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WVDUKEFAN
10-16-2018, 06:46 PM
Wow. I hope there is no truth to this.

https://www.aseaofblue.com/2018/10/16/17975240/kansas-jayhawks-zion-williamson-duke-basketball-ncaa-corruption-trial

CameronBornAndBred
10-16-2018, 06:52 PM
Here is the source.


In a taped conversation that was not allowed into evidence today, Adidas' Merl Code and Kansas asst Kurtis Townsend discuss the recruitment of Zion Williamson, who wound up at Duke. In arguing for admission, a transcript was read by Code defense atty Mark Moore. (thread)

Bold type is mine.

link https://twitter.com/DanWetzel/status/1052323887621578752

Troublemaker
10-16-2018, 07:13 PM
I mean, even assuming the sleazy sneaker exec Merl Code is telling the truth here on that tape as opposed to putting words in Zion's mouth in order to brag / signal to others that Code is an important guy to whom important recruits make important demands, there's no need to assume that (A) Zion made the same alleged demands to Duke via Nike and that (B) Duke acquiesced to Zion's demands, leading to his commitment.

hallcity
10-16-2018, 07:14 PM
Here is the source.



Bold type is mine.

link https://twitter.com/DanWetzel/status/1052323887621578752

You can’t unring a bell. It’s out there. The fact that it was irrelevant to this trial doesn’t keep it from hurting Williamson and Duke even if Williamson says, as I expect, that he has no idea what the guy was talking about.

Troublemaker
10-16-2018, 07:22 PM
You can’t unring a bell. It’s out there. The fact that it was irrelevant to this trial doesn’t keep it from hurting Williamson and Duke even if Williamson says, as I expect, that he has no idea what the guy was talking about.

Explicate this, please. How exactly will Zion and Duke be hurt?

DukeFanSince1990
10-16-2018, 07:26 PM
Pretty cool we got him for free. #blessed

hallcity
10-16-2018, 08:03 PM
Explicate this, please. How exactly will Zion and Duke be hurt?

Seems obvious to me. Williamson and K will be asked about it all season. It’s an annoyance at the least. Many sports writers will st least imply that Williamson and Duke are guilty. I can’t say how big a damage to reputation it will be but it will have some effect. K’s recent statement that he knows nothing of cheating in college BB isn’t playing so well already. We all know there’s been some degree of cheating. We just don’t know how widespread it has been. I hope Nike is clean but I’m far from certain of it.

BigZ
10-16-2018, 08:10 PM
K isn’t a moron. Forget the moral aspect of it, K isn’t going gubeba Guy $$ or benefits in the middle of all of these investigations

UrinalCake
10-16-2018, 08:17 PM
This sounds like a similar scenario to the one Oregon was associated with last week. An Adidas agent or exec claims that the school wants to pay money for a player. There’s no proof that the school actually said this, it could just be the agent trying to up the price for the player. And there’s certainly no evidence that money actually changed hands. I hate that Zion’s name has gotten dragged into this, but it’s not really a shock considered we have recruited numerous top players every year. I’ll assume he’s clean until I see proof otherwise (and hold the same attitude towards players from other schools).

Pghdukie
10-16-2018, 08:49 PM
I hope this isn't a case of the GM giving his MGR/HC the vote of confidence - then next week all hell breaks loose. I'm getting a little edgy about this entire process. Here's hoping there is nothing to be found.

ChillinDuke
10-16-2018, 08:59 PM
Putting Duke and Coach K's reputation aside for just a second, if the program gave something improper to Zion in the midst of this entire scandal, it would be (to me) a new level of idiocy the likes of which I would not be able to ever understand.

Now layering back in Duke and Coach K's reputation, it seems next to impossible that Duke did anything significantly improper.

- Chillin

BigZ
10-16-2018, 09:01 PM
Was Capel out the door when Duke got Zion?

Dr. Rosenrosen
10-16-2018, 09:13 PM
I hope we do all due diligence here quickly and ensure clearance with the NCAA so K doesn’t feel obligated to hold him out of games.

duke4ever19
10-16-2018, 09:48 PM
Was Capel out the door when Duke got Zion?

I'd like to emphasize that Capel was not let go at Oklahoma because he had personally broken NCAA rules. Capel's firing was the result of an assistant trying to help a recruit with moving costs to OU. Capel was left in the dark.

But if you want to know the real reason Capel was let go, look no further than the former OU head coach, Kelvin Sampson, who had been investigated for breaking some NCAA recruitment rules. As a result, OU basketball ended up in the NCAA crosshairs for the better part of three years.

Oklahoma fired Capel, because they had committed to a zero-tolerance type policy. Firing Capel was a way of showing the NCAA that they were committed to steer clear of any rules violations. In my opinion, Capel was punished for Kelvin Sampson's legacy.

Bluedog
10-16-2018, 10:01 PM
I'd like to emphasize that Capel was not let go at Oklahoma because he had personally broken NCAA rules. Capel's firing was the result of an assistant trying to help a recruit with moving costs to OU. Capel was left in the dark. [...] In my opinion, Capel was punished for Kelvin Sampson's legacy.

Capel was mostly let go because after one Elite 8 appearance (with Mr. Griffin) and a large contract extension, Capel had back-to-back losing seasons at OK with no major recruits signed. I think it was more about on-court performance...and in this day and age, ADs are quick to pull the trigger and try somebody new. If he had continued to deliver Elite 8-type level results, no way he would have been fired.

devildeac
10-16-2018, 10:30 PM
I'd like to emphasize that Capel was not let go at Oklahoma because he had personally broken NCAA rules. Capel's firing was the result of an assistant trying to help a recruit with moving costs to OU. Capel was left in the dark.

But if you want to know the real reason Capel was let go, look no further than the former OU head coach, Kelvin Sampson, who had been investigated for breaking some NCAA recruitment rules. As a result, OU basketball ended up in the NCAA crosshairs for the better part of three years.

Oklahoma fired Capel, because they had committed to a zero-tolerance type policy. Firing Capel was a way of showing the NCAA that they were committed to steer clear of any rules violations. In my opinion, Capel was punished for Kelvin Sampson's legacy.

Kel-vin called me: clap/clap/clap-clap-clap.

Or was it:

Call me Kelvin: clap/clap/clap-clap-clap.

:confused:;)

proelitedota
10-16-2018, 10:44 PM
Hope he didn't end up taking any benefits because it would suck for him to be ineligible for the year.

johnb
10-16-2018, 10:51 PM
Kentucky fans are gonna hop on the Bus of Criticism, but a couple of cheaters talking about cheating to get the most famous high school recruit of the year doesn’t mean the recruit participated. Much less that one of our coaches—all of whom played for K—would cheat.

This seems especially unlikely given our visibility, the coaches own bright futures, and our endless stream of recruiting successes. If you can get anyone to come with you to the prom, you don’t need to rent a date.

UrinalCake
10-17-2018, 06:55 AM
Kentucky was recruiting Zion very heavily too, so they should be careful before slinging mud. But the assumption being made here by many is simply that Kansas was willing to pay him, and he ended up at Duke, so why would he have come to Duke for free? It’s circumstantial but understandable that rival fan bases would be quick to jump to such conclusions.

DukeFanSince1990
10-17-2018, 07:16 AM
Honestly, this sounds like BS to me. This guy sounds like a sales guy talking himself up. I may be wrong but I have known guys like that and it's so similar.

Troublemaker
10-17-2018, 08:07 AM
Seems obvious to me. Williamson and K will be asked about it all season. It’s an annoyance at the least.

Doubtful. One press release containing a statement from Zion and the Duke AD should take care of it.


I can’t say how big a damage to reputation it will be but it will have some effect.

A very minimal one, imo. The opposing fans / media who were already inclined to think that Duke cheats will be X% more confident in it. Otherwise, I can't see it moving the needle. Duke will still be widely regarded as a clean program that does things right unless something more substantial drops.

AGDukesky
10-17-2018, 08:24 AM
Doubtful. One press release containing a statement from Zion and the Duke AD should take care of it.



A very minimal one, imo. The opposing fans / media who were already inclined to think that Duke cheats will be X% more confident in it. Otherwise, I can't see it moving the needle. Duke will still be widely regarded as a clean program that does things right unless something more substantial drops.

It’s over

UrinalCake
10-17-2018, 09:47 AM
Does anyone know why the tape recording was not allowed into evidence? Maybe a minor point but the recent changes to NCAA allow them to use evidence from FBI testimony to dole out punishments. But if the evidence is never entered, then maybe they won’t be able to use it. (Not that I believe this warrants NCAA action, but just a thought that came to mind.)

I suspect that K will talk to Zion and his family and issue a statement or a comment during an interview, similar to what he did with Wendell’s mom.

HereBeforeCoachK
10-17-2018, 09:48 AM
Seems to me that in any inquiry into any national recruiting violations, the names of the hot shot recruits would come up....whether or not they or their parents had any involvement at all. Zion's name came up.....of course....he was the most famous recruit last year, by a wide margin.

I'm gonna have to see something more before I even worry about this.

DavidBenAkiva
10-17-2018, 09:53 AM
A very minimal one, imo. The opposing fans / media who were already inclined to think that Duke cheats will be X% more confident in it. Otherwise, I can't see it moving the needle. Duke will still be widely regarded as a clean program that does things right unless something more substantial drops.

The impact of this will be both small, but it will last a long, loooooooooooooong time.

Any time Duke is mentioned, or even implied, through hearsay or second-hand testimony, it will "stick" to Duke in the minds of the haters and detractors. Let's not forget that Clemson, South Carolina, and Kentucky were all recruiting Zion at the time of this text message. But the focus is on Duke because Zion ended up there. Here, for example, is a tweet (https://twitter.com/YahooForde/status/1052175087397429248) from Pat Forde of Yahoo Sports from yesterday:

"Wendell Carter's parents met w Christian Dawkins. Lance Thomas' jewelry. Cory Magette was in the Myron Piggie posse. Bagleys owned a Nike AAU team. But K doesn't know a thing about how the CBB underground economy works."

It'll be yet another smear without credible evidence that people will bring up to try to prove that Duke and Coach K are dirty or somehow not what they seem.

DukeFanSince1990
10-17-2018, 10:15 AM
The impact of this will be both small, but it will last a long, loooooooooooooong time.

Any time Duke is mentioned, or even implied, through hearsay or second-hand testimony, it will "stick" to Duke in the minds of the haters and detractors. Let's not forget that Clemson, South Carolina, and Kentucky were all recruiting Zion at the time of this text message. But the focus is on Duke because Zion ended up there. Here, for example, is a tweet (https://twitter.com/YahooForde/status/1052175087397429248) from Pat Forde of Yahoo Sports from yesterday:

"Wendell Carter's parents met w Christian Dawkins. Lance Thomas' jewelry. Cory Magette was in the Myron Piggie posse. Bagleys owned a Nike AAU team. But K doesn't know a thing about how the CBB underground economy works."

It'll be yet another smear without credible evidence that people will bring up to try to prove that Duke and Coach K are dirty or somehow not what they seem.

They will hate and detract anyway. Just last week I was told "it was time for Coach K to fake a back injury again". So screw em.

Billy Dat
10-17-2018, 10:16 AM
The impact of this will be both small, but it will last a long, loooooooooooooong time.

Any time Duke is mentioned, or even implied, through hearsay or second-hand testimony, it will "stick" to Duke in the minds of the haters and detractors. Let's not forget that Clemson, South Carolina, and Kentucky were all recruiting Zion at the time of this text message. But the focus is on Duke because Zion ended up there. Here, for example, is a tweet (https://twitter.com/YahooForde/status/1052175087397429248) from Pat Forde of Yahoo Sports from yesterday:

"Wendell Carter's parents met w Christian Dawkins. Lance Thomas' jewelry. Cory Magette was in the Myron Piggie posse. Bagleys owned a Nike AAU team. But K doesn't know a thing about how the CBB underground economy works."

It'll be yet another smear without credible evidence that people will bring up to try to prove that Duke and Coach K are dirty or somehow not what they seem.

The perception is that the NCAA gives Duke a pass because to investigate Duke means to really expose everything dirty happening because Duke is supposed to be the shining beacon of virtue....so says Wetzel in today's installment of the "Duke gets a pass" trope.
https://sports.yahoo.com/ncaa-even-dare-investigate-zion-williamson-now-hes-duke-043518120.html

4Gen
10-17-2018, 10:26 AM
Common sense guarantees Coach K and by extension his assistants would never have paid Zion a dime. At this point in his illustrious career, would K even consider destroying his reputation as the GOAT?

PackMan97
10-17-2018, 10:33 AM
Adidas tried to buy the player, their family and/or the school.
Nike owns the NCAA.

As they say in banking, if you owe the bank $100 that's your problem. If you owe the bank $100 million, that's their problem.

JasonEvans
10-17-2018, 10:38 AM
Let's not forget that the Addidas scandal blew up more than a year ago. Pitino was fired a year ago yesterday (October 16th). Zion Williamson committed to Duke 3 months later, in January.

I bring this up because EVERYONE associated with recruiting knew about the Addidas scandal right away. If you were a recruit looking for a handout from a shoe company rep, you went into immediate panic mode. You saw Brian Bowen barred from playing by the NCAA and searching for a new school after Louisville dropped him. You saw folks getting arrested for fraud and heard about the FBI wiretapping phones.

There is no way someone with a guaranteed future like Zion Williamson would risk it to take a measley $100-grand or so. NO WAY!

Now, if you want to make some kind of allegation against Wendell Carter or Marvin Bagley or Trevon Duval, guys who committed before all this stuff blew up, fine (but you better bring some evidence -- something more than a lunch receipt with Mrs. Carter). But, allegations against the current Duke recruits doesn't really hold water to me given all of them (except Tre, who was already connected to the Duke program and had no reason to take money given his bro is a millionaire) committed after the investigation into the pay-for-recruits scandal was well known.

-Jason "I'd hate to see silly stuff like actual, factual timelines get in the way of Dan Wetzel's purely speculative narrative" Evans

Troublemaker
10-17-2018, 10:51 AM
The impact of this will be both small, but it will last a long, loooooooooooooong time.

Any time Duke is mentioned, or even implied, through hearsay or second-hand testimony, it will "stick" to Duke in the minds of the haters and detractors. Let's not forget that Clemson, South Carolina, and Kentucky were all recruiting Zion at the time of this text message. But the focus is on Duke because Zion ended up there. Here, for example, is a tweet (https://twitter.com/YahooForde/status/1052175087397429248) from Pat Forde of Yahoo Sports from yesterday:

"Wendell Carter's parents met w Christian Dawkins. Lance Thomas' jewelry. Cory Magette was in the Myron Piggie posse. Bagleys owned a Nike AAU team. But K doesn't know a thing about how the CBB underground economy works."

It'll be yet another smear without credible evidence that people will bring up to try to prove that Duke and Coach K are dirty or somehow not what they seem.

Sure, but life is too short to worry about what Pat Forde or Dan Wetzel or UNC/UK fans think.

I have absolutely no interest in convincing them that Duke is clean. They can think whatever they want.

Stray Gator
10-17-2018, 10:59 AM
The usual gaggle of Duke-haters and click-baiters are predictably pouncing on this dung-drop like a bunch of rabid dogs running back and forth at the end of their chains with their eyes bulging out, rushing to insinuate that Duke and Coach K must be dirty. Unless and until someone presents reliable evidence showing that the Duke program has provided Zion Williamson improper benefits, however, I'm not going to waste my time and attention on these disparaging suppositions being spewed by "commentators" based on the suspicions of a few squirming low-lifes trying to divert focus away from their own failings or misdeeds by resorting to the pathetic "everyone does it" excuse.

SavDukeGrad
10-17-2018, 11:40 AM
Honestly, this sounds like BS to me. This guy sounds like a sales guy talking himself up. I may be wrong but I have known guys like that and it's so similar.

I totally agree with this! And also with Jason's reasoning.

Remember Zion is from Spartanburg, SC, and his stepfather, Lee Anderson, played basketball at Clemson from 1975-1978. Merl Code is also a local product - he grew up in Greenville, SC and played at Clemson from 1993-1997. And his father, Merl Code, Sr., is well known around those parts as a former professional football player (CFL & WFL), lawyer, and municipal court judge. Couple that with the fact that Merl Jr. left Nike in 2014 and had recently joined Adidas (and I think I even remember reading last year when this news first broke that he was not an Adidas employee but was only a consultant).

Look, I know the optics aren't good for Duke, and we never want one of our players mentioned in this situation. But I feel 95% certain that Merl Code was exaggerating his connections/influence with Zion and his family because of their local connection. And I don't think it is a stretch at all to assume that he was trying to use that connection to expand his role at Adidas.

SavDukeGrad
10-17-2018, 12:11 PM
I should have also added:

I think people who are calling Merl Code a "sneaker company executive" are WAY overstating his role at Adidas.

English
10-17-2018, 01:11 PM
I should have also added:

I think people who are calling Merl Code a "sneaker company executive" are WAY overstating his role at Adidas.

To this point, really no one involved on the defense side (save Slick Rick) is much of a big fish in the CBB landscape. Even Jim Gatto, who is constantly being painted as some big shot sneaker exec, actually makes about $140k/yr. That's a fine living, sure, but not considering this is a multi-billion dollar machine.

elvis14
10-17-2018, 01:22 PM
The worst thing about this is that even with no evidence that Duke did anything wrong, this will be thrown in our faces for decades. I had a UNCheat fan throw Corey Magette at me as proof that Duke/K are dirty just yesterday on twitter.

proelitedota
10-17-2018, 01:24 PM
The worst thing about this is that even with no evidence that Duke did anything wrong, this will be thrown in our faces for decades. I had a UNCheat fan throw Corey Magette at me as proof that Duke/K are dirty just yesterday on twitter.

If it doesn't matter on the court it doesn't matter.

AGDukesky
10-17-2018, 01:41 PM
The worst thing about this is that even with no evidence that Duke did anything wrong, this will be thrown in our faces for decades. I had a UNCheat fan throw Corey Magette at me as proof that Duke/K are dirty just yesterday on twitter.

I love when people do that - it just gives me a public forum to dispel that myth and show that person’s ignorance...

devildeac
10-17-2018, 02:00 PM
The worst thing about this is that even with no evidence that Duke did anything wrong, this will be thrown in our faces for decades. I had a UNCheat fan throw Corey Magette at me as proof that Duke/K are dirty just yesterday on twitter.

Remember: 23 years of academic fraud>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>$2Kish of AAU money 20 years ago before he matriculated to Duke.

MCFinARL
10-17-2018, 03:08 PM
Does anyone know why the tape recording was not allowed into evidence? Maybe a minor point but the recent changes to NCAA allow them to use evidence from FBI testimony to dole out punishments. But if the evidence is never entered, then maybe they won’t be able to use it. (Not that I believe this warrants NCAA action, but just a thought that came to mind.)

I suspect that K will talk to Zion and his family and issue a statement or a comment during an interview, similar to what he did with Wendell’s mom.

This is a good question. My impression is that the tape was submitted as evidence that coaches were aware of, and encouraged, the offering of money to recruits. The argument seems to be that this is essentially an "everybody does it" defense and thus irrelevant. But if the point is that the coaches know, and the programs now, about these payments, and thus the schools are not being defrauded (by getting athletes they think are eligible under NCAA rules), then maybe it should be admissible for that purpose.

DukeFanSince1990
10-17-2018, 04:23 PM
https://www.newsobserver.com/sports/article220170485.html

Kevin White seems confident.

devildeac
10-17-2018, 04:59 PM
https://www.newsobserver.com/sports/article220170485.html

Kevin White seems confident.

Steve Wiseman on top of things again.

proelitedota
10-17-2018, 05:12 PM
Good for our administration to stand up for Zion.

BD80
10-17-2018, 06:08 PM
Does anyone know why the tape recording was not allowed into evidence? Maybe a minor point but the recent changes to NCAA allow them to use evidence from FBI testimony to dole out punishments. But if the evidence is never entered, then maybe they won’t be able to use it. (Not that I believe this warrants NCAA action, but just a thought that came to mind.)

I suspect that K will talk to Zion and his family and issue a statement or a comment during an interview, similar to what he did with Wendell’s mom.


My guess is that the tape could not be authenticated.

"Kansas assistant Kurtis Townsend was [allegedly] caught on a wiretap expressing a willingness to provide money and other benefits in exchange for No. 4 overall 2018 recruit Zion Williamson (who is now a freshman at Duke), … "

"the defense [attorney for former Adidas executive Jim Gatto] attempted to enter into the record a transcript of a recorded conversation in which then-Adidas consultant Merl Code told Townsend that Williamson’s father was “asking for opportunities from an occupational prospective. He's asking for money in the pocket. And he's asking for housing for him and the family." According to Moore’s reading, Townsend responded, "I've got to just try to work and figure out a way. Because if that's what it takes to get him for 10 months, we're going to have to do it some way."

No party to the conversation is likely to admit that they were a part of the conversation.

Then there is this sneaky little concept called hearsay. The alleged "fact" of Zion's dad asking for things is certainly hearsay. I'm not sure why the defendant would be offering the "fact" that a KU assistant was willing to pony up money - unc's everybody does it defense?

Dr. Rosenrosen
10-17-2018, 07:29 PM
Besides, wouldn’t be surprised if that jagoff didn’t make that stuff up in order to get Kansas to commmit to paying up so that he could approach the Williamson family with an offer in an effort to sway them.

Seemingly lost in all the reporting is the deep doo doo that Kansas is in. Self has to be squirming. And perhaps Ol’ Roy left a legacy there after all...

UrinalCake
10-17-2018, 08:17 PM
I'm not sure why the defendant would be offering the "fact" that a KU assistant was willing to pony up money - unc's everybody does it defense?

The prosecution is claiming that the Adidas people defrauded the universities by ruining the eligibility of their players. So the defense is motivated to prove that the schools knew exactly what was going on, they were not victims.

I also find it really odd that none of the three defendants are planning to take the stand (based on reports). They got busted by the feds, they were likely offered some sort of plea deal in exchange for giving up information, and they instead chose to take their chances going to trial. Yet they’re not going to testify or call any witnesses? That seems really bizarre to me and I would love to hear input from some legal minds.

golfinesquire
10-17-2018, 08:21 PM
Most likely the tape was not admitted because it was irrelevant.
A discussion about a player who did not go to an adidas school and whom they did not pay has little to do with the trial issues. Also thesectapes came from the wires so authentication woukd not have been an issue.

BD80
10-17-2018, 09:41 PM
Most likely the tape was not admitted because it was irrelevant.
A discussion about a player who did not go to an adidas school and whom they did not pay has little to do with the trial issues. Also thesectapes came from the wires so authentication woukd not have been an issue.

Authentication as to whose voices were on the tape. I can call someone from Bill Self's phone and say I'm Bill Self. That doesn't make me Bill Self.

devildeac
10-17-2018, 10:08 PM
Authentication as to whose voices were on the tape. I can call someone from Bill Self's phone and say I'm Bill Self. That doesn't make me Bill Self.

But, if you had Kelvin Sampson's phone, you could call anybody.

OldPhiKap
10-17-2018, 10:13 PM
But, if you had Kelvin Sampson's phone, you could call anybody.

But who would answer a call?

Duke79UNLV77
10-17-2018, 10:18 PM
I also find it really odd that none of the three defendants are planning to take the stand (based on reports). They got busted by the feds, they were likely offered some sort of plea deal in exchange for giving up information, and they instead chose to take their chances going to trial. Yet they’re not going to testify or call any witnesses? That seems really bizarre to me and I would love to hear input from some legal minds.

Call it the Manafort defense. And, actually a defense that a lot of people charged with crimes use. Not that it often works.

Nugget
10-17-2018, 10:24 PM
I'm not sure why the defendant would be offering the "fact" that a KU assistant was willing to pony up money - unc's everybody does it defense?

Yes, that's exactly why the defendant would be offering this conversation -- it would go to show that a KU representative was a willing participant in the process of Gatto/Adidas paying players and thus, was not defrauded.

Remember, that the theory of this case -- as stated in Paragraph 1 of the Superseding Indictment -- is that defendants carried out a “scheme to defraud [the schools] by causing them to issue athletic-based financial aid under false and fraudulent pretenses and by intentionally concealing from them significant and material information necessary to the universities’ ability to exercise their right to control their financial assets.”

In other words, the Govt’s actual claim is that the defendants, by paying the players, caused the players to falsely attest in the scholarship papers that they were amateurs/eligible to play, and that the schools then innocently granted scholarships to players they didn’t know were ineligible (and to whom they would not have issued scholarships had they known the players were ineligible).

Thus, as charged in these cases, the schools are the victims of the fraud. Accordingly, if they knew of the payments, the elements of the crime charged are not met. In short: no victim = no crime. As such, it would be very helpful to the defendants to be able to show the schools knew what they were doing.

golfinesquire
10-17-2018, 10:32 PM
Authentication as to whose voices were on the tape. I can call someone from Bill Self's phone and say I'm Bill Self. That doesn't make me Bill Self.

With wiretaps, there are monitors that listen to calls in real time and become familiar with voices. Authentication is often not a problem.

brevity
10-18-2018, 01:57 AM
I can call someone from Bill Self's phone and say I'm Bill Self. That doesn't make me Bill Self.

Yeah, it’s like saying that Roy Williams has been secretly behind this DBR account this whole time because dadgum aw shucks frickin’ Coca-Cola.

MarkD83
10-18-2018, 05:03 AM
Yeah, it’s like saying that Roy Williams has been secretly behind this DBR account this whole time because dadgum aw shucks frickin’ Coca-Cola.

Sorry you are not dumbfounded so you are not Roy.

David Bunkley
10-18-2018, 07:08 AM
Besides, wouldn’t be surprised if that jagoff didn’t make that stuff up in order to get Kansas to commmit to paying up so that he could approach the Williamson family with an offer in an effort to sway them.


That was exactly my reaction upon first reading about this.

plimnko
10-18-2018, 07:08 AM
What a difference 8 miles down the road makes!

golfinesquire
10-18-2018, 07:49 AM
Call it the Manafort defense. And, actually a defense that a lot of people charged with crimes use. Not that it often works.

Taking the stand can be really risky. A defendant opens himself up to cross-examination and if he has lied anywhere, the jury will hear about it. If a defendant is unlikeable, that too hurts his case. Also, in this case, the real defense is that the government’s theory of the case is nonsense, both as a legal and factual matter, so with that, there is no reason for the defendants to take the stand. They can make their arguments based strictly on the government’s proof. A lot of defendants do not testify.

rsvman
10-18-2018, 09:51 AM
Yeah, it’s like saying that Roy Williams has been secretly behind this DBR account this whole time because dadgum aw shucks frickin’ Coca-Cola.

We need a rolling on the floor laughing smiley with tears pouring out of its eyes.


Oh, and apparently I must spread some comments around....yada..yada..yada...

devildeac
10-18-2018, 10:00 AM
We need a rolling on the floor laughing smiley with tears pouring out of its eyes.


Oh, and apparently I must spread some comments around...yada..yada..yada...

Does this help?

8722

(No tears but no fears either.)

Now, I'll see if I'm able to cover your spork account for brevity. I think I'm due.

(Done)

Acymetric
10-18-2018, 01:59 PM
Does this help?

8722

(No tears but no fears either.)

Now, I'll see if I'm able to cover your spork account for brevity. I think I'm due.

(Done)

...Is that blood?

devildeac
10-18-2018, 03:03 PM
...Is that blood?

Not sure. Break It Down Again for me, please.

evrim
10-18-2018, 07:13 PM
If you want to see how people are just using this to attack Duke, check out the comments.

https://twitter.com/DukeMBB/status/1052595624070270979

proelitedota
10-18-2018, 07:16 PM
If you want to see how people are just using this to attack Duke, check out the comments.

https://twitter.com/DukeMBB/status/1052595624070270979

I am going to lose an hour of sleep per attack. :rolleyes:

tbyers11
10-18-2018, 07:59 PM
If you want to see how people are just using this to attack Duke, check out the comments.

https://twitter.com/DukeMBB/status/1052595624070270979

Meh.

The same people writing that have been saying that our recruiting success the last few years are only due to Capel giving them all bags of cash.

Haters gonna hate

rsvman
10-19-2018, 10:37 AM
Does this help?

8722

(No tears but no fears either.)

Now, I'll see if I'm able to cover your spork account for brevity. I think I'm due.

(Done)

It does, and thank you.

elvis14
10-19-2018, 11:01 AM
If you want to see how people are just using this to attack Duke, check out the comments.

https://twitter.com/DukeMBB/status/1052595624070270979

I saw that tweet this morning and the comments. Every single post on Twitter and Facebook is being filled with the same comments. Yes, obviously we can ignore them....for the next 20-30 years but it would be better if we didn't have to.

And if you think I'm kidding about 20-30 years, here's a response I received on twitter this week:

Yeah coach k is innocent never knew about maggete William Avery couldn’t read bagley lived in one of the most expensive neighborhoods but I’m sure he didn’t know anything surprising he shows up to practice on time


Corey played at Duke 20 years ago. So from now until the year 2038 and beyond you can expect dumbazz comments online about paying Zion. Annoying. Note in the 2038, I will still be posting "UNCheat"...

thedukelamere
10-19-2018, 11:15 AM
Note in the 2038, I will still be posting "UNCheat"...

True, but since that violation lasted 23 years, there is a longer (eternal) shelf life on that one.

Troublemaker
10-19-2018, 11:36 AM
I saw that tweet this morning and the comments. Every single post on Twitter and Facebook is being filled with the same comments. Yes, obviously we can ignore them...for the next 20-30 years but it would be better if we didn't have to.

And if you think I'm kidding about 20-30 years, here's a response I received on twitter this week:

Yeah coach k is innocent never knew about maggete William Avery couldn’t read bagley lived in one of the most expensive neighborhoods but I’m sure he didn’t know anything surprising he shows up to practice on time


Corey played at Duke 20 years ago. So from now until the year 2038 and beyond you can expect dumbazz comments online about paying Zion. Annoying. Note in the 2038, I will still be posting "UNCheat"...

What is the alternative to just ignoring them? Genocide? (I'd be down!) We're not going to convince them. They're not going to argue or listen in good faith.

plimnko
10-19-2018, 11:50 AM
I'll trust what Coach K says.

HereBeforeCoachK
10-19-2018, 12:09 PM
What is the alternative to just ignoring them? Genocide? (I'd be down!) We're not going to convince them. They're not going to argue or listen in good faith.

True, because Duke haters don't want the truth - they want the hate target. None of them can even put two syllables together coherently explaining WHY they hate Duke. They see K scowl on TV and somehow think he's "a rat" or something, even as he is one of the most popular coaches among other coaches and other teams' players, and among media who know him. It's insanity.

sagegrouse
10-19-2018, 12:34 PM
What is the alternative to just ignoring them? Genocide? (I'd be down!) We're not going to convince them. They're not going to argue or listen in good faith.

Whatever happened to the adage of totally ignoring comments on articles posted on the internet? Pimply-faced teenagers, obnoxious morons, and pathological Duke-haters IMHO (where the H is missing and may be subject of an NCAA investigation).

devildeac
10-19-2018, 01:03 PM
I saw that tweet this morning and the comments. Every single post on Twitter and Facebook is being filled with the same comments. Yes, obviously we can ignore them...for the next 20-30 years but it would be better if we didn't have to.

And if you think I'm kidding about 20-30 years, here's a response I received on twitter this week:

Yeah coach k is innocent never knew about maggete William Avery couldn’t read bagley lived in one of the most expensive neighborhoods but I’m sure he didn’t know anything surprising he shows up to practice on time


Corey played at Duke 20 years ago. So from now until the year 2038 and beyond you can expect dumbazz comments online about paying Zion. Annoying. Note in the 2038, I will still be posting "UNCheat"...

If I'm still breathing and can read/see and type, so will I.

devildeac
10-19-2018, 01:05 PM
Whatever happened to the adage of totally ignoring comments on articles posted on the internet? Pimply-faced teenagers, obnoxious morons, and pathological Duke-haters IMHO (where the H is missing and may be subject of an NCAA investigation).

Must be a typo.

:rolleyes::mad:

elvis14
10-19-2018, 01:31 PM
What is the alternative to just ignoring them? Genocide? (I'd be down!) We're not going to convince them. They're not going to argue or listen in good faith.


Whatever happened to the adage of totally ignoring comments on articles posted on the internet? Pimply-faced teenagers, obnoxious morons, and pathological Duke-haters IMHO (where the H is missing and may be subject of an NCAA investigation).

What I'm saying is that I wish we didn't have to ignore them. Meaning, I hate that Zion was mentioned because from now on Duke is the school who paid Zion. Troublemaker, now that Zion has been mentioned, you are right we just have ignore them. It's annoying, I miss polite discourse and good natured ribbing.

sage, I know what you are saying and I agree....it would be better if there wasn't fodder for them to post about, however, even if it is BS.

(before anyone kills me, I don't believe that Duke paid Zion but the truth doesn't matter, to everyone that's not a Duke fan we paid him)

wavedukefan70s
11-08-2018, 01:14 PM
http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/25210341/ncaa-gets-approval-investigate-schools-college-basketball-corruption-case
Espn has brought zion's name up again today.
NCAA to start investigating up to 3 dozen div1 programs.

Truth&Justise
11-08-2018, 01:22 PM
http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/25210341/ncaa-gets-approval-investigate-schools-college-basketball-corruption-case
Espn has brought zion's name up again today.
NCAA to start investigating up to 3 dozen div1 programs.

Didn't see any mention of Duke or Zion in this article. It was mostly details about the following:


In the email Dawkins sent to his business partner Munish Sood, he detailed payment plans for players at Alabama, Arizona, Cincinnati, Kentucky, Louisville, LSU, Miami, Mississippi State, Oregon, USC and Xavier, some of which were to begin in September 2017.

And of course, this is one agent's notes, without any confirmation yet that players or schools knew of it.

UrinalCake
11-08-2018, 01:28 PM
I don’t see Zion’s name anywhere in that article. Am I missing something?

The article combines several different scenarios. In some, Dawkins claims to have made arrangements with players and their families to pay them. In others, he has a “plan in place” to pay prospective players. It is not clear whether any payments actually took place or whether this was simply a business plan on paper that he created.

Kinda funny to see Jarred Vanderbilt’s name among those listed. UK fans spent an awful lot of time claiming Zion should be ineligible.

wavedukefan70s
11-08-2018, 04:17 PM
I don’t see Zion’s name anywhere in that article. Am I missing something?

The article combines several different scenarios. In some, Dawkins claims to have made arrangements with players and their families to pay them. In others, he has a “plan in place” to pay prospective players. It is not clear whether any payments actually took place or whether this was simply a business plan on paper that he created.

Kinda funny to see Jarred Vanderbilt’s name among those listed. UK fans spent an awful lot of time claiming Zion should be ineligible.

No I scanned the article while watching espn at noon.I cant remember the anchors name but she had short hair .she definitely said his name showed him in uniform then it went to Jay Bilas whom did not say his name. I guess it was mission accomplished. The article with her talking about Zion definitely got me clicking .they were insinuating that since the NCAA is given the green light that he would be looked at now.

plimnko
11-08-2018, 05:57 PM
https://www.aseaofblue.com/2017/9/28/16382394/zion-williamson-recruiting-family-report-adidas-scandal


is there any REAL evidence or just accusations? between the linked article and what k said earlier concerning the vetting of recruits........i think it's the media throwing out zion's name for the attention factor.

sagegrouse
11-08-2018, 06:10 PM
https://www.aseaofblue.com/2017/9/28/16382394/zion-williamson-recruiting-family-report-adidas-scandal


is there any REAL evidence or just accusations? between the linked article and what k said earlier concerning the vetting of recruits....i think it's the media throwing out zion's name for the attention factor.

FWIW, this is a September 2017 link.

wavedukefan70s
11-08-2018, 06:50 PM
From what the lady said it all dated back to the same stuff .just now the NCAA can look at it.yeah it looks as if they got me .if I was a fish I'd be covered in lemon and half eaten by now.