MBB: Duke 72, UVA 70 Post-Game Thread

[JBDuke]

Put your post-game thoughts here.

[curtis325]

Great win with horrible FT shooting.

[fuse]

Wow. What an amazing basketball game!!!!!

[Troublemaker]

"Duke is never the underdog!!!" - Quinn Cook, 2015.

Shame on anyone who forgot.

(Especially in Cameron).

[Mak P]

RJ made clutch Ft's, if he can consistently put together efficient games like this, we got this even without Tre

[Bob Green]

Outstanding basketball game! Tonight is a perfect example of why we all LOVE college basketball. :cool:

[CDu]

That was fantastic! What an effort from our top six. Just never let up all night. A well-earned victory, and we maintain control of our own destiny. Loved pretty much everything about this. To light up the best defense in the country without our PG is phenomenal.

[jhmoss1812]

I'll just get my congrats in right now. Neither team shot the ball very well from the outside but Zion and Barrett were just unguardable on the drive. Impressive to win without Tre as well. Looking forward to the rematch in a few weeks. Hope Tre is healthy and can go then. I still feel good about my team but I knew Duke would be the toughest matchup for us. Really hope we can avoid you down the road. Here's to staying healthy.

[lmb]

Not perfect, but gutsy and determined. Amazing win!

[arnie]

Everyone can now apologize to RJ. What a finish for Mr. Canada.

[TKG]

Great decision by K to have Z inbound the ball in the final minute.

[DukeWarhead]

Ecstatic with the win. Scratching my head about 3 point shooting but who cares right now!!! Awesome

[Troublemaker]

Everyone can now apologize to RJ. What a finish for Mr. Canada.

I enjoyed watching RJ Barrett's hero balls.

[MartyClark]

I'll just get my congrats in right now. Neither team shot the ball very well from the outside but Zion and Barrett were just unguardable on the drive. Impressive to win without Tre as well. Looking forward to the rematch in a few weeks. Hope Tre is healthy and can go then. I still feel good about my team but I knew Duke would be the toughest matchup for us. Really hope we can avoid you down the road. Here's to staying healthy.

Very gracious. Virginia is really good. I wish them great success this year except against Duke.

[Dub]

Great win by the good guys. RJ and Zion were amazing. Need to work on those FTs fellas. Game shouldn’t have been this close. Defense made just enough stops and we did this without our floor general and the best perimeter defender in the country. Hope Tre sits out until he’s 100%.

Per the usual, in-game thread disappointingly had quite a bit of RJ bashing. I don’t think some of our fans truly appreciate how good he is. He’s a volume shooter and will always be a volume shooter. He’s a freshmen arguably leading the most watched College Basketball team in America. He’s under a microscope every game but I’m sure glad he’s on our side. On to the next one...

[tbyers11]

"Duke is never the underdog!!!" - Quinn Cook, 2015.

Shame on anyone who forgot.

(Especially in Cameron).

Great call. That's why I keep in my signature.

Dec 3rd, 2014 @Wisconsin to be exact

[CDu]

Everyone can now apologize to RJ. What a finish for Mr. Canada.

I mean, no. He has been inefficient this year. That is a fact. One shouldn’t have to apologize for noting facts.

He was not inefficient tonight, and I loved it.

[Saratoga2]

Great game plan by coach K and executed well with RJ and Zion carrying the team. Very little 3 point attempts which was smart, lorts of driving to the basket. Zion was great on defense and rebounding. Barrett is phenominal.

Our FT shooting is a work in progress as is Cam. Bolden was important in this win while Javin was way too foul prone. Maybe we will see Tre back for the next game. Hope so as he gives us even better defense and even better points off turnovers. No undefeated teams left.

[proelitedota]

This game was anti-GSW. Who needs pace and space when you can pain train with Lebarkley.

[Troublemaker]

I mean, no. He has been inefficient this year. That is a fact. One shouldn’t have to apologize for noting facts.

He was not inefficient tonight, and I loved it.

I think he was referring to the in-game bash fest. And RJ's had average to above average efficiency, not poor efficiency, this season. You have to adjust for usage.

[DukeWarhead]

Dumb question, but I had to watch the game with the sound off. Looked like Cameron was electric as it should have been. Was it loud??

[lotusland]

Great win and great performance from Zion and R.J. I thought folks were hard on Bolden in chat. K switched 1-5 which is asking a lot from your center but he played hard all night. UVA depends on the 3 more than Duke and they shot 18% from behind the arc and didn’t get a lot of clean looks.

Surprised AOC didn’t get in but a minute or so considering how bad we shot but the game plan worked.

[MaxAMillion]

I mean, no. He has been inefficient this year. That is a fact. One shouldn’t have to apologize for noting facts.

He was not inefficient tonight, and I loved it.

One should apologize for bashing him before the game even ends. People can’t wait to trash him or any other Duke player 8n a game thread who does anything the least bit disappointing.

[arnie]

Great game plan by coach K and executed well with RJ and Zion carrying the team. Very little 3 point attempts which was smart, lorts of driving to the basket. Zion was great on defense and rebounding. Barrett is phenominal.

Our FT shooting is a work in progress as is Cam. Bolden was important in this win while Javin was way too foul prone. Maybe we will see Tre back for the next game. Hope so as he gives us even better defense and even better points off turnovers. No undefeated teams left.

May be wrong, but don’t remember taking a 3 in the last 15 or so minutes- think K shut that down. Javin’s line is humorous, all “0s” except for the 5 fouls.

[Phredd3]

RJ was sooooo good this game. Hugely efficient, as he needed to be. Crucial time to figure out how to do that.

[texasdevil06]

Per the usual, in-game thread disappointingly had quite a bit of RJ bashing. I don’t think some of our fans truly appreciate how good he is.

I do. He is a fabulous young basketball player who needs to work on his outside and FT shooting. What a future he has.

[CDu]

I think he was referring to the in-game bash fest. And RJ's had average to above average efficiency, not poor efficiency, this season. You have to adjust for usage.

Ah ok. Wasn’t privy to the in-game bashing. My bad.

And apologies for my misstatement. I was referring to being inefficient in games against Power-5/top-25s. On the season he indeed had been a smidge above average thanks to steamrolling the cupcakes.

But, that’s neither here nor there if I wasn’t the target market for that post.

Either way, REALLY happy with Barrett’s performance tonight.

[dukelifer]

I enjoyed watching RJ Barrett's hero balls.

Two things- my reverse jinx worked to perfection- you are welcome. K switching to zone definitely messed with their heads a bit. Duke did what they needed to do- not pretty- just gutsy. UVa is an excellent team- just not excellent enough tonight. Duke still with a shot to win the regular season.

[dukelion]

14% from three
58% from the free throw line
No Tre
No Prob

Man this is a special team.

[DukeBlue666s]

I'll just get my congrats in right now. Neither team shot the ball very well from the outside but Zion and Barrett were just unguardable on the drive. Impressive to win without Tre as well. Looking forward to the rematch in a few weeks. Hope Tre is healthy and can go then. I still feel good about my team but I knew Duke would be the toughest matchup for us. Really hope we can avoid you down the road. Here's to staying healthy.

Wish there were more fans like you around!!!

UVA is EXTREMELY talented and there is absolutely NO reason for anyone to have their head down. I’m really glad Duke pulled this win out, but if this game were played anywhere else today, we all know the outcome would have been different. Great game from both teams!

[lotusland]

May be wrong, but don’t remember taking a 3 in the last 15 or so minutes- think K shut that down. Javin’s line is humorous, all “0s” except for the 5 fouls.

RJ and Zion were both able to penetrate and score without picking up charging fouls against the pack line so why stop. Cam had smaller guys guarding him but wasn’t able get to rim and finish as much.

[ACCfaninVirginia]

Give Coach K credit for this one - he came up with a defense that shut down the 3 point game for the most part

[Wahoo2000]

Congrats. MVP prob should go to K for going to the 1-5 switch all. We (UVa) did a good job of abusing Bolden in the switches, but it resulted in 2s, not 3s. Our big advantage coming in was the 3-ball, and that pretty much negated that. Kudos to the GOAT coach for that strategy.

I will say that it was basically a coin flip in the end (Duke shot awful from the FT line, but we shot awful in the good looks we DID get from 3 - including one from Guy at the 2 min mark that bricked and resulted in a secondary transition "and-1" bucket for Duke that PRETTY MUCH iced the game), but Duke came out on top. Excited to see the rematch with Jones healthy, but @UVa - should be another classic.

Again, congrats, but I think this only cemented what I thought coming in. All respect to Michigan and Tenn, but THESE are the two best teams in the country.

See ya in 3 weeks! (Probably for gameday again)

[kAzE]

Huge win!!!! RJ and Zion are the most talented duo Duke has ever had on the same team, and I don't think that's being hyperbolic.

Marques Bolden deserves a shout out too. He was being picked on all night long on switches, and had to play massive minutes because of Javin being Javin (he's gotta be close to 7 fouls per 40 minutes now). Great adjustment by Coach K to switch to zone to help out Marques in the 2nd half.

Plus, Marques had the game-sealing rebound and drained 2 free throws to lock up the W. Very underrated performance. If he could master the technique of going straight up to challenge shots without fouling (like Wendell Carter did, and Jack Salt in this game), he'd be a monster.

[WakeDevil]

That last FG cause a lot of money to change hands.

[BD80]

Great basketball game.

Our kids are growing up. Today was a great experience for them - suck on that Scottie Pippen.

K is a really good coach.

[DarkstarWahoo]

That last FG cause a lot of money to change hands.

Gambling is a fickle mistress.

[HereBeforeCoachK]

Gambling is a fickle mistress.

Yep, last hoop changed the original OU and the final line.......

[kAzE]

That last FG cause a lot of money to change hands.

I actually thought he released the shot after the buzzer. If so, that's even more of a bad beat.

[simplyluvin]

Heckuva win. I’ll take it. Both teams played the same game today: no perimeter offense and a lot of dribble penetration and excellent finishing in the paint. Difference was we have RJ and Zion.

Worried about our outside shooting and free throws, but I’ll save that for another thread and savor this win.

[devilsince1977]

What a great win. No Tre, 8 turnovers against VA and 1 was a BS offensive foul against Cam. The team played very strong. RJ has a lot of Laettner in him. Zion is a beast. They had no answer. Cam is still struggling on the offensive end, but he made a few good plays on D. Virginia is a very good team and we beat them without our Most Important Player.

[Furniture]

I did predict a Duke win. :cool:

[MChambers]

I'll just get my congrats in right now. Neither team shot the ball very well from the outside but Zion and Barrett were just unguardable on the drive. Impressive to win without Tre as well. Looking forward to the rematch in a few weeks. Hope Tre is healthy and can go then. I still feel good about my team but I knew Duke would be the toughest matchup for us. Really hope we can avoid you down the road. Here's to staying healthy.
I greatly appreciate your posts and the posts of other UVa fans. You really add a lot to the board.

[robed deity]

Huge win!!!! RJ and Zion are the most talented duo Duke has ever had on the same team, and I don't think that's being hyperbolic.

Marques Bolden deserves a shout out too. He was being picked on all night long on switches, and had to play massive minutes because of Javin being Javin (he's gotta be close to 7 fouls per 40 minutes now). Great adjustment by Coach K to switch to zone to help out Marques in the 2nd half.

Plus, Marques had the game-sealing rebound and drained 2 free throws to lock up the W. Very underrated performance. If he could master the technique of going straight up to challenge shots without fouling (like Wendell Carter did, and Jack Salt in this game), he'd be a monster.

Salt goes straight up a lot. He also doesn't sometimes and for some reason doesn't get called.

[MartyClark]

Great win. Thoroughly enjoyable game.

Zion and RJ were great. Cam was good. Bolden, IMO, played well.

Downside - AOC in a brief appearance, did not look good and does not look up to the task of facing good competition. Javin plays hard. 0 points and 5 fouls won't cut it if Duke has title hopes.

[InSpades]

The offense was great. So glad we got away from hoisting up a bunch of 3s. Wonder if K said something. Zion thought about 1 late in the game and then decided not to shoot it.

RJ and Zion are amazing basketball players. They will be the top 2 picks in the NBA draft. They are these things because of when they can do driving the ball and finishing around the basket. They are elite when they do that. When we are turning the game into a 3-point shooting contest we can lose to a team like Syracuse. When we exert our will and make them stop us at our best... we can beat UVA w/out our PG.

The switch to 2-3 zone was really smart. Yes we limited then to terrible 3-point shooting all game but I think that was 2 things... #1 they just weren't on today. #2 when you can get a layup whenever you want, why shoot 3s? They were near 60% the field before we went to zone and they struggled for a few minutes which let us build a lead we barely held onto.

I'm not faulting Bolden... he's being put in tough spots. We need our bigs closer to the rim to prevent other teams from driving and getting easy layups against the pressure man-to-man. Or maybe we just need Tre to get healthy :).

Great win Devils!

[duke79]

I'll just get my congrats in right now. Neither team shot the ball very well from the outside but Zion and Barrett were just unguardable on the drive. Impressive to win without Tre as well. Looking forward to the rematch in a few weeks. Hope Tre is healthy and can go then. I still feel good about my team but I knew Duke would be the toughest matchup for us. Really hope we can avoid you down the road. Here's to staying healthy.


Congrats. MVP prob should go to K for going to the 1-5 switch all. We (UVa) did a good job of abusing Bolden in the switches, but it resulted in 2s, not 3s. Our big advantage coming in was the 3-ball, and that pretty much negated that. Kudos to the GOAT coach for that strategy.

I will say that it was basically a coin flip in the end (Duke shot awful from the FT line, but we shot awful in the good looks we DID get from 3 - including one from Guy at the 2 min mark that bricked and resulted in a secondary transition "and-1" bucket for Duke that PRETTY MUCH iced the game), but Duke came out on top. Excited to see the rematch with Jones healthy, but @UVa - should be another classic.

Again, congrats, but I think this only cemented what I thought coming in. All respect to Michigan and Tenn, but THESE are the two best teams in the country.


See ya in 3 weeks! (Probably for gameday again)

Thanks for your kind words. I've always thought that UVa IS a class school. (and the more I see of Tony Bennett, the more impressed I am by him!) I truly thought, for almost all of the game, that it could have gone either way. UVa is a great team and I hope they go far this year in the tourney (until they meet Duke again). Looking forward to the re-match in Charlottesville.

[BlueandWhite]

I'll just get my congrats in right now. Neither team shot the ball very well from the outside but Zion and Barrett were just unguardable on the drive. Impressive to win without Tre as well. Looking forward to the rematch in a few weeks. Hope Tre is healthy and can go then. I still feel good about my team but I knew Duke would be the toughest matchup for us. Really hope we can avoid you down the road. Here's to staying healthy.

Thanks for chiming in & for your sportsmanship. Your Hoos are an excellent team. What a great college basketball game! Our FT shooting nearly cost us this one. Jerome is a terrific guard...I really look forward to watching Tre Jones match up with him in C’Ville next month.

[jwillfan]

May be wrong, but don’t remember taking a 3 in the last 15 or so minutes- think K shut that down. Javin’s line is humorous, all “0s” except for the 5 fouls.

Javin's last foul was a clean block, however.

[jv001]

Great win over a very very good Virginia team. The players stepped up and so did our GOAT. The switch to the zone at the end stopped the driving to the hoop.
Some stats from ESPN:
Zion 27 pts. 10-16 from the field, 7-14 FTs, 9 rebounds 1 assist, 3 TOs 1 block and 2 fouls
RJ 30 pts. 11-19 from the field, 7-11 FTs, 5 rebounds, 3 assists, 1 TO and 0 fouls
Cam 9 pts, 3-12 from the field, 2-4 FTs, 8 rebounds, 1 assist, 4 TOs, 4 fouls
Jack 4 pts, 2-3 from the field, 4 rebounds, 3 fouls
Marques 2 pts, 0-0 from the field, 4 rebounds, 2-2 FTs
Javin all zeros except 5 fouls.

It was pretty much a 5 man showing. Except Javin did take away some fouls for the starters.

The guys really stepped up tonight in a very big game. RJ played the role of distributor and still scored 30 points. If all the fouls that were committed against Zion had been called, he might have fouled 3 or 4 guys out of the game. He really takes punishment well. GoDuke!

[duke4ever19]

The Pack-line is famously built on the following: (1) Deny dribble penetration, (2) keep opponents off the offensive glass, and (3) shutdown fast break opportunities.

It was a thing of beauty to watch Duke draw UVA out beyond the arc (out of their comfort-zone as a defense) allowing Barrett and Zion to simply out-athlete their man. Barrett's herky-jerky playing style is perfectly suited to confounding UVA's defense, and his ability to get past his man creates great outlet-pass opportunities off the UVA help defender. Zion is also incredibly agile for a man his size and so it comes as no surprise that UVA had the same issues with him too.

As for keeping Duke off the offensive glass, that ain't easy with Zion Williamson on the floor.

Coach K drew up a great game-plan.

[SavDukeGrad]

What a great win. No Tre, 8 turnovers against VA and 1 was a BS offensive foul against Cam. The team played very strong. RJ has a lot of Laettner in him. Zion is a beast. They had no answer. Cam is still struggling on the offensive end, but he made a few good plays on D. Virginia is a very good team and we beat them without our Most Important Player.

Great win for our team!

I have said all year that RJ is our first player in a long time to have that Laettner gene - a cold blooded assassin who wants the ball with the game on the line. Great games from RJ and Zion!

[lotusland]

Ty Jerome is very good player but if he played for Duke he’d be the most hated player in America.

[weezie]

...The switch to 2-3 zone was really smart.... they struggled for a few minutes which let us build a lead we barely held onto....Great win Devils!

Seconded and passed. Errant passes were cut down the lane was hard to see.

Well done K!

[Wahoo2000]

Ty Jerome is very good player but if he played for Duke he’d be the most hated player in America.

The dreaded... "You must spread some Comments around before commenting on lotusland again."... prevents me from sporking you, but a truer statement has never been uttered on this board.

[HereBeforeCoachK]

The dreaded... "You must spread some Comments around before commenting on lotusland again."... prevents me from sporking you, but a truer statement has never been uttered on this board.

Yep, and I uttered it earlier in the week here too.......

[jv001]

The dreaded... "You must spread some Comments around before commenting on lotusland again."... prevents me from sporking you, but a truer statement has never been uttered on this board.

Took care of that for you. Jerome is a very talented player and I think he could get under your skin if you had him guarding you, but so would Hunter. GoDuke!

[HereBeforeCoachK]

The Pack-line is famously built on the following: (1) Deny dribble penetration, (2) keep opponents off the offensive glass, and (3) shutdown fast break opportunities.

It was a thing of beauty to watch Duke draw UVA out beyond the arc (out of their comfort-zone as a defense) allowing Barrett and Zion to simply out-athlete their man. Barrett's herky-jerky playing style is perfectly suited to confounding UVA's defense, and his ability to get past his man creates great outlet-pass opportunities off the UVA help defender. Zion is also incredibly agile for a man his size and so it comes as no surprise that UVA had the same issues with him too.

As for keeping Duke off the offensive glass, that ain't easy with Zion Williamson on the floor.

Coach K drew up a great game-plan.

Coach K after Hurley goes down: Hill to PG and they beat great LSU team on the road. (I think that was the first game post Hurley injury)
After Booz goes down, Casey jumps in and they beat the Cheats on the road.
Tre goes down.......Rj to the point and they beat the Hoos.

Amazing.

[Devilwin]

Great win, especially after another bad free throw shooting night.

https://forums.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/showthread.php?43006-MBB-Syracuse-95-Duke-91-(OT)-Post-Game-Thread&p=1116690#post1116690

[MarkD83]

Ty Jerome is very good player but if he played for Duke he’d be the most hated player in America.

And Ty should take this as one of the highest compliments a Duke fan can give. You are only hated if you are a great player and competitor.

On another note...it is great to see all of the positive comments from both fan bases. Two top academic schools with great basketball teams. (and I went to both so I am very proud!!!)

[KandG]

As everyone said, just a phenomenal showing from Zion and RJ. Was really impressed by RJ, one of his most controlled performances all season. Only one turnover and 30 points on 19 shots (plus making those FTs at the end).

Very impressed by Bolden holding his own despite the numerous mismatches he was confronted with, and that rebound and the two FTs to make it a seven point game was one of the biggest sequences of a tight game. Slightly frustrated by Javin picking up cheap fouls early again and he looked rough being targeted by Virginia's guards on switches, but he made up for it with his defensive work when we went to the zone (used his length well, didn't have to move his feet to keep up with guards the same way).

Knew that in a tight game against one of the very best teams, Cam's looseness with the ball would be an issue -- just like Texas Tech, he tended to charge headlong into defenders and/or get stripped, especially in the second half. With that said, I thought he showed improvement relative to earlier in the season and he made some big defensive plays and loose ball recoveries (eight rebounds!) to contribute to the win.

Absolutely loved Jack attacking closeouts -- looks iike the coaching staff has been working with him to eliminate his tentativeness outside the 3 point line -- and can't wait to see him do more now that our schedule eases up a little.

Work on those free throws guys -- have a feeling that Virginia will shoot a little better from outside for the rematch, and we have to show more polish on the small things. Still a super impressive win without the heart of our team...I thought we might lose this game even when Tre was healthy. Our defense and our talent are no joke.

[jv001]

One thing that impresses me is how hard Zion plays. Not just on offense but on defense as well. This young man has good basketball IQ and has great instincts. He seems to come from no where and tips a ball, makes a block on help defense and seems to be all over the court. And he really wants the TEAM to win. We are so blessed to have this talented basketball player in a Duke uniform.

[Saratoga2]

Great win, especially after another bad free throw shooting night.

https://forums.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/showthread.php?43006-MBB-Syracuse-95-Duke-91-(OT)-Post-Game-Thread&p=1116690#post1116690

We played a very short rotation and the guys had to be getting tired toward the end. That has to have an impact of shooting in general. We need more depth and Tre will give us that and perhaps Cam will recover from his illness and get some Mojo back. His defense was good but his decision making and ball security needed improvement. Wondered if we might see Vrank for a few minutes with both our bigs in foul trouble.

[UrinalCake]

Without Jones, K just said put the ball in RJ and Zion’s hands and let them go to work. ISO ball gets a bad rap, people think it’s aesthetically unpleasing or not democratic but when you have two guys who can’t be stopped one on one, there’s really no defensive scheme that will work against them.

UVA is so tough, this game could have easily gone the other way had a couple more shots fallen for them, but tonight was Duke’s night. Our defensive did just enough to contain them, and sprinkling in the zone prevented them from isolating Bolden on the perimeter which was clearly their game plan.

[sciencegeek]

Just looked at the box score, and Jack White played 40 minutes, wow!

[Danke Shane]

The game flow reminded me of the 2010 Butler game. Any time we had a 5 point lead and the ball we could never get an additional score to push out the lead further it seemed.

[sciencegeek]

One thing that impresses me is how hard Zion plays. Not just on offense but on defense as well. This young man has good basketball IQ and has great instincts. He seems to come from no where and tips a ball, makes a block on help defense and seems to be all over the court. And he really wants the TEAM to win. We are so blessed to have this talented basketball player in a Duke uniform.

What a fantastic TEAM player Zion is, I love his great attitude!. Kids in high school should take notes on how to conduct themselves, and watch Zion.

[CDu]

Just looked at the box score, and Jack White played 40 minutes, wow!

The starters played 188 minutes. In other words, the averaged 37.6 mpg between them. Phenomenal.

[jv001]

Without Jones, K just said put the ball in RJ and Zion’s hands and let them go to work. ISO ball gets a bad rap, people think it’s aesthetically unpleasing or not democratic but when you have two guys who can’t be stopped one on one, there’s really no defensive scheme that will work against them.

UVA is so tough, this game could have easily gone the other way had a couple more shots fallen for them, but tonight was Duke’s night. Our defensive did just enough to contain them, and sprinkling in the zone prevented them from isolating Bolden on the perimeter.

I think as long as Duke switches on everrrrrrrry screen, teams will do just that. But it would be the same with Javin, Vrank or Robinson. The only way to stop it would be the "death lineup" but that can't be used until Tre gets back. GoDuke!

[Indoor66]

The game flow reminded me of the 2010 Butler game. Any time we had a 5 point lead and the ball we could never get an additional score to push out the lead further it seemed.

Isn't that partly the result of playing a really good opponent?

[dukejim1]

Just looked at the box score, and Jack White played 40 minutes, wow!

Jack actually came out for about 10 seconds but went right back in when Alex got pulled for not knowing how much time was on the shot clock.

[Billy Dat]

Fantastic win! Kudos to the team, I never thought our D would be that good without Tre. Granted, Virginia didn’t play well on offense. I think our D can take some credit but they also just didn’t execute. They play referred to earlier, when Guy missed a wide open 3 leading to a run out and-1 was emblematic - they miss a shot they almost always make and give up a fast break they typically avoid. I guess that’s what playing at home can provide.

I thought K was NUTS to go zone, I thought they would shred it. I was wrong.

Zion and RJ were amazing. To get to the rim over and over against that D is a testament to their ability. Amazing.

The Zion dunk against Huff might be his most incredible play of the year.

I also applaud Bolden’s play. He has really become a vital piece of the rotation. Even when he was continually targeted, he kept fighting and I think we were smart to not leave shooters. They got lau-ups sometimes, but not 3s.

MAD respect for Ty Jerome. That dude is awesome.

Very proud of our team, they are some tough mofos. This win is very very sweet!

[DarkstarWahoo]

Weirdly, UVA actually extended its lead over Duke in KenPom. I’m assuming it’s from outperforming whatever home-court advantage he builds in.

[mgtr]

I was thrilled when we pulled it out, but it could have gone the other way. Props to the Hoos for having a great team and coach. I can see the possibility of playing them three more times this year: Regular season rematch, Conference tournament, and the NCAAs, possibly for the national championship.
That thought is more than a dream, it is a nightmare. I haven't seen every good team play this year, but i cannot imagine a tougher opponent than UVa. Should be an interesting year.

[ncexnyc]

An impressive win and hopefully it's enough to keep us in the #1 spot come Monday. I'm sure Vol fans will have something to say about that should they not get the nod for #1.

I can't believe all of the comments still being directed at RJ. The kid can flat out ball. I guess people take him and our other freshmen for granted, but they are indeed freshman and are entitled to a poor decision or two every now and then. I appreciate a kid that doesn't shy away from putting a team on his shoulder's and attempting to carry that team. I bet you Kansas fans wish Andrew Wiggins had RJ's attitude during his stint with the Jayhawks.

Wow, that was an impressive defensive effort! Our size definitely did a number on UVA and our 3 pt defense was outstanding. Rarely did UVA get a clean look from beyond the arc.

[MChambers]

Weirdly, UVA actually extended its lead over Duke in KenPom. I’m assuming it’s from outperforming whatever home-court advantage he builds in.
That is it.

[du_bb1]

This was a great game to watch-was able to dissociate a bit and just watch player movement-it was a thing of beauty.
We are really going to be spoiled after this year. Their exuberance for each other and pure joy is beyond exciting.

[InSpades]

I thought K was NUTS to go zone, I thought they would shred it. I was wrong.



I mean... they were shredding our man-to-man as it was. Trying something different couldn't be much worse (I guess giving up 3 is technically worse than giving up 2... but I'd rather give up an open 3 than an open layup).

Even just taking them out of their offensive rhythm was worth trying.

I was impressed w/ their offense... they really worked to get good shots which is something Duke doesn't always do. Though we did today.

[CDu]

Weirdly, UVA actually extended its lead over Duke in KenPom. I’m assuming it’s from outperforming whatever home-court advantage he builds in.

Yep. The ratings - don’t account for Duke missing Reddish and Jones against Cuse and missing Jones tonight - said we would win by more than two.

[hustleplays]

I'll just get my congrats in right now. Neither team shot the ball very well from the outside but Zion and Barrett were just unguardable on the drive. Impressive to win without Tre as well. Looking forward to the rematch in a few weeks. Hope Tre is healthy and can go then. I still feel good about my team but I knew Duke would be the toughest matchup for us. Really hope we can avoid you down the road. Here's to staying healthy.

jhmoss, You exemplify why so many of us Dukies have such respect for UVA and your b-ball program. This game could have gone either way. Such a tight, beautifully contested game. You guys play so well together and execute brilliantly. You have superb players: Salk, Guy, Jerome, Hunter, Key, Huff, and others.

Only one critique: Your coach is so unattractive and unpopular. I was visiting Darden [UVA's b-school] and was looking for the right classroom. I popped into one room full of MBAs, and asked for directions. A conversation with the class ensued and I identified myself as a prof from Fuqua. The students happily engaged [which was cool, absolutely no negativity] in a dialogue and I lamented that my dear wife was in love with your coach. The class spontaneously said, "We all are!" Good stuff. Best of luck the rest of the way.

[SavDukeGrad]

I think as long as Duke switches on everrrrrrrry screen, teams will do just that. But it would be the same with Javin, Vrank or Robinson. The only way to stop it would be the "death lineup" but that can't be used until Tre gets back. GoDuke!

Coach K just addressed switching 1-5 in his press conference. He said he was afraid we couldn’t contain Guy and limit threes without it. He also said Guy was the closest thing to JJ he has seen in the ACC - can hit while he’s turning.

[lotusland]

One thing that impresses me is how hard Zion plays. Not just on offense but on defense as well. This young man has good basketball IQ and has great instincts. He seems to come from no where and tips a ball, makes a block on help defense and seems to be all over the court. And he really wants the TEAM to win. We are so blessed to have this talented basketball player in a Duke uniform.

Well said. Suck it Scottie Pippen!

[Ranidad]

What an awesome game. Coach K with adjustments based on personnel available. All out effort from the both teams. Against the UVA defense that routinely forces teams to stay on the perimeter and try a late 3, we drive repeatedly. RJ and Zion are truly exceptional talents.

I know that Tennessee fans, and others, will “hate” on Duke but I think we end up #1 again. We lost in OT at home after unexpectedly losing 2 starters and then beat the #4 ranked team without our starting point guard while scoring more points than anyone else this season against their defense. Tennessee won a close one at home to an unranked team.

[jv001]

Coach K just addressed switching 1-5 in his press conference. He said he was afraid we couldn’t contain Guy and limit threes without it. He also said Guy was the closest thing to JJ he has seen in the ACC - can hit while he’s turning.

Thanks for the information from Coach K. We certainly didn't let the Wahoos beat us with 3 pointers. Good game plan and I thought Marques played the switches as well as he could. GoDuke!

[Wahoo2000]

An impressive win and hopefully it's enough to keep us in the #1 spot come Monday. I'm sure Vol fans will have something to say about that should they not get the nod for #1.

I can't believe all of the comments still being directed at RJ. The kid can flat out ball. I guess people take him and our other freshmen for granted, but they are indeed freshman and are entitled to a poor decision or two every now and then. I appreciate a kid that doesn't shy away from putting a team on his shoulder's and attempting to carry that team. I bet you Kansas fans wish Andrew Wiggins had RJ's attitude during his stint with the Jayhawks.

Wow, that was an impressive defensive effort! Our size definitely did a number on UVA and our 3 pt defense was outstanding. Rarely did UVA get a clean look from beyond the arc.

If I had to make an early guess about the AP poll on Monday, I'd say 1-Tenn, 2-Duke, 3-UVA, 4-Michigan. Honestly, just not much separation resume-wise among those 4. I'll also say Zags and Michigan State belong in that tier of quality. Then, IMO, there's a chasm to the next tier. If one of those 6 don't win the NCAA title, I'll be somewhat surprised. (And if the NCAA tourney was a best of 3 or 5 tournament, I'd bet my life one of those 6 win it all).

[Sluggo]

Great win! I am impressed that Zion seems to be figuring out how to avoid foul trouble, especially since he seemed to pick up a lot of questionable calls in earlier games. We need him on the court for so many reasons. I also like what I am hearing/seeing regarding these guys playing as a team. They genuinely seem to want to win for each other. A team with that mentality can often times exceed expectations. This could get good!

[DarkstarWahoo]

If I had to make an early guess about the AP poll on Monday, I'd say 1-Tenn, 2-Duke, 3-UVA, 4-Michigan. Honestly, just not much separation resume-wise among those 4. I'll also say Zags and Michigan State belong in that tier of quality. Then, IMO, there's a chasm to the next tier. If one of those 6 don't win the NCAA title, I'll be somewhat surprised. (And if the NCAA tourney was a best of 3 or 5 tournament, I'd bet my life one of those 6 win it all).

This is where I am, too. It’s why I don’t really think VT should fall that far in the next poll. Who below them should jump them?

[uh_no]

That is it.

could have also been an opponent of theirs had a great game or one of ours had a crap game....but doesn't look like it in this case.

[DarkstarWahoo]

could have also been an opponent of theirs had a great game or one of ours had a crap game...but doesn't look like it in this case.

We probably did get a nice bump from Wisconsin.

[CoachJ10]

Sure this was mentioned in the in-game thread, but UVA hit a high % of low % 2 pt shots in the first half that kept this game closer than I was hoping for. When our opponent has that going for them...always makes me a little queasy.

For those who have insight...(or at least think they so, this is a fan board after all..) why is RJ not a better FT shooter? His form doesn't seem like the problem.

And that sequence by Bolden, grabbing the clutch board and hitting clutch FTs...those are plays that help win Championships.

[CDu]

Coach K just addressed switching 1-5 in his press conference. He said he was afraid we couldn’t contain Guy and limit threes without it. He also said Guy was the closest thing to JJ he has seen in the ACC - can hit while he’s turning.

Yeah, that is the only way to counter the off-ball screen action UVa runs. We saw what happens if you don’t switch when Guy ran the elevator play for a wide open 3.

Assuming everyone is healthy the next time around, I would expect more of the same in Charlottesville.

[CoachJ10]

I really want to see Trey up in Jerome’s business all game long next time we play...

[uh_no]

I've never seen a team get to the back of the uva defense with such ruthless efficiency as I saw tonight. Their adjusted defensive efficiency was 96...10 points off expectation. We forced them into a place where they RARELY end up....where they simply can't slow a team down.

Bolden was getting killed on the 1-5 switch....felt bad for him....but it was part of the plan. Tonights game shows the difference between having a game plan, and having to burn your game plan when two starters go down. We outright beat arguably the best team in the country.....vs we lose in OT. It just shows how thrown off the deep-end (through no one's fault) those guys were on monday....and how well they did to take cuse to OT. Were we to be able to game plan around having no cam or tre, I think we beat them no problem.

[SavDukeGrad]

Both press conferences up now on goduke.com.

[DukeBlue666s]

I greatly appreciate your posts and the posts of other UVa fans. You really add a lot to the board.

I had said the same thing a few posts before this ...

Don’t get me wrong, I love all the duke members on the board, but what’s better than poster that are fans of other teams, signing up for a Duke Forum and giving their honest opinion and saying congrats after a game?! They don’t come here to argue ... IMO, that just adds to why this is the best forum on the interwebs!

jhmoss1812
Wahoo2000

It starts with you guys. Just wanted to say Thank You!!!

[ACCfaninVirginia]

Weirdly, UVA actually extended its lead over Duke in KenPom. I’m assuming it’s from outperforming whatever home-court advantage he builds in.

ACC now has 4 of top 10 in KenPom - probably same in both polls when they are released.

[bluesin]

Weirdly, UVA actually extended its lead over Duke in KenPom. I’m assuming it’s from outperforming whatever home-court advantage he builds in.

VA scored 1 more point in 4 fewer possessions than expected per the Kenpom prediction to start the game, it resulted in an increase by about 1.3 or so (going off memory because I already closed the pregame page) in Duke's adjusted D. That last bucket was basically to keep the AdjEM the same as it was before the game or increase it - the results were slightly magnified I image because it was 1 and 2 head to head.

Great game by everyone involved really, Bennett smiling and chatting in the post game hand shake with K was a great sight to see as well, increased the (substantial) respect I already had for him being such a gracious loser in a tough game.

[Dukehky]

Pretty great win. Cam didn't play great on offense, Jack gave us 4 points, Javin gave us 4 fouls, just kind of a weird game. To beat UVA shooting 60% from the line and making 2 threes is wild.

I was really proud of Bolden tonight. He kept working his butt off even though the scheme kept putting him in difficult positions having to guard All-ACC guards on the perimeter in isolation.

Can we start a serious conversation about what is going on with Javin? I mean, he has been really bad lately and I don't quite get it. He just fouls and fouls and fouls. It's more like Josh Hairston than anything else I can think about it.

[CameronDuke]

Just an incredible win for Duke any way you look at it. What an emotional roller coaster the team has been on for the last week. To beat the 4th ranked team in the country with just 80% of your normal starting rotation coming off a home loss to Cuse where they were stunned from Tre's injury and could never fully recover says a lot about this team's resilience. Virginia is legit and probably loses 3-4 games tops all year this season.

Coach K is simply the GOAT. Without Tre, he slightly out coached Tony Bennett tonight in my opinion and it was just enough of a difference to get Duke the win. Switching Virginia from the 1-5 positions took them out of their normal 3 point shooting dominant game and they shot abysmally from deep. Also throwing in the zone wrinkle late seemed to confuse Virginia lots and make them burn some clock when they were trying to get back into it late. Duke also made Virginia try to guard RJ/Zion on out around the 3 point line and get them into isolation and RJ/Zion were simply unstoppable tonight. A few times Duke got Salt/Clark into isolated matchups on Zion/RJ and they were either too slow are too small to keep up with Zion/RJ. I think Salt and Clark as well as many other Virginia players are gonna be seeing RJ/Zion drive by them in their sleep tonight. Zion/RJ hung 57 points on 21-35 shooting (60%) on Virginia. That is pure domination on the best defensive team in the country. If Duke hit just 70ish percent from the line they would have won this game pretty comfortably, not to mention if Tre Jones had played.

Coach K proved once again he's the GOAT and adept at adaptation on the fly. Virginia has a fine squad once again. Just a huge, much needed win to guard our home floor. The rematch in Charlottesville will be another classic. Nothing is a given but I feel like Duke may be 20-2, 8-1 (ACC games at Pitt, vs GT, at Notre Dame, vs BC, out of conference vs St John's) when they go to Charlottesville and the game there will determine the 2018-2019 ACC regular season championship.

By my count, Coach K is now 56-19 vs Virginia as head coach at Duke (he was 0-1 vs Virginia as head coach at Army) and Coach K is also 10-3 vs Tony Bennett now. Pretty dominant for Coach K and another reason he is the GOAT!

Let's Go Duke!

[HereBeforeCoachK]

Great game by everyone involved really, Bennett smiling and chatting in the post game hand shake with K was a great sight to see as well, increased the (substantial) respect I already had for him being such a gracious loser in a tough game.

K and Bennett are class. For decades, K has been the most gracious to Duke's opponents, the opposing crowds in away games...the opposing coaches - and you can tell in the handshake line that a lot of oppo players really enjoy their brief moment with K. The haters can KMA. And Bennett is very likely going to have a long record of class and success at UVa too.

[budwom]

Pretty great win. Cam didn't play great on offense, Jack gave us 4 points, Javin gave us 4 fouls, just kind of a weird game. To beat UVA shooting 60% from the line and making 2 threes is wild.

I was really proud of Bolden tonight. He kept working his butt off even though the scheme kept putting him in difficult positions having to guard All-ACC guards on the perimeter in isolation.

Can we start a serious conversation about what is going on with Javin? I mean, he has been really bad lately and I don't quite get it. He just fouls and fouls and fouls. It's more like Josh Hairston than anything else I can think about it.

Javin gave us seven minutes and five fouls. The bench minutes had to be close to an all time low, 12 total (with no points, no rebounds). Quite the thing to have Marques play 33 minutes.
K will be splaining to AOC this week what that little box with the numbers on it is doing over the backboard.
Alls well that ends well...

[uh_no]

Javin gave us seven minutes and five fouls. The bench minutes had to be close to an all time low, 12 total (with no points, no rebounds). Quite the thing to have Marques play 33 minutes.
K will be splaining to AOC this week what that little box with the numbers on it is doing over the backboard.
Alls well that ends well...

best part of the aoc play was the crazies, of one mind, seemed to shout "shoot it" in unison before he fired the wild shot as time expired.

That was a bad mental mistake.

[Ima Facultiwyfe]

Hard fought, clean game among guys and coaches with the right attitude. I wish Virginia were considered "Our Rival" because the programs are worthy of one another. The handshake line at the end was a thing of beauty!

Everybody stay healthy now and let's both have a great time the rest of the year.
Love, Ima

[jipops]

2-14 from 3. 18-31 on ft’s. And we won!!? Against uva!!?? This one just didn’t make any sense. But I’ll take it.

[Reilly]

... Coach K is now 56-19 vs Virginia as head coach at Duke (he was 0-1 vs Virginia as head coach at Army) and Coach K is also 10-3 vs Tony Bennett ...

Here's to never forgetting tonight.

Didn't realize K lost to Ralph and Holland while K was at Army.

In the mid-80s, K would make the 'circle talk' to the Crazies before the UVa game every year -- at least, it always seemed to be before the UVa game -- stopping to give a pep talk to all the Crazies in a section, then moving to the next one, an hour or so before the game ... does he still do that?

It seems the Virginia game has always held somewhat of a special place in K's heart.

[DukeBlue666s]

2-14 from 3. 18-31 on ft’s. And we won!!? Against uva!!?? This one just didn’t make any sense. But I’ll take it.

As we all know, Duke has that ‘WTH loss’ every year ... I’ll definitely take a ‘WTH win’ (looking at game stats) here and there.

[uh_no]

As we all know, Duke has that ‘WTH loss’ every year


2007-2011 duke lost exactly 2 games at home, both to UNC....so I'm not sure I agree at face value with your statement.

[Kedsy]

ADVANCED STATS

Possessions: 62.9 (a few possessions faster than UVa's adjusted season pace of 60.1, but a lot closer to UVa's pace than Duke's)

OFFENSE

oRtg: 1.15 (our adjusted oRtg was 1.32, pretty amazing against a defense like Virginia's, especially considering we played it without our PG)
eFG%: 52.9% (again, good against a team like UVa)
3pt%: 14.3% (somewhat pathetic)
2pt%: 64.9% (really good against the kind of defense Virginia plays)
%threes: 27.5% (in light of the two numbers above, this was smart)
FT rate: 60.9% (our 2nd highest FTR of the season, after the Auburn game, but a large part of this number (as well as against Auburn) was because they were intentionally fouling us at the end)
OR%: 30.3% (not great, but UVa is a good DR team, so not terrible either)
TO%: 12.7% (very strong, especially considering we played without our PG)
a/to: 0.75:1 (not surprising, with no PG)
%assisted: 23.1% (ditto)
fast break pts: 15 (20.8% of our points, which is pretty good against a team like Virginia)


DEFENSE

dRtg: 1.11 (adjusted that's 0.94, decent but probably better than decent, considering our best defender watched from the bench)
eFG%: 55.7% (bad)
3pt%: 17.6% (amazing, but not sure how much was skill and how much was luck)
2pt%: 69.4% (horrible)
%threes: 32.1%
FT rate: 32.1% (this is probably too high, but not alarmingly so)
DR%: 75.9% (really good for Duke, though Virginia isn't the best offensive rebounding team, either)
TO%: 12.7% (way too low, but actually this is about average for Virginia's offense)
a/to: 1:1 (after ten straight games holding our opponents to fewer assists than turnovers, Virginia broke that streak by having the same number of assists and TOs)
%assisted: 28.6%
fast break pts: 8 (11.4% of their points)
block%: 1.9%; 2.8% of 2-point shots (we only had one block, which for this team is almost hard to believe)
steal%: 7.9% (fourth straight only so-so game, compared to our season steals performance; but against Virginia and without Tre, it's actually pretty decent)


In the end, I'm not sure any stat really mattered today other than points scored and points allowed.

[robed deity]

ADVANCED STATS

Possessions: 62.9 (a few possessions faster than UVa's adjusted season pace of 60.1, but a lot closer to UVa's pace than Duke's)

OFFENSE

oRtg: 1.15 (our adjusted oRtg was 1.32, pretty amazing against a defense like Virginia's, especially considering we played it without our PG)
eFG%: 52.9% (again, good against a team like UVa)
3pt%: 14.3% (somewhat pathetic)
2pt%: 64.9% (really good against the kind of defense Virginia plays)
%threes: 27.5% (in light of the two numbers above, this was smart)
FT rate: 60.9% (our 2nd highest FTR of the season, after the Auburn game, but a large part of this number (as well as against Auburn) was because they were intentionally fouling us at the end)
OR%: 30.3% (not great, but UVa is a good DR team, so not terrible either)
TO%: 12.7% (very strong, especially considering we played without our PG)
a/to: 0.75:1 (not surprising, with no PG)
%assisted: 23.1% (ditto)
fast break pts: 15 (20.8% of our points, which is pretty good against a team like Virginia)


DEFENSE

dRtg: 1.11 (adjusted that's 0.94, decent but probably better than decent, considering our best defender watched from the bench)
eFG%: 55.7% (bad)
3pt%: 17.6% (amazing, but not sure how much was skill and how much was luck)
2pt%: 69.4% (horrible)
%threes: 32.1%
FT rate: 32.1% (this is probably too high, but not alarmingly so)
DR%: 75.9% (really good for Duke, though Virginia isn't the best offensive rebounding team, either)
TO%: 12.7% (way too low, but actually this is about average for Virginia's offense)
a/to: 1:1 (after ten straight games holding our opponents to fewer assists than turnovers, Virginia broke that streak by having the same number of assists and TOs)
%assisted: 28.6%
fast break pts: 8 (11.4% of their points)
block%: 1.9%; 2.8% of 2-point shots (we only had one block, which for this team is almost hard to believe)
steal%: 7.9% (fourth straight only so-so game, compared to our season steals performance; but against Virginia and without Tre, it's actually pretty decent)


In the end, I'm not sure any stat really mattered today other than points scored and points allowed.

That one block was worth at least 5 though.

[KandG]

Can we start a serious conversation about what is going on with Javin? I mean, he has been really bad lately and I don't quite get it. He just fouls and fouls and fouls. It's more like Josh Hairston than anything else I can think about it.

The Josh Hairston reference is excellent: he's the last player whose fouls/40 minutes rivals or exceeds Javin's. If you look back at Duke players who've played a reasonable number of minutes and games and had a foul rate as high as 7 per 40 minutes or higher, it's an assortment of highly foul-prone bigs with varying degrees of physical coordination. Chase Jeter, Brian Zoubek, Lance Thomas, heck we can go all the way back to Casey Sanders and Matt Christensen.

Javin has the highest foul rate among his teammates playing notable minutes since he enrolled on campus, and it hasn't been close. Like Hairston, the high foul rate has dogged him even with greater experience and minutes (in Hairston's case, it actually got worse). Only Zoubek managed a vital role on a championship team despite maintaining an ungainly foul rate.

It's discouraging to see Javin unable to stay on the floor for long because he can't resist reaching or because he's unable to move his feet well enough to get in the path of even a marginally quicker opponent on a drive, or going for a loose ball. I thought Javin would be our first or second choice small ball center in most lineups, but he's going through a rough patch right now.

Bolden looks far better in our switching defense attempting to stay in front of quick perimeter players, even though he gets beaten plenty and commits his share of fouls. Marques has better shot blocking instincts than Javin and has improved his understanding of how to use his length to handle a smaller player who's gotten by him. He's also more coordinated and stronger with the ball in a scrum.

[84Duke]

I can live with an interior player who fouls a lot. We have had our share over the years. But Javin does frustrate me because he seems to frequently foul really late in the shot clock. Maybe I've just noticed it recently, but when your D works the shot clock down to 3 or 2 or 1 second, and the opponent is forced into a tough shot - let him shoot. No reason to try and stop a shot that has a 5-10% chance of going in. It's bailing the other team out.

[Barnstormer]

I wonder if Zion was not feeling well tonight. I thought his balance was off. He was able to overcome for the most part but he he fell down a few times. His free throw shots were way off and I got the impression that he was either extremely tired or maybe had the same flu that Cam had. Look at his drives to the basket in the first half there were 2 possessions when he fell down and then left the shot short. It is a tribute to his will that he overcame a bad shooting night to still score as many as he did but I wonder if something was amiss.

[BandAlum83]

I can live with an interior player who fouls a lot. We have had our share over the years. But Javin does frustrate me because he seems to frequently foul really late in the shot clock. Maybe I've just noticed it recently, but when your D works the shot clock down to 3 or 2 or 1 second, and the opponent is forced into a tough shot - let him shoot. No reason to try and stop a shot that has a 5-10% chance of going in. It's bailing the other team out.

So I'm re-wathcing the second half, and with 6:22 left in the game, Zion makes his incredible block stright into the hands of Guy, who immediately shoots a 3 and misses.

Guess who gets the rebound?

Javin.

I rechecked the box score, and sure enough, Javin shows zeroes across the board.

So I went to the play-by-play to see who was credited with the rebound: Cam Reddish.

So I went back to the game to make sure it was Javin #12, and not Cam #2 who grabbed the rebound.

Cam was who Javin passed out to after the rebound.

I'd just like to set the record straight and give Javin his due. He didn't have straight zeroes. Do things like this get fixed after the fact?

[richardjackson199]

Fantastic win! Kudos to the team, I never thought our D would be that good without Tre. Granted, Virginia didn’t play well on offense. I think our D can take some credit but they also just didn’t execute. They play referred to earlier, when Guy missed a wide open 3 leading to a run out and-1 was emblematic - they miss a shot they almost always make and give up a fast break they typically avoid. I guess that’s what playing at home can provide.

I thought K was NUTS to go zone, I thought they would shred it. I was wrong.

Zion and RJ were amazing. To get to the rim over and over against that D is a testament to their ability. Amazing.

The Zion dunk against Huff might be his most incredible play of the year.

I also applaud Bolden’s play. He has really become a vital piece of the rotation. Even when he was continually targeted, he kept fighting and I think we were smart to not leave shooters. They got lau-ups sometimes, but not 3s.

MAD respect for Ty Jerome. That dude is awesome.

Very proud of our team, they are some tough mofos. This win is very very sweet!

Excellent post.

K went to some zone for Old Dukie, to show him he can still coach a little. Then he celebrated the win by watching a happy movie with his grandkids, a movie that an OldDukie would like:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oWgTqLCLE8k

[Steven43]

RJ made clutch Ft's, if he can consistently put together efficient games like this, we got this even without Tre
You didn’t really just say this did you?

[Steven43]

Per the usual, in-game thread disappointingly had quite a bit of RJ bashing. I don’t think some of our fans truly appreciate how good he is. He’s a volume shooter and will always be a volume shooter. He’s a freshmen arguably leading the most watched College Basketball team in America.
What is a “volume shooter”? And RJ s not the leader of this team as far as I see it. If anything he’s third behind Zion and Tre.

[richardjackson199]

What is a “volume shooter”? And RJ s not the leader of this team as far as I see it. If anything he’s third behind Zion and Tre.

I am just wondering what percentage of your posts say something negative about a current or former Duke player, team, or assistant coach?

RJ did an absolutely outstanding job tonight filling in as point guard and leading this team to a win. The teammates you mention are his brothers, not players he is competing with to lead the team. K alluded to it in his post-game comments. Players like Zion and RJ aren't trying to single themselves out from their teammates with game-day stuff. They play for their teammates.

This team has such great chemistry because we have so many players who step up and lead when called upon. Captain Jack White and Javin have been phenomenal role model captains leading by showing communication on D and filling a role. Tre has been a game-changing point guard on both ends of the floor with brutally efficient offense setting up his teammates, and the most ferocious defense of any player in the country. Zion is the most humble #1 player in the country and draft I've ever seen, the consummate team player. RJ is an elite finisher and lethal in transition. Bolden leads selflessly - like playing his butt off in a defensive switching scheme which exposes him and then being the first guy to drain 2 clutch free throws when we needed them. And RJ was asked to step up and lead this team as pg tonight and did so in incredible fashion against one of the most impressive teams in the country.

Enjoy the ride. This Duke team is incredible, and is showing incredibly selfless leadership all the way around.

[Steven43]

I am just wondering what percentage of your posts say something negative about a current or former Duke player, team, or assistant coach.
How is it saying something negative to ask what is a volume shooter and to rightfully, I think, say that Zion and Tre are first and second with RJ third as leaders of the team? And the only assistant coach I’ve ever said anything even approaching negativity about is Jeff Capel. And all I ever said about him is he’s not going to become Duke’s head coach after K leaves, he gets credit for recruiting that should go more to K and Duke, and I haven’t seen any strong evidence for why he should be in the conversation for head coach at Duke. Tell me one other negative word I ever said about any other assistant coach at Duke.

And yes, I have questioned Cam’s shooting form and overall shooting in general. Look at the stats. And no, I don’t like RJ shooting as much as he does and I don’t think he’s a good outside shooter. And? I hear other Duke fans (and sportswriters in general) talk about these issues all the time. Just because I sometimes post comments expressing these thoughts on DBR does not mean many other Duke fans are not also thinking and saying the exact same thing. I know they are because I hear it said on a nearly daily basis.

And I have complemented RJ’s competitiveness, confidence, and his ability to draw fouls and get points near the basket. And no, I have not complemented Cam much, but I have complimented Zion a million times, Tre almost as much, Jack many times, Marques here and there, Alex here and there, Javin on occasion, and Coach K many many times. So you choose to focus on only the negative things mentioned; that’s your issue, not mine.

[richardjackson199]

This is an outstanding, well-written article about RJ and Zion helping to lead us to the Virginia win:

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/25804871/williamson-barrett-deliver-short-handed-duke

[slower]

What is a “volume shooter”? And RJ s not the leader of this team as far as I see it. If anything he’s third behind Zion and Tre.

I think most on this board might disagree that Zion is more of a "leader" than RJ. I certainly do.

[jv001]

So I'm re-wathcing the second half, and with 6:22 left in the game, Zion makes his incredible block stright into the hands of Guy, who immediately shoots a 3 and misses.

Guess who gets the rebound?

Javin.

I rechecked the box score, and sure enough, Javin shows zeroes across the board.

So I went to the play-by-play to see who was credited with the rebound: Cam Reddish.

So I went back to the game to make sure it was Javin #12, and not Cam #2 who grabbed the rebound.

Cam was who Javin passed out to after the rebound.

I'd just like to set the record straight and give Javin his due. He didn't have straight zeroes. Do things like this get fixed after the fact?

Well, I think that gives Javin 1 rebound in the last 2 games if I'm not mistaken. Javin to me, seems off balance like he's about to fall down just moving around on the court. I've never seen a basketball player that looks like he does. His biggest problem on defense is he can't move his feet very well(off balance?). If he could hit a mid-range jumper, it would help the team tremendously. I'm hoping he get's it together because we need more than one player coming off the bench that can play 15-20 minutes. GoDuke!

[Tripping William]

Boy, this UVa team sure is boring to watch. :rolleyes:

[Ggallagher]

I just noticed that our 72 points last night is our lowest scoring game of the year; and the most points Virginia's given up all year.

[Tripping William]

I just noticed that our 72 points last night is our lowest scoring game of the year; and the most points Virginia's given up all year.

Duke only scored 69 in defeating Texas Tech. The Red Raider effect?

[Ggallagher]

Duke only scored 69 in defeating Texas Tech. The Red Raider effect?

Oops, missed that somehow. Sorry about that.

[House P]

The bench minutes had to be close to an all time low, 12 total

As far as I can tell, the 12 minutes for Duke's bench was tied (with one other game) for the 4th fewest since Coach K arrived.

Sporks to the first person who can name any of the 4 other Duke games since 1981 where the bench* combined for 12 minutes or less. Hint: Three of these games happened since 2000 (and two of them happened since 2010).



*The spreadsheet I use for minutes played in each Duke game since 1981 doesn't list who actually started each game. Therefore, I am defining "bench" as the players who received the 6th-12th most minutes played in a particular game.

[84Duke]

As far as I can tell, the 12 minutes for Duke's bench was tied (with one other game) for the 4th fewest since Coach K arrived.

Sporks to the first person who can name any of the 4 other Duke games since 1981 where the bench* combined for 12 minutes or less. Hint: Three of these games happened since 2000 (and two of them happened since 2010).



*The spreadsheet I use for minutes played in each Duke game since 1981 doesn't list who actually started each game. Therefore, I am defining "bench" as the players who received the 6th-12th most minutes played in a particular game.

I'm trying to think of information that could be less valuable than that. Unless, of course, I want a tent.

[UrinalCake]

... Javin does frustrate me because he seems to frequently foul really late in the shot clock. Maybe I've just noticed it recently, but when your D works the shot clock down to 3 or 2 or 1 second, and the opponent is forced into a tough shot - let him shoot. No reason to try and stop a shot that has a 5-10% chance of going in. It's bailing the other team out.

I’ve noticed that as well. It’s deflating when the team plays great D for 30 seconds, and then Javin comes over and just bumps or hand checks a guy who’s about to have to force up a bad shot. And it’s weird because at the start of the season Javin was playing sooo much better than Bolden, and now the roles have flipped. Hope he can get things figured out because we’ll need them both to play their roles in order to maximize the team’s chances.

[UrinalCake]

Sporks to the first person who can name any of the 4 other Duke games since 1981 where the bench* combined for 12 minutes or less.

I’m thinking of the game in Chapel Hill during Brandon Ingram’s year, when Matt Jones got hurt and we basically had to go iron man for the whole second half. Marshall even picked up his fourth foul with several minutes left but we still pulled out the win when Derryck Thorton blocked Joel Berry on their final possession.

[OldPhiKap]

As far as I can tell, the 12 minutes for Duke's bench was tied (with one other game) for the 4th fewest since Coach K arrived.

Sporks to the first person who can name any of the 4 other Duke games since 1981 where the bench* combined for 12 minutes or less. Hint: Three of these games happened since 2000 (and two of them happened since 2010).



*The spreadsheet I use for minutes played in each Duke game since 1981 doesn't list who actually started each game. Therefore, I am defining "bench" as the players who received the 6th-12th most minutes played in a particular game.


I'm trying to think of information that could be less valuable than that. Unless, of course, I want a tent.

Not sure why the snark is needed, it’s an interesting observation. (To me, at least)

I’m guessing one or more of the others may be when we had an injury to a major player, and our usual sixth man was in the line-up. Like tonight.

[Kedsy]

Weirdly, UVA actually extended its lead over Duke in KenPom. I’m assuming it’s from outperforming whatever home-court advantage he builds in.


That is it.

I'm not so sure. I mean, I guess that's part of it, but a larger part is probably that Pomeroy builds in some sort of recency bias, meaning the last x games count more than the older games. I don't know exactly how it works but if, for example, x=10, then in the list of weighted games we're losing the 123/78 adjusted we put up against Indiana and replacing it with the 132/94 we achieved against Virginia. (And if x=anything between 4 and 9, we replaced an even better defensive performance with our only-OK UVa adjusted D.) That's probably the main reason why our KenPom defensive number jumped up so much after the UVa game, and why Uva's KenPom lead over us got a little bigger.

[Dukehk]

We just beat the number four team in the country who were previously undefeated! All this without our most important player, Tre Jones.

That was a seriously impressive performance, obviously led by RJ and Zion. Cam had a so-so game and we are still waiting for him to click on a consistent basis. Still alot of room for improvement and hopefully Tre comes back in the next one or two games.

If we hit our free throws this would have been an easy win!

[84Duke]

Not sure why the snark is needed, it’s an interesting observation. (To me, at least)

I’m guessing one or more of the others may be when we had an injury to a major player, and our usual sixth man was in the line-up. Like tonight.

OPK - it's just random occurrences that have little or nothing to do with this year's team. Just name them - all it is is trivia. I'm sure I watched the games where it happened, and I am extra sure I don't really care.

[CDu]

I’m thinking of the game in Chapel Hill during Brandon Ingram’s year, when Matt Jones got hurt and we basically had to go iron man for the whole second half. Marshall even picked up his fourth foul with several minutes left but we still pulled out the win when Derryck Thorton blocked Joel Berry on their final possession.

Since Jones was a starter, we can go ahead and rule this one out as a possibility. The bench was forced to play more than 12 minutes.

[Kedsy]

OPK - it's just random occurrences that have little or nothing to do with this year's team. Just name them - all it is is trivia. I'm sure I watched the games where it happened, and I am extra sure I don't really care.

OPK is correct. Absolutely nothing wrong with talking about Duke basketball trivia on a Duke basketball board and there was no reason for you to be mean or snarky. If you don't really care then better practice would be to ignore the trivia post and keep silent, because other people might care and this isn't the "84Duke basketball report."

[Kedsy]

Since Jones was a starter, we can go ahead and rule this one out as a possibility. The bench was forced to play more than 12 minutes.

Depends on whether he was hurt before or during the game.

[CDu]

2007-2011 duke lost exactly 2 games at home, both to UNC...so I'm not sure I agree at face value with your statement.

Does a ‘WTH’ loss have to be at home?

[CDu]

Depends on whether he was hurt before or during the game.

He was hurt during that game. Sprained ankle. Hence the “we went Ironman in the second half.

[UrinalCake]

Since Jones was a starter, we can go ahead and rule this one out as a possibility. The bench was forced to play more than 12 minutes.

According to HouseP, he is defining “starters” as the five guys who played the most minutes, not necessarily the ones who started the game.

I looked it up, the bench gave us 14 minutes in that game. So close!

[84Duke]

OPK is correct. Absolutely nothing wrong with talking about Duke basketball trivia on a Duke basketball board and there was no reason for you to be mean or snarky. If you don't really care then better practice would be to ignore the trivia post and keep silent, because other people might care and this isn't the "84Duke basketball report."

I have 68 comments under this name. I'm pretty sure this will never be the "84Duke Basketball Report." Or even the "Duke84 Basketball Report." I just didn't consider this information of any value.

[NSDukeFan]

Weirdly, UVA actually extended its lead over Duke in KenPom. I’m assuming it’s from outperforming whatever home-court advantage he builds in.
Since KenPom gives 2.5 or so points for home court, did we actually lose that game neutrally? :)

I have 68 comments under this name. I'm pretty sure this will never be the "84Duke Basketball Report." Or even the "Duke84 Basketball Report." I just didn't consider this information of any value.

As a Duke basketball fan, I enjoy Duke basketball trivia, though I am sure my wife would not be impressed with my trivia knowledge.

[Indoor66]

2-14 from 3. 18-31 on ft’s. And we won!!? Against uva!!?? This one just didn’t make any sense. But I’ll take it.

That is why statistics cannot be the final arbiter of outcomes.

[84Duke]

Since KenPom gives 2.5 or so points for home court, did we actually lose that game neutrally? :)


As a Duke basketball fan, I enjoy Duke basketball trivia, though I am sure my wife would not be impressed with my trivia knowledge.

Rank the Top 10 Duke players by shoe size. Players whose names began with "D" by assist:turnover ratio. What Duke players had the tallest grandmothers?

[HereBeforeCoachK]

That is why statistics cannot be the final arbiter of outcomes.

True, to an extent.....the stats of Virginia's three point shooting in the game mitigate those mentioned above.

[NashvilleDevil]

Rank the Top 10 Duke players by shoe size. Players whose names began with "D" by assist:turnover ratio. What Duke players had the tallest grandmothers?

This is getting ridiculous. It’s a Duke board and most of us like these little nuggets of Duke trivia. As someone mentioned if you don’t care about the trivial stuff then don’t respond.

[84Duke]

This is getting ridiculous. It’s a Duke board and most of us like these little nuggets of Duke trivia. As someone mentioned if you don’t care about the trivial stuff then don’t respond.

Well then tell us what the trivia actually is. Fewest bench minutes in a 39 year coaching career (defined if you don't count actual starters but qualified as #6-12 in minutes played) just isn't that significant.

I guess I'm going to take one of those moderator hits for this, which is expected. At least we won. My last time was slamming Trevon Duval for one of his last minute chokes.

[camion]

Rank the Top 10 Duke players by shoe size. Players whose names began with "D" by assist:turnover ratio. What Duke players had the tallest grandmothers?

I find your attempt at reductio ad absurdum to be unpersuasive.

I will counter with the motto of a famous institution of higher learning, "Knowledge Is Good."

[Troublemaker]

I think most on this board might disagree that Zion is more of a "leader" than RJ. I certainly do.

I do, too. Zion is clearing out for RJ at the end of games, not the other way around. (Whether we like that decision or not).

In any case, among players, I would say Captain Jack is the leader of the team. Co-captain Javin would be right there with him but can't stay out of foul trouble.

Among the freshmen, Tre and RJ are the leaders. Zion is the best player on the team, i.e. "leads by example," one might say.

[CameronDuke]

Duke is now 11-57 (19.3%) from 3 in their last two games, both at Cameron Indoor Stadium - an OT loss to Cuse and a 2 point win over Virginia. As much as I think we all want the trend to reverse, this team is just not going to be an efficient 3 point shooting team it appears. For the season, Duke is shooting just 132-423 (31.2%) from 3. Also, Duke is shooting just 270-403 (67.0%) from the charity stripe. Duke easily could improve the free throw shooting and get to about 70% as a team by the end of the year but the 3 point shooting I feel will be mostly abysmal for the rest of the season.

[BD80]

I'm not so sure. I mean, I guess that's part of it, but a larger part is probably that Pomeroy builds in some sort of recency bias, meaning the last x games count more than the older games. I don't know exactly how it works but if, for example, x=10, then in the list of weighted games we're losing the 123/78 adjusted we put up against Indiana and replacing it with the 132/94 we achieved against Virginia. (And if x=anything between 4 and 9, we replaced an even better defensive performance with our only-OK UVa adjusted D.) That's probably the main reason why our KenPom defensive number jumped up so much after the UVa game, and why Uva's KenPom lead over us got a little bigger.

Did the last second shot affect our ranking? Did it really leave the shooter's hand in time?

I have little sympathy for the multitude of gamblers whose fortunes changed with that shot. If it didn't impact the game, don't bother with video review.

However, if that shot could alter our seeding, they darn well better confirm it on video!

[Neals384]

Well then tell us what the trivia actually is. Fewest bench minutes in a 39 year coaching career (defined if you don't count actual starters but qualified as #6-12 in minutes played) just isn't that significant.

I guess I'm going to take one of those moderator hits for this, which is expected. At least we won. My last time was slamming Trevon Duval for one of his last minute chokes.

Gosh, we heard you the first time. Please just give yourself a timeout.

[NSDukeFan]

Well then tell us what the trivia actually is. Fewest bench minutes in a 39 year coaching career (defined if you don't count actual starters but qualified as #6-12 in minutes played) just isn't that significant.

I guess I'm going to take one of those moderator hits for this, which is expected. At least we won. My last time was slamming Trevon Duval for one of his last minute chokes.

You are of course free to decide what you find significant or not. Others on a Duke basketball board might like to think back to previous games they have watched and might find that interesting. Fortunately, they can post those questions here and those that aren’t interested don’t have to read or post about that particular topic.

A bigger deal than being condescending to other posters is slamming the 18-21 year old players who bring this community together and are working very hard and are trying their best.

[ratamero]

Oh boy, if anything else, this topic is helping me increase the size of my ignore list. :rolleyes:

Haven't watched the game yet (moving house, no internet at the moment), but if at the beginning of the week you told me we'd go 2-1 after playing Florida State, Syracuse and Virginia, I'd probably be alright with that, and that was before losing Tre and Cam (for a game). It's ACC season, every win counts - especially against arguably the other best team in the country!

[CameronDuke]

Anyone want take a crack at the top 5 in the polls next week?

I say:

1. Tennessee
2. Duke
3. Gonzaga
4. Virginia
5. Michigan

[budwom]

Not sure why the snark is needed, it’s an interesting observation. (To me, at least)

I’m guessing one or more of the others may be when we had an injury to a major player, and our usual sixth man was in the line-up. Like tonight.

Indeed. When I first pointed out that the team had only twelve bench minutes, I thought it was apropos to some of the other discussions we've had, such as is this Duke's deepest team ever, or will Goldwire see PG time ...definitely did not expect that
anyone would find it so distasteful. It's just an observation...

[84Duke]

You are of course free to decide what you find significant or not. Others on a Duke basketball board might like to think back to previous games they have watched and might find that interesting. Fortunately, they can post those questions here and those that aren’t interested don’t have to read or post about that particular topic.

A bigger deal than being condescending to other posters is slamming the 18-21 year old players who bring this community together and are working very hard and are trying their best.

So I am condescending and actively working to tear the Duke community apart. Got it. I was explaining last night how great the experience of a packed Cameron was, win or lose. And there were many losses.

[NSDukeFan]

So I am condescending and actively working to tear the Duke community apart. Got it. I was explaining last night how great the experience of a packed Cameron was, win or lose. And there were many losses.

I believe your remarks were condescending to those who might be interested in Duke trivia. I don’t recall any mention of tearing the Duke community apart. I am sorry if you felt that way. I’m glad glad you have enjoyed the experience of a packed Cameron, win or lose. Nights like last night are why I love Duke basketball.

[simplyluvin]

I wonder if Zion was not feeling well tonight. I thought his balance was off. He was able to overcome for the most part but he he fell down a few times. His free throw shots were way off and I got the impression that he was either extremely tired or maybe had the same flu that Cam had. Look at his drives to the basket in the first half there were 2 possessions when he fell down and then left the shot short. It is a tribute to his will that he overcame a bad shooting night to still score as many as he did but I wonder if something was amiss.

I think Z was gassed. His misses were mostly at the end of the second half. Shows how clutch RJs free throw shooting was at the end.

[HereBeforeCoachK]

Anyone want take a crack at the top 5 in the polls next week?

I say:

1. Tennessee
2. Duke
3. Gonzaga
4. Virginia
5. Michigan

That could happen....seems to me you can put Duke and TN in a hat and draw either one out as number one....and it would be valid. You could put UVa, Michigan and the Zags in another hat and draw them out as 3 thru 5 and it would be valid.

[flyingdutchdevil]

Great win for a pissed off team! Zion/RJ absolutely incredible (minus Zion’s FT shooting)

So impressed with this win.

[Steven43]

I think most on this board might disagree that Zion is more of a "leader" than RJ. I certainly do.
You make a fair point. Perhaps you’re right. I really just meant “leader” in the sense of who best “leads” with their play. Based on that metric I put Zion first, then Tre, then RJ.

Zion is the front-runner for National Player of the Year. Tre is perhaps the greatest perimeter defender Coach K has ever had, is considered a top contender for National Defensive Player of the Year, and is possibly the best PG in the nation. There is zero shame in RJ being third in that pecking order.

But again, my definition of leader on a basketball team might be different from yours or others on this board. I completely understand that my definition might be considered wrong and I get why you would question it.

[azzefkram]

Great win. Zion and RJ were awesome. Marques played a really solid game. Cam had difficulty playing through contact but had a great steal on an attempted backdoor cut. Jack had a quiet but effective game. I thought RJ looked good running the show.

A policy of non-engagement is not a bad policy to have.

[slower]

You make a fair point. Perhaps you’re right. I really just meant “leader” in the sense of who best “leads” with their play. Based on that metric I put Zion first, then Tre, then RJ.

Zion is the front-runner for National Player of the Year. Tre is perhaps the greatest perimeter defender Coach K has ever had, is considered a top contender for National Defensive Player of the Year, and is possibly the best PG in the nation. There is zero shame in RJ being third in that pecking order.

But again, my definition of leader on a basketball team might be different from yours or others on this board. I completely understand that my definition might be considered wrong and I get why you would question it.

No worries, my friend.

[HereBeforeCoachK]

As discussed on another thread about chemistry, there are a lot of leadership qualities on this team, spread among numerous players. So far it seems to mesh, and not clash.

I would lean towards Zion being the leader of the team because he has one of those personalities that is almost as rare as his physical skillset is. I think he is leading...by deferring to RJ as leader. Zion dominates the eyeballs of the fans, opposing players and coaches, and viewers every time he is on the court. It takes a fabulous young man to realize that, and yet defer to RJ.

Zion could dominate everything, but he seems to have innate wisdom that it's better for the group not to. And there's no doubt that RJ has that alpha dog mentality, and happily fills that role, and does it well. I respect the idea of RJ as the leader, I just think it's more complicated than that with this team, in a good way.

And then there's also Tre and his leadership, which is also obvious. Then the captains, Jack and Javin, who also add to the mix. It's a complicated mix of leaders on this team, and its' working remarkably well. My gut tells me it's the personalities of Zion and Tre that allow that to happen. I think it's also clear they genuinely like each other.

[CameronDuke]

I want to reiterate what others have said up thread about how good Virginia is for the league. That is one classy bunch. Tony Bennett is about as respectful as they come. The school is unreal academically and the campus is among the most beautiful in the country. Obviously it's easier to be gracious when you win but that team represents their school very well. I would be a Virginia fan if I weren't a Duke fan.

[Dukehky]

As discussed on another thread about chemistry, there are a lot of leadership qualities on this team, spread among numerous players. So far it seems to mesh, and not clash.

I would lean towards Zion being the leader of the team because he has one of those personalities that is almost as rare as his physical skillset is. I think he is leading...by deferring to RJ as leader. Zion dominates the eyeballs of the fans, opposing players and coaches, and viewers every time he is on the court. It takes a fabulous young man to realize that, and yet defer to RJ.

Zion could dominate everything, but he seems to have innate wisdom that it's better for the group not to. And there's no doubt that RJ has that alpha dog mentality, and happily fills that role, and does it well. I respect the idea of RJ as the leader, I just think it's more complicated than that with this team, in a good way.

And then there's also Tre and his leadership, which is also obvious. Then the captains, Jack and Javin, who also add to the mix. It's a complicated mix of leaders on this team, and its' working remarkably well. My gut tells me it's the personalities of Zion and Tre that allow that to happen. I think it's also clear they genuinely like each other.

I understand this take, but I disagree. I think it's Barrett. Zion is less in control of his emotions than Barrett is, which is awesome, but Barrett is just a killer and he just keeps getting better, Syracuse efficiency night notwithstanding.

[HereBeforeCoachK]

I understand this take, but I disagree. I think it's Barrett. Zion is less in control of his emotions than Barrett is, which is awesome, but Barrett is just a killer and he just keeps getting better, Syracuse efficiency night notwithstanding.

I understand that take, but I would bring this up: RJ was apparently not universally loved in Canada on people he played with. Zion is, and I wonder what the reaction would be to RJ on the team without Zion being RJ's biggest fan. I mean, the 91-92 teams had Laettner and a complicated chemistry on the court that was strained and at times vitriolic.

Having those two guys room together, and be best of friends, is the nexus upon which this team turns.

[budwom]

It is kind of funny/interesting that Zion's well deserved publicity has, to some (emphasis) extent pushed Barrett's extraordinary season a wee bit away from what would otherwise be the spotlight.
I say that more from the standpoint of national media attention, in which Zion is getting so much focus. To be clear, this isn't a problem, it's just an observation. Both deserve all the attention they get.

[PackMan97]

Thank you for a faster than expected game :)

[UVa1981]

I slept in a bit late after last night's game, but I did want to stop by to congratulate Duke on a very gutsy win in less than ideal circumstances. Tre Jones is simply an outstanding defender who appeared to be coming into his own directing the team on offense.

That said, that was one heckuva a ball game. 15 lead changes!! No team able to get out to the breathing space of a comfortable lead. Great coaching moves. 1-5 switch-ups met with guards driving on bigs. Each team responding repeatedly to lead changes. Terrific rock fight. Basketball, wherever played, doesn't get better for me than that.

I'm very eager to witness our Charlottesville re-match and as hopeful that Jones has returned to full health by then, if not before.

In the pre-game thread, I was unwilling to offer a point prediction, though I did say this: if Virginia limited Williamson in the paint and Duke didn't rain 3s, edge Virginia; if only one of those things happened, push; if neither happened, edge Duke.

Well, we weren't able to slow Williamson down in the paint. Credit to him and Duke. I hope Bennett can cook up something between now and the re-match.

Good luck from here out except when you're playing Virginia.

[House P]

As far as I can tell, the 12 minutes for Duke's bench was tied (with one other game) for the 4th fewest since Coach K arrived.

Sporks to the first person who can name any of the 4 other Duke games since 1981 where the bench* combined for 12 minutes or less. Hint: Three of these games happened since 2000 (and two of them happened since 2010).

My intention was to post a fun (for some, at least) trivia question related to last night's game. However, I recognize that the game thread for one of the biggest wins of the year might not be the best place for a trivia question about games from past seasons. So apologies to anyone who thinks I derailed this thread.

Anyway, in order to head off additional derailing of the thread, here are the answers to my trivia question. Upon further review, it seems that there were only 3 games where Duke got 12 or fewer minutes from players outside the Top 5.

- Jan 27, 2018 vs UVA: 6 total bench minutes (3 from Javin, 3 from Alex)
- Nov 20, 2016 vs Rhode Island: 12 total bench minutes (8 from Chase, 4 from Vrank)
- Feb 3, 1982 vs Georgia Tech: 10 total bench minutes (all from Dan Meaghar)

Here is something about the trivia question which may be relevant to future UVA games. In 3 of Duke's last 4 games vs UVA, the bench has played less than 15 total minutes (the bench played a total of 14 minutes in the 2016 game). So there may be something about UVA's style (slow pace, low number of fouls) which makes Coach K even more comfortable than usual to stick with his top 5 players.

################

Finally, for those who hate minutes discussions AND trivia questions, here is an observation from last's nights game which isn't related to either.

I was impressed with Jack Salt's ability to defend without fouling by jumping straight up while keeping his arm's completely vertical. If I recall correctly, there was one play where Zion went up twice (with contact) and no foul was called because Salt did an excellent job remaining vertical. On this play, Salt effectively defended Zion by absorbing contact and making himself an obstacle rather than by trying to swat the ball away (I don't think Salt touched the ball either time). If Salt had moved his arms forward, even slightly, I suspect he might have been called for a foul. Sagaba Konate from West Virginia is also excellent at defending this way.

[sagegrouse]

So I am condescending and actively working to tear the Duke community apart. Got it. I was explaining last night how great the experience of a packed Cameron was, win or lose. And there were many losses.

Uh, valuable poster, 84Duke, "It's not all about you." You're making this thread seem that way.

[sagegrouse]

I understand this take, but I disagree. I think it's Barrett. Zion is less in control of his emotions than Barrett is, which is awesome, but Barrett is just a killer and he just keeps getting better, Syracuse efficiency night notwithstanding.

Didn't Zion recently say -- "It's R.J.'s team" --? Who's gonna disagree with Zion?

[84Duke]

Well, there you go. Duke-Georgia Tech Feb. 3 1982. I was at that one. I was not calculating bench minutes. 47-46 Duke. Those were two bad teams.

[HereBeforeCoachK]

Didn't Zion recently say -- "It's R.J.'s team" --? Who's gonna disagree with Zion?

If you understood the point I was making, you'd know that this does not at all contradict my point necessarily.

[BandAlum83]

Great win for a pissed off team! Zion/RJ absolutely incredible (minus Zion’s FT shooting)

So impressed with this win.

I would like to point out that Zion hit 7 of his first 10 FTs last night and was 71% going into the game. 70% is kinda my standard for being a decent (not good) FT shooter. RJ was 69% going into last night’s game.

Kedsy can chime in if he wants, but I believe based on a prior comment of his, a 70% FT rate yields somewhere in the neighborhood of 1.46 offensive efficiency.

Look, we all wish our players could all hit 90% FTs, but it ain’t happening. Let’s inject some realism. The fact is the team has generally been on an upward trajectory with overall FT performance.

[sagegrouse]

If you understood the point I was making, you'd know that this does not at all contradict my point necessarily.

HBCK! I didn't even reference your post. Is it required that we acknowledge your prior posts when posting on a thread??

[lotusland]

My intention was to post a fun (for some, at least) trivia question related to last night's game. However, I recognize that the game thread for one of the biggest wins of the year might not be the best place for a trivia question about games from past seasons. So apologies to anyone who thinks I derailed this thread.

Anyway, in order to head off additional derailing of the thread, here are the answers to my trivia question. Upon further review, it seems that there were only 3 games where Duke got 12 or fewer minutes from players outside the Top 5.

- Jan 27, 2018 vs UVA: 6 total bench minutes (3 from Javin, 3 from Alex)
- Nov 20, 2016 vs Rhode Island: 12 total bench minutes (8 from Chase, 4 from Vrank)
- Feb 3, 1982 vs Georgia Tech: 10 total bench minutes (all from Dan Meaghar)

Here is something about the trivia question which may be relevant to future UVA games. In 3 of Duke's last 4 games vs UVA, the bench has played less than 15 total minutes (the bench played a total of 14 minutes in the 2016 game). So there may be something about UVA's style (slow pace, low number of fouls) which makes Coach K even more comfortable than usual to stick with his top 5 players.

################

Finally, for those who hate minutes discussions AND trivia questions, here is an observation from last's nights game which isn't related to either.

I was impressed with Jack Salt's ability to defend without fouling by jumping straight up while keeping his arm's completely vertical. If I recall correctly, there was one play where Zion went up twice (with contact) and no foul was called because Salt did an excellent job remaining vertical. On this play, Salt effectively defended Zion by absorbing contact and making himself an obstacle rather than by trying to swat the ball away (I don't think Salt touched the ball either time). If Salt had moved his arms forward, even slightly, I suspect he might have been called for a foul. Sagaba Konate from West Virginia is also excellent at defending this way.

That definitely happened with Cam in the first half. I don’t remember it happening with Zion. Cam went up into Salt’s chest on the second block. I think Zion might have created enough space to get the shot off with that move.

[84Duke]

That definitely happened with Cam in the first half. I don’t remember it happening with Zion. Cam went up into Salt’s chest on the second block. I think Zion might have created enough space to get the shot off with that move.

That was Reddish. two consecutive attempts. Bilas was raving about the good defense.

[KandG]

Here is something about the trivia question which may be relevant to future UVA games. In 3 of Duke's last 4 games vs UVA, the bench has played less than 15 total minutes (the bench played a total of 14 minutes in the 2016 game). So there may be something about UVA's style (slow pace, low number of fouls) which makes Coach K even more comfortable than usual to stick with his top 5 players.

################

Finally, for those who hate minutes discussions AND trivia questions, here is an observation from last's nights game which isn't related to either.

I was impressed with Jack Salt's ability to defend without fouling by jumping straight up while keeping his arm's completely vertical. If I recall correctly, there was one play where Zion went up twice (with contact) and no foul was called because Salt did an excellent job remaining vertical. On this play, Salt effectively defended Zion by absorbing contact and making himself an obstacle rather than by trying to swat the ball away (I don't think Salt touched the ball either time). If Salt had moved his arms forward, even slightly, I suspect he might have been called for a foul. Sagaba Konate from West Virginia is also excellent at defending this way.

I had no issue with the trivia...I actually found it highly germane to the discussion, especially since questions of how K manages his rotations come up regularly. Thanks for the info.

As far as Jack Salt, that was Cam Reddish who he managed to stymie twice. (Salt had a much harder time with Zion all game, mainly because Zion moves so well laterally and in mid-air). I wasn't too bothered about the sequence. However, I think Salt got a little too much leeway from the officials for the second "block"...I thought he jumped into Cam slightly while attempting to sell how vertical he was. Sam Vecenie said as much on twitter (https://twitter.com/Sam_Vecenie/status/1086770595293933568).

You see this a lot especially with college officials -- they struggle with how much credit to give a big man who's clearly stronger than the player he's defending, so any attempt to be vertical results in a no-call, even with lots of contact. Thought FSU's Koumadje got away with at least one such foul playing against us because he's 7-4 and built like a tank. You could even argue that RJ got the short end of such a call at the end of the Gonzaga game.

Interesting contrast with the NBA, where last night in an overtime game between the Lakers and Rockets, the Lakers' big man Ivica Zubac appeared to go straight up against Harden, but the officials said he jumped slightly into Harden. Very similar to what Salt did last night vs Reddish. In my opinion, the officials sometimes factor in the skill, strength and body control of the offensive player with that type of call (even though they shouldn't).

[84Duke]

I had no issue with the trivia...I actually found it highly germane to the discussion, especially since questions of how K manages his rotations come up regularly. Thanks for the info.

As far as Jack Salt, that was Cam Reddish who he managed to stymie twice. (Salt had a much harder time with Zion all game, mainly because Zion moves so well laterally and in mid-air). I wasn't too bothered about the sequence. However, I think Salt got a little too much leeway from the officials for the second "block"...I thought he jumped into Cam slightly while attempting to sell how vertical he was. Sam Vecenie said as much on twitter (https://twitter.com/Sam_Vecenie/status/1086770595293933568).

You see this a lot especially with college officials -- they struggle with how much credit to give a big man who's clearly stronger than the player he's defending, so any attempt to be vertical results in a no-call, even with lots of contact. Thought FSU's Koumadje got away with at least one such foul playing against us because he's 7-4 and built like a tank. You could even argue that RJ got the short end of such a call at the end of the Gonzaga game.

Interesting contrast with the NBA, where last night in an overtime game between the Lakers and Rockets, the Lakers' big man Ivica Zubac appeared to go straight up against Harden, but the officials said he jumped slightly into Harden. Very similar to what Salt did last night vs Reddish. In my opinion, the officials sometimes factor in the skill, strength and body control of the offensive player with that type of call (even though they shouldn't).

I thought Jack Salt was straight up on the first contact. Not so much when Reddish went back to exactly the same move a second time. I would have leaned (pun intended) to no foul first, foul the second time.

[Troublemaker]

But again, my definition of leader on a basketball team might be different from yours or others on this board.

That's safe to say. Your definition of leadership is just a redundancy for "best player." Everyone else just says "best player" :-)

Leadership is something else. Otherwise, Jack and Javin couldn't be the captains.

[Ggallagher]

Didn't Zion recently say -- "It's R.J.'s team" --? Who's gonna disagree with Zion?

Well probably no Marek Dolezaj. He can probably offer some advice on the benefits of taking a stance against Zion.

[KandG]

I thought Jack Salt was straight up on the first contact. Not so much when Reddish went back to exactly the same move a second time. I would have leaned (pun intended) to no foul first, foul the second time.

Exactly my read! But Cam has almost never gotten the benefit of a 50-50 call to date, and he wasn't going to get it against Salt.

[lotusland]

I rewatched the first half this morning rewinding parts I thought were interesting. I haven’t had a chance to watch the second half yet. Javin’s first half fouls were reach in fouls after a switch. I though his movement and positioning was fine and the reach was unnecessary Bolden kept his hands up for the most part and tried to bother the shots without fouling. Steals create a great advantage for us but I like Bolden’s method better against a penetrating guard/wing.

I watched to see what Alex might have done to limit his minutes. I don’t think he played in the second half. I think it was just that the offense R.J. and Zion was generating was working so we just rode those guys to the end. Coach K pulled Alex out for some reason and they had a mildly animated conversation on the sideline as he came out and then Scheyer went over and chatted with him on the bench immediately thereafter. Unfortunately ESPN completely missed the play coming back late from commercial. I think it was following the goal-tend call on Bolden. The ensuing possession was over when espn rejoined the action and Alex got yanked and scolded as the teams lined up for free-throws. AOC did come back in and assisted on Zion’s second and-one play in a row play. I think he went back out before the free-throw miss. Alex got man-handled blocking out Key on the prior possession but the shot fell so there was no rebound.

[DFife90]

This is an outstanding, well-written article about RJ and Zion helping to lead us to the Virginia win:

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/25804871/williamson-barrett-deliver-short-handed-duke

This was a great read! Thanks for sharing. Replying so others who missed it can take a look.

Watching the game, I was thinking about what it must be doing for Zion and RJ’s confidence (already high admittedly) to be breaking down one of the best defenses in the NCAA almost every time one on one. You would think two players couldn’t carry the team against one of the best defenses, but these two did. During the game, UVA knew they had to stop at least one of these guys, but could not.

[budwom]

I rewatched the first half this morning rewinding parts I thought were interesting. I haven’t had a chance to watch the second half yet. Javin’s first half fouls were reach in fouls after a switch. I though his movement and positioning was fine and the reach was unnecessary Bolden kept his hands up for the most part and tried to bother the shots without fouling. Steals create a great advantage for us but I like Bolden’s method better against a penetrating guard/wing.

I watched to see what Alex might have done to limit his minutes. I don’t think he played in the second half. I think it was just that the offense R.J. and Zion was generating was working so we just rode those guys to the end. Coach K pulled Alex out for some reason and they had a mildly animated conversation on the sideline as he came out and then Scheyer went over and chatted with him on the bench immediately thereafter. Unfortunately ESPN completely missed the play coming back late from commercial. I think it was following the goal-tend call on Bolden. The ensuing possession was over when espn rejoined the action and Alex got yanked and scolded as the teams lined up for free-throws. AOC did come back in and assisted on Zion’s second and-one play in a row play. I think he went back out before the free-throw miss. Alex got man-handled blocking out Key on the prior possession but the shot fell so there was no rebound.

he yanked AOC immediately after he somehow failed to recognize only a few seconds on the shot clock when he got the inbounds pass and just meandered about. He got a reprimand and a pat on the back. It was a fairly noteworthy spaceout.

[KandG]

Coach K pulled Alex out for some reason and they had a mildly animated conversation on the sideline as he came out and then Scheyer went over and chatted with him on the bench immediately thereafter. Unfortunately ESPN completely missed the play coming back late from commercial. I think it was following the goal-tend call on Bolden. The ensuing possession was over when espn rejoined the action and Alex got yanked and scolded as the teams lined up for free-throws. AOC did come back in and assisted on Zion’s second and-one play in a row play. I think he went back out before the free-throw miss. Alex got man-handled blocking out Key on the prior possession but the shot fell so there was no rebound.

Pretty sure Alex lost track of the shot clock on an out of bounds play and failed to put up a shot or initiate any kind of offense, resulting in a shot clock violation. This is what I recall as to why K was so hot, especially in a slower paced game like this where possessions were so crucial.

The game was so tense that even I was super annoyed with Alex for being so casual, though Bilas rightly pointed out that that brain fart is exactly the sort of error Tre Jones would have prevented from happening, because he would have reminded everyone on the floor about the clock situation.

[House P]

As far as Jack Salt, that was Cam Reddish who he managed to stymie twice. (Salt had a much harder time with Zion all game, mainly because Zion moves so well laterally and in mid-air). I wasn't too bothered about the sequence. However, I think Salt got a little too much leeway from the officials for the second "block"...I thought he jumped into Cam slightly while attempting to sell how vertical he was. Sam Vecenie said as much on twitter (https://twitter.com/Sam_Vecenie/status/1086770595293933568).

You see this a lot especially with college officials -- they struggle with how much credit to give a big man who's clearly stronger than the player he's defending, so any attempt to be vertical results in a no-call, even with lots of contact. Thought FSU's Koumadje got away with at least one such foul playing against us because he's 7-4 and built like a tank. You could even argue that RJ got the short end of such a call at the end of the Gonzaga game.

Makes a lot of sense that it was Cam and not Zion. Thanks for the correction.

As for the bolded part, that is my impression as well. It seems to me that college refs pay a lot of attention to whether the defender's arms are vertical or not. If your arms are vertical, you can get away with body contact. If your arms come forward, it seems that body contact almost always results in a defensive foul. If refs are going to call things this way, I like the idea of defending with your arms straight up as a way of impeding (though not necessarily blocking) a shot.

[dukelifer]

Pretty sure Alex lost track of the shot clock on an out of bounds play and failed to put up a shot or initiate any kind of offense, resulting in a shot clock violation. This is what I recall as to why K was so hot, especially in a slower paced game like this where possessions were so crucial.

The game was so tense that I even recall being annoyed with Alex for being so casual, though Bilas rightly pointed out that that sort of brain fart is exactly the sort of error Tre Jones would have prevented from happening, because he would have reminded everyone on the floor about the clock situation.

I suspect this annoyance with AOC was carry over from the Syracuse game where a similar unfocused play led to a steal and layup. In big games you have to be laser focused.

[Troublemaker]

Hero Balls' personality is pretty dynamic, too, I gotta say. Love some of his answers in the postgame.

e.g. (paraphrasing) At what point in the game did you think Duke was going to win?

"Before the game."


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZG4mzjo4R7c

[DarkstarWahoo]

Salt also got a pretty questionable foul called on him in the first half when he was standing still with his arms straight up and Zion drove his shoulder into him and got an and-1. Hunter had a similar foul called on him when the only contact was Zion throwing his non-shooting arm into him.

I think the questionable calls pretty much evened out.

[Bob Green]

I think the questionable calls pretty much evened out.

I agree with your assessment and believe that is the case in most games. As much as everyone (including me) whines about the refs, overall, they do a very good job an overwhelming majority of the time.

[KandG]

Salt also got a pretty questionable foul called on him in the first half when he was standing still with his arms straight up and Zion drove his shoulder into him and got an and-1. Hunter had a similar foul called on him when the only contact was Zion throwing his non-shooting arm into him.

I think the questionable calls pretty much evened out.

I would agree with this...my point wasn't to highlight any officiating discrepancies favoring one team or the other. I was more interested in how officials tend to call verticality, and Salt's defense on the play in question was a perfect example. (Salt is an excellent defender, so he's earned the benefit of the doubt in really tough situations)

The call that baffled me was the shot clock violation late in the second half on Virginia when it appeared there were a couple of seconds left on the shot clock. I was surprised the announcers never addressed it. But as you said, the calls largely evened out.

[MrPoon]

I suspect this annoyance with AOC was carry over from the Syracuse game where a similar unfocused play led to a steal and layup. In big games you have to be laser focused.

It’s true AOC is faced with is focus style mistakes but the bigger issue is on D. Especially on switch everything styles like D played in first half. He has improved but teams will force a favorable switch and he has a real hard time on top flight players like Hunter.

I was watching at a restaurant so my view isn’t particularly strong but other players have made mistakes and K doesn’t banish them, such as Cam.

[WillJ]

Salt also got a pretty questionable foul called on him in the first half when he was standing still with his arms straight up and Zion drove his shoulder into him and got an and-1. Hunter had a similar foul called on him when the only contact was Zion throwing his non-shooting arm into him.

I think the questionable calls pretty much evened out.

Agreed.

[Rich]

As discussed on another thread about chemistry, there are a lot of leadership qualities on this team, spread among numerous players. So far it seems to mesh, and not clash.

I would lean towards Zion being the leader of the team because he has one of those personalities that is almost as rare as his physical skillset is. I think he is leading...by deferring to RJ as leader. Zion dominates the eyeballs of the fans, opposing players and coaches, and viewers every time he is on the court. It takes a fabulous young man to realize that, and yet defer to RJ.

Zion could dominate everything, but he seems to have innate wisdom that it's better for the group not to. And there's no doubt that RJ has that alpha dog mentality, and happily fills that role, and does it well. I respect the idea of RJ as the leader, I just think it's more complicated than that with this team, in a good way.

And then there's also Tre and his leadership, which is also obvious. Then the captains, Jack and Javin, who also add to the mix. It's a complicated mix of leaders on this team, and its' working remarkably well. My gut tells me it's the personalities of Zion and Tre that allow that to happen. I think it's also clear they genuinely like each other.


I understand this take, but I disagree. I think it's Barrett. Zion is less in control of his emotions than Barrett is, which is awesome, but Barrett is just a killer and he just keeps getting better, Syracuse efficiency night notwithstanding.

With no particular sources other than watching the videos of the players before and during the season, including interviews and some sporadic end of blowout game bench footage, it seems to me that RJ has a kind of big brother, alpha male role, who pushes the others, both on and off the court. He has a really engaging personality and great wit, which others respect and want to emulate.

Zion strikes me as a little brother type, who might even be better than his big bro, but who aims to please and wants the respect of his big brother. He kind of lumbers around with a big smile and great personality, but takes his cues from RJ. That's my take, FWIW.

[Papa John]

Hero Balls' personality is pretty dynamic, too, I gotta say. Love some of his answers in the postgame.

e.g. (paraphrasing) At what point in the game did you think Duke was going to win?

"Before the game."

Absolutely loved that answer. These guys have swagger and confidence, and don’t seem to get rattled much, if at all.

[BandAlum83]

I would agree with this...my point wasn't to highlight any officiating discrepancies favoring one team or the other. I was more interested in how officials tend to call verticality, and Salt's defense on the play in question was a perfect example. (Salt is an excellent defender, so he's earned the benefit of the doubt in really tough situations)

The call that baffled me was the shot clock violation late in the second half on Virginia when it appeared there were a couple of seconds left on the shot clock. I was surprised the announcers never addressed it. But as you said, the calls largely evened out.

That was a very odd play. The shot definitely got off in time AND the ball hit the rim! It did go out of bounds in the rebound. I’d like to think the ref just made the incorrect signal and in the end Duke got the ball on a out of bounds off UVA.

I haven’t check the play by play to see the official call.

[tbyers11]

Salt also got a pretty questionable foul called on him in the first half when he was standing still with his arms straight up and Zion drove his shoulder into him and got an and-1. Hunter had a similar foul called on him when the only contact was Zion throwing his non-shooting arm into him.

I think the questionable calls pretty much evened out.

Salt didn’t keep his arms straight up on this play. He brought the left one down. Bring the arm down lose verticality. IMO, that’s why the foul was called. One could argue that his arm came down after the initial contact caused by Zion but it didn’t look that way to me.

[Steven43]

That's safe to say. Your definition of leadership is just a redundancy for "best player." Everyone else just says "best player" :-)

Leadership is something else. Otherwise, Jack and Javin couldn't be the captains.

Point taken. However, I do not agree that “everyone else” differentiates between best player and leader. Usually with basketball teams they are one and the same. There might be an exception here and there, but almost always the best players lead.

[tbyers11]

I would agree with this...my point wasn't to highlight any officiating discrepancies favoring one team or the other. I was more interested in how officials tend to call verticality, and Salt's defense on the play in question was a perfect example. (Salt is an excellent defender, so he's earned the benefit of the doubt in really tough situations)

The call that baffled me was the shot clock violation late in the second half on Virginia when it appeared there were a couple of seconds left on the shot clock. I was surprised the announcers never addressed it. But as you said, the calls largely evened out.

It wasn’t called a shot clock violation. It was out of bounds. The ref was saying that ball went off the UVA players head. It’s listed as OOB in the official play by play. Bilas totally blew that call by mentioning shot clock.

Now who it was actually off of was also debatable and a replay by ESPN would have helped there. but since it was too early to go to replay the refs call would have stood anyway

[Papa John]

It wasn’t called a shot clock violation. It was out of bounds. The ref was saying that ball went off the UVA players head. It’s listed as OOB in the official play by play. Bilas totally blew that call by mentioning shot clock.

Now who it was actually off of was also debatable and a replay by ESPN would have helped there. but since it was too early to go to replay the refs call would have stood anyway

Agree, I think the ref was saying it went off Jerome, although I was pretty sure one of our guys poked it out and thought a replay likely would have gone UVa’s way there. Also agree with DarkstarWahoo that missed calls pretty much evened out. In the end, just a spectacular basketball game.

[SavDukeGrad]

Absolutely loved that answer. These guys have swagger and confidence, and don’t seem to get rattled much, if at all.

Completely agree! I love RJ’s swagger - he has that Laettner gene imo. He is 18 years old, could be a senior in high school, and instead has played EVERY minute of our last 3 games (40, 45, and 40 minutes) in 8 days. I am so glad he is playing for us and not against us!

[uh_no]

Agree, I think the ref was saying it went off Jerome, although I was pretty sure one of our guys poked it out and thought a replay likely would have gone UVa’s way there. Also agree with DarkstarWahoo that missed calls pretty much evened out. In the end, just a spectacular basketball game.

the ones that stuck out in my head were a really bad hook by a UVA player on offense, and the blown OOB call with 3 (?) minutes left that they said jack (?) kicked?

I questioned some of our and-1s and thought there should have been some that were called but weren't.

[Saratoga2]

I rewatched the first half this morning rewinding parts I thought were interesting. I haven’t had a chance to watch the second half yet. Javin’s first half fouls were reach in fouls after a switch. I though his movement and positioning was fine and the reach was unnecessary Bolden kept his hands up for the most part and tried to bother the shots without fouling. Steals create a great advantage for us but I like Bolden’s method better against a penetrating guard/wing.

I watched to see what Alex might have done to limit his minutes. I don’t think he played in the second half. I think it was just that the offense R.J. and Zion was generating was working so we just rode those guys to the end. Coach K pulled Alex out for some reason and they had a mildly animated conversation on the sideline as he came out and then Scheyer went over and chatted with him on the bench immediately thereafter. Unfortunately ESPN completely missed the play coming back late from commercial. I think it was following the goal-tend call on Bolden. The ensuing possession was over when espn rejoined the action and Alex got yanked and scolded as the teams lined up for free-throws. AOC did come back in and assisted on Zion’s second and-one play in a row play. I think he went back out before the free-throw miss. Alex got man-handled blocking out Key on the prior possession but the shot fell so there was no rebound.

Alex went in on the play when the shot clock was winding down and he didn't realize it. The fans yelled shoot and he realized it at the last moment and threw up a prayer. He was pulled after that and talked to, presumably about being aware of the game situation. I don't think he played after that.

[wsb3]

My intention was to post a fun (for some, at least) trivia question related to last night's game. However, I recognize that the game thread for one of the biggest wins of the year might not be the best place for a trivia question about games from past seasons. So apologies to anyone who thinks I derailed this thread.

Anyway, in order to head off additional derailing of the thread, here are the answers to my trivia question. Upon further review, it seems that there were only 3 games where Duke got 12 or fewer minutes from players outside th4e Top 5.

- Jan 27, 2018 vs UVA: 6 total bench minutes (3 from Javin, 3 from Alex)
- Nov 20, 2016 vs Rhode Island: 12 total bench minutes (8 from Chase, 4 from Vrank)
- Feb 3, 1982 vs Georgia Tech: 10 total bench minutes (all from Dan Meaghar)



No worries here with your post..

I was at the GT game..The good news was tickets were easy to purchase that year..The bad..That was a horrible Duke team.

Won 10 games that year & 4 of those were by 1 point.

[84Duke]

the ones that stuck out in my head were a really bad hook by a UVA player on offense, and the blown OOB call with 3 (?) minutes left that they said jack (?) kicked?

I questioned some of our and-1s and thought there should have been some that were called but weren't.

I hope this doesn't become a trend, but the last few games it looks like the refs assume that Duke players (Zion especially) can tolerate more contact than the opposing team can. Barrett takes an awful lot of contact, too. Like they are being penalized for being able to play through fouls.

[CameronDuke]

Virginia went 17-1 in the ACC regular season last year and 3-0 in the ACC Tournament to capture both ACC Championships last year. In other words, they were 20-1 in the ACC. Their first and only loss in the ACC occurred on February 10th, 2018 at home to rival Virginia Tech. Their first ACC loss this season occurred on January 19th, 2019. Almost a full month before their first loss last season. With road games still at UNC, NCSU, Virginia Tech, and Louisville along with a home game vs Duke left, I'd be shocked if Virginia went 17-1 in the ACC again this regular season.

[Saratoga2]

Makes a lot of sense that it was Cam and not Zion. Thanks for the correction.

As for the bolded part, that is my impression as well. It seems to me that college refs pay a lot of attention to whether the defender's arms are vertical or not. If your arms are vertical, you can get away with body contact. If your arms come forward, it seems that body contact almost always results in a defensive foul. If refs are going to call things this way, I like the idea of defending with your arms straight up as a way of impeding (though not necessarily blocking) a shot.

On that particular play, the defenders hands were definitely up vertically, however, he is a big guy and it appeared he moved into Cam and initiated contact but got away with it.

[Chard]

Filling up the car this morning, gas station TV shows Zion's dunk on Huff. Pulled up Fox news, front page is Zion's dunk on Huff. Watched random non-sports related show last night, they showed Zion's dunk on Huff. After watching Huff huff after a couple of good plays, all of that media attention on Huff getting dunked on was sweet. Dude is going to be reminded of that constantly.

[CDu]

That was a very odd play. The shot definitely got off in time AND the ball hit the rim! It did go out of bounds in the rebound. I’d like to think the ref just made the incorrect signal and in the end Duke got the ball on a out of bounds off UVA.

I haven’t check the play by play to see the official call.

It was called out of bounds off Jerome. More specifically, Zion was credited with a rebound and then, mid-air, Jerome knocked it out of bounds.

[KandG]

It wasn’t called a shot clock violation. It was out of bounds. The ref was saying that ball went off the UVA players head. It’s listed as OOB in the official play by play. Bilas totally blew that call by mentioning shot clock.

Now who it was actually off of was also debatable and a replay by ESPN would have helped there. but since it was too early to go to replay the refs call would have stood anyway

This is probably where the confusion was created...the motion made by the ref slapping his palm to his head. I too thought that it was out of bounds off UVA, but apparently Bilas got confused by the ref's motion and interpreted it as a shot clock violation. Which then confused a lot of people at home (like me).

[NashvilleDevil]

No worries here with your post..

I was at the GT game..The good news was tickets were easy to purchase that year..The bad..That was a horrible Duke team.

Won 10 games that year & 4 of those were by 1 point.

Stall ball works!

[uh_no]

This is probably where the confusion was created...the motion made by the ref slapping his palm to his head. I too thought that it was out of bounds off UVA, but apparently Bilas got confused by the ref's motion and interpreted it as a shot clock violation. Which then confused a lot of people at home (like me).

I was confused at the stadium. Initially I thought it was OOB, but didn't remember the ball going off anyone's head...then since I (think) there was a timeout afterwards, I was wondering if maybe it was a shot clock violation....but didn't remember the clock being that low.

Oh well.

[Kfanarmy]

Two things- my reverse jinx worked to perfection- you are welcome. K switching to zone definitely messed with their heads a bit. Duke did what they needed to do- not pretty- just gutsy. UVa is an excellent team- just not excellent enough tonight. Duke still with a shot to win the regular season.

And switching back out of the zone was perfectly timed as well, as Bennett spent the timeout just before drawing up a play to beat it. Wasted effort.

[DarkstarWahoo]

I would agree with this...my point wasn't to highlight any officiating discrepancies favoring one team or the other. I was more interested in how officials tend to call verticality, and Salt's defense on the play in question was a perfect example. (Salt is an excellent defender, so he's earned the benefit of the doubt in really tough situations)

The call that baffled me was the shot clock violation late in the second half on Virginia when it appeared there were a couple of seconds left on the shot clock. I was surprised the announcers never addressed it. But as you said, the calls largely evened out.
Was that the Jerome/Zion collision? I think they were signaling that the ball went out off Jerome’s head, and it just happened to look like the shot-clock violation signal. Now I do think Zion knocked it out, but it was a judgment call that might not have gone the wrong way, which happens, versus an inexplicable screwup.

EDIT: Should have read further in the thread!

[84Duke]

Stall ball works!

That was a lot of stall. One of those years, we beat Clemson by a point because their star guard Vincent Hamilton kept stepping over the free throw line taking free throws.

[kako]

Great win. 5 thoughts on my mind:

1. I said on another thread: Barrett is the man. Ran the offense, kept TOs down, hit key shots down the stretch and led the team in scoring with 30. I loved the Maple Mamba sign. It describes his game well.

2. FT shooting - ugh. Seems to me that a made up ratio of "Great Duke team:poor FT shooting" is the worst ever this year. No one is reliable, which is pretty scary. It's our Achilles' heel, definitely. Duke got lucky today in a close game.

3. DeLaurier fouling out in 7 minutes reminded me of the forgettable Jay Bryan/Todd Anderson days. I think those guys also closed in on foul-a-minute and got the DQ. He just seems to reach way too often.

4. K's pre- and in-game plan was awesome today. The staff had the team prepped and ready to go. The switches to zone worked great. Trust in K.

5. Seeing that Goldwire didn't even sniff a minute in this game (with no Jones and Barrett playing 40 minutes) pretty much tells me that he's not in the plan much at all for the rest of the year. Disappointing. Hopefully he keeps learning and can become a role player next year.

and one extra:

6. I hope Duke isn't #1 in the new polls. It would be one less target each time a team plays Duke. Who cares about rankings mid-season? All I care about is being #1 in April.

[84Duke]

Great win. 5 thoughts on my mind:

1. I said on another thread: Barrett is the man. Ran the offense, kept TOs down, hit key shots down the stretch and led the team in scoring with 30. I loved the Maple Mamba sign. It describes his game well.

2. FT shooting - ugh. Seems to me that a made up ratio of "Great Duke team:poor FT shooting" is the worst ever this year. No one is reliable, which is pretty scary. It's our Achilles' heel, definitely. Duke got lucky today in a close game.

3. DeLaurier fouling out in 7 minutes reminded me of the forgettable Jay Bryan/Todd Anderson days. I think those guys also closed in on foul-a-minute and got the DQ. He just seems to reach way too often.

4. K's pre- and in-game plan was awesome today. The staff had the team prepped and ready to go. The switches to zone worked great. Trust in K.

5. Seeing that Goldwire didn't even sniff a minute in this game (with no Jones and Barrett playing 40 minutes) pretty much tells me that he's not in the plan much at all for the rest of the year. Disappointing. Hopefully he keeps learning and can become a role player next year.

and one extra:

6. I hope Duke isn't #1 in the new polls. It would be one less target each time a team plays Duke. Who cares about rankings mid-season? All I care about is being #1 in April.

Jay Bryan fouled out in 4 minutes against Virginia. One of those stats I will never forget.

[budwom]

^ Goldwire will still get his few minutes most games, when possessions aren't so crucial...

[BandAlum83]

I hope this doesn't become a trend, but the last few games it looks like the refs assume that Duke players (Zion especially) can tolerate more contact than the opposing team can. Barrett takes an awful lot of contact, too. Like they are being penalized for being able to play through fouls.

I think it's been a trend since the first game. Since Zion in particular can so easily play through contact, the assumption seems to be that he wasn't fouled, or he must be committing an offensive foul.

[HereBeforeCoachK]

I think it's been a trend since the first game. Since Zion in particular can so easily play through contact, the assumption seems to be that he wasn't fouled, or he must be committing an offensive foul.

This is where you have to hope there is some lobbying going on behind the scenes - some video evidence - being made available to the conference office.

[robed deity]

I think it's been a trend since the first game. Since Zion in particular can so easily play through contact, the assumption seems to be that he wasn't fouled, or he must be committing an offensive foul.

I'm convinced Zion especially will get more love from the refs in the league, even as a rookie.

[Kfanarmy]

...Interesting contrast with the NBA, where last night in an overtime game between the Lakers and Rockets, the Lakers' big man Ivica Zubac appeared to go straight up against Harden, but the officials said he jumped slightly into Harden. Very similar to what Salt did last night vs Reddish. In my opinion, the officials sometimes factor in the skill, strength and body control of the offensive player with that type of call (even though they shouldn't).
I don't think any Harden situation can be used to make a general NBA officiating comment this year. They've decided to make bank off of creating a star on that team, so he's not being called for his fouls and is getting a lot of calls that aren't made for other players.

[SavDukeGrad]

I think it's been a trend since the first game. Since Zion in particular can so easily play through contact, the assumption seems to be that he wasn't fouled, or he must be committing an offensive foul.

Agree that it’s been a trend all year. Coach K has said delicately in several press conferences that Zion “could” go to the line twice as much as he does - walking that fine line without criticizing the officials.

[jimsumner]

^ Goldwire will still get his few minutes most games, when possessions aren't so crucial...

Late in the second half yesterday, K sent Goldwire to the scorer's table. He was going to check in for Williamson if Williamson made the second of two free throws. Duke would have been on defense and I suppose Williamson would have gotten a short breather.

But Williamson missed both foul shots, K sat Goldwire back down and he never got in.

A curious sidebar.

[budwom]

Late in the second half yesterday, K sent Goldwire to the scorer's table. He was going to check in for Williamson if Williamson made the second of two free throws. Duke would have been on defense and I suppose Williamson would have gotten a short breather.

But Williamson missed both foul shots, K sat Goldwire back down and he never got in.

A curious sidebar.

Yeah, the savvy K knows when he can sneak Goldwire in for a few minutes, e.g. when a TV timeout looms for example...that's kind of his niche at this point.

[Kfanarmy]

Great game. Agree with those who've commented on Salt's good defense. I still think he could foul out most games just on moving screens.

[Fish80]

Great game. Agree with those who've commented on Salt's good defense. I still think he could foul out most games just on moving screens.

Yeah, they could have called a moving screen on that elevator play.

[Papa John]

the ones that stuck out in my head were a really bad hook by a UVA player on offense, and the blown OOB call with 3 (?) minutes left that they said jack (?) kicked?

I questioned some of our and-1s and thought there should have been some that were called but weren't.

Don't disagree that there were missed calls that went against us. I guess last night was one of those games when I would see, for example, Jerome get away with a chicken wing and react like, "aw, c'mon... that was obvious!", only to have RJ get away with a chicken wing on the other end, which had me reacting like, "phew, got away with one there!" And, not scientific at all, but my 11-year-old son would likely agree that both sets of reactions last night were pretty even/equal (in our household, at least). I thought they got away with some stuff, and I thought we also got away with some stuff. I also thought they got whistled for a few BS calls, but thought we did as well. At the end of the game, I thought two important things: (1) it all came out in the wash (i.e., neither team truly benefitted from uneven officiating) and (2) there weren't too many whistles blown overall. The refs let the kids on the court decide the outcome. At the end of the day, that's all you really want from a crew—even officiating throughout (the definition of a foul doesn't evolve throughout the course of a game), allowing the players to determine the outcome.

[HereBeforeCoachK]

Don't disagree that there were missed calls that went against us. I guess last night was one of those games when I would see, for example, Jerome get away with a chicken wing and react like, "aw, c'mon... that was obvious!", only to have RJ get away with a chicken wing on the other end, which had me reacting like, "phew, got away with one there!" And, not scientific at all, but my 11-year-old son would likely agree that both sets of reactions last night were pretty even/equal (in our household, at least). I thought they got away with some stuff, and I thought we also got away with some stuff. I also thought they got whistled for a few BS calls, but thought we did as well. At the end of the game, I thought two important things: (1) it all came out in the wash (i.e., neither team truly benefitted from uneven officiating) and (2) there weren't too many whistles blown overall. The refs let the kids on the court decide the outcome. At the end of the day, that's all you really want from a crew—even officiating throughout (the definition of a foul doesn't evolve throughout the course of a game), allowing the players to determine the outcome.

I thought the officiating when Zion was on the move was very inconsistent. Several times he gets bumped big time and there's no call....on the other hand, a couple of his and one opportunities came on plays with far less contact.

[jimsumner]

there weren't too many whistles blown overall. The refs let the kids on the court decide the outcome. .

Tell that to Javin DeLaurier, who wasn't on the court long enough to help decide the outcome. :)

[HereBeforeCoachK]

(2) there weren't too many whistles blown overall. The refs let the kids on the court decide the outcome. .

What does this even mean? Okay I know what you think it means...and I hear it a lot...but frankly, both a ref blowing a whistle...or NOT blowing a whistle...are decisions that impact the game. If you swallow your whistle, you have let illegal defensive maneuvers decide the game. If you blow the whistle too much, you have penalized aggressive defense.

If you put a guy on the FT line to decide the game that shouldn't be there, the officials have decided the game. But if you don't put a guy on the FT line who does deserve to be there...all in the name of "letting the kids decide the game" - you have also decided the game.

The only way refs actually let players decide the game...is if they officiate correctly. Letting fouls go is not doing that.

[Papa John]

Okay I know what you think it means...

Actually, I’m not sure you do, unless you somehow have the ability to climb into a doorway into my mind, ala Being John Malkovich.

[UrinalCake]

I suspect this annoyance with AOC was carry over from the Syracuse game where a similar unfocused play led to a steal and layup. In big games you have to be laser focused.

IIRC, at the end of the first half against Syracuse we committed a shot clock violation by failing to realize that the SC was ahead of the game clock by a few seconds. That led to Syracuse getting to inbounds the ball and hit that prayer from 80 feet. Obviously that’s not something you expect to happen, but could have been prevented anyways if we had simply taken a shot.

I suspect that was a point of emphasis in film sessions this week, so when Alex let the clock expire yesterday he got the quick hook. I didn’t think K was particularly harsh on him though, he was firm but still encouraging towards Alex as he went to the bench.

[dukelifer]

And switching back out of the zone was perfectly timed as well, as Bennett spent the timeout just before drawing up a play to beat it. Wasted effort.

K has a developed a great feel for a game. I guess he has learned a few things over the years. He may turn out to be a pretty coach if he keeps this up.

[jimsumner]

IIRC, at the end of the first half against Syracuse we committed a shot clock violation by failing to realize that the SC was ahead of the game clock by a few seconds. That led to Syracuse getting to inbounds the ball and hit that prayer from 80 feet. Obviously that’s not something you expect to happen, but could have been prevented anyways if we had simply taken a shot.

I suspect that was a point of emphasis in film sessions this week, so when Alex let the clock expire yesterday he got the quick hook. I didn’t think K was particularly harsh on him though, he was firm but still encouraging towards Alex as he went to the bench.

Scheyer actually was the read-O'Connell-the-riot-act-guy after AOC was pulled. And Duke did put him right back in. But O'Connell looked like a deer in the headlights and took a more permanent seat on the bench.

And this in the same week as he played the best game of his career.

So, we know he can play better. And he has to. Getting a scoreless performance from your bench doesn't strike me as a sustainable, long-term strategy.

[Rich]

K has a developed a great feel for a game. I guess he has learned a few things over the years. He may turn out to be a pretty coach if he keeps this up.

Meh, the jury's still out. I'm gonna need to see a few more years out of him before I draw any conclusions.

[HereBeforeCoachK]

Actually, I’m not sure you do, unless you somehow have the ability to climb into a doorway into my mind, ala Being John Malkovich.

Hardly a new concept. Once I've heard something a few million times, I think I'm zeroing in on the gist. That is, unless what you mean is different from what everybody else means by "letting the players decide." It's not new.

What you mean is, not making the calls...letting the play go. My contention is that is just as much the refs deciding the game as calling too much.

[Indoor66]

What you mean is, not making the calls...letting the play go. My contention is that is just as much the refs deciding the game as calling too much.

IMO, the refs establish a pattern for calls in every game and they should continue that pattern at the end of the game. If it is a foul or a walk in the 28th minute of the game, it should be the same in the last minute. To do otherwise is to take the game away from the players by the failure to make the call.

[richardjackson199]

Duke is now 11-57 (19.3%) from 3 in their last two games, both at Cameron Indoor Stadium - an OT loss to Cuse and a 2 point win over Virginia. As much as I think we all want the trend to reverse, this team is just not going to be an efficient 3 point shooting team it appears. For the season, Duke is shooting just 132-423 (31.2%) from 3. Also, Duke is shooting just 270-403 (67.0%) from the charity stripe. Duke easily could improve the free throw shooting and get to about 70% as a team by the end of the year but the 3 point shooting I feel will be mostly abysmal for the rest of the season.

This is why I still wonder if it might help Duke to burn Joey Baker's redshirt. UrinalCake perhaps accurately pointed out that Baker wouldn't add much beyond what AOC and Jack White give. And we know K likes to tighten to a shorter rotation so another player getting some minutes just hasn't been K's M.O.

And I have no clue what Baker could provide defensively, rebounding, passing, positioning, communicating, etc. But Baker can really shoot, and that may be the only glaring achilles heel of this superteam. There may be matchups where teams force us to shoot open 3's, and having a zone-buster guy who can come in and drain them could help. I don't know about Baker's free-throw shooting, but if he's a guy you can bring in at the end of a 2 point game to swish two 1-and-1 free throws that could mean the difference between a win and a loss.

This team is so special I want all-in and all hands on deck if there are pieces who can help us have a better chance to win it all. Of course if Reddish, White, and O-Connell etc can provide that consistent clutch shooting that would be ideal. I really hope they all get their shooting mojo back so that we can peak into the scary best version of this team we can be. But I'm wondering if Baker could be the best shooter on this team? He sure looks that way in pregame warm-ups. I don't know, and trust K. He knows and I'm sure UrinalCake is probably right if the decision is made not to bring Baker into the mix.

And not this is not some desperate wish to win my pie bet with Kaze. Warm up the bus baby that one is "O"-"V"-"E"-"R." (Sorry couldn't resist with all the clear closet Dickie V lovers on this board.) ;)

[BandAlum83]

Meh, the jury's still out. I'm gonna need to see a few more years out of him before I draw any conclusions.

I'm willing to give him 5-10 more years and let history decide if he was any good.

[SavDukeGrad]

I have no idea what Carolina Blitz is, but I ran across this clip of questions to Jack, RJ, and Zion in the postgame locker room.

My favorite - someone asks RJ that, if he saw Zion walking down the street, would he think Zion had such a good handle?
RJ's response - "I wouldn't think he played basketball."

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g_ek5eNDNhM

[Reilly]

... Baker's redshirt ... could mean the difference between a win and a loss.

This team is so special I want all-in and all hands on deck ...

It looks like Grayson had ten games of 0-4 minutes his frosh year, but certainly was a difference-maker against Wisc: http://dukehana.lsiconsulting.com:8000/Duke_University/duke_mbb_stats/WebContent/player_info.html?player_id=2757

[richardjackson199]

It looks like Grayson had ten games of 0-4 minutes his frosh year, but certainly was a difference-maker against Wisc: http://dukehana.lsiconsulting.com:8000/Duke_University/duke_mbb_stats/WebContent/player_info.html?player_id=2757

Exactly. I have no idea what the answer is regarding Baker. I just think the question has to be asked. Our weakness is shooting, and that is his strength. If he can make this team even better, it should be considered. If he can come in and rain a bunch of 3's on a defense that gives us that, that could make us better. Is he the guy we can count on to hit 2 clutch free throws when a big game is on the line? Even if that was the only thing he did, it would be huge to close out a big game with high pressure ending. Gotta make those end-of-game free throws and 1-and-1's.

Maybe the answer to the question is that he wouldn't make us better this year and isn't ready. The coaches see him in practice and they would know. But if he is the guy who would come in and hit shots, I'd vote to play him on this team. It's special.

K will make the right decision.

[sagegrouse]

^ Goldwire will still get his few minutes most games, when possessions aren't so crucial...

Horses for courses. We played a switching man-to-man for the most part, which required our smallest player to guard their tallest and our tallest to guard their quickest. All players on the floor were 6-7 or taller (Alex is 6-6 but played only a few minutes). Jordan is 6-2. He would play more under a different defensive scheme. I think Alex would have played more absent that one awful play.

[HereBeforeCoachK]

IMO, the refs establish a pattern for calls in every game and they should continue that pattern at the end of the game. If it is a foul or a walk in the 28th minute of the game, it should be the same in the last minute. To do otherwise is to take the game away from the players by the failure to make the call.

AMEN...preach!

[jimsumner]

Horses for courses. We played a switching man-to-man for the most part, which required our smallest player to guard their tallest and our tallest to guard their quickest. All players on the floor were 6-7 or taller (Alex is 6-6 but played only a few minutes). Jordan is 6-2. He would play more under a different defensive scheme. I think Alex would have played more absent that one awful play.

But O'Connell went back in after that bad play and thus had a chance to earn some PT. He did not do anything to earn that PT. So, it was more than that one play.

O'Connell has the ability, no doubt. But he needs to be stronger, physically and mentally.

[golfinesquire]

But O'Connell went back in after that bad play and thus had a chance to earn some PT. He did not do anything to earn that PT. So, it was more than that one play.

O'Connell has the ability, no doubt. But he needs to be stronger, physically and mentally.

I thought K’s reaction when he took Alex out after the 30 second violation was telling. He stopped him on the way to the bench and grabbed hold of him to talk to him, in what looked like a fatherly way. Said to me that K knows the kid needs encouragement and did not want gim to get too down. I was wondering if there are reports from practice that he is grtting ready. to break out?