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wiscodevil
09-13-2007, 01:38 PM
wow, what a tough break for him and the city.

riverside6
09-13-2007, 01:50 PM
Could be good news for McRoberts though in terms of playing time. Gotta be a bigtime bummer for Blazers fans (if any exist).

Patrick Yates
09-13-2007, 02:16 PM
Shades of Sam Bowie everyone? Bowie was a stud center with a history of injury problems taken ahead of MJ. Bowie was reportedly a great player, and no one at the time questioned the pick, but injuries never let him live up to his potential.

Also, how old is Oden? I know we all made jokes about it, but he has the durability of a thirty year old who has been ridden hard throughout his career. Maybe he isn't a teen ager after all.

All I am saying is that something suuuuuuuuuure smells rotten in the state of Denmark [Oregon].

Patrick Yates

lavell12
09-13-2007, 02:54 PM
Atleast Josh will get to play more minutes now. Sucks for Portland. Not to be a jerk but I was one of the guys on the Durant side when it came to who the Blazers should pick.

SoCalDukeFan
09-13-2007, 03:09 PM
Also, how old is Oden? I know we all made jokes about it, but he has the durability of a thirty year old who has been ridden hard throughout his career. Maybe he isn't a teen ager after all.

All I am saying is that something suuuuuuuuuure smells rotten in the state of Denmark [Oregon].

Patrick Yates

If Oden is 30 what was he doing for the last 10 years? I mean the guy is a little hard to hide.

SoCal

AtlBluRew
09-13-2007, 03:58 PM
His demeanor has been a breath of fresh air in the NBA. Here's to a full recovery and henceforth an injury-free career.

Johnboy
09-13-2007, 04:06 PM
I agree with the main point of your post, which is that Oden could be the next Bowie, but I couldn't let this little nit be left unpicked.


Shades of Sam Bowie everyone? Bowie was a stud center with a history of injury problems taken ahead of MJ. Bowie was reportedly a great player, and no one at the time questioned the pick, but injuries never let him live up to his potential.


Were you around when MJ went third in the draft? I think most people questioned the pick. Hell, I wasn't even a rabid fan, and I questioned the pick. Hakeem was the expected first pick, I will grant you. Bowie made sense for Portland, considering that Drexler was already there, but it wasn't exactly the consensus that Bowie was the best pick in that spot, even at the time, because of his injuries.

Here's what MJ's bio (http://www.nba.com/history/players/jordan_bio.html) on NBA.com says about it:

The Houston Rockets selected 7-0 center Hakeem Olajuwon form the University of Houston with the No.1 pick, which most expected. The Portland Trail Blazers, however, with the No. 2 pick chose 7-1 center Sam Bowie from Kentucky, which was not as anticipated. Bowie had suffered several injuries while in college but the Blazers bypassed Jordan because just the year before the team selected another exciting shooting guard in Clyde Drexler. Although Drexler went onto to be a star, Bowie was an injury prone player with a journeyman pro career.

ACCBBallFan
09-13-2007, 04:44 PM
Greg Oden will bounce back and so will Portland, but some insurance carrier just took a bit hit.

elvis14
09-13-2007, 05:04 PM
Greg Oden sure seems like a pretty good kid. This is the second bad thing to happen to him lately. The first would be Portland winning the draft lottery! :D Microfracture surgery is serious stuff. Look at Amare Stoudimare. Even after all this time, he still doesn't look like the same explosive player he was IMHO (not that he isn't great still). Hopefully Oden's injury is less severe. From a Portland perspective this will put them back in the lottery next year with the opportunity to pick up another super stud to build a team around. Not too bad a deal for the team in the long run.

Mostly though I hope Oden is able to recover and be successful. Stuff like this is supposed to happen to Tar Heels, not likable guys like Oden!

BD80
09-13-2007, 05:36 PM
So you're saying that Oden gets the surgery, the insurance co. pays his salary this year, and Portland gets:

A SIDE OF MAYO????

Sorry.

They might also get a $3 mil injury excemption that might have some trade value. (Or is Portland under the cap after dumping Randolph).

greybeard
09-13-2007, 06:01 PM
SI on-line reports that some team doc's were very unsure about Oden based upon the many problems his body presents. SI also reports that his doctors think that the knee might be the result of problems with his hip and back. I say look to the feet.

grey "If you want to know, what is hurtin him so, it's in his feet" beard

Others with the microfracture problem have not faired as well as Amarie, except for Kidd. I never liked Oden's act after dunking, hanging on the rim, bringing his knees up to his chest, and swinging. Said so here. Something about that seemed terribly wrong and unnecessary. Maybe he was just protecting an injury that hadn't yet made itself completely manifest.

grey "sports need to fit the bodies of the athletes who play them; any other option is just plain wrong" beard

JasonEvans
09-13-2007, 08:53 PM
I believe one of Oden's legs is longer than the other -- anyone know anything about that? Is this injury in the long leg or the short one.

As a semi-playful aside, I am sure Greybeard has a 330-line dissertation on why poeple with different sized limbs are more prone to injury or something like that.

--Jason "I am not so sure the Blazers are lottery bound next season-- certainly not the top of the lottery unless they get lucky again" Evans

greybeard
09-13-2007, 09:34 PM
I believe one of Oden's legs is longer than the other -- anyone know anything about that? Is this injury in the long leg or the short one.

As a semi-playful aside, I am sure Greybeard has a 330-line dissertation on why poeple with different sized limbs are more prone to injury or something like that.

--Jason "I am not so sure the Blazers are lottery bound next season-- certainly not the top of the lottery unless they get lucky again" Evans

The question is is the leg really shorter. Try this Jason "you're too young to be so cynical" Evans.

Stand with your feet comfortably (shoulder width apart). Put both arms out in front of you and notice if the fingers of either hand is longer than the other, and, if so, by how much. Now, let your dominant arm hang loose, and then losser than that. Even lean to that side so that the shoulder droops. Now, let a little nothing start to happen (shaking) between the thumb and other fingers in that hand. I mean a little nothing. Let the shaking find its way up to your forearm, only what is easy now Evans, like your thumb and your third and fourth fingers are like a butterfly. Let the shaking move up into your upper arm, and then into your shoulder muscles. Then let the butterfly fly around. Zoom all the way up and around and let your body move with it. Let the butterfly soar up, up, up, way high and then let it just drop (letting your shoulder droop down). Let it fly again and then let it drop again.

Now stand comfortably letting your arms hang. Bring your arms up and see if any fingers are longer.

Or, you could make believe you lift a bucket of mud in one arm. Let it swing forward and backward, gentely, until the momentum (make believe) of the bucket increases the arch. Let the entire body become involved. As the bucket swings down let the knees and torso bend. On the upswings the opposite. Then measure your arms.

Now, picture a cronic problem with a person's hip, aka Oden, over a period of many years. Imagine further, as I posit, that there are problems with one of the feet. Imagine further that there is a back problem. What's the chance the legs are going to have anywhere the same tension in them and be the same length.

Then again, maybe one or more of the freakin bones in one of the legs is really discernibly shorter than the other.

Grey "I bet that one leg is not shorter than the other; if it is, I'd operate and make the other the same size; problem solved" beard :cool:

throatybeard
09-13-2007, 09:51 PM
Wait, has Oden played Women's BB? Or football?

greybeard
09-13-2007, 10:13 PM
Wait, has Oden played Women's BB? Or football?

With all the money he's gotten for doing exactly nothing, he could have been playing one on one with you, Throaty. Is this a great country or what?

Now, I wonder how fast he can "come back." Over and under on whether it's before Amaire blows out his knee again.

I hope he becomes a dentist and let's his legs stay uneven instead of getting one shortened. Is there any other remedy for having legs that ain't the same size?

Throaty, what does it say to you that two of the top 5 centers to come out of high school in the last three years (not counting this past one) got drafted by the same team but are not nearly as healthy and therefore as good as when they first came out?
a. They both should be able to sue the NBA? b. Portland has a thing for gimps? c. Portand was just trying to replace Bill Walton as the best big man with the shortest NBA career. or d. the game is seriously damaging some terrific, terrific talents and that is a real shame.

Never mind. Making choices is oh so difficult for you younger guys; you'd much prefer to let other people take the risks, whatever they are, right? ;)

JasonEvans
09-13-2007, 10:27 PM
The question is is the leg really shorter. Try this Jason "you're too young to be so cynical" Evans.

Stand with your feet comfortably (shoulder width apart). Put both arms out in front of you and notice if the fingers of either hand is longer than the other, and, if so, by how much. Now, let your dominant arm hang loose, and then losser than that. Even lean to that side so that the shoulder droops. Now, let a little nothing start to happen (shaking) between the thumb and other fingers in that hand. I mean a little nothing. Let the shaking find its way up to your forearm, only what is easy now Evans, like your thumb and your third and fourth fingers are like a butterfly. Let the shaking move up into your upper arm, and then into your shoulder muscles. Then let the butterfly fly around. Zoom all the way up and around and let your body move with it. Let the butterfly soar up, up, up, way high and then let it just drop (letting your shoulder droop down). Let it fly again and then let it drop again.

Now stand comfortably letting your arms hang. Bring your arms up and see if any fingers are longer.

Or, you could make believe you lift a bucket of mud in one arm. Let it swing forward and backward, gentely, until the momentum (make believe) of the bucket increases the arch. Let the entire body become involved. As the bucket swings down let the knees and torso bend. On the upswings the opposite. Then measure your arms.

Now, picture a cronic problem with a person's hip, aka Oden, over a period of many years. Imagine further, as I posit, that there are problems with one of the feet. Imagine further that there is a back problem. What's the chance the legs are going to have anywhere the same tension in them and be the same length.

Then again, maybe one or more of the freakin bones in one of the legs is really discernibly shorter than the other.

Grey "I bet that one leg is not shorter than the other; if it is, I'd operate and make the other the same size; problem solved" beard :cool:

I'll give a buck to anyone who understand what the heck Greybeard is talking about in this post. Seriously. I read it twice. I think it is an English translation of a Japanese stretching exercise. What's more, I'll double the reward if you can explain what this has to do with Greg Oden's physical problems.

--Jason "the fact that Greg Oden and Amare Stoudamire have had knee problems must mean that every basketball player is in grave danger" Evans

DevilAlumna
09-13-2007, 11:06 PM
--Jason "the fact that Greg Oden and Amare Stoudamire have had knee problems must mean that every basketball player is in grave danger" Evans

Geez, you really HAVEN'T been reading the OT board lately, have you? :D Otherwise, you would have already known that the very essence of civilization as we know it is threatened by Basketball and Soccer and Football.

Luckily, rowing and field hockey are apparently safe. Whew.

The scary thing is, I think I understand his point.:eek:

greybeard
09-13-2007, 11:07 PM
I'll give a buck to anyone who understand what the heck Greybeard is talking about in this post. Seriously. I read it twice. I think it is an English translation of a Japanese stretching exercise. What's more, I'll double the reward if you can explain what this has to do with Greg Oden's physical problems.

--Jason "the fact that Greg Oden and Amare Stoudamire have had knee problems must mean that every basketball player is in grave danger" Evans

Trager mentastics, look it up and weep, you young neophite who has so much to learn but so little will.

Had you simply followed the instructions instead of trying to understand (like Bill Munch used to say, "don't think, you ain't built for it" not meant personal, I hated Munch for such comments), you might have found that the arm would have lengthened several inches after doing that silly nothing butterfly exercise. That is how much tension we hold, particularly in the shoulders. Now, if someone has a "bad" hip, how much holding (constriction) takes place cronically in the big muscle groups on that side of the body (butt, psoas, mid back, hip flexors, quads, etc). Enough to make a leg shorter, albeit not anotomically, just physically. Ditto if his spine is twisted, causing muscle spasms in the back.

So, how this maize gets unlocked, untwisted, unstressed, is outside the ken of most orthopods and trainers. Of most people. So, one leg becomes shorter than the other, which it is, but not because any bones are of appreciably different length.

Jason "you'll catch on and might even find value in it, if you give yourself a chance to become a butterfly, which requires accepting change, in your case, a change in concepts" Evans

Or not.

Try the freakin experience; it ain't that tough.

BTW, Milton Trager was a way cool dude from Miami who became an MD late in life, and became way big in California and around the country in the 70s.

Metastics, or mental gymnastics as Milton coined them, btw, you've seen swimmers doing them when they get ready for races for years only I doubt that even they knew their warmups by their true name. They, the good ones at least, when she see them shaking their arms while standing on the racing blocks, they are really just making shaking (butterfly like) movements with their fingers which they allow to shake their forearm muscles up through their shoulders. Loosens their upper extremities for maximum range of motion, legth, and mechanical advantage. And, oh, when they kick their heals out, like they're trying to walk, mentastics too, to loosen their butts and lower backs so their rotation and kicking will again be maximized with mimial effort. Very similar to some Feldenkrais stuff, btw, but different in purpose.

Grey "I been around and have kept my eyes open and am not so easily dismissed" beard

BTW, Jason, SI listed I think it was five current players who are known to have micofractures; how many aren't, yet? But, hey, like Throaty, I'm as comfortable as the next guy in having the guys gettin paid the big bucks takin the big risks for my entertainment, only I don't find NBA basketball entertaining for precisely the reasons that contribute to the risks. You probably like heavy metal too; I'm an R&B man myself.

Wander
09-14-2007, 12:15 AM
Anyone who ever reverts to an "I'm older than you, so I'm right" argument should be banned from the internet.

unexpected
09-14-2007, 01:18 AM
IIRC, Oden shoots free throws backwards because of his leg situation.

His longer leg becomes the back leg, and the shorter leg becomes the front leg. Since Oden is right-handed, you'd assume that the left leg would be in front. According to this backward hypothesis, this would mean that his left leg is indeed the longer leg.

They have said that the surgery is on the right leg. So, surgery is on shorter leg.

Did anyone read the post by Bill Simmons about tall people and the way they move? It's too true:

http://proxy.espn.go.com/espn/page2/blog/index?name=simmons

dukemomLA
09-14-2007, 02:37 AM
I understood you perfectly. Tried the exercises -- and yes my right fingers are longer than my left, etc. etc. (And I'm left-handed). Fun stuff!

Lavabe
09-14-2007, 04:11 AM
Did anyone read the post by Bill Simmons about tall people and the way they move? It's too true:

"For instance, we all know one or two exceptionally tall people who don't play sports -- they always move gingerly, and their posture usually isn't that good, and everything about them says, "I wish I wasn't this tall."

I confess. I always wanted to be a jockey. :rolleyes: Maybe a short sportswriter. :rolleyes: Or at least, I always wanted to be that nasty, short so-and-so who feels compelled to recline, without notice, in the airplane seat in front of me. That simple act bruises my knees for days. That'll make ANYONE walk gingerly.

Other than that, it's a poor stereotype. "I wish I wasn't this tall?" HUH?!?!?! :eek:

Cheers,
Lavabe

Lavabe
09-14-2007, 04:58 AM
Have we now crossed into off-topic board territory?

Cheers,
Lavabe

greybeard
09-14-2007, 08:00 AM
Anyone who ever reverts to an "I'm older than you, so I'm right" argument should be banned from the internet.

Not "older", silly, just much more informed.

I have emerced myself in different courses of exploration/study from some extremely talented/gifted/knowledgible folks over a 20 year period.

Not better, just different. "I mean no harm, nor put fault, on anyone, who lives in a vault, but It's Alright Ma, if I can't please them." Robert Zimmerman

greybeard
09-14-2007, 08:13 AM
Geez, you really HAVEN'T been reading the OT board lately, have you? :D Otherwise, you would have already known that the very essence of civilization as we know it is threatened by Basketball and Soccer and Football.

Luckily, rowing and field hockey are apparently safe. Whew.

The scary thing is, I think I understand his point.:eek:

I'm sorry to have been so strident in our little debate. I think that we are actually pretty much on the same page with regard to caring a lot about reducing the incidence of injury in sport and you seem much more knowledgible than I about some of the stuff that is being accepted and acted upon in the mainstream which holds some promise.

Not surprised at all that you get it. There is a book written on Mentastics by a women who was close to Milton for many years. Very poetic, with lots of photos. Very good bathroom, er, coffee table, book.

BTW, Milton came upon mentastics when he and his brothers used to entertain folks on the beach in Miami to earn some dough as teenagers doing handstands, leaping over eachother, etc. A regular circus act. One day Milton said to himself, "I wonder what it would be like if, instead of just trying to jump higher, I tried to land softer, and then asked myself what could be softer than that.

We all copy.

AtlBluRew
09-14-2007, 09:10 AM
I'll give a buck to anyone who understand what the heck Greybeard is talking about in this post. Seriously. I read it twice. I think it is an English translation of a Japanese stretching exercise. What's more, I'll double the reward if you can explain what this has to do with Greg Oden's physical problems.

--Jason "the fact that Greg Oden and Amare Stoudamire have had knee problems must mean that every basketball player is in grave danger" Evans

I read it quickly and realized the source of your confusion. I think he forgot to add, after all those instructions of what to do with arms, hands and legs:

"And then you do the hokey-pokey
And you shake it all about ...
That's what it's all about!"

greybeard
09-14-2007, 09:31 AM
I read it quickly and realized the source of your confusion. I think he forgot to add, after all those instructions of what to do with arms, hands and legs:

"And then you do then you do the hokey-pokey
And you shake it all about ...
That's what it's all about!"

"He not busy being born is busy dying." BZ. Nevertheless, that was funny.

Come to think of it, you could do worse than the old hokey-pokey to warm up your body for activity; or you can go to an orthopod and get your "longer" leg shortened, or, for that matter, your "shorter" leg lengthened (possible, but takes a long time for the broken bone that is spaced by metal bars to mesh, and even a youngster like Jason would grow impatient (you think!)).

Say, wht is it with you Atlanta sports fans. You're probably actually happy that the court ruled for the Spirit.

RepoMan
09-14-2007, 10:08 AM
Anyone who ever reverts to an "I'm older than you, so I'm right" argument should be banned from the internet.

Dude, if you don't love Greybeard's posts, you ain't listenin'. A truly unique voice in an Internet wilderness.

Indoor66
09-14-2007, 10:19 AM
Dude, if you don't love Greybeard's posts, you ain't listenin'. A truly unique voice in an Internet wilderness.

I completely agree. Maybe painful at times, always unique. Getting old ain't all bad, just mostly bad! :D

greybeard
09-14-2007, 12:10 PM
Wow, RepoMan and Indoor66, I hardly know what to say. In such circumstances, I rely on the Bard:

Alone you stand without nobody near
When a trembling distant voice, unclear
Startles your sleeping ears to hear
That somebody thinks
They really found you.

BTW, ATlBlueReview, if the hokey pokey ain't daring enough for ya, try this:

get a piece of fast music that goes on for a while (10 minutes preferrably), and dance naked in front of a mirror until the music stops. You start thinking, "This is ridiculous," say to yourself, "Interesting thought, now dance;" you start thinking, "this is boring or this is tiring or this is pointless," reply, "thank you for sharing, then keep dancing;" you notice that maybe your "dance moves" are more illusion then movement, see what it is like to dance with no script, no judgments, keep dancing, moving to, with, in the music, until it stops.

Notice if it is not more quiet, more spaceous, inside. Or not.

grey "yeap, I was once 'a wild and crazy' guy myself and boy do I miss the wild part" beard

AtlBluRew
09-14-2007, 12:43 PM
BTW, ATlBlueReview, if the hokey pokey ain't daring enough for ya, try this:

get a piece of fast music that goes on for a while (10 minutes preferrably), and dance naked in front of a mirror until the music stops. You start thinking, "This is ridiculous," say to yourself, "Interesting thought, now dance;" you start thinking, "this is boring or this is tiring or this is pointless," reply, "thank you for sharing, then keep dancing;" you notice that maybe your "dance moves" are more illusion then movement, see what it is like to dance with no script, no judgments, keep dancing, moving to, with, in the music, until it stops.

Notice if it is not more quiet, more spaceous, inside. Or not.

Oh sure, I've done that. But I probably shouldn't have taken the mirror out into the front yard before I started. :eek:

Indoor66
09-14-2007, 12:50 PM
Wow, RepoMan and Indoor66, I hardly know what to say. In such circumstances, I rely on the Bard:

Alone you stand without nobody near
When a trembling distant voice, unclear
Startles your sleeping ears to hear
That somebody thinks
They really found you.

BTW, ATlBlueReview, if the hokey pokey ain't daring enough for ya, try this:

get a piece of fast music that goes on for a while (10 minutes preferrably), and dance naked in front of a mirror until the music stops. You start thinking, "This is ridiculous," say to yourself, "Interesting thought, now dance;" you start thinking, "this is boring or this is tiring or this is pointless," reply, "thank you for sharing, then keep dancing;" you notice that maybe your "dance moves" are more illusion then movement, see what it is like to dance with no script, no judgments, keep dancing, moving to, with, in the music, until it stops.

Notice if it is not more quiet, more spaceous, inside. Or not.

grey "yeap, I was once 'a wild and crazy' guy myself and boy do I miss the wild part" beard

To be clear, I am on your side. That signature fits me as well - especially the "do I miss the wild part..." LOL

greybeard
09-14-2007, 01:28 PM
To be clear, I am on your side. That signature fits me as well - especially the "do I miss the wild part..." LOL

Got that entirely; very, very gratifying. To the "wild part" then, eh, Cisco?:cool:

Indoor66
09-14-2007, 02:17 PM
Got that entirely; very, very gratifying. To the "wild part" then, eh, Cisco?:cool:

Eh, Pancho :) :)

mapei
09-14-2007, 02:23 PM
I have emerced myself in different courses of exploration/study from some extremely talented/gifted/knowledgible folks over a 20 year period.

Was spelling among them? ;)

greybeard
09-14-2007, 02:48 PM
Was spelling among them? ;)

Who cares about no stinkin spellin: there are horrific things going on in the world, particularly in AtlBluRew's neighborhood, for the devil is surely he with the images his words conjure. :)

greybeard
09-14-2007, 06:42 PM
It has come to my attention through channels that some of my posts seem "rude and antagonist." I can only say that any person that I poke fun at, and that is what I try to do, especially if I copy a poster's style, reflects only that that person has tickled my mind. Mimicry, as they say, is the highest form of flattery. That informs my posts here.

Where or what would DBR be without the originals, the creative wits, that provide some pop to be played off of. Hurumph. Hurumph, I say. Can't do any better. :o

johnnydakota
09-14-2007, 07:04 PM
Shades of Sam Bowie everyone? Bowie was a stud center with a history of injury problems taken ahead of MJ. Bowie was reportedly a great player, and no one at the time questioned the pick, but injuries never let him live up to his potential.

Also, how old is Oden? I know we all made jokes about it, but he has the durability of a thirty year old who has been ridden hard throughout his career. Maybe he isn't a teen ager after all.

All I am saying is that something suuuuuuuuuure smells rotten in the state of Denmark [Oregon].

Patrick Yates

Uh, Pat, to compare Bowie's injury history to Oden's is waaay off. To compare them as players is even further off. Oden broke his wrist after h.s. which certainly is no indicator that he is injury prone. He never missed a game in h.s., and just 7 because of the wrist in college. Bowie had all kinds of habitual problems throughout his career. As players, Bowie was skilled offensively, but hardly explosive. Oden is a dominant rebounder and defender who is as physical and explosive as any college center since Shaq.

captmojo
09-15-2007, 07:29 AM
You don't get to being old by being stupid...but you gotta admit AltBlu's hokey pokey thing was funny.

EarlJam
09-17-2007, 11:04 AM
Anyone who ever reverts to an "I'm older than you, so I'm right" argument should be banned from the internet.

Well,

I just tried the "exercise" and both my legs just snapped in half. I'm going to the emergency room now. OH the pain. The pain!

-EarlJam

tropical storm
09-17-2007, 11:32 AM
Ok, I like most people read Greybeard's post and thought he had mostly written it to see if he could get us to all look really foolish by acting like a butterfly. I even expected the final sentence to be something like "Are you flapping like a butterfly, He-He boy did I get you".

Still I have to report that I was gullible enough to do exactly this. As a control I had only my right arm act as a butterfly. Initially my Right Arm appeared about 1/2 inch shorter than my dominate left arm. However after a few minutes of flapping my fingers, forearms and shoulders like a wounded butterfly, when I held my arms out at the end of the experiment my right arm appears about 1 1/2 inches longer than my left.

Of course, my co-workers now think I am very strange, but that is a small price to pay in the name of science. I recommend others try this.... preferably in a small, dark secluded room.

-Storm

greybeard
09-17-2007, 01:20 PM
Well,

I just tried the "exercise" and both my legs just snapped in half. I'm going to the emergency room now. OH the pain. The pain!

-EarlJam

No, no, no, EarlJam, that was for everybody else. For you, I would have recommended some partner yoga work, with someone of the female persuasion (assuming we could find someone). Something Tantric. Proof of efficacy would then be at hand. :eek:

EarlJam
09-17-2007, 01:30 PM
I read it quickly and realized the source of your confusion. I think he forgot to add, after all those instructions of what to do with arms, hands and legs:

"And then you do the hokey-pokey
And you shake it all about ...
That's what it's all about!"

Once seen on a bumper sticker: "What if the Hokey Pokey really IS what it's all about?"

I liked it.

-Earl O' the Jam

EarlJam
09-17-2007, 01:36 PM
BTW, ATlBlueReview, if the hokey pokey ain't daring enough for ya, try this:

get a piece of fast music that goes on for a while (10 minutes preferrably), and dance naked in front of a mirror until the music stops. You start thinking, "This is ridiculous," say to yourself, "Interesting thought, now dance;" you start thinking, "this is boring or this is tiring or this is pointless," reply, "thank you for sharing, then keep dancing;" you notice that maybe your "dance moves" are more illusion then movement, see what it is like to dance with no script, no judgments, keep dancing, moving to, with, in the music, until it stops.

Notice if it is not more quiet, more spaceous, inside. Or not.

grey "yeap, I was once 'a wild and crazy' guy myself and boy do I miss the wild part" beard

far OUT!!!!

I did something very similar to this the last time I was on pain meds (Saturday) - only I was wearing a nurse's outfit with white thigh-highs and a garter belt. :eek:

I just threw up.

Seriously, cool post Greaybeard. I like the way you think!

-EarlJam

JasonEvans
09-17-2007, 01:40 PM
http://www.bumperart.com/ProductImages/2004012441_Display-25.gif

greybeard
09-17-2007, 02:04 PM
Wow, folks tried it. If you find that small dark room, Tropical Storm speaks of, let me know. No, just kidding, you might want also to try a little Feldenkrais experience, that might take maybe 5 minutes and almost zero effort. This is done on the floor, so you need a towel, maybe two.

lie on your back with your shoes off. If your neck feels crunched, take the second towel and fold it sufficiently that when you put it under the back of your head, no crunched feeling any more.

Now, this is about discerning differences, feel, so always have the intention of moving until the quality of tonus changes and no farther. What I refer to as "only what is easy." This work oh so does not depend on how "big" a movement is.

Now, lie there for a second and notice how your body contacts the floor, your feet--their direction, which parts touch or don't), calves, back of your upper legs, butt, lower back ribs, shoulder blades, etc. Notice differences between the two sides. If you want to go crazy with this, you might try to imagine a straight edge going from between your eyes to your nose and chin and see which way your head points.

Anyway. Here we go. This involves a simple movement. Turning your head in one direction. Which one. Well, for us right now, it don't matter. If we were working for real, we would suggest a way for you to chose.

So, open your eyes and turn your head to the right (that is, keeping the back of your head where it is, turn to the right as if you wanted to look over your shoulder) but only go so far as what is easy, and go slowly; then turn back to center. Rest for a moment, and repeat 5 times or more, each time making sure that it only as far as what is easy (see above). Notice by referencing the wall to the side, where on the wall your eyes settle (oh, did I mention turn on the lights).

Now, do the very same thing slowly and what is easy while exhaling while turning away. Repeat a number of times (your choice, but 5 to 15 will do). Then rest. Notice the contact your body makes with the ground. If it is different and how.

Now, repeat the process only inhale as you turn your head. Notice how that affects the range of motion. Repeat and then rest.

Now, try once again turning while exhailing. Notice where your eyes rest on the wall. Interesting.

Now, place your feet on the floor so that your knees are pointing to the ceiling.

This time turn your head but lead the turn with your eyes (so your eyes begin looking to the right but again doing only what is easy). Repeat the usual number of times.

Now, as you turn to the right, let your eyes move in the opposite direction, that is towards the left. (yeap, you heard me right). Repeat the usual number of times.

Now, turn your head to the right with your eyes leading. Again, only what is easy. Notice where your eyes rest on the wall.

Now, let your legs go long and notice the contact with the ground. Notice if there are differences between the two sides.

Finally, bring the feet to the floor with the left knee up and the right leg long. As you turn your head to the right, push gently into the ground with your left foot. Turning only as far as easy. Do not push so hard that the left knee turns to the right. Let it be upright, pointing towards the ceiling.

Repeat the usual number of times. Notice how far your eyes go on the wall.

Let both feet go long and relax your body. Notice the contact with the ground. Now, turn your head to the right. Only what is easy. Notice where your eyes go. Lie flat again.

Interesting stuff. How comes come later, in your own good time.

"Still crazy, after all these years, yes, still crazy . . . ." My once main man Paul.

Lavabe
09-17-2007, 04:49 PM
I have two degenerative disks in my lower neck, and have about 90% motion in the neck (on a good day). If I try your latest "experience" will I be in pain a la EarlJam, or will I now be able to spin my head like Linda Blair in the Exorcist?;)

Cheers,
Lavabe

greybeard
09-17-2007, 05:23 PM
I have two degenerative disks in my lower neck, and have about 90% motion in the neck (on a good day). If I try your latest "experience" will I be in pain a la EarlJam, or will I now be able to spin my head like Linda Blair in the Exorcist?;)

Cheers,
Lavabe

Guy walks into a bar, sees a dog lying in the corner, lickin his ownself, and says, "Gee, I wish I could do that."

Bartender replies, "You should have been here a few minutes ago, there was this ole dukie who lied down and started to slowly turn his head, and before you know it . . . ."

Only what is easy, Lavmygoodman, only what is easy, and who knows what could happen. ;)