Brey Says Matt Farrell Is Better Than Bobby Hurley

[slower]

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/18915797/mike-brey-says-notre-dame-fighting-irish-pg-matt-farrell-better-bobby-hurley


Uh...no.

[JasonEvans]

I love Mike. Not only is he part of the Duke family, but he has built a great program at ND. They play a fun, fundamental brand of basketball and have been among the best teams in the land fairly consistently in recent years. Again, I love Mike.

But, I think this may be taking things (http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/18915797/mike-brey-says-notre-dame-fighting-irish-pg-matt-farrell-better-bobby-hurley) a bit too far.


Bobby Hurley was a first-team All-American at Duke, played in three Final Fours, won two national championships, was the most outstanding player of the Final Four and still holds the NCAA record for assists.

Matt Farrell is a first-team All-ACC tournament player at Notre Dame, an honorable mention All-ACC player, has played in two Elite Eight games and has 238 career assists -- just 838 shy of Hurley's mark.

"I think he's better than Hurley," Notre Dame coach Mike Brey said of Farrell.

Reminded of some of Hurley's credentials, Brey reiterated, "I think he's better. He shoots it better."

--Jason "for the record, Bobby Hurley hit a higher percentage of his shots from 2 and from 3 as a freshman, soph, and junior than Farrell did in each of his first 3 seasons" Evans

[FerryFor50]

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/18915797/mike-brey-says-notre-dame-fighting-irish-pg-matt-farrell-better-bobby-hurley


Uh...no.

"He shoots it better."

Farrell's career shooting %:
http://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/matt-farrell-1.html

42.5% FG
39.3% 3PT
82.3% FT
52.4 eFG%

Hurley's career shooting %:
http://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/bobby-hurley-1.html

41% FG%
40.5% 3pt
77.6% FT
51.5% eFG%

So Brey's not *wrong* about Farrell "shooting it better" (he's barely better, percentage-wise) but that doesn't make Farrell better than Hurley - especially when you take into account assists (3.1 apg to 7.7 apg) and defense. And the fact that Farrell could barely crack the rotation as a freshman.

I like Farrell's game a lot, but he's not even on the same level as Hurley.

[WillJ]

Farrell's a good player, but that's ridiculous. Also, Brey seems to forget that Hurley developed into an excellent on-ball defender.

[CrazyNotCrazie]

I love Mike. Not only is he part of the Duke family, but he has built a great program at ND. They play a fun, fundamental brand of basketball and have been among the best teams in the land fairly consistently in recent years. Again, I love Mike.

But, I think this may be taking things (http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/18915797/mike-brey-says-notre-dame-fighting-irish-pg-matt-farrell-better-bobby-hurley) a bit too far.



--Jason "for the record, Bobby Hurley hit a higher percentage of his shots from 2 and from 3 as a freshman, soph, and junior than Farrell did in each of his first 3 seasons" Evans

Maybe he was really referring to Danny Hurley...

[NYBri]

Whatevs. :cool:

[jacone21]

I think somebody must've slipped something into Brey's Brylcreem.

[rsvman]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hw3CE04LGiA

[uh_no]

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/18915797/mike-brey-says-notre-dame-fighting-irish-pg-matt-farrell-better-bobby-hurley


Uh...no.

yes?

[Indoor66]

Props to a coach blowing smoke.

[Duke79UNLV77]

Brey must be high. Don't they test for that in the tournament?

http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=bobby+hurley+duke+highlights&adlt=strict&view=detail&mid=BF6EF4579A68B4111F6FBF6EF4579A68B4111F6F&FORM=VRDGAR

How was it Hurley responded when Jimmy King called him an "average" point guard? Something like, I guess I'm just an average point guard with 2 national titles.

[RPS]

Brey must be high. Don't they test for that in the tournament?

It's a silly claim and obviously so. But I still appreciate Mike sticking up for his guy. It's something his mentor would do.

[English]

It's a silly claim and obviously so. But I still appreciate Mike sticking up for his guy. It's something his mentor would do.

"Nate James could beat up Mike Tyson in his prime."
- Coach K, probably

[RPS]

"Nate James could beat up Mike Tyson in his prime."
- Coach K, probably

"Patrick Davidson could beat up Mike Tyson in his prime."
- Coach K, probably

Fixed it.

[jacone21]

This could be a meme.

Mike Brey says Nickleback is better than Led Zeppelin.

Mike Brey says chuck steak is better than tenderloin.

[Listen to Quants]

Seems plausible. Bobby has lost a step over the last two decades.

[Jeffrey]

Brey might as well finish it off by stating which of his players he thinks are better than Grant Hill and Christian Laettner. After all, he coached all of them.

[Wander]

This could be a meme.

Mike Brey says Nickleback is better than Led Zeppelin.

Mike Brey says chuck steak is better than tenderloin.

Mike Brey says Attack of the Clones is better than Empire Strikes back.

Mike Brey says Nate Britt is better than Steph Curry.

Mike Brey says the Dorne subplot is the best storyline in Game of Thrones.

[dukejim1]

Maybe he was really referring to Danny Hurley...

Or Bob Hurley the Dad

[Tripping William]

#Sh*tMikeBreySays

[Philadukie]

It's a silly claim and obviously so. But I still appreciate Mike sticking up for his guy. It's something his mentor would do.

I think it's the opposite. Brey isn't doing Ferrell any favors by saying he's better - or even comparable - to Bobby Hurley. It only forces people to throw shade on Ferrell. Bobby Hurley was one of the greatest college PG's of all time. Matt Ferrell isn't even one of the best PG's THIS YEAR.

K would never say one of his current players is better than one of the all time greats. He might compare a player's style of play to other former Duke players, as I've heard him do from time to time, but that is very different.

K is sophisticated enough to know that nothing good comes from doing this, especially for the player.

[MaxAMillion]

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/18915797/mike-brey-says-notre-dame-fighting-irish-pg-matt-farrell-better-bobby-hurley


Uh...no.

I am sure people will get upset about it but it means nothing to me. Brey could say that Colston is better than Laettner and I wouldn't blink. Just as I didn't blink when Coach K refused to condemn Henderson hitting Hansblow in the face. Coaches tend to lose perspective when describing players they teach. The players become like family members.

[duke4ever19]

That's impressive!

I look forward to seeing Matt Farrell taken in the first round of the NBA draft as a lottery pick, just like Bobby! ;)

[plimnko]

i'll have some of what he's been smoking

[dukelifer]

"He shoots it better."

Farrell's career shooting %:
http://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/matt-farrell-1.html

42.5% FG
39.3% 3PT
82.3% FT
52.4 eFG%

Hurley's career shooting %:
http://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/bobby-hurley-1.html

41% FG%
40.5% 3pt
77.6% FT
51.5% eFG%

So Brey's not *wrong* about Farrell "shooting it better" (he's barely better, percentage-wise) but that doesn't make Farrell better than Hurley - especially when you take into account assists (3.1 apg to 7.7 apg) and defense. And the fact that Farrell could barely crack the rotation as a freshman.

I like Farrell's game a lot, but he's not even on the same level as Hurley.

Memory fades with age. When Farrell leads his team to three FFs and two national championships- call me.

[duketaylor]

"and has 238 career assists -- just 838 shy of Hurley's mark."

"I think he's better than Hurley," Notre Dame coach Mike Brey said of Farrell."

Please, Dr. Feelgood told me when Bobby was a frosh that nobody could anticipate the passes he could toss as they ran downcourt or else Bobby would have a hundred or more on top his "meager" (not) number. Dr. Joe said at the Blue-White game Bobby was hitting guys in the head and body because they were not ready for a pass that quickly.

So I'll have to disagree.

[Reilly]

Brey probably thinks Oscar Robertson was better than Nick Horvath, too.

[MrPoon]

Either he was talking about the ASU coach today not past Duke player (who, I suspect has lost some of this jump shooting skills) or Brey suffers from short term memory loss and all of this was actually a cry for help.
Wait, what if this is all a recruiting pitch? You should come ND and I'll blindly compare you to past greats.

[kmspeaks]

"Patrick Davidson could beat up Mike Tyson in his prime."
- Coach K, probably

Fixed it.

Except that one's not hyperbole, it's true.

[dukelifer]

Brey probably thinks Oscar Robertson was better than Nick Horvath, too.
Maybe but never in the summer.

[Newton_14]

"He shoots it better."

Farrell's career shooting %:
http://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/matt-farrell-1.html

42.5% FG
39.3% 3PT
82.3% FT
52.4 eFG%

Hurley's career shooting %:
http://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/bobby-hurley-1.html

41% FG%
40.5% 3pt
77.6% FT
51.5% eFG%

So Brey's not *wrong* about Farrell "shooting it better" (he's barely better, percentage-wise) but that doesn't make Farrell better than Hurley - especially when you take into account assists (3.1 apg to 7.7 apg) and defense. And the fact that Farrell could barely crack the rotation as a freshman.

I like Farrell's game a lot, but he's not even on the same level as Hurley.
It's laughable. Farrell is a good player. Better than I thought he was going to be when I first saw him last season. Hurley was other worldly in college, and the Number 7 pick in the NBA draft. I get that Brey wants to pump his player up, but this is nothing other than coach speak. And don't even get me started on defense, playmaking, ball handling, and the ability to lead and direct a team. It's just not even close. That's that saying Beachum is a better player than Grant Hill was, or that Bonzie is better than Laettner was. Uh No.

[rsvman]

Mike Brey says Trump is a better president than Lincoln.


Too soon?

[weezie]

Ahhh, the Ol' Tugboat Cap'n Brey somehow always managing to get a little dig in on Duke. Hooray for him, classless though he obviously is. Otoh, Hurley's response was all class.

Obviously, Cap'n Tugboat must be veeerrrryyy tired of the Duke references. Considering how he's proved that he can win on the big stage. Uh, what?

[Reddevil]

The Flat Earth Society agrees with Brey.

[91devil]

Mike Brey says he'd prefer to see Matt Jones shoot clutch three-pointers in the last minute of a conference championship game.

[Hingeknocker]

The only way this makes sense is if Brey is making an argument that modern basketball players in general are better than their historical counterparts. I'd like to think this is the argument he is making, since it's obvious that Hurley is, by far, the more accomplished player. However, it's kind of indisputably true that basketball players of today are much, much better at the actual playing of basketball than at any point in history. What I mean by this is that their skill level (shooting, especially) and tactical understanding of the game far outstrips those who came before them. This is true for all sports, too; Aaron Rodgers is better at playing quarterback than basically every QB who played pre-2000. If you transported him back in time and he kept his current skill level, he'd be the best QB in the league. In college basketball, one of Ken Pomeroy's favorite stats to track on his Twitter account is the national FT%. If I recall the last time he updated the stat, this season's crop of college basketball players is about to set a new all-time record for that stat.

While it may not seem particularly instructive, or just self-evident, to view players' skill levels this way, it actually has real world implications to understand that players collectively improve their abilities over time. It's because of this that 3-point lines are introduced and moved back. The current ability of NBA players to shoot 3's may force the league to adopt even more radical changes to their 3-point line. In football, they moved back extra points because NFL kickers were just too good at them. I think I've rambled, but when I saw this headline I had a small hope that this is the point Brey was trying to make. But he was probably just trying to pump up his guy, which is fine with me, too.

[rsvman]

Mike Brey says Dude, Where's Your Car is a better movie than Citizen Kane.

This is kind of fun.

[camion]

I don't think it's a big thing unless he doubles down on it.

Then IT'S ON. :mad:

[chriso]

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/18915797/mike-brey-says-notre-dame-fighting-irish-pg-matt-farrell-better-bobby-hurley


Uh...no.
I say sure as long as you overlook the 2 National Titles and the first team All-America thing.:cool: Is this a new drinking game among the rich and famous? Say something outrageous (the world is flat) and watch the media go coo coo for cocoa puffs?

[Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15]

Is Ferrell the one who looks like a beardy Harry Potter?,

[OldPhiKap]

Brey prefers New Coke, and thinks the new "Most Interesting Man in the World" is an improvement.

[cato]

Brey thinks Caddyshack 2 is better

[luburch]

Mike Brey thinks UNC players went to class.

[CrazyNotCrazie]

Brey thinks Roy uses timeouts too liberally

[weezie]

Brey actually likes talking chairs.

[WVDUKEFAN]

He's nuts. Bobby Hurley, in my humble opinion, was the best PURE POINT GUARD ever to play college basketball.

[left_hook_lacey]

Mike Brey thiinks Western NC BBQ is better.

[TruBlu]

Mike Brey says that Rosie O'Donnell:p is better than Kate Upton:).

[OldPhiKap]

Mike Brey recommends sugar-filled gum for his patients that chew gum.


(Actually, I like Brey and have no problem with him giving props to his kids. I'm sure that when K recruits, he mentions how Mr. Recruit reminds him of X and how K used him at Duke or in the USA Basketball teams).

[MChambers]

Mike Brey recommends sugar-filled gum for his patients that chew gum.


(Actually, I like Brey and have no problem with him giving props to his kids. I'm sure that when K recruits, he mentions how Mr. Recruit reminds him of X and how K used him at Duke or in the USA Basketball teams).

He didn't say Farrell "reminds" him of Hurley; he said Farrell is better. Silly thing to say.

Brey thinks light beer is better than real ale.

[duketaylor]

Mike Brey thinks the ceiling is the roof.:confused:

[OldPhiKap]

Mike Brey thinks the ceiling is the roof.:confused:

duketaylor wins the thread.

[Reilly]

Brey prefers New Coke, and thinks the new "Most Interesting Man in the World" is an improvement.

Mike Brey thinks Cindy is the best-looking Brady sister.

[flyingdutchdevil]

Brey is supporting his players and comparing to legends. That's probably an ego boost. Yeah - the comparison is a little farfetched, but it's not the worst comparison to come out of a coach's mouth.

[jacone21]

Mike Brey thiinks Western NC BBQ is better.

Uh Oh. Now you've done it. Religion and politics discussions are verboten here.

Slaw on a sandwich? Really?

[cato]

Brey is supporting his players and comparing to legends. That's probably an ego boost. Yeah - the comparison is a little farfetched, but it's not the worst comparison to come out of a coach's mouth.

FDD thinks Mike Brey is a better coach than Mike . . .


:-)

[OldPhiKap]

When asked "Ginger or Maryanne?," Brey answers "Lovey"

[Troublemaker]

Am I the only one who doesn't think this is a big deal. At all? Brey is supporting his players and comparing to legends. That's probably an ego boost.

While I agree it's no big deal, this thread is too fun, regardless.

FDD thinks Bluto should've been interrupted when he got rolling in his speech...

[FerryFor50]

Brey is supporting his players and comparing to legends. That's probably an ego boost. Yeah - the comparison is a little farfetched, but it's not the worst comparison to come out of a coach's mouth.

I don't think most people think it's a big deal. But it is absurd, and must be called out as such. :D

[Jeffrey]

Am I the only one who doesn't think this is a big deal. At all?

If Brey had not coached Bobby Hurley, then I would agree with you. Since he did, then, IMO, he is minimizing the accomplishments of one of his former players. Bobby was one of the all-time great college PGs and his former assistant coach should not diminish that by saying he was not as good as Matt Farrell.

[gus]

In Brey's defense, Farrell probably is better than Bobby right now.

[jacone21]

Brey says packet gravy is better than Granny's.

[Jeffrey]

In Brey's defense, Farrell probably is better than Bobby right now.

I dare you to say that to Bobby.

[Rich]

Mike Brey says his team won the 2017 ACC Tournament

[gus]

I dare you to say that to Bobby.

No thanks.

http://images.performgroup.com/di/library/sporting_news/b2/96/hurley-bobby110914-getty-ftrjpg_1f7zm1alowps61i4fvawcitw7u.jpg

(I did say "probably")

In all seriousness -- if Bobby hadn't had the accident in his 20s, I wouldn't bet against the 45 year old Hurley against Farrell.

[rsvman]

Mike Brey says The Bridges of Madison County is a better book than The Brothers Karamazov.

[kAzE]

Yeah, this isn't a big deal. Mike Brey knows Bobby Hurley was better, but he has to instill belief in his own guys. You can't put limits on your players as a coach, so I don't begrudge him for saying what he said. I'm sure he's hoping Matt Farrell can be better than Bobby Hurley for 2-6 games in this tournament.

But he's obviously wrong, and I'm sure he knows it. After all, he coached Bobby.

[killerleft]

Mike Brey thiinks Western NC BBQ is better.

He's wrong about that! As long as he doesn't get silly and include the Lexington style, he's alright by me. Lex IS just west of the center of the state, I guess.

Out in the mountainy region they have a multitude of styles. In Lexington they have the festival where more barbeque is consumed in one day than probably a year's worth of eastern style 'que in the flatlands. Hakk-kaff!!! Mmmmmm, barbeque.

[Jeffrey]

No thanks.

(I did say "probably")

In all seriousness -- if Bobby hadn't had the accident in his 20s, I wouldn't bet against the 45 year old Hurley against Farrell.

Smart man!

Bobby might still win, if there were no refs.

[left_hook_lacey]

Uh Oh. Now you've done it. Religion and politics discussions are verboten here.

Slaw on a sandwich? Really?

Yes.

[left_hook_lacey]

He's wrong about that! As long as he doesn't get silly and include the Lexington style, he's alright by me. Lex IS just west of the center of the state, I guess.

Out in the mountainy region they have a multitude of styles. In Lexington they have the festival where more barbeque is consumed in one day than probably a year's worth of eastern style 'que in the flatlands. Hakk-kaff!!! Mmmmmm, barbeque.

So, quantity over quality? :p

[OldPhiKap]

I thought East NC BBQ v. West NC BBQ was PPB and off-limits.

[LasVegas]

Mike Brey thinks Lavar Ball could beat MJ in his prime.

[left_hook_lacey]

I thought East NC BBQ v. West NC BBQ was PPB and off-limits.

I withdrawal my last statement your honor.

[BandAlum83]

Mike Brey thinks Lavar Ball could beat MJ in his prime.

I think this one might be true - on the basketball court. But in a Hollywood set built to look like a subway station, MJ and his homeys could dance circles around the entire Ball family!

The Balls aren't nearly as BADa** as MJ.

[dukebluesincebirth]

Mike Brey thinks the world is flat...or maybe he thinks it's round. Wait, did he say Farrell is better than Kyrie?

[Eakane]

I am sure people will get upset about it but it means nothing to me. Brey could say that Colston is better than Laettner and I wouldn't blink. Just as I didn't blink when Coach K refused to condemn Henderson hitting Hansblow in the face. Coaches tend to lose perspective when describing players they teach. The players become like family members.

Can't let that one pass

17.5 seconds left in the game
UNCheat up by 12
Hansbrough follows a missed free throw to dunk the ball.

Henderson did absolutely nothing wrong.

[davekay1971]

Mike Brey says Alien 3 is better than Aliens

Mike Brey says Back Street Boys are better than the Beatles

Mike Brey says The Hobbit movies are better than The Lord of The Rings movies.

[davekay1971]

Can't let that one pass

17.5 seconds left in the game
UNCheat up by 12
Hansbrough follows a missed free throw to dunk the ball.

Henderson did absolutely nothing wrong.

This.

As my father-in-law says, "Every once in a while, somebody just needs to have his *** kicked."

[killerleft]

So, quantity over quality? :p

Quantity of people who know quality when they, uh, eat it? I love both of the major North Carolina styles of Q. I just wanna set Mike Brey straight!:)

[juise]

Mike Brey says Attack of the Clones is better than Return of the Jedi.

Hey, this is fun.

[SirIronDuke]

I've got no problem with Mike Brey saying this at all. It's a calculated stirring of the pot to motivate his own guys.

In case you didn't notice, ND was well on the way to making the ACC Tournament a coin-flip game at crunch time last Saturday, until Bonnie Colson twisted his ankle. And even then it was still a total 50-50 coin flip game that went down to the last minute. We should feel lucky we dodged that bullet. I am sure ND is noticing that Duke got a 2 seed despite finishing behind the Irish, yet again, in the regular season. Somehow winning the ACC Tournament did not do the same seed-boosting for ND 2 years ago when ND won the ACCT. Nor did winning the big tournaments this year seem to help Iowa State or Michigan seeding the same way it helped Duke. The Committee was inconsistent; there is just no way around that fact.

Brey's comment got this whole board talking. What Brey needs at this point is to find that Eugene Banks that can come in and change his program and put it over the top. This will not be an OAD and if Farrell>Hurley it shows Brey can develop talent.

If their performance on the court won't get the respect then I do not begrudge him creating his own PR while also motivating his own guys. It's just good coaching. It's no big deal and I am sure Collins and Wojo are doing some version of this too

[cato]

Somehow winning the ACC Tournament did not do the same seed-boosting for ND 2 years ago when ND won the ACCT. Nor did winning the big tournaments this year seem to help Iowa State or Michigan seeding the same way it helped Duke. The Committee was inconsistent; there is just no way around that fact.


The Committee may be inconsistent, but this is not evidence of that fact. Duke did not earn a 2 seed based on its performance in the ACCT alone. It earned the seed by compiling a resume that arguably was better than some 1 seeds. And don't forget that the committee takes into account injuries -- both ways. The fact that Duke's losses (UNC 2 aside) came while injuries impacted the team means something. Taking down Louisville, Carolina and, yes, ND while enjoying better health boosted Duke's seed -- rightfully so.

TL;DR version: Mike Brey thinks toffuti is better than ice cream.

[rsvman]

Brey was lucky to get out of the first round. Princeton had a great look at the game-winning shot but it just missed.

[Tripping William]

Brey was lucky to get out of the first round. Princeton had a great look at the game-winning shot but it just missed.

Brey says, "Matt Ferrell always hits clutch free throws."

[SirIronDuke]

Well I guess I am Old School because I believe in settling things on the court instead of woulda coulda shoulda excuses with injuries. Duke did not earn the 2 seed based on a 5th place finish on the court in the regular season. And we were rewarded disproportionately in the ACC Tournament weighting relative to other Power 5 tournament winners (and yes even relative to ND which lost in the last 30 sec and also did better in the regular season.)

You can only play who they schedule and yes it's not always fair in a given season but it should even out over time. Do you really think Duke was the only team that had injuries this long season?

If Duke is the cream that can rise to the top we should be able to do it from our legit 3-4-5 seed (prob 4) and not need an unfair and unearned seeding advantage.

Talent is potential and that is nice, but if we are just going to look at talent and not at game results well why even play the games? Should we just aware the banners to the teams with the most McDonald's All Americans? Kentucky has shown that stacking a team with OAD is not a recipe.

I still believe Brey has a method to his madness. Let's see how Farrell does although he stunk it up today (as did Hurley a few times)

[dalmatians98]

Mike Brey says, "Matt Farrell is more Old School than SirIronDuke."

[wilson]

Brey prefers New Coke, and thinks the new "Most Interesting Man in the World" is an improvement.

Brey was lucky to get out of the first round. Princeton had a great look at the game-winning shot but it just missed.Bobby Hurley didn't often win NCAA Tournament squeakers, but when he did, they were all-time great games on the way to championships.

[Owen Meany]

Well I guess I am Old School because I believe in settling things on the court instead of woulda coulda shoulda excuses with injuries. Duke did not earn the 2 seed based on a 5th place finish on the court in the regular season. And we were rewarded disproportionately in the ACC Tournament weighting relative to other Power 5 tournament winners (and yes even relative to ND which lost in the last 30 sec and also did better in the regular season.)

You can only play who they schedule and yes it's not always fair in a given season but it should even out over time. Do you really think Duke was the only team that had injuries this long season?

If Duke is the cream that can rise to the top we should be able to do it from our legit 3-4-5 seed (prob 4) and not need an unfair and unearned seeding advantage.

Talent is potential and that is nice, but if we are just going to look at talent and not at game results well why even play the games? Should we just aware the banners to the teams with the most McDonald's All Americans? Kentucky has shown that stacking a team with OAD is not a recipe.

I still believe Brey has a method to his madness. Let's see how Farrell does although he stunk it up today (as did Hurley a few times)

I have not heard anyone, even Duke "haters", suggest Duke did not earn its 2 seed. Many people thought they had earned a 1 seed, some thought a 2 seed, but I did not hear a single person suggest they were lower than a 2.

You mentioned more than once that Duke was 5th in the league. You failed to mention that they were a whopping 1 game behind Notre Dame in the regular season (and beat Notre Dame at Notre Dame). When you include all ACC games, including the tournament, they have the same number of losses as Notre Dame - but beat Notre Dame twice - at Notre Dame and on a neutral court. That is a straight up comparison, with no disproportionate weighting of the conference tournament.

Notre Dame was also 4-8 against the AP Top25 versus 9-4 for Duke (33% win pct vs 78% for Duke). So there are ample reasons why Duke was a 2 seed without any coulda shoulda woulda taking injuries into account. In fact, despite Duke having an unusual number of injuries this year, and missing the best coach in college basketball, I have not heard anyone suggest these factors were actually taken into account for Duke (although they often have been in the past for other teams). If these factors had been considered, Duke would likely have been a 1 seed.

Duke absolutely earned its 2 seed.

[OldPhiKap]

I prefer Mike Farrell to Matt Farrell.

[Troublemaker]

Well I guess I am Old School because I believe in settling things on the court instead of woulda coulda shoulda excuses with injuries. Duke did not earn the 2 seed based on a 5th place finish on the court in the regular season. And we were rewarded disproportionately in the ACC Tournament weighting relative to other Power 5 tournament winners (and yes even relative to ND which lost in the last 30 sec and also did better in the regular season.)

You can only play who they schedule and yes it's not always fair in a given season but it should even out over time. Do you really think Duke was the only team that had injuries this long season?

If Duke is the cream that can rise to the top we should be able to do it from our legit 3-4-5 seed (prob 4) and not need an unfair and unearned seeding advantage.

Talent is potential and that is nice, but if we are just going to look at talent and not at game results well why even play the games? Should we just aware the banners to the teams with the most McDonald's All Americans? Kentucky has shown that stacking a team with OAD is not a recipe.

I still believe Brey has a method to his madness. Let's see how Farrell does although he stunk it up today (as did Hurley a few times)

Here's a helpful link for you: http://www.bracketmatrix.com/

169 out of 174 brackets had Duke as a 2 seed or 1 seed.

Your problem is a lack of understanding of what goes into seeding. Seeding is about whom you've beaten and whom you've played. The "5th place finish" is meaningless.

Duke's resume was of a 2 seed at least. The selection committee actually underrated Duke by making us 7th overall (out of 68). We deserved to be 5th or 4th overall.

[COYS]

Kentucky has shown that stacking a team with OAD is not a recipe.


OwenMeany already responded to the rest of your post, but this last statement just doesn't hold up to scrutiny. While Duke has more titles since Cal arrived at UK and hasn't missed the NCAAT in that span like UK in 2013, there is plenty of ammunition for the argument that UK has had a better run than Duke during this time (personally, I'll take the extra Natty, but I'm biased). Since the 2009-2010 season, they've made the Final Four 4 times ('11, '12, '14 and '15), won a NCAAT Title ('12), and added an Elite Eight appearance ('10). In addition, they've won five SEC Tourney titles during that span (Duke has three ACC, 2 Final Fours, one Elite Eight, and 2 National Titles over those seven seasons). If that is not an indication that Calipari has a "recipe" for success, then what is? Sure, it's possible to argue that the presence of more senior leadership could have helped them win an additional title. But it's hard to say that Calipari's OAD approach hasn't been a recipe for success.

Note: I do think there is some risk to sustained success with the OAD approach. Injuries and a lack of experience doomed Calipari's 2013 team. Also, the pressure is on for the coach to land the best talent year after year, which means that only the most elite recruiters can even bank on the strategy. 2016 would have been a much more difficult year for Duke if Coach K had not been able to work some recruiting magic and land Brandon Ingram (especially considering Amile Jefferson's injury). But so far, UK, and to a lesser extent Duke, have found quite a bit of success with OAD recruits. So it can definitely be done.

As for Mike Brey and the Irish, I'm a Princeton fan so I'm still smarting a bit from the game, today. I actually thought Princeton left quite a few buckets on the court by making some mistakes. Notre Dame didn't play particularly well which kept us in the game despite some of our mental errors, but without a few boneheaded travels, Princeton would have been protecting a narrow lead in the closing minute instead of fighting to make a comeback. And no, Farrell is DEFINITELY not Bobby Hurley.

[davekay1971]

Mike Brey thinks SirIronDuke's post is better than OwenMeany's.

[Edouble]

Mike Brey thinks Titus Andronicus is better than King Lear.

[Indoor66]

Mike Brey thinks Titus Andronicus is better than King Lear.

Damn. Whoda thunk it? I agree with him. 😜😂😎

[Tripping William]

I prefer Mike Farrell to Matt Farrell.

Peg Hunnicutt agrees

[BandAlum83]

Mike Brey thinks Titus Andronicus is better than King Lear.

The Adirondaks are lovely in the fall when at peak color.

The air is crisp and it's also a great time for apple picking.

[Edouble]

The Adirondaks are lovely in the fall when at peak color.

The air is crisp and it's also a great time for apple picking.

Couldn't spork you, but I laughed hard at this.

[juise]

Watching this game so far, I'm thinking...
Coach, I matriculated with Bobby Hurley. I knew Bobby Hurley. Bobby Hurley was a friend of mine. Coach, Matt Farrell is no Bobby Hurley.

(But then again I'm actually Duke '04, so that stuff isn't remotely true.)

[BandAlum83]

Couldn't spork you, but I laughed hard at this.

Thank you, thank you. I'll be here all week.

[DUKIE V(A)]

Just turned ND-WVU game on only to see Farrell get trapped on two possessions in a row. Once cost ND a timeout and then Farrell turned it over. I actually like Farrell but come on -- he's no Bobby Hurley.

[Papa John]

Brey says that Valentine is better than Wertz...

[plimnko]

jimmy king from michigan once called hurley "an average point guard. hurley responded, " yeah, an average point guard with 2 national championships". i think that speaks for itself.

[killerleft]

There's just enough time left in the game for Farrell to do a credible Bobby Hurley imitation.61-68, 4 mins. left.

[DUKIE V(A)]

Mike Brey thinks Matt Farrell could beat up Chuck Norris. Quit embarrassing yourself Mike. 😂

[BlueDevilBrowns]

Farrell got domesticated today.

[dukelifer]

Farrell got domesticated today.

Won't be able to get his two National Championships.

[CDu]

Won't be able to get his two National Championships.

Well he is only a sophomore, so technicality still possible.

[BandAlum83]

Farrell got domesticated today.

I see what you tried to do there. A for effort, but just doesn't work.

The words are too similar in a way that just makes it seem you may have thought they were spelled the same.

Thanks for playing.

[Olympic Fan]

Well he is only a sophomore, so technicality still possible.

Nope, Farrell is a junior this season. He's only got one more chance.

[arnie]

Nope, Farrell is a junior this season. He's only got one more chance.

Yep, ND site lists as Junior. Also, does Colson go pro early? If so, Farrell want have much help next year.

[CDu]

Nope, Farrell is a junior this season. He's only got one more chance.

You're right. For some reason I lunped him in with Ryan and Pflueger.

[BlueDevilBrowns]

I see what you tried to do there. A for effort, but just doesn't work.

The words are too similar in a way that just makes it seem you may have thought they were spelled the same.

Thanks for playing.

You mad, bro?

I think everyone understood it was a bad pun... Btw, you might want to spell check your own post buddy.

But don't worry, I knew what you meant. 😉

[BandAlum83]

You mad, bro?

I think everyone understood it was a bad pun... Btw, you might want to spell check your own post buddy.

But don't worry, I knew what you meant. 😉

Lol. On my tiny phone, spelling is a challenge. It's easier to proof read and correct after posting. I do think I caught everything before you responded.

Happy to know I'm your bro and buddy!

[Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15]

I see what you tried to do there. A for effort, but just doesn't work.

The words are too similar in a way that just makes it seem you may have thought they were spelled the same.

Thanks for playing.

I disagree - felt it was A+ wordplay. Sporks given, as such

[rsvman]

I disagree - felt it was A+ wordplay. Sporks given, as such

I enjoyed it, too.


Unfortunate to see ND go out at the hands of West Virginia, though.








Oh, and Brey says Rebecca Black's "Friday" is better music than Mozart's 41st Symphony.

[BlueDevilBrowns]

Lol. On my tiny phone, spelling is a challenge. It's easier to proof read and correct after posting. I do think I caught everything before you responded.

Happy to know I'm your bro and buddy!

No worries... And we're all family here, so you're most definitely my bro and buddy 🙂

[plimnko]

Farrell got domesticated today.

better than being neutered!!

[BandAlum83]

better than being neutered!!

Now that's a good one!

A neutered Leprechaun on St. Patrick's day weekend!. Ouch!