MBB: Duke @ Wake Forest (Tue, Jan 8, 7pm ET, ESPN) Pre-Game and In-Game Thread

[JBDuke]

Duke travels to Wake Forest for their first conference road game this Tuesday. Early slot on Tuesday evening on ESPN at least means the start won't be lost to an earlier game running long, but it does make it harder on Duke fans on the west coast.

Wake Forest has struggled so far this year, but with a really tough match up in Tallahassee next weekend, this smells a bit like a trap game. Wake could go a long way towards saving their season with a victory over Duke...

[OldPhiKap]

Wake opened in 1834 as the Wake Forest Manual Labor Institute, and all students were required to spend half the day working on a plantation. The course of education was essentially Baptist ministry and theology. Notable alum include Carroll O’Connor, Arnold Palmer, David Chase (creator of The Sopranos), and Jesse Helms.

It is a pretty campus.

[Bob Green]

I'm headed to San Diego tomorrow so I'll have to remember to adjust my schedule for a 4 pm tip-off.

[Indoor66]

I'm headed to San Diego tomorrow so I'll have to remember to adjust my schedule for a 4 pm tip-off.

Please say hello to Coronado.

[devildeac]

Wake opened in 1834 as the Wake Forest Manual Labor Institute, and all students were required to spend half the day working on a plantation. The course of education was essentially Baptist ministry and theology. Notable alum include Carroll O’Connor, Arnold Palmer, David Chase (creator of The Sopranos), and Jesse Helms.

It is a pretty campus.

Ha-rumph.

Oh, wait a minute. You posted "notable."

:o

Carry on.

[OldPhiKap]

Ha-rumph.

Oh, wait a minute. You posted "notable."

:o

Carry on.

You went without saying. So I didn’t say it.

[Bob Green]

Please say hello to Coronado.

That will be easily accomplished as I will be on Coronado (North Island N.A.S.) each day.

[Indoor66]

That will be easily accomplished as I will be on Coronado (North Island N.A.S.) each day.

I figured you would. I always liked Coronado.

[CDu]

This is not a very good Wake team. Attrition has caught up to them, and it is now a really young team. There is some talent, but it's far from a quality product being put on the floor so far. Overall, they are 7-6, with home losses to Gardner-Webb and Houston Baptist along with a neutral-site loss to St Joe's and road losses to Tennessee, Ga Tech, and Richmond. They don't even have a single Q2 win this year (yikes!).

Wake doesn't play notably fast or slow, but right in the middle of the pack nationally in tempo. They are pretty blah offensively for a P5 school, and bad defensively regardless of conference (outside the top-200 nationally on D). The only thing they do well offensively is draw fouls and offensive rebound. Defensively, they patrol the defensive glass well and don't give up a high shooting percentage on 3s. But they are terrible at forcing turnovers and terrible at preventing two-point baskets. It's a bad combination for facing a team like Duke.

Centers: The Deacs sport a two-headed "monster" at center. Ikenna Smart (6'10", 245lb grad transfer from Nigeria via Buffalo) starts, but plays very limited minutes because he fouls religiously (3.1 per 14.5 minutes played). Smart is a little like a poor man's Marques Bolden: big, underwhelming rebounder but a bit of a shotblocker, not much of a threat away from the rim. He's really raw and foul-prone, and I'd expect him to continue that Tuesday. Behind Smart is Olivier Sarr (7'0", 215lb soph from France). Sarr is a terrific shotblocker and a solid rebounder. He has a little bit of a jumper, but that's very much in development. He does draw fouls and shoots okay from the line. But he, too, has foul problems (3.4 per 20.5 minutes). Odds are that one of them will foul out, and I'd be surprised if they combine for 40 minutes. Sunday Okeke (6'8", 240lb soph from Nigeria) is the break in case of emergency big. He's athletic and rebounds and blocks shots, but brings little else to the table.

Forwards: Jaylen Hoard (6'8", 205lb freshman from France) is the headliner at forward. Hoard is, if you squint REALLY hard, a little like a combo-forward version of RJ Barrett (don't get me wrong: he's not NEARLY as good as Barrett, just has some physical and stylistic similarities). He's a lanky but deceptively strong forward with good driving skills, long arms, and strong rebounding skills. On offense, he's a volume scorer, capable of making shots but not a high-percentage shooter. But he does most of his work going to the rim, and doesn't force many up from outside at all. Hoard is a pretty talented kid and one of Wake's better recruits in recent years. Hoard leads the team in rebounding and is second in scoring. Backing up (and sometimes alongside) Hoard is Isaiah Mucius (6'8", 190lb freshman). Mucius is a bouncy, lanky forward who has some potential. But he's super skinny and raw. Mucius can shoot it a little, but again that's not a strength by any means. He's very much a work in progress.

Wings: Chaudee Brown (6'5", 215lb soph) is the headliner on the wing. Brown can play. He's strong and athletic, and has a pretty decent shooting touch. However, he's pretty limited off the dribble, which is a problem since the Deacs don't pass well/much. But off-ball he can be a dangerous player if ignored, so keeping track of him would be wise. Sharone Wright Jr (6'5", 180lb frosh) is the other wing of note. Wright is the son of former Clemson and NBA player Sharone Wright. In short, he's nothing like his dad on the court. Wright is a solid ballhandler and decent athlete, though he lacks a bit in terms of shooting touch. He's a pretty decent finisher inside the arc, but struggles from 3 and from the FT line. A promising young player, but a year or two away. Still, good lineage. Last among the regular wings is Torry Johnson (6'3", 165lb grad transfer from Northern Arizona). Johnson is athletic with long arms, and excels and drawing fouls. He's a good free throw shooter too, but he's pretty mediocre shooting from the field.

Guards: The PG is a name familiar to Duke fans, Brandon Childress (6'0", 190lb junior). Coming into this year, Childress was probably best known for being Randolph's son and for picking a fight on the Duke bench at Wake. Other than that, he wasn't a terribly productive player his first two years. But this year, he's really found his game. He is a score-first lead guard who shoots over 50% from the field, over 40% from 3, and over 75% from the FT line. He is fearless attacking the rim, and has finally seemed to figure out how to make that work. And he's improved dramatically from 3pt range as well, though not nearly to the degree he's improved inside the arc. Childress leads the team in scoring (17.3 ppg) and assists (4.2 apg), steals (1.6 spg), and assist/turnover ratio (nearly 2:1). If he can keep up his play in ACC play, he'll be a contender for an All-ACC mention (3rd team or honorable). Nominally, Torry Johnson backs Childress up. But they don't really have a backup PG as Johnson is more wing than PG.

This is a VERY friendly first road game for us. Wake is bad AND inexperienced. They basically have 3 ACC level starters and 2-3 ACC level backups. It's a bad situation for them and they have a good chance of finishing last in the ACC this year. We need to win this game.

[Kedsy]

I'm headed to San Diego tomorrow so I'll have to remember to adjust my schedule for a 4 pm tip-off.

Please let us know if you see any Aztecs.

[tteettimes]

Are you going to visit the Fountain of Youth while there ??
😆😆😆😆😆

[OldPhiKap]

Are you going to visit the Fountain of Youth while there ??
😆😆😆😆😆

St. Augustine, Florida claims it I believe.

(No Aztecs. At least, living.)

[BandAlum83]

St. Augustine, Florida claims it I believe.

(No Aztecs. At least, living.)

Well that proves it. There would be plenty of vintage Aztecs around if it were located there.

Personally, I think it must be hidden somewhere in the highlands of Scotland.

[slower]

Recently (the last 10 years or so), Wake always seems to field a team of chippy, borderline dirty players. What's their a-hole rating this year (on a scale from Tim Duncan to Bryant Crawford)?

[Natty_B]

This will at least put the tired "Duke doesn't play road games" narrative to bed for this season. Seth Davis was going on about it today (while failing to note Tennessee has played all of one road game and Michigan all of two).

[UrinalCake]

I know Wake isn’t any good, but I’m not going to take any game for granted, especially our first true road test. Last year we lost to BC in a similar spot. The season before we needed a monster game from Luke to escape with a one possession win in Winston Salem. Wake knows that a win over us would make their season and possibly save Manning’s job. We’ll have to bring it for the full 40 to notch the win.

[TruBlu]

This will at least put the tired "Duke doesn't play road games" narrative to bed for this season. Seth Davis was going on about it today (while failing to note Tennessee has played all of one road game and Michigan all of two).

It will merely change to "Duke doesn't play road games unless it is mandated by the ACC schedule". And they have a point.

[Tripping William]

Recently (the last 10 years or so), Wake always seems to field a team of chippy, borderline dirty players. What's their a-hole rating this year (on a scale from Tim Duncan to Bryant Crawford)?

Brandon Childress remains on the roster. So, on the high side.

[arnie]

Wake knows that a win over us would make their season and possibly save Manning’s job. We’ll have to bring it for the full 40 to notch the win.
Long term, probably better for Wake to lose big time, otherwise Manning may stay longer.
Kind of like Roof beating GaT and Cheats as interim coach. Those wins just extended the misery for 4-5 years.

[Troublemaker]

I know Wake isn’t any good, but I’m not going to take any game for granted, especially our first true road test. Last year we lost to BC in a similar spot. The season before we needed a monster game from Luke to escape with a one possession win in Winston Salem. Wake knows that a win over us would make their season and possibly save Manning’s job. We’ll have to bring it for the full 40 to notch the win.

The Wake team two seasons was an NCAA tournament team while this Wake team is shaping up to be the worst of Manning's tenure. BC last season had a lottery pick at guard in Jerome Robinson and possibly another pro in Ky Bowman. Usually when Duke faceplants as a favorite, it involves tremendous guard play on the other team, e.g. Dennis Smith Jr, Shamorie Ponds, particularly off the dribble drive. I'm just not seeing the guard talent on this Wake team, although maybe I'll be surprised. Childress is good but more dangerous as a shooter than driver.

Also, needless to say, by many measures, this is shaping up to be a very different Duke team than previous versions.

Nobody bangs the "watch out for opponents early in the ACC schedule" drum around here more than me, but I just can't see it in this particular game.

I very well may end up taking Wake against the spread in the Degenerates Contest, but as for just getting a win, we're going to have such a wiiiiide margin of error. Duke is going to be ~23-pt favorites. Lose here, and it'd immediately be one of the worst losses of Coach K's career. (Very possibly THE worst, by point spread.)

[SavDukeGrad]

I know Wake isn’t any good, but I’m not going to take any game for granted, especially our first true road test. Last year we lost to BC in a similar spot. The season before we needed a monster game from Luke to escape with a one possession win in Winston Salem. Wake knows that a win over us would make their season and possibly save Manning’s job. We’ll have to bring it for the full 40 to notch the win.

I totally agree with you that we shouldn’t take any game for granted. And I was at the Duke game in Winston in 2014 when we were upset in Jeff Bzdelik’s final season. (Incidentally that win didn’t save his job as he was forced out a couple of weeks later).

But the Wake team that almost beat us in Winston two years ago was a MUCH better team than this year’s version, and had John Collins.

BTW, in one of the stranger career arcs, did anyone notice that in November, the Houston Rockets talked Bzdelik into coming back after a 2 month retirement to help their defense.

[devildeac]

The Wake team two seasons was an NCAA tournament team while this Wake team is shaping up to be the worst of Manning's tenure. BC last season had a lottery pick at guard in Jerome Robinson and possibly another pro in Ky Bowman. Usually when Duke faceplants as a favorite, it involves tremendous guard play on the other team, e.g. Dennis Smith Jr, Shamorie Ponds, particularly off the dribble drive. I'm just not seeing the guard talent on this Wake team, although maybe I'll be surprised. Childress is good but more dangerous as a shooter than driver.

Also, needless to say, by many measures, this is shaping up to be a very different Duke team than previous versions.

Nobody bangs the "watch out for opponents early in the ACC schedule" drum around here more than me, but I just can't see it in this particular game.

I very well may end up taking Wake against the spread in the Degenerates Contest, but as for just getting a win, we're going to have such a wiiiiide margin of error. Duke is going to be ~23-pt favorites. Lose here, and it'd immediately be one of the worst losses of Coach K's career. (Very possibly THE worst, by point spread.)

He may be even more dangerous in dead ball situations:

https://collegebasketball.nbcsports.com/2017/01/28/video-brandon-childress-tackles-grayson-allen-in-duke-wake-forest-dust-up/

:mad::mad:

[budwom]

I know Wake isn’t any good, but I’m not going to take any game for granted, especially our first true road test. Last year we lost to BC in a similar spot. The season before we needed a monster game from Luke to escape with a one possession win in Winston Salem. Wake knows that a win over us would make their season and possibly save Manning’s job. We’ll have to bring it for the full 40 to notch the win.

Fair point on ACC road games (which I never take for granted), but this is a VERY bad Wake team, not expected to get another win all season, already having lost at home to Houston Bappist.
Now next Saturday's tiff at FSU is one in which we can surely expect a severe test. And almost all of our other ACC road games...

[HereBeforeCoachK]

Fair point on ACC road games (which I never take for granted), but this is a VERY bad Wake team, not expected to get another win all season, already having lost at home to Houston Bappist.
Now next Saturday's tiff at FSU is one in which we can surely expect a severe test. And almost all of our other ACC road games...

Agree, Urinal made a very fair point....in general....but this WF team is nowhere near as good as the BC team that beat Duke last season. And I think this Duke team has the chemistry to hold up on the road better.

[dukelifer]

Agree, Urinal made a very fair point...in general...but this WF team is nowhere near as good as the BC team that beat Duke last season. And I think this Duke team has the chemistry to hold up on the road better.

Duke should win this game but basketball is a crazy sport. Players can have the game of their lives on any given night and if two or three do- and a key player fouls out- it can be a challenge. Duke has a big margin for error in this one, however.

[ChillinDuke]

Duke should win this game but basketball is a crazy sport. Players can have the game of their lives on any given night and if two or three do- and a key player fouls out- it can be a challenge. Duke has a big margin for error in this one, however.

Wait, just checking on this. If, not one but, three opposing players have the game of their lives AND a key player for Duke fouls out, then we could have a challenge?

I mean, yeah, I think everyone agrees with that.

:D

- Chillin

[CDu]

I mean, I could see a scenario in which we lose. But it would involve a LOT of things going right for Wake and wrong for Duke. The talent gap is just that wide. Torvik has Duke as a 94% chance of winning, with an expected margin of victory of 20. That is amazing for an in-conference road game. And, honestly, I feel like that might even be a little (not much, but perhaps a little) conservative. Even assuming that probability though, it is a game we should win 19 times in 20. We really should win this game.

Wake does have a few real players (Childress, Hoard, and Brown). But they don't have any depth and they don't have any experience. That's a bad combination when you are already at a substantial talent and coaching deficit.

[sagegrouse]

Wait, just checking on this. If, not one but, three opposing players have the game of their lives AND a key player for Duke fouls out, then we could have a challenge?

I mean, yeah, I think everyone agrees with that.

:D

- Chillin

When we are losing to a team with a lot less talent, I try to remind myself that there is a pattern. The underdog plays with a very high level of intensity and takes the lead or keeps the score close for a half or a little more. Then the opponent seems to run out of gas in the second half. That happened against both Texas Tech and Clemson, both teams that are a lot better than Wake Forest.

[HereBeforeCoachK]

Duke should win this game but basketball is a crazy sport. Players can have the game of their lives on any given night and if two or three do- and a key player fouls out- it can be a challenge. Duke has a big margin for error in this one, however.

Agree, in a single game scenario, anything is possible...and also agree, the margin of error for Duke is much thicker than it was last season at BC. BC's guards were big time, just not many people had realized it yet.

[budwom]

I think the style of defense Duke plays this year (as opposed to last) largely precludes losing to a team like Wake, just too many athletes making life miserable for Wake's offense. Or so I think...

[kmspeaks]

This will at least put the tired "Duke doesn't play road games" narrative to bed for this season. Seth Davis was going on about it today (while failing to note Tennessee has played all of one road game and Michigan all of two).

I will never understand the schedule more road games argument. The goal is to win the National Championship. Last time I checked those games were played, wait for it.....at neutral sites! But sure, playing at Wake is a better test than Texas Tech in New York because the words on the floor are the same color as their uniforms, or something. :rolleyes:

[CDu]

I think the style of defense Duke plays this year (as opposed to last) largely precludes losing to a team like Wake, just too many athletes making life miserable for Wake's offense. Or so I think...

Yeah, last year’s team was - until we committed to zone - pretty limited defensively. Not much quickness and/or lateral mobility, and to be honest not enough good individual defenders. Teams with multiple attacking guards/wings could (and did) exploit us in man-to-man. Once we went zone, that changed of course.

This year’s team has way more defensive versatility, and more good defenders. There arguably are hardly any bad defenders in the primary rotation (with O’Connell being the only possible exception), whereas last year we had very few good defenders. The combination of more versatility and better defenders makes it really hard for teams to have big offensive games. And aside from the Gonzaga game, we haven’t been hurt defensively this year.

Not saying it can’t happen. Just that it seems much less likely.

[SorryForHot]

Could we see a change in the starting 5 for this game? With Cam's struggles and White's play - is it possible a little bit of tinkering could improve the team as a whole? Line-up changes usually happen after loses but if Duke were to experiment...why not this game?

[MChambers]

Could we see a change in the starting 5 for this game? With Cam's struggles and White's play - is it possible a little bit of tinkering could improve the team as a whole? Line-up changes usually happen after loses but if Duke were to experiment...why not this game?

If Cam is having confidence issues, I don’t think taking him out of the starting lineup will help. K is a master motivator and I’m sure he’s trying to get Cam going. Having him come off the bench may not help, however.

[CDu]

If Cam is having confidence issues, I don’t think taking him out of the starting lineup will help. K is a master motivator and I’m sure he’s trying to get Cam going. Having him come off the bench may not help, however.

Yeah, it's a complicated question. If it is a confidence issue, I can't imagine getting benched would help. If it is a "needs more touches" question, then maybe playing a greater percentage of his minutes without Barrett will help.

Of course, I can't imagine Barrett is going to sit much, so it isn't like there are going to be a ton of minutes to be had without Barrett. So I think that figuring out how to maximize Reddish's production with Barrett on the court will be important.

That said, I think there needs to be zero minutes per game (barring garbage time and/or foul trouble) when there aren't at least two of Williamson, Barrett, and Reddish are on the floor. So staggering their minutes to achieve that goal would seem to make sense. Wouldn't necessarily require a starting lineup change, just an earlier substitution pattern for one of the three if all 3 start.

I don't know what is the best solution for getting Reddish going, so I won't rule out any of the possibilities including bringing him off the bench.

[niveklaen]

When we are losing to a team with a lot less talent, I try to remind myself that there is a pattern. The underdog plays with a very high level of intensity and takes the lead or keeps the score close for a half or a little more. Then the opponent seems to run out of gas in the second half. That happened against both Texas Tech and Clemson, both teams that are a lot better than Wake Forest.

It also happened in the Gonzaga game, but too late and their lead was too big - down 13 with 8 minutes and change left - lost by 2.

As a result our dominance this year feels very different than in 1999 and 2001 and 2002 when it felt like we consistently blew games open by the under 12 TV timeout.

[UrinalCake]

I will never understand the schedule more road games argument. The goal is to win the National Championship. Last time I checked those games were played, wait for it....at neutral sites! But sure, playing at Wake is a better test than Texas Tech in New York because the words on the floor are the same color as their uniforms, or something. :rolleyes:

I honestly think a lot of it comes from the idea that it would be good for the sport if teams like Duke scheduled more OOC road games, not that it would be better for Duke. Many people feel that the odds are stacked against mid-majors being able to earn at-large bids and a big part of it is that the top schools refuse to come and play them on their home courts. Teams like Duke and Kentucky and Kansas are in a position of power, and people unaffiliated with those schools want them to construct their schedules in a way that benefits others.

With that said, I don't discount the notion that playing on the road is a lot harder than playing at a neutral site. And if Duke was the team scheduling lots of road games while UNC chose to stay home throughout the OOC, I have no doubt we'd be mocking them for that.

[HereBeforeCoachK]

I honestly think a lot of it comes from the idea that it would be good for the sport if teams like Duke scheduled more OOC road games, not that it would be better for Duke. Many people feel that the odds are stacked against mid-majors being able to earn at-large bids and a big part of it is that the top schools refuse to come and play them on their home courts. Teams like Duke and Kentucky and Kansas are in a position of power, and people unaffiliated with those schools want them to construct their schedules in a way that benefits others.

With that said, I don't discount the notion that playing on the road is a lot harder than playing at a neutral site. And if Duke was the team scheduling lots of road games while UNC chose to stay home throughout the OOC, I have no doubt we'd be mocking them for that.

A lot of it is just mindless envy and hate. The facts are these:

A: Duke, due to its position in the college BB world, will be in something like 3 to 5 big time TV events during the early season (Maui, the Kentucky and TT games, and Big Ten challenge). Those are neutral sites for the most part, sometimes away in Big Ten Challenge. This year there were 5 neutral court games I think....that's 5 dates where Duke can't go on the road. Those are also always against top flight teams.

B: When Duke goes on the road 9 times in the ACC, they will be facing the other team's Super Bowl performance every time. And some of those teams (UNC, Va, FSU, VT) are darn good teams anyway. This super bowl syndrome has been that way most of the time since 1992. No other team on the planet faces 9 "super bowl" road trips.

Anyone who thinks at Elon is tougher than Texas Tech on a neutral court is too stupid to argue with.

[sagegrouse]

I will never understand the schedule more road games argument. The goal is to win the National Championship. Last time I checked those games were played, wait for it....at neutral sites! But sure, playing at Wake is a better test than Texas Tech in New York because the words on the floor are the same color as their uniforms, or something. :rolleyes:

I agree, and two more points. First, the ACC is the strongest conference, and Duke has nine ACC road games. Isn't that enough, with VT, FSU, UVa and UNC on the away schedule. Second, it's in part economics -- Cameron's small size make other non-conference marquee teams less willing to do home-and-home series with Duke. As a result, we tend to play high-profile opponents on neutral sites.

[Billy Dat]

I agree, and two more points. First, the ACC is the strongest conference, and Duke has nine ACC road games. Isn't that enough, with VT, FSU, UVa and UNC on the away schedule. Second, it's in part economics -- Cameron's small size make other non-conference marquee teams less willing to do home-and-home series with Duke. As a result, we tend to play high-profile opponents on neutral sites.

I can't remember exactly when we started the neutral site thing, but K was definitely spooked when Nan replaced HKH as Prez that the school might pivot away from major sports and he was determined to "endow" his program's scholarships. Since then, the man has been a fundraising fiend. It would be interesting for someone to do an article on how the program, with such a small stadium where so many tickets are free, manages to be so flush. These sponsored neutral site games are a big part of it.

I also think that if the tournament committee wanted everyone to schedule true road games, they'd build it more prominently into the formula and I bet we'd comply. We don't because it doesn't help us at all. Would it be fun? Sure. Would it make scribes happy? Sure. Does it hurt us...meh. John Gasaway wrote an ESPN+ article saying as much today.

I actually like that we are the very last D1 team to play a true roadie. Everyone can pound sand.

[HereBeforeCoachK]

I can't remember exactly when we started the neutral site thing, but K was definitely spooked when Nan replaced HKH as Prez that the school might pivot away from major sports and he was determined to "endow" his program's scholarships. Since then, the man has been a fundraising fiend. It would be interesting for someone to do an article on how the program, with such a small stadium where so many tickets are free, manages to be so flush. These sponsored neutral site games are a big part of it.

I also think that if the tournament committee wanted everyone to schedule true road games, they'd build it more prominently into the formula and I bet we'd comply. We don't because it doesn't help us at all. Would it be fun? Sure. Would it make scribes happy? Sure. Does it hurt us...meh. John Gasaway wrote an ESPN+ article saying as much today.

I actually like that we are the very last D1 team to play a true roadie. Everyone can pound sand.

Couple thoughts to buttress your points:
Pound sand indeed. Hopefully we'll be the last team to cut down nets too. F(redacted) em.

Yeah, the Big TV games help revenue. So does Clemson football for that matter vis a vis the conference split. Everyone in the ACC should thank whoever they pray to every night for Clemson FB and Duke BB - and for the Duke-Cheats rivalry. Sometimes I think some on DBR take that for granted. So few....so very few teams....get to be part of a rivalry that everyone nationwide acknowledges. It's a huge PR and revenue boost for the entire league.

[budwom]

^ keep in mind that Duke manages the scarcity of tickets in Cameron rather well. What many (I'd say the vast majority) pay for tickets is considerably (emphasis) less (as expensive as they are) than the annual Iron Dukes contribution required to purchase said tickets. OK, just looked it up, this summer they (Iron Dukes) anticipated it would take an $8000 (annual) contribution to enable one to buy two season tickets for this season.

I'm too lazy to count home games, but if we had 20, that would amount to a surcharge of $200 per ticket, on top of the actual ticket price...which is why building a larger stadium and screwing up this demand dynamic makes no sense.

[hallcity]

I agree, and two more points. First, the ACC is the strongest conference, and Duke has nine ACC road games. Isn't that enough, with VT, FSU, UVa and UNC on the away schedule. Second, it's in part economics -- Cameron's small size make other non-conference marquee teams less willing to do home-and-home series with Duke. As a result, we tend to play high-profile opponents on neutral sites.

I wonder whether the advent of the ACC Network puts Duke will be under some special pressure next season to play a major non-conference game in Cameron in November. The ACC wants to give those on the fence about subscribing to the ACC Network lots of incentive to do so and to do so early. That’s why the first FB game on the Network is a Clemson game that might otherwise be on ESPN and that’s why there are reports that all the ACC schools other than Duke will be playing a conference game in November. A high exposure Duke non-conference game in November on the ACC Network would probably be quite helpful for the network. Of course, Duke would probably have to return the favor in 2020.

[duketaylor]

It will merely change to "Duke doesn't play road games unless it is mandated by the ACC schedule". And they have a point.

ACC/Big Ten challenge, not our fault. Why would K play somewhere else anyway.

[chrishoke]

^ keep in mind that Duke manages the scarcity of tickets in Cameron rather well. What many (I'd say the vast majority) pay for tickets is considerably (emphasis) less (as expensive as they are) than the annual Iron Dukes contribution required to purchase said tickets. OK, just looked it up, this summer they (Iron Dukes) anticipated it would take an $8000 (annual) contribution to enable one to buy two season tickets for this season.

I'm too lazy to count home games, but if we had 20, that would amount to a surcharge of $200 per ticket, on top of the actual ticket price...which is why building a larger stadium and screwing up this demand dynamic makes no sense.

Don't forget, some long time season ticket holders - like me- are grandfathered in at a much, much lower annual Iron Duke contribution.

[-jk]

DBR Chat (http://forums.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/misc.php?do=cchatbox) is open!

If it gets a bit slow, refresh the page. If you're on a mobile device, you'll need to select "Blue" at the bottom.

As always - please follow the DBR Posting Guidelines.

Let's Go Duke!

-jk

[AZLA]

Okay. I'm going to go out on a limb and say that Cam has a breakout game tonight.

[AZLA]

Okay. I'm going to go out on a limb and say that Cam has a breakout game tonight.

Yikes. Oops. I mushed him.

[slower]

Reddish is broken. Full stop.

The problem is with his head, not his eyes.

[fuse]

Childress.

Let’s Go Duke!!!!! 🔵😈

[kAzE]

Okay. I'm going to go out on a limb and say that Cam has a breakout game tonight.

So far, not so good :(

[MarkD83]

This game has some bad vibes already. Childress...fouls...air balls

[jipops]

Good thing this is Wake. Seems like we always start out poor in the 1st ACC road game that is now becoming the 1st actual road game.

[slower]

One of the worst things about Reddish melting down is that we're forced to rely more on Bolden, DeLaurier and AOC, who are all vastly unreliable.

Duke will probably pull away in the second half and pull out this game, but Saturday will be an entirely different kind of test.

[slower]

Reddish is broken. Full stop.

The problem is with his head, not his eyes.
He's not even CLOSE on any of these shots.

[94duke]

Was that actually over and back? It didn't look like the ball had crossed yet.

[MarkD83]

One of the worst things about Reddish melting down is that we're forced to rely more on Bolden, DeLaurier and AOC, who are all vastly unreliable.

Duke will probably pull away in the second half and pull out this game, but Saturday will be an entirely different kind of test.

The announcers did mention that Javin has made 17 field goals in a row. That is pretty consistent

[uh_no]

He's not even CLOSE on any of these shots.

glad he got that dunk. needs to realize he can do that.

[brickey]

Was that actually over and back? It didn't look like the ball had crossed yet.

It wasn’t, but Daniel Ewing fouled someone simultaneously, so it’s a wash.

[jipops]

Wake has 11 offensive boards right now. There’s the story.

[slower]

The announcers did mention that Javin has made 17 field goals in a row. That is pretty consistent

Whatever. His made shots are always gimmes. His presence on the court is not reassuring to me, unlike Jack.

[kAzE]

Zion, Tre, Jack, and Javin came to play. Not sure anyone else has gotten off the bus yet.

[downeastdad]

Zion should maybe lay off the showboat 360s a little.

[OldPhiKap]

Zion, Tre, Jack, and Javin came to play. Not sure anyone else has gotten off the bus yet.

Bolden too.

[rsvman]

Do the refs even know the rules? Can't call backcourt unless both get and the ball are over the line. Sheesh.

[rsvman]

White didn't walk, either.

[fuse]

Just a weird lack of flow in the first half.

Agree with jipops that Wake offensive rebounds are giving them life.

[jipops]

Bolden too.

Barrett is 4-8.

The problem is on the boards. Wake getting way too many shots.

[wilson]

Cam Reddish still looks a little herky-jerky overall, like he's overeager to get in rhythm, but I thought he had some nice moments down the stretch toward halftime. 8 points on 6 shots is solid.

[MarkD83]

Whatever. His made shots are always gimmes. His presence on the court is not reassuring to me, unlike Jack.

I was not trying to start an argument. I agree with you that cam or jack on the floor are better options. However Javin is doing what a big man role player should do. Keep your hands up for the pass and make the layups

[CDu]

Not a great start, but we are a made Zion dunk and one stop away from being on expected pace.

Promising signs from Reddish.

[slower]

Nice job by RJ to get Cam involved.

[AtlDuke72]

Zion should maybe lay off the showboat 360s a little.

Wow- he misses one dunk and you want him to change his game?

[downeastdad]

Wow- he misses one dunk and you want him to change his game?

You're right. I didn't think he should be throwing up threes, either.

[slower]

Did Bolden just pick up 3 fouls in like 30 seconds?

Just let Zion take over.

[wilson]

Zion should maybe lay off the showboat 360s a little.


Wow- he misses one dunk and you want him to change his game?


You're right. I didn't think he should be throwing up threes, either.Zion is 3-4 on threes and 10-13 overall. I think we can all keep our shirts on here. :rolleyes:

[MChambers]

Did Bolden just pick up 3 fouls in like 30 seconds?

Just let Zion take over.

Last one looked clean, but I’m watching in NYC.

[slower]

Zion currently at 26/9/5, with 12 minutes left. Will he hit 40 tonight? Seems like an easy reach, if they leave him in long enough. I think they'll pull him before he gets there, though.

Is it too early to think about #1 hanging in the rafters? He's currently the front-runner for NPOY.

[jipops]

Zion currently at 26/9/5, with 12 minutes left. Will he hit 40 tonight? Seems like an easy reach, if they leave him in long enough.

He is in a different league than everyone else on the floor tonight.

I hope he isn’t falling in love with the 3 now.

[WVDUKEFAN]

Is Cam on the bench?

[Duke76]

He is in a different league than everyone else on the floor tonight.

I hope he isn’t falling in love with the 3 now.

Don't see him on floor or the bench?

[MChambers]

He is in a different league than everyone else on the floor tonight.

I hope he isn’t falling in love with the 3 now.

He’s only taken four, right? He’s got a bunch of twos too.

[OldPhiKap]

Per Swiseman on twitter, Cam is in the locker with the trainer. Not sure of injury. Has had a sore right calf.

[MChambers]

Don't see him on floor or the bench?

He’s played in this half. Played pretty well, except for another foul.

[arnie]

Wake has now tanked the game. Don’t see them finishing higher than 15th in the conference. Manning buyout will be interesting.

[fuse]

This team has absolutely spoiled me as a fan.
So much fun to watch.

[slower]

However Javin is doing what a big man role player should do. Keep your hands up for the pass and make the layups

And he's doing a great job on the ones he manages to hang on to.

[MChambers]

Per Swiseman on twitter, Cam is in the locker with the trainer. Not sure of injury. Has had a sore right calf.
Cam is back.

[GGLC]

And he's doing a great job on the ones he manages to hang on to.

C'mon, dude.

[slower]

C'mon, dude.

Ok, sorry. We've all made the points we wanted to make.

[kAzE]

Zion should have had close to a triple double. Two of his turnovers should have been easy assists to Javin and Jordan.