MBB: Duke vs. Kentucky (Tue, Nov 6, 930pm, ESPN) Pre-Game and In-Game Thread

[House G]

Is it too early to start thinking about the Wildcats (or, as I like to call them, the KY jellies)? Every spring, my favorite baseball team (the Twins) has a new group of players on their roster. In a similar vein, there is a lot of turnover on college basketball teams, especially those with a lot of OAD players. I don’t know much about KY. Can someone provide a scouting report? Discuss matchups? Make a prediction? Here’s one article talking about the matchup and another that may get you fired up:

https://balldurham.com/2018/08/30/duke-basketball-preview-duke-kentucky/


https://www.ncaa.com/news/basketball-men/duke-kentuky-25-years-later

[House G]

I meant to add my favorite quote from the article about the Duke-Kentucky game in 1992.

Deron Feldhaus: “He (Pitino) said it more than once (don’t foul the guy—Laettner). I think that was probably the last thing he said. We just played soft, that was the bottom line. We should have been more aggressive. What do you do?”

Foul him maybe?

Feldhaus: “No, he would have made them. That guy had ice in his veins.”

[HereBeforeCoachK]

I meant to add my favorite quote from the article about the Duke-Kentucky game in 1992.

Deron Feldhaus: “He (Pitino) said it more than once (don’t foul the guy—Laettner). I think that was probably the last thing he said. We just played soft, that was the bottom line. We should have been more aggressive. What do you do?”

Foul him maybe?

Feldhaus: “No, he would have made them. That guy had ice in his veins.”

The great irony of that game, which Rick Pitino, to his credit realized, is that losing it in that fashion was the best thing that could happen to Kentucky. Think about it...UK pulls off that upset, and go on to lose in the Final Four (which surely would have happened) - no one is talking about Deron Feldhaus or Sean Woods or any of them ever...because Duke didn't really become THE beast, and the dynasty, until they completed the back to back a week later. It was Duke completing their mission that made Kentucky's near win so magical...more magical than upsetting just another team that couldn't go back to back.

Another irony...I am pretty sure this is the only...ONLY GAME...where Kentucky basketball was considered the fuzzy little lovable underdog. Ever. Their only game as David against Goliath.

And the great Cawood Ledford's last play by play game after 40 years...ends on Laettner's bucket? The stuff surrounding that game was just as magical as the game itself.

[Dr. Rosenrosen]

Another irony...I am pretty sure this is the only...ONLY GAME...where Kentucky basketball was considered the fuzzy little lovable underdog. Ever. Their only game as David against Goliath.
Robert Morris begs to differ.

[Billy Dat]

With a full week to get ready for this game, I am sure this thread will get a lot of action.

This far out, I have a couple of primary interests:

-It seems like we are trying to play fast, I wonder if we'll be able to effectively push pace against UK without turning the ball over? Typically, I think UK would like to run with us, but I am not sure that is the best approach for their current line-up. If we are forced into a more traditional half-court game, I think it favors UK. I worry about a young team lacking experience playing together reverting to hero ball (RJ). I think it would be well intentioned hero ball driven by competitive fire, but hero ball nonetheless.

-Will we be able to keep them off the glass? I worry, a lot, about 2nd and 3rd chances that result in easy baskets and fouls on our "bigs".

-I am guessing we'll open as an underdog, and that BBN betting might push the line even higher.

-It would be nice to beat someone other than MSU in this event. I know we have that victory over UK in 2012...let's get another. It's a bummer being 1-3 against UK/Kansas. Interestingly, over the 7 years of the event, Kentucky is the only team to beat, and be beaten, by every team. MSU has not lost to Kansas, Duke has not lost to MSU. Kentucky is 1-1 vs Duke and MSU and 2-1 over Kansas.

[AGDukesky]

Agree on both points about hero ball (especially RJ) and concern about rebounding. I think we will be able to get offensive rebounds to help the half court game but we have not faced a defense with the length and athleticism UK will provide. Often both teams have some jitters and of course neither team will be well-oiled machines in game one- which likely makes for an ugly game offensively. Duke should be the underdog and I’m expecting a loss mostly because UK actually returns some key players- including PG. Still, I like the makeup of this team and think we have the kind of competitors that I would never bet against...

[Troublemaker]

With a full week to get ready for this game, I am sure this thread will get a lot of action.

This far out, I have a couple of primary interests:

-It seems like we are trying to play fast, I wonder if we'll be able to effectively push pace against UK without turning the ball over? Typically, I think UK would like to run with us, but I am not sure that is the best approach for their current line-up. If we are forced into a more traditional half-court game, I think it favors UK. I worry about a young team lacking experience playing together reverting to hero ball (RJ). I think it would be well intentioned hero ball driven by competitive fire, but hero ball nonetheless.


I think so. I think this is going to be one of Duke's best ball-handling and passing teams in awhile.

As for Kentucky, I fully expect that they will want to run with us. All my preseason reading suggests that they're a team that wants to be uptempo and use their depth advantage. (Note: I actually like Duke's bench, but UK is a team that will have a depth advantage over almost every team, including us.) My concern will be Coach K's rotation. It'd be foolish to get into a fast-paced, high-possession game and not use your bench to rest the starters and spread around fouls. For example, if Coach tries to play the 4 freshmen 20 minutes in the 2nd half against a UK team that's coming at us in waves, I don't like our chances to hold onto a lead in crunch time.

Hopefully Coach K was serious with all the offseason promotion of "the value of the role player."



-It would be nice to beat someone other than MSU in this event. I know we have that victory over UK in 2012...let's get another. It's a bummer being 1-3 against UK/Kansas. Interestingly, over the 7 years of the event, Kentucky is the only team to beat, and be beaten, by every team. MSU has not lost to Kansas, Duke has not lost to MSU. Kentucky is 1-1 vs Duke and MSU and 2-1 over Kansas.

Overall, the Champions Classic standings are:
Duke 4-3
UK 4-3
MSU 3-4
KU 3-4

In other words, the winner of this game will take the lead in the Champions Classic standings with no other team being above .500


Agree on both points about hero ball (especially RJ) and concern about rebounding. I think we will be able to get offensive rebounds to help the half court game but we have not faced a defense with the length and athleticism UK will provide. Often both teams have some jitters and of course neither team will be well-oiled machines in game one- which likely makes for an ugly game offensively. Duke should be the underdog and I’m expecting a loss mostly because UK actually returns some key players- including PG. Still, I like the makeup of this team and think we have the kind of competitors that I would never bet against...

The same is true of UK, though. It'll be interesting to see how both teams respond to a step up in competition over what either team has faced on foreign trips and in exhibitions.

[JasonEvans]

I worry about experience. The 4 guys who will play the most minutes for us will be in their first game against D1 competition. For UK, their starting front line is likely to be 2 experienced sophs and a 5th year player. That could really be a problem for us. Plus, their bigs are athletic enough to not be overwhelmed by our uber athletic freshmen.

-Jason "I am fully expecting Duke to lose this game... I do not say that often" Evans

[Mike Corey]

I hope we win by 70-80 points, but also anticipate a loss here because youth.

Will be most interested to watch for three things:

1) Our defense
2) Our communicating
3) Our leaders (i.e., who will be in command on the court?)

[NSDukeFan]

I am not anticipating a loss(though I wouldn’t be shocked by one) because I think Marquese and Javin will be able to hold their own inside and have experience and I believe our frosh are just that good right now. I don’t think UK will have an answer for R.J., Zion or Cam and Tre is solid at the point. Should be fun to watch.

[hsheffield]

I worry about experience. The 4 guys who will play the most minutes for us will be in their first game against D1 competition. For UK, their starting front line is likely to be 2 experienced sophs and a 5th year player. That could really be a problem for us. Plus, their bigs are athletic enough to not be overwhelmed by our uber athletic freshmen.

-Jason "I am fully expecting Duke to lose this game... I do not say that often" Evans

Naughty Jason.

Go to your room.

[Stray Gator]

Even if I didn't believe that Duke has better players and coaches, I would expect the Blue Devils to win. This game is being played in Indianapolis, right?

[HereBeforeCoachK]

Even if I didn't believe that Duke has better players and coaches, I would expect the Blue Devils to win. This game is being played in Indianapolis, right?

...and I believe the FF is in Minneapolis......we tend to win the titles in the "apolis" towns....

[devildeac]

...and I believe the FF is in Minneapolis...we tend to win the titles in the "apolis" towns...

But we've yet to play In The Annapolis as Sir Charles thought. :rolleyes:

[Billy Dat]

I am not anticipating a loss(though I wouldn’t be shocked by one) because I think Marquese and Javin will be able to hold their own inside and have experience and I believe our frosh are just that good right now. I don’t think UK will have an answer for R.J., Zion or Cam and Tre is solid at the point. Should be fun to watch.

It is because of the frosh that I am also allowing myself to have some confidence about winning, especially RJ. While I think he tends to try and do too much at times, I feel like it is because he is such a competitive freak and wants to win at all costs, rather than because he's trying to show out on a big stage. The kid is BIG TIME. I also think Zion is BIG TIME. Tre is hugely important to how we want to play on both ends. I still worry that Cam is a bit off the odd man out, but his assist totals show me that he is a committed team dude. Maybe he doesn't need the spotlight? I don't know.

[UrinalCake]

We tend to lean on our veterans in these early-season showcase games. Last season Grayson went off for 29 points (after Bagley missed most of the game). In 2016 vs. Kansas Luke, Amile, and Matt were the leaders as the freshmen were all injured. In 2015 vs. Kentucky we saw MP3 score the first 6 points of the game as he and Matt and Grayson again provided the scoring while Ingram struggled big time. In 2014 Quinn was the leading scorer against MSU.

It’s a ton of pressure for a freshman to step into a court in this sort of atmosphere. Barrett has played in international games on the big stage, and Zion has a billion followers online, but it’s still a different kind of pressure. Can guys like Bolden, Javin, Jack and Alex help steady the ship?

UK will have a likely starting lineup of
Green (soph)
Herro or Hagans (fresh)
Washington (soph)
Montgomery (fresh)
Travis (senior)

Which is a ton more experience than our four freshmen and one junior.

[kAzE]

It seems like we are trying to play fast, I wonder if we'll be able to effectively push pace against UK without turning the ball over? Typically, I think UK would like to run with us, but I am not sure that is the best approach for their current line-up. If we are forced into a more traditional half-court game, I think it favors UK. I worry about a young team lacking experience playing together reverting to hero ball (RJ). I think it would be well intentioned hero ball driven by competitive fire, but hero ball nonetheless.

You're right to point out RJ as part of your "hero ball" concerns, but he's really the only guy on the team looking to get his own shot first, and I do think part of that is by design, rather than any kind of selfish play. We want RJ to be aggressive, because he is the best guy on the team at getting in the paint and making tough shots or earning a trip to the foul line. Everyone else (even Zion) is just looking to find the open man whenever they touch the ball, so I'm actually very encouraged by the ball movement we've shown thus far.

If RJ is hitting contested 3s like he did against the 2 exhibition opponents, I'm perfectly fine with him taking those. But hopefully he doesn't settle for those shots when it's not going in. RJ can and should take the most shots of anyone on the team, so I'm okay with a little hero ball here and there, because he seems to be able to convert even the toughest of shot attempts more often than not so far.

[luvdahops]

We tend to lean on our veterans in these early-season showcase games. Last season Grayson went off for 29 points (after Bagley missed most of the game). In 2016 vs. Kansas Luke, Amile, and Matt were the leaders as the freshmen were all injured. In 2015 vs. Kentucky we saw MP3 score the first 6 points of the game as he and Matt and Grayson again provided the scoring while Ingram struggled big time. In 2014 Quinn was the leading scorer against MSU.

It’s a ton of pressure for a freshman to step into a court in this sort of atmosphere. Barrett has played in international games on the big stage, and Zion has a billion followers online, but it’s still a different kind of pressure. Can guys like Bolden, Javin, Jack and Alex help steady the ship?

UK will have a likely starting lineup of
Green (soph)
Herro or Hagans (fresh)
Washington (soph)
Montgomery (fresh)
Travis (senior)

Which is a ton more experience than our four freshmen and one junior.

Amile was actually our best player against Kentucky in 2015 with a 16/15 game that featured a number of slick drives and finishes, as well as yeoman work on the glass. Grayson struggled mightily against the size and athleticism of the UK defenders, as did Ingram.

[fuse]

While I don’t want to see hero ball, I do want to see the glimmers of a Laettner-esque attitude from RJ stoked to a full blown blaze in this game.

I also want to see what Zion will do against quality competition.

Expecting a fun game.

[HereBeforeCoachK]

We tend to lean on our veterans in these early-season showcase games. Last season Grayson went off for 29 points (after Bagley missed most of the game).

Actually, it was 37

[Reddevil]

Scenario 1) Duke's youth works to their advantage because they are oblivious to the notion of losing. They run over KY just like any other foe because that is what they do.

Scenario 2) Duke's youth leads to foul trouble, turnovers, and RJ's scoop shots are routinely blocked. They become discouraged and K has a great coaching tape to show the boys how to improve.

Either way it is a November tournament. Wins would be nice, but setting the table for the spring is of course more important. Do they need to take some lumps before they reach their potential, or are they ready for the big time NOW?

It's basketball season!!!!!!!:D

[subzero02]

Scenario 1) Duke's youth works to their advantage because they are oblivious to the notion of losing. They run over KY just like any other foe because that is what they do.

Scenario 2) Duke's youth leads to foul trouble, turnovers, and RJ's scoop shots are routinely blocked. They become discouraged and K has a great coaching tape to show the boys how to improve.

Either way it is a November tournament. Wins would be nice, but setting the table for the spring is of course more important. Do they need to take some lumps before they reach their potential, or are they ready for the big time NOW?

It's basketball season!!!!!!!:D

It's not a tournament... 4 teams, 2 total games, 1 night and 1 court.

[Reddevil]

It's not a tournament... 4 teams, 2 total games, 1 night and 1 court.

Oh...........................it's basketball season!!!!!!!!:D

[DavidBenAkiva]

We tend to lean on our veterans in these early-season showcase games. Last season Grayson went off for 29 points (after Bagley missed most of the game). In 2016 vs. Kansas Luke, Amile, and Matt were the leaders as the freshmen were all injured. In 2015 vs. Kentucky we saw MP3 score the first 6 points of the game as he and Matt and Grayson again provided the scoring while Ingram struggled big time. In 2014 Quinn was the leading scorer against MSU.

It’s a ton of pressure for a freshman to step into a court in this sort of atmosphere. Barrett has played in international games on the big stage, and Zion has a billion followers online, but it’s still a different kind of pressure. Can guys like Bolden, Javin, Jack and Alex help steady the ship?

UK will have a likely starting lineup of
Green (soph)
Herro or Hagans (fresh)
Washington (soph)
Montgomery (fresh)
Travis (senior)

Which is a ton more experience than our four freshmen and one junior.

There are a lot of fascinating matchups in this game. While we will hear all the time that Duke is very young, UK lost 6 of its 9 rotation players from a moderately successful (by UK standards) team. They will have one grad transfer that is new to the program, 3 sophomores, and 5 freshmen in their regular rotation. That doesn't scream "so experienced!" to me.

While UK is the bigger team overall, Duke will have a serious height advantage at the 2 and 3. Keldon Johnson is the only guard that physically compares to R.J., Cameron Reddish, or Alex O'Connell. And Marques and Javin are as tall and lanky as anyone that UK can throw out there. Another thing that Bolden and DeLaurier do well is block shots. They each had a better blocked shot rate than Nick Richards last season. Reid Travis has never shown any shot blocking acumen in his four years of college. We don't know how E.J. Montgomery will be around the basket on defense. For a team that wants to play close to the rim, Duke might actually have an advantage with Bolden on the ball and Zion or R.J. coming over from the help side.

UK doesn't appear to have an obvious alpha scorer on the roster. Keldon Johnson might be the most obvious answer by the end of the season, but he probably won't start the game. Tyler Herro has been impressive over the summer, but he's not a guy that will be able to generate looks for himself or others. Reid Travis is the most experienced big and a capable scorer, but can he be relied upon for efficient scoring? And if UK goes big and plays Washington at the wing, can they shoot at all?

My hunch is that this will be an ugly, defense-oriented game with neither team being able to generate many clean looks. Hopefully, Alex O'Connell and Jack White can come in off the bench and provide some scoring punch and a steady presence. I like Duke's chances in this game but can see things getting out of hand if R.J. and Zion become frustrated about their ability to drive and score. Tre Jones is going to have to provide a steady influence and help prevent dribble penetration from the UK guards. It's a tall task to place on a freshman in his first game. I sure hope he has the stones his brother does!

[BandAlum83]

My hunch is that this will be an ugly, defense-oriented game with neither team being able to generate many clean looks. Hopefully, Alex O'Connell and Jack White can come in off the bench and provide some scoring punch and a steady presence. I like Duke's chances in this game but can see things getting out of hand if R.J. and Zion become frustrated about their ability to drive and score. Tre Jones is going to have to provide a steady influence and help prevent dribble penetration from the UK guards. It's a tall task to place on a freshman in his first game. I sure hope he has the stones his brother does!

2015 was a magical season to be sure. As such, it's easy to remember Tyus Stones, the legend. What I don't recall is when Tyus started exhibiting said stones. How far into the season were we before we started to truly recognize how special that group was?

For instance, I really didn't think that Okafor's season was nearly as good as his stats. As a matter of fact, his championship game was, for me, more how I remember his season. He had foul trouble, didn't necessarily dominate, and came up big when he had to. Very different, clearly, from Bagley's wire-to-wire domination (by my recollection).

So how about it? What do you DBRs really remember about Tyus and his first 10 games or so (by anecdote or statistics).

[kAzE]

2015 was a magical season to be sure. As such, it's easy to remember Tyus Stones, the legend. What I don't recall is when Tyus started exhibiting said stones. How far into the season were we before we started to truly recognize how special that group was?

For instance, I really didn't think that Okafor's season was nearly as good as his stats. As a matter of fact, his championship game was, for me, more how I remember his season. He had foul trouble, didn't necessarily dominate, and came up big when he had to. Very different, clearly, from Bagley's wire-to-wire domination (by my recollection).

So how about it? What do you DBRs really remember about Tyus and his first 10 games or so (by anecdote or statistics).

I was able to get tickets for the Duke @ Wisconsin game in early December 2014. It was the marquee ACC/B10 matchup that year, a true road contest versus what is now considered the best Wisconsin team of all time. Tyus had a big game down the stretch, also hitting a clutch 3 in that game, and ending with 22 points on 7-11 shooting, 6 rebounds, and 4 assists to only 1 turnover in one of most hostile road environments in the country at the Kohl center.

I came away from that game feeling pretty good about what we had going on with the point guard position that year.

[HereBeforeCoachK]

So how about it? What do you DBRs really remember about Tyus and his first 10 games or so (by anecdote or statistics).

Without going to the record book to look through the season, the games that stood out to me were at Wisconsin and at Virginia. Tyus was really good at Wisconsin, as was the entire team. And at UVa, a magic final minute by Tyus and Quinn Cook. I think the Wisconsin game was probably in the first ten of the season.

[moonpie23]

CatsPause has us losing by double digits because "all their guys play the same position"


so, we prolly shouldn't even make the trip...

[BandAlum83]

I was able to get tickets for the Duke @ Wisconsin game in early December 2014. It was the marquee ACC/B10 matchup that year, a true road contest versus what is now considered the best Wisconsin team of all time. Tyus had a big game down the stretch, also hitting a clutch 3 in that game, and ending with 22 points on 7-11 shooting, 6 rebounds, and 4 assists to only 1 turnover in one of most hostile road environments at the Kohl center in the country.

I came away from that game feeling pretty good about what we had going on with the point guard position that year.

Good job, Kaze. That's precisely what I was looking for. I do remember that game now that you mention it. Wasn't there something else about that game in terms of players who were injured or something that made people think that the final would end up with a different outcome?

[Troublemaker]

They will have one grad transfer that is new to the program, 3 sophomores, and 5 freshmen in their regular rotation. That doesn't scream "so experienced!" to me.

Thanks. You beat me to it.

Here's UK's minutes from their previous exhibition game:

https://i.imgur.com/oQfJdqC.png


To re-state what you already said for emphasis, UK's expected to play a 9-man rotation consisting of 5 freshmen, 3 sophomores, and 1 grad transfer. (By comparison, Duke's expected to play 4 freshmen, 1 sophomore, and 3 juniors in our rotation.) Yeah, Duke's freshmen will play more minutes than Kentucky's, but if one expects Kentucky to have a more cohesive team just because of this miniscule difference in experience, I would re-consider.

UK (like Duke) is still throwing together lots of players who've never played together before outside of a foreign trip and exhibitions. I think, if anything, Duke is probably further along in defining roles. It's one of the benefits of not being mega-deep (like Kentucky) and having clear separation between certain players. We know with very good confidence whom our top two scorers this season are going to be. Does Kentucky? We know whom our point guard is. Does Kentucky? As long as Duke stays healthy, our rotation in Game 1 is going to look pretty similar to our rotation in Game 30, imo. Will Kentucky's?

I'll predict that Keldon Johnson and EJ Montgomery may be coming off the bench right now but will eventually start for UK. The same may go for Ashton Hagans. I just think Duke may be further along in figuring out whom we are as a team.

[OldPhiKap]

CatsPause has us losing by double digits because "all their guys play the same position"


so, we prolly shouldn't even make the trip...


True. With sharp analysis and irrefutable logic like that, it's pretty clear we're sunk.

Frankly, if UK doesn't win by double digits, they should be embarrassed.


(Full disclosure: I would expect UK to probably win this game but would favor us come March if healthy. A win here, frankly, is gravy)

[kAzE]

Good job, Kaze. That's precisely what I was looking for. I do remember that game now that you mention it. Wasn't there something else about that game in terms of players who were injured or something that made people think that the final would end up with a different outcome?

I couldn't remember at all, but I checked out the game recap here: http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/recap?gameId=400587822

Sam Dekker was slowed down that game due to an ankle injury, so that's probably what you were thinking of.

Our 2nd leading scorer that game was Rasheed Sulaimon, who obviously was dismissed from the team later that season, and despite all that, we still won the rematch in the title game. What a team!

[Troublemaker]

True. With sharp analysis and irrefutable logic like that, it's pretty clear we're sunk.

Frankly, if UK doesn't win by double digits, they should be embarrassed.


(Full disclosure: I would expect UK to probably win this game but would favor us come March if healthy. A win here, frankly, is gravy)

When Jason Evans gets around to starting this season's Degenerate Gambling Contest, you will quickly be looking up at me in the standings. I'm expecting -550 for you and +500 for me after Nov 6th.

:-)

[Troublemaker]

FYI, Reid Travis really struggled putting the ball into the basket on UK's foreign trip (https://www.aseaofblue.com/2018/8/13/17681550/kentucky-basketball-reid-travis-on-floor-impact), although apparently he was a monster on the boards and played well defensively, according to a UK assistant.

Below is Calipari's analysis on Travis' struggles, which stem from not getting the ball to the rim quickly enough. It sounds a lot like what we try to coach Marques (and other big men) on doing - just go up quickly and get rid of the gather.

I like the fact that Reid [Travis] kind of busted through today because he struggled,” Calipari said Sunday. “But he’s still — he and I just talked and I said, your habit right now is to gather yourself. It isn’t going to work anymore. Not only here but if you want to be professional, that will not work. “And he knows it. He says ‘you read my mind.’ I said, anytime there’s any kind of pressure, you’re going to revert to what you know best. And that’s what he knows best right now because we haven’t coached him. So I said, ‘we’re going to get you to where you’re getting balls to the rim quicker, you’re shooting some runners and then go rebound your miss and you’re not going to gather yourself down and bust your way through.’

“There are games he can do that, but not against the good teams.”


Anyway, the point is that Travis is an OAD as well. He has to learn new teammates, new coaches, a new system, new expectations, and a new level of competition. Does he have an advantage over a freshman who's playing Div I ball for the first time? Sure. But should we expect him to, right off the bat, be able to perform like a 5th-year player such as Amile Jefferson who played all his games for one program? No, I wouldn't think so. Travis is going to be somewhere in between and probably closer to the freshman as far as finding his way in new circumstances.

[SlapTheFloor]

Good job, Kaze. That's precisely what I was looking for. I do remember that game now that you mention it. Wasn't there something else about that game in terms of players who were injured or something that made people think that the final would end up with a different outcome?

Tyus had that reputation coming out of high school as well. I can't remember if it was the Nike game of the McD's, but I remember the game was close toward the end and the other team chose to double-team Tyus. I also remember him coming up big at the end of Apple Valley's game against Okafor's Whitney M Young.

[kAzE]

I'm really confused with UK's starting lineup from the above post . . . is PJ Washington the 3 in that lineup? I did not realize he was skilled enough to play on the perimeter. He was definitely a power forward last year IIRC.

[OldPhiKap]

When Jason Evans gets around to starting this season's Degenerate Gambling Contest, you will quickly be looking up at me in the standings. I'm expecting -550 for you and +500 for me after Nov 6th.

:-)

Dude. “Degenerate” is my middle name. And my passion. And, well, a pretty apt description all around.

Wait, what were we talking about?

[Kedsy]

They will have one grad transfer that is new to the program, 3 sophomores, and 5 freshmen in their regular rotation. That doesn't scream "so experienced!" to me.



Anyway, the point is that Travis is an OAD as well. He has to learn new teammates, new coaches, a new system, new expectations, and a new level of competition. Does he have an advantage over a freshman who's playing Div I ball for the first time? Sure. But should we expect him to, right off the bat, be able to perform like a 5th-year player such as Amile Jefferson who played all his games for one program? No, I wouldn't think so. Travis is going to be somewhere in between and probably closer to the freshman as far as finding his way in new circumstances.

I completely agree with both of you. People seem to be treating Travis as the talent and experience that puts UK over the top, but he's not particularly athletic and he's learning a new system (as Troublemaker points out). I'll grant he's a good player and obviously he's a 5th year senior, but his impact in my opinion is being overstated on both counts (talent and experience).

And that matters. UK has five good freshman (rated #10, #12, #14, #23, #35); they're just not nearly as good as Duke's five freshmen (#1, #2, #4, #13, #37). And UK's main three returning players are returning for a reason -- they weren't very good last season. Richards's advanced stats were pretty much exactly the same as Marques Bolden's, and while Green and Washington do things that no Duke returning players do, both did so fairly inefficiently (last season Green's oRtg and PER were 111.4 and 12.9 and Washington's were 110.1 and 17.8; while by comparison O'Connell's and DeLaurier's were (albeit with much lower usage) 124.3/14.8 and 122.5/18.4).

Looking at the above, it would seem the only reason to think UK might be better than or beat Duke would be if the existence of Travis more than makes up for the superiority of Duke's freshmen. Obviously we'll see, but I'm far from convinced.

[whereinthehellami]

My concerns with UK coming into this season was would their experience give them a toughness advantage this early in the season and would the freshmen be able to match the energy/focus that UK is going to bring to this game. UK nation seems to be obsessing to the level of unhealthiness IMO. But after seeing the preseason/exhibition games I tend to agree with a lot of the posters above in that Duke seems to be really gelling and confident and UK might be be a little behind in establishing their team identity.

The Duke fixation might work against them. RJ, Zion, and Tre seem to have this chill but confident energy that has to be tough to go up against. Almost like UK nation is wondering why the Duke freshmen aren't more nervous, do they know something we don't know.

[chris13]

I am not a Duke or UK fan, but I don't understand why Duke isn't significantly favored. I know comparative scores aren't everything, but UK beat a Division 3 school by 18 points. Meanwhile, Duke beat two Division II schools by 42 and 84 points. I expect Duke to win by 10 or 12.

[AGDukesky]

I am not a Duke or UK fan, but I don't understand why Duke isn't significantly favored. I know comparative scores aren't everything, but UK beat a Division 3 school by 18 points. Meanwhile, Duke beat two Division II schools by 42 and 84 points. I expect Duke to win by 10 or 12.

94-66 is a difference of 28. UK led by 19 at half and I’m guessing wasn’t too concerned about the size of the blowout. Regardless, comparing exhibition game scores against different badly outmatched opponents tells almost nothing of the relative abilities of the teams...

[chris13]

94-66 is a difference of 28. UK led by 19 at half and I’m guessing wasn’t too concerned about the size of the blowout. Regardless, comparing exhibition game scores against different badly outmatched opponents tells almost nothing of the relative abilities of the teams...

My bad. For some reason I had 84-66 as the score. Agreed on the general point about comparing scores. Having said that have more confidence in Duke O vs Kentucky D that vice versa.

[HereBeforeCoachK]

I am not a Duke or UK fan, but I don't understand why Duke isn't significantly favored. I know comparative scores aren't everything, but UK beat a Division 3 school by 18 points. Meanwhile, Duke beat two Division II schools by 42 and 84 points. I expect Duke to win by 10 or 12.

Comparative scores are never a valid way (by themselves) to measure relative strengths. Especially when you are lumping all division 3 into the same camp. I heard someone the other day say that using comparative scores can lead you to thinking Old Dominion is better than Bama (FB).

[MCFinARL]

Comparative scores are never a valid way (by themselves) to measure relative strengths. Especially when you are lumping all division 3 into the same camp. I heard someone the other day say that using comparative scores can lead you to thinking Old Dominion is better than Bama (FB).

When in fact, ODU is just better than Virginia Tech. (But not Liberty, Charlotte, or Middle Tennessee, among others. hahahahaha)

[BandAlum83]

I'm looking for a DUKE blue tsunami eliminating from Indianapolis on election day!

[Troublemaker]

My concerns with UK coming into this season was would their experience give them a toughness advantage this early in the season and would the freshmen be able to match the energy/focus that UK is going to bring to this game. UK nation seems to be obsessing to the level of unhealthiness IMO. But after seeing the preseason/exhibition games I tend to agree with a lot of the posters above in that Duke seems to be really gelling and confident and UK might be be a little behind in establishing their team identity.

The Duke fixation might work against them. RJ, Zion, and Tre seem to have this chill but confident energy that has to be tough to go up against. Almost like UK nation is wondering why the Duke freshmen aren't more nervous, do they know something we don't know.

OUT: Being razzle-dazzled that UK's 3 sophomores played more minutes last season than Javin, Jack, and Alex. Experience edge!

IN: Being razzle-dazzled (on Nov 6th, hopefully) that Duke has two alpha monsters in RJ and Zion, and the entire Duke team (and soon all of college basketball) realizes it.

[kAzE]

Has anybody watched enough of UK to give us a scouting report and/or breakdown of the match ups?

I'm pretty stumped about this game. I know they only beat Transylvania by a measly 18 points, but Kentucky did look really good against some very highly regarded teams in the Bahamas.

They definitely appear to have some legit defensive guys. Hagans looks like a major ball hawk and we know Washington is a bruiser. It will be interesting to see how Tre fares against the Hagans/Quickley duo and I'm also interested to see who they have guarding Zion/RJ.

[NSDukeFan]

Has anybody watched enough of UK to give us a scouting report and/or breakdown of the match ups?

I'm pretty stumped about this game. I know they only beat Transylvania by a measly 18 points, but Kentucky did look really good against some very highly regarded teams in the Bahamas.

They definitely appear to have some legit defensive guys. Hagans looks like a major ball hawk and we know Washington is a bruiser. It will be interesting to see how Tre fares against the Hagans/Quickley duo and I'm also interested to see who they have guarding Zion/RJ.

I don’t think it’s fair to compare scores as I hear the Transylvania game sucked the blood right out of them. Sorry, couldn’t resist so close to Halloween.

[Billy Dat]

Has anybody watched enough of UK to give us a scouting report and/or breakdown of the match ups?

I'm pretty stumped about this game. I know they only beat Transylvania by a measly 18 points, but Kentucky did look really good against some very highly regarded teams in the Bahamas.

They definitely appear to have some legit defensive guys. Hagans looks like a major ball hawk and we know Washington is a bruiser. It will be interesting to see how Tre fares against the Hagans/Quickley duo and I'm also interested to see who they have guarding Zion/RJ.

The wait for this game has been so long that I have been looking for some of the past UK games just to get a look. The ESPN app has their blue/white scrimmage (which I haven't watched) but no other games that I could find. Maybe watching the blue/white is good because it's against good competition.

[kAzE]

I did a little of Googling, and it's still very fluid, but here's what I think Kentucky will go with as their rotation against Duke. They are legitimately 9 deep, so I expect them to use all 9 guys, and play extremely high pressure defense to take advantage of their depth:

PG: Immanuel Quickley
SG: Quade Green
SF: PJ Washington
PF: Reid Travis
C: Nick Richards
First 4 guys off the bench: Keldon Johnson, Ashton Hagans, EJ Montgomery, Tyler Herro

I think the major thing to watch is how they fare against us using the big lineups with Washington or Montgomery at the small forward spot. Those guys will have a big advantage on the boards against our wings, but how are they going to stop Cam and/or RJ on defense?

If that doesn't work out for UK, they will probably go smaller, with Johnson at the 3.

The key to the game IMO will be rebounding. If we hang with UK on the glass with their big lineup, this will be a Duke victory.

[luvdahops]

I did a little of Googling, and it's still very fluid, but here's what I think Kentucky will go with as their rotation against Duke. They are legitimately 9 deep, so I expect them to use all 9 guys, and play extremely high pressure defense to take advantage of their depth:

PG: Immanuel Quickley
SG: Quade Green
SF: PJ Washington
PF: Reid Travis
C: Nick Richards
First 4 guys off the bench: Keldon Johnson, Ashton Hagans, EJ Montgomery, Tyler Herro

I think the major thing to watch is how they fare against us using the big lineups with Washington or Montgomery at the small forward spot. Those guys will have a big advantage on the boards against our wings, but how are they going to stop Cam and/or RJ on defense?

If that doesn't work out for UK, they will probably go smaller, with Johnson at the 3.

The key to the game IMO will be rebounding. If we hang with UK on the glass with their big lineup, this will be a Duke victory.

I expect Johnson to spend a lot of time on RJ, whether he starts or not, as he seems like Calipari's best option for slowing Barrett, given size, motor, athleticism, etc.

[kAzE]

I expect Johnson to spend a lot of time on RJ, whether he starts or not, as he seems like Calipari's best option for slowing Barrett, given size, motor, athleticism, etc.

Yeah, you are probably right. I can't see Quade Green having any chance of stopping RJ. That's going to be a hilarious match up to watch if they do end up starting Green at the 2 guard. Most UK bloggers do think he is locked in as a starter, though.

I see this match up as a high paced/bad shooting game on both sides. Both teams will probably struggle mightily from 3, and there's going to be a high amount of turnovers on both sides. Rebounding and limiting turnovers will be the keys for Duke.

[NSDukeFan]

Yeah, you are probably right. I can't see Quade Green having any chance of stopping RJ. That's going to be a hilarious match up to watch if they do end up starting Green at the 2 guard. Most UK bloggers do think he is locked in as a starter, though.

I think Calipari should forget about who his best players are and just go to a platoon and play everyone even minutes.

[kAzE]

I think Calipari should forget about who his best players are and just go to a platoon and play everyone even minutes.

I sense the sarcasm, but in truth, you're not that far off. I don't think anybody really knows who UK's best players are. Johnson, Montgomery, and Hagans are just as good as the projected starters. Hopefully the uncertainty in the pecking order hurts them early on. A lot of people think EJ Montgomery might be their most talented guy. It seems like player roles on this Duke team are much more clearly defined right now. We will certainly have the 3 most talented players on the court, which bodes well for us, IMO.

[House P]

I think Calipari should forget about who his best players are and just go to a platoon and play everyone even minutes.

I am all for Brad Calipari getting 20 minutes vs Duke! I assume he would (attempt to) guard RJ.

On second thought, I see that Brad has made 3 of the 20 field goals he has attempted during his UK career (https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/brad-calipari-1.html). So if Brad plays 20 minutes vs Duke, it probably means he pulled an all-time “Bootsy”.

[Troublemaker]

Kentucky just beat IUPUI (kenpom preseason 286th-ranked team), 86 to 64.

Stats are here: https://ukathletics.com/sidearmstats/mbball/individual;team=home

It looks like UK changed starters. PJ Washington and Reid Travis remained starters in the frontcourt, but Hagans, Keldon Johnson, and Herro started, unlike the previous game.



https://i.imgur.com/VGPTX9n.png

[hallcity]

Kentucky just beat IUPUI (kenpom preseason 286th-ranked team), 86 to 64.

Stats are here: https://ukathletics.com/sidearmstats/mbball/individual;team=home

It looks like UK changed starters. PJ Washington and Reid Travis remained starters in the frontcourt, but Hagans, Keldon Johnson, and Herro started, unlike the previous game.



https://i.imgur.com/VGPTX9n.png

No, they played Indiana University of Pennsylvania (IUP), a Division II school, not Indiana University Purdue University Indianapolis (IUPUI), a Division I school. They can’t play a Division I school like IUPUI this early; only an exhibition game against a Division II school like IUP.

[AGDukesky]

No, they played Indiana University of Pennsylvania (IUP), a Division II school, not Indiana University Purdue University Indianapolis (IUPUI), a Division I school. They can’t play a Division I school like IUPUI this early; only an exhibition game against a Division II school like IUP.

Better box score is here:

https://ukathletics.com/boxscore.aspx?id=4286&path=mbball


UK only led by 9 at half

[CajunDevil]

Also, UK was up 77-62 with 2:21 left... not the blowout many expected.

[-jk]

Also, UK was up 77-62 with 2:21 left... not the blowout many expected.

Clearly they're sandbagging...

-jk

[SavDukeGrad]

I loved this quote from Jim Sumner's article about the Duke/Kentucky rivalry on the front page:

"Delaurier also had the quote of the year, actually a quote he ascribed to one of the trainers, discussing freshman phenom Zion Williamson.

'You guys all won the genetic lottery. Zion won it twice.' "

3 more days! Let's Go Duke!

[NSDukeFan]

Kentucky just beat IUPUI (kenpom preseason 286th-ranked team), 86 to 64.

Stats are here: https://ukathletics.com/sidearmstats/mbball/individual;team=home

It looks like UK changed starters. PJ Washington and Reid Travis remained starters in the frontcourt, but Hagans, Keldon Johnson, and Herro started, unlike the previous game.



https://i.imgur.com/VGPTX9n.png

They dropped some of their starters Quickley. 😀

[jwillfan]

Almost started a thread wondering where a *BASKETBALL* game our team was about to play in 2 days against KENTUCKY was...here it
is, at the very bottom of a page of threads about Football. Time to change the the name of this here blog?

[MarkD83]

There are a lot of fun threads about Duke football and they deserve the attention from the Duke fan base.

However,...there is a Duke-Ky basketball game that is in just 2 days to start the season. So this thread shouldn't fall off the first page.

BTW, I was talking to a friend of mine who is a Ky fan and she was lamenting that all of the Ky fan base sites were also caught up in football talk.

(jwillfan was thinking the same way I was...great mind think alike.)

[duketaylor]

I'm looking for a DUKE blue tsunami eliminating from Indianapolis on election day!

Er, uh, maybe emanating??? I catch the drift to which you refer.

GO DUKE BLUE!!!!

[duketaylor]

Alas, not a BBQ thread!! Spread? I'd guess Duke -8, no line yet on vegasinsider.com.

[HereBeforeCoachK]

There are a lot of fun threads about Duke football and they deserve the attention from the Duke fan base.

However,...there is a Duke-Ky basketball game that is in just 2 days to start the season. So this thread shouldn't fall off the first page.

BTW, I was talking to a friend of mine who is a Ky fan and she was lamenting that all of the Ky fan base sites were also caught up in football talk.

(jwillfan was thinking the same way I was...great mind think alike.)

FB games in November are more important than BB games in November. March, on the other hand....

[OldPhiKap]

FB games in November are more important than BB games in November. March, on the other hand...

Yup, this. Go to HELL Carolina. Kentucky, meh.

[jwillfan]

Well - don't disagree with the FB/Nov importance but the name of this site is "Duke BASKETBALL Report"

Maybe since Duke has been bowl eligible 6 times in the last 7 years, it is the new normal, so we just call it Duke Sports Report - ugh, not exactly catchy but there have been plenty of threads on soccer, lax, and recently baseball.

Maybe a board/sport? Again - not sure the best approach but when a BASKETBALL game against a top rated opponent, to start the year, with a highly anticipated team, is being played in 2 days and it barely rates a mention? That's damn weird.

[Troublemaker]

Alas, not a BBQ thread!! Spread? I'd guess Duke -8, no line yet on vegasinsider.com.

No way. It'll be within the range of Duke -3.5 to UK -3.5.

[hsheffield]

what did he say about the shot?

(I've used up all my free articles in the Ky newspaper reading about their congressional race...)

[richardjackson199]

If anyone has trouble with the Link on the Front Page Article to Where Was John Calipari when Laettner hit "the shot", it's here:

https://www.kentucky.com/sports/college/kentucky-sports/uk-basketball-men/article221121230.html

[HereBeforeCoachK]

Well - don't disagree with the FB/Nov importance but the name of this site is "Duke BASKETBALL Report"

Maybe since Duke has been bowl eligible 6 times in the last 7 years, it is the new normal, so we just call it Duke Sports Report - ugh, not exactly catchy but there have been plenty of threads on soccer, lax, and recently baseball.

Maybe a board/sport? Again - not sure the best approach but when a BASKETBALL game against a top rated opponent, to start the year, with a highly anticipated team, is being played in 2 days and it barely rates a mention? That's damn weird.

And just two days before the Miami game, all the basketball topics were above the football topics. Im sure Monday and Tuesday BB will dominate. There is a lot more basketball talk during football season than vice versa.

I'll throw another analogy out...NCNB was North Carolina National Bank for a long time...then as they spread out, NCNB became the real name, and it no longer ws North Carolina National Bank..just NCNB. Officially it no longer was the longer version..just 'nik nib' as it was known. So maybe just think DBR...don't fill in the blanks....

[hsheffield]

If anyone has trouble with the Link on the Front Page Article to Where Was John Calipari when Laettner hit "the shot", it's here:

https://www.kentucky.com/sports/college/kentucky-sports/uk-basketball-men/article221121230.html

the link is okay, it just won't let me read anything w/o buying a subscription

[Troublemaker]

No way. It'll be within the range of Duke -3.5 to UK -3.5.

And, actually, I just checked. The world opener has been released at Pinnacle, one of the world's most respected books.

It's Kentucky -1 and Kansas -5 for the Champions Classic. (Keep in mind Kentucky is ranked higher than Duke. Some of us might think Duke should be the favorite, but it's a relatively unpopular opinion.)



Pinnacle‏Verified account @PinnacleSports (https://twitter.com/PinnacleSports) 12h12 hours ago (https://twitter.com/PinnacleSports/status/1059096237641814016)
#NewLine (https://twitter.com/hashtag/NewLine?src=hash) Duke vs. Kentucky and Michigan State vs. Kansas lines are now on site for the opening day
https://www.pinnacle.com/en/odds/match/basketball/usa/ncaa?sport=True

[BandAlum83]

Er, uh, maybe emanating??? I catch the drift to which you refer.

GO DUKE BLUE!!!!

Damn auto correct on my iPhone. I really should proofread. Emanating

[jimsumner]

Well - don't disagree with the FB/Nov importance but the name of this site is "Duke BASKETBALL Report"

Maybe since Duke has been bowl eligible 6 times in the last 7 years, it is the new normal, so we just call it Duke Sports Report - ugh, not exactly catchy but there have been plenty of threads on soccer, lax, and recently baseball.

Maybe a board/sport? Again - not sure the best approach but when a BASKETBALL game against a top rated opponent, to start the year, with a highly anticipated team, is being played in 2 days and it barely rates a mention? That's damn weird.

From the sticky posted at the top of the site.

"You'll mostly find Duke topics, as well as general college sports and other basketball topics, on the EK Board."

Name notwithstanding, DBR has never been only about Duke basketball, especially in the middle of a successful football season.

Which wasn't much of an issue back in the late 1990s.

But I suspect Duke Basketball, Football, Barbeque and Occasionally Soccer, Lacrosse, Baseball and Other Sports Report seems a bit much.

Now, if you want to complain about threads involving poker or hot-dog eating, well, you've got an ally. :)

[OldPhiKap]

Now, if you want to complain about threads involving poker or hot-dog eating, well, you've got an ally. :)

How about if someone combined the two together, though? Hmmm?


Basketball traditionally did not start until after Thanksgiving. If basketball wants to expand into football season, so be it. But it’s still football season.

[dukelifer]

And, actually, I just checked. The world opener has been released at Pinnacle, one of the world's most respected books.

It's Kentucky -1 and Kansas -5 for the Champions Classic. (Keep in mind Kentucky is ranked higher than Duke. Some of us might think Duke should be the favorite, but it's a relatively unpopular opinion.)



Pinnacle‏Verified account @PinnacleSports (https://twitter.com/PinnacleSports) 12h12 hours ago (https://twitter.com/PinnacleSports/status/1059096237641814016)
#NewLine (https://twitter.com/hashtag/NewLine?src=hash) Duke vs. Kentucky and Michigan State vs. Kansas lines are now on site for the opening day
https://www.pinnacle.com/en/odds/match/basketball/usa/ncaa?sport=True
I predict Duke by 2- that is 2 more spectacular dunks than UK.

[Neals384]

Well - don't disagree with the FB/Nov importance but the name of this site is "Duke BASKETBALL Report"

Maybe since Duke has been bowl eligible 6 times in the last 7 years, it is the new normal, so we just call it Duke Sports Report - ugh, not exactly catchy but there have been plenty of threads on soccer, lax, and recently baseball.

Maybe a board/sport? Again - not sure the best approach but when a BASKETBALL game against a top rated opponent, to start the year, with a highly anticipated team, is being played in 2 days and it barely rates a mention? That's damn weird.

This. Not to mention this is the first game of the season! It could be against Podunk U, and Duke could have the least promising lineup in years and it would still go to the top of my page.

There is an Off Topic board, and if people used it for lesser sports it would keep our basketball forum less cluttered🤣

[BandAlum83]

This. Not to mention this is the first game of the season! It could be against Podunk U, and Duke could have the least promising lineup in years and it would still go to the top of my page.

There is an Off Topic board, and if people used it for lesser sports it would keep our basketball forum less cluttered🤣

Y'all can play football on my lawn anytime you want. But keep it to touch or flag, I don't want any gruesome injuries on my property.

[Pghdukie]

Vegas Insider just went to Kty -1.5. But its early.

[kAzE]

So . . . back to Duke/UK discussion?

I'm feeling pretty good about our chances in this game, based on how Kentucky has looked in their 2 exhibitions games compared to how we looked in ours.

Kentucky has the look of a very dangerous team that could become a problem in a couple of months, but at this moment, I think Duke is further ahead in establishing roles and team identity.

John Calipari has a lot of things to figure out, such as "who are my best 5 guys?" and "who is my go-to player?"

I think the answer to that 2nd question right now is Reid Travis, but the first question is wide open. They've had 2 completely different starting lineups in their 2 exhibition contests.

Duke at least knows their 4 best guys, and that's pretty huge to start out the season. There's no question that the 4 freshmen will be out there in crunch time. The 5th guy is still a mystery, but we have several solid options, and it could be based on a matchup or whoever has the "hot hand."

We have the best 3 players in this game (does anybody really think Reid Travis is better than Zion, RJ, or Cam? I don't), and the best offensive point guard. Granted, Washington, Travis, and Richards could have a slight edge right now because of their experience, but we're way ahead in terms of talent. They have better post players, but more often than not in college basketball, perimeter players are more important. I really like Duke in this game. Obviously UK has a good chance to beat us, but if I had to guess, I would say Duke wins by 7-12 points.

UK's young guards are going to be something we have to take advantage of. If we can speed them up and force some live ball turnovers, it will really help.

[BandAlum83]

So . . . back to Duke/UK discussion?

I'm feeling pretty good about our chances in this game, based on how Kentucky has looked in their 2 exhibitions games compared to how we looked in ours.

Kentucky has the look of a very dangerous team that could become a problem in a couple of months, but at this moment, I think Duke is further ahead in establishing roles and team identity.

John Calipari has a lot of things to figure out, such as "who are my best 5 guys?" and "who is my go-to player?"

I think the answer to that 2nd question right now is Reid Travis, but the first question is wide open. They've had 2 completely different starting lineups in their 2 exhibition contests.

Duke at least knows their 4 best guys, and that's pretty huge to start out the season. There's no question that the 4 freshmen will be out there in crunch time. The 5th guy is still a mystery, but we have several solid options, and it could be based on a matchup or whoever has the "hot hand."

We have the best 3 players in this game (does anybody really think Reid Travis is better than Zion, RJ, or Cam? I don't), and the best offensive point guard. Granted, Washington, Travis, and Richards could have a slight edge right now because of their experience, but we're way ahead in terms of talent. They have better post players, but more often than not in college basketball, perimeter players are more important. I really like Duke in this game. Obviously UK has a good chance to beat us, but if I had to guess, I would say Duke wins by 7-12 points.

UK's young guards are going to be something we have to take advantage of. If we can speed them up and force some live ball turnovers, it will really help.

I think this game will come down to free throws, especially down the stretch. And in that category, we really have no idea how our freshmen will respond. High school and AAU performances will not mean much compared to the huge stage and pressure of this Ky game!

[flyingdutchdevil]

So . . . back to Duke/UK discussion?

I'm feeling pretty good about our chances in this game, based on how Kentucky has looked in their 2 exhibitions games compared to how we looked in ours.

Kentucky has the look of a very dangerous team that could become a problem in a couple of months, but at this moment, I think Duke is further ahead in establishing roles and team identity.

John Calipari has a lot of things to figure out, such as "who are my best 5 guys?" and "who is my go-to player?"

I think the answer to that 2nd question right now is Reid Travis, but the first question is wide open. They've had 2 completely different starting lineups in their 2 exhibition contests.

Duke at least knows their 4 best guys, and that's pretty huge to start out the season. There's no question that the 4 freshmen will be out there in crunch time. The 5th guy is still a mystery, but we have several solid options, and it could be based on a matchup or whoever has the "hot hand."

We have the best 3 players in this game (does anybody really think Reid Travis is better than Zion, RJ, or Cam? I don't), and the best offensive point guard. Granted, Washington, Travis, and Richards could have a slight edge right now because of their experience, but we're way ahead in terms of talent. They have better post players, but more often than not in college basketball, perimeter players are more important. I really like Duke in this game. Obviously UK has a good chance to beat us, but if I had to guess, I would say Duke wins by 7-12 points.

UK's young guards are going to be something we have to take advantage of. If we can speed them up and force some live ball turnovers, it will really help.

I weirdly feel good about this game. Not saying we're definitely going to win, but I like our chances.

We know Duke is immensely talented, will play a tight rotation, and is very, very inexperienced.

We know Kentucky is talented, will play a large rotation, and is fairly inexperienced.

The question is whether Duke's talent trumps Kentucky's depth. And I think it will. Duke will have the 3 best players on the court tomorrow. And, unlike UK, we have 1 PG who, as unproven as he is, likely can play better with his teammates based on the fact that he is lead guard for every practice, has played with his buddies for a few years in the AAU circuit, and is incredibly unselfish (maybe to a fault). I also like our chances of Javin/Marques neutralizing the plethora of 5s that UK can throw at Duke. If there is one position you want experienced, it's the 5 (and I understand me saying our 5s are experienced is like saying Jayson Tatum is a seasoned vet).

I also think Calipari's game plan will focus on stopping Zion and RJ and having Tre/Cam/"5" beat you. I think it's a smart game plan. But I think asking a young team to stop two explosive scorers is asking way too much. I think UK will stop one of them (my guess is Zion), but the other will go off. Couple that with Cam having a 23 point game (my bold prediction for the game), and Duke will be a really good place.

I think what sinks Duke (if they do) will be foul trouble (could happen given 1st game jitters and inexperience) and inability to capitalize on FTs (another major concern given RJ/Zion's shooting skills).

[-jk]

Latest NCAA champ odds (courtesy of Bovada, www.Bovada.lv, Twitter: @BovadaLV):


Duke 5/1
Kentucky 5/1
Nevada 8/1
Gonzaga 17/2
Kansas 19/2
North Carolina 15/1

Fun hoops night tomorrow...

-jk

[flyingdutchdevil]

Latest NCAA champ odds (courtesy of Bovada, www.Bovada.lv, Twitter: @BovadaLV):


Duke 5/1
Kentucky 5/1
Nevada 8/1
Gonzaga 17/2
Kansas 19/2
North Carolina 15/1

Fun hoops night tomorrow...

-jk

Really, really shocked by Kansas. 19/2? Really? I thought they were the leader: strong coach, really good talent, some experience...

Are they getting hammered because of adidas-gate?

[kAzE]

Really, really shocked by Kansas. 19/2? Really? I thought they were the leader: strong coach, really good talent, some experience...

Are they getting hammered because of adidas-gate?

I'm more shocked by Nevada having the 3rd best odds . . . that's ridiculous.

And to your point, I think you're right about the Adidas scandal affecting KU futures. Of course it should. De Sousa is already being held out due to questions about his eligibility. It could be another Billy Preston situation, and there may be even more violations . . . so it's gotta dent their national championship futures in Vegas.

[subzero02]

I'm more shocked by Nevada having the 3rd best odds . . . that's ridiculous.

And to your point, I think you're right about the Adidas scandal affecting KU futures. Of course it should. De Sousa is already being held out due to questions about his eligibility. It could be another Billy Preston situation, and there may be even more violations . . . so it's gotta dent their national championship futures in Vegas.

I was surprised by their odds as well. They had a very good squad last year but they did not seem like a final four caliber team.

[Troublemaker]

Below is a sampling of futures odds from some other books to provide a better picture (more data points = better). (Source: SportsBookReview)

I would say Kansas and Kentucky are basically 2A and 2B, and Nevada is more likely to be 5 thru 8 at most books.


https://i.imgur.com/1JY9cFs.png

[WVDUKEFAN]

I’ve watched snippets of Coach K interviews this year. One thing that excites me is the statements he’s made about getting to know this years team. I think him being able to spend more time with this team as opposed to last years team is going to be very meaningful.

[HereBeforeCoachK]

I’ve watched snippets of Coach K interviews this year. One thing that excites me is the statements he’s made about getting to know this years team. I think him being able to spend more time with this team as opposed to last years team is going to be very meaningful.

And along those lines, I think this freshman class is more together than last year's frosh class was, by far. Last year's class had two, maybe three, sulkers. Clearly Wendell had a problem with the late Bagley recruitment. This year's class seems more like 14-15's frosh class.

UPDATE: I just saw on another thread that there is an article talking about how Tre Jones kind of got this class together during recruitment.....kind of like Tyus a few years ago.

[Pghdukie]

Vegas Insider has Kentucky at -2.

[Bluedog]

I like our chances, but playing UK in Indy (with Kansas and MSU fans in the stands) will make this a de facto away game. Not easy for a young team. Let's go Duke!!

[left_hook_lacey]

Duke by at least 10.

[left_hook_lacey]

I like our chances, but playing UK in Indy (with Kansas and MSU fans in the stands) will make this a de facto away game. Not easy for a young team. Let's go Duke!!

Good, because we rarely have actual away games in non conference. I like the adversity and think it's a good building block for our team character. I wish we would play actual road games early in the season, but this is close enough.

[DukieInBrasil]

John Calipari has a lot of things to figure out, such as "who are my best 5 guys?" and "who is my go-to player?"

I think the answer to that 2nd question right now is Reid Travis, but the first question is wide open. They've had 2 completely different starting lineups in their 2 exhibition contests.


We have the best 3 players in this game (does anybody really think Reid Travis is better than Zion, RJ, or Cam? I don't), and the best offensive point guard. Granted, Washington, Travis, and Richards could have a slight edge right now because of their experience, but we're way ahead in terms of talent. They have better post players, but more often than not in college basketball, perimeter players are more important. I really like Duke in this game. Obviously UK has a good chance to beat us, but if I had to guess, I would say Duke wins by 7-12 points.

UK's young guards are going to be something we have to take advantage of. If we can speed them up and force some live ball turnovers, it will really help.

I'm not nearly as high on RT as others seem to be. He had a very good Sr. year in a pretty bad conference. I think your analysis that he's not as good as any of our top 3 is probably right. He's pretty clearly more polished than Bolden or Javin, but i don't think he's so much better than either of them that Duke will have to change its game plan to contain him.


And along those lines, I think this freshman class is more together than last year's frosh class was, by far. Last year's class had two, maybe three, sulkers. Clearly Wendell had a problem with the late Bagley recruitment. This year's class seems more like 14-15's frosh class.

UPDATE: I just saw on another thread that there is an article talking about how Tre Jones kind of got this class together during recruitment....kind of like Tyus a few years ago.

Whether or not WC had a problem with Bagley coming to Duke, it seems really obvious to me that having both of them and feeling obligated to play both of them together lowered Duke's ceiling because it really constrained what the other players could do and the space they could operate in. The team had an amazing string of stunning come-from-behind wins to start the season, but once other teams figured out how to defend them, Duke lost a lot of its sizzle. It was still a very good team, but the pieces were better than the whole.

[Kedsy]

I'm not nearly as high on RT as others seem to be. He had a very good Sr. year in a pretty bad conference. I think your analysis that he's not as good as any of our top 3 is probably right. He's pretty clearly more polished than Bolden or Javin, but i don't think he's so much better than either of them that Duke will have to change its game plan to contain him.

Believe it or not, Reid Travis only played four games against top 25 teams (as rated by Pomeroy) last season. In those four games, Travis scored 17.5 ppg with 5.25 rpg. Good numbers, but not nearly as good as the 19.7 and 9.2 he put up against non-top 25 teams. Small sample size alert, and all that.

[dukelifer]

Believe it or not, Reid Travis only played four games against top 25 teams (as rated by Pomeroy) last season. In those four games, Travis scored 17.5 ppg with 5.25 rpg. Good numbers, but not nearly as good as the 19.7 and 9.2 he put up against non-top 25 teams. Small sample size alert, and all that.

A year older - a year smarter - a year stronger. He is a very good college player with a lot of in game experience. KY has a lot of weapons and he is just one more to worry about. Duke will learn a lot about itself tonight. A good way to start the season.

[lotusland]

I like our chances, but playing UK in Indy (with Kansas and MSU fans in the stands) will make this a de facto away game. Not easy for a young team. Let's go Duke!!

Do Kansas and Sparty fans really hate Duke more than UK?

[chazz101s]

Folks,

We are SlingTV basic subscribers, own an Amazon FireTV stick, and I know how to use an HDMI cable to connect a laptop to our non-smart TV (if ESPN Watch or ESPN3 or whatever it's called this year and "on demand" will help in viewing a replay of Duke-KY on Wednesday).

Anybody know if a full-game replay will be possible tomorrow, Nov 7? If so, how would that be accomplished?

Thanks for any advice you care to give. . . .

[kmspeaks]

Folks,

We are SlingTV basic subscribers, own an Amazon FireTV stick, and I know how to use an HDMI cable to connect a laptop to our non-smart TV (if ESPN Watch or ESPN3 or whatever it's called this year and "on demand" will help in viewing a replay of Duke-KY on Wednesday).

Anybody know if a full-game replay will be possible tomorrow, Nov 7? If so, how would that be accomplished?

Thanks for any advice you care to give. . . .

You should be able to watch via the ESPN app on your Fire Stick by logging in with your Sling TV credentials as long as ESPN is part of your Sling package. I can't remember if there's a search function in the app or if you have to go to college basketball and find the replay section.

[whereinthehellami]

It is finally here, the game everyone has been looking forward to all summer. It seems like a 50-50 kind of game, which usually means a close game and while that is the expectation, I wouldn't be surprised if one team gets hot shooting and wins by 15.

The keys to the game:


Foul trouble, more of an issue for Duke and their freshman. Something UK will try to exploit, especially in the paint.


Turnovers, will one team separate themselves and value the ball more and get some easy points off of TOs?


Shooting, will one team get hot shooting in the half court while the other team struggles manufacturing points? Keep an eye on Tyler Herro?


Rebounding, could be more an advantage for UK and a way to get easy points and pick up some cheap fouls.

On paper, I think UK has a slight experience edge and that they could get Duke in some foul trouble while getting some easy baskets with an edge in rebounding. But my heart thinks that RJ, Zion, and Tre might rise up amidst the bright lights and make enough plays to pull this one out.

My prediction: Duke 78, UK 76

[Billy Dat]

Kentucky has the look of a very dangerous team that could become a problem in a couple of months, but at this moment, I think Duke is further ahead in establishing roles and team identity.

John Calipari has a lot of things to figure out, such as "who are my best 5 guys?" and "who is my go-to player?"

I think the answer to that 2nd question right now is Reid Travis, but the first question is wide open. They've had 2 completely different starting lineups in their 2 exhibition contests.

Duke at least knows their 4 best guys, and that's pretty huge to start out the season. There's no question that the 4 freshmen will be out there in crunch time. The 5th guy is still a mystery, but we have several solid options, and it could be based on a matchup or whoever has the "hot hand."

We have the best 3 players in this game (does anybody really think Reid Travis is better than Zion, RJ, or Cam? I don't), and the best offensive point guard. Granted, Washington, Travis, and Richards could have a slight edge right now because of their experience, but we're way ahead in terms of talent. They have better post players, but more often than not in college basketball, perimeter players are more important. I really like Duke in this game. Obviously UK has a good chance to beat us, but if I had to guess, I would say Duke wins by 7-12 points.


I think your post sums up my feelings about the game as it FINALLY arrives.

A couple of additional/related thoughts:
-Credit Rob Dauster of NBC for saying, "Kentucky's best defensive line-up looks completely different than it's best offensive line-up". This feeds into your comments about Duke having a more defined identity early in the year.
-My primary concern is that if Kentucky's defense really slows us down - and Cal's team's are usually better defensively early than they are offensively - then we may lose our cool and (A) resort to hero ball and (B) lose focus on defense which will make it easier for UK to score in transition.
-Speaking of hero ball...I am worried about Herro ball...for some reason I have visions of Tyler Herro knocking down 5+ 3 pointers.

[DavidBenAkiva]

It is finally here, the game everyone has been looking forward to all summer. It seems like a 50-50 kind of game, which usually means a close game and while that is the expectation, I wouldn't be surprised if one team gets hot shooting and wins by 15.

The keys to the game:


Foul trouble, more of an issue for Duke and their freshman. Something UK will try to exploit, especially in the paint.


Turnovers, will one team separate themselves and value the ball more and get some easy points off of TOs?


Shooting, will one team get hot shooting in the half court while the other team struggles manufacturing points? Keep an eye on Tyler Herro?


Rebounding, could be more an advantage for UK and a way to get easy points and pick up some cheap fouls.

On paper, I think UK has a slight experience edge and that they could get Duke in some foul trouble while getting some easy baskets with an edge in rebounding. But my heart thinks that RJ, Zion, and Tre might rise up amidst the bright lights and make enough plays to pull this one out.

My prediction: Duke 78, UK 76

This is going to be a contrast of styles game. UK is going to start the season with 2 and maybe even 3 big men on the floor when P.J. Washington is the nominal small forward. Meanwhile, might Duke try our a "lineup of death" for a few minutes here and there with Jack White or Alex O'Connell in with Tre, R.J., Cam, and Zion? Even when the starters are in, it's possible that the Zion or the other freshmen can exploit a more slow-footed matchup. How far away from the hoop can Duke draw Reid Travis and Nick Richards? If they can bring them out a few feet, that'll open up the lane for drives and dump-offs. But then, can Duke adequately rebound the ball when they go small? It's a fascinating matchup.

[J_C_Steel]

I'm just glad the season is starting again, and I'm excited to get to see these freshmen play. If ZW can be a great rebounder and finisher around the basket, I think the offense will come together very well. Tre Jones should be adept at running the show, and Barrett and Reddish should have plenty of room to do their thing.

My question is about the defense. Can this team play man-to-man effectively without fouling? That may be the biggest question for this game and the entire season...

[PackMan97]

Dear Duke Basketball,

Do the needful.

-All of college basketball not named UK or UNC


The key to any small ball Duke tries to play is ball pressure. You've gotta to get back to the days of old when opposing point guards had trouble dribbling let along running the offense and passing. Take away the guards ability to dribble and move freely and the small ball will be effective. Allow them to run plays with the Kentucky bigs and it could be a long night.

[JasonEvans]

Wanna know how big this game is?

The top sportstalk station in Atlanta actually took a break from non-stop football coverage (there is only one sport in Georgia during the NFL/College Football season) to briefly interview a local college basketball expert (https://vocaroo.com/i/s1oQTsoDpDLz) about the Duke-Kentucky game.

Now this "expert" stupidly referred to Kentucky as "Kansas" a couple times (perhaps because they surprised him and told him he would also have to talk about Kansas and his last second cramming caused his brain to go to mush) but I think you will find his analysis spot on ;)

He also talks about movies a little bit at the end of the segment.

-Jason "Enjoy and let me know if you think the expert is an idiot. I'll be sure to tell him" Evans

[DarkstarWahoo]

Apropos of nothing: From what I've seen of Zion, he reminds me of Shawn Kemp after he put on some weight, but before he lost his hops. (About a 6-month window for Kemp.) Because Zion is already carrying that bit of weight, I see no reason his athleticism will be sapped as quickly as Kemp's was, although it might start to go earlier than a skinnier player (but long after he's left Duke).

Once he does lose the athleticism, I see him settling into an Antoine Walker-type game.

[arnie]

I'm just glad the season is starting again, and I'm excited to get to see these freshmen play. If ZW can be a great rebounder and finisher around the basket, I think the offense will come together very well. Tre Jones should be adept at running the show, and Barrett and Reddish should have plenty of room to do their thing.

My question is about the defense. Can this team play man-to-man effectively without fouling? That may be the biggest question for this game and the entire season...

If ZW can be a great rebounder and finisher around the basket?? Don’t think that’s a real question.

He’s not exactly a 🍤

[OldPhiKap]

I highly recommend you pick up the Wall Street Journal today (well, everyday but . . . .). Page A9:

Article title: "There's Never Been a Player Like Zion Williamson"

Sub-title: "Duke's star freshman is listed at 6 foot 7 and 285 pounds -- and can dunk from the foul line."

Great photographs, too!!!!

Not sure if this is behind a paywall:

https://www.wsj.com/articles/there-has-never-been-a-basketball-player-like-dukes-zion-williamson-1541436454

[Billy Dat]

Apropos of nothing: From what I've seen of Zion, he reminds me of Shawn Kemp after he put on some weight, but before he lost his hops. (About a 6-month window for Kemp.) Because Zion is already carrying that bit of weight, I see no reason his athleticism will be sapped as quickly as Kemp's was, although it might start to go earlier than a skinnier player (but long after he's left Duke).

Once he does lose the athleticism, I see him settling into an Antoine Walker-type game.

If Zion can have the NBA careers of either guy, despite the argument that neither realized their full potential, he should be very happy. But, neither is my favorite comp. I think Kemp, at 6'10", is too tall (Zion is 6'6") and isn't the ball-handler and passer that Zion is. Walker is also much taller, 6'9", and, while possessing the passing and ball-handling chops, "settled" into being one of the most unapologetic 3-point gunners in NBA history. I guess if Zion proves to be too small in the NBA to do anything but jack 3s, that could be a comp.

Personally, I like the Larry "Grandmama" Johnson comp...same size, same kind of build, similar games at this stage. Again, if Zion can have an NBA career like LJ, which was lessened by back injury, he would be happy. All 3 of these NBA comps were multi-time All Stars and Kemp and Johnson were also All NBA selections...that is rare air.

As for his weight, I honestly think that if he doesn't stay in optimal shape, he'll be out of the league. The number of "chubby" NBA players these days compared to the 90s era in which Kemp, Walker and Johnson played can probably be counted on one hand. Now that Boris Diaw is out of the league, I can't think of any off the top of my head.

[budwom]

^ he's not 285 lbs (despite the roster listing, he's roughly 272) and he's not fat. At all. He's just large.

[left_hook_lacey]

^ he's not 285 lbs (despite the roster listing, he's roughly 272) and he's not fat. At all. He's just large.

This. It's really getting annoying that the media and fans alike keep running with the notion that Zion is chubby or fat. He is a solid 270 ish and has appeared to have lost the cubby baby fat he was carrying in high school. It's obvious his diet and work out routine have changed since being in Duke's hands. I don't understand how people can see recent pictures of him and think that he is fat at all. I see a tank when I look at his recent games and or action shots.

Either way, I think those people are going to be surprised when a lean and mean Zion is tearing down the rim in their team's home gym.

[TruBlu]

Zion and I have about the same height/weight ratio. His seems to be distributed somewhat differently.

[subzero02]

^ he's not 285 lbs (despite the roster listing, he's roughly 272) and he's not fat. At all. He's just large.

He lost the baby fat in his midsection but has kept his ample caboose. Anyone who has played in the post, knows that a large caboose can be quite an asset in creating space on rebounds and post moves. He just needs to avoid involving it in asinine offensive fouls.

[DarkstarWahoo]

He lost the baby fat in his midsection but has kept his ample caboose. Anyone who has played in the post, knows that a large caboose can be quite an asset in creating space on rebounds and post moves. He just needs to avoid involving it in asinine offensive fouls.

I believe the preferred term of art in 2018 is "thicc."

[devildeac]

He lost the baby fat in his midsection but has kept his ample caboose. Anyone who has played in the post, knows that a large caboose can be quite an asset in creating space on rebounds and post moves. He just needs to avoid involving it in asinine offensive fouls.

Nice choice of words...

:p

[OldPhiKap]

Nice choice of words...

:p

Are we talking about Warren Martin again?

[luvdahops]

Are we talking about Warren Martin again?

Anyone here recall Steve Johnson, who played college ball at Oregon State and then had a solid NBA career over 10 seasons or so? I remember reading that his Beaver teammates would stuff basketballs in their shorts during practice to mock Johnson's ample rump.

[left_hook_lacey]

He lost the baby fat in his midsection but has kept his ample caboose. Anyone who has played in the post, knows that a large caboose can be quite an asset in creating space on rebounds and post moves. He just needs to avoid involving it in asinine offensive fouls.

I may be coming up on the rear end of this conversation but I think you're right. I failed to assess his entire physique.

[HereBeforeCoachK]

He lost the baby fat in his midsection but has kept his ample caboose. Anyone who has played in the post, knows that a large caboose can be quite an asset in creating space on rebounds and post moves. He just needs to avoid involving it in asinine offensive fouls.

....and in that large caboose are glutes that provide incredible power, thrust and lift...his ample caboose IS certainly almost solid muscle.

[BandAlum83]

Arrrrrgh! It's only 3:00!

[Kedsy]

Keep an eye on Tyler Herro?

You think Big Blue Nation is worried about Tyler playing "Herro ball"?

[FerryFor50]

You think Big Blue Nation is worried about Tyler playing "Herro ball"?

I'm eagerly looking forward to the media narrative all year on how Tyler Herro is college basketball's most hated player.

Wait. That's not going to happen, is it?

[elvis14]

Arrrrrgh! It's only 3:00!

It's 5:00 somewhere...which doesn't help at all because I really need it to be 9:30 here!

[BandAlum83]

It's 5:00 somewhere...which doesn't help at all because I really need it to be 9:30 here!

Can't even pass the time with election returns yet.

[UrinalCake]

I may be coming up on the rear end of this conversation but I think you're right. I failed to assess his entire physique.

Zion’s weight is going to be the butt of many jokes, but his athleticism is from another planet. Perhaps Uranus.

[devildeac]

Zion’s weight is going to be the butt of many jokes, but his athleticism is from another planet. Perhaps Uranus.

Ahh, invoking the old planetary cheer from my days at Duke: Up Mars, up Jupiter...

[weezie]

Can't even pass the time with election returns yet.

I thank the Lord that I won't have to watch a second of election coverage tonight either. Hoops, save us!

[budwom]

...and in that large caboose are glutes that provide incredible power, thrust and lift...his ample caboose IS certainly almost solid muscle.

It has been said that the English language has more than twice as many words as any other, perhaps that's true. (It's also been said the Inuit have 7000 words for snow when in fact they only have 200 or something, I'm hazy on this).
Anyway...the English language has presented us with THE appropriate characteristic we are discussing, a veritable five star, Scrabble crushing winner: Steatopygia

And because we have a limited time offer of two for one, I give you a sister word, one which friends and I use when required: callipygia

[rsvman]

It has been said that the English language has more than twice as many words as any other, perhaps that's true. (It's also been said the Inuit have 7000 words for snow when in fact they only have 200 or something, I'm hazy on this).
Anyway...the English language has presented us with THE appropriate characteristic we are discussing, a veritable five star, Scrabble crushing winner: Steatopygia

And because we have a limited time offer of two for one, I give you a sister word, one which friends and I use when required: callipygia

This is in the wrong thread. Needs to be in the "words you like..." thread on the off-topic forum. Those are some stellar words, my friend.

[budwom]

This is in the wrong thread. Needs to be in the "words you like..." thread on the off-topic forum. Those are some stellar words, my friend.

I see your point, but discussions of Zion's physiology kind of made me do it, could not help myself.

[Billy Dat]

Be warned...Google image searches of budwom's terms may be NSFW..but definitely worth checking out.

Back to the game...prediction time...

Duke 77
UK 72

Let's go Duke!

[budwom]

speaking of which, when can we really expect tipoff? First game is set for 7pm, but doesn't that really mean 7:10 or so? If it's close, with lots of timeouts, I
could see that game going until close to 9:30, our game starting around 10....just a DVR alert for those who scrimp on recording time...

[BandAlum83]

It has been said that the English language has more than twice as many words as any other, perhaps that's true. (It's also been said the Inuit have 7000 words for snow when in fact they only have 200 or something, I'm hazy on this).
Anyway...the English language has presented us with THE appropriate characteristic we are discussing, a veritable five star, Scrabble crushing winner: Steatopygia

And because we have a limited time offer of two for one, I give you a sister word, one which friends and I use when required: callipygia

I don't think I can say it:

ste·at·o·py·gi·a
/ˌstēətəˈpijēə,stēˌatə-/

[BandAlum83]

speaking of which, when can we really expect tipoff? First game is set for 7pm, but doesn't that really mean 7:10 or so? If it's close, with lots of timeouts, I
could see that game going until close to 9:30, our game starting around 10...just a DVR alert for those who scrimp on recording time...

Mine auto extends the recording of live events, meaning overtimes are not missed.

[budwom]

Mine auto extends the recording of live events, meaning overtimes are not missed.

how does it know? I know my DirecTV asks me each time how much extra time I want to record...I just routinely add a whole lot every time...

[Skydog]

I think there is big difference between:

a) bunch of highly talented freshmen trying to figure out what to do on the fly (2017 and many other OAD years)
and
b) bunch of highly talented freshmen that includes a mature-beyond-his-years high IQ, high skill pg" (2015 and I think 2018)

To be honest my biggest concern about this team isn't inexperience. My biggest worry so far is our poor defensive rebounding against weaker, less athletic teams.

[budwom]

I'm eager to see who shoots the ball, and how well, if they zone us....could be some offensive rebound opportunities.

[BandAlum83]

how does it know? I know my DirecTV asks me each time how much extra time I want to record...I just routinely add a whole lot every time...

On xfinity, it's an option for live events. It defaults to extra time.

That's why the other day when I saw the length of the Miami game recording, I thought Miami was going to tie it up on the last drive. The DVR thought that extra game coverage of another game was till part of the live game feed.

[JNort]

Keys for tonight are 3 point shooting and man defense. We are better all over the floor but are weak behind the line and untested on defense.

[SavDukeGrad]

So glad this game is finally here! Let’s Go Duke!!

But I’m nervous...and superstitious...and it looks like R J got a haircut...

[MChambers]

Keys for tonight are 3 point shooting and man defense. We are better all over the floor but are weak behind the line and untested on defense.

Aren't those the keys for the season? Other than health, of course.

[-jk]

Gonna be a long night...

DBR Chat (http://forums.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/misc.php?do=cchatbox) is open!

If it gets a bit slow, refresh the page. If you're on a mobile device, you'll need to select "Blue" at the bottom.

As always - please follow the DBR Posting Guidelines.

Let's Go Duke!

(And let's keep chat hoops specific!)

-jk

[devilsince1977]

To me, Zion is a 270 pound Dominique Wilkins. I saw him play in high school at a Christmas tournament in the old Durham High School Gym and again in the
State Championship game. Nique became a jump shooter at UGA , but in HS; he was a dunker, low post beast.

The most impressive thing about Zion is he lands very soft for a guy his size.

[Wildling]

To me, Zion is a 270 pound Dominique Wilkins. I saw him play in high school at a Christmas tournament in the old Durham High School Gym and again in the
State Championship game. Nique became a jump shooter at UGA , but in HS; he was a dunker, low post beast.

The most impressive thing about Zion is he lands very soft for a guy his size.

I've been comparing Zion to Nique too. I'm surprised not more people have been making that comparison. I watched a lot of Dominique as a kid thanks to the Turner network, and Zion looks just like him when I see some of the plays Zion makes.

I rarely buy into the hype of any incoming freshman that come to Duke over the past 10 years or so. But I gotta be honest, I'm totally sucked into the hype bandwagon with these new guys. I just can't help myself to be excited. I just have to restrain myself and remind myself these kids are freshman.... It's going to be a exciting year regardless! Go Duke!

[Channing]

The most impressive thing about Zion is he lands very soft for a guy his size.

I think the most exciting thing about Zion is he can dunk from the ft line!

[Bluedog]

Was funny to hear all the boos as Duke took the court and the cheers for UK during that after game interview.

[PackMan97]

Have I missed something? I turn on the game 10 minutes after it's supposed to start and all that is on is a football talk show?

Show me Kentucky getting Zioned!

[Green Wave Dukie]

Have I missed something? I turn on the game 10 minutes after it's supposed to start and all that is on is a football talk show?

Show me Kentucky getting Zioned!

Instead, Pack, you got ESPNed.

[PackMan97]

Instead, Pack, you got ESPNed.

I forgot. There was a reason I haven't tried watching live sports in years.

Duke/UK was supposed to be at 9:30 wasn't it? Hrm, now google is telling me it starts at 9:49. Blah! So my beef is with Duke reporting a 9:30p start.

Bad Duke! bad!

[dukebluesincebirth]

Start the game already! Some people have to sleep tonight!🙄.

[TJ99]

Super cool....John Krawczynski on Twitter :

UK v. Duke in Indy tonight. Tyus was looking for a flight from LA to see his brother Tre's first game. Couldn't get one to work. Jimmy Butler heard him and chartered a private jet for the two of them.

[arnie]

Start the game already! Some people have to sleep tonight!🙄.

If ESPN decides the college fball show needs to take an hour, then our guys don’t play until over. They make the rules.

[MartyClark]

This yapping about football is tiresome. I don't understand why EXPN needs to dilute a great basketball doubleheader with this.

[weezie]

Super cool...John Krawczynski on Twitter :

UK v. Duke in Indy tonight. Tyus was looking for a flight from LA to see his brother Tre's first game. Couldn't get one to work. Jimmy Butler heard him and chartered a private jet for the two of them.

Wow, that's really something!

[arnie]

This yapping about football is tiresome. I don't understand why EXPN needs to dilute a great basketball doubleheader with this.

Too bad the fans won’t start booing the fball experts.

[AGDukesky]

So we can count on this 3-point shooting to keep up all year, right?

[AGDukesky]

Team doesn’t seem too nervous...

[YmoBeThere]

Most athletic team we've ever had...

[wavedukefan70s]

Wholly cow I've been buried in my sons football season .this team win or lose is flat out scary .

[AGDukesky]

Refs with some really weak fouls called on Duke

[ChrisP]

I thought both fouls on Javin were bogus (def the 1st one was anyway)

[AGDukesky]

Foul a minute...

[devildeac]

Refs with some really weak fouls called on Duke

Some things never change. :mad:

[wilson]

Most athletic team we've ever had...One might say...alarmingly so.

[scottdude8]

Jack White contributing like he is right now could be the difference between us having a good or a transcendent year. He’s made at least half a dozen “glue guy” plays already, made all the more important by Javin’s foul trouble. The chatter about him taking a step forward appears to be legit.

[jipops]

Wow we look great! But foul issues will bring UK back in this.

[AGDukesky]

Several shots rimming out and FTs keeping UK closer than it should be...

[ChrisP]

Several shots rimming out and FTs keeping UK closer than it should be...

Yeah but...we were hitting EVERYTHING at the start so not (to me) unexpected to see some rimming out.

On another note, really tired of the announcers questioning foul calls that go against UK.

[AGDukesky]

White has been fantastic!

[AGDukesky]

Duke has 2 TOs- both totally unforced on fast breaks. Javin has had a rough game...

[jipops]

Jack White has been essential in this game so far.

[arnie]

White has been fantastic!
Amazing, but he’s doing those things he’s good at - not trying to do too much. Javin??

[jipops]

Duke has 2 TOs- both totally unforced on fast breaks. Javin has had a rough game...

Javin just doesn’t have much skill. He’s at his best rebounding and kicking it out. But that’s it.

[jipops]

No stops now. Foul issues have killed the D

[InSpades]

The defense needs some work (#1 would be not fouling) but...

The offense is stunning. For a team starting 4 freshmen... this is going to be amazingly fun to watch all season.

A 59-42 lead at the half in the 1st game of the year? That's pretty good (against Wofford). Against Kentucky? Good god.

Let's finish this game strong and send a message.

[4Gen]

ESPN is not loving this, because all over the east coast people are saying, goodnight, Gracie.

[AGDukesky]

Difficult to judge the defense with all of the fouls called. Many were pretty marginal both ways and then once players are in foul trouble it is hard to play defense.

[TruBlu]

The polls are closed on the east coast, but I vote that these freshmen stay 4 years.

[AGDukesky]

Another shaky start to a half😛

[AGDukesky]

And right back to a foul a minute pace...

[arnie]

Another shaky start to a half😛

Me thinks this team better and more cohesive than Duke 2017/2018.

[ChrisP]

Me thinks this team better and more cohesive than Duke 2017/2018.

Agreed. Also seem WAY better defensively than any Duke team of the past several years

[AGDukesky]

Wow is this fun!!!

[proelitedota]

82-50 lmao.

[ChrisP]

This team is just so...fluid. Offensively, defensively and also in transition. Like buddah, baby!

[subzero02]

82-50!!!! 82-50!!!! we were 2 point underdogs and we just Zoubeked them!!! 13:26 remaining

[scottdude8]

That play from RJ from the center of the 2-3 zone out to Jack for 3 was the textbook way you break down the zone. I tried for years to teach middle schoolers that back when I coached youth basketball. Considering we’re gonna see a lot of zone this year that play was incredibly heartening.

[wilson]

Holy crap, Zion's strip + pass to run the lead out to 30...:eek:

[pfrduke]

Holy crap, Zion's strip + pass to run the lead out to 30...:eek:

Yeah - not a lot of people playing college ball who can make that play. That was something.

[ChrisP]

There is one thing I absolutely HATE about this year's Duke team: Having to pick my favorite player :(

Will it be Jack? RJ? Zion? Cam?

[DukieInKansas]

This is fun but how do they keep their focus with so much time left and such a lead?

[InSpades]

My #5 road jersey has been a good investment.

Hood to Jones to Kennard to Barrett.

[arnie]

91 points in high paced game - 4 turnovers. Wow

[InSpades]

There is one thing I absolutely HATE about this year's Duke team: Having to pick my favorite player :(

Will it be Jack? RJ? Zion? Cam?

My personal qualm right now is that I expect them to score every time down the court and occasionally they don't. I guess there are some things they still need to work on.

[ChrisP]

My personal qualm right now is that I expect them to score every time down the court and occasionally they don't. I guess there are some things they still need to work on.

You make a good point :)

[LasVegas]

I’m not even sure what to say.

[AGDukesky]

Basically no matter what the final margin ends up, the game was not as close as the score...

[InSpades]

Zion breaks Bagley's debut scoring record. RJ breaks Zion's debut scoring record. Zion ties RJ's debut scoring record... RJ retakes the debut scoring record...

[fuse]

Speechless.

[subzero02]

I’m not even sure what to say.

Would Shaq call this Kentucky fried chicken?

Stopping RJ from getting to the hoop is harder than keeping maple syrup from touching your plate while eating pancakes.

[Faison1]

RJ Barrett reminds me of Penny Hardaway.....has someone already said that?

[AGDukesky]

And the big 3 all score 20+