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View Full Version : MBB: GT at Duke (1/4, 7 pm, ESPN2) Pre Game and In Game Thread



uh_no
01-02-2017, 12:33 AM
Enough about the VT shenanigans. We got a game in a couple days!

GT is obviously not great. several mediocre losses. Their best win is an OT win over #51 vcu...and they have wins against other cupcakes such as Wofford, NC AT, and UNC. Their SOS was one of the worst in the country....

The vast plurality of their time is played with

Justin Moore... 6'4 162(???) Is this kid missing an arm or something? yeesh. He doesn't appear to jump off the charts at anything, and doesn't appear to be able to shoot his way out of a paper bag, with a .464 FT% and a whopping 1-5 from 3.
Josh Okagie ...6-4 207.takes a few threes...though not prolific. He is one of the teams 4 main shot takers
Quinton Stephens...6-9 196 (???) not sure whether his or Moore's weight is worse. as a senior, you'd expect him to have bulked up a bit...but he's a stick. He's an awful shooter...converting just 38% from 2 and 28% form 3. He is the omong the teams 4 primary shot takers. He is a decent rebounder.
Ben lammers...6-10 227. Solid rebounder, solid scorer. solid shot blocker. probably the best player on the team

The SG spot seems to be split almost evenly between
Tadric Jackson...6-2...teams only reasonable 3 point shooter, and the last of the 4 primary shooters
Corey Heyward...6-1...in Kenpoms "nearly invisible" category...seems to get minutes because he's a senior? maybe he's good at defense?
Josh Heath...6-2...also a senior, also little to recommend him...but will pick up PG duties when moore takes a break. usually allowing jackson more minutes at the 2.

Abdoulaye is the last big man who eats minutes to the tune of 10 a game. It should be noted that heyward barely got any minutes vs UNC, and jackson was severly limited by foul trouble. So basically we're looking at 4 guards and 2 big men, with the 2 big men almost always on the floor.

As for what we'll do:

Given that their top 8 lineups have two big men in there, and given jackson's less than stellar performance last week, I wouldn't be surprised if chase or even perhaps harry got the start alongside amile. quinton's popsickle stick frame. That leaves jayson luke and matt to deal with the guards.

Jayson ought to be a matchup mightmare for them, as they have no players between 6'4 and 6'9 that play any meaningful minutes.

Given that they have two bigguns down low, i'm not sure we'll be able to make a killing simply getting layups as we did against VT.

Also fortunately, they're not a particularly prolific three point shooting team. Having only one good shooter.


I didn't watch the UNC game, but the two people that really beat them were Okogie and Heath, who combined for 17-19 from the free throw line and 41 points overall. The team as a whole scored 28 from the line. Given the foul trouble. Kepping GT off the line will be key given their relatively poor shooting from the floor. If we do that and rebound well, we SHOULD win this game. We also need to look to come out and score early. I'm tired of us taking 10 minutes to figure out how to attack the defense. I wouldn't be surprised to see us run some sets to get luke a couple looks from three early, as well as hopefully getting jayson some mismatch opportunities...as I'm not sure they have anyone that can guard him.

LGD

Doria
01-02-2017, 03:08 AM
I didn't see the Carolina game either, but hopefully in the friendly confines of Cameron, we'll be able to hit some outside shots early to open up some scoring lanes on the interior. Also hopefully, from the start, we'll be able to establish another couple (few?!) scoring threats to go with Luke.

I assume their big men aren't particularly skilled, but this is a good chance for a couple of ours to step up alongside Amile. And I'd really like to see us stay with their perimeter shooters (at least those that are scoring threats at all).

It shouldn't be too complicated. Play as a team, and we should win, without any need for fuss. GoDuke!

LasVegas
01-02-2017, 04:04 AM
Hopefully we win and look better. It's all about progress now. Baby steps. My hope is that they look a little more cohesive out there and Giles/Bolden get extended time. What has really been lost in all of this is Kennard being in a battle for POY. If this team can come close to their ceiling and his numbers stay close to the same, you have to REALLY like his chances.

Bob Green
01-02-2017, 07:24 AM
The most important element of Wednesday's game against Georgia Tech is seeing how Duke responds. The team must display some grit and play with focused intensity.

dukejim1
01-02-2017, 07:41 AM
The most important element of Wednesday's game against Georgia Tech is seeing how Duke responds. The team must display some grit and play with focused intensity.

That sums it up.

UrinalCake
01-02-2017, 09:27 AM
I remember a couple seasons ago, GT was terrible shooting from deep, like last in the conference, yet they came into Cameron and shot something like 8 for 12 and almost pulled out a win. So anything can happen. You'd have to imagine their confidence is high after beating the CHeats and with the way we've been playing I definitely don't feel very comfortable. I'll be at the game, hope my fellow Crazies bring it because the team is going to need all the help they can get!

Troublemaker
01-02-2017, 09:43 AM
GaTech plays a couple of zone defenses, a couple of pretty good ones to hold down UNC. If they play mostly the 2-3 zone, get ready for a barrage of Tatum free-throw line jumpers. Hope he makes them. And if he can make the right reads and either kick out for an open 3 or pass to an open man near the basket, even better.

Easily the biggest problem versus VaTech was transition defense, so hopefully we see improvement there.

CDu
01-02-2017, 09:44 AM
Tech has two good players. Lammers is an All-ACC caliber big man. Okogie is a dangerous slasher on the wing. The rest are not ACC-starting quality. Tech beat UNC by playing zone and letting UNC shoot themselves out of the game (19% on 3s, 33% overall, 20 turnovers). Tech is not good.

They are small. Lammers plays a ton. But aside from him, they don't play anyone with real size. Stephens, McCormick, and Gueya are tall (6'8"-6'9") but skinny (190-210lb), and not very good. Stephens plays by far the most, and fancies himself a stretch 4 (though he doesn't shoot well). Heath and Moore are caretaking PGs. Heyward is a fire hydrant of a guard who looks more suited to play football than bball. He isn't a good player. Jackson has been an effective 3pt shooter this year, and can score.

But overall this isn't a team that should be able to compete with us in Cameron. Contain Lammers and Okogie and we should win big.

jv001
01-02-2017, 09:58 AM
Tech has two good players. Lammers is an All-ACC caliber big man. Okogie is a dangerous slasher on the wing. The rest are not ACC-starting quality. Tech beat UNC by playing zone and letting UNC shoot themselves out of the game (19% on 3s, 33% overall, 20 turnovers). Tech is not good.

They are small. Lammers plays a ton. But aside from him, they don't play anyone with real size. Stephens, McCormick, and Gueya are tall (6'8"-6'9") but skinny (190-210lb), and not very good. Stephens plays by far the most, and fancies himself a stretch 4 (though he doesn't shoot well). Heath and Moore are caretaking PGs. Heyward is a fire hydrant of a guard who looks more suited to play football than bball. He isn't a good player. Jackson has been an effective 3pt shooter this year, and can score.

But overall this isn't a team that should be able to compete with us in Cameron. Contain Lammers and Okogie and we should win big.

But Duke is not good at this point in the season either. I'm more worried about Duke than I am GT. This group of young men need to come together as a team. Then I believe we'll be fine. The comments coming from Luke have me concerned. Looking for a good turn around and a sweet victory. GoDuke!

OldPhiKap
01-02-2017, 10:04 AM
Elon should not have been able to hang at a Cameron.

GT played well against the Heels, and the Heels were cold from outside. We are at our worst when we just jack up shots without driving first and attacking.

We are not playing well right now. I am hoping the light clicks back on Wednesday

CDu
01-02-2017, 10:19 AM
But Duke is not good at this point in the season either. I'm more worried about Duke than I am GT. This group of young men need to come together as a team. Then I believe we'll be fine. The comments coming from Luke have me concerned. Looking for a good turn around and a sweet victory. GoDuke!

We are not good relative to Duke's standards. Tech is just not good.

That is not to say we can't play worse and make this one stressful. But Tech is much worse than us, even as we are playing right now.

CDu
01-02-2017, 10:26 AM
Elon should not have been able to hang at a Cameron.

GT played well against the Heels, and the Heels were cold from outside. We are at our worst when we just jack up shots without driving first and attacking.

We are not playing well right now. I am hoping the light clicks back on Wednesday

Technically Elon didn't hang with us in Cameron (Greensboro).

OldPhiKap
01-02-2017, 11:23 AM
Technically Elon didn't hang with us in Cameron (Greensboro).

Fair point.

CDu
01-02-2017, 01:54 PM
Fair point.

Though I guess you can just as well replace "Elon" with "Tennessee St.". I think Tennessee St is better than Tech. And that was our first game following exams, so some sloppiness is to be expected.

But yes, if we play awful basketball like UNC did (19% on 3s, 33% overall, 20 TOs) we could run into trouble with Tech. But we will have to try to lose. Tech got blown out by Tennessee and Georgia. They lost to Ohio and Penn St. They struggled to beat Sam Houston St, Wofford, and NC A&T. This is a game that even a struggling Duke team should win.

Utley
01-02-2017, 05:26 PM
But Duke is not good at this point in the season either. I'm more worried about Duke than I am GT. This group of young men need to come together as a team. Then I believe we'll be fine. The comments coming from Luke have me concerned. Looking for a good turn around and a sweet victory. GoDuke!

I should probably know these but were these comments from Luke post the Va Tech game? If so - what did he say? I know he made some comments about selfish play recently.

Bob Green
01-02-2017, 07:14 PM
I should probably know these but were these comments from Luke post the Va Tech game? If so - what did he say? I know he made some comments about selfish play recently.

The comments were Elon post game.

Eakane
01-02-2017, 07:41 PM
I know we're all dealing with other issues; Grayson, K, the drubbing we took from V.Tech., but I'd like to talk some basic X and O's for a moment. I'm seeing a pattern on the defensive side that is disturbing. It looks like opposing teams are running lay-up drills. And it wasn't just V.Tech, who couldn't miss. We saw it in the 2 warm up games last week, and we saw it with Florida and Rhode Island. Teams are getting out in transition and beating us back to the basket for an easy score. 3 thoughts to deal with this: 1. Get back. If we're pressing or going zone, get to your spot. If we're going man, then get the heck back. Usually I reserve my screaming at the TV to get back for the UNC game, and that ridiculous (but somehow effective) secondary break they run, but I'm losing me voice already and it's barely January. 2. I thought we had a few rim protectors this year? I realize we had some injuries early on, but I'm seeing a lot of standing around and watching. And 3. (and I expect to catch hell for this), no uncontested lay ups. I'm not advocating hurting anyone, but if you're not in position to take a charge, then no ticky tack Ole defense on a drive to the basket. I'd like to see some attention to this in Wednesday's game.

Finally, for all of you complaining about Matt, stop.

gofurman
01-02-2017, 07:59 PM
I didn't see the Carolina game either, but hopefully in the friendly confines of Cameron, we'll be able to hit some outside shots early to open up some scoring lanes on the interior. Also hopefully, from the start, we'll be able to establish another couple (few?!) scoring threats to go with Luke.

I assume their big men aren't particularly skilled, but this is a good chance for a couple of ours to step up alongside Amile. And I'd really like to see us stay with their perimeter shooters (at least those that are scoring threats at all).

It shouldn't be too complicated. Play as a team, and we should win, without any need for fuss. GoDuke!

I would have to disagree that 'their big men aren''t particularly skilled'.. Lammers is pretty good. Not NBA talent perhaps but he has worked hard to make himself a good ACC player and I wish we had him

Maybe I am jaded after the last 3 games but this post seems to indicate we can win easily "without any fuss". I don't know that I feel we can win any game "without any fuss". We couldn't beat TSU or Elon without some fuss. And GT is better than TSU and ELon by some measures. ELon doesn't have a Lammers in the middle.

NSDukeFan
01-02-2017, 08:08 PM
I know we're all dealing with other issues; Grayson, K, the drubbing we took from V.Tech., but I'd like to talk some basic X and O's for a moment. I'm seeing a pattern on the defensive side that is disturbing. It looks like opposing teams are running lay-up drills. And it wasn't just V.Tech, who couldn't miss. We saw it in the 2 warm up games last week, and we saw it with Florida and Rhode Island. Teams are getting out in transition and beating us back to the basket for an easy score. 3 thoughts to deal with this: 1. Get back. If we're pressing or going zone, get to your spot. If we're going man, then get the heck back. Usually I reserve my screaming at the TV to get back for the UNC game, and that ridiculous (but somehow effective) secondary break they run, but I'm losing me voice already and it's barely January. 2. I thought we had a few rim protectors this year? I realize we had some injuries early on, but I'm seeing a lot of standing around and watching. And 3. (and I expect to catch hell for this), no uncontested lay ups. I'm not advocating hurting anyone, but if you're not in position to take a charge, then no ticky tack Ole defense on a drive to the basket. I'd like to see some attention to this in Wednesday's game.

Finally, for all of you complaining about Matt, stop.
The problem with 3 is the last time someone stuck their leg (neck?) out, ESPN blew up. Just kidding.

CDu
01-02-2017, 08:11 PM
I would have to disagree that 'their big men aren''t particularly skilled'.. Lammers is pretty good. Not NBA talent perhaps but he has worked hard to make himself a good ACC player and I wish we had him

Maybe I am jaded after the last 3 games but this post seems to indicate we can win easily "without any fuss". I don't know that I feel we can win any game "without any fuss". We couldn't beat TSU or Elon without some fuss. And GT is better than TSU and ELon by some measures. ELon doesn't have a Lammers in the middle.

I don't think Tech is better than TSU at all, actually. I would say those programs are pretty comparable this year.

Kedsy
01-02-2017, 11:01 PM
And GT is better than TSU and ELon by some measures.

This really isn't quite true, at least according to the computer rankings:

Pomeroy:
--------
Ga Tech 130
Tenn St 138
Elon 153

Sagarin
-------
Tenn St 111
Ga Tech 112
Elon 167

RPI
----
Tenn St 60 (yes, 60, 103 spots better than Tech)
Ga Tech 163
Elon 170

Massey
-------
Ga Tech 103
Tenn St 109
Elon 166

Basically Ga Tech and Tenn St are the same, or if you believe RPI, Tenn St is much better. Elon is worse than both, but I guess it depends on what you mean by "some measures."

uh_no
01-02-2017, 11:38 PM
This really isn't quite true, at least according to the computer rankings:

Pomeroy:
--------
Ga Tech 130
Tenn St 138
Elon 153

Sagarin
-------
Tenn St 111
Ga Tech 112
Elon 167

RPI
----
Tenn St 60 (yes, 60, 103 spots better than Tech)
Ga Tech 163
Elon 170

Massey
-------
Ga Tech 103
Tenn St 109
Elon 166

Basically Ga Tech and Tenn St are the same, or if you believe RPI, Tenn St is much better. Elon is worse than both, but I guess it depends on what you mean by "some measures."

School name length.

Steven43
01-02-2017, 11:50 PM
The comments coming from Luke have me concerned.
What comments coming from Luke? Thanks.

Doria
01-03-2017, 02:52 AM
I would have to disagree that 'their big men aren''t particularly skilled'.. Lammers is pretty good. Not NBA talent perhaps but he has worked hard to make himself a good ACC player and I wish we had him

Maybe I am jaded after the last 3 games but this post seems to indicate we can win easily "without any fuss". I don't know that I feel we can win any game "without any fuss". We couldn't beat TSU or Elon without some fuss. And GT is better than TSU and ELon by some measures. ELon doesn't have a Lammers in the middle.

I was honestly just basing my assessment on the write-up, not my own personal knowledge. As I noted, I wasn't able to watch the Carolina game, and I watched maybe two GT games last year, so I certainly meant no disrespect to Lammers.

However, I stand by the fact that I believe we have the capacity to beat GT without much fuss. I am absolutely with you in not feeling terribly confident after our last few flat performances. But I certainly hope we play more to our potential in this case.

Spanarkel
01-03-2017, 09:01 AM
Corey Heyward...6-1...in Kenpoms "nearly invisible" category...seems to get minutes because he's a senior? maybe he's good at defense?

LGD


Thanks for the player summary and insights! Corey Heyward is son of the late NFL running back Craig("Ironhead")and brother of current Pittsburgh Steeler Cameron. Not sure if I want any of our guys taking a charge from him.

sagegrouse
01-03-2017, 09:12 AM
This really isn't quite true, at least according to the computer rankings:

Pomeroy:
--------
Ga Tech 130
Tenn St 138
Elon 153

Sagarin
-------
Tenn St 111
Ga Tech 112
Elon 167

RPI
----
Tenn St 60 (yes, 60, 103 spots better than Tech)
Ga Tech 163
Elon 170

Massey
-------
Ga Tech 103
Tenn St 109
Elon 166

Basically Ga Tech and Tenn St are the same, or if you believe RPI, Tenn St is much better. Elon is worse than both, but I guess it depends on what you mean by "some measures."

Although GoFurman's post is literally true, and he may have even looked up the numbers (shocking, I know), you bring us a refreshing dose of
Teutonic scholarship, where every declarative statement is properly footnoted. This approach keeps honest those of us more in the Cambridge School of scholarship, which starts with theoretical principals and assumptions and views prior research and messy data as, well, beneath the dignity of a Cameron, er, Cambridge don.

Kindly,
Sage

elvis14
01-03-2017, 10:36 AM
Looking forward to this game. Something about beating GT right after they beat the cheats makes me happy. Would love to see a starting 5 (and a lineup that plays a lot) of Luke, Grayson, Jayson, Harry, Amile.

Anyone know if Frank is still in a walking boot and/or practicing? I'd really like to see him bounce back.

LasVegas
01-03-2017, 11:58 AM
Looking forward to this game. Something about beating GT right after they beat the cheats makes me happy. Would love to see a starting 5 (and a lineup that plays a lot) of Luke, Grayson, Jayson, Harry, Amile.

Anyone know if Frank is still in a walking boot and/or practicing? I'd really like to see him bounce back.

I'm not the GOAT but this is the starting 5 we need to reach our potential. Like I've stated before, I'm all about baptism by fire. Throw them out there, let the rust fall off, develop chemistry/roles, win a natty.

UrinalCake
01-03-2017, 12:10 PM
^ I don't think Grayson plays but I do think he'll be back for the following game against BC. Having K absent will provide sufficient cover to "sneak" him back into the lineup since all the media buzz will be about K. Plus, the following two games are on the road against FSU and Louisville, who are coincidentally the two teams against which grayson had tripping incidents last season. So I think the staff will want to get him in for a game at home before that stretch.

I think we beat GT but I don't think it will be an easy win.

Troublemaker
01-03-2017, 01:03 PM
Looking forward to this game. Something about beating GT right after they beat the cheats makes me happy. Would love to see a starting 5 (and a lineup that plays a lot) of Luke, Grayson, Jayson, Harry, Amile.

Anyone know if Frank is still in a walking boot and/or practicing? I'd really like to see him bounce back.

That's the lineup I predicted in the offseason and am rooting for to eventually happen. But I don't think it's coming soon. In Harry's case, I'm encouraged by the progress he's made so far, going from 4 minutes to 6 minutes to 13 minutes in 3 games. But I suspect he won't be ready for full starter's minutes until February.

cspan37421
01-03-2017, 01:08 PM
What comments coming from Luke? Thanks.

Probably referring to Luke's post-Elon game comments, cited elsewhere on forum.

gofurman
01-03-2017, 04:06 PM
Although GoFurman's post is literally true, and he may have even looked up the numbers (shocking, I know), you bring us a refreshing dose of
Teutonic scholarship, where every declarative statement is properly footnoted. This approach keeps honest those of us more in the Cambridge School of scholarship, which starts with theoretical principals and assumptions and views prior research and messy data as, well, beneath the dignity of a Cameron, er, Cambridge don.

Kindly,
Sage

Yes, I looked at the numbers. Believe me, I like numerics. I give KenPom the most credence - and he supports both my viewpoint as well as those who disagree w me. Basically, Tech is ever so slightly better than TSU.. and a little better than Elon. Both of whom we beat by 10 I think (not going to go back and look)... But 2 things that TSU and ELon didn't have that Tech does - more comfort in that they play at Duke most years (I assume Lammers and some upperclassmen have played at Duke?) and gt just beat UNC.. All of which makes me see them as slightly more dangerous than TSU and Elon. TSU and Elon didn't come in thinking 'we just beat UNC'!!! I think we win. But IF we win I will feel better about our team than I did in our wins over Elon and TSU.

Tech will win a few (maybe very few) ACC games this year.

This is a good time for this game - we need an ACC win. And it would be bad to lose right now. 0-2 in ACC? W K leaving? It could erode confidence ... Kids start doubting this season 'is everything going to go wrong?'. Win this and BC and it's ok.. get through January and keep improving.

And to those saying in '15 we could just 'roll the ball out and win' I think you are thinking of '99 ! These guys (HG etc) were ranked 'similarly' to our 99 guys... plus Amile, Grayson and Luke ... but it just hasn't panned out that way. Teaches you to never get too excited until you see someone actually play - plus I adhere to the 'you are never as good as you think you are when you win.. and you are never as bad as you think you are when you lose'

Skydog
01-03-2017, 06:25 PM
Yes, I looked at the numbers. Believe me, I like numerics. I give KenPom the most credence - and he supports both my viewpoint as well as those who disagree w me. ..

If you like KenPom's numerics then we have a 96% chance of winning this game. OTOH my own confidence in "almost certain" outcome predictions has been shaken in recent months.

ChillinDuke
01-03-2017, 06:28 PM
Enough about the VT shenanigans. We got a game in a couple days!

GT is obviously not great. several mediocre losses. Their best win is an OT win over #51 vcu...and they have wins against other cupcakes such as Wofford, NC AT, and UNC. Their SOS was one of the worst in the country...

The vast plurality of their time is played with

Justin Moore... 6'4 162(???) Is this kid missing an arm or something? yeesh. He doesn't appear to jump off the charts at anything, and doesn't appear to be able to shoot his way out of a paper bag, with a .464 FT% and a whopping 1-5 from 3.
Josh Okagie ...6-4 207.takes a few threes...though not prolific. He is one of the teams 4 main shot takers
Quinton Stephens...6-9 196 (???) not sure whether his or Moore's weight is worse. as a senior, you'd expect him to have bulked up a bit...but he's a stick. He's an awful shooter...converting just 38% from 2 and 28% form 3. He is the omong the teams 4 primary shot takers. He is a decent rebounder.
Ben lammers...6-10 227. Solid rebounder, solid scorer. solid shot blocker. probably the best player on the team

The SG spot seems to be split almost evenly between
Tadric Jackson...6-2...teams only reasonable 3 point shooter, and the last of the 4 primary shooters
Corey Heyward...6-1...in Kenpoms "nearly invisible" category...seems to get minutes because he's a senior? maybe he's good at defense?
Josh Heath...6-2...also a senior, also little to recommend him...but will pick up PG duties when moore takes a break. usually allowing jackson more minutes at the 2.

Abdoulaye is the last big man who eats minutes to the tune of 10 a game. It should be noted that heyward barely got any minutes vs UNC, and jackson was severly limited by foul trouble. So basically we're looking at 4 guards and 2 big men, with the 2 big men almost always on the floor.

As for what we'll do:

Given that their top 8 lineups have two big men in there, and given jackson's less than stellar performance last week, I wouldn't be surprised if chase or even perhaps harry got the start alongside amile. quinton's popsickle stick frame. That leaves jayson luke and matt to deal with the guards.

Jayson ought to be a matchup mightmare for them, as they have no players between 6'4 and 6'9 that play any meaningful minutes.

Given that they have two bigguns down low, i'm not sure we'll be able to make a killing simply getting layups as we did against VT.

Also fortunately, they're not a particularly prolific three point shooting team. Having only one good shooter.


I didn't watch the UNC game, but the two people that really beat them were Okogie and Heath, who combined for 17-19 from the free throw line and 41 points overall. The team as a whole scored 28 from the line. Given the foul trouble. Kepping GT off the line will be key given their relatively poor shooting from the floor. If we do that and rebound well, we SHOULD win this game. We also need to look to come out and score early. I'm tired of us taking 10 minutes to figure out how to attack the defense. I wouldn't be surprised to see us run some sets to get luke a couple looks from three early, as well as hopefully getting jayson some mismatch opportunities...as I'm not sure they have anyone that can guard him.

LGD

Ohhhhhh, that's Ben Lammers.

Nice rundown, thanks UhNo.

- Chillin

CoachJ10
01-03-2017, 09:19 PM
Does anyone know if Grayson is practicing?

uh_no
01-03-2017, 09:22 PM
Does anyone know if Grayson is practicing?

From the quotes from K, it seemed that he would be practicing...though i'm sure the nature of practice has changed in order to prepare for not having him on game day.

Kedsy
01-03-2017, 10:41 PM
From the quotes from K, it seemed that he would be practicing...though i'm sure the nature of practice has changed in order to prepare for not having him on game day.

The announcers for the VaTech game said he'd been practicing on the scout team.

Troublemaker
01-04-2017, 09:36 AM
I think we beat GT but I don't think it will be an easy win.

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Maybe I am jaded after the last 3 games but this post seems to indicate we can win easily "without any fuss". I don't know that I feel we can win any game "without any fuss". We couldn't beat TSU or Elon without some fuss. And GT is better than TSU and ELon by some measures. ELon doesn't have a Lammers in the middle.

gofurman, you want to get in on the action, too?

Devilwin
01-04-2017, 04:33 PM
I know we're all dealing with other issues; Grayson, K, the drubbing we took from V.Tech., but I'd like to talk some basic X and O's for a moment. I'm seeing a pattern on the defensive side that is disturbing. It looks like opposing teams are running lay-up drills. And it wasn't just V.Tech, who couldn't miss. We saw it in the 2 warm up games last week, and we saw it with Florida and Rhode Island. Teams are getting out in transition and beating us back to the basket for an easy score. 3 thoughts to deal with this: 1. Get back. If we're pressing or going zone, get to your spot. If we're going man, then get the heck back. Usually I reserve my screaming at the TV to get back for the UNC game, and that ridiculous (but somehow effective) secondary break they run, but I'm losing me voice already and it's barely January. 2. I thought we had a few rim protectors this year? I realize we had some injuries early on, but I'm seeing a lot of standing around and watching. And 3. (and I expect to catch hell for this), no uncontested lay ups. I'm not advocating hurting anyone, but if you're not in position to take a charge, then no ticky tack Ole defense on a drive to the basket. I'd like to see some attention to this in Wednesday's game.

Finally, for all of you complaining about Matt, stop.

Good defense can cover up poor shooting in most cases. At Virginia Tech, we were awful on both sides. That needs to change.
I feel Jeff will do a great job in Coach's spot, no worries there..

Bob Green
01-04-2017, 04:45 PM
I feel Jeff will do a great job in Coach's spot, no worries there..

Coach K will be coaching the team tonight against Georgia Tech.

BandAlum83
01-04-2017, 04:55 PM
Has the starting lineup been announced yet? Has anyone seen?

uh_no
01-04-2017, 05:46 PM
Harry and marques were working hard on footwork with Nate before the game

BandAlum83
01-04-2017, 05:57 PM
Stephen Wiseman ‏@stevewisemanNC 1m1 minute ago
Grayson warming up. More than he did on Saturday at VT.

just seen on twitter


Duke Basketball ‏@dukebasketball 45s45 seconds ago
Grayson Allen is warming up with his teammates—something he didn't do Saturday at Virginia Tech. No word on if he will play tonight

uh_no
01-04-2017, 05:57 PM
justice Samuel alito will also be here tonight

uh_no
01-04-2017, 06:01 PM
Grayson is shooting around with the team

BD80
01-04-2017, 06:01 PM
justice Samuel alito will also be here tonight

So there will be the appearance of Justice?

BandAlum83
01-04-2017, 06:01 PM
justice Samuel alito will also be here tonight

Does he have a connection to Duke? I wasn't aware.

BandAlum83
01-04-2017, 06:03 PM
Jeter not in uniform.


Stephen Wiseman ‏@stevewisemanNC 2m2 minutes ago
The Obi unavailable list currently includes Jeter and DeLuarier. Neither in uniform

Troublemaker
01-04-2017, 06:03 PM
Does he have a connection to Duke? I wasn't aware.

Visiting Professor of Law: https://law.duke.edu/fac/alito/

mr. synellinden
01-04-2017, 06:04 PM
Jeter not in uniform.

Would love to know why both Jeter and DeLaurier are not in uniform.

Devil2
01-04-2017, 06:17 PM
Would love to know why both Jeter and DeLaurier are not in uniform.

De Laurier has an injury. Not sure what Jeter's situation is

BandAlum83
01-04-2017, 06:18 PM
Duke Basketball ‏@dukebasketball 1m1 minute ago
Grayson Allen is still going through normal warmups about 45 minutes until tipoff. Still unclear if he'll play tonight.

The sportsworld may explode tonight!

BD80
01-04-2017, 06:22 PM
Jeter not in uniform.


Would love to know why both Jeter and DeLaurier are not in uniform.

It's a conspiracy to get more PT for Giles.

devildeac
01-04-2017, 06:23 PM
De Laurier has an injury. Not sure what Jeter's situation is


Starting to hear "injury."

We're going to have to get extra bandwidth here for more injury vigils. :(

tbyers11
01-04-2017, 06:25 PM
According to Duke Men BB twitter Grayson is starting

https://twitter.com/DukeMBB/status/816787271923941380

Along with Amile, Jayson, Luke and Harry

OZZIE4DUKE
01-04-2017, 06:27 PM
Grayson is warming up, doing layup drill.

devildeac
01-04-2017, 06:28 PM
The sportsworld may explode tonight!

I hope it's just john skipper's HQ.

BandAlum83
01-04-2017, 06:29 PM
Duke Basketball
‏@dukebasketball
Grayson Allen, Luke Kennard, Jayson Tatum, Harry Giles and Amile Jefferson are Duke's starters tonight. One-game suspension for Allen

Via twitter

devildeac
01-04-2017, 06:29 PM
It's a conspiracy to get more PT for Giles.


According to Duke Men BB twitter Grayson is starting

https://twitter.com/DukeMBB/status/816787271923941380

Along with Amile, Jayson, Luke and Harry


From your keyboard to...

Indoor66
01-04-2017, 06:30 PM
I am very pleased to hear that Grayson will start. He ain't Jack The Ripper, for crying out loud.

DukeDevil
01-04-2017, 06:31 PM
Grayson is a starter according to the Duke MBB facebook "starters" video they always show just before the game.

BandAlum83
01-04-2017, 06:31 PM
From your keyboard to...

I forsee significant minutes for Giles and Bolden.

Bring it, Guys!!

devildeac
01-04-2017, 06:31 PM
I am very pleased to hear that Grayson will start. He ain't Jack The tRipper, for crying out loud.

Clarification. ;)

Eakane
01-04-2017, 06:36 PM
I'm sure I'm in the minority here but I hope Gray is still out. A one game suspension might have been sufficient for a first or even a second incident; but a third? And the hissy fit he threw on the bench filled with righteous indignation?

I love watching Gray play, and I'll always be thankful that he almost single-handedly brought us back against Whisky two years ago; even if he never plays another minute in a Duke uniform. But a one-game suspension sends a message that Duke condones his behavior, or that because we got are butts kicked in the V.Tech game that somehow effects the length of his suspension. Whether we "need" him tonight is irrelevant. Whether he needs to continue to sit is proper.

-jk
01-04-2017, 06:36 PM
DBR Chat (http://forums.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/misc.php?do=cchatbox) is open!

If it gets a bit slow, refresh the page. If you're on a mobile device, you'll need to select "Blue" at the bottom.

As always - please follow the DBR Posting Guidelines.

Let's Go Duke!

-jk

Troublemaker
01-04-2017, 06:37 PM
Love it. Let the haters whine.

Indoor66
01-04-2017, 06:38 PM
Clarification. ;)

You ARE a sly Devil 😈😈😈.

mattman91
01-04-2017, 06:38 PM
Maybe Javin has a fake injury and we are trying to scam a medical redshirt, like how we did with Amile last year. :rolleyes:

pfrduke
01-04-2017, 06:39 PM
I'm sure I'm in the minority here but I hope Gray is still out. A one game suspension might have been sufficient for a first or even a second incident; but a third? And the hissy fit he threw on the bench filled with righteous indignation?

I love watching Gray play, and I'll always be thankful that he almost single-handedly brought us back against Whisky two years ago; even if he never plays another minute in a Duke uniform. But a one-game suspension sends a message that Duke condones his behavior, or that because we got are butts kicked in the V.Tech game that somehow effects the length of his suspension. Whether we "need" him tonight is irrelevant. Whether he needs to continue to sit is proper.

Reasonable minds can differ on the appropriate length of the suspension, but I don't understand how suspending him for one game sends a message that the team condones his behavior. If they condoned his behavior, they wouldn't have suspended him at all.

NashvilleDevil
01-04-2017, 06:40 PM
Grayson starting and so is Harry (clap, clap, clap clap clap,)

Troublemaker
01-04-2017, 06:40 PM
I'm sure I'm in the minority here but I hope Gray is still out. A one game suspension might have been sufficient for a first or even a second incident; but a third? And the hissy fit he threw on the bench filled with righteous indignation?

I love watching Gray play, and I'll always be thankful that he almost single-handedly brought us back against Whisky two years ago; even if he never plays another minute in a Duke uniform. But a one-game suspension sends a message that Duke condones his behavior, or that because we got are butts kicked in the V.Tech game that somehow effects the length of his suspension. Whether we "need" him tonight is irrelevant. Whether he needs to continue to sit is proper.

How would you know what he needs or what the proper suspension length is more than Coach K?

NashvilleDevil
01-04-2017, 06:41 PM
I'm sure I'm in the minority here but I hope Gray is still out. A one game suspension might have been sufficient for a first or even a second incident; but a third? And the hissy fit he threw on the bench filled with righteous indignation?

I love watching Gray play, and I'll always be thankful that he almost single-handedly brought us back against Whisky two years ago; even if he never plays another minute in a Duke uniform. But a one-game suspension sends a message that Duke condones his behavior, or that because we got are butts kicked in the V.Tech game that somehow effects the length of his suspension. Whether we "need" him tonight is irrelevant. Whether he needs to continue to sit is proper.

He also was stripped of his captaincy. That's a big deal.

Ballboy1998
01-04-2017, 06:43 PM
I'm sure I'm in the minority here but I hope Gray is still out. A one game suspension might have been sufficient for a first or even a second incident; but a third? And the hissy fit he threw on the bench filled with righteous indignation?

I love watching Gray play, and I'll always be thankful that he almost single-handedly brought us back against Whisky two years ago; even if he never plays another minute in a Duke uniform. But a one-game suspension sends a message that Duke condones his behavior, or that because we got are butts kicked in the V.Tech game that somehow effects the length of his suspension. Whether we "need" him tonight is irrelevant. Whether he needs to continue to sit is proper.

Grayson personally apologized to the opposing player and coach, was stripped of his captaincy, and was suspended for at least one full game. I think that is more than sufficient punishment for his actions. If the punishment had to be reflective of the media reaction, only the guillotine would suffice.

That said, I would have been fine with a longer suspension if the staff deemed it necessary for Grayson to get his head right, but if they think he has shown enough growth to get back out there then go for it!

Troublemaker
01-04-2017, 06:44 PM
Jeter "twisted" his back and is out. Pregame radio.

BandAlum83
01-04-2017, 06:46 PM
Jeter "twisted" his back and is out. Pregame radio.

Source?

So Harry is starting and we have the lineup everyone has been calling for.

I was so excited to see Grayson starting, I missed the other BIG news!

richardjackson199
01-04-2017, 06:46 PM
I'm sure I'm in the minority here but I hope Gray is still out. A one game suspension might have been sufficient for a first or even a second incident; but a third? And the hissy fit he threw on the bench filled with righteous indignation?

I love watching Gray play, and I'll always be thankful that he almost single-handedly brought us back against Whisky two years ago; even if he never plays another minute in a Duke uniform. But a one-game suspension sends a message that Duke condones his behavior, or that because we got are butts kicked in the V.Tech game that somehow effects the length of his suspension. Whether we "need" him tonight is irrelevant. Whether he needs to continue to sit is proper.

In Coach K I trust.

mattman91
01-04-2017, 06:48 PM
In Coach K I trust.

Should be on our currency.

riverside6
01-04-2017, 06:48 PM
Live tempo-based stats for Duke/Georgia Tech, starters posted...

http://www.scacchoops.com/georgia-tech-at-duke-basketball-live-stats-01042017

NSDukeFan
01-04-2017, 06:51 PM
I have just received word from ESPN that they will show a few game highlights, but most of the coverage will be a 3-way split screen showing Grayson on one screen, coach K on another and Jay Williams and Seth Greenberg on the third showing their moral indignation.

BandAlum83
01-04-2017, 06:54 PM
I have just received word from ESPN that they will show a few game highlights, but most of the coverage will be a 3-way split screen showing Grayson on one screen, coach K on another and Jay Williams and Seth Greenberg on the third showing their moral indignation.

An ISO cam on Giles, in all likelihood as well. Their heads will explode. Too many big stories in one night for Duke BB

ChillinDuke
01-04-2017, 06:56 PM
I have just received word from ESPN that they will show a few game highlights, but most of the coverage will be a 3-way split screen showing Grayson on one screen, coach K on another and Jay Williams and Seth Greenberg on the third showing their moral indignation.

On which ESPN outlet can I get solely the Jay/Seth Moral Indignation screen? I just found 8 "special event" ESPN channels on my TV box. Surely one of them will have only Jay/Seth. Heck, Seth only, if possible. Special Event #6?

- Chillin

tbyers11
01-04-2017, 06:57 PM
On which ESPN outlet can I get solely the Jay/Seth Moral Indignation screen? I just found 8 "special event" ESPN channels on my TV box. Surely one of them will have only Jay/Seth. Heck, Seth only, if possible. Special Event #6?

- Chillin

By not announcing it until right before game time Duke didn't give ESPN time to mobilize their Full Indignation coverage. We will have to settle for Karl Ravech and Jay Bilas from the crow's nest.

Eakane
01-04-2017, 07:00 PM
I don't need to know what K knows to have the opinion that this was noting more than another hand slap.

He deserved to be stripped of the Captaincy.

His apology was necessary and appropriate.

Has he completed an anger management course? Has he received any counseling?

Are you all at least in agreement with me that if it happens again (and lord knows he's going to be tested by opposing teams trying to get under his skin), he should be dismissed?

lotusland
01-04-2017, 07:01 PM
I watched the UNC vs GT game. GT try's to get to the baskets with pick a rolls, back cuts and run outs on defensive rebounds. They want to make you pay for over playing on D. Duke's normal man to man D is vulnerable to GT's offense. It won't help to have Giles or Bolden in if they're out of position. I don't know how good our zone is but might be a good time find out. Also just go under some screens without switching on their non-shooters to see if they can hurt us. They got a lot of lay ups against UNC. Hopefully Duke can do better

mr. synellinden
01-04-2017, 07:01 PM
De Laurier has an injury. Not sure what Jeter's situation is

Will we get more or less information on his injury than Bolden's?



Jeter "twisted" his back and is out. Pregame radio.

We're allowed to have injuries that are not leg injuries?

WHOneedsSOX
01-04-2017, 07:02 PM
Anyone know where to buy the jerseys they're wearing tonight?

NSDukeFan
01-04-2017, 07:02 PM
I don't need to know what K knows to have the opinion that this was noting more than another hand slap.

He deserved to be stripped of the Captaincy.

His apology was necessary and appropriate.

Has he completed an anger management course? Has he received any counseling?

Are you all at least in agreement with me that if it happens again (and lord knows he's going to be tested by opposing teams trying to get under his skin), he should be dismissed?

Sorry, I am not in agreement.

Indoor66
01-04-2017, 07:02 PM
Damn, guess I will have to use Mute - Bilas!

NashvilleDevil
01-04-2017, 07:03 PM
An ISO cam on Giles, in all likelihood as well. Their heads will explode. Too many big stories in one night for Duke BB

Just as K planned

pfrduke
01-04-2017, 07:03 PM
Are you all at least in agreement with me that if it happens again (and lord knows he's going to be tested by opposing teams trying to get under his skin), he should be dismissed?

I am not. I do not believe the offense, even repeated multiple times, is so far outside the bounds of reasonable sportsmanship that it should disqualify him from further competition for Duke.

Now, if Coach K wanted to make that the consequence, I would think it was too harsh but ultimately wouldn't have a problem with the outcome, because team rules are team rules.

pfrduke
01-04-2017, 07:07 PM
The ball moves a lot better with Grayson in the game.

Eakane
01-04-2017, 07:16 PM
Okay, is there ANYBODY (Duke fans only, we all know how they must feel over at IC, and who cares how they feel?) who believes the one game suspension was way too light? Anybody at least concerned that it sends the wrong message, or that his head isn't quite screwed back on right yet?

I'd hate to lose him, but more because I'd hate it for him, not Duke's chances this year. But one more trip, kick, sucker punch or any other equivalent incident, and I'd think he should be gone.

And this is me talking -- been a fan for 28 years.

BLPOG
01-04-2017, 07:19 PM
Okay, is there ANYBODY (Duke fans only, we all know how they must feel over at IC, and who cares how they feel?) who believes the one game suspension was way too light? Anybody at least concerned that it sends the wrong message, or that his head isn't quite screwed back on right yet?

I'd hate to lose him, but more because I'd hate it for him, not Duke's chances this year. But one more trip, kick, sucker punch or any other equivalent incident, and I'd think he should be gone.

And this is me talking -- been a fan for 28 years.

My opinion is that this thread should be about the basketball game I'm watching right now.

accfanfrom1970
01-04-2017, 07:20 PM
[QUOTE=Eakane;938171]I don't need to know what K knows to have the opinion that this was noting more than another hand slap.

You can certainly have an opinion, no matter how little you know about the situation compared to Coach K and the staff.

So I too will disagree.

curtis325
01-04-2017, 07:20 PM
Okay, is there ANYBODY (Duke fans only, we all know how they must feel over at IC, and who cares how they feel?) who believes the one game suspension was way too light? Anybody at least concerned that it sends the wrong message, or that his head isn't quite screwed back on right yet?

I'd hate to lose him, but more because I'd hate it for him, not Duke's chances this year. But one more trip, kick, sucker punch or any other equivalent incident, and I'd think he should be gone.

And this is me talking -- been a fan for 28 years.

Only one person counts. Coach K thinks it is right, so it is right.

arnie
01-04-2017, 07:21 PM
I have just received word from ESPN that they will show a few game highlights, but most of the coverage will be a 3-way split screen showing Grayson on one screen, coach K on another and Jay Williams and Seth Greenberg on the third showing their moral indignation.

Great start for all Duke players. Unfortunately, Bilas will not shut up. It's all Bilas opining on the short Grayson suspension.

ricks68
01-04-2017, 07:21 PM
Anyone know where to buy the jerseys they're wearing tonight?

Dope Shop.

ricks

WHOneedsSOX
01-04-2017, 07:32 PM
Dope Shop.

ricks

Is that the school store? Anyone want to buy me one and send it to LA? I'll pay you back. lol

Duke76
01-04-2017, 07:32 PM
Great start for all Duke players. Unfortunately, Bilas will not shut up. It's all Bilas opining on the short Grayson suspension.

halftime show should really be interesting

CDu
01-04-2017, 07:37 PM
As mentioned, Tech is not good.

arnie
01-04-2017, 07:39 PM
halftime show should really be interesting

You don't think the ex VPI will have K's back on this?

Duke76
01-04-2017, 07:46 PM
You don't think the ex VPI will have K's back on this?

Jay Williams didn't disappoint...in the run up to halftime show, stay tuned

brevity
01-04-2017, 07:51 PM
Okay, is there ANYBODY (Duke fans only, we all know how they must feel over at IC, and who cares how they feel?) who believes the one game suspension was way too light?

Yes.

But keep in mind that, in this holiday calendar, the one-game suspension was 14 days. That may not be as long as some here would consider fair, but it is theoretically long enough to meet whatever internal criteria there was.

Also, keep in mind that Coach K brought back Grayson while he was still in charge, rather than sometime in the next 4 weeks when Jeff Capel would have to deal with the headache. This closes the matter, and gives K a rest period with no open issues and Capel a complete team.

I don't love the optics and I don't love the timing, but I'm not sure what else there is to say. Others here no doubt will find something.

BD80
01-04-2017, 07:55 PM
My wife doesn't follow basketball that closely, but is in the room with me as I watch the game.

Her comment: "That one announcer is a bit of a jerk: 'sensitive ears.' He's kind of a blowhard."

jbay201
01-04-2017, 07:59 PM
let the haters hate but the team is completely different with grayson allen and it was definitely the right call to bring him back. Looks like he has taken over PG duties from Jones. Great half so far!

CDu
01-04-2017, 08:00 PM
Yes.

But keep in mind that, in this holiday calendar, the one-game suspension was 14 days. That may not be as long as some here would consider fair, but it is theoretically long enough to meet whatever internal criteria there was.

Also, keep in mind that Coach K brought back Grayson while he was still in charge, rather than sometime in the next 4 weeks when Jeff Capel would have to deal with the headache. This closes the matter, and gives K a rest period with no open issues and Capel a complete team.

I don't love the optics and I don't love the timing, but I'm not sure what else there is to say. Others here no doubt will find something.

I don't love the optics. But ultimately I don'tcare as long as he doesn't do it or anything bad again at Duke.

richardjackson199
01-04-2017, 08:00 PM
Seth Greenberg, pretty sure you aren't qualified to diagnose Grayson with "an issue" or make any treatment recommendations.

BandAlum83
01-04-2017, 08:01 PM
Is that the school store? Anyone want to buy me one and send it to LA? I'll pay you back. lol

I'd gladly pay you Tuesday for a hamburger today.

Indoor66
01-04-2017, 08:06 PM
May we now put the Grayson issue to bed? The powers that be have dealt with the matter in the way they deem appropriate. IMO, it behooves us to put the issue behind us. If, God forbid, it arises again, we can deal with it. Otherwise, let's find something else to be distraught and indignant about.

WHOneedsSOX
01-04-2017, 08:15 PM
I'd gladly pay you Tuesday for a hamburger today.

Sure if you buy me a jersey haha

cakerace
01-04-2017, 08:20 PM
Seth Greenberg wears Dope Shop ties...

downeastdad
01-04-2017, 08:22 PM
May we now put the Grayson issue to bed? The powers that be have dealt with the matter in the way they deem appropriate. IMO, it behooves us to put the issue behind us. If, God forbid, it arises again, we can deal with it. Otherwise, let's find something else to be distraught and indignant about.

Totally agree. But how long are we going to have to listen to "should have been the ACC" or "should have been three games" or any of the other comments that for sure are coming? This ain't over yet, no matter what we say.

arnie
01-04-2017, 08:28 PM
Totally agree. But how long are we going to have to listen to "should have been the ACC" or "should have been three games" or any of the other comments that for sure are coming? This ain't over yet, no matter what we say.

Think ESPN will vilify Grayson the entire year - expect the a--hol-- to bring it up every game.

ricks68
01-04-2017, 08:31 PM
Is that the school store? Anyone want to buy me one and send it to LA? I'll pay you back. lol

My comment was a joke because the jerseys look like those that the team wore over 50 years ago when I was a student. The Dope Shop was the center of student activity at the time and the Duke Store was connected to it. I doubt that the jerseys and shorts (which also look similar except for the length) are available outside the program.

ricks

WHOneedsSOX
01-04-2017, 08:35 PM
My comment was a joke because the jerseys look like those that the team wore over 50 years ago when I was a student. The Dope Shop was the center of student activity at the time and the Duke Store was connected to it. I doubt that the jerseys and shorts (which also look similar except for the length) are available outside the program.

ricks

Aww got it. Thanks.