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TerpsInACC
11-21-2015, 04:17 PM
I am sure you heard that Northern Iowa beat North Carolina 71 to 67 today. Down goes the #1 ranked team. Around 11/25, I will start asking for heavy advice on how my Terps can beat UNC from the most knowledgeable fans in the country - Duke. Thank you and have a good weekend.

CDu
11-21-2015, 04:21 PM
Helps that UNC doesn't have their PG and best player right now. Maryland has the talent to beat UNC, especially with them not having Paige.

Still, fun to see them lose and I hope the Terps can give them another loss.

dukelion
11-21-2015, 04:25 PM
Not terribly surprised.

I'll give UNC credit for playing a true road game in a very hostile atmosphere this early in the season but this is largely the same team that lost 12 games last year and who also lost their best perimeter defender and best athlete in Tokoto.

It's a concerning loss because of the repeated major defensive breakdowns for a veteran team....some were just down right comical.

Still going to be a solid team but you have to wonder if this group just won't improve enough to compete for a national championship.

wilko
11-21-2015, 04:25 PM
Ride Sheed.
He will teach your team you how to take it to the Heels...

Seriously - bury those guys.
Only 2 things UNC should ever be good at : Women's Soccer and Losing.

CDu
11-21-2015, 04:27 PM
Not terribly surprised.

I'll give UNC credit for playing a true road game in a very hostile atmosphere this early in the season but this is largely the same team that lost 12 games last year and who also lost their best perimeter defender and best athlete in Tokoto.

It's a concerning loss because of the repeated major defensive breakdowns for a veteran team...some were just down right comical.

Still going to be a solid team but you have to wonder if this group just won't improve enough to compete for a national championship.

Well, they will improve a lot in a few weeks. The team that played today is roughly the same 12-loss team from last year... minus Tokoto AND Paige. Getting Paige back will make a big difference.

Skitzle
11-21-2015, 04:33 PM
Well, they will improve a lot in a few weeks. The team that played today is roughly the same 12-loss team from last year... minus Tokoto AND Paige. Getting Paige back will make a big difference.

I'm on extreme tape delay, but just watched the Kentucky game earlier today. Let me tell you this loss takes the sting off the UK loss!!! Haha uni. Man got to love schadenfreude!

77devil
11-21-2015, 04:34 PM
Jackson lived up to his billing today(and then some) but that was about it. Meeks disappeared for a large part of the game, and the very poor guard play reinforced how dependent on Paige the Heel are. NIU was able to dribble drive through UNC all day.

CDu
11-21-2015, 04:34 PM
I'm on extreme tape delay, but just watched the Kentucky game earlier today. Let me tell you this loss takes the sting off the UK loss!!! Haha uni. Man got to love schadenfreude!

Absolutely! A UNC bball loss is always agood day!

brevity
11-21-2015, 04:39 PM
Carolina Meltdown (https://twitter.com/ICMeltdown/status/668175572787441667?lang=en) ‏@ICMeltdown

Since @hbarnes skyped to #UNC, Tar Heels are 3-10 to Duke & have lost to Iowa, Iowa St & N. Iowa #TheCurseOfTheBlackFalcon

1:14 PM - 21 Nov 2015

dukelifer
11-21-2015, 04:41 PM
Absolutely! A UNC bball loss is always agood day!

In the grand scheme of things - probably a loss that helps UNC. Easy to explain away and gives them more motivation moving forward. But to make the fan base nervous - an early loss helps.

Indoor66
11-21-2015, 04:46 PM
Ride Sheed.
He will teach your team you how to take it to the Heels...

Seriously - bury those guys.
Only 2 things UNC should ever be good at : Women's Soccer and Losing.

...And they cheat at women's soccer!

Indoor66
11-21-2015, 04:51 PM
Well, they will improve a lot in a few weeks. The team that played today is roughly the same 12-loss team from last year... minus Tokoto AND Paige. Getting Paige back will make a big difference.

And they are not too happy over at the sewer called inside carowina:



izeCB1 (http://mbd.scout.com/mb.aspx?s=78&up=izeCB1)
All-American
Rating: 0.0/5 this site
1261 posts this site

Posted: Today 4:20 PM

Re: This was expected ....This is always expected now. We are Carolina basketball. The past few years we are known for 3 things. Missing on big recruits, losing to over matched teams, and being way over hyped to begin the year. It's who are now. Get used to it like some already are.

Wahoo2000
11-21-2015, 04:55 PM
Bad week for the top 6.

UNC & UVa both had road losses to inferior teams
Md looked awful vs Rider at home (but squeaked)
Duke looked shaky vs KY and took a while to sort out VCU
Kansas collapsed vs MSU (something I know too much about...)
KY wasn't sharp yesterday

Kentucky definitely had the best week, but overall - those who said parity would reign supreme this year and that entering the season there didn't seem to be any truly "elite" teams...... well, looks about right.

Skitzle
11-21-2015, 04:58 PM
Bad week for the top 6.

UNC & UVa both had road losses to inferior teams
Md looked awful vs Rider at home (but squeaked)
Duke looked shaky vs KY and took a while to sort out VCU
Kansas collapsed vs MSU (something I know too much about...)
KY wasn't sharp yesterday

Kentucky definitely had the best week, but overall - those who said parity would reign supreme this year and that entering the season there didn't seem to be any truly "elite" teams... well, looks about right.

It's the kind of year where a Melo/Anthony Davis/Ben Simmons like single player cam get you a national championship. I'm all in.

If not Duke in 2016 I'm all for LSimmonsU

Olympic Fan
11-21-2015, 05:21 PM
I'm as negative about UNC as anybody on this board (not talking hatred, although I'm up there, but my consistent insistence that they are not a top 10 team this year).

Having said that, I don't think this is a terrible loss for them -- on the road against a quality mid-major and without Paige. It's not so very different than Virginia's loss to George Washington -- except the Cavs were at full strength.

They had some good news in that Jackson finally stepped up and played at an all-star level after two very weak performances.

The bad news is that their multitude of big men weren't very effective against a much smaller team ... and Nate Britt stopped being the player Wheat thinks he is (and he was for two games this season) and reverted to the player we think he is.

BD80
11-21-2015, 05:26 PM
I keep reading that ol' roy was "continuing" the tradition of scheduling away games so seniors can play a game near their hometown. This one was for the injured Paige.

Did carolina have this tradition before Coach K started doing it?

Will this be the end of the "tradition" at unc?

gurufrisbee
11-21-2015, 05:28 PM
This almost makes me forgive UNI for not nearly doing as well in the tournament as I had them on my bracket. Almost.

Carolina was overrated to begin with.

MChambers
11-21-2015, 05:28 PM
Doesn't this just belong in the This Week in the ACC thread?

jv001
11-21-2015, 05:35 PM
I keep reading that ol' roy was "continuing" the tradition of scheduling away games so seniors can play a game near their hometown. This one was for the injured Paige.

Did carolina have this tradition before Coach K started doing it?

Will this be the end of the "tradition" at unc?

When the NCAA get's through with the uncheats, I hope we no longer see unc bb or unc fb. GoDuke!

weezie
11-21-2015, 05:41 PM
I'm as negative about UNC as anybody on this board (not talking hatred.....

Yes Sir Oly, understood but I'm pointing and laughing. As always, Duke had the class to honorably fight and miss to a semi-recognized team of a sort of kinda sometimes meehhh ugh barf peer?

eddiehaskell
11-21-2015, 06:23 PM
UNC looked beatable for a large portion of the Wofford game.

77devil
11-21-2015, 06:28 PM
I'm as negative about UNC as anybody on this board (not talking hatred, although I'm up there, but my consistent insistence that they are not a top 10 team this year).


It's a mystery how a 12 loss team that losses one of its best defenders and adds no meaningful talent improve to #1 because everyone is one year older. Even with a healthy Paige, I doubt UNC will see #1 again this season.

davidson
11-21-2015, 06:46 PM
Carolina Meltdown (https://twitter.com/ICMeltdown/status/668175572787441667?lang=en) ‏@ICMeltdown

Since @hbarnes skyped to #UNC, Tar Heels are 3-10 to Duke & have lost to Iowa, Iowa St & N. Iowa #TheCurseOfTheBlackFalcon

1:14 PM - 21 Nov 2015

It's actually the "Curse of Brian King". UNC was flying high at the time - but it's been nothing but trouble since Roy kicked out him out at the Presbyterian game. Can't remember if it was here or on the Davidson board, but there was at one point a very long list of everything bad that had happened since Brian King was ejected from the Nose Dome.

BlueDevilBrowns
11-21-2015, 07:25 PM
It's a mystery how a 12 loss team that losses one of its best defenders and adds no meaningful talent improve to #1 because everyone is one year older. Even with a healthy Paige, I doubt UNC will see #1 again this season.

They were voted #1, not because of anything they did really, but because UK, Duke, Wisc, and AZ(among others) all lost tons of talent to the NBA and graduation.

UNC was voted #1 by default so this is not a surprising outcome.

kmspeaks
11-21-2015, 07:31 PM
It's the kind of year where a Melo/Anthony Davis/Ben Simmons like single player cam get you a national championship. I'm all in.

If not Duke in 2016 I'm all for LSimmonsU

I don't know, 2006 still stings. Watching JJ walk off the court is the closest I've come to tears over a Duke loss.

Wheat/"/"/"
11-21-2015, 07:41 PM
Brice Johnson got 1 offensive rebound and did not get to the FT line today.
That's about all that needs to be said about his effort inside. Northern Iowa bigs did a great job of blocking him and Meeks out, but they have to be more active and work harder to get their position on the blocks. It looked like they were coasting for much of the game, content to set up where their bigs dictated or settle for jumpers.

This team has the talent to be very, very good...the question is the same as last season and this preseason. Where is the focus and toughness going to come from? Lots of TO's and poor shot selection at crucial times, from everybody-again. Very un-UNC like. Composure has always been a hallmark of a Dean or Roy coached team. Roy continues to struggle getting intensity/focus from this group of players.

Without Paige, nobody has stepped up to lead, in effort or with their play.

Where is an alpha dog besides Paige?

My hope is it becomes Berry, but he had one of the worst games I've seen him play today for the lead PG. he got killed on D time and again and shot horribly and turned it over twice in the late game. Yea, he's only a Sophomore who had lots of injuries last season, and it's early this season...yada, yada...but he's capable of being an elite PG...somebody needs to challenge him in the locker room.

Pinson sometimes shows potential to lead, but was MIA in this one. 0 offensive rebounds, 1 steal, 4 points. He sure didn't lead today.

Britt's game is a facilitator, not a creator. Britt played OK for most of the game, but took a bad 3 pt shot and then got this pocket picked to give them momentum in the second half...as a Jr. He's got to be better than that.

Jackson finally got out of his scoring funk he's had to start the season, and had a good game, but he's an off the ball player. He's not a lead player with the ball, not in his make up.

What they need is some swagger, and I'm not convinced yet there is that personality on the team past Paige.

All in all not a surprising loss. Good game to show them where they have to improve. And it is early.

N. Iowa played well and earned the win at home. They played with solid fundamentals and excellent effort. Give them the credit they deserve.

OldPhiKap
11-21-2015, 08:05 PM
Brice Johnson got 1 offensive rebound and did not get to the FT line today.
That's about all that needs to be said about his effort inside. Northern Iowa bigs did a great job of blocking him and Meeks out, but they have to be more active and work harder to get their position on the blocks. It looked like they were coasting for much of the game, content to set up where their bigs dictated or settle for jumpers.

This team has the talent to be very, very good...the question is the same as last season and this preseason. Where is the focus and toughness going to come from? Lots of TO's and poor shot selection at crucial times, from everybody-again. Very un-UNC like. Composure has always been a hallmark of a Dean or Roy coached team. Roy continues to struggle getting intensity/focus from this group of players.

Without Paige, nobody has stepped up to lead, in effort or with their play.

Where is an alpha dog besides Paige?

My hope is it becomes Berry, but he had one of the worst games I've seen him play today for the lead PG. he got killed on D time and again and shot horribly and turned it over twice in the late game. Yea, he's only a Sophomore who had lots of injuries last season, and it's early this season...yada, yada...but he's capable of being an elite PG...somebody needs to challenge him in the locker room.

Pinson sometimes shows potential to lead, but was MIA in this one. 0 offensive rebounds, 1 steal, 4 points. He sure didn't lead today.

Britt's game is a facilitator, not a creator. Britt played OK for most of the game, but took a bad 3 pt shot and then got this pocket picked to give them momentum in the second half...as a Jr. He's got to be better than that.

Jackson finally got out of his scoring funk he's had to start the season, and had a good game, but he's an off the ball player. He's not a lead player with the ball, not in his make up.

What they need is some swagger, and I'm not convinced yet there is that personality on the team past Paige.

All in all not a surprising loss. Good game to show them where they have to improve. And it is early.

N. Iowa played well and earned the win at home. They played with solid fundamentals and excellent effort. Give them the credit they deserve.

As usual, I agree with your analysis of the players and play. And as usual, we disagree on Roy's responsibility for the performance (or if you agree with me, you elected not to comment on it which is fine).

I'd Roy cannot get players to focus and play with passion, he's not. Doing his job well. That IS coaching.

Having said all of that, Paige is the best player on. The team and, when healthy, is a first-team all-ACC player. UNC will still be very good and, assuming no NCAA ban, a difficult out in March.

timmy c
11-21-2015, 08:12 PM
Loved seeing the passion from the UNI team. They just wanted it more today. Wheat is on target with his comment about missing an alpha dog.

The pick and roll defense was a complete mystery to the heels. It looked like the bigs were not communicating and the guards didn't fight through the screens. On several occasions they gave up easy lay ups. I thought UNC would be an improved squad this year based on the maturity of a veteran squad. However, these are mistakes you would expect freshman to make. The addition of Paige makes this a very different team.

Bottom line is no leadership on the floor. Hmmmm, kinda like having no leadership in the academic/administrative buildings...

Oriole Way
11-21-2015, 08:26 PM
Brice Johnson got 1 offensive rebound and did not get to the FT line today.
That's about all that needs to be said about his effort inside. Northern Iowa bigs did a great job of blocking him and Meeks out, but they have to be more active and work harder to get their position on the blocks. It looked like they were coasting for much of the game, content to set up where their bigs dictated or settle for jumpers.

This team has the talent to be very, very good...the question is the same as last season and this preseason. Where is the focus and toughness going to come from? Lots of TO's and poor shot selection at crucial times, from everybody-again. Very un-UNC like. Composure has always been a hallmark of a Dean or Roy coached team. Roy continues to struggle getting intensity/focus from this group of players.

Without Paige, nobody has stepped up to lead, in effort or with their play.

Where is an alpha dog besides Paige?

My hope is it becomes Berry, but he had one of the worst games I've seen him play today for the lead PG. he got killed on D time and again and shot horribly and turned it over twice in the late game. Yea, he's only a Sophomore who had lots of injuries last season, and it's early this season...yada, yada...but he's capable of being an elite PG...somebody needs to challenge him in the locker room.

Pinson sometimes shows potential to lead, but was MIA in this one. 0 offensive rebounds, 1 steal, 4 points. He sure didn't lead today.

Britt's game is a facilitator, not a creator. Britt played OK for most of the game, but took a bad 3 pt shot and then got this pocket picked to give them momentum in the second half...as a Jr. He's got to be better than that.

Jackson finally got out of his scoring funk he's had to start the season, and had a good game, but he's an off the ball player. He's not a lead player with the ball, not in his make up.

What they need is some swagger, and I'm not convinced yet there is that personality on the team past Paige.

All in all not a surprising loss. Good game to show them where they have to improve. And it is early.

N. Iowa played well and earned the win at home. They played with solid fundamentals and excellent effort. Give them the credit they deserve.

UNC won't win it all because, yet again, they don't have enough perimeter shooting aside from Paige. And yet again, Roy Williams is going to let his team down due to his tactical and motivational deficiencies as an in-game coach. UNC should beat UNI even without Paige. As someone who has followed ACC basketball for a long time, it sure seems that Roy's teams since 2009 tend to lose games as a result of poor effort and playing down to their opponents a lot more than they did prior to that season.

I've always respected your ability to be a fairly objective UNC fan on a Duke board. But I'm interested to see how UNC fans like you will handle it if UNC falls short of their goals this season, and once the NCAA sanctions are handed down which will nuke UNC basketball into oblivion.

Wheat/"/"/"
11-21-2015, 08:27 PM
As usual, I agree with your analysis of the players and play. And as usual, we disagree on Roy's responsibility for the performance (or if you agree with me, you elected not to comment on it which is fine).

I'd Roy cannot get players to focus and play with passion, he's not. Doing his job well. That IS coaching.

Having said all of that, Paige is the best player on. The team and, when healthy, is a first-team all-ACC player. UNC will still be very good and, assuming no NCAA ban, a difficult out in March.

Roy only played his starters together twice...beginning of each half. That's typical from him in the early season. He puts players he knows he needs to prepare, (like Hicks in for Meeks 2nd half in this one), in tight, tough early season situations to have them experienced for later. Seems like it's always good for and early season loss or two...drives the fans crazy...but I get it.

Still, that's no excuse to lose when you should still win.They have to step up or deal with losses like this.

Read Roy's post game press conference...he agrees with you. He's got to be a better coach. He's falling on the sword for this one...blaming himself, didn't have them ready...etc.

That's all coach speak for the public in reality. He will be on their );/ tomorrow at practice, as he should.

A coach shouldn't have to coach effort. Players should take responsibility for that...but that's just my opinion.

OldPhiKap
11-21-2015, 08:31 PM
Roy only played his starters together twice...beginning of each half. That's typical from him in the early season. He puts players he knows he needs to prepare, (like Hicks in for Meeks 2nd half in this one), in tight, tough early season situations to have them experienced for later. Seems like it's always good for and early season loss or two...drives the fans crazy...but I get it.

Still, that's no excuse to lose when you should still win.They have to step up or deal with losses like this.

Read Roy's post game press conference...he agrees with you. He's got to be a better coach. He's falling on the sword for this one...blaming himself, didn't have them ready...etc.

That's all coach speak for the public in reality. He will be on their );/ tomorrow at practice, as he should.

A coach shouldn't have to coach effort. Players should take responsibility for that...but that's just my opinion.

I listened to the whole thing. I know Roy is kidding about jumping off of buildings and all when they lose, but -- wow.

Agree, practice is going to be brutal.

cptnflash
11-21-2015, 08:40 PM
Watching Carolina lose is like skiing powder. No matter how many times you do it, it never gets old.

MarkD83
11-21-2015, 08:40 PM
A coach shouldn't have to coach effort. Players should take responsibility for that.

The interesting thing about this is that as fans we usually talk about the talent level of players but not the "effort" level. Jay Williams mentioned that Marshall and Amile have "energy" as a skill set, which is an interesting perspective.

I have to believe that Paige is an energy guy and plays his best when it is most needed. (Actually 2 years ago weren't his stats for the 2nd half of games better than for his first halves?)

So, on the Duke team I see lots of players that bring the energy; Marshall, Amile, Grayson, Thornton brought some energy vs VCU, even Kennard who is struggling with scoring had a lot of energy plays....

On UNC who are the energy guys? Paige, Brice Johnson......

Wheat/"/"/"
11-21-2015, 08:46 PM
UNC won't win it all because, yet again, they don't have enough perimeter shooting aside from Paige. And yet again, Roy Williams is going to let his team down due to his tactical and motivational deficiencies as an in-game coach. UNC should beat UNI even without Paige. As someone who has follows ACC basketball for a long time, it sure seems that Roy's teams since 2009 tend to lose games as a result of poor effort and playing down to their opponents a lot more than they did prior to that season.

I've always respected your ability to be a fairly objective UNC fan on a Duke board. But I'm interested to see how UNC fans like you will handle it if UNC falls short of their goals this season, and once the NCAA sanctions are handed down which will nuke UNC basketball into oblivion.

I still expect UNC to be a final four team. If not, they will play next year, and the year after, and...personally, I like the journey, more than the destination.

Everybody loves to rag on Roy in a post game loss. But I didn't see the board discussing coach K for a poor coaching decision and lack of adjustment when allowing Allen to continuously drive into the teeth of the KY defense in that loss...point being that coaching is an inexact science. Some things work, some don't. Allen finishes some of those that he normally would, different game. Berry hits a couple of 3's, doesn't turn it over...different game today..and the coach is an afterthought.

Players gotta play.

It's easy to coach in hindsight.

BD80
11-21-2015, 08:47 PM
Roy ...he agrees with you. He's got to be a better coach. He's falling on the sword for this one...blaming himself, didn't have them ready...etc. ...

ol' roy threw himself under the bus?

The summer surgeries must have been successful, he would never have been able to do that last year

Henderson
11-21-2015, 08:53 PM
Meeks disappeared for a large part of the game


So it's Meeks' fault they put the arena so far from the nearest McDonald's?

Wheat/"/"/"
11-21-2015, 08:59 PM
The interesting thing about this is that as fans we usually talk about the talent level of players but not the "effort" level. Jay Williams mentioned that Marshall and Amile have "energy" as a skill set, which is an interesting perspective.

I have to believe that Paige is an energy guy and plays his best when it is most needed. (Actually 2 years ago weren't his stats for the 2nd half of games better than for his first halves?)

So, on the Duke team I see lots of players that bring the energy; Marshall, Amile, Grayson, Thornton brought some energy vs VCU, even Kennard who is struggling with scoring had a lot of energy plays...

On UNC who are the energy guys? Paige, Brice Johnson...

Energy guys= Paige, Pinson.

Energy/intensity is absolutely a talent. Meeks,Hicks, Johnson think they are intense, but they're not. Not even close. Hansbrough was intense.

Marshall is intense. And he gets playing time and makes plays because he's intense. It's not great talent that gets him on the court.

Intensity is a personality thing and I don't think it can be taught...but it can be recruited. K has always looked for Alpha dawgs, Roy has been content to look for talent he can mold to fit a system then expect energy...doesn't always get it.

Take Marshall's energy and combine it with Brice Johnson's talent, and then you'd have an all American player.

norduck
11-21-2015, 09:02 PM
I still expect UNC to be a final four team. If not, they will play next year, and the year after, and...personally, I like the journey, more than the destination.

Everybody loves to rag on Roy in a post game loss. But I didn't see the board discussing coach K for a poor coaching decision and lack of adjustment when allowing Allen to continuously drive into the teeth of the KY defense in that loss...point being that coaching is an inexact science. Some things work, some don't. Allen finishes some of those that he normally would, different game. Berry hits a couple of 3's, doesn't turn it over...different game today..and the coach is an afterthought.

Players gotta play.

It's easy to coach in hindsight.

And I didn't hear Coach K apologizing to his players for his lack of coaching following the Ky loss. Wish you would once post a pre game prediction instead of a post game analysis,excuse for a loss.

Wheat/"/"/"
11-21-2015, 09:12 PM
And I didn't hear Coach K apologizing to his players for his lack of coaching following the Ky loss. Wish you would once post a pre game prediction instead of a post game analysis,excuse for a loss.

Different coaches, different ways to coach and motivate their players. Both are successful hall of farmers.

I have often posted pre game predictions over the years. But I need to see the teams play to have an informed opinion...so I don't predict games against teams I haven't seen play.

By the time ACC play gets here, we will have seen enough of the teams to have some opinions...but don't expect perfection, otherwise you would see me living it up in Vegas.

77devil
11-21-2015, 09:22 PM
A coach shouldn't have to coach effort. Players should take responsibility for that...but that's just my opinion.

During the course of a long, gruelling season, player effort can ebb for all kinds of reasons. Anyone who has played competitive sports at a high level knows and understand this. Coaches who are great motivators get more effort out of their players over the long run. This is a major difference between K and Roy. And in Roy's case, his inability to inspire maximum effort seems to be getting worse.

construe
11-21-2015, 09:35 PM
Don't post much to this thread, but gotta give Wheat props here: he often comes on DBR after a loss and provides a detailed analysis of his team's deficiencies without resorting to excuses ("If only that shot had fallen!", "We wuz robbed by the refs!!", etc). Williams hasn't been a great coach the last few years, but overall he's still well above the regression line of pay rate to win %age (I'm looking at you, Leonard Hamilton!)

Anyway, just want to pay some respect to Wheat for his break-down of a loss that I'm sure would be quite painful if it happened to Duke.

Indoor66
11-21-2015, 09:45 PM
Don't post much to this thread, but gotta give Wheat props here: he often comes on DBR after a loss and provides a detailed analysis of his team's deficiencies without resorting to excuses ("If only that shot had fallen!", "We wuz robbed by the refs!!", etc). Williams hasn't been a great coach the last few years, but overall he's still well above the regression line of pay rate to win %age (I'm looking at you, Leonard Hamilton!)

Anyway, just want to pay some respect to Wheat for his break-down of a loss that I'm sure would be quite painful if it happened to Duke.

Not for my Florida buddie, Wheat /././ :cool:

NYBri
11-21-2015, 09:52 PM
Always a good day when I see Baby Blues on the short end of the score.

9F!!!!

Henderson
11-21-2015, 10:05 PM
During the course of a long, gruelling season, player effort can ebb for all kinds of reasons. Anyone who has played competitive sports at a high level knows and understand this. Coaches who are great motivators get more effort out of their players over the long run. This is a major difference between K and Roy. And in Roy's case, his inability to inspire maximum effort seems to be getting worse.

True and well-put. And it's not even limited to the season. That effort has to continue through the off-season and in pre-season practices. As Bob Knight used to say, it's not the will to win that counts, but the will to work. It may be a recruiting issue or it may be a motivation issue, but it's a coaching issue foremost.

Edouble
11-21-2015, 10:21 PM
And I didn't hear Coach K apologizing to his players for his lack of coaching following the Ky loss. Wish you would once post a pre game prediction instead of a post game analysis,excuse for a loss.

In Wheat's defense, where would he post such a prediction? I'm sure we don't want a pre-game thread for every UNC game, here on the DBR boards.

The only reason this UNC game gets its own post game thread, which I'm not entirely sure it should, is because UNC was ranked #1 and lost.

Tom B.
11-21-2015, 11:02 PM
Poor Roy. Instead of hoarding his timeouts like he's done in the past, today he had the opposite problem. He burned his last timeout with about a minute to go. So when UNC had the ball with under 30 seconds left, down by three, and was completely out of sorts, Roy couldn't stop the game to calm everyone down and reset. Carolina ended up with a long contested three-pointer that missed, got the offensive rebound, then threw the ball away. Game over.

devildeac
11-21-2015, 11:04 PM
Poor Roy. Instead of hoarding his timeouts like he's done in the past, today he had the opposite problem. He burned his last timeout with about a minute to go. So when UNC had the ball with under 30 seconds left, down by three, and was completely out of sorts, Roy couldn't stop the game to calm everyone down and reset. Carolina ended up with a long contested three-pointer that missed, got the offensive rebound, then threw the ball away. Game over.

Heart-breaking:rolleyes:.

5726

Dr. Rosenrosen
11-21-2015, 11:31 PM
Maybe it's hard for them to play with passion and toughness because they know the bomb is about to be dropped. Maybe they've had this problem for a while. Roy sure has.

OldPhiKap
11-21-2015, 11:46 PM
Maybe it's hard for them to play with passion and toughness because they know the bomb is about to be dropped. Maybe they've had this problem for a while. Roy sure has.

Maybe they don't play with passion or toughness because they take after their coach -- they don't give a s#!t about Carolina.

Indoor66
11-22-2015, 07:44 AM
Maybe they don't play with passion or toughness because they take after their coach -- they don't give a s#!t about Carolina.

They are trying to figure out why in the H#@@ they are in college, anyway. No classes, no studies, no fun on the court. Why bother?

TruBlu
11-22-2015, 07:54 AM
They are trying to figure out why in the H#@@ they are in college, anyway. No classes, no studies, no fun on the court. Why bother?

Maybe because better play on the court translates into: 1) better free cars, 2) easier classes, 3) better looking female "tutors" to turn in "their" papers, 4) more lucrative handshakes.

Can you tell that I have very little respect for unc and their "student" athletes?

Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15
11-22-2015, 07:58 AM
Energy guys= Paige, Pinson.

Energy/intensity is absolutely a talent. Meeks,Hicks, Johnson think they are intense, but they're not. Not even close. Hansbrough was intense.

Marshall is intense. And he gets playing time and makes plays because he's intense. It's not great talent that gets him on the court.

Intensity is a personality thing and I don't think it can be taught...but it can be recruited. K has always looked for Alpha dawgs, Roy has been content to look for talent he can mold to fit a system then expect energy...doesn't always get it.

Take Marshall's energy and combine it with Brice Johnson's talent, and then you'd have an all American player.

Did not watch much of the UNC games, but your talk of "energy" guys intrigues me. Duke seems to always have a guy or two who gets pumped and bring everything to the floor even if in limited minutes (think Tyler Thornton). What I see at UNC is a slightly different problem - floor leadership. Lots of moving parts but no cog.

Paige will be back soon - and I think that most posters here would begrudgingly acknkwledge at least respect for Paige. Personally, he's my favorite Heel in about 15 years. When he returns, that void will be a non-issue... until his next injury.

Hate for Paige that his heart and ability seem to far outweigh what his body can take. Would love to see him go out with a stellar senior season. I think five losses sounds about right - yesterday, and four to Duke.

Go Duke!

superdave
11-22-2015, 09:39 AM
Carolina Meltdown (https://twitter.com/ICMeltdown/status/668175572787441667?lang=en) ‏@ICMeltdown

Since @hbarnes skyped to #UNC, Tar Heels are 3-10 to Duke & have lost to Iowa, Iowa St & N. Iowa #TheCurseOfTheBlackFalcon

1:14 PM - 21 Nov 2015

Thanks for sharing this. No one messes with Coach K.

jipops
11-22-2015, 09:57 AM
The N Iowa loss really doesn't mean much at all. The '04-'05 uncheats lost to Santa Clara without Felton.

Papa John
11-22-2015, 10:00 AM
Only 2 things UNC should ever be good at: Women's Soccer and Losing.

I think you mistyped "women's soccer" for "cheating"... ;-)

BD80
11-22-2015, 10:17 AM
I think you mistyped "women's soccer" for "cheating"... ;-)

They're synonyms

flyingdutchdevil
11-22-2015, 10:27 AM
Again, and I've said this many times, but if you are having a bad day, please go to Inside Carolina. They are a wonderful blend of delusional (UNC may go undefeated this year!), self-deprecating (After last night's performance, UNC won't make the tourney...), and creative (they call Calipari 'PayPal Cal', which I think is hilarious). Check out this gem:

What happens now? That's easy.

We win the next few games convincingly. The atmosphere on the board changes back to ' we don't lose another game, [duke] will not make the tournament, the only reason [said recruit] did not come here was because they were paid to go elsewhere, Roy coaches another ten years, paypal Cal off to the NBA, etc.'

Once we lose again, back to 'we may not make the tournament'

Wheat/"/"/"
11-22-2015, 02:25 PM
I should take a quick minute to explain my thoughts when I challenge UNC players on effort/intensity/focus.

I know these kids are trying. It's not like they are slackers, cocky, overconfident etc...

Meeks didn't transform his body without great effort and focus. Johnson hasn't improved into a likely first round draft choice without a ton of hard work and focus. Hicks really wants to become a force.

What is so hard to get some players to understand, and is Roy's challenge, is getting them to grasp in their soul the edge you gain when you are the one to set the pace, take that position, not settle, and force the other guy to react, always push harder than the other guy even when...especially when...you are more talented.

Talent can cause complacency. Without a player realizing it. It's a trap and these guys need to get past it to play at their highest level possible.

OldPhiKap
11-22-2015, 02:37 PM
I should take a quick minute to explain my thoughts when I challenge UNC players on effort/intensity/focus.

I know these kids are trying. It's not like they are slackers, cocky, overconfident etc...

Meeks didn't transform his body without great effort and focus. Johnson hasn't improved into a likely first round draft choice without a ton of hard work and focus. Hicks really wants to become a force.

What is so hard to get some players to understand, and is Roy's challenge, is getting them to grasp in their soul the edge you gain when you are the one to set the pace, take that position, not settle, and force the other guy to react, always push harder than the other guy even when...especially when...you are more talented.

Talent can cause complacency. Without a player realizing it. It's a trap and these guys need to get past it to play at their highest level possible.

We agree in general, and my point is the bolded. This has been a recurring theme for a number of years now in Chapel Hill. But I think you have described the challenge with some big recruits very well.