Big Bawler and the NCAA

[SoCalDukeFan]

I found this article to be very interesting.

LaVar Ball, father of UCLA's Lonzo Ball and his two brothers who are high school stars, has started a family apparel business - Big Baller Brand. Lonzo has worn BBB socks in warm ups and is mentioned on the site's website.

The NCAA has a problem with this. I guess UCLA and the NCAA have worked through it.

http://www.latimes.com/sports/sportsnow/la-sp-ball-brothers-business-20170322-story.html


SoCal

[BD80]

I found this article to be very interesting.

LaVar Ball, father of UCLA's Lonzo Ball and his two brothers who are high school stars, has started a family apparel business - Big Baller Brand. Lonzo has worn BBB socks in warm ups and is mentioned on the site's website.

The NCAA has a problem with this. I guess UCLA and the NCAA have worked through it.

http://www.latimes.com/sports/sportsnow/la-sp-ball-brothers-business-20170322-story.html


SoCal

How are the younger Balls going to play college ball once the Big Ball chooses who will get to pay the $1B endorsement deal for all three sons?

[weezie]

I kinda agree with LeBron saying something to the effect that Ball, Sr. had an awful lot to say for someone who had a career scoring average of 2pts/game. Ball was shooting his mouth off about young LeBron, Jr?

As the kids say, James was throwing major shade.

[Pghdukie]

Hello Mr. Ball, maybe you've heard of me - my name is Todd Marinovich. Nice to meet you.

[BD80]

Here's something for LaVar to think about:

http://www.cbssports.com/soccer/news/millions-of-dollars-in-lionel-messi-branded-cocaine-were-found-in-peru-drug-bust/

Ball brand cocaine ... Eight Ball?

[Channing]

This guy can't be serious ...

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/19264024/nike-armour-adidas-not-interested-deal-lonzo-ball

[Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15]

This guy can't be serious ...

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/19264024/nike-armour-adidas-not-interested-deal-lonzo-ball

"The worst thing to happen to college basketball?" That's also a stretch. Clearly, they haven't met Grayson Allen.

[El_Diablo]

Video of LaVar Ball's pitch:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=48TR0vUPQCs

[gocanes0506]

Well the big 3 brands of shoes aren't signing Lonzo because of his dad's negotiating. Lamar wants the shoe company to license this brand of his as a part of the deal. He is killing his kids' wallets while trying to pad his. Lonzo better break from his father or he is going to lose out in millions.

[Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15]

Well the big 3 brands of shoes aren't signing Lonzo because of his dad's negotiating. Lamar wants the shoe company to license this brand of his as a part of the deal. He is killing his kids' wallets while trying to pad his. Lonzo better break from his father or he is going to lose out in millions.

Like it or not, the brand and the dad are inseparable at this point.

[Indoor66]

What does daddy think he is selling? Maybe a little more performance and success should precede such demands?

[MrPoon]

I love this story.
It's like the contestant on a game show who has $100,000 in hand but risks that for a long shot at $1m only to miss it and walk away empty handed with the host shaking his head. Up until this story the dad has been an absurd fiction of what makes ESPN a failing business, all style but no substance. For the first time, he is actually doing something of meaning. Sadly for his son or sons, that something is going to cost them a lot of money and and a lot of coverage. Plus, as an NBA team, I would increasingly worry about what his dad does to his career once he arrives. Can you image ESPN running over to his Dad the first time an NBA coach chooses to call a play for a different player and his team looses the game? Or if a team not in a major market takes his son in the draft?
He is a disrupter but the model he is looking to disrupt has Jordan owning an NBA team and LeBron and Durant making more money on shoes than playing basketball.
In poker or any business negotiation the saying is to know who the sucker at the table is, and if you don't, its you. Guess who is the sucker in this story?

[LasVegas]

Not to mention the terrible name. Big Baller Brand? BBB? Nike, adidas, UA, Carters, Osh Kosh B'gosh.......doesn't matter to me. No way I would wear something stupid like that.

[flyingdutchdevil]

Not to mention the terrible name. Big Baller Brand? BBB? Nike, adidas, UA, Carters, Osh Kosh B'gosh....doesn't matter to me. No way I would wear something stupid like that.

Problem is there are a lot of "stupid" people out there. LaVar is anti-establishment. He's gonna get plenty of followers and sadly make a ton of money with a dumb brand.

[CDu]

What does daddy think he is selling? Maybe a little more performance and success should precede such demands?

Yup. This is the issue. He keeps marketing his "3 sons." Well, right now, only Lonzo Ball is close to a proven marketable commodity. And even that's a stretch. The middle brother is just a 3-star recruit and doesn't appear destined for the NBA. The youngest brother is talented but not as highly-rated so far as Lonzo was in high school. And again, we're talking about a kid in Lonzo ball who hasn't done anything yet. If he's the best of the three and is just an okay basketball player, what does that do?

I get what Lavar Ball is trying to do. He probably knows that Lonzo is the most marketable asset he has. LiAngelo most probably won't ever play in the NBA and almost certainly won't be a star. LaMelo might or might not make it. He's a top-20 recruit right now, so there is potential. But it's far from a given (at least 3 years and possibly more) that LaMelo will make any impact in the NBA. Lonzo is the one clear marketing chip Lavar has. So he's trying to strike while the iron is hot and get the best deal he can to build his business. It appears to be backfiring so far, as the major US shoe companies aren't interested. Maybe a foreign company jumps on board. If so, good for Ball. But if not, and if Lonzo struggles to make a name for himself as a superstar in the league (ask D'Angelo Russell and Jahlil Okafor how the league is compared to college) then Lavar Ball has nothing.

[jimmymax]

The Chinese outfit LiNing sounds like the LiLikliest partner but LaVar better not LeLeave it too LoLong. LaLater...

[CrazyNotCrazie]

Yup. This is the issue. He keeps marketing his "3 sons." Well, right now, only Lonzo Ball is close to a proven marketable commodity. And even that's a stretch. The middle brother is just a 3-star recruit and doesn't appear destined for the NBA. The youngest brother is talented but not as highly-rated so far as Lonzo was in high school. And again, we're talking about a kid in Lonzo ball who hasn't done anything yet. If he's the best of the three and is just an okay basketball player, what does that do?

I get what Lavar Ball is trying to do. He probably knows that Lonzo is the most marketable asset he has. LiAngelo most probably won't ever play in the NBA and almost certainly won't be a star. LaMelo might or might not make it. He's a top-20 recruit right now, so there is potential. But it's far from a given (at least 3 years and possibly more) that LaMelo will make any impact in the NBA. Lonzo is the one clear marketing chip Lavar has. So he's trying to strike while the iron is hot and get the best deal he can to build his business. It appears to be backfiring so far, as the major US shoe companies aren't interested. Maybe a foreign company jumps on board. If so, good for Ball. But if not, and if Lonzo struggles to make a name for himself as a superstar in the league (ask D'Angelo Russell and Jahlil Okafor how the league is compared to college) then Lavar Ball has nothing.

One wonders if at some point Steve Alford gets tired of this and decides to pass on the third Ball brother - I think all of the dad's antics are likely keeping UCLA's compliance department on full alert (if they care about such things). I know Duke has periodically been burned by overbearing parents and Coach K has kept his distance from some of these situations. Lavar sounds like an absolute buffoon. It would also be nice if the media stopped giving him a microphone to speak into.

[blUDAYvil]

It would also be nice if the media stopped giving him a microphone to speak into.

Let's blame ourselves a little bit for this debacle before laying blame with the "media". If we weren't at all interested in what Mr. Ball has to say, maybe the media wouldn't hand him a microphone. That there is a thread on DBR dedicated to the Ball brothers speaks volumes...

[CameronBornAndBred]

Not to mention the terrible name. Big Baller Brand? BBB? Nike, adidas, UA, Carters, Osh Kosh B'gosh...doesn't matter to me. No way I would wear something stupid like that.


Problem is there are a lot of "stupid" people out there. LaVar is anti-establishment. He's gonna get plenty of followers and sadly make a ton of money with a dumb brand.

Has he made any yet? The only people I've seen wearing BBB clothes are him, his kids, his wife, and his great aunt. His dog might sleep on a t-shirt. (In a BBB doghouse.)

[CDu]

One wonders if at some point Steve Alford gets tired of this and decides to pass on the third Ball brother - I think all of the dad's antics are likely keeping UCLA's compliance department on full alert (if they care about such things). I know Duke has periodically been burned by overbearing parents and Coach K has kept his distance from some of these situations. Lavar sounds like an absolute buffoon. It would also be nice if the media stopped giving him a microphone to speak into.

To be fair, he only sounds like a buffoon because he's given the chance to sound like a buffoon. I'm sure there are plenty of dads who would sound exactly the same if given the same media opportunities. Ball has just taken advantage of his son's talent and the availability of media to promote himself and his brand. He's not the first, nor will he be the last. But he's one of the first to take advantage of the proliferation of available media outlets.

[Indoor66]

To be fair, he only sounds like a buffoon because he's given the chance to sound like a buffoon. I'm sure there are plenty of dads who would sound exactly the same if given the same media opportunities. Ball has just taken advantage of his son's talent and the availability of media to promote himself and his brand. He's not the first, nor will he be the last. But he's one of the first to take advantage of the proliferation of available media outlets.

I have to disagree (is anyone surprised at that). I have followed college sports since the early 50's and recall some overbearing parents, but this is unprecedented in my experience. To me it reflects a real confusion about how the world works. It seems to me that daddy needs to get his feet on the ground and smell the reality roses.

[CDu]

I have to disagree (is anyone surprised at that). I have followed college sports since the early 50's and recall some overbearing parents, but this is unprecedented in my experience. To me it reflects a real confusion about how the world works. It seems to me that daddy needs to get his feet on the ground and smell the reality roses.

I agree that it is unprecedented to have a parent so publicly acting the fool. My point is that Ball is not unprecedented. It's just that we haven't had the media access to previous guys like Ball.

The situation (the combination of a guy like Ball and the ever-expanding world of media outlets) is unprecedented. But guys like Ball aren't. Ball just has a bigger (or more easily-transmitted) pulpit from which to preach his crazy.

[53n206]

Makes me think of the tree falling in the forest. Does it mak noise if no one there? Those days are gone.

[weezie]

Sweet! I'm in! Do they come in pink?

Where can I pre-order?

[Indoor66]

Sweet! I'm in! Do they come in pink?

Where can I pre-order?

I got a bridge you can add to that order....

[Olympic Fan]

Reading the ESPN story about how Nike, UA and adidas are all rejecting Ball and the Blas brand, I came across this quote from the father, insisting that he won't accept anything less than a co-brand:

"Just imagine how rich Tiger [Woods], Kobe [Bryant], Serena [Williams], [Michael] Jordan and LeBron [James] would have been if they dared to do their own thing," LaVar said. "No one owned their own brand before they turned pro. We do, and I have three sons, so it's that much more valuable."

Yeah, too bad those poor broke idiots signed a normal shoe deal instead of following Ball's business model.

Just think -- Tiger could have made hundreds of millions ... Jordan would be a rich man today. LeBron could retire on his hundreds of millions.

What idiots ...

[Indoor66]

It is always better to have 100% of nothing.

[cspan37421]

If papa Ball's idea is so great, and his brand will be so successful, why does he need to partner with Nike, Adidas, etc? Shouldn't banks, VC firms, etc etc, be lining up to partner with him and his great idea? Even just to finance him without any equity interest - what great a great client to have! It's as if the whole world is wrong and Lavar Ball is the only one who truly sees the future.

[Henderson]

It's going to be really sad if, 20 years from now, Lavar Ball is interviewed in his trailer park about the sons who never quite lived up to his expectations, and explaining why it all didn't work out and that he was actually right all along but the system let him down and that he has no regrets about turning down all that sneaker money in 2017.

[Dr. Rosenrosen]

So at what point does Lonzo the legal adult tell his egomaniacal, manipulative, money grubbing father to get lost?

[Dukehky]

This most hilarious part of this whole process is he's touting his 3 kids like they're all some transcendent talents, and that the brands can make money off all three, nope. The middle kid was a package deal to get Lonzo to go to UCLA, and the younger one is okay, but neither of them is likely to sniff the NBA.

I wish he would go away. I'm so tired of people saying he's a good father and bad manager, because that's what literally everyone says. That statement is just rife with racial overtones. That because all it takes for a black father to be a good father is to stick around. I don't know what kind of dad he actually is, I would be ashamed of him at this point, but it could all be a show, even though the show is not working. I feel so bad for Lonzo especially since he's the only one who has a shot at the league, but he is going to get treated like absolute crap beyond how rookies are treated because his dad is such a pain. Even Chuck Okafor is rarely in the public eye anymore, and he's as outspoken as it gets, he's just got some sense.

This dude is a clown, who is likely to be hosting sports center with Stephen A soon.

[El_Diablo]

All jokes aside, this guy is clearly jeopardizing the amateur status of his two younger sons by implying that they are part of the deal.

[LasVegas]

This most hilarious part of this whole process is he's touting his 3 kids like they're all some transcendent talents, and that the brands can make money off all three, nope. The middle kid was a package deal to get Lonzo to go to UCLA, and the younger one is okay, but neither of them is likely to sniff the NBA.

BINGO. He named some BIG TIME athletes in Jordan,Kobe, Lebron, Serena, Tiger. Yeah, sure...if those guys/girl would of held off maybe his master plan would of worked for THEM. But he is doubling down on a huge bet here that at least one of his kids will have their names added to the above list. What's the odds? 1 million to 1? Too risky. Got to take the money and run. Lonzo could be out of the league in a few years easy. Happens all the time.

[YmoBeThere]

Man! Y'all just don't get it! A transcendent mind such as his along with the transcendent talent of his three sons...



*Yes, he's a special kind of crazy.

[jimsumner]

I'm so tired of people saying he's a good father and bad manager, because that's what literally everyone says.



literally everyone?

Oh, dear.

[Indoor66]

literally everyone?

Oh, dear.

Yeah. Seems like an overly large group.

[TKG]

I will defer to the lawyers in the community, but when negotiating doesn't each party have to have something the other party wants? What does BBB (and all that comes with it) have that the big shoe companies want/need? What leverage does BBB have in these negotiations? Because BBB must be taken in total. The shoe companies do not get the athlete on a stand alone basis.

[Henderson]

So at what point does Lonzo the legal adult tell his egomaniacal, manipulative, money grubbing father to get lost?

#stockholmsyndrome

Patty Hearst brandished a Thompson machine gun during a bank robbery for Cinque, and she'd only known him a few weeks.

[Dukehky]

I'm so tired of people saying he's a good father and bad manager, because that's what literally everyone says.



literally everyone?

Oh, dear.

Okay, okay you two, noses down.

That was a bad mistake. Apologies.

[uh_no]

I will defer to the lawyers in the community, but when negotiating doesn't each party have to have something the other party wants? What does BBB (and all that comes with it) have that the big shoe companies want/need? What leverage does BBB have in these negotiations? Because BBB must be taken in total. The shoe companies do not get the athlete on a stand alone basis.

that's the point....BBB needs a big company. big shoe companies don't need BBB....so BBB has no leverage at all.

[slower]

It's going to be really sad if, 20 years from now, Lavar Ball is interviewed in his trailer park about the sons who never quite lived up to his expectations, and explaining why it all didn't work out...

Actually, it would be hilarious. Wishing nothing but failure to them all and others of the same loudmouth, self-promoting ilk.

[TKG]

that's the point...BBB needs a big company. big shoe companies don't need BBB...so BBB has no leverage at all.

Not sure Father Ball grasps this fundamental reality.....

[uh_no]

Actually, it would be hilarious. Wishing nothing but failure to them all and others of the same loudmouth, self-promoting ilk.

lavar is like harrisson barnes on steroids.

[cato]

So at what point does Lonzo the legal adult tell his egomaniacal, manipulative, money grubbing father to get lost?

He may not. We don't really know much about their relationship. Just what they show to the public.

[moonpie23]

i KNOW this kind of parent...


it's sad...and almost always turns out to be to late for the artist...errr...athlete to understand what daddy is doing to their careers....

[Tom B.]

Reading the ESPN story about how Nike, UA and adidas are all rejecting Ball and the Blas brand, I came across this quote from the father, insisting that he won't accept anything less than a co-brand:

"Just imagine how rich Tiger [Woods], Kobe [Bryant], Serena [Williams], [Michael] Jordan and LeBron [James] would have been if they dared to do their own thing," LaVar said. "No one owned their own brand before they turned pro. We do, and I have three sons, so it's that much more valuable."

Yeah, too bad those poor broke idiots signed a normal shoe deal instead of following Ball's business model.

Just think -- Tiger could have made hundreds of millions ... Jordan would be a rich man today. LeBron could retire on his hundreds of millions.

What idiots ...

That was my first thought too. Um, dude...you just cited five people who are worth nine or ten figures, several of whom do, in fact, have co-branding deals with Big Shoe. You know how they got there? By dominating their sports and being the very best at what they do. If your kids can do that, they'll have every opportunity to cash in the same way.


And this quote from the ESPN article jumped out at me:



When asked how long he has been working on the design of Lonzo's shoe, Ball said, "I've been working on that shoe ever since my boys were born."


Well hello, Marv Marinovich...


As for George Raveling's "worst thing to happen to basketball in the last hundred years" crack about LaVar...yeah, I thought that was a little over the top. Fortunately, Lavar responded in his typical measured and thoughtful manner:

https://www.instagram.com/p/BTKOX1MBZjE/

[NashvilleDevil]

Another nugget to this saga is the coach at Chino Hills was let go.

[sagegrouse]

I don't believe any kid (or anyone) has an inalienable right to tens of millions of dollars from sneaker companies. But here's my fear -- Lavar will loot his son's bank account, including his NBA salary, to fund his sneaker enterprise. And the money will be gone in a NY minute. That wouldn't be right.

I don't know the rules/laws affecting parents and children, but it has apparently been a problem in hockey, where many kids sign away their earnings on their 18th birthday in return for the parents financing their junior hockey. And there are cases where the parents just spend all the NHL money and leave the kid with nothing.

[arnie]

Not sure Father Ball grasps this fundamental reality....

I'll be the contrarian; seems Lavar could be a great fit as a talking head for ESPN with a lot more personality than most of the pre-armaggedon guys. As long as his kids are OK with this, why do I care. Plus I like his chicken grilling skit.

[Tom B.]

I don't believe any kid (or anyone) has an inalienable right to tens of millions of dollars from sneaker companies. But here's my fear -- Lavar will loot his son's bank account, including his NBA salary, to fund his sneaker enterprise. And the money will be gone in a NY minute. That wouldn't be right.

I don't know the rules/laws affecting parents and children, but it has apparently been a problem in hockey, where many kids sign away their earnings on their 18th birthday in return for the parents financing their junior hockey. And there are cases where the parents just spend all the NHL money and leave the kid with nothing.

In theory, this shouldn't be an issue, because Lonzo is over 18 and a legal adult. He'll have total legal control over his money, and doesn't have to give a dime of it to Dear Old dad if he doesn't want to. It's not like a situation where a parent acts as a trustee for a kid because the kid's still legally a minor, like we see in some sports where kids often turn pro before age 18 (e.g., tennis), and then the parent uses his access to the kid's earnings for his own benefit.

Now, I say "in theory" because who knows what kind of hold LaVar has over his sons? Lonzo doesn't have to give LaVar access to his money, but he's certainly allowed to if he wants to. And if Lonzo believes LaVar and lets LaVar manage his money, there's nothing anyone can do to stop him. And sadly, the sports world is littered with stories about young athletes who entrust parents, relatives, or friends with their money, only to regret it later. I don't know if LaVar will turn out to be one of those parents, but there are, shall we say, red flags. What LaVar should be doing is helping Lonzo find and hire a reputable agent, attorney, and financial adviser, not looking to use his kids as his own private moneymaking machine.

[CameronBornAndBred]

Now that he had said he is turning pro, does Lonzo have an sort of contract with his dad's company?

[sagegrouse]

In theory, this shouldn't be an issue, because Lonzo is over 18 and a legal adult. He'll have total legal control over his money, and doesn't have to give a dime of it to Dear Old dad if he doesn't want to. It's not like a situation where a parent acts as a trustee for a kid because the kid's still legally a minor, like we see in some sports where kids often turn pro before age 18 (e.g., tennis), and then the parent uses his access to the kid's earnings for his own benefit.

Now, I say "in theory" because who knows what kind of hold LaVar has over his sons? Lonzo doesn't have to give LaVar access to his money, but he's certainly allowed to if he wants to. And if Lonzo believes LaVar and lets LaVar manage his money, there's nothing anyone can do to stop him. And sadly, the sports world is littered with stories about young athletes who entrust parents, relatives, or friends with their money, only to regret it later. I don't know if LaVar will turn out to be one of those parents, but there are, shall we say, red flags. What LaVar should be doing is helping Lonzo find and hire a reputable agent, attorney, and financial adviser, not looking to use his kids as his own private moneymaking machine.

Ah, yes! So the problem I cited was likely one affecting minors being involved with trust agreements with their parents.

[JasonEvans]

My bet is that the problem wasn't so much that the shoe companies would have to license BBB from Lavar, but that Lavar likely was going to require them to do all kinds of stuff to promote BBB in a major way. I am betting that the economics of the deal would not come close to working unless Lonzo turned into Steph or Lebron or KD... and while Lonzo is a very good prospect, no shoe company is going to make a huge bet on him that will only pay off if he becomes a future mutli-year MVP.

-Jason "also, for the record, most recruiting gurus say the littlest Ball, LaMello, is a strong pro prospect. He is widely considered among the 20 best players in his class" Evans

[sagegrouse]

My bet is that the problem wasn't so much that the shoe companies would have to license BBB from Lavar, but that Lavar likely was going to require them to do all kinds of stuff to promote BBB in a major way. I am betting that the economics of the deal would not come close to working unless Lonzo turned into Steph or Lebron or KD... and while Lonzo is a very good prospect, no shoe company is going to make a huge bet on him that will only pay off if he becomes a future mutli-year MVP.

-Jason "also, for the record, most recruiting gurus say the littlest Ball, LaMello, is a strong pro prospect. He is widely considered among the 20 best players in his class" Evans

Also, you don't have a business partnership with a loose cannon -- no matter the economics.

[Olympic Fan]

-Jason "also, for the record, most recruiting gurus say the littlest Ball, LaMello, is a strong pro prospect. He is widely considered among the 20 best players in his class" Evans

Well, Lonzo Ball is going to be a top 2-3 pick in June's draft.

The middle Ball brother is not a top 100 prospect

LaMelo (I think that's now it's spelled) is currently rated as the No. 16 prospect in the ESPN Class of 2019 rankings.

That's good, but hardly the billion dollar franchise that the father keeps pushing.

Unless Lonzo (or one of the younger brothers) is MUCH better than expected, I don't see the huge merchandising deal.

[Indoor66]

Too many people construct their own World and the believe that what they construct is reality.

[dudog84]

Too many people construct their own World and the believe that what they construct is reality.

Boy, the places I could go with that comment...but one of the places would be timeout from the mods.

[Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15]

Boy, the places I could go with that comment...but one of the places would be timeout from the mods.

I tried to spork the comment,but apparently I have been too friendly to Indoor as of late.

[CameronBornAndBred]

Chino Hills' next coach will be their third in three years. New guy will either be LaVar's best friend/family member, LaVar himself, or someone incredibly desperate/brave.
Not enough money in the world would be worth that headache.

“Man, we were supposed to go to Sacramento, but that coach is hard-headed. He wanted to do things his way. If we would have gotten along, we would have been in the state title easy. But he’s trying to have a little resistance towards me. And I’m like, ‘Man, try and do it your way. That’s why you lost three games.’
“Because once he run and just play and when my son really wants to play for you, we’re gonna do good. But when you have any kind of resistance towards me, and you the head coach, it don’t work out that good. I already knew he was going to lose that game.”


http://ftw.usatoday.com/2017/03/lavar-ball-lamelo-liangelo-lonzo-chino-hills-high-school-coach-stephan-gilling-ucla

[brevity]

Too many people construct their own World and the believe that what they construct is reality.

You mean like this?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=trDnp3dWlXk

I would invest in these Ball Brothers. Too bad that all the big shoe companies are trying to Black Ball them.

(Source: Deadspin (http://deadspin.com/the-sports-highlight-of-day-is-these-two-balls-rescuing-1794746314), where the commenters immediately made the same sports connection)

[ChillinDuke]

You mean like this?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=trDnp3dWlXk

I would invest in these Ball Brothers. Too bad that all the big shoe companies are trying to Black Ball them.

(Source: Deadspin (http://deadspin.com/the-sports-highlight-of-day-is-these-two-balls-rescuing-1794746314), where the commenters immediately made the same sports connection)

HA!

I can't even. This is amazing.

- Chillin

[yancem]

That was pretty impressive (and funny to!!!).

[Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15]

You mean like this?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=trDnp3dWlXk

I would invest in these Ball Brothers. Too bad that all the big shoe companies are trying to Black Ball them.

(Source: Deadspin (http://deadspin.com/the-sports-highlight-of-day-is-these-two-balls-rescuing-1794746314), where the commenters immediately made the same sports connection)

I had no intention of watching the entire clip, but once it started...

Japanese culture never, ever disappoints.

[MCFinARL]

Boy, the places I could go with that comment...but one of the places would be timeout from the mods.

Only one? :)

[CameronBornAndBred]

I had no intention of watching the entire clip, but once it started...

Japanese culture never, ever disappoints.
Ditto! (Although I call trickery on the bounce shots and pipe drain. :rolleyes:)

[CameronBornAndBred]

“Because once he run and just play and when my son really wants to play for you, we’re gonna do good. But when you have any kind of resistance towards me, and you the head coach, it don’t work out that good. I already knew he was going to lose that game.”


http://ftw.usatoday.com/2017/03/lavar-ball-lamelo-liangelo-lonzo-chino-hills-high-school-coach-stephan-gilling-ucla
You know, after reading that quote over and over, I wonder if Derek Zoolander might be looking for a coach.
Lavar could teach grammar, too.

https://img.wonkette.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/08/zoolander.jpg

[sagegrouse]

Anyone else here feel like they are watching a slow-motion train wreck that will take a few years to achieve fully ruin and mayhem?

[AtlDuke72]

Anyone else here feel like they are watching a slow-motion train wreck that will take a few years to achieve fully ruin and mayhem?

what is remarkeable is that this guy continues to get major, national time in the press and the media. I suggest that he never be mentioned again and maybe we can just forget about him.

[moonpie23]

what is remarkeable is that this guy continues to get major, national time in the press and the media. I suggest that he never be mentioned again and maybe we can just forget about him.

sorry, this country can't ignore a dumpster fire......

[CameronBornAndBred]

what is remarkeable is that this guy continues to get major, national time in the press and the media. I suggest that he never be mentioned again and maybe we can just forget about him.
Must....bite........tongue..............

[dudog84]

Anyone else here feel like they are watching a slow-motion train wreck that will take a few years to achieve fully ruin and mayhem?

Hold it, which thread am I on? Is this the uNC scandal thread? A boy can hope.

[CameronBornAndBred]

LaVar Ball's Big Baller Brand on Thursday unveiled the ZO2 shoe line that he designed for his son Lonzo (http://insider.espn.com/nbadraft/draft/tracker/player?draftyear=2010&playerId=20368), with the main pair debuting at $495 on the company's website.
Bwahahahahahahahaha!!!!!!!


The main shoe, at the aforementioned price of $495, has a "microfiber python texture" in matte black and what the website describes as a "Delorean finish."
Double Bwahahahahahahaha!!!!!! (Because nothing says style like snake oil and a failed car venture.)
http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/19311049/big-baller-brand-unveils-debut-z02-shoe-lonzo-ball


PS...one last laugh...

According to the website, all sales of the ZO2 are final and there could be a wait for fans to get a pair. The website says there will be no refunds or exchanges and that the shoes would be shipped by Nov. 24.
Do they have to breed the pythons first?

[Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15]

Bwahahahahahahahaha!!!!!!!


Double Bwahahahahahahaha!!!!!! (Because nothing says style like snake oil and a failed car venture.)
http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/19311049/big-baller-brand-unveils-debut-z02-shoe-lonzo-ball


PS...one last laugh...

Do they have to breed the pythons first?

Well, at those prices I assume the Balls themselves are sewing them. Ought to be a fun summer job.

[Indoor66]

Well, at those prices I assume the Balls themselves are sewing them. Ought to be a fun summer job.

How long to make about 1/2 dozen pair?

[Henderson]

Yeah, it's May, and for $495 you get a pre-order for a shoe to be shipped in November, with no refunds. It's a Kickstarter campaign, LaVar style. If it doesn't work out, LaVar keeps your money.

He should publish a list of everyone who plops down the cash. Then we will know who on this planet should not be allowed to procreate.

[Indoor66]

Yeah, it's May, and for $495 you get a pre-order for a shoe to be shipped in November, with no refunds. It's a Kickstarter campaign, LaVar style. If it doesn't work out, LaVar keeps your money.

He should publish a list of everyone who plops down the cash. Then we will know who on this planet should not be allowed to procreate.

Or who to put on the solicitation list. :o

[CDu]

Yeah, it's May, and for $495 you get a pre-order for a shoe to be shipped in November, with no refunds. It's a Kickstarter campaign, LaVar style. If it doesn't work out, LaVar keeps your money.

He should publish a list of everyone who plops down the cash. Then we will know who on this planet should not be allowed to procreate.

All based on a theoretical shoe based on the "brand" of a kid who probably will be a good but not overly great pro.

Ball is doing his son no favors. Folks are gonna want to destroy him in the pros.

[NSDukeFan]

All based on a theoretical shoe based on the "brand" of a kid who probably will be a good but not overly great pro.

Ball is doing his son no favors. Folks are gonna want to destroy him in the pros.

Or maybe they'll just feel sorry for him.

[Pghdukie]

Sucker born every minute. Unfortunately.

[Tripping William]

All based on a theoretical shoe based on the "brand" of a kid who probably will be a good but not overly great pro.

Ball is doing his son no favors. Folks are gonna want to destroy him in the pros.


Or maybe they'll just feel sorry for him.

I'm sure LeBron will go reeeeeeallllly easy on him. Ya know, out of respect for the kid's dad .....

[Merlindevildog91]

Arian Foster bought, according to his Twitter feed.

[CrazyNotCrazie]

Yeah, it's May, and for $495 you get a pre-order for a shoe to be shipped in November, with no refunds. It's a Kickstarter campaign, LaVar style. If it doesn't work out, LaVar keeps your money.

He should publish a list of everyone who plops down the cash. Then we will know who on this planet should not be allowed to procreate.

I bet this list would overlap a lot with those who attended Fyre Festival

[Channing]

Did we all miss the ZO1s?

[camion]

Yeah, it's May, and for $495 you get a pre-order for a shoe to be shipped in November, with no refunds. It's a Kickstarter campaign, LaVar style. If it doesn't work out, LaVar keeps your money.

He should publish a list of everyone who plops down the cash. Then we will know who on this planet should not be allowed to procreate.

That price is appalling. :eek:

I can beat easily beat that price with a flubberized shoe I have in mind. Talk about hops!! And for only $299.99

Just send me the money and if I ever manufacture basketball shoes you will get yours. :cool:

[Papa John]

That price is appalling. :eek:

I can beat easily beat that price with a flubberized shoe I have in mind. Talk about hops!! And for only $299.99

Just send me the money and if I ever manufacture basketball shoes you will get yours. :cool:

Hey, "if you can't afford the ZO2's, you're NOT a big baller..." That in response to Shaq's Tweet criticizing the pricing... Clearly, Shaq ain't a big baller...

This guy is hilarious... He's a living, breathing sitcom...

[JasonEvans]

I'm sure LeBron will go reeeeeeallllly easy on him. Ya know, out of respect for the kid's dad ....

The guy who is going to destroy is Steph Curry, who Lavar repeatedly stated was worse than his college freshman son. In fact, it was the absurd pronouncements about Lonzo making the Warriors better that initially got Lavar all this attention.

-Jason "Steph may hang 50 on this kid... I can't wait to see it" Evans

[mph]

The guy who is going to destroy is Steph Curry, who Lavar repeatedly stated was worse than his college freshman son. In fact, it was the absurd pronouncements about Lonzo making the Warriors better that initially got Lavar all this attention.

-Jason "Steph may hang 50 on this kid... I can't wait to see it" Evans

And that's the biggest disservice this father is doing to his sons. Many people are rooting for them to fail because they can't stand dad. Shoot, half the NBA is waiting to take it to Lonzo just to shut up his father. It's hard enough to succeed in the NBA without adding that kind of baggage.

[flyingdutchdevil]

And that's the biggest disservice this father is doing to his sons. Many people are rooting for them to fail because they can't stand dad. Shoot, half the NBA is waiting to take it to Lonzo just to shut up his father. It's hard enough to succeed in the NBA without adding that kind of baggage.

As a rookie, no less. I hope Jeannie is smart to pass on this clown. Take Fultz, J Jackson, Tatum, D Smith, Fox, or Monk. This Ball kid is a joke.

[Dukehky]

As a rookie, no less. I hope Jeannie is smart to pass on this clown. Take Fultz, J Jackson, Tatum, D Smith, Fox, or Monk. This Ball kid is a joke.

I'm not sure that's totally fair. He's just still under daddy's thumb, as a lot of 19 year old kids are, especially those whose entire lives have been dominated by that person (this dude is like Joe Jackson without the Jehovah's Witnesses).

I think Lonzo is a really good player. His dad is making his life so much worse for him, and I feel bad for the kid. I don't feel as bad for his other 2 kids because they got scholarships to UCLA as part of a deal with Lavar to get Lonzo there (that's just my hunch because neither of them is good enough to be such early recruits to UCLA).

[gam7]

These shoes look like what I had to wear as part of my uniform when I worked in food concessions at Sea World during high school. I got them at Payless Shoe Source for about $15.

[CrazyNotCrazie]

As a rookie, no less. I hope Jeannie is smart to pass on this clown. Take Fultz, J Jackson, Tatum, D Smith, Fox, or Monk. This Ball kid is a joke.

He is an excellent player who will do fine in the NBA. But he will not live up to his dad's hype. Going to the Lakers would be the worst thing that could happen to him - he needs to get as far away from home as possible. And to a team with a strong coaching staff and infrastructure that will insulate him from his dad's stupidity. I know it can't and won't happen but if he somehow ended up on the Spurs, do you think Pop would put up with this? No way. As a Knicks fan, I can only imagine what it would be like here...

[English]

These shoes look like what I had to wear as part of my uniform when I worked in food concessions at Sea World during high school. I got them at Payless Shoe Source for about $15.

Don't forget about the LO2 flip flops, retailing for a reasonable $220. Only real Big Ballers need apply.

[CameronBornAndBred]

And to a team with a strong coaching staff and infrastructure that will insulate him from his dad's stupidity.
I predict that dad is going to get banned by his son's team before the end of the season.

[CDu]

I will give Lavar Ball credit for one thing: he is taking basically a zero-risk approach to his sales. The reason there is a 6-month lag from when you "pre-order" to when you receive the shoe is likely because he isn't producing any shoes without a purchase in hand. So, basically, you pay him, then he makes a shoe. No inventory concerns.

It's probably the same with the shirts, socks, and hats, though the turnaround time for those is less (basically he just orders some crappy shirts/hats/socks, throws a logo on them, and ships them). So basically his operating costs are minimal, and the risk of unsold inventory is nonexistent.

Now, the market is of course going to be smaller (though not nonexistent). But if you are profiting at, say, $250-350 per pair of shoes (add another $600-800 if signed), $150 per pair of flip-flops, $20 per hat, and $40 per t-shirt, what does it really matter? Sell just 100 pairs of shoes and you've made $25-35K. Sell 100 pairs of signed shoes and you're around $100K in profit. It's not nothing, but then again 100 pairs of shoes is basically nothing anyway.

What is more interesting is that their website is actively using LiAngelo and LaMelo Ball to promote their products, which has to raise questions about eligibility. Seems like a no-no with respect to the NCAA.

[Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15]

I will give Lavar Ball credit for one thing: he is taking basically a zero-risk approach to his sales. The reason there is a 6-month lag from when you "pre-order" to when you receive the shoe is likely because he isn't producing any shoes without a purchase in hand. So, basically, you pay him, then he makes a shoe. No inventory concerns.

The doughnut place down the street from my work does that, and somehow it is far more charming. And, it is 6 minutes, not 6 months.

[JasonEvans]

What is more interesting is that their website is actively using LiAngelo and LaMelo Ball to promote their products, which has to raise questions about eligibility. Seems like a no-no with respect to the NCAA.

The UCLA compliance folks must be freaking out.

[uh_no]

The UCLA compliance folks must be freaking out.

or UCLA is realizing this gives them an out so they don't even have to let the other 2 set foot on campus!

[CameronBornAndBred]

The UCLA compliance folks must be freaking out.
I thought they looked at this once and decided they were all fine and dandy. (Which boggled my mind back then.)

Edit..and so they did.


Yet the NCAA, which has (http://articles.latimes.com/1995-10-13/sports/sp-56618_1_edwards-suspended)suspended players for accepting $150 worth of groceries, hasn't disciplined UCLA's young star. In a joint statement in response to inquiries about Big Baller Brand, the NCAA and UCLA said: " Like many schools, UCLA has frequently worked with the NCAA to determine what is and is not allowed within the member-adopted rules. While neither the NCAA nor UCLA will address details of a specific student-athlete's situation, both are comfortable the appropriate measures have been taken to review the potential issues under NCAA rules and processes regarding Lonzo Ball. As is standard practice, both will continue to work together to monitor this matter."
http://time.com/4699494/lonzo-ball-lavar-ball-ucla-ncaa-tournament/

You can be sure those "appropriate measures" include BB2 and 3 as well.

[jv001]

This thread is already 4 pages longer than I expected. :cool: GoDuke!

[TKG]

The UCLA compliance folks must be freaking out.

Probably should speak to the UNCheats and the Denistry Foundation.

[CDu]

I thought they looked at this once and decided they were all fine and dandy. (Which boggled my mind back then.)

Edit..and so they did.


http://time.com/4699494/lonzo-ball-lavar-ball-ucla-ncaa-tournament/

You can be sure those "appropriate measures" include BB2 and 3 as well.

Lonzo Ball isn't the issue. He is out of school. LiAngelo and LaMelo are currently advertised on the BBB website, though both are amateurs.

[Newton_14]

Probably should speak to the UNCheats and the Denistry Foundation.

Would be kinda hard to speak to the "good dentist" now seeing as he mysteriously died this week. Sort of like the "good agent" died at an opportune time for the Cheats a few years back.

[Pghdukie]

An honest, serious question - how many pair of shoes will the speculators,memorabilia collectors, etc buy ? First edition units can either grow in value - or be totally worthless. Comments?

[gam7]

Now, the market is of course going to be smaller (though not nonexistent). But if you are profiting at, say, $250-350 per pair of shoes (add another $600-800 if signed), $150 per pair of flip-flops, $20 per hat, and $40 per t-shirt, what does it really matter? Sell just 100 pairs of shoes and you've made $25-35K. Sell 100 pairs of signed shoes and you're around $100K in profit. It's not nothing, but then again 100 pairs of shoes is basically nothing anyway.


Wow, I did not realize the premium for the signed shoes.
Imagine what he'll charge for Lonzo's signature!

[LasVegas]

A large part of me wants this kid to be a huge bust. And that's a shame because from all accounts he is said to be a very nice/humble kid. His dad has ruined it for me.

[mdj]

I'll be the contrarian and say (having coached little league in subrurban USA and watched countless parents drop their kids off at practice then bury their heads in their smart phones for an hour while I tried to get little Billy to pay just a little bit of attention) there are MUCH worse parents than Mr Ball. Probably some fellow Dukies. I agree the guys not perfect (or anything close) but he's a MUCH better than average Dad IMO.

[arnie]

I will give Lavar Ball credit for one thing: he is taking basically a zero-risk approach to his sales. The reason there is a 6-month lag from when you "pre-order" to when you receive the shoe is likely because he isn't producing any shoes without a purchase in hand. So, basically, you pay him, then he makes a shoe. No inventory concerns.

It's probably the same with the shirts, socks, and hats, though the turnaround time for those is less (basically he just orders some crappy shirts/hats/socks, throws a logo on them, and ships them). So basically his operating costs are minimal, and the risk of unsold inventory is nonexistent.

Now, the market is of course going to be smaller (though not nonexistent). But if you are profiting at, say, $250-350 per pair of shoes (add another $600-800 if signed), $150 per pair of flip-flops, $20 per hat, and $40 per t-shirt, what does it really matter? Sell just 100 pairs of shoes and you've made $25-35K. Sell 100 pairs of signed shoes and you're around $100K in profit. It's not nothing, but then again 100 pairs of shoes is basically nothing anyway.

What is more interesting is that their website is actively using LiAngelo and LaMelo Ball to promote their products, which has to raise questions about eligibility. Seems like a no-no with respect to the NCAA.

Assume Roy has instructed some random UNC foundation to purchase a few thousand pair of the signed shoes. That gives him a leg up on actually signing one of the Ball kids in the future.

[CameronBornAndBred]

I thought they looked at this once and decided they were all fine and dandy. (Which boggled my mind back then.)

Edit..and so they did.


http://time.com/4699494/lonzo-ball-lavar-ball-ucla-ncaa-tournament/

You can be sure those "appropriate measures" include BB2 and 3 as well.


Lonzo Ball isn't the issue. He is out of school. LiAngelo and LaMelo are currently advertised on the BBB website, though both are amateurs.
See bold text.

[Papa John]

I'll be the contrarian and say (having coached little league in subrurban USA and watched countless parents drop their kids off at practice then bury their heads in their smart phones for an hour while I tried to get little Billy to pay just a little bit of attention) there are MUCH worse parents than Mr Ball. Probably some fellow Dukies. I agree the guys not perfect (or anything close) but he's a MUCH better than average Dad IMO.

That's a pretty low bar... There are also far better parents than Mr. Ball, and I'm not sure I'd say that he's a "MUCH better than average Dad." He really is setting his kid up for a very unpleasant initiation into the league, and I daresay that I don't think he's doing him any financial favors, either, by locking the kid into the 'family business.' Mr. Ball has a warped sense of mathematics and statistics, which will likely cost the kid tens of millions of dollars in the long run...

[bob blue devil]

That's a pretty low bar... There are also far better parents than Mr. Ball, and I'm not sure I'd say that he's a "MUCH better than average Dad." He really is setting his kid up for a very unpleasant initiation into the league, and I daresay that I don't think he's doing him any financial favors, either, by locking the kid into the 'family business.' Mr. Ball has a warped sense of mathematics and statistics, which will likely cost the kid tens of millions of dollars in the long run...

yeah, i hesitate to render greater judgment on lavar than he's a mixed bag. would lonzo be where he is without lavar? doubtful. does that make lavar perfect dad? obviously not. even on the whole BBB thing - i mean look at the publicity he is creating as a polarizing anti-establishment persona (stealing point made by savvy poster previously) - didn't we just learn the power of this stuff with our recent election? is anybody in mainstream media talking about any of the other prospective top 5 picks right now? and i wonder how much he has to back this up on the court for it to work out - there are plenty of examples in sports of personalities achieving levels of fame not warranted by results. even if BBB fails on its own and lonzo winds up doing a traditional shoe deal, lonzo's brand is probably more valuable with all this publicity. that said, this feels more like lamar's brand that is being built - it will be interesting to see how it filters through to lonzo/whether he can play the part too.

don't get me wrong, i am no lavar fan and suspect his megalomania will eventually cost them big time. but i don't see clear evidence that it has happened yet.

[mdj]

That's a pretty low bar... There are also far better parents than Mr. Ball, and I'm not sure I'd say that he's a "MUCH better than average Dad." He really is setting his kid up for a very unpleasant initiation into the league, and I daresay that I don't think he's doing him any financial favors, either, by locking the kid into the 'family business.' Mr. Ball has a warped sense of mathematics and statistics, which will likely cost the kid tens of millions of dollars in the long run...

True it is a low bar but it's maybe 10-20% of parents I'd say. Also agree that if I was lonzo's agent this wouldn't be the road I'd take but he did just orchestrate the highest profile launch of a shoe that I can remember with a marketing budget of roughly zero. With no middle man guessing their margins are about $400 a pair, it's not inconceivable that they do ok. I'd be happy to see them do well, not so much that I'll be buying a pair though.

[JasonEvans]

He really is setting his kid up for a very unpleasant initiation into the league, and I daresay that I don't think he's doing him any financial favors, either, by locking the kid into the 'family business.' Mr. Ball has a warped sense of mathematics and statistics, which will likely cost the kid tens of millions of dollars in the long run...

So, There have been a flurry of reports -- none of which seem to have any more than rumors/buzz as their basis -- that say 5000 pairs of Lonzo's shoe sold in the first 24 hours. It is pretty widely assumed that a certain top 3 pick in the draft (which Lonzo is) would get around $2 mil per year from a shoe company if he had signed with one of them. Well, 5000 shoes at $495 per shoe (he could have some some of the $900 signature shoes too) would be $2.5 mil in revenue and the Ball family gets to keep all of that money (except the cost of making the shoes, which is supposedly in the $50 range, depending on how many Lavar orders at one time).

In other words, the reports said, Lavar just made his son at least $2 million of profit in 24 hours... the same that Nike or Addidas would have paid him for a year.

So much for the "costing his kid tens of millions of dollars" argument.

But, that only works if they did actually sell 5000 shoes. No one seems to know...

So, an outlet called NiceKicks.com decided to try to find out (http://www.nicekicks.com/facts-many-pairs-sneakers-big-baller-brand-actually-sell/). One of the writers there actually bought a pair almost as soon as the BBB store opened. He is fairly sure he bought the second pair of ZO2s on the website. NiceKicks has been using invoice numbers as well as inventory tracking and they have a muuuuch smaller figure than 5000 shoes sold.


Out of the 328 transactions that happened on BigBallerBrand.com in the first 24 hours that the shoes were offered for sale, we tracked that a total of just 263 pairs of sneakers had sold in both signed and unsigned versions of the ZO2 Prime.

After noting the initial product levels at the start and deducting the current units sold, we can confidently say that 210 pairs of unsigned ZO2 Primes had sold (103 pairs in sz 8.5 alone), along with 53 autographed ZO2 Primes.

Not accounting for shipping or sales tax (that doesn’t appear to be properly applied to transactions anyways), the total revenue for footwear in the first 24 hours was $157,685, based on the numbers sold for signed, unsigned, and the larger sizes that are priced at an extra $200.

While $157,685 is an incredible amount of sales in one day, it is far from the $2.5Million that numerous outlets have reported today online.

-Jason "I wonder if Lavar will ever accurately report on the number of shoes sold... I doubt it" Evans

[Papa John]

So, There have been a flurry of reports -- none of which seem to have any more than rumors/buzz as their basis -- that say 5000 pairs of Lonzo's shoe sold in the first 24 hours. It is pretty widely assumed that a certain top 3 pick in the draft (which Lonzo is) would get around $2 mil per year from a shoe company if he had signed with one of them. Well, 5000 shoes at $495 per shoe (he could have some some of the $900 signature shoes too) would be $2.5 mil in revenue and the Ball family gets to keep all of that money (except the cost of making the shoes, which is supposedly in the $50 range, depending on how many Lavar orders at one time).

In other words, the reports said, Lavar just made his son at least $2 million of profit in 24 hours... the same that Nike or Addidas would have paid him for a year.

So much for the "costing his kid tens of millions of dollars" argument.

But, that only works if they did actually sell 5000 shoes. No one seems to know...

Only works if they did actually sell 5000 shoes... and if they continue to sell shoes in years to come. Come on, Jason. The benefit of a shoe deal isn't 2.5 million in a year, it's in tens of millions over multiple years, as endorsements normally work. You know that. The ZO2s are a novelty that some collectors will, indeed shell out money for, some hoping that they will get a return in the future through the rarity of the artifact say 10 years down the road. The question is will these shoes sell beyond this initial release period to those select few. My hunch is they won't. Thus papa Ball has effectively cost his son tens of millions...

[JasonEvans]

You know, if Lavar had priced these suckers a bit more reasonably -- like say $195 for regular shoes -- and then really put a premium on the signature shoes then I don't think it would have been nearly as controversial and I bet he would have sold 5k or 10k or more in the first few days. The guy does know how to get media attention and that kind of attention will sell a fair number of shoes.

-Jason "I won't be even mildly surprised if Lonzo makes more off shoe sales in the first year than he would have with a big shoe brand... but years 2-??? depend upon his actual performance in the NBA" Evans

[sagegrouse]

So, There have been a flurry of reports -- none of which seem to have any more than rumors/buzz as their basis -- that say 5000 pairs of Lonzo's shoe sold in the first 24 hours. It is pretty widely assumed that a certain top 3 pick in the draft (which Lonzo is) would get around $2 mil per year from a shoe company if he had signed with one of them. Well, 5000 shoes at $495 per shoe (he could have some some of the $900 signature shoes too) would be $2.5 mil in revenue and the Ball family gets to keep all of that money (except the cost of making the shoes, which is supposedly in the $50 range, depending on how many Lavar orders at one time).

In other words, the reports said, Lavar just made his son at least $2 million of profit in 24 hours... the same that Nike or Addidas would have paid him for a year.

So much for the "costing his kid tens of millions of dollars" argument.

But, that only works if they did actually sell 5000 shoes. No one seems to know...

So, an outlet called NiceKicks.com decided to try to find out (http://www.nicekicks.com/facts-many-pairs-sneakers-big-baller-brand-actually-sell/). One of the writers there actually bought a pair almost as soon as the BBB store opened. He is fairly sure he bought the second pair of ZO2s on the website. NiceKicks has been using invoice numbers as well as inventory tracking and they have a muuuuch smaller figure than 5000 shoes sold.



-Jason "I wonder if Lavar will ever accurately report on the number of shoes sold... I doubt it" Evans

Jason -- Here's the scary part for me. Businesses need capital -- both successful and unsuccessful businesses. I don't see anyone backing Lavar, the proverbial loose cannon on the deck, unless he is willing to give up control, which won't happen. Except, there's one person who may back him -- that's Alonzo, and he may not have much choice. There goes Alonzo's bonus, salary, endorsements, whatever -- right to the bottom of the sea, sunk by an explosion of the loose cannon.

[JasonEvans]

The question is will these shoes sell beyond this initial release period to those select few. My hunch is they won't. Thus papa Ball has effectively cost his son tens of millions...

Yup, I made that same point about future sales in a post that went live literally seconds after your's did. But, I think future sales will largely depend upon the performance of Lonzo in the NBA. If he is a stud, he will sell shoes -- not as many as if he was with Nike or UA, but enough to make the family very, very rich -- but if he is not one of the 3-5 best PGs in the NBA then he is not going to sell many shoes at all and then papa will have cost him a lot of money.

I see this as Lavar betting big on his son's success. If Lonzo is one of the top 15-20 players in the NBA, then his athletic apparel brand will be worth tens, maybe hundreds of millions of dollars to the family because they would own all aspects of it. But, if Lonzo is merely a very good NBA player but not a great one the BBB brand will be worth only a marginal amount and may end up going bust. It is certainly a risky move by Lavar... but maybe Lonzo is that good.

-Jason "hard to root for him" Evans

[LasVegas]

I think lonzo ball has backup pg written all over him. He doesn't impress me all that much when watching his games. He lacks elite athleticism, great handles, and a decent looking shot. He has a nice size and vision, though.

[JasonEvans]

I think lonzo ball has backup pg written all over him. He doesn't impress me all that much when watching his games. He lacks elite athleticism, great handles, and a decent looking shot. He has a nice size and vision, though.

I dunno... I'm not a fan and have not seen him all that much but he does seem to have a really good sense of where to get the ball on the floor. Jason Kidd also lacked elite athleticism and a decent looking shot but he was a darn good NBA PG. I need to see him actually play in the league to render any kind of verdict, but NBA talent evaluators are decent at their job and they all say he is one of the top 3 players available in the draft.

[bob blue devil]

Jason -- Here's the scary part for me. Businesses need capital -- both successful and unsuccessful businesses. I don't see anyone backing Lavar, the proverbial loose cannon on the deck, unless he is willing to give up control, which won't happen. Except, there's one person who may back him -- that's Alonzo, and he may not have much choice. There goes Alonzo's bonus, salary, endorsements, whatever -- right to the bottom of the sea, sunk by an explosion of the loose cannon.

great point. i'd add the caveat that control is not binary and there are ways to be part of the financing of a project while both protecting your butt and not taking control over the bigger picture. e.g. i might be a shoe manufacturer who will finance shoe production by keeping control of that part of the process - if i can validate the pre-order book, have a lock-box on sales, and can mitigate risk with conservative production quotas, how much risk am i really taking? i know the money will be there for the shoes and i know i can deliver the shoes as promised.

[LasVegas]

I dunno... I'm not a fan and have not seen him all that much but he does seem to have a really good sense of where to get the ball on the floor. Jason Kidd also lacked elite athleticism and a decent looking shot but he was a darn good NBA PG. I need to see him actually play in the league to render any kind of verdict, but NBA talent evaluators are decent at their job and they all say he is one of the top 3 players available in the draft.

Yeah, his vision and basketball IQ could make him a top PG for sure. I just don't see it. PG is just such a deep position right now.

[rsvman]

You know, if Lavar had priced these suckers a bit more reasonably -- like say $195 for regular shoes -- and then really put a premium on the signature shoes then I don't think it would have been nearly as controversial and I bet he would have sold 5k or 10k or more in the first few days. The guy does know how to get media attention and that kind of attention will sell a fair number of shoes.

-Jason "I won't be even mildly surprised if Lonzo makes more off shoe sales in the first year than he would have with a big shoe brand... but years 2-??? depend upon his actual performance in the NBA" Evans

I don't think Lavar really understands the price point concept. Make the price higher and you have a larger profit margin, but sell fewer shoes; make the price lower and you sell more shoes but at a smaller profit margin. There's a place where profits are maximized, and it's neither on the really high end nor on the really low end.

I agree that if they were somewhere between $165 and $195 he probably would make a lot more money.

[dudog84]

I dunno... I'm not a fan and have not seen him all that much but he does seem to have a really good sense of where to get the ball on the floor. Jason Kidd also lacked elite athleticism and a decent looking shot but he was a darn good NBA PG. I need to see him actually play in the league to render any kind of verdict, but NBA talent evaluators are decent at their job and they all say he is one of the top 3 players available in the draft.

Not to be a jerk, but somebody recently went over NBA drafts and re-slotted the picks. I can't remember whether it was Featherston or a link from the main page, and I don't have the know-how to find it quickly (lots of links to individual years, but somebody did a bunch of years together). So I went to Wikipedia and started backward from 2013 (because that is the most recent year a draftee got to the All-Star game or all-NBA), often the best of the draft wasn't in the first 3 picks. My criteria is the un-scientific 10+ PPG career average.

2013: #1 Anthony Bennett (some say the biggest bust ever)
#3 Otto Porter
2012: #2 Michael Kidd-Gilchrist
2011: #2 Derrick Williams
2009: #2 Hasheem Thabeet

Going back further, remember the (in)famous #1s Michael Olowokandi and Kwame Brown. If you're wondering why 2010 didn't make the list, #2 and #3 have averaged 10.5 and 11.4 PPG...but they were picked over DeMarcus Cousins, Gordon Hayward, and Paul George.

The draft is a bit of a crapshoot unless you've got a LeBron available.

Yeah the old man is getting his kid some publicity, but he's also putting him in the cross-hairs.

[duke4ever19]

My brother-in-law was trying to convince me that LaVar is a genius, because he got rid of the middle-man (Nike, Adidas etc.) who takes a portion of each product sold. So, ideally, LaVar and the consumer are supposed to benefit from LaVar telling Nike where to stick it.

This sounds good in theory, but then wouldn't the shoes would be more affordable, with Nike not taking a chunk of it?

LaVar keeps saying that he's going to compete with Nike and Adidas etc. but I think he has priced himself out of that market. At $495, his competition is on 5th Avenue, not at the local sporting goods store.

[Edouble]

My brother-in-law was trying to convince me that LaVar is a genius, because he got rid of the middle-man (Nike, Adidas etc.) who takes a portion of each product sold. So, ideally, LaVar and the consumer are supposed to benefit from LaVar telling Nike where to stick it.

This sounds good in theory, but then wouldn't the shoes would be more affordable, with Nike not taking a chunk of it?

LaVar keeps saying that he's going to compete with Nike and Adidas etc. but I think he has priced himself out of that market. At $495, his competition is on 5th Avenue, not at the local sporting goods store.

No, because Nike is set up to produce millions of shoes every year. Lavar is going to have to produce, what, 1,000-3,000 pairs? When you buy (build) in bulk, it is much, much less expensive.

[gam7]

I don't think Lavar really understands the price point concept. Make the price higher and you have a larger profit margin, but sell fewer shoes; make the price lower and you sell more shoes but at a smaller profit margin. There's a place where profits are maximized, and it's neither on the really high end nor on the really low end.


Wouldn't this depend on demand elasticity? If demand didn't change at all in response to a change in price (which tends to be the case with luxury goods) then you'd charge at the high end. And Lavar clearly views his shoes as luxury goods.

[sagegrouse]

Wouldn't this depend on demand elasticity? If demand didn't change at all in response to a change in price (which tends to be the case with luxury goods) then you'd charge at the high end. And Lavar clearly views his shoes as luxury goods.



There is inelastic demand, as tend to be the case for luxury goods. Although, for every good, at some price it is ludicrously un-economic and no one will buy it. (500 bucks for a no-name sneaker meets my definition of ludicrously overpriced). Then there is elastic demand, which is price-sensitive. And then there is "no demand," which is a different case altogether. We shall see.

[moonpie23]

people who are going to buy the big Baller shoe at $495 click on that link and buy them, like i click on that hippie bracelet for my wife @ $14 cause i've got $20 in the paypal account...

[cato]

I don't think Lavar really understands the price point concept. Make the price higher and you have a larger profit margin, but sell fewer shoes; make the price lower and you sell more shoes but at a smaller profit margin. There's a place where profits are maximized, and it's neither on the really high end nor on the really low end.

I agree that if they were somewhere between $165 and $195 he probably would make a lot more money.


Tell that to Yeti.

Sometimes a premium actually helps something sell. I doubt this will be one of those times, but who knows.

I agree that this looks like it will end badly, but if one or more of the kids blow up, maybe they hit a home run.

[SupaDave]

If he was really smart they would let Lonzo sign with a shoe company and then use that money to invest in some REAL ESTATE. Then you could set the younger ones up.

He's doing it the hard way...

[duke4ever19]

No, because Nike is set up to produce millions of shoes every year. Lavar is going to have to produce, what, 1,000-3,000 pairs? When you buy (build) in bulk, it is much, much less expensive.

Where are you getting this number? Is that how many pairs you think LaVar has in stock, or is it the number of pairs you think he will sell in total?

In a NYT article, Matt Powell, a sports industry analyst at NPD group estimates that the number will be closer to 10,000 pairs sold, but he also said that the shoes should cost $500 only if "you did it in snakeskin and pixie dust . . . ."

I'm still flummoxed by the price of these shoes and LaVar's stated desire to compete with the major athletic shoe companies. Like I said, he's priced himself out of that market.

[elvis14]

I've pretty much ignored all things 'Ball' and didn't read this thread until this morning. Giving an undeserving person too much attention and credit can result in a real trumpster fire. But this morning when I was listening to Mike and Mike they played a clip from the Dan Lebetard show where Ball was asked about the price of the shoe. When he answered, in hyperbole, I thought I was listening to a cartoon character. In the space of about one minute I went from being apathetic to really wanting this guy (the Dad) to fail and fail big. I feel bad for the kids.

[Tom B.]

Dick Vitale throws some Twitter shade.


7398

[DangerDevil]

http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/19404697/lavar-ball-now-wants-3b-shoe-cos-want-get-deal

Now that he thinks Lonzo will go to LA, Papa Ball says the $1b offer that no one took him up on has increased to $3b. The saddest part of the interview to me is that LaVar "revealed" that they have orders for 400-500 pairs. My bet is that number is inflated but even if they have sold 500 pairs that's not even $250000 in revenue, compare that to the estimated $5m annually plus royalties that Kyrie supposedly makes from Nike. We might be talking about LaVar and the Big Baller Brand but I don't see anyone lining up to pay them for their talk or shoes.

https://www.forbes.com/profile/kyrie-irving/

[Dr. Rosenrosen]

http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/19404697/lavar-ball-now-wants-3b-shoe-cos-want-get-deal

Now that he thinks Lonzo will go to LA, Papa Ball says the $1b offer that no one took him up on has increased to $3b. The saddest part of the interview to me is that LaVar "revealed" that they have orders for 400-500 pairs. My bet is that number is inflated but even if they have sold 500 pairs that's not even $250000 in revenue, compare that to the estimated $5m annually plus royalties that Kyrie supposedly makes from Nike. We might be talking about LaVar and the Big Baller Brand but I don't see anyone lining up to pay them for their talk or shoes.

https://www.forbes.com/profile/kyrie-irving/
So 250K est. revenue minus expenses. Then pappa's cut of any profit and so, what, does Lonzo have to pay his dad the shortfall in expected windfall from his NBA salary?

[gam7]

Man, this is bad. If I'm Jeanie Buss, this is getting my attention.

https://www.yahoo.com/sports/news/lavar-ball-tells-fs1-host-stay-lane-testy-interview-190733413.html

[flyingdutchdevil]

...this thread is proof that whatever his father is doing, it's working.

Duke has zero interest in the Balls. Duke has zero interest in UCLA. Yet we have 7 pages dedicated to the Balls. Hate on LaVar all you want, but whatever he's doing works.

[MartyClark]

...this thread is proof that whatever his father is doing, it's working.

Duke has zero interest in the Balls. Duke has zero interest in UCLA. Yet we have 7 pages dedicated to the Balls. Hate on LaVar all you want, but whatever he's doing works.

I acknowledge your point. Duke and Duke fans don't have any personal stake in the Ball drama.

I still find it interesting and wonder how disruptive LeVar would be for the Lakers or another NBA team. I think this type of basketball dad is much more disruptive at the high school and college level.

I can't immediately think of an NBA dad who disrupted his son's team or career.

[DangerDevil]

...this thread is proof that whatever his father is doing, it's working.

Duke has zero interest in the Balls. Duke has zero interest in UCLA. Yet we have 7 pages dedicated to the Balls. Hate on LaVar all you want, but whatever he's doing works.

How is it working?

Admittedly plenty of people are talking about the Balls (us included) but the talk has to translate to sales of Big Baller Brand merchandise, I don't think that is happening now or in the future if LaVar keeps following his "business plan". I think that the Balls are leaving a lot of money on the table and alienating the establishment in the process, even if they are generating "buzz".

[Pghdukie]

...this thread is proof that whatever his father is doing, it's working.

Duke has zero interest in the Balls. Duke has zero interest in UCLA. Yet we have 7 pages dedicated to the Balls. Hate on LaVar all you want, but whatever he's doing works.

It doesn't cost $495 to join this thread. On this thread, you get good, hard, and sometimes humorous facts ! LaVar should have invested in DBR and it's posters

[subzero02]

Man, this is bad. If I'm Jeanie Buss, this is getting my attention.

https://www.yahoo.com/sports/news/lavar-ball-tells-fs1-host-stay-lane-testy-interview-190733413.html

I didn't think it was possible for Cowherd to sound reasonable... I guess all you have to do is sit him next to Lavar.

[kAzE]

So apparently LaVar wants $3 Billion from the major athletic companies for his Big Baller Brand license because "3 B's"

That's some serious market pricing research right there.

[sagegrouse]

So 250K est. revenue minus expenses. Then pappa's cut of any profit and so, what, does Lonzo have to pay his dad the shortfall in expected windfall from his NBA salary?

Moreover, starting a business takes investment. Lavar doesn't seem to have any money. I doubt that any bank or investment entity would have anything to do with him. So, maybe Alonzo gets to fund his Dad's company.

[Dr. Rosenrosen]

Moreover, starting a business takes investment. Lavar doesn't seem to have any money. I doubt that any bank or investment entity would have anything to do with him. So, maybe Alonzo gets to fund his Dad's company.
I'm deadly serious in suggesting that Lonzo better keep a close eye on his money. I could easily see his self-annointed "genius" of a father taking big loans (from Lonzo) to do god knows what without Lonzo ever seeing a dime in return.

[NSDukeFan]

I'm deadly serious in suggesting that Lonzo better keep a close eye on his money. I could easily see his self-annointed "genius" of a father taking big loans (from Lonzo) to do god knows what without Lonzo ever seeing a dime in return.

In that case would he be a Lonzo mourning ?

[Henderson]

So apparently LaVar wants $3 Billion from the major athletic companies for his Big Baller Brand license because "3 B's"


I'm going to start a crowd funding project to raise $3B and offer it to LaVar to go live out his days in a hut in Kyrgystan. One without a postal address, roads to or from, phone, cell service, or internet access. If everyone on the planet pitches in $1, we could make the world a better place.

[Indoor66]

I'm going to start a crowd funding project to raise $3B and offer it to LaVar to go live out his days in a hut in Kyrgystan. One without a postal address, roads to or from, phone, cell service, or internet access. If everyone on the planet pitches in $1, we could make the world a better place.

Tell you what. Raise the money, pay it to me and I will guarantee that he will withdraw from the spotlight. 😂

[CrazyNotCrazie]

Could everyone please just ignore this buffoon? He has done nothing to merit our attention. Let's just stop sticking a microphone in front of him and instead focus on the basketball talents of his son. He is clearly an attention-seeking, narcissistic grandstander with no grasp of reality. I feel horrible for his children and I think that potentially being drafted by the Lakers could be the worst thing that could happen to Ball, as he needs to move far, far away from his father. If he ends up with the Lakers, hopefully Magic and Walton will help him seek intense psychological counseling, hire a good lawyer to protect his soon-to-be significant assets from his father, and in general extricate himself from this train wreck.

[gam7]

In that case would he be a Lonzo mourning ?

Can't spork you, but very funny!

[chriso]

Can't spork you, but very funny!

He's (Ball's dad) like that crazy guy on the corner who screams to himself and anyone who passes by and makes eye contact.

[westwall]

Could everyone please just ignore this buffoon? . . , , He is clearly an attention-seeking, narcissistic grandstander with no grasp of reality.

I refuse to bite! It's off-topic.

[English]

...this thread is proof that whatever his father is doing, it's working.

Duke has zero interest in the Balls. Duke has zero interest in UCLA. Yet we have 7 pages dedicated to the Balls. Hate on LaVar all you want, but whatever he's doing works.

How much is Lavar Ball and his merch company making per page?

[flyingdutchdevil]

How much is Lavar Ball and his merch company making per page?

Probably more than you think. The genius of LaVar is that he's getting free marketing for his Big Baller Brand. Will this all backfire? Maybe. But give the guy credit for doing zero conventional marketing and already selling plenty of hats, shirts, and maybe even a few shoes.

Don't underestimate UCLA fans, Laker fans, and fans who wear BBB "ironically".

I think LaVar will crash and burn, but he's getting EVERYONE to talk about him.

[Furniture]

That family stinks reality TV.

[Henderson]

It shouldn't matter to me, but I can't help hoping the Lakers pass on Lonzo, just so LaVar is disappointed. Let him go watch games in Philadelphia, Phoenix, or Sacramento.

[Tom B.]

Couple of new viral videos making the rounds. LaMelo Ball, LaVar's youngest son, apparently had an epic disaster of a performance in an AAU game, which his team lost by 52 points.

Did I mention that LaVar is the team's organizer and coach? And the team's name is...the Big Ballers. Of course.

See LaMelo's "highlights" here: http://duke.247sports.com/Bolt/Watch-5-star-LaMelo-Balls-52-point-loss-is-going-viral-52939187

And here's a snippet from Lavar's halftime speech (the kid to Lavar's right, wearing #7, looks like he'd rather be anywhere but there): http://duke.247sports.com/Bolt/Watch-LaVar-Balls-animated-AAU-halftime-speech-didnt-help-52930448

[Pghdukie]

LaVar reminds me of the guy that made lots of money smashing watermelons. Only LaVar will not be so lucky !

[sagegrouse]

You can get a custom Lavar Ball autographed trading card from eBay for $59.95. Read this (http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/19629539/lavar-ball-signs-autograph-deal).

[Ichabod Drain]

This is hilarious.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iPteUZfRrKw

[JasonEvans]

You can get a custom Lavar Ball autographed trading card from eBay for $59.95. Read this (http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/19629539/lavar-ball-signs-autograph-deal).

There are only 200 of the cards and they sell for $60 each. That's total revenue of $12,000. I am betting Leaf (the card company that paid Ball) paid him $1000 to do this.

[JasonEvans]

This is hilarious.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iPteUZfRrKw

Holy #!%^! That is incredibly funny. To me, it shows that Lavar and Lonzo know just what they are doing.

[sagegrouse]

Holy #!%^! That is incredibly funny. To me, it shows that Lavar and Lonzo know just what they are doing.

My opinion of Lonzo Ball just increased 10,000 percent.

[elvis14]

My opinion of Lonzo Ball just increased 10,000 percent.

Mine too....and I still want him to fail spectacularly :-) Or better yet, play a long time in the NBA as a mediocre player never getting the big contract and losing out because he has no shoe contract. I hate to sound mean but after hearing his pops do interviews I just want a crash and burn scenario.

[rsvman]

This is hilarious.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iPteUZfRrKw

LOL. Thanks for posting this.

[Henderson]

My father never told 97% of my potential employers not to think about hiring me.

He must not have cared.

[Furniture]

Is that even serious? Wow!

[Olympic Fan]

I know this is an old thread, but Ball is back in the news (did he ever leave?)

In fact, he's all over the news. I went to ESPN's basketball page Thursday and the top three stories were all about LaVar Ball. I went back today and there are two new stories about the old (I can't use he word I want because I don't want the DBR software to label me a wanker) so and so.

His latest news -- he was coaching his AAU team Thursday night when he was given a technical foul by a female ref. That so offended Ball that he threatened to pull his team off the floor unless she was
removed ... and she was.

I know the guy is a publicity whore, but I don't understand why ESPN is in his pocket. I know I'm not the target market, but I would never ever spend a center on his Big Baller Brand.

[atoomer0881]

I know this is an old thread, but Ball is back in the news (did he ever leave?)

In fact, he's all over the news. I went to ESPN's basketball page Thursday and the top three stories were all about LaVar Ball. I went back today and there are two new stories about the old (I can't use he word I want because I don't want the DBR software to label me a wanker) so and so.

His latest news -- he was coaching his AAU team Thursday night when he was given a technical foul by a female ref. That so offended Ball that he threatened to pull his team off the floor unless she was
removed ... and she was.

I know the guy is a publicity whore, but I don't understand why ESPN is in his pocket. I know I'm not the target market, but I would never ever spend a center on his Big Baller Brand.

I had heard that he threatened to pull his team off the floor after receiving a technical. I had not heard that he requested a ref to be removed. The fact that she was is absolutely mind boggling to me. Like how does that even happen...?

[Olympic Fan]

Here's the ESPN story confirming that the ref was, in fact, pulled as Ball demanded:

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/20183144/female-referee-removed-lavar-ball-threatens-pull-aau-team-court

[MartyClark]

Here's the ESPN story confirming that the ref was, in fact, pulled as Ball demanded:

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/20183144/female-referee-removed-lavar-ball-threatens-pull-aau-team-court

Shame on the tournament officials for pulling a referee midgame. I don't understand why Adidas or their tournament crew gives in to a bully like LaVar. Talking about the female referee LaVar said "She needs to stay in her lane".

[BD80]

I know this is an old thread, but Ball is back in the news (did he ever leave?)

In fact, he's all over the news. I went to ESPN's basketball page Thursday and the top three stories were all about LaVar Ball. I went back today and there are two new stories about the old (I can't use he word I want because I don't want the DBR software to label me a wanker) so and so.

His latest news -- he was coaching his AAU team Thursday night when he was given a technical foul by a female ref. That so offended Ball that he threatened to pull his team off the floor unless she was
removed ... and she was.

I know the guy is a publicity whore, but I don't understand why ESPN is in his pocket. I know I'm not the target market, but I would never ever spend a center on his Big Baller Brand.

A week or 2 ago he forfeited a game his team was winning by having them walk off the court to protest a foul call.

And yet, for some reason, he is the biggest attraction at the Vegas AAU event in progress. Even King James couldn't get in to see a Ball game.

This must be the athletic incarnation of the Kardashians.

[atoomer0881]

Here's the ESPN story confirming that the ref was, in fact, pulled as Ball demanded:

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/20183144/female-referee-removed-lavar-ball-threatens-pull-aau-team-court


Shame on the tournament officials for pulling a referee midgame. I don't understand why Adidas or their tournament crew gives in to a bully like LaVar. Talking about the female referee LaVar said "She needs to stay in her lane".

That is absolutely disgraceful on the parts of the tournament officials and Adidas. What a horrible message that sends to the players and other coaches. That if you threaten the pull your team off the court, you can get away with whatever you want. Disgraceful.

Edit: ESPN updated the article. Below is Ball's full quote:

"She's got a vendetta," Ball told ESPN after the game. "I get that she's trying to break into the refereeing thing. But just giving techs and calling fouls, that's no way to do it. I know what she's trying to say, 'Oh I gave LaVar a tech, I'm strong.' That ain't got nothing to do with it. Just call the game. If you're going to be qualified, you better be in shape and you better know the game. And she's bad on both of them.

"She's not in shape, she's not calling the game right. And she don't understand. And now she's trying to make a name for herself, so she's walking around like, 'You know I'm the only woman in here.' Yeah we get it. I don't care if you're a woman, or a man or whatever, just be good at what you do. She needs to stay in her lane because she ain't ready for this. [Ref] the little kids first and then come up. Because she ain't did enough. She ain't got enough on her resume, I could tell."

So apparently he feels she's out of shape and not qualified. And she just got there with no experience but also has a vendetta against him? Sure LaVar. That makes sense. This guy is such a jerk

[CrazyNotCrazie]

I know this is an old thread, but Ball is back in the news (did he ever leave?)

In fact, he's all over the news. I went to ESPN's basketball page Thursday and the top three stories were all about LaVar Ball. I went back today and there are two new stories about the old (I can't use he word I want because I don't want the DBR software to label me a wanker) so and so.

His latest news -- he was coaching his AAU team Thursday night when he was given a technical foul by a female ref. That so offended Ball that he threatened to pull his team off the floor unless she was
removed ... and she was.

I know the guy is a publicity whore, but I don't understand why ESPN is in his pocket. I know I'm not the target market, but I would never ever spend a center on his Big Baller Brand.

I agree 100%. Stop paying attention to this idiot. I am sure ESPN does a ton of analytics that show that people click on these stories, but it just makes me visit their site less. Kind of like how they keep featuring Stephen A Smith on tv even though many people can't stand him. It is very sad that this is what this country is coming to. And get off my lawn!

[BD80]

Here's the ESPN story confirming that the ref was, in fact, pulled as Ball demanded:

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/20183144/female-referee-removed-lavar-ball-threatens-pull-aau-team-court

Amusingly, even after getting an official replaced, Ball STILL later forfeited the game by REFUSING to leave the court after getting a 2nd technical


A week or 2 ago he forfeited a game his team was winning by having them walk off the court to protest a foul call. ...

Last week: https://www.thescore.com/news/1337493

[Troublemaker]

I agree 100%. Stop paying attention to this idiot. I am sure ESPN does a ton of analytics that show that people click on these stories, but it just makes me visit their site less. Kind of like how they keep featuring Stephen A Smith on tv even though many people can't stand him. It is very sad that this is what this country is coming to. And get off my lawn!

Exactly. A lot of people can't stand him AND tune in to see what he's saying next. (There's no scenario where Smith is getting paid what he's paid and not producing ratings). I assume something similar is happening with Lavar. ESPN was pretty upfront that their re-structuring was going to focus on big personalities and less on news (because that's apparently what drives ratings and clicks). Lavar is a big personality if nothing else.

[BD80]

This is really sick:

Adidas "event officials reportedly ask[ed] the group who supplied refs for the tournament to 'put three officials on the game who will keep him in the building'"

https://www.cbssports.com/college-basketball/news/report-adidas-pressured-refs-to-avoid-calling-technical-fouls-against-lavar-ball/

This will really put LaVar in his place won't it?

[moonpie23]

the media, and the money makers can NOT walk away from a dumpster fire...it's too compelling...

they will aid and abet the fire itself, so they can make money from it, by showing it, and standing in mock shock.

"look how awful this is".....

[mgtr]

Ball, Sr. obviously believes in the maxim that any publicity is good publicity, as long as they spell your name right.

[Indoor66]

Ball, Sr. obviously believes in the maxim that any publicity is good publicity, as long as they spell your name right.

Why give them that publicity by linking to them or talking about them? What relevance to they have to anything of any consequence to anyone?:confused:

[sagegrouse]

Ball, Sr. obviously believes in the maxim that any publicity is good publicity, as long as they spell your name right.

Yes, indeed. But isn't it possible that Adidas is totally behind this? Apparently it is the Adidas Summer Championship, and it is making the decisions. Perhaps it sees Lavar Ball himself as the star of the tournament -- and the more outrageous, the better. Or, more realistically, Adidas is catering to Lavar's every whim and foot stomp to sign Lonzo to a shoe contract.

[Pghdukie]

Yes, indeed. But isn't it possible that Adidas is totally behind this? Apparently it is the Adidas Summer Championship, and it is making the decisions. Perhaps it sees Lavar Ball himself as the star of the tournament -- and the more outrageous, the better. Or, more realistically, Adidas is catering to Lavar's every whim and foot stomp to sign Lonzo to a shoe contract.

Or maybe Lavar is looking to sign a big contract with Vince McMahon

[elvis14]

I've pretty much said I can't stand Lavar from the first time I heard him speak. He's a real <wankerizer will remove>. I didn't think I could like him less...until I heard that the female ref was removed and later heard his comments about her. Turns out he's not just a real <wank> but he's a sexist <wank>. I like him less today than yesterday..who knew that could happen.

I will never buy anything from BBB and if any of my friends were to show up wearing that crap, I'd hassle them endlessly (and probably for years on end).

[kAzE]

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/20204846/lavar-ball-crossed-line-funny-carnival-barker-misogynist

Jay keeping it 100.

[duke4ever19]

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/20204846/lavar-ball-crossed-line-funny-carnival-barker-misogynist

Jay keeping it 100.

"I will no longer laugh at the behavior of LaVar Ball, nor will I participate in the coverage of his prattle and hot air. It is not worthy of our coverage and not at all funny anymore."

Jay, this article should be formal letter addressed to your employer -- ESPN -- yet your employer has taken a letter that should be a condemnation of their shameless promotion of this buffoon and turned it into . . . wait for it . . . yet another article about LaVar.

Let's not pretend what LaVar has said recently is any different from how he's been talking this whole time, yet ESPN has continued to give this man all the publicity he could ever hope for. LaVar had already said enough stuff 8-10 months ago to warrant an article like this [In fact, many columnists have beaten you to this by many months] yet your employer decided to continue making money off of it by making it "news."

[Deslok]

In a slight bit of promising news, the referees association who oversees ADIDAS summer events has withdrawn from their contract with them after the Las Vegas interaction, where even the NBA refs union clearly condemned Ball and ADIDAS for their actions https://www.cbssports.com/college-basketball/news/company-that-provides-refs-for-events-ends-relationship-with-adidas-over-lavar-ball/

[arnie]

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/20204846/lavar-ball-crossed-line-funny-carnival-barker-misogynist

Jay keeping it 100.

And yet Lavar's stain on college bball is so very faint as compared to the stain left by the Cheats. Yet Jay has only accolades for that fine, upstanding program.

[NSDukeFan]

"I will no longer laugh at the behavior of LaVar Ball, nor will I participate in the coverage of his prattle and hot air. It is not worthy of our coverage and not at all funny anymore."

Jay, this article should be formal letter addressed to your employer -- ESPN -- yet your employer has taken a letter that should be a condemnation of their shameless promotion of this buffoon and turned it into . . . wait for it . . . yet another article about LaVar.

Let's not pretend what LaVar has said recently is any different from how he's been talking this whole time, yet ESPN has continued to give this man all the publicity he could ever hope for. LaVar had already said enough stuff 8-10 months ago to warrant an article like this [In fact, many columnists have beaten you to this by many months] yet your employer decided to continue making money off of it by making it "news."

Could LaVar be a future president?

[Papa John]

"I will no longer laugh at the behavior of LaVar Ball, nor will I participate in the coverage of his prattle and hot air. It is not worthy of our coverage and not at all funny anymore."

Which is why Bilas took the time to... pen an article about said prattle and hot air? Keeping it real, indeed, Jay...

[uh_no]

Which is why Bilas took the time to... pen an article about said prattle and hot air? Keeping it real, indeed, Jay...

I thought for a second Jay was writing an article about himself. After the things he said and my interactions with him last year, he's only one step above Lavar to me. Minus the sexism. He's every bit as full of himself.

[CrazyNotCrazie]

And the new top story on ESPN.com is "MJ: Lavar couldn't beat me if I was one-legged" - I did not click through on it to encourage further articles from them like this. I begrudgingly know why ESPN runs stories like this - there are a lot of idiots in America who click through and read it. I wish ESPN would rise above this but that is clearly asking way too much of them. The bigger question is why is Michael Jordan giving this buffoon a moment of his attention? Just ignore him and he will hopefully go away!

I know I sound like an old man (I'm only in my 40s), but the dumbing down of this country is truly frightening. I enjoy my gossip as much as the next person, but this is really ridiculous. I guess I am enabling it in part by posting about it, but I truly try to ignore it and it is impossible to miss.

[kostar]

And the new top story on ESPN.com is "MJ: Lavar couldn't beat me if I was one-legged" - I did not click through on it to encourage further articles from them like this. I begrudgingly know why ESPN runs stories like this - there are a lot of idiots in America who click through and read it. I wish ESPN would rise above this but that is clearly asking way too much of them. The bigger question is why is Michael Jordan giving this buffoon a moment of his attention? Just ignore him and he will hopefully go away!

I know I sound like an old man (I'm only in my 40s), but the dumbing down of this country is truly frightening. I enjoy my gossip as much as the next person, but this is really ridiculous. I guess I am enabling it in part by posting about it, but I truly try to ignore it and it is impossible to miss.

CrazyNotCrazie - I read it for you and here's the excerpt:

"You got to understand the source. I think he played college, maybe?" Jordan told campers at his Flight School basketball camp Monday. "He averaged 2.2 points a game. Really?

"It doesn't deserve a response, but I'm [going to] give it to you because you asked the question. I don't think he could beat me if I was one-legged."

edit: adding link - http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/20218746/michael-jordan-says-beat-lavar-ball-one-one-one-leg -- not that I want people to click and read to add to ESPN's click/web analytics but more so for sourcing.

[brevity]

I wish ESPN would rise above this...

Why? ESPN is "this". It's up to us to rise above ESPN.

[BD80]

Why? ESPN is "this". It's up to us to rise above ESPN.

The real trick is to rise above the stench

[kAzE]

Why? ESPN is "this". It's up to us to rise above ESPN.

You guys are taking this way too seriously. LaVar is a punchline. He's popular because everyone hates him. He's the definition of "all publicity is good publicity."

There is a 10 page thread on DBR about LaVar. We can pretend to be better, but we're on the same exact level as ESPN. LaVar is controversial, he knows what he's saying is total garbage most of the time, but it gets everyone talking, and he stays in the spotlight. You can either completely ignore him, or keep coming back for more. Judging by the nearly 20,000 views on this thread, and the fact that you are reading this post right now, I'm guessing you chose the latter.

I'm okay with it. I think he's entertaining. He's just a harmless distraction who is a fun punching bag on social media. I don't think anyone really takes him seriously. You kind of lose all credibility when your claim to fame is that you boldly stated that you would beat MJ 1 on 1.

Besides, this amazing diss track (by Shaq of all people) would not exist without LaVar: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QeaRxgNe_Y0

It's basketball offseason. LaVar is keeping the masses entertained, mostly through people dissing him in creative ways.

[duke4ever19]

You guys are taking this way too seriously. LaVar is a punchline. He's popular because everyone hates him. He's the definition of "all publicity is good publicity."

There is a 10 page thread on DBR about LaVar. We can pretend to be better, but we're on the same exact level as ESPN. LaVar is controversial, he knows what he's saying is total garbage most of the time, but it gets everyone talking, and he stays in the spotlight. You can either completely ignore him, or keep coming back for more. Judging by the nearly 20,000 views on this thread, and the fact that you are reading this post right now, I'm guessing you chose the latter.

I'm okay with it. I think he's entertaining. He's just a harmless distraction who is a fun punching bag on social media. I don't think anyone really takes him seriously. You kind of lose all credibility when your claim to fame is that you boldly stated that you would beat MJ 1 on 1.

Besides, this amazing diss track (by Shaq of all people) would not exist without LaVar: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QeaRxgNe_Y0

It's basketball offseason. LaVar is keeping the masses entertained, mostly through people dissing him in creative ways.

Fine, you self-identify as on the same level as the people who churn out stories for clicks on ESPN. You aren't better. I'll take you at your word. My post here was to protest LaVar and people who want to get credit for seeing the obvious (he's clearly unstable) and saying "I don't think this is okay behavior."

As to your second comment, I highly disagree. As a psychotherapist, I worry for his children. LaVar is not a healthy human being and that's as far as I'll go, because it's not my place to diagnose him (but holy cow, it's tempting), but I fully expect at least one of his children to be estranged from him within, say, 10 years. It will happen. I've seen this movie too many times to count.

[Troublemaker]

As to your second comment, I highly disagree. As a psychotherapist, I worry for his children. LaVar is not a healthy human being and that's as far as I'll go, because it's not my place to diagnose him (but holy cow, it's tempting), but I fully expect at least one of his children to be estranged from him within, say, 10 years. It will happen. I've seen this movie too many times to count.

Are you sure he's not a different man privately and all this is just a public act that he's explained to his children beforehand? Are we looking at an unhealthy human being or an unconventional marketer (whose tactics I don't much like)?


Which is why Bilas took the time to... pen an article about said prattle and hot air? Keeping it real, indeed, Jay...

Yeah, my reaction was similar to yours. I think Lavar thanks Bilas for writing that column and bringing more attention to Lavar and the Balls, and in general, Lavar thanks ESPN for turning Lavar into a big deal and playing both sides of the perpetual Lavar controvery.

[uh_no]

Yeah, my reaction was similar to yours. I think Lavar thanks Bilas for writing that column and bringing more attention to Lavar and the Balls, and in general, Lavar thanks ESPN for turning Lavar into a big deal and playing both sides of the perpetual Lavar controvery.

and now both bilas and ball have what they want....more attention.

[BD80]

and now both bilas and ball have what they want...more attention.

I saw somewhere that they had a crackling Twitter battle:

"Am not!"
"Are too!"
"Am not!"
"Are too!"
"Am not!"
"Are too!"
"Am not!"
"Are too!"
...

[kAzE]

Fine, you self-identify as on the same level as the people who churn out stories for clicks on ESPN. You aren't better. I'll take you at your word. My post here was to protest LaVar and people who want to get credit for seeing the obvious (he's clearly unstable) and saying "I don't think this is okay behavior."

As to your second comment, I highly disagree. As a psychotherapist, I worry for his children. LaVar is not a healthy human being and that's as far as I'll go, because it's not my place to diagnose him (but holy cow, it's tempting), but I fully expect at least one of his children to be estranged from him within, say, 10 years. It will happen. I've seen this movie too many times to count.

Oh please . . . get off your high horse. LaVar has provided for his wife and 3 kids, raised them into successful young men, and all 3 of them got full scholarships to go to college. One of them is already a millionaire and his youngest probably will be someday as well. I think you could do much, much worse than LaVar Ball as a father.

You may dislike LaVar and disagree with his methods, but you're doing the exact same thing he did to LeBron by implying that he is a bad parent.

Why is neccessary to "protest" LaVar? He's not a public official. He has no responsibility to you or anyone except himself and his family. I don't like him, but there are way more important things for which you could spend your time protesting than LaVar Ball.

I'll reiterate my original point, and leave it at this: LaVar is a joke, and should not be taken seriously.

[JasonEvans]

SNL weighs in... hysterical.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3OvJrkc7wgE

-Jason "at the end, they call him Black Trump... will Lavar or Donald be more angry at that?" Evans

[WVDUKEFAN]

He's an embarrassment to the sport.

[gam7]

SNL weighs in... hysterical.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3OvJrkc7wgE

-Jason "at the end, they call him Black Trump... will Lavar or Donald be more angry at that?" Evans

This really is hilarious. If Lonzo wins a purple heart and Best Truck in His Class by JD Power and Associates, I will give Lavar his due.

[jimsumner]

"I don't care what you say about me, as long as you say something about me, and as long as you spell my name right."

George C. Cohan.

I've also seen something similar attributed to Boss Tweed.

So, Ball is hardly the first.

[BD80]

SNL weighs in... hysterical.


-Jason "at the end, they call him Black Trump... will Lavar or Donald be more angry at that?" Evans

Have the two ever been photographed together?

Could be make-up and wig ...

[MartyClark]

I hate to say it but I'm starting to enjoy some of the Big Baller stuff a bit. I may be the most old school guy on this board. I hate players who taunt, celebrate or brag.

The Big Baller is so outrageous and comical that I can't help but be slightly amused.

Please don't ban me from this board.

[Indoor66]

I hate to say it but I'm starting to enjoy some of the Big Baller stuff a bit. I may be the most old school guy on this board. I hate players who taunt, celebrate or brag.

The Big Baller is so outrageous and comical that I can't help but be slightly amused.

Please don't ban me from this board.

No ban but I do have to consider the ignore option. 😂😋😎

[Steven43]

I will never buy anything from BBB and if any of my friends were to show up wearing that crap, I'd hassle them endlessly (and probably for years on end).
Perhaps trusting one's friends to make their own decisions without reproach would be a decent option. You know, if one cares to keep said friends. Please don't take offense as this is advice for myself as much as it is for anyone else.

[elvis14]

Perhaps trusting one's friends to make their own decisions without reproach would be a decent option. You know, if one cares to keep said friends. Please don't take offense as this is advice for myself as much as it is for anyone else.

After reading your post, I rethought what I had to say about BBB and reexamined the relationship I have with my friends. After this extensive introspection....I don't think I was harsh enough when I said I'd hassle any friends wearing BBB crap endlessly. I mean 'hassle' isn't really the right term but the wankerizer would go nuts if I really typed what would happen and I have to double down on my response!

[-jk]

It's been too quiet on the bawler front!

LaMelo's about to get schooled! Home schooled, that is (https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/early-lead/wp/2017/10/02/lavar-ball-says-hell-home-school-son-lamelo-and-pull-him-out-of-high-school-basketball/)!


“I’m not dealing with the administration over there. I don’t want no distractions on Melo.

“So therefore I’m going to home-school him and make him the best basketball player ever.”

-jk

[CameronBornAndBred]

It's been too quiet on the bawler front!

LaMelo's about to get schooled! Home schooled, that is (https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/early-lead/wp/2017/10/02/lavar-ball-says-hell-home-school-son-lamelo-and-pull-him-out-of-high-school-basketball/)!



-jk

Chino Hills' coach probably just smiled as he threw out a case of aspirin.

[BD80]

It's been too quiet on the bawler front!

LaMelo's about to get schooled! Home schooled, that is (https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/early-lead/wp/2017/10/02/lavar-ball-says-hell-home-school-son-lamelo-and-pull-him-out-of-high-school-basketball/)!



“I’m not dealing with the administration over there. I don’t want no distractions on Melo.

“So therefore I’m going to home-school him and make him the best basketball player ever.”


-jk

UCLA has got to be loving Lavar's media obsession. Just in recent days, he paints a target on his sons' backs by saying they get offered huge amounts of $ in recruiting every summer. Now he brings UCLA's admission under the microscope. In all fairness, LaMelo probably already has his academics in order for graduation, and this is just Lavar trying to take credit for something the high school has already done.

Wonder how Alford feels about his highest recruit actively avoiding a year of coaching in order to focus solely on himself.

Undoubtedly, Melo is on board with this carnival show, hoping his dad's hype will turn him into the sensation his brother has become. I think the move will backfire as the public will get tired of the schtick. Of course, I thought the public would quickly tire of the Kardashians ...

Wonder how Lonzo feels about his dad calling Melo the best basketball player ever?

[bob blue devil]

It's been too quiet on the bawler front!

LaMelo's about to get schooled! Home schooled, that is (https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/early-lead/wp/2017/10/02/lavar-ball-says-hell-home-school-son-lamelo-and-pull-him-out-of-high-school-basketball/)!



“I’m not dealing with the administration over there. I don’t want no distractions on Melo.

“So therefore I’m going to home-school him and make him the best basketball player ever.”


-jk

well this is pretty consistent with lavar's behavior in general - he really strives to avoid distractions for his boys. :rolleyes:

[Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15]

UCLA has got to be loving Lavar's media obsession. Just in recent days, he paints a target on his sons' backs by saying they get offered huge amounts of $ in recruiting every summer. Now he brings UCLA's admission under the microscope. In all fairness, LaMelo probably already has his academics in order for graduation, and this is just Lavar trying to take credit for something the high school has already done.

Wonder how Alford feels about his highest recruit actively avoiding a year of coaching in order to focus solely on himself.

Undoubtedly, Melo is on board with this carnival show, hoping his dad's hype will turn him into the sensation his brother has become. I think the move will backfire as the public will get tired of the schtick. Of course, I thought the public would quickly tire of the Kardashians ...

Wonder how Lonzo feels about his dad calling Melo the best basketball player ever?

I suspect that Lonzo understands that now that he is in the league with the Lakers, dad's priorities move on down the line. Lavar will build up each of his kids in succession, and I have to admit that Lonzo seems like the real deal. Not "would break MJ's ankles in his prime" real deal, but definitely has some actual talent to back up dad's swagger.

Honestly, I find Lavar's bluster incredibly off-putting, but I do find the "BBB" schtick interesting in light of all the Adidas/Nike/NCAA action in the last week or so.

[JasonEvans]

I suspect that Lonzo understands that now that he is in the league with the Lakers, dad's priorities move on down the line. Lavar will build up each of his kids in succession, and I have to admit that Lonzo seems like the real deal.

But what about LaMiddleChild who just enrolled at UCLA? LiAngelo appears to be the least talented of the trio and most in need of "pumping up."

Wait, I just found this article (http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2716994-lavar-ball-told-son-liangelo-he-doesnt-think-hell-make-it-to-the-nba) from a couple months back.


"I told my boys that one of them wasn't going to make it. Because if you've got three, only one, maybe two make it to the NBA," Ball said, adding that LiAngelo is "going to be taken care of either way."

-Jason "so, apparently the 225th best high school recruit (according to 247) won't be one-and-done... color me shocked" Evans

[left_hook_lacey]

I've been playing the newly released NBA 2k18. The main character, DJ, is an up-and-coming NBA prospect trying to make it to stardom in the league. As you play the story mode, there comes a time when your player gets good enough to start getting attention and small contract offers from the shoe companies. You have to meet with Nike, Adidas, UA, etc. and decide which shoes you want to wear for a small bonus check per game.

So, as I played, I've been negotiating with Nike through my agent when suddenly, I get a rash of texts from, none other than, Lavar Ball. His profile pic shows up on the texts making a really dumb looking face. He sends me hyperbolic texts, asking if "I'm a real BALLER!!!!!" and blasting the other shoe companies as they don't represent "real ballers!!!". Much like real life, he doesn't go away until you respond to him. Then in a few days, he comes back.

So, it got me thinking. Who initiated the idea of possibly putting him in this game? Did 2k sports want him in to give the game some street cred, and a new dynamic? Or did Lavar and his endless PR machine irritate 2K until they entertained the idea? I wonder if the other "real" shoe companies care that he's in it? I can actually see the appeal to young teenagers and twenty somethings that want to stick it to the man, and wear big baller brand. This game is a genius way to appeal to that target demographic. Kids buy into BBB in the game, and before you know it, they want them in real life. I could see it being a status symbol because they are so expensive, and not everyone would have them unlike Jordans, etc.

It'll be interesting to see how this plays out in the story mode, as in, if he just goes away as the game goes on and DJ becomes a star. I'm almost interested in signing with him in the game, just to see how he behaves and carries himself as DJ's fame rises. You know Nike, Adidas, etc. aren't going to let BBB show them up in a video game.

I was just very surprised to see him have such a prominent role in the game. And I'll also add, you can go to foot locker, and the NBA store in the game and buy shoes, gear, etc for your character to wear around town. I wonder if BBB shoes are available in those stores? I'll have to go check.

[Henderson]

Chino Hills' coach probably just smiled as he threw out a case of aspirin.

And Steve Alford says, "Got it. Nice toss."