Toughness and Emotion

[slower]

I posted this in the St. John's post-game thread, but thought it might work as a separate thread.

Last night was huge.

To me, the most memorable part of the game was seeing Tyus show some raw emotion near half-court. THAT'S the kind of passion we need from these guys. We get it pretty regularly from Amile, Quinn and Sheed, but if Tyus and Jah get in the spirit, it's gonna be fun.

I'm sick and tired of seeing teams try to punk us. It happens year after year. Thank God for the Thorntons and Singlers of the world, because turning the other cheek is NOT the right way to respond to teams that try to bully you. In street-ball, let-them-play, incompetent-ref games like last night, you just can't be soft. The mental game and confidence is hugely important. If our guys get treated like punks and don't respond, they'll be perceived as punks or soft. You don't think other teams can smell that? I WANT Tyus pumping his fists and I WANT Jah talking smack and absolutely punishing people and I WANT Marshall and everybody else in there trading blow for blow. Heck, I don't even care if somebody takes a swing and gets ejected, I just don't want them to get bullied. You know that K is tough as nails under his classy exterior, and he probably secretly wouldn't mind a good scuffle to instill some team toughness and swagger. Do you think Nate's internal temperature approaches 212 degrees when our guys get pushed around?

Look back at our championship teams. Yes, they had great talent. But they didn't let people push them around. How do you think Laettner, Hurley, JWill or Kyle would have acted last night? I would have LOVED to see one of those guys out there. Let's hope our current squad channels the toughness of those great teams.

[duke74]

I posted this in the St. John's post-game thread, but thought it might work as a separate thread.

Last night was huge.

To me, the most memorable part of the game was seeing Tyus show some raw emotion near half-court. THAT'S the kind of passion we need from these guys. We get it pretty regularly from Amile, Quinn and Sheed, but if Tyus and Jah get in the spirit, it's gonna be fun.

I'm sick and tired of seeing teams try to punk us. It happens year after year. Thank God for the Thorntons and Singlers of the world, because turning the other cheek is NOT the right way to respond to teams that try to bully you. In street-ball, let-them-play, incompetent-ref games like last night, you just can't be soft. The mental game and confidence is hugely important. If our guys get treated like punks and don't respond, they'll be perceived as punks or soft. You don't think other teams can smell that? I WANT Tyus pumping his fists and I WANT Jah talking smack and absolutely punishing people and I WANT Marshall and everybody else in there trading blow for blow. Heck, I don't even care if somebody takes a swing and gets ejected, I just don't want them to get bullied. You know that K is tough as nails under his classy exterior, and he probably secretly wouldn't mind a good scuffle to instill some team toughness and swagger. Do you think Nate's internal temperature approaches 212 degrees when our guys get pushed around?

Look back at our championship teams. Yes, they had great talent. But they didn't let people push them around. How do you think Laettner, Hurley, JWill or Kyle would have acted last night? I would have LOVED to see one of those guys out there. Let's hope our current squad channels the toughness of those great teams.

Completely agree. Was there yesterday and saw this tide of emotion welling up during the course of the game Saw more emotion out of Jah in the last 8 or so minutes than at any other point this year. Enough was just enough....

[Nugget]

I posted this in the St. John's post-game thread, but thought it might work as a separate thread.

Last night was huge.

To me, the most memorable part of the game was seeing Tyus show some raw emotion near half-court. THAT'S the kind of passion we need from these guys. We get it pretty regularly from Amile, Quinn and Sheed, but if Tyus and Jah get in the spirit, it's gonna be fun.

I'm sick and tired of seeing teams try to punk us. It happens year after year. Thank God for the Thorntons and Singlers of the world, because turning the other cheek is NOT the right way to respond to teams that try to bully you. In street-ball, let-them-play, incompetent-ref games like last night, you just can't be soft. The mental game and confidence is hugely important. If our guys get treated like punks and don't respond, they'll be perceived as punks or soft. You don't think other teams can smell that? I WANT Tyus pumping his fists and I WANT Jah talking smack and absolutely punishing people and I WANT Marshall and everybody else in there trading blow for blow. Heck, I don't even care if somebody takes a swing and gets ejected, I just don't want them to get bullied. You know that K is tough as nails under his classy exterior, and he probably secretly wouldn't mind a good scuffle to instill some team toughness and swagger. Do you think Nate's internal temperature approaches 212 degrees when our guys get pushed around?

Look back at our championship teams. Yes, they had great talent. But they didn't let people push them around. How do you think Laettner, Hurley, JWill or Kyle would have acted last night? I would have LOVED to see one of those guys out there. Let's hope our current squad channels the toughness of those great teams.


I don't think in any way that "toughness" is any way equivalent to nor demonstrated by "showing emotion." Johnny Dawkins and Shane Battier are two of the "toughest" Duke players I have ever seen and I would be hard put to name any instance of them making memorable public displays of "emotion." Or, to go the the shade of blue, think of Marcus Paige. He's carried UNC for almost 3 years being the only player on the team who can make a shot outside 6 feet. He strikes me as enormously "tough," but I don't think I have ever seen any change in his demanor.

So, while I wholeheartedly echo that we need to play with toughness, I think you look in the wrong place for it by judging its presence or absence on displays of emotion.

[CDu]

I don't think in any way that "toughness" is any way equivalent to nor demonstrated by "showing emotion." Johnny Dawkins and Shane Battier are two of the "toughest" Duke players I have ever seen and I would be hard put to name any instance of them making memorable public displays of "emotion." Or, to go the the shade of blue, think of Marcus Paige. He's carried UNC for almost 3 years being the only player on the team who can make a shot outside 6 feet. He strikes me as enormously "tough," but I don't think I have ever seen any change in his demanor.

So, while I wholeheartedly echo that we need to play with toughness, I think you look in the wrong place for it by judging its presence or absence on displays of emotion.

I agree. Two good examples from our own team:
- Justice Winslow, who is not at all emotional/vocal on the floor, would be considered by many/most to be very tough
- Rasheed Sulaimon, who is as emotional as they come, probably doesn't qualify as overly tough. He frequently lets his emotions get the better of him, which is not a good show of toughness in my mind.

That being said, I do think yesterday's game was one of those cases where toughness and emotion coincided. We were getting pushed around out there, and were not tough enough. Then, down the stretch, we got fired up and we started playing tougher. So the two can coexist, but they are not 100% correlated by any means.


Note: this is not meant to be a badmouthing of Sulaimon, who is a terrific player and has been a very good teammate throughout his career. Just that "tough" isn't the term I'd first use to describe him.

[slower]

I don't think in any way that "toughness" is any way equivalent to nor demonstrated by "showing emotion." Johnny Dawkins and Shane Battier are two of the "toughest" Duke players I have ever seen and I would be hard put to name any instance of them making memorable public displays of "emotion." Or, to go the the shade of blue, think of Marcus Paige. He's carried UNC for almost 3 years being the only player on the team who can make a shot outside 6 feet. He strikes me as enormously "tough," but I don't think I have ever seen any change in his demanor.

So, while I wholeheartedly echo that we need to play with toughness, I think you look in the wrong place for it by judging its presence or absence on displays of emotion.

My comments are concerned mostly with the kind of game we saw last night. Sometimes, toughness COUPLED WITH emotion IS the best response. To disregard or underestimate the relationship between confidence and outward displays of emotion/toughness, particularly in situations like last night, is to misunderstand human nature, IMO.

[AIRFORCEDUKIE]

Honestly, when I was playing if someone on my team got laid out and stared down like Amile did on Sunday, he would be on his backside very soon after if not immediately after. However, we just weren't very good and that was our only way to respond to those situations. In the moment though I don't think anyone on Duke realized just what was happening, and I don't think Coach K coaches his teams to play that kind of basketball.

The toughness I want to see out of this team is Quinn Cook toughness, things are going bad and he makes his defender look silly and gives him the look. Or when Jah finished and just made his defender look like a little kid even though Jah is just a freshman. Its moments and play making that make a team like Duke tough. We can't get caught up trading blow for blow with other teams. Every team plays us that way and it would cost us fouls and free throws, neither of which we can afford. We have to respond with timely buckets, and Defensive stops.

If a player gets hard fouled, hit the free throws, make a stop, and come down and nail a three. These are momentum swinging moments in games that Duke needs to take advantage of. No tough guy act or hard foul is any competition for good basketball in timely situations. Let the other team make the boneheaded emotional plays, hopefully they get techs unlike the St. Johns game when there were clearly three situations that warranted techs. I don't think its ever beneficial for a player to get a tech called on him. The only one on Duke who should be getting a tech is Coach K.

This team is too good and too skilled to be dragged down into a fist fight, we can respond in more appropriate ways.

[jv001]

The last 10 minutes Duke displayed mental toughness and physical toughness against the Red Storm. St. Johns displayed punkness throughout the entire game. I don't know St. Johns well enough to say that this is the way they play in all games or this was just their way of saying, "you're not winning Coach K's 1K on our home court. When MPIII and Matt Jones came into the lineup, things changed. The energy picked up, Jahlil began to play more physical, we rebounded better and the guys got excited. But the toughness began on defense. We got stronger on the boards, players moved their feet on defense, players communicated better and then the shots started to drop. I hope to see this continue against ND. We'll need it against The Irish and the Cavaliers. GoDuke!

[duke09hms]

My comments are concerned mostly with the kind of game we saw last night. Sometimes, toughness COUPLED WITH emotion IS the best response. To disregard or underestimate the relationship between confidence and outward displays of emotion/toughness, particularly in situations like last night, is to misunderstand human nature, IMO.

I fully agree with the previous posters that the TRUE toughness Duke should be going for should be in their performance. Not chest-punching or jawing. How many times in the past do we do the floor slap and proceed to give up a layup or a dunk. Sunday might have been the first time in a while that didn't happen.

Case in point: when we were only up 63-62 w/ 4 mins left, Jah backs that SJU defender down with 2 power dribbles straight into the chest, no finesse, and turns for the power finish. Then a simple look that says "I OWN YOU." Toughness in play. Right here at 2:30 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TRS9AvJz5pU#t=150

Finishing through contact and-1s. Where I think we're sometimes handicapped is our dedication to taking 3s. On a psychological level, shooting jumpshots is a MUCH harder way to exert physical dominance or toughness over an opponent. It just doesn't translate as well.

[jv001]

I fully agree with the previous posters that the TRUE toughness Duke should be going for should be in their performance. Not chest-punching or jawing. How many times in the past do we do the floor slap and proceed to give up a layup or a dunk. Sunday might have been the first time in a while that didn't happen.

Case in point: when we were only up 63-62 w/ 4 mins left, Jah backs that SJU defender down with 2 power dribbles straight into the chest, no finesse, and turns for the power finish. Then a simple look that says "I OWN YOU." Toughness in play. Right here at 2:30 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TRS9AvJz5pU#t=150
Finishing through contact and-1s. Where I think we're sometimes handicapped is our dedication to taking 3s. On a psychological level, shooting jumpshots is a MUCH harder way to exert physical dominance or toughness over an opponent. It just doesn't translate as well.

This was the play that came to mind when I mentioned Jahlil began to play more physical(tough). I also agree about the chest pumping part of your post. But I did like Tyus' emotional outburst toward the end of the game. But the whistle had blown there and it didn't hurt us on defense by not getting back down court. Good post duke09. GoDuke!

[DukieInBrasil]

I missed the first 10 minutes or so, and therefore missed the hard foul on Amile followed by the staredown which people keep referring to. Is there anyway to grab that sequence from the game and post it here (a la the now deleted Wheat/TJones 3pt foul convo in the post-game thread)?
From the rest of the game that i did see, i thought there was just an insane amount of fouling permitted by the refs, coupled with the blatantly wrong call on the 3FG to close the 1st half, plus the travel under the basket by SJ.... it was truly one of the most poorly officiated games i've ever seen, or just a typical Big East game.

[grad_devil]

...Is there anyway to grab that sequence from the game and post it here (a la the now deleted Wheat/TJones 3pt foul convo in the post-game thread)?
...

Work? What work? Sure I can find that video clip, but no fancy zoom-in slow motion, like the Tyus video link that was deleted earlier :)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=io_lobhitMQ

[MCFinARL]

I agree. Two good examples from our own team:
- Justice Winslow, who is not at all emotional/vocal on the floor, would be considered by many/most to be very tough
- Rasheed Sulaimon, who is as emotional as they come, probably doesn't qualify as overly tough. He frequently lets his emotions get the better of him, which is not a good show of toughness in my mind.

That being said, I do think yesterday's game was one of those cases where toughness and emotion coincided. We were getting pushed around out there, and were not tough enough. Then, down the stretch, we got fired up and we started playing tougher. So the two can coexist, but they are not 100% correlated by any means.


Note: this is not meant to be a badmouthing of Sulaimon, who is a terrific player and has been a very good teammate throughout his career. Just that "tough" isn't the term I'd first use to describe him.

Minor quibble--I'm not sure I agree that Justise Winslow is not at all emotional on the floor. He often shows some swagger after a good play, including one in a recent game (apologize, I can't remember which game and can't find the clip) in which he faced down a defender after a made basket and Tyus Jones came to pull him away. It's "tough" emotion, but it's still emotion.

[peterjswift]

What does everyone think about tie-ups and who is the last person holding the ball? I've often noticed in games when two people are going for the ball, neither player wants to let go after the whistle. Is it toughness to be the last one holding the ball? Or is it childish? Does the "victor" of the tieup who is left with the ball afterwards get a mental edge by thinking he dominated his opponent somehow?

This is one I go back and forth on a lot. Part of me wants "my guy" to be the one with the ball at the end...and part of me wants him to just let go as soon as the whistle blows and get ready for the next play.

I do agree with the posters on here that point out that emotional outbursts and toughness are not the same, but then again, I want players to protect their teammates. When Amile got fouled hard on Sunday, I was surprised that there wasn't an immediate wall of teammates separating him from the players in white and red. I don't know if that is a signal of lack of toughness, or just lack of awareness.

[dukebballcamper90-91]

Some good points here. I having been saying similar things to fellow basketball fans I'm in contact with. I think if this team can figure out the mental and physical toughness of the game like our great teams, it could be a nightmare for the competition. The one play where Jah had ball just a step or 2 outside block and the guy with little shorts on had his chest all on Jah and Jah, took a dribble and put his should in guy with little shorts and backed him up a few feet and scored. Jim Jackson made a comment something like, there's no stopping that when he decides that's what he wants to do. I want to see more of that.

[MCFinARL]

What does everyone think about tie-ups and who is the last person holding the ball? I've often noticed in games when two people are going for the ball, neither player wants to let go after the whistle. Is it toughness to be the last one holding the ball? Or is it childish? Does the "victor" of the tieup who is left with the ball afterwards get a mental edge by thinking he dominated his opponent somehow?

This is one I go back and forth on a lot. Part of me wants "my guy" to be the one with the ball at the end...and part of me wants him to just let go as soon as the whistle blows and get ready for the next play.

I do agree with the posters on here that point out that emotional outbursts and toughness are not the same, but then again, I want players to protect their teammates. When Amile got fouled hard on Sunday, I was surprised that there wasn't an immediate wall of teammates separating him from the players in white and red. I don't know if that is a signal of lack of toughness, or just lack of awareness.

I'm not sure what you were expecting here--if you look at the clip posted above, Sulaimon and Plumlee, who are the nearest Duke players, immediately go to Amile. Given that Amile was still on the floor and looked like he might be hurt, I'm not sure I would want them to be confronting the fouling player rather than attending to their teammate.

[dukebballcamper90-91]

I'm not sure what you were expecting here--if you look at the clip posted above, Sulaimon and Plumlee, who are the nearest Duke players, immediately go to Amile. Given that Amile was still on the floor and looked like he might be hurt, I'm not sure I would want them to be confronting the fouling player rather than attending to their teammate.

Let trainer attend to hurt player. Somebody confront the bad guy.

[peterjswift]

I'm not sure what you were expecting here--if you look at the clip posted above, Sulaimon and Plumlee, who are the nearest Duke players, immediately go to Amile. Given that Amile was still on the floor and looked like he might be hurt, I'm not sure I would want them to be confronting the fouling player rather than attending to their teammate.

I don't even necessarily mean confronting the player, but creating a wall of separation with teammates. Circle the wagons. Don't let the other team see your guy on the ground, and don't give them the opportunity to taunt either. Immediately get in between the person on the floor and the other team.

[gumbomoop]

I remember the '91 and '92 champions as being very tough. I'm pretty sure it was Brian Davis who commented before the '91 semifinal with menacing looking-and-playing UNLV, "My guys won't back down." There were a bunch of tough players on those Duke teams; all 5 starters on the '92 champs.

[DukieInBrasil]

Work? What work? Sure I can find that video clip, but no fancy zoom-in slow motion, like the Tyus video link that was deleted earlier :)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=io_lobhitMQ

Thanks!!!
Not sure that should have been a flagrant foul. A) He did get Amile's arm, so that shows intent to make a play on the ball (it's not his fault he's too slow/fat/unathletic to get as high as Amile had the ball). B) The follow through came down on Amile's head, elbow to face and hand wrapped around the top of AJ's head, which seems like what the rule change is designed to prevent, but it's not like he led with his elbow. Seems like a rather gray area of the rule, and i don't fault the refs for not calling a flagrant.
The taunting is also rather gray, in that he stood over the fallen player, but he didn't shout or otherwise insult AJ while he was down. Still, that type of play is the type of play that can cause refs to lose control of the game, and maybe it did cuz those refs were blowing donkey spheroids the whole game long.

[Jeffrey]

The taunting is also rather gray, in that he stood over the fallen player, but he didn't shout or otherwise insult AJ while he was down. Still, that type of play is the type of play that can cause refs to lose control of the game, and maybe it did cuz those refs were blowing donkey spheroids the whole game long.

Hi,

FYI (since you did not see it live), the refs did address him, directly before the FT's, and told him not to stand over the fallen player.

IMO, the body posturing was taunting.

[devildeac]

Thanks!!!
Not sure that should have been a flagrant foul. A) He did get Amile's arm, so that shows intent to make a play on the ball (it's not his fault he's too slow/fat/unathletic to get as high as Amile had the ball). B) The follow through came down on Amile's head, elbow to face and hand wrapped around the top of AJ's head, which seems like what the rule change is designed to prevent, but it's not like he led with his elbow. Seems like a rather gray area of the rule, and i don't fault the refs for not calling a flagrant.
The taunting is also rather gray, in that he stood over the fallen player, but he didn't shout or otherwise insult AJ while he was down. Still, that type of play is the type of play that can cause refs to lose control of the game, and maybe it did cuz those refs were blowing donkey spheroids the whole game long.

If you look at the Playcaller tweets from that game that someone was kind enough to post the link for here, you'll see he had many negative comments about the calls during the game. It's not entirely clear which comment went with which play but the two that stood out to me were the "should have been an F1" and "refs have lost control of the game" (paraphrased). Can't recall if he said anything about the taunting or the push in the back. It's the refs job to control the game and I think they did a lousy job on Sunday which allowed the johnnies to continue their "playground" style. It's not our players' jobs to retaliate after "flagrant" fouls, called or not. K has roles in teaching his players not to retaliate and, as a coach, to "discuss" (cough) with the refs about the style of play. I've seen K get T'd up a couple times but not for several years (IIRC) for plays like that. The last one I recall was at CIS when a hewitt-coached GT player took down Ewing (who didn't get a T:p) from behind on a breakaway or layup and injured his wrist. K was absolutely livid at the call (maybe just a PF and not an intentional) that he got the T and threw off his coat.

[Jeffrey]

Heck, I don't even care if somebody takes a swing and gets ejected, I just don't want them to get bullied.

Hi,

I don't think that's best for Duke basketball. I also would not want to see Okafor ejected.

[captmojo]

Everyone has their own moments that relate to their own definition of 'tough' or 'toughness'.
To me, it's was most revealed by the 'refuse to give up' second half, screaming rebound by Marshall Plumlee.
And, I'd be willing to bet, that was probably one of Coach's favorite moments.


I'm certain there are some here willing to disagree with me.

[jv001]

Thanks!!!
Not sure that should have been a flagrant foul. A) He did get Amile's arm, so that shows intent to make a play on the ball (it's not his fault he's too slow/fat/unathletic to get as high as Amile had the ball). B) The follow through came down on Amile's head, elbow to face and hand wrapped around the top of AJ's head, which seems like what the rule change is designed to prevent, but it's not like he led with his elbow. Seems like a rather gray area of the rule, and i don't fault the refs for not calling a flagrant.
The taunting is also rather gray, in that he stood over the fallen player, but he didn't shout or otherwise insult AJ while he was down. Still, that type of play is the type of play that can cause refs to lose control of the game, and maybe it did cuz those refs were blowing donkey spheroids the whole game long.

Tee him up and toss him for being too fat and slow that he had to revert to such a hard foul, :cool: GoDuke!

[fuse]

The compare / contrast I would offer is in the losses to NC State and Miami, we lacked toughness.

In the win against St Johns, we showed grit, determination and the intestinal fortitude to generate a win out of what looked like would be a crushing loss. That is toughness.

[slower]

I don't even necessarily mean confronting the player, but creating a wall of separation with teammates. Circle the wagons. Don't let the other team see your guy on the ground, and don't give them the opportunity to taunt either. Immediately get in between the person on the floor and the other team.

Abso-freakin-lutely!

I can pretty much guarantee that Tyler Thornton (without question) or Kyle Singler or Dahntay Jones or Laettner, Hurley or JWill would have gotten to Amile quickly and walled him off from the punk who decked him. Also, I'm fairly certain (absolutely certain, in Tyler's case) that the punk might also have been forcibly moved back away from Amile without regard for his feelings or skeletal integrity.

You can't back down from a bully. That's one of the things that you realize as you get older.

Somebody made the comment that "making jump shots" is the way to show toughness. I agree. But there are some situations where, for lack of a better term, your "manhood" is in question. I'm absolutely convinced that a lot of teams out there relish the opportunity to play rough with Duke, for various reasons. And in THOSE situations, each person has to decide how much abuse they're willing to take. Turning the other cheek isn't going to make them suddenly treat you better. It just gives them a different side of your face to punch.

[fuse]

Turning the other cheek isn't going to make them suddenly treat you better. It just gives them a different side of your face to punch.

Never thought I'd have the opportunity to share this "fun fact" on DBR.
Trying to stay away from the source of the quote at the risk of offending anyone, I was recently taught the true meaning behind "turn the other cheek."

In that particular period of history, getting smacked in the face was typically done backhand and symbolic of the person getting smacked having lower social status.
In those days you had a clean hand (right) and a profane hand (left), and you would not generally strike someone with the profane hand (use your imagination).

By turning the other cheek, you force the other person to strike you open handed, which would have symbolized equality between the person hitting and being hit.

So the cool thing about that quote is not turn the other cheek to be a wimp. It is turn the other cheek to be a rebel and put your assailant in a position where they would be acknowledging you as an equal. A subversive gesture for the culture of the time.

Thank you, you may now return to your regularly scheduled basketball programming.

[freshmanjs]

Never thought I'd have the opportunity to share this "fun fact" on DBR.
Trying to stay away from the source of the quote at the risk of offending anyone, I was recently taught the true meaning behind "turn the other cheek."

In that particular period of history, getting smacked in the face was typically done backhand and symbolic of the person getting smacked having lower social status.
In those days you had a clean hand (right) and a profane hand (left), and you would not generally strike someone with the profane hand (use your imagination).

By turning the other cheek, you force the other person to strike you open handed, which would have symbolized equality between the person hitting and being hit.

So the cool thing about that quote is not turn the other cheek to be a wimp. It is turn the other cheek to be a rebel and put your assailant in a position where they would be acknowledging you as an equal. A subversive gesture for the culture of the time.

Thank you, you may now return to your regularly scheduled basketball programming.

that is one interpretation, among several, that have been suggested. it is certainly not accepted as "the true meaning"

[weezie]

...In that particular period of history, getting smacked in the face was typically done backhand and symbolic of the person getting smacked having lower social status.
In those days you had a clean hand (right) and a profane hand (left), and you would not generally strike someone with the profane hand (use your imagination)...


And here's an example of why this is such a good and informative site. Being of Irish descent (very very shanty Irish descent) I'd have hauled off and belted the slapper and the slappee just for being in my way.

Let's Go Devils. Do some irish head slapping in south bend!

[wavedukefan70s]

I'm glad we didn't over react .I'm not sure the technical fouls would have been worth it.
I remember grabbing a guys face mask in highschool after a dirty play.i really remember the 6 am Saturday morning after windsprints and laps.coach wanted his 15 yds back and then some.
But to be honest .I'd do it again.

[flyingdutchdevil]

I'm glad we didn't over react .I'm not sure the technical fouls would have been worth it.

Yup. I never want to see a Duke player throw a punch, even if we are being so-called "bullied". In the history of DBR, there is a lot of talk about "punks" and "thugs", terms frequently used against teams who throw punches. If we do throw punches, I'll be the first to call us "punks" if that happens. That is a low-class, no value move. Punching someone so we can show toughness? Please.

But, as the OP said, showing toughness and emotion is a great thing. IMO, I think this team has a ton of emotion and is still finding their toughness. It'll come.