Bonzie Colson out 2 Months with Broken Foot

[richardjackson199]

Hallcity posted this in ACC weekly thread. It seems like pretty huge news, so I started unique thread.

Best wishes to Colson for a full and speedy recovery. It stinks this happened to him his senior year. I hope he makes an NBA team. He has always been a very tough guy for Duke to play against. But I really respect his game and fire. I think K does too.



Here's the link:

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/21944749/notre-dame-forward-bonzie-colson-expected-miss-eight-weeks-due-left-foot-fracture

[Channing]

Looks like we are likely to miss Bonzie during the regular season, though we may get him in the ACC tourney. When I said I never wanted to see that guy again, this is not what I had in mind. Foot injuries are a real bummer. Hope he gets well soon.

[freshmanjs]

This is such a bummer. He is a really good player and it's been fun to see his progression over 4 years. Has played great against Duke too.

[CDu]

Man that sucks. I am not a fan of Colson’s on-court personality, but he is an amazing player. We are surely catching a break in avoiding him, although I guess so are a bunch of ACC schools (including UNC twice). Hope he has a quick and full recovery and can enjoy what is left of his senior year.

[plimnko]

that REALLY sucks!!! if anyone can understand how a ND fan feels, it's a Duke fan.

[proelitedota]

UNC gets a seed or two higher because of this. :(

[Ultrarunner]

Well, shoot. Get healed fast and 100 percent, Mr. Colson. Love the effort Bonzie puts out every single game. Hope to see him at full strength by the ACC tournament.

[Troublemaker]

Man that sucks. I am not a fan of Colson’s on-court personality, but he is an amazing player. We are surely catching a break in avoiding him, although I guess so are a bunch of ACC schools (including UNC twice). Hope he has a quick and full recovery and can enjoy what is left of his senior year.

Grrrrr. I was sad to hear the news at first, and then I read the bolded and became angry.

[weezie]

UNC gets a seed or two higher because of this. :(

Uuuugh, yeah, you're right. I feel bad for the young man. He sure had our number last year.

[kAzE]

Awww man . . . that suuuucks!! I love to watch this guy play, even though he probably would have put up 30 and 16 on this Duke team. Get well soon Bonzie.

[OldPhiKap]

Sad to hear. Hope he has a full and quick recovery.

[rolm]

Sad news. Bonzie is one of the hardest working players around and deserved to have a healthy and productive senior season. It's also disappointing that we won't be able to see Carter battle with Bonzie. Carter would have learned so much from this experience (i.e. how to play defense without fouling) and would have better prepared him for the post-season. Bonzie not playing against Duke hurts both teams.

[BD80]

What happened?

Did he think about transferring to Duke?

I thought we had the monopoly on broken feet!

[skysdad]

That's tough. Don't want to see that happen to anyone. Remember how much losing Kyrie affected us.

[flyingdutchdevil]

What happened?

Did he think about transferring to Duke?

I thought we had the monopoly on broken feet!

Coach K taught Brey how to break feet.

This is really sad. Love Bonzi's game. Such a fun player to watch.

Get well soon, Bonzi.

[nmduke2001]

It sucks that he's injured but I'm relieved our guys don't have to play him. In my opinion, Bonzi is the dirtiest player in all of college basketball.

[Steven43]

That's tough. Don't want to see that happen to anyone. Remember how much losing Kyrie affected us.
Umm....yeah, it affected us all right. As in one fewer National Championship banner hanging in Cameron.

[UrinalCake]

Bonzie would have been a tough matchup for us, as one of our bigs would have to guard him out to the three point line. Bagley seems the most equipped to do that, but then that leaves Carter on a guard. ND already has three losses, this is a real killer for them.

[JasonEvans]

He sure had our number last year.

Ye of short memory...

2015 - As a relatively unheralded freshman (he had scored a grand total of 4 points in ND's two previous games) he came out of nowhere to lead the Irish to an upset of Duke in the ACC semi-finals by scoring 17 points in 26 minutes.

2016 - In January, Colson posts a career high 31 points and 11 rebounds to lead Notre Dame to another upset win over the Devils. The game also marks the debut of Colson as a 3-point threat as he hits 2-3 from deep. Prior to that game, he had only hit 2-8 3-pointers for the entire season. He waited until playing Duke to unveil this new weapon in his arsenal. Later that year, in the ACC tourney, ND again upsets Duke as Colson has yet another double-double with 12 points and 12 rebounds. Colson's career record against Duke is now 4-1.

2017 - Duke beats ND in January as Colson scores 17 and grabs 9 rebounds. Bonzie goes off against Duke again in the ACC tournament, scoring 29 with 9 rebounds, but Duke still manages to win.

The kid owned us... no two ways about it. Still, I am so sad to see this news of his injury. I always admired the way he played, reminded me of Kevin McHale with his moves and finishing touch around the basket (as well as his freakishly long arms). I truly hope he can recover quickly and get a satisfying end to what has been a special college career.

-Jason "for anyone wondering, it is waaaay too late to even dream of a medical redshirt" Evans

[Doria]

I hated him when we played against him, but in the best possible way. Really hate to see this happen to him. Best wishes to him for a full and speedy recovery.

[DukieInKansas]

So sad to hear this. Hope he heals quickly and completely.

[BeachBlueDevil]

Hate to see this happen.... I really wanted to see him matchup on Carter/Bagley. Watching Colson bang with bigs at 6'4 is a lesson in not only heart and tenacity but also how big fundamentals and using your body to your advantage are.

[elvis14]

I really hope he has a good recovery and can make an NBA team. I do respect his game. I don't care much for his on court personality....but that doesn't mean I want him injured, it means I wanted Carter and Bagley to out play him. I'm sure he'll come back just in time to put up 32+15 against us in the ACC tournament (in an Irish loss).

[thedukelamere]

Living in Indiana, the Irish are who I root for as a distant 2nd behind our Devils, but Bonzie has always rubbed me the wrong way (probably because he OWNS us and then flexes all over the place like a goon). That being said, I love his talent and think if he played for us he'd be a favorite of ours due to his grit and tenacity. Really hope he heals up and his team is able to secure an at large bid without him... I'd hate to see him miss the tourney his senior year (plus I'm hoping ND ends up as a 8/9 seed and takes down Nova or MSU in the 2nd round).

[wobatus]

Living in Indiana, the Irish are who I root for as a distant 2nd behind our Devils, but Bonzie has always rubbed me the wrong way (probably because he OWNS us and then flexes all over the place like a goon). That being said, I love his talent and think if he played for us he'd be a favorite of ours due to his grit and tenacity. Really hope he heals up and his team is able to secure an at large bid without him... I'd hate to see him miss the tourney his senior year (plus I'm hoping ND ends up as a 8/9 seed and takes down Nova or MSU in the 2nd round).

They can still make it. Losing Colson is a rough blow. And very rough for him. Now it's up to the other guys to carry the team until he gets back. Losing a big player can often galvanize a team (although often only in the short run). But they have some good players and are not a one man team. Farrell obviously is really good. Temple Gibbs has really stepped up as a soph, going from 4.7 to 14.1 ppg. Farrell is at .404 from 3, Gibbs .470. But they are already playing 35 minutes per. They'll get a couple more shots a game.

Geben is not a star but extremely efficient. He's 10th in the league in PER, would be 2nd in eFG% if he qualified, 11th in rebounding %. He'll need to grab them with Colson out. Pflueger is playing a little better. His 3% is a little down at .359, but he's become a better defender.

The guys who have a real chance to step up are Harvey, Mooney and Burns. Harvey had some big time offers and a top 50 recruit (43 RSCI). Hasn't nailed a high % of 3s (neither did Gibbs last year), but at 53% or so inside the arc, and the 3s should come. Big time winner at DeMatha, and he has the body to bang down low, too. Mooney's a big kid (6'9" 245 lbs), and has been rebounding well and nailing 3s in his 10 minutes a game. Just outside the top 100 as a recruit. Has a decent rebound % off the bench. As does Burns. Torres is a senior glue guy, and may be a better defender than the young bigs, but doesn't have their size.

Colson's usage rate was 30%, so everything went through him. The other guys likely won't be as efficient at higher usage rates, but they are already such an efficient team on offense they can likely handle the increase, and surprisingly I don't think they will slip all that much on offense, although it'll hurt not to have a go to guy late. But Colson was also a really good interior defender with his big body and long arms.

They have a fairly favorable schedule. Florida State, Miami, Louisville and Virginia Tech once each, all at home. And Pitt. Syracuse, Virginia, Duke, Clemson and Wake once on road. BC, Heels and NC State twice. Georgia tech again, on the road. That looks like they could go about 10-8 league even without Colson. If anyone can get them there it's Brey. Then they'll get a huge boost assuming Colson returns for March.

[wobatus]

They can still make it. Losing Colson is a rough blow. And very rough for him. Now it's up to the other guys to carry the team until he gets back. Losing a big player can often galvanize a team (although often only in the short run). But they have some good players and are not a one man team. Farrell obviously is really good. Temple Gibbs has really stepped up as a soph, going from 4.7 to 14.1 ppg. Farrell is at .404 from 3, Gibbs .470. But they are already playing 35 minutes per. They'll get a couple more shots a game.

Geben is no a star but extremely efficient. He's 10th in the league in PER, would be 2nd in eFG% if he qualified, 11th in rebounding %. He'll need to grab them with Colson out. Pflueger is playing a little better. His 3% is a little down at .359, but he's become a better defender.

The guys who have a real chance to step up are Harvey, Mooney and Burns. Harvey had some big time offers and a top 50 recruit (43 RSCI). Hasn't nailed a high % of 3s (neither did Gibbs last year), but at 53% or so inside the arc, and the 3s should come. Big time winner at DeMatha, and he has the body to bang down low, too. Mooney's a big kid (6'9" 245 lbs), and has been rebounding well and nailing 3s in his 10 minutes a game. Just outside the top 100 as a recruit. Has a decent rebound % off the bench. As does Burns. Torres is a senior glue guy, and may be a better defender than the young bigs, but doesn't have their size.

Colson's usage rate was 30%, so everything went through him. The other guys likely won't be as efficient at higher usage rates, but they are already such an efficient team on offense they can likely handle the increase, and surprisingly I don't think they will slip all that much on offense, although it'll hurt not to have a go to guy late. But Colson was also a really good interior defender with his big body and long arms.

They have a fairly favorable schedule. Florida State, Miami, Louisville and Virginia Tech once each, all at home. And Pitt. Syracuse, Virginia, Duke, Clemson and Wake once on road. BC, Heels and NC State twice. Georgia tech again, on the road. That looks like they could go about 10-8 league even without Colson. If anyone can get them there it's Brey. Then they'll get a huge boost assuming Colson returns for March.

10-8 actually is pretty conservative. They have a win in the bank. T-rank has them going 10-8 (not sure if that factors in Colson), but actually has them favored in 11 of their next 17 conference games, but a lot of squeakers. favored by .9 over Miami at home and NC St on the road, .4 dogs to UNC at home. If they took all the nailbiters and got some upsets, maybe even 12 wins, but that seems maybe a bit much with Colson down. Brey gets the most out of his talent and here comes a real test.

[JasonEvans]

They could present a real test for the NCAA committee. At the moment, with Colson, they look like about a 6 seed (#28 in KenPom, #28 in AP, #21 in BPI). Lets say they play more like a 9 or 10 or even a bubble team (#11 seed) without him but they get Colson back for the ACC tourney and they play well. What does the committee do with them? Does it give them the #6 and ignore 2 months of weaker play? Does it seed them as a #10 or #11 and pretend like Colson's injury did not affect the team? Does it split the difference, making them a #8 or #9, and potentially give a #1 seed a much tougher than expected 2nd round game?

Hmmmmm... will be interesting to see.

Of course, the real dilemma would be if they were not even a bubble team without Colson but then played well when he returned... would the committee put an 8-10 in the ACC Notre Dame into the tournament?

-Jason "Brey is a fine coach, but it may take Notre Dame some time to figure this one out... NC State game tonight!" Evans

[proelitedota]

Hate to see this happen... I really wanted to see him matchup on Carter/Bagley. Watching Colson bang with bigs at 6'4 is a lesson in not only heart and tenacity but also how big fundamentals and using your body to your advantage are.

Colson is 6'5.5" in shoes, same as Winslow. He does have +2 inches in wingspan over Winslow.

[wobatus]

They could present a real test for the NCAA committee. At the moment, with Colson, they look like about a 6 seed (#28 in KenPom, #28 in AP, #21 in BPI). Lets say they play more like a 9 or 10 or even a bubble team (#11 seed) without him but they get Colson back for the ACC tourney and they play well. What does the committee do with them? Does it give them the #6 and ignore 2 months of weaker play? Does it seed them as a #10 or #11 and pretend like Colson's injury did not affect the team? Does it split the difference, making them a #8 or #9, and potentially give a #1 seed a much tougher than expected 2nd round game?

Hmmmmm... will be interesting to see.

Of course, the real dilemma would be if they were not even a bubble team without Colson but then played well when he returned... would the committee put an 8-10 in the ACC Notre Dame into the tournament?

-Jason "Brey is a fine coach, but it may take Notre Dame some time to figure this one out... NC State game tonight!" Evans

If they go 8-9 rest of regular season that's 9-9 and 19-12. Colson back and they go 1-1 in ACC tourney, 20-13. That's probably in. Maybe even 19-14 (Syracuse in 2016 was 9-9, 19-13 and lost 1st game in ACC tourney to Pitt).

[UrinalCake]

They could present a real test for the NCAA committee.

The Selection Committee didn’t seem to care in the slightest that we played almost all of last season with guys injured.

[BeachBlueDevil]

Colson is 6'5.5" in shoes, same as Winslow. He does have +2 inches in wingspan over Winslow.

Yeah, after I wrote this I thought he was taller... I checked and he was. Still same applies... Undersized for his position and battling guys much taller and using fundamentals and his body to get the edge.

[AGDukesky]

Yeah, after I wrote this I thought he was taller... I checked and he was. Still same applies... Undersized for his position and battling guys much taller and using fundamentals and his body to get the edge.

This is one of my biggest pet peeves. You were right the first time when you said he is 6’4”. Giving height “in shoes” is a made-up thing by lazy basketball people. I wear dress shoes to work every day but I don’t magically get to add an inch to my height...

[wobatus]

This is one of my biggest pet peeves. You were right the first time when you said he is 6’4”. Giving height “in shoes” is a made-up thing by lazy basketball people. I wear dress shoes to work every day but I don’t magically get to add an inch to my height...


What's his barefoot vertical?

[wobatus]

10-8 actually is pretty conservative. They have a win in the bank. T-rank has them going 10-8 (not sure if that factors in Colson), but actually has them favored in 11 of their next 17 conference games, but a lot of squeakers. favored by .9 over Miami at home and NC St on the road, .4 dogs to UNC at home. If they took all the nailbiters and got some upsets, maybe even 12 wins, but that seems maybe a bit much with Colson down. Brey gets the most out of his talent and here comes a real test.

Now Farrell down with a bad ankle sprain, but they did even better once he went down last night against the pack. Torres was pretty good in his 15 minutes but it was Gibbs and especially Harvey stepping up.

[JasonEvans]

Now Farrell down with a bad ankle sprain, but they did even better once he went down last night against the pack. Torres was pretty good in his 15 minutes but it was Gibbs and especially Harvey stepping up.

Coaching Matters...
https://www.gannett-cdn.com/-mm-/13537c977614b6704b389d118a831a774b5e18c7/c=173-0-5110-3712&r=x404&c=534x401/local/-/media/2017/08/04/INGroup/Indianapolis/636374673338842853-USATSI-9910489-1-.jpg

[AGDukesky]

What's his barefoot vertical?

How fast can hockey players skate barefoot?

[wobatus]

How fast can hockey players skate barefoot?

How tall was Bobby Orr on skates?

I agree with you. Not sure when I first saw that but height should be barefoot. You get different measures all the time now and it gets confusing. I think teams lie about height all the time. Guys listed at 6' are more like 5'10" barefoot with a crew cut.

[wobatus]

Coaching Matters...

There was a study done of which teams did better in 2nd halves versus 1st halves that rated Brey one of the top (if not the top, I forget) coaches at half time adjustments. And he obviously has a philosophy and has his teams prepared. This year they are 2nd in fewest fouls per defensive possession. Last year first. They are also second in fewest turnovers per possession. They were 2nd last year, too. And they are routinely top 10 or 20 in both. His teams just don't hurt themselves.

I think he's done a little better in the ACC than in the Big East (although he did quite well there), maybe because he's gotten better. It could just be coincidence, but I think the old Big East slugfest style wasn't as suited to his more wide open game. He made one Sweet 16 in the Big East and already 2 Elite 8s in the ACC.

[sagegrouse]

How tall was Bobby Orr on skates?

I agree with you. Not sure when I first saw that but height should be barefoot. You get different measures all the time now and it gets confusing. I think teams lie about height all the time. Guys listed at 6' are more like 5'10" barefoot with a crew cut.

"Lie" is strong. I remember a quote from Ryan Kelly. Something like, "I am a legitimate 6-11 -- I measure 6-9 and 1/2 in my stocking feet." Hunh? That's just how it's done, and I suppose I can live with it. What I can't live with is that I am of an age where I am shrinking. not growing.

[Saratoga2]

How tall was Bobby Orr on skates?

I agree with you. Not sure when I first saw that but height should be barefoot. You get different measures all the time now and it gets confusing. I think teams lie about height all the time. Guys listed at 6' are more like 5'10" barefoot with a crew cut.

Guys who are good enough to go pro generally have a variety of measurements made at the Chicago pre-draft camp. Those measurement include a stocking foot height and upon review you can see how misleading the figures given for Duke players have been. One of the guys who did have the same height listed for Duke as the stocking foot measurement taken at the camp was JJ. During their Duke playing days it doesn't matter how many cinder blocks high a player measures except that at times it does aggravate the fan base. Grayson is listed at 6'5" and admits to only being 6'4" and that is probably with shoes on so make that 6'3" to a scout.

[Olympic Fan]

The Selection Committee didn’t seem to care in the slightest that we played almost all of last season with guys injured.

I think you are wrong ... the Selection Committee can factor injuries -- IF THE INJURED PLAYER OR PLAYERS RETURN AND DEMONSTRATE THAT THEY ARE BACK AT THE PREINJURY LEVEL

Last year Duke played the first quarter of the season without Tatum, Giles or Bolden and with Grayson Allen hobbled.

But team only lost one game during that stretch (by two points to Kansas).

Tatum returned and established himself as a star player through the bulk of the ACC season. Giles eventually established himself as a nice supporting player. Bolden never had much of an impact.

The two injuries that impacted Duke late in the season were the foot injury that hobbled Amile against BC (he was not the same player after his return) and the sprained ankle that Grayson suffered against Clemson, just as he was regaining his healthy form.

Those two injuries continued to limit Duke as the Committee did its work. I'm not sure what extra consideration Duke should have gotten -- neither Grayson, nor Amile had regained their pre-injury form when the committee selected.

That applies to Notre Dame -- for the committee to cut them some slack, Colson must return and demonstrate he is the same player he was before the injury.

PS The debate about measuring heights with and/or without shoes is silly. In the first place, fans pay way too much attention to height - as Dean Smith once noted (when talking about Sam Perkins' long arms), you don't play basketball with the top of your head ... reach (and reaching height) are much more important.

Secondly, as long as you compare players measured the same way, what does it matter which way you measure them -- with or without shoes?

BTW, I still remember Tommy Burleson's observation after a reporter pointed out that he was 7-foot-4 in shoes, but just 7-2 3/4 in his bare feet: "I never play in my bare feet ... I always wear shoes."

[duke4ever19]

I think you are wrong ... the Selection Committee can factor injuries -- IF THE INJURED PLAYER OR PLAYERS RETURN AND DEMONSTRATE THAT THEY ARE BACK AT THE PREINJURY LEVEL

Could you provide a source for this?

I've been reading the selection committee principles and procedures, but I didn't see anything about this.