FSU Scandal Thread - Jameis in Jeopardy?

[Duvall]

Reports coming today that FSU Compliance is investigating the substantial number of autographed items authenticated by the autograph dealer linked to suspended Georgia running back Todd Gurley. (http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/11697064/florida-state-seminoles-look-jameis-winston-autographs)


Fisher then told reporters he wasn't concerned that an autograph authentication business, which recently was linked to suspended Georgia running back Todd Gurley, also was linked to Winston.

James Spence Authentication certified more than 500 autographs of Gurley, who is being investigated for allegedly taking money for signings.

A cursory search on JSA's website found more than 340 certified Winston autographs.

This comes on the heels of the news that Winston will be facing an ad hoc hearing to determine whether he violated the school's code of student conduct (http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/11697065/one-three-former-florida-supreme-court-justices-serve-official-jameis-winston-hearing) in relation to an alleged sexual assault in December 2012. This in turns follows a Fox Sports report that FSU university officials and Tallahassee police hampered the investigation into the December 2012 incident (http://www.foxsports.com/college-football/story/jameis-winston-florida-state-tallahassee-police-hindered-investigation-documents-101014) by, among other things, providing police reports to university athletic officials and Winston's attorney days before the reports were provided to the local prosecutor.

Also this week the New York Times reviewed the sometimes checkered relationship between FSU football and Tallahassee criminal justice. (http://www.nytimes.com/2014/10/12/us/florida-state-football-casts-shadow-over-tallahassee-justice.html)


When Jesus (Bobo) Wilson, an up-and-coming wide receiver, was stopped by the Tallahassee police in June while riding a stolen Bintelli Sprint motor scooter, his story was dubious: He claimed he had borrowed it from a student whose last name he did not know. But for Officer Michael Petroczky, it was convincing enough to forestall an arrest.

The officer, noting in his report that Mr. Wilson was a Florida State football player, wrote: “Wilson was not arrested today because he cooperated, showed no signs of guilt and provided a plausible story that needs to be investigated.”

According to the scooter’s owner, Mr. Wilson’s football connections weighed heavily on the case. After letting Mr. Wilson go, the officer arranged to meet the owner, a Florida State student, in a campus parking lot at night and “questioned if I was mentally stable or if I had forgotten that I lent him the scooter,” the student said in an email interview. The officer seemed deeply reluctant to charge Mr. Wilson, saying he did not want his name on the arrest report, according to the student.

“He told me that he had not arrested Wilson because he was a football player, and he did not want to ‘ruin’ his record by arresting him” if there was a chance he might be innocent, the student wrote.

So...all that is happening.

[left_hook_lacey]

Reports coming today that FSU Compliance is investigating the substantial number of autographed items authenticated by the autograph dealer linked to suspended Georgia running back Todd Gurley. (http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/11697064/florida-state-seminoles-look-jameis-winston-autographs)



This comes on the heels of the news that Winston will be facing an ad hoc hearing to determine whether he violated the school's code of student conduct (http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/11697065/one-three-former-florida-supreme-court-justices-serve-official-jameis-winston-hearing) in relation to an alleged sexual assault in December 2012. This in turns follows a Fox Sports report that FSU university officials and Tallahassee police hampered the investigation into the December 2012 incident (http://www.foxsports.com/college-football/story/jameis-winston-florida-state-tallahassee-police-hindered-investigation-documents-101014) by, among other things, providing police reports to university athletic officials and Winston's attorney days before the reports were provided to the local prosecutor.

Also this week the New York Times reviewed the sometimes checkered relationship between FSU football and Tallahassee criminal justice. (http://www.nytimes.com/2014/10/12/us/florida-state-football-casts-shadow-over-tallahassee-justice.html)



So...all that is happening.


WOW. This kid is either a really bad apple, or the unluckiest person on the planet. Seems like a new accusation everytime an old one dies down a bit.

[lotusland]

Reports coming today that FSU Compliance is investigating the substantial number of autographed items authenticated by the autograph dealer linked to suspended Georgia running back Todd Gurley. (http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/11697064/florida-state-seminoles-look-jameis-winston-autographs)



This comes on the heels of the news that Winston will be facing an ad hoc hearing to determine whether he violated the school's code of student conduct (http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/11697065/one-three-former-florida-supreme-court-justices-serve-official-jameis-winston-hearing) in relation to an alleged sexual assault in December 2012. This in turns follows a Fox Sports report that FSU university officials and Tallahassee police hampered the investigation into the December 2012 incident (http://www.foxsports.com/college-football/story/jameis-winston-florida-state-tallahassee-police-hindered-investigation-documents-101014) by, among other things, providing police reports to university athletic officials and Winston's attorney days before the reports were provided to the local prosecutor.

Also this week the New York Times reviewed the sometimes checkered relationship between FSU football and Tallahassee criminal justice. (http://www.nytimes.com/2014/10/12/us/florida-state-football-casts-shadow-over-tallahassee-justice.html)

So...all that is happening.

I'm generally opposed to paying college athletes but football is a vastly different than basketball. Gurley and Winston, like Manziel last year, had already proven themselves to the NFL at least a year before their third season. Those guys could really only hurt their draft stock by playing an additional year of college. Likewise for Clowney last year. Marcus Lattimore may very well have suffered a career ending injury his junior year. I think it's just a matter of time before guys like Clowney or Gurley sit out the third year, sign some endorsement deals and wait for the draft. Rules are rules so Gurley and possibly Winston should suffer the consequences but I think the courts should really be looking at the NFL and NBA for anti-trust violations more so than the NCAA.

[uh_no]

I'm generally opposed to paying college athletes but football is a vastly different than basketball. Gurley and Winston, like Manziel last year, had already proven themselves to the NFL at least a year before their third season. Those guys could really only hurt their draft stock by playing an additional year of college. Likewise for Clowney last year. Marcus Lattimore may very well have suffered a career ending injury his junior year. I think it's just a matter of time before guys like Clowney or Gurley sit out the third year, sign some endorsement deals and wait for the draft. Rules are rules so Gurley and possibly Winston should suffer the consequences but I think the courts should really be looking at the NFL and NBA for anti-trust violations more so than the NCAA.

too bad Manziel can't prove himself to the NFL now :P

[Atlanta Duke]

They got Al Capone on tax evasion, not the St Valentines Day massacre

Go for it

[Bluegrassdevil1]

When coupled with the list found in Duvall's post, last year's assault accusation, and the crab misplacement, Winston's issues are an athletic Pollock painting: Where does it begin and end? Which stroke was the tipping point? Where does one focus their eye? How did it get so big?

Winston also tends to remind me of Murphy's murder in Robocop. Watching the scene play out, the shots just keep coming, the kill shot seems to happen over and over again, yet Murphy survives, he perseveres, until being encased in the protective shell of his helmet, torso protector, powerful boots with grips on the bottom, and the awe-inspiring weapon found in his arm.

Everyone in the film rooted for Robocop, willingly excusing his violent assaults and thoughtless actions, so long as at the end, the corrupt, and heartless all-powering corporation could remain in control.

[Dr. Rosenrosen]

When coupled with the list found in Duvall's post, last year's assault accusation, and the crab misplacement, Winston's issues are an athletic Pollock painting: Where does it begin and end? Which stroke was the tipping point? Where does one focus their eye? How did it get so big?

Winston also tends to remind me of Murphy's murder in Robocop. Watching the scene play out, the shots just keep coming, the kill shot seems to happen over and over again, yet Murphy survives, he perseveres, until being encased in the protective shell of his helmet, torso protector, powerful boots with grips on the bottom, and the awe-inspiring weapon found in his arm.

Everyone in the film rooted for Robocop, willingly excusing his violent assaults and thoughtless actions, so long as at the end, the corrupt, and heartless all-powering corporation could remain in control.
You win... something... for figuring out how to reference both Jackson Pollock and Robocop in the same post about Jameis Winston. Nicely done.

[msdukie]

Reports coming today that FSU Compliance is investigating the substantial number of autographed items authenticated by the autograph dealer linked to suspended Georgia running back Todd Gurley. (http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/11697064/florida-state-seminoles-look-jameis-winston-autographs)



This comes on the heels of the news that Winston will be facing an ad hoc hearing to determine whether he violated the school's code of student conduct (http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/11697065/one-three-former-florida-supreme-court-justices-serve-official-jameis-winston-hearing) in relation to an alleged sexual assault in December 2012. This in turns follows a Fox Sports report that FSU university officials and Tallahassee police hampered the investigation into the December 2012 incident (http://www.foxsports.com/college-football/story/jameis-winston-florida-state-tallahassee-police-hindered-investigation-documents-101014) by, among other things, providing police reports to university athletic officials and Winston's attorney days before the reports were provided to the local prosecutor.

Also this week the New York Times reviewed the sometimes checkered relationship between FSU football and Tallahassee criminal justice. (http://www.nytimes.com/2014/10/12/us/florida-state-football-casts-shadow-over-tallahassee-justice.html)



So...all that is happening.

And yet it is and shall remain F$U, and unless we find out that Jameis is actually a basketball player and not a football player, we know how this ends.

[CameronBornAndBred]

And yet it is and shall remain F$U, and unless we find out that Jameis is actually a basketball player and not a football player, we know how this ends.
Yes. He would be forced to sit out a baseball game.

[OldPhiKap]

Winston obviously never took any money for signatures. The poor guy has to shoplift crab legs to eat, for Pete's sake.

[subzero02]

Manziel helped build the foundation for this house of autographed cards... Players should be able to profit from their likenesses while in college.

[devildeac]

Yes. He would be forced to sit out a baseball game.

Maybe an inning:rolleyes:.

[arnie]

Manziel helped build the foundation for this house of autographed cards... Players should be able to profit from their likenesses while in college.

Absolutely, then boosters can hand them large bills every day without using Kentucky style mailing envelopes.

[miramar]

Reports coming today that FSU Compliance is investigating the substantial number of autographed items authenticated by the autograph dealer linked to suspended Georgia running back Todd Gurley. (http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/11697064/florida-state-seminoles-look-jameis-winston-autographs)



Did you mean to entitle the thread Jameis in Jeopardy or Jameis is Jeopardy?

The guy seems to be a walking, talking, stealing NCAA investigation.

Notice that I didn't say a Tallahassee Police investigation because that's never going to happen.

[El_Diablo]

Winston obviously never took any money for signatures. The poor guy has to shoplift crab legs to eat, for Pete's sake.

He also has to supplement his diet with squirrel meat:

http://www.cbssports.com/collegefootball/eye-on-college-football/24643321/report-jameis-winston-handcuffed-by-police-over-pellet-gun-in-2012

And steal soda from Burger King:

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/college/hear-burger-king-manager-tells-cops-florida-state-gb-jameis-winston-stealing-soda-article-1.1801658

Poor fella.

[budwom]

Jesus "Bobo" Wilson is quite a name.

[Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15]

So...

Now that it has come to light that FSU was likely complicit in a degree of covering up Mr. Winston's transgressions... there will be an internal disciplinary hearing at FSU? Are they going to slap him on the wrist for (among a laundry list of other things)... allowing the school to perform a cover up?

This is turning into a really sordid mess.

[devildeac]

So...

Now that it has come to light that FSU was likely complicit in a degree of covering up Mr. Winston's transgressions... there will be an internal disciplinary hearing at FSU? Are they going to slap him on the wrist for (among a laundry list of other things)... allowing the school to perform a cover up?

This is turning into a really sordid mess.

Nah. No chance. But, if we were to suddenly find out he was not attending his upper level seminar classes and/or having someone compose his end-of-semester paper, then, and only then might we have a (potentially) serious problem.

Couldn't possibly happen.;):rolleyes: Or could it?

[PSurprise]

What is, FSU will get off scott-free, duh? I'll take Scandalicious Football Cover-ups for $800, Alex.

[FerryFor50]

Used to be Free Shoe U. Now it's Free Snowcrab U...

Or For-pay Signing U

[devildeac]

Used to be Free Shoe U. Now it's Free Snowcrab U...

Or For-pay Signing U

Have you been communicating with Spurrier about new nicknames?;)

[Tom B.]

WOW. This kid is either a really bad apple, or the unluckiest person on the planet. Seems like a new accusation everytime an old one dies down a bit.




Let's not overlook the third possibility of "breathtakingly immature."

As much as Fisher is trying to stick up for Winston now, Fisher's eyeroll when Winston came out of the locker room dressed in full uniform and pads for the Clemson game -- the game for which Winston was suspended -- said it all. In that moment, you could practically hear Fisher saying to himself, "Wow, I really am dealing with one of the dumbest human beings alive."

[Dukehky]

I do not care if Winston made infinite dollars off his autographs.



FSU's hearing of the sexual assault case is another example of universities thinking that they are better able to legislate certain legal issues than the court system. The guy was never even charged, let alone convicted of this crime, why the hell does Florida State University think they can do things better. If he did do it, then I want him punished in a legal setting by people whose job it is to do it, not by an educational institution. It is also ridiculous that he has to be treated differently than other students. I thought that was what schools and the NCAA want to avoid? The hypocrisy of it all baffles me. I understand that they have to do something based on Title IX. But schools need to leave investigations and court-like procedures up to the legal system when it comes to legal matters. It is just infuriating to me that schools think they can operate outside the judicial system. Duke has done it on several occasions and has cost themselves millions of dollars in legal fees and out of court settlements because of their stupidity, other institutions do the same thing, and it just makes no sense to me.

[left_hook_lacey]

Let's not overlook the third possibility of "breathtakingly immature.""

Good point. The "yelling terrible things across the quad" incident after already dealing with other allegations lends itself to your theory.

It just takes some guys longer to "get it". Some never do. Time will tell for Mr. Winston.

[FerryFor50]

Good point. The "yelling terrible things across the quad" incident after already dealing with other allegations lends itself to your theory.

It just takes some guys longer to "get it". Some never do. Time will tell for Mr. Winston.

Generally one has to suffer actual repercussions to "get it."

Which explains a lot in Winston's case.

[subzero02]

Read this article and you'll see the likely origin of Mr. Jameis Winston's behavior. The kid steals seafood and his father blames everyone but Jameis... "He's a Heisman Trophy winner so he's definitely not supposed to be by himself"???? No, my knucklehead son should've been disciplined a lot more while I was raising him.

http://www.foxsports.com/college-football/story/jameis-winston-dad-wants-fsu-to-provide-constant-handler-051214

[burnspbesq]

In a rational world, Jameis Winston would be playing for the Atlanta Falcons reserves and hoping to either break into the first team or go out on loan to the Jets in order to get playing time and advance his development.

Remind me again why it makes a lick of sense for universities to be providing a billion-dollar subsidy for the NFL and NBA by running their player-development setup without compensation.

[53n206]

Reminds me of the apples falling from trees analogy.

[OldPhiKap]

In a rational world, Jameis Winston would be playing for the Atlanta Falcons reserves and hoping to either break into the first team or go out on loan to the Jets in order to get playing time and advance his development.

Remind me again why it makes a lick of sense for universities to be providing a billion-dollar subsidy for the NFL and NBA by running their player-development setup without compensation.

Is it the NFL player's union that champions the 3-years-of-college rule, or the owners (or both)?

[bob blue devil]

Remind me again why it makes a lick of sense for universities to be providing a billion-dollar subsidy for the NFL and NBA by running their player-development setup without compensation.

Haha - you had me for a second

[Henderson]

All Jameis all the time. It's not just about him. For all the stupid (and illegal) crap he's done, he's still got a victim, a victim of alleged sexual assault out there, and let's not forget her. Sexual assault (rape) isn't a football issue; it's a crime of violence. I'd like to say we should let the judicial system run its course, but the Tallahassee P.D. are homers. Sad.

[AncientPsychicT]

In a rational world, Jameis Winston would be playing for the Atlanta Falcons reserves and hoping to either break into the first team or go out on loan to the Jets in order to get playing time and advance his development.

Remind me again why it makes a lick of sense for universities to be providing a billion-dollar subsidy for the NFL and NBA by running their player-development setup without compensation.

Are you suggesting the Jets would play in the Football League Championship instead of the American Premier League? Cause I would agree :D

[OldPhiKap]

Are you suggesting the Jets would play in the Football League Championship instead of the American Premier League? Cause I would agree :D

Are you suggesting that they would be relegated?

[burnspbesq]

Are you suggesting that they would be relegated?

If we had promotion and relegation in American football, the Jets would be in the Big North Conference, playing against the likes of Ridgewood and Don Bosco. They'd be hoping to get promoted to the NJAC, where they would face Montclair State, Kean, et al.

[AncientPsychicT]

Are you suggesting that they would be relegated?

Who said they were ever in the top flight to begin with? :cool:

[burnspbesq]

Who said they were ever in the top flight to begin with? :cool:

Jets = Leeds United. One very brief period of glory, a very long time ago.

[DU82]

If we had promotion and relegation in American football, the Jets would be in the Big North Conference, playing against the likes of Ridgewood and Don Bosco. They'd be hoping to get promoted to the NJAC, where they would face Montclair State, Kean, et al.

If they did that, then Teaneck would have a chance to win a game. (Go Highwaymen!)

[msdukie]

Yes. He would be forced to sit out a baseball game.

Obviously, you do not realize that they care about baseball at FSU (They think it is the #2 revenue sport (or 4 after spring football and 'crootin).

Basketball not so much. They would just kick him out of school if someone complained.

[FerryFor50]

Bo Jackson is giving up on Jameis Winston. (http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2232758-bo-jackson-speaks-about-failed-attempt-to-mentor-jameis-winston)

Bo knows... Winston's a moron.

[CameronBornAndBred]

Obviously, you do not realize that they care about baseball at FSU.
Yes....obviously. (Or it was a tongue in cheek reference to his suspension from the team last season for his stolen crab legs.)

[devildeac]

Bo Jackson is giving up on Jameis Winston. (http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2232758-bo-jackson-speaks-about-failed-attempt-to-mentor-jameis-winston)

Bo knows... Winston's a moron.


I am not so sure about that. No, wait. In fact, I am sure. Bo don't know Diddley:

https://www.google.com/webhp?sourceid=chrome-instant&ion=1&espv=2&ie=UTF-8#q=bo%20jackson%2C%20bo%20diddley%20commercial

[Newton_14]

Bo Jackson is giving up on Jameis Winston. (http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2232758-bo-jackson-speaks-about-failed-attempt-to-mentor-jameis-winston)

Bo knows... Winston's a moron.

Thanks for sharing. Interesting. Yeah, who needs to listen to Bo... what could he possibly know about being both an NFL and MLB star or staying clear of trouble? What a moron.

There was a scout on ESPN radio yesterday arguing with the hosts. The scout declared definitely that WInston would never amount to squat in the NFL and teams should not touch him because of the character issues and the thought that Winston is the type of person that will never get it. The hosts argued loudly he could mature and be a star. The scouts response? "Winston will fail in the NFL no matter which team drafts him, their scheme's or their coaching. He will never ever make it. Guaranteed bust and teams should not touch him, certainly not with a first round pick and large salary.."

Harsh words and strong statement for sure, but at this point, with all we have to go on, I think we have to lean toward the side of the scout vs the side of the hosts who said he could mature and be a star in the "right circumstances"

Time will tell but at the current rate it will be a miracle if Winston survives the year at FSU.

SO much talent and a big waste if he can't get himself under control.

[burnspbesq]

If they did that, then Teaneck would have a chance to win a game. (Go Highwaymen!)

Teaneck already has one win this year. Don't get greedy.

[cato]

Thanks for sharing. Interesting. Yeah, who needs to listen to Bo... what could he possibly know about being both an NFL and MLB star or staying clear of trouble? What a moron.

There was a scout on ESPN radio yesterday arguing with the hosts. The scout declared definitely that WInston would never amount to squat in the NFL and teams should not touch him because of the character issues and the thought that Winston is the type of person that will never get it. The hosts argued loudly he could mature and be a star. The scouts response? "Winston will fail in the NFL no matter which team drafts him, their scheme's or their coaching. He will never ever make it. Guaranteed bust and teams should not touch him, certainly not with a first round pick and large salary.."

Harsh words and strong statement for sure, but at this point, with all we have to go on, I think we have to lean toward the side of the scout vs the side of the hosts who said he could mature and be a star in the "right circumstances"

Time will tell but at the current rate it will be a miracle if Winston survives the year at FSU.

SO much talent and a big waste if he can't get himself under control.

So . . . can we pencil him in as the Raiders' first round draft pick?

[DU82]

Teaneck already has one win this year. Don't get greedy.

That's the same number of wins I saw in three years in the band there. ( missed one game in those years, which they won, of course!)

[PSurprise]

So . . . can we pencil him in as the Raiders' first round draft pick?

They'll trade their first round picks for the next 3 years to move up to get him.

[Dev11]

They'll trade their first round picks for the next 3 years to move up to get him.

You're confusing the Raiders with the Redskins.

[53n206]

"Time will tell but at the current rate it will be a miracle if Winston survives the year at FSU."
Are we talking of the FSU team in Florida? Football? You gotta be kiddin'.He will be too busy with football to have time of university investigations in his conduct. Maybe before baseball.

[BigWayne]

I do not care if Winston made infinite dollars off his autographs.



FSU's hearing of the sexual assault case is another example of universities thinking that they are better able to legislate certain legal issues than the court system. The guy was never even charged, let alone convicted of this crime, why the hell does Florida State University think they can do things better. If he did do it, then I want him punished in a legal setting by people whose job it is to do it, not by an educational institution. It is also ridiculous that he has to be treated differently than other students. I thought that was what schools and the NCAA want to avoid? The hypocrisy of it all baffles me. I understand that they have to do something based on Title IX. But schools need to leave investigations and court-like procedures up to the legal system when it comes to legal matters. It is just infuriating to me that schools think they can operate outside the judicial system. Duke has done it on several occasions and has cost themselves millions of dollars in legal fees and out of court settlements because of their stupidity, other institutions do the same thing, and it just makes no sense to me.
FSU is similar to Duke apparently in having a policy for sexual assault tribunals where the accused is not allowed some of the normal due process rights we expect in US court proceedings, including a right to independent legal counsel. I am very interested to see how this plays out in the Winston case as he has a lawyer and the lawyer is apparently trying to challenge this construct. Most college students charged in these types of cases do not have the resources to truly challenge this like Winston will probably be able to.

tOSU has a case in this area right now where they may have to pony up some big bucks in the marching band director case. Reading between the lawsuit filed on line, it seems like tOSU got on the hot seat with the Feds task force that is coming after the way universities handle sexual assualt reporting, etc. In order to get the feds to back off, they needed to find a way to show the feds how tough they are on this issue so they made an example of the marching band director. If you believe half of what the band directors lawyers have published, tOSU is in trouble.

[Channing]

It looks like the latest potential scandal with Winston is a possible points shaving allegation. Apparently an old high school teammate and a close friend wagered 5500 that Lville would have the first half lead against fsu. Allegedly the largest bet this guy ever made with the bookie.

....something about smoke and fire seems appropriate

[weezie]

OK., now we're talking. Holes will be thrilled by the cover fire!

[OldPhiKap]

OK., now we're talking. Holes will be thrilled by the cover fire!

The source of this accusation seems a bit thin at the moment (to be polite):

http://heavy.com/sports/2014/11/jameis-winston-point-shaving-allegations-chris-rabb/

[77devil]

The source of this accusation seems a bit thin at the moment (to be polite):

http://heavy.com/sports/2014/11/jameis-winston-point-shaving-allegations-chris-rabb/

Yes, but Jameis attracts accusations like bees to honey. Something is going to stick.

[CameronBornAndBred]

How common is to have a lawyer representing you outside of a court of law?

The attorney for Florida State quarterback Jameis Winston (http://espn.go.com/college-football/player/_/id/530308/jameis-winston) has requested that FSU officials delay his upcoming student conduct code hearing, in which Winston potentially could face four violations for his involvement in an alleged sexual assault in December 2012.

http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/11836777/jameis-winston-attorney-seeks-delay-hearing-florida-state

[OldPhiKap]

How common is to have a lawyer representing you outside of a court of law?


http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/11836777/jameis-winston-attorney-seeks-delay-hearing-florida-state

Given the civil and possible criminal implications of the evidence adduced at the hearing, anyone in his situation should have one.

[CameronBornAndBred]

Given the civil and possible criminal implications of the evidence adduced at the hearing, anyone in his situation should have one.
Ok...but his criminal day in court has already come and gone, right? I thought that the proceedings he is facing now are basically in front of a student group, and they would be deciding what his punishment, if any, would be related to student activities.
Seems an odd place for a lawyer to show up, but maybe it is common practice. Either way, awfully convenient to ask for it progress after the FB season is over. I like how the reasoning is so the lawyer can be prepared. Because all the lawyer has done the last 12 months is sit on the beach and sip margaritas. :confused:

[OldPhiKap]

Ok...but his criminal day in court has already come and gone, right? I thought that the proceedings he is facing now are basically in front of a student group, and they would be deciding what his punishment, if any, would be related to student activities.
Seems an odd place for a lawyer to show up, but maybe it is common practice. Either way, awfully convenient to ask for it progress after the FB season is over. I like how the reasoning is so the lawyer can be prepared. Because all the lawyer has done the last 12 months is sit on the beach and sip margaritas. :confused:

It may or may not work, but he's doing exactly what I would do. Run out the clock if you can, don't let your client testify under any circumstances whatsoever.

[Devil in the Blue Dress]

It may or may not work, but he's doing exactly what I would do. Run out the clock if you can, don't let your client testify under any circumstances whatsoever.

An equally interesting question is what's the source of paying the legal fees. Somebody has introduced Mr. Green somewhere in the process. Follow the money......

[Duvall]

An equally interesting question is what's the source of paying the legal fees. Somebody has introduced Mr. Green somewhere in the process. Follow the money......

...to where? There are plenty of reasonable explanations.

[OldPhiKap]

An equally interesting question is what's the source of paying the legal fees. Somebody has introduced Mr. Green somewhere in the process. Follow the money......


...to where? There are plenty of reasonable explanations.

My question is -- why a lawyer from Georgia instead of local.

Not saying this is the case, but plenty of lawyers would represent this dude for free. He will be a repeat client, and next time he will have a multi-million dollar annual stream. "Loss leader" is a phrase that comes to mind.

And my closest experience is UGa, which has a well-respected (Athens) lawyer represent players in various capacities. Not sure in internal matters though like this because that may be a conflict of interest.

[Merlindevildog91]

My question is -- why a lawyer from Georgia instead of local.

Not saying this is the case, but plenty of lawyers would represent this dude for free. He will be a repeat client, and next time he will have a multi-million dollar annual stream. "Loss leader" is a phrase that comes to mind.

And my closest experience is UGa, which has a well-respected (Athens) lawyer represent players in various capacities. Not sure in internal matters though like this because that may be a conflict of interest.

I think it's odd as well that the lawyer isn't a local. My closest experience is Virginia Tech. The football team apparently has a certain attorney (who happens to be the son of a federal judge) on speed dial, and some of the outcomes leave us in the hinterlands shaking our heads.

Also to (I think) CB&B's earlier point: I don't know if there is a statute of limitations in Florida for felonies (there isn't one in Virginia) but if Jameis were to testify at this tribunal that he had non-consensual sex with the young lady in question, I think even the Tallahassee police would have no choice to charge him at that point. It's an extreme situation, but the young man hasn't exactly shown the ability to make smart decisions off the football field.

[OldPhiKap]

I think it's odd as well that the lawyer isn't a local. My closest experience is Virginia Tech. The football team apparently has a certain attorney (who happens to be the son of a federal judge) on speed dial, and some of the outcomes leave us in the hinterlands shaking our heads.

Also to (I think) CB&B's earlier point: I don't know if there is a statute of limitations in Florida for felonies (there isn't one in Virginia) but if Jameis were to testify at this tribunal that he had non-consensual sex with the young lady in question, I think even the Tallahassee police would have no choice to charge him at that point. It's an extreme situation, but the young man hasn't exactly shown the ability to make smart decisions off the football field.

Yup.

My guess is that the S/L for rape (IF that was the charge -- lacrosse case still fresh enough to remind us all that these are mere allegations at this point) has quite a way to go before running.

[moonpie23]

How common is to have a lawyer representing you outside of a court of law?


http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/11836777/jameis-winston-attorney-seeks-delay-hearing-florida-state

ummm.....all the time.....

[CameronBornAndBred]

ummm.....all the time.....
Really? Kids hire attorneys all the time for school issues? I figured they wouldn't be there in the presence of student review board, or whatever they may call it.
It looks like both parties will have attorneys there, though. I'm thinking I might not be picturing this correctly. Is Winston's hearing in front of peers, or administrators? If it is school admins, that puts things on a different plane, although my initial scoffing at the timing still remains. (Even though OPK is totally correct about how any lawyer would do it, it's still obviously trying to keep J.W. on the field.)

[Stray Gator]

Really? Kids hire attorneys all the time for school issues? I figured they wouldn't be there in the presence of student review board, or whatever they may call it.
It looks like both parties will have attorneys there, though. I'm thinking I might not be picturing this correctly. Is Winston's hearing in front of peers, or administrators? If it is school admins, that puts things on a different plane, although my initial scoffing at the timing still remains. (Even though OPK is totally correct about how any lawyer would do it, it's still obviously trying to keep J.W. on the field.)

In this case, FSU has taken the unusual step of arranging for the hearing on the charges against Winston to be conducted before a former Florida Supreme Court chief justice. (Three former chief justices were originally nominated, then Winston's attorney and the accuser's attorney were each permitted to eliminate one candidate.) The principal question now, of course, is whether FSU's administration will allow Winston's attorney to delay the hearing until the end of football season, at which point Winston can drop out of school and effectively render the proceedings moot -- at least insofar as FSU will no longer have authority to impose any discipline upon him.

[77devil]

Really? Kids hire attorneys all the time for school issues? I figured they wouldn't be there in the presence of student review board, or whatever they may call it.
It looks like both parties will have attorneys there, though. I'm thinking I might not be picturing this correctly. Is Winston's hearing in front of peers, or administrators? If it is school admins, that puts things on a different plane, although my initial scoffing at the timing still remains. (Even though OPK is totally correct about how any lawyer would do it, it's still obviously trying to keep J.W. on the field.)

It depends on the school. Some, including Duke as I recall, do not allow the accused to be represented by an attorney at a disciplinary proceeding. Representation is a critical part of due process. Given the life consequences that can result from expulsion, for example, any student should be represented by an attorney if possible.

[duke4ever19]

It looks like the latest potential scandal with Winston is a possible points shaving allegation....

....something about smoke and fire seems appropriate

Sometimes there's fire. Other times there's an idiot with dry ice in a bucket hoping to get some attention.

The people that broke the story on this point shaving allegation also wrote a completely fabricated story on Tajh Boyd last year.

Yeah, Winston has done some pretty stupid stuff in his brief college career, but I'm betting this is just an example of people hitching their wagon to a star (before that star implodes).

[cspan37421]

Sometimes there's fire. Other times there's an idiot with dry ice in a bucket hoping to get some attention.

The people that broke the story on this point shaving allegation also wrote a completely fabricated story on Tajh Boyd last year.

Yeah, Winston has done some pretty stupid stuff in his brief college career, but I'm betting this is just an example of people hitching their wagon to a star (before that star implodes).

Any chance the easily-dismissed story is intended to help Winston by enabling his supporters to point to a false negative story and imply that all the other negative accusations are false too? That seems to be a strategy for damage control that emerged in politics a few cycles ago. Doesn't help in a court of law but the court of public opinion, maybe.

[BD80]

Any chance the easily-dismissed story is intended to help Winston by enabling his supporters to point to a false negative story and imply that all the other negative accusations are false too? That seems to be a strategy for damage control that emerged in politics a few cycles ago. Doesn't help in a court of law but the court of public opinion, maybe.

Gambling on the straw man gambler gambit? Risky business

[Olympic Fan]

Ok...but his criminal day in court has already come and gone, right? I thought that the proceedings he is facing now are basically in front of a student group, and they would be deciding what his punishment, if any, would be related to student activities.
Seems an odd place for a lawyer to show up, but maybe it is common practice. Either way, awfully convenient to ask for it progress after the FB season is over. I like how the reasoning is so the lawyer can be prepared. Because all the lawyer has done the last 12 months is sit on the beach and sip margaritas. :confused:

Actually, it's not a student-run hearing. The upcoming hearing will be conducted by a retired Florida State Supreme Court Justice:

http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/11752246/jameis-winston-hearing-conducted-retired-florida-supreme-court-chief-justice

According to the story, the school offered attorney's for Winston and for the girl bringing charges a list of three retired judges and they each eliminated one of the candidates. Judge Harding (Wake undergrad, UVa law school) got the job.

I have no problem with Winston having an attorney. The girl has an attorney. That's fine. Objections to this remind me to one of Mike Nifong's early pronouncements when the accused lacrosse players obtained attorneys -- he said, "Innocent people don't need attorneys." I know this is not a criminal matter for Winston, but let's not kid ourselves -- it will go a long way towards determining his future.

That said, I can see where the request for a delay is a stalling tactic to push this back until after the season. If there is a valid legal reason, okay -- but I'm not qualified to judge this.

I know the incident happened two years ago, but when it comes to the delay, there are a lot of parties that contributed -- the Tallahassee police, the school itself and the girl who claims to be the victim -- over various times she has refused to cooperate with the police and/or school, Maybe she had valid reasons -- considering the way the Tallahassee police have systematically protected FSU athletes, perhaps she was right to be suspicious of working with them.

I don't know what should be done here, just that I don't condemn either Winston nor the girl for hiring a lawyer to represent their interests.

PS Consider this scenario -- Winston's lawyer gets the hearing delayed a month. On Dec. 7, the College Football selection committee has to pick its Final Four teams -- and undefeated FSU is one of them. What happens then if 10 days later, Winston is suspended after the hearing?

[Henderson]

PS Consider this scenario -- Winston's lawyer gets the hearing delayed a month. On Dec. 7, the College Football selection committee has to pick its Final Four teams -- and undefeated FSU is one of them. What happens then if 10 days later, Winston is suspended after the hearing?

He appeals, and the appeal isn't decided until after the championship game? I'm assuming there is some sort of appeal provided for, either to the Provost or Dean of Student Affairs, and maybe further, like to the President for final decision. Winston's going to run out the clock on this. He could drop out after his last game of the season, and this part of his problems (student conduct) goes away.

[sagegrouse]

PS Consider this scenario -- Winston's lawyer gets the hearing delayed a month. On Dec. 7, the College Football selection committee has to pick its Final Four teams -- and undefeated FSU is one of them. What happens then if 10 days later, Winston is suspended after the hearing?


He appeals, and the appeal isn't decided until after the championship game? I'm assuming there is some sort of appeal provided for, either to the Provost or Dean of Student Affairs, and maybe further, like to the President for final decision.

Or else, he doesn't play because the school has had enough of his sorry act and decides not to play a player found guilty of an offense leading to expulsion. FSU, having been selected, still plays in the CFP and loses badly. And the putative #5 team and their fans get to complain for the next 50 years. That's college sports!

Kindly, Sage
'And let me tell you about the totally unfair Final Four in 1964!'

[Duvall]

Or else, he doesn't play because the school has had enough of his sorry act and decides not to play a player found guilty of an offense leading to expulsion. FSU, having been selected, still plays in the CFP and loses badly. And the putative #5 team and their fans get to complain for the next 50 years. That's college sports!
'

Is Florida State still a school? I thought they hired John Thrasher to put an end to that.

[Henderson]

Or else, he doesn't play because the school has had enough of his sorry act and decides not to play a player found guilty of an offense leading to expulsion.

Hahaha! Good one.

[CameronBornAndBred]

Actually, it's not a student-run hearing. The upcoming hearing will be conducted by a retired Florida State Supreme Court Justice:

http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/11752246/jameis-winston-hearing-conducted-retired-florida-supreme-court-chief-justice

According to the story, the school offered attorney's for Winston and for the girl bringing charges a list of three retired judges and they each eliminated one of the candidates. Judge Harding (Wake undergrad, UVa law school) got the job.

I have no problem with Winston having an attorney. The girl has an attorney. That's fine. Objections to this remind me to one of Mike Nifong's early pronouncements when the accused lacrosse players obtained attorneys -- he said, "Innocent people don't need attorneys." I know this is not a criminal matter for Winston, but let's not kid ourselves -- it will go a long way towards determining his future.

That said, I can see where the request for a delay is a stalling tactic to push this back until after the season. If there is a valid legal reason, okay -- but I'm not qualified to judge this.

I know the incident happened two years ago, but when it comes to the delay, there are a lot of parties that contributed -- the Tallahassee police, the school itself and the girl who claims to be the victim -- over various times she has refused to cooperate with the police and/or school, Maybe she had valid reasons -- considering the way the Tallahassee police have systematically protected FSU athletes, perhaps she was right to be suspicious of working with them.

I don't know what should be done here, just that I don't condemn either Winston nor the girl for hiring a lawyer to represent their interests.

PS Consider this scenario -- Winston's lawyer gets the hearing delayed a month. On Dec. 7, the College Football selection committee has to pick its Final Four teams -- and undefeated FSU is one of them. What happens then if 10 days later, Winston is suspended after the hearing?
Thanks much. Can't spork you till I spread some love, but that is the breakdown I've been looking for. Not sure how I'd be thinking if I were a Seminoles fan. Toss up between getting it over with now and setting up plan B, or hoping it gets delayed and missing out on the baseball season.

[Newton_14]

Thanks much. Can't spork you till I spread some love, but that is the breakdown I've been looking for. Not sure how I'd be thinking if I were a Seminoles fan. Toss up between getting it over with now and setting up plan B, or hoping it gets delayed and missing out on the baseball season.

Agree, but I think baseball is out of the question either way. He for sure will play in the NFL next season so that means going to the combine, and continuing training for Football. I think he has already worn a FSU baseball uni for the last time.

[Jim3k]

Actually, it's not a student-run hearing. The upcoming hearing will be conducted by a retired Florida State Supreme Court Justice:

http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/11752246/jameis-winston-hearing-conducted-retired-florida-supreme-court-chief-justice



Technically it is a student-run hearing, nothing more. It's just that the students would have been way over their heads if the system had not been able to provide a presiding officer with real world experience. The (retired) justice chosen is serving as a private volunteer, not as a state official. He stands in the shoes of a student judge. He's used to lawyers but must follow the rules of the student disciplinary system.

Since that system generally operates without lawyers (I think), the justice will be able to run the hearing much more quickly. If having a lawyer is not a right under the rules, I expect both lawyers' participation will be pruned. Don't be surprised if he summarily denies Winston's lawyer's requests for postponement, especially if the grounds are to allow time for the lawyer to get better prepared. He can rule that Winston must be treated the same as any student defendant--because that's what he is. The lawyer is likely to be allowed only the same amount of preparation time normally given any unrepresented defendant tried under the system's rules/normal practice. Sufficient time may already have passed. Also don't be surprised if the lawyers are permitted to serve only as advisers, not advocates.

If the complainant testifies to a prima facie case (not a given here) under the student sexual misconduct rules, Winston will be expected to testify to rebut. If the lawyer advises him not to testify (as I expect), the justice will immediately (or in a short time) find the misconduct to have occurred. Moreover, since this is not a criminal proceeding, the justice could choose to draw an adverse inference from Winston's silence. He doesn't really have to go that far since the woman's testimony would stand unrebutted.

The quantum of proof required is certainly of interest. Where on the scale does the prima facie case fall? Preponderance? Probably, but might be less. Plus, hearsay is likely to be permitted.

The complainant's testimony is that she was drugged, lost consciousness and was taken home on someone's motorbike, to discover only later that sex had occurred. There may be additional evidence she can present as well. Winston has told the police that she consented. If he must testify to that contention, it will be in rebuttal, and would establish that they had intercourse, filling in the gap her unconscious state could not. In essence, he is trapped. If her testimony about being drugged is credited, the sex cannot be regarded as consensual. He then has to claim he made a mistake. But that is unlikely to be acceptable as a defense.

Because of that, he isn't going to testify. He'll have to bet there is no prima facie case and decline to testify because, in his opinion, she failed to prove her case. Would you take that bet? His lawyer won't.

I doubt Winston and his lawyer will be able to run out the clock, internal appeal rights not withstanding.

[Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15]

Mods:

Is there a way we can up some sort of "tickle" on this thread where every 10 days it gets brought back to the top of the board as a reminder to check for new scandals/information? Otherwise we might miss important shoplifting/assault/BB gun/attorney/point-shaving updates.

Just a thought.

[BD80]

Mods:

Is there a way we can up some sort of "tickle" on this thread where every 10 days it gets brought back to the top of the board as a reminder to check for new scandals/information? Otherwise we might miss important shoplifting/assault/BB gun/attorney/point-shaving updates.

Just a thought.

I think Jameis' biological clock is already set to do just that

[Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15]

Agree, but I think baseball is out of the question either way. He for sure will play in the NFL next season so that means going to the combine, and continuing training for Football. I think he has already worn a FSU baseball uni for the last time.

I am willing to bet Winston would trade two more months of football eligibility for his baseball season.

In fact, I think that is exactly what he is doing.

Or, he knows the case is a lost proposition and any extra football games are just more data on his NFL resume.

I assume he stands to profit substantially more in the NFL than in baseball? Is he considered a top MLB prospect?

[rasputin]

Really? Kids hire attorneys all the time for school issues? I figured they wouldn't be there in the presence of student review board, or whatever they may call it.
It looks like both parties will have attorneys there, though. I'm thinking I might not be picturing this correctly. Is Winston's hearing in front of peers, or administrators? If it is school admins, that puts things on a different plane, although my initial scoffing at the timing still remains. (Even though OPK is totally correct about how any lawyer would do it, it's still obviously trying to keep J.W. on the field.)

I'm an attorney who represents schools (mostly elementary and secondary schools). Students/parents engaging lawyers for school-related issues is not a rare occurrence.

[77devil]

I'm an attorney who represents schools (mostly elementary and secondary schools). Students/parents engaging lawyers for school-related issues is not a rare occurrence.

This is America where it is our duty to retain counsel and litigate. Seriously though as I wrote up thread, many private universities do not allow the accused to have a lawyer present or directly engaged in the disciplinary process. Such is the case at Duke unless it were law school faculty or some other attorney in the university community all of whom are conflicted.

http://studentaffairs.duke.edu/conduct/undergraduate-disciplinary-system/disciplinary-process/disciplinary-hearing-types#participation

Obviously at FSU attorneys are permitted. Perhaps this is more common at state schools or mandated by the very nature of being a public institution.

[IrishDevil]

This is America where it is our duty to retain counsel and litigate. Seriously though as I wrote up thread, many private universities do not allow the accused to have a lawyer present or directly engaged in the disciplinary process. Such is the case at Duke unless it were law school faculty or some other attorney in the university community all of whom are conflicted.

http://studentaffairs.duke.edu/conduct/undergraduate-disciplinary-system/disciplinary-process/disciplinary-hearing-types#participation

Obviously at FSU attorneys are permitted. Perhaps this is more common at state schools or mandated by the very nature of being a public institution.

Speaking as a lawyer who has represented students in the past, another common setup is to allow a student to have an "adviser," who may or may not be a lawyer; although Duke appears to limit this role to members of the University community, I have not seen that arrangement yet in my practice. Instead, the adviser can be more or less anyone, and can assist and represent the student throughout the investigation and run-up to any actual hearing, but is forbidden from addressing the deciding panel or speaking in any way during the hearing itself, other than occasional whispers to the student. University disciplinary bodies tend to be wary of turning every matter before them into a full-blown trial with grandstanding lawyers, but there is often a need for counsel, particularly where the disciplinary proceeding could have consequences beyond the university setting.

[jimsumner]

I am willing to bet Winston would trade two more months of football eligibility for his baseball season.

In fact, I think that is exactly what he is doing.

Or, he knows the case is a lost proposition and any extra football games are just more data on his NFL resume.

I assume he stands to profit substantially more in the NFL than in baseball? Is he considered a top MLB prospect?

Winston is considered a major-league prospect.

But he can be playing in the NFL next season. He's likely looking at 3-4 years in the minors before ever reaching the majors.

[Henderson]

Winston is considered a major-league prospect.

But he can be playing in the NFL next season. He's likely looking at 3-4 years in the minors before ever reaching the majors.

Watch out if the Yankees get involved. We could be set up for a John Elway 1983 redux.

Actually, a Dan Marino 1983 may be a more apt comparator. Winston will enter the NFL draft with questions about his off-field life, as did Marino. Marino slipped badly in that draft, though in fairness it wasn't just the (apparently unfounded) rumors of personal issues; he had a mediocre season leading up to the draft. Then again, Marino didn't have baseball like Winston does and Elway did.

[94duke]

FSU postpones the hearing until Dec 1.
http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/ncaaf/2014/11/12/jameis-winston-florida-state-hearing-delayed--december-1/18921357/

[Duvall]

FSU postpones the hearing until Dec 1.
http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/ncaaf/2014/11/12/jameis-winston-florida-state-hearing-delayed--december-1/18921357/


Whether Winston is found responsible or not for any student conduct code violations, the delay means that decision might not be made until the Seminoles are in the College Football Playoff. FSU's conduct code says a decision letter will be sent to the student within 10 class days from the conclusion of the hearing but allows for more time "if additional consideration of evidence and deliberation is required."

The last day for fall semester final exams is Dec. 12 and spring semester classes begin on Jan. 7.

If the hearing concludes on Dec. 5 or later, any decision might not be rendered until after the national championship game. A period of 10 class days from that date would mean a decision would not be due until Jan. 13, one day after the championship game.

In Tallahassee that's just the way things go.

[devildeac]

FSU postpones the hearing until Dec 1.
http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/ncaaf/2014/11/12/jameis-winston-florida-state-hearing-delayed--december-1/18921357/


In Tallahassee that's just the way things go.

Almost makes one want to become a Hurricanes fan this weekend and then Eagle and Gator fans after that.

Incredibly convenient timing:rolleyes:.

[uh_no]

I am willing to bet Winston would trade two more months of football eligibility for his baseball season.


Do we honestly think he's planning on sticking in school for baseball season? he's gone, the day after the bowl game IMO.

[Olympic Fan]

Almost makes one want to become a Hurricanes fan this weekend and then Eagle and Gator fans after that.

Incredibly convenient timing:rolleyes:.

If Duke beats Virginia Tech Saturday in a noon game, I will probably pull for Miami (although it's not like THAT is a clean program). If we lose Saturday, you HAVE to pull for FSU to beat Miami. I hate it, but we need FSU to beat Miami to open up a gap in the standings over the one team that has a tiebreaker vs. Duke.

But feel free to pull for BC and Florida (with Kurt Roper as OC). I know I probably will (unless my lust for the Orange Bowl gets the best of me).

[devildeac]

If Duke beats Virginia Tech Saturday in a noon game, I will probably pull for Miami (although it's not like THAT is a clean program). If we lose Saturday, you HAVE to pull for FSU to beat Miami. I hate it, but we need FSU to beat Miami to open up a gap in the standings over the one team that has a tiebreaker vs. Duke.

But feel free to pull for BC and Florida (with Kurt Roper as OC). I know I probably will (unless my lust for the Orange Bowl gets the best of me).

Ok, you convinced me. It'll be a game day decision. But, don't ever, ever, ever, ever ask me to root for the cheaters:p.

[Duvall]

If Duke beats Virginia Tech Saturday in a noon game, I will probably pull for Miami (although it's not like THAT is a clean program). If we lose Saturday, you HAVE to pull for FSU to beat Miami. I hate it, but we need FSU to beat Miami to open up a gap in the standings over the one team that has a tiebreaker vs. Duke.

But feel free to pull for BC and Florida (with Kurt Roper as OC). I know I probably will (unless my lust for the Orange Bowl gets the best of me).

It's not just the Orange Bowl, it's every bowl. A Florida State loss before the ACC Championship Game would knock Duke down a spot in the bowl order unless Duke plays in and wins the ACCCG.

[Mike Corey]

More unflattering coverage out of Tallahassee (http://www.nytimes.com/2014/11/15/sports/ncaafootball/for-an-fsu-football-player-a-hit-and-run-becomes-two-traffic-tickets.html?hp&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&module=photo-spot-region&region=top-news&WT.nav=top-news):


In the early-morning hours of Oct. 5, as this college town was celebrating another big football victory by Florida State University, a starting cornerback on the team drove his car into the path of an oncoming vehicle driven by a teenager returning home from a job at the Olive Garden.

Both cars were totaled. But rather than remain at the scene as the law requires, the football player, P. J. Williams, left his wrecked vehicle in the street and fled into the darkness along with his two passengers, including Ronald Darby, the team’s other starting cornerback.

The Tallahassee police responded to the off-campus accident, eventually reaching out to the Florida State University police and the university’s athletic department.

By the next day, it was as if the hit and run had never happened.

The New York Times looked into how the police handled this case, reviewing law enforcement records and interviewing witnesses, lawyers, the police and a university representative. The examination found that Mr. Williams, driving with a suspended license, was given a break by the Tallahassee police, who initially labeled the accident a hit and run, a criminal act, but later decided to issue him only two traffic tickets. Afterward, the case did not show up in the city’s public online database of police calls — a technical glitch, the police said.

[Duvall]

More unflattering coverage out of Tallahassee (http://www.nytimes.com/2014/11/15/sports/ncaafootball/for-an-fsu-football-player-a-hit-and-run-becomes-two-traffic-tickets.html?hp&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&module=photo-spot-region&region=top-news&WT.nav=top-news):

The Onion, America's other paper of record, also responds, though more succinctly. (http://www.theonion.com/articles/florida-state-coaches-award-helmet-sticker-to-tall,37451/)

[Tappan Zee Devil]

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/24/sports/ncaafootball/transcript-of-jameis-winston-hearing-reveals-accusers-words-and-florida-states-complicity.html?ref=sports&_r=0

According to the Times, evidence is damning, but he walks

[lotusland]

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/24/sports/ncaafootball/transcript-of-jameis-winston-hearing-reveals-accusers-words-and-florida-states-complicity.html?ref=sports&_r=0

According to the Times, evidence is damning, but he walks

What part is damning?

[J.Blink]

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/24/sports/ncaafootball/transcript-of-jameis-winston-hearing-reveals-accusers-words-and-florida-states-complicity.html?ref=sports&_r=0

According to the Times, evidence is damning, but he walks

I have not followed the case at all, and I have no particular insights or knowledge.

I did, however, see this site linked from the NYTimes comments:

http://chopchat.com/2014/12/24/heres-new-york-times-isnt-telling/

It provides a very different narrative.

[cspan37421]

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/24/sports/ncaafootball/transcript-of-jameis-winston-hearing-reveals-accusers-words-and-florida-states-complicity.html?ref=sports&_r=0

According to the Times, evidence is damning, but he walks

I'm inclined to believe just about anything bad about Jameis Winston [crab legs, really???] and FSU ... but let's keep in mind, according to the Times, the "evidence" against the Duke Lax players was damning too. We know how that turned out.

There's a 248-page PDF with evidence here - I would encourage you to read it and draw your own conclusions.

http://espn.go.com/pdf/2013/1206/winston-inv1.pdf

[Tappan Zee Devil]

What part is damning?

Well = to start with - she gave permission by moaning. Read the article.

[cspan37421]

Well = to start with - she gave permission by moaning. Read the article.

Read the PDF. I think you'll find the summary in the Times is neither complete nor representative of the balance of evidence.

[Tappan Zee Devil]

Read the PDF. I think you'll find the summary in the Times is neither complete nor representative of the balance of evidence.

Ok - will do. I hope that is the case given that he walked and the Times article certainly implied that the evidence was completely against him and that the local authorities either dropped the ball or were covering for him - either of which would be extremely troubling.

[Indoor66]

Ok - will do. I hope that is the case given that he walked and the Times article certainly implied that the evidence was completely against him and that the local authorities either dropped the ball or were covering for him - either of which would be extremely troubling.

Let's not go Lacrosse on him. Read ALL of the evidence. Failing to do so tends to lead to riots and all that PPB stuff.

[lotusland]

Well = to start with - she gave permission by moaning. Read the article.
I had read the article before I posted. I hope you have not surmised that Winston is most likely guilty from that comment alone. It certainly is not "damning" evidence.

[Dukehky]

That Times article was a little irresponsible. Surprise surprise, media outlets pandering to public opinion (people hate Jameis so we may as well say it was a conspiracy to keep him out of trouble).

I think what the mediator in the FSU hearings said was best. There is not enough evidence for me to say that either of you is lying or telling the truth. This is unfortunate IF Jameis did something wrong, but it is also unfortunate if the girl was not telling the truth, because there is always a "what if" with Jameis now. I hope that if he was in fact guilty of some wrong doing, that his friends and teammates would not perjure themselves on his behalf, and frankly, that is why I give Winston a bit more benefit than many do. Too much faith in bystanders perhaps.

Also, to respond to Duke's disciplinary operations. They are a complete sham. Every disciplinary hearing is a total kangaroo court. The Duke Student Conduct faculty/system is abhorrent. The advisors at hearings are students who do that job to put on their resume. They have no knowledge of the system, and even if they did, they aren't allowed to speak or even speak to the person they are representing. Student Conduct never learns from any mistakes. Every single one of them should have been fired after the Duke Lax scandal, but all of them kept their jobs and they operate in the exact same manner that keeps getting the university bad press, not to mention sued all the time. Oh and they lose those law suits a lot (in settlements).

But FSU got the thing done before the bowl game, which was a GREAT pr move. had they put it off until after the bowl games, the questions would have been relentless. This is as over as it is going to be for the Noles.

[Kfanarmy]

I may be partial, but I really don't agree with the ruling. Without allowing follow up questioning his statement that "moaning" met the standard of "clear verbal consent," would have caused me to find him guilty of violating the FSU code. I don't think moaning can ever rise to the level of any clear verbal communication. Using his own words, I argue that he violated the code.

[Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15]

Kind of surprised how much this little follow up flew under the radar. Perhaps because it coincided with his "selection" to the Pro Bowl?

http://www.cnn.com/2016/01/25/us/florida-state-fsu-settles-jameis-winston-rape-lawsuit/

[devildeac]

Kind of surprised how much this little follow up flew under the radar. Perhaps because it coincided with his "selection" to the Pro Bowl?

http://www.cnn.com/2016/01/25/us/florida-state-fsu-settles-jameis-winston-rape-lawsuit/


Hmmm, maybe the light blue bastards down the road need to learn something from this excerpt:

"The main reason the school settled, Thrasher said, was to avoid millions of dollars in legal expenses."

[Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15]

Hmmm, maybe the light blue bastards down the road need to learn something from this excerpt:

"The main reason the school settled, Thrasher said, was to avoid millions of dollars in legal expenses."

Learning isn't their best trick.