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DavidBenAkiva
02-14-2019, 02:25 PM
The ACC today announced the future conference matchups (http://theacc.com/news/2019/2/14/acc-announces-future-mens-basketball-20-game-opponents.aspx) for all members.

For Duke, the schedule looks like this:

2019-20: Rivals (home-and-home): UNC, Wake Forest; Repeats (home-and-home): BC, Miami, NC State, VA Tech; Home only: FSU, Louisville, Notre Dame, Pitt; Away only: Clemson, GA Tech, Syracuse, Virginia
2020-21: Rivals: UNC, Wake Forest; Repeats: GA Tech, Louisville, Notre Dame, Pitt; Home only: BC, Clemson, Syracuse, Virginia; Away only: FSU, Miami, NC State, VA Tech
2021-22: Rivals: UNC, Wake Forest; Repeats: Clemson, FSU, Syracuse, Virginia; Home only: GA Tech, Miami, NC State, VA Tech; Away only: BC, Louisville, Notre Dame, Pitt

The 2019-20 schedule looks, at least from right now, to be softer than this season. There is only one matchup with Virginia, although it is an away game. Louisville could be really good next year in Chris Mack's second season. Pitt and Notre Dame will both be better, so better to see those three teams at home next season. I expect Clemson, who will lose 5 players from their current team, to fall off a cliff next season. Syracuse might be weaker next season, too, if Tyus Battle leaves along with Frank Howard and Paschal Chukwu. And VA Tech might be a bit weaker next season as senior PG Justin Robinson graduates (they have looked terrible without him out to injury) and assuming Nickeil Alexander-Walker goes to the NBA Draft. The Hokies do bring in a good recruiting class. All in all, this looks like a suitable schedule for what should be a competitive Duke team.

uh_no
02-14-2019, 02:42 PM
The ACC today announced the future conference matchups (http://theacc.com/news/2019/2/14/acc-announces-future-mens-basketball-20-game-opponents.aspx) for all members.

For Duke, the schedule looks like this:

2019-20: Rivals (home-and-home): UNC, Wake Forest; Repeats (home-and-home): BC, Miami, NC State, VA Tech; Home only: FSU, Louisville, Notre Dame, Pitt; Away only: Clemson, GA Tech, Syracuse, Virginia
2020-21: Rivals: UNC, Wake Forest; Repeats: GA Tech, Louisville, Notre Dame, Pitt; Home only: BC, Clemson, Syracuse, Virginia; Away only: FSU, Miami, NC State, VA Tech
2021-22: Rivals: UNC, Wake Forest; Repeats: Clemson, FSU, Syracuse, Virginia; Home only: GA Tech, Miami, NC State, VA Tech; Away only: BC, Louisville, Notre Dame, Pitt

The 2019-20 schedule looks, at least from right now, to be softer than this season. There is only one matchup with Virginia, although it is an away game. Louisville could be really good next year in Chris Mack's second season. Pitt and Notre Dame will both be better, so better to see those three teams at home next season. I expect Clemson, who will lose 5 players from their current team, to fall off a cliff next season. Syracuse might be weaker next season, too, if Tyus Battle leaves along with Frank Howard and Paschal Chukwu. And VA Tech might be a bit weaker next season as senior PG Justin Robinson graduates (they have looked terrible without him out to injury) and assuming Nickeil Alexander-Walker goes to the NBA Draft. The Hokies do bring in a good recruiting class. All in all, this looks like a suitable schedule for what should be a competitive Duke team.


I wish the ACC would do kind of like the NFL....for the 6 extra games (or 4 if you exclude "rivals") the top 7 teams each play eachother twice, and the next 7 play eachother twice....or something to that effect.

Obviously you couldn't do it THAT cleanly...but it would make for great basketball and help lower teams to perform a bit better...And then the guys at the top couldn't complain that one had an easier or harder set of h+h at least. I think everyone would complain, though, since the people at the top would have to play hard teams, and the people at the bototm wouldn't get h&h with the teams that bring in fans.

But it would be amazing basketball.

Imagine if h+h next year were
-uva
-unc
-UL
-vt
-cuse
-fsu
-ncsu

That would be a lot of darn good games in cameron. guaranteed. every year.

and what if wake got an easy schedule and was able to pick up some wins and attention and get some recruits in?

It's like pro-rel in a bit more of a continuous fashion.

AustinDevil
02-14-2019, 02:58 PM
I wish the ACC would do kind of like the NFL...for the 6 extra games (or 4 if you exclude "rivals") the top 7 teams each play eachother twice, and the next 7 play eachother twice...or something to that effect.

Obviously you couldn't do it THAT cleanly...but it would make for great basketball and help lower teams to perform a bit better...And then the guys at the top couldn't complain that one had an easier or harder set of h+h at least. I think everyone would complain, though, since the people at the top would have to play hard teams, and the people at the bototm wouldn't get h&h with the teams that bring in fans.

But it would be amazing basketball.

Imagine if h+h next year were
-uva
-unc
-UL
-vt
-cuse
-fsu
-ncsu

That would be a lot of darn good games in cameron. guaranteed. every year.

and what if wake got an easy schedule and was able to pick up some wins and attention and get some recruits in?

It's like pro-rel in a bit more of a continuous fashion.

It would also let flourishing rivalries at the top of the current conference continue, even if they weren't so hot when the "rival" pairings were made (hi, Yooveeeay). In fact, if permanent rivals were re-set today, is it a given that Duke-Wake would happen again, over Duke-UVa (or maybe Duke-State, if State wanted to sign up for two v Duke and two v UNC every year?).

English
02-14-2019, 03:30 PM
It would also let flourishing rivalries at the top of the current conference continue, even if they weren't so hot when the "rival" pairings were made (hi, Yooveeeay). In fact, if permanent rivals were re-set today, is it a given that Duke-Wake would happen again, over Duke-UVa (or maybe Duke-State, if State wanted to sign up for two v Duke and two v UNC every year?).

I'm curious if more State fans would be horrified at having Duke & unx as their pre-set rivals, or would they appreciate the traditional triangle arrangement. I've heard plenty of folks around here bemoan going years without playing State in football, but I don't really feel that way. Just curious.

scottdude8
02-14-2019, 03:33 PM
Next year's schedule actually looks relatively favorable, as we avoid Louisville and FSU on the road and three of our four "only road" games are quite winnable. Playing Virginia only once, on the road, is obviously not ideal though.

2020 looks significantly more challenging with each of our "only road" games against tough teams/venues (N.C. State, Miami, FSU and Virginia Tech), and two games against Louisville. However, Virginia and Syracuse only at home is a plus.

2021 isn't as bad as 2020 in terms of the home/road split, but we have bad luck with our "home-and home" matchups as we double up against Virginia, FSU, Syracuse, and Virginia.

Unfortunately, winning the ACC Regular Season title going forward is going to be as much about schedule luck (how many times are you playing the other top teams, and where?) as how good of a team you are... we're already seeing that play out in the 20 game B1G schedule this year (it could come back to bite my Wolverines, especially after our horrible loss to PSU this week... Michigan has to play MSU and Maryland both twice over the last 6 games, along with a tough road game at Minnesota). After a cursory glance, it looks like next year's schedule may be the most reasonable in that regard.

HereBeforeCoachK
02-14-2019, 03:35 PM
Unfortunately, winning the ACC Regular Season title going forward is going to be as much about schedule luck (how many times are you playing the other top teams, and where?) as how good of a team you are... .

It has been that way for a number of years IMO.

DarkstarWahoo
02-14-2019, 08:10 PM
I wish the ACC would do kind of like the NFL...for the 6 extra games (or 4 if you exclude "rivals") the top 7 teams each play eachother twice, and the next 7 play eachother twice...or something to that effect.

Obviously you couldn't do it THAT cleanly...but it would make for great basketball and help lower teams to perform a bit better...And then the guys at the top couldn't complain that one had an easier or harder set of h+h at least. I think everyone would complain, though, since the people at the top would have to play hard teams, and the people at the bototm wouldn't get h&h with the teams that bring in fans.

But it would be amazing basketball.

Imagine if h+h next year were
-uva
-unc
-UL
-vt
-cuse
-fsu
-ncsu

That would be a lot of darn good games in cameron. guaranteed. every year.

and what if wake got an easy schedule and was able to pick up some wins and attention and get some recruits in?

It's like pro-rel in a bit more of a continuous fashion.

CUSA is doing something like this starting next week. Really interested to see how it works.

https://www.dailypress.com/sports/dp-spt-miller-cusa-20190213-story.html

sagegrouse
02-14-2019, 08:31 PM
I wish the ACC would do kind of like the NFL...for the 6 extra games (or 4 if you exclude "rivals") the top 7 teams each play eachother twice, and the next 7 play eachother twice...or something to that effect.

Obviously you couldn't do it THAT cleanly...but it would make for great basketball and help lower teams to perform a bit better...And then the guys at the top couldn't complain that one had an easier or harder set of h+h at least. I think everyone would complain, though, since the people at the top would have to play hard teams, and the people at the bototm wouldn't get h&h with the teams that bring in fans.

But it would be amazing basketball.

Imagine if h+h next year were
-uva
-unc
-UL
-vt
-cuse
-fsu
-ncsu

That would be a lot of darn good games in cameron. guaranteed. every year.

and what if wake got an easy schedule and was able to pick up some wins and attention and get some recruits in?

It's like pro-rel in a bit more of a continuous fashion.

Then there is the economics of it. Duke is the "big money" game for most of our opponents, often used as a carrot to sell season ticket plans. Who wants to surrender a home date with the Blue Devils?

uh_no
02-14-2019, 11:39 PM
Then there is the economics of it. Duke is the "big money" game for most of our opponents, often used as a carrot to sell season ticket plans. Who wants to surrender a home date with the Blue Devils?

i mentioned that bottom teams wouldn't want to surrender those games

HereBeforeCoachK
02-15-2019, 07:46 AM
Then there is the economics of it. Duke is the "big money" game for most of our opponents, often used as a carrot to sell season ticket plans. Who wants to surrender a home date with the Blue Devils?

Yep, as Duke is the money game for the TV nets......one reason we get those Saturday / Monday splits.....BIG MONDAY. Also why Duke has has so many 9 pm starts over the years.

DarkstarWahoo
02-15-2019, 09:16 AM
I think this evens things out SLIGHTLY over the medium term. Each team goes home-and-home with each other (non-permanent partner) team every three years, and the other two years are home-only and away-only. That's an improvement over where things stand now.

Even over that three-year stretch, there's disparity, of course. The permanent partners will always be an issue. You guys will have that issue with UNC always being good. We likely will be in the same boat with Louisville. It's all because the conference is just too big, but that genie has long since escaped the bottle.

DevilYouKnow
02-15-2019, 09:36 AM
Damn, no double Virginia games for a while.

I want us to play the best, as many times as we can.

gotoguy
02-15-2019, 09:44 AM
The short term good new for me is that the Devils will be in Atlanta to play Tech two years in a row, '20 and '21. Now it's every other alternating with the Cheats

DukeDevil
02-15-2019, 10:05 AM
http://www.theacc.com/common/controls/image_handler.aspx?thumb_id=12&image_path=/images/2019/2/14/18_19_ACC_MBB_FutureMatchups_Review_v3.jpg

WakeDevil
02-15-2019, 10:32 AM
I'm curious if more State fans would be horrified at having Duke & unx as their pre-set rivals, or would they appreciate the traditional triangle arrangement. I've heard plenty of folks around here bemoan going years without playing State in football, but I don't really feel that way. Just curious.

Some of us are less than excited about playing Syracuse, Pitt or the New England ratings juggernaut.

DavidBenAkiva
02-15-2019, 10:57 AM
Just noticed for UNC,next year will be a big step up in strength of schedule. They have had it quite easy the past couple of years, so it is nice to see some headwinds for once.

A home-and-home with Virginia
Away games at FSU, at Louisville, at Syracuse, and at VA Tech

DarkstarWahoo
02-15-2019, 11:14 AM
Taking a deeper dive into it, I think there's a clear five schools that have sustained long-term recent success (Duke, UNC, Louisville, Syracuse) or appear to be set up for sustainable success (UVA). Other schools have runs of being good but haven't sustained it (NCSU, FSU, Clemson, Miami, VT) or have uncertainty that makes them less likely to stay near the top (also Miami and VT). So let's look at the permanent partners for those five schools - specifically, which ones have other top schools as permanent partners:

Duke: UNC, Wake
UNC: Duke, NCSU
UVA: Louisville, VT
Louisville: UVA, Pitt
Cuse: Pitt, BC

So of those five schools, Cuse gets a sustained advantage in potential wins. On the other hand, they don't get the other top schools at home as much, so less excitement and potentially less gate.

The losers out of this (at least in terms of moving up in the standings) are the non-top teams which have permanent partners from the top teams:

Pitt: Cuse, Louisville
BC: Cuse
NCSU: UNC
VT: UVA
Wake: Duke

jv001
02-15-2019, 11:22 AM
Taking a deeper dive into it, I think there's a clear five schools that have sustained long-term recent success (Duke, UNC, Louisville, Syracuse) or appear to be set up for sustainable success (UVA). Other schools have runs of being good but haven't sustained it (NCSU, FSU, Clemson, Miami, VT) or have uncertainty that makes them less likely to stay near the top (also Miami and VT). So let's look at the permanent partners for those five schools - specifically, which ones have other top schools as permanent partners:

Duke: UNC, Wake
UNC: Duke, NCSU
UVA: Louisville, VT
Louisville: UVA, Pitt
Cuse: Pitt, BC

So of those five schools, Cuse gets a sustained advantage in potential wins. On the other hand, they don't get the other top schools at home as much, so less excitement and potentially less gate.

The losers out of this (at least in terms of moving up in the standings) are the non-top teams which have permanent partners from the top teams:

Pitt: Cuse, Louisville
BC: Cuse
NCSU: UNC
VT: UVA
Wake: Duke

You guys don't get any favors with Louisville and VT. I think VT will be pretty good as long as Buzz is there and Mack will have Louisville up there with the best teams in the conference. GoDuke!

Just noticed your away games are not bad.

uh_no
02-15-2019, 11:28 AM
the New England ratings juggernaut.

you must mean BC, right?

Sir Stealth
02-15-2019, 11:46 AM
I'm not a big fan of the current overbloated conference but I will say that at least the permanent rivals do fit together pretty well. The one that seems to have the least historical tie is probably UVA-Louisville, which at least has state continguity albeit with a mountain range in between. Georgia Tech and Notre Dame at least have some football history that fits them together decently. It's still dumb that Louisville is in the ACC and not Maryland.

jv001
02-15-2019, 11:52 AM
I'm not a big fan of the current overbloated conference but I will say that at least the permanent rivals do fit together pretty well. The one that seems to have the least historical tie is probably UVA-Louisville, which at least has state continguity albeit with a mountain range in between. Georgia Tech and Notre Dame at least have some football history that fits them together decently. It's still dumb that Louisville is in the ACC and not Maryland.

I want no part of the terps in the ACC. Their fans spoiled that for me. They are not our rivals. GoDuke!

sagegrouse
02-15-2019, 11:58 AM
you must mean BC, right?

Not just TV. I watched the Pitt-BC game, and the attendance was what one would expect at an intramural championship game. Even the courtside seats were largely empty.

tbyers11
02-15-2019, 12:03 PM
Not just TV. I watched the Pitt-BC game, and the attendance was what one would expect at an intramural championship game. Even the courtside seats were largely empty.

BC basketball attendance is generally poor. However, as I was in Boston for work Tuesday night I can attest to the fact the Boston was getting 4-6 inches of snow that was turning to freezing rain/sleet from ~4pm onward Tuesday evening. That likely played a role in the even worse than normal attendance.

Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15
02-15-2019, 12:33 PM
http://www.theacc.com/common/controls/image_handler.aspx?thumb_id=12&image_path=/images/2019/2/14/18_19_ACC_MBB_FutureMatchups_Review_v3.jpg

That's a great graphic. Very helpful for visualizing the match ups.

ACCfaninVirginia
02-15-2019, 01:35 PM
I'm not a big fan of the current overbloated conference but I will say that at least the permanent rivals do fit together pretty well. The one that seems to have the least historical tie is probably UVA-Louisville, which at least has state continguity albeit with a mountain range in between. Georgia Tech and Notre Dame at least have some football history that fits them together decently. It's still dumb that Louisville is in the ACC and not Maryland.

Then Maryland walked, so the league stuck Louisville in rather than redo the entire grid. At least as long as Bennett is at Virginia and K at Duke, I wish they played H&A every year - and the netowrks would love that too since those 2 games have been the highest ratings this year.

Chris Mack seems to be doing well at L'ville - I believe they will be a contender in the top 4-5 every year.

-jk
02-15-2019, 05:01 PM
I want no part of the terps in the ACC. Their fans spoiled that for me. They are not our rivals. GoDuke!

While I miss UMd, I don't miss worrying about my car with a Duke sticker, or - worse yet - not putting one on my latest one.

Some of my MD neighbors are really wigged out...

-jk

HereBeforeCoachK
02-15-2019, 05:17 PM
Not just TV. I watched the Pitt-BC game, and the attendance was what one would expect at an intramural championship game. Even the courtside seats were largely empty.

Yeah, it had that Wally Wade noon kick quality to it.......

BandAlum83
02-15-2019, 06:14 PM
The short term good new for me is that the Devils will be in Atlanta to play Tech two years in a row, '20 and '21. Now it's every other alternating with the Cheats

I'm with you on that!