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dukefan_828
03-13-2017, 02:35 AM
Someone post a link please but this is a quote from his post game interview, after asked what made the win Saturday night so special (may not be word for word)

"It was just great to get the seniors their first ACCT championship, on their way out."

Most of the season the assumption here is that even with what has been considered a down year for Grayson (I credit it to injuries, and he still avg 15ppg most of the season) it was a foregone conclusion G would not return for his senior campaign. I have stated all along i don't believe this would be the case as he turned down first round money last year to stay. I think the kid loves playing for K, a wiz in the class room, and just can't see him leaving a year early when mock drafts have him projected in the second round. Once again he turned down being a millionaire last year to come back, and if we can do something special in this tournament or he comes back for a healthy senior year puts together the season he is capable and cuts down more nets he would be in line to get his jersey retired as well as more importantly greatly improve draft stock.

Would like to hear some other opinions, but imo it's an easy pick for G3 and from his comments as well as voice tone in the interview it certainly didn't seem like he wasn't planning on being in Durham next season.

Let's go LUKE.. I MEAN DUKE!!! :cool:

subzero02
03-13-2017, 03:21 AM
Someone post a link please but this is a quote from his post game interview, after asked what made the win Saturday night so special (may not be word for word)

"It was just great to get the seniors their first ACCT championship, on their way out."

Most of the season the assumption here is that even with what has been considered a down year for Grayson (I credit it to injuries, and he still avg 15ppg most of the season) it was a foregone conclusion G would not return for his senior campaign. I have stated all along i don't believe this would be the case as he turned down first round money last year to stay. I think the kid loves playing for K, a wiz in the class room, and just can't see him leaving a year early when mock drafts have him projected in the second round. Once again he turned down being a millionaire last year to come back, and if we can do something special in this tournament or he comes back for a healthy senior year puts together the season he is capable and cuts down more nets he would be in line to get his jersey retired as well as more importantly greatly improve draft stock.

Would like to hear some other opinions, but imo it's an easy pick for G3 and from his comments as well as voice tone in the interview it certainly didn't seem like he wasn't planning on being in Durham next season.

Let's go LUKE.. I MEAN DUKE!!! :cool:

It'a hard to tell. Several players have a lot to think about once the off season is here and that won't come for several more weeks. I can see Grayson making the choice to comeback. I still don't think he is 100 percent. He just doesn't have the same lift as he did when he flew down the lane for that monster dunk early in the year. I could see an improved and healthy Allen becoming a first round pick in what will be a weaker draft next year. We will see what he decides to do. A backcourt of Jackson, Allen and Kennard would score in bushels. If Allen does return, ESPN should go ahead and start producing his 30 for 30.

BandAlum83
03-13-2017, 04:05 AM
And become the first 3 time National Champion since...

Bill Walton?

Furniture
03-13-2017, 06:05 AM
If he comes back he will be a graduate student. I supposed that's ok?
I watched the interview and thought he said 'captains' not seniors.

OZZIE4DUKE
03-13-2017, 06:53 AM
If he comes back he will be a graduate student. I supposed that's ok?
I watched the interview and thought he said 'captains' not seniors.
Amile is a grad student this year. LGD GTHc!

ricks68
03-13-2017, 10:44 AM
Someone post a link please but this is a quote from his post game interview, after asked what made the win Saturday night so special (may not be word for word)

"It was just great to get the seniors their first ACCT championship, on their way out."

Most of the season the assumption here is that even with what has been considered a down year for Grayson (I credit it to injuries, and he still avg 15ppg most of the season) it was a foregone conclusion G would not return for his senior campaign. I have stated all along i don't believe this would be the case as he turned down first round money last year to stay. I think the kid loves playing for K, a wiz in the class room, and just can't see him leaving a year early when mock drafts have him projected in the second round. Once again he turned down being a millionaire last year to come back, and if we can do something special in this tournament or he comes back for a healthy senior year puts together the season he is capable and cuts down more nets he would be in line to get his jersey retired as well as more importantly greatly improve draft stock.

Would like to hear some other opinions, but imo it's an easy pick for G3 and from his comments as well as voice tone in the interview it certainly didn't seem like he wasn't planning on being in Durham next season.

Let's go LUKE.. I MEAN DUKE!!! :cool:

I think he just plain meant what he said, that's all. He's like that, a good guy that cares a lot about his teammates.

ricks

slower
03-13-2017, 10:48 AM
I can't imagine why Grayson (or ANYBODY in his position) would come back to face another year of haters. He can't be THAT much of a masochist.

Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15
03-13-2017, 11:02 AM
I can't imagine why Grayson (or ANYBODY in his position) would come back to face another year of haters. He can't be THAT much of a masochist.

He is likely gone, but the one reason I could see him returning is the switch that he seems to have flipped in the last few games.

Rather than worrying over the media the fans, the boos, and the hate, he seems to have begun to lean into it. If he can pull that off - feeding off that negative emotion with positive play - it might fuel a "Grayson's Revenge" tour next year that would be quite interesting. And, would vault him up the draft boards.

BoiseDevil
03-13-2017, 11:14 AM
My opinion is it's as simple as this:

If Grayson is healthy for NBA tryouts, he's gone as some team in late 1st round will give him quasi-guarantee (nothing is ever guaranteed in a pro draft)

If he's not fully recovered, his explosion won't be there and he'll return.

Just my opinion.

Another is that we'll likely return one of Luke/Grayson and one of Bolden/Jeter. If both Bolden and Jeter don't return, I would suggest a reclassifying Bagley if we don't lure Bamba. All opinions, mind you.

Olympic Fan
03-13-2017, 11:32 AM
And become the first 3 time National Champion since...

Bill Walton?

Nope ... Walton won two titles. He couldn't play as a freshman and as a senior, he lost to NC State in the semifinals.

I'd have to look it up, but it would be somebody who was a senior at UCLA in 1973.

oldnavy
03-13-2017, 11:34 AM
I can't imagine why Grayson (or ANYBODY in his position) would come back to face another year of haters. He can't be THAT much of a masochist.

As opposed to being warmly embraced at the next level???

GA is going to face the haters no matter where he plays as long as he stays relevant. I would hope he comes back, but I wouldn't blame him if he says he's done with CBB...

I could see him making an NBA roster and fading away into obscurity, and I am not bashing him, I just don't think his game translates to being a starter in the NBA. And maybe that would be the best for him... IDK.

I just wish him the best in life, he really seems like a good kid.

CDu
03-13-2017, 11:40 AM
As opposed to being warmly embraced at the next level???

GA is going to face the haters no matter where he plays as long as he stays relevant. I would hope he comes back, but I wouldn't blame him if he says he's done with CBB...

I could see him making an NBA roster and fading away into obscurity, and I am not bashing him, I just don't think his game translates to being a starter in the NBA. And maybe that would be the best for him... IDK.

I just wish him the best in life, he really seems like a good kid.

I think that the bolded part is in part what the previous poster was referencing. And even if he is a starter and star at the NBA level, he won't face nearly the same animosity he faced under the Duke microscope after the tripping incidents. I would venture that Allen's NBA career will have WAY less hating on him personally than his Duke career has had.

oldnavy
03-13-2017, 11:42 AM
I think that the bolded part is in part what the previous poster was referencing. And even if he is a starter and star at the NBA level, he won't face nearly the same animosity he faced under the Duke microscope after the tripping incidents. I would venture that Allen's NBA career will have WAY less hating on him personally than his Duke career has had.

Well, I don't see how it could be any worse..., so I agree.

rsvman
03-13-2017, 11:45 AM
Saying that other guys are "on their way out" in no implies that he is not. I don't understand the OP at all. The sentence the way Grayson stated it is true whether Grayson elects to go or to stay, and I don't think his decision plays into the sentence at all.

elvis14
03-13-2017, 11:45 AM
When I heard his post game comments about getting Amile and Matt a championship on their way out...the way it was worded definitely made me think that GA is coming back. Of course I'm probably guilty of reading too much into that fueled by wishful thinking.

Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15
03-13-2017, 12:03 PM
As opposed to being warmly embraced at the next level???

GA is going to face the haters no matter where he plays as long as he stays relevant. I would hope he comes back, but I wouldn't blame him if he says he's done with CBB...

I don't think NBA players, coaches, or fans will give a single tip about Grayson until/unless he gives them reason to.

subzero02
03-13-2017, 12:05 PM
If he comes back he will be a graduate student. I supposed that's ok?
I watched the interview and thought he said 'captains' not seniors.

Yes, it's not an issue at all. Amile was announced as a graduate student during the ACC tournament player introductions. As a graduate student, Grayson would be eligible to transfer and play at another school immediately. If he's truly a masochist, we'll see him in a Kentucky uniform next year pursuing a masters in bourbon distillation.

phaedrus
03-13-2017, 12:10 PM
I think that the bolded part is in part what the previous poster was referencing. And even if he is a starter and star at the NBA level, he won't face nearly the same animosity he faced under the Duke microscope after the tripping incidents. I would venture that Allen's NBA career will have WAY less hating on him personally than his Duke career has had.

Plus, there's a funny pattern of Duke players who were hated in college being embraced by NBA fans - Battier and Redick, for example. Here in Milwaukee, every Duke player who has come through town became something of a fan favorite, even among erstwhile Duke-haters.

BandAlum83
03-13-2017, 12:22 PM
Nope ... Walton won two titles. He couldn't play as a freshman and as a senior, he lost to NC State in the semifinals.

I'd have to look it up, but it would be somebody who was a senior at UCLA in 1973.

I just did. Larry Farmer and Larry Hollyfield were both Senior starters on the 1973 team.

Farmer was the only player that participated in all the games for the UCLA teams that went 89–1 (.989), the best winning percentage in NCAA men's basketball history.

Hollyfield transferred to UCLA for their 1970–71 season, when they won a National Collegiate Athletic Association (NCAA) Division I championship. Although he received minimal playing time during the regular season, he was ineligible for the postseason due to NCAA restrictions on junior college transfers.

It appears there were no other Seniors on the team, based on Wikipedia.

So first 3 time champion since Larry Farmer, who went on to a long college coaching career (UCLA, Weber State, Loyola Chicago)

Aziggazoomba
03-13-2017, 12:44 PM
I just did. Larry Farmer and Larry Hollyfield were both Senior starters on the 1973 team.

Farmer was the only player that participated in all the games for the UCLA teams that went 89–1 (.989), the best winning percentage in NCAA men's basketball history.

Hollyfield transferred to UCLA for their 1970–71 season, when they won a National Collegiate Athletic Association (NCAA) Division I championship. Although he received minimal playing time during the regular season, he was ineligible for the postseason due to NCAA restrictions on junior college transfers.

It appears there were no other Seniors on the team, based on Wikipedia.

So first 3 time champion since Larry Farmer, who went on to a long college coaching career (UCLA, Weber State, Loyola Chicago)

FWIW and I could be wrong but I think Swen Nater was a senior on the '72-'73 team, but because of a red-shirt season he was involved in only two national championships, so he would not have been a 3-timer like Farmer.

Ultrarunner
03-13-2017, 01:08 PM
My opinion is it's as simple as this:

If Grayson is healthy for NBA tryouts, he's gone as some team in late 1st round will give him quasi-guarantee (nothing is ever guaranteed in a pro draft)

If he's not fully recovered, his explosion won't be there and he'll return.

Just my opinion.

I don't think a team will give Grayson a wink-and-nod guarantee in this draft. The quality, especially at the point guard positions, is unreal. Currently, there are four freshmen point guards in top ten. At shooting guard, he's competing with the likes of Monk from UK and Josh Hart from Villanova.

I thought Grayson should have left last year as the events of this year were predictable. 20/20 hindsight.

If Grayson does stay (and I can't see why he would, given the unfair abuse of the clickbait culture), it would give him a chance to improve on his play-making skills even more than he has. He's also shown flashes of a mid-range game, a al Luke, in the last month. That may give him an edge against the biggest offensive knock on him, that he can't finish over length. Improvement in both, along with demonstrated improvement in temperament, would put him back in the first round.

He could also go D-League or overseas. Options he has, and I have no idea which he'll embrace.

MCFinARL
03-13-2017, 01:11 PM
Yes, it's not an issue at all. Amile was announced as a graduate student during the ACC tournament player introductions. As a graduate student, Grayson would be eligible to transfer and play at another school immediately. If he's truly a masochist, we'll see him in a Kentucky uniform next year pursuing a masters in bourbon distillation.

Yes, but this is the one thing I can't imagine him doing. Despite all the issues, he appears to genuinely like Duke, and the Duke fans have supported him well through everything. If he plays anywhere in college next year, I am betting the farm it is at Duke.

One thought--Grayson is on track to graduate early, but apparently only after summer semesters to finish his credits. Should he decide to stay at Duke another year, it might make more sense for him to shift back to graduating on schedule and take the opportunity to do some interesting electives or extra work in his major instead of rushing into a graduate program (unless there is one he particularly wants to pursue). Should he decide to go, he can finish his degree in the summer and thus leave early while already having the credential he would need to move into coaching or another career field altogether whenever he is done playing basketball.

sagegrouse
03-13-2017, 01:35 PM
Nope ... Walton won two titles. He couldn't play as a freshman and as a senior, he lost to NC State in the semifinals.

I'd have to look it up, but it would be somebody who was a senior at UCLA in 1973.

Swen Nater only played two seasons at UCLA.

Tripping William
03-13-2017, 01:45 PM
I just did. Larry Farmer and Larry Hollyfield were both Senior starters on the 1973 team.

Farmer was the only player that participated in all the games for the UCLA teams that went 89–1 (.989), the best winning percentage in NCAA men's basketball history.

Hollyfield transferred to UCLA for their 1970–71 season, when they won a National Collegiate Athletic Association (NCAA) Division I championship. Although he received minimal playing time during the regular season, he was ineligible for the postseason due to NCAA restrictions on junior college transfers.

It appears there were no other Seniors on the team, based on Wikipedia.

So first 3 time champion since Larry Farmer, who went on to a long college coaching career (UCLA, Weber State, Loyola Chicago)

Of course, the answer would have been "Grant Hill" except for Tony Lang's manicurist being just a touch overzealous . . . . . :mad:

jimsumner
03-13-2017, 02:28 PM
Of course, the answer would have been "Grant Hill" except for Tony Lang's manicurist being just a touch overzealous . . . . . :mad:

Actually, the names would have been Grant Hill, Tony Lang and Marty Clark.

niveklaen
03-13-2017, 02:40 PM
I don't think a team will give Grayson a wink-and-nod guarantee in this draft. The quality, especially at the point guard positions, is unreal. Currently, there are four freshmen point guards in top ten. At shooting guard, he's competing with the likes of Monk from UK and Josh Hart from Villanova.

I thought Grayson should have left last year as the events of this year were predictable. 20/20 hindsight.

If Grayson does stay (and I can't see why he would, given the unfair abuse of the clickbait culture), it would give him a chance to improve on his play-making skills even more than he has. He's also shown flashes of a mid-range game, a al Luke, in the last month. That may give him an edge against the biggest offensive knock on him, that he can't finish over length. Improvement in both, along with demonstrated improvement in temperament, would put him back in the first round.

He could also go D-League or overseas. Options he has, and I have no idea which he'll embrace.

IIRC, Grayson had hernia surgery immediately after the season last year - he would have been in no condition to participate in the combines/workout for teams last year.

Ultrarunner
03-13-2017, 02:50 PM
IIRC, Grayson had hernia surgery immediately after the season last year - he would have been in no condition to participate in the combines/workout for teams last year.

I forgot about that. Thanks for the reminder. He could have skipped the combine but that's usually a recourse for a surefire top 5 pick, not for someone on the edge of the first round.

Listen to Quants
03-13-2017, 03:10 PM
Of course, the answer would have been "Grant Hill" except for Tony Lang's manicurist being just a touch overzealous . . . . . :mad:

Question. I saw it at the time but I don't remember and google didn't answer easily, 'did Lang's fingernail actually touch/graze the ball?' Basically, what did Tony Lang say about it? .... and of course you are right the image/thought does stick with you for decades.

CDu
03-13-2017, 03:12 PM
Question. I saw it at the time but I don't remember and google didn't answer easily, 'did Lang's fingernail actually touch/graze the ball?' Basically, what did Tony Lang say about it? ... and of course you are right the image/thought does stick with you for decades.

No, Lang didn't quite get to it. He missed by seemingly a nanosecond.

Tripping William
03-13-2017, 03:15 PM
Question. I saw it at the time but I don't remember and google didn't answer easily, 'did Lang's fingernail actually touch/graze the ball?' Basically, what did Tony Lang say about it? ... and of course you are right the image/thought does stick with you for decades.

Truthfully, television angles being deceptive sometimes, I don't think Tony "literally" (in the Jim Sumner sense) got within a shaved fingernail of that shot. But TV made it look like he got really close, so the fingernail has become somewhat urban legend for how close he may have come.

oldnavy
03-13-2017, 03:54 PM
I don't think NBA players, coaches, or fans will give a single tip about Grayson until/unless he gives them reason to.

I don't think they will care either, because I don't think he will be a factor in the NBA thus he will be out of site out of mind.

I take no pleasure in saying that, but he is a 6'5" 2 guard, and the NBA has no shortage of those guys.

Out of curiosity though, who would you use as a comparison? What college player has had the hate from the media, and received as much vilification as Grayson?

I can't think of anyone close.

Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15
03-13-2017, 04:02 PM
I don't think they will care either, because I don't think he will be a factor in the NBA thus he will be out of site out of mind.

I take no pleasure in saying that, but he is a 6'5" 2 guard, and the NBA has no shortage of those guys.

Out of curiosity though, who would you use as a comparison? What college player has had the hate from the media, and received as much vilification as Grayson?

I can't think of anyone close.

I could be wrong, but I get the impression that whenever Grayson goes to the NBA, he will get to reinvent himself. JJ sure caught a lot of hate in college,that didn't seem to follow him to the NBA.

BandAlum83
03-13-2017, 04:05 PM
FWIW and I could be wrong but I think Swen Nater was a senior on the '72-'73 team, but because of a red-shirt season he was involved in only two national championships, so he would not have been a 3-timer like Farmer.

He was a JUCO transfer, so was only at UCLA 2 years, but was a senior in 73. He did redshirt Junior year. From Wikipedia:


Nater attended and played basketball at Cypress College, a junior college in Cypress, California (where he met his wife, Marlene). He played little as a freshman, but was a Community College All-American as a sophomore. He earned a scholarship to UCLA, and reshirted his first year.

Nater helped John Wooden's UCLA Bruins win two NCAA titles. He was a backup to Bill Walton, and he never started a collegiate game—his primary role was helping to develop Walton in practice

BandAlum83
03-13-2017, 04:07 PM
I don't think a team will give Grayson a wink-and-nod guarantee in this draft. The quality, especially at the point guard positions, is unreal. Currently, there are four freshmen point guards in top ten. At shooting guard, he's competing with the likes of Monk from UK and Josh Hart from Villanova.

I thought Grayson should have left last year as the events of this year were predictable. 20/20 hindsight.

If Grayson does stay (and I can't see why he would, given the unfair abuse of the clickbait culture), it would give him a chance to improve on his play-making skills even more than he has. He's also shown flashes of a mid-range game, a al Luke, in the last month. That may give him an edge against the biggest offensive knock on him, that he can't finish over length. Improvement in both, along with demonstrated improvement in temperament, would put him back in the first round.

He could also go D-League or overseas. Options he has, and I have no idea which he'll embrace.

Could you PM me with the powerball numbers for this week, please?

I wouldn't want to have to split the jackpot with too many other people.

oldnavy
03-13-2017, 04:33 PM
I could be wrong, but I get the impression that whenever Grayson goes to the NBA, he will get to reinvent himself. JJ sure caught a lot of hate in college,that didn't seem to follow him to the NBA.

I can't compare JJ's issues which were mostly local, "in the arena" vitriol to what Grayson has had to endure through the non-stop media focus on his every move, or in some cases his time on the bench.

Yes, JJ got "the business" from fan bases but I sure don't remember anything that even comes remotely close to what Grayson has dealt with on a national level.

Hingeknocker
03-13-2017, 05:29 PM
I can't compare JJ's issues which were mostly local, "in the arena" vitriol to what Grayson has had to endure through the non-stop media focus on his every move, or in some cases his time on the bench.

Yes, JJ got "the business" from fan bases but I sure don't remember anything that even comes remotely close to what Grayson has dealt with on a national level.

This is a good point. From an off-the-court standpoint, the two dominant narratives I can remember from JJ's time were: 1) Look how he got into much better shape after his sophomore season! and 2) He liked to play video games with Adam Morrison. Perhaps it turned a bit negative when people made fun of his poetry, but since Twitter wasn't even a thing yet, he escaped anything close to what Grayson has been through.

devilsince1977
03-13-2017, 08:15 PM
I have been trying to find a good comparison to Grayson. This is only about his basketball skills, not the non-basketball B.S. This reference may be too old for some of the younger members. I also hate to compare him to a Kentucky player, but here goes.

Rex Chapman.

They are about the same size and athleticism. Both are excellent shooters and played with a lot of intensity. Neither has natural point guard skills.

Let me know if I should keep looking for a good comparison. (I have heard Bob Sura and that was my choice before I thought of Rex.)

quahog174
03-13-2017, 09:30 PM
I have been trying to find a good comparison to Grayson. This is only about his basketball skills, not the non-basketball B.S. This reference may be too old for some of the younger members. I also hate to compare him to a Kentucky player, but here goes.

Rex Chapman.

They are about the same size and athleticism. Both are excellent shooters and played with a lot of intensity. Neither has natural point guard skills.

Let me know if I should keep looking for a good comparison. (I have heard Bob Sura and that was my choice before I thought of Rex.)

Think Havlicek.

elvis14
03-14-2017, 09:34 AM
I thought Grayson should have left last year as the events of this year were predictable. 20/20 hindsight.



Despite the hyper overexposure from the media, the 'events' that have really affected Grayson this year are the 5 injuries. I have to admit, I didn't predict them but hey, if they were predictable then maybe I'm the only one that didn't see them coming.

I really hope Grayson stays for his senior season but I fully admit it's for selfish reasons (back to back championships) although I do want to see him drafted in the first round.

Indoor66
03-14-2017, 10:07 AM
Despite the hyper overexposure from the media, the 'events' that have really affected Grayson this year are the 5 injuries. I have to admit, I didn't predict them but hey, if they were predictable then maybe I'm the only one that didn't see them coming.

I really hope Grayson stays for his senior season but I fully admit it's for selfish reasons (back to back championships) although I do want to see him drafted in the first round.

Never let a good negative meme be dissuaded by reference to relevant facts - such as injuries. Same comment applies to the Matt Jones shooting meme.

Rich
03-14-2017, 10:10 AM
I really hope Grayson stays for his senior season but I fully admit it's for selfish reasons (back to back championships) although I do want to see him drafted in the first round.

Given he's apparently ready to graduate, he already has.

Ballboy1998
03-14-2017, 10:17 AM
My plan is for Grayson to average 25+ points through the NCAAs and declare for the draft while still hanging from the rim after the monster dunk exclamation point to Duke's dominating 50 pt national championship game win. Who's in?

niveklaen
03-14-2017, 10:19 AM
My plan is for Grayson to average 25+ points through the NCAAs and declare for the draft while still hanging from the rim after the monster dunk exclamation point to Duke's dominating 50 pt national championship game win. Who's in?

So you want him to get a T and be declared ineligible in the title game causing the NCAA to vacate the win? Sounds like a plan

luburch
03-14-2017, 10:20 AM
My plan is for Grayson to average 25+ points through the NCAAs and declare for the draft while still hanging from the rim after the monster dunk exclamation point to Duke's dominating 50 pt national championship game win. Who's in?

He has to slap the backboard so Daniel Ewing can get a T, of course.

tbyers11
03-14-2017, 10:33 AM
So you want him to get a T and be declared ineligible in the title game causing the NCAA to vacate the win? Sounds like a plan

Not that it is the best idea, but a technical for hanging on the rim wouldn't result in anything besides a technical. Even if there were a future suspension resulting from a play in the national championship game it wouldn't cause retroactive ineligibility.

uh_no
03-14-2017, 10:36 AM
Given he's apparently ready to graduate, he already has.

this keeps being bandied around...does anyone have any actual source for this?

Jeffrey
03-14-2017, 10:36 AM
Yes, JJ got "the business" from fan bases but I sure don't remember anything that even comes remotely close to what Grayson has dealt with on a national level.

IMO, what the greatest to play at Duke dealt with "comes remotely close".

niveklaen
03-14-2017, 10:42 AM
Not that it is the best idea, but a technical for hanging on the rim wouldn't result in anything besides a technical. Even if there were a future suspension resulting from a play in the national championship game it wouldn't cause retroactive ineligibility.

I was implying that he would be ineligible the moment he declared for the draft as the clock ran down - although I am not certain that is actually the rule...

Ultrarunner
03-14-2017, 10:45 AM
Could you PM me with the powerball numbers for this week, please?

I wouldn't want to have to split the jackpot with too many other people.

Dude, you're on your own for numbers. I used up my luck when I found my sweetie.

As for the predictability of the wave of hate directed towards Grayson, any observant person could note that ClickBait Culture requires constant feeding. Grayson came into the season already wearing a target. Did I think that he was going to trip someone? No, I didn't. When did trip Santa Ana, I felt terrible for him. He didn't meet his own standards, and he let his teammates down. I think both of those are important priorities for the young man, and I still believe that he's a good individual with a few all-to-human flaws.

That is not relevant, though. Clickbait Culture was waiting for any incident, even the most minor, to indict and publicly humiliate Grayson. The trip just made it easy for ESPN, BleacherReport, Deadspin, and the thousands of anonymous cowards who suffer instant outrage syndrome. In the case of the former, it gives them those precious clicks; in the latter, the cowards get to feel a moral superiority in their petty lives by tearing down someone else.

So, yes, the firestorm was entirely predictable. Clickbait Culture is ugly, it is hatefilled, and it is a defining characteristic of our age.

tbyers11
03-14-2017, 10:53 AM
I was implying that he would be ineligible the moment he declared for the draft as the clock ran down - although I am not certain that is actually the rule...

Ooh, good point. Unless he declared for the draft, signed a contract and took money from agent while he was up there I think we would be OK. Grayson has good hops but not sure he can hang in the air for that long. :D

SoCalDukeFan
03-14-2017, 11:18 AM
the reason why you push yourself to graduate in 3 years is so you can go pro after the 3rd year with your degree.

Would be very surprised if Grayson came back.

SoCal

CDu
03-14-2017, 11:22 AM
this keeps being bandied around...does anyone have any actual source for this?

I have the same question. If he was graduating this Spring, would he not have been honored on senior night? That's not to say he won't still go pro. Nor does it definitely disprove he is graduating in May. It just raises the question.

Troublemaker
03-14-2017, 11:27 AM
Source for Grayson graduating in three years (http://www.dukechronicle.com/article/2016/11/grayson-allens-unique-academic-approach-in-the-one-and-done-era) (Chronicle):

At the team’s media day in early October, Krzyzewski said Jason Williams was his last player to graduate early, making Allen the first Blue Devil in nearly 15 years to attempt a feat that is rare even for regular Duke students. Allen will not quite finish all his requirements by the end of the spring semester—he will still have one or two courses left to take. The junior guard has shouldered a heavy academic load throughout his career, always with the intention of completing his degree.

niveklaen
03-14-2017, 11:28 AM
I have the same question. If he was graduating this Spring, would he not have been honored on senior night? That's not to say he won't still go pro. Nor does it definitely disprove he is graduating in May. It just raises the question.

Just speculation, but if he is still not certain that he is going pro he might not want to be honored on senior night. It could be embarrassing to do the senior night stuff, go to the combines/indiv workouts, be told you are a borderline 1st round draft pick and then come back. If you know you are a lottery pick, sure but Grayson has struggled enough this year that this may be a game time decision.

gus
03-14-2017, 11:32 AM
Question. I saw it at the time but I don't remember and google didn't answer easily, 'did Lang's fingernail actually touch/graze the ball?' Basically, what did Tony Lang say about it? ... and of course you are right the image/thought does stick with you for decades.

I don't recall what Tony had to say- but he came really, really close (https://youtu.be/lDMH2H18LE8?t=9m6s). It's kind of in between frames, but it really looks like he was within millimeters of touching the ball.

Jeffrey
03-14-2017, 11:35 AM
Everyone looks at very big decisions differently. If I were in Grayson's position, had passed on big bucks last year, and felt certain I would not go until the 2nd round this year, then I would return, get a Duke graduate degree, and try to work my way back to a lottery selection. In many ways, that decision would be based upon my competitive nature. Grayson's competitive nature may also come into play with his decision.

uh_no
03-14-2017, 12:18 PM
the reason why you push yourself to graduate in 3 years is so you can go pro after the 3rd year with your degree.

Would be very surprised if Grayson came back.

SoCal

Oh...I thought his reason was to be in a 4 year Bachelor + PhD program! :D

Indoor66
03-14-2017, 12:30 PM
Just speculation, but if he is still not certain that he is going pro he might not want to be honored on senior night. It could be embarrassing to do the senior night stuff, go to the combines/indiv workouts, be told you are a borderline 1st round draft pick and then come back. If you know you are a lottery pick, sure but Grayson has struggled enough this year that this may be a game time decision.

Frankly, that is, IMO, ridiculous. Grayson came to Duke as a good student and has been Academic ACC through his career. IMO, he is attempting to do the 3 year program because he wants to get on with his career - whether basketball or just the rest of his life. I can understand that. I did undergrad in three years and then moved on the Law School. I had a drive to get on with my life.

CDu
03-14-2017, 12:58 PM
Frankly, that is, IMO, ridiculous. Grayson came to Duke as a good student and has been Academic ACC through his career. IMO, he is attempting to do the 3 year program because he wants to get on with his career - whether basketball or just the rest of his life. I can understand that. I did undergrad in three years and then moved on the Law School. I had a drive to get on with my life.

Just because you chose to graduate in 3 years in order to get on with your life doesn't mean that Allen is hellbent on getting on with his life. Or that he may have decided along the way to stick around for a fourth year after originally planning to finish in three. People make decisions for all sorts of reasons.

I'm agnostic on this one. Coming into the year, I felt VERY strongly that he was gone after this year. During January after the tripping incident, I felt even more strongly that this would be the case. Now? Who knows? He seems rejunevated out there. His draft stock has taken a hit. He would have a chance to join the pantheon of Duke greats.

I think it is certainly possible that he goes pro this summer. I also think it is quite possible he returns. And I think that it is a possibility whether he graduates in May or not.

killerleft
03-14-2017, 03:10 PM
the reason why you push yourself to graduate in 3 years is so you can go pro after the 3rd year with your degree.

Would be very surprised if Grayson came back.

SoCal

Things change. Unless his tournament is really strong I would be a bit surprised if he left. Since we may need the jumping Grayson, I guess I'd approve of Grayson, Jayson, and Frank leaving after a victorious NCAA Tournament final.:) Well, I can't stop them.:D

jv001
03-14-2017, 08:33 PM
Things change. Unless his tournament is really strong I would be a bit surprised if he left. Since we may need the jumping Grayson, I guess I'd approve of Grayson, Jayson, and Frank leaving after a victorious NCAA Tournament final.:) Well, I can't stop them.:D

After reading the post on this thread, I believe it's 50-50 situation. I think Grayson will test the waters and if healthy, go to the combine/workouts. I would like to see him come back at 100% and show ESPN and other haters the real Grayson Allen. GoDuke!

gep
03-15-2017, 12:44 AM
After reading the post on this thread, I believe it's 50-50 situation. I think Grayson will test the waters and if healthy, go to the combine/workouts. I would like to see him come back at 100% and show ESPN and other haters the real Grayson Allen. GoDuke!

I would like to see Grayson Allen show ESPN and all the other haters the real Grayson Allen in the next 6 games... 100% or not!!!

GO DUKE!!!!

jv001
03-15-2017, 07:07 AM
I would like to see Grayson Allen show ESPN and all the other haters the real Grayson Allen in the next 6 games... 100% or not!!!
GO DUKE!!!!

I don't think we'll see the real Grayson Allen until he's 100% healthy. GoDuke!

MCFinARL
03-15-2017, 02:06 PM
Given he's apparently ready to graduate, he already has.

This could lead to a humdinger of a semantic argument. If Grayson is on target to graduate at the end of the summer, then he is, at least this semester, in his senior year. But is that his senior season? Since seasons refer specifically to sports play and not to academics, I would argue that he is not playing his "senior" season because he has a remaining year of eligibility. But others might disagree. Obviously, I am getting bored waiting for Friday and have nothing to do but raise trivial semantic issues....


Frankly, that is, IMO, ridiculous. Grayson came to Duke as a good student and has been Academic ACC through his career. IMO, he is attempting to do the 3 year program because he wants to get on with his career - whether basketball or just the rest of his life. I can understand that. I did undergrad in three years and then moved on the Law School. I had a drive to get on with my life.


Just because you chose to graduate in 3 years in order to get on with your life doesn't mean that Allen is hellbent on getting on with his life. Or that he may have decided along the way to stick around for a fourth year after originally planning to finish in three. People make decisions for all sorts of reasons.

I'm agnostic on this one. Coming into the year, I felt VERY strongly that he was gone after this year. During January after the tripping incident, I felt even more strongly that this would be the case. Now? Who knows? He seems rejunevated out there. His draft stock has taken a hit. He would have a chance to join the pantheon of Duke greats.

I think it is certainly possible that he goes pro this summer. I also think it is quite possible he returns. And I think that it is a possibility whether he graduates in May or not.

Generally, I'm with CDu here. I want to add, though, that one way of "getting on with his life" might be staying at Duke, playing basketball, and starting a graduate program; that would fit as well with his academic strength as graduating and leaving to pursue non-basketball options. The original point related to Grayson's choice to be recognized on senior night; if he had any question as to whether he might play at Duke next year, it would make sense to forego that recognition.

CDu
03-15-2017, 02:14 PM
Generally, I'm with CDu here. I want to add, though, that one way of "getting on with his life" might be staying at Duke, playing basketball, and starting a graduate program; that would fit as well with his academic strength as graduating and leaving to pursue non-basketball options. The original point related to Grayson's choice to be recognized on senior night; if he had any question as to whether he might play at Duke next year, it would make sense to forego that recognition.

I was told by some on this board it should not be a foregone conclusion that Marshall Plumlee (when he already had his military contract signed) would return for his redshirt senior year. They said that folks with a military calling (perhaps not unlike the clergy) are just different. And I don't disagree. But he obviously returned, and is now getting an NBA paycheck. Different strokes for different folks, even amongst the military.

I won't be at all surprised if Allen goes pro this summer. It appeared that that was the plan as of last year. And the early part of this year can't have made him relish the idea of returning. I also won't be at all surprised if Allen returns for his senior year. His draft stock appears to have suffered. Next year's draft class is weaker. He gets to spend another year at his dream school.

Jeffrey
03-15-2017, 02:21 PM
His draft stock appears to have suffered.

That's an understatement. Many considered him preseason NPOY. Now, he is the third or fourth best player on our team.

luburch
03-15-2017, 02:34 PM
That's an understatement. Many considered him preseason NPOY. Now, he is the third or fourth best player on our team.

He may have been preseason NPOY, but his draft stock was peaking around the low 20s. Grayson was never really considered a top tier pick.

Jeffrey
03-15-2017, 02:45 PM
He may have been preseason NPOY, but his draft stock was peaking around the low 20s. Grayson was never really considered a top tier pick.

His draft stock is no longer peaking and this year's performance is a major reason.