MBB: Duke 63, Louisville 52 Post-Game Thread

[JBDuke]

Put your post-game thoughts here.

[dukebluesincebirth]

We got our swagger back!

[AIRFORCEDUKIE]

Great adjustments, great win, back on track.. Now we have the hardest part of our schedule coming up. Will we stay in a zone or mix it up some?

[arnie]

We got our swagger back!

I assume we won no thanks to ESPN. Zone looked solid!

[Bay Area Duke Fan]

Pitino must have pulled the plug.

[MCFinARL]

I assume we won no thanks to ESPN. Zone looked solid!

Yeah, that was some very lame work by ESPN. If you lose the camera feed have someone call in a play by play and at least tell folks what is happening.

[wgl1228]

I'll second that Jefferson was absolutely brilliant!

[gurufrisbee]

THAT was good for my heart.

[superdave]

That was a great effort and nice result today. Coach K made some adjustments and showed some new (zone) tricks. Bet no one really thought they'd play THAT much zone.

I look forward to seeing how we play vs Pitt Monday. Will the zone be back? Will it be effective vs a quicker guard?

I thought Amile played great today. Game ball to the veteran.

[jacone21]

Never a doubt!

[kAzE]

I always thought Winslow and Jefferson would be very good in 2-3 zone. Amile was great on both sides of the floor tonight. That combination of length and athleticism on the wings of a 2-3 is pretty ideal. Unfortunately, this will only work against this particular type of team. Our undersized backcourt is going to be an issue no matter what type of defensive scheme we use. They still got a ton of pretty good open looks, they just couldn't hit anything. We're still going to struggle defensively against good shooting teams if we don't figure out our man to man. Still, it was an outstanding effort. Amile, you da real MVP. Harrell, you da real Whoopi Goldberg.

[gocanes0506]

The zone and making them shoot jumpers won the game.

But since the game got closer because of late sloppy O play, U of L fans will blame the refs.

That D will not work against a team that can shoot the 3 even decently. Louisville had a bunch of open 3s.

[FerryFor50]

They out-defensed one of the best defenses in the country *and* scored very well.

Duke's up to 65 in kenpom on D. Louisville is at #4 now.

Amile was a BEAST. And that dunk attempt over Mathiang? Awesome. So glad he's coming on.

Also glad K realized how bad L'ville shoots and stayed in the zone. I didn't expect to see it at all, especially not as much as we saw it. I don't expect to see it in every game, though. Just for teams like L'ville that aren't great from the perimeter. Meaning, I expect we'll see it against UNC.

Okafor was pretty much unstoppable. Wish they had tried to get him the ball earlier in the shot clock down the stretch in the 2nd half rather than forcing it to him for turnovers or taking bad shots with the shot clock running down.

Pretty much the only complaint I have. :)

[TruBlu]

This ends a week long depression period. My wife says "thanks".

Coach K showed flexibility . . . defense was much better because of it. Players were focused and intense (for the most part).

Future opponents will not be able to focus on how to beat the overplay. Part of our past problems is that we were so predictable . . . somewhat on offense, but especially on defense. If an opposing team had a few days to prepare (cough, Lehigh & Mercer), we struggled. Maybe no more.

[freshmanjs]

They out-defensed one of the best defenses in the country *and* scored very well.

Duke's up to 65 in kenpom on D. Louisville is at #4 now.



those rankings dont include this game

[Kfanarmy]

Great win, zone worked against Louisville. Good job by the coaching staff. Working AJs offense in the first half made Louisville adjust the double team and got Okafor going in the 2nd half. Solid interior passing for the most part. Started working clock, and got a bit tentative getting the ball down the court in the last 4-5 minutes, strategy worked against poor shooting team. I think they'd have kept the O going a bit more had Louisville been hitting. Only nit to pick defensively is that JW has to step out on the three point shooter...he has a tendency to stand and dare them to hit it...against a reasonable shooting team, even Louisville hitting their average, this might have been a nail biter. I'm a big MPIII fan, but that couple of minutes he was out on the floor earlier in the 2nd half, Duke had no offense and gave Louisville hope as they went on a 7-0 run, then Duke started trying to drain the clock. a bit better shooting gets Louisville back in the game. Great win, got some mojo back. Let's see what adjustments are made between now and the next game!

[FerryFor50]

I always thought Winslow and Jefferson would be very good in 2-3 zone. Amile was great on both sides of the floor tonight. That combination of length and athleticism on the wings of a 2-3 is pretty ideal. Unfortunately, this will only work against this particular type of team. Our undersized backcourt is going to be an issue no matter what type of defensive scheme we use. They still got a ton of pretty good open looks, they just couldn't hit anything. We're still going to struggle defensively against good shooting teams if we don't figure out our man to man. Still, it was an outstanding effort. Amile, you da real MVP. Harrell, you da real Whoopi Goldberg.

Very few teams have guards that are great penetrators *and* great shooters. So I don't expect that man or zone will be as much of an issue as you think.

[Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15]

We got our swagger back!

I used that exact phrase in talking with my dad.

LOVE Amile coming on strong. We started the season with one of the top back courts, and at the halfway mark, are looking like we have a pretty damned sharp front court too.

[DU82]

Also glad K realized how bad L'ville shoots and stayed in the zone. I didn't expect to see it at all, especially not as much as we saw it. I don't expect to see it in every game, though. Just for teams like L'ville that aren't great from the perimeter. Meaning, I expect we'll see it against UNC.


Now that we've jumped in with the zone, do we go all in and play a box and one against Paige?

[jv001]

The zone and making them shoot jumpers won the game.

But since the game got closer because of late sloppy O play, U of L fans will blame the refs.

That D will not work against a team that can shoot the 3 even decently. Louisville had a bunch of open 3s.

But that zone can be worked on and tweaked so the team can play better zone. I'm not saying zone will be used the most, but I hope Coach K uses it some each game. Just not the same type zone every time. Great job by Coach K and his staff. GoDuke!

[FerryFor50]

those rankings dont include this game

Oh thought they updated them in real time.

Then Duke will likely make a big jump and L'ville will make a slight drop, given the pace of the game wasn't very fast.

[arnie]

The zone and making them shoot jumpers won the game.

But since the game got closer because of late sloppy O play, U of L fans will blame the refs.

That D will not work against a team that can shoot the 3 even decently. Louisville had a bunch of open 3s.

I think if we mix the zone in throughout a game it will work better than the drive- by D we've been playing

[Troublemaker]

We'll probably be mostly a man-to-man team going forward, but the zone is a nice changeup to have in the bag. And for certain opponents, it may indeed be the predominant defense we use.

The offense was mostly tremendous as well. According to SCACC, Duke's offensive efficiency for this game was 110. If true, that's the best offensive performance against Louisville this season.

[Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15]

Now that we've jumped in with the zone, do we go all in and play a box and one against Paige?

Having watched a fair amount of UNC games this year, that looks like a great strategy. He's the only one on that team that can create on offense. Several other guys have got a nice jump shot or some good post skills, but as far as making their own shot, Marcus is the extent.

[CameronBlue]

The zone and making them shoot jumpers won the game.

But since the game got closer because of late sloppy O play, U of L fans will blame the refs.

That D will not work against a team that can shoot the 3 even decently. Louisville had a bunch of open 3s.

Amazing adjustments by the coaches and the team. It didn't surprise me that Duke went to a zone, what amazed me was how well Duke played it. K has NEVER been comfortable with the zone and in past attempts it showed, Duke has usually struggled. My sense that this was Boeheim's influence on K was confirmed by the comment attributed to Chris Collins late in the game. I don't think you have to worry about K being a convert but what a weapon to have in his arsenal. Great execution, terrific game overall.

The only other thing to say about the game is that I have now traveled inside the mind of Matthew McConaughey and it is really, really scary.

[OldPhiKap]

Having watched a fair amount of UNC games this year, that looks like a great strategy. He's the only one on that team that can create on offense. Several other guys have got a nice jump shot or some good post skills, but as far as making their own shot, Marcus is the extent.

Exactly. UNC and Louisville are very similar it seems to me.

[Bob Green]

Now that we've jumped in with the zone, do we go all in and play a box and one against Paige?

I don't think so. The Box and One is a junk defense that works great in high school or recreation league games, but it is difficult to pull off against a legitimate D-1 team/coach.

[Dr. Rosenrosen]

Al Featherston = Nostradamus?

[FerryFor50]

K mentioned in the presser that the offense has been affecting the defense. Also brought up the Wake game as one they could have lost but pulled out with great play in the last 5 minutes. That probably made the team feel like they could play poorly and still win. NCSU and Miami games taught them otherwise.

Also mentioned this game was huge for confidence. "Confidence through accomplishment."

As for the zone, I think it helped keep the points in the paint down, but also helped stop transition points because there was always a man or two at the top of the key to get back.

[Rickshaw]

I don't think you learn a zone defense in 3 days.
I bet coach K was planning to zone the cards irregardless of our last 2 losses.
nice !

[mapei]

I'll have to admit to getting really tense in the last 7-8 minutes when we basically didn't make any shots and Lville's inbounds press was ferocious. Didn't we have to call 3 straight timeouts at one point and still turned it over on the next possession? I've been conditioned to believe that no cushion is ever enough to feel confident when suddenly you can't play offense.

That said, what a win! Until that bad stretch, everything we did worked, and nothing they did worked. Loved seeing Amile break out, and hitting his FTs, too. Go Duke!

[sagegrouse]

If I had been in the press room, I would have asked, "Coach K, when you go to confession, will you mention the zone defense?"

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't it true that in 1,174 games at Duke, this is the first game where he has played zone for (basically) the entire game?

[KandG]

As for the zone, I think it helped keep the points in the paint down, but also helped stop transition points because there was always a man or two at the top of the key to get back.

This is a great point -- one of the most noticeable changes from the last couple of games was how Duke was no longer getting burned on runouts. Seth Davis made a good point during the game as well: changes like this can be exciting for the players, who have clearly been in a rut.

I was still shocked to see the zone used as much as it was, given how long K has been coaching and how he's always had a quick hook on the zone after using it for one or two possessions, when he can be bothered to use it at all. This game had a little bit of an outlier feel, kind of like the game against Miami -- the loser in the last two games wasn't quite as terrible as the score made them out to be, but the matchups and strategies employed exacerbated the losing team's weaknesses.

Would still love to see the zone pulled out a little more often from time to time, and gradually incorporated as a genuine weapon on defense, instead of as a novelty.

UPDATE: As if to reinforce all the observations on zone, Pitino's post-game quote about Duke's zone: "Zone is a smart move because it eliminates Okafor having to come out"

[Troublemaker]

Al Featherston = Nostradamus?

Very close. Even Al didn't anticipate the zone.

But yes, it was definitely a good bet that Coach K would make an adjustment.

[OldPhiKap]

If I had been in the press room, I would have asked, "Coach K, when you go to confession, will you mention the zone defense?"

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't it true that in 1,174 games at Duke, this is the first game where he has played zone for (basically) the entire game?

I can only think of a handful of games where we played zone for a significant portion of a game, let alone as the base defensive scheme for an entire game. I cannot think of anything even close to this, by a long long shot.

[Troublemaker]

I don't think you learn a zone defense in 3 days.

You don't. Duke had implemented this in the fall and even gave it a nice 10-minute practice run in one of the early regular season games.

The past 3 days was spent re-acquainting the team to the zone, not teaching them from scratch.

[NYBri]

This reinforces that it wasn't necessarily the players, but the approach.

I sure am glad, and was surprised, to see zone so much.

K did good switching things other than just the lineup. That would have been just rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic. He grabbed the wheel and turned away from the iceberg.

He has the talent to do many different things....so use that talent to do just that.

[freshmanjs]

Oh thought they updated them in real time.

Then Duke will likely make a big jump and L'ville will make a slight drop, given the pace of the game wasn't very fast.

Duke D now #50. Louisville D still #4.

[tux]

Great game plan from the coaching staff.

I actually didn't think we played the zone all that well (relative to teams that play it often), but obviously well enough to get the W.

We were getting killed on the boards, which can be one of the weaknesses of a zone if guys aren't actively boxing out. I felt like some guys weren't active enough in general.

Yes, UL shot horribly from outside, which they often do (this year). But they were getting good looks from both the 3-pt line and inside IMO. They just missed a bunch of shots. I guess it's just one of my pet peeves --- declaring the defense good or bad solely on the score. Even the announcers were saying that Duke's defense was *much* improved, despite all the uncontested shots.

I guess my thought is that it was a great defense to play against this particular opponent. I think what Duke should do is incorporate some zone principles into their man-to-man, or vice versa --- i.e., match-up a bit more in it to take away some of those open looks.

Anyway, it will be very interesting to see what K does going forward.

[freshmanjs]

Great game plan from the coaching staff.

I actually didn't think we played the zone all that well (relative to teams that play it often), but obviously well enough to get the W.

We were getting killed on the boards, which can be one of the weaknesses of a zone if guys aren't actively boxing out. I felt like some guys weren't active enough in general.

Yes, UL shot horribly from outside, which they often do (this year). But they were getting good looks from both the 3-pt line and inside IMO. They just missed a bunch of shots. I guess it's just one of my pet peeves --- declaring the defense good or bad solely on the score. Even the announcers were saying that Duke's defense was *much* improved, despite all the uncontested shots.

I guess my thought is that it was a great defense to play against this particular opponent. I think what Duke should do is incorporate some zone principles into their man-to-man, or vice versa --- i.e., match-up a bit more in it to take away some of those open looks.

Anyway, it will be very interesting to see what K does going forward.

to this point, i just watched pitino press conference. he said this was the most open shots louisville had all year.

[sagegrouse]

We were getting killed on the boards, which can be one of the weaknesses of a zone if guys aren't actively boxing out. I felt like some guys weren't active enough in general.

.

In the first half, a lot of the offensive rebounds by Lullville were long rebounds on clanged shots. It only converted one of ten OR's into a basket.

[weezie]

Well called game too...for a change.

[davekay1971]

I don't think so. The Box and One is a junk defense that works great in high school or recreation league games, but it is difficult to pull off against a legitimate D-1 team/coach.

Agreed we almost certainly won't see it, but, on the other hand, Coach K did become close friends with Jimmy V, and Valvano was one to throw a junk defense at an opponent from time to time. Would it be stunning to see Sulaimon or Jones as the one in a box and one on Paige? Yes. Would it be awesome to see the look of shock on Ol' Roy's face (not to mention my own) if it happened. Yes. Yes it would.

[tux]

In the first half, a lot of the offensive rebounds by Lullville were long rebounds on clanged shots. It only converted one of ten OR's into a basket.

Yes, because we were giving them a ton of wide open looks from the 3-pt line and they were bricking most of them. The fact that they failed to convert the ORs is more evidence of their awful shooting IMO. But, I'm not arguing that Duke stunk it up. Just that we shouldn't get too excited. I said in the pre-game thread (or the Miami post-game thread) that UL would be a difficult opponent to use for gauging the Duke defense b/c they are so mediocre to bad on that end. The fact that K opened in a zone and pretty much played it throughout really surprised me. I almost expected him to go immediately to man when that first 3 fell...

[BD80]

If I had been in the press room, I would have asked, "Coach K, when you go to confession, will you mention the zone defense?"

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't it true that in 1,174 games at Duke, this is the first game where he has played zone for (basically) the entire game?

Just think how many wins Coach K would have by now if he had only tried playing zone earlier in his career.

Damn Bobby Knight

[jv001]

I don't think so. The Box and One is a junk defense that works great in high school or recreation league games, but it is difficult to pull off against a legitimate D-1 team/coach.

I agree, but The Box and One could be used for a short time to give the uncheaters something new to look at. GoDuke!

[superdave]

Al Featherston = Nostradamus?


Oh really? And I quote from Al's article:

"Let me stop here to elaborate. He's not going to abandon the man-to-man and play zone. I know that there is a segment of Duke fans who have raised a pro-zone chorus in recent days. Without being insulting, allow me to say, they don't know what they are talking about."

Al was dead wrong here. I thought you might see zone for a few plays, but not a whole game. So I was wrong as well.

Guess none of us know what we're talking about.

[duke80]

Couldn't watch the game and don't see it on ESPN3 yet, while some 1PM games are up. Does it take time sometimes or might there not be a replay? Thanks. Any other sites thathave replays of Duke games? From the comments Amile and zone were revelations and exciting to see. Who would of thought a zone would be exciting to watch under any conditions? This is when growing pains are fun. I had my doubts. Not enough faith I guess. Go Duke!

[gurufrisbee]

The Zone was exciting, but it did exactly what it's supposed to. Limited penetration and good shots from inside. Doesn't allow you to block out and makes you more vulnerable to the other team getting offensive rebounds. Is great if the other team is bad offensively and can't shoot. I'm not sure there is a worse offensive team in the ACC than L'Ville so I doubt we'll see it a lot any more. It clearly would not have worked against the shooting skill NC St and Miami had. But it was darn fun today.

[Troublemaker]

Both coach's press conferences are worth a viewing, folks. Very informative.

Coach K spoke for a long time (relative to the usual postgame length) and was very classy and jovial.

[OldPhiKap]

Couldn't watch the game and don't see it on ESPN3 yet, while some 1PM games are up. Does it take time sometimes or might there not be a replay? Thanks. Any other sites thathave replays of Duke games? From the comments Amile and zone were revelations and exciting to see. Who would of thought a zone would be exciting to watch under any conditions? This is when growing pains are fun. I had my doubts. Not enough faith I guess. Go Duke!
GoDuke app has replay as well as post-game PCs and some interviews.

[TruBlu]

Now that we've jumped in with the zone, do we go all in and play a box and one against Paige?


I don't think so. The Box and One is a junk defense that works great in high school or recreation league games, but it is difficult to pull off against a legitimate D-1 team/coach.

UNC is going to stop cheating and change coaches before we play them?

[OldPhiKap]

UNC is going to stop cheating and change coaches before we play them?

I assume that Roy is legitimate. But frankly I don't know when his parents got married.

One thing is for sure -- Roy ain't bona fide.

[jv001]

I assume that Roy is legitimate. But frankly I don't know when his parents got married.

One thing is for sure -- Roy ain't bona fide.

Too bad I couldn't spork you. Now that's funny. GoDuke!

[Bob Green]

I don't think so. The Box and One is a junk defense that works great in high school or recreation league games, but it is difficult to pull off against a legitimate D-1 team/coach.


UNC is going to stop cheating and change coaches before we play them?

I don't like Roy Williams, but he is a good coach. The cheating is a separate subject but has nothing to do with the two games we will play against Carolina during the regular season.

[Native]

Deep breaths. We're fine.

[NashvilleDevil]

Great game plan from the coaching staff.

I actually didn't think we played the zone all that well (relative to teams that play it often), but obviously well enough to get the W.

We were getting killed on the boards, which can be one of the weaknesses of a zone if guys aren't actively boxing out. I felt like some guys weren't active enough in general.

Yes, UL shot horribly from outside, which they often do (this year). But they were getting good looks from both the 3-pt line and inside IMO. They just missed a bunch of shots. I guess it's just one of my pet peeves --- declaring the defense good or bad solely on the score. Even the announcers were saying that Duke's defense was *much* improved, despite all the uncontested shots.

I guess my thought is that it was a great defense to play against this particular opponent. I think what Duke should do is incorporate some zone principles into their man-to-man, or vice versa --- i.e., match-up a bit more in it to take away some of those open looks.

Anyway, it will be very interesting to see what K does going forward.

Can't tell if Duke won or lost by this post.

[NSDukeFan]

I'm not sure there is a worse offensive team in the ACC than L'Ville so I doubt we'll see it a lot any more. It clearly would not have worked against the shooting skill NC St and Miami had. But it was darn fun today.
Clemson, Virginia Tech, BC, Syracuse and Georgia Tech say hi. I agree with the way NC State and Miami shot, zone may not have been the best choice.

So, does this mean that Duke could make the tournament this year?

[mattman91]

Can't tell if Duke won or lost by this post.

It's OK...this isn't the Optimist thread :cool:

[SoCalDukeFan]

Couldn't watch the game and don't see it on ESPN3 yet, while some 1PM games are up. Does it take time sometimes or might there not be a replay? Thanks. Any other sites thathave replays of Duke games? From the comments Amile and zone were revelations and exciting to see. Who would of thought a zone would be exciting to watch under any conditions? This is when growing pains are fun. I had my doubts. Not enough faith I guess. Go Duke!

I wrote ESPN and got the following:

Hello,

Thank you for contacting us.

Unless noted otherwise, replays are generally available for viewing within one hour of the live event ending.

Some events, such as Major League Baseball games and Monday Night Football will not be posted for replay. There are also special circumstances where we cannot post a replay until the following day. However, the desired game, #4 Duke vs. #6 Louisville (M Basketball), will not be available for replay.

If you have additional questions about a specific event, please write back and provide the name of the event and date/time of the live broadcast.

Please keep in mind that replays are only available for ESPN3 programming. Programming broadcast live on WatchESPN from ESPN, ESPN2, ESPNU, ESPNEWS, ESPN Deportes, SEC Network, Goal Line and Buzzer Beater that is not broadcast on ESPN3 will not be made available for replay.

For live assistance with this or any other issue, please call Customer Care at 1-888-549-3776 (ESPN) between 8:00 a.m. and 1:00 a.m. EST.

Regards,

[jipops]

Why in the world is this thread mentioning that inferior program down the road in such volume? We just beat Louisville at their place. Don't poison it!

[mgtr]

Typical non-answer from a bureaucracy.

[devildeac]

Clemson, Virginia Tech, BC, Syracuse and Georgia Tech say hi. I agree with the way NC State and Miami shot, zone may not have been the best choice.

So, does this mean that Duke could make the tournament this year?

Angel Rodriguez had a fine shooting display at ND today :rolleyes:(He was 1-10).

[Dukehky]

Angel Rodriguez had a fine shooting display at ND today :rolleyes:(He was 1-10).

This is something that should surprise no one. The post Duke let down is as real as gravity.

[Dr. Rosenrosen]

Oh really? And I quote from Al's article:

"Let me stop here to elaborate. He's not going to abandon the man-to-man and play zone. I know that there is a segment of Duke fans who have raised a pro-zone chorus in recent days. Without being insulting, allow me to say, they don't know what they are talking about."

Al was dead wrong here. I thought you might see zone for a few plays, but not a whole game. So I was wrong as well.

Guess none of us know what we're talking about.
Yeah you're right obviously. I was thinking about it from the standpoint of making adjustments. But I'd forgotten that he had said that about the zone. Credit to K and the staff for putting the team in a position to execute so well. Few saw it coming. Quick Rick certainly didn't seem to have anticipated it.

[dukelifer]

Angel Rodriguez had a fine shooting display at ND today :rolleyes:(He was 1-10).

What a shock.

[SupaDave]

All this talk about the zone but I don't see anyone discussing the other wrinkle Coach slipped in today a bit more than usual - and that's Amile cutting to the basket. Lack of movement is my pet peeve with any half court offense.

In previous games with the double team it appeared we were "JJ watching" with Jah and today Coach K decided to start trusting Amile and slicing him through more. THIS is a huge development b/c if Amile's confidence stays up (and he's pretty confidant) then we are a different squad where teams have to stop the double team (as Louisville did in the second half and allowed Jah freedom of movement) and play a more honest defense.

This wrinkle totally kept Louisville off balance and helped to keep shooters open. I pray we keep it up.

Oh - and our shot clock management was great today. Quinn's 3 with no time on the clock was a nice little cherry on top of what was a much more patient team.

[jv001]

All this talk about the zone but I don't see anyone discussing the other wrinkle Coach slipped in today a bit more than usual - and that's Amile cutting to the basket. Lack of movement is my pet peeve with any half court offense.

In previous games with the double team it appeared we were "JJ watching" with Jah and today Coach K decided to start trusting Amile and slicing him through more. THIS is a huge development b/c if Amile's confidence stays up (and he's pretty confidant) then we are a different squad where teams have to stop the double team (as Louisville did in the second half and allowed Jah freedom of movement) and play a more honest defense.

This wrinkle totally kept Louisville off balance and helped to keep shooters open. I pray we keep it up.
Oh - and our shot clock management was great today. Quinn's 3 with no time on the clock was a nice little cherry on top of what was a much more patient team.

Worthy of sporks. I have said the same thing regarding cuts through the lane. This keeps Jahlil from occupying the ball so much(JJ watching). I also hope we keep it up. GoDuke!

[Furniture]

GREAT WIN!
I attribute it to having lost two top assistant coaches in the past two years, K is past it and too old and the one and dones are ruining our team!!

[DrChainsaw]

Well called game too...for a change.

Although even I was started to get nauseated by Dickie V's gushing over K.....

I feel as though I should say 10 Hail Marys tomorrow for thinking that, but it's true.

[DrChainsaw]

Although even I was started to get nauseated by Dickie V's gushing over K.....

I feel as though I should say 10 Hail Marys tomorrow for thinking that, but it's true.

OK, so I figured out you were speaking of the refs, not the broadcasters. I'll up my Hail Marys to 20 and say that, if anything, I thought there were a couple of questionable calls against L'ville. I'll take that any day.

[dukelion]

Angel Rodriguez had a fine shooting display at ND today :rolleyes:(He was 1-10).

I watched that game for two minutes and saw Rodriguez drill a contested 26 footer.......then I saw the boxscore later.....classic post Duke meltdown.

[Neals384]

So is 19 a career high for Amile? Is it the first time he has been "game high scorer"? Regardless, it was a marvelous performance for him!

[KandG]

I wrote ESPN and got the following:

Hello,

Thank you for contacting us.

Unless noted otherwise, replays are generally available for viewing within one hour of the live event ending.

Some events, such as Major League Baseball games and Monday Night Football will not be posted for replay. There are also special circumstances where we cannot post a replay until the following day. However, the desired game, #4 Duke vs. #6 Louisville (M Basketball), will not be available for replay.




That is really bizarre. Wonder if whatever fried the end of their telecast also affected the replay (sounds silly, I know). I've watched soccer matches, NBA games, Duke games, five hour tennis finals all on ESPN replay at one point or another the last few years. Yet they don't produce a replay of a game they've been hyping all season?

[Native]

That is really bizarre. Wonder if whatever fried the end of their telecast also affected the replay (sounds silly, I know).

That doesn't sound silly at all. Maybe they won't offer it up for replay because they don't have the whole game recorded or something. Hooray for technical difficulties.

It'll probably hit Reddit's CBB Uploads at some point.

[CajunDevil]

Great game! K never ceases to amaze. Duke goes zone - which many on this board were adamant he wouldn't do and I was very skeptical myself - and we were able to shut down Harrell while allowing/forcing their bad shooters to be... bad.

Amile was amazing. Jah was dominant in second half. Tyus had several tremendous passes - loved the one through traffic to Amile in the 2nd half. And how big were Matt's two 3's? Those shots gave us some much needed early confidence that helped set the tone.

[Newton_14]

If I had been in the press room, I would have asked, "Coach K, when you go to confession, will you mention the zone defense?"

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't it true that in 1,174 games at Duke, this is the first game where he has played zone for (basically) the entire game?

Big, big win, and speaks a lot, I think, to the character of this team. A lesser group of men would have been mired in a pity party after the two horrible losses in a row, and tanked. Not this group. I like what someone upstream said about "getting their swagger back". I feel that is one thing that happened for sure. Sage, to your point, you read my mind so to speak. The talking heads were expecting today to be a huge milestone day, with K getting his 1000th win, however, the basketball gods had something different in mind. To me, it was in fact a milestone game. Jim or Oly would have to chime in on if it has happened before. I don't remember it happening but my brain is not as good as theirs. Certainly in this current era of hoops, this is the first time a Coach K led team played zone exclusively for an entire game. So talking heads, you got your milestone, it just wasn't the one you thought you were getting. It will remain to be seen, but it could be a turning point game in that the zone is used as a real tool in the tool box, vs just a brief cup of coffee every 50th game or something as in times past. I am not saying we will become Syracuse, just saying the "no zone ever" rule may have been stricken from the Coach K list of rules. If so, I applaud him. Everyone of K's pupils in his coaching tree have and do use a zone as a real tool, sometimes for entire games, or in given years most every game due to personnel. I have to wonder if collectively, along with his current assistants, they pleaded with their famed mentor to toss out the rule in favor of winning even more games.

For me it was refreshing to see them not only use it today as the main defense, but to do it well. I recognize Louisville is not a good shooting team. Pitino has been saying that all season, but it still had to feel really good, and really refreshing today for the guys to get so many stops defensively. You could see their confidence growing like Pinnochio's nose as the game progressed and they kept getting defensive rebounds to shut down another offensive possession.

I have been saying for two seasons now that Amile can score in the post and needs to be used as an offensive weapon vs a conduit and screener. His play was huge today and he was easily the man of the match. That is how you punish teams for doubling and tripling Jahlil. Forget the jumpshot, though if Amile add's that, and he does need to take the occasional jumper, it will help his game and our offense, but attack the darn basket with passion, use that great footwork, length, and craftiness and put the ball in the basket or go to the line or both. The kid can score. We become a much more dangerous and much better team when he does score. The other thing about that is Amile is a clear leader. He needs to be THE leader of this team, being vocal early and often, barking instructions, encouragement, and criticism to his teammates. I think Quinn is one of those kids who is a great leader behind the scenes and off the court but Amile is a great on the floor leader. I hope he continues to attack the basket with passion and like Ferryfor50, I loved the attempted dunk. I think the fact he got his hand to the rim, and the fact the defender had both arms up in the air is why it got called a block instead of a charge. Keep it up young man.

Matt's two 3's were big, and I thought Tyus had a good floor game today as well. Finally, Jahlil got his 18 points on 8-10 shooting while his sidekick Amile was punishing the opponent, so they played well off each other today. We still need to get Winslow going offensively, and he will break out of that slump soon. Too good not to.

Enjoy and celebrate this win. It was huge in more ways than one. This team needs to keep that swagger, walking onto the floor believing they are the best team out there and then executing and playing like it. (While still respecting the opponent of course). They are still a Top 5 team in my mind, that hit a pot hole and blew a couple of tires, but hopefully, quickly put on two fresh new ones, and got back to driving 70 with ease, power, and grace.

Go Duke. Go to Hell Carolina you bunch of cheating low-life scumbags.

[Saratoga2]

I didn't expect a win today, but coach K made a significant adjustment going to a zone, and that really worked against the poor shooting Louisville team. Louisville is a top notch defensive team and it showed in that they held us to 63. Our defense was enough to really stop them though. I do agree that we slowed things down in the later stages of the game and we did have some turnovers against the full Louisville press but were in command throughout.

I had thought for some time that no one could stop Okafor and that he would score in the mid teens at a minimum. Also, the defensive concentration on Okafor opened opportunities for Jefferson and there were even plays put in for him to exploit the defense. I think Tyus was the third cog of the offense with good ball handling, passing as some scoring. Cook had an off day for him but he did chip in. We got the frosting on the cake with 4 from Matt Jones. Not much from Winslow on offense but he contributed in other ways as did Rasheed. MP3 was not much help in either offense or defense.

It will be interesting to see if Coach K uses addiitional adjustments to the defense when we play against some of the tough teams remaining in the ACC Schedule.

[jv001]

Big, big win, and speaks a lot, I think, to the character of this team. A lesser group of men would have been mired in a pity party after the two horrible losses in a row, and tanked. Not this group. I like what someone upstream said about "getting their swagger back". I feel that is one thing that happened for sure. Sage, to your point, you read my mind so to speak. The talking heads were expecting today to be a huge milestone day, with K getting his 1000th win, however, the basketball gods had something different in mind. To me, it was in fact a milestone game. Jim or Oly would have to chime in on if it has happened before. I don't remember it happening but my brain is not as good as theirs. Certainly in this current era of hoops, this is the first time a Coach K led team played zone exclusively for an entire game. So talking heads, you got your milestone, it just wasn't the one you thought you were getting. It will remain to be seen, but it could be a turning point game in that the zone is used as a real tool in the tool box, vs just a brief cup of coffee every 50th game or something as in times past. I am not saying we will become Syracuse, just saying the "no zone ever" rule may have been stricken from the Coach K list of rules. If so, I applaud him. Everyone of K's pupils in his coaching tree have and do use a zone as a real tool, sometimes for entire games, or in given years most every game due to personnel. I have to wonder if collectively, along with his current assistants, they pleaded with their famed mentor to toss out the rule in favor of winning even more games.

For me it was refreshing to see them not only use it today as the main defense, but to do it well. I recognize Louisville is not a good shooting team. Pitino has been saying that all season, but it still had to feel really good, and really refreshing today for the guys to get so many stops defensively. You could see their confidence growing like Pinnochio's nose as the game progressed and they kept getting defensive rebounds to shut down another offensive possession.

I have been saying for two seasons now that Amile can score in the post and needs to be used as an offensive weapon vs a conduit and screener. His play was huge today and he was easily the man of the match. That is how you punish teams for doubling and tripling Jahlil. Forget the jumpshot, though if Amile add's that, and he does need to take the occasional jumper, it will help his game and our offense, but attack the darn basket with passion, use that great footwork, length, and craftiness and put the ball in the basket or go to the line or both. The kid can score. We become a much more dangerous and much better team when he does score. The other thing about that is Amile is a clear leader. He needs to be THE leader of this team, being vocal early and often, barking instructions, encouragement, and criticism to his teammates. I think Quinn is one of those kids who is a great leader behind the scenes and off the court but Amile is a great on the floor leader. I hope he continues to attack the basket with passion and like Ferryfor50, I loved the attempted dunk. I think the fact he got his hand to the rim, and the fact the defender had both arms up in the air is why it got called a block instead of a charge. Keep it up young man.

Matt's two 3's were big, and I thought Tyus had a good floor game today as well. Finally, Jahlil got his 18 points on 8-10 shooting while his sidekick Amile was punishing the opponent, so they played well off each other today. We still need to get Winslow going offensively, and he will break out of that slump soon. Too good not to.

Enjoy and celebrate this win. It was huge in more ways than one. This team needs to keep that swagger, walking onto the floor believing they are the best team out there and then executing and playing like it. (While still respecting the opponent of course). They are still a Top 5 team in my mind, that hit a pot hole and blew a couple of tires, but hopefully, quickly put on two fresh new ones, and got back to driving 70 with ease, power, and grace.

Go Duke. Go to Hell Carolina you bunch of cheating low-life scumbags.

Newton, very well written comment and I can't disagree with anything in your post. This was a Team Win. I thought everyone contributed in one way or another. Tyus is certainly the straw that stirs the drink and Amile is the leader of the defense. Jahlil is just the number one big man in the country. Quinn is the heart of the team and has sacrificed to make the team better. Justise is the all around player that we've needed for a while now. Just wait until he get's his shooting eye back. Matt Jones may have hit two of the biggest shots of the game and his career. MPIII played strong in his short minutes off the bench. Many teams would love to have him. But the game ball goes our HOF Coach K. He went against the grain and played mostly zone for the entire game and the guys played it well. I'm going to enjoy this win for a couple of days and then it's time to beat Pitt. Love the bolded part of your post. GoDuke!

[weezie]

Although even I was started to get nauseated by Dickie V's gushing over K.....

I feel as though I should say 10 Hail Marys tomorrow for thinking that, but it's true.


Ehhh, I meant the officiating.

I have developed a bit of deafness to Vitale. It's the reward of a long career in hoops watching.

[CDu]

I have to agree with what Newton_14 said. This was a momentous game. I'm a bit younger than some of the folks on DBR, but I certainly don't remember a game in which Duke went zone for more than a few minutes in a big game, let alone the vast majority of the game. The team needed to do something different defensively. Well, this would constitute different.

I had said in a previous thread that it amazed me how inflexible Coach K has been with his half-court defense over the years, in stark contrast to his well-noted flexibility with regards to offense each year. Even in the face of the reality that he often had teams ill-suited to pressure the ball (I'm picturing the Paulus/Scheyer backcourt of 2007 with a shudder), he stuck with it. Well, today he made the most drastic defensive change a coach can make: he switched from man-to-man to zone. Now, of course he did not do it overnight; we played a decent amount of zone against an overmatched foe early. So it is clear that we'd at least dabbled with it in preseason practices. But simply showing the willingness to try something completely against his nature is a great sign. It means that an old dog still can learn new tricks, and it means that Coach K isn't so set in his ways that he can't adapt to the changing game around him. I'm thrilled to see it. I'm not saying we should become a zone team, but when the matchup calls for it (and few matchups call for it more than this one did), I think it behooves us to have it in the toolkit.

I won't say that the zone was a thing of beauty. Louisville got more than their fair share of open shots. But for a team that had never played it for any meaningful stretches, we certainly didn't look awful at it. Louisville certainly helped us by having one of their worst shooting games. But I'll take it. We dared them to beat us with something other than their preferred strategy, and it worked. We bottled up Montrezl Harrell by packing in the zone and making sure our back 3 knew where Harrell was lurking the baseline. The zone had Louisville's guards caught off guard, and you could see that they were rattled. And since we were in a zone, the high pick was largely useless (as we had another guard in position to defend the ballhandler).

As I said, we didn't run the zone to perfection: Louisville got plenty of open shots and added 18 offensive rebounds (40% OReb%). But we closed the driving lanes for Rozier and Jones, and that kept Louisville from the type of buckets they are used to.

Along with the zone, the other thing worth noting is how well we handled Louisville's pressure. Louisville pressed probably 1/3 of the time on made baskets, and yet we did a solid job of avoiding open court turnovers. This is one area where playing two PGs really helps us. It's very hard to press a team that has multiple players capable of handling the ball. Add in Winslow and/or Sulaimon, and there is just too much competence to get into too much trouble. Still, the guys deserve a lot of credit for their patience and execution.

As for the players, a lot of kudos go to three guys: Jefferson, Tyus Jones, and Okafor. Jefferson really punished Louisville for not paying him due attention. His ability to drive the lane and occasionally score in the post changed the game. He was terrific. Jones deserves credit for easily his best performance in weeks. Putting up 10 points (on 5 FGA) and 8 assists to 2 turnovers is a tremendous game period. But against as good a defense as Louisville's, it is that much more impressive. And what can you say about Okafor? He's just a dominant scorer. But the thing that impressed me most was his patience. Things weren't going his way early. But instead of trying to force the action, he stayed within the flow of the game and waited for his chances. And when they eventually came, he capitalized.

We didn't have noteworthy performances from the others (other than a couple of nice 3s for Matt Jones), but against a very stout Louisville defense (kudos to them for continuing to bring the effort even when things were looking bleak for them) that is not shocking. Thankfully Okafor and Jefferson (who combined for 37 points on 14-17 shooting and 14 rebounds) were enough. Heck, the three players I mentioned first almost outscored Louisville by themselves.

Just a really satisfying win. I'm thrilled that our guys could get their confidence back. I'm thrilled that Coach K was willing to do something drastic to improve the defense. And I'm mostly just thrilled that we got a big win. Nobody in the country has as good a road win as our second best road win. Hopefully we can build on this and survive the gauntlet over the next few weeks and find ourselves eventually back atop the ACC standings.

[bluenorth]

Great win at a crucial time. Would have been fascinating to sit in on the coaches' meeting when K and his staff decided to use a zone - you really can teach an old dog new tricks. We also did a great job of controlling the tempo of the game. One minor concern was the problem we had dealing with full court pressure. I'd expect the team to work on that, as we'll likely see more of it now.

[Wheat/"/"/"]

Coach K was not going to allow guard penetration to beat him again. I thought he'd go soft man but it was the right move to go zone.
It was hard for me to tell if it was that good because Louisville missed so many good looks. Whatever, a win on the road against a good team like that is a great day.
Jefferson has made a big improvement in his post play from his freshman year. I like his energy in there and he made a couple of solid post moves.
Duke was more patient today shooting it as well, which helped their defense.
Good game and good win.

[Devilwin]

I was happy to see them play zone, it certainly cut the layup drill down to a whisper, and Louisville was forced to go outside for their attempts, which they obviously aren't good at. I say continue the zone, at least part time. 15-20 footers are harder to hit than layups!
Overall, good win and nice bounce back after the two horrid games we had! We needed this bad.
Now, the Hurricanes won tonight too, so all I need is for Green Bay to take down the Seabuzzards tomorrow and my weekend is complete!:D

[OldPhiKap]

Coach K was not going to allow guard penetration to beat him again. I thought he'd go soft man but it was the right move to go zone.
It was hard for me to tell if it was that good because Louisville missed so many good looks. Whatever, a win on the road against a good team like that is a great day.
Jefferson has made a big improvement in his post play from his freshman year. I like his energy in there and he made a couple of solid post moves.
Duke was more patient today shooting it as well, which helped their defense.
Good game and good win.

Agree with all of this, and would not be surprised to see us try the same against UNC. Both teams are similar -- talented, like to run, limited outside shooting if you make it a half-court game. Paige is better than any Louisville guard though. (Tokoto has a very respectable 3pt % last I saw but small sample size)

[Wander]

Nobody in the country has as good a road win as our second best road win.

Except, of course, Miami.

[mkirsh]

Good article on how the plan to play zone came together:
http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketball/eye-on-college-basketball/24970710/coach-k-scraps-tradition-and-uses-zone-in-dukes-win-at-louisville

Will be interesting to see if the zone is a short lived change of pace like last year's line changes, or if it has more staying power.

[uh_no]

Good article on how the plan to play zone came together:
http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketball/eye-on-college-basketball/24970710/coach-k-scraps-tradition-and-uses-zone-in-dukes-win-at-louisville

Will be interesting to see if the zone is a short lived change of pace like last year's line changes, or if it has more staying power.

the only real question is why the coaches were up until 5:15 when they could have just stopped by the post game thread and we could have told them everything they needed to do :)

[gep]

I think Amile was just GREAT. Not only his energy... but his aggressiveness on offense. I don't recall him ever doing this much, if at all. But he did this the whole game. His couple of post moves was great. Someone posted in-game that everyone was talking about Jahlil in the post, that Amile wanted to show that he's no slouch. But, I think his defining moment was when he ran down the middle and attempted that dunk. Even if the dunk wasn't there, the aggressiveness was very nice to see. In the past, I think he would have held up and looked to pass. I was very surprised that he took it all the way. And, when he went to the foul line, he was 7 for 9. Solid.

[Kedsy]

Interesting thing about our two big road wins is in both games we tried something that nobody expected -- against Wisconsin we switched every screen and against Louisville obviously we played zone. I'm not sure either strategy would work a second time against the same opponent, unless we get a lot better at zone, but that's not the point. Miami's coaches and players said in their post-Duke-win press conference that they knew exactly what Duke was going to do and how to beat it. But Coach K kept Wisconsin and Louisville off-balance by doing something entirely unexpected.

Can the coaching staff find more unexpected things to throw at opponents in big games? Presumably that will become harder and harder to do, but it'll be interesting to watch.

The other thing that makes me chuckle is how most of the things people were harping on before the game turned out the opposite of the comments. Some people were lamenting Matt Jones being unable to shoot and becoming a liability on offense, and then he goes and hits two big threes (in three attempts, for 67% on three pointers), out of only four made threes by Duke in the game. Some suggested we couldn't win unless we shot better from long range, but we didn't and it didn't matter: we shot 26% on threes against NCSU, 29% on threes against Miami, and 27% on threes against Louisville.

A lot of posters were certain we'd see a new lineup. Didn't happen. Several people suggested benching Tyus Jones and he went out and had one of his best games at Duke. People said Amile Jefferson wasn't contributing anything on offense, and some suggested he should/would lose time to our guards in a small lineup, but instead he played 31 minutes and scored 19 points. I guess all this just goes to show that making definitive statements about a team based on the previous one or two games is a process bound to look silly when the future actually unfolds.

[gumbomoop]

Good article on how the plan to play zone came together:
http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketball/eye-on-college-basketball/24970710/coach-k-scraps-tradition-and-uses-zone-in-dukes-win-at-louisville

Thanks for this informative link. The coaching staff all-nighter is a revealing bit of inside info, at least to me, a way-outsider.

Also, I'm curious exactly what the mandatory rule is. I assume it's not mandatory to take a day off if your team has, say, a Saturday game followed by a Monday game. Or is there a mandatory off-day at a certain point or points in the season?

Did the rest of you know about mandatory off-day(s)?

[fgb]

Couldn't watch the game and don't see it on ESPN3 yet, while some 1PM games are up. Does it take time sometimes or might there not be a replay? Thanks. Any other sites thathave replays of Duke games? From the comments Amile and zone were revelations and exciting to see. Who would of thought a zone would be exciting to watch under any conditions? This is when growing pains are fun. I had my doubts. Not enough faith I guess. Go Duke!

game is still not up. it's 1am. does espn really hate us that much?

[MartyClark]

I'm late to the thread because I just got home from the game. I don't get to see many Duke games in person and it was worth a trip from Denver.

I'm not sure I can add anything to the good analysis already on this thread but would like to add two tangential thoughts.

First, Louisville is a good place to see a game. The area around the Yum Center is good, the arena itself is good and the Louisville fans were passionate but very civil.

Second, I was fortunate to be sitting in the lobby of the Courtyard by Marriott a couple of hours before the game when the Okafor family rolled through. There are some big personalities in that family and they were really fun to watch. In a very good natured way, they were talking serious Duke smack to the hotel employees and the Louisville fans in the lobby.

[Jim3k]

game is still not up. it's 1am. does espn really hate us that much?

Not being put up by ESPN for reasons known only to them. I watched it on BDN+. Even so, the last minute and a half was lost due to technical difficulties, so maybe the botched ending was the reason. Since it was fried live, it was also fried for the replay.

I wanted to watch that zone and the only way I could was to sign up for BDN+. Aside from ESPN's screw-up, it was a decent experience.

[CDu]

Except, of course, Miami.

Whoops! You're absolutely correct, of course. I'm trying to forget that that game happened. :)

[sagegrouse]

game is still not up. it's 1am. does espn really hate us that much?


Not being put up by ESPN for reasons known only to them. I watched it on BDN+. Even so, the last minute and a half was lost due to technical difficulties, so maybe the botched ending was the reason. Since it was fried live, it was also fried for the replay.

I wanted to watch that zone and the only way I could was to sign up for BDN+. Aside from ESPN's screw-up, it was a decent experience.

This is unacceptable. It looks like the only solution is to replay the last 1:30, from the point where Louisville was as the foul line. I mean, the fans got cheated.

[freshmanjs]

Whoops! You're absolutely correct, of course. I'm trying to forget that that game happened. :)

kentucky also has a similar road win @louisville

[mgtr]

Interesting thing about our two big road wins is in both games we tried something that nobody expected -- against Wisconsin we switched every screen and against Louisville obviously we played zone. I'm not sure either strategy would work a second time against the same opponent, unless we get a lot better at zone, but that's not the point. Miami's coaches and players said in their post-Duke-win press conference that they knew exactly what Duke was going to do and how to beat it. But Coach K kept Wisconsin and Louisville off-balance by doing something entirely unexpected.

Can the coaching staff find more unexpected things to throw at opponents in big games? Presumably that will become harder and harder to do, but it'll be interesting to watch.

The other thing that makes me chuckle is how most of the things people were harping on before the game turned out the opposite of the comments. Some people were lamenting Matt Jones being unable to shoot and becoming a liability on offense, and then he goes and hits two big threes (in three attempts, for 67% on three pointers), out of only four made threes by Duke in the game. Some suggested we couldn't win unless we shot better from long range, but we didn't and it didn't matter: we shot 26% on threes against NCSU, 29% on threes against Miami, and 27% on threes against Louisville.

A lot of posters were certain we'd see a new lineup. Didn't happen. Several people suggested benching Tyus Jones and he went out and had one of his best games at Duke. People said Amile Jefferson wasn't contributing anything on offense, and some suggested he should/would lose time to our guards in a small lineup, but instead he played 31 minutes and scored 19 points. I guess all this just goes to show that making definitive statements about a team based on the previous one or two games is a process bound to look silly when the future actually unfolds.

Ok, I was guilty of some or all of the items in the last paragraph, so I deserve to have my feet held to the fire. One correct thing I said was that Coach K didn't get to 997 wins (now 998!) by accident, and that he would figure it out -- and he did!!!

[dbcooper]

game is still not up. it's 1am. does espn really hate us that much?

If anyone has Dish Network(ESPN On Demand)they have a category called "Coach K" that has many of his historic Wins, I just re-watched K's 500th win against UNC(pretty much an all NBA team) on Wojo's senior day. Man that was awesome to relive that!

Also there is a "College Basketball" category that has some previous Duke games from this year- The Duke- Louisville Game is not up yet.

DB.

[porkpa]

I take full credit for the win. I told Coach K to play some zone and he did.

[SoCalDukeFan]

Good article on how the plan to play zone came together:
http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketball/eye-on-college-basketball/24970710/coach-k-scraps-tradition-and-uses-zone-in-dukes-win-at-louisville

Will be interesting to see if the zone is a short lived change of pace like last year's line changes, or if it has more staying power.

is that we will practice it more and get better at the zone and will use it more than in the past, but certainly will not become a zone team a la Syracuse.

If so, teams will need to prepare for the zone as well as the traditional Duke defense.

SoCal

[Indoor66]

is that we will practice it more and get better at the zone and will use it more than in the past, but certainly will not become a zone team a la Syracuse.

If so, teams will need to prepare for the zone as well as the traditional Duke defense

...and while I prefer Man to Man, having a strong Zone in the arsenal makes us MUCH harder team to prepare for. I would be happy to see us have the ability to switch between M to M and Z during games. It throws the other team off balance.

[kshepinthehouse]

If anyone has Dish Network(ESPN On Demand)they have a category called "Coach K" that has many of his historic Wins, I just re-watched K's 500th win against UNC(pretty much an all NBA team) on Wojo's senior day. Man that was awesome to relive that!

Also there is a "College Basketball" category that has some previous Duke games from this year- The Duke- Louisville Game is not up yet.

DB.

How do I get to this?

[CDu]

Ok, I was guilty of some or all of the items in the last paragraph, so I deserve to have my feet held to the fire. One correct thing I said was that Coach K didn't get to 997 wins (now 998!) by accident, and that he would figure it out -- and he did!!!

To be fair to you, all it took for you to be wrong was for Coach K to make the most dramatic and most unexpected shift in defensive strategy in his entire career. It is quite possible that, had we not completely changed defenses yesterday, you'd have still been correct.

Well, except for the Jefferson thing (if you were one who said that) of course.

[dbcooper]

How do I get to this?

http://www.multichannel.com/news/ott/espn-classic-converts-demand-dish/384327

It looks like it only available for Dish subscribers? Formally ESPN Classic.

Its a condensed version and highlights of the games not full length games, each is approximately 20- 30 Mins.

DB.

[sagegrouse]

A lot of posters were certain we'd see a new lineup. Didn't happen. Several people suggested benching Tyus Jones and he went out and had one of his best games at Duke. People said Amile Jefferson wasn't contributing anything on offense, and some suggested he should/would lose time to our guards in a small lineup, but instead he played 31 minutes and scored 19 points. I guess all this just goes to show that making definitive statements about a team based on the previous one or two games is a process bound to look silly when the future actually unfolds.


To be fair to you, all it took for you to be wrong was for Coach K to make the most dramatic and most unexpected shift in defensive strategy in his entire career. It is quite possible that, had we not completely changed defenses yesterday, you'd have still been correct.

Well, except for the Jefferson thing (if you were one who said that) of course.

Well, sports is sorta silly.... I always thought that benching one of the freshmen is potentially de-motivating, not the opposite. That said, Amile was "told" to be more aggressive on offense, but it didn't really take until the Coach sat him on the bench for long periods:

Like, how about?


Game Mins Points
Wofford 18 10
BC 17 4
Wake 19 4
State 22 4
Miami 29 14
Lville 31 19


Gee! His minutes went up when his offense increased. Looks like he got the message.

[CDu]

Well, sports is sorta silly.... I always thought that benching one of the freshmen is potentially de-motivating, not the opposite. That said, Amile was "told" to be more aggressive on offense, but it didn't really take until the Coach sat him on the bench for long periods:

Like, how about?


Game Mins Points
Wofford 18 10
BC 17 4
Wake 19 4
State 22 4
Miami 29 14
Lville 31 19


Gee! His minutes went up when his offense increased. Looks like he got the message.

Also a terrific point. Jefferson's minutes were indeed down due to his lack of impact on offense (and his drop in rebounding). And while Coach K would never say it, I suspect the Matt Jones start was a subtle nudge to Jefferson to pick up his play. Thankfully, Jefferson has responded with his two best games. With our lack of depth at PF, we need him to be an impact player.

[Saratoga2]

Interesting thing about our two big road wins is in both games we tried something that nobody expected -- against Wisconsin we switched every screen and against Louisville obviously we played zone. I'm not sure either strategy would work a second time against the same opponent, unless we get a lot better at zone, but that's not the point. Miami's coaches and players said in their post-Duke-win press conference that they knew exactly what Duke was going to do and how to beat it. But Coach K kept Wisconsin and Louisville off-balance by doing something entirely unexpected.

Can the coaching staff find more unexpected things to throw at opponents in big games? Presumably that will become harder and harder to do, but it'll be interesting to watch.

The other thing that makes me chuckle is how most of the things people were harping on before the game turned out the opposite of the comments. Some people were lamenting Matt Jones being unable to shoot and becoming a liability on offense, and then he goes and hits two big threes (in three attempts, for 67% on three pointers), out of only four made threes by Duke in the game. Some suggested we couldn't win unless we shot better from long range, but we didn't and it didn't matter: we shot 26% on threes against NCSU, 29% on threes against Miami, and 27% on threes against Louisville.

A lot of posters were certain we'd see a new lineup. Didn't happen. Several people suggested benching Tyus Jones and he went out and had one of his best games at Duke. People said Amile Jefferson wasn't contributing anything on offense, and some suggested he should/would lose time to our guards in a small lineup, but instead he played 31 minutes and scored 19 points. I guess all this just goes to show that making definitive statements about a team based on the previous one or two games is a process bound to look silly when the future actually unfolds.

This is an open sight where you get a wide variety of opinions and no doubt you can point to examples of people who suggested the things which you bring up. On the other hand you will also see people who suggested Tyus Jones is an important cog and that he should be encouraged to attempt to score along with running the team. Also there were those that suggested that with the double team of Okafor the team should look to Amile, who has been showing more confidence in his offensive game of late. There were ,many who hoped that coach K would pull his defense in to make it more difficult to penetrate. Coach K did surprise many of us by going zone, something even a 73 year old has not seen for a whole game. There were those that suggested Okafor would get solid points no matter what defense was thrown against him. Also, that Matt had an unconventional shot and that what he could get would be like frosting on the cake, because he is not a consistent shooter at this time.

The Louisville defense was very good and they were able to hold Quinn to less than his normal points, but he and Okafor have been our steadiest scorers and will continue to provide points.

That justise had a below par scoring game is not surprising due to the excellent defense on him and he does still have an awkward shot. He is an NBA quality althlete with a decent handle and a high motor and he will contribute more on offense in many games going forward. Rasheed had a weak offensive game. He has all of the tools, but in my mind he doesn't think the game and is often out of control. Against many opponents, he also could have a solid scoring game and his defense is very good and energetic.

I wouldn't congratulate yourself too much in finding opinions which went against the way the game was play. I think you will always find those instances in widely utilized threads.

[Saratoga2]

is that we will practice it more and get better at the zone and will use it more than in the past, but certainly will not become a zone team a la Syracuse.

If so, teams will need to prepare for the zone as well as the traditional Duke defense.

SoCal

While coach K is at it, he also should consider whether the Pack Line defense of Virginia would be an option that would fit our personnel. You have to be impressed with the way Virginia has used it with good but not great personnel. Does a team have to recruit for that defense or can teams make it work with the personnel they have. With Virginia's great success of late, I am surprised it is not being copied around the league and the country.

[Duke3517]

A zone is completely ineffective if the other team is having a really good shooting day. Just not a fan of it in terms of going deep in the NCAA tournament. Man to man defense is the best way to go but you do have to have the personnel in order to stop penetrating guards.

Duke did what they had to do to get the win. It was an excellent game plan and execution of that game plan from Duke. I would doubt many teams in the NCAA have the front court that Duke has outside of Kentucky.

On the plus side Tyus played better. Duke needs him at his best if they want to go deep in the tournament.

[kmspeaks]

Thanks for this informative link. The coaching staff all-nighter is a revealing bit of inside info, at least to me, a way-outsider.

Also, I'm curious exactly what the mandatory rule is. I assume it's not mandatory to take a day off if your team has, say, a Saturday game followed by a Monday game. Or is there a mandatory off-day at a certain point or points in the season?

Did the rest of you know about mandatory off-day(s)?


Assuming things haven't changed from my time (2005-09) and assuming I remember it correctly, the rule is worded a little funny but it basically boils down to one day off a week. It doesn't have to be the same day every week and I think the actual wording is a 7 day period and not necessarily a calendar week. The way they explained it in our beginning of the year rule meetings was you could practice/play 12 days in a row as long as you had the day before and the day after those 12 days off. So I'm guessing that Wednesday was a mandatory off-day because of the way Duke's practice and game schedule worked out, not because you have to take a day off after a game or because 1/14 was a special date.

[bbosbbos]

At least for UL our zone D worked very well. I think this will work well when playing cheaters & the Orange. But ND & UVA are totally different in terms of O. I do not know what tactics we would use to stop their 3s.

As mentioned in the post Miami game, leader(s) is needed for us. AJ came out in time to show that he is a leader. QC is still QC. When played as a PG, he was so slow and predictable. Hopefully T. Jones will get some confidence back to play PG.

Another huge change in this game was that passing to big Jah was significantly less in the 1st half. Instead the basketball went to Aj or we shoot 3s. UL did not expect this at all. If we had a better 3 shooting, this game would have been even much uglier for UL. Quicky Ricky adjusted in the 2nd half. Their press D caused a lot of problems to our guards, but left some space to big Jah. We all know what happened afterwards. imho, we should keep using this strategy. Do not let the passing to big Jah become so predictable.

[Dukehky]

While coach K is at it, he also should consider whether the Pack Line defense of Virginia would be an option that would fit our personnel. You have to be impressed with the way Virginia has used it with good but not great personnel. Does a team have to recruit for that defense or can teams make it work with the personnel they have. With Virginia's great success of late, I am surprised it is not being copied around the league and the country.

This is good in theory, but a 2/3 zone is way easier to teach. Also, most of those kids have played a 2/3 zone for large portions of their basketball careers. Jah only played zone in high school for instance.

Pack line is a system that takes a ton of teaching and discipline. Hence why UVA's veteran laden team is so effective at it, Arizona plays it as well and they are a pretty experienced team too. All in all, the pack line philosophy isn't something that K and this young team is going to be able to effectively implement in the 3 days between games.

[Clay Feet POF]

Since Wojo got the Marquette job, I’ve been checking their Board and here are some interesting things. I have to prefix this with the fact that Wojo and K talk everyday


1) Wojo inherits a undersized team, with a short roster (8 on rides). This is coupled with few of the returning players having played many minutes. ( 2 freshmen, 2 Transfers, and 2 without much playing time)

2) First few games were terrible with man to man, so Wojo switches to Zone which was a little better and conserved more of the players energy.

3) But Wojo has little experience with the Zone, so he goes and hires a former Syracuse walk on (Jake Presutti) as the Video Coordinator. Tyler Thornton (Grad Assistant at MU) commented this guy is very important in the Zoning schemes, it would be inter
esting to know if it was this K’s or Wojo’s idea.

4 MU’s defense has vastly improve (8 SPG) using many variations of the Zone with a little man to man.


My hunch is Duke will use a mixed bag of man to man and zone, with more variations of the zone as the season and players progress.

[Kedsy]

I wouldn't congratulate yourself too much in finding opinions which went against the way the game was play.

I wasn't congratulating myself. I was trying to point out that after the two losses, the boards were flooded with negativity and with people making definitive statements about the players and the team that were completely unwarranted. And most of the kneejerk reactions were wrong.


While coach K is at it, he also should consider whether the Pack Line defense of Virginia would be an option that would fit our personnel.

You have made this suggestion many times over the past year or so. My understanding of the packline is that it's almost a philosophy and not just a scheme, that teams that play it pretty much play nothing else, and that it's fairly complex and difficult to master. So I really don't think it's a realistic option for Duke under Coach K, and I also don't think it should be, just because a couple teams are able to use it successfully.

[uh_no]

I wasn't congratulating myself. I was trying to point out that after the two losses, the boards were flooded with negativity and with people making definitive statements about the players and the team that were completely unwarranted. And most of the kneejerk reactions were wrong.


most? I think most of the knee jerk reactions called for an overhaul of the defensive scheme, or suffer a recapitulation of last year's exposition. An overhaul is exactly what we got.

Some did call for mass benchings, firings etc...

But as much as people would caution against putting a ton of weight on a couple of bad games, i similarly caution against putting too much weight on a single good game in a new scheme. Will teams be able to exploit it now that the element of surprise is lost? Did we just get lucky?

I'm not sure we can rule on the efficacy just yet. A couple more performances like this will go a long way.

[azzefkram]

I wasn't congratulating myself. I was trying to point out that after the two losses, the boards were flooded with negativity and with people making definitive statements about the players and the team that were completely unwarranted. And most of the kneejerk reactions were wrong.

Saying Matt is struggling offensively is not a kneejerk reaction. Matt is shooting 27% from three and 26% from two since December, a span of 10 games. He's a good defender, but not a great one. I'm sure a valid argument could be made for playing Matt less. While everyone is distracted (with some cause) about our defensive struggles, our O has been largely meh in league play.

[gumbomoop]

Assuming things haven't changed from my time (2005-09) and assuming I remember it correctly, the rule is worded a little funny but it basically boils down to one day off a week. It doesn't have to be the same day every week and I think the actual wording is a 7 day period and not necessarily a calendar week. The way they explained it in our beginning of the year rule meetings was you could practice/play 12 days in a row as long as you had the day before and the day after those 12 days off. So I'm guessing that Wednesday was a mandatory off-day because of the way Duke's practice and game schedule worked out, not because you have to take a day off after a game or because 1/14 was a special date.

Thanks for the response. I'm guessing maybe many readers - but not me - vaguely knew something about this occasional, mandated off-day. I'd have thought that after the Miami loss, and especially given the decision to go zone, this mandated off-day came at the worst possible time. Looks like it was the opposite, a lucky-break-mandate, as it provided time for the coaches' all-nighter-rethink, and allowed the players time to recoup physically and mentally.

[vick]

Saying Matt is struggling offensively is not a kneejerk reaction. Matt is shooting 27% from three and 26% from two since December, a span of 10 games. He's a good defender, but not a great one. I'm sure a valid argument could be made for playing Matt less. While everyone is distracted (with some cause) about our defensive struggles, our O has been largely meh in league play.

I 100% agree with the bolded part, and I think both the eye test and stats (Duke is actually 6th in the conference in points per possession on offense and 5th in points allowed) bear it out. It's weird to me how obsessed we've been with the zone defense, which I doubt we stick with, compared with offensive changes that may be more sustainable (Amile's of course not going to equal Okafor in scoring, but I'd love for him to be shooting as much as Justise for the rest of the season).

I disagree with your singling out of Matt Jones though. Here are some stats in conference play:

Matt Jones: 12.5 points/40 minutes on 47% true shooting (i.e. adjusting for threes and free throws)
Tyus Jones: 8.9 points/40 minutes on 40% true shooting
Justise Winslow: 12.2 points/40 minutes on 44% true shooting

Doesn't look to me that Matt's the big problem here. Of course I realize that Tyus has point guard distribution responsibilities, but we have a former all-ACC point guard in the lineup...(not that I propose actually changing the rotation substantially).

[ArtVandelay]

A few observations about the game that don't really directly relate to the zone defense. Agreed with prior commenters who said the zone was ok, not great, but it's useful to be able to deploy it competently when needed.

1) This felt like a statistical correction (or Basketball Gods correction) game, in that NC State hit everything and Duke missed everything for two games in a row, and then we got somewhat lucky that Louisville had just an awful shooting day. The zone was a great strategy against the Cards given their poor shooting, but they had a lot of wide-open looks that they just missed. And it wasn't limited to threes. They missed a number of chippies and easier shots they should've made. Yesterday felt like one of those games where everything was going our way. Not sure my concerns about our defense have been particularly reduced based just on yesterday's game.

2) After last season's team's problems in crunch time, I was concerned going into the season about how such a freshman-laden team would respond under serious game pressure. I remain concerned about this. It feels like this team really feeds on confidence (as in, even more than all teams do). When things are going well (e.g. yesterday, Wisconsin), they go quite well. When they face adversity (albeit only a few times), things seem like they snowball in a hurry. This is not surprising for such a young team, so it'll be interesting to see if this changes going forward. It seems in particular that this phenomenon may be linked to the play of T. Jones. He has really elevated his level of play in big games, when he served as a big calming influence. But in the two losses plus Wake, he seemed to disappear. In some ways, as he goes, we go.

3) Shooting remains a potential red flag. One lesson opponents likely drew from the past few games -- to the extent they didn't know it already -- is that you can't guard Oak one-on-one. When L'Ville tried to do that in the second half, he absolutely shredded them. Double-teaming Oak and forcing him to kick it out to 3-point shooters is the best way to slow down our offense. Despite the generally solid offensive showing against an excellent defense yesterday, the shooting was once again suspect. I am guessing teams will continue to force us to live and die with the three. Frankly, I am surprised we haven't seen more zone, like we saw constantly last season.

4) On a related point, opponents would be smart to leave Amile alone. He unfortunately still can't shoot. That is why getting him moving to the basket yesterday was a great sign. He actually is very skilled at driving the ball and finishing around the basket. Getting him the ball in ways where he can score will help take double-team pressure off Oak.

5) Based on what I could tell on TV, I was not too impressed by the Louisville crowd. From everything I've heard, it's one of the more intense basketball towns in the country. I expected something on par to the Syracuse game last year -- first game against Duke in the ACC and all that. That is why I was surprised that the crowd was out of the game basically all day. Granted, their team was not playing well, but Harrell had to basically beg the crowd to get excited a few times. I also noticed a lot of empty seats from people who'd left in the last 5 minutes, even though the Cards had fought to get the lead down to 10. Maybe I'm offbase on this, but it seemed like a poor showing by the fans.

[dukelifer]

A few observations about the game that don't really directly relate to the zone defense. Agreed with prior commenters who said the zone was ok, not great, but it's useful to be able to deploy it competently when needed.

1) This felt like a statistical correction (or Basketball Gods correction) game, in that NC State hit everything and Duke missed everything for two games in a row, and then we got somewhat lucky that Louisville had just an awful shooting day. The zone was a great strategy against the Cards given their poor shooting, but they had a lot of wide-open looks that they just missed. And it wasn't limited to threes. They missed a number of chippies and easier shots they should've made. Yesterday felt like one of those games where everything was going our way. Not sure my concerns about our defense have been particularly reduced based just on yesterday's game.

2) After last season's team's problems in crunch time, I was concerned going into the season about how such a freshman-laden team would respond under serious game pressure. I remain concerned about this. It feels like this team really feeds on confidence (as in, even more than all teams do). When things are going well (e.g. yesterday, Wisconsin), they go quite well. When they face adversity (albeit only a few times), things seem like they snowball in a hurry. This is not surprising for such a young team, so it'll be interesting to see if this changes going forward. It seems in particular that this phenomenon may be linked to the play of T. Jones. He has really elevated his level of play in big games, when he served as a big calming influence. But in the two losses plus Wake, he seemed to disappear. In some ways, as he goes, we go.

3) Shooting remains a potential red flag. One lesson opponents likely drew from the past few games -- to the extent they didn't know it already -- is that you can't guard Oak one-on-one. When L'Ville tried to do that in the second half, he absolutely shredded them. Double-teaming Oak and forcing him to kick it out to 3-point shooters is the best way to slow down our offense. Despite the generally solid offensive showing against an excellent defense yesterday, the shooting was once again suspect. I am guessing teams will continue to force us to live and die with the three. Frankly, I am surprised we haven't seen more zone, like we saw constantly last season.

4) On a related point, opponents would be smart to leave Amile alone. He unfortunately still can't shoot. That is why getting him moving to the basket yesterday was a great sign. He actually is very skilled at driving the ball and finishing around the basket. Getting him the ball in ways where he can score will help take double-team pressure off Oak.

5) Based on what I could tell on TV, I was not too impressed by the Louisville crowd. From everything I've heard, it's one of the more intense basketball towns in the country. I expected something on par to the Syracuse game last year -- first game against Duke in the ACC and all that. That is why I was surprised that the crowd was out of the game basically all day. Granted, their team was not playing well, but Harrell had to basically beg the crowd to get excited a few times. I also noticed a lot of empty seats from people who'd left in the last 5 minutes, even though the Cards had fought to get the lead down to 10. Maybe I'm offbase on this, but it seemed like a poor showing by the fans.

Not going to disagree with most of this. A big key is to punish the double team and that requires good shooting or better movement. Amile is great around the basket and there were a few plays where Jones found him cutting. Using Amile more like this is a good idea. There is no question Duke played hard and their D while not great did make Louisville work for their shots and got them frustrated. Being unpredictable on D will help Duke. K used to do this more a long time ago- throw in a new wrinkle or junk defense to shake things up against a given opponent. Duke is much better when Jones is driving an dishing. He may need to do more of this. No question that this was a great win. The issues have not gone away- but with a young team- you have to get ship righted quickly. K did that and the older guys- particularly Amile- helped to show the way. Another tough game at home and then a little break to work on some defense.

As for Louisville crowd- their team played very poorly and Duke was 20 points ahead before they had a chance to get back to their seats after half-time. I am sure if this was as close as the Syracuse game last year- which was a GREAT game- it would have been much louder.

[Troublemaker]

To be fair to you, all it took for you to be wrong was for Coach K to make the most dramatic and most unexpected shift in defensive strategy in his entire career. It is quite possible that, had we not completely changed defenses yesterday, you'd have still been correct.

Well, it didn't have to be the zone. The contracted m2m defense that you and others were suggesting could've worked also. Switching around some defensive assignments or player minutes could've worked also. The team just plain executing better could've worked also.

I would say let mgtr take his well-deserved medicine if he was one of the people freaking out. After the Miami game, the best bet to make was that things were going to change for the better, without necessarily knowing how that change would end up manifesting itself. And I have some standing to say this since I was one of the few on here who predicted that Duke would beat Louisville. Yes, this post was basically a brag!

[kmspeaks]

As for Louisville crowd- their team played very poorly and Duke was 20 points ahead before they had a chance to get back to their seats after half-time. I am sure if this was as close as the Syracuse game last year- which was a GREAT game- it would have been much louder.

I don't know, I kinda agree with Art on the crowd. Yes the second half was a blowout, but Duke didn't get a 2 possession lead until under the 4 minute mark in the 1st half and I never really felt like the crowd was a factor. Right before tip-off when they went to a really wide shot it looked like all the fans were sitting down. Even the usual pre-game fans going crazy shot was just 2 guys yelling while everyone around them looked bored.

[slower]

That justise had a below par scoring game is not surprising due to the excellent defense on him and he does still have an awkward shot.

Justise's form doesn't seem that awkward to me. Matt Jones, on the other hand, has a very awkward shot.

And yes, Amile was great. But he still can't hit a shot from more than a few feet away. But hopefully, he won't have to.

[azzefkram]

I 100% agree with the bolded part, and I think both the eye test and stats (Duke is actually 6th in the conference in points per possession on offense and 5th in points allowed) bear it out. It's weird to me how obsessed we've been with the zone defense, which I doubt we stick with, compared with offensive changes that may be more sustainable (Amile's of course not going to equal Okafor in scoring, but I'd love for him to be shooting as much as Justise for the rest of the season).

I disagree with your singling out of Matt Jones though. Here are some stats in conference play:

Matt Jones: 12.5 points/40 minutes on 47% true shooting (i.e. adjusting for threes and free throws)
Tyus Jones: 8.9 points/40 minutes on 40% true shooting
Justise Winslow: 12.2 points/40 minutes on 44% true shooting

Doesn't look to me that Matt's the big problem here. Of course I realize that Tyus has point guard distribution responsibilities, but we have a former all-ACC point guard in the lineup...(not that I propose actually changing the rotation substantially).

I didn't mean to single out Matt. Kedsy referenced him in the post prior, I was just too lazy to multiquote. I also think TS% is a poor comparator for the Jones boys given Tyus' additional responsibilities. I think our offensive woes are tied to three things: a bit of cold shooting team wide, Jah watching and Jah holding on to the ball a bit too much.

[evrim]

It seemed to me that when Rasheed was in the game, we did more man to man. Did anybody else notice that? Esp. when Tyus Jones was injured at the beginning, we switched. I am guessing Rasheed is better at stopping quicker guards?

[gep]

Coach K in the Louisville post game pressed mentioned this... Maybe?
•••••••••••

(Has the team been practicing more zone recently)“Again, we practice zone even before this game. We practiced it a lot. Basically what we did was we went zone on makes, and 11 on misses. The 11 is a little bit like a zone and it basically tries to keep people out of our paint.”

••••••••••

[mgtr]

Well, it didn't have to be the zone. The contracted m2m defense that you and others were suggesting could've worked also. Switching around some defensive assignments or player minutes could've worked also. The team just plain executing better could've worked also.

I would say let mgtr take his well-deserved medicine if he was one of the people freaking out. After the Miami game, the best bet to make was that things were going to change for the better, without necessarily knowing how that change would end up manifesting itself. And I have some standing to say this since I was one of the few on here who predicted that Duke would beat Louisville. Yes, this post was basically a brag!

Well, I was wrong, but not exactly freaking out. What I said was --

A lot of very good points made in this thread. I don't know how the Louisville game will come out, but I think it will be a turning point. I would expect to see a different starting lineup, and our players play very hard or sit for a period. I think that the key is that our coach did not get 997 wins by accident -- he knows what he is doing. Win or lose, lessons will be learned.

We didn't see a different starting lineup, and nobody sat for non-hard play that I could tell. Willing to take my medicine, but please, Daddy, no cod liver oil!!!

[Kfanarmy]

Interesting thing about our two big road wins is in both games we tried something that nobody expected ..
. But Coach K kept Wisconsin and Louisville off-balance by doing ...

The other thing that makes me chuckle is how most of the things people were harping on before the game turned out the opposite ... I guess all this just goes to show that making definitive statements about a team based on the previous one or two games is a process bound to look silly when the future actually unfolds. and what did you step out with?

[Kfanarmy]

3) Shooting remains a potential red flag. One lesson opponents likely drew from the past few games -- to the extent they didn't know it already -- is that you can't guard Oak one-on-one. When L'Ville tried to do that in the second half, he absolutely shredded them. Double-teaming Oak and forcing him to kick it out to 3-point shooters is the best way to slow down our offense.

4) On a related point, opponents would be smart to leave Amile alone. He unfortunately still can't shoot.

I thought Amile's play in the first half, which was by design, made Louisville go away from the double team of Okafor. It was a "pick your poison" situation in the second half until Duke started milking the clock. Good offensive adjustment by coaches coming into the game.

[Kedsy]

and what did you step out with?

I have no idea what this means.

[Kfanarmy]

I have no idea what this means.

Really? What did you offer as a prediction on what K would do or should do that justifies guffawing at others?

[Kedsy]

Really? What did you offer as a prediction on what K would do or should do that justifies guffawing at others?

The "guffawing," as you put it, was mostly at the way people can often only see the most recent game and not the bigger picture. And that there wasn't nearly so much of a major problem as many people thought. I don't think you need to make predictions to justify that opinion.

But, if you actually want an answer to your question, I believe I offered the suggestion that the lineup probably wouldn't change, that Amile was going to start and Matt was going to play, that Tyus would come around, that Justise wasn't in a "funk" because he'd had one bad game, that the team was much better than some people seemed to think after two bad losses, and that people shouldn't freak out and act like we were headed for the NIT. I had no idea what Coach K might do on defense, but I would never have guessed zone. I didn't offer a public opinion on whether we'd beat Louisville, because I didn't want to get into an argument about that and I didn't want to anger the weuxf gods, but privately I thought we would win. I didn't necessarily think we'd win as comfortably as we did.

Any other questions?

[Kfanarmy]

The "guffawing," as you put it, was mostly at the way people can often only see the most recent game and not the bigger picture. And that there wasn't nearly so much of a major problem as many people thought. I don't think you need to make predictions to justify that opinion.

But, if you actually want an answer to your question, I believe I offered the suggestion that the lineup probably wouldn't change, that Amile was going to start and Matt was going to play, that Tyus would come around, that Justise wasn't in a "funk" because he'd had one bad game, that the team was much better than some people seemed to think after two bad losses, and that people shouldn't freak out and act like we were headed for the NIT. I had no idea what Coach K might do on defense, but I would never have guessed zone. I didn't offer a public opinion on whether we'd beat Louisville, because I didn't want to get into an argument about that and I didn't want to anger the weuxf gods, but privately I thought we would win. I didn't necessarily think we'd win as comfortably as we did.

Any other questions?

Its perfectly reasonable for folks to offer their opinions on what Duke would, could, should do; where the season is and isnt headed, but the safest of all from criticism is to proffer little of predictive value but 20 20 hindsight, which is almost 100% statistically speaking. Venting in a non destructive way is what a lot of fans do.

[Kedsy]

Venting in a non destructive way is what a lot of fans do.

I think you're missing my point, but whatever. I suppose it depends on what you mean by "a non destructive way."

[Kfanarmy]

I think you're missing my point, but whatever. I suppose it depends on what you mean by "a non destructive way."

I think you're avoiding mine.

[sagegrouse]

The "guffawing," as you put it, was mostly at the way people can often only see the most recent game and not the bigger picture. And that there wasn't nearly so much of a major problem as many people thought. I don't think you need to make predictions to justify that opinion.

But, if you actually want an answer to your question, I believe I offered the suggestion that the lineup probably wouldn't change, that Amile was going to start and Matt was going to play, that Tyus would come around, that Justise wasn't in a "funk" because he'd had one bad game, that the team was much better than some people seemed to think after two bad losses, and that people shouldn't freak out and act like we were headed for the NIT. I had no idea what Coach K might do on defense, but I would never have guessed zone. I didn't offer a public opinion on whether we'd beat Louisville, because I didn't want to get into an argument about that and I didn't want to anger the weuxf gods, but privately I thought we would win. I didn't necessarily think we'd win as comfortably as we did.

Any other questions?

I would like to defend Al on his front page article. As far as I know, K had coached 1,100 games at Duke without ever playing primarily zone defense.* It is not unreasonable to say, "Fuhgedaboutit," when it comes to zone at Duke.

I, for one, thought that benching Tyus was really unlikely, because he's the QB. Benching the QB has long-term as well as short-term consequences. Moreover, any coach has the prerogative of starting a player but reducing his minutes, sometimes to salutary effects, such as with Amile.

I am amused that Winslow, despite almost no productivity on the offensive end, played more minutes against Louisville than any other player. I birding we have a term, GIs, which means "general impression and shape." My general impression is that Justise is a formidable presence on the flooe, even when he is doing very little.