Maryland Terrapin advice for Duke

[TerpsInACC]

As a die-hard Maryland fan that misses playing in the ACC, my advice is that the Duke football coach should go to the media on Tuesday and say, "Having seen the video and the numerous mistakes made on the final play, if I was the Miami Coach, I would agree to forfeit the game and give Duke the win. After all, the ACC obviously agrees with us or they would have not have disciplined the refs." Anyone here close to the Duke football staff should push this idea tomorrow morning as that final play is so disgusting. Good luck in basketball unless you are playing the Terps in the tournament.

[Wander]

As a die-hard Maryland fan that misses playing in the ACC, my advice is that the Duke football coach should go to the media on Tuesday and say, "Having seen the video and the numerous mistakes made on the final play, if I was the Miami Coach, I would agree to forfeit the game and give Duke the win. After all, the ACC obviously agrees with us or they would have not have disciplined the refs."

I appreciate the sentiment, but I'd rather Cutcliffe not lie, and him saying that would be lying. No Division 1A coach, including Cutcliffe, would ever forfeit a game due to even egregiously bad officiating.

[aswewere]

I appreciate the sentiment, but I'd rather Cutcliffe not lie, and him saying that would be lying. No Division 1A coach, including Cutcliffe, would ever forfeit a game due to even egregiously bad officiating.

The president , AD could and should have by now.

[TerpsInACC]

My thought behind this was to make Miami feel guilty for taking the victory. Someone high up at Duke should make this statement ASAP as it has a major effect on the rest of the season. Still not sure how with instant replay, the refs missed any of the four penalties (that I counted) on the last play. I just wonder how Coach K would have handle this if this insanity happened in a basketball game.

[Edouble]

My thought behind this was to make Miami feel guilty for taking the victory. Someone high up at Duke should make this statement ASAP as it has a major effect on the rest of the season. Still not sure how with instant replay, the refs missed any of the four penalties (that I counted) on the last play. I just wonder how Coach K would have handle this if this insanity happened in a basketball game.

It pretty much did in the 2014 game at Syracuse. In these kinds of situations, Coach K usually says that was just one play out of the whole game... if we had played better the rest of the game, that we wouldn't be in the position to lose on a referee's blow call.

[duke09hms]

My thought behind this was to make Miami feel guilty for taking the victory. Someone high up at Duke should make this statement ASAP as it has a major effect on the rest of the season. Still not sure how with instant replay, the refs missed any of the four penalties (that I counted) on the last play. I just wonder how Coach K would have handle this if this insanity happened in a basketball game.

Hmmm, the thing is there is absolutely no equivalent in basketball. That single play was responsible for 20% of Miami's scoring output. In basketball, this would have to be a controversial 12-pt. shot that goes in after Duke is up 6. Hard to say "we should never have let it come down to that one play" in that hypothetical situation.

[JetpackJesus]

Hmmm, the thing is there is absolutely no equivalent in basketball. That single play was responsible for 20% of Miami's scoring output. In basketball, this would have to be a controversial 12-pt. shot that goes in after Duke is up 6. Hard to say "we should never have let it come down to that one play" in that hypothetical situation.

I think the more significant distinction is that no plays can happen in basketball once time has expired. In basketball, if you could go back on replay review and determine that a turnover occurred (stepping out of bounds = knee down perhaps?) or a foul occurred, then there must still necessarily be time left on the clock or they cannot make the correct call. If a call in basketball can actually be overturned, that means the game is not conclusively over and something, however unlikely, could happen. Dockery could beat VPI. Laettner could make the shot. But nothing can happen to alter the outcome of the game once the clock hits 0 in basketball.

In football, we can have the refs fail to call a player down with 0 seconds left. We can have a missed block in the back with 0 seconds left. We can have too many men on the field with 0 seconds left. We can have a td counted 43 seconds after the clock hits 0.

This is really why comparing basketball officiating to whatever it was the striped dudes were doing Saturday doesn't work. We can say with 100% certainty, based on the replay, that the football game ended (re: should have) when the Miami player's knee touched the ground because it happened after time had expired. No other outcome is possible at that point, unlike in basketball.

[bjornolf]

Speaking of terp supporters wanting to change the outcome, Scott Van Pelt gave an impassioned speech on Sportscenter this morning about why the ACC should overturn the result. Loved it.

[wsb3]

Dan Patrick said on his show yesterday that Duke should be awarded the win. Not going to happen but there is a lot of sentiment leaning that way with the sports media.

[DukieInKansas]

I respectfully disagree with the OP. If asked, Coach Cutcliffe and anyone associated with Duke should say the ACC made a ruling and we are now concentrating onour next opponent. Let the media take our side and see what happens from there.

[Saratoga2]

I respectfully disagree with the OP. If asked, Coach Cutcliffe and anyone associated with Duke should say the ACC made a ruling and we are now concentrating onour next opponent. Let the media take our side and see what happens from there.

It sounds like whining when the coach gets into the middle of the issue.

[weezie]

Speaking of terp supporters wanting to change the outcome, Scott Van Pelt gave an impassioned speech on Sportscenter this morning about why the ACC should overturn the result. Loved it.

What?!! Scottie Van P actually supports Duke? Wow, cased closed! Flabbergasted am I.

[Duke95]

What?!! Scottie Van P actually supports Duke? Wow, cased closed! Flabbergasted am I.

Massive drought...flooding...huge cyclones...snowpocalypse...Van Pelt saying something nice about Duke...man, climate change is getting out of control!

[84crazy]

When you see SVP and so many others repeating almost the exact same speach about overturning the game I have to assume its coming from above. Whatever I may think about that ending I think it would be horrible Karma for us to see the game changed now to a victory for us. Time to go down the road Saturday and play inspired start to finish. and come on with the short yardage goal line offense.

Guess the older media guys still hate the U more than Duke amazingly. Non-state schools are never going to get the love.

[FerryFor50]

Hmmm, the thing is there is absolutely no equivalent in basketball. That single play was responsible for 20% of Miami's scoring output. In basketball, this would have to be a controversial 12-pt. shot that goes in after Duke is up 6. Hard to say "we should never have let it come down to that one play" in that hypothetical situation.

As one of my UNC fan friends pointed out, there is a Duke-related incident that is equivalent.

That would be the 2007 clock issue during the Clemson game, where McClure hit the buzzer beater.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5btBUrV8Dac

I begrudgingly tend to agree. But I also feel like a college football game has way more weight on it than a basketball game, given the fact that there are so fewer football games in a season. (1/3 as many, in most cases)

[Wander]

As one of my UNC fan friends pointed out, there is a Duke-related incident that is equivalent.


I don't think it's equivalent because there was a whole play that happened after the mistake, which, yes, was a bad mistake. Duke ran a play thinking there was 4.4 seconds left, and would have run a different play (or at least shot the ball sooner) if there had only been 1.8 seconds left.

That said, I don't think the result should be overturned, as happy as that would make me. I think it sets a really bad precedent, and I don't want officials thinking they have more leeway to screw up because the conference can just make it right later. Having Miami forfeit is a more interesting argument, but like I said, not going to happen.

[Rich]

As a die-hard Maryland fan that misses playing in the ACC, my advice is that the Duke football coach should go to the media on Tuesday and say, "Having seen the video and the numerous mistakes made on the final play, if I was the Miami Coach, I would agree to forfeit the game and give Duke the win. After all, the ACC obviously agrees with us or they would have not have disciplined the refs." Anyone here close to the Duke football staff should push this idea tomorrow morning as that final play is so disgusting. Good luck in basketball unless you are playing the Terps in the tournament.

Umm, we call that "Terping" around here so it's understandable why you would think that.

[91devil]

As one of my UNC fan friends pointed out, there is a Duke-related incident that is equivalent.


I very much disagree with your friend. The only thing these two instances have in common is that Duke was part of both (which, leads to the comment of your friend).

As I recall, in the Clemson game, the officials went to the monitor, reviewed the clock timing problems, and correctly reset the game clock to what should have been in place without the problem. The officials did what they were supposed to do; that is, they fixed a problem on the court (or, in this instance, with the scoreboard). The football game officials did not fix a problem on the field.

[freshmanjs]

As I recall, in the Clemson game, the officials went to the monitor, reviewed the clock timing problems, and correctly reset the game clock to what should have been in place without the problem. The officials did what they were supposed to do; that is, they fixed a problem on the court (or, in this instance, with the scoreboard). The football game officials did not fix a problem on the field.

This is not correct. The problem was never fixed and Duke was awarded the win. I do agree that this is not entirely similar to the football game, but the reason is as stated a few posts above. If the clock were set correctly, Duke would have run a different play. So, we will never know what would have happened. This is the unusual thing about the football game. There is no uncertainty about what would have happened if the play were called correctly.

[FerryFor50]

This is not correct. The problem was never fixed and Duke was awarded the win. I do agree that this is not entirely similar to the football game, but the reason is as stated a few posts above. If the clock were set correctly, Duke would have run a different play. So, we will never know what would have happened. This is the unusual thing about the football game. There is no uncertainty about what would have happened if the play were called correctly.

That is a fair point. But a clock issue is a pretty close equivalent. For instance, if a shot is released after the buzzer and goes in and is counted/vice versa.

[freshmanjs]

That is a fair point. But a clock issue is a pretty close equivalent. For instance, if a shot is released after the buzzer and goes in and is counted/vice versa.

Agree. a case where a final game winning shot was after the clock hit zero and this was missed by the refs and by the replay would be similar in spirit to the miami game case.

[Potato Head]

Seeing a lot of haters talking about Duke fans complaining and asking to overturn the result. Maybe I'm not around enough people but it seems to me like the only people that AREN'T really calling for the result to be changed are Duke fans (and Duke haters of course). The loudest "change the result" cries seem to be coming from the unaffiliated. And I agree. I don't want the result changed, I just want everybody to acknowledge how screwed over we were.

[Edouble]

Agree. a case where a final game winning shot was after the clock hit zero and this was missed by the refs and by the replay would be similar in spirit to the miami game case.

The Virginia game in 1997 is as close as you are gonna get. There are UVA fans I know that still complain about that one.

[84crazy]

Seeing a lot of haters talking about Duke fans complaining and asking to overturn the result. Maybe I'm not around enough people but it seems to me like the only people that AREN'T really calling for the result to be changed are Duke fans (and Duke haters of course). The loudest "change the result" cries seem to be coming from the unaffiliated. And I agree. I don't want the result changed, I just want everybody to acknowledge how screwed over we were.

I'm with you. It's funny I actually think the non-reversal of the fumble after the catch early on was even more obvious a mistake. Failing to score after starting off with the fumbled kickoff was The Big key to the game. The surge of emotion that gave the Canes was enormous.

[tux]

I'm with you. It's funny I actually think the non-reversal of the fumble after the catch early on was even more obvious a mistake. Failing to score after starting off with the fumbled kickoff was The Big key to the game. The surge of emotion that gave the Canes was enormous.


Yes. Duke made plenty of mistakes.

But the fact that there is only one replay official (and a retired official), plus the fact that he so obviously blew that non-reversal of the fumble . . . I mean, no wonder he couldn't make heads or tails of the 8-lateral return. I'm assuming being a replay official requires some comfort with technology; getting older retired folks to work the replay booth seems like a bad decision... (Maybe he was using that 9 minute review period to forward a chain email to his relatives...)

[duke2x]

The Virginia game in 1997 is as close as you are gonna get. There are UVA fans I know that still complain about that one.

I was thinking about what was the worst officiating error in ACC history before Saturday. I watched some highlights of that game on Youtube, and it certainly belonged in the discussion. That game had one very bad substitution error that lead to the ACC's first officiating suspension (1 game). We had 4+ that most middle school football players, band members, etc. would have gotten right.

It is interesting to note that UVA got an 8 seed for a 7-9 ACC team, probably much higher than they would have gotten without the error.

[TerpsInACC]

Glad some of you like to watch Scott Van Pelt on ESPN at midnight. I have met Scott at some Maryland games and like 98% of the alumni older than 30 years old we never wanted to leave the ACC. I 100% agree with SVP that the ACC should have the guts to say they cannot let Miami have that victory when there is overwhelming video evidence. The ACC Commissioner Swofford (?) talks tough but did nothing. I hope you all root for Maryland when we play UNC on 12/1.

[RCDevil]

The refs absolutely botched the end of the Clemson game.

What's different is that we didn't make a T-shirt commemorating winning on a call that everyone could clearly see was blown.

Also, had the correct call been made, the most likely result is that the game goes to OT, not a Clemson victory seconds later.

@OP: SVP is a cool cat and I will absolutely be rooting for Maryland when y'all play UNC. As far as your original post goes, that's probably what I'd do if I were our head coach, but Cut is the consummate professional and wouldn't stir the pot like that regardless of the situation.