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drummerdevil
03-26-2018, 09:06 AM
What do y’all think: will Zion, the dunking legend, pass Marvin?

BullBlue
10-20-2018, 06:49 AM
What do y’all think: will Zion, the dunking legend, pass Marvin?

I say yes. We know we can extrapolate seasonally accurate stats from 20 minutes of Blue/White CTC action.

So let's see - Last year, Marvin averaged 33.9 min/game, played a total of 1118 minutes, and finished with 96 Dunks, averaging 1 Dunk every 11min/39sec.

Zion had 5 dunks in 20 minutes last night, for an average of 1 every 4 minutes. If Zion averages 33.9 minutes/game x 40 games (we are playing 40 this year, right?), that's 1356 minutes. If he dunks every 4 minutes, he should finish with 339. That sounds about right. Might even be a little higher if he gets carried away in a couple of games.

I am a great lover of pies, so putting my pie where my mouth is (literally, I hope), I am willing to bet any taker that Zion will break Marvin's Dunk record this season, even if he doesn't keep up his current average.

PS. Kedsey, this was one of my favorite threads last year. Thanks! It would be great to see a 2018/2019 version.

BandAlum83
10-20-2018, 09:40 AM
I say yes. We know we can extrapolate seasonally accurate stats from 20 minutes of Blue/White CTC action.

So let's see - Last year, Marvin averaged 33.9 min/game, played a total of 1118 minutes, and finished with 96 Dunks, averaging 1 Dunk every 11min/39sec.

Zion had 5 dunks in 20 minutes last night, for an average of 1 every 4 minutes. If Zion averages 33.9 minutes/game x 40 games (we are playing 40 this year, right?), that's 1356 minutes. If he dunks every 4 minutes, he should finish with 339. That sounds about right. Might even be a little higher if he gets carried away in a couple of games.

I am a great lover of pies, so putting my pie where my mouth is (literally, I hope), I am willing to bet any taker that Zion will break Marvin's Dunk record this season, even if he doesn't keep up his current average.

PS. Kedsey, this was one of my favorite threads last year. Thanks! It would be great to see a 2018/2019 version.

Ahhhhh, but would you bet a pie that Zion single-handey breaks Duke single season team record for dunks?

Kedsy
10-20-2018, 11:59 AM
PS. Kedsey, this was one of my favorite threads last year. Thanks! It would be great to see a 2018/2019 version.

Once the real games start (i.e., not the exhibition games), I will endeavor to keep this thread going again.

HereBeforeCoachK
10-20-2018, 12:10 PM
Ahhhhh, but would you bet a pie that Zion single-handey breaks Duke single season team record for dunks?

I think I would.....

DevilHorse
10-21-2018, 10:52 AM
So what is the Over/Under on the number of times Zion will have a dunk on the ESPN Sports Center Top 10. He had one from the Blue/White Scrimmage! I'm thinking that he'll have 14 1/2 regular season (typical over/under number). Looking forward to seeing others getting "Zionized".

Larry
DevilHorse

Kedsy
10-24-2018, 12:28 AM
I said I'd start this once the real games begin, but I couldn't help myself.

We had 14 dunks against Virginia Union (Zion 4; RJ 4; AOC 2; Marques 2; Cam 1; Jack 1).

During last season's record-setting dunkathon, in the real games (I didn't chart this in the exhibitions), we only reached double-figures twice, in consecutive games in late February, with 14 against Louisville followed by 13 against Syracuse.

So, who knows, that record might not last so long.


(for reference, last year's dunk thread is here (https://forums.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/showthread.php?40760-Duke-Dunk-Report))

Kedsy
10-24-2018, 12:33 AM
(I didn't chart this in the exhibitions)

OK, again I couldn't help myself. I just checked, and in last year's exhibitions we had 7 dunks against NW Mo State and 18 (!) dunks against Bowie State.

Guess we'll have to see how we do in the second exhibition game before we can draw (useless) comparisons.

Kedsy
10-28-2018, 10:51 AM
11 Dunks against Ferris State: 4 by Zion; 2 by Marques; 2 by AOC; 1 each by RJ, Cam, and Javin.

That's 25 dunks for the two exhibition games, exactly the same number that last season's team achieved in its two exhibition games.

The race is on.

Kedsy
11-07-2018, 02:29 AM
The dunkathon has begun:

6 dunks against Kentucky: Zion 3; RJ 1; Cam 1; Marques 1.


Considering the vaunted size and supposed defensive ability of UK, not a bad season debut.

AGDukesky
11-07-2018, 06:41 AM
I thought Bolden had two dunks - the alley pop from Barrett and the inbounds play

GGLC
11-07-2018, 08:17 AM
I thought Bolden had two dunks - the alley pop from Barrett and the inbounds play

He definitely did.

pfrduke
11-07-2018, 08:35 AM
Dangers of relying on box scores/play-by-play - the official log of the alley oop to Bolden (which, if I'm remembering correctly, came right before the end of the half) is:

GOOD! JUMPER by Marques Bolden [PNT]00:41 ASSIST by R.J. Barrett

AGDukesky
11-07-2018, 08:37 AM
He definitely did.

Yeah, I looked at the play by play on GoDuke and it lists the alley oop wrong

JasonEvans
11-07-2018, 08:59 AM
GOOD! JUMPER by Marques Bolden [PNT]00:41 ASSIST by R.J. Barrett

In fairness, Bolden did jump on that play ;)

UrinalCake
11-07-2018, 09:02 AM
So Zion would have to average roughly 2.5 dunks per game or slightly more to tie Bagley’s total (keeping in mind that Bagley missed four games plus most of the MSU game due to injury). Looks like he’s right on pace.

Kedsy
11-07-2018, 12:13 PM
Dangers of relying on box scores/play-by-play...

Perhaps, but the official box is the only thing I can reasonably rely on. I'm sure we got snookered out of at least one dunk last year too.

AGDukesky
11-07-2018, 12:53 PM
Perhaps, but the official box is the only thing I can reasonably rely on. I'm sure we got snookered out of at least one dunk last year too.

The box score on ncaa.com credits Duke with 7 dunks (including both by Bolden)

https://www.ncaa.com/game/basketball-men/d1/2018/11/06/kentucky-duke/play-by-play

Kedsy
11-07-2018, 01:31 PM
The dunkathon has begun:

6 dunks against Kentucky: Zion 3; RJ 1; Cam 1; Marques 1.

Considering the vaunted size and supposed defensive ability of UK, not a bad season debut.


The box score on ncaa.com credits Duke with 7 dunks (including both by Bolden)

https://www.ncaa.com/game/basketball-men/d1/2018/11/06/kentucky-duke/play-by-play

OK, I will happily fix:

7 dunks against Kentucky: Zion 3; Marques 2; RJ 1; Cam 1.


Seven is exactly the number of dunks we achieved in our first game last season (against Elon, which was not exactly Kentucky).

BD80
11-07-2018, 02:34 PM
OK, I will happily fix:

7 dunks against Kentucky: Zion 3; Marques 2; RJ 1; Cam 1.


Seven is exactly the number of dunks we achieved in our first game last season (against Elon, which was not exactly Kentucky).


When I played, if I touched the net when making a layup, it counted as a dunk.



I still didn't have many dunks.

Kedsy
11-07-2018, 04:23 PM
When I played, if I touched the net when making a layup, it counted as a dunk.



I still didn't have many dunks.

I can believe that, because how many layups did you make?

Newton_14
11-07-2018, 04:29 PM
When I played, if I touched the net when making a layup, it counted as a dunk.



I still didn't have many dunks.

i counted it as a dunk when I slapped the backboard on a layup. I could finally do that as a Senior! I even managed to hit it with both hands once in practice! :)

Short guys gotta do whatever we can right? :cool::cool:

BD80
11-07-2018, 04:48 PM
I can believe that, because how many layups did you make?

Can I count lay-up lines, shoot-arounds, practices, the years of shooting hoops in the driveway growing up?


Three or four.

rsvman
11-07-2018, 05:05 PM
Maybe it would be more accurate to count dunks while watching the game? Provided you watch the whole game and pay attention, I can't imagine a DBR person watching the game wouldn't be at least as accurate as a box score, and probably more so.

BandAlum83
11-07-2018, 05:24 PM
Maybe it would be more accurate to count dunks while watching the game? Provided you watch the whole game and pay attention, I can't imagine a DBR person watching the game wouldn't be at least as accurate as a box score, and probably more so.

That's a great idea. You're hired!

Kedsy
11-11-2018, 05:13 PM
Just 2 dunks against Army: Zion 1, RJ 1.

I will note that the official Duke box once again missed a dunk (it called Zion's alley-oop a "jumper"). So our season count is 9 according to the NCAA.com box score and 7 according to the official Duke box score. I hope the official Duke box mislabeling dunks doesn't become a trend.

Season totals (using NCAA.com):

Zion: 4
RJ: 2
Marques: 2
Cam: 1

Total: 9

-jk
11-11-2018, 05:19 PM
Just 2 dunks against Army: Zion 1, RJ 1.

I will note that the official Duke box once again missed a dunk (it called Zion's alley-oop a "jumper"). So our season count is 9 according to the NCAA.com box score and 7 according to the official Duke box score. I hope the official Duke box mislabeling dunks doesn't become a trend.

Season totals (using NCAA.com):

Zion: 4
RJ: 2
Marques: 2
Cam: 1

Total: 9

Who, at Duke, can you pop off a message to asking about the discrepancy? (Ducks, covers...)

-jk

Kedsy
11-15-2018, 12:50 AM
Depending on which box score you look at, we either had 12 or 14 dunks tonight:

Official Duke box: 12 (Zion 5, Marques 4, RJ 1, Javin 1, Jack 1);

NCAA.com box: 14 (Zion 6, Marques 4, RJ 2, Javin 1, Jack 1).

Which gives us either 23 (NCAA) or 19 (Duke) for the season (3 games):

Zion 10 or 8;
Marques 6 or 5;
RJ 4 or 3;
Cam 1;
Javin 1;
Jack 1;

23 (NCAA) or 19 (Duke).

Makes me wonder if we had the same problem last year? I used the Duke official box, but I never looked at the NCAA.com box. This year, NCAA.com seems more accurate. Though for the official "record" I think the Duke SID uses the official Duke box. It's a conundrum.

For what it's worth, after three games last season we had 21 dunks (either two more or two less than this season). Marvin Bagley led the team with 7 (either 1 less or 3 less than Zion).

Savage
11-15-2018, 01:11 AM
From goduke.com: • Duke finished the game with 14 dunks, which matched the most it had in any game last season (14 vs. Louisville, 2/21/2018)

http://www.goduke.com/pdf9/5479256.pdf

Kedsy
11-15-2018, 01:25 AM
From goduke.com: • Duke finished the game with 14 dunks, which matched the most it had in any game last season (14 vs. Louisville, 2/21/2018)

http://www.goduke.com/pdf9/5479256.pdf

Great, except the official Duke box says 12.

uh_no
11-15-2018, 06:48 AM
Great, except the official Duke box says 12.

disappointing and sad the article writer accounts the stats more accurately than the official scorer.

HereBeforeCoachK
11-15-2018, 06:51 AM
Great, except the official Duke box says 12.

What is up with that? They seem low all the time. This is not hard. It's not a big deal, but it is incompetent.

DevilHorse
11-15-2018, 08:57 AM
With the Eastern Michigan game, that is 4 ESPN SCTop10 highlights in 3 games for Duke (actually Zion).

Game #1 - KY - SCT10-#8 - Zion nifty Block/Catch at one end/ Keyhole Assist to Barrett at the other
Game #2 - Army - SCT10 - #3 - Zion blocks Army shot on the far side of the Army player (over Army player's head)
Game #3 - E. Michigan - SCT10 - #9 - Zion 2nd Half (tame) Slam from Capt. Jack assist (How they missed the Tre Jones quarter court Oop assist for this, I'll never know)
Game #3 - E. Michigan - SCT10 - #1 - Zion Two Handed 3 foot out 2.5 foot above Rim Rattler

Larry
DevilHorse

ChillinDuke
11-15-2018, 09:18 AM
What is up with that? They seem low all the time. This is not hard. It's not a big deal, but it is incompetent.

I was about to post the same thing. How hard is it to count dunks? Either a guy dunks it or he doesn't. It's not really that ambiguous.

I could understand missing 5 dunks all season, but to miscount on the order of 2 per game is really pretty lame.

- Chillin

Acymetric
11-15-2018, 09:21 AM
Depending on which box score you look at, we either had 12 or 14 dunks tonight:

Official Duke box: 12 (Zion 5, Marques 4, RJ 1, Javin 1, Jack 1);

NCAA.com box: 14 (Zion 6, Marques 4, RJ 2, Javin 1, Jack 1).

Which gives us either 23 (NCAA) or 19 (Duke) for the season (3 games):

Zion 10 or 8;
Marques 6 or 5;
RJ 4 or 3;
Cam 1;
Javin 1;
Jack 1;

23 (NCAA) or 19 (Duke).

Makes me wonder if we had the same problem last year? I used the Duke official box, but I never looked at the NCAA.com box. This year, NCAA.com seems more accurate. Though for the official "record" I think the Duke SID uses the official Duke box. It's a conundrum.

For what it's worth, after three games last season we had 21 dunks (either two more or two less than this season). Marvin Bagley led the team with 7 (either 1 less or 3 less than Zion).

Weren't there a couple very clear discrepencies in the dunk totals reported by the team on social media last year? Like, Duke's account would post something about Bagley having x number of dunks, but the total according to the Duke box scores as we tracked it in the thread was different (and we can now probably assume that the total according to the NCAA box scores was...even different-er)?

El_Diablo
11-15-2018, 09:40 AM
Great, except the official Duke box says 12.

The official Duke box is wrong, as Zion clearly had 6. You can go to ESPN.com to watch a highlight reel showing all six in succession if you want to verify.

WNC
11-15-2018, 09:48 AM
Maybe it's dunk envy.

JasonEvans
11-15-2018, 11:43 AM
With the Eastern Michigan game, that is 4 ESPN SCTop10 highlights in 3 games for Duke (actually Zion).

Game #1 - KY - SCT10-#8 - Zion nifty Block/Catch at one end/ Keyhole Assist to Barrett at the other
Game #2 - Army - SCT10 - #3 - Zion blocks Army shot on the far side of the Army player (over Army player's head)
Game #3 - E. Michigan - SCT10 - #9 - Zion 2nd Half (tame) Slam from Capt. Jack assist (How they missed the Tre Jones quarter court Oop assist for this, I'll never know)
Game #3 - E. Michigan - SCT10 - #1 - Zion Two Handed 3 foot out 2.5 foot above Rim Rattler

Larry
DevilHorse

And, somehow, Tre Jones' blind flip over his shoulder for a Zion dunk didn't make the top ten. How?!?!

You can see it at the 4:00 mark of this video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N-2gwW8JwUo

jimsumner
11-15-2018, 11:53 AM
I asked last night. A member of the Duke media relations department told me 14 dunks, six by Zion Williamson, four by Marques Bolden.

FWIW.

DevilHorse
11-15-2018, 12:43 PM
And, somehow, Tre Jones' blind flip over his shoulder for a Zion dunk didn't make the top ten. How?!?!

You can see it at the 4:00 mark of this video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N-2gwW8JwUo

Jason - that IS the play that I refer to in parenthesis on #9. Just a great play.

Impressive too is that until yesterday's game, Zion's two SCT10 highlights were not dunks.

Larry
DevilHorse

Kedsy
11-15-2018, 01:22 PM
Weren't there a couple very clear discrepencies in the dunk totals reported by the team on social media last year? Like, Duke's account would post something about Bagley having x number of dunks, but the total according to the Duke box scores as we tracked it in the thread was different

Last year, we had a couple discrepancies, but my recollection is it was one or two dunks for the season, not one or two a game.


(and we can now probably assume that the total according to the NCAA box scores was...even different-er)?

I'm actually a little worried about this, but I'm too tired to go through the NCAA boxes for every game of last season.

El_Diablo
11-15-2018, 02:10 PM
Using the ESPN and NCAA play by play summaries, I rewatched the game tape to look at the shots that one or both credited as dunks. I would score them as follows:

Zion: 6
Bolden: 3 (a fourth one was counted as a dunk by ESPN/NCAA but was more of an alley-oop that he gathered with one hand and layed in from the side; I did not count it as a dunk here, but it was a close call; it was at the 11:24 mark in the first half if anyone else wants to watch it and weigh in)
DeLaurier: 2 (the first of which was a close call, somewhat similar to the Bolden one above; it was an alley-oop that he caught with two hands and quickly slammed through without his hands pulling down on the rim; ESPN counted it as a dunk, but I can see why GoDuke/NCAA didn't; I would go with ESPN on this one, but it was at the 7:42 mark in the first half if anyone else wants to weigh in)
Barrett: 1 (the NCAA box score also credited him with a second half dunk, but it was just a layup off the backboard and not even a close call)
White: 1
Total: 13

BandAlum83
11-15-2018, 02:30 PM
Using the ESPN and NCAA play by play summaries, I rewatched the game tape to look at the shots that one or both credited as dunks. I would score them as follows:

Zion: 6
Bolden: 3 (a fourth one was counted as a dunk by ESPN/NCAA but was more of an alley-oop that he gathered with one hand and layed in from the side; I did not count it as a dunk here, but it was a close call; it was at the 11:24 mark in the first half if anyone else wants to watch it and weigh in)
DeLaurier: 2 (the first of which was a close call, somewhat similar to the Bolden one above; it was an alley-oop that he caught with two hands and quickly slammed through without his hands pulling down on the rim; ESPN counted it as a dunk, but I can see why GoDuke/NCAA didn't; I would go with ESPN on this one, but it was at the 7:42 mark in the first half if anyone else wants to weigh in)
Barrett: 1 (the NCAA box score also credited him with a second half dunk, but it was just a layup off the backboard and not even a close call)
White: 1
Total: 13

I remember those close calls and wondered at the time if they were dunks or not.

Is there a definition of what is a dunk? Seems like a silly question, but probably isn't. If a player guides a ball down trough the rim without propelling it, is it still a dunk?

Is there a difference between a slam dunk and a regular dunk?

El_Diablo
11-15-2018, 05:44 PM
I remember those close calls and wondered at the time if they were dunks or not.

Is there a definition of what is a dunk? Seems like a silly question, but probably isn't. If a player guides a ball down trough the rim without propelling it, is it still a dunk?

Is there a difference between a slam dunk and a regular dunk?

I think the SCOTUS analysis of the term “hardcore pornography” applies to dunks: “I shall not today attempt further to define the kinds of material I understand to be embraced within that shorthand description, and perhaps I could never succeed in intelligibly doing so. But I know it when I see it . . . .”

cato
11-15-2018, 05:51 PM
Is there a definition of what is a dunk?

If there is, I’m pretty sure there is a picture of Zion in the entry.

gus
11-15-2018, 05:58 PM
If there is, I’m pretty sure there is a picture of Zion in the entry.

8813

HereBeforeCoachK
11-15-2018, 06:59 PM
8813

Either I'm blind, horizontally challenged in my perception, or bad at geometry....OR- a straight line from the top of Zion's head would end up ABOVE THE RIM!!!!

cato
11-15-2018, 07:08 PM
Either I'm blind, horizontally challenged in my perception, or bad at geometry...OR- a straight line from the top of Zion's head would end up ABOVE THE RIM!!!!

That’s what I thought. Unfortunately I don’t think we can tell for sure due to the angle.

arnie
11-15-2018, 07:23 PM
That’s what I thought. Unfortunately I don’t think we can tell for sure due to the angle.

If Zion is 6’7” tall, add an inch for shoes and his vertical must be 40 inches to match top of rim. Seems about right.

Neals384
11-15-2018, 08:04 PM
OK, after going through the play-by-play at ncaa.com and comparing to the play-by-play at goduke.com:

goduke.com shows 12 dunks for Duke: Zion 5, Bolden 4, Barrett, DeLaurier ansd White 1 each
ncaa.com shows 16 dunks for Duke: Zion 7, Bolden 4, Barret 2, DeLaurier 2, White 1

What's the difference? The following dunks are recorded on ncaa.com but shown as a "jumper" or "Layup" at goduke.com:
1H
7:41 DeLaurier
5:21 Zion
2H
18:00 Zion
16:15 Barrett

If someone wants to look at a replay and check these possesions, we might be able to establish who got it right. Thanks.

HereBeforeCoachK
11-15-2018, 08:59 PM
OK, after going through the play-by-play at ncaa.com and comparing to the play-by-play at goduke.com:

goduke.com shows 12 dunks for Duke: Zion 5, Bolden 4, Barrett, DeLaurier ansd White 1 each
ncaa.com shows 16 dunks for Duke: Zion 7, Bolden 4, Barret 2, DeLaurier 2, White 1
.

That's a ridiculous disparity. Inexcusable on someone's part.

BandAlum83
11-15-2018, 09:34 PM
I think the SCOTUS analysis of the term “hardcore pornography” applies to dunks: “I shall not today attempt further to define the kinds of material I understand to be embraced within that shorthand description, and perhaps I could never succeed in intelligibly doing so. But I know it when I see it . . . .”

Mega sporks for that most excellent response!

BandAlum83
11-15-2018, 09:46 PM
OK, after going through the play-by-play at ncaa.com and comparing to the play-by-play at goduke.com:

goduke.com shows 12 dunks for Duke: Zion 5, Bolden 4, Barrett, DeLaurier ansd White 1 each
ncaa.com shows 16 dunks for Duke: Zion 7, Bolden 4, Barret 2, DeLaurier 2, White 1

What's the difference? The following dunks are recorded on ncaa.com but shown as a "jumper" or "Layup" at goduke.com:
1H
7:41 DeLaurier
5:21 Zion
2H
18:00 Zion
16:15 Barrett

If someone wants to look at a replay and check these possesions, we might be able to establish who got it right. Thanks.

1H
7:41 DeLaurier Defintiely a Dunk, but not a "slam dunk"
5:21 Zion Definitely a lay up Not a dunk
2H
18:00 Zion This was the MONSTER DUNK, over the shoulder pass from Tre. Definitely a dunk!
16:15 Barrett Definitely a lay up (underhand) Not a dunk

yancem
11-15-2018, 10:25 PM
I remember those close calls and wondered at the time if they were dunks or not.

Is there a definition of what is a dunk? Seems like a silly question, but probably isn't. If a player guides a ball down trough the rim without propelling it, is it still a dunk?

Is there a difference between a slam dunk and a regular dunk?

I define a dunk as the pushing the ball down and through the rim from above it. I don’t think touching the rim is necessary. So I think that Bolden alley oop counts, but a finger roll wouldn’t because wIle the hand is above the rim the ball is not propelled downward. Not sure if there is an official definition but that’s mine, so it must be correct, it’s on the internet 😁.

Acymetric
11-15-2018, 10:28 PM
I define a dunk as the pushing the ball down and through the rim from above it. I don’t think touching the rim is necessary. So I think that Bolden alley oop counts, but a finger roll wouldn’t because wIle the hand is above the rim the ball is not propelled downward. Not sure if there is an official definition but that’s mine, so it must be correct, it’s on the internet 😁.

I feel like contact with the rim is requisite (remember that when "dunking" was illegal during warmups players would do exactly what you describe to avoid infraction), but your definition is definitely reasonable. No clue what the "official" definition is.

Kedsy
11-15-2018, 10:29 PM
Depending on which box score you look at, we either had 12 or 14 dunks tonight:

Official Duke box: 12 (Zion 5, Marques 4, RJ 1, Javin 1, Jack 1);

NCAA.com box: 14 (Zion 6, Marques 4, RJ 2, Javin 1, Jack 1).

Which gives us either 23 (NCAA) or 19 (Duke) for the season (3 games):

Zion 10 or 8;
Marques 6 or 5;
RJ 4 or 3;
Cam 1;
Javin 1;
Jack 1;

23 (NCAA) or 19 (Duke).

Makes me wonder if we had the same problem last year? I used the Duke official box, but I never looked at the NCAA.com box. This year, NCAA.com seems more accurate. Though for the official "record" I think the Duke SID uses the official Duke box. It's a conundrum.

For what it's worth, after three games last season we had 21 dunks (either two more or two less than this season). Marvin Bagley led the team with 7 (either 1 less or 3 less than Zion).

OK, I just went through it again, and the NCAA.com box does have 16 (though apparently there are issues with that accuracy). So my chart above should look like:

Official Duke box: 12 (Zion 5, Marques 4, RJ 1, Javin 1, Jack 1);

NCAA.com box: 16 (Zion 7, Marques 4, RJ 2, Javin 2, Jack 1).

Which gives us either 25 (NCAA) or 19 (Duke) for the season (3 games):

Zion 11 or 8;
Marques 6 or 5;
RJ 4 or 3;
Javin 2 or 1;
Cam 1;
Jack 1;

25 (NCAA) or 19 (Duke).

Especially in light of the above discussion that the real number is 14 (not 12 OR 16), I'm not sure how to handle this thread going forward. I'm sorry but I'm not willing to watch film of each game to confirm the play-by-play, and even if I was willing, since we're trying to chart Duke records here, I think we need to figure out what source Duke is using and stick with it. Not sure how to do that, however.

Bluedog
11-15-2018, 11:42 PM
OK, I just went through it again, and the NCAA.com box does have 16 (though apparently there are issues with that accuracy). So my chart above should look like:

Official Duke box: 12 (Zion 5, Marques 4, RJ 1, Javin 1, Jack 1);

NCAA.com box: 16 (Zion 7, Marques 4, RJ 2, Javin 2, Jack 1).

Which gives us either 25 (NCAA) or 19 (Duke) for the season (3 games):

Zion 11 or 8;
Marques 6 or 5;
RJ 4 or 3;
Javin 2 or 1;
Cam 1;
Jack 1;

25 (NCAA) or 19 (Duke).

Especially in light of the above discussion that the real number is 14 (not 12 OR 16), I'm not sure how to handle this thread going forward. I'm sorry but I'm not willing to watch film of each game to confirm the play-by-play, and even if I was willing, since we're trying to chart Duke records here, I think we need to figure out what source Duke is using and stick with it. Not sure how to do that, however.

I think we contact Duke SID and ask them what's up and why the differences with the box scores. And why they can't get somebody to count dunks correctly given the correct answer is 14. And then point them to this thread. I'm serious. I, however, don't have enough power /knowledge of people who can do something about it, but I'm sure there are posters on this site that do.

Neals384
11-16-2018, 02:47 AM
Having a contact at the Duke office would also help us let them know of other errors in the official play-by-play. In the Eastern Michigan game, the PBP fails to note that Jack White stared the 2nd half in place of Cam. At 16:57 of the 2nd half, the PBP shows DeLaurier and O'Connell subbing in, but only Bolden subbing out. White also subbed out.

HereBeforeCoachK
11-16-2018, 06:56 AM
So stepping back for a second, and looking at it in a bigger context...there seems to be a pattern at Duke of self inflicted wounds...due to simple incompetence. Not among the big positions...not Cut or Coach K or what have you. It's in the more mundane, and easier to fill, positions.

First, it is not that hard to count dunks. Oh sure, a few a season might be iffy, but it's not that hard. For two services to be four dunks off in a single game is absurd. Some human is making inexcusable errors. We've seen this with security and crowd control at Wallace Wade, I heard about the SNAFU with student seating for some Carolina games in Cameron...and on and on. I was a vendor for Duke years ago, and I saw it there too. Maybe I'm reading too much into this, but Duke is a world class university with a world class BB and FB coaches - but there are some odd failings with the nuts and bolts for some reason.

Coaches don't last long when they can't do the job. The same is not true with the underlings.

DevilHorse
11-16-2018, 08:14 AM
I define a dunk as the pushing the ball down and through the rim from above it. I don’t think touching the rim is necessary. So I think that Bolden alley oop counts, but a finger roll wouldn’t because wIle the hand is above the rim the ball is not propelled downward. Not sure if there is an official definition but that’s mine, so it must be correct, it’s on the internet 😁.

Would any of the hands have to be within the cylinder, during the throw down, to make a difference as to a dunk vs. a shot down?

If I was a strong guy like Zion, I might perfect some non-touch throw down techniques to preserve the feeling in my fingers. I thought some of his two hand throw downs did just that, and evaded the cylinder. Definitely a dunk.

Larry
DevilHorse

camion
11-16-2018, 09:58 AM
I'm pretty much in the school of, "if the player is giving the ball a downward impetus into the basket when released then it's a dunk."

Consider, if Grant Hill's hand hadn't touched the rim during his shot against Kansas in 1991 would that have disqualified it from being a dunk? I don't think so.

Linky. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=paRAMM3rZw8)

Kedsy
11-16-2018, 11:21 AM
I'm pretty much in the school of, "if the player is giving the ball a downward impetus into the basket when released then it's a dunk."

Consider, if Grant Hill's hand hadn't touched the rim during his shot against Kansas in 1991 would that have disqualified it from being a dunk? I don't think so.

Linky. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=paRAMM3rZw8)

I agree, but don't think that this is the scoring issue here. Each game we've played this season, at least one dunk has been labeled a "jumper" in the official Duke play-by-play. If it was a technical issue, they would have called it a layup, not a jumper. These are just mistakes.

yancem
11-16-2018, 12:42 PM
Would any of the hands have to be within the cylinder, during the throw down, to make a difference as to a dunk vs. a shot down?

If I was a strong guy like Zion, I might perfect some non-touch throw down techniques to preserve the feeling in my fingers. I thought some of his two hand throw downs did just that, and evaded the cylinder. Definitely a dunk.

Larry
DevilHorse

I don't think so (again just my opinion). I think the key is that the hand has to be above the rim and the ball has to be forced down into the cylinder. Basically, to me, if you get up high enough to dunk and make the correct downward motion (not a finger-roll) then it is a dunk. Now if you want to pull the rim down for effect, that's nice also but not necessary.

DevilHorse
11-16-2018, 12:51 PM
I'm pretty much in the school of, "if the player is giving the ball a downward impetus into the basket when released then it's a dunk."

Consider, if Grant Hill's hand hadn't touched the rim during his shot against Kansas in 1991 would that have disqualified it from being a dunk? I don't think so.

Linky. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=paRAMM3rZw8)

Although not in a game, Kyle Singler has a trick shot at the 28 second point in his Video #2 where he jumps off of a second level set of seats, into a pool, shoots a ball down into a basket (and obviously makes it). Although exaggerated, would it be a dunk?

https://today.duke.edu/2011/05/buckets

Good to see Singler again anyway.

Just being a Devil's Advocate (I don't know whose side that makes me).

Larry
DevilHorse

Kedsy
11-16-2018, 01:18 PM
Although not in a game, Kyle Singler has a trick shot at the 28 second point in his Video #2 where he jumps off of a second level set of seats, into a pool, shoots a ball down into a basket (and obviously makes it). Although exaggerated, would it be a dunk?

https://today.duke.edu/2011/05/buckets

Actually, in the video, the ball went up slightly as it left Kyle's hands before it started it's downward trajectory, so he did not "shoot the ball down into a basket."

But, if he had, I say anyone who can get 15 feet above the basket during a game and shoot downward through the hoop deserves credit in his dunk stats. It's possible Zion may prove this theorem sometime this season, we'll just have to wait and see.

UrinalCake
11-16-2018, 01:59 PM
Call me old fashioned, but I believe your hand or hands have to make forcible contact with the rim to count as a dunk. For example, as awesome as this play is I don’t consider it a dunk. Griffin throws the ball through the hoop, with his fingers just barely grazing the rim.


https://youtu.be/AbyOevVAYQI

JasonEvans
11-16-2018, 02:04 PM
Call me old fashioned, but I believe your hand or hands have to make forcible contact with the rim to count as a dunk. For example, as awesome as this play is I don’t consider it a dunk. Griffin throws the ball through the hoop, with his fingers just barely grazing the rim.


https://youtu.be/AbyOevVAYQI

Dissent... that is absolutely a dunk.

Indoor66
11-16-2018, 02:14 PM
Dissent... that is absolutely a dunk.

I agree with you.

Wow, this crowd can argue any mundane point! 😵

cato
11-16-2018, 02:15 PM
Call me old fashioned, but I believe your hand or hands have to make forcible contact with the rim to count as a dunk. For example, as awesome as this play is I don’t consider it a dunk. Griffin throws the ball through the hoop, with his fingers just barely grazing the rim.


https://youtu.be/AbyOevVAYQI

Oh my. I don’t think Perkins was surreptitiously looking up at the scoreboard to see if was laid up on.

Kedsy
11-16-2018, 02:19 PM
Dissent... that is absolutely a dunk.

Yeah, if that wasn't a dunk then there's no point to this thread.

UrinalCake
11-16-2018, 02:37 PM
Being very easily distractable this Friday afternoon, I went and discovered that there is an actual term called “throw-in dunk,” or “thrunk” for short. I had no idea. I guess I stand corrected, if YouTube thinks this is a dunk then it must be so.


https://youtu.be/awJqZmslXJI

UrinalCake
11-16-2018, 02:40 PM
I will stand firm on one point, however - if a player jumps from the free throw line and then performs a throw-in dunk, that absolutely does NOT count as a free throw line dunk. His hand has to actually grab the rim. I will take that to my grave.

cato
11-16-2018, 02:46 PM
I will stand firm on one point, however - if a player jumps from the free throw line and then performs a throw-in dunk, that absolutely does NOT count as a free throw line dunk. His hand has to actually grab the rim. I will take that to my grave.

Oh great. Now I’m going to be watching Zion dunk from the free throw line all day.

yancem
11-16-2018, 03:07 PM
^^ Oh, I definitely consider that a dunk but to each their own. As for the Singler shot, as Kedsy points out the ball is pushed out and up not down so not a dunk. He actually uses a normal shooting form where his hands are under the ball not the top. I guess for the sake of clearity the angle at which the ball leaves the hands may need to be concidered. I guess the ball would need to be leave the hand at say no more than 10 degrees from vertical? Never thought the definition of a dunk would need to get so technical :D

yancem
11-16-2018, 03:19 PM
I will stand firm on one point, however - if a player jumps from the free throw line and then performs a throw-in dunk, that absolutely does NOT count as a free throw line dunk. His hand has to actually grab the rim. I will take that to my grave.

That is an interesting case and one where my angle the ball leaves the hand stipulation may be important. Logistically due to the distance, one must travel in the air, the player isn't going to get as high off the ground as when he jumps from 2-3 feet away so his hand won't get as high. This would mean that the ball would have a much more horizontal angle if he was at the rim. I guess I would have to see the attempt, but I am inclined to agree with you.

devildeac
11-16-2018, 03:34 PM
Thankfully, no one has mentioned Sean May, coffee and 8815 yet.

Oops:o.

Indoor66
11-16-2018, 04:31 PM
Thankfully, no one has mentioned Sean May, coffee and 8815 yet.

Oops:o.

I'll have 12 please.

devildeac
11-16-2018, 04:53 PM
I'll have 12 please.

The official scorer said you should have 14.

BandAlum83
11-16-2018, 05:25 PM
I remember those close calls and wondered at the time if they were dunks or not.

Is there a definition of what is a dunk? Seems like a silly question, but probably isn't. If a player guides a ball down trough the rim without propelling it, is it still a dunk?

Is there a difference between a slam dunk and a regular dunk?

I just love to instigate facilitate good healthy DBR discussion. :)

BandAlum83
11-16-2018, 05:26 PM
The official scorer said you should have 14.

One of these days I'll be able to spork Devildeac again.

devildeac
11-16-2018, 05:34 PM
One of these days I'll be able to spork Devildeac again.

It's the thought/intent that counts (whether you touch the rim or not). Thanks.

Indoor66
11-16-2018, 07:20 PM
The official scorer said you should have 14.

There you are: drumming up business.😂

HereBeforeCoachK
11-16-2018, 07:24 PM
It's the thought/intent that counts (whether you touch the rim or not). Thanks.

Well played.....:)

HereBeforeCoachK
11-16-2018, 07:27 PM
Call me old fashioned, but I believe your hand or hands have to make forcible contact with the rim to count as a dunk. For example, as awesome as this play is I don’t consider it a dunk. Griffin throws the ball through the hoop, with his fingers just barely grazing the rim.


https://youtu.be/AbyOevVAYQI

Actually Urinal, you're new age. For years no one was allowed to hardly grab the rim on dunks. It's been greatly relaxed now...now you're fine as long as you don't swing on the rim for a while. When dunks first came back in, many dunks were with little or no rim contact. Griffin SLAM DUNKED it. Hand grabbing the rim is not part of the requirements.

Kedsy
11-20-2018, 12:08 AM
Only two dunks tonight against San Diego State: Zion 1, Justin 1.

For once, the GoDuke box score and the NCAA.com box score agree. Which gives us either 27 (NCAA) or 21 (Duke) for the season (4 games), or most likely somewhere in between:

Zion 12 or 9 (probably really 11);
Marques 6 or 5 (probably 6);
RJ 4 or 3 (probably 3);
Javin 2 or 1 (probably 2);
Cam 1;
Jack 1;
Justin 1:

27 (NCAA) or 21 (Duke) [but the real number is probably 25].

FWIW, last year's team had 26 dunks after four games.

Truth&Justise
11-20-2018, 10:29 AM
Only two dunks tonight against San Diego State: Zion 1, Justin 1.

But oh what a dunk it was!

Kedsy
11-21-2018, 12:18 AM
Once again, the GoDuke box score and the NCAA.com box score don't match. And once again I think the NCAA.com box score is more accurate.

We had either five (GoDuke) or six (NCAA) dunks tonight against Auburn: RJ had 2 and Marques had 3 (GoDuke) or 4 (NCAA), but my recollection says 4.

It's worth noting that we were outdunked tonight (for the first time this season), as Auburn threw down 8 dunks against us.

So far, for the season:

Zion 12 or 9 (probably really 11);
Marques 10 or 8 (probably 10);
RJ 6 or 5 (probably 5);
Javin 2 or 1 (probably 2);
Cam 1;
Jack 1;
Justin 1:

33 (NCAA) or 26 (Duke) [but the real number is probably 31].

This was Zion's first dunkless performance, allowing Marques to challenge him for the season lead.

FWIW, last year's team had 35 dunks after five games. At this point last season, Marvin had 13 and Wendell had 6.

DevilHorse
11-21-2018, 07:47 AM
With the Eastern Michigan game, that is 4 ESPN SCTop10 highlights in 3 games for Duke (actually Zion).

Game #1 - KY - SCT10-#8 - Zion nifty Block/Catch at one end/ Keyhole Assist to Barrett at the other
Game #2 - Army - SCT10 - #3 - Zion blocks Army shot on the far side of the Army player (over Army player's head)
Game #3 - E. Michigan - SCT10 - #9 - Zion 2nd Half (tame) Slam from Capt. Jack assist (How they missed the Tre Jones quarter court Oop assist for this, I'll never know)
Game #3 - E. Michigan - SCT10 - #1 - Zion Two Handed 3 foot out 2.5 foot above Rim Rattler

Larry
DevilHorse

Game #4 - SDSU - SCT10-#3 - Zion breakaway Windmill
Game #5 - Auburn - SCT10 - #2 - RJ Barrett Windmill Like Zion

Larry
DevilHorse

Kedsy
11-22-2018, 12:17 AM
The GoDuke and NCAA boxes matched this time. We had six dunks against Gonzaga: Marques 2, RJ 2, Zion 1, Javin 1.

So far, for the season, in six games:

Zion 13 or 10 (probably really 12);
Marques 12 or 10 (probably 12);
RJ 8 or 7 (probably 7);
Javin 3 or 2 (probably 3);
Cam 1;
Jack 1;
Justin 1:

TOTAL: 39 (NCAA) or 32 (Duke) [but the real number is probably 37].

So, going with the "probably really" numbers, Marques is tied with Zion for the team lead (both with 12), and who would have thought that possible?

FWIW, last year's team had 40 dunks after six games. At this point last season, Marvin had 14 and Wendell had 8, so while nobody is ahead of Marvin's pace, Zion + Marques is ahead of Marvin + Wendell, 24 to 22.

DevilHorse
11-22-2018, 08:49 AM
Game #4 - SDSU - SCT10-#3 - Zion breakaway Windmill
Game #5 - Auburn - SCT10 - #2 - RJ Barrett Windmill Like Zion

Larry
DevilHorse

Game #6 - Gonzaga - SCT10 - #4 - Zion out of nowhere Block of layup (nifty layup by Gonzaga player, under the basket reverse, to avoid Zion block was SCT10 - #5).

Larry
DevilHorse

HereBeforeCoachK
11-22-2018, 06:25 PM
The GoDuke and NCAA boxes matched this time. We had six dunks against Gonzaga: Marques 2, RJ 2, Zion 1, Javin 1.

So far, for the season, in six games:

Zion 13 or 10 (probably really 12);
Marques 12 or 10 (probably 12);
RJ 8 or 7 (probably 7);
Javin 3 or 2 (probably 3);
Cam 1;
Jack 1;
Justin 1:

TOTAL: 39 (NCAA) or 32 (Duke) [but the real number is probably 37].

So, going with the "probably really" numbers, Marques is tied with Zion for the team lead (both with 12), and who would have thought that possible?

FWIW, last year's team had 40 dunks after six games. At this point last season, Marvin had 14 and Wendell had 8, so while nobody is ahead of Marvin's pace, Zion + Marques is ahead of Marvin + Wendell, 24 to 22.

Makes you wonder if whatever lackey at Duke is keeping up with this....has some kind of agenda. Ridiculous to be off by that much.

Kedsy
11-28-2018, 01:15 AM
OK, this is getting silly: everyone saw our two 2nd half alley-oop dunks, but the official GoDuke box called both of them "jumpers." I'm not sure it's worth even tracking dunks from GoDuke anymore, though the NCAA.com box was also (I believe) wrong in at least one game this season. In any event, GoDuke says we had five dunks against Indiana (all by Zion), and NCAA.com says we had seven dunks (6 by Zion and 1 by RJ).

So far, for the season, in seven games:

Zion 19 or 15 (probably really 18);
Marques 12 or 10 (probably 12);
RJ 9 or 7 (probably 8);
Javin 3 or 2 (probably 3);
Cam 1;
Jack 1;
Justin 1:

TOTAL: 46 (NCAA) or 37 (Duke) [but the real number is probably 44].

FWIW, last year's team had 49 dunks after seven games. At this point last season, Marvin had 20 and Wendell had 10, meaning (using the "probably really" numbers) Zion + Marques are tied with Marvin + Wendell, both pairs with 30.

brlftz
11-28-2018, 03:24 AM
would be nice if someone better connected than me could give some feedback to the official duke scorer to see if there's a reason for the discrepancy

DevilHorse
11-28-2018, 08:25 AM
Game #6 - Gonzaga - SCT10 - #4 - Zion out of nowhere Block of layup (nifty layup by Gonzaga player, under the basket reverse, to avoid Zion block was SCT10 - #5).

Larry
DevilHorse

Game #7 - Indiana - SCT10 - #2 - Zion Steal and Breakaway Lefthanded Windmill

Larry
DevilHorse

JasonEvans
11-28-2018, 08:57 AM
OK, this is getting silly: everyone saw our two 2nd half alley-oop dunks, but the official GoDuke box called both of them "jumpers."

Well, I mean, RJ did "jump" to get this basket.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EXiqwW1V1_E

-Jason "the GoDuke boxscore should just be excluded from your tallies. It is so clearly wrong it is not worth tracking" Evans

Truth&Justise
11-28-2018, 10:26 AM
Should we start a separate count for windmill dunks? We have at least three:

-Zion v. SDSU
-RJ v. Aurburn
-Zion v. Indiana

Crazy that we have this many highlight reel dunks already. Kids these days!

DevilHorse
11-28-2018, 01:17 PM
Should we start a separate count for windmill dunks? We have at least three:

-Zion v. SDSU
-RJ v. Aurburn
-Zion v. Indiana

Crazy that we have this many highlight reel dunks already. Kids these days!

Duke Dunking goes Dutch?

Larry
DevilHorse

Kedsy
12-02-2018, 12:26 AM
I'm not sure it's worth even tracking dunks from GoDuke anymore, though the NCAA.com box was also (I believe) wrong in at least one game this season.

This is becoming more and more of an issue. Tonight I tried to keep track while watching, and the announcers were accommodating in their zeal to count Duke's dunks. My count was 13, which matched the NCAA.com count. The GoDuke count? 10. At some point soon I'm going to just stop using the official GoDuke box score as a source for this thread.

But I guess not yet. GoDuke says we had 10 dunks against Stetson (RJ 3; Zion 2; Javin 2; Marques, Cam, and Justin 1 each), and NCAA.com says we had 13 dunks (RJ 4; Zion 3; Javin 3; Marques, Cam, and Justin 1 each).

So far, for the season, in eight games:

Zion 22 or 17 (probably really 21);
Marques 13 or 11 (probably 13);
RJ 13 or 10 (probably 12);
Javin 6 or 4 (probably 6);
Cam 2;
Justin 2;
Jack 1;

TOTAL: 59 (NCAA) or 47 (Duke) [but the real number is probably 57].

FWIW, last year's team had 51 dunks after eight games. At this point last season, Marvin had 21 and Wendell had 10. Third place was Trevon Duval with 7. So using the "probably really" numbers, (a) Zion is tied with Marvin; (b) Zion + Marques are ahead of Marvin + Wendell, 34 to 31; and (c) Zion, Marques, and RJ are ahead of Marvin, Wendell, and Trevon, 46 to 38.

uh_no
12-02-2018, 12:32 AM
This is becoming more and more of an issue. Tonight I tried to keep track while watching, and the announcers were accommodating in their zeal to count Duke's dunks. My count was 13, which matched the NCAA.com count. The GoDuke count? 10. At some point soon I'm going to just stop using the official GoDuke box score as a source for this thread.

But I guess not yet. GoDuke says we had 10 dunks against Stetson (RJ 3; Zion 2; Javin 2; Marques, Cam, and Justin 1 each), and NCAA.com says we had 13 dunks (RJ 4; Zion 3; Javin 3; Marques, Cam, and Justin 1 each).

So far, for the season, in eight games:

Zion 22 or 17 (probably really 21);
Marques 13 or 11 (probably 13);
RJ 13 or 10 (probably 12);
Javin 6 or 4 (probably 6);
Cam 2;
Justin 2;
Jack 1;

TOTAL: 59 (NCAA) or 47 (Duke) [but the real number is probably 57].

FWIW, last year's team had 51 dunks after eight games. At this point last season, Marvin had 21 and Wendell had 10. Third place was Trevon Duval with 7. So using the "probably really" numbers, (a) Zion is tied with Marvin; (b) Zion + Marques are ahead of Marvin + Wendell, 34 to 31; and (c) Zion, Marques, and RJ are ahead of Marvin, Wendell, and Trevon, 46 to 38.

Who would be the right person to email? the SID? I'll write up an email.....not that they'll care....but It's stupid that Duke can't keep its own stats accurately.

Kedsy
12-02-2018, 12:39 AM
Who would be the right person to email? the SID? I'll write up an email...not that they'll care...but It's stupid that Duke can't keep its own stats accurately.

Yeah, probably the SID, or if you actually want a response, an assistant SID.

Kedsy
12-06-2018, 12:51 AM
The TV broadcast said we had 10 dunks tonight against Hartford, which matched the NCAA.com count. The official GoDuke box score said we only had 9 dunks, because the play-by-play counted the outrageous Zion-to-RJ alley-oop off the backboard as a "jumper." But we'll call it 10: Zion 3, RJ 3, Javin 2, Jack and Marques 1 each.

So far, for the season, in nine games:

Zion 25 or 20 (probably really 24);
RJ 16 or 12 (probably 15);
Marques 14 or 12 (probably 14);
Javin 8 or 6 (probably 8);
Cam 2;
Justin 2;
Jack 2;

TOTAL: 69 (NCAA) or 56 (Duke) [but the real number is probably 67].

FWIW, last year's team had 58 dunks after nine games. At this point last season, Marvin had 24 and Wendell had 13. Third place was Trevon Duval with 7. So using the "probably really" numbers, (a) Zion is tied with Marvin; (b) Zion + RJ are ahead of Marvin + Wendell, 39 to 37; and (c) Zion, RJ, and Marques are ahead of Marvin, Wendell, and Trevon, 53 to 44.

arnie
12-06-2018, 06:53 AM
The TV broadcast said we had 10 dunks tonight against Hartford, which matched the NCAA.com count. The official GoDuke box score said we only had 9 dunks, because the play-by-play counted the outrageous Zion-to-RJ alley-oop off the backboard as a "jumper." But we'll call it 10: Zion 3, RJ 3, Javin 2, Jack and Marques 1 each.

So far, for the season, in nine games:

Zion 25 or 20 (probably really 24);
RJ 16 or 12 (probably 15);
Marques 14 or 12 (probably 14);
Javin 8 or 6 (probably 8);
Cam 2;
Justin 2;
Jack 2;

TOTAL: 69 (NCAA) or 56 (Duke) [but the real number is probably 67].

FWIW, last year's team had 58 dunks after nine games. At this point last season, Marvin had 24 and Wendell had 13. Third place was Trevon Duval with 7. So using the "probably really" numbers, (a) Zion is tied with Marvin; (b) Zion + RJ are ahead of Marvin + Wendell, 39 to 37; and (c) Zion, RJ, and Marques are ahead of Marvin, Wendell, and Trevon, 53 to 44.

In all fairness to GoDuke, RJ did jump a little for the off the backboard slam. Guess the GoDuke scorer has a very, very, very high threshold for dunk categorizations?

fraggler
12-06-2018, 07:09 AM
Were I better at social media-ing, I'd put ESPN onto the fact that one of the best highlight alley-oops on the season was called a jumper. You'd have to think a little ribbing from national media would get the sports info office to at least look into it. Maybe Zion should let his 1.2 million Instagram followers know.

DevilHorse
12-06-2018, 07:56 AM
Game #7 - Indiana - SCT10 - #2 - Zion Steal and Breakaway Lefthanded Windmill

Larry
DevilHorse

Game #8 - Stetson - Zippo - Tough Day. Lots of conference Football Championships with Great Plays. (rumors are Coach K lights a [big] candle later in the week.. bids to increase his oil holdings)
Game #9 - Hartford - SCT10 #1 - Zion Assist off the backboard to R.J. Barrett for 2 Handed Slam (9 Duke SCTop 10 Highlights in 9 games)

Larry
DevilHorse

camion
12-06-2018, 08:01 AM
game #8 - stetson - zippo - tough day. Lots of conference football championships with great plays. (rumors are coach k lights a candle..)
game #9 - hartford - sct10 #1 - zion assist off the backboard to r.j. Barrett for 2 handed jumper (9 duke sctop 10 highlights in 9 games)

larry
devilhorse

fify

;)



(Odd, I've tried to captialize "FIFY" several times and the system always puts it back as lowercase.)

HereBeforeCoachK
12-06-2018, 08:08 AM
In all fairness to GoDuke, RJ did jump a little for the off the backboard slam. Guess the GoDuke scorer has a very, very, very high threshold for dunk categorizations?

...there is some agenda going on here.....no one is that incompetent. I mean, on the one hand, this is not that important. NCAA stats are the official stats. On the other hand, it's inexcusable and a little annoying.

Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15
12-06-2018, 09:19 AM
...there is some agenda going on here....no one is that incompetent. I mean, on the one hand, this is not that important. NCAA stats are the official stats. On the other hand, it's inexcusable and a little annoying.

"Inexcusable" is a little harsh for something I assume amounts to a sophomore sitting in a room with a piece of paper tallying dunks as the game happens. It's inconsequential and doesn't even rise to "a little annoying" in my book, though clearly you have some company in your group.

To me, angst over this internal stat is less interesting than angst over Joey Brackets' late December seedings.

BandAlum83
12-06-2018, 09:50 AM
In all fairness to GoDuke, RJ did jump a little for the off the backboard slam. Guess the GoDuke scorer has a very, very, very high threshold for dunk categorizations?

Did GoDuke score it as a missed shot and O rebound, or did Zion at least get credit for the assist?

HereBeforeCoachK
12-06-2018, 09:56 AM
"Inexcusable" is a little harsh for something I assume amounts to a sophomore sitting in a room with a piece of paper tallying dunks as the game happens. .

For a world class university, I must respectfully disagree with you....and I stand by it being inexcusable - if for no other reason than it's really easy to get this right, or very close to right. This is not even close.

Now keep in mind - I did mention in my post - and agree with you - that it's of little consequence - but that's an entirely different subject as to acceptable or un-acceptable. If you're gonna be cavalier about keeping stats, why keep them at all? Why publish your results?

I would add, in retrospect, that dunk stats ARE maybe going to be more important for this Duke team than any other - because the national media is very interested in Duke's dunks this season, more than ever.

fraggler
12-06-2018, 10:07 AM
"Inexcusable" is a little harsh for something I assume amounts to a sophomore sitting in a room with a piece of paper tallying dunks as the game happens. It's inconsequential and doesn't even rise to "a little annoying" in my book, though clearly you have some company in your group.

To me, angst over this internal stat is less interesting than angst over Joey Brackets' late December seedings.

Accuracy is important in the keeping of records, especially in recent years. For sports, which are definitely culturally important and not inconsequential, statistics and their place in history are particularly important. Given that Duke is, at the moment, the premier college basketball program in the world, I don't think expecting better from the official scorekeeper is out of line.

It is completely nonsensical to repeatedly mislabel alleyoop dunks as jumpers. Mistakes are forgivable, but the same one made repeatedly is a problem, especially in a high profile job like this.

devildeac
12-06-2018, 10:12 AM
Did GoDuke score it as a missed shot and O rebound, or did Zion at least get credit for the assist?

I thought the same thing considering that it hit the backboard. :confused:

fraggler
12-06-2018, 10:13 AM
Did GoDuke score it as a missed shot and O rebound, or did Zion at least get credit for the assist?

Jumper by RJ with an assist from Zion. So they were following the action, they just keep mislabeling alley-oops as jumpers.

DevilHorse
12-06-2018, 11:59 AM
fify

;)



(Odd, I've tried to captialize "FIFY" several times and the system always puts it back as lowercase.)

Is Red Klotz training the Canadian National Team (from the grave)? Oops, jump shot, Red only did sets.

Larry
DevilHorse

uh_no
12-06-2018, 12:24 PM
For a world class university, I must respectfully disagree with you...and I stand by it being inexcusable - if for no other reason than it's really easy to get this right, or very close to right. This is not even close.

Now keep in mind - I did mention in my post - and agree with you - that it's of little consequence - but that's an entirely different subject as to acceptable or un-acceptable. If you're gonna be cavalier about keeping stats, why keep them at all? Why publish your results?

I would add, in retrospect, that dunk stats ARE maybe going to be more important for this Duke team than any other - because the national media is very interested in Duke's dunks this season, more than ever.

I agree wholeheartedly. Maybe some statistics guy down the road attempts to do a study on some athletics thing and attempts to use duke's published stats? His research is now bogus because the the SID couldn't be bothered to take minimal effort in publishing accurate data.

Say Zion ends up near some season record for dunks, and the duke number doesn't match the NCAA number, and there's forever an argument over the record holder, because the SID couldn't be bothered to track it correctly.

If you're going to be sloppy about your record keeping, then you ought not bother keeping records at all. No information is better than misinformation, IMO, especially when there is already another organization who IS bothered to do it right.

cato
12-06-2018, 12:44 PM
I missed the game, but just saw the off the glass pass to Barrett.

I know what is going on. Whoever is keeping stats just keeps spilling drinks on the keyboard when stuff like that goes down.

Kedsy
12-06-2018, 12:55 PM
It is completely nonsensical to repeatedly mislabel alleyoop dunks as jumpers. Mistakes are forgivable, but the same one made repeatedly is a problem, especially in a high profile job like this.

So, I know that several alley-oops have been mislabeled as "jumpers" by GoDuke. I also know that the NCAA play-by-play labels such a play as an "alley-oop dunk." I don't know if all the discrepancies are on alley-oops are not. I also don't know how the play-by-play gets transcribed. But if the data gets entered into a computer that subsequently creates the box score, maybe they created a new code for alley-oop dunk but the computer program mistakenly translates that to "jumper." It's a possibility, anyway.

HereBeforeCoachK
12-06-2018, 01:39 PM
Jumper by RJ with an assist from Zion. So they were following the action, they just keep mislabeling alley-oops as jumpers.

.....how do you let that mistake slip once......let alone consistently? Seriously, HOW???

BandAlum83
12-06-2018, 03:28 PM
So, I know that several alley-oops have been mislabeled as "jumpers" by GoDuke. I also know that the NCAA play-by-play labels such a play as an "alley-oop dunk." I don't know if all the discrepancies are on alley-oops are not. I also don't know how the play-by-play gets transcribed. But if the data gets entered into a computer that subsequently creates the box score, maybe they created a new code for alley-oop dunk but the computer program mistakenly translates that to "jumper." It's a possibility, anyway.

I was just thinking something similar. They might be attempting (unsuccessfully) to track alley oops separate from non-assisted dunks.

fraggler
12-06-2018, 05:42 PM
I was just thinking something similar. They might be attempting (unsuccessfully) to track alley oops separate from non-assisted dunks.

Iirc, not all alley-oops have been mis-categorized, just some. I doubt it is an automated coding error unless there is inconsistency in the input.

At any rate, it would be nice if the sports info office noticed and sussed it out.

HereBeforeCoachK
12-06-2018, 05:44 PM
I was just thinking something similar. They might be attempting (unsuccessfully) to track alley oops separate from non-assisted dunks.

....maybe, but that doesn't fit the model for a "jumper" either.

arnie
12-06-2018, 05:47 PM
Iirc, not all alley-oops have been mis-categorized, just some. I doubt it is an automated coding error unless there is inconsistency in the input.

At any rate, it would be nice if the sports info office noticed and sussed it out.

It’s probably just a millennial disease 😎. Hoping to get a 70 grade and coast on in.

BandAlum83
12-07-2018, 03:59 PM
It’s probably just a millennial disease ��. Hoping to get a 70 grade and coast on in.

Has anyone tried to contact the office of the SID? I mean, I'll try, but I have no contacts over there and don't know anything about how that department works.

Kedsy
12-08-2018, 10:31 PM
Happily, the GoDuke count matched the NCAA count (perhaps because we didn't have any alley-oop dunks today, or perhaps not), and that count was 6: Jack White led the team (first time ever for that) with 2, and Javin, AOC, RJ, and Zion had 1 each.

So far, for the season, in ten games:

Zion 26 or 21 (probably really 25);
RJ 17 or 13 (probably 16);
Marques 14 or 12 (probably 14);
Javin 9 or 7 (probably 9);
Jack 4;
Cam 2;
Justin 2;
AOC 1.

TOTAL: 75 (NCAA) or 62 (Duke) [but the real number is probably 73].

FWIW, last year's team had 64 dunks after ten games. At this point last season, Marvin had 26 and Wendell had 15. Third place was a tie between Trevon and Javin, both with 7. So using the "probably really" numbers, (a) Zion is one behind Marvin; (b) Zion + RJ are tied with Marvin + Wendell, 41 to 41; (c) Zion, RJ, and Marques are ahead of Marvin, Wendell, and Trevon, 55 to 48; and (d) Zion, RJ, Marques, and Javin are ahead of Marvin, Wendell, Trevon, and Javin, 64 to 55.

Bluedog
12-08-2018, 11:03 PM
Happily, the GoDuke count matched the NCAA count (perhaps because we didn't have any alley-oop dunks today, or perhaps not), and that count was 6: Jack White led the team (first time ever for that) with 2, and Javin, AOC, RJ, and Zion had 1 each.

So far, for the season, in ten games:

Zion 26 or 21 (probably really 25);
RJ 17 or 13 (probably 16);
Marques 14 or 12 (probably 14);
Javin 9 or 7 (probably 9);
Jack 4;
Cam 2;
Justin 2;
AOC 1.

TOTAL: 75 (NCAA) or 62 (Duke) [but the real number is probably 73].

FWIW, last year's team had 64 dunks after ten games. At this point last season, Marvin had 26 and Wendell had 15. Third place was a tie between Trevon and Javin, both with 7. So using the "probably really" numbers, (a) Zion is one behind Marvin; (b) Zion + RJ are tied with Marvin + Wendell, 41 to 41; (c) Zion, RJ, and Marques are ahead of Marvin, Wendell, and Trevon, 55 to 48; and (d) Zion, RJ, Marques, and Javin are ahead of Marvin, Wendell, Trevon, and Javin, 64 to 55.

Are last year's comparison numbers you're referring from the NCAA or Duke box scores? I assume the Duke box scores also had the same issues last year? Thanks for tracking!

Kedsy
12-08-2018, 11:21 PM
Are last year's comparison numbers you're referring from the NCAA or Duke box scores? I assume the Duke box scores also had the same issues last year? Thanks for tracking!

Last year's numbers were from the GoDuke box score, but we didn't have this problem (or not nearly to the same extent, at any rate). The "official" record book is different by just 3 dunks from last year's thread's numbers. Three discrepancies in the whole season is far different from an average of 1.3 discrepancies per game.

If you want detail, my thread last season said 232 dunks and the Duke media guide says 235 (which is the exact number you see bandied about when they talk about the Duke dunk record). I gave Marvin credit for 96 vs. 98 in the Duke media guide, and I gave Wendell credit for 57 and the Duke media guide said 58. Everything else in the thread matched the media guide.

Something else I just noticed, Marvin Bagley had 98 dunks last season and Duke's opponents only totaled 94.

GGLC
12-08-2018, 11:36 PM
Could have sworn that RJ had two dunks, but I guess I'm wrong.

Kedsy
12-08-2018, 11:39 PM
Could have sworn that RJ had two dunks, but I guess I'm wrong.

RJ had a breakaway that he looked like he was going to dunk but instead he dropped it in from about an inch away from the rim. When I saw it, I wondered whether he'd get credit for a dunk or not, but neither GoDuke nor NCAA.com ended up giving it to him so I guess not. Maybe that was what you were thinking of?

GGLC
12-08-2018, 11:41 PM
That could be, yeah!

jjasper0729
12-10-2018, 09:17 AM
I wanted to give this thread a quick reply and let everyone know why there may be a discrepancy with the play by play vs. the box scores. The NCAA has mandated that all schools use a new statistics program starting for the 2019-2020 season. NEXT season, everyone will have to use the new software. THIS season, 2018-2019 it is optional and Duke has opted in. This is the first season we are using the software program after using the same program for the last 15 years.

The benefit of this is that we can help the developers get any kinks worked out before it has to be used universally next season, but the downside is there may be some kinks. When inputting the plays, there is an option for dunk and also an option for alley oop. It had been presumed that an alley oop would show up as "Alley-Oop" in the play by play and not as a jumper. As the official scorer for Duke (and have been for the last 20 years and 24 out of the last 27) I've sent a request to the software company to look into adding an alley-oop dunk option as well as relabeling the current alley-oop option as a layup in the play by play.

I just hope this helps to clarify some things so that everyone understands what is going on rather than disparaging people for being incompetent, that give a lot of time for every home game because of their love of Duke

Thanks

Kedsy
12-10-2018, 10:46 AM
I wanted to give this thread a quick reply and let everyone know why there may be a discrepancy with the play by play vs. the box scores. The NCAA has mandated that all schools use a new statistics program starting for the 2019-2020 season. NEXT season, everyone will have to use the new software. THIS season, 2018-2019 it is optional and Duke has opted in. This is the first season we are using the software program after using the same program for the last 15 years.

The benefit of this is that we can help the developers get any kinks worked out before it has to be used universally next season, but the downside is there may be some kinks. When inputting the plays, there is an option for dunk and also an option for alley oop. It had been presumed that an alley oop would show up as "Alley-Oop" in the play by play and not as a jumper. As the official scorer for Duke (and have been for the last 20 years and 24 out of the last 27) I've sent a request to the software company to look into adding an alley-oop dunk option as well as relabeling the current alley-oop option as a layup in the play by play.

I just hope this helps to clarify some things so that everyone understands what is going on rather than disparaging people for being incompetent, that give a lot of time for every home game because of their love of Duke

Thanks

Thank you so much for your response. This is exactly what I hypothesized might be the problem. If we want an accurate source on dunks, should we use the NCAA.com site or is there somewhere else where that data is being kept?

Thanks again.

uh_no
12-10-2018, 11:03 AM
I wanted to give this thread a quick reply and let everyone know why there may be a discrepancy with the play by play vs. the box scores. The NCAA has mandated that all schools use a new statistics program starting for the 2019-2020 season. NEXT season, everyone will have to use the new software. THIS season, 2018-2019 it is optional and Duke has opted in. This is the first season we are using the software program after using the same program for the last 15 years.

The benefit of this is that we can help the developers get any kinks worked out before it has to be used universally next season, but the downside is there may be some kinks. When inputting the plays, there is an option for dunk and also an option for alley oop. It had been presumed that an alley oop would show up as "Alley-Oop" in the play by play and not as a jumper. As the official scorer for Duke (and have been for the last 20 years and 24 out of the last 27) I've sent a request to the software company to look into adding an alley-oop dunk option as well as relabeling the current alley-oop option as a layup in the play by play.

I just hope this helps to clarify some things so that everyone understands what is going on rather than disparaging people for being incompetent, that give a lot of time for every home game because of their love of Duke

Thanks

Thanks for the response. I appreciate your explaining the situation. That said, the primary purpose of record keeping is to keep accurate records, and Duke has significantly missed that directive in this stat category. When you sign up as a beta tester for some piece of software, you accept that there might be some growing pains. In this case, the growing pain seems to be improper reporting of alley-oops as jumpers rather than dunks. That being the case, if Duke needs to manually edit the box to meet the goal of accurate records, then that's what they ought to be doing, not simply chalking it simply chalking it up to a software issue.

I write software. I deal with beta customers. I know sometimes things can be rough. Duke needs to ensure it's record keeping is accurate. Right now, it is not. So while I agree that people shouldn't be called incompetent, I also don't believe this is an acceptable situation and hope Duke corrects this moving forward, with or without a fix to the underlying software.

HereBeforeCoachK
12-10-2018, 11:16 AM
Thanks for the response. I appreciate your explaining the situation. That said, the primary purpose of record keeping is to keep accurate records, and Duke has significantly missed that directive in this stat category. When you sign up as a beta tester for some piece of software, you accept that there might be some growing pains. In this case, the growing pain seems to be improper reporting of alley-oops as jumpers rather than dunks. That being the case, if Duke needs to manually edit the box to meet the goal of accurate records, then that's what they ought to be doing, not simply chalking it simply chalking it up to a software issue.

I write software. I deal with beta customers. I know sometimes things can be rough. Duke needs to ensure it's record keeping is accurate. Right now, it is not. So while I agree that people shouldn't be called incompetent, I also don't believe this is an acceptable situation and hope Duke corrects this moving forward, with or without a fix to the underlying software.

I agree with your response here, and I also appreciate your inside info. So let me ask, wouldn't this be a very simple software situation? I mean, keeping hoop stats is not that difficult - and I can't imagine that software to compile and compare those stats would be pretty easy pickings as far as software goes. Am I right here with my instincts, or am I missing something?

uh_no
12-10-2018, 11:28 AM
I agree with your response here, and I also appreciate your inside info. So let me ask, wouldn't this be a very simple software situation? I mean, keeping hoop stats is not that difficult - and I can't imagine that software to compile and compare those stats would be pretty easy pickings as far as software goes. Am I right here with my instincts, or am I missing something?

Yes. and I would hope the NCAA, given they're intending to roll this out nationwide next year, would be checking stats collected by this new system for discrepancies with stats collected the old way. It shouldn't take a bunch of rag tag arm-chair statisticians on DBR (who you callin rag tag??!!?) to identify a major issue like this. What other potential issues are there that we might be missing because we don't follow every stat as closely as dunks? I hope someone's looking, at least.

BandAlum83
12-10-2018, 11:57 AM
I wanted to give this thread a quick reply and let everyone know why there may be a discrepancy with the play by play vs. the box scores. The NCAA has mandated that all schools use a new statistics program starting for the 2019-2020 season. NEXT season, everyone will have to use the new software. THIS season, 2018-2019 it is optional and Duke has opted in. This is the first season we are using the software program after using the same program for the last 15 years.

The benefit of this is that we can help the developers get any kinks worked out before it has to be used universally next season, but the downside is there may be some kinks. When inputting the plays, there is an option for dunk and also an option for alley oop. It had been presumed that an alley oop would show up as "Alley-Oop" in the play by play and not as a jumper. As the official scorer for Duke (and have been for the last 20 years and 24 out of the last 27) I've sent a request to the software company to look into adding an alley-oop dunk option as well as relabeling the current alley-oop option as a layup in the play by play.

I just hope this helps to clarify some things so that everyone understands what is going on rather than disparaging people for being incompetent, that give a lot of time for every home game because of their love of Duke

Thanks

Thank you, Jasper. As a process consultant myself, I thought that very likely it was some sort of coding issue. This is great information!

And thank you for what you do for Duke!

jjasper0729
12-10-2018, 12:09 PM
Thanks for the response. I appreciate your explaining the situation. That said, the primary purpose of record keeping is to keep accurate records, and Duke has significantly missed that directive in this stat category. When you sign up as a beta tester for some piece of software, you accept that there might be some growing pains. In this case, the growing pain seems to be improper reporting of alley-oops as jumpers rather than dunks. That being the case, if Duke needs to manually edit the box to meet the goal of accurate records, then that's what they ought to be doing, not simply chalking it simply chalking it up to a software issue.

I write software. I deal with beta customers. I know sometimes things can be rough. Duke needs to ensure it's record keeping is accurate. Right now, it is not. So while I agree that people shouldn't be called incompetent, I also don't believe this is an acceptable situation and hope Duke corrects this moving forward, with or without a fix to the underlying software.

I also write software as my day job so I understand as well the pitfalls that might come being part of an initial roll out. This software has been used in the NBA and in FIBA for a while now so it's been tested. You can also be assured that, in fact, yes, we try to be as accurate as possible during the game and after it is over to make sure statistics are correct based on the score book as well. We aren't just doing this willy nilly and to presume that we don't care about accuracy is just wrong. That's all I'm going to say on that lest I get dinged by the mods

I have found the issue with this thread and I will tell you that if you are going by box scores, then you need to use the NCAA box. If you are using the play by play then use the LiveStats play by play on the Duke page rather than the "Stats" link that shows up. The "Stats" link is a product of uploading the game to the cloud per the new software and the NCAA and then importing it into the old software as necessary this year (only) to update statistics. The play by play there has a translation issue with some of the codes and is allocating them incorrectly. Again, use the LiveStats link or the NCAA box score if you are going to calculate Dunks for the year. I can't speak for the SID office on how they are doing it but I'm sure they'll be using the NCAA as well since that's what is uploaded when the game is wrapped up.

uh_no
12-10-2018, 12:22 PM
I also write software as my day job so I understand as well the pitfalls that might come being part of an initial roll out. This software has been used in the NBA and in FIBA for a while now so it's been tested. You can also be assured that, in fact, yes, we try to be as accurate as possible during the game and after it is over to make sure statistics are correct based on the score book as well. We aren't just doing this willy nilly and to presume that we don't care about accuracy is just wrong. That's all I'm going to say on that lest I get dinged by the mods

I have found the issue with this thread and I will tell you that if you are going by box scores, then you need to use the NCAA box. If you are using the play by play then use the LiveStats play by play on the Duke page rather than the "Stats" link that shows up. The "Stats" link is a product of uploading the game to the cloud per the new software and the NCAA and then importing it into the old software as necessary this year (only) to update statistics. The play by play there has a translation issue with some of the codes and is allocating them incorrectly. Again, use the LiveStats link or the NCAA box score if you are going to calculate Dunks for the year. I can't speak for the SID office on how they are doing it but I'm sure they'll be using the NCAA as well since that's what is uploaded when the game is wrapped up.

I'm out of sporks to give. This is fantastic insight.

JasonEvans
12-10-2018, 12:57 PM
I also write software as my day job so I understand as well the pitfalls that might come being part of an initial roll out. This software has been used in the NBA and in FIBA for a while now so it's been tested. You can also be assured that, in fact, yes, we try to be as accurate as possible during the game and after it is over to make sure statistics are correct based on the score book as well. We aren't just doing this willy nilly and to presume that we don't care about accuracy is just wrong. That's all I'm going to say on that lest I get dinged by the mods

I have found the issue with this thread and I will tell you that if you are going by box scores, then you need to use the NCAA box. If you are using the play by play then use the LiveStats play by play on the Duke page rather than the "Stats" link that shows up. The "Stats" link is a product of uploading the game to the cloud per the new software and the NCAA and then importing it into the old software as necessary this year (only) to update statistics. The play by play there has a translation issue with some of the codes and is allocating them incorrectly. Again, use the LiveStats link or the NCAA box score if you are going to calculate Dunks for the year. I can't speak for the SID office on how they are doing it but I'm sure they'll be using the NCAA as well since that's what is uploaded when the game is wrapped up.

Jasper is a stud for coming here to answer these questions and help to resolve this issue.

And the posts he/she has made serve as an important reminder to all of us. While it is easy on an internet message board to slam someone, it is worth remembering that the best posting style is one where you assume the other poster (or perhaps the person you are angry at) is standing right in front of you. Some folks said some really angry things about Duke's official scorer/stat management. And while the complaints were very legit, the tone may have been a bit too personal and disrespectful.

--Jason "http://systems-engineering.weebly.com/uploads/1/8/7/9/18795700/875299530.png" Evans

Tripping William
12-10-2018, 01:03 PM
I'm out of sporks to give. This is fantastic insight.

Gotcha covered.

devildeac
12-10-2018, 10:18 PM
I'm out of sporks to give. This is fantastic insight.


Gotcha covered.

I agree that this was a great explanation and thanks for taking the time to post that.

Sporks also given. I initially awarded six but the software only credited four.

;):rolleyes:

elvis14
12-10-2018, 10:58 PM
Two thoughts. First, awesome responses from Jasper, thanks. Those of us that are a bit OCD are really glad to have clarity. Second thought...I test software (and write software to test software)...chances are I still have some open Burts on "uh no" (aside from the ones I filed when he was in middle school).

uh_no
12-10-2018, 11:57 PM
Two thoughts. First, awesome responses from Jasper, thanks. Those of us that are a bit OCD are really glad to have clarity. Second thought...I test software (and write software to test software)...chances are I still have some open Burts on "uh no" (aside from the ones I filed when he was in middle school).

Everyone knows this must be a lie, as I spend all day on DBR.

Kedsy
12-19-2018, 01:24 AM
Tonight, the GoDuke count was actually bigger than the NCAA count. GoDuke said 5: Javin 2, RJ 1, AOC 1, and Justin 1. NCAA.com didn't give a dunk to AOC, and since I can't remember the play, I'm not sure who's right. Zion got no dunks tonight. Justin now ranks 6th on the team with 3.

So far, for the season, in 11 games:

Zion 26 or 21 (probably really 25);
RJ 18 or 14 (probably 17);
Marques 14 or 12 (probably 14);
Javin 11 or 9 (probably 11);
Jack 4;
Justin 3;
Cam 2;
AOC 1 or 2 (probably ?).

TOTAL: 79 (NCAA) or 68 (Duke) [but the real number is probably 77 or 78].

FWIW, last year's team had 73 dunks after eleven games. At this point last season, Marvin had 30 and Wendell had 17. Third place was a tie between Trevon, Javin, and Grayson, all with 7. So using the "probably really" numbers, (a) Zion is five behind Marvin; (b) Zion + RJ are five behind Marvin + Wendell, 47 to 42; (c) Zion, RJ, and Marques are ahead of Marvin, Wendell, and Trevon, 56 to 54; (d) Zion, RJ, Marques, and Javin are ahead of Marvin, Wendell, Trevon, and Javin, 67 to 61; and (e) top five vs. top five has this year's team ahead, 71 to 68.

DevilHorse
12-19-2018, 08:25 AM
Game #8 - Stetson - Zippo - Tough Day. Lots of conference Football Championships with Great Plays. (rumors are Coach K lights a [big] candle later in the week.. bids to increase his oil holdings)
Game #9 - Hartford - SCT10 #1 - Zion Assist off the backboard to R.J. Barrett for 2 Handed Slam (9 Duke SCTop 10 Highlights in 9 games)

Larry
DevilHorse

Game #10 - Yale - Zilch
Game #11 - Princeton - SCT10 #2 - Zion Blocks a Princeton Player's shot above the box, so deep he hits his head on the backboard (no repair of the backboard needed, mysterious Harry Potter "Z" shows up on Zion's head. Obviously protected by a horcrux.). Personnally, I liked Reddish's Rip and Assist. (10 SCT10 in 11 games).

Larry
DevilHorse

JasonEvans
12-19-2018, 11:06 AM
Game #11 - Princeton - SCT10 #2 - Zion Blocks a Princeton Player's shot above the box, so deep he hits his head on the backboard (no repair of the backboard needed, mysterious Harry Potter "Z" shows up on Zion's head. Obviously protected by a horcrux.).

https://www.sbnation.com/college-basketball/2018/12/18/18147383/zion-williamson-block-princeton-vs-duke-highlights

Zion Williamson: murder blocker. It’s the only way to sum it up.

jimsumner
12-19-2018, 12:17 PM
I haven't really kept up with this thread but, for the record, that Jasper person who posted upthread is actually pretty competent.

Despite the fact that he's a Red Sox fan. :)

Neals384
12-19-2018, 12:43 PM
Tonight, the GoDuke count was actually bigger than the NCAA count. GoDuke said 5: Javin 2, RJ 1, AOC 1, and Justin 1. NCAA.com didn't give a dunk to AOC, and since I can't remember the play, I'm not sure who's right. Zion got no dunks tonight. Justin now ranks 6th on the team with 3.

So far, for the season, in 11 games:

Zion 26 or 21 (probably really 25);
RJ 18 or 14 (probably 17);
Marques 14 or 12 (probably 14);
Javin 11 or 9 (probably 11);
Jack 4;
Justin 3;
Cam 2;
AOC 1 or 2 (probably ?).

TOTAL: 79 (NCAA) or 68 (Duke) [but the real number is probably 77 or 78].

FWIW, last year's team had 73 dunks after eleven games. At this point last season, Marvin had 30 and Wendell had 17. Third place was a tie between Trevon, Javin, and Grayson, all with 7. So using the "probably really" numbers, (a) Zion is five behind Marvin; (b) Zion + RJ are five behind Marvin + Wendell, 47 to 42; (c) Zion, RJ, and Marques are ahead of Marvin, Wendell, and Trevon, 56 to 54; (d) Zion, RJ, Marques, and Javin are ahead of Marvin, Wendell, Trevon, and Javin, 67 to 61; and (e) top five vs. top five has this year's team ahead, 71 to 68.

No dunk for AOC. At 3:43 of the 2H. White makes a steal, goes the length of the court but misses the layup. Goldwire tries for a put back dunk(!) but it bounces off the back rim. Then AOC makes a nice tip in. But AOC was nowhere near the rim, certainly not above it. That was his only 2pointer of the game.

AOC missed a dunk at 4:39 of the 2H, but was fouled and made both.

Vrank got an ORebound off an AOC miss at 1:45. Open unde the basket but opted for the layup instead of a dunk. Must do wind sprints for failing to boost the team dunk count;)

English
12-19-2018, 01:47 PM
I haven't really kept up with this thread but, for the record, that Jasper person who posted upthread is actually pretty competent.

Despite the fact that he's a Red Sox fan. :)

Absolutely--and, as if we needed any corroboration, KenPom addressed this in his latest pod. He gave a big shoutout to David Worlock as an invaluable resource who has been at his constant call making necessary stats updates/corrections because (as Jasper pointed out) the NCAA software is changing over. I didn't really consider the potential hijinx this would cause to predictive modeling like KenPom, but rather viewed this as a minor inconvenience when counting Duke dunks for posterity. Instead, it had the potential to wreak major havoc on a larger scale--especially when considering that these rankings will actually be provided on team sheets for the Selection Committee.

Long winded way of throwing another kudos (sporks provided earlier) to JJasper.

DevilHorse
12-21-2018, 12:08 PM
Game #10 - Yale - Zilch
Game #11 - Princeton - SCT10 #2 - Zion Blocks a Princeton Player's shot above the box, so deep he hits his head on the backboard (no repair of the backboard needed, mysterious Harry Potter "Z" shows up on Zion's head. Obviously protected by a horcrux.). Personnally, I liked Reddish's Rip and Assist. (10 SCT10 in 11 games).

Larry
DevilHorse

Game #12 - Texas Tech - SCT10 #8 - Zion oops an assist from out of Tre's hands for slam from the left side. Levitation involved. Levity ensued. Levis left the seats (11 SCT10 in 12 games)

Larry
DevilHorse

Kedsy
12-21-2018, 12:25 PM
Game #12 - Texas Tech - SCT10 #8 - Zion oops an assist from out of Tre's hands for slam from the left side. Levitation involved. Levity ensued.

And GoDuke called it a "jumper."

Now that we understand the problem, this will probably be the last post where I track GoDuke's count. I won't use NCAA.com's count if we know it's wrong, either, so hopefully the total we get in this thread at least comes close to matching whatever "official" tally is being kept somewhere. Be that as it may, the GoDuke count was 4: Zion 2, RJ 1, and Javin 1. NCAA.com said 5: Zion 3, RJ and Javin 1 each.

So far, for the season, in 12 games:

Zion 29 or 23 (probably really 28);
RJ 19 or 15 (probably 18);
Marques 14 or 12 (probably 14);
Javin 12 or 10 (probably 12);
Jack 4;
Justin 3;
Cam 2;
AOC 1 or 2 (probably 1).

TOTAL: 84 (NCAA) or 71 (Duke) [but the real number is probably 82].

FWIW, last year's team had 79 dunks after twelve games, so using our "probably" number this year's team is 3 ahead of last season's record-setting pace. At this point last season, Marvin had 30 and Wendell had 19. Javin had 9, Grayson had 8 and Trevon had 7. So using the "probably really" numbers, (a) Zion is two behind Marvin; (b) Zion + RJ are three behind Marvin + Wendell, 49 to 46; (c) Zion, RJ, and Marques are ahead of Marvin, Wendell, and Javin, 60 to 58; (d) Zion, RJ, Marques, and Javin are ahead of Marvin, Wendell, Javin, and Grayson, 72 to 66; and (e) top five vs. top five has this year's team ahead, 76 to 73.

HereBeforeCoachK
12-21-2018, 07:26 PM
And GoDuke called it a "jumper."


What an embarrassment.

-jk
12-21-2018, 07:33 PM
What an embarrassment.

Beta testing is fraught with troubles; parallel testing is so much better!

-jk

BullBlue
01-04-2019, 11:50 AM
Wow, had to go all the way to page 4 to find one of my favorite ongoing threads? Must be a long time since we played. For your viewing pleasure:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tOcf6Dgj_Xo

All of the slams from Zion and the squad in 2018 Duke wins. TOTAL: 84 (NCAA) or 71 (Duke) [but the real number is probably 82]...but I didn't try to count them.

Let's add to the total tomorrow night! Going to be at the game - first time to see a Duke/ACC game in Cameron. Man-o-man, can hardly wait!

DukieInBrasil
01-06-2019, 11:29 AM
i know that Zion had at least 2, and Javin had at least 1, does anyone know the official tally?

uh_no
01-06-2019, 11:30 AM
i know that Zion had at least 2, and Javin had at least 1, does anyone know the official tally?


History of Universe dunk total:
Zion Williamson: 1
Everyone Else: 0

JNort
01-06-2019, 12:10 PM
Wow, had to go all the way to page 4 to find one of my favorite ongoing threads? Must be a long time since we played. For your viewing pleasure:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tOcf6Dgj_Xo

All of the slams from Zion and the squad in 2018 Duke wins. TOTAL: 84 (NCAA) or 71 (Duke) [but the real number is probably 82]...but I didn't try to count them.

Let's add to the total tomorrow night! Going to be at the game - first time to see a Duke/ACC game in Cameron. Man-o-man, can hardly wait!

I counted 71 in that video

DevilHorse
01-06-2019, 12:17 PM
Game #12 - Texas Tech - SCT10 #8 - Zion oops an assist from out of Tre's hands for slam from the left side. Levitation involved. Levity ensued. Levis left the seats (11 SCT10 in 12 games)

Larry
DevilHorse

Game #13 - Clemson - CST10 #1 - Zion double team, steal from behind at half-court, dribbles in for a fluid and powerful, 360 degree, left hand rim rattler that left everyone in blue quite excited.
(12 SCT10 in 13games)


Larry
DevilHorse

DukieInBrasil
01-06-2019, 12:41 PM
History of Universe dunk total:
Zion Williamson: 1
Everyone Else: 0

couldn't spork you so i'll say that was a good one!
Very Chuck Norris-esque, in that it reminded me of a post somebody made in which Zion replaced Chuck...

HereBeforeCoachK
01-06-2019, 02:09 PM
I counted 71 in that video

Of course, that's a Duke video, and Im sure they just followed the "official" Duke tally sheet to time stamped moments to do the video.

Kedsy
01-06-2019, 03:10 PM
Starting now, I will use NCAA.com's count, with question marks if I thought it was wrong. Last night, NCAA.com said we had 5 dunks: Zion 2, Marques, Javin, and Alex 1 each.

I don't remember Alex's dunk (supposedly with 1:25 to go in the first half), and GoDuke didn't give him credit for one. Does anyone else remember seeing Alex dunk last night?

So far, for the season, in 13 games:

Zion 31 (probably really 30);
RJ 19 (probably 18);
Marques 15;
Javin 13;
Jack 4;
Justin 3;
Cam 2;
AOC 2 (probably 1).

TOTAL: 89 [but the real number is probably 86].

FWIW, last year's team had 85 dunks after 13 games, so this year's team is either one or three ahead of last season's record-setting pace. At this point last season, Marvin had 32 and Wendell had 20. Javin had 9, Grayson had 8 and Trevon had 7. So (a) Zion is one or two behind Marvin; (b) Zion + RJ are between two-to-four behind Marvin + Wendell; (c) Zion, RJ, and Marques are two-to-four ahead of Marvin, Wendell, and Javin; (d) Zion, RJ, Marques, and Javin are seven-to-nine ahead of Marvin, Wendell, Javin, and Grayson; and (e) top five vs. top five has this year's team four-to-six ahead of last year's team.

HereBeforeCoachK
01-06-2019, 03:19 PM
Starting now, I will use NCAA.com's count, with question marks if I thought it was wrong. Last night, NCAA.com said we had 5 dunks: Zion 2, Marques, Javin, and Alex 1 each.

I don't remember Alex's dunk (supposedly with 1:25 to go in the first half), and GoDuke didn't give him credit for one. Does anyone else remember seeing Alex dunk last night?.

Alex had a follow off the glass....not a dunk...at that point. That was his only hoop.

Kedsy
01-06-2019, 03:29 PM
Alex had a follow off the glass...not a dunk...at that point. That was his only hoop.

Thanks. That confirms that NCAA.com is also not especially reliable, but hopefully we can keep up with their mistakes.

GGLC
01-06-2019, 03:42 PM
I thought Zion had three dunks last night. Weird.

Kedsy
01-06-2019, 03:52 PM
I thought Zion had three dunks last night. Weird.

There was a graphic on TV saying he'd had three dunks, but both NCAA and GoDuke agree on two. I seem to remember one where he kind of threw it in the basket from a few inches away, but even if I'm right about that neither of the play-by-plays I consulted thought it was a dunk.

BandAlum83
01-06-2019, 04:58 PM
There was a graphic on TV saying he'd had three dunks, but both NCAA and GoDuke agree on two. I seem to remember one where he kind of threw it in the basket from a few inches away, but even if I'm right about that neither of the play-by-plays I consulted thought it was a dunk.

Unrelated,but there was a play where a Clemson player tried to throw down on JW and missed. Both announcers called it a block even after seeing multiple slo mo replays that clearly showed JW didn’t touch the ball. Did the play by play transcript credit JW with a block for that play?

HereBeforeCoachK
01-06-2019, 05:38 PM
Unrelated,but there was a play where a Clemson player tried to throw down on JW and missed. Both announcers called it a block even after seeing multiple slo mo replays that clearly showed JW didn’t touch the ball. Did the play by play transcript credit JW with a block for that play?

THIS ^^^^^....wondered it myself. It's so funny how these announcers will stick to their story (a foul, or in this case, a blocked shot) even when replay shows AIR between the subjects at hand. And by funny, I mean annoying as heck.

On the other hand, great D by Jack to force the miss......

Tripping William
01-06-2019, 08:22 PM
THIS ^^^^^...wondered it myself. It's so funny how these announcers will stick to their story (a foul, or in this case, a blocked shot) even when replay shows AIR between the subjects at hand. And by funny, I mean annoying as heck.

On the other hand, great D by Jack to force the miss...

Nobody puts Jack White on a poster ....

Kedsy
01-06-2019, 09:07 PM
Unrelated,but there was a play where a Clemson player tried to throw down on JW and missed. Both announcers called it a block even after seeing multiple slo mo replays that clearly showed JW didn’t touch the ball. Did the play by play transcript credit JW with a block for that play?

I don't know for certain without knowing who the Clemson player was and when the play occurred (I saw the play but I wasn't paying attention enough to know those things). But I do not believe Jack got credit for a block on that play.

FWIW, however, my recollection of the TV replay was seeing that Jack did touch the ball (barely) as the guy was bringing it toward the basket (but not on his downward motion which is why I assume it wasn't really a block).

curtis325
01-06-2019, 10:06 PM
I don't know for certain without knowing who the Clemson player was and when the play occurred (I saw the play but I wasn't paying attention enough to know those things). But I do not believe Jack got credit for a block on that play.

FWIW, however, my recollection of the TV replay was seeing that Jack did touch the ball (barely) as the guy was bringing it toward the basket (but not on his downward motion which is why I assume it wasn't really a block).

It was a great play by Jack. It looked to me like he went straight up, thus no foul, and he clearly prevented the dunk whether he gets credit for a blocked shot or not.

Crikey!

JasonEvans
01-08-2019, 01:49 PM
Not a tracking of dunks, but a countdown. ESPN's top 10 this morning was the top 10 dunks by Zion this season. Not top 10 plays from the CFB national title game, it was all about Zion. That's kinda remarkable.

Enjoy!

http://www.espn.com/watch/player?id=25713187

-Jason "I think you can guess at #1" Evans

elvis14
01-08-2019, 02:00 PM
Not a tracking of dunks, but a countdown. ESPN's top 10 this morning was the top 10 dunks by Zion this season. Not top 10 plays from the CFB national title game, it was all about Zion. That's kinda remarkable.

Enjoy!

http://www.espn.com/watch/player?id=25713187

-Jason "I think you can guess at #1" Evans

I wish they would have included some of his blocked shots instead of just dunks. Sometimes the blocks are more impressive (even if they are called a goal tend).

JasonEvans
01-08-2019, 02:33 PM
Check out Mike Bucmire on the bench with the video camera. Hysterical!!

https://media.giphy.com/media/3d9toYjTyE4q28eBLO/giphy.gif

CDu
01-08-2019, 02:57 PM
There was a graphic on TV saying he'd had three dunks, but both NCAA and GoDuke agree on two. I seem to remember one where he kind of threw it in the basket from a few inches away, but even if I'm right about that neither of the play-by-plays I consulted thought it was a dunk.

I can confirm just 2 dunks. One was the putback of Reddish's miss early, and the other was the "360" (really a 270 or so, but still really impressive). All of his other "layups" were pretty clearly layups, banking them off the glass from a variety of angles.

Kedsy
01-09-2019, 12:42 AM
Nine dunks against Wake Forest: Zion 3, Marques and Javin 2 each, RJ and Cam 1 each.

So far, for the season, in 14 games:

Zion 33;
RJ 19;
Marques 17;
Javin 15;
Jack 4;
Justin 3;
Cam 3;
AOC 1.

TOTAL: 95

FWIW, last year's team had 94 dunks after 14 games, so this year's team is one ahead of last season's record-setting pace. At this point last season, Marvin had 37 and Wendell had 24. Javin had 9, Grayson had 8 and Trevon had 7. So (a) Zion four behind Marvin; (b) Zion + RJ are nine behind Marvin + Wendell; (c) Zion, RJ, and Marques are one behind Marvin, Wendell, and Javin; (d) Zion, RJ, Marques, and Javin are six ahead of Marvin, Wendell, Javin, and Grayson; and (e) top five vs. top five has this year's team ahead of last year's team, 88 to 85.


P.S.: GoDuke had Zion with zero (0) dunks tonight, presumably because they were all alley-oops.

DevilHorse
01-09-2019, 08:38 AM
Game #13 - Clemson - CST10 #1 - Zion double team, steal from behind at half-court, dribbles in for a fluid and powerful, 360 degree, left hand rim rattler that left everyone in blue quite excited.
(12 SCT10 in 13games)


Larry
DevilHorse

Game #14 - Wake Forest - SCT10 #8 - Zion assist in the lane to DiLaurier
Game #14 - Wake Forest - SCT10 #6 - RJ Barrett ankle breaking jab step fake on Wake player, pull back 3pt jumper
(14 SCT10 in 14 games)

Larry
DevilHorse

fuse
01-09-2019, 08:44 AM
Zion’s dunk percentage last night went way down. Was his three point percentage (3/4) higher than his dunk percentage (3/5)? 🙄😳🤣

Truth&Justise
01-09-2019, 10:28 AM
Nine dunks against Wake Forest: Zion 3, Marques and Javin 2 each, RJ and Cam 1 each.

Ok, time to get philosophical. Zion had two clear alley-oop dunks: one at 10:49 in the first half, and one with 16:19 left in the second half. But when was his third dunk? The only candidate is this play, with 14:33 left in the second half--let's watch:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=if1WgIJ2HHs&t=2m58s

Edit: The video is supposed to start at the 2:58 mark, having trouble embedding it that way

Bolden pops to the top of the key, receives a pass, and immediately makes a great read to see Zion has his man sealed inside (it happened so quick I'm wondering if this is a designed play). He throws the lob, Zion catches it and...then what? The ball went through the basket. Zion's hands were above the rim, and maybe touched the rim on the way down? Unclear. There's a noise, was that Zion's hand on the rim? I wish we had more replays.

I've seen it counted as a layup in the ESPN box score (http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/playbyplay?gameId=401082678), but as a dunk by CBS (https://www.foxsports.com/college-basketball/boxscore?id=115895), by the NCAA (https://www.ncaa.com/game/basketball-men/d1/2019/01/08/duke-wake-forest/play-by-play), and by others (http://stats.wralsportsfan.com/cbk/pbp.asp?gamecode=201901080628&home=628&vis=173).

So, was that play a dunk?

Kedsy
01-09-2019, 10:33 AM
Ok, time to get philosophical. Zion had two clear alley-oop dunks: one at 10:49 in the first half, and one with 16:19 left in the second half. But when was his third dunk? The only candidate is this play, with 14:33 left in the second half--let's watch:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=if1WgIJ2HHs&t=2m58s

Edit: The video is supposed to start at the 2:58 mark, having trouble embedding it that way

Bolden pops to the top of the key, receives a pass, and immediately makes a great read to see Zion has his man sealed inside (it happened so quick I'm wondering if this is a designed play). He throws the lob, Zion catches it and...then what? The ball went through the basket. Zion's hands were above the rim, and maybe touched the rim on the way down? Unclear. There's a noise, was that Zion's hand on the rim? I wish we had more replays.

I've seen it counted as a layup in the ESPN box score (http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/playbyplay?gameId=401082678), but as a dunk by CBS (https://www.foxsports.com/college-basketball/boxscore?id=115895), by the NCAA (https://www.ncaa.com/game/basketball-men/d1/2019/01/08/duke-wake-forest/play-by-play), and by others (http://stats.wralsportsfan.com/cbk/pbp.asp?gamecode=201901080628&home=628&vis=173).

So, was that play a dunk?

Yes, I assume that was it. The NCAA play by play credited Zion with a dunk assisted by Marques.

jv001
01-09-2019, 10:39 AM
Yes, I assume that was it. The NCAA play by play credited Zion with a dunk assisted by Marques.

And we know the NCAA is never wrong. Oh, wait, there's that thing that happened down in Chapel Hell. :cool:GoDuke!

curtis325
01-09-2019, 11:34 AM
Ok, time to get philosophical. Zion had two clear alley-oop dunks: one at 10:49 in the first half, and one with 16:19 left in the second half. But when was his third dunk? The only candidate is this play, with 14:33 left in the second half--let's watch:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=if1WgIJ2HHs&t=2m58s

Edit: The video is supposed to start at the 2:58 mark, having trouble embedding it that way

Bolden pops to the top of the key, receives a pass, and immediately makes a great read to see Zion has his man sealed inside (it happened so quick I'm wondering if this is a designed play). He throws the lob, Zion catches it and...then what? The ball went through the basket. Zion's hands were above the rim, and maybe touched the rim on the way down? Unclear. There's a noise, was that Zion's hand on the rim? I wish we had more replays.

I've seen it counted as a layup in the ESPN box score (http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/playbyplay?gameId=401082678), but as a dunk by CBS (https://www.foxsports.com/college-basketball/boxscore?id=115895), by the NCAA (https://www.ncaa.com/game/basketball-men/d1/2019/01/08/duke-wake-forest/play-by-play), and by others (http://stats.wralsportsfan.com/cbk/pbp.asp?gamecode=201901080628&home=628&vis=173).

So, was that play a dunk?


It looked kinda dunky to me--I'll allow it.

rsvman
01-09-2019, 01:59 PM
It's a dunk.

-jk
01-09-2019, 02:35 PM
I’m inclined to call any shot that would otherwise be offensive interference a dunk. So a dunk.

-jk

HereBeforeCoachK
01-09-2019, 03:12 PM
I’m inclined to call any shot that would otherwise be offensive interference a dunk. So a dunk.

-jk

This is a great way of explaining the standard, or what should be the standard. Dunking is indeed "offensive interference" under the rules, it's just dunks are allowed specifically as an exclusion to the rule. Tipping a ball in that is still on the rim is still not a legal hoop of course.

BandAlum83
01-09-2019, 04:45 PM
Ok, time to get philosophical. Zion had two clear alley-oop dunks: one at 10:49 in the first half, and one with 16:19 left in the second half. But when was his third dunk? The only candidate is this play, with 14:33 left in the second half--let's watch:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=if1WgIJ2HHs&t=2m58s

Edit: The video is supposed to start at the 2:58 mark, having trouble embedding it that way

Bolden pops to the top of the key, receives a pass, and immediately makes a great read to see Zion has his man sealed inside (it happened so quick I'm wondering if this is a designed play). He throws the lob, Zion catches it and...then what? The ball went through the basket. Zion's hands were above the rim, and maybe touched the rim on the way down? Unclear. There's a noise, was that Zion's hand on the rim? I wish we had more replays.

I've seen it counted as a layup in the ESPN box score (http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/playbyplay?gameId=401082678), but as a dunk by CBS (https://www.foxsports.com/college-basketball/boxscore?id=115895), by the NCAA (https://www.ncaa.com/game/basketball-men/d1/2019/01/08/duke-wake-forest/play-by-play), and by others (http://stats.wralsportsfan.com/cbk/pbp.asp?gamecode=201901080628&home=628&vis=173).

So, was that play a dunk?


As I watched real time, I thought "that's a dunk, but there will be discussion about it." I still think it's a dunk.

devilsince1977
01-09-2019, 07:08 PM
It was a dunk, but not a SLAM - Those were bouncing off the rim on Zion last night.

Kedsy
01-12-2019, 05:23 PM
I feel a little embarrassed, posting to this thread after a game in which we got outdunked 10 to 1. Though perhaps Zion not playing in the 2nd half had an effect on both of those numbers. In any event, just one dunk against Florida State, by RJ.

So far, for the season, in 15 games:

Zion 33;
RJ 20;
Marques 17;
Javin 15;
Jack 4;
Justin 3;
Cam 3;
AOC 1.

TOTAL: 96

FWIW, last year's team had 99 dunks after 15 games, so this year's team is three behind last season's record-setting pace. At this point last season, Marvin had 40 and Wendell had 24. Javin had 10, Grayson had 9 and Trevon had 7. So (a) Zion is seven behind Marvin; (b) Zion + RJ are 11 behind Marvin + Wendell; (c) Zion, RJ, and Marques are four behind Marvin, Wendell, and Javin; (d) Zion, RJ, Marques, and Javin are two ahead of Marvin, Wendell, Javin, and Grayson; and (e) top five vs. top five has this year's team behind last year's team, 90 to 89.

DevilHorse
01-13-2019, 09:07 AM
Game #14 - Wake Forest - SCT10 #8 - Zion assist in the lane to DiLaurier
Game #14 - Wake Forest - SCT10 #6 - RJ Barrett ankle breaking jab step fake on Wake player, pull back 3pt jumper
(14 SCT10 in 14 games)

Larry
DevilHorse

Game #15 - Florida State - SCT10 #4 - Cam Reddish last (0.8) second buzzer beater [the top 3 were worthy, although I liked RJ's lone dunk in the game]

Larry
DevilHorse

Sir Stealth
01-13-2019, 05:32 PM
In any event, just one dunk against Florida State, by RJ.



That was some dunk though. Feel like it was under the radar even when it happened based on the way it unfolded in transition, the announcers not really paying attention as it was happening, and somehow no foul getting called despite tons of contact that RJ dunked right through anyway. Then it got somewhat lost amidst the excitement of Cam's game winner. Early leader for underrated dunk of the season.

Papa John
01-13-2019, 06:18 PM
That was some dunk though. Feel like it was under the radar even when it happened based on the way it unfolded in transition, the announcers not really paying attention as it was happening, and somehow no foul getting called despite tons of contact that RJ dunked right through anyway. Then it got somewhat lost amidst the excitement of Cam's game winner. Early leader for underrated dunk of the season.

It was a pretty amazing fast break, if I recall correctly, as it came right after FSU put down a dunk on us so it was a quick inbound to around half court and RJ just took off and beat the Noles down court. To be fair, though [again, if I recall correctly], I believe one of the FSU players had gone down near the 3-point line on the previous play (was it Forrest?), so they were a man down on the break... It wasn't one of those backboard-rattling dunks, but more of a ridiculously fast-launch, emphatic, "ain't no way you're defending this with a foul, because you ain't fast enough to get up in the air to foul me" type throw-down. I think my reaction was simply, "wow!".

The other play that made me chuckle at the ridiculous athletic display last night was Cam's reverse layup (I think it was in the first half), where it initially appeared that he went up too early to try a reverse, but his ability to hang and his long arms made it end up looking so simple and fluid. I recall wincing when he started the maneuver, thinking a sure block was coming, then uttering a "holy [expletive]—that was pretty freaking amazing, for a layup!" Great to see Cam have such a phenomenal outing, given how his offensive game has been struggling of late [despite that, his D has been pretty consistently amazing].

Kedsy
01-15-2019, 11:54 AM
With Tre in the game, we had two dunks in five minutes. Without Tre, we went dunkless in 40 minutes. Coincidence? I think not.

Anyway, two dunks against Syracuse, one each from Zion and RJ.

So far, for the season, in 16 games:

Zion 34;
RJ 21;
Marques 17;
Javin 15;
Jack 4;
Justin 3;
Cam 3;
AOC 1.

TOTAL: 98

FWIW, last year's team had 105 dunks after 16 games, so after getting only three dunks total the last two games, this year's team is now seven behind last season's record-setting pace. At this point last season, Marvin had 43 and Wendell had 27. Javin had 10, Grayson had 9 and Trevon had 7. So (a) Zion is nine behind Marvin; (b) Zion + RJ are 15 behind Marvin + Wendell; (c) Zion, RJ, and Marques are eight behind Marvin, Wendell, and Javin; (d) Zion, RJ, Marques, and Javin are two behind Marvin, Wendell, Javin, and Grayson; and (e) top five vs. top five has this year's team behind last year's team, 96 to 91.

DevilHorse
01-15-2019, 09:35 PM
Game #15 - Florida State - SCT10 #4 - Cam Reddish last (0.8) second buzzer beater [the top 3 were worthy, although I liked RJ's lone dunk in the game]

Larry
DevilHorse

Game # 16 - Syracuse - Zippo for Duke [although the Syracuse shot at the half was #1]
(15 SCTop10 in 16 Games)

Larry
DevilHorse

Kedsy
01-20-2019, 01:00 AM
Four dunks against Virginia, two each from Zion and Jack.

So far, for the season, in 17 games:

Zion 36;
RJ 21;
Marques 17;
Javin 15;
Jack 6;
Justin 3;
Cam 3;
AOC 1.

TOTAL: 102

FWIW, last year's team had 111 dunks after 17 games, so this year's team is now nine behind last season's record-setting pace. At this point last season, Marvin had 49 and Wendell had 27. Javin had 10, Grayson had 9 and Trevon had 7. So (a) Zion is 13 behind Marvin; (b) Zion + RJ are 19 behind Marvin + Wendell; (c) Zion, RJ, and Marques are 12 behind Marvin, Wendell, and Javin; (d) Zion, RJ, Marques, and Javin are six behind Marvin, Wendell, Javin, and Grayson; and (e) top five vs. top five has this year's team behind last year's team, 102 to 95.

DevilHorse
01-20-2019, 09:17 AM
Game # 16 - Syracuse - Zippo for Duke [although the Syracuse shot at the half was #1]
(15 SCTop10 in 16 Games)

Larry
DevilHorse

Yes Virginia, there is a Zion Clause in your contract (or nightmares)..

Game #17 - Virginia - Can you guess? Zion dribbles through 4 players, gets fouled on Right Hand jam - #1 on a Saturday night
(16 SCTop10 in 17 Games)

Bonus Highlight, they showed all of Zion's Slams, in sequence and count, in a montage, in the middle of the show, count was 36!
Good math all around.

Larry
DevilHorse

Kedsy
01-23-2019, 12:43 AM
Five dunks against Pitt, two each from Zion and Marques, plus one from RJ.

So far, for the season, in 18 games:

Zion 38;
RJ 22;
Marques 19;
Javin 15;
Jack 6;
Justin 3;
Cam 3;
AOC 1.

TOTAL: 107

FWIW, last year's team had 116 dunks after 18 games, so this year's team is still nine behind last season's record-setting pace. At this point last season, Marvin had 50 and Wendell had 30. Javin had 10, Grayson had 10 and Trevon had 7. So (a) Zion is 12 behind Marvin; (b) Zion + RJ are 20 behind Marvin + Wendell; (c) Zion, RJ, and Marques are 11 behind Marvin, Wendell, and Javin; (d) Zion, RJ, Marques, and Javin are six behind Marvin, Wendell, Javin, and Grayson; and (e) top five vs. top five has this year's team behind last year's team, 107 to 100.

DevilHorse
01-23-2019, 08:03 AM
Yes Virginia, there is a Zion Clause in your contract (or nightmares)..

Game #17 - Virginia - Can you guess? Zion dribbles through 4 players, gets fouled on Right Hand jam - #1 on a Saturday night
(16 SCTop10 in 17 Games)

Bonus Highlight, they showed all of Zion's Slams, in sequence and count, in a montage, in the middle of the show, count was 36!
Good math all around.

Larry
DevilHorse

Game #18 - Pittsburgh - Zip
(16 SCTop10 in 18 Games)

HereBeforeCoachK
01-23-2019, 08:06 AM
Game #18 - Pittsburgh - Zip
(16 SCTop10 in 18 Games)

16 top ten appearances in 18 games???? Has anyone ever done that?????

DevilHorse
01-23-2019, 01:32 PM
16 top ten appearances in 18 games???? Has anyone ever done that?????

Who would count :p

Larry
DevilHorse

Kedsy
01-26-2019, 03:54 PM
I'm out of town, so just the facts and I'll add the comps to last season tomorrow.

Six dunks against Georgia Tech, four from Zion and one each from Marques and RJ.

So far, for the season, in 19 games:

Zion 42;
RJ 23;
Marques 20;
Javin 15;
Jack 6;
Justin 3;
Cam 3;
AOC 1.

TOTAL: 113

DevilHorse
01-27-2019, 09:24 AM
Game #18 - Pittsburgh - Zip
(16 SCTop10 in 18 Games)

Game #19 - Georgia Tech - Zip (Saturday is a tough night. Lots of good highlights to beat)
(16 SCTop10 in 19 Games)

Larry
DevilHorse

Kedsy
01-29-2019, 12:52 AM
Four dunks against Notre Dame, two from Marques, one each for Javin and RJ. None by Zion.

So far, for the season, in 20 games:

Zion 42;
RJ 24;
Marques 22;
Javin 16;
Jack 6;
Justin 3;
Cam 3;
AOC 1.

TOTAL: 117

FWIW, after 20 games last year's team had 127 dunks. Marvin had 54 and Wendell had 33. Grayson and Javin each had 11 and Trevon had 7. So, we are 10 behind last season's record-setting pace. Zion is 12 behind Marvin's record-setting pace. Zion + RJ are 21 behind Marvin + Wendell. Zion + RJ + Marques are 10 behind Marvin + Wendell + Grayson. Zion + RJ + Marques + Javin are 5 behind Marvin + Wendell + Grayson + Javin. Top 5 vs. top 5, this year's team is 6 behind last year's team.

DevilHorse
01-29-2019, 06:57 AM
Game #19 - Georgia Tech - Zip (Saturday is a tough night. Lots of good highlights to beat)
(16 SCTop10 in 19 Games)

Larry
DevilHorse

Game #20 - Notre Dame - nada (expecting the spectacular, we'll have to settle for great)
(16 SCTop10 in 20 Games)

Larry
DevilHorse

Kedsy
02-02-2019, 03:28 PM
Seven dunks against St. John's, five from Zion, one each for Marques and RJ.

So far, for the season, in 21 games:

Zion 47;
RJ 25;
Marques 23;
Javin 16;
Jack 6;
Justin 3;
Cam 3;
AOC 1.

TOTAL: 124

FWIW, after 21 games last year's team had 134 dunks. Marvin had 58 and Wendell had 35. Grayson and Javin each had 11 and Trevon had 7. So, we are 10 behind last season's record-setting pace. Zion is 11 behind Marvin's record-setting pace. Zion + RJ are 21 behind Marvin + Wendell. Zion + RJ + Marques are nine behind Marvin + Wendell + Grayson. Zion + RJ + Marques + Javin are four behind Marvin + Wendell + Grayson + Javin. Top 5 vs. top 5, this year's team is five behind last year's team.

BandAlum83
02-02-2019, 03:31 PM
Seven dunks against St. John's, five from Zion, one each for Marques and RJ.

So far, for the season, in 21 games:

Zion 47;
RJ 25;
Marques 23;
Javin 16;
Jack 6;
Justin 3;
Cam 3;
AOC 1.

TOTAL: 124

FWIW, after 21 games last year's team had 134 dunks. Marvin had 58 and Wendell had 35. Grayson and Javin each had 11 and Trevon had 7. So, we are 10 behind last season's record-setting pace. Zion is 11 behind Marvin's record-setting pace. Zion + RJ are 21 behind Marvin + Wendell. Zion + RJ + Marques are nine behind Marvin + Wendell + Grayson. Zion + RJ + Marques + Javin are four behind Marvin + Wendell + Grayson + Javin. Top 5 vs. top 5, this year's team is five behind last year's team.

We may need to get to the ACCT and NCAAT championship games in order to catch last year's raw totals.

Are last year's per-game totals easily accessible to you? It would be interesting to get a pre-game notice on how many were in comparable games last year before the game. So, for example, Tuesday we will play game 22. How many dunks were there in last year's 22nd game?

Also, were there any games last year that were particularly short in dunks that we might be able to make up some ground on?

jv001
02-02-2019, 03:38 PM
We may need to get to the ACCT and NCAAT championship games in order to catch last year's raw totals.

Are last year's per-game totals easily accessible to you? It would be interesting to get a pre-game notice on how many were in comparable games last year before the game. So, for example, Tuesday we will play game 22. How many dunks were there in last year's 22nd game?

Also, were there any games last year that were particularly short in dunks that we might be able to make up some ground on?

Marvin was a great Duke player but he couldn't do what Zion does on his dunks and Zion can create his own shots(dunks) better than anyone I've seen in college basketball. GoDuke!

El_Diablo
02-02-2019, 07:41 PM
We may need to get to the ACCT and NCAAT championship games in order to catch last year's raw totals.

Are last year's per-game totals easily accessible to you? It would be interesting to get a pre-game notice on how many were in comparable games last year before the game. So, for example, Tuesday we will play game 22. How many dunks were there in last year's 22nd game?

Also, were there any games last year that were particularly short in dunks that we might be able to make up some ground on?

Come on, Kedsy does enough. We don’t need a pre-game rundown of how many dunks were made in the equivalent of each upcoming game.

Kedsy
02-02-2019, 09:36 PM
Are last year's per-game totals easily accessible to you? It would be interesting to get a pre-game notice on how many were in comparable games last year before the game. So, for example, Tuesday we will play game 22. How many dunks were there in last year's 22nd game?

They're easily accessible to everyone, in last year's dunk thread (https://forums.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/showthread.php?40760-Duke-Dunk-Report). Last season, we had five dunks in game 22. I'm not currently in the mood to look up the rest of the games to see where last year's team fell short, dunk-wise, but I do know that Marvin Bagley missed four games with an injury.

BandAlum83
02-02-2019, 09:39 PM
They're easily accessible to everyone, in last year's dunk thread (https://forums.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/showthread.php?40760-Duke-Dunk-Report). Last season, we had five dunks in game 22. I'm not currently in the mood to look up the rest of the games to see where last year's team fell short, dunk-wise, but I do know that Marvin Bagley missed four games with an injury.

Thanks for the link to look it up.

Marvin was out for four games, but this happened in game 28 when he was out:


Marvin who? Fourteen dunks vs. Louisville, crushing our previous season high of 9 (achieved five different times): Marques had 4, Wendell 3, Javin 2, Jack 2 (and the legend continues), plus Trevon, Grayson, and Gary had one each. That's seven (7) players with a dunk tonight.

Kedsy
02-02-2019, 10:00 PM
Thanks for the link to look it up.

Marvin was out for four games, but this happened in game 28 when he was out:

And then, in game 29 (his first game back), Marvin had 6 of our 13 dunks against Syracuse. I guess Zion and this year's team have their work cut out for them if they want to set records.

BandAlum83
02-02-2019, 10:00 PM
They're easily accessible to everyone, in last year's dunk thread (https://forums.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/showthread.php?40760-Duke-Dunk-Report). Last season, we had five dunks in game 22. I'm not currently in the mood to look up the rest of the games to see where last year's team fell short, dunk-wise, but I do know that Marvin Bagley missed four games with an injury.

Here we go. Last year's team had 232 total dunks with an average of 6.3 dunks/game in 37 games played. We are currently averaging 5.90 dunks per game.



Game
Dunks
Notes


22
5



23
4



24
7



25
5
*


26
3
*


27
3
*


28
14
*


29
13



30
4



31
8



32
5
**


33
4
**


34
8
***


35
5
***


36
5
***


37
5
***


Total
232
6.3 per game



* - Marvin Bagley out of line up
** - ACC Tournament
*** - NCAA Tournament

BandAlum83
02-02-2019, 10:05 PM
And then, in game 29 (his first game back), Marvin had 6 of our 13 dunks against Syracuse. I guess Zion and this year's team have their work cut out for them if they want to set records.

If we can play in 40 games, we would need to average "only" 5.8 dunks per game to equal last year's season record. If we play in only 37 games this year (perish the thought!), we would need to average 6.75 per game the rest of the way to equal last year's total.

So let's average 7.0 per game the rest of the way and get the record without the need for an asterisk!

DevilHorse
02-03-2019, 09:30 AM
Game #20 - Notre Dame - nada (expecting the spectacular, we'll have to settle for great)
(16 SCTop10 in 20 Games)

Larry
DevilHorse

Double Delight

Game #21 - St. Johns - SCT10 #9 - Zion swats away an apparent lay-up of #6 on St. John, who just got by Bolden.
Game #21 - St. Johns - SCT10 #6 - Zion steals ball from St. Johns player when he turns his back to face Tre. Then dribbles the length of floor and takes off for jam outside the lane.
(18 SCT10 in 21 Games)


Frankly, in Zion math, #9 + #6 should = #3, no? Although, those plays seem to multiply..

Larry
DevilHorse

HereBeforeCoachK
02-03-2019, 02:44 PM
Double Delight

Game #21 - St. Johns - SCT10 #9 - Zion swats away an apparent lay-up of #6 on St. John, who just got by Bolden.
Game #21 - St. Johns - SCT10 #6 - Zion steals ball from St. Johns player when he turns his back to face Tre. Then dribbles the length of floor and takes off for jam outside the lane.
(18 SCT10 in 21 Games)




That may be the scariest stat of all....

DevilHorse
02-06-2019, 08:06 AM
Double Delight

Game #21 - St. Johns - SCT10 #9 - Zion swats away an apparent lay-up of #6 on St. John, who just got by Bolden.
Game #21 - St. Johns - SCT10 #6 - Zion steals ball from St. Johns player when he turns his back to face Tre. Then dribbles the length of floor and takes off for jam outside the lane.
(18 SCT10 in 21 Games)


Frankly, in Zion math, #9 + #6 should = #3, no? Although, those plays seem to multiply..

Larry
DevilHorse

Liftoff, but didn't make orbit there Zion..

Game #22 - Boston College - zippo
(18 SCT10 in 22 Games)

Larry
DevilHorse

uh_no
02-06-2019, 10:05 AM
Liftoff, but didn't make orbit there Zion..

Game #22 - Boston College - zippo
(18 SCT10 in 22 Games)

Larry
DevilHorse

if he landed it, it was sure fire to top ten

Kedsy
02-06-2019, 12:14 PM
A little embarrassing, we had more missed dunks than made dunks last night; just one measly dunk against BC, and it was Marques. That's going to dent our chances of breaking last year's team's record.

So far, for the season, in 22 games:

Zion 47;
RJ 25;
Marques 24;
Javin 16;
Jack 6;
Justin 3;
Cam 3;
AOC 1.

TOTAL: 125

FWIW, after 22 games last year's team had 139 dunks. Marvin had 59 and Wendell had 37. Grayson had 12, Javin had 11, and Trevon had 7. So, we are 14 behind last season's record-setting pace. Zion is 12 behind Marvin's record-setting pace. Zion + RJ are 24 behind Marvin + Wendell. Zion + RJ + Marques are 12 behind Marvin + Wendell + Grayson. Zion + RJ + Marques + Javin are seven behind Marvin + Wendell + Grayson + Javin. Top 5 vs. top 5, this year's team is eight behind last year's team.

rsvman
02-06-2019, 12:17 PM
The record is, in my opinion, out of reach, and here's why.

Opposing teams have definitely figured out that their only chance of pulling off an upset is to play a zone and pack it in. They are also generally going to try to slow the pace of the game. Both of these strategies are going to decrease the number of slam dunk opportunities. Probably so much so that even if we take every available opportunity and never miss another one we would fall short of the record.

HereBeforeCoachK
02-06-2019, 05:20 PM
The record is, in my opinion, out of reach, and here's why.

Opposing teams have definitely figured out that their only chance of pulling off an upset is to play a zone and pack it in. They are also generally going to try to slow the pace of the game. Both of these strategies are going to decrease the number of slam dunk opportunities. Probably so much so that even if we take every available opportunity and never miss another one we would fall short of the record.

I agree with this observation......all of it.

Kedsy
02-10-2019, 12:12 AM
Three dunks against Virginia, two by Zion and one by RJ.

So far, for the season, in 23 games:

Zion 49;
RJ 26;
Marques 24;
Javin 16;
Jack 6;
Justin 3;
Cam 3;
AOC 1.

TOTAL: 128

FWIW, after 23 games last year's team had 143 dunks. Marvin had 61 and Wendell had 37. Grayson had 12, Javin had 11, and Trevon and Marques both had 7. So, we are 15 behind last season's record-setting pace. Zion is 12 behind Marvin's record-setting pace. Zion + RJ are 23 behind Marvin + Wendell. Zion + RJ + Marques are 11 behind Marvin + Wendell + Grayson. Zion + RJ + Marques + Javin are six behind Marvin + Wendell + Grayson + Javin. Top 5 vs. top 5, this year's team is seven behind last year's team.

DevilHorse
02-10-2019, 09:52 AM
Liftoff, but didn't make orbit there Zion..

Game #22 - Boston College - zippo
(18 SCT10 in 22 Games)

Larry
DevilHorse

Game #23 - Virginia - SCT10 #6 - Zion bounds from midway between side of foul line to swat De'andre Hunter's 3 point attempt out of the sky and into the mezzanine.
Here is a photo of what De'andre saw just microseconds before the block:
https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcS-_Sr5XbexkShqJnHA3IQ0_DGEHwKyy9S3YXSVrchmfd_KjaAM
(19 SCT10 in 23 Games)

Note 1: Zion landed inches short of the first row of seats. Any further and he would have been standing on people.
Note 2: Another SCT10 was a Virginia student sinking a half court shot. Last week an SCT10 it was a Notre Dame student/Leprechaun making a full court put to win something for the crowd. How does Duke inspire SCT10 shots from the students.

Larry
DevilHorse

Kedsy
02-13-2019, 01:20 AM
Just one dunk against Louisville, by Cam Reddish. A very impressive dunk at that, for a guy who only has four for the season.

So far, for the season, in 24 games:

Zion 49;
RJ 26;
Marques 24;
Javin 16;
Jack 6;
Cam 4;
Justin 3;
AOC 1.

TOTAL: 129

FWIW, after 24 games last year's team had 150 dunks. Marvin had 65 and Wendell had 38. Grayson had 12, Javin had 11, and Trevon and Marques both had 8. So, we are 21 behind last season's record-setting pace. Zion is 16 behind Marvin's record-setting pace. Zion + RJ are 28 behind Marvin + Wendell. Zion + RJ + Marques are 16 behind Marvin + Wendell + Grayson. Zion + RJ + Marques + Javin are 11 behind Marvin + Wendell + Grayson + Javin. Top 5 vs. top 5, this year's team is 13 behind last year's team.

This year's team has to really pick it up if they want to challenge last year's team's record.

DevilHorse
02-13-2019, 07:00 AM
Game #23 - Virginia - SCT10 #6 - Zion bounds from midway between side of foul line to swat De'andre Hunter's 3 point attempt out of the sky and into the mezzanine.
Here is a photo of what De'andre saw just microseconds before the block:
https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcS-_Sr5XbexkShqJnHA3IQ0_DGEHwKyy9S3YXSVrchmfd_KjaAM
(19 SCT10 in 23 Games)

Note 1: Zion landed inches short of the first row of seats. Any further and he would have been standing on people.
Note 2: Another SCT10 was a Virginia student sinking a half court shot. Last week an SCT10 it was a Notre Dame student/Leprechaun making a full court put to win something for the crowd. How does Duke inspire SCT10 shots from the students.

Larry
DevilHorse

As Duke makes the fashion statement 'White is the new Black"

Game #24 - Louisville - SCT10 #3 - Cam Reddish makes a great ESPN SCT10 debut with an 'area code' 3 off a between the legs assist from Barrett.
(20 SCT10 in 24 Games)
Could have been first, but for a Tatum jam (#2), and KY loss at the buzzer (#1), which made for a pretty good trio of highlights from a Duke Blue perspective..

Larry
DevilHorse

jv001
02-13-2019, 11:21 AM
I'm glad the team didn't have any more dunks. The way Louisville was playing, one of our players may have been injured. Not that they were dirty players but our team took some hard shots from the Cards. GoDuke!

HereBeforeCoachK
02-13-2019, 12:01 PM
Perhaps the most stunning play from Zion last night was when he went, oh I don't know, about 17 feet in the air and tipped the ball...which missed off the rim....which of course he then rebounded and scored on the second try. He was amazingly high on the tap attempt... I don't think David Thompson, Dr. J (who I saw in his youth in the ABA) or Grant Hill could've done that. Maybe I'm being a prisoner of the moment, but DAY YUM that young man is giving us some amazing moments.

DevilHorse
02-17-2019, 11:25 AM
As Duke makes the fashion statement 'White is the new Black"

Game #24 - Louisville - SCT10 #3 - Cam Reddish makes a great ESPN SCT10 debut with an 'area code' 3 off a between the legs assist from Barrett.
(20 SCT10 in 24 Games)
Could have been first, but for a Tatum jam (#2), and KY loss at the buzzer (#1), which made for a pretty good trio of highlights from a Duke Blue perspective..

Larry
DevilHorse

Game #25 - N C State - zippo
(20 SCT10 in 25 Games)
Saturdays are tough to break into, lots of other worthy highlights.
Lots of good, but not great, Duke plays.

Larry
DevilHorse

Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15
02-17-2019, 12:12 PM
Game #25 - N C State - zippo
(20 SCT10 in 25 Games)
Saturdays are tough to break into, lots of other worthy highlights.
Lots of good, but not great, Duke plays.

Larry
DevilHorse

Lots of nice dunks though. Will be interested in the count. First three scores of the second half were dunks.

HereBeforeCoachK
02-17-2019, 01:15 PM
Lots of nice dunks though. Will be interested in the count. First three scores of the second half were dunks.

I'd like to know the count too....Coach K mentioned Jack's dunk as part of an answer to his question in the post game. He also said Jack is playing well but is not but "a shell of who he was" (I think that was the phrase he used....something along those lines) early in the year. Didn't come across as criticism, more statement of fact, with encouragement that he'll get back to being Jack.

Kedsy
02-17-2019, 01:45 PM
That's what I'm talking about. Double-figure dunks for the first time since the Stetson game (10 dunks vs. NCSU): Marques 3; Zion 3; Jack 2; Cam 1; RJ 1

So far, for the season, in 25 games:

Zion 52;
RJ 27;
Marques 27;
Javin 16;
Jack 8;
Cam 5;
Justin 3;
AOC 1.

TOTAL: 139

After 25 games last year's team had 155 dunks. Marvin had 65 and Wendell had 42. Grayson had 12, Javin had 11, and Marques had 9. So, we are 16 behind last season's record-setting pace. Zion is 13 behind Marvin's record-setting pace. Zion + RJ are 28 behind Marvin + Wendell. Zion + RJ + Marques are 13 behind Marvin + Wendell + Grayson. Zion + RJ + Marques + Javin are 8 behind Marvin + Wendell + Grayson + Javin. Top 5 vs. top 5, this year's team is 9 behind last year's team.

JasonEvans
02-18-2019, 08:54 AM
So far, for the season, in 25 games:

Zion 52;

After 25 games last year's team had 155 dunks. Marvin had 65

We have now entered the window of 4 games that Marvin missed due to injury. It will be interesting to see how much ground Zion can gain on MB over the next few games to see if this race can become a bit more competitive.

gep
02-19-2019, 11:58 PM
We have now entered the window of 4 games that Marvin missed due to injury. It will be interesting to see how much ground Zion can gain on MB over the next few games to see if this race can become a bit more competitive.

Jason... I thoroughly enjoy the podcasts (props to Sam and Donald too!!!) and I remember before the season started that you thought this team... especially Zion... would destroy the dunk records that last year recorded (Marvin, Wendell, Grayson, etc). I've been interested since then to see how this year's team does too. GO DUKE!!! Especially tomorrow...

Kedsy
02-21-2019, 12:38 AM
Zion only played 33 seconds, and without him we only had four dunks against UNC: 3 by Javin and 1 by RJ.

So far, for the season, in 26 games:

Zion 52;
RJ 28;
Marques 27;
Javin 19;
Jack 8;
Cam 5;
Justin 3;
AOC 1.

TOTAL: 143

After 26 games last year's team had 158 dunks. Marvin had 65 and Wendell had 43. Javin had 13, Grayson had 12, and Marques had 9. So, we are 15 behind last season's record-setting pace. Zion is still 13 behind Marvin's record-setting pace. Zion + RJ are 28 behind Marvin + Wendell. Zion + RJ + Marques are 14 behind Marvin + Wendell + Javin. Zion + RJ + Marques + Javin are 7 behind Marvin + Wendell + Grayson + Javin. Top 5 vs. top 5, this year's team is 8 behind last year's team.

Kedsy
02-21-2019, 12:39 AM
We have now entered the window of 4 games that Marvin missed due to injury. It will be interesting to see how much ground Zion can gain on MB over the next few games to see if this race can become a bit more competitive.

Sadly, probably not very much.

HereBeforeCoachK
02-21-2019, 01:01 AM
Sadly, probably not very much.

Unless you count how badly he dunked Nike's stock price tomorrow....

DevilHorse
02-21-2019, 07:42 AM
Game #25 - N C State - zippo
(20 SCT10 in 25 Games)
Saturdays are tough to break into, lots of other worthy highlights.
Lots of good, but not great, Duke plays.

Larry
DevilHorse

Game #26 - UNC - Nothing
(20 SCT10 in 26 Games)

Time to get off the matt and make new highlights!

Larry
DevilHorse

Kedsy
02-24-2019, 12:56 AM
No Zion, four dunks against Syracuse: 1 each by Javin, Alex, RJ, and Marques.

So far, for the season, in 27 games:

Zion 52;
RJ 29;
Marques 28;
Javin 20;
Jack 8;
Cam 5;
Justin 3;
AOC 2.

TOTAL: 147

We already have four players with 20+ dunks, something that in entire seasons has only happened once before in Duke history (1998-99; can you name the four 20+ dunkers?).

After 27 games last year's team had 161 dunks. Marvin had 65 and Wendell had 43. Javin had 13, Grayson had 13, and Marques and Trevon each had 9. So, we are 14 behind last season's record-setting pace. Zion is still 13 behind Marvin's record-setting pace. Zion + RJ are 27 behind Marvin + Wendell. Zion + RJ + Marques are 12 behind Marvin + Wendell + Javin. Zion + RJ + Marques + Javin are 7 behind Marvin + Wendell + Grayson + Javin. Top 5 vs. top 5, this year's team is 6 behind last year's team.

DevilHorse
02-24-2019, 09:40 AM
Game #26 - UNC - Nothing
(20 SCT10 in 26 Games)

Time to get off the matt and make new highlights!

Larry
DevilHorse

Game #27 - Syracuse - Nothing
(20 SCT10 in 27 Games)

I suppose if the defender fell over on that RJ ball fake they might have had something. But it seems they need ever more spectacular stuff. A Lot of nice plays but not too many 'did you see that' plays.

Larry
DevilHorse

fuse
02-24-2019, 10:14 AM
No Zion, four dunks against Syracuse: 1 each by Javin, Alex, RJ, and Marques.

So far, for the season, in 27 games:

Zion 52;
RJ 29;
Marques 28;
Javin 20;
Jack 8;
Cam 5;
Justin 3;
AOC 2.

TOTAL: 147

We already have four players with 20+ dunks, something that in entire seasons has only happened once before in Duke history (1998-99; can you name the four 20+ dunkers?).

After 27 games last year's team had 161 dunks. Marvin had 65 and Wendell had 43. Javin had 13, Grayson had 13, and Marques and Trevon each had 9. So, we are 14 behind last season's record-setting pace. Zion is still 13 behind Marvin's record-setting pace. Zion + RJ are 27 behind Marvin + Wendell. Zion + RJ + Marques are 12 behind Marvin + Wendell + Javin. Zion + RJ + Marques + Javin are 7 behind Marvin + Wendell + Grayson + Javin. Top 5 vs. top 5, this year's team is 6 behind last year's team.

1998-99 20+ dunkers:
Brand
Maggette
Carrawell
James

That would be my guess. I don’t remember Avery as a dunker, maybe Battier dunked a lot that year, I don’t recall.

Papa John
02-24-2019, 11:20 AM
1998-99 20+ dunkers:
Brand
Maggette
Carrawell
James

That would be my guess. I don’t remember Avery as a dunker, maybe Battier dunked a lot that year, I don’t recall.

Fun question... I wouldn't rule out Burgess—he didn't score as much as the others, but it's a fair bet that dunks were his primary means of doing so.

Kedsy
02-24-2019, 12:17 PM
1998-99 20+ dunkers:
Brand
Maggette
Carrawell
James

That would be my guess. I don’t remember Avery as a dunker, maybe Battier dunked a lot that year, I don’t recall.

You got three out of four (Nate James was 5th on the team with 12 dunks).


Fun question... I wouldn't rule out Burgess—he didn't score as much as the others, but it's a fair bet that dunks were his primary means of doing so.

Winner, winner, chicken dinner. Chris Burgess was actually 2nd on the team in dunks, with 34.

fuse
02-24-2019, 12:20 PM
Fun question... I wouldn't rule out Burgess—he didn't score as much as the others, but it's a fair bet that dunks were his primary means of doing so.

I thought about that- he played in every game, so that is a dunk basically every other game, and at 5ppg, about half his scoring sounds reasonable.

English
02-25-2019, 12:43 PM
Game #26 - UNC - Nothing
(20 SCT10 in 26 Games)

Time to get off the matt and make new highlights!

Larry
DevilHorse

So I guess we're not counting entire talk shows dedicated to Zion, then? Zion generated more content in 33secs than may have been dedicated to the team in its previous 5 games. Maybe 10. Entire segments of regular news broadcasts were Zion-specific. Still that clips was probably more Not-Top-10.

Kedsy
02-27-2019, 12:35 AM
Only two dunks against Virginia Tech, both by Marques.

So far, for the season, in 28 games:

Zion 52;
Marques 30;
RJ 29;
Javin 20;
Jack 8;
Cam 5;
Justin 3;
AOC 2.

TOTAL: 149

In last season's 28th game, we had 14 dunks against Louisville, giving last year's team 175 dunks. Marvin had 65 and Wendell had 46. Javin had 15, Grayson had 14, Marques had 13, and Trevon had 10. So, we are now 26 behind last season's record-setting pace. Zion is still 13 behind Marvin's record-setting pace. Zion + Marques are 29 behind Marvin + Wendell. Zion + Marques + RJ are 15 behind Marvin + Wendell + Javin. Zion + Marques + RJ + Javin are 9 behind Marvin + Wendell + Grayson + Javin. Top 5 vs. top 5, this year's team is 14 behind last year's team.

DevilHorse
02-27-2019, 08:38 AM
Game #27 - Syracuse - Nothing
(20 SCT10 in 27 Games)

I suppose if the defender fell over on that RJ ball fake they might have had something. But it seems they need ever more spectacular stuff. A Lot of nice plays but not too many 'did you see that' plays.

Larry
DevilHorse

Game #28 - Va Tech - Nothing # Seems Quiet
(20 SCT10 in 28 Games)

Larry
DevilHorse

SupaDave
03-02-2019, 05:06 PM
Only two dunks against Virginia Tech, both by Marques.

So far, for the season, in 28 games:

Zion 52;
Marques 30;
RJ 29;
Javin 20;
Jack 8;
Cam 5;
Justin 3;
AOC 2.

TOTAL: 149

In last season's 28th game, we had 14 dunks against Louisville, giving last year's team 175 dunks. Marvin had 65 and Wendell had 46. Javin had 15, Grayson had 14, Marques had 13, and Trevon had 10. So, we are now 26 behind last season's record-setting pace. Zion is still 13 behind Marvin's record-setting pace. Zion + Marques are 29 behind Marvin + Wendell. Zion + Marques + RJ are 15 behind Marvin + Wendell + Javin. Zion + Marques + RJ + Javin are 9 behind Marvin + Wendell + Grayson + Javin. Top 5 vs. top 5, this year's team is 14 behind last year's team.

Was today's game Tre's first dunk attempt?

arnie
03-02-2019, 05:11 PM
Was today's game Tre's first dunk attempt?

Thought he missed one early in season.

uh_no
03-02-2019, 05:36 PM
Thought he missed one early in season.

at least once.

Kedsy
03-03-2019, 12:47 AM
Six dunks against Miami, led by Alex with 2, followed by RJ, Marques, Cam, and Javin, each with 1.

So far, for the season, in 29 games:

Zion 52;
Marques 31;
RJ 30;
Javin 21;
Jack 8;
Cam 6;
AOC 4;
Justin 3.

TOTAL: 155

RJ's monster jam gave us three players with 30+ dunks in a season, the first time that's ever happened in Duke history.

Zion is just outside the Duke single-season top 10 (#10 is Josh McRoberts with 54), and is #6 on the freshman single-season list (also just behind McBob). RJ just passed Corey Maggette (29) to move to #9 on the freshman list.

In last season's 29th game, Marvin Bagley returned from his injury and delivered 6 of our 13 dunks against Syracuse, giving last year's team 188 dunks. Marvin had 71 and Wendell had 49. Grayson had 16, Javin had 15, Marques had 14, and Trevon had 10. So, we are now 33 behind last season's record-setting pace. Zion is 19 behind Marvin's record-setting pace. Zion + Marques are 37 behind Marvin + Wendell. Zion + Marques + RJ are 23 behind Marvin + Wendell + Grayson. Zion + Marques + RJ + Javin are 17 behind Marvin + Wendell + Grayson + Javin. Top 5 vs. top 5, this year's team is 23 behind last year's team.

Neals384
03-03-2019, 05:48 AM
Thought he missed one early in season.

Uh, yeah. Vs. gonzaga.

DevilHorse
03-03-2019, 10:43 AM
Game #28 - Va Tech - Nothing # Seems Quiet
(20 SCT10 in 28 Games)

Larry
DevilHorse

Game #29 - Miami - Nothing
(20 SCT10 in 29 Games)

Larry
DevilHorse

Kedsy
03-03-2019, 01:17 PM
Game #29 - Miami - Nothing
(20 SCT10 in 29 Games)

Larry
DevilHorse

I thought RJ's dunk was worthy of SC attention, but I guess not.

Acymetric
03-03-2019, 01:37 PM
I thought RJ's dunk was worthy of SC attention, but I guess not.

I was surprised there was no mention of Jack White breaking out of his slump in the SC recap I saw earlier today.

HereBeforeCoachK
03-03-2019, 01:56 PM
I thought RJ's dunk was worthy of SC attention, but I guess not.

Dittos