PDA

View Full Version : I just can't take it anymore!



Bostondevil
03-08-2007, 01:06 AM
I am tired of all these (Samuel Jackson epithet) articles about (Samuel Jackson epithet) hating Duke.

ESPN page 2 - there's an article, with a vote, about the most hated Dukies of all time, Bill Simmons rags on us, again, in his basketball blog (he doesn't just hate the basketball team, he hates us grads as well)

Gregg Doyel - I think I just threw up in my mouth typing that

I love reading about college basketball but I've found I need to be really careful because I really just can't take it anymore. And it's been done to death. Can't these people find something, anything, new to write about? Why can't that (Samuel Jackson epithet) school of journalism over at the baby blue university teach some creativity to their students, why?

I want it to be safe to read sports articles again. Please just leave us the (Samuel Jackson epithet) alone. Apologies to the moderators if (Samuel Jackson epithet) does not pass muster.

gus
03-08-2007, 08:37 AM
whoaw... wait. Samuel L Jackson $%!"!ing hates duke?

rsvman
03-08-2007, 05:41 PM
I am tired of all these (Samuel Jackson epithet) articles about (Samuel Jackson epithet) hating Duke.

ESPN page 2 - there's an article, with a vote, about the most hated Dukies of all time, Bill Simmons rags on us, again, in his basketball blog (he doesn't just hate the basketball team, he hates us grads as well)

Gregg Doyel - I think I just threw up in my mouth typing that

I love reading about college basketball but I've found I need to be really careful because I really just can't take it anymore. And it's been done to death. Can't these people find something, anything, new to write about? Why can't that (Samuel Jackson epithet) school of journalism over at the baby blue university teach some creativity to their students, why?

I want it to be safe to read sports articles again. Please just leave us the (Samuel Jackson epithet) alone. Apologies to the moderators if (Samuel Jackson epithet) does not pass muster.



I think what you're trying to say could be stated more succintly like this:

"I'm TIRED of all these #@$%#&# hate Duke articles on this #@$%#&# internet!"


Close?

dockfan
03-08-2007, 06:02 PM
Or, metaphorically speaking, "We've gotta get these $&@#$ snakes off this #$#@$ plane!"

NOW I get what that movie really meant. :)

SECulp
03-08-2007, 06:50 PM
I read the same crap on ESPN Page 2. In the article he called K a "sniveling ninny"...I sent him an email asking if he had looked in the mirror. I have not heard anything back. My guess is he was shocked at what he saw staring back at him!

As for Doyel...just a tool.

unwrinkled ear
03-08-2007, 06:55 PM
What i'm sick of are the comparisons with the yankees.

There are a TON of yankee fans, and their logo is everywhere - on hip-hop hats, etc.

The only people that root for Duke have some connection with the university. That makes our pool of suppporters MUCH SMALLER.

That alone makes comparisons with the yankees ridiculous: there is an exponential difference in fanbase and cultural symbology/ clout.

Tappan Zee Devil
03-08-2007, 06:59 PM
I think the comparison is more with always winning.

As a Met fan living in New York, that is not good
As a Duke alum - Hey, suckit up

Jim

JBDuke
03-08-2007, 07:00 PM
What i'm sick of are the comparisons with the yankees.

There are a TON of yankee fans, and their logo is everywhere - on hip-hop hats, etc.

The only people that root for Duke have some connection with the university. That makes our pool of suppporters MUCH SMALLER.

That alone makes comparisons with the yankees ridiculous: there is an exponential difference in fanbase and cultural symbology/ clout.

If you think the only people that pull for Duke have some connection to the university, you need to meet more Duke fans. I've met more that have no significant connection to Duke than those that do

RelativeWays
03-08-2007, 07:03 PM
My respose to Doyle and that insightful article in the Chapel Hill News

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c53/drallen/wtfisthis****qi4.jpg

*hope that doesn't violate the TOS*

_Gary
03-08-2007, 07:18 PM
We've got all this hatred for Duke, fostered on many different levels, presumably because Duke has been kicking butt and taking names for years now. And that's true. Problem is, as dominant as this program has been over the last decade we've only got one national championship to show for it. It's not like Duke has won 5 out of the last 10 years. Sure, we've been good enough to have done that, but we haven't. So all the hatred really is based even more on perceptions than usual. We are perceived to be this juggernaut, but in terms of championships we aren't any more "powerful" (and therefore worthy to be hated) than UNC, UConn, UK, UF, etc. But somehow we've acquired the "Yankees" label. Gosh, at least the Yankees have the hardware to back the hatred up. I could take the vitriol a lot more if we had some more national titles in to show for it. As it is, we should be in the same position we were nearly 20 years ago - just one more team trying to win it all, with an equal amount of fans, haters, and neutral observers. Or at least in the same position as the other teams I mentioned. But we aren't. For whatever reason, we are the most hated team in Men's College Basketball, IMHO.

I really got tee'd off yesterday as I was driving. I heard what was perhaps the most repugnant thing yet on the radio concerning "the nose." It was of course Jim Rome, giving his little 1 minute report that our local station carries and plays a few times a day. And get this. He talked about Tyler and how classy he was in his comments on Tuesday, where he said he held nothing against Gerald. And that was fine if Rome had left it there, but he didn't. After lauding both Tyler and Roy Williams as paragons of virtue and class, he then went on to say that Duke was no longer a class program and that Coach K could take a few lessons from Williams in class. Now I understand that Rome is an idiot and that he hates Duke. No doubt about that. But you've got millions of people that are hearing this crap and just digesting it without thinking at all. It just continues to fuel the hatred. It's really frustrating and I admit that I'm tiring of all the crap this program takes on a national level. Again, if we had 5 championships in the last 10 years I could understand it. At least then it would have be worth it to be hated this much. But where we are isn't matching up with the hatred we are receiving. It's a real bummer, that's for sure.

Gary

Kdogg
03-08-2007, 07:52 PM
It's easier to spit vitriol than journalism. People like Rome are there just to elicit a reaction. Of course it can back fire.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9HNgqQVHI_8

DevilYouthCoach
03-08-2007, 10:43 PM
I am not sure the number of National Championships matters as much as the consistent, year-in, year-out outstanding play and success of our teams. We almost never have a bad year! Fact: We have ended the regular season ranked Number One more times than any other school, except for the UCLA Wooden teams. We have the best record of any team in the NCAA tournaments (winning percentage). We have won the ACC tournament 7 out of 9 years, which is phenomenal. We have been ranked in the national polls more weeks in a row than any other team, but one. We have had national sportscasters raving about our program, our coaches, our clean-cut players until even I get bored. And let's face it, we have had our share of high-profile swaggering sharpshooters who positively enjoyed annoying all the opposition. Not a way to become popular! But we have been great! The jealous hatred comes with the territory. I say Relish It, while we can!

A-Tex Devil
03-08-2007, 11:41 PM
Seriously. It's time to let people hate us and relish it. We're the Iron Shiek and Nikolai Volkov to circa 1986 Sgt. Slaughter and Hulk Hogan!! Coach K is Mr. Fuji!!!

Get on your mic and play the villain. You know the business will turn you back into a good guy eventually.

We have to stop whining about why we are hated and just be fans. We don't have to be a-holes about it, but sometimes we have to just say, "Whatever."

Stop reading Doyell, stop caring that Simmons made a choice in his life and picked Carolina -- at least he admits it's an either or. Own it and root for Duke and if people want to bring us down, just know that you're livin' the high life as a Duke fan, and the sweet 16 to their team is an accomplishment and not an expectation.

As disappointed as I am in our performance this season and tonight, I never really felt pissed about being a Duke fan. Bad guys forever!!!

GO DUKE!!!!!

unwrinkled ear
03-09-2007, 01:04 PM
If you think the only people that pull for Duke have some connection to the university, you need to meet more Duke fans. I've met more that have no significant connection to Duke than those that do

OK - I do continue to think this. Is anyone on this board a duke fan without a connection to the university?

i've watched a lot of duke games in a lot of public places in chicago, atlanta california and london, and I ain't never met a duke fan who didn't connect to the uni.

in fact, many duke fans that i have met have dismissed me once they found out I didn't go to school there (my parents did. i chose a real basketball powerhouse with massive tradition: northwestern)

mapei
03-09-2007, 01:55 PM
I began rooting for Duke in the late 80s because I liked what the program stood for. Having said that, it's possible that I might not have noticed if my significant other had not been an alum.

Bostondevil
03-09-2007, 02:08 PM
You are absolutely right, I need to own it.

The thing with Simmons is, well, I found him after the 2003 ALCS when I stumbled around for a couple of days wondering why, why, why didn't Grady Little take Pedro out. And he wrote a column that spoke to my feelings exactly and I felt better. So, you see, I really like his column. He's funny and entertaining and somewhat different, I think. Then you get the shoe drop, to quote him, you're going along, reading his blog, enjoying the analysis like any hoops junkie, only he hates you. Not Duke, but you specifically, cause he hates all Duke grads, and well, it got to me. (Simmons is a New England prep school private university product, by the way.) I hate that Duke is always referred to as elitist, always. What do they mean by that, exactly?

And did anyone notice that all the Top Ten hated Dukies were white guys? All of them. Maybe it is a race thing.

I think I do own that people hate us but I am just really tired of reading about it and hearing about it and having it analyzed by every sports pundit around. Last night's broadcast, "There are no grey areas, you either love them or you hate them." Actually, there can be grey areas, and some people might find themselves more neutral if you would just shut up! OK, maybe I don't own it. Hate us, OK, fine, go ahead, just stop talking about it so much!

rsvman
03-09-2007, 02:17 PM
I hate that Duke is always referred to as elitist, always. What do they mean by that, exactly?
They say it like it's a negative thing. To me it means that the University doesn't admit anybody who has a pulse; you have to have some qualifications. If that makes the place elitist, so be it.

wilko
03-09-2007, 02:20 PM
Hey UE,
Just answering your all call.

Im a Duke fan with no appreciable connection to the University. Tho Geography IS in my favor.

Im a Durham Native born at the School of Math and Science (when it WAS a hosp.) I've had relatives born at DUMC and die there. I was fired from a job there once. My youngest son there was born during the hydrolic fluid/ cleaning solution fiasco. If you've ever gotten a bill from DUMC you really start to question wether truly they are non-profit or not.

But in Spite of all that... I'm a Duke fan thru and thru...
Growing up in rural Durham there wasnt much going on for pro sports. This was pre soccer, panthers, hurricanes, hornets and bobcats. College basketball was the ONLY game in town. You got to CHOOSE your religion. It was either light (pisspot) blue, Dark blue or red. There were no other options. Other schools were not allowed to be on the ballot as they didnt matter. And largely still dont. Social cliques were formed off this alliance. I chose the religion of my Dad and uncles.

I remember playing rec league pee-wee basketball in Durham. My Coach got in touch with the right folks at Duke got our team tix to see a couple of games over a Christmas break when it wasnt as crowded. We got to see such giants of the hardwood as Mike Tissaw, Tom Emma, Chip England and Vince Taylor. It mattered quite alot to bunch of local townie Kids. I never got the chance to thank K personally for that.

Then there were times where my dad would get "vendor" passes from some of the guys he would do business with. He and I would waltz into Cameron and Blend into the student section. I was all of 12 or 13 maybe... Good times.

Later still, my Sr yr in HS was 86' so that will always be special for me and every other Duke fan old enuff to recall it.

So why am I giving this Biography?
Not real sure...exactly. Just felt like I needed to get that out. To remind me why Im a fan.. thru good times and not so good ones.. Heck... I hit the lottery of College Fandom.

So UE, I respectully have to pose a question to you... what do you mean by "connected to the university"?

While I never went to school there, I dare say Im as connected to as some who have.

unwrinkled ear
03-09-2007, 04:21 PM
Hey UE,
Just answering your all call.

Im a Duke fan with no appreciable connection to the University. Tho Geography IS in my favor.

Im a Durham Native born at the School of Math and Science (when it WAS a hosp.) I've had relatives born at DUMC and die there. I was fired from a job there once. My youngest son there was born during the hydrolic fluid/ cleaning solution fiasco. If you've ever gotten a bill from DUMC you really start to question wether truly they are non-profit or not.

But in Spite of all that... I'm a Duke fan thru and thru...
Growing up in rural Durham there wasnt much going on for pro sports. This was pre soccer, panthers, hurricanes, hornets and bobcats. College basketball was the ONLY game in town. You got to CHOOSE your religion. It was either light (pisspot) blue, Dark blue or red. There were no other options. Other schools were not allowed to be on the ballot as they didnt matter. And largely still dont. Social cliques were formed off this alliance. I chose the religion of my Dad and uncles.

I remember playing rec league pee-wee basketball in Durham. My Coach got in touch with the right folks at Duke got our team tix to see a couple of games over a Christmas break when it wasnt as crowded. We got to see such giants of the hardwood as Mike Tissaw, Tom Emma, Chip England and Vince Taylor. It mattered quite alot to bunch of local townie Kids. I never got the chance to thank K personally for that.

Then there were times where my dad would get "vendor" passes from some of the guys he would do business with. He and I would waltz into Cameron and Blend into the student section. I was all of 12 or 13 maybe... Good times.

Later still, my Sr yr in HS was 86' so that will always be special for me and every other Duke fan old enuff to recall it.

So why am I giving this Biography?
Not real sure...exactly. Just felt like I needed to get that out. To remind me why Im a fan.. thru good times and not so good ones.. Heck... I hit the lottery of College Fandom.

So UE, I respectully have to pose a question to you... what do you mean by "connected to the university"?

While I never went to school there, I dare say Im as connected to as some who have.

Thanks a bunch for this post Wilko. My question is based on the fact that I have never met a duke fan 'connected' to the uni. When I say connected, I mean - "do you have any relation to the uni? does anyone you know/ love/ family?"

if you're married to an alum - that's a connection!
I also think anyone from durham could potentially have a connection.

I'm not complaining that we don't have enough fans. I don't even mind being 'hated' (whenever so many media outlets and people tend to be in agreement about something, i'm always skeptical, so I'm perfectly fine to be an outsider and have the national consensus/ opinion of us be that we should be hated)

peple pick their teams for a lot of diff. reasons, i just think that the sports media culture prevents people from picking duke, whereas I've met a lot of people in the places i've lived that have adopted other college schools programs for one reason or another, despite no ties to the uni.

The first report i ever did for school when i was allowed to choose the subject(i was 10 years old) was on duke basketball, 1986. Yes! Go devils!

Virginian
03-09-2007, 05:07 PM
I don't mind that people hate Duke. I don't like it, but I've gotten used to it and just figure it's the price we pay for having the winningest program over the last 10 or so years. But the stupidity of the sports writers and game announcers who can't mention Duke without adding "the team you love to hate" or "the team you either love or hate" and reading it and hearing it several times a week throughout every season is just mind-numbing.

They only write and say it because they have nothing original to day. It's like every mention of Martha Stewart has to include "the domestic diva."

The bad side of it is that people just start taking it for granted that "everyone hates Duke." Even people who have no real interest in the sport or know anything about it. Just stupid.

Of course with some it just goes beyond stupidity. When a national news guy like Doyle is now openly writing about how he hates the Duke coach, you know it's gone way beyond stupidity. When the Tampa police start looking into possible death threats against G. Hernderson, it's gone way beyond stupidity. When Md. fans start throwing bottles at Duke players' parents, it's gone way beyond stupidity.

I hope people like Doyle can recover their mental equilibrium before someone gets hurt. If I were the sports information guy at Duke I'd seriously consider having a quiet talk with some of these writers and announcers and pointing out the need to take a calmer approach to a game played by kids.

mapei
03-09-2007, 05:55 PM
>We got to see such giants of the hardwood as Mike Tissaw, Tom Emma, Chip England and Vince Taylor. It mattered quite alot to bunch of local townie Kids.

Forgive me, but I've never heard of these names. Were they Duke walk-ons or something?

rfaison
03-09-2007, 06:11 PM
I don't mind that people hate Duke. I don't like it, but I've gotten used to it and just figure it's the price we pay for having the winningest program over the last 10 or so years. But the stupidity of the sports writers and game announcers who can't mention Duke without adding "the team you love to hate" or "the team you either love or hate" and reading it and hearing it several times a week throughout every season is just mind-numbing.

They only write and say it because they have nothing original to day. It's like every mention of Martha Stewart has to include "the domestic diva."

The bad side of it is that people just start taking it for granted that "everyone hates Duke." Even people who have no real interest in the sport or know anything about it. Just stupid.
...

WELL SAID!! I agree with you right down the line, though I'll confess that even though I try to act like the Duke-hating doesn't bother me, it still gets under my skin sometimes. And it bugs me too because the various combinations of mindlessness, stupidity, meanness and narrow-minded competition (which values only winning) can take some of the pure fun out of being a fan.

Bostondevil
03-09-2007, 06:18 PM
Thank you Virginian.

Remember a couple of years ago when the off duty cop brought a gun to the ACC Tournament? Remember how it accidentally went off and he shot himself in the foot? I thought at the time, the height of JJ hating, what if he'd read some article that convinced him shooting JJ or Coach K was a good idea. I do think something like that could happen. And the good folks at whatever media outlet calling for Blue Devil blood should be held partly responsible.

Mike Tissaw, wan't he a linebacker, drafted by the Dallas Cowboys? ;)

E(again)TA: Sometimes I can be petty and vindictive, I don't like that side of me, but I sure was rooting for Bucknell against Holy Cross today, just cause Bill Simmons went to Holy Cross.

devildownunder
03-09-2007, 11:49 PM
What i'm sick of are the comparisons with the yankees.

There are a TON of yankee fans, and their logo is everywhere - on hip-hop hats, etc.

The only people that root for Duke have some connection with the university. That makes our pool of suppporters MUCH SMALLER.

That alone makes comparisons with the yankees ridiculous: there is an exponential difference in fanbase and cultural symbology/ clout.

I don't have a connection to Duke and I'm a huge fan. I do agree with your general point though.

wilko
03-10-2007, 09:04 AM
>
Forgive me, but I've never heard of these names. Were they Duke walk-ons or something?

Hi Mapei,
Those guys were on some of K's earliest teams at Duke. Some of Bill Fosters holdover players from the 79 season (I think). Giants of the hardwood was a bit of a reach... :)

I wanted to stress the point that it meant a great deal to see Duke, no matter who was suited up, and to give a raw timeline that I've been onboard the Duke train for a looooong time. Before they got really good.

Guess that means I'm getting old too....

trianglelawdevil
03-10-2007, 10:06 AM
The problem I have with so much of the duke hatred is that it extends beyond mere hatred of the team and coach to hatred of the fans, the school, or anything else duke. At UNC I often came across students who would comment about how duke students were actually bad people. I thought this would end once I left that bastion of the enemy, but I still encounter it to some degree in my professional life. What makes me most uncomfortable about some of the hatred is that it presumes to make judgments about duke students and alums as people. I think this makes the hatred a lot less palatable and a lot more difficult to "own."

dukie8
03-10-2007, 10:28 AM
The problem I have with so much of the duke hatred is that it extends beyond mere hatred of the team and coach to hatred of the fans, the school, or anything else duke. At UNC I often came across students who would comment about how duke students were actually bad people. I thought this would end once I left that bastion of the enemy, but I still encounter it to some degree in my professional life. What makes me most uncomfortable about some of the hatred is that it presumes to make judgments about duke students and alums as people. I think this makes the hatred a lot less palatable and a lot more difficult to "own."

you really need to tell those people to get a life. i have found that there is a very inverse relationship between the quality/success of an individual and his/her hatred of duke. i think that if you could somehow analyze the typical person who really hates duke, like you described, you aren't going to see too many ceos, professors or priests. anyone who gets that worked up over duke has serious issues that go well beyond watching basketball games.

MattyB.
03-10-2007, 10:29 AM
What i'm sick of are the comparisons with the yankees.

There are a TON of yankee fans, and their logo is everywhere - on hip-hop hats, etc.

The only people that root for Duke have some connection with the university. That makes our pool of suppporters MUCH SMALLER.

That alone makes comparisons with the yankees ridiculous: there is an exponential difference in fanbase and cultural symbology/ clout.
Wow is THAT not true. I have several friends who never lived in NC, never went to Duke, who like/pull for Duke. Largely because Duke (and K) do things "the right way." Duke recruits good, smart kids, and they win - largely clean. There are more people than you think that like Duke for these reasons - not least of all is because we win, and have a long history of doing so -- much like the Yankees. When we win, everyone wants to be on the bandwagon.

I'm generally a Yankee-hater (growing up a Mets fan in NY), so I can see it both ways. And frankly, I'd much rather folks hate us - for being good and clean - than be indifferent or irrelevant (ala Feinstein's article today). Let's keep winning, and BRING ON THE HATERS!

I love that K rendered Doyel irrelevant by not letting him write his insider book about Duke, and that Doyel can't get over it. Heh.

A-Tex Devil
03-10-2007, 12:21 PM
The problem I have with so much of the duke hatred is that it extends beyond mere hatred of the team and coach to hatred of the fans, the school, or anything else duke. At UNC I often came across students who would comment about how duke students were actually bad people. I thought this would end once I left that bastion of the enemy, but I still encounter it to some degree in my professional life. What makes me most uncomfortable about some of the hatred is that it presumes to make judgments about duke students and alums as people. I think this makes the hatred a lot less palatable and a lot more difficult to "own."

You really get a lot of that in your professional life? I'm not saying it doesn't exist, but I guess I haven't run into it in any significant way in my 9 years after Duke. My colleagues and clients that know I'm from Duke give me some good natured ribbing after games like the Clemson clock game or the Hendu/Hansblahblah incident. Or just our general struggling.

But I've never had Duke held over me -- by anyone that matters -- as a judgment of my character. And if it is, it's usually in a positive way. Sure, I run into the occasional fellow ACC or Kentucky grad that give me an unusually hard time, but I've found people that end up in any position of power or influence, with rare exceptions, are able to get past the undergraduate institution on the resume.

My most uncomfortable encounters (and there are only a few) have ALWAYS been with Maryland fans (never have had a bad experience personally or professionally with a UNC fan I met outside of a game watching context). I have run into some irrational judgments of "me" as a Duke alum in those few instances. But as soon as someone acts like that, I tend to ignore them or just say "33 point swing. Gone in 60 seconds. Leave me alone." Probably perpetuates that person's image of Duke, but it's not worth my time to fix their personality flaw.

Bostondevil
03-10-2007, 12:35 PM
You should read Will Blythe's book. Don't buy it though. Email me your address and I'll send it to you, seriously, I don't want the guy getting anymore royalties. He actually is kind to the Duke program. The people he trashes? The alumni.

He interviews one woman who refused to hire a qualified candidate because he was a Duke grad and he interviews a Duke Law professor who is predisposed to find the Double Dukes, as he calls them, an inferior yet more arrogant class of student, nice.

And as far as people hating us because we're smug and arrogant, aren't we smug and arrogant as a defense mechanism because people hate us?

A-Tex Devil
03-10-2007, 12:55 PM
I own Blythe's book. Never could get through it, though. May try again this summer. My take from all that was more an indictment on UNC grads for being petty in ways that might not be benefical to them in a rivalry free world. Maybe the tone is different, though.

I'd hope a neutral observer would see that as a negative about that woman and that law professor than as any general truism about Duke alums.

Like I said -- there are people like that out there, but I'd bet they are few and far between and seem worse and more prevalent when highlighted in a book. I see Aggies and Longhorns working together all the time here, and say what you will, that rivalry amongst students is a lot less gentlemanly in my opinion (To be clear, it's not a "better" rivalry. I've just seen more ridiculous generalizations and near fights tossed about in the UT-A&M rivalry than Duke-UNC).

Bostondevil
03-10-2007, 02:14 PM
I lived in Dallas for 2 years, I know what you mean about UT/A&M. You're right. Somehow, I bet the only people reading Blythe's book have already made up their minds about Duke and/or UNC though.

captmojo
03-10-2007, 09:05 PM
unless you don't count growing up and still living in NC, addiction to cigarettes thanks to American Tobacco Co.,paying for electrical supply service to Duke Power,having close relatives' lives saved by Duke Medical Center (more than one)and being completely glued to the coming and goings of the university athletics dept. I have no direct connection here. I was always secretly wishing to be Doris Duke's lover.

SeattleIrish
03-10-2007, 10:27 PM
I have no real connection to Duke, and even did my doctoral work at a different ACC school, but I've been a casual Duke fan since 1979 and a very dedicated FAN since 1984.

Started out because my big brother liked UNC (we're close in age) and so I HAD to take their rival - and, blah-blah-blah, it grew a great deal from there.

s.i.