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View Full Version : Dean Tribute - Wed Feb 18th



jtholland
02-11-2015, 01:32 PM
I was forwarded this idea about a way to honor Dean Smith at next week's home game

http://kirschsubjudice.postach.io/honoring-dean-smith

It looked pretty cool and simple to me. No trademark issues, so I put something up on Cafe Press. Feel free to go buy one, wear it in Cameron next week. You can easily create a women's shirt too, change the font, have fun with it. No money being made on this at all, total cost goes towards printing via Cafe Press.

http://www.cafepress.com/cp/customize/product2.aspx?from=CustomDesigner&number=1515891637

My original thought was to do a Tfund project fundraiser, and give the money to Dean's preferred charities. However, the delivery time on shirts in that method wouldn't be for several weeks. If you are interested in donating in Dean's memory, his family has asked that money be given to either The Inter-Faith Council for Social Service, based in Chapel Hill, or to the Dean E. Smith Opening Doors Fund.

Dean's passing has made me sentimental. This is such a great rivalry, and even though we don't admit it often, we have more in common with Chapel Hill folks than not. It feels pretty good to be able to recognize that once in a while.

Duvall
02-11-2015, 01:49 PM
I think a moment of silence before Wednesday's game would be appropriate and sufficient.

Olympic Fan
02-11-2015, 01:58 PM
I think a moment of silence before Wednesday's game would be appropriate and sufficient.

Agree ...

mattman91
02-11-2015, 02:02 PM
Cool idea. Don't want to motivate the Heels too much though...

elvis14
02-11-2015, 02:12 PM
I think a moment of silence before Wednesday's game would be appropriate and sufficient.

Considering how much of a tribute has been given repeatedly on every media outlet having anything to do with sports, I think enough has been done already.

Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15
02-11-2015, 02:13 PM
I was forwarded this idea about a way to honor Dean Smith at next week's home game

http://kirschsubjudice.postach.io/honoring-dean-smith

It looked pretty cool and simple to me. No trademark issues, so I put something up on Cafe Press. Feel free to go buy one, wear it in Cameron next week. You can easily create a women's shirt too, change the font, have fun with it. No money being made on this at all, total cost goes towards printing via Cafe Press.

http://www.cafepress.com/cp/customize/product2.aspx?from=CustomDesigner&number=1515891637

My original thought was to do a Tfund project fundraiser, and give the money to Dean's preferred charities. However, the delivery time on shirts in that method wouldn't be for several weeks. If you are interested in donating in Dean's memory, his family has asked that money be given to either The Inter-Faith Council for Social Service, based in Chapel Hill, or to the Dean E. Smith Opening Doors Fund.

Dean's passing has made me sentimental. This is such a great rivalry, and even though we don't admit it often, we have more in common with Chapel Hill folks than not. It feels pretty good to be able to recognize that once in a while.

Love the idea behind this. Hope it gains some legs.

jtholland
02-11-2015, 02:16 PM
Considering how much of a tribute has been given repeatedly on every media outlet having anything to do with sports, I think enough has been done already.

Wow, I'm a little surprised at the responses here. I will point out that the shirt is intentionally in Duke colors, using a Duke tshirt style.

But ultimately I have nothing to gain either way, just thought I'd take a good idea and give it life.

FerryFor50
02-11-2015, 02:16 PM
Considering how much of a tribute has been given repeatedly on every media outlet having anything to do with sports, I think enough has been done already.

Nah, I think we need a 24+ hour tribute on ESPN...

http://www.si.com/college-basketball/2015/02/10/dean-smith-death-north-carolina-espn-marathon

arnie
02-11-2015, 02:17 PM
Agree ...

Can we combine the "tribute" with one for Tarkanian the same night?

flyingdutchdevil
02-11-2015, 02:18 PM
Considering how much of a tribute has been given repeatedly on every media outlet having anything to do with sports, I think enough has been done already.

Couldn't disagree more. A moment of silence or a moment of reflection would be a wonderful thing for arguably Coach K's biggest rival coach.

I'd be shocked if Coach K didn't honor Dean Smith at some point next Wednesday. This will be, of course, before we massacre UNC by 20.

BigWayne
02-11-2015, 02:44 PM
I think a moment of silence before Wednesday's game would be appropriate and sufficient.

Ditto - Nothing more, nothing less.

AIRFORCEDUKIE
02-11-2015, 03:11 PM
well if its just a moment of silence, Tar Holes will say what unbelievable nerve we have for only doing a moment of silence at the game. If we do anything more, they will say how self serving Duke is using Dean Smiths passing for good press... really its a lose lose situation :rolleyes:

Seriously though, looks cool good luck with it and have fun to anyone whos going to be at the game. Also if you have an extra ticket and you can fly me to Durham that night private message me.

weezie
02-11-2015, 03:57 PM
Agree ...

I also concur. These younger fans may not realize what they are asking of some of us Crusties....

Trinity09
02-11-2015, 04:11 PM
I respect the heck out of Dean, but I would never wear one of those shirts. Never, ever, ever. I know some will see this stance as insensitive, etc., and that's OK. As a Duke fan, I simply cannot get behind wearing a rival coach's name across my chest while my school plays said rival's basketball team--especially when the rival is that rival and the coach, rest his soul, is that coach. Express yourself and your admiration for Dean as you wish, but this is not that way I would choose to pay my respects if I were lucky enough to be in Cameron next Wednesday.

I think a moment of silence and perhaps a video tribute to Dean's contributions to the rivalry are appropriate.

OldPhiKap
02-11-2015, 04:33 PM
I also concur. These younger fans may not realize what they are asking of some of us Crusties....

Agreed.

Dean was an ACC legend and fierce rival. He deserves a moment of remembrance out of respect, and a moment of silence is appropriate.

Troublemaker
02-11-2015, 04:34 PM
well if its just a moment of silence, Tar Heels will say what unbelievable nerve we have for only doing a moment of silence at the game. If we do anything more, they will say how self serving Duke is using Dean Smiths passing for good press... really its a lose lose situation :rolleyes:

Seriously though,

You write this as if you're joking, but you're probably going to end up being right. Carolina fans are lunatics. See: Eve Carson ribbon controversy.

DukieInKansas
02-11-2015, 05:04 PM
I respect the heck out of Dean, but I would never wear one of those shirts. Never, ever, ever. I know some will see this stance as insensitive, etc., and that's OK. As a Duke fan, I simply cannot get behind wearing a rival coach's name across my chest while my school plays said rival's basketball team--especially when the rival is that rival and the coach, rest his soul, is that coach. Express yourself and your admiration for Dean as you wish, but this is not that way I would choose to pay my respects if I were lucky enough to be in Cameron next Wednesday.

I think a moment of silence and perhaps a video tribute to Dean's contributions to the rivalry are appropriate.

As long as the video includes the scores and/or plays from all the games when Duke won! ;)

I agree with a moment of silence and perhaps a video tribute are appropriate.

Unfortunately, Troublemaker's response to AIRFORCEDUKIE is probably pretty accurate.

Son of Mojo
02-11-2015, 05:24 PM
I appreciate the plight that the man had to suffer through. It's terrible and I'd wish it on no one. My maternal grandmother has some dementia and to see its effects firsthand is not an experience you want to have happen. Having said all that, a moment of silence is more than sufficient and K very well may make some comments to the crowd pre-game in addition to having a moment of silence.

CameronBlue
02-11-2015, 05:26 PM
A moment of silence, perhaps a stylized rendition of the Carolina Fightsong played by the pep band with a still image of Dean projected on the video screen, something like that. I'd love it if K would present a momento of some sort symbolizing the rivalry to the UNC SiD or AD at mid-court during halftime, a photo of Dean in action in Cameron, maybe a moment of celebration after a hard-fought win. But no video montage, no t-shirts, personally speaking. Dean wasn't a fan of the Crazies. He was not amused by the coordinated cheers and he thought that distracting the free-throw shooter was poor sportsmanship. I applaud the idea of the Crazies rising above the rivalry to honor Dean by wearing a T-shirt. But I think it's unnecessary. A moment of silence is fitting and sufficient.

jimsumner
02-11-2015, 05:59 PM
Duke had a moment of silence before the Duke-Clemson women's game Sunday.

So, I can't imagine they'll not have one before a men's game with the team he coached for generations.

And Duke should have one.

bedeviled
02-11-2015, 06:14 PM
I support the idea of a moment of silence, but I honestly don't understand the point or message of Duke, the institution, doing anything further. And, if they did, I wouldn't begrudge UNC fans for thinking that it is the result of a public relations decision...because it wouldn't happen without a PR decision of some sort.

That being said, I read this article (http://articles.chicagotribune.com/1993-04-04/sports/9304140367_1_jim-valvano-defeat-cancer-cancer-research/2) about Jim Valvano, in which it mentioned them symptoms he had during his last game providing tv commentary, a Duke vs UNC matchup on March 7, 1993:
a crowd of several hundred fans lingered 30 minutes after the Duke game, chanting, "Jim- my V! Jim-my V! Jim-my V!"

Actually, I don't think the chant was as meaningful and momentous as it seems in retrospect. The crowd was simply there still celebrating after storming the court following their win and, I think, chanted as he made is way out....much like students will do with Dickie V and others (The game and post-game are on YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kj8ZebfPeLg), but the video ends before any chants other than the fight song and "We're #1"). HOWEVER, knowing the history, I found this little story touching nonetheless. As such, I would be pleased with the Crazies if they had a, more or less, impromptu chant in honor of the man, basketball, and the rivalry. NOT some institutional respect ordered from on high, but fans celebrating their enjoyment of what he had given them.

hurleyfor3
02-11-2015, 06:19 PM
I say we wait for the game in Chapel Hill and let the crowd there enjoy 40 minutes of silence.

DukieInKansas
02-11-2015, 06:54 PM
I say we wait for the game in Chapel Hill and let the crowd there enjoy 40 minutes of silence.

Best idea yet! Live the rivalry in honor of Coach Smith.

weezie
02-11-2015, 06:54 PM
^^^ Well said young H43, well said.

Dukehky
02-11-2015, 07:07 PM
I support the idea of a moment of silence, but I honestly don't understand the point or message of Duke, the institution, doing anything further. And, if they did, I wouldn't begrudge UNC fans for thinking that it is the result of a public relations decision...because it wouldn't happen without a PR decision of some sort.

That being said, I read this article (http://articles.chicagotribune.com/1993-04-04/sports/9304140367_1_jim-valvano-defeat-cancer-cancer-research/2) about Jim Valvano, in which it mentioned them symptoms he had during his last game providing tv commentary, a Duke vs UNC matchup on March 7, 1993:

Actually, I don't think the chant was as meaningful and momentous as it seems in retrospect. The crowd was simply there still celebrating after storming the court following their win and, I think, chanted as he made is way out....much like students will do with Dickie V and others (The game and post-game are on YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kj8ZebfPeLg), but the video ends before any chants other than the fight song and "We're #1"). HOWEVER, knowing the history, I found this little story touching nonetheless. As such, I would be pleased with the Crazies if they had a, more or less, impromptu chant in honor of the man, basketball, and the rivalry. NOT some institutional respect ordered from on high, but fans celebrating their enjoyment of what he had given them.

The academic transgressions at UNC started before the 1993 national championship, just saying.

I respect Dean, I loved to hate him. I have 0 doubt in my mind that if UNC was giving out grades in the early 90s that Dean had no idea about it.

That being said, Dean had many years of struggle, but this isn't some surprising tragedy. The man was 83 years old. Both my grandparents lived to be 66 and smoked a lot just like Dean. 83 is nothing to sneeze at. Not searching for pity, just saying that as when a lot of old people pass on, it's sad, but it doesn't require overt displays of affection by those not directly involved.

I think a moment of silence is appropriate and anything more is superfluous.

And in response to the crazies developing some creative chant, most of these kids weren't even 5 years old before Dean retired. If you have to watch youtube clips to obtain any semblance of knowledge of a person, just be quiet and respectful

MartyClark
02-11-2015, 08:29 PM
The academic transgressions at UNC started before the 1993 national championship, just saying.

I respect Dean, I loved to hate him. I have 0 doubt in my mind that if UNC was giving out grades in the early 90s that Dean had no idea about it.

That being said, Dean had many years of struggle, but this isn't some surprising tragedy. The man was 83 years old. Both my grandparents lived to be 66 and smoked a lot just like Dean. 83 is nothing to sneeze at. Not searching for pity, just saying that as when a lot of old people pass on, it's sad, but it doesn't require overt displays of affection by those not directly involved.

I think a moment of silence is appropriate and anything more is superfluous.

And in response to the crazies developing some creative chant, most of these kids weren't even 5 years old before Dean retired. If you have to watch youtube clips to obtain any semblance of knowledge of a person, just be quiet and respectful

A moment of silence may be appropriate but is not required. I'm fine with Duke doing nothing. North Carolina can honor him in any manner they wish. He's not a part of the Duke family.

I suspect K makes the decision and that he'll choose a moment of silence. I trust K on this and support his whatever he decides.

bedeviled
02-11-2015, 08:35 PM
And in response to the crazies developing some creative chant, most of these kids weren't even 5 years old before Dean retired. If you have to watch youtube clips to obtain any semblance of knowledge of a person, just be quiet and respectfulSorry, I wasn't clear. I meant that the Crazies are currently enjoying the legacy of basketball enhanced by Dean and the rivalry. Moreover, if they can get outside of their present perspective and emotions, they can realize that, in this very moment, they are part of building that legacy. Ultimately, it is bigger than the man and the moment itself. It becomes part of the lore, and I think that's pretty cool.
Perhaps decades from now, someone would transmit a neural post about the game in which the Crazies showed their respect for Dean's legacy, just like I posted about Tar Heels chanting for Valvano. And, maybe, just maybe, they would chant for Coach K when that time comes....or, at least, we can ridicule them because we showed that we are better people than they are! :D

jdk
02-11-2015, 08:36 PM
Were any of the current players even alive when Dean was coaching? Such a gesture would only serve to motivate Ol Roy.

FerryFor50
02-11-2015, 08:39 PM
I say we wait for the game in Chapel Hill and let the crowd there enjoy 40 minutes of silence.

I like it.

It's like Arkansas and "40 minutes of hell" but quieter...

orrnot
02-11-2015, 10:11 PM
The T shirts are too much. My hope is that those wearing them will display them for the moment of silence and then strip them off to a more appropriate under-layer afterward. That could work out ok. Not wearing such a shirt does no dishonor to Dean Smith, but wearing one throughout the game invites all sorts of odd impressions. It'll be awkward at best; insulting to his memory at worst.

hurleyfor3
02-12-2015, 02:14 AM
These guys have the best idea

http://forums.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=4750&d=1423725250

Edouble
02-12-2015, 03:03 AM
Can we just point at Roy and chant "Dean was bet-ter, clap, clap, clap-clap-clap"?

Seriously, those tee shirts are awful. Let's cheer and wear tee shirts for our coach (1K) while he's still alive to see them!!! To quote an old poem, Dean is "Carolina dead". A moment of silence is more than enough.

The guy did not like the Crazies. At all. It dishonors him, and all that he fought and coached for, to wear those shirts. Let's not do any revisionist sugar coating now that he's gone!

TKG
02-12-2015, 05:47 AM
These guys have the best idea

http://forums.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=4750&d=1423725250


Just as exciting as I remember.

devilish
02-12-2015, 06:28 AM
Considering how much of a tribute has been given repeatedly on every media outlet having anything to do with sports, I think enough has been done already.

No kidding... Sports radio in the Triangle has given "Dean talk" more airtime than Mike and Mike talking NFL. Not to mention flags at half mast. My 9 year old son even pondered if Coach K would get the same treatment upon his passing.

Moment of silence would be appropriate.

Reilly
02-12-2015, 07:28 AM
I like it.

It's like Arkansas and "40 minutes of hell" but quieter...

Since this thread started with a photo of clothing, I think some Nolan Richardson and Roy Williams side-by-sides of sartorial splendor may be in order.

weezie
02-12-2015, 09:26 AM
These guys have the best idea

http://forums.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=4750&d=1423725250


Some restful moments of peace and quiet at Casa h43.....

gumbomoop
02-12-2015, 10:24 AM
Don't want to post this in 3 separate threads, and K's comments about Dean are probably the most interesting. Worth 3 minutes of your time.

http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=12314044&categoryid=2459792

nocilla
02-12-2015, 03:09 PM
I think the best way to honor Dean is the following; When there is about 2 minutes left in the game and we have a double digit lead, Coach K holds up 4 fingers, the 5 on the court hold up 4 fingers in response and we go 4 corners to run down the shot clock. Similar to our current stall ball, but a little tribute to Dean.

weezie
02-12-2015, 03:41 PM
...K's comments about Dean are probably the most interesting.


K looks good, in spite of what a long of a couple of weeks it's been. Being asked about the deaths of guys you came up the ranks against can't be a whole ton of fun.
But he looks rested and relaxed.

Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15
02-17-2015, 03:46 AM
Congrats, OP, for getting some traction in other circles.

http://www.newsobserver.com/2015/02/16/4560510_decock-collaboration-among-rivals.html?rh=1

Dukehky
02-17-2015, 10:51 AM
Congrats, OP, for getting some traction in other circles.

http://www.newsobserver.com/2015/02/16/4560510_decock-collaboration-among-rivals.html?rh=1

This is so dumb. I understand showing respect, but this is beyond superfluous. This is people wanting to get attention so that others see how 'classy' they are. It's disingenuous, not to mention unnecessary.

I wouldn't want UNC fans wearing 1K shirts at any point.

If I saw a group of fans wearing these shirts in front of me in the student's section, and they were not personal friends or family of Smith, I would vandalize the shirt in any manner that I could. If we lose this game, it is their fault for bringing bad juju into the arena, and they deserve to be drawn and quartered as a result.

AIRFORCEDUKIE
02-17-2015, 10:57 AM
This is so dumb. I understand showing respect, but this is beyond superfluous. This is people wanting to get attention so that others see how 'classy' they are. It's disingenuous, not to mention unnecessary.

I wouldn't want UNC fans wearing 1K shirts at any point.

If I saw a group of fans wearing these shirts in front of me in the student's section, and they were not personal friends or family of Smith, I would vandalize the shirt in any manner that I could. If we lose this game, it is their fault for bringing bad juju into the arena, and they deserve to be drawn and quartered as a result.


well then... Taking this a bit too serious don't you think? Isn't it for Charity as well? Could they just be good people doing what they can and paying tribute in whatever way they seem fit? What if Duke does a Dean video tribute or something, or Coach K says a few words about Dean? Will it be Dukes fault or Coach Ks for losing the game because they made a gesture?

Dukehky
02-17-2015, 11:01 AM
well then... Taking this a bit too serious don't you think? Isn't it for Charity as well? Could they just be good people doing what they can and paying tribute in whatever way they seem fit? What if Duke does a Dean video tribute or something, or Coach K says a few words about Dean? Will it be Dukes fault or Coach Ks for losing the game because they made a gesture?

Totally different for K who was a personal friend of Dean (well maybe), but no one in the undergraduate section remembers seeing Dean Smith coach a game. The seniors would have been 4 years old when Dean last coached. Again, Dean's death is very sad, he did some great things, but it's not a tragedy. A moment of silence is appropriate.

I also don't expect K to say anything after the game, nor do I expect there to be a video tribute.

Furniture
02-17-2015, 12:16 PM
This is so dumb. I understand showing respect, but this is beyond superfluous. This is people wanting to get attention so that others see how 'classy' they are. It's disingenuous, not to mention unnecessary.

I wouldn't want UNC fans wearing 1K shirts at any point.

If I saw a group of fans wearing these shirts in front of me in the student's section, and they were not personal friends or family of Smith, I would vandalize the shirt in any manner that I could. If we lose this game, it is their fault for bringing bad juju into the arena, and they deserve to be drawn and quartered as a result.

I would conject that this would be behavior from what some would call a tar heel....Just such an obsurd, mean spirited non Duke comment.

Olympic Fan
02-17-2015, 12:56 PM
I think Dukehky went too far in his last paragraph. No excuse to vandalize somebody's shirt (whatever it is) and if Duke loses, it won't be due to the shirts.

But I fully agree and support his first two paragraphs. I think the shirts are a stupid idea and I hope I don't see any Crazies wearing them.

A moment of silence ... yes. Beyond that, let's play the game.

PS I would have advocated something along the lines of "Dean would have been ashamed of you, Roy," to remind people of the cheating scandal at UNC. Except that according to the Wainstein report, the cheating actually started during Dean's tenure (which is another reason not to go overboard honoring the man).

hudlow
02-17-2015, 01:05 PM
Why not print up a bunch, sell them to the visitors as a commemorative and donate the proceeds?

OldPhiKap
02-17-2015, 01:27 PM
The best tribute we can pay Dean is to whip Carolina's butt, and then chant "Dean was better" at Roy.


(Okay, kidding. But if the legend of Dean is to be believed, he would not have wanted any attention to himself -- just on the game. I am okay with that. A moment of silence for an ACC icon is more than appropriate, and is more than satisfactory. I imagine K will make some statement about Dean at the opening of his press conference win or lose, and if K wants to say something else it's his court [literally] and he has earned the right to do it. But this is their moment, not ours; our job is to win a game.)

Dukehky
02-17-2015, 03:00 PM
I think Dukehky went too far in his last paragraph. No excuse to vandalize somebody's shirt (whatever it is) and if Duke loses, it won't be due to the shirts.

But I fully agree and support his first two paragraphs. I think the shirts are a stupid idea and I hope I don't see any Crazies wearing them.

A moment of silence ... yes. Beyond that, let's play the game.

PS I would have advocated something along the lines of "Dean would have been ashamed of you, Roy," to remind people of the cheating scandal at UNC. Except that according to the Wainstein report, the cheating actually started during Dean's tenure (which is another reason not to go overboard honoring the man).

I think the fact that i finished said paragraph with the suggestion that those who wore them should be drawn and quartered is pretty indicative of the exaggerative nature of the same paragraph.

And I totally agree with your last point. I actually believe that Dean had no knowledge of the going's on concerning grades in 1992 (which is approx when the report says it started), but he didn't find out, which is not great either. The Carolina Way which he preached and upheld for so many years deteriorated under his watch, and he deserves some blame for it.

Trinity09
02-17-2015, 03:23 PM
I think the fact that i finished said paragraph with the suggestion that those who wore them should be drawn and quartered is pretty indicative of the exaggerative nature of the same paragraph.

And I totally agree with your last point. I actually believe that Dean had no knowledge of the going's on concerning grades in 1992 (which is approx when the report says it started), but he didn't find out, which is not great either. The Carolina Way which he preached and upheld for so many years deteriorated under his watch, and he deserves some blame for it.

If Dean was as on top of his players' academic pursuits as he claimed, it would have been irresponsible for him not to have known about the cheating. Same goes for Roy. Best case: they lied about their involvement in their players' academic lives and were inexplicably blind to tutors obviously funneling players into AFAM. Worst case: they lied about not knowing about the cheating in order to protect their and unc's reputations. IMO, it takes a ton of mental gymnastics to make sense of the "best case" and none to make sense of the "worst case."

Agree 100% with you on the shirts. This is a silly idea. Donate to a charity in Dean's memory, but don't wear the shirts.

Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15
02-17-2015, 04:17 PM
This is so dumb. I understand showing respect, but this is beyond superfluous. This is people wanting to get attention so that others see how 'classy' they are. It's disingenuous, not to mention unnecessary.


Well, seems I am in the minority. I think honoring someone's notable life and accomplishments while donating to charity supercedes rivalry.

Devil in the Blue Dress
02-17-2015, 04:19 PM
Well, seems I am in the minority. I think honoring someone's notable life and accomplishments while donating to charity supercedes rivalry.
In view of how the shirt project has taken off, I'd say you aren't in the minority.

flyingdutchdevil
02-17-2015, 04:22 PM
Well, seems I am in the minority. I think honoring someone's notable life and accomplishments while donating to charity supercedes rivalry.

I'm 100% with you. A little shocked by the lack of respect for one of the greatest coaches in college basketball.

Duvall
02-17-2015, 04:24 PM
I'm 100% with you. A little shocked by the lack of respect for one of the greatest coaches in college basketball.

There have been a fair number of great coaches in college basketball history, most of whom did not openly despise Duke fans. Let's keep some perspective here.

Trinity09
02-17-2015, 04:27 PM
I'm 100% with you. A little shocked by the lack of respect for one of the greatest coaches in college basketball.

Disagreeing with the shirt idea =/= lack of respect for Dean.

jv001
02-17-2015, 04:28 PM
Well, seems I am in the minority. I think honoring someone's notable life and accomplishments while donating to charity supercedes rivalry.

I agree with you on this and sporked you accordingly. Sometimes things are bigger than sports. No one on this board hates the Uncheaters like I do. Well, I can't see how anyone would. But there's nothing wrong with honoring Coach Smith. Back in the day, I probably wouldn't have said that because I really didn't like the guy. But when I became a Christian, my life changed. As a Christian, you are supposed to love everyone in Christ because He loved us. Enough to die on the cross for us. It's ok to hate what a person does, but not ok to hate the person. Sorry to take this to another level, but I thought it needs saying. GoDuke!

bedeviled
02-17-2015, 04:44 PM
I think honoring someone's notable life and accomplishments while donating to charity supercedes rivalry.I would argue that this should read as "supercedes personal pettiness." I think the rivalry, Duke basketball, and fans of the future would benefit from adding something to this moment, and I hope Duke fans see past their thumbed up noses.

Does ignoring this occasion add anything to the rivalry? Does it enhance the myth for future fans? Will you read an article a decade from now and recall, "oh, that was the game when my friends and I had a minute of silence for Dean Smith?"
No. The rivalry and the memories are reborn in individual moments. This is obviously a momentous time in the rivalry, and, in my view, ignoring it drains life from the rivalry rather than celebrating it. Do something special. It doesn't have to be fawning or saccharine.

Olympic Fan
02-17-2015, 04:54 PM
In view of how the shirt project has taken off, I'd say you aren't in the minority.

the N&O story said that less than 300 shirts had been sold. I'm not sure than qualifies as having "taken off".

Let's see how many show up in Cameron before we judge the success or failure of the idea.

And speaking of pettiness, maybe you should ask Christian Laettner and Danny Ferry -- whose SAT scores Dean publically trashed, what they think of the idea.

oldnavy
02-17-2015, 05:03 PM
The best tribute we can pay Dean is to whip Carolina's butt, and then chant "Dean was better" at Roy.


(Okay, kidding. But if the legend of Dean is to be believed, he would not have wanted any attention to himself -- just on the game. I am okay with that. A moment of silence for an ACC icon is more than appropriate, and is more than satisfactory. I imagine K will make some statement about Dean at the opening of his press conference win or lose, and if K wants to say something else it's his court [literally] and he has earned the right to do it. But this is their moment, not ours; our job is to win a game.)

But I heard that he "Vehemently" opposed the naming of the court!!

:rolleyes:

Naw, not really but it really makes for a great PR story about how humble Coach K is....

Mike Corey
02-17-2015, 05:05 PM
I understand the shirts being worn during the moment of silence.

I don't understand wearing the shirts thereafter if you're a Duke fan. I can't imagine Coach Smith would understand it either.

Edited to add: I do understand the Dean shirts being worn throughout the game if you're a UNC fan; I wasn't trying to suggest one abdicated their Duke fandom if they opted to wear the Dean shirt throughout the game.

Trinity09
02-17-2015, 05:06 PM
I'll steal a post from TDD, which says how I feel better than I've thus far articulated. Credit goes to DrKlahn:

I think the shirts are well-intentioned but they definitely cross the line into pandering. They say "look at how respectful I am being," not "I am being respectful."

weezie
02-17-2015, 05:17 PM
the N&O story said that less than 300 shirts had been sold. I'm not sure than qualifies as having "taken off".
Let's see how many show up in Cameron before we judge the success or failure of the idea.
And speaking of pettiness, maybe you should ask Christian Laettner and Danny Ferry -- whose SAT scores Dean publically trashed, what they think of the idea.

I'd be in favor of donating money to a charity if every carholina fan hits themselves in the head with a 2x4.

But I would not donate to or wear that shirt for charity.

BluBones
02-17-2015, 05:23 PM
Well, seems I am in the minority. I think honoring someone's notable life and accomplishments while donating to charity supercedes rivalry.

I like the idea. I'm surprised so many posters here did not learn from Pitt. Make a classy gesture, and you destroy UNC: http://espn.go.com/blog/collegebasketballnation/post/_/id/103102/pitt-students-honor-dean-smith-with-a-quiet-powerful-tribute

chrishoke
02-17-2015, 05:28 PM
I could see wearing Dean noses the entire game.

BigWayne
02-17-2015, 05:36 PM
I like the idea. I'm surprised so many posters here did not learn from Pitt. Make a classy gesture, and you destroy UNC: http://espn.go.com/blog/collegebasketballnation/post/_/id/103102/pitt-students-honor-dean-smith-with-a-quiet-powerful-tribute

Nice sign with a quote from Dean: "“You should never be proud of doing what’s right. You should just do what’s right.”

I think maybe it needs a NOW! added to the end.

Trinity09
02-17-2015, 05:40 PM
Nice sign with a quote from Dean: "“You should never be proud of doing what’s right. You should just do what’s right.”

I think maybe it needs a NOW! added to the end.

Adjacent sign: "That means you, Bubba!" and a picture of the '93, '05, and '09 banners with red X's over them.

OldPhiKap
02-17-2015, 05:55 PM
Nice sign with a quote from Dean: "“You should never be proud of doing what’s right. You should just do what’s right.”



Now, this I could get behind.

hurleyfor3
02-17-2015, 07:03 PM
Now, this I could get behind.

Not me; it would block my view.

Edouble
02-17-2015, 07:05 PM
I could see wearing Dean noses the entire game.

As in "Dean knows (nose) his program cheats"?

RoyalBlue08
02-17-2015, 10:28 PM
I thought for sure this thread was going to be filled with ideas on how to best honor the memory of Coach Smith. I guess the internet is not a great place to look for civility. I did find it funny the people who think that honoring the recently departed has some sort of self servicing motivations. I would invite those who feel that way to look inside first. As an alumni who is unable to be at the game tomorrow, I am very hopefully that the feelings expressed in this thread are representative of a minority in attendance tomorrow. If I could go to the game, I would gladly wear one of these shirts. If for no other reason, than as a gesture to our neighbors in Chapel Hill, for whom I can only imagine feeling a great loss. I don't believe this would at all impact the outcome of the basketball game, nor do I feel that this makes me less of a fan of the basketball team.

Olympic Fan
02-17-2015, 10:53 PM
I thought for sure this thread was going to be filled with ideas on how to best honor the memory of Coach Smith. I guess the internet is not a great place to look for civility. I did find it funny the people who think that honoring the recently departed has some sort of self servicing motivations. I would invite those who feel that way to look inside first. As an alumni who is unable to be at the game tomorrow, I am very hopefully that the feelings expressed in this thread are representative of a minority in attendance tomorrow. If I could go to the game, I would gladly wear one of these shirts. If for no other reason, than as a gesture to our neighbors in Chapel Hill, for whom I can only imagine feeling a great loss. I don't believe this would at all impact the outcome of the basketball game, nor do I feel that this makes me less of a fan of the basketball team.

To borrow from another thread (in the off-topic board), Well, Excu-u-u-u-u-se Me!

Sorry to offend your sensibilities.

But it's a matter of perspective. Dean deserves to be honored and I'm sure there will be a moment of silence in his honor. I'll observe that.

But how much is enough?

We should wear t-shorts in his honor while his cheating program tries to beat ours?

What did everybody do when Everett Case died in 1966? How was Jimmy V honored the first time N.C. State visited after his death?

Maybe we should rename our arena in honor of Dean Smith? Think that's absurd? Why, I thought you wanted to honor Coach Smith. Think how much praise we'd get for renaming our court in favor of our biggest rival. Don't agree with that? Maybe YOU should look inside yourself.

Dean Smith was a good man and a great coach. But he wasn't the saint his supporters try to paint him. He was very minor mover in the Civil Rights movement and he wasn't a leader in integrating the ACC (he was in fact, tied for the third ACC coach to integrate his team). He took shots at opposing players (publically labeling FSU's Kirk Luchman as "Mr. Choke" and publically trashing Danny Ferry and Christian Laettner for their SAT scores). He regularly berated refs and has been thrown out of three times as many games as our own "foul-mouthed" coach. Dean almost single-handedly killed the Big Four Tournament and the North-South Doubleheader -- two great basketball events in the state.

And, worst of all, Dean was the head coach when the longest-running academic fraud scandal in NCAA history was instituted. Did he know about it? Maybe not, but he always bragged that he knew every detail of his players' academic work. He should have known.

I'm sorry to bring all this up. I do want honor a very fine human being -- with some very human flaws -- on his passing. But I don't want to deify the guy and I'm tired of hearing that there's something wrong because I don't want to honor the guy as much as you do.

Wear your Dean Smith shirt if you want. I'll honor the moment of silence before the game. But that's all I'm going to do.

Furniture
02-17-2015, 10:57 PM
I thought for sure this thread was going to be filled with ideas on how to best honor the memory of Coach Smith. I guess the internet is not a great place to look for civility. I did find it funny the people who think that honoring the recently departed has some sort of self servicing motivations. I would invite those who feel that way to look inside first. As an alumni who is unable to be at the game tomorrow, I am very hopefully that the feelings expressed in this thread are representative of a minority in attendance tomorrow. If I could go to the game, I would gladly wear one of these shirts. If for no other reason, than as a gesture to our neighbors in Chapel Hill, for whom I can only imagine feeling a great loss. I don't believe this would at all impact the outcome of the basketball game, nor do I feel that this makes me less of a fan of the basketball team.

That sums up my feelings. Very well said!!

tbyers11
02-17-2015, 11:15 PM
I'm sorry to bring all this up. I do want honor a very fine human being -- with some very human flaws -- on his passing. But I don't want to deify the guy and I'm tired of hearing that there's something wrong because I don't want to honor the guy as much as you do.

Wear your Dean Smith shirt if you want. I'll honor the moment of silence before the game. But that's all I'm going to do.

This is the crux of the whole deal here for me. I'm in the moment of silence is plenty camp. I don't think it is necessary for anyone to wear a shirt. However, if someone wants to wear one I'm not going to look down on them or tell them that they shouldn't do so. Alternatively, I would hope that people wouldn't think that I would need to "look inside" if I don't want to wear a t-shirt.

Differences of opinion on this matter are not going to lead to children starving or wars starting so why are we getting so worked up about how others feel.

Cause it is an internet message board, I guess.

Go to Hell Carolina!

Oriole Way
02-18-2015, 12:39 AM
I'm sorry, but I think the shirts are a poor idea, even though there are good intentions behind it.

Let's put aside the distinct possibility that Dean orchestrated, approved, and/or perpetuated the most egregious athletic eligibility fraud in NCAA history. No one man is bigger than the Duke/UNC rivalry. Not even Coach K.

A moment of silence is appropriate and classy. But the shirts are excessive and unnecessary. If you hold Dean, his memory, and his accomplishments (some of which were likely ill-gotten) in such high regard, then pay your respects somewhere outside of Cameron Indoor. UNC as an institution and basketball program deserves no respect from the Crazies. Only ridicule.

No disrespect to the creator of the shirt, but as a die-hard Duke fan, I will be disappointed and embarrassed if any Crazies are wearing the shirt at the game.

Duvall
02-18-2015, 01:12 AM
the N&O story said that less than 300 shirts had been sold. I'm not sure than qualifies as having "taken off".

Let's see how many show up in Cameron before we judge the success or failure of the idea.

It doesn't matter. If one person in the crowd has one of the shirts ESPN will focus on it and talk about it incessantly.

DukieInKansas
02-18-2015, 01:41 AM
It doesn't matter. If one person in the crowd has one of the shirts ESPN will focus on it and talk about it incessantly.

And if you could get Coach K to wear it, I predict that heads would explode at Inside Carolina. If the tie he wore to the service brought up some nasty comments*, just think what the shirt would do.

* The comments I read were more positive than negative on the tie and they even called out the negative posters.


A moment of silence is highly appropriate. If anyone wants to wear the shirt, I think it is fine. (If someone wants to give me a ticket to the game, I'll find the shirt and wear it. Then I can report back on how I was treated. ;) )

Whether you think Coach Smith is a saint or a sinner or some of both - as most of us are - his life touched a lot of people. All in all, even though I couldn't stand him when he was coaching, I think the world is a better place for having had Dean Smith in it. May good memories help his family and friends cope with the loss.

Coballs
02-18-2015, 02:02 AM
Without retracing every post in this thread, I'm willing to bet that the majority of those in favor of wearing shirts to honor Dean Smith tomorrow night were never in the building when he was competing against Duke or were too young to have seen him coach. Dean Smith was a good man, beloved by the UNC faithful, and unquestionably an all-time great coach. But Dean Smith had no love for Duke. From our perspective, he was our rival and a great competitor, but nothing more.

Coach K attended his funeral. And tomorrow night Dean Smith should receive our full respect and our condolences in an an appropriate moment of silence. But anything beyond that from the Crazies is unnecessary. Let UNC and the ACC during the conference tournament appropriately handle the major tributes.

NovaScotian
02-18-2015, 05:18 AM
Personally, I'm all for people wearing these shirts, if only because if coach dean could see tons of duke fans wearing shirts with his name he'd probably be disgusted.

OldPhiKap
02-18-2015, 07:10 AM
Without retracing every post in this thread, I'm willing to bet that the majority of those in favor of wearing shirts to honor Dean Smith tomorrow night were never in the building when he was competing against Duke or were too young to have seen him coach. Dean Smith was a good man, beloved by the UNC faithful, and unquestionably an all-time great coach. But Dean Smith had no love for Duke. From our perspective, he was our rival and a great competitor, but nothing more.

Coach K attended his funeral. And tomorrow night Dean Smith should receive our full respect and our condolences in an an appropriate moment of silence. But anything beyond that from the Crazies is unnecessary. Let UNC and the ACC during the conference tournament appropriately handle the major tributes.

Nailed it. Weezie made this point early in the thread, too.

I was at Duke in the mid-80's. Dean hated us and upstart Mike K, and we hated him. I'd love to give a warm revisionist history, suggesting we were all just kindred spirits and fellow travelers in the spirited competition of sport, but that's not true.

Of those who think this is a good idea, I'd love to see an age break-down. Not saying us crusties are right -- just saying we had to endure Dean and have a different perspective.

A moment of silence is an appropriate honor. I don't have a problem if folks want to do more, but the idea of wearing a shirt with his name on it is not appealing to me.

77devil
02-18-2015, 07:53 AM
Nailed it. Weezie made this point early in the thread, too.

I was at Duke in the mid-80's. Dean hated us and upstart Mike K, and we hated him. I'd love to give a warm revisionist history, suggesting we were all just kindred spirits and fellow travelers in the spirited competition of sport, but that's not true.

Of those who think this is a good idea, I'd love to see an age break-down. Not saying us crusties are right -- just saying we had to endure Dean and have a different perspective.

A moment of silence is an appropriate honor. I don't have a problem if folks want to do more, but the idea of wearing a shirt with his name on it is not appealing to me.

Well, they're millenials, so it's really about them, not Dean.

rthomas
02-18-2015, 08:26 AM
The last time we wore nontraditional shirts, they were green. Great idea at the time, but nontraditional never works out right. I would buy a DEAN shirt, but I wouldn't wear it. I'd hang it in my Duke shirt hall of fame right next to my green one.

Can't wait for the game!

Thundarr
02-18-2015, 08:41 AM
After the moment of silence honoring Dean, the crowd needs to break into a GTHC chant.

NashvilleDevil
02-18-2015, 08:52 AM
After the moment of silence honoring Dean, the crowd needs to break into a GTHC chant.

No they don't

jv001
02-18-2015, 08:56 AM
No they don't

More like the pep band goes with "Devil with a Blue Dress On" and the Crazies go crazie. GoDuke!

oldnavy
02-18-2015, 09:00 AM
Nailed it. Weezie made this point early in the thread, too.

I was at Duke in the mid-80's. Dean hated us and upstart Mike K, and we hated him. I'd love to give a warm revisionist history, suggesting we were all just kindred spirits and fellow travelers in the spirited competition of sport, but that's not true.

Of those who think this is a good idea, I'd love to see an age break-down. Not saying us crusties are right -- just saying we had to endure Dean and have a different perspective.

A moment of silence is an appropriate honor. I don't have a problem if folks want to do more, but the idea of wearing a shirt with his name on it is not appealing to me.

YES! Plus we also had to endure the UNC faithful during that time (Dean's tenure) when "the Carolina way*" was birthed, nursed and matured into accepted dogma by most.... unless you grew up during the height of the arrogance that was "the Carolina way*" you really wouldn't understand.

*= lies and BS

Danke Shane
02-18-2015, 09:25 AM
Nailed it. Weezie made this point early in the thread, too.

I was at Duke in the mid-80's. Dean hated us and upstart Mike K, and we hated him. I'd love to give a warm revisionist history, suggesting we were all just kindred spirits and fellow travelers in the spirited competition of sport, but that's not true.

Of those who think this is a good idea, I'd love to see an age break-down. Not saying us crusties are right -- just saying we had to endure Dean and have a different perspective.

A moment of silence is an appropriate honor. I don't have a problem if folks want to do more, but the idea of wearing a shirt with his name on it is not appealing to me.

I have a feeling the supporters of the shirt have only known Duke Basketball during the "ABD" Billy-Packer n friends-Duke-gets-all-the-calls years and beyond. This seems more like an attempt at trying to win over the "hearts and minds" than an attempt at honoring someone.

hudlow
02-18-2015, 09:42 AM
Maybe I'm just arguing semantics but.....I'm not a Duke Alum, I've never set foot in Cameron but I've been to my share of Duke games and ACC tourneys since I became a Duke fan in the early 70's.

Because I didn't attend Duke, I know I was not privileged to be a part of the "true rivalry" that Duke students enjoy with Carolina and my dislike for the Tar Heels cannot ever be the same as those who did.

That being said...."Hate" is a strong word for me. I reserve it for cancer, those who abuse children and old men who send our best off to needless wars.

As I said, I'll never know the depth of the rivalry as a Duke Alum. But I can't bring myself to hate anyone just because they are delusional, misguided and gullible enough to buy into "The Carolina Way"

There's no love lost and I feel a weird sense of pity, but "hate"....life's too short for that.

However it's decided to honor Coach Smith, I hope it's short, sweet, respectful and shows Duke's unique class while the team is soundly whipping Baby Blue Butt tonight.

GO DUKE!

hud

BluBones
02-18-2015, 09:43 AM
Without retracing every post in this thread, I'm willing to bet that the majority of those in favor of wearing shirts to honor Dean Smith tomorrow night were never in the building when he was competing against Duke or were too young to have seen him coach.

Maybe. But I was in the building when Dean Smith was competing against Duke. I was there when we had no expectation of winning.

Things change. If K can get over a reflexive antipathy towards Dean, I don't see why fans can't.

mattman91
02-18-2015, 09:45 AM
Maybe I'm just arguing semantics but.....I'm not a Duke Alum, I've never set foot in Cameron but I've been to my share of Duke games and ACC tourneys since I became a Duke fan in the early 70's.

Because I didn't attend Duke, I know I was not privileged to be a part of the "true rivalry" that Duke students enjoy with Carolina and my dislike for the Tar Heels cannot ever be the same as those who did.

That being said...."Hate" is a strong word for me. I reserve it for cancer, those who abuse children and old men who send our best off to needless wars.

As I said, I'll never know the depth of the rivalry as a Duke Alum. But I can't bring myself to hate anyone just because they are delusional, misguided and gullible enough to buy into "The Carolina Way"

There's no love lost and I feel a weird sense of pity, but "hate"....life's too short for that.

However it's decided to honor Coach Smith, I hope it's short, sweet, respectful and shows Duke's unique class while the team is soundly whipping Baby Blue Butt tonight.

GO DUKE!

hud

Tried sporking you but couldn't. Very well said.

GO DUKE!

Trinity09
02-18-2015, 10:10 AM
Maybe. But I was in the building when Dean Smith was competing against Duke. I was there when we had no expectation of winning.

Things change. If K can get over a reflexive antipathy towards Dean, I don't see why fans can't.

You can respect a man without canonizing him. This post and others imply that those who don't wear the shirts and fawn over Dean have an irrational hatred of him and are acting disrespectfully. There's very little "reflexive antipathy" in this thread. The "anti-shirt" crowd's points have largely been much more nuanced than those of the "pro-shirt" crowd.

sagegrouse
02-18-2015, 10:31 AM
And if you could get Coach K to wear it, I predict that heads would explode at Inside Carolina. If the tie he wore to the service brought up some nasty comments*, just think what the shirt would do.



Ummm,... we wouldn't know -- we'd be covered with gore from the exploding heads at DBR.

FerryFor50
02-18-2015, 10:33 AM
Ummm,... we wouldn't know -- we'd be covered with gore from the exploding heads at DBR.

Seeing on how this thread is 5 pages, over/under on the exploding heads/K wears Dean shirt thread?

The Gordog
02-18-2015, 10:58 AM
Maybe I'm just arguing semantics but.....I'm not a Duke Alum, I've never set foot in Cameron but I've been to my share of Duke games and ACC tourneys since I became a Duke fan in the early 70's.

Because I didn't attend Duke, I know I was not privileged to be a part of the "true rivalry" that Duke students enjoy with Carolina and my dislike for the Tar Heels cannot ever be the same as those who did.

That being said...."Hate" is a strong word for me. I reserve it for cancer, those who abuse children and old men who send our best off to needless wars.
As I said, I'll never know the depth of the rivalry as a Duke Alum. But I can't bring myself to hate anyone just because they are delusional, misguided and gullible enough to buy into "The Carolina Way"

There's no love lost and I feel a weird sense of pity, but "hate"....life's too short for that.

However it's decided to honor Coach Smith, I hope it's short, sweet, respectful and shows Duke's unique class while the team is soundly whipping Baby Blue Butt tonight.

GO DUKE!

hud

Beautifully said! Can I use that sometime? :cool:

peterjswift
02-18-2015, 11:09 AM
As I said, I'll never know the depth of the rivalry as a Duke Alum. But I can't bring myself to hate anyone just because they are delusional, misguided and gullible enough to buy into "The Carolina Way"

There's no love lost and I feel a weird sense of pity, but "hate"....life's too short for that.

However it's decided to honor Coach Smith, I hope it's short, sweet, respectful and shows Duke's unique class while the team is soundly whipping Baby Blue Butt tonight.


Hudlow,
I appreciate your post. As someone who is also not an alum, and also closer to the age of the students than I am to many of those who attended Duke during the 80s and before, I don't have the same degree of distaste for Smith as others. That being said, I would hope any tribute would actually be a tribute...not anything that is self-serving or any attempt to change folks' attitudes towards Duke or their fans. For any tribute to have any meaning or be beneficial, it can't be used as a tool for an end other than to memorialize Dean Smith.

I do appreciate that Duke fans and others are in a difficult position....the cognitive dissonance is not easy to deal with when it comes to a rival who we suddenly have to like or appreciate. I think part of this discussion is that no one wants to have to pretend - and I think that is appropriate. It wouldn't be a memorial or have any meaning if a bunch of people are pretending to appreciate things they dislike or even hate.

That's why I think any tribute or any memorial should focus on the things that Duke fans can thank Dean for, and from my young and naive perspective, I have the several weeks leading up to and the day of this game to thank Dean for. Tonight (and two weeks from tonight) are two dates that I look forward to all season thanks in part to the bitterness of the rivalry from previous decades. This thankfulness isn't solely directed toward Dean, but he definitely is a part of it, and for that reason I hope the Crazies and the Duke team do observe a moment of silence to consider those things that Dean contributed toward the rivalry - both good and bad.

I think what is sometimes lost is the purpose of a moment of silence. The moment of silence is not a memorial in and of itself - it is an opportunity for reflection on the person. That is the memorial - it is an opportunity for everyone to remember and focus on Dean Smith for that moment. That doesn't just mean the good things he did, that is remembering him from all perspectives. That's why I think a moment of silence is so important and worthwhile for this rivalry - this isn't revisionist history or warm and fuzzies - this is simply taking a moment for everyone to think about the man that has passed. I think it is something that someone of Dean's importance to the sport and rivalry has earned...and it is something that everyone from the undergrads to the "crusties" can participate in their own way. The undergrads experience of the moment will likely be different from those upstairs, but the purpose of a memorial will be met regardless.

So that all being said - I don't like the t-shirts, I don't like a video memorial...I don't like the fluff. I think a moment of silence, however, is the perfect memorial that shouldn't have the hint of being self-serving or offensive.

OldPhiKap
02-18-2015, 11:13 AM
Maybe I'm just arguing semantics but.....I'm not a Duke Alum, I've never set foot in Cameron but I've been to my share of Duke games and ACC tourneys since I became a Duke fan in the early 70's.

Because I didn't attend Duke, I know I was not privileged to be a part of the "true rivalry" that Duke students enjoy with Carolina and my dislike for the Tar Heels cannot ever be the same as those who did.

That being said...."Hate" is a strong word for me. I reserve it for cancer, those who abuse children and old men who send our best off to needless wars.

As I said, I'll never know the depth of the rivalry as a Duke Alum. But I can't bring myself to hate anyone just because they are delusional, misguided and gullible enough to buy into "The Carolina Way"

There's no love lost and I feel a weird sense of pity, but "hate"....life's too short for that.

However it's decided to honor Coach Smith, I hope it's short, sweet, respectful and shows Duke's unique class while the team is soundly whipping Baby Blue Butt tonight.

GO DUKE!

hud

I don't think anyone is suggesting that non-alums cannot or do not feel the rivalry as strongly as alumni. From attendance these days, you probably feel it stronger than some current students. Many of us are describing our personal feelings of Dean, from our experiences. Some may be alumni, some may not be.

There is a broad spectrum of feelings towards Dean, as there should be. It is a complicated relationship.

There are folks who hated Dean with more of a passion than I did. There are folks who admired him. There are folks who have mellowed about Dean, there are folks who are more incensed now after the Wainstein Report. I don't think any less of any of these people because of how they feel. But I'm not going to tell them how they "should" feel, either, as some have on this thread. (Last sentence NOT aimed at or referring you, hud -- want to make that clear).

Anyone who wants to wear a shirt, by all means do. Anyone who wants to throw rotten garbage at the television when they show a picture of Dean, well -- perhaps there is more reason to it than just a failure to look into their heart.

As peterjswift eloquently stated, a moment of silence is appropriate. I do not think that anyone has suggested that we do less.

Anyway, Go Duke. Beat Carolina. Roy knew.

hudlow
02-18-2015, 11:27 AM
Beautifully said! Can I use that sometime? :cool:

Please do...I was having a rare moment of coherency.

hudlow
02-18-2015, 11:33 AM
I don't think anyone is suggesting that non-alums cannot or do not feel the rivalry as strongly as alumni. From attendance these days, you probably feel it stronger than some current students. Many of us are describing our personal feelings of Dean, from our experiences. Some may be alumni, some may not be.

There is a broad spectrum of feelings towards Dean, as there should be. It is a complicated relationship.

There are folks who hated Dean with more of a passion than I did. There are folks who admired him. There are folks who have mellowed about Dean, there are folks who are more incensed now after the Wainstein Report. I don't think any less of any of these people because of how they feel. But I'm not going to tell them how they "should" feel, either, as some have on this thread. (Last sentence NOT aimed at or referring you, hud -- want to make that clear).

Anyone who wants to wear a shirt, by all means do. Anyone who wants to throw rotten garbage at the television when they show a picture of Dean, well -- perhaps there is more reason to it than just a failure to look into their heart.

As peterjswift eloquently stated, a moment of silence is appropriate. I do not think that anyone has suggested that we do less.

Anyway, Go Duke. Beat Carolina. Roy knew.

Thanks OPK....We're all in the same boat together when it gets down to it.

GO DUKE

OldPhiKap
02-18-2015, 11:49 AM
Thanks OPK....We're all in the same boat together when it gets down to it.

GO DUKE

Hell yes. Go DUKE!

(Could not spork your initial thread -- must wait -- but very well-stated)

Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15
02-18-2015, 12:04 PM
How about if we agree that whether or not one supports this idea of selling shirts to benefit charity and honor Dean Smith is NOT indicative of how "true" a fan one is?

Personally, I'm hoping that the Duke fans/players/admin comes up with a unique way to celebrate the man pregame that is indicative of the... unique relationship that Duke had with Dean. And then, we go out and make UNC wish the roads were still iced over so that they could never make the trip in the first place.

Let's not get too hung up on this - I like the gesture the shirts suggest, many don't. But come 9pm tonight, let's go whoop some Tar Heel rears!

Go Duke!

HaveFunExpectToWin
02-18-2015, 12:17 PM
Who! Who doesn't want to wear the DEAN shirt!
4766

aimo
02-18-2015, 12:33 PM
Moment of silence, fine. T-shirts? Absolutely not.

trinity92
02-18-2015, 02:12 PM
With recent IC posts running the gamut from saying Coach K (actually, you get chastised over there if you don't call him Krat, but I digress) had nefarious intentions and was grandstanding with his wearing the tie, to posters on a thread about Jay Williams' announcing asking if he planned on getting to a recent game by motorcycle, I think they're lucky if all of Cameron doesn't chant "Dean can't find the Dome." And yes, folks, in case I was too subtle, that's a dementia/alzheimers joke. Too soon?

It's not impossible to understand the animosity if you didn't go to Duke, but you did miss the experience I had of encountering carolina fans driving around campus talking smack after a victory. Think about that-- they drove all the way over to let us know they had won.

AIRFORCEDUKIE
02-18-2015, 02:31 PM
This rivalry is poison I tell you poison. But I agree going over to IC enrages me, which is why I avoid it at all times. I've grown up enough to know that the internet is not the place to look for sanity or quality analysis. Unless of course its here at DBR.

TruBlu
02-18-2015, 02:32 PM
That being said...."Hate" is a strong word for me. I reserve it for cancer, those who abuse children and old men who send our best off to needless wars.

However it's decided to honor Coach Smith, I hope it's short, sweet, respectful and shows Duke's unique class while the team is soundly whipping Baby Blue Butt tonight.

GO DUKE!

hud


Great post. We (me included) do toss around the word "Hate" too easily. My son explained it to me this way: "Hate", when used in a sports rivalry, should be understood to have a silent "Sports" in front of the word "Hate".

We want them to lose every game. We do not wish them or any of their fans harm. We actually have sympathy for them when actual harm comes their way, including the loss of someone that they love. Their fans, and especially Dean's family and close friends, love Dean.

I also hope (and expect) that all true Duke fans tonight show respect to Dean, and Dean's loved ones and family. Anything else will reflect (IMO) negatively on the individual(s) who show disrespect. Unfortunately, there are some Duke "Sports Haters" who will claim that those (if any) individuals are representative of all Duke fans.


"Sports" GTHC

alteran
02-18-2015, 03:15 PM
I also hope (and expect) that all true Duke fans tonight show respect to Dean, and Dean's loved ones and family. Anything else will reflect (IMO) negatively on the individual(s) who show disrespect. Unfortunately, there are some Duke "Sports Haters" who will claim that those (if any) individuals are representative of all Duke fans.


Prepare yourself for the Duke Community getting dinged no matter what they do tonight.

DarkstarWahoo
02-18-2015, 04:35 PM
We want them to lose every game. We do not wish them or any of their fans harm. We actually have sympathy for them when actual harm comes their way, including the loss of someone that they love. Their fans, and especially Dean's family and close friends, love Dean.


This is, of course, exactly right, but something about the cadence of this post reminds me of the SNL sketch about the Guy Who Plays Mr. Belvedere Fan Club. "I should want to cook him a simple meal. I shouldn't want to cut into him, to tear the flesh, to wear the flesh, to be born unto new worlds where his flesh becomes my key."

CameronBornAndBred
02-18-2015, 04:49 PM
No disrespect to the creator of the shirt, but as a die-hard Duke fan, I will be disappointed and embarrassed if any Crazies are wearing the shirt at the game.
I read this earlier today but wasn't able to respond until now. I would never be be disappointed or embarrassed at the thought of ANY Duke fan, Crazie or Crustie, wearing this shirt. I could see how you might be embarrassed in doing it yourself; that's an easy solution...don't wear it. I am neither pro-shirt or anti-shirt, but I think it is a respectable and noteworthy way of making note of Dean's passing. One of my clients today came into his office, and without knowing that I am a Duke fan made a comment about how he saw it on the news and "thought that was really cool". So...you are embarrassed at Duke fans doing something in a positive light?
I'd reserve that judgement for Maryland fans and their vulgar shirts and signs, not for a Duke fan's positive note of our #1 rival's coach's passing.

jv001
02-18-2015, 04:59 PM
This rivalry is poison I tell you poison. But I agree going over to IC enrages me, which is why I avoid it at all times. I've grown up enough to know that the internet is not the place to look for sanity or quality analysis. Unless of course its here at DBR.

That's why I hope the Duke fans don't bring themselves down to IC/uncheat lowlife. Whether fans wear the tee shirt or don't is up to them. I would not but that's my belief. A moment of silence for a deceased coach is fine with me. GoDuke!

Danke Shane
02-18-2015, 05:03 PM
This is, of course, exactly right, but something about the cadence of this post reminds me of the SNL sketch about the Guy Who Plays Mr. Belvedere Fan Club. "I should want to cook him a simple meal. I shouldn't want to cut into him, to tear the flesh, to wear the flesh, to be born unto new worlds where his flesh becomes my key."

A+ callback and reference!

Oriole Way
02-18-2015, 07:06 PM
I read this earlier today but wasn't able to respond until now. I would never be be disappointed or embarrassed at the thought of ANY Duke fan, Crazie or Crustie, wearing this shirt. I could see how you might be embarrassed in doing it yourself; that's an easy solution...don't wear it. I am neither pro-shirt or anti-shirt, but I think it is a respectable and noteworthy way of making note of Dean's passing. One of my clients today came into his office, and without knowing that I am a Duke fan made a comment about how he saw it on the news and "thought that was really cool". So...you are embarrassed at Duke fans doing something in a positive light?
I'd reserve that judgement for Maryland fans and their vulgar shirts and signs, not for a Duke fan's positive note of our #1 rival's coach's passing.

Do you not think that Dean Smith oversaw the beginnings of the athletic/academic scandal at UNC? Because I do, as the evidence shows that everyone from Roy Williams back to Dean knew.

As such, I believe Dean was a cheater. Honoring him when the NCAA is investigating 20 years of fraud at UNC is foolish at the very best.

Even if you think Dean was a saint, he wasn't - and isn't - bigger than the rivalry. Wearing these shirts at the game is the Cameron Crazies' all-time low point.

Duvall
02-18-2015, 07:09 PM
Wearing these shirts at the game is the Cameron Crazies' all-time low point.

The shirts are weird, self-indulgent and a bizarre tribute to a man that hated Duke fans, but that's a silly claim. Also, I'll be surprised if there are many shirts at the game.

Oriole Way
02-18-2015, 07:25 PM
The shirts are weird, self-indulgent and a bizarre tribute to a man that hated Duke fans, but that's a silly claim. Also, I'll be surprised if there are many shirts at the game.

What would be the low point in your opinion? Herman Veal?

Stuff like that was boorish behavior. This is weakness and political correctness disguised as a noble gesture. I find that more offensive.

I hope you're right about there not being many shirts at the game, though.

mattman91
02-18-2015, 07:55 PM
In the brief pre game shots of the crowd I have seen zero Dean shirts.

ricks68
02-18-2015, 08:05 PM
Just thought y'all would like to know that they sold over 1600 shirts per Aaron Kirschenfeld's twitter account, with more being provided for those attending the game. I would suggest reading the article in the N & O posted earlier to understand how it came about and the reasoning behind it. For me, a moment of silence would be the appropriate way to go, but I can now have some understanding about why it is being done. So, expect to see a lot more shirts than you would think. Hopefully, the responses by some at the game will also keep it in perspective so that those over at Cheaters U and IC will have less ammunition than usual for their pitiful nasty diatribes. As Dean Wormer said: "I hate those guys." (Just a quote, so please don't get on me for using the word "hate".)

GTHC!!!!!!

ricks

DU82
02-18-2015, 08:06 PM
z
In the brief pre game shots of the crowd I have seen zero Dean shirts.

I haven't spotted any yet, although I'm a bit far from the student section (holding up the back wall.)

ricks68
02-18-2015, 08:08 PM
In the brief pre game shots of the crowd I have seen zero Dean shirts.

Interesting.

(Make sure you have good tires on for traction tomorrow, Mattman. Call if you need directions, but the new Google Maps can get you here pretty easily.)

ricks

mattman91
02-18-2015, 08:09 PM
Just thought y'all would like to know that they sold over 1600 shirts per Aaron Kirschenfeld's twitter account, with more being provided for those attending the game. I would suggest reading the article in the N & O posted earlier to understand how it came about and the reasoning behind it. For me, a moment of silence would be the appropriate way to go, but I can now have some understanding about why it is being done. So, expect to see a lot more shirts than you would think. Hopefully, the responses by some at the game will also keep it in perspective so that those over at Cheaters U and IC will have less ammunition than usual for their pitiful nasty diatribes. As Dean Wormer said: "I hate those guys." (Just a quote, so please don't get on me for using the word "hate".)

GTHC!!!!!!

ricks

It's ok. I hate those sons of britches too.

mattman91
02-18-2015, 08:10 PM
Interesting.

(Make sure you have good tires on for traction tomorrow, Mattman. Call if you need directions, but the new Google Maps can get you here pretty easily.)

ricks

Luckily, I have some fairly new tires. Shoot me a text with your address.

AIRFORCEDUKIE
02-18-2015, 09:18 PM
I havent seen any Dean shirts... Thread closed? Haha

DangerDevil
02-18-2015, 09:54 PM
2 old guys wearing them on the baseline under the hoop we are defending.

CameronBornAndBred
02-18-2015, 10:09 PM
The two teams and coaches sharing center court was pretty powerful.

peterjswift
02-18-2015, 11:51 PM
The two teams and coaches sharing center court was pretty powerful.

I thought this was a great and appropriate tribute.

elvis14
02-18-2015, 11:53 PM
I thought this was a great and appropriate tribute.

I thought so too. Classy move, well done and not over the top.

uh_no
02-19-2015, 12:48 AM
there were at least a few dozen crusties wearing them. i had no real problem with it, as it probably was much more personal to them than a bunch of students who were mostly not alive when dean was coaching.

westwall
02-19-2015, 01:09 AM
there were at least a few dozen crusties wearing them. i had no real problem with it, as it probably was much more personal to them than a bunch of students who were mostly not alive when dean was coaching.

A "few dozen" may be high. I spotted 8 in Sections 3-5 and some of those appeared to be UNC fans, Couldn't see any above the Crazies across the way, but could have been a couple.

uh_no
02-19-2015, 01:13 AM
A "few dozen" may be high. I spotted 8 in Sections 3-5 and some of those appeared to be UNC fans, Couldn't see any above the Crazies across the way, but could have been a couple.

that's 1/5 of the sections. 8*5=40, or a few dozen. There were at least 5 in my section alone.

weezie
02-19-2015, 01:21 AM
I sat next to two of them. They were a tad nervous looking. Maybe something was bothering them. Maybe it was me.

DukieInKansas
02-19-2015, 01:34 AM
The two teams and coaches sharing center court was pretty powerful.

Very cool moment. I really liked that Quinn Cook was on one side of Roy and Coach K on the other.

CameronBornAndBred
02-19-2015, 08:15 AM
Very cool moment. I really liked that Quinn Cook was on one side of Roy and Coach K on the other.

"It shows the class this rivalry has," Williams said. "Some people hate, hate, hate, and I want to beat their butts so bad I can taste it. But there's a great deal of respect between the two programs."

The rarest of sights in a rivalry, but there they were: Tar Heels. Blue Devils. Krzyzewski. Williams. One arm draped around the next man, all around the circle at half court. They paused for a moment of silence to honor Smith before the national anthem.

"Last night when we met I talked to my team about Coach Smith, who he was and what he did," Krzyzewski said, "... it means a lot. I loved the way that went. He's looking down and saying he may not have liked the result of the game, but I'm sure he liked the way both teams played."
http://espn.go.com/blog/collegebasketballnation/post/_/id/103237/duke-and-north-carolina-provide-exactly-what-the-game-needed

aimo
02-19-2015, 08:47 AM
I saw eight.

Chillduck
02-19-2015, 01:57 PM
And Roy Williams shows his respect to the rivalry by taping over DUKE on his chair! Always classy, Roy! I don't think we will ever see ROY shirts in Cameron!

77devil
02-19-2015, 02:13 PM
And Roy Williams shows his respect to the rivalry by taping over DUKE on his chair! Always classy, Roy! I don't think we will ever see ROY shirts in Cameron!

No big deal. It's done everywhere, including the Dome, to denote Roy's chair.

OldPhiKap
02-19-2015, 02:21 PM
No big deal. It's done everywhere, including the Dome, to denote Roy's chair.

I thought it was always the chair with the RC Cola next to it.