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View Full Version : MBB: Duke vs. VCU (Nov 20, 7:30 pm, ESPN2) Pre-Game and In-Game Thread



CameronDuke
11-18-2015, 05:32 PM
Time to learn from the Kentucky game and move onto the next game. Duke gets Virginia Commonwealth University (VCU) Friday night at 7:30 pm at Madison Square Garden in New York, New York. VCU lost head coach Shaka Smart to the University of Texas this past offseason. Smart took VCU to the 2011 Final Four and was arguably the most sought after mid major coach in the country the past two off seasons. VCU has been to the NCAA Tournament 7 times since 2007 and 5 times in a row (2007, 2009, 2011, 2012, 2013, 2014, and 2015). The 2007 Duke vs. VCU first round game saw Duke as a 6 seed and VCU as an 11 seed in Buffalo, New York and VCU point guard Eric Maynor hit a game winning shot with under two seconds left to lead VCU over Duke. That VCU team was coached by Anthony Grant who was fired from Alabama last offseason. Interestingly enough, Maynor was a Jeff Capel recruit from when Capel was the head coach at VCU. The two teams met in the semifinals of the 2012 Battle 4 Atlantis as well, with VCU bowing to Duke that night 68-57. VCU's current coach is previous Shaka Smart assistant Will Wade. He spent 2002-2005 at Clemson as a student manager under Oliver Purnell and Larry Shyatt. In 2005-2006, he was a graduate assistant at Clemson and in 2006-2007, Wade was Director of Basketball Operations at Clemson. Tommy Amaker brought Wade to Harvard in 2007 as an assistant coach and also as Amaker's first hire. Wade helped build a Top 25 recruiting class that year and stayed two seasons (2007-2008 and 2008-2009). Wade then went to VCU as an assistant coach under Shaka Smart from 2009-2013. Wade was the head coach at the University of Tennessee-Chatanooga for two seasons (2013-2014 and 2014-2015) and amassed a record of 40-25 there. When Smart was hired by Texas, VCU brought Wade back as their head coach where he is 2-0 this season with home wins thus far over Prairie View A&M and Radford. Wade is just 32 years of age in his third overall head coaching season.

VCU was the home of "havoc" under Smart - all out, baseline to baseline, pressure defense for 40 minutes with lots of substitutions throughout the game. Wade institutes a similar style to "havoc." VCU still plays tough, man to man, pressure defense and loves to trap in the backcourt and force turnovers. They want to play an uptempo, fast paced, transition basketball game. They are spearheaded by their guards (Jr. PG JeQuan Lewis, Jr. SG Doug Brooks, So. PG Jonathan Williams, Sr. SG Korey Billbury, Sr. SG Melvin Johnson, and RS Jr. SG Jordan Burgess). Burgess had an older brother, Bradford Burgess, who also played at VCU and has his jersey retired there now after a stellar career for the Rams. The frontcourt for VCU consists of RS Jr. Mo Alie-Cox, So. Justin Tillman, So. Michael Gilmore, and Jr. Ahmed Hamdy-Mohamed. VCU has good size all around, especially in the backcourt - Brooks is 6-4, 195 lbs, Burgess is 6-5, 225 lbs, Billbury is 6-4, 210 lbs. Down low, Duke has a slight size advantage when Plumlee, Ingram, and Jefferson are on the floor. Cox is 6-7, 250 lbs, Tillman is 6-7, 215 lbs, Gilmore is 6-10, 215 lbs, and Hamdy is 6-9, 230 lbs.

VCU will want to speed this game up and force turnovers. Duke will need to show better ball handling and smarter passing than they did in the Kentucky game as VCU likes to trap and get into passing lanes and force the offense into turnovers and get easy baskets. Duke will need to exercise great effort on the boards again and utilize the slight size advantage they have down low to get some buckets for the front court. This is a good test for Duke early on this season against the defending Atlantic 10 conference tournament champions.

CameronDuke
11-18-2015, 09:30 PM
With Virginia losing 73-68 Monday night in Washington, District of Columbia to George Washington, Syracuse defeating St. Bonaventure last night at home in Syracuse, New York 79-66, and Wake Forest losing 91-82 tonight at home in Winston-Salem, North Carolina to Richmond, Duke will be looking to tie the ACC-Atlantic 10 head to head competition record at 2-2 Friday night when they take on VCU.

Duke95
11-18-2015, 10:08 PM
Saweeet. My flight home lands 45 minutes before tipoff. Win.

whereinthehellami
11-19-2015, 08:39 AM
I'm concerned about three things. First, what the havoc system will do to Duke's ballhandling and passing. Second, the experience that VCU has, especially in the backcourt. And lastly, the athleticism that VCU brings to the table. I thought the KY game was a bit of a layup drill, way too many easy baskets for KY. I hope this game does not go that way.

Duke needs to dribble/pass with a purpose and make VCU play half-court defense. I'd also like to see Duke go zone. This team has size and length but I don't like their athletisicm or agility in a game like this. keep the bigs near the hoop. I hate seeing Plumlee lumbering out to cover a 3 pointer only to have said player blow by him for a layup. It hurts my basketball soul.

CameronDuke
11-19-2015, 09:04 AM
Last time out vs. Radford, VCU started JeQuan Lewis, Melvin Johnson, and Jordan Burgess in the backcourt with Mo Alie-Cox and Justin Tillman in the frontcourt. Assuming they stay with this lineup and Duke starts Allen, Jones, Ingram, Jefferson, and Plumlee, some interesting match ups jump out. I think Jones will start on Johnson - Johnson can get hot from 3 very quickly and Duke needs its lock down defender to close out on him and prevent him from drilling 3s. Hailing from The Bronx, New York, Johnson likely will be fired up for this one, probably playing in front of many friends and family at Madison Square Garden. I think Ingram starts on Burgess. Ingram has the height advantage but Burgess is a bit more bulky. On offense, Ingram needs to try to take Burgess down low for some shots around the rim. Allen likely starts on JeQuan Lewis. Lewis is a jitterbug with the ball - Allen will not have as much speed as Lewis but if he moves his feet and Duke plays good help defense, he can be contained. A zone defense might be in order. Down low, Jefferson starts on Tillman. Tillman is a good rebounder and this will be a good matchup. They will battle it out on the blocks. Plumlee likely starts on Cox. Plumlee has a significant size advantage on Cox. Cox is massive at 6-7, 250 lbs. and likely has a future in the NFL as a tight end. He is chiseled and solid, but Plumlee can use his height advantage to get easy put backs and shots around the rim. Plumlee played great against Kentucky and a similar effort will be important tomorrow to exploit this matchup.

Billy Dat
11-19-2015, 09:51 AM
VCU will want to speed this game up and force turnovers. Duke will need to show better ball handling and smarter passing than they did in the Kentucky game as VCU likes to trap and get into passing lanes and force the offense into turnovers and get easy baskets. Duke will need to exercise great effort on the boards again and utilize the slight size advantage they have down low to get some buckets for the front court. This is a good test for Duke early on this season against the defending Atlantic 10 conference tournament champions.

Thanks for an excellent primer on the Rams.

Based on your scout, we will have to correct some of the issues we had with Kentucky in order to win. Keeping them from scoring in transition will be important, including running off of made baskets and rebounds near the basket. Avoiding backcourt turnovers that lead to transition opportunities will also be key.

I am very curious to see if K makes any starting line-up changes as a result of the Kentucky game. It would be interesting to see Derryck get the start, but it would mean bringing either Grayson or Brandon off the bench. Based on Kentucky, there is justification for either getting a demotion for similar reasons. Both let early frustration take them out of their game. It's easy to say Grayson should have been expected to shake it off better as the 2nd year man but we must also remember that Grayson barely played last year and this spotlight is all new to him.

The last time we played these guys was really a coming out party for Quinn Cook, and we also were able to slay Havoc because Ryan Kelly was able to bring up the ball. In that regard, Ingram could be a real valuable piece as the big guy who can handle. Of course, Ryan was a Senior at that point.

As was said in the Kentucky post-game thread, our halfcourt defense was good so I am not as worried about that. If we can limit transition, we should be ok. Then again, they attempt WAY more 3s than Kentucky - it will be more like the exhibition games and Bryant with better players.

Our offense is a work in progress. Kentucky's D was stout and we had a really hard time getting into stuff, their pressure and the shorter shot clock seemed to combine to keep us from taking good shots for most of the game. I really have no idea what we'll try to do, it's wide open. I do hope we see a Grayson that is closer to what we saw in the first two games then the last game, and Brandon, too.

Any game prediction I make will assume that we can rely on Matt, Amile and Marshall to just be themselves - which gives us a great foundation. They are, hopefully, the known quantities. Everyone else's development is the variable.

It looks to be the only game I will attend in person so I hope the team plays well!

Billy Dat
11-19-2015, 10:09 AM
I am very curious to see if K makes any starting line-up changes as a result of the Kentucky game. It would be interesting to see Derryck get the start, but it would mean bringing either Grayson or Brandon off the bench. Based on Kentucky, there is justification for either getting a demotion for similar reasons. Both let early frustration take them out of their game. It's easy to say Grayson should have been expected to shake it off better as the 2nd year man but we must also remember that Grayson barely played last year and this spotlight is all new to him.


Quoting myself is really fun, but I wrote my post before seeing the updated +/- from the Kentucky game...from that game only...

Plumlee Jefferson Ingram Jones Thornton -5 04:02 -49.6 1
Plumlee Jefferson Jones Allen Thornton -6 09:41 -24.8 2

Yikes, the sample size is small but that certainly doesn't call for swapping Derryck for Grayson or Brandon.

Ima Facultiwyfe
11-19-2015, 10:20 AM
Gonna be fun to see what they've learned this week and what the first adjustment strategy from K is. This is going to be a fascinating year.

Go Devils! We're behind ya ALL the time!
Love, Ima

DukieInBrasil
11-19-2015, 10:29 AM
i was extraordinarily unimpressed by the ballhandling of Thornton and Allen, and somewhat unimpressed with Kennard, in the Kentucky game. I didn't expect much in terms of ballhandling from Jones, and he did ok. Thornton coughed up the ball on multiple occasions on simple handoffs. Allen dribbled it off his thigh at midcourt under mild pressure, when he drove to the basket it seemed he had a good handle on the ball, but had real difficulty recognizing that Kentucky's interior D was not gonna give up what he was looking for.
If Duke's backcourt doesn't improve on their performance from the Kentucky game, i don't see how the team will really win against a high-pressure defense.
I'm hoping that the Fr. were able to get those jitters out of their system and that they'll play at a higher level than against Kentucky. I was impressed by the composure of the upperclassmen, and i hope that the solid presence they provided will continue forward.

CameronDuke
11-19-2015, 10:47 AM
i was extraordinarily unimpressed by the ballhandling of Thornton and Allen, and somewhat unimpressed with Kennard, in the Kentucky game. I didn't expect much in terms of ballhandling from Jones, and he did ok. Thornton coughed up the ball on multiple occasions on simple handoffs. Allen dribbled it off his thigh at midcourt under mild pressure, when he drove to the basket it seemed he had a good handle on the ball, but had real difficulty recognizing that Kentucky's interior D was not gonna give up what he was looking for.
If Duke's backcourt doesn't improve on their performance from the Kentucky game, i don't see how the team will really win against a high-pressure defense.
I'm hoping that the Fr. were able to get those jitters out of their system and that they'll play at a higher level than against Kentucky. I was impressed by the composure of the upperclassmen, and i hope that the solid presence they provided will continue forward.

It is of paramount performance that Duke handle the ball better in this game. 16 turnovers against Kentucky led to a loss and I think that number of turnovers against VCU plays right into their strategy and game plan. Looking at some of VCU's losses in the NCAAT against major competition, teams that have slowed their pressing attack down have found success against them. Teams that have good, solid guard play with minimal turnovers, patience in the backcourt against the press, and good, deliberate offensive sets have won. Trey Burke and Michigan demolished the VCU press in the 2013 NCAAT. Stephen F. Austin defeated VCU in the 2014 NCAAT due to taking care of the ball with patient guards and good half court sets, though they did commit 17 turnovers that night. However, they shot 52.9% from the floor that night as a team. Last season, Ohio State led by Deangelo Russell defeated VCU in the NCAAT. He nearly single handedly demolished the VCU press. Taking care of the ball will be Duke's number one priority tomorrow.

COYS
11-19-2015, 10:53 AM
I'm hoping that the Fr. were able to get those jitters out of their system and that they'll play at a higher level than against Kentucky. I was impressed by the composure of the upperclassmen, and i hope that the solid presence they provided will continue forward.

I think this is the key part of your analysis. Derryck made some big mistakes, but he also made some really nice plays. He was able to slice through the stout UK defense at times with some nice moves. Grayson was forcing his drives way too much. He often didn't even take the time to assess the defense before driving right into the teeth of it. Of course, it also seemed like he was pressing in the exhibitions and he responded by averaged 27ppg in the first two regular season games against tougher competition. Our guards will have to mature quickly, of course. But even though they struggled against UK, there were moments when we saw what they can do when they're on, as well.

As a point of optimism, as recently as April, I don't think we could realistically have expected Marshall to handle himself with so much composure against NBA caliber forwards. And yet he had a really nice game against UK. I know he had the summer to work on his game, but it is still an impressive transformation for him. I wouldn't be surprised to see our guards do the same thing. As has been mentioned quite a bit, if we simply cut down on a few turnovers and ill advised shots that led to fast breaks for UK, that game would have been a whole lot closer.

whereinthehellami
11-19-2015, 11:10 AM
I think people are over-hyping the KY defense. They have the pieces to be a really good defense but they are young and haven't reached that point yet. Duke just did not have the right pieces ready at the right time to exploit them. Duke reminded me of a fawn stumbling around trying to finds it's legs the other night. Bad timing.

This VCU game should be an interesting one for the young devil backcourt. If they struggle against the veteran and athletic VCU team like they did against the KY backcourt, I might unveil scenario 11 earlier than I was planning on.

Billy Dat
11-19-2015, 11:37 AM
I think people are over-hyping the KY defense. They have the pieces to be a really good defense but they are young and haven't reached that point yet. Duke just did not have the right pieces ready at the right time to exploit them. Duke reminded me of a fawn stumbling around trying to finds it's legs the other night. Bad timing.

This VCU game should be an interesting one for the young devil backcourt. If they struggle against the veteran and athletic VCU team like they did against the KY backcourt, I might unveil scenario 11 earlier than I was planning on.

I know it's early, but Kentucky's D is #1 at KenPom right now.

Thinking about the constant refrain from some that Cal is not a good coach, I thought looking at historic KenPom numbers for defense, Cal vs K, might be instructive since K has expressed that trying to teach "Duke D" to completely rebuilt rosters every year is close to impossible. I think it's hard to argue that good D has a lot to do with coaching. The comparison is interesting:

These are year end numbers:

2015, UK - 2, Duke - 12
2014, UK - 41, Duke - 166
2013, UK - 129, Duke - 31
2012, UK - 8, Duke - 81
2011, UK - 15, Duke - 21
2010, UK - 5, Duke - 8
Average, UK - 33, Duke 53

If you throw out each team's bad outlier (their 129, our 166), it comes out UK - 14, Duke - 30. All that is to say that Kentucky's D has been really good since Cal got there and this year's team is very likely to remain a top 10 defense.

VCU's current KenPom D is 38. Over the same stretch illustrated above, their average year end if 47, between Kentucky and Duke.

Kedsy
11-19-2015, 12:13 PM
Keeping them from scoring in transition will be important, including running off of made baskets and rebounds near the basket.

Did Kentucky have any fast breaks off of made baskets? It's hard to tell from the box score but I'm pretty sure they didn't.


Stephen F. Austin defeated VCU in the 2014 NCAAT due to taking care of the ball with patient guards and good half court sets, though they did commit 17 turnovers that night. However, they shot 52.9% from the floor that night as a team.

So, we either have to turn the ball over less or shoot better?

We committed 16 turnovers against Kentucky, which is more than you want, but if we just cut down a few of the more egregious ones it would have been OK. I think the nature of the turnovers was more important. Dead ball turnovers led to half-court offense, where UK scored fewer than a point per possession. Live ball turnovers out near halfcourt tend to lead to fast-break baskets, more or less two points per possession. Looking at the box score, Duke had:

4 dead ball turnovers;

9 live ball turnovers, 4 of which turned into fast-break points;

3 I couldn't tell from the box score, but none of which led to fast-break points;

So while I agree with you that we have to take care of the ball better, generally, the more important thing is to avoid the turnovers that lead to fast breaks (which we did four times against UK).

dukebballcamper90-91
11-19-2015, 01:21 PM
I think our D needs some major work. UK didn't play a lights out kind of game, our d made it easy for them. Shots don't fall sometimes and youth mistakes happen, but defense can pull us thru these things. I hope we play better d vs VCU. They got a couple of real good shooters.

CameronDuke
11-19-2015, 01:29 PM
Did Kentucky have any fast breaks off of made baskets? It's hard to tell from the box score but I'm pretty sure they didn't.



So, we either have to turn the ball over less or shoot better?

We committed 16 turnovers against Kentucky, which is more than you want, but if we just cut down a few of the more egregious ones it would have been OK. I think the nature of the turnovers was more important. Dead ball turnovers led to half-court offense, where UK scored fewer than a point per possession. Live ball turnovers out near halfcourt tend to lead to fast-break baskets, more or less two points per possession. Looking at the box score, Duke had:

4 dead ball turnovers;

9 live ball turnovers, 4 of which turned into fast-break points;

3 I couldn't tell from the box score, but none of which led to fast-break points;

So while I agree with you that we have to take care of the ball better, generally, the more important thing is to avoid the turnovers that lead to fast breaks (which we did four times against UK).

I agree that if we do turn it over, dead ball are less perilous than live ball turnovers against teams like Kentucky or VCU. Another thing Duke needs to do to win is what Stephen F. Austin did. That is, when the press is broken and when the ball is advanced into the front court, don't let the speed of the press speed up the offense. VCU likes to press and when a turnover is NOT forced, they still consider it a success if the opposing offense is sped up and a quick shot (usually taken by a guard advancing the ball in transition) is forced and VCU gets the quick rebound. It's all about tempo and cumulative effect with "havoc" as much as it is turnovers. If Duke can take the initial hit and speed increase the press forces upon opponents, then settle down into their halfcourt sets and force VCU to guard them in the halfcourt, their chances to win increase. A rushed shot after breaking the press for Duke is a bad shot tomorrow night in most cases. Also, lay ups can be gained off of breaking the press. Look for those opportunities, but don't force the issue if you're Duke.

Olympic Fan
11-19-2015, 01:52 PM
Just a word about VCU ...

I know how misleading comparative scores are, but I think it interesting that:

(1) Radford beats Georgetown in overtime
(2) Georgetown takes No. 3 Maryland to the wire in College Park
(3) VCU dominates Radford, 92-74.

Again, not to read too much into comparative scores* but at least an indication that VCU will be a very competitive opponent. I think that will end up a top 50 RPI team, so a win Friday would really help our resume in March. But this is a team that could beat Duke on a neutral court, if the Devils don't play well.

*Going by comparative scores, the best team in the country last year was Eastern Kentucky. They routed Miami by 28 points in Coral Gables ... Miami beat Duke by 16 in Durham and Duke won the national title. Our, you could take it further -- Eastern Kentucky lost to Tennessee Tech, Eastern Illinois, Florida Atlantic and East Tennessee State -- I guess they ALL can claim to be better than the national champs by using comparative scores.

flyingdutchdevil
11-19-2015, 08:53 PM
Just a word about VCU ...

I know how misleading comparative scores are, but I think it interesting that:

(1) Radford beats Georgetown in overtime
(2) Georgetown takes No. 3 Maryland to the wire in College Park
(3) VCU dominates Radford, 92-74.

Again, not to read too much into comparative scores* but at least an indication that VCU will be a very competitive opponent. I think that will end up a top 50 RPI team, so a win Friday would really help our resume in March. But this is a team that could beat Duke on a neutral court, if the Devils don't play well.

*Going by comparative scores, the best team in the country last year was Eastern Kentucky. They routed Miami by 28 points in Coral Gables ... Miami beat Duke by 16 in Durham and Duke won the national title. Our, you could take it further -- Eastern Kentucky lost to Tennessee Tech, Eastern Illinois, Florida Atlantic and East Tennessee State -- I guess they ALL can claim to be better than the national champs by using comparative scores.

In fairness, Radford is ranked 214 according to kenpom. And VCU is 51st, with an offense in the 80s and a defense in the 30s. This team is clearly more talented than Siena / Bryant, but nowhere near as talented as Kentucky (who I think has incredible defense and talented guards, two important criteria for being considered the best team in the country).

Duke will undoubtedly take VCU seriously, but I'd be surprised if the game is close. And I hope it isn't, cus I don't want to see Duke lose in person (humble-brag, sorry).

CameronDuke
11-19-2015, 10:40 PM
In fairness, Radford is ranked 214 according to kenpom. And VCU is 51st, with an offense in the 80s and a defense in the 30s. This team is clearly more talented than Siena / Bryant, but nowhere near as talented as Kentucky (who I think has incredible defense and talented guards, two important criteria for being considered the best team in the country).

Duke will undoubtedly take VCU seriously, but I'd be surprised if the game is close. And I hope it isn't, cus I don't want to see Duke lose in person (humble-brag, sorry).

For what it's worth, Vegas currently has Duke as a 10 point favorite tomorrow vs. VCU. Take from that what you want.

Troublemaker
11-19-2015, 10:55 PM
Thanks for an excellent primer on the Rams.

Based on your scout, we will have to correct some of the issues we had with Kentucky in order to win. Keeping them from scoring in transition will be important, including running off of made baskets and rebounds near the basket. Avoiding backcourt turnovers that lead to transition opportunities will also be key.

Yeah, my initial diagnosis post-Kentucky is that Duke is fine and that very few teams and possibly ONLY Kentucky can do what they did to Duke. UK's the only team in the country who can put 3 point guards of that caliber on the court to pressure our 3 perimeter players.

However, if VCU also bothers us with their pressure, I'd have to change my mind. I definitely want to see a clean ball-handling game against Havoc here, especially a Shaka-less Havoc.



I am very curious to see if K makes any starting line-up changes as a result of the Kentucky game. It would be interesting to see Derryck get the start, but it would mean bringing either Grayson or Brandon off the bench. Based on Kentucky, there is justification for either getting a demotion for similar reasons. Both let early frustration take them out of their game.

If Derryck starts, it'll probably be Grayson who comes off the bench. When Derryck started the 2nd half of the first exhibition game, it was Grayson who sat. In the Kentucky game, when Derryck came in early in the 2nd half, it was for Grayson; Coach K could've shifted Grayson off the ball and sat Brandon or Matt instead, but he didn't do that.

I think in Coach K's mind, right or wrong, he's pretty set on Matt (great 3-and-D and leadership), Brandon (top 5 lottery talent, and classic swing player between SF and PF), and the big rotation of Amile, Marshall, and Chase. If Derryck ever starts this season, it'll be in place of Grayson who then becomes the 6th man.

gep
11-19-2015, 11:42 PM
I think in Coach K's mind, right or wrong, he's pretty set on Matt (great 3-and-D and leadership), Brandon (top 5 lottery talent, and classic swing player between SF and PF), and the big rotation of Amile, Marshall, and Chase. If Derryck ever starts this season, it'll be in place of Grayson who then becomes the 6th man.

Scheyer WAS the 6th man in his sophomore season (I hope I have this right). Didn't seem to affect his career...:cool: AND with Scheyer on the bench, should help a lot.

Troublemaker
11-20-2015, 02:44 AM
Scheyer WAS the 6th man in his sophomore season (I hope I have this right). Didn't seem to affect his career...:cool: AND with Scheyer on the bench, should help a lot.

No doubt. And just for the record, I do think Grayson will maintain his starting role and will please us with his play both against VCU and going forward.

I've thought for awhile now that Grayson's going to develop into a very good player this season -- 2nd-team ACC, and possibly 1st-team ACC. One poor game against Kentucky, no matter how bad it was, shouldn't shake my confidence in him. Now, two or three bad games in quick succession? That might shake it, haha. So let's see a great bounce-back performance against VCU, Grayson.

dukebballcamper90-91
11-20-2015, 09:14 AM
Lets GO DUKE!!!!!!!

gumbomoop
11-20-2015, 10:41 AM
VCU wins?

http://espn.go.com/blog/collegebasketballnation/post/_/id/109116/weekend-predictions-vulnerable-duke-loses-again

Medcalf questions Duke's tenacity and toughness, says timing is everything, and Duke's guys will be vulnerable to big-stage discombobulation.

DukieTiger
11-20-2015, 11:09 AM
VCU wins?

http://espn.go.com/blog/collegebasketballnation/post/_/id/109116/weekend-predictions-vulnerable-duke-loses-again

Medcalf questions Duke's tenacity and toughness, says timing is everything, and Duke's guys will be vulnerable to big-stage discombobulation.

Seems like anytime there is a narrative like that about Duke, they end up doing the exact opposite of what they talking heads are suggesting at the time.

flyingdutchdevil
11-20-2015, 12:08 PM
VCU wins?

http://espn.go.com/blog/collegebasketballnation/post/_/id/109116/weekend-predictions-vulnerable-duke-loses-again

Medcalf questions Duke's tenacity and toughness, says timing is everything, and Duke's guys will be vulnerable to big-stage discombobulation.

I'm cool with this type of publicity. Hopefully it lights a fire under these guys. Medcalf does have valid points, but he fails to realize that Kentucky looked outstanding. And VCU is, well, a midmajor not ranked in the top 50 in kenpom (okay...they're 51st).

We have a few things going for us:

1) Grayson and Ingram cannot play worse

2) Thornton is getting better every single game

3) Our vets are outperforming everyone's expectations

4) It's MSG!

5) We have Coach K

We'll be fine tonight. Let the media do their thing. Can't wait for Medcalf to say, "Coach K really worked his magic in the last 3 days to get this Duke team ready and hungry" or some crap like that.

Bob Green
11-20-2015, 01:27 PM
I'm looking forward to tonight's game as it is our first opportunity to see the guys bounce back after a tough game. The guys will be fine and down the road we will all view the Kentucky game as an early season speed bump.

mo.st.dukie
11-20-2015, 01:38 PM
VCU wins?

http://espn.go.com/blog/collegebasketballnation/post/_/id/109116/weekend-predictions-vulnerable-duke-loses-again

Medcalf questions Duke's tenacity and toughness, says timing is everything, and Duke's guys will be vulnerable to big-stage discombobulation.

He said Duke look timid against an elite opponent and I agree with that, at least in regards to our young players with Thornton being the exception. The game was too big for our other freshmen and the lone sophomore, Coach K said as much in the post game press conference. The only thing that kept that game from being a complete disaster was the upperclassmen.

While I agree with that I disagree with the prediction that we'll lose tonight, but at least he predicted just a 1 point OT loss so basically a toss-up game. I'm really glad the team is able to get right back into another big-time atmosphere (MSG) against name programs after that loss. It keeps them challenged, alert, and out of their comfort zone, much more beneficial than going right back to Cameron to play an over-matched team.

Billy Dat
11-20-2015, 02:07 PM
He said Duke look timid against an elite opponent and I agree with that, at least in regards to our young players with Thornton being the exception. The game was too big for our other freshmen and the lone sophomore, Coach K said as much in the post game press conference. The only thing that kept that game from being a complete disaster was the upperclassmen.

While I agree with that I disagree with the prediction that we'll lose tonight, but at least he predicted just a 1 point OT loss so basically a toss-up game. I'm really glad the team is able to get right back into another big-time atmosphere (MSG) against name programs after that loss. It keeps them challenged, alert, and out of their comfort zone, much more beneficial than going right back to Cameron to play an over-matched team.

Coming off the Kentucky game and facing a solid opponent in another big arena - THE WORLD'S MOST FAMOUS ARENA - I think Metcalf has proper latitude to be provocative. The game is also being shown by his employer so if predicting a Duke loss generates some more eyeballs...

Devilwin
11-20-2015, 02:39 PM
VCU wins?

http://espn.go.com/blog/collegebasketballnation/post/_/id/109116/weekend-predictions-vulnerable-duke-loses-again

Medcalf questions Duke's tenacity and toughness, says timing is everything, and Duke's guys will be vulnerable to big-stage discombobulation.

If the freshmen get out of their "deer in headlights" mentality, our superior skill set should win out. But if they come out like they did against UK, the writer may be correct.
This isn't last year's team, and these freshmen aren't nowhere near as tough as last year's were, albeit a talented group.

jv001
11-20-2015, 04:09 PM
It looks like the point spread is 8.5 to 9.5 favoring Duke. I'm hoping we handle their pressure and the youngsters improve since the loss to Kentucky. GoDuke!

-jk
11-20-2015, 07:15 PM
DBR Chat (http://forums.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/misc.php?do=cchatbox) is open!

If it gets a bit slow, refresh the page. As always - please follow the DBR Posting Guidelines.

Let's Go Duke!

-jk

Henderson
11-20-2015, 07:17 PM
Come on, man. Wiscy just lost, are we're playing basketball in 30 minutes.

And this thread is drifting down to the bottom? Not on my watch. Go Duke Basketball. DBR

Does no one care about Duke basketball anymore now that The Greatest Football Coach on Earth has ironed things out on the gridiron?

Duke we thy anthems praise...

Come on you football geeks. You know the words, even if you've been embarrassed to sing them.

Troublemaker
11-20-2015, 07:23 PM
Get in chat, Hendo

CDu
11-20-2015, 07:36 PM
And there is where Allen is effective: in transition. He gets an open 3, and gets a breakout race toward the rim. VCU seems a good matchup for him, as there should be a LOT of open court play.

53n206
11-20-2015, 07:52 PM
Poor shooting (open, not dropping). No defense. sloppy with ball.

53n206
11-20-2015, 08:03 PM
Getting better. Shots are starting to drop.

riverside6
11-20-2015, 08:34 PM
Better late than never, live tempo-based stats for Duke/VCU...

http://www.scacchoops.com/vcu-at-duke-basketball-live-stats-11202015

jipops
11-20-2015, 08:41 PM
The '13-'14 defense is back.

Sixthman
11-20-2015, 08:42 PM
Sadly, so far, lazy is the word which would characterize our ball handling, defense, and shot selection.

Sixthman
11-20-2015, 08:46 PM
Jones and Jefferson as bad tonight as they were good against Ky. If they turn that around for the last ten minutes it will be a different game.

jipops
11-20-2015, 08:54 PM
Foul fest from here on out. Got to make free throws

1999ballboy
11-20-2015, 08:54 PM
Thornton is showing some confidence and skill, but jeez, how annoying is Dick Vitale? He's acting like he invented the idea that Derryck is our only true point guard.

Edouble
11-20-2015, 09:03 PM
VCU appears to be getting just a bit fatigued. They seem to be a split second late on both sides of the ball.

Edouble
11-20-2015, 09:04 PM
Thornton is showing some confidence and skill, but jeez, how annoying is Dick Vitale? He's acting like he invented the idea that Derryck is our only true point guard.

Silver lining... Chase Jeter has played zero minutes, so Vitale has not had a segue to talk about Derek Jeter.

Ultrarunner
11-20-2015, 09:13 PM
Jones and Jefferson as bad tonight as they were good against Ky. If they turn that around for the last ten minutes it will be a different game.

So, I'm a little confused. Jones and Jefferson were the leading scorers against KY. Plus Amile snagged 15 rebounds.

Sixthman
11-20-2015, 09:27 PM
The last 15 minutes was much better on the defensive side. Jefferson very effective on D. Referees much more friendly as well. Free throw line was atrocious. We got tired the last two minutes. Ingram showed his inexperience in every aspect of the game. He rebounded well. Grayson potent and under control on offense. Thorton has a nice game scoring and played markedly better defense in the second. Good win.

Sixthman
11-20-2015, 09:32 PM
So, I'm a little confused. Jones and Jefferson were the leading scorers against KY. Plus Amile snagged 15 rebounds.

Yes, they were great agsinst ky, but poor the first 25 minutes tonight, with turn overs and defensive lapses. As bad tonight as they were good against kentucky. They did change that the last ten minutes, as neither had a turnover, both began rebounding, and they contributed to settling the team down on defense.