a big media market with a large appetite for Lavar's antics. Plus, I suspect the media has tired of Lavar's nonsense and he won't get nearly as much attention" Evans

Agreed. It's hard but I think we have to separate Lonzo's play from his dad's antics. I actually LOVED the way he played at UCLA facilitating an offense. As a guy who is as close to a past-first point guard as there may be in the NBA at this day and age, at least in the starting lineup, imagine all the lobs to Zion he could throw.

[nmduke2001]

It was always interesting to me how Holliday and Davis were both elite defenders yet as a team the Pelicans were terrible on defense. The other three starters must have been an abomination. The notion of adding Zion into the mix would have made for a really exciting team defensively (if such a think is even possible). Alas, I totally agree with you that Ball is a great fit for Zion. He’s a pass-first point guard who defends well, not unlike Tre Jones.

On the break, Lonzo will be great for Zion; in the half court, he'll make things much harder. Lonzo's busted shot doesn't scare anybody. It will be near impossible to put Zion in a pick a roll situation with Ball. The opposing guard will simply go under the screen and clog the lane and force Ball or Zion to make outside shots. I could see a situation in which Ball plays the 2 with Jrue Holiday running the half court offense. That still lets Ball's man sag into the middle. Not sure both Oak and Zion will have a lot of space in which to operate in the lane.

[Dukehk]

I hope they don't as I think he could be a really good fit with Zion and I really like his defensive abilities. He and Jru are going to be one of the better defensive backcourts in the NBA. I suspect his stock is far below his actual play at this point. No reason to sell low on a kid with this much potential.

-Jason "Nawlins is not a big media market with a large appetite for Lavar's antics. Plus, I suspect the media has tired of Lavar's nonsense and he won't get nearly as much attention" Evans

They key thing with Lonzo is that he has to get healthy. Starting to get a tag as being injury prone. Might have to do with his slight build and lack of work on his body.

I want them to actually put shooters around Zion as I think thats NO's biggest weakness right now. They really don't have any wing players that can hit the 3 at a high clip. Its something they need to address immediately either through the draft or via free agency/trades. Crucial to them getting back to the playoffs and helping to create space for Zion.

I like the situation Zion is heading into though. Alot of young and hungry players with chips on their shoulders. By all accounts, Lonzo, Ingram, Holiday and Randle are team players who don't shy away from defence.

Holiday and Ball also are quick guards who like to push the tempo. I think NO could be an exciting team to watch next year if they go the fastbreak/run and gun route. Alvin Gentry is also a great coach to have for a young player.

[AZLA]

On the break, Lonzo will be great for Zion; in the half court, he'll make things much harder. Lonzo's busted shot doesn't scare anybody. It will be near impossible to put Zion in a pick a roll situation with Ball. The opposing guard will simply go under the screen and clog the lane and force Ball or Zion to make outside shots. I could see a situation in which Ball plays the 2 with Jrue Holiday running the half court offense. That still lets Ball's man sag into the middle. Not sure both Oak and Zion will have a lot of space in which to operate in the lane.

You guys make great points. Lonzo is a good passing guard, especially on the fast break, and can actually finish strong at the rim. Jrue is strong too and a little overlooked in the league. It’s going to be fun seeing a young team anchored by Zion trying to make a name for The Pelicans in the league. I was hoping the Knicks or Suns for Zion, but I was prone to like wherever he went, but also there is something about The Big Easy and Zion that might just click. Kind of reminds me of Jordan’s first few seasons at the Bulls...

So Okafor. I still don’t quite get what happened to his career. I know the league transitioned to splash brothers, wide open offense, no one plays with their back to the basket, James and the deep chuck and foul — okay — but how did he become so irrelevant so fast at the Sixers then Pelicans?

I understand that there was a big man dude ranch in Philly with top tier talent, and he was behind AD in New Orleans — but was his perceived drop more of a game shift in the NBA and a circumstance of coaching style? Is there still hope for a low post big man in the NBA and can his game become more prominent in NO?

I’m asking because it struck me during the finals that the Raptors were actually extremely successful playing physical inside and without a limited Boogie inside — the Warriors probably wouldn’t have stayed as competitive in the last two games with all their injuries. And it seemed to me that the game was being allowed to be more physical.

Might be a stretch but — is there a need for a back-to-basket center in the NBA? Can Okafor make a bigger impact and have a better career?

[budwom]

^ I think Okafor upped his game late in the year and was developing a reputation as someone who was working hard to become relevant again, though production fell off late in the season...I'm pretty hopeful he'll fit in somewhere...still surprised he can't play better defense...

[CDu]

So Okafor. I still don’t quite get what happened to his career. I know the league transitioned to splash brothers, wide open offense, no one plays with their back to the basket, James and the deep chuck and foul — okay — but how did he become so irrelevant so fast at the Sixers then Pelicans?

I understand that there was a big man dude ranch in Philly with top tier talent, and he was behind AD in New Orleans — but was his perceived drop more of a game shift in the NBA and a circumstance of coaching style? Is there still hope for a low post big man in the NBA and can his game become more prominent in NO?


It's a combination of a league-wide shift in philosophy as well as some of his own limitations. As far as the philosophy change, there are a few reasons:
1. Rules changes and general officiating have opened up play on the perimeter, whereas physicality is still allowed defensively in the post. This makes it easier to create points from the perimeter.
2. Teams have gotten more switch-happy on defense to try to combat the immediate advantage of ball screens...
3. Because players are becoming more proficient overall at shooting 3s
4. The combination of 1 and 3 make attacking from the perimeter more efficient offensively than playing out of the post

So the league has kind of evolved to understanding that post play is less efficient offensively. So what Okafor does well is now far less valuable.

As far as his limitations go, there are a few:
1. Limited athleticism. Okafor is largely an at/below-the-rim type of player, with limited mobility. He was a great high school player and a great college player in part because his size and interior skill was such that he could overwhelm smaller, less-skilled players. He wasn't as dominant or even as consistently effective in college as he was in high school, because the size and skill of the opposition improved. At the NBA level, his size isn't that noteworthy relative to other bigs. And his athleticism is/was below-average even for his position. So, no longer having a size advantage and being at a detriment athletically makes even his strengths less effective.
2. Limited skill set beyond post scoring. Okafor isn't a good defender. His mobility is limited, and he doesn't jump well. So he doesn't provide much shotblocking, and he can't defend outside of the paint. On top of that, he can't shoot away from the basket, and doesn't have the quickness/athleticism to crash on a pick-and-roll offensively. Basically, he doesn't do any of the things that you want out of your center in the new NBA.

When you combine that he struggles at all of the stuff the "modern" NBA center needs to do with the fact that what he does well is naturally less effective at the NBA level, it's a bad combination.

That doesn't mean he can't find a role. He just had his best season as a pro last year in a reserve role. Now, it still wasn't a net positive overall (still a low WS/48 and negative BPM). But it is at least trending in the right direction.

If the NBA ever makes new rules changes to try to re-diversify the league, he might find value. Additionally, if he continues to improve his body and athleticism (he's still just 23), he might find ways to utilize his post game better too. But for now, he's probably a backup center in the league.

[Steven43]

I hope they don't as I think he could be a really good fit with Zion and I really like his defensive abilities. He and Jru are going to be one of the better defensive backcourts in the NBA. I suspect his stock is far below his actual play at this point. No reason to sell low on a kid with this much potential.

Don’t both Ball and Holiday play PG? How could they be starters together in the backcourt?

[JasonEvans]

Don’t both Ball and Holiday play PG? How could they be starters together in the backcourt?

Holiday can easily play SG. I think most folks expect them to play together... though it would not be a great shooting backcourt.

In other Nawlins news, Julis Randall declined his $9 mil option. He's looking for a pay raise, probably until the upper teens millions.

[kAzE]

Holiday can easily play SG. I think most folks expect them to play together... though it would not be a great shooting backcourt.

In other Nawlins news, Julis Randall declined his $9 mil option. He's looking for a pay raise, probably until the upper teens millions.

I'm concerned that it's just not a good shooting team, period. Of the 5 projected starters: Ball, Holiday, Ingram, Zion, and Okafor (who played well last year, but I'm sure the Pelicans would prefer to find another center to be their long term starter), none of those guys are stretching a defense. Beyond that, they also don't really have any sharpshooters on the bench. The only halfway decent shooter on the current roster is E'Twaun Moore.

If I'm the Pelicans, I'll be looking to either trade the #4 pick to get some shooting and/or a center (maybe Clint Capela?), OR I'm taking Darius Garland, who looks like the best shooter in the draft. Regarding Garland, I'm not concerned about fit with Lonzo and Jrue. If he's the next Lillard, that's who I want playing long term with Zion.

[Truth&Justise]

In other Nawlins news, Julis Randall declined his $9 mil option. He's looking for a pay raise, probably until the upper teens millions.

Randle would have been a bad fit with Zion -- neither is big enough to play center (Zion may eventually get there, but as of now you don't want him guarding Embiid, Jokic, Towns, Valanciunas, Gasol, Cousins, etc.), neither can shoot from the outside, and both are at their best creating off the dribble against bigger defenders. Too much overlap in skillset, just didn't see any good lineups with them sharing the court.

[AZLA]

It's a combination of a league-wide shift in philosophy as well as some of his own limitations. As far as the philosophy change, there are a few reasons:
1. Rules changes and general officiating have opened up play on the perimeter, whereas physicality is still allowed defensively in the post. This makes it easier to create points from the perimeter.
2. Teams have gotten more switch-happy on defense to try to combat the immediate advantage of ball screens...
3. Because players are becoming more proficient overall at shooting 3s
4. The combination of 1 and 3 make attacking from the perimeter more efficient offensively than playing out of the post

So the league has kind of evolved to understanding that post play is less efficient offensively. So what Okafor does well is now far less valuable.

As far as his limitations go, there are a few:
1. Limited athleticism. Okafor is largely an at/below-the-rim type of player, with limited mobility. He was a great high school player and a great college player in part because his size and interior skill was such that he could overwhelm smaller, less-skilled players. He wasn't as dominant or even as consistently effective in college as he was in high school, because the size and skill of the opposition improved. At the NBA level, his size isn't that noteworthy relative to other bigs. And his athleticism is/was below-average even for his position. So, no longer having a size advantage and being at a detriment athletically makes even his strengths less effective.
2. Limited skill set beyond post scoring. Okafor isn't a good defender. His mobility is limited, and he doesn't jump well. So he doesn't provide much shotblocking, and he can't defend outside of the paint. On top of that, he can't shoot away from the basket, and doesn't have the quickness/athleticism to crash on a pick-and-roll offensively. Basically, he doesn't do any of the things that you want out of your center in the new NBA.

When you combine that he struggles at all of the stuff the "modern" NBA center needs to do with the fact that what he does well is naturally less effective at the NBA level, it's a bad combination.

That doesn't mean he can't find a role. He just had his best season as a pro last year in a reserve role. Now, it still wasn't a net positive overall (still a low WS/48 and negative BPM). But it is at least trending in the right direction.

If the NBA ever makes new rules changes to try to re-diversify the league, he might find value. Additionally, if he continues to improve his body and athleticism (he's still just 23), he might find ways to utilize his post game better too. But for now, he's probably a backup center in the league.

Sage analysis, thanks.

What strikes me as head-scratching is his rookie year, he averaged an impressive 17.5 points a game, at over 50% FG percentage. Of course that was all around the rim and PHI wasn't make any waves as a contender at that time. But they had high hopes when he was picked, but then was picking more mobile and above-the-rim bigs over him.

That 17.5 year was in 2015-2016 coming off the first year the modern GS Warriors won their first championship...

Then he dropped the second year to about 11 ppg and his minutes and stats plummeted. It wasn't gradual.

It was boom, here's a high-producing rookie nearing 20 points per game, then suddenly a rapid drop (still above 50% shooting and some solid rebounding stats), and then it plummets in his third year though minutes were cut in half.

It's astonishing how it coincides with a major shift in the game, but also that there wasn't an increase nor a gradual decrease.

It was literally a very good Rookie year, then a plummet in the third year. The off-the-court skirmish and optics didn't help him either, but that was years ago, and water under the bridge now.

Brandon Ingram should be interesting too, as the reverse scenario. His rookie year he wasn't playing as many minutes but as his career progressed he increased his playing time and his PTS from 9 to 18 -- but his eFG% went to 51% his third year. Curious to see what kind of productivity he has at NO.

Random thoughts... thanks for the great insights.

[JasonEvans]

I'm concerned that it's just not a good shooting team, period. Of the 5 projected starters: Ball, Holiday, Ingram, Zion, and Okafor (who played well last year, but I'm sure the Pelicans would prefer to find another center to be their long term starter), none of those guys are stretching a defense. Beyond that, they also don't really have any sharpshooters on the bench. The only halfway decent shooter on the current roster is E'Twaun Moore.

If I'm the Pelicans, I'll be looking to either trade the #4 pick to get some shooting and/or a center (maybe Clint Capela?), OR I'm taking Darius Garland, who looks like the best shooter in the draft. Regarding Garland, I'm not concerned about fit with Lonzo and Jrue. If he's the next Lillard, that's who I want playing long term with Zion.

The Pels would seem to have the cap space to chase a big man who can defend and rebound at one end and get out of the way by being an outside threat at the other. How good would that New Orleans lineup look with Brook Lopez in the middle of it? If not Lopez, who I expect to be a sneaky in-demand free agent, what about Dwayne Deadmon or Nikola Vucevic? Al Horford could still opt out and he would be a fun fit for the Pels.

-Jason "here is a thought... deal for Kevin Love, maybe trade a couple of the Lakers future picks they sent you along with Josh Hart or Frank Jackson" Evans

[Steven43]

Holiday can easily play SG. I think most folks expect them to play together... though it would not be a great shooting backcourt.
Maybe it’s true that Holiday can easily play SG. But does he want to? What if Holiday is adamant that he will only play PG? What does NO do then?

[JasonEvans]

Maybe it’s true that Holiday can easily play SG. But does he want to? What if Holiday is adamant that he will only play PG? What does NO do then?

Well, seeing as Effrid Payton started at PG (pushing Holiday to SG) for more than 40 games before being hurt this past season, I think the idea that Holiday would suddenly become a problem about this seems pretty darn unlikely. But, any guy who was more about his own success than the team's would be a strong candidate to be traded, I think.

[Truth&Justise]

The Pels would seem to have the cap space to chase a big man who can defend and rebound at one end and get out of the way by being an outside threat at the other. How good would that New Orleans lineup look with Brook Lopez in the middle of it? If not Lopez, who I expect to be a sneaky in-demand free agent, what about Dwayne Deadmon or Nikola Vucevic? Al Horford could still opt out and he would be a fun fit for the Pels.

-Jason "here is a thought... deal for Kevin Love, maybe trade a couple of the Lakers future picks they sent you along with Josh Hart or Frank Jackson" Evans

I mean, if New Orleans is committed to finding a good defensive center who can also shoot from outside, maybe they could go after Anthony Davis? They have the assets--maybe a package of Lonzo, Brandon Ingram, Josh Hart and some picks?

All kidding aside, I like your suggestion of Deadmon. New Orleans is in a position to let the new pieces gel and grow without the pressure of needing to contend this year. It doesn't fit that timleine to spend the newly acquired assets on someone like Kevin Love, or highly sought after veteran free agents like Horford and Lopez.

Vucevic is younger and fits the timleine, but he'll be expensive, and you'd have to be optimistic about Zion's development as a post defender to think that pairing will work. Deadmon fits the timeline and will come at a lower cost, so I think that would be a wise choice for New Orleans.

[Steven43]

Well, seeing as Effrid Payton started at PG (pushing Holiday to SG) for more than 40 games before being hurt this past season, I think the idea that Holiday would suddenly become a problem about this seems pretty darn unlikely. But, any guy who was more about his own success than the team's would be a strong candidate to be traded, I think.

Okay, thanks for the additional info. NO might well be planning to keep both Ball and Holiday. Do you know how good of a 3-pt shooter Holiday is? I know Ball is not a good shooter and might never be. So it would be especially important that NO have a SG who can really shoot well from three if Ball is going to be their starting PG.

[CDu]

Sage analysis, thanks.

What strikes me as head-scratching is his rookie year, he averaged an impressive 17.5 points a game, at over 50% FG percentage. Of course that was all around the rim and PHI wasn't make any waves as a contender at that time. But they had high hopes when he was picked, but then was picking more mobile and above-the-rim bigs over him.

That 17.5 year was in 2015-2016 coming off the first year the modern GS Warriors won their first championship...

Then he dropped the second year to about 11 ppg and his minutes and stats plummeted. It wasn't gradual.

The issue is that that 17.5 ppg was actually a pretty bad year on a really bad team. Yes, his count stats didn't look awful, but they are deceiving: he was a low-efficiency player bulking up on count stats with volume. It was his worst year in terms of FG% and TS% and WS/48 and VORP. He's steadily gotten less bad since then, albeit in a steadily smaller role.

Okafor's rookie year was the best-case scenario for his count stats: it was a team going nowhere, with no incentive but to feed him the ball. Embiid was out that season, and they had no other stars to command shots. So Okafor, as the most offensive-minded top draft pick available, got a lot of looks. The next year, Embiid returned from injury for part of the season, and Okafor's role decreased. He didn't actually necessarily play worse in his second year than his first; they just had a better (less awful) option in his second year.

Worth noting that the 76ers also didn't actually draft over Okafor; he was the third big man that they drafted (first Noel, then Embiid, then Okafor). They just quickly figured out that Embiid was better, and moved on from Okafor. Their more recent high lottery picks were guards/wings (Simmons and Fultz).

[Spanarkel]

It's a combination of a league-wide shift in philosophy as well as some of his own limitations. As far as the philosophy change, there are a few reasons:
1. Rules changes and general officiating have opened up play on the perimeter, whereas physicality is still allowed defensively in the post. This makes it easier to create points from the perimeter.
2. Teams have gotten more switch-happy on defense to try to combat the immediate advantage of ball screens...
3. Because players are becoming more proficient overall at shooting 3s
4. The combination of 1 and 3 make attacking from the perimeter more efficient offensively than playing out of the post

So the league has kind of evolved to understanding that post play is less efficient offensively. So what Okafor does well is now far less valuable.

As far as his limitations go, there are a few:
1. Limited athleticism. Okafor is largely an at/below-the-rim type of player, with limited mobility. He was a great high school player and a great college player in part because his size and interior skill was such that he could overwhelm smaller, less-skilled players. He wasn't as dominant or even as consistently effective in college as he was in high school, because the size and skill of the opposition improved. At the NBA level, his size isn't that noteworthy relative to other bigs. And his athleticism is/was below-average even for his position. So, no longer having a size advantage and being at a detriment athletically makes even his strengths less effective.
2. Limited skill set beyond post scoring. Okafor isn't a good defender. His mobility is limited, and he doesn't jump well. So he doesn't provide much shotblocking, and he can't defend outside of the paint. On top of that, he can't shoot away from the basket, and doesn't have the quickness/athleticism to crash on a pick-and-roll offensively. Basically, he doesn't do any of the things that you want out of your center in the new NBA.

When you combine that he struggles at all of the stuff the "modern" NBA center needs to do with the fact that what he does well is naturally less effective at the NBA level, it's a bad combination.

That doesn't mean he can't find a role. He just had his best season as a pro last year in a reserve role. Now, it still wasn't a net positive overall (still a low WS/48 and negative BPM). But it is at least trending in the right direction.

If the NBA ever makes new rules changes to try to re-diversify the league, he might find value. Additionally, if he continues to improve his body and athleticism (he's still just 23), he might find ways to utilize his post game better too. But for now, he's probably a backup center in the league.


League-wide 3 point shooting percentage for '18-'19 was 35.5%, which is worse than 10 years ago(realize that many more threes are being taken).

The league’s 35.5 percent three-point percentage for '18-'19 only ranks 14th all-time — the record is 36.7 percent in 2008-09.

[CDu]

League-wide 3 point shooting percentage for '18-'19 was 35.5%, which is worse than 10 years ago(realize that many more threes are being taken).

The league’s 35.5 percent three-point percentage for '18-'19 only ranks 14th all-time — the record is 36.7 percent in 2008-09.

Fair enough. The rest is still correct though.

[AZLA]

The issue is that that 17.5 ppg was actually a pretty bad year on a really bad team. Yes, his count stats didn't look awful, but they are deceiving: he was a low-efficiency player bulking up on count stats with volume. It was his worst year in terms of FG% and TS% and WS/48 and VORP. He's steadily gotten less bad since then, albeit in a steadily smaller role.

Okafor's rookie year was the best-case scenario for his count stats: it was a team going nowhere, with no incentive but to feed him the ball. Embiid was out that season, and they had no other stars to command shots. So Okafor, as the most offensive-minded top draft pick available, got a lot of looks. The next year, Embiid returned from injury for part of the season, and Okafor's role decreased. He didn't actually necessarily play worse in his second year than his first; they just had a better (less awful) option in his second year.

Worth noting that the 76ers also didn't actually draft over Okafor; he was the third big man that they drafted (first Noel, then Embiid, then Okafor). They just quickly figured out that Embiid was better, and moved on from Okafor. Their more recent high lottery picks were guards/wings (Simmons and Fultz).

Good context to the discussion, agreed. I tend to recall Okafor was good at body'ing up down low, but was said to lack lateral quickness to defend all the space and lanes that open up in the pros. Fair enough. I wonder how good he is moving to set picks -- probably not ideal for the pick 'n roll. I was thinking, well if by the the logic of doing well on the low-rung Sixers, that the Pelicans might be bad enough that his numbers will thrive next year ;).

But thinking through the talent they will have in Zion (presumably), the new young talent from the Lakers, and their existing talent -- let me pivot the discussion -- do the Pelicans make the playoffs in the upcoming season?

I'll be an optimist and say... (hedge) why not?

[JasonEvans]

But thinking through the talent they will have in Zion (presumably), the new young talent from the Lakers, and their existing talent -- let me pivot the discussion -- do the Pelicans make the playoffs in the upcoming season?

I'll be an optimist and say... (hedge) why not?

A lot will depend on what they do with their cap space... a lot will depend on how quickly Zion and the #4 pick adjust to the NBA game. I will merely say that I think they will be a strong contender for a playoff spot and likely a team that wins right around half their games. I won't be shocked with as many as 47 or so wins... nor would I be shocked if they only win 37. sorry to waffle so much but there is a lot of potential and a lot of unknown with this franchise.

-Jason "I wonder how many times they will appear on ESPN/ABC/TNT national broadcasts... Zion is really, really popular. Could be 30+ national TV appearances, which would probably put them in the top 5 (https://247sports.com/nba/los-angeles-lakers/ContentGallery/NBA-teams-with-the-most-nationally-televised-games-during-the-2018-19-season-120601341/#120601341_4)among all teams in the league" Evans

[superdave]

A lot will depend on what they do with their cap space... a lot will depend on how quickly Zion and the #4 pick adjust to the NBA game. I will merely say that I think they will be a strong contender for a playoff spot and likely a team that wins right around half their games. I won't be shocked with as many as 47 or so wins... nor would I be shocked if they only win 37. sorry to waffle so much but there is a lot of potential and a lot of unknown with this franchise.

-Jason "I wonder how many times they will appear on ESPN/ABC/TNT national broadcasts... Zion is really, really popular. Could be 30+ national TV appearances, which would probably put them in the top 5 (https://247sports.com/nba/los-angeles-lakers/ContentGallery/NBA-teams-with-the-most-nationally-televised-games-during-the-2018-19-season-120601341/#120601341_4)among all teams in the league" Evans

NOP should be trading the #4 and Ingram for an up and comer like Beal. #4 is worth more before the draft when you can pick your player. Ingram is ball dominant so may not be a great fit on this roster. I'd try to win now and the best way to do that look for an All-Star that needs a change of scenery.

[ncexnyc]

NOP should be trading the #4 and Ingram for an up and comer like Beal. #4 is worth more before the draft when you can pick your player. Ingram is ball dominant so may not be a great fit on this roster. I'd try to win now and the best way to do that look for an All-Star that needs a change of scenery.
That could definitely work as Wall will be sidelined for the season with his injury and a trade would enable Washington to be in a position to draft Garland.

[JetpackJesus]

Sage analysis, thanks.

What strikes me as head-scratching is his rookie year, he averaged an impressive 17.5 points a game, at over 50% FG percentage. Of course that was all around the rim and PHI wasn't make any waves as a contender at that time. But they had high hopes when he was picked, but then was picking more mobile and above-the-rim bigs over him.

That 17.5 year was in 2015-2016 coming off the first year the modern GS Warriors won their first championship...

Then he dropped the second year to about 11 ppg and his minutes and stats plummeted. It wasn't gradual.

It was boom, here's a high-producing rookie nearing 20 points per game, then suddenly a rapid drop (still above 50% shooting and some solid rebounding stats), and then it plummets in his third year though minutes were cut in half.

It's astonishing how it coincides with a major shift in the game, but also that there wasn't an increase nor a gradual decrease.

It was literally a very good Rookie year, then a plummet in the third year. The off-the-court skirmish and optics didn't help him either, but that was years ago, and water under the bridge now.

Brandon Ingram should be interesting too, as the reverse scenario. His rookie year he wasn't playing as many minutes but as his career progressed he increased his playing time and his PTS from 9 to 18 -- but his eFG% went to 51% his third year. Curious to see what kind of productivity he has at NO.

Random thoughts... thanks for the great insights.

There is context for that sudden drop you noted in year 2. Jah's second season began with him on a minutes restriction (16 and then 24 MPG) due to the meniscus injury that ended his rookie season. He was also restricted from playing in back-to-back games to start the season. His minute restriction was removed around November. he was ruled out for the remainder of the season sometime in March due to knee pain.

[superdave]

That could definitely work as Wall will be sidelined for the season with his injury and a trade would enable Washington to be in a position to draft Garland.

The Wiz are going to be stuck in neutral until Wall's deal burns off in 2023. Beal's value is highest today with two seasons at a pretty good value remaining. They should be stockpiling picks, young talent and renting out their cap space the next three years. The first move to that end is to trade Beal to a contender, sadly.

[MChambers]

The Wiz are going to be stuck in neutral until Wall's deal burns off in 2023. Beal's value is highest today with two seasons at a pretty good value remaining. They should be stockpiling picks, young talent and renting out their cap space the next three years. The first move to that end is to trade Beal to a contender, sadly.

I've lived in DC since 1984 and the Wizards have always been stuck in neutral, at best.

[English]

NOP should be trading the #4 and Ingram for an up and comer like Beal. #4 is worth more before the draft when you can pick your player. Ingram is ball dominant so may not be a great fit on this roster. I'd try to win now and the best way to do that look for an All-Star that needs a change of scenery.

You should tell that to the Wiz' GM...oh wait.

I can't imagine the fleecing that David Griffin would put on whoever is acting in that role these days, given what he was able to pry from Rob Pelinka. My guess is Beal stays put (for now), and the Pels hang on to BI until they see what they have. Ingram's trade value is probably well below its apex, given his uncertain medical situation. I'd also speculate that Jrue Holiday is a piece they'd look to deal before Ingram, but again, I'd be mildly surprised if it's before the draft.

ETA: Is Beal really an up-and-comer? He's basically an All-NBA player now and in his prime at 25yo. I'd say he's an established marquee player, but I suppose it's probably just semantics.

[Steven43]

I've lived in DC since 1984 and the Wizards have always been stuck in neutral, at best.

I don’t think the Wizards would trade their only healthy marketable player (Bradley Beal) who just happens to be in his prime. Not unless they could get a treasure trove in return.

By the way, I’m visiting DC soon to attend two concerts. I would like to go to a couple of restaurants that I haven’t been to before. For years I have heard Tony Kornheiser rave about The Palm, but I’ve never been. I’d also like to check out his restaurant, Chatter, for breakfast, particularly while he’s doing his podcast show from there. Have you eaten at either of them?

Who are the Wizards looking to get with the #9 pick in the draft? Have you been hearing anything? Thanks.

[MChambers]

I don’t think the Wizards would trade their only healthy marketable player (Bradley Beal) who just happens to be in his prime. Not unless they could get a treasure trove in return.

By the way, I’m visiting DC soon to attend two concerts. I would like to go to a couple of restaurants that I haven’t been to before. For years I have heard Tony Kornheiser rave about The Palm, but I’ve never been. I’d also like to check out his restaurant, Chatter, for breakfast, particularly while he’s doing his podcast show from there. Have you eaten at either of them?

Who are the Wizards looking to get with the #9 pick in the draft? Have you been hearing anything? Thanks.

Sorry, but I haven't eaten at either. I mostly eat in the suburbs these days, except for an occasional trip downtown to have lunch with former colleagues (I'm retired).

To keep this on topic, I don't have any idea what the Wizards will do, or even if they will have a GM by then. I pay very little attention to the NBA and even less to the Wizards. I assume that whatever they do with the pick will not be good.

What concerts are you seeing?

What kind of food do you want? Rasika and Rasika West End are two of my go to restaurants for out of town guests. For 'cue, go to Hill Country and see some music, too. Tom Sietsema in the Post has good restaurant reviews: https://www.washingtonpost.com/people/tom-sietsema/?utm_term=.dcfdac3a01fc

[sagegrouse]

I don’t think the Wizards would trade their only healthy marketable player (Bradley Beal) who just happens to be in his prime. Not unless they could get a treasure trove in return.

By the way, I’m visiting DC soon to attend two concerts. I would like to go to a couple of restaurants that I haven’t been to before. For years I have heard Tony Kornheiser rave about The Palm, but I’ve never been. I’d also like to check out his restaurant, Chatter, for breakfast, particularly while he’s doing his podcast show from there. Have you eaten at either of them?

Who are the Wizards looking to get with the #9 pick in the draft? Have you been hearing anything? Thanks.

Here is the link to the WaPo's Fall Dining Guide (https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/2018/food/dc-fall-restaurant-guide/?utm_term=.f3520bdf7ded) from a few months ago. Anyway, Tom Sietsema is the Post's main restaurant reviewer and is reliable -- but read the reviews carefully, as some restaurants these days are, uh, "unusual."

My own tip would be that Penn Quarter/Chinatown -- near the Capital One Arena (formerly Verizon Center) -- is full of good restaurants, many of them new.

Ah,... The Palm -- it's still around, I believe. Many years ago my much younger brother came to town with a couple of friends. His lawyer friend insisted on eating at the Palm because one of the judges he appeared before recommended it. I ordered the smallest steak I could get away with without embarrassing my brother and his trenchermen buddies. Then the lawyer ordered a lobster as a first course -- it was five pounds and the claws were as big as my hands -- it felt like doing an autopsy -- although it was delicious. I can't remember how much (or how little) of the main course I ate.

[UrinalCake]

Here's a report that suggests the Pelicans are exploring a trade with the Grizzlies that would move them up from #4 to #2 so they could draft Barrett. Would be interesting to see him and Zion playing together again over in Cajun Duke country. There's such a huge dropoff between #3 and #4 in this draft, I would think NO either wants to trade up or trade down but staying at #4 is the worst possible spot.

link (https://nypost.com/2019/06/17/pelicans-new-draft-plan-could-allow-ja-morant-to-fall-to-knicks/)

[flyingdutchdevil]

Here's a report that suggests the Pelicans are exploring a trade with the Grizzlies that would move them up from #4 to #2 so they could draft Barrett. Would be interesting to see him and Zion playing together again over in Cajun Duke country. There's such a huge dropoff between #3 and #4 in this draft, I would think NO either wants to trade up or trade down but staying at #4 is the worst possible spot.

link (https://nypost.com/2019/06/17/pelicans-new-draft-plan-could-allow-ja-morant-to-fall-to-knicks/)

It's the NY Post. Not sure I put much equity into that. Also, Zion and Barrett is not an ideal combo, especially with Ball and Ingram in the mix. You basically have 4 above-average players (and maybe better) who are below-average 3pt shooters. Zion is arguably the best of the 4, and he shot 64% from the FT line.

For Zion's sake, I really hope the Pellies don't draft RJ.

[sagegrouse]

Here's a report that suggests the Pelicans are exploring a trade with the Grizzlies that would move them up from #4 to #2 so they could draft Barrett. Would be interesting to see him and Zion playing together again over in Cajun Duke country. There's such a huge dropoff between #3 and #4 in this draft, I would think NO either wants to trade up or trade down but staying at #4 is the worst possible spot.

link (https://nypost.com/2019/06/17/pelicans-new-draft-plan-could-allow-ja-morant-to-fall-to-knicks/)


It's the NY Post. Not sure I put much equity into that. Also, Zion and Barrett is not an ideal combo, especially with Ball and Ingram in the mix. You basically have 4 above-average players (and maybe better) who are below-average 3pt shooters. Zion is arguably the best of the 4, and he shot 64% from the FT line.

For Zion's sake, I really hope the Pellies don't draft RJ.

Enough, already. I think the Pelicans need some more experience on the team -- not another rookie from Duke. Also, I wouldn't necessarily like to see a team with five Blue Devils.

[UrinalCake]

Zion and Barrett is not an ideal combo, especially with Ball and Ingram in the mix. You basically have 4 above-average players (and maybe better) who are below-average 3pt shooters.

The alternative is to stay at #4 and draft someone like Culver, Hunter, or Garland none of whom are an answer either. Garland is the best shooter but they already have two point guards. I think Barrett is a huge step up in talent and star power from anybody they would get at #4, again it’s a really weak draft.

[JasonEvans]

There's such a huge dropoff between #3 and #4 in this draft, I would think NO either wants to trade up or trade down but staying at #4 is the worst possible spot.

Not so sure I agree with that. Apparently more and more teams are getting really intrigued by Darius Garland. We barely got to see him in college before he got hurt, but dude looks like a crazy good shooter with some major league ballhandling. He says he is the best guard in the draft and it seems some scouts are starting to believe him. I think the drop off from Garland is pretty steep though.

-Jason "I'm not saying it is likely, but it is possible Garland goes ahead of either Barrett or Morant" Evans

[mkirsh]

Not so sure I agree with that. Apparently more and more teams are getting really intrigued by Darius Garland. We barely got to see him in college before he got hurt, but dude looks like a crazy good shooter with some major league ballhandling. He says he is the best guard in the draft and it seems some scouts are starting to believe him. I think the drop off from Garland is pretty steep though.

-Jason "I'm not saying it is likely, but it is possible Garland goes ahead of either Barrett or Morant" Evans

Aren't we in the full on "don't believe anything you hear before the draft" smokescreen zone? At least that is my hope as the WaPo has an article on the great workouts my Wiz had with both Coby White and Nas Little this week.

[UrinalCake]

Aren't we in the full on "don't believe anything you hear before the draft" smokescreen zone? At least that is my hope as the WaPo has an article on the great workouts my Wiz had with both Coby White and Nas Little this week.

Are they bringing Jordan back to be the owner again?

[UrinalCake]

Apparently more and more teams are getting really intrigued by Darius Garland. We barely got to see him in college before he got hurt, but dude looks like a crazy good shooter with some major league ballhandling. He says he is the best guard in the draft and it seems some scouts are starting to believe him.

Garland was #15 RSCI coming out of high school, played in 5 college games against garbage opponents and put up good numbers, then got hurt. If he winds up as the #3 pick then that should be a signal to every high schooler in the country that they shouldn’t even consider playing a minute of college ball. Just sit out and tell everybody how awesome you are rather than letting scouts see your weaknesses against actual competition.

[English]

Garland was #15 RSCI coming out of high school, played in 5 college games against garbage opponents and put up good numbers, then got hurt. If he winds up as the #3 pick then that should be a signal to every high schooler in the country that they shouldn’t even consider playing a minute of college ball. Just sit out and tell everybody how awesome you are rather than letting scouts see your weaknesses against actual competition.

I've been thinking the exact same thing for the last three or four weeks, since Garland has climbed slowly up the draft boards--he was a likely lottery pick as the CBB season was winding down, then top-10, then a top-3 PG prospect, and here we are, he could be the top PG and as high as a top-3 overall pick. Man, he's got some great PR. Just think if Cam Reddish had gotten hurt after that UK opener...he might be considered the 1a prospect in the draft with Zion (Kidding, sort of).

[budwom]

I've been intrigued by the fact that nearly everyone projecting the draft seems to think Morant is a better choice than Barrett and #2....I'm less than convinced that this is true, though I should watch more of Morant I suppose.

[MChambers]

It's the NY Post. Not sure I put much equity into that. Also, Zion and Barrett is not an ideal combo, especially with Ball and Ingram in the mix. You basically have 4 above-average players (and maybe better) who are below-average 3pt shooters. Zion is arguably the best of the 4, and he shot 64% from the FT line.

For Zion's sake, I really hope the Pellies don't draft RJ.

Yes, that would be a very bad move for the Pelicans. And I like Barrett a lot, but he'd be a bad fit.

[UrinalCake]

I've been intrigued by the fact that nearly everyone projecting the draft seems to think Morant is a better choice than Barrett and #2...I'm less than convinced that this is true, though I should watch more of Morant I suppose.

I haven’t watched a lot of Morant either, but I have to believe if Barrett had played for Murray State against that level of competition he would have averaged 40ppg.

[Steven43]

I mostly eat in the suburbs these days, except for an occasional trip downtown to have lunch with former colleagues (I'm retired).

What concerts are you seeing?

What kind of food do you want? Rasika and Rasika West End are two of my go to restaurants for out of town guests.You pay very little attention to the NBA?! Just not enough spare time?

The concerts I’m going to see are Jackson Browne and my son, who is a guitarist.

In any case, I appreciate your restaurant suggestions. Rasika looks promising. An authentic dish of chicken tikka masala is hard to beat.

Sorry for taking the thread momentarily off topic.

[budwom]

I haven’t watched a lot of Morant either, but I have to believe if Barrett had played for Murray State against that level of competition he would have averaged 40ppg.

This is kind of my thinking...Duke asked RJ to do a lot, actually more than they should have, because of a lack of shooters...I think he'll be great in the NBA...

[AZLA]

This is kind of my thinking...Duke asked RJ to do a lot, actually more than they should have, because of a lack of shooters...I think he'll be great in the NBA...

True but look at it this way. Had Zion not been playing college ball this season, Morant would have been the player with the most SC highlights and the most media heat.

[brevity]

Sports Illustrated has posted their final Big Board of Top 100 Prospects (https://www.si.com/nba/2019/nba-draft-big-board-top-100-player-rankings). No paywalls or anything. Some variations to the top 10:

1. Zion Williamson
2. Ja Morant
3. Jarrett Culver
4. RJ Barrett
5. Coby White
6. Darius Garland
7. De'Andre Hunter
8. Goga Bitadze
9. Sekou Doumbouya
10. Cam Reddish

The top 100 lists, when available, are somewhat more helpful than early entry lists and mock drafts because they include the seniors. After their (questionably) highly elevated opinion of Goga Bitadze -- no mock draft source, even SI, has him picked higher than #14 -- this particular list is low on international content. Also, if you're wondering, Marques Bolden is not listed (but neither are Luke Maye or Kenny Williams). I think DBR's mock draft picked four players ranked after #80.

[UrinalCake]

True but look at it this way. Had Zion not been playing college ball this season, Morant would have been the player with the most SC highlights and the most media heat.

In that scenario Barrett would have been the featured player at Duke and would have gotten more hype himself.

Morant is a legit player, I'm not saying he's going to be a bust. Mac Mclung can dunk too and he didn't get as much coverage because he just wasn't as good as Morant. But in my highly biased view I would take Barrett over Morant.

[Steven43]

In that scenario Barrett would have been the featured player at Duke and would have gotten more hype himself.
.

Maybe, but I doubt it would have been much different hype-wise for Barrett had Zion not gone to Duke. Barrett did not have anywhere close to the number of flashy, jaw-dropping plays that Zion and Morant did. He’s not that type of player. And his usage rate could not have been much higher than it was. So what would have caused the extra hype?

[ncexnyc]

The Knicks finally doing something right.
https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/27001537/source-knicks-reject-hawks-offer-no-3-pick

[superdave]

The Knicks finally doing something right.
https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/27001537/source-knicks-reject-hawks-offer-no-3-pick

The Knicks now just have to sit on their powder another season, only sign 1-year contracts, draft well again in 2020, and hope their roster grows.

Anyone think they can pull that off?

[Billy Dat]

The Knicks finally doing something right.
https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/27001537/source-knicks-reject-hawks-offer-no-3-pick

Here's where I get worried, "Although Duke's RJ Barrett has been projected as the No. 3 pick, New York plans to hold a workout Wednesday for Vanderbilt guard Darius Garland, according to Givony."

I don't understand how Darius Garland plays a few college games, suffers a serious injury, and his draft stock only improves. When people gnash their teeth about kids leaving school, or skipping college entirely, this is why...your draft status only gets hurt if people have more data to rely on and less conjecture. It boggles the mind.



The Knicks now just have to sit on their powder another season, only sign 1-year contracts, draft well again in 2020, and hope their roster grows.
Anyone think they can pull that off?

I think they can, but I am not confident. The Perry/Mills front office, particularly the Perry part, as been competent. I am happy with competence for now. The big debate is whether or not they offer KD the max, even with the injury. Many people I consider smart seem to think that is a no brainer. I am less sure.

[johnb]

With the worst record in the league over the past 20 years, the only thing that would truly help the Knicks would be for the owner to trade himself. It would be a complete win for the team if he had to package himself with the #3 pick and some floor tickets in exchange for nothing.

[flyingdutchdevil]

Here's where I get worried, "Although Duke's RJ Barrett has been projected as the No. 3 pick, New York plans to hold a workout Wednesday for Vanderbilt guard Darius Garland, according to Givony."

I don't understand how Darius Garland plays a few college games, suffers a serious injury, and his draft stock only improves. When people gnash their teeth about kids leaving school, or skipping college entirely, this is why...your draft status only gets hurt if people have more data to rely on and less conjecture. It boggles the mind.




I think they can, but I am not confident. The Perry/Mills front office, particularly the Perry part, as been competent. I am happy with competence for now. The big debate is whether or not they offer KD the max, even with the injury. Many people I consider smart seem to think that is a no brainer. I am less sure.

Because he's the best shooter in the lottery. In HS, he had a rep for a great 3pt shooter. In college - in limited games - he shot 47.8% from 3.

[CDu]

Because he's the best shooter in the lottery. In HS, he had a rep for a great 3pt shooter. In college - in limited games - he shot 47.8% from 3.

The question is whether or not he can play PG. Because he's only 6'2", and he averaged 2.6 assists to 3.0 turnovers last year in limited time, and that was against bad teams.

If he can play PG, he might be really good. But that's a big if.

[Truth&Justise]

I don't understand how Darius Garland plays a few college games, suffers a serious injury, and his draft stock only improves. When people gnash their teeth about kids leaving school, or skipping college entirely, this is why...your draft status only gets hurt if people have more data to rely on and less conjecture. It boggles the mind.

I mean, I can think of a recent example that worked out pretty well for a 6'2" freshman point guard who was injured almost the entire season. Even got drafted #1.

[CDu]

I mean, I can think of a recent example that worked out pretty well for a 6'2" freshman point guard who was injured almost the entire season. Even got drafted #1.

Some notable differences in those two scenarios:
1. that PG played real opponents
2. that PG actually played PG

[UrinalCake]

Here's where I get worried, "Although Duke's RJ Barrett has been projected as the No. 3 pick, New York plans to hold a workout Wednesday for Vanderbilt guard Darius Garland, according to Givony."

I don't see why that would be cause for worry; it would be stupid for them to NOT work out more than one player given how much is at stake. Plus there are so many variables. What if Memphis unexpectedly takes Barrett at #2? What if the Knicks are thinking of trading down to get multiple picks and/or a future asset? On top of all that, teams love to create misdirection and throw off their competition regarding what their true intentions are.

[superdave]

I don't see why that would be cause for worry; it would be stupid for them to NOT work out more than one player given how much is at stake. Plus there are so many variables. What if Memphis unexpectedly takes Barrett at #2? What if the Knicks are thinking of trading down to get multiple picks and/or a future asset? On top of all that, teams love to create misdirection and throw off their competition regarding what their true intentions are.

In a three person draft, the Knicks cant afford to trade out of the top 3 unless there's an all-star or future all-star attached.

They literally need to go from a fourth of a competent rotation to a half in the next without screwing up the cap in the out years. It shouldnt be hard, but their track record suggests it is hard for them.

[jimsumner]

RE: Darius Garland.

You may recall that Duke recruited Garland in high school. Most recruitniks regarded Garland and Tre Jones as mutually exclusive. But after getting Jones, Duke continued to recruit Garland with the message that Garland could play off the ball, with Jones at the point.

Now, getting all of Jones, Garland, Reddish and Barrett was likely a bridge too far and Garland certainly felt that way. But it does say something about Duke's perception of Garland's strengths and weaknesses.

[UrinalCake]

If we had gotten Garland and he was subsequently lost for the season after 5 games, this message board might have imploded.

[JasonEvans]

If we had gotten Garland and he was subsequently lost for the season after 5 games, this message board might would have imploded.

FIFY

[English]

Here's where I get worried, "Although Duke's RJ Barrett has been projected as the No. 3 pick, New York plans to hold a workout Wednesday for Vanderbilt guard Darius Garland, according to Givony."

There's a rumor floating around that the Pels are considering trading up to grab Memphis' No. 2 pick and RJ Barrett, so it's possible the Knicks are kicking the tires on Garland as a possible alternative to Morant. It's incredible to me how quickly the Darius Garland hype train has gained steam. Of course, how much can be believed down the stretch leading up to the draft? Teams can work out whomever they want, whether they intend to seriously consider drafting them or not.

[superdave]

There's a rumor floating around that the Pels are considering trading up to grab Memphis' No. 2 pick and RJ Barrett, so it's possible the Knicks are kicking the tires on Garland as a possible alternative to Morant. It's incredible to me how quickly the Darius Garland hype train has gained steam. Of course, how much can be believed down the stretch leading up to the draft? Teams can work out whomever they want, whether they intend to seriously consider drafting them or not.

PG is probably the most important position. And Garland has great scouting reports.

I doubt the wisdom of pairing Zion with RJ. NOP has the assets to be a contender in the next couple of years by spending capital to get a veteran like Beal, but bringing Barrett in instead pushes that out to 5-6 years while the young core grows. That also wastes Holiday's prime years.

[flyingdutchdevil]

There's a rumor floating around that the Pels are considering trading up to grab Memphis' No. 2 pick and RJ Barrett, so it's possible the Knicks are kicking the tires on Garland as a possible alternative to Morant. It's incredible to me how quickly the Darius Garland hype train has gained steam. Of course, how much can be believed down the stretch leading up to the draft? Teams can work out whomever they want, whether they intend to seriously consider drafting them or not.

Ain't happening anymore. With Conley traded, Grizz are certainly keeping the pick and drafting Morant.

[Billy Dat]

I don't see why that would be cause for worry; it would be stupid for them to NOT work out more than one player given how much is at stake. Plus there are so many variables. What if Memphis unexpectedly takes Barrett at #2? What if the Knicks are thinking of trading down to get multiple picks and/or a future asset? On top of all that, teams love to create misdirection and throw off their competition regarding what their true intentions are.

I was not considering the misdirection approach nor just the overall due dilligence of working out all these guys. I just don't want them drafting Garland over RJ.


In a three person draft, the Knicks cant afford to trade out of the top 3 unless there's an all-star or future all-star attached. They literally need to go from a fourth of a competent rotation to a half in the next without screwing up the cap in the out years. It shouldnt be hard, but their track record suggests it is hard for them.

Yes, I agree and that is basically my thinking, although signing a busted Durant is still something I am on the fence about, and that would certainly screw the cap if he never comes back at whatever percentage of his old self makes him worth that money (95%? 90%?)


There's a rumor floating around that the Pels are considering trading up to grab Memphis' No. 2 pick and RJ Barrett, so it's possible the Knicks are kicking the tires on Garland as a possible alternative to Morant. It's incredible to me how quickly the Darius Garland hype train has gained steam. Of course, how much can be believed down the stretch leading up to the draft? Teams can work out whomever they want, whether they intend to seriously consider drafting them or not.

It really has


I mean, I can think of a recent example that worked out pretty well for a 6'2" freshman point guard who was injured almost the entire season. Even got drafted #1.

As CDu alluded to, I think a big part of Kyrie was that he made it back for the NCAAs and played really well. I'd feel differently about Garland had he done that.



I doubt the wisdom of pairing Zion with RJ. NOP has the assets to be a contender in the next couple of years by spending capital to get a veteran like Beal, but bringing Barrett in instead pushes that out to 5-6 years while the young core grows. That also wastes Holiday's prime years.

I doubt it because despite the narrative of how much these guys love each other, which I think is 100% true, I sense that RJ wants to spread his wings and be out from that shadow. He wants that NYC spotlight.

[JasonEvans]

Here are the 20 players invited by the NBA to be in the Green Room for the draft


Zion Williamson, Duke
Ja Morant, Murray State
RJ Barrett, Duke
Darius Garland, Vanderbilt
De'Andre Hunter, Virginia
Jarrett Culver, Texas Tech
Cam Reddish, Duke
Coby White, North Carolina
Sekou Doumbouya, Limoges
Nassir Little, North Carolina
Jaxson Hayes, Texas
Rui Hachimura, Gonzaga
Brandon Clarke, Gonzaga
Romeo Langford, Indiana
PJ Washington, Kentucky
Goga Bitadze, Mega Bemax
Tyler Herro, Kentucky
Keldon Johnson, Kentucky
Nickeil Alexander-Walker, Virginia Tech
Bol Bol, Oregon

[Eternal Outlaw]

Here are the 20 players invited by the NBA to be in the Green Room for the draft


Zion Williamson, Duke
Ja Morant, Murray State
RJ Barrett, Duke
Darius Garland, Vanderbilt
De'Andre Hunter, Virginia
Jarrett Culver, Texas Tech
Cam Reddish, Duke
Coby White, North Carolina
Sekou Doumbouya, Limoges
Nassir Little, North Carolina
Jaxson Hayes, Texas
Rui Hachimura, Gonzaga
Brandon Clarke, Gonzaga
Romeo Langford, Indiana
PJ Washington, Kentucky
Goga Bitadze, Mega Bemax
Tyler Herro, Kentucky
Keldon Johnson, Kentucky
Nickeil Alexander-Walker, Virginia Tech
Bol Bol, Oregon

Givony has the list up to 22, USC's Kevin Porter and Georgia's Nic Claxton were added

ETA: Just added a 23rd:
Jonathan Givony
@DraftExpress

Florida State's Mfiondu Kabengele has received an invite to the NBA Draft Green Room, a source told ESPN. That makes 23 players who will be in Brooklyn tomorrow with their families and associates, including four Canadians and a record-tying eight internationals.

[Billy Dat]

I think maybe I am just gradually more turned off by the hyperbole of prognostication when it comes to the draft.

Take Cam...his freshman season is universally called a disappointment, even a major disappointment by many. The kid was a top 3 recruit in the country, therefore, I guess, should be projected as a top 3 pick? Maybe, but I'll go along with it.

He averaged 13.5 next to Zion and RJ. He put up a team high 267 3s...now it was disappointing that he only hit at 33%, but that's far from passive. He had some strange circumstances like when he got sick against Syracuse and pulled up lame before the VTech Sweet 16 game...

But, still, he's projected to be a top 10 pick on nearly every list I have seen, some even higher. Yet, despite this, I see Seth Davis answer a reader question about Reddish with, "honestly I don't know that I would draft him in the first round. He should have gone back to Duke."

REALLY?

Again, had Cam gone the route of not going to college and just "worked out", maybe he's still a top 3 pick because playing on the #1 team in the country next to two of the top 3 picks and averaging 13 points a game only hurt his reputation.

[superdave]

I doubt it because despite the narrative of how much these guys love each other, which I think is 100% true, I sense that RJ wants to spread his wings and be out from that shadow. He wants that NYC spotlight.

Apparently Kyrie and KD love each other and want to team up, but if I'm a GM would I take a risk pairing two of the moodier guys in the league?

Maybe go all in and throw out three max deals to Kyrie, KD and Jimmy Butler!? Anyone under age 24 on that roster better run....

[Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15]

Apparently Kyrie and KD love each other and want to team up, but if I'm a GM would I take a risk pairing two of the moodier guys in the league?

Maybe go all in and throw out three max deals to Kyrie, KD and Jimmy Butler!? Anyone under age 24 on that roster better run...

Is Derrick Rose available?

[JasonEvans]

Apparently Kyrie and KD love each other and want to team up, but if I'm a GM would I take a risk pairing two of the moodier guys in the league?

Maybe go all in and throw out three max deals to Kyrie, KD and Jimmy Butler!? Anyone under age 24 on that roster better run...

It is really, really hard to clear 3 max spots on a roster. Depending on the player's experience, a max contract is for between 25% and 35% of the cap. KD is a 35% dude. Kyrie and Butler will be at 30%. Simple math says you cannot sign all of them at the same time unless they are already on your team and you are allowed to go over the cap to retain them.

[Wander]

I think maybe I am just gradually more turned off by the hyperbole of prognostication when it comes to the draft.

Take Cam...his freshman season is universally called a disappointment, even a major disappointment by many. The kid was a top 3 recruit in the country, therefore, I guess, should be projected as a top 3 pick? Maybe, but I'll go along with it.

He averaged 13.5 next to Zion and RJ. He put up a team high 267 3s...now it was disappointing that he only hit at 33%, but that's far from passive. He had some strange circumstances like when he got sick against Syracuse and pulled up lame before the VTech Sweet 16 game...

But, still, he's projected to be a top 10 pick on nearly every list I have seen, some even higher. Yet, despite this, I see Seth Davis answer a reader question about Reddish with, "honestly I don't know that I would draft him in the first round. He should have gone back to Duke."

REALLY?

Again, had Cam gone the route of not going to college and just "worked out", maybe he's still a top 3 pick because playing on the #1 team in the country next to two of the top 3 picks and averaging 13 points a game only hurt his reputation.

But playing alongside Zion and RJ and averaging "only" 13 points per game isn't what hurt him. His poor shooting percentage and overall mistakes on offense are red flags for someone who's supposed to maybe be a 3 and D type of guy, or at least a good floor spacer. That shooting percentage should have been HELPED by Zion's presence, not hurt. I think he would have fallen just as much if not more had Duke not had Zion and RJ (but he has enough promise and tools to definitely be drafted in the 1st round – that Seth Davis comment is dumb).

[CDu]

It is really, really hard to clear 3 max spots on a roster. Depending on the player's experience, a max contract is for between 25% and 35% of the cap. KD is a 35% dude. Kyrie and Butler will be at 30%. Simple math says you cannot sign all of them at the same time unless they are already on your team and you are allowed to go over the cap to retain them.

Yes, it is virtually impossible to do so. The Lakers are about as close to the scenario as possible, but they did it via trade (and AD is a sub-tier max contract right now). And even they are going to have to strain to actually have enough room for another max guy, and it wouldn't be a 35% max guy.

The Nets are going to be in position to get two 30% guys after they renounce every free agent including Russell. The Knicks can get enough to get a 35% and a 30% guy, but that's it. They could try to trade for a third max guy, but it would basically require all of their remaining assets AND for a team to consider those assets worthwhile to acquire. It would look something like Smith Jr + Knox + Trier + Thomas' non-guaranteed + more non-guaranteed stuff + picks for a max guy that is disgruntled elsewhere. Then sign two max guys.

In short, as Jason said, it's REALLY unlikely for any team to sign three max free agents under the new CBA.

[bundabergdevil]

Pretty good shot of some more prospect (Goga Bitazde) that was seated next to Zion (https://twitter.com/FletcherWDSU/status/1141373240469872645/photo/1?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwte rm%5E1141373240469872645&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fbleacherreport.com%2F) during the media session.

[CDu]

But playing alongside Zion and RJ and averaging "only" 13 points per game isn't what hurt him. His poor shooting percentage and overall mistakes on offense are red flags for someone who's supposed to maybe be a 3 and D type of guy, or at least a good floor spacer. That shooting percentage should have been HELPED by Zion's presence, not hurt. I think he would have fallen just as much if not more had Duke not had Zion and RJ (but he has enough promise and tools to definitely be drafted in the 1st round – that Seth Davis comment is dumb).

Yep. Reddish showed he didn't really have playmaker/creator skills, which suggests he should be a 3-and-D guy. But he also wasn't a very good shooter. Those are real concerns.

It's possible that Reddish fluorishes elsewhere. It's also possible that Reddish was just a miss by the recruiting gurus, not unlike Kwame Brown, or Darius Miles, or James Michael McAdoo, or countless others over the years/decades.

[budwom]

Yep. Reddish showed he didn't really have playmaker/creator skills, which suggests he should be a 3-and-D guy. But he also wasn't a very good shooter. Those are real concerns.

It's possible that Reddish fluorishes elsewhere. It's also possible that Reddish was just a miss by the recruiting gurus, not unlike Kwame Brown, or Darius Miles, or James Michael McAdoo, or countless others over the years/decades.

Yes, I am very unpersuaded by Reddish and his skills...could definitely see him blossoming in time, but he sure has a lot of current weaknesses.

In terms of the moodiness of Kyrie and KD, the Nix grabbing both of them is almost too perfect. What could go wrong?

[superdave]

It is really, really hard to clear 3 max spots on a roster. Depending on the player's experience, a max contract is for between 25% and 35% of the cap. KD is a 35% dude. Kyrie and Butler will be at 30%. Simple math says you cannot sign all of them at the same time unless they are already on your team and you are allowed to go over the cap to retain them.

GM's should always give 110%!

Apparently my sarcasm font on teaming up Kyrie, KD and Jimmy didnt come through....

[JasonEvans]

Pretty good shot of some more prospect (Goga Bitazde) that was seated next to Zion (https://twitter.com/FletcherWDSU/status/1141373240469872645/photo/1?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwte rm%5E1141373240469872645&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fbleacherreport.com%2F) during the media session.

This is unquestionably the best NBA Draft media day photo in history!!!
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D9b45gkWsAAzLZG.jpg

[CameronBornAndBred]

This is unquestionably the best NBA Draft media day photo in history!!!
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D9b45gkWsAAzLZG.jpg

Kudos to the photog for enjoying "The Big Picture", instead of going for the immediate one. :)

[superdave]

Yep. Reddish showed he didn't really have playmaker/creator skills, which suggests he should be a 3-and-D guy. But he also wasn't a very good shooter. Those are real concerns.

It's possible that Reddish fluorishes elsewhere. It's also possible that Reddish was just a miss by the recruiting gurus, not unlike Kwame Brown, or Darius Miles, or James Michael McAdoo, or countless others over the years/decades.

I thought the game didnt slow down for Cam this year. He was either trying to play too fast (on offense) or he was pressing because RJ and Zion were taking so many shots that he knew he might not get the ball back. If he'd returned, I would have expected his productivity and efficiency to skyrocket. He's such a fluid player and so big for the wing.

His defense was really good and I never saw him let up on that end. So when I heard people questions his hustle, I assumed it's because they maybe only saw him play a few games.

He's the perfect third option at the next level and will benefit from great spacing. It will take him some time to catch up to the speed and physicality though.

[PackMan97]

Of course, given the talk of this being a weak draft...there will be someone drafted at #57 that few have heard of that will go on to win many NBA championships and a potential hall of famer.

[Billy Dat]

But playing alongside Zion and RJ and averaging "only" 13 points per game isn't what hurt him. His poor shooting percentage and overall mistakes on offense are red flags for someone who's supposed to maybe be a 3 and D type of guy, or at least a good floor spacer. That shooting percentage should have been HELPED by Zion's presence, not hurt. I think he would have fallen just as much if not more had Duke not had Zion and RJ (but he has enough promise and tools to definitely be drafted in the 1st round – that Seth Davis comment is dumb).

I agree with everything you are saying, but it's stuff like the Seth Davis quote that drive me crazy. I think we all agree that Cam was a relative disappointment in regards to performance vs expectation, but relative is the key word. The pendulum swings are so crazy with this stuff, it goes from a "disappointing" season to something more, while someone like Darius Garland is moving up draft boards because, why, no one could see his weaknesses up close? The fact that Vanderbilt went 0 forthe SEC is now somehow an endorsement. If he'd been taking on the SEC all by himself, and dealing with the expected double teams because his team was so bad, do we think, maybe, he'd be getting picked over a little more because, perhaps, they go 3-15?

I guess none of this is new, but it does seem like some guys are labled draft darlings and some are labled disappointments based on nothing but more and more talk since none of them participate in the drills. Looking at the history of DBR Mock drafts was really interesting because so many of the guys who we chose high based on all of this consensus talk never amount to anything but, again, so it is an so it will ever be.

[flyingdutchdevil]

Of course, given the talk of this being a weak draft...there will be someone drafted at #57 that few have heard of that will go on to win many NBA championships and a potential hall of famer.

I've heard of Marques Bolden.

[duke74]

Nice article about RJ in the N.Y. Post. A lifelong Knicks fan! (Grandfather was one - his mom’s from Bklyn)

Love this - and the St. John’s connection.

https://nypost.com/2019/06/19/rj-barrett-reveals-the-personal-reason-he-wants-to-be-a-knick/?utm_campaign=iosapp&utm_source=pasteboard_app

[nocilla]

I'm curious to see where Carson Edwards goes. He clearly showed NBA range on his 3s in the tourney. Someone may be getting a dangerous scorer late in the draft.

[brevity]

I guess none of this is new, but it does seem like some guys are labled draft darlings and some are labled disappointments based on nothing but more and more talk since none of them participate in the drills. Looking at the history of DBR Mock drafts was really interesting because so many of the guys who we chose high based on all of this consensus talk never amount to anything but, again, so it is an so it will ever be.

I liked the deep dives into past DBR Mock Drafts. Thanks again for suggesting it.

When it comes to players at the very top, I'm not sure how different our mock drafts are to the real drafts. Generally, both follow the conventional wisdom at the time, and today we can gawk and wonder at how any well-paid real GM ever believed that [Hasheem Thabeet, Anthony Bennett, Darko Milicic, or whoever] deserved to be a top 3 lottery pick.

The comparisons between the DBR mock drafts and the real drafts get more interesting as you work your way down. For example, I was impressed to see that, back in 2007, JBDuke had drafted recent NBA champion Marc Gasol at #16 when he really went at #48. Simply saying, "Well, he's a Gasol" would have put him way ahead of pretty much the whole NBA as a talent evaluator, but some more cogent reasoning was provided for that pick here (https://forums.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/showthread.php?2387-DBR-Mock-Draft-MAKE-PICKS-HERE!!&p=26992#post26992). So the Gasol pick at #16 looks pretty good 12 years later, but it looks even better -- in a depressing and morbidly fascinating way -- if you see who was mock selected at #15: Javaris Crittenton.

I mention this example to illustrate that what writer William Goldman once famously said about predicting a movie's success also applies here: Nobody knows anything. (https://www.goodreads.com/quotes/457097-nobody-knows-anything-not-one-person-in-the-entire-motion) And more to the point, as I get older, I see less and less of a difference between the civilians and the professionals. We try to sound like experts, but so do they. I doubt you'll find much actual genius among the people (GMs, owners, agents, reporters) that we discuss in the business of pro basketball, aside from the skillful brilliance of former players, and Adrian Wojnarowski's magical ability to transform himself into a literal fly on the wall.

[Steven43]

Of course, given the talk of this being a weak draft...there will be someone drafted at #57 that few have heard of that will go on to win many NBA championships and a potential hall of famer.

You’re probably right. Well, maybe not the HOF part, but very possibly an All Star or close to it.

[JasonEvans]

Here is the last composite of various mock drafts:
https://i.ibb.co/Xs22pMM/Capture.png

[CrazyNotCrazie]

I liked the deep dives into past DBR Mock Drafts. Thanks again for suggesting it.

When it comes to players at the very top, I'm not sure how different our mock drafts are to the real drafts. Generally, both follow the conventional wisdom at the time, and today we can gawk and wonder at how any well-paid real GM ever believed that [Hasheem Thabeet, Anthony Bennett, Darko Milicic, or whoever] deserved to be a top 3 lottery pick.

The comparisons between the DBR mock drafts and the real drafts get more interesting as you work your way down. For example, I was impressed to see that, back in 2007, JBDuke had drafted recent NBA champion Marc Gasol at #16 when he really went at #48. Simply saying, "Well, he's a Gasol" would have put him way ahead of pretty much the whole NBA as a talent evaluator, but some more cogent reasoning was provided for that pick here (https://forums.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/showthread.php?2387-DBR-Mock-Draft-MAKE-PICKS-HERE!!&p=26992#post26992). So the Gasol pick at #16 looks pretty good 12 years later, but it looks even better -- in a depressing and morbidly fascinating way -- if you see who was mock selected at #15: Javaris Crittenton.

I mention this example to illustrate that what writer William Goldman once famously said about predicting a movie's success also applies here: Nobody knows anything. (https://www.goodreads.com/quotes/457097-nobody-knows-anything-not-one-person-in-the-entire-motion) And more to the point, as I get older, I see less and less of a difference between the civilians and the professionals. We try to sound like experts, but so do they. I doubt you'll find much actual genius among the people (GMs, owners, agents, reporters) that we discuss in the business of pro basketball, aside from the skillful brilliance of former players, and Adrian Wojnarowski's magical ability to transform himself into a literal fly on the wall.

I think Crittenton was only taken #15 due to the Crittenden (sic) Compromise... #HistoryNerd #Sorry

[Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15]

I think Crittenton was only taken #15 due to the Crittenden (sic) Compromise... #HistoryNerd #Sorry

I got 3/5ths of that joke.

[CrazyNotCrazie]

I got 3/5ths of that joke.

Would spork you if I could - actually, I would give you 36.30 sporks if I could

[GGLC]

I liked the deep dives into past DBR Mock Drafts. Thanks again for suggesting it.

Was this posted somewhere? I'd be interested to see it.

[JasonEvans]

I got 3/5ths of that joke.

Would spork you if I could - actually, I would give you 36.30 sporks if I could

Number of basketball bulletin board where these jokes would even be attempted... much less appreciated... less than 0.1%

[brevity]

I liked the deep dives into past DBR Mock Drafts. Thanks again for suggesting it.


Was this posted somewhere? I'd be interested to see it.

I took a look at how DBR mock drafted the championship Toronto roster in the NBA Playoffs thread (https://forums.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/showthread.php?43691-2019-NBA-Playoffs&p=1170061#post1170061).

Turk and FerryFor50 did some independent work in the 2019 DBR Mock Draft thread (https://forums.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/showthread.php?43817-2019-DBR-Mock-Draft-It-s-a-Wrap!&p=1170084#post1170084).

[Turk]

Was this posted somewhere? I'd be interested to see it.

There were two spork-worthy posts:

In the NBA Playoffs thread, Brevity went through the Raptors roster and dug out where everyone was taken in the DBR mock:
Raptors roster in DBR mocks (https://forums.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/showthread.php?43691-2019-NBA-Playoffs&p=1170061#post1170061)

In the Mock Draft thread, FerryFor50 pulled the top three picks and links for all the mocks he could find:
DBR Mock Draft History (https://forums.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/showthread.php?43817-2019-DBR-Mock-Draft-It-s-a-Wrap!&p=1170170#post1170170) (I'll go so far as to nominate this post be tagged as a sticky somewhere for future reference)

[Turk]

And in other news, the Bucks send their first round pick (#30) and Tony Snell to Detroit for Jon Leuer (had no idea he was still in the league). Leuer's primary value is that his contract is slightly cheaper and a year shorter than Snell's, helping the Bucks free up as much cap space as they can to re-sign their starters.

So right now, the Bucks are completely out of the draft, unless they try to buy back in on the cheap by dealing with teams with a surplus of 2nd round picks, such as the Sixers.

[scottdude8]

I'm curious to see where Carson Edwards goes. He clearly showed NBA range on his 3s in the tourney. Someone may be getting a dangerous scorer late in the draft.

With the Pistons acquiring the #30 pick, I wouldn't be surprised if they target either Ty Jerome or Edwards with the last pick of the first round. Backup PG, ideally someone with upside (since Reggie Jackson is so hot and cold, and likely isn't part of the team's long term future alongside Blake Griffin and Andre Drummond) is a need. The local media had discussed both of those guys for the No. 15 pick but obviously that's a reach there... at 30 either of those guys would be justifiable/solid picks.

[brevity]

With the Pistons acquiring the #30 pick, I wouldn't be surprised if they target either Ty Jerome or Edwards with the last pick of the first round.

I have a feeling that risk-averse GMs will make a run on point guards and draft them earlier than expected. Don’t be stunned if Jerome and Edwards go before #25, and maybe one of those before #20. (I doubt a 4th PG is selected in the lottery, but if that happens, we’ll know the league has lost its collective mind, and all bets are off.)

It’s heresy on a Duke board, but I regard point guards (and quarterbacks) as a vastly overrated and over-discussed position. Honestly, in today’s NBA, the better football comparison is running back: it might be nice to have one dominant starter, but most teams will make do with filling the role by committee.

[subzero02]

I have a feeling that risk-averse GMs will make a run on point guards and draft them earlier than expected. Don’t be stunned if Jerome and Edwards go before #25, and maybe one of those before #20. (I doubt a 4th PG is selected in the lottery, but if that happens, we’ll know the league has lost its collective mind, and all bets are off.)

It’s heresy on a Duke board, but I regard point guards (and quarterbacks) as a vastly overrated and over-discussed position. Honestly, in today’s NBA, the better football comparison is running back: it might be nice to have one dominant starter, but most teams will make do with filling the role by committee.

The Knicks apparently had Coby White in for a workout earlier today.

[BD80]

Number of basketball bulletin board where these jokes would even be attempted... much less appreciated... less than 0.1%

Don't encourage them, jokes like that could prompt half the board (or so) to leave!

[jimsumner]

Don't encourage them, jokes like that could prompt half the board (or so) to leave!

Perhaps the posters from Missouri can come up with a compromise.

[devildeac]

Perhaps the posters from Missouri can come up with a compromise.

Show Me if/when they do.

[subzero02]

Show Me if/when they do.

Sustaining a balance between respect and comedic value should always be a maine goal of message board banter.

[Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15]

Sustaining a balance between respect and comedic value should always be a maine goal of message board banter.

Gah. I need to Remember the Maine.

[CDu]

Per Woj, the Hawks just traded the 8, 17, and 35 pick for pick 4, and plan to take De’Andre Hunter.

Atlanta will also get Solomon Hill and 2 2nd rounders.

[jimsumner]

Per Woj, the Hawks just traded the 8, 17, and 35 pick for pick 4, and plan to take De’Andre Hunter.

Atlanta will also get Solomon Hill and 2 2nd rounders.

Atlanta was supposedly locked in on Cam Reddish.

I like Hunter but that's a big buy-in. I rather suspect Reddish will be better than Hunter in a couple of years.

[JasonEvans]

Per Woj, the Hawks just traded the 8, 17, and 35 pick for pick 4, and plan to take De’Andre Hunter.

Atlanta will also get Solomon Hill and 2 2nd rounders.

The Hawks also sent a Cleveland first rounder in 2020 that is top 10 protected and becomes a pair of 2nd round picks if it does not convey in 2020. Seeing as the Cavs are highly likely to be in the top 10 in the draft next year, this is basically 2 2nd rounders added in.

Hill is a $12 mil expiring contract, something Atlanta can afford to pick up this year and which sweetens the deal for the Pelicans by shedding some unwanted salary.

[Edouble]

Atlanta was supposedly locked in on Cam Reddish.

I like Hunter but that's a big buy-in. I rather suspect Reddish will be better than Hunter in a couple of years.

Possible insane chance that RJ is still around at #4. Would we really trade all that to move up to Hunter?

This native Atlantan can dream (for another hour, anyway).

[Avvocato]

Possible insane chance that RJ is still around at #4. Would we really trade all that to move up to Hunter?

This native Atlantan can dream (for another hour, anyway).

No chance. Knicks are taking RJ (or I hope to God there's no chance the Knicks mess this up). However, imagine if it's Cam who teams up with Zion in New Orleans instead of RJ. What a crazy draft this is turning out to be.

[BigZ]

Th funny part is the Lakers are making the pick st four

[CDu]

Atlanta was supposedly locked in on Cam Reddish.

I like Hunter but that's a big buy-in. I rather suspect Reddish will be better than Hunter in a couple of years.


The Hawks also sent a Cleveland first rounder in 2020 that is top 10 protected and becomes a pair of 2nd round picks if it does not convey in 2020. Seeing as the Cavs are highly likely to be in the top 10 in the draft next year, this is basically 2 2nd rounders added in.

Hill is a $12 mil expiring contract, something Atlanta can afford to pick up this year and which sweetens the deal for the Pelicans by shedding some unwanted salary.

It seems an awfully expensive trade to move up 4 spots. Granted, you can almost always buy 2nd rounders, so maybe not so bad. But still a hefty price.

[CDu]

Minnesota trades 11 and Saric for 6. Cleveland shopping the 5th pick. A lot of movement happening in the top 6.

[JetpackJesus]

Per Woj, the Hawks just traded the 8, 17, and 35 pick for pick 4, and plan to take De’Andre Hunter.

Atlanta will also get Solomon Hill and 2 2nd rounders.

for killing the run of historical puns.

[subzero02]

Minnesota trades 11 and Saric for 6. Cleveland shopping the 5th pick. A lot of movement happening in the top 6.

I think that ESPN might begin their coverage a bit earlier next year. The viewership is there. With the playoffs leading directly to the draft and the draft leading directly into summer league play and free agency, the NBA has the most exciting off season in sports, hands down.

[DarkstarWahoo]

Atlanta was supposedly locked in on Cam Reddish.

I like Hunter but that's a big buy-in. I rather suspect Reddish will be better than Hunter in a couple of years.

If the rumors are correct, they’re going to try to get both.

[weezie]

Snaps!

Our Duke men are looking extremely fly tonight. Very smooth ensembles!

[Indoor66]

Sustaining a balance between respect and comedic value should always be a maine goal of message board banter.

Also a vermont goal as well.

[CDu]

If the rumors are correct, they’re going to try to get both.

Are they making another trade? Seems like they traded out of position to get Reddish.

[DarkstarWahoo]

Are they making another trade? Seems like they traded out of position to get Reddish.

They’ve still got the Dallas pick at 10. No sure thing he’s available there, of course.

[CDu]

They’ve still got the Dallas pick at 10. No sure thing he’s available there, of course.

Ah right. Yeah I assume he will be gone before 10. But you are right: no guarantee.

[subzero02]

The announcer has obviously practiced these names quite a bit...

[brevity]

DBR Chat? We're all watching the same thing, and the first hour is Duke heavy.

[weezie]

Wow that's great seeing the crowds watching in New Orleans.

[dukelifer]

DBR Chat? We're all watching the same thing, and the first hour is Duke heavy.

Makes sense- perfect for trivia

[JetpackJesus]

DBR Chat? We're all watching the same thing, and the first hour is Duke heavy.

Seems like a good idea. But moonpie has to chat from the present, not the future.

EDIT: Does the chat just work all the time, or does an admin need to do something to activate it? It seems like you can access it (https://forums.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/misc.php?do=cchatbox) whenever you want.

[brevity]

Wow that's great seeing the crowds watching in New Orleans.

I got home 15 minutes ago, and I am still cooling down. Those people are insane.

[weezie]

Adorable smile Z!
Makes us so proud.

[BigZ]

Zion will be better than AD. He won’t stuff the stat sheet but will have a winning impact which AD didn’t have.

[brevity]

The chat room is open (https://forums.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/misc.php?do=cchatbox), for now.

https://forums.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/misc.php?do=cchatbox

Be on your best behavior, please. Board rules apply.

[CameronBornAndBred]

Morant might be the #2 pick, but ESPN doesn't care who he is.

9538

[subzero02]

Zion will be better than AD. He won’t stuff the stat sheet but will have a winning impact which AD didn’t have.


AD had a winning impact at Kentucky and he took NO to the playoffs twice. I hope that Zion will be better than AD but I wouldn't bet on it. I don't think AD has peaked yet and he's already a top 5 or 6 player in the league.

[Duke79UNLV77]

AD had a winning impact at Kentucky and he took NO to the playoffs twice. I hope that Zion will be better than AD but I wouldn't bet on it. I don't think AD has peaked yet and he's already a top 5 or 6 player in the league.

AD seems to get a free pass for winning little and openly quitting on his team midseason.

Are number of tears at the draft Zion’s first NBA record?

[AZLA]

Atlanta did well with HUNTER and CAM. Cam is going to be a good long term pro.

[arnie]

Atlanta did well with HUNTER and CAM. Cam is going to be a good long term pro.

Nassir Little droppin* like a rock. Will not be a lottery pick.

[nmduke2001]

I believe that Cam will be a better pro than RJ. I think Cam’s defense is highly underrated and a dude with that form will figure out his shooting issues.

[JasonEvans]

1) Elated that the Hawks still got Reddish with the #10. Love the Hunter pick too. Yeah, they gave up a lot, but I love 3&D guys to surround Collins and especially Trae and the hawks may have just taken the two best 3&D guys in the draft

2) Cam Johnson went at least 10 picks higher than he should have. Shows you that NBA teams really, really value shooting... but then why is no one taking Carson Edwards?

3) I have it on good authority that Nassir Little is crying in the green room. He may end up being the real draft version of the DBr Mock Draft Romeo Langford

4) No one... NO ONE... will make a louder fashion statement than Tyler Hero. I want to give a shout out to his grandmother for stitching that thing from her bedroom curtains. Really nice of her to give up her favorite heirloom like that.

[JasonEvans]

Okeke at #16?!?!? I love the kid, but I think he would have still been on the board for at least 10 more picks.

[Acymetric]

The biggest question here is how Jason Evans feels about the Hawks' draft so far.

Edit: And now we know...should have refreshed before posting!

[CoachJ10]

Question from my wife...”Did Zion, RJ and Cam take final exams”.

I said of course...am I right?

[JNort]

Obviously it's early and I hate saying it because I despise them but the Hawks have had one of the best drafts I've ever seen in my life time. If they somehow move back up and get a rim running center or a back up point it will be insane.


O and I'm a real wanker for saying this.I'm a real wanker for saying this.I'm a real wanker for saying this.I'm a real wanker for saying this. the mother I'm a real wanker for saying this.I'm a real wanker for saying this.I'm a real wanker for saying this.I'm a real wanker for saying this.ing Hornets they can go I'm a real wanker for saying this.I'm a real wanker for saying this.I'm a real wanker for saying this.I'm a real wanker for saying this. themselves. Maybe I'll look stupid in a few years but WTF. I would have taken at a minimum 7 other guys there over PJ. We deserve every loss we get, I feel for Kemba and would personally drive him to whatever other team he wants to just to get him away from this I'm a real wanker for saying this.I'm a real wanker for saying this.I'm a real wanker for saying this.I'm a real wanker for saying this. franchise.

[Acymetric]

Question from my wife...”Did Zion, RJ and Cam take final exams”.

I said of course...am I right?

If they didn't, I think they would be the first gys in the OAD era to bail on school after the season. I'm under the impression all our guys left school in good academic standing (which would require taking and passing finals, presumably).

[Acymetric]

3) I have it on good authority that Nassir Little is crying in the green room. He may end up being the real draft version of the DBr Mock Draft Romeo Langford

I kinda feel bad for the guy...finally came to his senses and left unc and this is his reward?


4) No one... NO ONE... will make a louder fashion statement than Tyler Hero. I want to give a shout out to his grandmother for stitching that thing from her bedroom curtains. Really nice of her to give up her favorite heirloom like that.

That suit was fly as hell.

[DarkstarWahoo]

It screws with APR if they don’t, right?

[arnie]

It screws with APR if they don’t, right?

Should I be concerned that Roy has fixed the draft. If Nassir not drafted, he can go back to Cheats.

[JetpackJesus]

It screws with APR if they don’t, right?
I believe so. It's a requirement for players leaving early to be in good standing when they leave school. I assume that requires completing all courses during your final semester.

[JasonEvans]

None of the teams drafting right now have scouted Little at all. Uh-oh...

[Bluedog]

Yeah, the OAD guys at Duke definitely take final exams, but honestly they schedule courses that afford them major flexibility and some of these have things in lieu of an actual exam (e.g. paper, etc.). And the professors probably give them some leeway to take it as a more convenient time or other accommodations. I mean, Cam Reddish was sitting courtside at a Lakers game the week after Duke was eliminated from the NCAA tournament (during the week). I certainly believe Duke holds these guys to a high standard and Coach K expects a lot of them -- and balancing all their priorities is amazing given the time commitment of being a Duke basketball player -- but we're kidding ourselves if we think they're going through the "normal" end of semester academic stuff that a typical Duke student is. They've been prepping like crazy for the draft.

[brlftz]

Man, first DJ to the Giants, and now RJ to the Knicks. New York sports weighted pretty heavily our way these days.

[JasonEvans]

What kind of odds could I have gotten in Vegas on Grant Williams, Cam Johnson, and Matisse Thybulle going before Little? 15-1? 30-1? 100-1?

[JasonEvans]

Man, first DJ to the Giants, and now RJ to the Knicks. New York sports weighted pretty heavily our way these days.

And Kyrie is about 90% to the Nets

[Steven43]

2) Cam Johnson went at least 10 picks higher than he should have. Shows you that NBA teams really, really value shooting... but then why is no one taking Carson Edwards?.
Maybe because Johnson is 6’9” and Edwards is 6’1”.

[JNort]

How are the fine folks at IC handling the slip and slide that is Little? I assume they are mostly trashing the fan base that liked him saying Roy was right.

[downeastdad]

Damn. My Blazers ended up with Little. Now I gotta root for McCollum and a Tarhole.
downeastdad (and Lehigh grad)

[duke74]

Man, first DJ to the Giants, and now RJ to the Knicks. New York sports weighted pretty heavily our way these days.

And we NYers love it!

[Steven43]

AD seems to get a free pass for winning little and openly quitting on his team midseason.

Are number of tears at the draft Zion’s first NBA record?

I think your point about Anthony Davis openly quitting on his team is very relevant. There should be a lot more discussion about this by sports commentators, the majority of whom have been lauding Davis for the past few days as essentially being on the level as his teammate, Lebron James. He isn’t.

He has not shown himself to be the type of player, like James, who helps his teammates reach a significantly higher level than they otherwise would have. I’m talking about all-time greats such as Larry Bird, Michael Jordan, Lebron James, Magic Johnson, Kareem Abdul Jabbar, Tim Duncan, Kawhi Leonard, etc. And not only is Davis not this type of player (though they are talking about him as if he is), but he actually went the opposite direction and sabotaged his team.

[Steven43]

Damn. My Blazers ended up with Little. Now I gotta root for McCollum and a Tar Heel.
downeastdad (and Lehigh grad)

Any insight into why Little fell so far from where he had been projected?

[bedeviled]

Any insight into why Little fell so far from where he had been projected?Sports Illustrated draft coverage mentioned two related issues:
1) He did well in high school because the ball was always in his hands. Never found his place in college with others driving the ship. In NBA, the ball will definitely be controlled by other players.
2) NBA execs concerned that he won't do well with a short shot clock because he wasn't able to understand offensive sets

[BigZ]

None of the teams drafting right now have scouted Little at all. Uh-oh...

They turned on UNC games so they didn’t see him

[Steven43]

They turned on UNC games so they didn’t see him

Clever. And somewhat true.

[Steven43]

And we NYers love it!

I’m really happy that R.J. went to the Knicks. I’d like to see him make that team his own. Plus, I love him having such a potentially large stage.

[Dukehk]

Apparently there were rumours that the Lakers traded up to get the 46th pick to try and draft Bol Bol. Only for him to be taken 2 picks earlier. :D

[MHNOLADevil]

Reporting in from New Orleans. This city is beyond stoked for Zion and Duke Gulf South. Check out the photos, including some nice ones of Jah. http://https://expo.nola.com/sports/g66l-2019/06/85cfa649292214/new-orleans-pelicans-fans-celebrate-pick-of-zion-williamson-see-photos-from-fulton-alley.html

[jacone21]

Reporting in from New Orleans. This city is beyond stoked for Zion and Duke Gulf South. Check out the photos, including some nice ones of Jah. https://expo.nola.com/sports/g66l-2019/06/85cfa649292214/new-orleans-pelicans-fans-celebrate-pick-of-zion-williamson-see-photos-from-fulton-alley.html

Fixed the link for you.

Also... OUCH! Too soon.

https://expo.advance.net/img/9587dfe54e/width960/062_21pelsdraftparty10.jpeg

[MHNOLADevil]

Reporting in from New Orleans. This city is beyond stoked for Zion and Duke Gulf South. Check out the photos, including some nice ones of Jah. http://https://expo.nola.com/sports/g66l-2019/06/85cfa649292214/new-orleans-pelicans-fans-celebrate-pick-of-zion-williamson-see-photos-from-fulton-alley.html

http://expo.nola.com/sports/g66l-2019/06/85cfa649292214/new-orleans-pelicans-fans-celebrate-pick-of-zion-williamson-see-photos-from-fulton-alley.html

[proelitedota]

https://www.dukechronicle.com/article/2019/06/duke-mens-basketball-marques-bolden-nba-draft

Marques signs with the Cavs.

[UrinalCake]

They turned on UNC games so they didn’t see him

Then they went looking for him in a classroom, and still couldn’t find him.

[brevity]

https://www.dukechronicle.com/article/2019/06/duke-mens-basketball-marques-bolden-nba-draft

Marques signs with the Cavs.

The annual argument: is it better to be drafted late in the second round or to have some sense of choosing a team as an undrafted free agent?

I like the idea that, should Marques Bolden play well enough in Summer League to earn a roster spot, he’ll have John Beilein as a coach, rather than some NBA retread. His staff now has a Duke connection, too: Beilein hired Antonio Lang (https://www.nba.com/cavaliers/releases/lang-assistant-coach-190619) away from Utah as an assistant coach.

[accfanfrom1970]

Will be looking forward to a post FA signing wrap up. So many 2nd round trades, team-by-team analysis when it’s all said and done will be a chance to really evaluate. Really interested to see where guys other than Bolden sign (Dawkins,Fall).

[lotusland]

I’m excited to watch some NOLA games next year with Zion at Duke South and I watched almost no NBA this year. Zion, Ingram and Cam should be able to defend after some time together. As a fan of post play I’m really rooting hard for Jah to turn the corner too.

[Dr. Rosenrosen]

I’m excited to watch some NOLA games next year with Zion at Duke South and I watched almost no NBA this year. Zion, Ingram and Cam should be able to defend after some time together. As a fan of post play I’m really rooting hard for Jah to turn the corner too.
Cam?

[bundabergdevil]

Bol Bol may need to change his name to Womp Womp. Feel bad for the guy, think his was among the longest green room falls and waits. Hope he stays healthy and proves 'em all wrong.

[lotusland]

Cam?

Oops thought I saw a headline last night that Cam ended up with the Pelicans. Too bad. That would have been some insane length with with Ingram and Reddish.

[Dr. Rosenrosen]

Oops thought I saw a headline last night that Cam ended up with the Pelicans. Too bad. That would have been some insane length with with Ingram and Reddish.
For a minute it looked possible when the pelicans had the 8th pick but alas.

[DevilYouKnow]

Wasn't Nassir supposed to be a top five pick going into his freshman season?

I guess he got MacAdoo'ed.

Coby and Cam Johnson did well, though.

[weezie]

Bolden to cle training camp?

[DarkstarWahoo]

Wasn't Nassir supposed to be a top five pick going into his freshman season?

I guess he got MacAdoo'ed.

Coby and Cam Johnson did well, though.

Speaking of which...I will take whatever medicine I get for speaking well of a Heel on this board, but this video of White learning about Johnson getting picked is...kind of adorable?

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=XukBLPLh-rQ

[Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15]

Speaking of which...I will take whatever medicine I get for speaking well of a Heel on this board, but this video of White learning about Johnson getting picked is...kind of adorable?

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=XukBLPLh-rQ

I also saw that and agree that it's more charm thab one would expect from a Heel. And I will certainly catch heat for this, but I sorta.... "like" Coby White.

I'll turn in my badge and gun before I leave.

[CrazyNotCrazie]

I also saw that and agree that it's more charm thab one would expect from a Heel. And I will certainly catch heat for this, but I sorta... "like" Coby White.

I'll turn in my badge and gun before I leave.

Unlike many here I am also occasionally able to be rational and put aside my pro-Duke/anti-Carolina bias and appreciate something Tar Heel related. I too enjoy watching Coby White play (as long as it isn't against Duke) and I think he is going to really help Wendell's career.

[BD80]

I also saw that and agree that it's more charm thab one would expect from a Heel. And I will certainly catch heat for this, but I sorta... "like" Coby White.

I'll turn in my badge and gun before I leave.

On occasion, the heels would bring it a really good kid, talented and worth rooting for.

We now know that this was to cover up for all of the less than likeable cesspool underlying the entire carolina athletics department and administration.

But a few of the kids are genuinely likeable.

[elvis14]

Damn. My Blazers ended up with Little. Now I gotta root for McCollum and a Tar Heel.
downeastdad (and Lehigh grad)

No worries, Little will be on the bench. It's kinda like when MacaDon't was on the GSW, everyone still wanted the Warriors to win because JMM didn't see the floor anyway.


Any insight into why Little fell so far from where he had been projected?

He's not very good and he didn't grow much at UNCheat and he came from a college system that doesn't translate into the NBA well. Other than that, it makes no sense because the guys on IC were saying how he was better than Zion just a few months ago...


Wasn't Nassir supposed to be a top five pick going into his freshman season?

I guess he got MacAdoo'ed.

Coby and Cam Johnson did well, though.

The Bulls made a mistake with Coby. He'd get hot and have some good games but I was not impressed overall. The Cheater system really give PG's a chance to shine and Coby did OK but for a top 10 draft pick...nope.

Any recruits watching the NBA draft should take note of what just happened with Naz Little...

9F, as always. I'm a real wanker for saying this.I'm a real wanker for saying this.I'm a real wanker for saying this.I'm a real wanker for saying this.ing Cheaters.

[elvis14]

On occasion, the heels would bring it a really good kid, talented and worth rooting for.

We now know that this was to cover up for all of the less than likeable cesspool underlying the entire carolina athletics department and administration.

But a few of the kids are genuinely likeable.

Nope.

[Indoor66]

Nope.

Would you like to elaborate? 😂

[Edouble]

Zion set an unofficial record for shortest time in the green room. He was the last to enter (players are introduced/announced alphabetically) and the first to leave.

Zion-mania continues. I have never seen that much extended coverage of a player after they are drafted.

I've never heard the Barclay's crowd and the Knicks fans cheer for any of their picks, ever. They wanted RJ. That was pretty cool.

Tacko Fall was not mentioned one time in the entire broadcast.

Coby White is weird. When they told him about Cam Johnson he just kept saying "that's crazy" (not "that's awesome" or "that's great"). Also, he has resting sad clown face and I will never cheer for any cheat.

[Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15]

No worries, Little will be on the bench. It's kinda like when MacaDon't was on the GSW, everyone still wanted the Warriors to win because JMM didn't see the floor anyway.



He's not very good and he didn't grow much at UNCheat and he came from a college system that doesn't translate into the NBA well. Other than that, it makes no sense because the guys on IC were saying how he was better than Zion just a few months ago...



The Bulls made a mistake with Coby. He'd get hot and have some good games but I was not impressed overall. The Cheater system really give PG's a chance to shine and Coby did OK but for a top 10 draft pick...nope.

Any recruits watching the NBA draft should take note of what just happened with Naz Little...

9F, as always. I'm a real wanker for saying this.I'm a real wanker for saying this.I'm a real wanker for saying this.I'm a real wanker for saying this.ing Cheaters.

I do agree that Nassir Little is excellent for the Roy Williams legacy and will be a great recruiting tool.

[PackMan97]

Jalen Lecque (undrafted, almost NC State) signed a four year deal with Phoenix, two of which are guaranteed.

https://www.brightsideofthesun.com/2019/6/20/18700333/undrafted-guard-jalen-lecque-signing-phoenix-suns


Signing him right away for two guaranteed years is surprising considering that the Suns just gave similar contract to Elie Okobo and De’Anthony Melton last year, who are both raw and play the same position as Lecque. According to Early Bird Rights, Lecque is projected to make $897,158 next season, the absolute minimum salary a player can earn in the NBA, generally only given to rookie second-round picks.

I guess that worked out well for him.

[left_hook_lacey]

I’m excited to watch some NOLA games next year with Zion at Duke South and I watched almost no NBA this year. Zion, Ingram and Cam should be able to defend after some time together. As a fan of post play I’m really rooting hard for Jah to turn the corner too.

Went to NOLA for the first time Christmas 2017. Me and Mrs. Lefthook have been looking for an excuse to get back there. Now we have one. I see several weekend trips to catch a Pelicans game in our future. :)

[sagegrouse]

Unlike many here I am also occasionally able to be rational and put aside my pro-Duke/anti-Carolina bias and appreciate something Tar Heel related. I too enjoy watching Coby White play (as long as it isn't against Duke) and I think he is going to really help Wendell's career.

I got nothing against Heels unless they have earned it independent from their UNC affiliation: McInnes, Makhtiar Ndiaye, Hansbrough, PJ and a couple of others. I am even softening on those who earned disdain but seem to have grown up: Rasheed, Vince Carter

[CrazyNotCrazie]

I got nothing against Heels unless they have earned it independent from their UNC affiliation: McInnes, Makhtiar Ndiaye, Hansbrough, PJ and a couple of others. I am even softening on those who earned disdain but seem to have grown up: Rasheed, Vince Carter

I agree with you. I don't want to take this discussion off track but there are many people here who hate all things Tar Heel, no matter what. I dislike most things Tar Heel, but I am more rational about it and can appreciate the occasional good things that come out of Chapel Hill - I have a few close friends and colleagues who went there and there have been some fairly likeable athletes to come out of Chapel Hill as well.

[Reddevil]

I thought highly of both Rui Hachimora and Cam Johnson and I was glad to see it reflected in the draft.

I was never impressed with Nassir Little and I was glad to see it reflected in the draft.

It was fun and bizarre to see Wendell Carter Jr. welcome Coby White to the Bulls.

I think the GSW made a fantastic second round pick in Erik Pashcall from Nova. They will need him, and I think he will deliver.

[Pghdukie]

Bolden signs FA contract with Cavs