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Deslok
02-23-2016, 01:20 AM
So, with the ACC tourney coming up, who is heading to London. (https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/dc-sports-bog/wp/2016/02/22/the-acc-made-an-ad-celebrating-the-u-s-capitol-it-used-the-wrong-building/).. oops, maybe that should be DC.

Though, it would be closer than Alaska, right?

AIRFORCEDUKIE
02-23-2016, 06:26 AM
So, with the ACC tourney coming up, who is heading to London. (https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/dc-sports-bog/wp/2016/02/22/the-acc-made-an-ad-celebrating-the-u-s-capitol-it-used-the-wrong-building/).. oops, maybe that should be DC.

Though, it would be closer than Alaska, right?

I am still pondering whether I want to make the trip for at leat Thursday - Saturday, or maybe just Friday-Saturday. I went the last time it was in DC and had a good time, if I remember correctly Duke turned in a pretty good performance behind some white dude named JJ. Duke has yet to lose an ACC tournament game that I have attended so perhaps I need to make the trip.

Ballboy1998
02-23-2016, 08:03 AM
Thanks for starting this thread! As a DC resident, I am hoping to go to at least a few of the games. While I am sure it varies some from venue to venue, I would really appreciate people's thoughts on the best way to get tickets (stub hub, outside the venue, piecemeal versus package, etc.), Info on the Duke seating sections, etc.

In return, happy to give DC suggestions!

duke blue brewcrew
02-23-2016, 08:26 AM
Thanks for starting this thread! As a DC resident, I am hoping to go to at least a few of the games. While I am sure it varies some from venue to venue, I would really appreciate people's thoughts on the best way to get tickets (stub hub, outside the venue, piecemeal versus package, etc.), Info on the Duke seating sections, etc.

In return, happy to give DC suggestions!

I've done it several ways and all worked pretty well. buying your own book takes IF out of the equation. That said, if you find the right fan, the best value may be to buy off of a fan who's team just lost.

gurufrisbee
02-23-2016, 08:42 AM
For a Duke fan near Seattle, I'm not even sure if Alaska is better or worse.

I keep waiting for Washington to schedule a home and home with them.

Of course it took over a decade for Washington to stop being scared pansies of Gonzaga from across the state and agreeing to play them again, so I can't imagine how long it's going to take to get Duke here.

sigh.

sagegrouse
02-23-2016, 09:26 AM
Thanks for starting this thread! As a DC resident, I am hoping to go to at least a few of the games. While I am sure it varies some from venue to venue, I would really appreciate people's thoughts on the best way to get tickets (stub hub, outside the venue, piecemeal versus package, etc.), Info on the Duke seating sections, etc.

In return, happy to give DC suggestions!

(a) Call the Duke ticket office.

(b) If unsuccessful, call Iron Dukes and make a donation, and then call the ticket office again.

(c) Stand outside the Verizon Center on Tuesday and get a cheap or free ticket to the games then.

(d) Once inside, buy a book from a fan of one of the losing teams.

(e) Or, make friends with a Duke fan with an extra ticket or tickets.

(f) Return Wednesday and go through the same routine.

(g) There will be scalpers outside, perhaps selling for less than face value.

Of course, take advantage of the restaurants and watering holes near Verizon. A high point for me in 2005 was to sit next to a bunch of Clemson coaches in orange shirts dining at Jaleo, which is a wonderful Spanish restaurant and only a block away.

Stray Gator
02-23-2016, 09:59 AM
(a) Call the Duke ticket office.

(b) If unsuccessful, call Iron Dukes and make a donation, and then call the ticket office again.

(c) Stand outside the Verizon Center on Tuesday and get a cheap or free ticket to the games then.

(d) Once inside, buy a book from a fan of one of the losing teams.

(e) Or, make friends with a Duke fan with an extra ticket or tickets.

(f) Return Wednesday and go through the same routine.

(g) There will be scalpers outside, perhaps selling for less than face value.

Of course, take advantage of the restaurants and watering holes near Verizon. A high point for me in 2005 was to sit next to a bunch of Clemson coaches in orange shirts dining at Jaleo, which is a wonderful Spanish restaurant and only a block away.

If the local laws against resale of tickets are the same as they were when we last played the ACC Tourney in D.C., and are being enforced with the same degree of "enthusiastic vigilance" by the D.C. Police, fans would be well-advised to avoid purchasing tickets from other fans anywhere around the arena. We saw a number of people arrested on the sidewalks outside the Verizon Center for selling and buying tickets -- including some incidents that were later claimed to be police entrapment. Also, once inside the arena, the "ushers" were absolutely inflexible about making sure that no person could enter their section, much less occupy a seat, without a ticket for that specific section and seat, even during games or intersessions when the section was virtually empty. These practices were contrary to customary policies in other venues and a slap in the face of ACC Tourney tradition. Such inhospitable policies, and the underlying attitude it manifests, are part of the reason we've decided not to attend the ACC Tourney for the first time in more than 20 years.

AIRFORCEDUKIE
02-23-2016, 10:30 AM
If the local laws against resale of tickets are the same as they were when we last played the ACC Tourney in D.C., and are being enforced with the same degree of "enthusiastic vigilance" by the D.C. Police, fans would be well-advised to avoid purchasing tickets from other fans anywhere around the arena. We saw a number of people arrested on the sidewalks outside the Verizon Center for selling and buying tickets -- including some incidents that were later claimed to be police entrapment. Also, once inside the arena, the "ushers" were absolutely inflexible about making sure that no person could enter their section, much less occupy a seat, without a ticket for that specific section and seat, even during games or intersessions when the section was virtually empty. These practices were contrary to customary policies in other venues and a slap in the face of ACC Tourney tradition. Such inhospitable policies, and the underlying attitude it manifests, are part of the reason we've decided not to attend the ACC Tourney for the first time in more than 20 years.


I remember buying tickets from folks right inside the stadium instead of walking outside. When a team lost I would seek out their exiting fans and see if they had better seats than me. I eventually got to 9 rows back for the Championship game for $50.

As we all know UNC losing is the best way to get tickets because they have the biggest cry baby fans who will storm our and sometimes just hand their tickets over. Its fairly easy to upgrade no matter the venue. Just dont do it outside in DC they are pretty vigilant about it.

weezie
02-23-2016, 11:26 AM
If the local laws against resale of tickets are the same as they were when we last played the ACC Tourney in D.C., and are being enforced with the same degree of "enthusiastic vigilance" by the D.C. Police, fans would be well-advised to avoid purchasing tickets from other fans anywhere around the arena. We saw a number of people arrested on the sidewalks outside the Verizon Center for selling and buying tickets -- including some incidents that were later claimed to be police entrapment. Also, once inside the arena, the "ushers" were absolutely inflexible about making sure that no person could enter their section, much less occupy a seat, without a ticket for that specific section and seat, even during games or intersessions when the section was virtually empty. These practices were contrary to customary policies in other venues and a slap in the face of ACC Tourney tradition. Such inhospitable policies, and the underlying attitude it manifests, are part of the reason we've decided not to attend the ACC Tourney for the first time in more than 20 years.

Listen to the Gator, he is absolutely correct. We too, although we live within 50 miles of DC are not attending this year. Plus the IDs are getting crappy seats in the endzone...except for the families and luminaries who donate heavy $$$ and get into the Duke seats behind the benches, of course.

It's a tiresome and annoying venue with awful food. AirforceDukie just above me here in thread was very lucky to avoid the police enforcement.

UrinalCake
02-23-2016, 11:26 AM
Why are we still playing this thing in DC? Couldn't we have moved it to MSG after Maryland left?

weezie
02-23-2016, 11:28 AM
Why are we still playing this thing in DC? Couldn't we have moved it to MSG after Maryland left?

Brooklyn next year!!!!! Yay!

sagegrouse
02-23-2016, 11:42 AM
StubHub has lots of tickets available at different prices, including Session One tix as low as $8.00 and entire books from $300 and up. I don't suppose that creates a legal problem, does it?

J_C_Steel
02-23-2016, 11:50 AM
I live in Northern Virginia, so I'm seriously contemplating going to a set of games at some point. My six-year-old son is a huge fan, so he would really enjoy it.

Olympic Fan
02-23-2016, 12:43 PM
Why are we still playing this thing in DC? Couldn't we have moved it to MSG after Maryland left?

The ACC actually scheduled the tournament in DC AFTER Maryland left the league.

It was done both as a slap in the face at the Terps and to reinforce Washington's long-time position as an ACC city.

MSG has never been a real option -- they insist on a long-term contract. That's why the ACC is going to Brooklyn, not Manhattan, for the next two years.

Ballboy1998
02-23-2016, 09:06 PM
Of course, take advantage of the restaurants and watering holes near Verizon. A high point for me in 2005 was to sit next to a bunch of Clemson coaches in orange shirts dining at Jaleo, which is a wonderful Spanish restaurant and only a block away.

Jaleo is great. The same chef, Jose Andres, is creating quite the DC restaurant empire and has a whole slew of good places near the Verizon center in addition to Jaleo -- all "small plates" and relatively pricey:

Oyamel (Mexican)
Zaytinya (Greek/Mediterranean)
China Chilcano (Peruvian Asian fusion, oddly enough)

A favorite of mine in the area is The Partisan (sit down) and its affiliated butcher's counter Red Apron (sandwiches/sausages to go). For quicker eats, Shake Shack is a solid NY/DC (and I think somewhat broader now) burger chain along the lines of Five Guys/In-and-Out

A couple suggestions for the beer folks:

RFD is a large craft beer bar right by the Verizon center with as many TVs as beers on tap
Iron Horse also has a solid draft list though less/smaller TVs
For a friendly crowd, The Laughing Man Tavern hosts all the Duke Alumni watch parties in their downstairs bar and will likely have a lot of Dukies watching the tourney

Notwithstanding the unflattering stories above regarding the past ACC Tourney in DC, I hope a lot of you will still make the trek!

Faison1
02-23-2016, 09:37 PM
Sorry if this has been covered in another thread, but I'm assuming Louisville's post-season ban includes the ACC Tourney?

Separately, no arena could possibly be as bad as the Georgia Dome set up...

Ballboy1998
02-23-2016, 09:49 PM
Sorry if this has been covered in another thread, but I'm assuming Louisville's post-season ban includes the ACC Tourney?

Separately, no arena could possibly be as bad as the Georgia Dome set up...

No ACC Tourney for the 'Ville.

I actually think the Verizon Center is a perfectly pleasant venue to watch basketball in, though I've only been to Wizards (and Caps) games there.

jmck214
02-23-2016, 09:49 PM
Brooklyn next year!!!!! Yay!

Yes I am already planning for Brooklyn next year since it's only about a 3 hour drive for me. I was there for the A10 tourney last year and it was a blast. I stayed in the Brooklyn Bridge Marriott which was the team hotel and I ended up getting in the same elevator as Shaka Smart

AIRFORCEDUKIE
03-01-2016, 08:29 AM
Figured with only a week and half left until the tourney starts this would be a good time to resurrect this thread.

Who's going, anyone found a good place to buy tickets?, best hotels to stay in?

I am thinking about going up Thursday to catch the night games, but now I am concerned that Duke might have to play Wednesday as well. Its a bit of a risk to buy thursday tickets when your team plays on wednesday, I don't want to Jinx it. With work I don't think I can pull of getting there on Wednesday.

So to boil it down I don't have a hotel yet, don't have tickets yet, however I have every intention of going anyway.

BLPOG
03-01-2016, 09:48 AM
Figured with only a week and half left until the tourney starts this would be a good time to resurrect this thread.

Who's going, anyone found a good place to buy tickets?, best hotels to stay in?

I am thinking about going up Thursday to catch the night games, but now I am concerned that Duke might have to play Wednesday as well. Its a bit of a risk to buy thursday tickets when your team plays on wednesday, I don't want to Jinx it. With work I don't think I can pull of getting there on Wednesday.

So to boil it down I don't have a hotel yet, don't have tickets yet, however I have every intention of going anyway.

My thoughts exactly. I live in Arlington, so it's easy for me to procrastinate on buying tickets. I'm planning on going to probably two days of games, but I'll decide based on prices and availability in a couple days. On the subject of hotels, I haven't checked prices (given that I won't be needing one), but my guess is that they will be somewhat cheaper in Arlington, probably justifying the small expenditure in time and coin to take the metrorail into the city (although possibly not justifying the aggravation/danger if your train catches fire).



A couple suggestions for the beer folks:

RFD is a large craft beer bar right by the Verizon center with as many TVs as beers on tap
Iron Horse also has a solid draft list though less/smaller TVs
For a friendly crowd, The Laughing Man Tavern hosts all the Duke Alumni watch parties in their downstairs bar and will likely have a lot of Dukies watching the tourney

Notwithstanding the unflattering stories above regarding the past ACC Tourney in DC, I hope a lot of you will still make the trek!

I like RFD a lot. Iron Horse is a good bar but from what I recall it's probably not the place to watch games. Laughing Man is great when watching with fellow Blue Devils but has among the worst service of all bars in DC (literally everyone I've spoken to agrees on this point, and would go to several more watch parties per season if they were held elsewhere).

As far as general sports bar recommendations go, Buffalo Billiards is fun. Lots of TVs and bar games. Could be too many rival fans around during tourney time.

As far as beer goes: Birch & Barley/Churchkey is rated among the best bars in the country.

Henderson
03-01-2016, 10:06 AM
It's troubling to me how little I care about the ACC Tourney. I really want to care like I used to. Instead, the tournament increasingly feels more like another round of games in which we battle for NCAA seeding, rather than an important milestone in and of itself with conference bragging rights and a banner. Maybe that's a natural phenomenon of NCAAT success in years when we didn't win the conference title. I hope it's just me.

DarkstarWahoo
03-01-2016, 10:16 AM
Jaleo is great. The same chef, Jose Andres, is creating quite the DC restaurant empire and has a whole slew of good places near the Verizon center in addition to Jaleo -- all "small plates" and relatively pricey:

Oyamel (Mexican)
Zaytinya (Greek/Mediterranean)
China Chilcano (Peruvian Asian fusion, oddly enough)

A favorite of mine in the area is The Partisan (sit down) and its affiliated butcher's counter Red Apron (sandwiches/sausages to go). For quicker eats, Shake Shack is a solid NY/DC (and I think somewhat broader now) burger chain along the lines of Five Guys/In-and-Out

A couple suggestions for the beer folks:

RFD is a large craft beer bar right by the Verizon center with as many TVs as beers on tap
Iron Horse also has a solid draft list though less/smaller TVs
For a friendly crowd, The Laughing Man Tavern hosts all the Duke Alumni watch parties in their downstairs bar and will likely have a lot of Dukies watching the tourney

Notwithstanding the unflattering stories above regarding the past ACC Tourney in DC, I hope a lot of you will still make the trek!
I just want to second the Oyamel recommendation. Holy crap, is that place good.

Reisen
03-01-2016, 10:23 AM
My advice to out of town attendees is to check priceline and hotwire for hotel deals. I just looked, and you can stay out near Dulles airport (you would take the Silver Line downtown from Wiehle Avenue) in a 3.5 star hotel (probably a Hyatt, Hilton, or Sheraton) for around $70 a night. If you want to spend more to be closer in (plan on a full hour from Dulles to get downtown), I'm seeing 3.5-4.5 star hotels in Crystal City or even DuPont circle for $99-$150 a night.

Olympic Fan
03-01-2016, 12:35 PM
It's troubling to me how little I care about the ACC Tourney. I really want to care like I used to. Instead, the tournament increasingly feels more like another round of games in which we battle for NCAA seeding, rather than an important milestone in and of itself with conference bragging rights and a banner. Maybe that's a natural phenomenon of NCAAT success in years when we didn't win the conference title. I hope it's just me.

I hope it's just you.

The ACC Tournament remains one of the highlights of the year in my eyes. It determines the ACC Championship ... and if you're not playing for championships, what the heck are you playing for?

Henderson
03-01-2016, 12:39 PM
I hope it's just you.

The ACC Tournament remains one of the highlights of the year in my eyes. It determines the ACC Championship ... and if you're not playing for championships, what the heck are you playing for?

I badly want you to be right.

BLPOG
03-01-2016, 01:42 PM
I hope it's just you.

The ACC Tournament remains one of the highlights of the year in my eyes. It determines the ACC Championship ... and if you're not playing for championships, what the heck are you playing for?

If anything, the ACC Tournament means more to me now than in (relatively) recent years. The expansion of the conference has substantially detracted from the legitimacy of the "regular season champion" since we don't come close to playing equivalent schedules. That makes the conference tournament the only real way to name a champion. It also makes the tournament harder to win.

Olympic Fan
03-01-2016, 01:51 PM
If anything, the ACC Tournament means more to me now than in (relatively) recent years. The expansion of the conference has substantially detracted from the legitimacy of the "regular season champion" since we don't come close to playing equivalent schedules. That makes the conference tournament the only real way to name a champion. It also makes the tournament harder to win.

Glad you agree. We go through this every year. You can argue perception all you want, but there's no debate: the tournament champion is the official ACC Champion.

The league voted in 1990 to allow the first-place finisher in the regular season to call itself "the regular season champion" -- but the official conference champion is and has always been the tournament winner.

I want to be the 2016 ACC champion. I think that's Coach K's goal too,

If that doesn't matter to anybody on this board, that's fine ... but it matters to the program.

FWIW: Duke leads the ACC with 19 championships. UNC actually had a 17-16 lead after winning in 2008. But Duke won the next three titles to take a 19-17 lead ... NC State is third with 10 titles. No one else has more than four (Wake Forest).

AIRFORCEDUKIE
03-01-2016, 02:41 PM
And it has been a while since we have won the Tournament, at the beginning of the season I said that should be a goal for this team. I still think it can be achieved, it will be really hard especially if we have to play Wednesday. However, this team can get hot and do it.

rasputin
03-01-2016, 03:19 PM
I hope it's just you.

The ACC Tournament remains one of the highlights of the year in my eyes. It determines the ACC Championship ... and if you're not playing for championships, what the heck are you playing for?

As usual, I agree with OF here. It is true that the expansion of the league has taken some of the luster of the ACC Tournament. The tournament Friday was always like Christmas to me, and things have changed.

That said, I still covet the title, and I remain interested in the ACC Tournament.

uh_no
03-05-2016, 09:59 PM
we're locked into the 5 seed. and so will play 12 seed v 13....or state v wake on Wednesday

uh_no
03-05-2016, 10:42 PM
game is at 230

Olympic Fan
03-05-2016, 11:06 PM
For anyone interested, here is the official bracket:

http://raycomsports.com/sports_labs_docs/m-baskbl/2016_mbb_bracket.pdf

You'll note that the official gametime for Duke is 2 p.m. Wednesday, That's bogus -- Duke will play the second game in the afternoon session ... the first game starts at noon. The second game actually starts 20 minutes after the two teams in the preceding game leave the floor. So actual tipoff for Duke might vary a lot -- if the first game is quick, it could start as early as 2:15 or so.

For Duke, the path is NC State or Wake on Wednesday, then Notre Dame on Thursday (also late afternoon), then the first game Friday night -- probably against UNC again ... that's if Duke gets that far. And winning Friday night means a fourth game in four days on Saturday night to win the title.

It's going to be tough for what is basically a six-man team.

mr shadow 008
03-06-2016, 02:45 AM
Got my tickets for the Friday night session the other day. Been to a women's game at Cameron but never been to a men's game before. Ironically going with my mother and my girlfriend who both happen to be Cheat fans. However, we are all hoping for a Duke-Unc matchup. I'm pretty familiar with the Verizon center and the surrounding area having been to multiple Wizards games but I am curious to any idea suggestions for restaurants and what to expect. Again first college men's game and hopefully first Duke men's game (fingers crossed) so any suggestions would be great!

Bob Green
03-06-2016, 07:21 AM
The ACC Tournament remains one of the highlights of the year in my eyes. It determines the ACC Championship ... and if you're not playing for championships, what the heck are you playing for?

I agree 100 percent and I want to play the Tar Heels on Friday night!

dukelifer
03-06-2016, 08:25 AM
I hope it's just you.

The ACC Tournament remains one of the highlights of the year in my eyes. It determines the ACC Championship ... and if you're not playing for championships, what the heck are you playing for?

For some reason - I think fans value the regular season championship more. But as it is, the long tourney spanning Tuesday to Saturday has lost some luster.

hudlow
03-06-2016, 12:18 PM
(1.) Go Duke!

(2.) A B C

NYBri
03-06-2016, 12:22 PM
For Duke, the path is NC State or Wake on Wednesday, then Notre Dame on Thursday (also late afternoon), then the first game Friday night -- probably against UNC again ... that's if Duke gets that far. And winning Friday night means a fourth game in four days on Saturday night to win the title.

It's going to be tough for what is basically a six-man team.

This.

Potentially 4 games in 4 days...the last three potentially against top teams. Mamma never said it would be easy.

sagegrouse
03-06-2016, 12:50 PM
By the way, there is an enormous potential for upsets throughout the tournament. Florida State, Virginia Tech (wow!), Georgia Tech, Clemson, Syracuse and Pitt are all capable of upsets, and both State and Wake play well against Duke. There are 13 games in the tournament. How many will be won by the lower seeded team?

My guess is "five."

superdave
03-06-2016, 03:07 PM
I live on Capitol Hill and work two blocks from the Verizon Center so here's some recommendations to follow on what other folks have suggested.

Quick Serve -
Cava at 7th and H is fantastic.
Potbelly's is right beside Cava and makes great toasted sandwiches.
Taylor Gourmet has some really good sandwich options.
Luke's Lobster...if you want a $16 lobster roll.
&Pizza lets you pick your own topping on a personal pie.
There are plenty of chain options too, but you all know them so I'll keep it to the local spots.

Semi-Quick Serve -
Nando's Peri Peri is good, spicy Peruvian style chicken.
Hill Country BBQ make sreally good Texas style brisket for not being in Texas.
Daikaya is a really good ramen shop.

Not as Quick -
Matchbox is good for pizza and sliders.
Austin Grill is solid Tex Mex.
Ella's is good for pizza and salads.
Clyde's has a massive menu.

If you are up for walking a few blocks -
District Taco is a must try. Great salsa choices.
Astro Fried Chicken n Donuts, if you are gluttonous.


If You have $ to Burn -
Oceannaire makes the best crab cakes you will ever try.
Rasika is A+ Indian.


If you are looking for a beverage nearby -
Close, Cheap - Rocket Bar, Jackpot, RFD, Iron Horse, Penn Quarter Sports Tavern, Penn Social, Fado and ahem, Hooters
A little nicer - Partisan, Redline, Clyde's, Poste

Hope this helps. Message me if anyone has questions.

Dr. Rosenrosen
03-06-2016, 09:59 PM
I live on Capitol Hill and work two blocks from the Verizon Center so here's some recommendations to follow on what other folks have suggested.

Quick Serve -
Cava at 7th and H is fantastic.
Potbelly's is right beside Cava and makes great toasted sandwiches.
Taylor Gourmet has some really good sandwich options.
Luke's Lobster...if you want a $16 lobster roll.
&Pizza lets you pick your own topping on a personal pie.
There are plenty of chain options too, but you all know them so I'll keep it to the local spots.

Semi-Quick Serve -
Nando's Peri Peri is good, spicy Peruvian style chicken.
Hill Country BBQ make sreally good Texas style brisket for not being in Texas.
Daikaya is a really good ramen shop.

Not as Quick -
Matchbox is good for pizza and sliders.
Austin Grill is solid Tex Mex.
Ella's is good for pizza and salads.
Clyde's has a massive menu.

If you are up for walking a few blocks -
District Taco is a must try. Great salsa choices.
Astro Fried Chicken n Donuts, if you are gluttonous.


If You have $ to Burn -
Oceannaire makes the best crab cakes you will ever try.
Rasika is A+ Indian.


If you are looking for a beverage nearby -
Close, Cheap - Rocket Bar, Jackpot, RFD, Iron Horse, Penn Quarter Sports Tavern, Penn Social, Fado and ahem, Hooters
A little nicer - Partisan, Redline, Clyde's, Poste

Hope this helps. Message me if anyone has questions.
Rasika is worth every penny.

luigi90
03-06-2016, 10:01 PM
Does anyone know the "duke" sections at the ACC tourney. I want to buy tix but would prefer to sit among friends rather than enemies. If anyone has an idea in the 100 and 200 sections please reply for all.

akg4y
03-07-2016, 12:07 AM
Does anyone know the "duke" sections at the ACC tourney. I want to buy tix but would prefer to sit among friends rather than enemies. If anyone has an idea in the 100 and 200 sections please reply for all.

Here you go:
Seating Chart (http://raycomsports.com/sports_labs_docs/m-baskbl/2016_acctourney_seatingchart.pdf)


BTW if any of you have lowers for Th/Fri and Duke doesnt make it to either of those games please let me know, I have 2 uppers (417 Row E) but would prefer to snag some lowers.

Good luck! Im actually rooting for UVA-Duke in the finals so we can get some payback!

superdave
03-09-2016, 12:52 PM
Lots of Duke fans walking around Chinatown, DC today. I will be there in about an hour for our game, wearing a business suit unfortunately.

Go Duke!

JasonEvans
03-09-2016, 01:30 PM
Pitt starting to run Syracuse out of the building here in the 2nd half. Currently Pitt by 11 with 15 minutes left.

Rumor has it that Syracuse is preparing a press release saying they will be taking a post-season ban this season as penance for any future rules violations they may commit.

-Jason "I keed, I keed" Evans

throatybeard
03-09-2016, 01:31 PM
This Syracuse-Pitt game is making me nostalgic for ACCT Wednesdays of yore.

Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15
03-09-2016, 01:33 PM
This Syracuse-Pitt game is making me nostalgic for ACCT Wednesdays of yore.

I've already had several of those moments in the Phase thread for the ACC Tourney. I miss having 7 can't miss games in 60 hours.

JasonEvans
03-09-2016, 01:37 PM
Pitt starting to run Syracuse out of the building here in the 2nd half. Currently Pitt by 11 with 15 minutes left.

Rumor has it that Syracuse is preparing a press release saying they will be taking a post-season ban this season as penance for any future rules violations they may commit.

-Jason "I keed, I keed" Evans

Now a 14 point Pitt lead. Syracuse was up 10 in the first half.

Ladies and gents, I think we know who one of the #1 seeds in the NIT tournament is going to be.

-Jason "Cuse is 1-4 in their past 5... they were looking like a 5 or 6 seed a couple weeks ago... not any more" Evans

Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15
03-09-2016, 01:43 PM
Now a 14 point Pitt lead. Syracuse was up 10 in the first half.

Ladies and gents, I think we know who one of the #1 seeds in the NIT tournament is going to be.

-Jason "Cuse is 1-4 in their past 5... they were looking like a 5 or 6 seed a couple weeks ago... not any more" Evans

Back to six points with ten to go

Bob Green
03-09-2016, 01:50 PM
Syracuse clawing their way back into the game, 56-51 Pitt with 7 and change to play.

throatybeard
03-09-2016, 01:50 PM
The problem resolves itself. If you watch this Pittsburgh-Syracuse game long enough, you get so bored that you think time is going backward. The Dinah Shore commercials are already running in my brain.

Indoor66
03-09-2016, 01:54 PM
The problem resolves itself. If you watch this Pittsburgh-Syracuse game long enough, you get so bored that you think time is going backward. The Dinah Shore commercials are already running in my brain.

That is the inevitable result of getting older. The excitement level of these games is inverse to our age.

throatybeard
03-09-2016, 01:57 PM
That is the inevitable result of getting older. The excitement level of these games is inverse to our age.

And here the graph I was making concerned Dinah Shore.

dukebluesincebirth
03-09-2016, 02:04 PM
I need this Pitt-Cuse game to go into quadruple overtime if I have any chance of seeing the last 10 mins of the Duke game :mad:....not looking good!

Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15
03-09-2016, 02:05 PM
And here the graph I was making concerned Dinah Shore.

How about Terry Holland's doppelganger from the Food Lion ads?

BandAlum83
03-09-2016, 02:06 PM
How about Terry Holland's doppelganger from the Food Lion ads?

Hah!! I wasn't the only one who thought Terry got himself a nice endorsement deal!!!??

throatybeard
03-09-2016, 02:08 PM
How about Terry Holland's doppelganger from the Food Lion ads?

Ah, before there was Lisa Kudrow, there was this masterpiece.

Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15
03-09-2016, 02:08 PM
I need this Pitt-Cuse game to go into quadruple overtime if I have any chance of seeing the last 10 mins of the Duke game :mad:...not looking good!

two points, two minutes

BandAlum83
03-09-2016, 02:12 PM
Ah, before there was Lisa Kudrow, there was this masterpiece.

Missed it. Definitely over my head.

cato
03-09-2016, 02:13 PM
How long between games?

timmy c
03-09-2016, 02:13 PM
I need this Pitt-Cuse game to go into quadruple overtime if I have any chance of seeing the last 10 mins of the Duke game :mad:...not looking good!

What a game... You might get your wish!

Who said this was boring?

BandAlum83
03-09-2016, 02:13 PM
Tie score, under 2 minutes, and the channel went out on my cable system....geez.

BandAlum83
03-09-2016, 02:14 PM
Tie score, under 2 minutes, and the channel went out on my cable system...geez.

Rebooting my X1 platform now

uh_no
03-09-2016, 02:18 PM
did the clock go out or something? looks like the backboard clock was out for the last play and there was one on the floor...probably prevented the SU guy from getting closer to the bucket

BandAlum83
03-09-2016, 02:19 PM
Got to see the last 6.6 seconds. How does Syracuse get such a bad 3 point shot there when only down one?

These are the noticeable things. I don't believe a K coached team would have gotten such a bad look at the end of a game as this.

Troublemaker
03-09-2016, 02:20 PM
Man, hopefully this loss doesn't cost Cuse a tournament spot. I feel like they're a good team, a tournament team.

Would love to see Gbinije get a chance to compete in the NCAAT as a starter.

throatybeard
03-09-2016, 02:20 PM
did the clock go out or something? looks like the backboard clock was out for the last play and there was one on the floor...probably prevented the SU guy from getting closer to the bucket

All that was a diversion that allowed UConn to sneak into the conference in Syracuse's luggage.

uh_no
03-09-2016, 02:20 PM
Got to see the last 6.6 seconds. How does Syracuse get such a shot 3 point shot there when only down one?

These are the noticeable things. I don't believe a K coached team would have gotten such a bad look at the end of a game as this.

per my other comment, looks like there might have been clock issues, potentially forcing the SU guy into a premature shot...since he didn't know how much time he had

Bob Green
03-09-2016, 02:21 PM
did the clock go out or something?

Yes. At the start of the game. They couldn't get it fixed at halftime so they will try again between games.

BandAlum83
03-09-2016, 02:22 PM
per my other comment, looks like there might have been clock issues, potentially forcing the SU guy into a premature shot...since he didn't know how much time he had

It seemed the only play there was, get the ball, dribble the length of the court and Chuck it up.

gus
03-09-2016, 02:27 PM
did the clock go out or something? looks like the backboard clock was out for the last play and there was one on the floor...probably prevented the SU guy from getting closer to the bucket

I only tuned in for the last few minutes. Doris mentioned a clock malfunction. Cooney's defender was falling to the floor and he still had time to drive for a much higher percentage two. Looks like the lack of a shot clock in his eyeline definitely affected his shot choice.

Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15
03-09-2016, 02:28 PM
I feel like we have a bunch of different ACC Tourney discussions going on right now on various threads. Can we make a committee decision about one "official" tourney thread? Right now, it's happening on the Phase thread and the ACC Tourney thread that was heretofore devoted to people going to the tournament.

Doria
03-09-2016, 02:31 PM
did the clock go out or something? looks like the backboard clock was out for the last play and there was one on the floor...probably prevented the SU guy from getting closer to the bucket

Oh, I see. I was working at the time, so I just heard "clock," and I thought it was the main clock. That makes more sense. I'm sorry for Cooney (I think it was) on that last shot. Looked like he could've taken another step or two. But honestly, it wasn't a terrible shot. He was pretty open after the defender fell down, and he has that range.

Anyway, that was an exciting finish to the game. I'm glad I watched the last 5 minutes.

Hope ours isn't quite so exciting (as long as the good guys win, obviously)...

Rich
03-09-2016, 02:42 PM
This Syracuse-Pitt game is making me nostalgic for ACCT Wednesdays of yore.

Considering it's Syracuse-Pitt are you sure you're not feeling nostalgic for Big East Wednesdays of yore? :rolleyes:

throatybeard
03-09-2016, 02:43 PM
Considering it's Syracuse-Pitt are you sure you're not feeling nostalgic for Big East Wednesdays of yore? :rolleyes:

Which one, though. That tournament always went for like two weeks.

Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15
03-09-2016, 02:43 PM
Considering it's Syracuse-Pitt are you sure you're not feeling nostalgic for Big East Wednesdays of yore? :rolleyes:

Or, snarky comment about "ACC Tourney Wednesdays" were actually Fridays?

JasonEvans
03-09-2016, 09:20 PM
Really Clemson... coming out of a timeout that was the shot you get? Really?

The strategy of walking it up with 13 seconds left so you are rushed and cannot get a shot that even hits the rim was brilliant, just brilliant!

-Jason "blowing an 18 point lead with 8 minute left... the very definition of Clemsoning, isn't it?" Evans

FerryFor50
03-09-2016, 09:21 PM
Really Clemson... coming out of a timeout that was the shot you get? Really?

The strategy of walking it up with 13 seconds left so you are rushed and cannot get a shot that even hits the rim was brilliant, just brilliant!

-Jason "blowing an 18 point lead with 8 minute left... the very definition of Clemsoning, isn't it?" Evans

I liked the lead block/screen they got to get the guy open.

tbyers11
03-09-2016, 09:36 PM
Really Clemson... coming out of a timeout that was the shot you get? Really?

The strategy of walking it up with 13 seconds left so you are rushed and cannot get a shot that even hits the rim was brilliant, just brilliant!

-Jason "blowing an 18 point lead with 8 minute left... the very definition of Clemsoning, isn't it?" Evans

This game was an epic fail even for Clemson.

/Clemson'd

dukelifer
03-09-2016, 09:39 PM
Really Clemson... coming out of a timeout that was the shot you get? Really?

The strategy of walking it up with 13 seconds left so you are rushed and cannot get a shot that even hits the rim was brilliant, just brilliant!

-Jason "blowing an 18 point lead with 8 minute left... the very definition of Clemsoning, isn't it?" Evans

Huge loss for Clemson. Hard to blow an 18 point lead with under 10 to go against a mediocre team that has only one three point shooter.

Tripping William
03-09-2016, 09:39 PM
Really Clemson... coming out of a timeout that was the shot you get? Really?

The strategy of walking it up with 13 seconds left so you are rushed and cannot get a shot that even hits the rim was brilliant, just brilliant!

-Jason "blowing an 18 point lead with 8 minute left... the very definition of Clemsoning, isn't it?" Evans

Yup. Tigers just Clemsoned all over themselves the last 6:00 minutes and in OT. They played anti-stallball with all those fouls. Really odd. I'm sure the Hokie and Nole fans are thrilled with the lengthening of the game.

sagegrouse
03-09-2016, 09:43 PM
We now have a living example of "dog-gack orange." Clemson gacks up an 18-point lead in eight minutes. The Tigers-Dogs lost in overtime to Georgia Tech, 88-85.

Doria
03-09-2016, 09:43 PM
That was not a good end-game sequence for Clemson at all. Still, today's games have been really entertaining for the most part.

DU82
03-09-2016, 09:43 PM
And again the refs blow the inbounds play. The question wasn't who the ball was out on with 1.7 seconds left, the question is why three refs didn't see/call the walk by the inbounder.

Eternal Outlaw
03-09-2016, 09:46 PM
And again the refs blow the inbounds play. The question wasn't who the ball was out on with 1.7 seconds left, the question is why three refs didn't see/call the walk by the inbounder.

Did that happen before or after the huge jersey pull of the guy who ended up knocking it out?

Wahoo2000
03-09-2016, 09:46 PM
Yup. Tigers just Clemsoned all over themselves the last 6:00 minutes and in OT. They played anti-stallball with all those fouls. Really odd. I'm sure the Hokie and Nole fans are thrilled with the lengthening of the game.

They might not like it, but I was rooting for a couple more OTs ;-)

Newton_14
03-09-2016, 09:52 PM
And again the refs blow the inbounds play. The question wasn't who the ball was out on with 1.7 seconds left, the question is why three refs didn't see/call the walk by the inbounder.

Well the walk no longer applies to the inbounder but they have to stay within the 3 foot "inbound spot". It's a turnover if they move outside that space.

Clemson Clemson Clemson. WOw. Just wow. Up 18 with 8 to go. LEARN THE STALL BALL TECHNIQUE from K and you cant possibly blow that lead in that amount of clock time....

Poor Klemnop. And whatever chance they had at the Big Dance just got barfed out the window.

So many game management mistakes. 6 fouls in the final two minutes. Dumb fouls. Bad fouls. Ludicrous fouls. Then they miss foul shots. Then, tied up, with the ball, 12 seconds left... PG casually walks the ball up the court almost running the clock out before even getting into a position to make a play... calls his own number and shoots some wild prayer over the goal. Well wait, 'shoot" is the improper word there.... "slung a one handed prayer against a much taller defender over the entire goal.

Then on last possession of OT down 3, don't get any semblance of a good look from 3, even after calling TO to set up a 3 point attempt..... lets drive to the corner instead... that's a great place to try a desperation 3 against heavy defense when you must make it....

I was a fan of their coach originally... but after tonight??? I'd fire him tomorrow morning.

FerryFor50
03-09-2016, 09:54 PM
Did that happen before or after the huge jersey pull of the guy who ended up knocking it out?

Was a flagrant called? :rolleyes:

BandAlum83
03-09-2016, 09:58 PM
Really Clemson... coming out of a timeout that was the shot you get? Really?

The strategy of walking it up with 13 seconds left so you are rushed and cannot get a shot that even hits the rim was brilliant, just brilliant!

-Jason "blowing an 18 point lead with 8 minute left... the very definition of Clemsoning, isn't it?" Evans

The more of that type of stuff I see, the more I appreciate how well coached Duke is. Syracuse had the same inability to get a good shot at the end.

DU82
03-09-2016, 10:05 PM
Newt, the inbounder took two steps, I thought. That's outside the three foot box.

-jk
03-09-2016, 10:09 PM
Newt, the inbounder took two steps, I thought. That's outside the three foot box.

Just have to keep one foot over the 3 foot spot width. A wide stance gives a fair bit of leeway.

I wasn't watching closely, though.

-jk

DU82
03-09-2016, 10:11 PM
Just have to keep one foot over the 3 foot spot width. A wide stance gives a fair bit of leeway.

I wasn't watching closely, though.

-jk

Brad was calling for a walk from the Clemson bench, but he had a reasonable need for that call. :)

devildeac
03-09-2016, 10:12 PM
Did that happen before or after the huge jersey pull of the guy who ended up knocking it out?

I'm guessing an F1 was not called then :rolleyes: .

Newton_14
03-09-2016, 10:16 PM
Newt, the inbounder took two steps, I thought. That's outside the three foot box. Agreed and thought it could/should have been called.... was mainly pointing out a player can no longer walk/travel in that situation like the old days.....

FerryFor50
03-09-2016, 10:30 PM
Agreed and thought it could/should have been called... was mainly pointing out a player can no longer walk/travel in that situation like the old days....

Why did they add ambiguity to something that should be clear cut and easy to call?

Changing it from what could be a clear travel to some imaginary 3 foot box is silly and open to interpretation. If we're going to make refs be so clear cut on stuff like, oh, I don't know, jersey pulls, why not on inbound walks?

-jk
03-09-2016, 10:40 PM
Why did they add ambiguity to something that should be clear cut and easy to call?

Changing it from what could be a clear travel to some imaginary 3 foot box is silly and open to interpretation. If we're going to make refs be so clear cut on stuff like, oh, I don't know, jersey pulls, why not on inbound walks?

I can't speak to "way back", but it's been the 3' rule for the decades. It's not been a "travel" regardless of what the talking heads say.

-jk

Ballboy1998
03-10-2016, 08:12 AM
Official got my ticket for today's game, to hell with work! Went for the cheapies so I will be way up in Section 429. Not looking forward to the prospect of the fans in pansy blue sticking around after their early game just to root against Duke. Hopefully Pitt can work some magic and send them packing early!

devildeac
03-10-2016, 01:29 PM
From on-line stats, it looks like Pitt is playing some great D vs the h**ls who are "only" shooting 58% :rolleyes: .

dukelifer
03-10-2016, 01:52 PM
Looks to be over. Joel Berry II is starting to get hot as a player of late. Could be all that is needed for UNC to make a run.

moonpie23
03-10-2016, 01:54 PM
stick a fork in pitt......berry playing on both ends

dukebluesincebirth
03-10-2016, 01:58 PM
Looks to be over. Joel Berry II is starting to get hot as a player of late. Could be all that is needed for UNC to make a run.

I still think they need Paige to do more...Berry will not average 17pts a game for the rest of the season.

dukelifer
03-10-2016, 02:01 PM
I still think they need Paige to do more...Berry will not average 17pts a game for the rest of the season.

No but he is getting better and we all know players have a great month- that is all it takes

TruBlu
03-10-2016, 02:21 PM
I'm not one to complain about refs (except when I'm awake), but the Pitt/unc game was close, maybe even tied, until about the middle of the second half. That's when the refs made a horrible call on an out of bounds play at the Pitt end and awarded the ball to the cheats. unc promptly hit a 3, and the route was on.

Back in the days of Lenny Wertz, this was SOP. If the game was tight, unc got the calls. Then after the game was out of hand, refs would balance out the calls.

Bob Green
03-11-2016, 08:02 PM
Carolina is up 19 on Notre Dame at the half in the first semi-final game. I hate to say it but the Tar Heels are clicking on all eight cylinders all of a sudden. The second semi-final is the more important one in my opinion as I am looking for Virginia to win this tournament. Go Wahoos!

Dukehky
03-11-2016, 08:07 PM
I do not like Carolina playing this well. I care about 4 things for the rest of this basketball season: 1. I want to get out of the first round, anything more to me would be gravy 2. I need someone to beat Carolina before the the Final Four 3. I need someone to beat Kentucky before the Final Four and 4. I need UNC to not win the ACC tournament.

Number 4 would be the least objectionable since at least it would come back to 15-501, but I would only rationalize it like that if they played Miami. Old School ACC UVA would be a heavy favorite in my household.

WakeDevil
03-11-2016, 08:07 PM
I am not unhappy to see a charter member of the league lay a smackdown on the interlopers. I hope Roy is talking enough to annoy Mikey boy.

Tripping William
03-11-2016, 08:24 PM
Surely we'd have made this more competitive. *sigh*

FerryFor50
03-11-2016, 08:34 PM
Surely we'd have made this more competitive. *sigh*

Surely ND will pull out another magic horseshoe from their collective rears and come storming back.

Curious. Where is all that fire and bravado from yesterday? 🙄

FerryFor50
03-11-2016, 08:37 PM
Definitely incredible how Auguste is suddenly being called for fouls.

dukelifer
03-11-2016, 08:50 PM
Carolina is up 19 on Notre Dame at the half in the first semi-final game. I hate to say it but the Tar Heels are clicking on all eight cylinders all of a sudden. The second semi-final is the more important one in my opinion as I am looking for Virginia to win this tournament. Go Wahoos!

Yes- they may have turned a corner. Confidence is a funny thing. I hope they do not win the NCAAs but they have a good shot to get to the FF.

Dukehky
03-11-2016, 08:50 PM
If Paige starts playing like sophomore Paige consistently and Roy doesn't do anything stupid like make him the pg again, Carolina may actually be the best team in the country. God I hate them.

dukelifer
03-11-2016, 08:53 PM
If Paige starts playing like sophomore Paige consistently and Roy doesn't do anything stupid like make him the pg again, Carolina may actually be the best team in the country. God I hate them.
We can only hope the NCAA acts to take away their joy.

moonpie23
03-11-2016, 08:54 PM
man...they are woodshedding the irish.....they are flat ballin...


don't know if we'd been the same fodder, or put up a different kind of fight....


ugh...makes me sick....

grossbus
03-11-2016, 08:54 PM
Irish flop

Doria
03-11-2016, 08:55 PM
If Paige starts playing like sophomore Paige consistently and Roy doesn't do anything stupid like make him the pg again, Carolina may actually be the best team in the country. God I hate them.

Yeah, while I don't really hate Paige, I was pretty okay with him being in that horrible slump. Certainly, he's the least objectionable Carolina guard to me.

Dukehky
03-11-2016, 08:57 PM
Yeah, while I don't really hate Paige, I was pretty okay with him being in that horrible slump. Certainly, he's the least objectionable Carolina guard to me.

I would argue that he became far less objectionable when he went into that slump. I thought he was insufferable before, largely because he got the opposite ESPN treatment that Grayson gets. Kid could do no wrong, even when he sucked.

Doria
03-11-2016, 09:00 PM
I would argue that he became far less objectionable when he went into that slump. I thought he was insufferable before, largely because he got the opposite ESPN treatment that Grayson gets. Kid could do no wrong, even when he sucked.

Well, if I'm truthful, it's mostly that I really hate Berry. I don't actually know why, I just always have. Also, I don't really hold ESPN's treatment of Paige against him any more than I would hold their treatment of Grayson against him. (I can understand your point, though, and seeing his teary speech for the billionth time just made me want to vomit.)

Also, I'm a little concerned for Roy; that was an uncharacteristically tasteful jacket. I guess he ran out of couches to murder and skin. Maybe his players should take out a collection to buy him a more Roy-ish jacket.

Edit: I must add, speaking of hatred, that I hope UVA destroys Miami. Man, I despise those guys.

dukelifer
03-11-2016, 09:10 PM
man...they are woodshedding the irish....they are flat ballin...


don't know if we'd been the same fodder, or put up a different kind of fight...


ugh...makes me sick...

Would have been the third game in three days. It would have been a tall order. UNC crushed both opponents. They are definitely peaking. Let's see how they handle a close game. That is the true test when a team is on a roll.

fuse
03-11-2016, 09:15 PM
Pretty clear we are still everyone's biggest game by a long shot.
While I am confident the OT sapped both teams, Notre Dame was content to beat Duke and did not have the same appetite for the cheaters.

Tripping William
03-11-2016, 09:17 PM
Extremely tough to beat Carolina when Berry and Paige are making shots. Then if the Heels actually defend, well, look out.

Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15
03-11-2016, 09:21 PM
Carolina suddenly looks like preseason expectations. They are playing with a grit and swagger that makes them look unstoppable.

Geez. Glad we didn't play them tonight.

El_Diablo
03-11-2016, 09:23 PM
Extremely tough to beat Carolina when Berry and Paige are making shots. Then if the Heels actually defend, well, look out.

No, no, Kedsy assured us that UNC is not good because they lost 12 games last year. He posted stats and everything.

dukelifer
03-11-2016, 09:38 PM
No, no, Kedsy assured us that UNC is not good because they lost 12 games last year. He posted stats and everything.

It must be all a bad dream. How can a team that starts 4 experienced former high school All Americans, has two on the bench and has another starter who is a first team All ACC performer be any good?

El_Diablo
03-11-2016, 09:53 PM
It must be all a bad dream. How can a team that starts 4 experienced former high school All Americans, has two on the bench and has another starter who is a first team All ACC performer be any good?

But, but Brice Johnson's RSCI rating....!

ncexnyc
03-11-2016, 10:03 PM
No, no, Kedsy assured us that UNC is not good because they lost 12 games last year. He posted stats and everything.
I wouldn't get to carried away.

The heels beat up an emotionally spent Irish team

norduck
03-11-2016, 10:12 PM
I wouldn't get to carried away.

The heels beat up an emotionally spent Irish team

and with a coach that hates the money making cocktail party.

Doria
03-11-2016, 10:29 PM
Well, I guess Mike Brey got the team he cheered for.

dukelifer
03-11-2016, 10:32 PM
But, but Brice Johnson's RSCI rating...!

Just looked at that. Interesting that Nik Stauskas, Terry Rozier and Montrezl Harrell were all below 75 during Brice's year. This year's Big ten player of the year and All American Denzel Valentine was 88. Brice was 40 or so.

Doria
03-12-2016, 03:45 AM
Good article on the front page, previewing Carolina-Virginia. Interesting to note that games where UVA gave up more than 60ish (and certainly 70) are kind of outliers, but they didn't necessarily lose those games. Often, when a team is committed to a particular play style, you can tell by the losses that they couldn't play their game. UVA won a couple of those games, including the tight one with UNC in the regular season.

I thought it was interesting the general observation that teams get one "great" game per tournament. I've also thought that many eventual champions have to survive one close game, often with good fortune involved at the end (e.g., a win on a buzzer beater, a comeback win, an unexpected TO, etc.). This is not a scientific observation, and is probably more true in the NCAA's than the ACCT. Anyway, I definitely hope the article's observation will prove true for the championship game tomorrow.

WakeDevil
03-12-2016, 07:57 AM
Mike Brey can sit in the UNC section while we have a real ACC final. No Big East.

devilseven
03-12-2016, 08:11 AM
Mike Brey can sit in the UNC section while we have a real ACC final. No Big East.

And wear his UNC-CHeat hat!!

TKG
03-12-2016, 08:54 AM
Today: Ich bin ein Wahooer!!!

Wander
03-12-2016, 09:24 AM
No, no, Kedsy assured us that UNC is not good because they lost 12 games last year. He posted stats and everything.

Assuming your team's players will improve while other teams' players will not is probably the single most common mistake fans make in preseason predictions.

jdc75
03-12-2016, 09:29 AM
Great game by the heels last night. They looked dominant.
With today's conference tournament championships and Selection Sunday Eve upon us, the entire national media will be turning most if not all of its attention to men's college basketball.
Everyone, from the most casual of fans to President Obama himself, will be be filling out brackets.

With all of this attention, I wonder if anybody in the media will have the guts or integrity to ask what I see as an obvious, fair, and valid question.
With five Level 1 violations pending, and 18 years of proven systemic academic fraud that kept their athletes eligible, why is UNC allowed to participate in this or any other post-season tournament?

I know this has been asked here many times before but it really just blows my mind and I think it needs to be asked again and again until their season is over.

I don't care who knew what when. The fact remains that it happened.

I truly believe if this were ANY OTHER SCHOOL they would not be participating.

TKG
03-12-2016, 09:34 AM
With all of this attention, I wonder if anybody in the media will have the guts or integrity to ask what I see as an obvious, fair, and valid question..

Guarantee no one employed by ESPN will show "guts" or "integrity".

WakeDevil
03-12-2016, 09:46 AM
It is called due process. We already have a lack of it with regard to alleged sexual assaults.

dukelifer
03-12-2016, 10:16 AM
Great game by the heels last night. They looked dominant.
With today's conference tournament championships and Selection Sunday Eve upon us, the entire national media will be turning most if not all of its attention to men's college basketball.
Everyone, from the most casual of fans to President Obama himself, will be be filling out brackets.

With all of this attention, I wonder if anybody in the media will have the guts or integrity to ask what I see as an obvious, fair, and valid question.
With five Level 1 violations pending, and 18 years of proven systemic academic fraud that kept their athletes eligible, why is UNC allowed to participate in this or any other post-season tournament?

I know this has been asked here many times before but it really just blows my mind and I think it needs to be asked again and again until their season is over.

I don't care who knew what when. The fact remains that it happened.

I truly believe if this were ANY OTHER SCHOOL they would not be participating.
It will be interesting to see how this plays out. A department at UNC created bogus classes which served multiple selfish purposes. It attracted students from all over campus - giving them numbers to justify hires and other institutional attention. If they were set up or extended in collaboration with Athletics to keep athletes eligible- then Althletics should be shut down. But I am not sure this happened. What likely did happen is that athletes took advantage of a bogus class set up for other purposes and their advisors looked the other way arguing that they don't have any control as to how classes are run. As such the line is blurry. I have no doubt athletes were funneled into these classes. Duke also directs many of its student athletes to avoid classes with labs or significant weekly homework. But taking advantage of easy classes to keep up GPAs is done by almost every kid in college. It is up to the institution to police this type of abuse and UNC did not shut it down for decades- and that boggles my mind. So all this is blurry- who is to blame- who set up what- is it ethical for Athletics to take advantage of a bogus class? The NCAA does not always act in the best interests of athletes and many institutions are exploiting athletes and athletics for selfish purposes of branding and soliciting donor attention by enrolling students who are not prepared for college work. The NCAA benefits from all this. It is a big mess and in some ways getting worse. Duke is by no means perfect but probably runs things as well as you can- in part because it is smaller and attracts and enrolled the top 1% high school students in the country. The NCAA knows they are opening a can of rancid worms on this one- so no idea what will happen.

rsvman
03-12-2016, 10:17 AM
...

With all of this attention, I wonder if anybody in the media will have the guts or integrity to ask what I see as an obvious, fair, and valid question.
With five Level 1 violations pending, and 18 years of proven systemic academic fraud that kept their athletes eligible, why is UNC allowed to participate in this or any other post-season tournament?

....

Outstanding question. I just posted a new thread called "My, how times have changed" that tells a story from NCAA men's basketball from 1979 that provides a really interesting (IMO) contrast. It shows what happens when you are UNM instead of UNC, or perhaps it shows what happens when it's 1979 instead of 2016, or perhaps a bit of both.


WakeDevil, it's not due process. We already know full well that they have been cheating. That particular point is not in dispute.

Dr. Rosenrosen
03-12-2016, 10:30 AM
With all of this attention, I wonder if anybody in the media will have the guts or integrity to ask what I see as an obvious, fair, and valid question.
With five Level 1 violations pending, and 18 years of proven systemic academic fraud that kept their athletes eligible, why is UNC allowed to participate in this or any other post-season tournament?

I know this has been asked here many times before but it really just blows my mind and I think it needs to be asked again and again until their season is over.

I don't care who knew what when. The fact remains that it happened.

I truly believe if this were ANY OTHER SCHOOL they would not be participating.
Why would they ask or answer this question when instead they can focus on the continued villifaction of the latest 19yr white Duke player who did very little to deserve the label in the first place and nothing to deserve the shameful treatment he's received by the media?

Just to make sure I have it all right... The two part plan is to ignore obvious cheating and total lack of regard for academic standards while you work to viciously tear down a 19 yr old academic all American true student-athlete. What the f@(& is wrong with people these days? Or am I confusing members of the mainstream media with actual human beings?

oldnavy
03-12-2016, 10:33 AM
Great game by the heels last night. They looked dominant.
With today's conference tournament championships and Selection Sunday Eve upon us, the entire national media will be turning most if not all of its attention to men's college basketball.
Everyone, from the most casual of fans to President Obama himself, will be be filling out brackets.

With all of this attention, I wonder if anybody in the media will have the guts or integrity to ask what I see as an obvious, fair, and valid question.
With five Level 1 violations pending, and 18 years of proven systemic academic fraud that kept their athletes eligible, why is UNC allowed to participate in this or any other post-season tournament?

I know this has been asked here many times before but it really just blows my mind and I think it needs to be asked again and again until their season is over.

I don't care who knew what when. The fact remains that it happened.

I truly believe if this were ANY OTHER SCHOOL they would not be participating.

Do you believe this because you think that the NCAA would have acted already or because you think any other school would have self imposed?

I think UNC's day will come but the NCAA has shown that it has various speeds at which it operates.


Now, UNC has played 1 and 1/2 good games back to back. They have the talent... I don't think anyone has said different.... the issue has been and will be going forward, their intensity and basketball IQ... if they start to miss from outside again, will they be stubborn and continue to jack up three's or will they go back inside? Will they play hard for 40 minutes each game? These are the questions that surround UNC... and they are legit questions based on this years team and past performances.

You don't have to go back to last year to question UNC's play... they were 3-5 against the RPI top 50 teams this year going into the tournament... and they had a loss at UNI which is not in the top 50... but that was without Marquis Paige, so you have to consider that. There losses were against Duke, UVa, ND, Texas and Louisville. None of these teams are probably going to be higher than a 4 seed in the tournament. They beat Maryland, Duke, Miami, again none above a 4 or 5 seed. So, they haven't really demonstrated that they are going to plow through the NCAA field.

HOWEVER, if UNC gets on a roll and keeps this level of play up, I think they are probably the best or one of the best teams in the country and could take the NC. They put a whooping on ND last night that's for sure.

I'm not betting on them, but my betting record is horrible...

arnie
03-12-2016, 10:45 AM
Well, I guess Mike Brey got the team he cheered for.

Missed the game, was Brey wearing his UNC baseball camp shirt.

oldnavy
03-12-2016, 10:56 AM
[/B]

Do you believe this because you think that the NCAA would have acted already or because you think any other school would have self imposed?

I think UNC's day will come but the NCAA has shown that it has various speeds at which it operates.


Now, UNC has played 1 and 1/2 good games back to back. They have the talent... I don't think anyone has said different... the issue has been and will be going forward, their intensity and basketball IQ... if they start to miss from outside again, will they be stubborn and continue to jack up three's or will they go back inside? Will they play hard for 40 minutes each game? These are the questions that surround UNC... and they are legit questions based on this years team and past performances.

You don't have to go back to last year to question UNC's play... they were 3-5 against the RPI top 50 teams this year going into the tournament... and they had a loss at UNI which is not in the top 50... but that was without Marquis Paige, so you have to consider that. There losses were against Duke, UVa, ND, Texas and Louisville. None of these teams are probably going to be higher than a 4 seed in the tournament. They beat Maryland, Duke, Miami, again none above a 4 or 5 seed. So, they haven't really demonstrated that they are going to plow through the NCAA field.

HOWEVER, if UNC gets on a roll and keeps this level of play up, I think they are probably the best or one of the best teams in the country and could take the NC. They put a whooping on ND last night that's for sure.

I'm not betting on them, but my betting record is horrible...

Oooops, UVa is definitely going to be higher than a 4 seed... blanked on them for some reason, not sure why because I AM A HUGE WAHOOO FAN TODAY!! GO HOO's!!!

duke09hms
03-12-2016, 11:26 AM
No, no, Kedsy assured us that UNC is not good because they lost 12 games last year. He posted stats and everything.

lol the fact Kedsy's premature prediction is on record might be the ONLY silver lining to a UNC title this year.

Dammit why aren't there any dominant teams this year ... especially because Michigan State ALWAYS folds against UNC.

Maybe it'd be poetic justice if Kansas knocks UNC out?

oldnavy
03-12-2016, 11:34 AM
lol the fact Kedsy's premature prediction is on record might be the ONLY silver lining to a UNC title this year.

Dammit why aren't there any dominant teams this year ... especially because Michigan State ALWAYS folds against UNC.

Maybe it'd be poetic justice if Kansas knocks UNC out?

That's what I would love to see...

Unfortunately that would mean UNC got to the final four and I want them to go out the first weekend!

jdc75
03-12-2016, 01:18 PM
Do you believe this because you think that the NCAA would have acted already or because you think any other school would have self imposed?

Yes and yes.

If this were anybody else I think the NCAA would have already acted in some way. But because they have bought, sold, and made a ton of money off the myth of "the Carolina way" for decades, they stand to lose too much money by dropping UNC from their tourney. Especially this year's team, who was everybody's preseason pick to win it all.

Louisville's administration was willing to step up and say we're not going to allow our basketball team to represent us in this year's post season because they have shamed our reputation, and even though we are a basketball powerhouse and a blue-blood program, no athletic team is bigger than the university. If Louisville is willing to self impose, then I don't see any reason not to assume most other schools would too, under similar circumstances.

UNC's administration has failed to do that because it is too arrogant to accept responsibility and get to the heart of the problem. This has been going on for 5 years!

What I really want to hear is one print or TV journalist just ask the question I mentioned in my previous post to the NCAA or to any UNC official. Preferably Roy:) Maybe Charles Barkley will mention it in an attempt to get Kenny Smith riled up. I know ESPN won't touch it.

jv001
03-12-2016, 03:02 PM
Why would they ask or answer this question when instead they can focus on the continued villifaction of the latest 19yr white Duke player who did very little to deserve the label in the first place and nothing to deserve the shameful treatment he's received by the media?

Just to make sure I have it all right... The two part plan is to ignore obvious cheating and total lack of regard for academic standards while you work to viciously tear down a 19 yr old academic all American true student-athlete. What the f@(& is wrong with people these days? Or am I confusing members of the mainstream media with actual human beings?

In the world we live in, right is wrong and wrong is right but I will not go into that because this topic is not for the Basketball Thread. I agree with every point you have made. If uncheating university doesn't get punished severely for their longtime cheating ways, I'll not comment on any threads involving uncheat university ever again. Because they will not matter any longer. GoDuke!

Indoor66
03-12-2016, 04:19 PM
Let's Go HOOS, beat unCheat

wavedukefan70s
03-12-2016, 04:48 PM
Im a part time virginia fan tonight!

royalblue
03-12-2016, 05:13 PM
That's what I would love to see...

Unfortunately that would mean UNC got to the final four and I want them to go out the first weekend!

If UVA rolls tonight
Nova wins
KU wins
MSU wins
uncch could be a 2seed with KU

royalblue
03-12-2016, 06:37 PM
If UVA rolls tonight
Nova wins
KU wins
MSU wins
uncch could be a 2seed with KU

Nova better get it together fast

dukelifer
03-12-2016, 08:31 PM
Nova better get it together fast

Nova not a 1 seed in my opinion.

grossbus
03-12-2016, 08:54 PM
"especially because Michigan State ALWAYS folds against UNC."

the truth.

Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15
03-12-2016, 08:58 PM
There is a part of me happy that we have two old school ACC teams in the championship. Let's hope Ol Roy can't match Bennett's sharpness on the bench.

Go Hoos!

subzero02
03-12-2016, 09:03 PM
Did the arena announcer just call them the Clemson Cavaliers? I have a cold so I might have heard him incorrectly.

gep
03-12-2016, 09:28 PM
I always liked Tony Bennett

royalblue
03-12-2016, 09:48 PM
I always liked Tony Bennett

I will like him more with a victory tonight

Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15
03-12-2016, 10:00 PM
I always liked Tony Bennett

Next generation of ACC coach

DukeTrinity11
03-12-2016, 10:25 PM
My 2 favorite coaches in the ACC right now besides K: Mike Brey and Tony Bennett

DukeTrinity11
03-12-2016, 10:28 PM
Come on Wahoos, BEAT THE CHEATERS!!

I'm worried UVA is running out of gas and their legs are shot, the 3 ball isn't falling for them right now.

grossbus
03-12-2016, 10:35 PM
None of their shots are falling. It may be over.

weezie
03-12-2016, 10:45 PM
Holy cow, this is just a disaster for the hoo.
Dreadful.

DarkstarWahoo
03-12-2016, 10:53 PM
You know, if the Grayson Allen call is made*, then UVA is the top seed and UNC has to play an actual game yesterday instead of the scrimmage against Notre Dame. ARE YOU GUYS HAPPY NOW?!?!?

* And, of course, everything else happens exactly as it did, which it would have, of course, don't question me!

devildeac
03-12-2016, 10:57 PM
You know, if the Grayson Allen call is made*, then UVA is the top seed and UNC has to play an actual game yesterday instead of the scrimmage against Notre Dame. ARE YOU GUYS HAPPY NOW?!?!?

* And, of course, everything else happens exactly as it did, which it would have, of course, don't question me!

Which Grayson Allen call? You mean the one where he was fouled 2 or 3 times on his drive to the basket before he didn't travel before his game-winning shot?

Troublemaker
03-12-2016, 10:58 PM
Oh, well. This was supposed to be their year, and to their credit, they won both the ACC regular season and tournament crowns.

Of course, the Hammer is just around the corner, and anything short of a national championship for UNC is something Duke fans can live with this year.

Congrats to Wheat any other Heel fans lurking on the ACC championship.

#1Duke
03-12-2016, 11:02 PM
Ugh! The Tar Heels looked very good tonight. Great defense and played tough till the very end of the game.
They are peaking at the right time.
They could go deep in the tourney.

duke09hms
03-12-2016, 11:07 PM
Ugh! The Tar Heels looked very good tonight. Great defense and played tough till the very end of the game.
They are peaking at the right time.
They could go deep in the tourney.

but but they lost 12 games last year! And their players weren't supposed to get better! And stats!

Rich
03-12-2016, 11:14 PM
I've been biting my tongue as I watched most of the ACC Tourney Games, and all of Carolina's games, and am just dumbfounded at the complete lack of any mention whatsoever about what hangs over their heads. If it was, let's say, Miami it would be a topic of discussion at some point during every game given their history. And, of course, ESPN is at the ready to show Grayson Allen at his worst the second he does something aggressive on the court. Yet, UNC has perhaps the greatest collegiate sports scandal in the history of the NCAA hanging over their heads and NOT ONE COMMENTATOR made a single peep about it. The silence is deafening!

Furniture
03-12-2016, 11:19 PM
UNC were good tonight. They deserved the win.
As much as I don't like anyone bringing up Grayson and his tripping when Duke are playing I am not in favor of bringing up the UNC academic scandal either on the day of this final. Don't know why really except that it feels like sour grapes.
UNC were better than us in the ACC but if that's the price of Duke winning a national championship the year before I'll take it every time.

DukeTrinity11
03-12-2016, 11:28 PM
UNC were good tonight. They deserved the win.
As much as I don't like anyone bringing up Grayson and his tripping when Duke are playing I am not in favor of bringing up the UNC academic scandal either on the day of this final. Don't know why really except that it feels like sour grapes.
UNC were better than us in the ACC but if that's the price of Duke winning a national championship the year before I'll take it every time.

Duke can win a national championship this year too my friend

Why is everyone writing this team off? We won't have to play back to back games in the NCAA tournament.

Duke is as dangerous as anyone else. We've already beaten UVA and UNC, both of whom are likely one seeds. Kansas and MSU don't scare me.

Rich
03-12-2016, 11:35 PM
I am not in favor of bringing up the UNC academic scandal either on the day of this final. Don't know why really except that it feels like sour grapes.

Perhaps not tonight, but the fact that not one commentator mentioned it at any point during the entire tourney? Between games, halftimes...not once. Frankly, I don't recall any ESPN commentator mentioning it during the season either, but I don't watch UNC games regularly. I watched all of their games during the ACC Tourney and it was never even hinted at. I just feel like ESPN is doing their best to ignore what is a potentially historic story and they are not willing to even come close to touching on it. I'm not sure that would be the case if it were Miami, FSU, Va Tech, and maybe some others. I would be shocked if there wasn't a memo to all ESPN game announcers not to touch it. I guess the double standard still exists.

Troublemaker
03-12-2016, 11:37 PM
Duke can win a national championship this year too my friend

Why is everyone writing this team off? We won't have to play back to back games in the NCAA tournament.

Duke is as dangerous as anyone else. We've already beaten UVA and UNC, both of whom are likely one seeds. Kansas and MSU don't scare me.

I mostly agree, but we really shouldn't even care how we match up with UVA, UNC, KU, and MSU.

The 12 seed could easily beat us, and so could the 4/13.

Furniture
03-12-2016, 11:40 PM
Duke can win a national championship this year too my friend

Why is everyone writing this team off? We won't have to play back to back games in the NCAA tournament.

Duke is as dangerous as anyone else. We've already beaten UVA and UNC, both of whom are likely one seeds. Kansas and MSU don't scare me.

I am not writing this team off for the NCAA.

jipops
03-12-2016, 11:59 PM
UNC were good tonight. They deserved the win.
As much as I don't like anyone bringing up Grayson and his tripping when Duke are playing I am not in favor of bringing up the UNC academic scandal either on the day of this final. Don't know why really except that it feels like sour grapes.
UNC were better than us in the ACC but if that's the price of Duke winning a national championship the year before I'll take it every time.

unc exploited kids for at least 2 decades by not providing any sort of education, something that was promised to them. All of this for the athletic department's own benefit. It should always be fair game, whether they win or lose. Grayson's dumb play tripping a player pales in comparison to say the least.

Dukehky
03-13-2016, 12:08 AM
I would just like to say that the ACC Regular Season Title is effectively meaningless. The unbalanced schedule makes it totally pointless. I guess it's nice, but throw in the fact that Carolina had the easiest ACC schedule of any team in the conference, I don't want to hear peep about them sweeping the conference.

I hate them so much. God I hate them. I never want to see Brice Johnson enjoy any happiness on a basketball court again. (Not in life, he can have a satisfying life, as long as he doesn't win, I'm tired of him crying)

jipops
03-13-2016, 12:13 AM
I would just like to say that the ACC Regular Season Title is effectively meaningless. The unbalanced schedule makes it totally pointless. I guess it's nice, but throw in the fact that Carolina had the easiest ACC schedule of any team in the conference, I don't want to hear peep about them sweeping the conference.

I hate them so much. God I hate them. I never want to see Brice Johnson enjoy any happiness on a basketball court again. (Not in life, he can have a satisfying life, as long as he doesn't win, I'm tired of him crying)



So a 3-5 day tournament sprint proves more than 2 months of conference play?

Look unc was obviously the best team in the conference this year. Certainly was with Amile's foot taking him out for the season. But none of this is remotely surprising with all of the talent and experience they returned this season.

Now I'm having to mentally prepare myself for a 2016 unc national title. Kharma is not working as well as it should.

Wheat/"/"/"
03-13-2016, 12:16 AM
Heels=Undisputed 2016 ACC Champions.

Well played by UVa. Nobody can say the Heels didn't earn it against a very good team.

Lots of anti UNC, biased narratives, bit the dust in this game. Looking forward to how Newton 14 and Kedsey spin this...should be entertaining.

About the game...

I enjoy watching Roy Williams coach. 1st, his teams win. He's also tactical, emotional, and he knows his players. He freely subs and he develops a deep bench, working all his players on multiple situations and lineups during season and in practice, and is not afraid to put anyone in and demand they produce. He did it all season to the cries of many who loved second guessing him, but they got better, while the team still won most games.

Tonight he showed confidence in his bench again. He brought in Kenny Williams and Joel James and they played well. He had them ready to play in a big game like the ACC championship for the situation that fit their skills and what the team needed at the time.
The players have to love that and know if they can contribute, he will call on them when he needs them.
How about him having the confidence to bring in freshman Kenny Williams for some key minutes? And getting some big minutes from Joel James when they needed some strength inside.

Balance, versatility and depth define this team. Add mental toughness now too.

And the team is buying into Roy's leadership. They are unselfish and seem to finally understand how to play with a "sense of urgency" for the entire 40 minutes that he harped on so much early in the season.

Defense. Good defense. The Heels are playing it and Roy can coach it. No sense in denying it.

They've had a great season, they are champions and earned it. The NCAA tourney is now gravy and they should enter it confident,focused and intense.

jipops
03-13-2016, 01:01 AM
Heels=Undisputed 2016 ACC Champions.

Well played by UVa. Nobody can say the Heels didn't earn it against a very good team.

Lots of anti UNC, biased narratives, bit the dust in this game. Looking forward to how Newton 14 and Kedsey spin this...should be entertaining.

About the game...

I enjoy watching Roy Williams coach. 1st, his teams win. He's also tactical, emotional, and he knows his players. He freely subs and he develops a deep bench, working all his players on multiple situations and lineups during season and in practice, and is not afraid to put anyone in and demand they produce. He did it all season to the cries of many who loved second guessing him, but they got better, while the team still won most games.

Tonight he showed confidence in his bench again. He brought in Kenny Williams and Joel James and they played well. He had them ready to play in a big game like the ACC championship for the situation that fit their skills and what the team needed at the time.
The players have to love that and know if they can contribute, he will call on them when he needs them.
How about him having the confidence to bring in freshman Kenny Williams for some key minutes? And getting some big minutes from Joel James when they needed some strength inside.

Balance, versatility and depth define this team. Add mental toughness now too.

And the team is buying into Roy's leadership. They are unselfish and seem to finally understand how to play with a "sense of urgency" for the entire 40 minutes that he harped on so much early in the season.

Defense. Good defense. The Heels are playing it and Roy can coach it. No sense in denying it.

They've had a great season, they are champions and earned it. The NCAA tourney is now gravy and they should enter it confident,focused and intense.

Due to that whole athletic/academic exploitation thing, I haven't allowed advertisers to generate much revenue from me watching a heels game. So I've only seen 2 this season. But from what I can gather the heels have been playing some of the best defense in the country lately, by the numbers. Hats off to the players. Experienced, talented teams tend to turn it on when it counts the most. Good job by Roy for not getting in the way of that.

Do you think Joel Berry will be able to keep up this level of play? He looked mediocre to me in the two Duke games, his dagger coast to coast layup in the 2nd game notwithstanding. I know you want to shower your praise on Roy. But Joel hitting shots has a heck of alot more to do with unc's success than any moves Roy has made.

Doria
03-13-2016, 01:21 AM
The NCAA tourney is now gravy and they should enter it confident,focused and intense.

I am grudgingly willing to see Carolina as ACC champion, provided that the NCAA games do, indeed, prove to be optional wins. Though if you expect them to enter it confident, focused, and intense, they should probably not view it as gravy ;)

(No one can accuse me of being a UNC fan, but congratulations to you on your team's win.)

kshepinthehouse
03-13-2016, 07:27 AM
Heels=Undisputed 2016 ACC Champions.

Well played by UVa. Nobody can say the Heels didn't earn it against a very good team.

Lots of anti UNC, biased narratives, bit the dust in this game. Looking forward to how Newton 14 and Kedsey spin this...should be entertaining.

About the game...

I enjoy watching Roy Williams coach. 1st, his teams win. He's also tactical, emotional, and he knows his players. He freely subs and he develops a deep bench, working all his players on multiple situations and lineups during season and in practice, and is not afraid to put anyone in and demand they produce. He did it all season to the cries of many who loved second guessing him, but they got better, while the team still won most games.

Tonight he showed confidence in his bench again. He brought in Kenny Williams and Joel James and they played well. He had them ready to play in a big game like the ACC championship for the situation that fit their skills and what the team needed at the time.
The players have to love that and know if they can contribute, he will call on them when he needs them.
How about him having the confidence to bring in freshman Kenny Williams for some key minutes? And getting some big minutes from Joel James when they needed some strength inside.

Balance, versatility and depth define this team. Add mental toughness now too.

And the team is buying into Roy's leadership. They are unselfish and seem to finally understand how to play with a "sense of urgency" for the entire 40 minutes that he harped on so much early in the season.

Defense. Good defense. The Heels are playing it and Roy can coach it. No sense in denying it.

They've had a great season, they are champions and earned it. The NCAA tourney is now gravy and they should enter it confident,focused and intense.

Wheat,
Please explain how schools like Syracuse, Louisville, SMU, etc. have all experienced postseason bans recently for what some would consider lesser offenses than what Carolina has done. In my opinion, anything UNC wins this year along with their accomplishments in the last twenty or so years will be considered tainted.

Indoor66
03-13-2016, 07:27 AM
I always liked Tony Bennett

Who can forget leaving their heart in San Fran? ;):cool:

I agree with you on Bennett - I like his calm demeanor.

dukelifer
03-13-2016, 07:34 AM
Oh, well. This was supposed to be their year, and to their credit, they won both the ACC regular season and tournament crowns.

Of course, the Hammer is just around the corner, and anything short of a national championship for UNC is something Duke fans can live with this year.

Congrats to Wheat any other Heel fans lurking on the ACC championship.

Wonder if the UNC fans still want to run Roy out of Chapel Hill or if they will wait to do that if they don't win it all. UNC is peaking and has the bodies to get a championship - but we forget that a bunch of other teams are also playing well right now. It comes down to matchups. I will be shocked if UNC is not in the final four- but it will be interesting to see who else is there.

cspan37421
03-13-2016, 08:31 AM
unc exploited kids for at least 2 decades by not providing any sort of education, something that was promised to them.

In the words of post-avuncular-letter Cameron Crazies, I beg to differ. It takes two to tango. With the one known exception of the UNC FB player who wanted to take real classes and was told "Uh, no, son", the UNC players were willing participants in the scheme.

Wheat, kudos to your team for playing well. Although I don't think they should be playing, now and for about 10 more years, they are impressive on the court and certainly could win it all.

Fortunately, this year, so could about two dozen teams.

weezie
03-13-2016, 08:51 AM
Did anyone catch Wanker Johnson's father wearing some kind of Flavor Flav necklace featuring his son dunking last night? Several friends texted me but alas, no pics.

Saratoga2
03-13-2016, 08:56 AM
Heels=Undisputed 2016 ACC Champions.

Well played by UVa. Nobody can say the Heels didn't earn it against a very good team.

Lots of anti UNC, biased narratives, bit the dust in this game. Looking forward to how Newton 14 and Kedsey spin this...should be entertaining.

About the game...

I enjoy watching Roy Williams coach. 1st, his teams win. He's also tactical, emotional, and he knows his players. He freely subs and he develops a deep bench, working all his players on multiple situations and lineups during season and in practice, and is not afraid to put anyone in and demand they produce. He did it all season to the cries of many who loved second guessing him, but they got better, while the team still won most games.

Tonight he showed confidence in his bench again. He brought in Kenny Williams and Joel James and they played well. He had them ready to play in a big game like the ACC championship for the situation that fit their skills and what the team needed at the time.
The players have to love that and know if they can contribute, he will call on them when he needs them.
How about him having the confidence to bring in freshman Kenny Williams for some key minutes? And getting some big minutes from Joel James when they needed some strength inside.

Balance, versatility and depth define this team. Add mental toughness now too.

And the team is buying into Roy's leadership. They are unselfish and seem to finally understand how to play with a "sense of urgency" for the entire 40 minutes that he harped on so much early in the season.

Defense. Good defense. The Heels are playing it and Roy can coach it. No sense in denying it.

They've had a great season, they are champions and earned it. The NCAA tourney is now gravy and they should enter it confident,focused and intense.

Yes, this team is playing well, has talent and experience. Saying that, I also believe that the investigation and penalization of UNC has been delayed, otherwise this team would not and probably should not have been playing in the tournaments this year. Whether it is the kids fault is immaterial, just look at Penn State and others penalized for the institutions lack of discipline.

Anyhow, these kids make up a very good basketball team and will be allowed to go forward and compete for the NCAA title.

gumbomoop
03-13-2016, 09:23 AM
Heels=Undisputed 2016 ACC Champions.

Well played by UVa. Nobody can say the Heels didn't earn it against a very good team.

Balance, versatility and depth define this team. Add mental toughness now too.

Defense. Good defense. The Heels are playing it and Roy can coach it. No sense in denying it.

They've had a great season, they are champions and earned it. The NCAA tourney is now gravy and they should enter it confident,focused and intense.

Indisputably undisputed.

Because I saw only parts of last night's game, I have no idea whether it was Heels' defense that harassed Brogdan and Perrantes into a combined 9 for 36, but if yes, that must have been outstanding D, especially since the Hoos shot only 3 FTs the whole game. If no, then one would have to say that the result would have been different had Brogdan and Perrantes not been way off at the same time. As I say, those of you who saw the game from start to finish could obviously comment, including our several very good Wahoo posters.

I continue to be surprised that Hicks doesn't take more minutes from Meeks. The Heels look a better team when Hicks is in there. That Hicks has accepted his limited role presumably reflects well on team chemistry.

Balance, versatility, and depth are big, big pluses. So if they do actually have the mental toughness to play excellent D every game in the NCAAT, they would be among the co-favorites [I guess in this "open" year that means 8 teams, the 1 and 2 seeds] to get to the Final Four.

One major disagreement, if you don't mind: "gravy"? This isn't remotely persuasive, to put it as mildly and as kindly as I can muster. No one knows what the penalty will be for the athletic-academic scandal. Perhaps there will be no penalty whatsoever, though I'm skeptical many Heel fans actually believe that. Given the fact that the 2005 and 2009 banners are not totally safe, and more important that Duke has won 2 NCs after 2009, for Heel fans a whole lot -- this is a massive understatement -- is riding on this March Madness.

So I have to imagine you may be unique in Heeldom in thinking it's all gravy from here on out.

MarkD83
03-13-2016, 10:47 AM
I can see wheat 's point about gravy. As a duke fan a successful season includes wins vs unc , acc championships, final 4 and national championship. So turning this around the same would hold for a unc fan. Of course by Thursday the acc championship will be a satisfying memory and the pressure to move on in the NCAA will be in everyone's mind

allenmurray
03-13-2016, 11:06 AM
Wheat,
Please explain how schools like Syracuse, Louisville, SMU, etc. have all experienced postseason bans recently for what some would consider lesser offenses than what Carolina has done. In my opinion, anything UNC wins this year along with their accomplishments in the last twenty or so years will be considered tainted.

UNC fans care only about victory, not how it was achieved.

Edouble
03-13-2016, 11:12 AM
Did anyone catch Wanker Johnson's father wearing some kind of Flavor Flav necklace featuring his son dunking last night? Several friends texted me but alas, no pics.

Well, Wayne Selden Jr.'s uncle was all over Sportscenter on Friday night after his nephew threw down a monstrous dunk against Baylor. Uncle Anthony was wearing a Flavor Flav clock with a picture of Wayne dunking on it. I think maybe your friends got some of the highlights and game mixed up, because they showed Brice Johnson's father during ACC Tournament coverage and he did not have that get up on.

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/ncaab-the-dagger/wayne-selden-s-uncle-anthony-takes-his-support-to-ridiculous-level-001923246.html;_ylt=A0LEVxB2guVWFVUAHjdXNyoA;_ylu= X3oDMTEyMjdoMW11BGNvbG8DYmYxBHBvcwMxBHZ0aWQDQjE3Mj JfMQRzZWMDc2M-

killerleft
03-13-2016, 11:44 AM
Heels=Undisputed 2016 ACC Champions.

Well played by UVa. Nobody can say the Heels didn't earn it against a very good team.

Lots of anti UNC, biased narratives, bit the dust in this game. Looking forward to how Newton 14 and Kedsey spin this...should be entertaining.

About the game...

I enjoy watching Roy Williams coach. 1st, his teams win. He's also tactical, emotional, and he knows his players. He freely subs and he develops a deep bench, working all his players on multiple situations and lineups during season and in practice, and is not afraid to put anyone in and demand they produce. He did it all season to the cries of many who loved second guessing him, but they got better, while the team still won most games.

Tonight he showed confidence in his bench again. He brought in Kenny Williams and Joel James and they played well. He had them ready to play in a big game like the ACC championship for the situation that fit their skills and what the team needed at the time.
The players have to love that and know if they can contribute, he will call on them when he needs them.
How about him having the confidence to bring in freshman Kenny Williams for some key minutes? And getting some big minutes from Joel James when they needed some strength inside.

Balance, versatility and depth define this team. Add mental toughness now too.

And the team is buying into Roy's leadership. They are unselfish and seem to finally understand how to play with a "sense of urgency" for the entire 40 minutes that he harped on so much early in the season.

Defense. Good defense. The Heels are playing it and Roy can coach it. No sense in denying it.

They've had a great season, they are champions and earned it. The NCAA tourney is now gravy and they should enter it confident,focused and intense.

If our beloved Blue Devils should somehow play to their potential and win it all, that's gonna be some of the bitterest gravy ever made.:) Several other scenarios might leave you guys with bitter-beer faces, but I like that one best of all.

Hail to the Champs, otherwise. They earned the real ACC Championship yesterday.

Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15
03-13-2016, 11:57 AM
Indisputably undisputed.

Because I saw only parts of last night's game, I have no idea whether it was Heels' defense that harassed Brogdan and Perrantes into a combined 9 for 36, but if yes, that must have been outstanding D, especially since the Hoos shot only 3 FTs the whole game. If no, then one would have to say that the result would have been different had Brogdan and Perrantes not been way off at the same time. As I say, those of you who saw the game from start to finish could obviously comment, including our several very good Wahoo posters.

I continue to be surprised that Hicks doesn't take more minutes from Meeks. The Heels look a better team when Hicks is in there. That Hicks has accepted his limited role presumably reflects well on team chemistry.

Balance, versatility, and depth are big, big pluses. So if they do actually have the mental toughness to play excellent D every game in the NCAAT, they would be among the co-favorites [I guess in this "open" year that means 8 teams, the 1 and 2 seeds] to get to the Final Four.

One major disagreement, if you don't mind: "gravy"? This isn't remotely persuasive, to put it as mildly and as kindly as I can muster. No one knows what the penalty will be for the athletic-academic scandal. Perhaps there will be no penalty whatsoever, though I'm skeptical many Heel fans actually believe that. Given the fact that the 2005 and 2009 banners are not totally safe, and more important that Duke has won 2 NCs after 2009, for Heel fans a whole lot -- this is a massive understatement -- is riding on this March Madness.

So I have to imagine you may be unique in Heeldom in thinking it's all gravy from here on out.

Paige played excellent and uncharacteristic defense on Brogdon yesterday. He got him out of his comfort zone and really stuck on him hard. Impressive. As someone on record as liking Paige as a person and as a player, I was really impressed

Congrats to UNC who is finally living up to preseason predictions. Hope we somehow go further than them in the Big Dance.

dukelifer
03-13-2016, 12:05 PM
Paige played excellent and uncharacteristic defense on Brogdon yesterday. He got him out of his comfort zone and really stuck on him hard. Impressive. As someone on record as liking Paige as a person and as a player, I was really impressed

Congrats to UNC who is finally living up to preseason predictions. Hope we somehow go further than them in the Big Dance.

A couple things to consider in all this. Paige and Johnson are seniors. Seniors start to play differently when they know the next game could be their last college game. We all know that Paige can be special and if he returns to that form even for a month, Carolina will win this. Every weekend is different from here on out- but make no mistake- this UNC team is pretty capable. I will be rooting against them- but am prepared for a championship should it reign on down.

Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15
03-13-2016, 12:11 PM
A couple things to consider in all this. Paige and Johnson are seniors. Seniors start to play differently when they know the next game could be their last college game. We all know that Paige can be special and if he returns to that form even for a month, Carolina will win this. Every weekend is different from here on out- but make no mistake- this UNC team is pretty capable. I will be rooting against them- but am prepared for a championship should it reign on down.

Paige's last two games seems to suggest a "return to form" that bodes poorly for the field. I heard it suggested last week by several talking heads that UNC has he highest ceiling of any team, and they seem to be peaking at the right time.

Having said all that, I would LOVE for this to finally be the year Duke meets UNC in the tourney. It would be so sweet to snatch their feeling of destiny away.

weezie
03-13-2016, 12:17 PM
...he did not have that get up on.


Thanks Edub. "Get up" makes me laugh.

mattman91
03-13-2016, 12:18 PM
Paige's last two games seems to suggest a "return to form" that bodes poorly for the field. I heard it suggested last week by several talking heads that UNC has he highest ceiling of any team, and they seem to be peaking at the right time.

Having said all that, I would LOVE for this to finally be the year Duke meets UNC in the tourney. It would be so sweet to snatch their feeling of destiny away.

Careful what you wish for, pal.

I don't want to see them until next year when Giles and company obliterate them.

Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15
03-13-2016, 12:20 PM
Careful what you wish for, pal.

I don't want to see them until next year when Giles and company obliterate them.

Well, the possibility of Duke not beating them doesn't occur to me, so of course I want to face them. :)

This is the guy who started the "optimist" thread. Twice.

gumbomoop
03-13-2016, 12:30 PM
I can see wheat 's point about gravy. As a duke fan a successful season includes wins vs unc , acc championships, final 4 and national championship. So turning this around the same would hold for a unc fan. Of course by Thursday the acc championship will be a satisfying memory and the pressure to move on in the NCAA will be in everyone's mind

Either you've misunderstood Wheat's point, or I have. For, I agree with you that "the same would hold for a UNC fan." But I understood Wheat's "gravy" reference to mean that now that UNC is the undisputed ACC champion, any further success in the NCAAT would be very nice -- "gravy" -- but not essential to a great season.

If that's what Wheat meant, and given the very specific circumstances of (1) Duke's 2 recent NCs, (2) the way-too-early look at Duke's roster for 2016-17, and (3) the high likelihood of UNC's forthcoming, serious punishment, then I'm certain Wheat does not reflect the anxiety in Heeldom. They should be confident, but anything less than the FF, and probably anything less than the NC, will not suffice.

There's a separate discussion about whether for either Duke or UNC fans a "successful" season, year by year, must include an appearance in the FF, much less winning the NC. I think most on EK do not judge our team a failure when we do not win the NC, though, admittedly, disappointment leads to a few bitter posts. At any rate, at this specific [1,2,3 in above paragraph] moment, anything less than playing in, and probably winning, the NC game will be seen as failure by most Heel fanatics.

Wheat/"/"/"
03-13-2016, 01:05 PM
Indisputably undisputed.

Because I saw only parts of last night's game, I have no idea whether it was Heels' defense that harassed Brogdan and Perrantes into a combined 9 for 36, but if yes, that must have been outstanding D, especially since the Hoos shot only 3 FTs the whole game. If no, then one would have to say that the result would have been different had Brogdan and Perrantes not been way off at the same time. As I say, those of you who saw the game from start to finish could obviously comment, including our several very good Wahoo posters.

I continue to be surprised that Hicks doesn't take more minutes from Meeks. The Heels look a better team when Hicks is in there. That Hicks has accepted his limited role presumably reflects well on team chemistry.

Balance, versatility, and depth are big, big pluses. So if they do actually have the mental toughness to play excellent D every game in the NCAAT, they would be among the co-favorites [I guess in this "open" year that means 8 teams, the 1 and 2 seeds] to get to the Final Four.

One major disagreement, if you don't mind: "gravy"? This isn't remotely persuasive, to put it as mildly and as kindly as I can muster. No one knows what the penalty will be for the athletic-academic scandal. Perhaps there will be no penalty whatsoever, though I'm skeptical many Heel fans actually believe that. Given the fact that the 2005 and 2009 banners are not totally safe, and more important that Duke has won 2 NCs after 2009, for Heel fans a whole lot -- this is a massive understatement -- is riding on this March Madness.

So I have to imagine you may be unique in Heeldom in thinking it's all gravy from here on out.

The defense was very good from both teams last night. Final four quality.

One stat I saw that is telling was that in the second half's of the tourney games, UNC held Pitt, ND, and UVA to a combined 33.7% fg % on 29-86 shooting. That's stifling defense in crunch time.

I wouldn't call Hick's role "limited". He is an energy guy who is comfortable coming off the bench. His minutes only get reduced when he picks up cheap fouls, which he has a bad habit of...

What makes this team so dangerous in the tourney is they can adapt to any style and still impose their will when they play well. Match ups are always key in college games, and the Heels should be able to match up well with anyone.
They have the ability to play big and post strong with Johnson, Meeks, James, and Hicks in the half court setting against that sort of team, along with the ability to go small and quicker with Jackson, Pinson, Britt, Paige, Berry and even Williams against teams that are smaller...all the while maintaining defensive intensity on the ball all game with fresh players that are not just out there, it's quality depth. Hicks, Britt, Pinson could start on many high division 1 teams from the bench. They are pressuring the other team and wearing them down all game. Not many teams have the depth of talent to withstand that pressure...assuming the Heels keep it up, I like their chances to win it all.

I'm a basketball junkie, not a alumni, not an apologist. I like to watch college kids and coaches play out the games on the court. All the rest is beaurocratic crap in my book and somebody else can decide what's right and just and that's fine with me.

The NCAA can do it...it's going to get resolved, to no-ones satisfaction. Hopefully soon, just as Roy Williams has been pleading.

Roy has consistently said the basketball program was not involved and had nothing to do with the classes in question. I've seen nothing to suggest he knew that at some point it appears "easy" classes crossed the line into "fraudulent" classes by someone's definition and that anyone in the basketball program pushed to make that happen or was aware of those classes crossing a line that is not so clear in the first place.

I look at the basketball program and the academic sides separately. Bottom line for me is that those responsible for maintaining the academic integrity at the University seem to have failed, and the University will rightfully be punished for that failure.

If that punishment trickles down to the basketball program as part of the University punishment as a whole, so be it. But I won't blame the basketball program for those classes. That responsibility goes to those whose job it was to oversee academics.

I'm just going to focus on watching good basketball and let it all play out...I have no say in anything.

Wheat/"/"/"
03-13-2016, 01:23 PM
Either you've misunderstood Wheat's point, or I have. For, I agree with you that "the same would hold for a UNC fan." But I understood Wheat's "gravy" reference to mean that now that UNC is the undisputed ACC champion, any further success in the NCAAT would be very nice -- "gravy" -- but not essential to a great season.

If that's what Wheat meant, and given the very specific circumstances of (1) Duke's 2 recent NCs, (2) the way-too-early look at Duke's roster for 2016-17, and (3) the high likelihood of UNC's forthcoming, serious punishment, then I'm certain Wheat does not reflect the anxiety in Heeldom. They should be confident, but anything less than the FF, and probably anything less than the NC, will not suffice.

There's a separate discussion about whether for either Duke or UNC fans a "successful" season, year by year, must include an appearance in the FF, much less winning the NC. I think most on EK do not judge our team a failure when we do not win the NC, though, admittedly, disappointment leads to a few bitter posts. At any rate, at this specific [1,2,3 in above paragraph] moment, anything less than playing in, and probably winning, the NC game will be seen as failure by most Heel fanatics.

I think I can qualify as a Heel fanatic, and I look at this season as already successful. I think the team looks at it that way as well and can go forward with confidence now, that's why I said the rest is gravy...

Of course they want to do even better and there would be disappointment in any loss, but the tourney is a crap shoot and teams know it. Going in with quiet confidence can be big...and that's how I see this team now.

Fans from all schools are usually a little unrealistic, I try not to be.

Wheat/"/"/"
03-13-2016, 01:40 PM
Paige played excellent and uncharacteristic defense on Brogdon yesterday. He got him out of his comfort zone and really stuck on him hard. Impressive. As someone on record as liking Paige as a person and as a player, I was really impressed

Congrats to UNC who is finally living up to preseason predictions. Hope we somehow go further than them in the Big Dance.

Roy has said that Paige has been one of the top five defensive points he has ever coached.

Troublemaker
03-13-2016, 02:10 PM
I think I can qualify as a Heel fanatic, and I look at this season as already successful. I think the team looks at it that way as well and can go forward with confidence now, that's why I said the rest is gravy...

Of course they want to do even better and there would be disappointment in any loss, but the tourney is a crap shoot and teams know it. Going in with quiet confidence can be big...and that's how I see this team now.

Fans from all schools are usually a little unrealistic, I try not to be.

Wheat, I think seniors Paige and Johnson desperately want at least a Final Four under their belt.

Your perspective is probably the healthy one, but I just don't believe your players hold it. They're going to be bitterly disappointed if they don't at least make a Final Four.

dukelifer
03-13-2016, 02:30 PM
Wheat, I think seniors Paige and Johnson desperately want at least a Final Four under their belt.

Your perspective is probably the healthy one, but I just don't believe your players hold it. They're going to be bitterly disappointed if they don't at least make a Final Four.

The majority of UNC fans will be disappointed. Of course if they don't do it- it must be something Roy did to screw it up. Roy must be the least appreciated two time National Champion, HOF coach by his own fan base.

MarkD83
03-13-2016, 03:04 PM
Wheat, I think seniors Paige and Johnson desperately want at least a Final Four under their belt.

Your perspective is probably the healthy one, but I just don't believe your players hold it. They're going to be bitterly disappointed if they don't at least make a Final Four.

I think Marshall Grayson Matt Amile desperately want a national championship. Oh wait they have one .... Never mind

gumbomoop
03-13-2016, 03:15 PM
I think I can qualify as a Heel fanatic, and I look at this season as already successful. I think the team looks at it that way as well and can go forward with confidence now, that's why I said the rest is gravy...

Of course they want to do even better and there would be disappointment in any loss, but the tourney is a crap shoot and teams know it. Going in with quiet confidence can be big...and that's how I see this team now.

Fans from all schools are usually a little unrealistic, I try not to be.

Briefly, let me first say that in my responses to your post on the UNC-UVa game, I am not trying to engage in a discussion about Roy's responsibility re the scandal, nor what should or will be any penalties. I only mention the scandal because of the effect that worrying about such penalties has on the intense emotions of fanatics.

I concede you are a fanatic, as am I. But my point is that you are surely among a very small minority of Heel fanatics in thinking "the rest is gravy." The specific circumstances [1,2,3 in my earlier post] make this NCAAT unusualy tension-filled for Heel fanatics, by which I mean fans, not players. Ok, fair enough, not for you.

In a weird way, it's [what I see as] the overwhelming majority of Heel fanatics who are being realistic rather than unrealistic. That is, when you have a strong team that is confident and might well be peaking, when you think your team probably won't be nearly this good in the near future, when you acknowledge, realistically, that your team might be banned from the tourney for a couple of years, well, that's likely to lead most Heel fanatics to disagree that "the rest is gravy."

DUKIE V(A)
03-13-2016, 03:33 PM
UNC won the ACC tournament with great team defense, terrific shooting by Berry, the reemergence of Paige, and the steady excellence of Johnson. I hated every second of it but confess it was well-earned.

Anything short of a National Championship will be a bitter disappointment to most all Tarheel fans. They have the depth and senior leadership to do it. Plus, the boom is about to get lowered by Duke and perhaps the NCAA. This could be their last good chance for a decade.

77devil
03-13-2016, 03:40 PM
Roy has consistently said the basketball program was not involved and had nothing to do with the classes in question. I've seen nothing to suggest he knew that at some point it appears "easy" classes crossed the line into "fraudulent" classes by someone's definition and that anyone in the basketball program pushed to make that happen or was aware of those classes crossing a line that is not so clear in the first place.

I look at the basketball program and the academic sides separately. Bottom line for me is that those responsible for maintaining the academic integrity at the University seem to have failed, and the University will rightfully be punished for that failure.

If that punishment trickles down to the basketball program as part of the University punishment as a whole, so be it. But I won't blame the basketball program for those classes. That responsibility goes to those whose job it was to oversee academics.


What you and your fellow Heel fanatics fail to acknowledge is all the evidence that contradicts Roy's protestations. There is a long paper trail that UNC basketball under Dean Smith started recruiting many more special admits in the late 80's while feeling the heat of the resurgent Duke program. The fake class scheme was created to keep these unprepared student athletes eligible to play basketball. Over time it became systemic.

Trying to separate basketball from academics is a convenient form of denial. In essence your saying the academic cheating by basketball players was ok. It's particularly ironic that you don't blame basketball when basketball was the genesis of the scandal.

cspan37421
03-13-2016, 04:21 PM
If that punishment trickles down to the basketball program as part of the University punishment as a whole, so be it. But I won't blame the basketball program for those classes. That responsibility goes to those whose job it was to oversee academics.


Sounds like you're saying that basketball, and athletics in general, can push the envelope as far as they want, even to the point of a fraud of unprecedented proportions, and that's OK, because it's the job of the academic side to keep them in check?

"If you don't catch me, it's not cheating" - is that the guiding principle you're endorsing?

Hey, it's your right to feel however you want about it. I can tell you that if the same thing happened at Duke, I would not feel the same way - not at all. And I wouldn't care for Duke fans who felt like you apparently do.

Wheat/"/"/"
03-13-2016, 04:54 PM
Briefly, let me first say that in my responses to your post on the UNC-UVa game, I am not trying to engage in a discussion about Roy's responsibility re the scandal, nor what should or will be any penalties. I only mention the scandal because of the effect that worrying about such penalties has on the intense emotions of fanatics.

I concede you are a fanatic, as am I. But my point is that you are surely among a very small minority of Heel fanatics in thinking "the rest is gravy." The specific circumstances [1,2,3 in my earlier post] make this NCAAT unusualy tension-filled for Heel fanatics, by which I mean fans, not players. Ok, fair enough, not for you.

In a weird way, it's [what I see as] the overwhelming majority of Heel fanatics who are being realistic rather than unrealistic. That is, when you have a strong team that is confident and might well be peaking, when you think your team probably won't be nearly this good in the near future, when you acknowledge, realistically, that your team might be banned from the tourney for a couple of years, well, that's likely to lead most Heel fanatics to disagree that "the rest is gravy."

Don't get me wrong, the team and fans definitely want to see at least a final four and will be disappointed with anything less. What I'm trying to say is with the conference titles and some hard earned respect under their belts, they will go into the dance more relaxed and without having to answer all the critics of the teams play and can focus more on their play. The tourney road got easier with those ACC title run wins.

I think UNC is going to be very good in the future. Next year in the front court they probably return Meeks, Hicks and I believe Jackson will return,(he needs to work on his shooting and strength). They'll also add Florida Mr. Basketball Tony Bradley, 6'9 230lbs and college ready to play as well inside.

They will have Berry, Britt, Pinson and Kenny Williams in the backcourt and add ultra quick Seventh Woods, and lanky shooter Brandon Robinson who could both make an impact as freshman, ...we'll see.

It will again be a team with good balance and depth. It's not looking as strong overall a team as this year, but they will be good.

Wheat/"/"/"
03-13-2016, 05:08 PM
Sounds like you're saying that basketball, and athletics in general, can push the envelope as far as they want, even to the point of a fraud of unprecedented proportions, and that's OK, because it's the job of the academic side to keep them in check?

"If you don't catch me, it's not cheating" - is that the guiding principle you're endorsing?

Hey, it's your right to feel however you want about it. I can tell you that if the same thing happened at Duke, I would not feel the same way - not at all. And I wouldn't care for Duke fans who felt like you apparently do.

I'll get into a civil conversation here after the NCAA rules and further my thoughts on all this. For now, I just want to watch some kids play hoops.

I've already said more than I should have on the matter, if I continue any replies it just gets too overwhelming to respond, you guys are like wolves fighting over a carcus to get in line at me over this. :)

I'm going to try and stay in self imposed time out on the class issues until the NCAA rules on what the heck went on.

allenmurray
03-13-2016, 06:53 PM
I've already said more than I should have on the matter, if I continue any replies it just gets too overwhelming to respond, you guys are like wolves fighting over a carcus to get in line at me over this. :)

I'm going to try and stay in self imposed time out on the class issues until the NCAA rules on what the heck went on.

Comes to a Duke board and complains about how he is treated by Duke fans. Hmmm

Doria
03-13-2016, 07:01 PM
I've already said more than I should have on the matter, if I continue any replies it just gets too overwhelming to respond, you guys are like wolves fighting over a carcus to get in line at me over this. :)

How dare you compare us to State?! (Kidding...)

TruBlu
03-13-2016, 07:14 PM
I'll get into a civil conversation here after the NCAA rules and further my thoughts on all this. For now, I just want to watch some kids play hoops.

I've already said more than I should have on the matter, if I continue any replies it just gets too overwhelming to respond, you guys are like wolves fighting over a carcus to get in line at me over this. :)

I'm going to try and stay in self imposed time out on the class issues until the NCAA rules on what the heck went on.

If unc gets what they deserve for their years of cheating, a carcass is all that should remain of their athletic programs. But even wolves would turn their noses up due to that rotten stench.

Dr. Rosenrosen
03-13-2016, 07:14 PM
Comes to a Duke board and gloats and slips in a dig on K not playing his bench and complains about how he is treated by Duke fans. Hmmm
Fixed it for you...

Wheat/"/"/"
03-13-2016, 07:18 PM
Comes to a Duke board and complains about how he is treated by Duke fans. Hmmm

Complains? I am happy to set some of you straight when necessary.

I just don't have the time or willpower to keep up with multiple questions at a time.

Wheat/"/"/"
03-13-2016, 07:20 PM
Fixed it for you...

Really? That's how you read my comment?

You are way too sensitive on that subject....

DUKIE V(A)
03-13-2016, 08:01 PM
Really? That's how you read my comment?

You are way too sensitive on that subject...

Roy made a great move shortening his bench in Cameron or he and the Heels would have lost. I think he gets a bit generous with his playing time in critical games and it hurts more than it helps.

Dr. Rosenrosen
03-13-2016, 09:24 PM
Really? That's how you read my comment?

You are way too sensitive on that subject...
You went out of your way to talk about your bench players appreciating knowing they are going to get to play. What was the point of that comment on a Duke board other than to try to turn the screws just a little on the question of duke's bench depth and K's management of rotation.

Wheat/"/"/"
03-13-2016, 11:33 PM
You went out of your way to talk about your bench players appreciating knowing they are going to get to play. What was the point of that comment on a Duke board other than to try to turn the screws just a little on the question of duke's bench depth and K's management of rotation.

Thinned skinned much?

Roy is often critiqued for subbing too much. Not just here, but by UNC fans too. I often defend his coaching to the biased and uninformed. Noting the players, deep in the bench, probably like the opportunity to play was an offhand comment about UNC's bench. That comment had nothing to do with Coach K, Duke players or anything else Duke related. I was talking Roy and UNC.

People love to further weak narratives that fit their opinions...like Roy can't coach defense or subs too much. I challenge those statements because I believe them to be weak. I was simply pointing out that subbing is one of the traits I like about how Roy coaches UNC and how his use of his bench makes them versatile, balanced and keeps them fresh.

Oh, and another plus is I get to see players progress from game to game when, unfortunately, I'm not invited to watch practice. I like that as a fan.

We can have the discussion of how coach K uses his bench, if you like, but you have issues if you think there was anything more than that in my comment.

wavedukefan70s
03-13-2016, 11:43 PM
Thinned skinned much?

Roy is often critiqued for subbing too much. Not just here, but by UNC fans too. I often defend his coaching to the biased and uninformed. Noting the players, deep in the bench, probably like the opportunity to play was an offhand comment about UNC's bench. That comment had nothing to do with Coach K, Duke players or anything else Duke related. I was talking Roy and UNC.

People love to further weak narratives that fit their opinions...like Roy can't coach defense or subs too much. I challenge those statements because I believe them to be weak. I was simply pointing out that subbing is one of the traits I like about how Roy coaches UNC and how his use of his bench makes them versatile, balanced and keeps them fresh.

Oh, and another plus is I get to see players progress from game to game when, unfortunately, I'm not invited to watch practice. I like that as a fan.

We can have the discussion of how coach K uses his bench, if you like, but you have issues if you think there was anything more than that in my comment.
I have a question for you.its a bit off topic.
Unc player or not.why in the world is brice johnson only staged at about 30 in a few mock drafts?i think he is undervalued and atleast a top 20 player,maybe top 15.wouldn't you agree?

Wheat/"/"/"
03-13-2016, 11:56 PM
I have a question for you.its a bit off topic.
Unc player or not.why in the world is brice johnson only staged at about 30 in a few mock drafts?i think he is undervalued and atleast a top 20 player,maybe top 15.wouldn't you agree?

Not really sure either, is my bad answer.

There have been questions about his intensity in the past, which he seems to have cured, and he hasn't shown a great ability to put the ball on the floor either, which most NBA bigs can do with at least a bit of success.

He also hasn't shown a great feel for one on one defense, which I think concerns them most.

That said, if he falls below 20, I'll be surprised. I'd bet there are some teams quietly hoping to get a shot at him for a bargain price and are keeping quiet on his perceived value.

He is fundamentally sound, has good size and length and can score with touch. That has great value in the NBA these days.

oldnavy
03-14-2016, 06:40 AM
Heels=Undisputed 2016 ACC Champions.

Well played by UVa. Nobody can say the Heels didn't earn it against a very good team.

Lots of anti UNC, biased narratives, bit the dust in this game. Looking forward to how Newton 14 and Kedsey spin this...should be entertaining.

About the game...

I enjoy watching Roy Williams coach. 1st, his teams win. He's also tactical, emotional, and he knows his players. He freely subs and he develops a deep bench, working all his players on multiple situations and lineups during season and in practice, and is not afraid to put anyone in and demand they produce. He did it all season to the cries of many who loved second guessing him, but they got better, while the team still won most games.

Tonight he showed confidence in his bench again. He brought in Kenny Williams and Joel James and they played well. He had them ready to play in a big game like the ACC championship for the situation that fit their skills and what the team needed at the time.
The players have to love that and know if they can contribute, he will call on them when he needs them.
How about him having the confidence to bring in freshman Kenny Williams for some key minutes? And getting some big minutes from Joel James when they needed some strength inside.

Balance, versatility and depth define this team. Add mental toughness now too.

And the team is buying into Roy's leadership. They are unselfish and seem to finally understand how to play with a "sense of urgency" for the entire 40 minutes that he harped on so much early in the season.

Defense. Good defense. The Heels are playing it and Roy can coach it. No sense in denying it.

They've had a great season, they are champions and earned it. The NCAA tourney is now gravy and they should enter it confident,focused and intense.

Just to be clear, when UNC plays without emotion or intensity, you put that back on the players and give Roy a pass, usually by saying something like "shouldn't have to coach effort..." but when they do come out and play hard then that is due to Roy's coaching and prep??

I'll give UNC credit, they are playing VERY well of late. But if you are going to give Roy the credit for their inspired play, doesn't he deserve the blame for when they are not inspired?

Dr. Rosenrosen
03-14-2016, 07:00 AM
Thinned skinned much?

Roy is often critiqued for subbing too much. Not just here, but by UNC fans too. I often defend his coaching to the biased and uninformed. Noting the players, deep in the bench, probably like the opportunity to play was an offhand comment about UNC's bench. That comment had nothing to do with Coach K, Duke players or anything else Duke related. I was talking Roy and UNC.

People love to further weak narratives that fit their opinions...like Roy can't coach defense or subs too much. I challenge those statements because I believe them to be weak. I was simply pointing out that subbing is one of the traits I like about how Roy coaches UNC and how his use of his bench makes them versatile, balanced and keeps them fresh.

Oh, and another plus is I get to see players progress from game to game when, unfortunately, I'm not invited to watch practice. I like that as a fan.

We can have the discussion of how coach K uses his bench, if you like, but you have issues if you think there was anything more than that in my comment.
The fact that you even mention thickness of skin tells me all I need to know about your motives, subtle though they may be. Okay, moving along now.

Dr. Rosenrosen
03-14-2016, 07:01 AM
Just to be clear, when UNC plays without emotion or intensity, you put that back on the players and give Roy a pass, usually by saying something like "shouldn't have to coach effort..." but when they do come out and play hard then that is due to Roy's coaching and prep??

I'll give UNC credit, they are playing VERY well of late. But if you are going to give Roy the credit for their inspired play, doesn't he deserve the blame for when they are not inspired?Whatever fits the narrative...

Indoor66
03-14-2016, 09:01 AM
Whatever fits the narrative...

To seem rather than be: The unCheat way.

Wheat/"/"/"
03-14-2016, 09:32 AM
Just to be clear, when UNC plays without emotion or intensity, you put that back on the players and give Roy a pass, usually by saying something like "shouldn't have to coach effort..." but when they do come out and play hard then that is due to Roy's coaching and prep??

I'll give UNC credit, they are playing VERY well of late. But if you are going to give Roy the credit for their inspired play, doesn't he deserve the blame for when they are not inspired?

Here's exactly what I said...

"Tonight he showed confidence in his bench again. He brought in Kenny Williams and Joel James and they played well. He had them ready to play in a big game like the ACC championship for the situation that fit their skills and what the team needed at the time."

Where do you see any reference to their intensity level?

We were talking about going deep in the bench, and fitting a need in a situation.
My point was he had played bench players throughout the season, had them familiar with their role, and had given them the experience during the season...he had them ready...to contribute in a big game.

I like the puzzle approach Roy uses with his players to find the right fit to win games. The team changes with the opponent. Keeps it interesting for me. That's all I've been trying to say.

Players bring intensity, or should. Coaches can coach intensity, but shouldn't have to. That's my thought on intensity.

oldnavy
03-14-2016, 12:36 PM
Here's exactly what I said...

"Tonight he showed confidence in his bench again. He brought in Kenny Williams and Joel James and they played well. He had them ready to play in a big game like the ACC championship for the situation that fit their skills and what the team needed at the time."

Where do you see any reference to their intensity level?

We were talking about going deep in the bench, and fitting a need in a situation.
My point was he had played bench players throughout the season, had them familiar with their role, and had given them the experience during the season...he had them ready...to contribute in a big game.

I like the puzzle approach Roy uses with his players to find the right fit to win games. The team changes with the opponent. Keeps it interesting for me. That's all I've been trying to say.

Players bring intensity, or should. Coaches can coach intensity, but shouldn't have to. That's my thought on intensity.

Except, you have consistently deflected blame off Roy when the players didn't play with intensity... now that they are playing with intensity it is because Roy has put the puzzle pieces together? Are you willing to blame Roy when the pieces don't fit together and the play is lacking?

That's all I'm looking for, consistency. If Roy is to be praised for puzzle solving, then he is to be held accountable for when the pieces don't fit... why can't you agree with that?

Wheat/"/"/"
03-14-2016, 12:52 PM
Except, you have consistently deflected blame off Roy when the players didn't play with intensity... now that they are playing with intensity it is because Roy has put the puzzle pieces together? Are you willing to blame Roy when the pieces don't fit together and the play is lacking?

That's all I'm looking for, consistency. If Roy is to be praised for puzzle solving, then he is to be held accountable for when the pieces don't fit... why can't you agree with that?

Yes, they are now playing with better intensity. And if they play with intensity and lose, we can all blame Roy's decisions.

I don't give Roy credit for that increase in intensity, other than him keeping it in the forefront and harping about it constantly...more like Joel Berry, Paige and now even Justin Jackson deserve the credit for taking it up a level...or two.

Roy is just putting the right players skill sets out there for UNC to have the advantage and, keeping them prepared to produce against those matchups. The players are bringing the intensity.

oldnavy
03-14-2016, 01:07 PM
Yes, they are now playing with better intensity. And if they play with intensity and lose, we can all blame Roy's decisions.I don't give Roy credit for that increase in intensity, other than him keeping it in the forefront and harping about it constantly...more like Joel Berry, Paige and now even Justin Jackson deserve the credit for taking it up a level...or two.

Roy is just putting the right players skill sets out there for UNC to have the advantage and, keeping them prepared to produce against those matchups. The players are bringing the intensity.

Not necessarily. They could play with crazy intensity and Roy's game plan could be flawless and still lose.

Sometimes the shots just ain't falling and it's not really anybody's fault. But if UNC has Paige and Berry jacking up 20 footers that aren't falling and Brice isn't getting the ball... well that is a different scenario completely.

I will go as far as to say that Roy has being doing a fine job this season, especially here towards the end. UNC is playing crazy good, and I think that if they can continue playing like this they will probably cut down the nets.... that hurts me to say that, but it is a fair assessment I think.

Now, having said that, I will also say that I would not be surprised to see Roy mismanage a game in this tourney either by subbing or not subbing, or by standing by and watching his team get off the rails without calling a time out. It has happened many times in the past and I hope that it happens this year as well...