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mgtr
06-01-2016, 09:27 AM
Well, the opinions are all over the place. I think we need a poll for winner and how many games. I am already on the record for the Warriors in 4, and many have said the Warriors in 5. I really would like to see a poll.

JasonEvans
06-01-2016, 02:16 PM
Well, the opinions are all over the place. I think we need a poll for winner and how many games. I am already on the record for the Warriors in 4, and many have said the Warriors in 5. I really would like to see a poll.

Ask and ye shall receive.

flyingdutchdevil
06-01-2016, 02:18 PM
My brain tells in Warriors in 5, but I really want Cleveland in 4, 5, 6, or 7. Sadly, I went with my brain.

luburch
06-01-2016, 03:15 PM
I would be okay with either team winning. I really enjoy Steph as well as LeBron and Kyrie. I just think that the Warriors are a really bad match-up for the Cavs. Had it been Cavs vs. OKC I would have taken Cavs in 6. Instead, Warriors in 6.

cato
06-01-2016, 03:49 PM
Huh. I guess my contrarian and somewhat flippant pick of Cavs in 6 was not so contrarian.

MarkD83
06-01-2016, 07:45 PM
I picked Duke which means Cleveland since they have Kyrie and Dahntay while GS has McAdoo and HWSNBN

kshepinthehouse
06-01-2016, 10:50 PM
Warriors in 5

duke4ever19
06-01-2016, 11:04 PM
Cavs in 6. Seems like the "sexy pick" at the moment.

luburch
06-02-2016, 07:11 AM
So the poll is currently 27-19 in favor of the Warriors, with two people just selecting "Duke" as an answer.

I'm a little surprised it's that close. I wonder if it's because Kyrie (& Dahntay) plays for for the Cavs.

tbyers11
06-02-2016, 07:23 AM
So the poll is currently 27-19 in favor of the Warriors, with two people just selecting "Duke" as an answer.

I'm a little surprised it's that close. I wonder if it's because Kyrie (& Dahntay) plays for for the Cavs.

I'm a bit surprised as well. If you combine the "experts" predictions from ESPN.com and CBSsports.com you have 28-7 in favor of Golden State

kshepinthehouse
06-02-2016, 07:27 AM
I'm a bit surprised as well. If you combine the "experts" predictions from ESPN.com and CBSsports.com you have 28-7 in favor of Golden State

Vegas with the Warriors as a big favorite along with the ESPN power index.

Not saying the Cavs can't win but everything points to them as underdogs.

If both teams play to their potential the Warriors win easily.

Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15
06-02-2016, 07:32 AM
So the poll is currently 27-19 in favor of the Warriors, with two people just selecting "Duke" as an answer.

I'm a little surprised it's that close. I wonder if it's because Kyrie (& Dahntay) plays for for the Cavs.

Wait... are you suggesting that certain posters are allowing their emotions to override facts and numbers?

Crazy.

Indoor66
06-02-2016, 08:12 AM
Wait... are you suggesting that certain posters are allowing their emotions to override facts and numbers?

Crazy.

Never happen on this board! :cool:

gurufrisbee
06-02-2016, 08:39 AM
I'm a bit surprised as well. If you combine the "experts" predictions from ESPN.com and CBSsports.com you have 28-7 in favor of Golden State

True, but only one of them has the Warriors winning in less than 6, which you could surmise means that they also aren't sold on the many "Warriors will crush them" predictions going around here either.

flyingdutchdevil
06-02-2016, 08:42 AM
True, but only one of them has the Warriors winning in less than 6, which you could surmise means that they also aren't sold on the many "Warriors will crush them" predictions going around here either.

11 of us, actually.

superdave
06-02-2016, 09:17 AM
I said Warriors in 7. I hope I am wrong and the Cavs sweep them. I'm feeling a bit over-exposed to Curry.

I do hope we get some close games though. I also think this is a big Finals for Lebron. He is 31 and cannot play forever. If he is going to move past Kobe, Duncan, Shaq, Oscar into the next level of all-time greats, he has to win this one and a few more.

Put it another way, if Lebron loses this Finals then Curry is the undisputed best player on the planet. Lebron probably would not get that mantle back. If Lebron wins, his peak is extended a while.

Troublemaker
06-02-2016, 10:19 AM
Wait... are you suggesting that certain posters are allowing their emotions to override facts and numbers?

Crazy.

While I picked GSW myself, the Cavs backers are certainly using facts and numbers to arrive at their pick, from what I've seen. They're just going to emphasize different facts and numbers (those that favor the Cavs) from those who chose GSW. And the Cavs backers MAY end up being correct; we'll find out over the next couple of weeks.

Avvocato
06-02-2016, 10:45 AM
I said Golden St. in 6. I think some might also remember that the Cavs held a 2-1 lead in last year's Finals with Lebron and a bag of balls (i.e., no Love and no Kyrie). I think the Warriors win, but I'm throwing a little respect Cleveland's way. I think even if the Cavs win a few games, the Warriors have shown an ability the last two postseasons to make adjustments and respond to adversity.

Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15
06-02-2016, 11:02 AM
While I picked GSW myself, the Cavs backers are certainly using facts and numbers to arrive at their pick, from what I've seen. They're just going to emphasize different facts and numbers (those that favor the Cavs) from those who chose GSW. And the Cavs backers MAY end up being correct; we'll find out over the next couple of weeks.

I'm just saying that it doesn't surprise me in the slightest that a group of Duke fans decide that Kyrie is more likely to win his first ring than the sports media might see it.

Fans have a tendency to predict what they WANT to happen rather than what is most likely to happen. I'm not saying it's a bad thing - I do it all the time with my NCAA brackets. Sometimes, it's correct.

kAzE
06-02-2016, 11:06 AM
Picked Warriors in 6, rooting for the Cavs sweep! (But also rooting for entertaining games, of course)

flyingdutchdevil
06-02-2016, 11:26 AM
Picked Warriors in 6, rooting for the Cavs sweep! (But also rooting for entertaining games, of course)

I'm rooting for Green to get a flagrant 2 in Game 1 that takes him out of the series. Then the Cavs play the Dubs even until Kyrie hits a three at the buzzer to steal four wins in a row. That would be the perfect Finals for me.

Troublemaker
06-02-2016, 02:20 PM
I'm just saying that it doesn't surprise me in the slightest that a group of Duke fans decide that Kyrie is more likely to win his first ring than the sports media might see it.

Fans have a tendency to predict what they WANT to happen rather than what is most likely to happen. I'm not saying it's a bad thing - I do it all the time with my NCAA brackets. Sometimes, it's correct.

Ah, gotcha. My bad -- somehow I missed the context the first time around of your comment.

Let me say, though, that the pundits may have their own biases. If you know lots of people will be reading your pick, it may influence you to make a safe, conservative pick according to the conventional wisdom.

And, of course, any Duke bias our DBR posters are carrying when making their picks could turn out to be a blessing in disguise. If Cleveland ends up winning, it's possible that the Duke bias allowed some of our posters to examine angles on how Cleveland could win that should've received more attention from the mainstream pundits. (That, or maybe our posters just blindly picked the team win more Duke players and got lucky :-)

rsvman
06-02-2016, 02:46 PM
Huh. I guess my contrarian and somewhat flippant pick of Cavs in 6 was not so contrarian.

I made the same pick. Seems that the most vociferous among us think the Warriors are invincible, making it seem as though nobody thinks the Cavs will win.

Reddevil
06-02-2016, 03:18 PM
I was watching Mike and Mike this morning while getting ready for work. They were telling Cleveland jokes since they have not had a champion of any kind in a major sport in 50 years or so like, "How do you count to 10 in Cleveland?" 0-1, 0-2, 0-3... (0 and one, 0 and two, 0 and three, etc.)

The futility continues - Oakland in seven!

CameronBlue
06-02-2016, 08:06 PM
The prognauseators want the feel-good story to continue. They want to see Curry recognized as the league's best player, force-fed to those who still consider Lebron the better player. The thought of GSW's epic 73 wins as a mere footnote to the season is unimaginable. A lot has to go well for Cleveland--Kyrie has to guard and Love has to rebound if his shot isn't falling--but if Kyrie is ready to prove he belongs in the conversation of greatest point guards ever--the potential is there--it will be the Cavs in 5.

The Cavs came into the playoffs and ran through 2 series undefeated; they are focused. GSW was looking for a way to alleviate boredom so they fabricated a 3-1 deficit to perk themselves up. But the photo-negative of over-confidence is complacency and a failure to play with urgency and that's where the Dubs are at the moment; they're intoxicated with swagger, oh poisonous elixir. This will be a 3 game series, not on the back end but on the front. The team that leads 2-1 will take the title and that will be Cleveland. GSW will find themselves out of the series before they've mentally gotten into it.

wavedukefan70s
06-02-2016, 08:16 PM
My moneys on golden state.kevin love is a deciding factor.i cant put my money on him.kyrie and lebron need another almost star player .

dukelifer
06-02-2016, 08:22 PM
I was watching Mike and Mike this morning while getting ready for work. They were telling Cleveland jokes since they have not had a champion of any kind in a major sport in 50 years or so like, "How do you count to 10 in Cleveland?" 0-1, 0-2, 0-3... (0 and one, 0 and two, 0 and three, etc.)

The futility continues - Oakland in seven!

Assuming no injuries- GS in five - although games will be fairly close.

Papa John
06-02-2016, 08:43 PM
I was watching Mike and Mike this morning while getting ready for work. They were telling Cleveland jokes since they have not had a champion of any kind in a major sport in 50 years or so like, "How do you count to 10 in Cleveland?" 0-1, 0-2, 0-3... (0 and one, 0 and two, 0 and three, etc.)

The futility continues - Oakland in seven!

Personally, I enjoyed the one about none of the teams in Cleveland having a website... Because none of them can string 3 w's together.

Getting to the business at hand, though... I'm a little surprised that Golden State is such a huge favorite. As someone who is not a big fan of the NBA, and therefore couldn't care less who wins this series, regardless of who is on which team (I'm far more interested in the Stanley Cup finals), I'd put my money on Cleveland in 6 as well. I mean, they had a realistic shot of winning it last year, and that was sans Love and Kyrie. I imagine it will be a competitive series either way, but I don't think it's at all illogical to pick Cleveland.

darthur
06-03-2016, 01:07 AM
GSW was looking for a way to alleviate boredom so they fabricated a 3-1 deficit to perk themselves up. But the photo-negative of over-confidence is complacency and a failure to play with urgency and that's where the Dubs are at the moment; they're intoxicated with swagger, oh poisonous elixir. This will be a 3 game series, not on the back end but on the front. The team that leads 2-1 will take the title and that will be Cleveland. GSW will find themselves out of the series before they've mentally gotten into it.

Uh not sure if serious? Outside of maybe the first game, the Warriors were not complacent in that series. They were rattled. Very different things.

YmoBeThere
06-03-2016, 06:52 AM
I didn't watch the whole game so missed the Cavs closing to within 2 in the 3rd, but the visible difference between the two teams was quite apparent. The difficulty that OKC presented to both GS and the Spurs was Adams and to a lesser extent Kanter. In other words, inside post play. This is exactly what the Cavs are missing.

Luckily, no one picked Cavs in 4.

Indoor66
06-03-2016, 08:30 AM
My moneys on golden state.kevin love is a deciding factor.i cant put my money on him.kyrie and lebron need another almost star player .

I'll contribute to your new keyboard fund. :mad:

DukieInBrasil
06-03-2016, 08:40 AM
Cavs need to let Dellavadova go, and bring up Cook. Can't happen this year, but the dude just isn't good enough to be a quality backup PG. He can shoot, sometimes, but so can a lot of other guys. Backup PGs don't need to be stars (by definition), but they need to at least not be -19 detractors.
OTOH, Kyrie didn't shoot very well from the floor, but got it done at the FT line.
It's definitely gonna be tough for the Cavs to win at GSW, but the starting 5 played reasonably well, except JR Smith who pulled a 36 minute disappearing act. But the Cleveland bench was on the verge of completely useless compared to GSW's.

flyingdutchdevil
06-03-2016, 08:48 AM
Cavs need to let Dellavadova go, and bring up Cook. Can't happen this year, but the dude just isn't good enough to be a quality backup PG. He can shoot, sometimes, but so can a lot of other guys. Backup PGs don't need to be stars (by definition), but they need to at least not be -19 detractors.
OTOH, Kyrie didn't shoot very well from the floor, but got it done at the FT line.
It's definitely gonna be tough for the Cavs to win at GSW, but the starting 5 played reasonably well, except JR Smith who pulled a 36 minute disappearing act. But the Cleveland bench was on the verge of completely useless compared to GSW's.

Disagree 100%. Delly can do something that Kyrie absolutely cannot and pretty sure is 10x better at it than Cook: defense.

Delly's value to the team isn't shooting; it's defense with some simple playmaking. Dropping Delly, with his small salary, is just a terrible choice.

superdave
06-03-2016, 09:25 AM
Disagree 100%. Delly can do something that Kyrie absolutely cannot and pretty sure is 10x better at it than Cook: defense.

Delly's value to the team isn't shooting; it's defense with some simple playmaking. Dropping Delly, with his small salary, is just a terrible choice.

Agreed. Delly is a tough SOB. He is the perfect backup in the NBA. Can run point or score if needed, plays tough D, and knows and accepts his role. Think Patty Mills or Jason Terry.

I think the biggest issue for the Cavs is having to rely on JR Smith. He fumbled his first two possessions last night and never recovered. Looked like stage fright to me. Stage fright for a swagger-driven player who was in the Finals last year? Need to upgrade that spot.

CDu
06-03-2016, 10:38 AM
Agreed. Delly is a tough SOB. He is the perfect backup in the NBA. Can run point or score if needed, plays tough D, and knows and accepts his role. Think Patty Mills or Jason Terry.

I think the biggest issue for the Cavs is having to rely on JR Smith. He fumbled his first two possessions last night and never recovered. Looked like stage fright to me. Stage fright for a swagger-driven player who was in the Finals last year? Need to upgrade that spot.

Yeah, I would say that Shumpert and Delly should play more than Smith right now. The danger there is that Smith has the higher ceiling, but if he's off he is just such a drain on the lineup. Shumpert is a lockdown defender with awful hair, and can hit open 3s with at least some regularity.

kAzE
06-03-2016, 10:46 AM
Yeah, I would say that Shumpert and Delly should play more than Smith right now. The danger there is that Smith has the higher ceiling, but if he's off he is just such a drain on the lineup. Shumpert is a lockdown defender with awful hair, and can hit open 3s with at least some regularity.

Not a fan of the high top fade? I think it's great! It even has actual utility on the court! As a defender, it's harder to see potential passes over his head, and I have to imagine at some point, it has been a factor in contesting a shot or obstructing vision just enough to affect a play defensively.

In all seriousness though, I think you have to keep starting J.R., just because if he's hot, he can swing a game by himself. If he doesn't have it going, you always have Shumpert/Delly who can fill in.

flyingdutchdevil
06-03-2016, 11:11 AM
Not a fan of the high top fade? I think it's great! It even has actual utility on the court! As a defender, it's harder to see potential passes over his head, and I have to imagine at some point, it has been a factor in contesting a shot or obstructing vision just enough to affect a play defensively.

In all seriousness though, I think you have to keep starting J.R., just because if he's hot, he can swing a game by himself. If he doesn't have it going, you always have Shumpert/Delly who can fill in.

Yes, yes, yes, and yes. Smith is indeed the closest thing the NBA has been to Dr Jekyll and Mr Hyde, but if Dr Jekyll comes out, watch out. Cavs will be nearly impossible to beat that game.

I would start Smith, monitor his play and attitude during the 1st quarter, and then keep him or switch to the Shump/Delly.

Smith, for me, is the 4th most exciting player in these playoffs after BronBron, Curry, and Irving, because he can swing a game faster than anyone. Likewise, he can sink the Cavs faster than anyone as well.

superdave
06-03-2016, 11:12 AM
Not a fan of the high top fade? I think it's great! It even has actual utility on the court! As a defender, it's harder to see potential passes over his head, and I have to imagine at some point, it has been a factor in contesting a shot or obstructing vision just enough to affect a play defensively.

In all seriousness though, I think you have to keep starting J.R., just because if he's hot, he can swing a game by himself. If he doesn't have it going, you always have Shumpert/Delly who can fill in.

Need more minutes for Frye as well

YmoBeThere
06-05-2016, 10:13 PM
I gave Cleveland much more credit than they deserve.

jipops
06-05-2016, 10:48 PM
I can totally see GS handing game 4 to Cleveland just so they can close this out at home. The matchup is so one-sided they could actually just give one away.

On the other hand, a Finals sweep may cement them as the greatest nba team of all time.

Edouble
06-06-2016, 09:52 AM
I can totally see GS handing game 4 to Cleveland just so they can close this out at home. The matchup is so one-sided they could actually just give one away.

On the other hand, a Finals sweep may cement them as the greatest nba team of all time.

But when they hand it to them, will they take it or drop it?

GS might have a hard time not winning by 20.

jimsumner
06-06-2016, 11:50 AM
I picked Cleveland in six.

I wish to amend my prediction to Golden State in three. I see Cleveland conceding after the next game.

NSDukeFan
06-06-2016, 12:06 PM
I picked Cleveland in six.

I wish to amend my prediction to Golden State in three. I see Cleveland conceding after the next game.

If nothing changes in the next game at home then Cleveland might as well concede. I do expect a competitive game 3.

Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15
06-07-2016, 07:53 PM
I picked Cleveland in six.

I wish to amend my prediction to Golden State in three. I see Cleveland conceding after the next game.

I picked GS in two. Do I win the pot?

mgtr
06-07-2016, 08:25 PM
I picked GS in two. Do I win the pot?

Only in Colorado.;)

Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15
06-07-2016, 11:38 PM
Only in Colorado.;)

Ah so. We Asheville folks don't catch on to innuendo.

luburch
06-14-2016, 07:38 AM
If the Warriors win on Thursday, the second-most popular selection will end up being the correct one as well.

CDu
06-14-2016, 09:24 AM
If the Warriors win on Thursday, the second-most popular selection will end up being the correct one as well.

With an asterisk. And I say that as someone who predicted a 7-game series.

UrinalCake
06-14-2016, 11:03 AM
I picked Warriors in six but would love to see this series go to seven for the entertainment value. I've probably watched more NBA games this playoffs than in the past ten years combined. Would love for Cleveland to win it all as well but I don't see it happening, despite how well they played yesterday.

cato
06-14-2016, 11:42 AM
With an asterisk. And I say that as someone who predicted a 7-game series.

What's the asterisk?

luburch
06-14-2016, 11:47 AM
What's the asterisk?

I'm assuming Draymond's suspension.

UrinalCake
06-14-2016, 11:49 AM
If we had done a poll before the series stared on whether Draymond would be suspended for a game at some point in the series, I'm guessing there would be a high percentage of "yes"'s

wavedukefan70s
06-14-2016, 12:01 PM
Yeah lm not saying what green did was right.,but lebron earned it by walking over him.i wouldnt have been happy either .i believe the suspension was handed down to extend the series.

cato
06-14-2016, 12:12 PM
Yeah lm not saying what green did was right.,but lebron earned it by walking over him.i wouldnt have been happy either .i believe the suspension was handed down to extend the series.

Why is everyone talking about a "suspension being handed down"? He got tagged with a flagrant 1. It was his fourth. Pretty straight forward.

When sitting on three flagrants, you should not try to punch a guy in the nuts. At least, if you want to play.

tbyers11
06-14-2016, 01:25 PM
Why is everyone talking about a "suspension being handed down"? He got tagged with a flagrant 1. It was his fourth. Pretty straight forward.

When sitting on three flagrants, you should not try to punch a guy in the nuts. At least, if you want to play.

The flagrant 1 call was not made during the game in real-time, but a day and a half later by the NBA review committee. So while you are correct that the suspension was automatic, the flagrant 1 that led to the suspension could be considered to have been "handed down".

cato
06-14-2016, 01:38 PM
The flagrant 1 call was not made during the game in real-time, but a day and a half later by the NBA review committee. So while you are correct that the suspension was automatic, the flagrant 1 that led to the suspension could be considered to have been "handed down".

Are you suggesting that the flagrant 1 was not the correct call? When it was handed out makes no difference. Flagrant fouls are handed out after the game all of the time.

Or are you suggesting that the NBA should have considered this foul differently, because Green was already sitting on 3 flagrants?

tbyers11
06-14-2016, 02:04 PM
Are you suggesting that the flagrant 1 was not the correct call? When it was handed out makes no difference. Flagrant fouls are handed out after the game all of the time.

Or are you suggesting that the NBA should have considered this foul differently, because Green was already sitting on 3 flagrants?

I think that particular flagrant foul call was weak because it looked more like a split second reaction by Draymond at being stepped over than a conscious decision to make contact with LeBron's nether regions. However, it is consistent with how flagrants have been handed out in these playoffs so I don't think it was incorrect.

When it was handed out does make a difference to tinfoil hat-wearing conspiracy types who say that the NBA handed it out to try and prolong the series. I don't consider myself part of this group but was trying to provide an answer to your original question about why "everyone [was] talking about a suspension being handed down".

Ichabod Drain
06-14-2016, 02:10 PM
I think that particular flagrant foul call was weak because it looked more like a split second reaction by Draymond at being stepped over than a conscious decision to make contact with LeBron's nether regions. However, it is consistent with how flagrants have been handed out in these playoffs so I don't think it was incorrect.



Amazing how many of Draymond's "split second reactions" result in his limbs moving quickly and directly at the opposing players nether regions.

flyingdutchdevil
06-14-2016, 02:30 PM
Amazing how many of Draymond's "split second reactions" result in his limbs moving quickly and directly at the opposing players nether regions.

His limbs are likely magnetized, like bolt to nut(s)...

tbyers11
06-14-2016, 02:51 PM
Amazing how many of Draymond's "split second reactions" result in his limbs moving quickly and directly at the opposing players nether regions.

Yes, but theoretically that shouldn't weigh in at all on the judgement of this particular case by the NBA.

Look, I'm no Draymond Green apologist. I think he definitely meant to make contact with Adams on the "flail" in the OKC series. He deserved what he got because his continued chippy and "borderline" dirty play led to a suspension of accumulation. I just think that Lebron was the instigator here and if a player who did not have Draymond's rightfully-deserved rep threw his arm up to get the player stepping over him "off" of him that player might not have gotten a flagrant here.

Also, as FDD said, Draymond has some weird magnetism in his limbs :)

Ichabod Drain
06-14-2016, 03:04 PM
Yes, but theoretically that shouldn't weigh in at all on the judgement of this particular case by the NBA.

Look, I'm no Draymond Green apologist. I think he definitely meant to make contact with Adams on the "flail" in the OKC series. He deserved what he got because his continued chippy and "borderline" dirty play led to a suspension of accumulation. I just think that Lebron was the instigator here and if a player who did not have Draymond's rightfully-deserved rep threw his arm up to get the player stepping over him "off" of him that player might not have gotten a flagrant here.

Also, as FDD said, Draymond has some weird magnetism in his limbs :)

Lebron was definitely the instigator and he received a technical for it. Draymond definitely reacted by sack-tapping Lebron and he received a flagrant for it. IMHO that is exactly how it should have been handled.

El_Diablo
06-14-2016, 03:16 PM
a split second reaction

Yeah, why should someone be punished for 48 minutes for a split section of action???

Every other punch that has been thrown in the history of the sport typically takes several days to plan and execute.

elvis14
06-14-2016, 04:38 PM
Lebron was definitely the instigator and he received a technical for it. Draymond definitely reacted by sack-tapping Lebron and he received a flagrant for it. IMHO that is exactly how it should have been handled.

Nope, no calls were made during the game and upon further review, nothing should have been done especially considering how this game was called. I guess the moral of the story here (one that D.Blatt learned) is that LeBron gets what he asks for...be it from the Cavs or the NBA. SMH

Ichabod Drain
06-14-2016, 04:40 PM
Nope, no calls were made during the game and upon further review, nothing should have been done especially considering how this game was called. I guess the moral of the story here (one that D.Blatt learned) is that LeBron gets what he asks for...be it from the Cavs or the NBA. SMH

Flagrant "1" (FFP1) - unnecessary contact committed by a player against an opponent. The opposing team is awarded two (2) free throws and possession.

Slapping a guy in the family jewels is unnecessary contact. You can't let a guy get away with that.

luburch
06-15-2016, 07:17 AM
Flagrant "1" (FFP1) - unnecessary contact committed by a player against an opponent. The opposing team is awarded two (2) free throws and possession.

Slapping a guy in the family jewels is unnecessary contact. You can't let a guy get away with that.

Nope. The entire NBA is rigged and LeBron is the only one who is allowed to win the title.

Troublemaker
06-15-2016, 07:39 AM
Flagrant "1" (FFP1) - unnecessary contact committed by a player against an opponent. The opposing team is awarded two (2) free throws and possession.

Slapping a guy in the family jewels is unnecessary contact. You can't let a guy get away with that.

I would argue that Lebron stepping over Draymond created unnecessary contact on Draymond's shoulders, too, with Lebron riding him for a brief moment. One might even argue that the step-over move was "excessive" (Flagrant 2).

With Lebron being the aggressor and making unnecessary contact himself in the altercation, and with Draymond's contact to the groin being minimal, I probably would've made a "spirit of the law" ruling and NOT suspended Draymond. But, I respect those that disagree and would go by the "letter of the law."

YmoBeThere
06-15-2016, 08:11 AM
Nope. The entire NBA is rigged and LeBron is the only one who is allowed to win the title.

Which is interesting because to date, he is 2-3 in NBA Finals.

elvis14
06-15-2016, 08:21 AM
I would argue that Lebron stepping over Draymond created unnecessary contact on Draymond's shoulders, too, with Lebron riding him for a brief moment. One might even argue that the step-over move was "excessive" (Flagrant 2).

With Lebron being the aggressor and making unnecessary contact himself in the altercation, and with Draymond's contact to the groin being minimal, I probably would've made a "spirit of the law" ruling and NOT suspended Draymond. But, I respect those that disagree and would go by the "letter of the law."

Very well said, Troublemaker. The amount of disdain for Green, Thompson and Curry on DBR has really turned me into a bigger fan of all 3.

Troublemaker
06-15-2016, 08:49 AM
Very well said, Troublemaker. The amount of disdain for Green, Thompson and Curry on DBR has really turned me into a bigger fan of all 3.

Thanks. I think Curry is pretty popular on DBR, actually, as he is on most basketball forums. I've not noticed any disdain for Klay. There's been some for Green, of course, but he's the type of player that polarizes fans.

If there's any anti-GSW sentiment on here, it's really just because they're playing Kyrie. (And even though Dahntay isn't in the rotation, he would stand to get a ring as well.) Oh, and because GSW hasn't put Barnes on a catapult out of town yet. Maybe this upcoming offseason.

cato
06-15-2016, 08:58 AM
Very well said, Troublemaker. The amount of disdain for Green, Thompson and Curry on DBR has really turned me into a bigger fan of all 3.

What does disdain for anyone have to do with rules and their application? Complaining about Green's suspension is what I don't understand. *Might* it have been okay for the NBA to look the other way and let this flagrant slide? I suppose. But it was a flagrant both per the rule book, and how flagrants have been handed out during the playoffs.

The only reason Green had to sit was because of his prior flagrants.

flyingdutchdevil
06-15-2016, 09:07 AM
Thanks. I think Curry is pretty popular on DBR, actually, as he is on most basketball forums. I've not noticed any disdain for Klay. There's been some for Green, of course, but he's the type of player that polarizes fans.

If there's any anti-GSW sentiment on here, it's really just because they're playing Kyrie. (And even though Dahntay isn't in the rotation, he would stand to get a ring as well.) Oh, and because GSW hasn't put Barnes on a catapult out of town yet. Maybe this upcoming offseason.

I agree. No disdain for Thompson; just disagreement over his talents. Curry is appreciated very well on DBR. Plenty of disdain for Green, and I'm certainly one of the posters spearheading that.

Number one reason to root for the Cavs: Kyrie
number two reason to root for the Cavs: Green

CDu
06-15-2016, 08:46 PM
Which is interesting because to date, he is 2-3 in NBA Finals.

He is actually 2-4.

elvis14
06-16-2016, 02:43 PM
He is actually 2-4.

I really hope we can update that tomorrow!

subzero02
06-16-2016, 02:47 PM
I really hope we can update that tomorrow!

I hope that we can update it on Sunday. I'd like to eventually see LeBron with a .500 NBA finals record.

elvis14
06-16-2016, 02:57 PM
I hope that we can update it on Sunday. I'd like to eventually see LeBron with a .500 NBA finals record.

Fair enough.

Here's a interesting LeBron question/observation. I think he's a fantastic player, an all time great (and please do not restart the conversation about the order of the top 10 players here). He's lead good and seemingly not so good teams to the finals and even managed win a couple. He seems like a pretty good guy, doesn't get much bad press (outside of the 'The Decision'), no arrest record, charity work, kids love him. Etc. Etc. I mean give the guy a halo and a superman cape, he's the total package. So why can't I get behind him? Am I the only one? Being really good isn't enough to get me root for you and for some reason I have just always wanted LeBron to lose (and he didn't go to UNCheat). Perhaps it's just rooting for the underdog and he's so good he's never the underdog. I don't know. When I logically think about it I can't come up with a good reason. Other players I've disliked I generally have a reason (UNC fans, Dallas Cowboy fans, Tiger's awful interviews, Jordan 9F, Laimbeer MMA, etc).

Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15
06-16-2016, 03:03 PM
Fair enough.

Here's a interesting LeBron question/observation. I think he's a fantastic player, an all time great (and please do not restart the conversation about the order of the top 10 players here). He's lead good and seemingly not so good teams to the finals and even managed win a couple. He seems like a pretty good guy, doesn't get much bad press (outside of the 'The Decision'), no arrest record, charity work, kids love him. Etc. Etc. I mean give the guy a halo and a superman cape, he's the total package. So why can't I get behind him? Am I the only one? Being really good isn't enough to get me root for you and for some reason I have just always wanted LeBron to lose (and he didn't go to UNCheat). Perhaps it's just rooting for the underdog and he's so good he's never the underdog. I don't know. When I logically think about it I can't come up with a good reason. Other players I've disliked I generally have a reason (UNC fans, Dallas Cowboy fans, Tiger's awful interviews, Jordan 9F, Laimbeer MMA, etc).

LeBron, for all the talk about his "softness" or "B-word" or what have you simply hasn't had that "next level" where he dominates. As a casual fan of the NBA, he seems to have all the talent on earth. When he drives to the basket, his physicality makes it look so darned easy. BUT - he never seems to impose his will. It's been nearly ten years since he broke an opponent all by himself, but there doesn't appear to be anything keeping him from doing the same other than his effort and determination.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d1Px-jPm_TU

phaedrus
06-16-2016, 03:13 PM
LeBron, for all the talk about his "softness" or "B-word" or what have you simply hasn't had that "next level" where he dominates. As a casual fan of the NBA, he seems to have all the talent on earth. When he drives to the basket, his physicality makes it look so darned easy. BUT - he never seems to impose his will. It's been nearly ten years since he broke an opponent all by himself, but there doesn't appear to be anything keeping him from doing the same other than his effort and determination.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d1Px-jPm_TU

Curious why you don't consider his performances in Cleveland's two wins in last years Finals (39 points, 16 rebounds, 11 assists in one, 40 points, 12 rebounds, 8 assists, 4 steals, 2 blocks in the other) examples of breaking an opponent all by himself. Because they lost the series, maybe?

He wasn't too bad in winning his two Finals MVPs, either, though of course he had more help those years.

I've always thought - because of the many often understated ways he excels outside of scoring - Lebron could impose his will without appearing to do so.

Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15
06-16-2016, 03:40 PM
Curious why you don't consider his performances in Cleveland's two wins in last years Finals (39 points, 16 rebounds, 11 assists in one, 40 points, 12 rebounds, 8 assists, 4 steals, 2 blocks in the other) examples of breaking an opponent all by himself. Because they lost the series, maybe?

He wasn't too bad in winning his two Finals MVPs, either, though of course he had more help those years.

I've always thought - because of the many often understated ways he excels outside of scoring - Lebron could impose his will without appearing to do so.

Hey, I like LeBron. But I think people see him as more Magic Johnson and want him to be more Michael Jordan.

Look at it this way - who would you rather play with, LBJ or MJ? LBJ, hands down, right?

Who would you rather have lead your favorite team into a game, LBJ or MJ? MJ sure seems more appealing as far as the nasty "refuse to lose" attitude.

kAzE
06-16-2016, 04:19 PM
Curious why you don't consider his performances in Cleveland's two wins in last years Finals (39 points, 16 rebounds, 11 assists in one, 40 points, 12 rebounds, 8 assists, 4 steals, 2 blocks in the other) examples of breaking an opponent all by himself. Because they lost the series, maybe?

He wasn't too bad in winning his two Finals MVPs, either, though of course he had more help those years.

I've always thought - because of the many often understated ways he excels outside of scoring - Lebron could impose his will without appearing to do so.

So . . . this may be a controversial opinion, but IMO, LeBron should have more than 2 finals MVPs. At the very least, he SHOULD have won finals MVP last year, because he was the most valuable player in the series. Even disregarding the stats (his were gaudy), just watch the games. He was the best player on the floor. Sure, Iguodala made big plays that helped his team win. He still wasn't the most valuable player in the finals last year in the literal sense. If you're only giving it to guys on the winning team, call it something different, because it makes no sense to me to not give it to LeBron last year.

I'm not even a huge LeBron fan. I think he's petty, whiny, and flops way too much for a player of his stature, but credit should be given where credit is due. Jerry West is known for being the only finals MVP of a series in which his team did not win. I don't understand why LeBron can't be allowed to have this. He's the 2nd leading scorer in this year's series, and leads all players in rebounds, assists, blocks, and steals, and is shooting nearly 50%. He should win the finals MVP, unless an individual actually outplays him. But up till now, he's been BY FAR the best player in the series. Yet, if the Cavs lose, there's probably no chance of that happening. Pretty dumb IMO.

luburch
06-17-2016, 07:05 AM
So 12 people picked the Warriors in 7, and 7 people picked the Cavs in 7. Best of luck to you all.

Also, I agree with the sentiment that LeBron should be the series MVP even if the Cavs lose.

kshepinthehouse
06-17-2016, 07:07 AM
Without the NBA prolonging this series I would have been right by taking the Warriors in 5.

luburch
06-17-2016, 07:17 AM
Without the NBA prolonging this series I would have been right by taking the Warriors in 5.

6446

Possibly, but that's not something we will ever know. What we do know is that the series is tied 3-3.

moonpie23
06-17-2016, 08:18 AM
Without the NBA prolonging this series I would have been right by taking the Warriors in 5.

do you have some facts to back up your assumption?

elvis14
06-17-2016, 09:54 AM
Without the NBA prolonging this series I would have been right by taking the Warriors in 5.

I picked the Warriors in 7 but I thought it was going to be because of a good series. Really bad look for the NBA here. Shady.

-jk
06-17-2016, 10:19 AM
Can't really lay blame on any conspiracies, but the playoffs - especially the finals - have been much more physical than the regular season. That favors the Cavs. And has worn out GS. GS was much better in the more flowy game of the regular season.

Of course, we see much the same thing in the NCAA tourney - just ask Boozer!

I never understood the "let the players decide", "let 'em play", "don't let the refs decide the game" thing about not calling fouls. If if a player fouls, that's on them - they're deciding it; just call it!

-jk

CDu
06-17-2016, 10:24 AM
Can't really lay blame on any conspiracies, but the playoffs - especially the finals - have been much more physical than the regular season. That favors the Cavs. And has worn out GS. GS was much better in the more flowy game of the regular season.

Of course, we see much the same thing in the NCAA tourney - just ask Boozer!

I never understood the "let the players decide", "let 'em play", "don't let the refs decide the game" thing about not calling fouls. If if a player fouls, that's on them - they're deciding it; just call it!

-jk

I agree wholeheartedly with this. I do think the excessive physicality has favored Cleveland. Thompson and Curry aren't built for physicality, and their play has suffered in this series. I suspect Game 6 was a boiling-over point for Curry. Credit to Cleveland for pushing the envelope though. They have seen the way the series has been called and kept banging on away. Golden State has banged away, too, but Cleveland's size/strength/athleticism on the perimeter has been better suited to take advantage.

This series has had the feel of a 1990s style, which I'd argue is among the worst era of basketball (thanks Detroit and New York!) in terms of overly physical play. It's been disappointing for sure.

kAzE
06-17-2016, 10:45 AM
I agree wholeheartedly with this. I do think the excessive physicality has favored Cleveland. Thompson and Curry aren't built for physicality, and their play has suffered in this series. I suspect Game 6 was a boiling-over point for Curry. Credit to Cleveland for pushing the envelope though. They have seen the way the series has been called and kept banging on away. Golden State has banged away, too, but Cleveland's size/strength/athleticism on the perimeter has been better suited to take advantage.

This series has had the feel of a 1990s style, which I'd argue is among the worst era of basketball (thanks Detroit and New York!) in terms of overly physical play. It's been disappointing for sure.

I don't think the Warriors at full strength are less built for physicality at all. They've been one of the most physical teams for the past 2 years. Game 4 was the most physical game of the series, and the Warriors dominated.

I think it's because the Warriors have been pushed in the Western Conference playoffs. They've played 3 more games, and against much tougher opponents. The Thunder series in particular had to be extremely taxing, both physically and mentally, and I believe it's beginning to wear them down. From an injury standpoint, they've obviously lost Bogut, and Iguodala seemed extremely limited in game 6. Iguodala will be playing his 14th straight game being the primary defender of either Kevin Durant or LeBron James. I don't envy what his body feels like right now.

It's a shame, because those 2 guys, along with Draymond give the Warriors their toughness and defensive identity. If Iggy is still hobbled in game 7, I think the Cavs have a great chance to steal this series on the road, as crazy as that sounds. I don't believe LeBron is feeling half as tired as the Warriors right now.

JNort
06-17-2016, 05:09 PM
Thanks. I think Curry is pretty popular on DBR, actually, as he is on most basketball forums. I've not noticed any disdain for Klay. There's been some for Green, of course, but he's the type of player that polarizes fans.

If there's any anti-GSW sentiment on here, it's really just because they're playing Kyrie. (And even though Dahntay isn't in the rotation, he would stand to get a ring as well.) Oh, and because GSW hasn't put Barnes on a catapult out of town yet. Maybe this upcoming offseason.

I don't like Klay. Not because of anything he's really done but because of how the media portrays him. I find him to be probably the most overrated player right now in the NBA. He may change my opinion of him but as of right now I'm comfortable with my assessment of him.

subzero02
06-17-2016, 05:25 PM
I don't think the Warriors at full strength are less built for physicality at all. They've been one of the most physical teams for the past 2 years. Game 4 was the most physical game of the series, and the Warriors dominated.

I think it's because the Warriors have been pushed in the Western Conference playoffs. They've played 3 more games, and against much tougher opponents. The Thunder series in particular had to be extremely taxing, both physically and mentally, and I believe it's beginning to wear them down. From an injury standpoint, they've obviously lost Bogut, and Iguodala seemed extremely limited in game 6. Iguodala will be playing his 14th straight game being the primary defender of either Kevin Durant or LeBron James. I don't envy what his body feels like right now.

It's a shame, because those 2 guys, along with Draymond give the Warriors their toughness and defensive identity. If Iggy is still hobbled in game 7, I think the Cavs have a great chance to steal this series on the road, as crazy as that sounds. I don't believe LeBron is feeling half as tired as the Warriors right now.

Outstanding post... I think you're right; the Warriors might have hit the wall.

luvdahops
06-17-2016, 05:42 PM
Without the NBA prolonging this series I would have been right by taking the Warriors in 5.

Well, you could just as easily argue that without the NBA prolonging the Western Conference Finals (by not suspending Green then), the Warriors would have been long gone by now. Tsk tsk.

Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15
06-17-2016, 05:48 PM
I don't like Klay. Not because of anything he's really done but because of how the media portrays him. I find him to be probably the most overrated player right now in the NBA. He may change my opinion of him but as of right now I'm comfortable with my assessment of him.

THIS JUST IN...

People on the internet like different things. Tune in at 11.

It is interesting to me how the only commonality on this board is Duke ball. As soon as you discuss politics, history, NBA, grilling steaks, movies, books... you find widely disparate views.

kAzE
06-17-2016, 05:53 PM
THIS JUST IN...

People on the internet like different things. Tune in at 11.

It is interesting to me how the only commonality on this board is Duke ball. As soon as you discuss politics, history, NBA, grilling steaks, movies, books... you find widely disparate views.

If it weren't for Klay Thompson, we'd be talking about Cavs/Thunder right now. I don't think he's overrated at all. Just from the eye test, he's one of the top 5/top 10 shot makers ever. His range and ability to hit off balance shots is ridiculous. The guy can swing the momentum of a series essentially by himself. Personally, I believe he is the premier shooting guard in the league. Granted it's the most shallow position by far, but he's, at the very least, top 3 along with James Harden and Dwayne Wade.

CDu
06-17-2016, 05:59 PM
If it weren't for Klay Thompson, we'd be talking about Cavs/Thunder right now. I don't think he's overrated at all. The guy can swing the momentum of a series essentially by himself. Personally, I believe he is the premier shooting guard in the league. Granted it's the most shallow position by far, but he's, at the very least, top 3 along with James Harden and Dwayne Wade.

I totally agree on Thompson, but would throw Butler in that discussion and suggest cutting Wade from it. 2-3 years ago? Wade is probably #1. But I think age and injuries have bumped him down to second tier. Still a great player, but I would take those other 3 over Wade at this point.

kAzE
06-17-2016, 07:49 PM
I totally agree on Thompson, but would throw Butler in that discussion and suggest cutting Wade from it. 2-3 years ago? Wade is probably #1. But I think age and injuries have bumped him down to second tier. Still a great player, but I would take those other 3 over Wade at this point.

I guess I've always thought of Butler as a 3, given his size, but he's really come along as a ball handler. And in that case, I'd have to rank him ahead of Wade, as well. Although Wade showed in the playoffs that he's still got it when it counts. He may have been the best player on the floor even in the Toronto series, and if Whiteside hadn't gone down, we might have seen a Cavs/Heat ECF.

CDu
06-17-2016, 08:24 PM
I guess I've always thought of Butler as a 3, given his size, but he's really come along as a ball handler. And in that case, I'd have to rank him ahead of Wade, as well. Although Wade showed in the playoffs that he's still got it when it counts. He may have been the best player on the floor even in the Toronto series, and if Whiteside hadn't gone down, we might have seen a Cavs/Heat ECF.

Yeah I definitely didn't mean it as a slight to Wade. He is still really really good. It was fun seeing him back in throwback mold. I think he suffered some from the Big Three years in terms of being the villian. For much of his career, he was the plucky underdog leading a team of upstarts (first at Marquette, then in the early years with Miami). And then suddenly the Big Three Extravaganza happened with such an embarrass intro, and suddenly he was part of the evil empire. And he went through some really bad character moments in the public eye. But now that he was back in the underdog role in the playoffs he seemed to thrive.

As for Butler, I agree he kind of blurs the line between SG and SF. I think he is probably best suited to be a SF, but these past two years he has taken on more of the lead guard role with Rose unable to find his stride. Butler is sadly the only glimmer of light for the Bulls as they have made misstep after misstep the past few years.

But I am now guilty of threadjacking. We were talking about Thompson and his proclivity to be unstoppable. We have only seen glimpses of it in the finals, but when that dude gets hot he is basically unguardable. As you mentioned, he showed that to the Thunder a few weeks ago. It remains to be seen if he will find it against the Cavs.

YmoBeThere
06-19-2016, 11:31 PM
7 out of 85 got it correct, or approximately 8.25%.