NBA Free Agency 2014

[pfrduke]

Figured we'd have a thread for summer transactions, and the LeBron opt out, coming on the heels of the Carmelo opt out, feel like good conversation starters. For Carmelo, it seems clearly a desire to leave the Knicks; for LeBron, the situation is less clear, and it may just be a way to explore options - and see what else the Heat do transaction-wise - before ultimately re-signing in Miami.

[superdave]

Could Lebron and Melo be a package deal somewhere? The Lakers have the cap room if they package the #7 and Nash's $9+ million expiring deal. The Cavs could clean house and trade Bennett, Waiters, Thompson, Jack and Varajao - all tradeable assets. The question is would they have to use Kyrie or the #1 to get there. The Knicks are at $92 million with Melo, so Lebron wont be joining him there.

The more likely scenarios - Wade and Bosh opt out as well and they drag Melo to South Beach with a giant restructuring. Or Lebron or Melo could go their own to the Clippers (after dumping Deandre, Crawford and Dudley) or Rockets (after getting rid of Lin/Asik).

Does anyone think Lebron might not want to go to LA and be seen as a hired gun? If so he might limit himself to Miami or Cleveland. Or if you think Lebron thinks Bosh and Wade are over the hill, might he strong-arm them to take a lot less or else he's gone. Lotta subplots here.

[Olympic Fan]

The LeBron opt-out is being overblown. Look for Wade and Bosh to opt out too.

They're not leaving -- they are allowing Miami to restructure their contracts so the Heat can afford another couple of players.

The big news would be in Wade does NOT opt out -- that would blow up the Heat plans and could lead to LeBron leaving.

[kAzE]

Man, if I was LeBron, I'd find some way to go to Golden State. They're gonna get Kevin Love, and a trio of Love, Curry, and LeBron would be unstoppable . . .

[superdave]

The LeBron opt-out is being overblown. Look for Wade and Bosh to opt out too.

They're not leaving -- they are allowing Miami to restructure their contracts so the Heat can afford another couple of players.

The big news would be in Wade does NOT opt out -- that would blow up the Heat plans and could lead to LeBron leaving.

You may be right. But Wade and Bosh averaged a combined 32 and 10 in the playoffs this year. Wade couldnt guard any of us at this point.

Do you think Lebron wants to stick around for that unless they cannot get Melo? It would be the Big One not the Big Three.

He has to see the Heat improve substantially or he should move on. I would bet his agent delivered that message to Pat Riley already.

[Henderson]

Could Lebron and Melo be a package deal somewhere? The Lakers have the cap room if they package the #7 and Nash's $9+ million expiring deal. The Cavs could clean house and trade Bennett, Waiters, Thompson, Jack and Varajao - all tradeable assets. The question is would they have to use Kyrie or the #1 to get there. The Knicks are at $92 million with Melo, so Lebron wont be joining him there.

The more likely scenarios - Wade and Bosh opt out as well and they drag Melo to South Beach with a giant restructuring. Or Lebron or Melo could go their own to the Clippers (after dumping Deandre, Crawford and Dudley) or Rockets (after getting rid of Lin/Asik).

Does anyone think Lebron might not want to go to LA and be seen as a hired gun? If so he might limit himself to Miami or Cleveland. Or if you think Lebron thinks Bosh and Wade are over the hill, might he strong-arm them to take a lot less or else he's gone. Lotta subplots here.

I just can't see Lebron and Melo joining up in Cleveland. Akron is home to both Lebron and his wife, but there is no way Carmelo Anthony's wife Lala is moving to Cleveland. No way. And a deal that sends Lebron to Cleveland makes little sense to me from a basketball standpoint. Lebron is an alpha male type whose ability to share the limelight with Kyrie I question. Kyrie would have to defer to him. Would he? And getting rid of Kyrie to acquire Lebron doesn't make sense from Lebron's standpoint. He'd be back where he started -- in Cleveland without much around him. Maybe a very talented rookie if the Cavs kept their #1 pick.

One way Lebron to Cleveland makes sense (and let me reiterate Melo isn't going there) is as a marketing move for both the Cavs and Lebron. The prodigal son returns. Sell outs every night. Big endorsement money locally for Lebron. That works for a year or so, but it doesn't add up to a championship for either the Cavs or Lebron. The only way Lebron-to-Cleveland works is if the Cavs also keep Kyrie and use the 1st pick to pick an all-star. Wiggins, Kyrie, and Lebron in Cleveland? That could be interesting if Kyrie and Lebron can work together. Maybe they can.

The Cavs pay a lot of money to some just OK players, so if they move those players they might even be able to afford a team like that. Jack and Varajoao are expensive players, Waiters needs to go anyway if Kyrie stays, and Bennett is a raw talent who might actually blossom in a new environment, which means he has value. I have a tough time seeing Parker and Lebron playing together though, so Wiggins would be the pick there I think.

[Edouble]

Man, if I was LeBron, I'd find some way to go to Golden State. They're gonna get Kevin Love, and a trio of Love, Curry, and LeBron would be unstoppable . . .

I don't think LeBron wants to go out west. If he can somehow improve The Heat (adding 'Melo) then he's pretty much in the NBA Finals every year for the next 4-5 years.

Edit: I mean, he doesn't want to go out west b/c he doesn't want to have to compete in the Western Conference... who would?

[dukelifer]

Man, if I was LeBron, I'd find some way to go to Golden State. They're gonna get Kevin Love, and a trio of Love, Curry, and LeBron would be unstoppable . . .

Go to San Antonio - he would fit right in with a team that likes to pass the ball.

[Edouble]

Man, if I was LeBron, I'd find some way to go to Golden State. They're gonna get Kevin Love, and a trio of Love, Curry, and LeBron would be unstoppable . . .

But he would have to beat out Black Falcon for PT...

[diveonthefloor]

Memphis would be absolutely sick if he went that unlikely route. Their new owner is a Cuban wanna-be. Wouldn't put it past him.

[greybeard]

Figured we'd have a thread for summer transactions, and the LeBron opt out, coming on the heels of the Carmelo opt out, feel like good conversation starters. For Carmelo, it seems clearly a desire to leave the Knicks; for LeBron, the situation is less clear, and it may just be a way to explore options - and see what else the Heat do transaction-wise - before ultimately re-signing in Miami.

Lebron's move forces Wade to do what he needs to do anyway, retire, which clears space for Melo, with Lebron taking less.

[CDu]

Lebron's move forces Wade to do what he needs to do anyway, retire, which clears space for Melo, with Lebron taking less.

Wade has over 40 million reasons not to retire. He is only going opt out if he can make even more (through added years). There is no way Wade will retire this offseason.

[FerryFor50]

Lebron is an alpha male type whose ability to share the limelight with Kyrie I question. Kyrie would have to defer to him. Would he? And getting rid of Kyrie to acquire Lebron doesn't make sense from Lebron's standpoint. He'd be back where he started -- in Cleveland without much around him. Maybe a very talented rookie if the Cavs kept their #1 pick.


This is problematic in a few ways.

For one, he went to Miami.. which was unquestionably Wade's team when he got there. LeBron got lots of criticism for deferring too much. It took them some time to figure out how to play together, but by no means was it because LeBron was an "alpha male."

Secondly, if LeBron went to Cleveland, it would unquestionably be LeBron's team. He would regain the love of his home city and Kyrie would be the one who would have to deal. And I fee like would.

Finally, LeBron likely won't go to Cleveland - at least not for a few years. He wants to go somewhere he has the best chance to win a title. Cleveland is not it right now.

Not sure where you get the "alpha male" vibe from LeBron.

[Henderson]

I don't think LeBron wants to go out west. If he can somehow improve The Heat (adding 'Melo) then he's pretty much in the NBA Finals every year for the next 4-5 years.


Wherever LeBron ends up, I hope we don't have to endure another TV special to hear about it. I thought the "I've decided to take my talents to South Beach" thing was a little much last time.

If he stays in Miami, I think it's going to take more than Carmelo to keep the Heat in the NBA Finals every year. I think both Bosh and Wade are going to be very expensive past-prime players wherever they play in the next 4-5 years. To me, it kind of makes more sense for LeBron to go to the Knicks with 'Melo re-signing there. NYC would eat that up. But Phil would have to trade away some very expensive talent to make that happen. Seems like the past few years the Knicks have been the repository for expensive "seasoned" talent that other teams wanted to move.

[pfrduke]

Wherever LeBron ends up, I hope we don't have to endure another TV special to hear about it. I thought the "I've decided to take my talents to South Beach" thing was a little much last time.

I have to assume he and his people recognize that was a mistake (a well-intentioned one perhaps, but a mistake nonetheless). I would be shocked if we saw that again.

[FerryFor50]

I have to assume he and his people recognize that was a mistake (a well-intentioned one perhaps, but a mistake nonetheless). I would be shocked if we saw that again.

It was also four years ago. I assume he's matured a bit since then ...

[greybeard]

Wade has over 40 million reasons not to retire. He is only going opt out if he can make even more (through added years). There is no way Wade will retire this offseason.

My speculation mistakenly presupposed that, if Wade was forced to retire because of his legs, his salary would not have counted against the cap. Still, no Lebron, Wade embarrasses himself. Leverage; who knows; obviously, not me.

[tommy]

Wade has over 40 million reasons not to retire. He is only going opt out if he can make even more (through added years). There is no way Wade will retire this offseason.

Agreed. And with his body in the condition it's in, I can't imagine anybody giving him a long contract for huge money. He's clearly in decline. And because he knows he's not going to do any better on the open market than the contract he's already got in Miami, he's not going to opt out.

Only way is if he said he wasn't going to opt out, LeBron then left because the team wouldn't have the ability to add the type of player(s) needed to win it all again, so now the team is really nowhere, and in that scenario maybe Wade opts out too at that point and signs a more reasonable deal with a contender on which he would fit in with what he's got to give at this point.

I just don't think so though. I think Wade plays out his contract in Miami, goes wire-to-wire in one uniform, retires in a year or two with his three rings, the adulation of the Miami fans, and his sure-bet Hall of Fame legacy intact, and goes home to count his money.

[FerryFor50]

Agreed. And with his body in the condition it's in, I can't imagine anybody giving him a long contract for huge money. He's clearly in decline. And because he knows he's not going to do any better on the open market than the contract he's already got in Miami, he's not going to opt out.

Only way is if he said he wasn't going to opt out, LeBron then left because the team wouldn't have the ability to add the type of player(s) needed to win it all again, so now the team is really nowhere, and in that scenario maybe Wade opts out too at that point and signs a more reasonable deal with a contender on which he would fit in with what he's got to give at this point.

I just don't think so though. I think Wade plays out his contract in Miami, goes wire-to-wire in one uniform, retires in a year or two with his three rings, the adulation of the Miami fans, and his sure-bet Hall of Fame legacy intact, and goes home to count his money.

Agreed.

I think Wade's made enough $$ from his playing career and from his endorsements to not really need the extra few million.

[Mabdul Doobakus]

It was also four years ago. I assume he's matured a bit since then ...

Too bad for the Boys and Girls Club, though, huh? I kind of wish Lebron would do another TV special just to rub it in everyone's faces.


Agreed. And with his body in the condition it's in, I can't imagine anybody giving him a long contract for huge money. He's clearly in decline. And because he knows he's not going to do any better on the open market than the contract he's already got in Miami, he's not going to opt out.

...

I think Wade plays out his contract in Miami, goes wire-to-wire in one uniform, retires in a year or two with his three rings, the adulation of the Miami fans, and his sure-bet Hall of Fame legacy intact, and goes home to count his money.

We'll obviously have to see how this all plays out, but Wade opting in would pretty much sink the franchise for the next two years. He's built up a lot of goodwill over the years here in Miami, and I think that goodwill has been very helpful in getting the good people of Miami to overlook the fact that he stopped trying consistently on defense about 5 years ago. If he opts in, it's probably going to drive Lebron away, and for as much as Wade has done for the city of Miami, I'm not sure how well the people here would respond to that. I don't know that people would necessarily turn on him, but it would knock his status down a peg.

As a Heat fan, following a day of reflection, I'm not terribly bothered by Lebron opting out. I actually welcome it. This was seen by all as the first step needed to retool the roster in order to better compete for a championship next year. If Wade and Bosh also opt out, then I think there's clearly a plan in place. If Wade and Bosh opt in, then Lebron may very well leave, and the Heat's ability to compete for a championship would leave with him, but they'd be in great shape to retool in 2016 when the free agency class is supposedly going to be spectacular.

If Lebron does leave, I don't expect him to be villified in this city like he was in Cleveland. I think everyone here appreciates the last 4 years, and whereas the people of Cleveland may have felt personally slighted by Lebron's departure, I'm pretty sure the people here will be too busy doing cocaine on yachts to even notice. I think he would return to Miami to a standing ovation (with, I'm sure, a smattering of boos).

[BobbyFan]

The LeBron opt-out is being overblown. Look for Wade and Bosh to opt out too.

They're not leaving -- they are allowing Miami to restructure their contracts so the Heat can afford another couple of players.

The big news would be in Wade does NOT opt out -- that would blow up the Heat plans and could lead to LeBron leaving.

Why is it so far fetched for Wade to not opt out? He already gave the Heat a discount when he signed in 2010, and he would now would be walking away from money he would never see in the open market. Even if he were to get a longer restructured contract, it would require him to play a few extra years to see the full money, and who knows what state his body is in two years from now.

He's also in a career decline, and his place in history is already set. He's not a top 15 all time player, but will be a first ballot HOF who has won 3 titles and is one of the top 3 or 4 SGs ever. Winning more titles as a supporting player won't add much to his legacy, and certainly won't be as significant as they would be to LeBron.

[superdave]

Chris Bosh playoff stats -
2011 - 18.6 and 8.5
2012 - 14.0 and 7.8
2013 - 12.1 and 7.3
2014 - 14.9 and 5.6


Dwyane Wade playoff stats -
2011 - 24.5 and 7.1
2012 - 22.8 and 5.2
2013 - 15.9 and 4.6
2014 - 17.8 and 3.9

This to me is why Pat Riley needs to find a way to upgrade the lineup and do it fast. My assumption is if Wade does NOT opt out, it is because he knows James is gone and he wants to keep the $. Bosh may have one more max deal left, but I dont think Wade can command that with his numbers tailing off and his DNP's up.

Short of Melo, could the Heat restructure their three guys and go after two of Deng/Gasol/Stephenson/Hawes/Livingston/McRoberts? Would getting Deng and Gasol be enough to get back in the title hunt? Would that be better than splurging on Melo?

[CDu]

Chris Bosh playoff stats -
2011 - 18.6 and 8.5
2012 - 14.0 and 7.8
2013 - 12.1 and 7.3
2014 - 14.9 and 5.6


Dwyane Wade playoff stats -
2011 - 24.5 and 7.1
2012 - 22.8 and 5.2
2013 - 15.9 and 4.6
2014 - 17.8 and 3.9

This to me is why Pat Riley needs to find a way to upgrade the lineup and do it fast. My assumption is if Wade does NOT opt out, it is because he knows James is gone and he wants to keep the $. Bosh may have one more max deal left, but I dont think Wade can command that with his numbers tailing off and his DNP's up.

Short of Melo, could the Heat restructure their three guys and go after two of Deng/Gasol/Stephenson/Hawes/Livingston/McRoberts? Would getting Deng and Gasol be enough to get back in the title hunt? Would that be better than splurging on Melo?

I think it's less likely that they get two second-tier guys than it is that they get Carmelo. And I don't think it's at all likely that they get Carmelo. First, it would require those guys to take a pay cut to join the Heat. Second, I can't imagine that Wade would take a substantial pay cut just to get two second-tier guys. But, I guess you just never know.

It all depends on (a) how much James and Bosh/Wade are willing to sacrifice salary-wise and (b) how much James wants to stay in Miami. And (b) is perhaps the more important point here, because James certainly has options that may be better than Miami.

Let's take the Bulls as an example. Assuming the Bulls amnesty Boozer, James could get a salary starting at ~$18 million next year from the Bulls. With that starting salary, Noah, Gibson, Butler, and a healthy Rose are a much better supporting cast than Wade, Bosh, and whatever guys are willing to come at a heavy discount (Miami would have only about $9 million in cap space). And there's much more staying power will the Bulls as those guys are reasonably young (definitely young compared to Miami's group). So James (and Wade and Bosh) would have to take substantially less money than that to get a better team than the Bulls with James. And they would still be a declining group with Wade and Bosh.

The story in Houston (if Houston can move Lin and Asik) is similar. James can get a pretty good salary and join a younger, better fitting duo with Howard and Harden. And he gets the same tax benefits in Houston that he'd get in Miami.

Basically, unless Wade and Bosh are willing to take hefty pay cuts (AND someone like Carmelo is willing to do the same), Miami doesn't appear to be James' best option.

Side note: all of the above is also pertinent to Carmelo Anthony. He's facing the same sort of options as James.

[Wander]

I'd really like to see Miami get some good YOUNG talent around Lebron. Yes, the Spurs stars are old, but they also had good young talent at their other positions in Leonard, Mills, and Green - the equivalent guys on the Heat are in their mid-to-late 30's. I guess they tried with Beasley, but they need to try again.

[CDu]

I'd really like to see Miami get some good YOUNG talent around Lebron. Yes, the Spurs stars are old, but they also had good young talent at their other positions in Leonard, Mills, and Green - the equivalent guys on the Heat are in their mid-to-late 30's. I guess they tried with Beasley, but they need to try again.

The problem is that there isn't a real way to do this unless Wade and Bosh and James all agree to take HUGE paycuts. Those guys, if they stay together, are going to take up at least 75% of the salary cap. That leaves very little cap space and no assets to acquire good young talent.

Basically, Miami's only path to find good young talent is to hope they can find some gems late in the draft. Otherwise, they are stuck with older guys willing to take the veteran's minimum to chase a ring.

[Matches]

The problem with a Bulls scenario is that Rose is such a huge question mark. No one really knows (a) if he'll be healthy and (b) if he'll be the same guy he was before the injury. It's hard to imagine Lebron jumping into that situation with such a significant unknown. Even without Rose, the current Bulls + Lebron would be really good, but that's true of almost any team in the league.

I still think the most likely scenario is that Wade & Bosh opt out, all three guys re-sign with Miami at reduced amounts, and the Heat uses the extra cash to either add Melo or 2-3 solid role players.

[CDu]

The problem with a Bulls scenario is that Rose is such a huge question mark. No one really knows (a) if he'll be healthy and (b) if he'll be the same guy he was before the injury. It's hard to imagine Lebron jumping into that situation with such a significant unknown. Even without Rose, the current Bulls + Lebron would be really good, but that's true of almost any team in the league.

I still think the most likely scenario is that Wade & Bosh opt out, all three guys re-sign with Miami at reduced amounts, and the Heat uses the extra cash to either add Melo or 2-3 solid role players.

To be fair, I don't think (a) is a question at all. Neither of his injuries are career-threatening injuries. The second of those injuries (a meniscus tear) was a MUCH less severe injury than the ACL. Rose is just notoriously slow to return to the court. But Rose is now 2 years removed from the ACL tear in the left knee and over 7 months removed from the torn meniscus in his right knee. He's fine in terms of health, and almost certainly has been so for a few months now.

Question (b) is the more interesting a question. Rose didn't look sharp at all in his brief return last season. A lot of that can be attributed to the rust associated with not playing competitive games in over a year (he didn't start playing until pre-season last year, and he kept his play limited during that time). So we don't know if we'll see the old Rose, or 95% of the old Rose, or 75% of the old Rose. The plan is to shake off that rust playing with Team USA this summer and then be ready for the season. But yes, (b) would have to be clarified as much as possible with Anthony or James (with Anthony the more likely target).

As for the most likely scenario, I don't think there's much likelihood of Carmelo joining James/Wade/Bosh. I think those guys would all have to take too big a pay cut to make that happen. And with Wade in such a decline (and questions as to whether Bosh can still be a big-time player, I can't see Anthony jumping on that ship. I think that Anthony is going to either go to LA, Chicago, or Houston. I'd put Anthony returning to New York as more likely than Anthony going to Miami. But you just never know.

[JasonEvans]

Supposedly, the "Big Three" are meeting to talk about their plans. I think they will opt for less money to stay with Miami and leave some cash on the table for Miami to bring in some help. I don't think there will be enough money to bring in Melo though.

If Lebron leaves Miami, I have not heard as much talk about Chicago recently. All the talk seems to center around the Lakers, Clippers, Houston, and Dallas. I'd hate for the East to lose Lebron as it will make the East seem even more like the minor leagues. ESPN Radio has been aflutter with the idea of Melo and Lebron joining Kobe on the Lakers, but every analyst seems to say that would not work because Kobe would not tolerate playing second or third fiddle to those guys.

Apparently, the Clippers would need to do the nearly unthinkable and trade Blake Griffin to make a deal for Lebron work. WOW! Here's a thought -- Blake Griffin to Cleveland for the #1 pick (Jabari or Wiggins) plus the rights to Verejao and Tristan Thompson. That trade works from a salary cap perspective. The Clips would have to Amnesty Verejao to make room for Lebron's salary.

I dunno -- this stuff is crazy! Teams are all going gaga right now to see if they can clear room for Lebron and Melo. The draft trade rumors are going batty. Twitter is abuzz with Cleveland talking to teams about Orlando's #4 and #12 picks, indicating the Orlando is offering those two picks (and probably something else) for the right to move up to #1. Philly supposedly really wants to move up to #1 as well. Last year's draft didn't feature many deals because no one really wanted picks in that draft. This year, I bet we see a lot of deals because teams are willing to pay a LOT for picks in what is seen as one of the deepest and most talented drafts in years.

-Jason "I suspect it is going to be a very interesting 12-14 hours in the NBA" Evans

[Matches]

If Lebron leaves Miami, I have not heard as much talk about Chicago recently. All the talk seems to center around the Lakers, Clippers, Houston, and Dallas. I'd hate for the East to lose Lebron as it will make the East seem even more like the minor leagues. ESPN Radio has been aflutter with the idea of Melo and Lebron joining Kobe on the Lakers, but every analyst seems to say that would not work because Kobe would not tolerate playing second or third fiddle to those guys.


Kobe's giant contract probably makes it impossible for the Lakers to add both Melo and Lebron. I could see Melo ending up there but not both of them.

I do expect Dallas to be a big player in the Melo sweepstakes, along with the Bulls. I'm skeptical of the Clippers - I highly doubt Lebron's going there with the ownership situation unresolved, given how outspoken he's been about Sterling, and if I'm the Clippers I'm not doing all the other rejiggering that would be necessary to get Melo. For Lebron - yea, pull out all the stops.

[CDu]

Kobe's giant contract probably makes it impossible for the Lakers to add both Melo and Lebron. I could see Melo ending up there but not both of them.

That's actually not true. Kobe is set to make $23.5 million next season. With Nash's $9.7 million and some other minor contracts, the Lakers only have about $36 million on the books for next year. With the cap at ~$63 million, that leaves about $27 million in free space. That's the same amount that James (and the others) would have to take to get Melo to Miami. And that's assuming the Lakers can't pull off a salary dump with Nash. That would get them to about $37 million in cap space, which would put them at $18.5 million each for James and Anthony.

Now, the question is whether a roster of old man Bryant, James, and Anthony and a bunch of scrubs is more interesting than a team of Howard, James, Anthony (if the Rockets do a sign-and-trade of Harden) or Rose, Noah, Gibson, Butler, and Anthony/James. And I don't think the Lakers look all that appealing by comparison. So while it is mathematically possible to get both at reasonably-doable contracts, I agree in that I don't think it is realistic.


I do expect Dallas to be a big player in the Melo sweepstakes, along with the Bulls. I'm skeptical of the Clippers - I highly doubt Lebron's going there with the ownership situation unresolved, given how outspoken he's been about Sterling, and if I'm the Clippers I'm not doing all the other rejiggering that would be necessary to get Melo. For Lebron - yea, pull out all the stops.

I think Dallas is not a big threat. They only have about $26 million in cap space, and that doesn't count the fact that they need to sign Nowitzki. Is an old Nowitzki, an old Chandler, and Monte Ellis really that appealing?

I think the Rockets and Bulls are the frontrunners for Melo if he leaves New York (which I consider probably a 50/50 or better chance). I think the Rockets would be the frontrunners for James if he leaves Miami (which I consider less likely). I agree on the Clippers - especially with regard to Anthony. Chris Paul is godfather to James' children, so I could see potential interest there. But I think the Clippers would have to give up too much to make that happen, and that would leave James in a less-than-desirable situation.

[Matches]

I think the Rockets and Bulls are the frontrunners for Melo if he leaves New York (which I consider probably a 50/50 or better chance). I think the Rockets would be the frontrunners for James if he leaves Miami (which I consider less likely).

IMO the best *fit* for Melo is clearly the Bulls. Defensive-minded team that struggles to score and needs a go-to guy? That's pretty close to the perfect scenario for Melo even without Rose. Whether that's where he'll end up, we'll see.

[CDu]

IMO the best *fit* for Melo is clearly the Bulls. Defensive-minded team that struggles to score and needs a go-to guy? That's pretty close to the perfect scenario for Melo even without Rose. Whether that's where he'll end up, we'll see.

Yeah, in terms of fit, I think the Bulls are clearly the best for Anthony. He can play his same game, but have a much better group around him and guys who are good defensively. It's less great a fit for James (unless they add some shooters), but it may still represent his best shot at future titles. But, as you said, you never know. Chicago certainly doesn't have a great history in landing big-name free agents, so to expect that to change now might be folly. As a Bulls fan, I'm hopeful that we get Anthony, but I certainly won't call it likely right now.

I'll add that, if the Rockets can trade Lin and then do a sign-and-trade with New York or Miami involving Harden, then the Rockets look really interesting with Howard, James, and Anthony. Of course, they'd be in the West, which is tougher sledding than the East. So there are obvious tradeoffs there.

Part of me thinks that all of this will just be a big tease though, with Miami's "big three" staying in place and Anthony staying in New York.

[Billy Dat]

Part of me thinks that all of this will just be a big tease though, with Miami's "big three" staying in place and Anthony staying in New York.

Yeah, if Wade is at a point where he is willing to restructure to take significantly less per season but gets more overall, and perhaps moves to the Manu 6th man role, I don't see why they'd break up. With the Knicks starting to make moves with the Chanlder/Felton trade, picking up an early second round pick, it'll be interesting to see what they look like when 7/1 rolls around.

Bottom line, the East is the path of least resistance to the Finals for all of these guys. Hopping out West and running that playoff gauntlet is a big challenge.

[FerryFor50]

Sounds like the Rockets are shipping Asik to the Pelicans:

http://www.cbssports.com/nba/eye-on-basketball/24597847/report-rockets-trade-omer-asik-to-pelicans-for-future-first-round-pick

Making a run at one of Anthony or James, of course...

[Mabdul Doobakus]

Bottom line, the East is the path of least resistance to the Finals for all of these guys. Hopping out West and running that playoff gauntlet is a big challenge.

The thing is, this year's Heat team probably would have had a great chance to beat any team in the West besides San Antonio. San Antonio is obviously the best team, but they also present significant matchup problems for the Heat. The Spurs nearly got knocked off by a pretty average Mavs team. I do think, for example, a Harden/Howard supporting case is an improvement over Wade/Bosh, but I don't think Lebron's chances of winning more rings improve by making that move, simply because he'd have a much tougher time of even making it to the Finals. The Heat could have returned the same exact team, and they'd probably waltz to the Final, and at that point you just hope San Antonio gets knocked off before then.


To be fair, I don't think (a) is a question at all. Neither of his injuries are career-threatening injuries. The second of those injuries (a meniscus tear) was a MUCH less severe injury than the ACL. Rose is just notoriously slow to return to the court. But Rose is now 2 years removed from the ACL tear in the left knee and over 7 months removed from the torn meniscus in his right knee. He's fine in terms of health, and almost certainly has been so for a few months now.

Question (b) is the more interesting a question. Rose didn't look sharp at all in his brief return last season. A lot of that can be attributed to the rust associated with not playing competitive games in over a year (he didn't start playing until pre-season last year, and he kept his play limited during that time). So we don't know if we'll see the old Rose, or 95% of the old Rose, or 75% of the old Rose. The plan is to shake off that rust playing with Team USA this summer and then be ready for the season. But yes, (b) would have to be clarified as much as possible with Anthony or James (with Anthony the more likely target).

Even without Rose, if you move James to Chicago, they're the best team in the East. Are they better than the current Heat with James? Probably not, but then if you add in a healthy Rose than probably yes. However, I'm pretty much a Rose skeptic at this point. I don't see him returning as the same caliber of player we saw before all the injuries. It's hard to imagine him having that same explosiveness, which was probably his single biggest asset, and he's no better than average as a shooter.



-Jason "I suspect it is going to be a very interesting 12-14 hours in the NBA" Evans

I don't usually get into drafts in any sport. I find them tedious to watch and anticlimactic, since the winners and losers aren't really determined until 2-3 years later. But I'm definitely intrigued for tonight's draft, not only due to the caliber of players available, but also because there's a ton of potential for player movement, setting the stage for the impending free agency period. The Heat are supposedly targeting Shabazz Napier, partly to please Lebron, but now that that news is out there, I suspect that task got a lot harder. Thank you, journalists.

[FerryFor50]

Interesting rumor on CNNSI:

http://www.si.com/nba/2014/06/26/2014-nba-draft-rumors


• Mark Heisler, Forbes: Celtics want Sacramento's No. 8 pick for [Rajon] Rondo. If they get it, Danny Ainge takes Elfrid Payton/Marcus Smart at No. 6.

I'd do #8 pick for Rondo in a heartbeat.

[Olympic Fan]

Why is it so far fetched for Wade to not opt out? He already gave the Heat a discount when he signed in 2010, and he would now would be walking away from money he would never see in the open market. Even if he were to get a longer restructured contract, it would require him to play a few extra years to see the full money, and who knows what state his body is in two years from now.

It's all a matter of winning.

Obviously, Wade can take the money and run. He's due $20.1 million next season and $21.7 million -- at HIS option -- in 2016.

That's almost $42 million he earns by doing nothing. And, quite clearly, at this stage of his career, he can't get that money anywhere else.

So why should he restructrure?

Because if the Big Three don't restructure, it's going to be difficult to build a Miami team that can win any more championships. LeBron likely leaves for a place he CAN win (which is why he came to Miami anyway) and Wade remains as a centerpiece on a mediocre team, making his 20-plus million. but fading into obscurity.

LeBron opted out because he wants to stay and win. The big three have all taken less money in the past so they could play on a great team. I can't see why that will change.

Wade can stand firm and blow up the team ... or he can restructure and the core of the Heat can remain intact.

I expect the latter to happen.

[superdave]

Interesting rumor on CNNSI:

http://www.si.com/nba/2014/06/26/2014-nba-draft-rumors



I'd do #8 pick for Rondo in a heartbeat.

Celtics need to get more than that. They should throw in some salary millstone to clear their cap space going forward. Maybe Rondo ($12.9m expiring in '15), Bogans ($5.5m expiring in '16) and Olynyk who is on a rookie deal for the #8 and a 2nd round pick. I dont know if that works under trade rules, but you need more for Rondo than just the #8.

I wonder if Ainge would then package the #6 and #8 for the #3, or maybe put together something bigger for Love. How about Jeff Green, Brandon Bass, the #6 and #8 for Kevin Love? Does that get the job done?

[JasonEvans]

A trade!!

The Mavs desperately wanted Tyson Chandler back from New York. So, they sent point guard Jose Calderon, center Samuel Dalembert, last year's first-round pick point guard Shane Larkin, reserve guard Wayne Ellington and the 34th and 51st picks in Thursday's draft to the Knicks. Actually, that wasn't enough. The Knicks also forced them to take Ray Felton off their hands. So Ray, the human lowlight film (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8K8s2K96GvY), heads to Dallas.

Also, speaking of the Mavs, everyone expects Dirk to agree to a sweet hometown discount to come back to Dallas. Dirk made $21.7 mil this past season but I bet he signs for $10 mil or less going forward. The Mavs are going to be real players in the free agent market this summer. They have to figure that adding either Melo or LeBron to Dirk and Chandler would give them probably the best front line in the NBA.

-Jason "Melo is going to a new team -- Lebron, not so much" Evans

[FerryFor50]

A trade!!

The Mavs desperately wanted Tyson Chandler back from New York. So, they sent point guard Jose Calderon, center Samuel Dalembert, last year's first-round pick point guard Shane Larkin, reserve guard Wayne Ellington and the 34th and 51st picks in Thursday's draft to the Knicks. Actually, that wasn't enough. The Knicks also forced them to take Ray Felton off their hands. So Ray, the human lowlight film (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8K8s2K96GvY), heads to Dallas.

Also, speaking of the Mavs, everyone expects Dirk to agree to a sweet hometown discount to come back to Dallas. Dirk made $21.7 mil this past season but I bet he signs for $10 mil or less going forward. The Mavs are going to be real players in the free agent market this summer. They have to figure that adding either Melo or LeBron to Dirk and Chandler would give them probably the best front line in the NBA.

-Jason "Melo is going to a new team -- Lebron, not so much" Evans

That is a WHOLE lot to give up for Chandler, who has been a bit injury prone the last year or two. Giving up all that *and* taking on Felton? No thanks.

[CDu]

That is a WHOLE lot to give up for Chandler, who has been a bit injury prone the last year or two. Giving up all that *and* taking on Felton? No thanks.

I'm not sure I really understand that deal from either side. Dallas made their cap situation a bit worse this summer with this move, while New York (who is well over the cap) saved a bit of money this year but hurt their cap situation for next summer (when they'd actually be in position to make moves).

As for the actual players changing hands, it's a whole lot of "meh" except for the possibility of development with Shane Larkin. But really, aside from getting a couple of second round picks (maybe Jackson can turn those into a late-first round pick?), this trade is just a case of shuffling deck chairs on the Titanic.

[kAzE]

That is a WHOLE lot to give up for Chandler, who has been a bit injury prone the last year or two. Giving up all that *and* taking on Felton? No thanks.

Agreed . . . the #34 pick in this draft is going to be a good player . . . and they are giving up Larkin, who was their first rounder last year, and, in my opinion, a vastly superior asset than Felton. You get Chandler at the end of his contract, past his prime, and you lose a guy who might be the best shooter in the league in Calderon. I guess this is an attempt to get better immediately, so that they can squeeze something out of Dirk's last few years, but this is just blowing up your future for a very small improvement in the present. If Chandler gets hurt, this becomes a disaster for them.

I actually like this deal for the Knicks, though, they get younger with Larkin and the draft picks, and Calderon is a very tradeable asset because of his shooting. They can get rid of him next summer, which creates the cap room that they want. And who can argue against getting rid of Ray Felton? That's a huge win, no matter how you slice it.

[Billy Dat]

Agreed . . . the #34 pick in this draft is going to be a good player . . . and they are giving up Larkin, who was their first rounder last year, and, in my opinion, a vastly superior asset than Felton. You get Chandler at the end of his contract, past his prime, and you lose a guy who might be the best shooter in the league in Calderon. I guess this is an attempt to get better immediately, so that they can squeeze something out of Dirk's last few years, but this is just blowing up your future for a very small improvement in the present. If Chandler gets hurt, this becomes a disaster for them.

I actually like this deal for the Knicks, though, they get younger with Larkin and the draft picks, and Calderon is a very tradeable asset because of his shooting. They can get rid of him next summer, which creates the cap room that they want. And who can argue against getting rid of Ray Felton? That's a huge win, no matter how you slice it.

The Knicks needed a PG and we just got a starter and a back-up. Calderon is a little past his prime, but he's 32 and had a really solid year last year playing 81 games. Like you say, he can shoot, and we will hopefully get some cheap rookie talent at #34. I'll take it.

That being said, Chandler was a great Knick for the short time he was with the team - a good guy all around who had some bad injury luck but earned a DPOY while with the squad. We'll miss the big guy.

[Mabdul Doobakus]

File this under Rumors That Probably Make No Sense For Anyone Involved:

Ric Bucher ‏@RicBucher 5m
Source: Toronto looking to S&T Kyle Lowry to Miami for cash and future picks. Part II: Bosh opts out, returns to Toronto.



I'm guessing Ric Bucher is one of those dudes who is willing to report anything?

[FerryFor50]

File this under Rumors That Probably Make No Sense For Anyone Involved:

Ric Bucher ‏@RicBucher 5m
Source: Toronto looking to S&T Kyle Lowry to Miami for cash and future picks. Part II: Bosh opts out, returns to Toronto.



I'm guessing Ric Bucher is one of those dudes who is willing to report anything?

Yea that would be a dumb move by everyone - Miami, Toronto, Bosh... only Lowry would benefit here.

[CDu]

File this under Rumors That Probably Make No Sense For Anyone Involved:

Ric Bucher ‏@RicBucher 5m
Source: Toronto looking to S&T Kyle Lowry to Miami for cash and future picks. Part II: Bosh opts out, returns to Toronto.



I'm guessing Ric Bucher is one of those dudes who is willing to report anything?


Yea that would be a dumb move by everyone - Miami, Toronto, Bosh... only Lowry would benefit here.

I could theoretically see Part I happening. But not Part II. And even Part I seems strange because Miami just traded up to get Shabazz Napier.

But yeah, no way Bosh agrees to opt out and then go to Toronto.

[Matches]

I could theoretically see Part I happening. But not Part II. And even Part I seems strange because Miami just traded up to get Shabazz Napier.


Lowry was a guy I know the Heat had some interest in, as a replacement for Chalmers and potentially a guy who could be serviceable at PG and relatively affordable. I agree, though - that idea's dead after the Heat got Napier. Questionable how much the Heat really needs a true PG anyway as long as they have Lebron - a combo guard like Napier may actually be a better fit.

[FerryFor50]

Lowry was a guy I know the Heat had some interest in, as a replacement for Chalmers and potentially a guy who could be serviceable at PG and relatively affordable. I agree, though - that idea's dead after the Heat got Napier. Questionable how much the Heat really needs a true PG anyway as long as they have Lebron - a combo guard like Napier may actually be a better fit.

They just need a capable PG. Someone who isn't going to make bad decision after bad decision and is capable of hurting teams that leave them open.

You know, someone who isn't Mario Chalmers...

Chalmers had a few good years in Miami, but I think he's regressed. I actually think being on the Heat has messed with his head. He might have been better off on a team without James and Wade barking at him non-stop.

[Henderson]

Questionable how much the Heat really needs a true GM anyway as long as they have Lebron ....

Fixed that for you. This was obviously LeBron's pick. When asked about that last night, a Heat source said the team didn't consult with LeBron about the pick, but added that they were aware of his wishes. Too bad they couldn't free up cap room by just releasing Erik Spoelstra and Pat Riley. LeBron handles those duties anyway.

[richardjackson199]

Not sure if this is the right thread, but James Michael McAdoo is a free agent now, right? He went from being a certain top 10 pick 2 years ago, to leaving school early undrafted. Wow. I think JMM will make an NBA team and be a solid player. But maybe UNC's finance classes on "sell stock high" were also paper classes.

[Mabdul Doobakus]

Ric Bucher issued a full retraction on that Lowery/Bosh story on Twitter. It was such a dumb transaction that it's hard to understand how he got so easily taken in by his sources.

Meanwhile, a local radio talk show host just reported the following:

Andy Slater
‏@AndySlater
Pat Riley, Dwyane Wade, Udonis Haslem, and LeBron James were together tonight in Coconut Grove. No sign of Chris Bosh.

Weird that I can't find any corroboration elsewhere on Twitter, but in another tweet, it sounds like this reporter saw them with his own eyes.

The feeling around here is that Wade and Bosh will opt out, but obviously no one can say for sure.

[Mabdul Doobakus]

Udonis Haslem has opted out of a 1 year extension, which I think was for around $4.5 million, with the understanding that he'll get a 3 year deal worth around $8-9 million, freeing up around $1.5 million in cap space this offseason.

Haslem has the same agent as Wade and Bosh. Hard to imagine this isn't part of a bigger plan. Just waiting on the official word from Wade and Bosh.

[Duvall]

Woj: Suns to attempt to assemble a new Big Three with LeBron, Carmelo and Miles Plumlee. (http://sports.yahoo.com/news/suns-to-pursue-lebron-james--carmelo-anthony-with-offer-for-them-to-play-together-163546302.html)

[Henderson]

Woj: Suns to attempt to assemble a new Big Three with LeBron, Carmelo and Miles Plumlee. (http://sports.yahoo.com/news/suns-to-pursue-lebron-james--carmelo-anthony-with-offer-for-them-to-play-together-163546302.html)

My first thought was, "Yeah, and I'm pursuing intimate relations with Scarlett Johansson too." Then I thought, hmmm, that kind of makes some sense. All that cap room.

Anyway, I hope Scarlett starts returning my calls, or I'm opting out.

[Dukehky]

Napier to the Heat doesn't mean that they should not go after Lowry. Napier isn't an automatic starter in the league or anything, but good depth never hurt anyone. They need to try desperately to get some kind of rim protection, but I'm not exactly sure what else is out there.

I always thought the Big 3 would opt out then re-sign for a discount.

[TexHawk]

They just need a capable PG. Someone who isn't going to make bad decision after bad decision and is capable of hurting teams that leave them open.

You know, someone who isn't Mario Chalmers...

Chalmers had a few good years in Miami, but I think he's regressed. I actually think being on the Heat has messed with his head. He might have been better off on a team without James and Wade barking at him non-stop.

I know he became the punchline after this last Spurs series, but it's easy to forget that Chalmers outplayed Tony Parker in games 6 & 7 last year. His 20 points in Game 6 helped keep that series alive (+/- is flawed, but he was +22 in those games, better than anyone else). 2013-14 was his 2nd best statistical season (he averaged double figures in 2009, on a pre-Lebron/Bosh Miami team). He also was the primary defender on Russell Westbrook in the 2012 Finals.

Of course, he didn't play well vs San Antonio this time around, so I doubt he comes back. But he'll land somewhere. He likely won't approach what he accomplished in Miami, but that sorta depends on where he ends up. I could see him becoming a poor poor poor poor man's Robert Horry, his value increases if he's on a good team that needs timely shooting and defense. On the 2015 Pelicans? Doubtful.

[Mabdul Doobakus]

My first thought was, "Yeah, and I'm pursuing intimate relations with Scarlett Johansson too." Then I thought, hmmm, that kind of makes some sense. All that cap room.

Anyway, I hope Scarlett starts returning my calls, or I'm opting out.

Yeah, I sort of had the same reaction. It's not a bad situation, and Woj is really trying to sell it (and does a decent job). The big problem is that it's Phoenix, and I think that's potentially a dealbreaker. I'm sure Phoenix is a fine city to live in, but I just don't see Lebron leaving Miami for a non-marquee team in a non-marquee city. The last big free agent to go to Phoenix was who?

And putting aside Lebron, I think it's even more unlikely that his wife Savannah would be happy with the move, which is I think a much, much bigger factor in his decisionmaking than we give it credit for.

------------------------------

I'm relieved specifically by the decisions by Wade and Haslem to opt out. I was worried that things would get a little weird around here had Wade opted in and prevented the team from making necessary improvements, or worse, chasing Lebron away. I think he has again bought himself a lot of goodwill from the fans down here, and thereby shielded himself from much of the criticism that would otherwise have likely attended his declining skills.

And, as for Haslem, I think people outside this city might find it surprising or even ridiculous, but he's going to have his jersey retired when his career is finished. He is a Miami native, and there is no Miami athlete who has shown more loyalty or who has sacrificed more for any of the sports teams here. Period. I don't think it's even close.

[brevity]

Woj: Suns to attempt to assemble a new Big Three with LeBron, Carmelo and Miles Plumlee. (http://sports.yahoo.com/news/suns-to-pursue-lebron-james--carmelo-anthony-with-offer-for-them-to-play-together-163546302.html)


My first thought was, "Yeah, and I'm pursuing intimate relations with Scarlett Johansson too." Then I thought, hmmm, that kind of makes some sense. All that cap room.

Anyway, I hope Scarlett starts returning my calls, or I'm opting out.


Yeah, I sort of had the same reaction. It's not a bad situation, and Woj is really trying to sell it (and does a decent job). The big problem is that it's Phoenix, and I think that's potentially a dealbreaker. I'm sure Phoenix is a fine city to live in, but I just don't see Lebron leaving Miami for a non-marquee team in a non-marquee city. The last big free agent to go to Phoenix was who?

And putting aside Lebron, I think it's even more unlikely that his wife Savannah would be happy with the move, which is I think a much, much bigger factor in his decisionmaking than we give it credit for.

We're getting a little sidetracked here. I want to hear more about Scarlett Johansson's cap room.

[sagegrouse]

Yeah, I sort of had the same reaction. It's not a bad situation, and Woj is really trying to sell it (and does a decent job). The big problem is that it's Phoenix, and I think that's potentially a dealbreaker. I'm sure Phoenix is a fine city to live in, but I just don't see Lebron leaving Miami for a non-marquee team in a non-marquee city. The last big free agent to go to Phoenix was who?

And putting aside Lebron, I think it's even more unlikely that his wife Savannah would be happy with the move, which is I think a much, much bigger factor in his decisionmaking than we give it credit for.

------------------------------

I'm relieved specifically by the decisions by Wade and Haslem to opt out. I was worried that things would get a little weird around here had Wade opted in and prevented the team from making necessary improvements, or worse, chasing Lebron away. I think he has again bought himself a lot of goodwill from the fans down here, and thereby shielded himself from much of the criticism that would otherwise have likely attended his declining skills.

And, as for Haslem, I think people outside this city might find it surprising or even ridiculous, but he's going to have his jersey retired when his career is finished. He is a Miami native, and there is no Miami athlete who has shown more loyalty or who has sacrificed more for any of the sports teams here. Period. I don't think it's even close.

Well, Sir Charles, for one.

[Mabdul Doobakus]

Well, Sir Charles, for one.

Barkley was traded to Phoenix, though...I'm not sure how much say he had in that. I think Steve Nash back in 2004 is probably the best answer, but he's Canadian and so that doesn't count.

[Billy Dat]

I know he became the punchline after this last Spurs series, but it's easy to forget that Chalmers outplayed Tony Parker in games 6 & 7 last year. His 20 points in Game 6 helped keep that series alive (+/- is flawed, but he was +22 in those games, better than anyone else). 2013-14 was his 2nd best statistical season (he averaged double figures in 2009, on a pre-Lebron/Bosh Miami team). He also was the primary defender on Russell Westbrook in the 2012 Finals.

Of course, he didn't play well vs San Antonio this time around, so I doubt he comes back. But he'll land somewhere. He likely won't approach what he accomplished in Miami, but that sorta depends on where he ends up. I could see him becoming a poor poor poor poor man's Robert Horry, his value increases if he's on a good team that needs timely shooting and defense. On the 2015 Pelicans? Doubtful.

Tex, how did you decide how many "poors" to use before Robert Horry? I think once you went beyond two, you may as well be describing Christian Ast (too soon?). I agree that Rio more than had his moments with the Heat, he just chose a bad time to completely fall apart. Now he gets to employ the one of the most annoying and overused cliches in sports, "play with a giant chip on his shoulder".

[Des Esseintes]

Tex, how did you decide how many "poors" to use before Robert Horry? I think once you went beyond two, you may as well be describing Christian Ast (too soon?). I agree that Rio more than had his moments with the Heat, he just chose a bad time to completely fall apart. Now he gets to employ the one of the most annoying and overused cliches in sports, "play with a giant chip on his shoulder".

I'm not sure about Horry. I would say he's closer to a remarkably-similarly-waged man's Derek Fisher.

[Billy Dat]

I'm not sure about Horry. I would say he's closer to a remarkably-similarly-waged man's Derek Fisher.

So are you telling me that I can look forward to rooting for Rio as my pro team's head coach in twelve years? Fisher is a good comp in many ways, and Chalmers would probably sign-up for his career if given the chance, especially the $63MM career earnings.

[Des Esseintes]

So are you telling me that I can look forward to rooting for Rio as my pro team's head coach in twelve years? Fisher is a good comp in many ways, and Chalmers would probably sign-up for his career if given the chance, especially the $63MM career earnings.

Fisher is a pro, but I think it's incontrovertible that if he had not ridden shotgun on all those Lakers titles (and, to be fair, hitting more than his share or ridiculously unlikely/utterly irritating pressure threes) his career would have ended years ago. Brooks put him on the court as some kind of winning talisman more than anything else. Championship aura goes a long way, and Chalmers's career earnings will be permanently enhanced by his association with the Miami Heat during the right seasons.

[superdave]

I know he became the punchline after this last Spurs series, but it's easy to forget that Chalmers outplayed Tony Parker in games 6 & 7 last year. His 20 points in Game 6 helped keep that series alive (+/- is flawed, but he was +22 in those games, better than anyone else). 2013-14 was his 2nd best statistical season (he averaged double figures in 2009, on a pre-Lebron/Bosh Miami team). He also was the primary defender on Russell Westbrook in the 2012 Finals.

Of course, he didn't play well vs San Antonio this time around, so I doubt he comes back. But he'll land somewhere. He likely won't approach what he accomplished in Miami, but that sorta depends on where he ends up. I could see him becoming a poor poor poor poor man's Robert Horry, his value increases if he's on a good team that needs timely shooting and defense. On the 2015 Pelicans? Doubtful.

What you just described is the career arc for BJ Armstrong.

[greybeard]

Fisher was president of the PA through some pretty tough times. Seemed to comport himself very well, and not just with the media, but with the media is important too. Jackson knows the extent of Fisher's leadership qualities, his character, and his ability to comprehend the game and communicate about it. Fisher seems to grasp essence, and Jackson knows that he is getting someone whom he can communicate with and trust to handle the job.

I don't see Chambers standing in Fisher's shoes on any level.

[Billy Dat]

Kyrie is about to get even richer...the Cavs are apparently flying to NJ with a max offer.

They are used to the flight having attended so many recent lotteries (bazinga!)

[Des Esseintes]

Fisher was president of the PA through some pretty tough times. Seemed to comport himself very well, and not just with the media, but with the media is important too. Jackson knows the extent of Fisher's leadership qualities, his character, and his ability to comprehend the game and communicate about it. Fisher seems to grasp essence, and Jackson knows that he is getting someone whom he can communicate with and trust to handle the job.

I don't see Chambers standing in Fisher's shoes on any level.
Not quite sure I agree with you there. Granted, I am far from an authority on the subject, but a quick search of Christian devotionals written by Oswald Chambers, the famous Scottish Baptist minister (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oswald_Chambers), reveals a number dedicated to "essence (http://utmost.org/?s=essence&submit=Submit+Query)." His wikipedia page certainly suggests he was at least decent as a leader as well.

[greybeard]

Not quite sure I agree with you there. Granted, I am far from an authority on the subject, but a quick search of Christian devotionals written by Oswald Chambers, the famous Scottish Baptist minister (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oswald_Chambers), reveals a number dedicated to "essence (http://utmost.org/?s=essence&submit=Submit+Query)." His wikipedia page certainly suggests he was at least decent as a leader as well.

On reconsideration . . . .

[Henderson]

Kyrie is about to get even richer...the Cavs are apparently flying to NJ with a max offer.

They are used to the flight having attended so many recent lotteries (bazinga!)

If they make a gift to Kyrie of Dion Waiters' jersey with fish wrapped in it, they could seal the deal quickly. You film guys know what I'm talking about.

[kAzE]

Well, it's all but official, Kyrie's gonna be a Cav for the long term: http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/11160663/kyrie-irving-cleveland-cavaliers-accepts-max-contract-extension

I really enjoyed the 2 threads about the Bucks with Jabari and the Jazz with Hood, so perhaps we can discuss the Cavs here. The reported details on the deal are 90 million over 5 years. I'm glad to see him stay in Cleveland, but I'm honestly surprised that he's chosen to pass up the experience of being a free agent. I guess he's staying true to Uncle Drew and keeping it old school. Our boy just got paid big time. Congrats Kyrie!

[pfrduke]

Well, it's all but official, Kyrie's gonna be a Cav for the long term: http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/11160663/kyrie-irving-cleveland-cavaliers-accepts-max-contract-extension

I really enjoyed the 2 threads about the Bucks with Jabari and the Jazz with Hood, so perhaps we can discuss the Cavs here. The reported details on the deal are 90 million over 5 years. I'm glad to see him stay in Cleveland, but I'm honestly surprised that he's chosen to pass up the experience of being a free agent. I guess he's staying true to Uncle Drew and keeping it old school. Our boy just got paid big time. Congrats Kyrie!

I'm not sure what experience you're referring to, but Kyrie got more money than anyone else can give him. I think the only thing surprising was that he signed on for the full 5 (not clear whether there are options as part of the deal), but that may have been Cleveland's condition for giving him max money.

[JasonEvans]

I am quite intrigued at Lebron leaking that he wants a max deal. His off the court earning dwarf everyone else in the NBA, so his basketball salary should be less important to him than, for example, Bosh.

I strongly suspect that he, Wade, and Bosh all figured out how much money they would each get under new deals to both make them happy and keep the team in position to pick up some quality depth. I won't be all that surprised if Bosh and especially Wade end up taking biiiig pay cuts to give the team more room to get some complimentary players. I think there are scenarios where those three (plus Ray Allen and Haslem) could come in with total salaries around $50 mil and still give the Heat room to sign a free agent for the mid-level exemption ($5+ mil a year) and the lower exemption ($2+ mil a year).

Of course, what the Heat really need to do is get lucky and find a Miles Plumlee hidden somewhere. Rim protectors are at a premium!

-Jason "I think Melo's destination is a lot more interesting to talk about than Lebron -- Bronbron is staying in Miami for probably two more years at least" Evans

[Billy Dat]

I am quite intrigued at Lebron leaking that he wants a max deal. His off the court earning dwarf everyone else in the NBA, so his basketball salary should be less important to him than, for example, Bosh.

I strongly suspect that he, Wade, and Bosh all figured out how much money they would each get under new deals to both make them happy and keep the team in position to pick up some quality depth. I won't be all that surprised if Bosh and especially Wade end up taking biiiig pay cuts to give the team more room to get some complimentary players. I think there are scenarios where those three (plus Ray Allen and Haslem) could come in with total salaries around $50 mil and still give the Heat room to sign a free agent for the mid-level exemption ($5+ mil a year) and the lower exemption ($2+ mil a year).

Of course, what the Heat really need to do is get lucky and find a Miles Plumlee hidden somewhere. Rim protectors are at a premium!

-Jason "I think Melo's destination is a lot more interesting to talk about than Lebron -- Bronbron is staying in Miami for probably two more years at least" Evans

Interesting stat that I heard on the latest Bill Simmons/Zach Lowe podcast, Lebron has never been the highest paid (salary) player on his team (I am not counting high school).

[Duvall]

Looks like the Lakers have found their next big man to add to that proud legacy. (http://www.latimes.com/sports/lakers/lakersnow/la-sp-ln-lakers-ryan-kelly-20140629-story.html)


The Lakers have given Ryan Kelly a $1-million qualifying offer, making the former Duke forward a restricted free agent.

Kelly was selected by the Lakers with the 48th pick in the 2013 NBA draft.

After a slow start as he recovered from April 2013 foot surgery, Kelly become a regular contributor this season, averaging 8.9 points, 4.4 rebounds and 1.1 blocks a game after the All-Star break.

[Henderson]

Looks like the Lakers have found their next big man to add to that proud legacy. (http://www.latimes.com/sports/lakers/lakersnow/la-sp-ln-lakers-ryan-kelly-20140629-story.html)

Good for Ryan. In a situation like this, where the current team puts a very low (but qualifying) offer on the table, could we expect other teams to see if they can get him for a bit more? And/or for more years? Kelly's gotta be worth more than a one-year $1M deal now that he's proved his NBA bona fides, doesn't he? Is the LA offer just to get that ball rolling?

[CDu]

Good for Ryan. In a situation like this, where the current team puts a very low (but qualifying) offer on the table, could we expect other teams to see if they can get him for a bit more? And/or for more years? Kelly's gotta be worth more than a one-year $1M deal now that he's proved his NBA bona fides, doesn't he? Is the LA offer just to get that ball rolling?

The qualifying offer is just to get the ball rolling. Kelly is now a restricted free agent, meaning the Lakers can match any offer made by another team.

[superdave]

The qualifying offer is just to get the ball rolling. Kelly is now a restricted free agent, meaning the Lakers can match any offer made by another team.

Lakers will have 7 days to match once someone else has made an offer.

Typically the biggest free agents get all the early attention and help set the market. Then everyone else eats. But Kelly's deal might be small enough, and as a stretch 4, to get him a deal earlier in the free agency season.

[Des Esseintes]

Interesting stat that I heard on the latest Bill Simmons/Zach Lowe podcast, Lebron has never been the highest paid (salary) player on his team (I am not counting high school).

I heard that, too. (I think it was Brian Windhorst who said it on Lowe's podcast, just to give proper credit.) Amazing. People want LeBron to take less "because he doesn't need it," even though he often already has and even though every metric tells us he is waaaay more valuable than the current max salary. Jordan negotiated for $30 million per season back in the mid-90s, and he didn't need it either. Respect is meaningful, and in sports the prime way a team shows respect is with money.

[kAzE]

I'm not sure what experience you're referring to, but Kyrie got more money than anyone else can give him. I think the only thing surprising was that he signed on for the full 5 (not clear whether there are options as part of the deal), but that may have been Cleveland's condition for giving him max money.

I was just referring to the experience of being wooed by other teams. Even though point guard is an extremely deep position in the NBA, I suspect there would have been a HUGE market for Kyrie from contending franchises looking to upgrade next year. Many people i think would enjoy the process of visiting these NBA cities and listening to what each team has to offer. (Basically what Carmelo is doing right now)

Kyrie's contract is going to be possibly the best 5 years of his playing career in terms of production, leading right up to his prime, and he was smart to demand the max. This is huge win for the Cavs, locking up Kyrie a year before hitting free agency. They now have way more to bait in front of free agents next summer. If David Blatt shows that he's a capable coach in this league (I believe he will be), there's a nice spot on this roster for a star next summer to come play with Kyrie and Andrew Wiggins. I also think Anthony Bennett will have a MUCH improved year coming up. Despite their managements best efforts to sabotage their own team for the past 3 years, the Cavs' arrow is trending solidly up. Imagine if we had Andre Drummond instead of Dion Waiters . . . . sigh.

[superdave]

Here is a link to the Cavs salary cap projections (http://www.basketball-reference.com/contracts/CLE.html)for the next few years. The 2014-2015 cap is $63.2 million so

Cleveland is more than $16 million under for the next season (not including Wiggins deal). They could offer Luol Deng $12 million or Spencer Hawes $5-$6 million to bring back their two free agents. But it is unlikely they could bring back both.

Here is their depth chart in order of minutes played last season:

Backcourt - Irving, Jack, Waiters, Delladova, Gee, Wiggins

Frontcourt - Thompson, Varajao, Deng, Zeller, Hawes, Bennett

If they can use Varajao's expiring as trade bait and package Waiters (personality dump) and Jack (salary dump), they could free themselves up to do something interesting. But without a move, or without bring back Deng, these Cavs will be in the 25-35 win range again. Otherwise they may have to wait for Wiggins and Irving to mature as players and hope to land a big man to replace Varajao's production.

[Henderson]

I was just referring to the experience of being wooed by other teams. Even though point guard is an extremely deep position in the NBA, I suspect there would have been a HUGE market for Kyrie from contending franchises looking to upgrade next year. Many people i think would enjoy the process of visiting these NBA cities and listening to what each team has to offer. (Basically what Carmelo is doing right now)

That would have been a very expensive road trip, not to mention risky. Carmelo's already made his NBA fortune and is late enough in his career that it's now or never if he's going to win a championship. Kyrie is 22.


Kyrie's contract is going to be possibly the best 5 years of his playing career in terms of production, leading right up to his prime, and he was smart to demand the max. This is huge win for the Cavs, locking up Kyrie a year before hitting free agency. They now have way more to bait in front of free agents next summer. If David Blatt shows that he's a capable coach in this league (I believe he will be), there's a nice spot on this roster for a star next summer to come play with Kyrie and Andrew Wiggins. I also think Anthony Bennett will have a MUCH improved year coming up. Despite their managements best efforts to sabotage their own team for the past 3 years, the Cavs' arrow is trending solidly up. Imagine if we had Andre Drummond instead of Dion Waiters . . . . sigh.

I agree that the Cavs are going to be interesting this next couple years. I also agree that it would be a mistake to underestimate Bennett. Word around the campfire is that Anthony Bennett has been working out hard and has lost a lot of weight. A local writer in Las Vegas saw him without a shirt and opined that he thinks Bennett is going to be a good NBA player, last season notwithstanding. His weight and conditioning may have been a part of his problem last year. But he had his tonsils out to help with a sleep apnea problem too. A Cavs fan apparently put up a post on social media quipping that when the doctors took out his tonsils, they found a meatloaf attached to one of them.

[Duvall]

A Cavs fan apparently put up a post on social media quipping that when the doctors took out his tonsils, they found a meatloaf attached to one of them.

Those Cavs fans sure are something.

[JasonEvans]

His weight and conditioning may have been a part of his problem last year. But he had his tonsils out to help with a sleep apnea problem too. A Cavs fan apparently put up a post on social media quipping that when the doctors took out his tonsils, they found a meatloaf attached to one of them.

I could see how one of these could get stuck in your throat...
http://img2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20110425015856/uncyclopedia/images/thumb/c/c4/Meatloaf.jpg/300px-Meatloaf.jpg

-Jason "...but I won't do that!" Evans

[kAzE]

That would have been a very expensive road trip, not to mention risky. Carmelo's already made his NBA fortune and is late enough in his career that it's now or never if he's going to win a championship. Kyrie is 22.



I agree that the Cavs are going to be interesting this next couple years. I also agree that it would be a mistake to underestimate Bennett. Word around the campfire is that Anthony Bennett has been working out hard and has lost a lot of weight. A local writer in Las Vegas saw him without a shirt and opined that he thinks Bennett is going to be a good NBA player, last season notwithstanding. His weight and conditioning may have been a part of his problem last year. But he had his tonsils out to help with a sleep apnea problem too. A Cavs fan apparently put up a post on social media quipping that when the doctors took out his tonsils, they found a meatloaf attached to one of them.

I heard from somewhere that his issues with sleep apnea were so bad last year that at times, he couldn't even breathe through his mouth . . . I can't imagine playing basketball while only nose breathing . . . that wouldn't be fun at all.

[Matches]

. . . I can't imagine playing basketball while only nose breathing . . . that wouldn't be fun at all.

Little known fact: this manuever is sometimes known as "The Reverse Hansbrough", and should never be attempted after completion of the third grade.

[Henderson]

I could see how one of these could get stuck in your throat...



I think if the meatloaf had been stuck on Bennett's tonsil, it would be a bit more angry and covered with mucous.

4192

[kAzE]

Here is a link to the Cavs salary cap projections (http://www.basketball-reference.com/contracts/CLE.html)for the next few years. The 2014-2015 cap is $63.2 million so

Cleveland is more than $16 million under for the next season (not including Wiggins deal). They could offer Luol Deng $12 million or Spencer Hawes $5-$6 million to bring back their two free agents. But it is unlikely they could bring back both.

Here is their depth chart in order of minutes played last season:

Backcourt - Irving, Jack, Waiters, Delladova, Gee, Wiggins

Frontcourt - Thompson, Varajao, Deng, Zeller, Hawes, Bennett

If they can use Varajao's expiring as trade bait and package Waiters (personality dump) and Jack (salary dump), they could free themselves up to do something interesting. But without a move, or without bring back Deng, these Cavs will be in the 25-35 win range again. Otherwise they may have to wait for Wiggins and Irving to mature as players and hope to land a big man to replace Varajao's production.

The Cavs' biggest need right now is a rim-protecting big man. Hawes does not fill that role, although I would not be surprised if they try to re-sign him. He's a productive player, and has some shooting ability to stretch the floor. However, I believe he played way out of his mind during his time with the Sixers last year, and I hope if they do re-sign him, it's a reasonable contract.

The team's second biggest need is at small forward, but I don't think there's any chance Luol Deng stays. I may be wrong, but I don't think the Cavs really want him to stay because of what he's going to cost. Deng is a great player, but if they let him walk now, they won't have to deal with moving him next summer to free up cap space. Depth up front is going to be a bigger concern, so I expect we try to keep Hawes around, and let Deng walk.

Jack has already been discussed as part of a trade with the Knicks that didn't pan out, so the Cavs are actively shopping him to get rid of that horrendous contract. Waiters is almost certainly not going to be with the team after his rookie deal expires. If the Cavs can somehow deal him and get something, that would be wonderful. Still, Waiters is a productive player. He's an ideal combo guard off the bench who brings scoring punch and toughness. Secretly, I'm hoping that the coaching change, an additional year to mature as a person, as well as a move to a 6th man role next year will allow Waiters to buy in to what the team is trying to accomplish. I don't think it'll happen, and he's going to want to get paid, so a trade is probably the next-best case scenario.

It'll be interesting to see if the Canadian dynamic develops into anything. With Wiggins, Thompson, and Bennett all a big part of the rotation, it'll be the most Canadian team in the league. Should be fun.

Here's what I project our rotation will look like next year:

C: Spencer Hawes
PF: Tristan Thompson
SF: Alonzo Gee
SG: Andrew Wiggins
PG: Kyrie Irving

Bench

6: Dion Waiters
7: Anthony Bennett
8: Jarrett Jack
9: Anderson Varejao
10: Tyler Zeller

I'm optimistically projecting this team to win 41 games . . . It think it can be done. That would make the Cavs a playoff team, likely resulting in a 6, 7, or 8 seed in the playoffs. I'm probably overestimating David Blatt, but his resume speaks for itself, and I think he can get much more out of Kyrie than Mike Brown ever did.

[Des Esseintes]

I was just referring to the experience of being wooed by other teams. Even though point guard is an extremely deep position in the NBA, I suspect there would have been a HUGE market for Kyrie from contending franchises looking to upgrade next year. Many people i think would enjoy the process of visiting these NBA cities and listening to what each team has to offer. (Basically what Carmelo is doing right now)

Kyrie's contract is going to be possibly the best 5 years of his playing career in terms of production, leading right up to his prime, and he was smart to demand the max. This is huge win for the Cavs, locking up Kyrie a year before hitting free agency. They now have way more to bait in front of free agents next summer. If David Blatt shows that he's a capable coach in this league (I believe he will be), there's a nice spot on this roster for a star next summer to come play with Kyrie and Andrew Wiggins. I also think Anthony Bennett will have a MUCH improved year coming up. Despite their managements best efforts to sabotage their own team for the past 3 years, the Cavs' arrow is trending solidly up. Imagine if we had Andre Drummond instead of Dion Waiters . . . . sigh.

I'm unclear what you are suggesting. Irving should have taken a one-year qualifying offer in order to make possible unrestricted free agency the following off-season? Because that would be taking what amounts to an $85 million dollar risk with his body. I don't care how much the city of Cleveland sucks (a lot) or how much the Cleveland franchise deserves to be contracted (give it a thought, Silver), no one is taking that risk. Or are you suggesting that Irving should have taken meetings as a restricted free agent with other teams. Because the Cavs would have matching rights with any contract he signed, meaning he could not leave if they didn't want him to, and in the process they would be locking him in at a lower number. Any offer sheet he signed would be substantially lower than this Cleveland contract, and it would only accomplish easing the Cavs' payroll. It would not get him one inch closer to freedom. Moreover, since this contract is the "designated player" 5-year kind, if Irving makes All-Star next year, his salary is automatically escalated to 30% of the Cleveland salary cap, per the Rose Rule. That means considerably more than $90 million is possible with this contract. All of which is to say, if Kyrie was insane and irresponsible, he might have done something other than what he has done.

[BD80]

... I also think Anthony Bennett will have a MUCH improved year coming up. ...

Difficult to imagine a worse year

[johnb]

This second contract is apparently why players like Kyrie and Jabari go pro after one year. Sure, some people may not want to spend a chunk of the year in Cleveland or Milwaukee, but most people would do so for $90 million. Having now read several recent articles about Mr. Bennett, Cleveland is likely to be very solid next year. I don't know how that would translate in regards to wins, but I wonder if big market teams like the Knicks, Nets, and Lakers might not be willing to trade rosters even up...

[FerryFor50]

Hawks make a weird trade:

http://www.si.com/nba/2014/07/01/ap-bkn-raptors-hawks-trade

Why give up Lou Williams for Salmons? And why add a 7 foot prospect to the deal?

[Henderson]

Difficult to imagine a worse year

Unless you are the Portland Trailblazers or Greg Oden. Imagination is what makes Portland great.

[pfrduke]

Hawks make a weird trade:

http://www.si.com/nba/2014/07/01/ap-bkn-raptors-hawks-trade

Why give up Lou Williams for Salmons? And why add a 7 foot prospect to the deal?

This is a pure cap move. Saves them ~$4-5 million. My guess is this will be followed by a waiver of Salmons (which can be accomplished for the tidy sum of $1 million*)

*Would that I were in a career where someone would pay me $1 million to go away

[Henderson]

The qualifying offer is just to get the ball rolling. Kelly is now a restricted free agent, meaning the Lakers can match any offer made by another team.

And others surely would in this case, right? They surely aren't going to let the Lakers grab Kelly for $1M, right?

Me, on the other hand, I'm available for $1M per year. And I'm pretty handy with a mop, Windex, Pledge, whatever the Lakers need.

[BD80]

...the Cavs are apparently flying to NJ with a max offer.

They are used to the flight having attended so many recent lotteries (bazinga!)

The Lottery was to be renamed the Cavaliers' annual pre-draft invitational party, then they hired an actual coach ...

[JasonEvans]

This is a pure cap move. Saves them ~$4-5 million. My guess is this will be followed by a waiver of Salmons (which can be accomplished for the tidy sum of $1 million*)

*Would that I were in a career where someone would pay me $1 million to go away

Bingo -- this move puts the Hawks up to something like $15 mil of cap space. They are supposedly going to go hard after Andre Drummond (Detroit will match just about anything offered) and Luol Deng. A front line of Deng, Millsaps, and Horford would seem to be one of the best in the East, no? I suppose Lebron, Bosh, and... well... just about anything this side of a rotting corpse would be better, but not much else.

Deng will probably sign for something in the $10-12 mil/year range, which would allow the Hawks to have money left over to get one more free agent if they sign him. I am bummed that they had to let the rights to Brazilian big man Nogiuera go in the deal, but they had to give up something to get the cap space that waiving Salmons gives them. I just hope that Nogiuera doesn't turn into a functioning NBA center or this deal could look lousy in retrospect.

I still lament the Hawks foolishly taking Adrienne Payne in the draft. I have no idea why they got another stretch 4 when they already had Mike Scott on the roster. Imagine what a good backup wing would do for this team... its not like Hood, Kyle Anderson, and James Young weren't all just sitting there waiting to be drafted. Wait, yes they were. Grrrrrr!

-Jason "if the German Tony Parker (Dennis Schroder) can become a decent player, the Hawks might actually be more than first round playoff fodder for once!" Evans

[JasonEvans]

Difficult to imagine a worse year

He produced -0.4 win shares. Meaning the Cavs would have been better off calling up some dude from the D-League and just cutting Bennett. That's pretty bad.

-Jason "one would think that if he struggles again, they will simply trade him to someone who thinks he can do better with a change of scenery" Evans

[kAzE]

I'm unclear what you are suggesting. Irving should have taken a one-year qualifying offer in order to make possible unrestricted free agency the following off-season? Because that would be taking what amounts to an $85 million dollar risk with his body. I don't care how much the city of Cleveland sucks (a lot) or how much the Cleveland franchise deserves to be contracted (give it a thought, Silver), no one is taking that risk. Or are you suggesting that Irving should have taken meetings as a restricted free agent with other teams. Because the Cavs would have matching rights with any contract he signed, meaning he could not leave if they didn't want him to, and in the process they would be locking him in at a lower number. Any offer sheet he signed would be substantially lower than this Cleveland contract, and it would only accomplish easing the Cavs' payroll. It would not get him one inch closer to freedom. Moreover, since this contract is the "designated player" 5-year kind, if Irving makes All-Star next year, his salary is automatically escalated to 30% of the Cleveland salary cap, per the Rose Rule. That means considerably more than $90 million is possible with this contract. All of which is to say, if Kyrie was insane and irresponsible, he might have done something other than what he has done.

That's a really good point, I hadn't considered that. Yes, I had originally imagined Kyrie playing out his rookie contract and testing free agency next summer. He hadn't really shown much interest in staying in Cleveland until after the Cavs won the draft lottery. But you are totally right, why gamble on that contract year when he can get a max deal right now? Plus, it's now a much better situation with the new management and Andrew Wiggins. The more I think about it now, the more this deal seems like a no-brainer. I'm just glad my favorite player is still staying with my team :)

[weezie]

So might this mean that the cavs are not interested in wooing LBJ back?

There's no salary room now, am I right?

[kAzE]

So might this mean that the cavs are not interested in wooing LBJ back?

There's no salary room now, am I right?

No, they are currently still pretty far under the cap. Hawes and Deng are off the books, and Kyrie got a 10 million dollar raise, so their current salary is about 42 mil, with the cap expected to grow to $66.5 million in 2015-16. They could easily fit another star free agent in there next summer, even if they re-sign Hawes. They actually only have 16 million guaranteed salary for next summer at the moment:

http://hoopshype.com/salaries/cleveland.htm

That site is accurate except for Kyrie's new contract.

[kAzE]

That said, I think LeBron is probably signing a big, long term deal with the Heat, and lock himself there for at least 3 years. The Cavs would have other unrestricted free agent options next summer though, such as Kevin Love, Paul Millsap, Brook Lopez, DeAndre Jordan, Marc Gasol, and LaMarcus Aldridge.

[BD80]

Under SVG - the Pistons won't be making any of those ridiculous free agent signings any more ...

http://www.cbssports.com/nba/eye-on-basketball/24602895/report-pistons-jodie-meeks-agree-to-three-year-19m-contract

Wait - $19.5 million for 3 years for who? Jodie Meeks????

The article starts with: "Just about every year, some Los Angeles Lakers' free agent gets a bigger contract than expected on the open market. This year, Jodie Meeks is apparently that player. New Detroit Pistons' president and coach Stan Van Gundy is happy to give it to him too."

Great. The Pistons haven't yet traded away their 2015 lottery pick have they?

Anyone got a handful of magic beans?

[Mabdul Doobakus]

I am quite intrigued at Lebron leaking that he wants a max deal. His off the court earning dwarf everyone else in the NBA, so his basketball salary should be less important to him than, for example, Bosh.

I strongly suspect that he, Wade, and Bosh all figured out how much money they would each get under new deals to both make them happy and keep the team in position to pick up some quality depth. I won't be all that surprised if Bosh and especially Wade end up taking biiiig pay cuts to give the team more room to get some complimentary players. I think there are scenarios where those three (plus Ray Allen and Haslem) could come in with total salaries around $50 mil and still give the Heat room to sign a free agent for the mid-level exemption ($5+ mil a year) and the lower exemption ($2+ mil a year).

Of course, what the Heat really need to do is get lucky and find a Miles Plumlee hidden somewhere. Rim protectors are at a premium!

-Jason "I think Melo's destination is a lot more interesting to talk about than Lebron -- Bronbron is staying in Miami for probably two more years at least" Evans

Yeah, I find the way this is shaking out a little surprising. Lebron has the most at stake and is least in need of the money, so I thought he would be the most willing to take a pay cut, or perhaps second to Bosh...but willing, nonetheless. It surprises me he's asking for max money, but let's face it...he deserves it. As CDu mentioned, he'd still be underpaid. If the rumors are to be believed, the Big Three seem to becoming to the most equitable solution, which demonstrates an impressive suppression of egos by the Lesser Two, who have much less on the line in terms of their place in history, and meanwhile probably also have significantly less future earnings potential, especially Wade. If this is all comes to be, my hat is off to all these guys.

[CDu]

Yeah, I find the way this is shaking out a little surprising. Lebron has the most at stake and is least in need of the money, so I thought he would be the most willing to take a pay cut, or perhaps second to Bosh...but willing, nonetheless. It surprises me he's asking for max money, but let's face it...he deserves it. As CDu mentioned, he'd still be underpaid. If the rumors are to be believed, the Big Three seem to becoming to the most equitable solution, which demonstrates an impressive suppression of egos by the Lesser Two, who have much less on the line in terms of their place in history, and meanwhile probably also have significantly less future earnings potential, especially Wade. If this is all comes to be, my hat is off to all these guys.

If this does play out as rumors suggest, I too would be surprised. I figured James would be the one taking the pay cut and Wade being the tough sell. However, I'm not sure I'd say "hats off to these guys for taking less." This could very well be a power play by James. Clearly, he's piggybacked the other two for the last couple of years, and he may very well have said, "Look, you guys have to take less because you aren't contributing enough. I need help, and the only way we can get that help is if you take less. So take less, or I'm outta here." At that point, Wade and Bosh have two choices: take the pay cut or break up the trio. Now, it may be that those two guys just decided altruistically to take pay cuts. But I have a feeling that James may just have forced their hands.

[CDu]

I am quite intrigued at Lebron leaking that he wants a max deal. His off the court earning dwarf everyone else in the NBA, so his basketball salary should be less important to him than, for example, Bosh.

I strongly suspect that he, Wade, and Bosh all figured out how much money they would each get under new deals to both make them happy and keep the team in position to pick up some quality depth. I won't be all that surprised if Bosh and especially Wade end up taking biiiig pay cuts to give the team more room to get some complimentary players. I think there are scenarios where those three (plus Ray Allen and Haslem) could come in with total salaries around $50 mil and still give the Heat room to sign a free agent for the mid-level exemption ($5+ mil a year) and the lower exemption ($2+ mil a year).

Of course, what the Heat really need to do is get lucky and find a Miles Plumlee hidden somewhere. Rim protectors are at a premium!

-Jason "I think Melo's destination is a lot more interesting to talk about than Lebron -- Bronbron is staying in Miami for probably two more years at least" Evans

One minor quibble here with the bolded part. Technically, if the Heat go below the cap to sign free agents, they lose the mid-level exception and lower exception. Those exceptions are only available to teams who are over the cap. In order to get under the cap, they'd need to renounce those exceptions (as those exceptions have cap holds).

Of course, that's a bit of a technical quibble. If they are down to about $50 million in salary for the big three plus Haslem and Allen (and assuming $1 million for Napier), that would still leave about $9 million in cap space (after taking the cap holds for empty player spots into account). So while they wouldn't have the exceptions anymore, they would have essentially that amount of cap space to make free agent signings.

[Mabdul Doobakus]

If this does play out as rumors suggest, I too would be surprised. I figured James would be the one taking the pay cut and Wade being the tough sell. However, I'm not sure I'd say "hats off to these guys for taking less." This could very well be a power play by James. Clearly, he's piggybacked the other two for the last couple of years, and he may very well have said, "Look, you guys have to take less because you aren't contributing enough. I need help, and the only way we can get that help is if you take less. So take less, or I'm outta here." At that point, Wade and Bosh have two choices: take the pay cut or break up the trio. Now, it may be that those two guys just decided altruistically to take pay cuts. But I have a feeling that James may just have forced their hands.

Well, in response to that, I'd say that when they all met up a few days ago, they were reportedly all in good spirits, joking around and such, so--if the numbers being reported are true--then they were either all cool with this plan then, or James switched gears later on...but I highly doubt Lebron just pulled a fast one on them.

And secondly, it is in a sense a power play be Lebron and he may very well have said something similar to what you wrote, but Wade and Bosh could have easily just opted in and taken the big money. I think a lot of guys would have done that. I'm not saying their decisionmaking is 100% altruistic...I don't believe anyone's decisionmaking ever is 100% altruistic. Call me a cynic. But I'm still impressed their egos didn't get in the way.

[CDu]

And secondly, it is in a sense a power play be Lebron and he may very well have said something similar to what you wrote, but Wade and Bosh could have easily just opted in and taken the big money. I think a lot of guys would have done that. I'm not saying their decisionmaking is 100% altruistic...I don't believe anyone's decisionmaking ever is 100% altruistic. Call me a cynic. But I'm still impressed their egos didn't get in the way.

Sure, they could have taken the money... and not won another championship and the adulation that comes with that any time soon. It's sort of choosing one ego-boost or the other. And again, these guys have all made well over $100 million in their careers. So giving up $10-20 million to have a chance at more titles isn't exactly earthshattering to me. Call me a cynic as well, but I can easily see this the other way. Not saying you're wrong - just saying I can see it the other way too.

[FerryFor50]

It could be that Lebron wants a max deal to scare off other teams and would still take below max money in Miami.

[FerryFor50]

Under SVG - the Pistons won't be making any of those ridiculous free agent signings any more ...

http://www.cbssports.com/nba/eye-on-basketball/24602895/report-pistons-jodie-meeks-agree-to-three-year-19m-contract

Wait - $19.5 million for 3 years for who? Jodie Meeks????

The article starts with: "Just about every year, some Los Angeles Lakers' free agent gets a bigger contract than expected on the open market. This year, Jodie Meeks is apparently that player. New Detroit Pistons' president and coach Stan Van Gundy is happy to give it to him too."

Great. The Pistons haven't yet traded away their 2015 lottery pick have they?

Anyone got a handful of magic beans?

The good news is that you pried Cartier Martin away from Atlanta!

[Duvall]

It could be that Lebron wants a max deal to scare off other teams and would still take below max money in Miami.

Why would LeBron need to scare off other teams?

[FerryFor50]

Why would LeBron need to scare off other teams?

Because it's irritating? :)

[wk2109]

This could very well be a power play by James. Clearly, he's piggybacked the other two for the last couple of years, and he may very well have said, "Look, you guys have to take less because you aren't contributing enough. I need help, and the only way we can get that help is if you take less. So take less, or I'm outta here." At that point, Wade and Bosh have two choices: take the pay cut or break up the trio. Now, it may be that those two guys just decided altruistically to take pay cuts. But I have a feeling that James may just have forced their hands.

I very strongly agree with this. I think LeBron sees that it's in his best interest to try to do away with the whole concept of the "Big Three" for several reasons. First, because it's not reality since there is no Big Three -- it's a Big One with a few former all-stars. Second, if he establishes himself even more clearly as the alpha dog (even though it's pretty clear already that he is), any future titles he wins won't have the "well he had to team up with other superstars to win it" asterisk attached. Third, it's the best way for him to make the max, which he deserves, while ensuring that the Heat can afford more depth.

Wade and Bosh are superstars in name and history only -- they haven't lived up to that billing in recent years and I'm sure LeBron realizes that. Any reputation of greatness Wade and Bosh have now is because of their association with LeBron. It's kind of like how the prestige of lower-level Ivy League schools is largely based on their connection with the Ivy League, but Harvard can stand alone and say, "We're great because we're Harvard, not because we're in the Ivy League."

[greybeard]

If Lebron leaves, the stands are empty, and Wade and Bosh look ridiculous. And I do mean ridiculous--a laughing stock, being paid obscene amounts to lose like the worst of them. How much do they want to avoid that? We'll see. Leverage ain't what it used to be, and rich ain't either.

[superdave]

http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/11168158/cleveland-cavaliers-prepare-maximum-offer-sheet-gordon-hayward-utah-jazz

I like Gordon at $8 million a year. His 16, 5 and 5 on a lottery team is good, but it's a lottery team. I really dont like Gordon at $15 million per. Perhaps Utah is willing to let him walk with Exum and Hood in the fold.

Would this plus Kyrie's max deal prevent them from offering another max deal to Wiggins in a few years? Do rules limit you to two max deals? Or am I mis-remembering.

[FerryFor50]

http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/11168158/cleveland-cavaliers-prepare-maximum-offer-sheet-gordon-hayward-utah-jazz

I like Gordon at $8 million a year. His 16, 5 and 5 on a lottery team is good, but it's a lottery team. I really dont like Gordon at $15 million per. Perhaps Utah is willing to let him walk with Exum and Hood in the fold.

Would this plus Kyrie's max deal prevent them from offering another max deal to Wiggins in a few years? Do rules limit you to two max deals? Or am I mis-remembering.

Yea, not sure why you give Hayward a max deal. He really hasn't proven he's worth it. I guess the Cavs can't help but making bad contract offers every year.

[Duvall]

I am trying to understand a world in which Gordon Hayward could be making more money than Russell Westbrook, and failing. Oh, Cavs.

[superdave]

Yea, not sure why you give Hayward a max deal. He really hasn't proven he's worth it. I guess the Cavs can't help but making bad contract offers every year.

I would overpay Deng before Hayward. I would also pursue Lance Stephenson or go cheaper with a guy like Ramon Session.

Perhaps Cleveland understands there is a premium they have to pay to get anyone to come there willingly....

[FerryFor50]

I would overpay Deng before Hayward. I would also pursue Lance Stephenson or go cheaper with a guy like Ramon Session.

Perhaps Cleveland understands there is a premium they have to pay to get anyone to come there willingly....

I'd overpay Deng because of what he brings to the table on both ends. However, he's been a little injury prone, so I definitely wouldn't lock myself in for more than 3 years.

As for Stephenson, no WAY you give him max money unless you have it laden with incentive clauses to keep the carrot in front of him. I feel like he's the type of player who could go sour if he no longer has contract motivation.

And I would never sign Sessions unless it was at the veterans minimum.

[Kedsy]

It could be that Lebron wants a max deal to scare off other teams and would still take below max money in Miami.


Why would LeBron need to scare off other teams?

My question is why would anyone think the "threat" of a max deal for LeBron would scare off anybody? There isn't a team in the league that wouldn't gladly commit to a max deal if LeBron would come play for them.

Put another way, it's possible LeBron is saying he wants a max deal for some strategic purpose, but that purpose sure isn't to scare anybody off.

[FerryFor50]

My question is why would anyone think the "threat" of a max deal for LeBron would scare off anybody? There isn't a team in the league that wouldn't gladly commit to a max deal if LeBron would come play for them.

Put another way, it's possible LeBron is saying he wants a max deal for some strategic purpose, but that purpose sure isn't to scare anybody off.

Maybe "scare off" was the wrong way of putting it. Perhaps "think twice?"

I think he's only willing to leave Miami for max money but won't necessarily take max money in Miami, which was my overall point.

[CDu]

My question is why would anyone think the "threat" of a max deal for LeBron would scare off anybody? There isn't a team in the league that wouldn't gladly commit to a max deal if LeBron would come play for them.

Put another way, it's possible LeBron is saying he wants a max deal for some strategic purpose, but that purpose sure isn't to scare anybody off.

Agreed. It's in no way necessary for James to "scare off" other teams by requesting the max, nor would requesting the max scare off anyone. If he's requesting the max (and that's no guarantee), he's almost certainly requesting it from the Heat too.

[Dev11]

The NBA CBA must an insanely silly thing since the best player in the world has to contemplate not taking a contract as big as Joe Johnson's.

[CDu]

The NBA CBA must an insanely silly thing since the best player in the world has to contemplate not taking a contract as big as Joe Johnson's.

Yeah, there has been a lot of discussion about how the players' union can't be thrilled with what James/Wade/Bosh are doing. If players are willing to throw money away to play in Miami (and I'm definitely not saying there is anything wrong with doing that), it kind of makes the labor battles over the CBA seem a bit silly.

[kAzE]

Yeah, there has been a lot of discussion about how the players' union can't be thrilled with what James/Wade/Bosh are doing. If players are willing to throw money away to play in Miami (and I'm definitely not saying there is anything wrong with doing that), it kind of makes the labor battles over the CBA seem a bit silly.

I don't really see why the players union would have a problem with it. After all, they were the ones who agreed to this CBA with the owners. With this CBA in today's NBA, there's obviously a compromise that players need to make between money and rings. The Spurs chose rings. Joe Johnson chose money. LeBron could be unique in this situation, where he's in a position to have both, and instead do the easiest thing in the world: spend other people's money. Now it's up to Wade and Bosh to decide whether or not they think it's worth it. In the end, the winners are still the owners. Must be nice to be Micky Arison and have players fighting to give your money back to you.

[kAzE]

What do you guys think of this Cavs offer sheet to Gordon Hayward? 15 mil seems like an awful lot for a middle of the road starting SF. He only shot 41% from the field and 30% from 3 last year as the main offensive threat in Utah last season. He's probably better than that, but wouldn't you rather have a better defensive player who is more accurate from deep for this team? There's already plenty of scoring on the Cavs roster, they need more shooters to space the floor, and big, athletic defensive players. I don't see this as a good move, and I hope the Jazz match this offer sheet. I'd much prefer a guy like Gerald Green, who is unrestricted next year, for like 4-7 mil than Hayward at 15.

[CDu]

What do you guys think of this Cavs offer sheet to Gordon Hayward? 15 mil seems like an awful lot for a middle of the road starting SF. He only shot 41% from the field and 30% from 3 last year as the main offensive threat in Utah last season. He's probably better than that, but wouldn't you rather have a better defensive player who is more accurate from deep for this team? There's already plenty of scoring on the Cavs roster, they need more shooters to space the floor, and big, athletic defensive players. I don't see this as a good move, and I hope the Jazz match this offer sheet. I'd much prefer a guy like Gerald Green, who is unrestricted next year, for like 4-7 mil than Hayward at 15.

Oh, it's definitely an overpay by the Cavs. And if I were the Jazz, I would not match that offer. The problem the Cavs have is that they HAVE to overpay to get guys to come there. Nobody is choosing to go to Cleveland at market value. So all of their free agent agreements are going to be overpays.

[kAzE]

Oh, it's definitely an overpay by the Cavs. And if I were the Jazz, I would not match that offer. The problem the Cavs have is that they HAVE to overpay to get guys to come there. Nobody is choosing to go to Cleveland at market value. So all of their free agent agreements are going to be overpays.

Well, I just think they are overpaying the wrong guy. Cleveland's not a destination city like LA or Miami, but if Wiggins lives up to the hype, the Cavs have 2 all stars and a ton of cap space. Maybe some free agent will look at that roster as a great fit, and a good spot to contend for titles. I think it's way too aggressive to use all of that cap space on Hayward, who isn't a great fit. I would have preferred that they held out until next summer and at least tried to make a run at an All-Star. If they get Hayward now, they lose a ton of their flexibility next year. I hate Dan Gilbert, he's probably got a gun trained on David Griffin's temple, screaming "WIN NOW!" even though the best they can do even with Hayward is a first round playoff exit.

[CDu]

Well, I just think they are overpaying the wrong guy. Cleveland's not a destination city like LA or Miami, but if Wiggins lives up to the hype, the Cavs have 2 all stars and a ton of cap space. Maybe some free agent will look at that roster as a great fit, and a good spot to contend for titles. I think it's way too aggressive to use all of that cap space on Hayward, who isn't a great fit. I would have preferred that they held out until next summer and at least tried to make a run at an All-Star. If they get Hayward now, they lose a ton of their flexibility next year. I hate Dan Gilbert, he's probably got a gun trained on David Griffin's temple, screaming "WIN NOW!" even though the best they can do even with Hayward is a first round playoff exit.

I agree. I was just saying that, no matter what guy they target, they are going to have to pay a premium. No disagreement with the fact that this guy is the wrong target.

[Dev11]

Yeah, there has been a lot of discussion about how the players' union can't be thrilled with what James/Wade/Bosh are doing.

Well, the Spurs have been paying their stars below market value for years to keep that core together. You just don't hear about it because they're all perfectly content in their situation and Duncan and Parker aren't quite the personalities that the Miami guys are.

The union recognizes that the league is built on star power. They're not going to prevent the stars from doing their thing. If anything, it distributes more money to more of their constituents.

[Billy Dat]

A little applause for former almost Dukie Shaun Livingston.

He gets to go to Golden State for 3 years, 18 million. Who would have guessed that this guy, 10 years after a potentially career ending knee injury and many false starts and stops, would sign a contract that nearly doubled his career earnings (he's made $24MM to date). I salute his persistence and perseverance.

[Des Esseintes]

Yeah, there has been a lot of discussion about how the players' union can't be thrilled with what James/Wade/Bosh are doing. If players are willing to throw money away to play in Miami (and I'm definitely not saying there is anything wrong with doing that), it kind of makes the labor battles over the CBA seem a bit silly.

I think that's an unnecessary trivialization of how important the lockout was. Another way of looking at this situation is that, because the CBA has artificially depressed what the best players can earn--and taken a fire ax to what all players can earn generally--those elite players are naturally going to prioritize other things when it comes to their contract situations. James reportedly (my source here is Brian Windhorst from the Zach Lowe podcast mentioned elsewhere) feels the max player salary ceiling is an absolute joke--as well he should, since he is worth far above it. He prizes flexibility and the chance to win, mainly because he's not going to get anything within screaming distance of fair market value. If someone could offer LeBron $35 million, we wouldn't be having this discussion. But nobody is offering James $35 mil, because the owners instituted a revolting lockout to force a deal even more advantageous to themselves than the advantageous deal they'd instituted before. I don't think that makes the CBA labor battles "silly."

[arnie]

I think that's an unnecessary trivialization of how important the lockout was. Another way of looking at this situation is that, because the CBA has artificially depressed what the best players can earn--and taken a fire ax to what all players can earn generally--those elite players are naturally going to prioritize other things when it comes to their contract situations. James reportedly (my source here is Brian Windhorst from the Zach Lowe podcast mentioned elsewhere) feels the max player salary ceiling is an absolute joke--as well he should, since he is worth far above it. He prizes flexibility and the chance to win, mainly because he's not going to get anything within screaming distance of fair market value. If someone could offer LeBron $35 million, we wouldn't be having this discussion. But nobody is offering James $35 mil, because the owners instituted a revolting lockout to force a deal even more advantageous to themselves than the advantageous deal they'd instituted before. I don't think that makes the CBA labor battles "silly."

So Lebron should lead a labor strike and force a cancellation of the 2014-15 season. Most of America wouldn't notice.

[Newton_14]

Agreed. It's in no way necessary for James to "scare off" other teams by requesting the max, nor would requesting the max scare off anyone. If he's requesting the max (and that's no guarantee), he's almost certainly requesting it from the Heat too.
He is already requesting the max from the Heat. That has already been confirmed. He wants the money that he deserves, and while I have always been of the mindset that if I were a great player and already rich, I would rather take less to have a great team around me than take the max with no chance of winning championships, I believe Lebron is right in demanding the max. He has already met with Wade and Bosh on this. Supposedly, even if Lebron makes the max, if Wade and Bosh take pay cuts, there is still enough cap space to allow the Heat to add free agents good enough to be impact players and help the Heat be at a level where they can win the title again.

Wade and Bosh need to cooperate with that strategy. Both are filthy rich if they never make another dime, and both have seen their skills and contributions decline to the point where Lebron is killing himself carrying the team. With the current contributions of Wade/Bosh, the Heat need more help in the supporting cast to realistically win titles again. Haslem can no longer get it done which was sad to watch, Chalmers play has gone to hell in a handbasket, Rashard Lewis is old, Shane is retiring. Ray Allen was suprisingly good in the playoffs and somehow raised his game to a level I did not think he had in him anymore, but how much longer can that last? 1 year? 2 max.

They need another center to help Birdman who is still very effective. They seem to believe they can get Michael Beasley back to an effective player which is possible given his skill set.

Bottom line though, they have to get better at several positions with both the starting line up and the back up players in the main playing rotation. It can be done, it is just going to be more difficult with Lebron taking the max. I don't think there was some grand conspiracy going on here as suggested upstream. Lebron just wants the money he rightfully deserves and has earned the right to make, he wants to stay in Miami, and he believes they can make the money work to get enough supporting cast members required to win titles again.

One things for sure, it is going to be interesting watching this one play out.

[ice-9]

Word is that the Cavs are offering Gordon Hayward a max contract at $15 million per season.

I don't know if this is a good move.

[Henderson]

Word is that the Cavs are offering Gordon Hayward a max contract at $15 million per season.

I don't know if this is a good move.

I think I like it, even if expensive.

The Cavs are pretty well stocked at the 2 (Wiggins, Harris, Waiters), so I assume Hayward would play mostly at the 3, which is a need for the Cavs with Deng in free agency. If Anthony Bennett comes back as a solid contributor this year (to be seen, but signs are hopeful), that could give the Cavs a starting line up of Kyrie, Wiggins, Hayward, Bennett, and a committee of serviceable centers. Dion Waiters becomes expendable (gee, what a shame). That's a young team with a ton of upside potential and contracts that would allow Blatt to develop the team over a few years. Hayward has a pretty good trajectory if you look at his stats over the course of his 4 years. His 3 pt. shooting dropped off last year, but he's really developed and had a 16+ PER last season. Started 77 games for the Jazz.

I don't know about all that money, but Hayward has a lot of potential. I can see what the Cavs are up to, and it's not bad.

[Duvall]

Lakers looking to create new Big Three of Kobe Bryant, Carmelo Anthony and Ryan Kelly. (http://www.sbnation.com/nba/2014/7/3/5869745/lakers-carmelo-anthony-max-contract-nba-free-agency)


The Los Angeles Lakers will offer Carmelo Anthony a max-level contract worth $97 million over four years, reports Ramona Shelburne of ESPN Los Angeles. That's the most money any team other than the New York Knicks can guarantee Anthony as a free agent this summer.

On Thursday, Anthony met with Lakers officials in Los Angeles to discuss the possibility of teaming with Kobe Bryant over the next few years. Earlier this week, the high-scoring forward already visited the Chicago Bulls, Houston Rockets and Dallas Mavericks, while the Knicks stand to make their best pitch to 'Melo sometime soon.

[BD80]

Lakers looking to create new Big Three of Kobe Bryant, Carmelo Anthony and Ryan Kelly. (http://www.sbnation.com/nba/2014/7/3/5869745/lakers-carmelo-anthony-max-contract-nba-free-agency)

Well, Ryan's communication skills would to some extent be wasted, he'd only need to communicate with the other three Lakers players playing defense

I understand that if Melo signs on, Dantoni is going to convert the "triangle" offense into the "two-ball" offense.

[tommy]

Sefalosha leaving the Thunder for 3 yrs, $12M with the Hawks. Whaddaya think, Jason??

[BigZ]

Multiple reports that the Lakers are going to Cleveland to meet with Lebron's agent tomorrow. I know it is highly unlikely that Lebron teams up with Melo and Kobe in LA but if for whatever reason it did what are the odds Coach K takes the job there? He has a great relationship with all three of them and almost took the Lakers job before.

[greybeard]

I think that's an unnecessary trivialization of how important the lockout was. Another way of looking at this situation is that, because the CBA has artificially depressed what the best players can earn--and taken a fire ax to what all players can earn generally--those elite players are naturally going to prioritize other things when it comes to their contract situations. James reportedly (my source here is Brian Windhorst from the Zach Lowe podcast mentioned elsewhere) feels the max player salary ceiling is an absolute joke--as well he should, since he is worth far above it. He prizes flexibility and the chance to win, mainly because he's not going to get anything within screaming distance of fair market value. If someone could offer LeBron $35 million, we wouldn't be having this discussion. But nobody is offering James $35 mil, because the owners instituted a revolting lockout to force a deal even more advantageous to themselves than the advantageous deal they'd instituted before. I don't think that makes the CBA labor battles "silly."

Excellent. Thanks.

[FerryFor50]

I understand that if Melo signs on, Dantoni is going to convert the "triangle" offense into the "two-ball" offense.

Doubt it. D'Antoni no longer coaches the Lakers...

[JasonEvans]

Sefalosha leaving the Thunder for 3 yrs, $12M with the Hawks. Whaddaya think, Jason??

What is not to love? A 3 year commitment to a 30 year old SG who played exactly 0 minutes in 3 of his teams final 4 games in the playoffs. This signing is a dream! Luckily, the Hawks are a team known for their prolific offensive output so the fact that Thabo has never scored even 8 ppg in his career won't be a problem for us.

I think we had about $15 mil of cap space, which would have been more than enough to sign Deng. This takes us down to about $11 mil, which may be not quite enough to sign Deng. Thank goodness, I was so worried we might actually sign a guy who plays big minutes and produces at both ends of the floor. Well, I need not worry about that any more!

Yup, I adore this signing...

-Jason "this is exactly what I would expect from a Hawks GM that drafted a stretch-PF instead of a SG or SF" Evans

[tommy]

What is not to love? A 3 year commitment to a 30 year old SG who played exactly 0 minutes in 3 of his teams final 4 games in the playoffs. This signing is a dream! Luckily, the Hawks are a team known for their prolific offensive output so the fact that Thabo has never scored even 8 ppg in his career won't be a problem for us.

I think we had about $15 mil of cap space, which would have been more than enough to sign Deng. This takes us down to about $11 mil, which may be not quite enough to sign Deng. Thank goodness, I was so worried we might actually sign a guy who plays big minutes and produces at both ends of the floor. Well, I need not worry about that any more!

Yup, I adore this signing...

-Jason "this is exactly what I would expect from a Hawks GM that drafted a stretch-PF instead of a SG or SF" Evans

Be honest, Jason. What do you really think?

[JNort]

Well, it's all but official, Kyrie's gonna be a Cav for the long term: http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/11160663/kyrie-irving-cleveland-cavaliers-accepts-max-contract-extension

I really enjoyed the 2 threads about the Bucks with Jabari and the Jazz with Hood, so perhaps we can discuss the Cavs here. The reported details on the deal are 90 million over 5 years. I'm glad to see him stay in Cleveland, but I'm honestly surprised that he's chosen to pass up the experience of being a free agent. I guess he's staying true to Uncle Drew and keeping it old school. Our boy just got paid big time. Congrats Kyrie!

Could be misremembering but I thought almost all big time players resigned after the rookie contract then dart thinking about leaving when that one ends.

[Kdogg]

What is not to love? A 3 year commitment to a 30 year old SG who played exactly 0 minutes in 3 of his teams final 4 games in the playoffs. This signing is a dream! Luckily, the Hawks are a team known for their prolific offensive output so the fact that Thabo has never scored even 8 ppg in his career won't be a problem for us.

I think we had about $15 mil of cap space, which would have been more than enough to sign Deng. This takes us down to about $11 mil, which may be not quite enough to sign Deng. Thank goodness, I was so worried we might actually sign a guy who plays big minutes and produces at both ends of the floor. Well, I need not worry about that any more!

Yup, I adore this signing...

-Jason "this is exactly what I would expect from a Hawks GM that drafted a stretch-PF instead of a SG or SF" Evans

Looks like the signing was part of Deng's recruitment: http://www.cbssports.com/nba/eye-on-basketball/24607832/report-hawks-pitching-deng-sefolosha-deal-part-of-recruiting-effort

[FerryFor50]

Looks like Bosh might not be long for Miami...

http://www.cbssports.com/nba/writer/ken-berger/24608555/sources-bosh-becomes-key-to-miami-keeping-big-three


A rival team executive told CBSSports.com Friday that the growing belief around the league is that Bosh would prefer a four-year max deal with another team to a discounted, longer-term deal with Miami.

[CDu]

Looks like Bosh might not be long for Miami...

http://www.cbssports.com/nba/writer/ken-berger/24608555/sources-bosh-becomes-key-to-miami-keeping-big-three

I'll believe it when I see it. Not many contenders can offer him the max, and he isn't good enough to turn a non-contender into a contender.

[Henderson]

I'll believe it when I see it. Not many contenders can offer him the max, and he isn't good enough to turn a non-contender into a contender.

June and July are good months to stop believing reports from "NBA sources" regarding possible moves. Execs, players, and agents all feed tidbits of info to reporters for their own reasons. And because it's a dead period for basketball, the reporters hungrily gobble and regurgitate. This story looks like a plant by Bosh's agent.

[FerryFor50]

Pretty good pickup for them.

http://www.cbssports.com/nba/eye-on-basketball/24608084/report-clippers-to-sign-spencer-hawes-to-4-year-23-million-deal

[JasonEvans]

Looks like the signing was part of Deng's recruitment: http://www.cbssports.com/nba/eye-on-basketball/24607832/report-hawks-pitching-deng-sefolosha-deal-part-of-recruiting-effort

Oh man, if this helps them get Deng I am going to feel like a total idiot... but I will be very happy. If the Hawks start Teague, Korver, Deng, Milsaps, and Horford with German Parker, Sefolosha, Mike Scott, and Paine coming off the bench I am going to be one happy camper. All the bad things I said about Ferry will be moot. If Ferry knew he could get Deng, then it makes passing on Hood, Harris, and Young explainable too.

-Jason "god, would I ever love to be wrong!!" Evans

[kAzE]

Pretty good pickup for them.

http://www.cbssports.com/nba/eye-on-basketball/24608084/report-clippers-to-sign-spencer-hawes-to-4-year-23-million-deal

Crap . . now the Cavs have to probably start Varejao at center, and then God knows who once he gets hurt . . . Tyller Zeller? ugh.

[Mabdul Doobakus]

Dan Gilbert, in response to a tweet from a local Cleveland broadcaster:

Dan Gilbert ‏@cavsdan 11m
“. @LullOnSports:Cavs owner Dan Gilbert is currently en route to south Florida.” I am? Sorry folks but enjoying weather in my backyard today


So much bad information circulating. I find the reports on Bosh particularly dubious, unless he's had a complete change of heart compared to earlier comments he's made.

No idea what's going on now in the Heat's house...seems like Riley is trying to find a bargain free agent signing that he can then hope to sell Lebron on and then convince the Other Two to sign for low enough salaries to accommodate this forth player. The biggest names being thrown around right now are Gasol, Deng, and Ariza. Lower tier guys I've seen mentioned include Marvin Williams, Anthony Morrow, and Kris Humphries. The Heat would then probably try to fill their roster out with guys on their last legs. Vince Carter's name was being thrown around a lot earlier in the free agency period. The Heat might have an easier time of this if Lebron was already signed, but Lebron seems to have put the Heat in the position where they need to show him something first. Fair enough, but it's hard to sell a guy like Deng on a discounted salary if he can't be sure Lebron will be there in the end.

[greybeard]

My main man Sekou Smith (long story, I was a regular, "The Flash," on a AJC blog for several years back in the Belkin-Spirit days) sees Sefolosa as a very good edition. Lock-down defender of many positions and knows how to be a value added player. Atlanta has a share-the-ball style, has a very nice team-thing going. Sefolosa promises to be all that he could be in that system. Once Harden left, no one on the Thunder not named Westbrook or Durant (okay, Ibaka) had a chance of being anything.

http://hangtime.blogs.nba.com/tag/thabo-sefolosha/

Several major OKC media experts graded Sepholosa very highly in post season evaluations. I read somewhere that Sepholosa allegedly had too slow a release on his 3-ball and therefore that his man could cheat on Durant or Westbrook and still recover. Recover for what? A shoot off a poorly timed and much more poorly delivered pass. Please. Slow release. Experts. Let's see how he shoots the 3 with a team that shares the ball and is lead by a point guard who not only keeps it moving but also is pass-generous off dribble penetration, is looking for it.
http://newsok.com/oklahoma-city-thunder-roundtable-evaluating-thabo-sefoloshas-season/article/3834692
http://www.welcometoloudcity.com/2009/4/17/842955/end-of-season-evaluation-Thabo


Sepholosa badly sprained his calf in March 2014, was expected to be out 4-6 weeks, and you'd have to expect that it was a real drag on his play through the end of the postseason. When you are expected to be out 4-6 weeks because of a sprained calf-muscle we are talking one damn serious sprain.
http://www.cbssports.com/nba/eye-on-basketball/24464657/thunders-thabo-sefolosha-out-4-6-weeks-with-calf-strain

Experts generally do not account for lasting effects after a guy comes back. Makes them look bad, while calling a player bad for poor performance. From what I've read on line in the last 10-15 minutes, not a sole mentioned that calf injury throughout the playoffs. Four to six weeks from the beginning of March makes the media's silence about the injury during the playoffs mal-practice if they were in any profession worth calling itself that, and no one pretends that being a talking head or its on-line equivalent is populated by real news people.

Without hearing about the injury, how is the non OKC fan to have a decent chance to evaluate this guy's playoff performance. How?

I saw in my reading that Sepholosa and Deng played together and get along quite well.

[theAlaskanBear]

Sefolosha. Thabo Patrick Sefolosha. His last name has only been spelled correctly in 1/3 posts in this thread so far. I'm not normally a spelling stickler, but what are we, Inside Carolina?

[FerryFor50]

Sefolosha. Thabo Patrick Sefolosha. His last name has only been spelled correctly in 1/3 posts in this thread so far. I'm not normally a spelling stickler, but what are we, Inside Carolina?

Well, someone's not in the daggum Sefolosha spirit... :)

[Edouble]

Oh man, if this helps them get Deng I am going to feel like a total idiot... but I will be very happy. If the Hawks start Teague, Korver, Deng, Milsaps, and Horford with German Parker, Sefolosha, Mike Scott, and Paine coming off the bench I am going to be one happy camper. All the bad things I said about Ferry will be moot. If Ferry knew he could get Deng, then it makes passing on Hood, Harris, and Young explainable too.

-Jason "god, would I ever love to be wrong!!" Evans

Even if we get Deng, that does not excuse passing on Kyle Anderson or James Young, who will turn out to be better NBA players than Payne.

[superdave]

Even if we get Deng, that does not excuse passing on Kyle Anderson or James Young, who will turn out to be better NBA players than Payne.

You have to understand that 9 out of 10 GMs just follow the lead of the best GMs. If RC Buford can use Matt Bonner and Boris Diaw to spread the floor and guard the 4, then daggummit, they all have to over-value 4's who can shoot!

[theAlaskanBear]

Dan Gilbert, in response to a tweet from a local Cleveland broadcaster:

Dan Gilbert ‏@cavsdan 11m
“. @LullOnSports:Cavs owner Dan Gilbert is currently en route to south Florida.” I am? Sorry folks but enjoying weather in my backyard today


So much bad information circulating. I find the reports on Bosh particularly dubious, unless he's had a complete change of heart compared to earlier comments he's made.

No idea what's going on now in the Heat's house...seems like Riley is trying to find a bargain free agent signing that he can then hope to sell Lebron on and then convince the Other Two to sign for low enough salaries to accommodate this forth player. The biggest names being thrown around right now are Gasol, Deng, and Ariza. Lower tier guys I've seen mentioned include Marvin Williams, Anthony Morrow, and Kris Humphries. The Heat would then probably try to fill their roster out with guys on their last legs. Vince Carter's name was being thrown around a lot earlier in the free agency period. The Heat might have an easier time of this if Lebron was already signed, but Lebron seems to have put the Heat in the position where they need to show him something first. Fair enough, but it's hard to sell a guy like Deng on a discounted salary if he can't be sure Lebron will be there in the end.

The confusion is because Gilbert's private plane flew Zydrunas Ilgauskas to Florida to presumably meet with James and his agent. Big Z is one of James' closest friends, and now works as assistant GM for the Cavs. No one is positive that Gilbert was or was not on the plane, only Big Z was confirmed. That said, Tom Rizzo, the guy who broke the Kyrie extension and the Embiid foot red flags tweeted that Dan and Z would meet LeBron last night. Supposedly Rizzo is close friends with Gilbert and has organizational sources.

Now the reports are that the Cavs are trying to trade Jarrett Jack to clear up some more cap space.

[CDu]

The confusion is because Gilbert's private plane flew Zydrunas Ilgauskas to Florida to presumably meet with James and his agent. Big Z is one of James' closest friends, and now works as assistant GM for the Cavs. No one is positive that Gilbert was or was not on the plane, only Big Z was confirmed. That said, Tom Rizzo, the guy who broke the Kyrie extension and the Embiid foot red flags tweeted that Dan and Z would meet LeBron last night. Supposedly Rizzo is close friends with Gilbert and has organizational sources.

Now the reports are that the Cavs are trying to trade Jarrett Jack to clear up some more cap space.

It would be a hilarious "F-you" to the Heat (mostly to Wade) if James opted out, then got Wade and Bosh to opt out (in Wade's case opting out of money he'll not make up on the open market), and then signed elsewhere. But I just can't see that happening. Especially not back home to Cleveland, whose owner had (until quite recently) a letter lambasting James posted on their team website.

[ice-9]

He is already requesting the max from the Heat. That has already been confirmed. He wants the money that he deserves, and while I have always been of the mindset that if I were a great player and already rich, I would rather take less to have a great team around me than take the max with no chance of winning championships, I believe Lebron is right in demanding the max. He has already met with Wade and Bosh on this. Supposedly, even if Lebron makes the max, if Wade and Bosh take pay cuts, there is still enough cap space to allow the Heat to add free agents good enough to be impact players and help the Heat be at a level where they can win the title again.

Wade and Bosh need to cooperate with that strategy. Both are filthy rich if they never make another dime, and both have seen their skills and contributions decline to the point where Lebron is killing himself carrying the team. With the current contributions of Wade/Bosh, the Heat need more help in the supporting cast to realistically win titles again. Haslem can no longer get it done which was sad to watch, Chalmers play has gone to hell in a handbasket, Rashard Lewis is old, Shane is retiring. Ray Allen was suprisingly good in the playoffs and somehow raised his game to a level I did not think he had in him anymore, but how much longer can that last? 1 year? 2 max.

They need another center to help Birdman who is still very effective. They seem to believe they can get Michael Beasley back to an effective player which is possible given his skill set.

Bottom line though, they have to get better at several positions with both the starting line up and the back up players in the main playing rotation. It can be done, it is just going to be more difficult with Lebron taking the max. I don't think there was some grand conspiracy going on here as suggested upstream. Lebron just wants the money he rightfully deserves and has earned the right to make, he wants to stay in Miami, and he believes they can make the money work to get enough supporting cast members required to win titles again.

One things for sure, it is going to be interesting watching this one play out.

I agree LeBron deserves a max deal. He's worth far more.

But the math simply doesn't work -- the Heat are not going to be able to construct a championship roster unless Wade and Bosh take HUGE pay cuts. Wade reportedly wants at least $14 million while Bosh wants at least $16 million. That's not going to get it done. The harsh reality is that both those players should be getting at most $25 million total, and probably more like $20 million if they really want to recruit good players. Even then, they probably need one or two of their younger guys to be better than expected and for everyone to be healthy.

My prediction is that Wade stays on because he's a Heat lifer; Bosh moves on for max money; and they get two or three good players in place of Bosh.

Although the better move would be to cut Wade and keep Bosh.

[flyingdutchdevil]

I agree LeBron deserves a max deal. He's worth far more.

But the math simply doesn't work -- the Heat are not going to be able to construct a championship roster unless Wade and Bosh take HUGE pay cuts. Wade reportedly wants at least $14 million while Bosh wants at least $16 million. That's not going to get it done. The harsh reality is that both those players should be getting at most $25 million total, and probably more like $20 million if they really want to recruit good players. Even then, they probably need one or two of their younger guys to be better than expected and for everyone to be healthy.

My prediction is that Wade stays on because he's a Heat lifer; Bosh moves on for max money; and they get two or three good players in place of Bosh.

Although the better move would be to cut Wade and keep Bosh.

Hard to disagree with anything said here. Wade is done. His value has been destroyed, and his health doesn't allow him to do what he is normally great at (getting to the rim, attacking the basket, defense). He doesn't have a 3pt shot or a strong mid-range, which really limits his effectiveness if he can't get to the rim.

I like the idea of the Heat retaining Wade because Wade has given everything to that organization. Bosh is another interesting candidate. He is still immensely talented and the least utilized of the Big 3. He could go to the Bulls or Rockets and be the 2nd best offensive player from the get-go. He'd get 2x the number of touches. Wouldn't he want to do that with a more diverse roster?

And if I'm Lebron, and Wade and Bosh get paid slightly under the maximum, why would I want to come back given that the Heat's salary cap is destroyed? You aren't getting a player in their prime, and you have to fill out around 4-6 bench spots with old veterans who may or may not pan out. It's a strategy that worked while the Big 3 were all in their prime, but now that Wade is past it and Bosh not fully comfortable as a stretch, it just doesn't make sense.

[Billy Dat]

Can this whole thing possibly be building to a "Decision II" where Cleveland takes it raw and unfiltered a second time. I mean, is Lebron's team stupid enough to let this happen again? That's what makes me think, more than anything else, that there must be a good chance that he is going back...how else could he possibly let the speculation build as dramatically as it has in the last 24 hours? He's barely over the stink that the first "Decision" put onto him.

It would also shock me to see the Heat crumble this dramatically. How the hell could Wade and Bosh opt-out without a pretty solid assurance that LBJ was coming back? Could Riley have pissed LBJ off this much? This is like WWF stuff.

I think we need a DBR poll...Will the Big 3 be back in Miami or not? This is getting crazy.

[kAzE]

He is already requesting the max from the Heat. That has already been confirmed. He wants the money that he deserves, and while I have always been of the mindset that if I were a great player and already rich, I would rather take less to have a great team around me than take the max with no chance of winning championships, I believe Lebron is right in demanding the max. He has already met with Wade and Bosh on this. Supposedly, even if Lebron makes the max, if Wade and Bosh take pay cuts, there is still enough cap space to allow the Heat to add free agents good enough to be impact players and help the Heat be at a level where they can win the title again.

I don't blame LeBron at all. In fact, I would want the max as well in his position. He's more than capable of getting a max contract on a team that he can win championships with, because he's that good. It's a joke that he's never even been the highest paid guy on his own team. He's absolutely worth the max, hell, he's worth $50 million a year, if that was even possible. LeBron is a smart guy, when he's done playing, he wants what Jordan and Magic have now: an ownership role with an NBA franchise. (Granted, these NBA contracts are really just a fraction of his net worth, but it all adds up) He's done taking less than he's worth, and that's what America's about: Professional mobility.

On a different note, apparently, The Cavs think they can get LeBron to listen: http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/11184766/cleveland-cavaliers-believe-lebron-james-receptive-their-free-agency-pitch-according-sources?ex_cid=espnsoc

SO YOU'RE SAYIN THERE'S A CHANCE??

Somehow, that Brendan Haywood trade got past me. I LOVE that trade, not necessarily because I love Haywood, who is 34, but because he's super cheap this year (2.2 mil, saves us a mil this year, and creating extra cap room), he's big, and we need depth up front, and we can dump him next summer (team option next year for 10.5 mil, he's getting dumped for sure) to chase bigger free agents. Great job, Griffin.

[InSpades]

1st off, the Wade opting out thing to me creates a weird situation. In some ways he had to opt out... he can't make $20M the next 2 years and be on a winning team. Lebron would be stupid to resign w/ the Heat w/ Wade getting $20M of the precious salary cap. Which means Wade had to opt out to give the Heat a shot at Lebron... but Wade still needs to get paid. The Heat can't let him walk after he basically did them a huge favor by opting out. If I had to guess there was a *wink wink* *nudge nudge* involved in that opt out. Some guarantee that Wade would get his money (less per year, more years, or something of that sort).

That being said... Lebron is better off leaving the Heat. He is the Heat. They are good because he's there. Well he will be there wherever he goes so why not go somewhere that has something more to offer? Somewhere that isn't tied up to overpay Wade and has future assets. Maybe that place isn't Cleveland... but what if it is Cleveland? Would you rather team w/ Kyrie or Wade right now? Maybe a year ago the answer is clearly Wade, but going forward it is Kyrie. Throw in Wiggins and possibly Bennett (if he ends up living up to his potential) and a few more 1st round picks in the next couple of years. Maybe it's Houston instead... or wherever. If I'm Lebron, the Heat are not where I want to be.

On the max contract... I think some of it is just machismo. Maybe I'm alone in thinking this... but if Lebron say signed for a minimum contract w/ the Clippers and won a title then I would consider that title a bit tainted. Lebron is a max contract guy... he should be able to win a championship while getting paid what he deserves. A few million here or there isn't a big deal I guess... but he's the best player in the league. He deserves his max contract.

I'm no Lebron fan... I love rooting against the guy. That being said... it would be exciting for him to be back in Cleveland. Pair him up w/ Kyrie and Wiggins... could be something special. I kind of hope it happens.

[superdave]

This article (http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/11184392/houston-rockets-ramp-pursuit-chris-bosh) is pretty good and covers a lot of ground on the NBA free agency season.

Houston is going after Bosh pretty hard, believing they cannot get James or Melo. This could be Bosh's backup plan if Lebron splits.

Miami is also looking at Gasol, Deng, Ariza, etc. I dont know if there is a chance that Lebron and Wade both return but Bosh leaves. If so Miami could afford 2-3 guys to round out the starting lineup. Bosh is a better compliment than Gasol at this point though, because of how well he spaces the floor.

I like the close of the article casually mentioned the possibility of Jeremy Lin to Philly. I am not sure how Lin fits into Philly's long-term rebuild, but at least his deal is expiring and could be flipped later this year.

[g-money]

The "Lebron goes home" rumors are picking up speed on ESPN this morning. While completely baseless, it should make for a fun next couple of weeks!

I wonder if it'll be Heat fans setting their jerseys on fire this time around.

[Billy Dat]

Adrian Wojnarowski ‏@WojYahooNBA 15m
Charlotte's Josh McRoberts emerging as serious free agent candidate for Miami, sources tell Yahoo. Realistic option at mid-level exception.

Zach Lowe ‏@ZachLowe_NBA 14m
Re: last @WojYahooNBA tweet. Growing # of execs leaguewide think McRoberts is going to get full MLE. That surprises me a bit.

Zach Lowe ‏@ZachLowe_NBA 12m
.@MarkDeeksNBA To be clear, I'm talking full non-tax MLE. Fan of McRoberts' game, but that seems steep w/ one season of good 3pt shooting

Headline:
"Wade, McRoberts, Napier poised to lead Miami back to the Finals!"
(sorry Mabdul)

Fran Fraschilla @franfraschilla · 2h
"With the first pick in the 2015 NBA Draft, the Miami Heat select..." Yikes!

(Mabdul, sorry about that one, too)

[greybeard]

You have to understand that 9 out of 10 GMs just follow the lead of the best GMs. If RC Buford can use Matt Bonner and Boris Diaw to spread the floor and guard the 4, then daggummit, they all have to over-value 4's who can shoot!

Look, a Gearon-lead critical mass once forced upon the rest of ownership, my man Belkin, the most stupid personnel move in the history of your franchise. Paying Phoenix Sun free Agent, Joe Johnson, the ungodly sum of 25 mill a year, when no one was interested at 15m but Phoenix (allegedly), and then in a leap of sheer madness threw away the team's future by agreeing to give Colangelo not 1, but 2, no.1s too boot. Johnson became the Hawks' "star" but actually established a ridiculously low ceiling and all but killed the performance of other talents with potential by his insatiable appetite for the ball. Ball movement on that team was an oxymoron because of Joe. Georon pressed this madness, by the way, to force a showdown with general partner (veto power) and largest owner Steve Belkin, my college buddy, who knew way better, in order to oust Belkin from his genral partner position, which deepened much further what the trade itself created--a dramatic and prolonged slide into nowhereism.

So, missing on a possible pick up of someone I never heard of, granted I am hardly a fan of the NBA but do watch ESPN, or listen out of one ear, is nothing to give a thought to as compare to what Atlanta fans, probably before your time, thought the best personnel move in the history of the franchise but had to be the worst ever. On the other hand, you seem an ardent and incredibly knowledgeable fan, and Atlanta does seem oh so close, that I feel your pain. The perspective of history perhaps might ease it. The choices made now hurt, but do not devastate; for that, be thankful.

[JasonEvans]

A few things worth mentioning --

1) Lebron is angling for a max contract because the Player's Association is really upset at the talk that players need to take less for the good of their teams. The PA felt like it gave up a lot in the last CBA and is really made that owners/management are now crying about players actually wanting to get max deals (that are still far less than legit market value). The owners are making money like crazy (the Clips are worth $2bill) and yet everyone moans about how star players should take millions of dollars less than they should each year to make teams more competitive. Well, the PA is really sick of it and is basically telling big stars that they need to make market value. That is why Lebron, who is a strong supporter of the PA, has made it clear he will be making the max next season.

2) I keep reading that Wade gave up the $40 mil over the next two seasons so he could sign a 4-year deal worth about $60 mil... does anyone think there is any chance he is still an effective player when he is 36, 37 years old at the end of that contract?

3) Someone explain to me how Miami isn't in a horrible Catch-22 right now -- they can't get Lebron (or Bosh?) to come back unless they show they have other quality free agents lined up. But, they can't get other quality free agents to commit (and don't even know what they can offer those free agents) until they know that Lebron (and Bosh) will be back. I suppose the only way it works is for Reilly to negotiate deals with Deng, Marvin Williams, whoever that are contingent on Lebron/Bosh/Wade returning and then going to Bosh and Wade to let them know how big a paycut he needs them to take. It all seems extremely complicated and difficult.

4) So, the irony with the Heat is that if Lebron and Bosh both go elsewhere, the Heat will suddenly have TONS of cap room to bring in free agents. I am not sure who would be left at that point, but the Heat would have the moolah to bring in a couple $10+ mil free agents (assuming they re-sign Wade, who is a fixture in the community).

-Jason "I cannot figure out what is going to happen -- but it is really starting to feel like Lebron is going to leave Miami" Evans

[greybeard]

If this is too far afield, mods please take it down. Belkin provided this team with tremendous promise. He had the Boston Celtics bought, when Larry O'Brien ripped it out from under him because the former governor of Kentucky decided he wanted it. Belkin had tremendous relationships with Boston personnel and before he took over had worked a deal to keep McKale a Celtic for 10 years. How'd that work out? Belkin put together a deal to build a stadium in Charlotte and get them a team. He had Larry Bird and ML Carr, with whom he was very tight, as minority partners and Bird was to be GM, he had the deal done, and Stern ripped the team from under them because Robert Johnson, Jr. decided he wanted it. How'd that work out.

Belkin, made the villain in Atlanta by a Gearon loving media, his old man had done good things with the Hawks before him, would have done special things with the Hawks. I knew him quite well in college; brilliant, passionate about the game, a forward thinking entrepreneur who grew his people into huge successes in their own rights, and who earned the respect of giants in the game. Shame what happened in Atlanta. For you Atlanta fans and him. Probably, because of how the media was played, the Atlanta fan base never knew what was at stake in the battle that Gearon created and how much that team and its fan base lost. I should write a book.

Again, Mods, take a look, and if a hint of a hijack , take it down.

[CDu]

Look, a Gearon-lead critical mass once forced upon the rest of ownership, my man Belkin, the most stupid personnel move in the history of your franchise. Paying Phoenix Sun free Agent, Joe Johnson, the ungodly sum of 25 mill a year, when no one was interested at 15m but Phoenix (allegedly), and then in a leap of sheer madness threw away the team's future by agreeing to give Colangelo not 1, but 2, no.1s too boot. Johnson became the Hawks' "star" but actually established a ridiculously low ceiling and all but killed the performance of other talents with potential by his insatiable appetite for the ball. Ball movement on that team was an oxymoron because of Joe. Georon pressed this madness, by the way, to force a showdown with general partner (veto power) and largest owner Steve Belkin, my college buddy, who knew way better, in order to oust Belkin from his genral partner position, which deepened much further what the trade itself created--a dramatic and prolonged slide into nowhereism.

Your timing is a little off on this. The Hawks did a sign-and-trade to get Johnson from Phoenix in 2005, but the deal was for $70 over 5 seasons. That was actually a VERY reasonable deal, as Johnson averaged well over 20 points per game for the Hawks over those 5 seasons. The two first round picks were middling picks that amounted to a decent backup C in Robin Lopez.

Where Atlanta gummed it up was paying Joe Johnson the max to stay in Atlanta in the summer of 2010. Johnson was a VERY good player at the time (as I'd mentioned, he was a perennial 20+ ppg scorer along with 4-6 assists and 4-5 rebounds per game). They couldn't afford to lose him to the Bulls or another team, because he was their best player (and probably one of the 10-15 best players in the league) at the time. Unfortunately, the wheels almost immediately came off the track, as age and injuries led Johnson into an early decline.

[CDu]

A few things worth mentioning --

1) Lebron is angling for a max contract because the Player's Association is really upset at the talk that players need to take less for the good of their teams. The PA felt like it gave up a lot in the last CBA and is really made that owners/management are now crying about players actually wanting to get max deals (that are still far less than legit market value). The owners are making money like crazy (the Clips are worth $2bill) and yet everyone moans about how star players should take millions of dollars less than they should each year to make teams more competitive. Well, the PA is really sick of it and is basically telling big stars that they need to make market value. That is why Lebron, who is a strong supporter of the PA, has made it clear he will be making the max next season.

I don't doubt this at all. I made an off-hand comment that the players' union can't be thrilled with all this talk of the best players not taking the max. It's one thing for an aging Duncan or Nowitzki to take less than the max, because those guys aren't max players. It's one thing for the best players to take just a smidge less than the max (like the big three did). But it's another thing altogether for the absolute best player in the game to take well-below the max.

I think James will end up in Miami. But I think he'll be getting the max, or very close to it.


2) I keep reading that Wade gave up the $40 mil over the next two seasons so he could sign a 4-year deal worth about $60 mil... does anyone think there is any chance he is still an effective player when he is 36, 37 years old at the end of that contract?

Yeah, that's the thing. There is absolutely no way that Wade is getting back the value he would have gotten from the last two years of his old contract. Nobody is paying him big money down the road. Miami is basically going to extend him beyond his worth (in terms of years) to get some flexibility for the next year or two. They're in some ways mortgaging the long-term fiscal health (maybe by just a year) to extend the championship window for a few more years.

This is a very touchy situation. Wade almost assuredly had a "wink-wink" deal in place when he opted out. But if LeBron leaves, Miami would be in a very awkward position of having to honor that "wink-wink" deal but losing the reason for that deal in the first place. So LeBron almost HAS to return to Miami.


3) Someone explain to me how Miami isn't in a horrible Catch-22 right now -- they can't get Lebron (or Bosh?) to come back unless they show they have other quality free agents lined up. But, they can't get other quality free agents to commit (and don't even know what they can offer those free agents) until they know that Lebron (and Bosh) will be back. I suppose the only way it works is for Reilly to negotiate deals with Deng, Marvin Williams, whoever that are contingent on Lebron/Bosh/Wade returning and then going to Bosh and Wade to let them know how big a paycut he needs them to take. It all seems extremely complicated and difficult.

I think that's exactly what they'll do: bring in free agents, get them to agree in principle, then go to the big three (or more specifically LeBron) and say "does this work?" Assuming all is kosher, they'll then sign everybody.


4) So, the irony with the Heat is that if Lebron and Bosh both go elsewhere, the Heat will suddenly have TONS of cap room to bring in free agents. I am not sure who would be left at that point, but the Heat would have the moolah to bring in a couple $10+ mil free agents (assuming they re-sign Wade, who is a fixture in the community).

-Jason "I cannot figure out what is going to happen -- but it is really starting to feel like Lebron is going to leave Miami" Evans

As I said with Bosh, I'll believe it when I see it. I think the Big Three will all return to Miami.

[Orange&BlackSheep]

[URL="http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/11184392/houston-rockets-ramp-pursuit-chris-bosh"]
I like the close of the article casually mentioned the possibility of Jeremy Lin to Philly. I am not sure how Lin fits into Philly's long-term rebuild, but at least his deal is expiring and could be flipped later this year.

Guessing that Philly would love to add him for the attention it will bring them without tying up long-term cap space.

[InSpades]

Yeah, that's the thing. There is absolutely no way that Wade is getting back the value he would have gotten from the last two years of his old contract. Nobody is paying him big money down the road. Miami is basically going to extend him beyond his worth (in terms of years) to get some flexibility for the next year or two. They're in some ways mortgaging the long-term fiscal health (maybe by just a year) to extend the championship window for a few more years.

This is a very touchy situation. Wade almost assuredly had a "wink-wink" deal in place when he opted out. But if LeBron leaves, Miami would be in a very awkward position of having to honor that "wink-wink" deal but losing the reason for that deal in the first place. So LeBron almost HAS to return to Miami.


I think Miami gives Wade a deal that pays him enough money to make the opt out seem like a good idea (60 for 4?). I can also see Wade retiring before the contract is done. Then at some point in the future Wade becomes a front office guy and makes up some of the lost money.

I still don't think Lebron comes back. He'll always have a shot at championships (just because he's Lebron) but I don't think Miami gives him the best chance. He's already shown that loyalty isn't 1st on his list... I'm not sure where the best landing spots for him are but I'll say it again... it would be real interesting to see him in Cleveland again.

[superdave]

Yeah, that's the thing. There is absolutely no way that Wade is getting back the value he would have gotten from the last two years of his old contract. Nobody is paying him big money down the road. Miami is basically going to extend him beyond his worth (in terms of years) to get some flexibility for the next year or two. They're in some ways mortgaging the long-term fiscal health (maybe by just a year) to extend the championship window for a few more years.

This is a very touchy situation. Wade almost assuredly had a "wink-wink" deal in place when he opted out. But if LeBron leaves, Miami would be in a very awkward position of having to honor that "wink-wink" deal but losing the reason for that deal in the first place. So LeBron almost HAS to return to Miami.



If the cupboard is bare in Miami and Bosh and James both bolt, Miami probably should re-sign Wade (assuming he wants to reture with the Heat in a few years) to a max deal.

With the Heat rebuilding and with $50 millin cap space, they may NEED to pay Wade the max just to get to the salary floor. So why not reward his flexibility and give the 2-year, $40 million he would have gotten before the opt-out? Either way, his wife will probably make more cash than him over the next ten years, so he wont miss any meals.

[Billy Dat]

Marc Stein ‏@ESPNSteinLine 5m
ESPN learned that Josh McRoberts has verbally committed to sign with the Miami Heat

[Kdogg]

1st off, the Wade opting out thing to me creates a weird situation. In some ways he had to opt out... he can't make $20M the next 2 years and be on a winning team. Lebron would be stupid to resign w/ the Heat w/ Wade getting $20M of the precious salary cap. Which means Wade had to opt out to give the Heat a shot at Lebron... but Wade still needs to get paid. The Heat can't let him walk after he basically did them a huge favor by opting out. If I had to guess there was a *wink wink* *nudge nudge* involved in that opt out. Some guarantee that Wade would get his money (less per year, more years, or something of that sort).



There has been talk for a long time that Wade with get a longer contract for less money and they transition into a front office job are he retires. I've been hearing this since last summer.

[flyingdutchdevil]

Either way, his wife will probably make more cash than him over the next ten years, so he wont miss any meals.

Sadly, the beautiful Ms. Gabrielle Union isn't making much money these days: http://grantland.com/hollywood-prospectus/career-arc-the-not-quite-stardom-of-gabrielle-union/

Once poised as one of the next big things in Hollywood, her career just hasn't panned out like that.

[CDu]

Marc Stein ‏@ESPNSteinLine 5m
ESPN learned that Josh McRoberts has verbally committed to sign with the Miami Heat

Hmmm... Good for him I guess. But I'm not sure I see that as a good fit. Basically, he replicates what Bosh and Lewis do (though not as well) as a stretch 4 who doesn't rebound or defend well. He's a better passer than those two guys, but not so great a passer as to warrant playing alongside Bosh. They need a strong, athletic defender/rebounder to bang inside and do the dirty work that Bosh doesn't want to do.

But, it's better than nothing for Heat. Just doesn't seem to address what they were lacking last year.

[Billy Dat]

Pat Riley - the lion in winter!

Adrian Wojnarowski ‏@WojYahooNBA 50s
Free agent Danny Granger has agreed to a two-year, $4.2 million deal with the Miami Heat, league sources tell Yahoo Sports.

[CDu]

Pat Riley - the lion in winter!

Adrian Wojnarowski ‏@WojYahooNBA 50s
Free agent Danny Granger has agreed to a two-year, $4.2 million deal with the Miami Heat, league sources tell Yahoo Sports.

Wow, that is an awful move. So, to recap, the Heat have now used the mid-level exception on McRoberts and the bi-annual exception on Granger. Both of whom would be backups if the Big Three return. One of whom has no knees. Now they literally cannot sign another external free agent to anything more than the veteran's minimum unless they can do a sign-and-trade.

Strange.

[sagegrouse]

Hmmm... Good for him I guess. But I'm not sure I see that as a good fit. Basically, he replicates what Bosh and Lewis do (though not as well) as a stretch 4 who doesn't rebound or defend well. He's a better passer than those two guys, but not so great a passer as to warrant playing alongside Bosh. They need a strong, athletic defender/rebounder to bang inside and do the dirty work that Bosh doesn't want to do.

But, it's better than nothing for Heat. Just doesn't seem to address what they were lacking last year.

Maybe Riley, Spoelstra and Co. were impressed with the way the Spurs passed the ball around and want to remedy that right away. I thought Rashard and Birdman were black holes on offense and couldn't complete a pass if their lives depended on it. And Bosh only averaged 1.1 assist per game. Josh ahd 4.3, about the same as Birdman, Rashard, and Bosh combined.

[CDu]

Maybe Riley, Spoelstra and Co. were impressed with the way the Spurs passed the ball around and want to remedy that right away. I thought Rashard and Birdman were black holes on offense and couldn't complete a pass if their lives depended on it. And Bosh only averaged 1.1 assist per game. Josh ahd 4.3, about the same as Birdman, Rashard, and Bosh combined.

Oh, no doubt that McRoberts is a good passer (a great passer for a big man). But they only had two places to sign guys above the veteran's minimum this year, and their biggest needs were more ballhandlers and interior defense and rebounding. Neither Granger nor McRoberts address either of those needs, and neither fits into the starting lineup (McRoberts would back up Bosh, Granger would back up James).

I don't think McRoberts is a useless pickup. I just don't think he was the best use of their mid-level exception. And Granger would be a great last-minute addition at the vet minimum (hoping to win the lottery on his knee). I just don't think it was the best use of their bi-annual exception.

[superdave]

Sadly, the beautiful Ms. Gabrielle Union isn't making much money these days: http://grantland.com/hollywood-prospectus/career-arc-the-not-quite-stardom-of-gabrielle-union/

Once poised as one of the next big things in Hollywood, her career just hasn't panned out like that.

She and Morris Chestnut need to go back to the well and do a rom-com. I guess she seems like a bigger star than she actually is.

So maybe Wade does need to get more in his next deal... Wade's divorce only cost him $5 million, so he cannot be in to bad shape. Career earnings to date: $121 million.

[superdave]

Oh, no doubt that McRoberts is a good passer (a great passer for a big man). But they only had two places to sign guys above the veteran's minimum this year, and their biggest needs were more ballhandlers and interior defense and rebounding. Neither Granger nor McRoberts address either of those needs, and neither fits into the starting lineup (McRoberts would back up Bosh, Granger would back up James).

I don't think McRoberts is a useless pickup. I just don't think he was the best use of their mid-level exception. And Granger would be a great last-minute addition at the vet minimum (hoping to win the lottery on his knee). I just don't think it was the best use of their bi-annual exception.

Is it possible these deals are contingent upon the Big Trio returning? Would McRoberts and Granger agree to that? Or would the NBA/ or PA frown upon that?

[CDu]

Is it possible these deals are contingent upon the Big Trio returning? Would McRoberts and Granger agree to that? Or would the NBA/ or PA frown upon that?

I don't know. But I was assuming the big three were returning with my previous post. The deals actually make more sense if at least one of the Big Three is NOT returning.

For example, if the Heat did a sign-and-trade of Bosh for somebody else (like to Houston for Lin?) then McRoberts makes sense. At that point, those players would no longer be exceptions but instead cap hits.

But I can't see a deal that makes sense for the Heat given these two acquisitions. Either Riley is REALLY clever or he's having trouble finding useful guys to join the ship for "chump change."

[JasonEvans]

Wow, that is an awful move. So, to recap, the Heat have now used the mid-level exception on McRoberts and the bi-annual exception on Granger. Both of whom would be backups if the Big Three return. One of whom has no knees. Now they literally cannot sign another external free agent to anything more than the veteran's minimum unless they can do a sign-and-trade.

Strange.

Yeah, if I am Lebron, I am looking at these two deals and wondering if this is now a legit championship contender -- wondering if I can now take nights off a little more often and let the other guys carry the load to save myself for the post-season. I'm not sure I see it.

Still, I think it would be insane to think that Lebron was not at least informed (an perhaps given out and out approval) of these two signings prior to Reilly pulling the trigger on these two. If the Big Three come back, I would disagee with the notion that McJosh does not start. I could imagine a starting lineup of:

PG: Chalmers or Napier
SG: Wade
SF: Lebron
PF: McJosh
C: Bosh

That's a pretty darn good passing team with a lot of guys who can shoot well from the perimeter. It does not help with rim protection and contains zero interior offensive threats (other than Lebron posting up), but it is probably better than the same team with the corpse that used to be Rashard Lewis at PF.

-Jason "is this enough to bring Lebron back? I dunno... I could see him trying it for a year or two and then moving on to Cleveland once Wiggins is a bit more established" Evans

[greybeard]

Your timing is a little off on this. The Hawks did a sign-and-trade to get Johnson from Phoenix in 2005, but the deal was for $70 over 5 seasons. That was actually a VERY reasonable deal, as Johnson averaged well over 20 points per game for the Hawks over those 5 seasons. The two first round picks were middling picks that amounted to a decent backup C in Robin Lopez.

Where Atlanta gummed it up was paying Joe Johnson the max to stay in Atlanta in the summer of 2010. Johnson was a VERY good player at the time (as I'd mentioned, he was a perennial 20+ ppg scorer along with 4-6 assists and 4-5 rebounds per game). They couldn't afford to lose him to the Bulls or another team, because he was their best player (and probably one of the 10-15 best players in the league) at the time. Unfortunately, the wheels almost immediately came off the track, as age and injuries led Johnson into an early decline.

I get your perspective; it comports with the overwhelmingly majority of view. The numbers, well it has been awhile, but I am correct in my recall that it was substantially more than what Phoenix was offering, which, if Phoenix wanted to keep him, it would have matched. But, while Joe was a productive off-the bench scorer, his style of play did not fit with a Steve Nash run and inspired Suns' approach, not at all. They needed to get rid of him, period.

Joe has never seen the offensive game in terms of the whole being the sum of its parts, of the value of what we can generally say is the passing game. How he sees offense is through a mirror pointing back. He loves to catch several feet above, at least, outside the 3 point line, hold to draw the defense with the specter of a shot, put it on the floor to close space to the line, dance using his considerable dribbling skills to freeze the defender and rise for the 3, or penetrate inside for a pull up or to the basket penetration (he was never a great finisher percentage wise by the way), but never ever penetrate to create angles for an effective kick. Rather, a kick would be a last resort and would leave the receiver with little time on the clock and without the organization, rhythm, time to do anything constructive with the damn thing. He had no interest in participating in moving the ball to create opportunity for others, I just think that he never saw it's value, and possessed no ability to see 2-3 steps in front of the play as most relatively high-end players do (Kobe and Kidd each put out 5 as his number, which is what soccer coaches ask of young players with talent).

So Gearon overpaid a bit for a scorer who killed offense and sold it as something it wasn't big deal. Not really. What was a huge deal is that he threw in Boris Diaw and the two first round draft picks to get a guy who was a great shooter and scorer but a ball killer who made no one better only worse.

The Spirits first year, while they had a losing record and were drawing no fans, the Hawks added Childress and Smith both of whom, playing with Diaw had smashing first seasons during which they continued to grow throughout, Childress especially. Before the next season Diaw was gone along with 2 draft picks, Marvin Williams arrived as did Joe. Marvin was a terrific spot-up, come-off-the-screen 3 shooter, with somewhat of a bounce game that played off the shooting game. The jump shot game got squashed by Joe's style, as did another key ability that Marvin had shown--he could play generously and very effectively in a passing game offense that cohered. He saw the game very well and was creative within it, not by dazzling but by seeing and making vaolue added plays, a pass, etc. So, credit Joe to Marvin's having gotten stuck in the mud on arrival. I would not have picked Marvin with the 2, but think that playing with Diaw, Childress, and Peschuler in a well conceived passing/movement offense with Diaw playing the organizing force, Williams would have had a first season like the two guys before him. Smith fit with that style but I think would have been slower to it. On the other hand, divies and drives to the basket would have been much more available and I think that Smith's creative mind would have been amped as the passing game developed, that he would have found the rhythm and logic of it. Speedy Claxton or Ivy would have fit such an offense and the Hawks would have been playing basketball. And, oh, had the Hawks passed on Joe and picked up a point guard who understood the game and could shoot, as they did when they grabbed Bibby a few years later, that offense could well have scared some people.

The next year the same guy who brought you Joe and sold the farm made oh such a good choice in using a top 10 pick, I think it was 5, on Shelden. Not so much sports fans. So, Joe has even more power because have destroyed any opportunity for a passing game that otherwise present. Peschuler was a good receiver of the ball (found good position on the move and had good hands) and had a great feel for the Euro-style passing game, which would have set up his inside scoring game that to be spoke of effectiveness only there was no inside out threat from Peschuler to set that game up. Childress was born to play that game and to a lesser extent was Williams. Smith, with the right rhythms, intelligence, and logic to such a game would I think picked up on it fast because it would have produced for him dives and catches down the lane and finishes at the rim. All this was possible without Diaw, but not with Joe.

Now, had Diaw stayed, I do not know how much of this was aired outside the Sekou's AJC blog, but guys who knew their stuff, my main man Doc among them (none were Belkin supporters but they came around from being Belkin haters), were ALL OVER the idea of bringing in a guy named Nene, who was coming off that bad knee and they said therefore could probably been had on the cheap. You add Nene and Diaw, and a quality point as described above instead of Joe (precisely the type player that Gearon touted to anyone who would listen that he had gotten in Joe) and you have which team--now add Horford. San Antonio Spurs circa 2014 begin to fit. Now the pick spent on Law could go for a sized and talented shooting guard who again can play, and you guys are there there, as on top, a long, long time ago. It was that close. The other owners, each of whom needed a piece of the power, the limelight, chose the wrong horse. Belkin was your man. Shame.

[greybeard]

Maybe Riley, Spoelstra and Co. were impressed with the way the Spurs passed the ball around and want to remedy that right away. I thought Rashard and Birdman were black holes on offense and couldn't complete a pass if their lives depended on it. And Bosh only averaged 1.1 assist per game. Josh ahd 4.3, about the same as Birdman, Rashard, and Bosh combined.

Might be attractive to Lebron. McRoberts immediately elevates the Heat's ability to impress in a half-court passing game, and defend against the passing game that the Spurs present. Lebron would have to be happy to see both.

What you don't understand on a visceral, down to the bone, level, you cannot defend against with high-level choices.

If you want to keep Lebron, McRoberts is a surprise (to me) terrific choice.

[Furniture]

Not sure if this has been posted anywhere yet.
It's a possible move for Ryan.
https://mobile.twitter.com/Tjonessltrib/statuses/483849316121849856

[ice-9]

Oh, no doubt that McRoberts is a good passer (a great passer for a big man). But they only had two places to sign guys above the veteran's minimum this year, and their biggest needs were more ballhandlers and interior defense and rebounding. Neither Granger nor McRoberts address either of those needs, and neither fits into the starting lineup (McRoberts would back up Bosh, Granger would back up James).

I don't think McRoberts is a useless pickup. I just don't think he was the best use of their mid-level exception. And Granger would be a great last-minute addition at the vet minimum (hoping to win the lottery on his knee). I just don't think it was the best use of their bi-annual exception.

Yeah this to me indicates that Bosh might heading out the door. McRoberts isn't his equal, but does a few similar things -- mobile big man, OK shooting, and probably a better defender. He's not as strong offensively but he's a better passer.

So LeBron $20 million, McRoberts and Granger $8 million, Wade $14 million, that might leave just enough to get Ariza with change left over for Haslem and Bird.

Hmm, don't know if that's a championship team. If Wade can take a few million less they might be able to get Deng. Still not sure that's a championship team though.

[CDu]

Yeah this to me indicates that Bosh might heading out the door. McRoberts isn't his equal, but does a few similar things -- mobile big man, OK shooting, and probably a better defender. He's not as strong offensively but he's a better passer.

So LeBron $20 million, McRoberts and Granger $8 million, Wade $14 million, that might leave just enough to get Ariza with change left over for Haslem and Bird.

Hmm, don't know if that's a championship team. If Wade can take a few million less they might be able to get Deng. Still not sure that's a championship team though.

Yeah that is the only thing that would make sense. McRoberts and Bosh are too similar. They don't fit well together.

I don't think Ariza would be the right guy though. That would be 3 SF and no big men. That extra cap space would need to be a big man.

[tommy]

If you want to keep Lebron, McRoberts is a surprise (to me) terrific choice.

Surprise to me too. Especially light of the idea, suggested by others on here but that I agree with, that the Heat aren't making a move without the approval of LeBron right now. Which makes this move interesting, as it was McRoberts who, in this year's playoffs, took LeBron down with a brutal forearm to the throat, which should have been a Flagrant 2, a play which caused the Heat medical staff to contact the NBA Offices and their medical people in particular, due to the unrecognized danger to player health that such a blow to that area poses. It really was a very, very dangerous play that had everyone in Miami -- and lots of other places too -- howling.

[Dukehky]

That said, I think LeBron is probably signing a big, long term deal with the Heat, and lock himself there for at least 3 years. The Cavs would have other unrestricted free agent options next summer though, such as Kevin Love, Paul Millsap, Brook Lopez, DeAndre Jordan, Marc Gasol, and LaMarcus Aldridge.

No big time free agent will choose to go to Cleveland, the only thing they can hope for is to keep a star draft pick for a long time because they can offer the most money. That being said, I am still SHOCKED Kyrie signed an extension there. 'Bron isn't going back to Cleveland. It's a PR politeness move to make them feel good about themselves because they almost got LeBron back.

[theAlaskanBear]

I don't think the McRobert signing means Bosh is gone. Anderson seems like he might be gone, so Josh would play some 5 and back up Bosh at the 4. It's become quite clear that Bosh does not want to bang in the post or guard centers, so that would be McRoberts job. On offense they can both stretch the floor but josh is a better passer, and bosh is a much more deadly jump shooter.

How would this work together? Well, position josh at the key and up top near the straight 3. Bosh would shade to the elbows/corner. Pg and Sg would be behind the three point line opposite bosh. Now, McRoberts has the ball, bosh screens for James who cuts to the basket. If the defenders peel off of Bosh to follow James, josh can send the ball to bosh for an easy jumper, or if James made a clean cut and is free you pass it to him. If the defense collapses on James, then he has 3+ options to pass: 1. Back to Bosh who may have slipped back to the corner three. 2 & 3. A cross court baseline kick to the PG and SG on the 3 point line that LeBron loves when he dives to the rim (the Ray Allen alley, as I like to call it). 4. He could pass it back out to McRoberts who can then whip the ball to around the horn to players on either side of him.

That's just one example of a play with bosh and josh on the floor at the same time.

[kAzE]

So, in the wake of this Stephen A. Smith thing on SportsCenter, there seems to be a prevailing notion that LeBron James is viewing Cleveland as an option in free agency. This is actually kind of crazy, considering Cleveland wasn't really even being mentioned in the running for James as recently as 5 days ago. It's easy to talk yourself into it though:

1. It's his home, it's where he's from, the family loves it there, he has a crazy expensive pad, he can just be himself and nobody bothers him, BLAH BLAH BLAH

2. It's the best option to boost his PR. America loves redemption stories. LeBron going back to Cleveland would instantly turn him from a villain back into a hero for many fans (me, myself, and I). LeBron cares intensely about his public image for reasons that I can't quite fathom . . . I always appreciated MJ and Kobe's IDGAF attitude towards public perception. But LeBron is LeBron, and he likes being the hero. He got a ton of flak for leaving the first time, but I don't think he gets that same level of disdain if he leaves Miami, especially if it's to Cleveland.

3. Would you rather play with D Wade or Kyrie for the next 5 years? How about Andrew Wiggins vs. Danny Granger? Wiggins is already solid, and he could be an absolute beast in 2 years. Sure, these guys are young and unproven, but would you rather have a roster of guys that are too young and unproven to compete for a title or a roster that's too old and washed-up? (Come on, Danny Granger's career as a productive NBA player ended like 2 years ago) The Cavs have a chance to get 3 first round picks next year, and with their insane draft luck, they'll probably get all 3. This team has a bright future, and not many guys in the league are as good at LeBron at making the talent around him better.

4. Cleveland has the roster flexibility to offer a max long term contract, which LeBron clearly covets.

5. They are in the East, which means if you have LeBron, congratulations, you're going to the finals! You really don't think so? Compare this roster to Cleveland's 2007 roster minus LeBron, and then get back to me.

6. Kyrie is a point guard. This is a plus for LeBron, it means he will in all likelihood be handling the ball less than he was in Miami. It's extremely taxing physically over the course of an NBA season, and exhausting on a game to game basis being the only guy who your team can depend on to create offense. I firmly believe this was a contributing factor in LeBron's less than stellar performance (by LeBron standards) in the NBA playoffs this past year. He just looked tired and beat up to me. Kyrie is among the top 10 (I'd even argue top 5) guys in the NBA at creating offense.

So, there's all that. Sure, it's not perfect. They are insanely young, Kyrie still hasn't proven he's capable of staying on the court for a full season, their coach is brand new to the NBA, and the owner is an idiot, but I don't see how Miami is even a better basketball choice. The title window is smaller, the roster as it's constructed thus far (Shabazz Napier, Josh McRoberts, Danny Granger, probably Wade, and probably NOT Bosh, who's likely going to Houston for 88 million different reasons) Good luck with that. COME ON HOME, LEBRON!

If you must burst my bubble, please be gentle.

[BD80]

So, in the wake of this Stephen A. Smith thing on SportsCenter, there seems to be a prevailing notion that LeBron James is viewing Cleveland as an option in free agency. This is actually kind of crazy, considering Cleveland wasn't really even being mentioned in the running for James as recently as 5 days ago. It's easy to talk yourself into it though:

1. It's his home, it's where he's from, the family loves it there, he has a crazy expensive pad, he can just be himself and nobody bothers him, BLAH BLAH BLAH

2. It's the best option to boost his PR. America loves redemption stories. LeBron going back to Cleveland would instantly turn him from a villain back into a hero for many fans (me, myself, and I). LeBron cares intensely about his public image for reasons that I can't quite fathom . . . I always appreciated MJ and Kobe's IDGAF attitude towards public perception. But LeBron is LeBron, and he likes being the hero. He got a ton of flak for leaving the first time, but I don't think he gets that same level of disdain if he leaves Miami, especially if it's to Cleveland.

3. Would you rather play with D Wade or Kyrie for the next 5 years? How about Andrew Wiggins vs. Danny Granger? Wiggins is already solid, and he could be an absolute beast in 2 years. Sure, these guys are young and unproven, but would you rather have a roster of guys that are too young and unproven to compete for a title or a roster that's too old and washed-up? (Come on, Danny Granger's career as a productive NBA player ended like 2 years ago) The Cavs have a chance to get 3 first round picks next year, and with their insane draft luck, they'll probably get all 3. This team has a bright future, and not many guys in the league are as good at LeBron at making the talent around him better.

4. Cleveland has the roster flexibility to offer a max long term contract, which LeBron clearly covets.

5. They are in the East, which means if you have LeBron, congratulations, you're going to the finals! You really don't think so? Compare this roster to Cleveland's 2007 roster minus LeBron, and then get back to me.

6. Kyrie is a point guard. This is a plus for LeBron, it means he will in all likelihood be handling the ball less than he was in Miami. It's extremely taxing physically over the course of an NBA season, and exhausting on a game to game basis being the only guy who your team can depend on to create offense. I firmly believe this was a contributing factor in LeBron's less than stellar performance (by LeBron standards) in the NBA playoffs this past year. He just looked tired and beat up to me. Kyrie is among the top 10 (I'd even argue top 5) guys in the NBA at creating offense.

So, there's all that. Sure, it's not perfect. They are insanely young, Kyrie still hasn't proven he's capable of staying on the court for a full season, their coach is brand new to the NBA, and the owner is an idiot, but I don't see how Miami is even a better basketball choice. The title window is smaller, the roster as it's constructed thus far (Shabazz Napier, Josh McRoberts, Danny Granger, probably Wade, and probably NOT Bosh, who's likely going to Houston for 88 million different reasons) Good luck with that. COME ON HOME, LEBRON!

If you must burst my bubble, please be gentle.

But ... its Cleveland

[luburch]

I heard Cleveland brought Ted Mosby in to pitch to him. If that doesn't work, I don't know what will.

[Henderson]

If you must burst my bubble, please be gentle.


But ... its Cleveland

:::POP!:::

Here's the bad news for Cleveland fans: Everything kAzE says in his post just above makes perfect sense, especially from a basketball perspective. So if LeBron doesn't go back to Cleveland, there's only one explanation left:

It's Cleveland.

P.S. Were he to return, I wonder if the city would permit LeBron to MC the annual Lighting of the River Pageant.

[ice-9]

Yeah that is the only thing that would make sense. McRoberts and Bosh are too similar. They don't fit well together.

I don't think Ariza would be the right guy though. That would be 3 SF and no big men. That extra cap space would need to be a big man.

I think it's possible.

PG: Napier
SG: Wade
SF: Ariza
PF: LeBron
C: McRoberts

McRoberts is big enough to defend the center position and Haslem would back him up. Ariza shot well last season. Granger would sub in for either him or LeBron. They'd be able to switch off of everything on defense at the 3-5, except maybe Haslem.

On offense this team would be lightning quick. Assuming Wade's knees hold up.

[FerryFor50]

Bosh reportedly tells Houston he wants to stay in Miami...

http://www.si.com/nba/2014/07/07/chris-bosh-wants-miami-heat-lebron-james-nba-free-agency

And Pat Riley is confident everyone is coming back! (but when has Pat Riley ever been anything but confident/arrogant?)

http://www.si.com/nba/2014/07/08/heat-pat-riley-confident-lebron-james-dwyane-wade-chris-bosh-returning

[Billy Dat]

But ... its Cleveland

I just listened to a good interview with Ira Winderman, a Heat beat reporter, who added some interesting additional color to the potential move to Cleveland.

-The "But....it's Cleveland" piece makes sense unless every single guy in the superstar's entourage, including the superstar himself, didn't call Cleveland home. All of those dudes, Mav Carter, Rich Paul, Randy Mims, et al are all from Cleveland and currently keeping two residences.

-Forget Lebron, Kyrie and Wiggins and start thinking about Lebron, Kyrie and Love as Cleveland has the assets (Wiggins, Bennett, lots of picks) to make Minnesota seriously consider a sign and trade.

-Rich Paul's agency, Klutch Sports, is Cleveland based. Lebron may not have legal ties to the organization, but you can assume he is heavily involved in it. He's looking to build an agency empire ala some of his mentors Worldwide Wes and Jay Z which will include his marketing/management firm, LRMR, which has already signed Cleveland-based Johnny Football.

I'm not saying it will happen, but right now it looks like Cleveland and Miami and Cleveland doesn't seem like such a long shot except.......

Lebron HATES Dan Gilbert. That's quite a stumbling block. All seem to think that Lebron's situation will be settled in the next 2 days.

[FerryFor50]

Lebron HATES Dan Gilbert.

Why would anyone hate Dan Gilbert?

[theAlaskanBear]

If LeBron is back in Miami, Bosh is back.

Secondly, I am not as optimistic about Cleveland's future as many are. Of course, LeBron makes any team a contender, and I DO agree that LBJ really needs a primary ballhandler/PG to take the pressure off of him during the regular season. James has never played with any approximation of a good PG.

That said, outside of Kyrie, what is so appealing about Team Cavaliers? They have a poor frontline (Varejao hasnt been healthy for 4 years, Thompson is good, but they have no depth and no big defensive presence). The SG position is either an unproven rookie with questions about his ball handling, or Dion Waiters. They have to trade their back up PG Jarret Jack to clear up cap space. What are they going to do, play Thompson at C and Bennett at PF, James at SF, Wiggins at SG, and Kyrie at PG? Thompson at C, James at PF, Wiggins at SF, Waiters at SG, Kyrie at PG?

The Cavs don't even have any Euro players they have stashed and can bring over. PS don't look at the Cleveland Cavs draft history post LeBron, unless you want a bleak morning.

[FerryFor50]

If LeBron is back in Miami, Bosh is back.

Secondly, I am not as optimistic about Cleveland's future as many are. Of course, LeBron makes any team a contender, and I DO agree that LBJ really needs a primary ballhandler/PG to take the pressure off of him during the regular season. James has never played with any approximation of a good PG.

That said, outside of Kyrie, what is so appealing about Team Cavaliers? They have a poor frontline (Varejao hasnt been healthy for 4 years, Thompson is good, but they have no depth and no big defensive presence). The SG position is either an unproven rookie with questions about his ball handling, or Dion Waiters. They have to trade their back up PG Jarret Jack to clear up cap space. What are they going to do, play Thompson at C and Bennett at PF, James at SF, Wiggins at SG, and Kyrie at PG? Thompson at C, James at PF, Wiggins at SF, Waiters at SG, Kyrie at PG?

The Cavs don't even have any Euro players they have stashed and can bring over. PS don't look at the Cleveland Cavs draft history post LeBron, unless you want a bleak morning.

Plus Miami made an effort to upgrade their PG situation by getting the PG LeBron wanted.

[superdave]

Marc Stein@ESPNSteinLine
Popular question raised by last five teams I've talked to: Is Melo holding out in hopes Bosh goes to Houston so he can join LeBron in Miami?
about 10 hours ago Reply Retweet Favorite


I could see Melo keeping this in mind. He would still have to take less than the max, but he would be on a contender for the first time in his career.

This could explain the McRoberts deal too - a not so subtle hint to Bosh to move one. But from x-o standpoint, Bosh is a great fit alongside Lebron because he shoots so well. Bosh is also a strong defender, he just drifts outside too much to be a very good rebounder and that puts pressure on Lebron to hit the boards.

[niveklaen]

What baffles me is that Lebron apparently has no interest in accepting a max offer from Houston to play with Howard & Harden - they are both in their prime and are both arguably top 4 at their respective positions - if Lebron wants 5 more titles he should go to Houston

[Duvall]

What baffles me is that Lebron apparently has no interest in accepting a max offer from Houston to play with Howard & Harden - they are both in their prime and are both arguably top 4 at their respective positions - if Lebron wants 5 more titles he should go to Houston

But...it's Houston.

[Billy Dat]

What baffles me is that Lebron apparently has no interest in accepting a max offer from Houston to play with Howard & Harden - they are both in their prime and are both arguably top 4 at their respective positions - if Lebron wants 5 more titles he should go to Houston

I think the primary issue is East vs West. It is SO much easier to get the best record in the East, make the playoffs in the East, play the day-in-day-out regular season in the East, get to the Finals in the East, etc.

[CDu]

I think it's possible.

PG: Napier
SG: Wade
SF: Ariza
PF: LeBron
C: McRoberts

McRoberts is big enough to defend the center position and Haslem would back him up. Ariza shot well last season. Granger would sub in for either him or LeBron. They'd be able to switch off of everything on defense at the 3-5, except maybe Haslem.

On offense this team would be lightning quick. Assuming Wade's knees hold up.

Sure, it's doable. With LeBron able to play any position, almost anything is doable.. But I don't think it's a good idea. For one, that means you're asking James to defend either a PF or a C full-time. That can't sound appealing to him. For another, McRoberts is even softer defensively than Bosh. So you are now going to ask James to take the toughest post assignment defensively, or you're putting McRoberts on the toughest assignment and getting abused there. It also means LeBron is your only good rebounding presence, as again McRoberts is less of a rebounder than Bosh.

Basically, if they went this route, they'd be putting even more burden on James. I can't see that being a good sales pitch.

[kAzE]

I'm not saying it will happen, but right now it looks like Cleveland and Miami and Cleveland doesn't seem like such a long shot except.......

Lebron HATES Dan Gilbert. That's quite a stumbling block. All seem to think that Lebron's situation will be settled in the next 2 days.

Oh, they are aware of this. Gilbert has got to be prepared to do some kind of public apology. He's an idiot, but he's not THAT dumb. He is a billionaire, after all. All he would really need to say is that he was wrong, and then try to appeal to the hometown boy in LeBron. LeBron has stated publicly that he has always wanted to go back to Cleveland. Nobody thought he would do it while still in his prime, though.

I'm a Cavs fan, so my perspective is biased, but I still think it's the best possible outcome for the NBA. It would be a hell of a story. Going back to Miami is so boring . . .

[CDu]

Marc Stein@ESPNSteinLine
Popular question raised by last five teams I've talked to: Is Melo holding out in hopes Bosh goes to Houston so he can join LeBron in Miami?
about 10 hours ago Reply Retweet Favorite


I could see Melo keeping this in mind. He would still have to take less than the max, but he would be on a contender for the first time in his career.

This could explain the McRoberts deal too - a not so subtle hint to Bosh to move one. But from x-o standpoint, Bosh is a great fit alongside Lebron because he shoots so well. Bosh is also a strong defender, he just drifts outside too much to be a very good rebounder and that puts pressure on Lebron to hit the boards.

The problem with this is that they'd have to convince somebody to take a lot less. With McRoberts and Granger and Cole taking up cap space (remember, in order to get Anthony, they'd need to be substantially under the cap, which means Granger and McRoberts are no longer exceptions but instead part of the cap), they'd have to renounce Bosh and Wade. They'd only have about $29 million in cap space (James+Granger+McRoberts+Cole+Napier+7 empty roster spots = $34 million). So they'd have to talk Anthony and Wade into taking BIG pay cuts to make it happen. And if you're getting Anthony to take such a big paycut, seems like he would be better served going to a younger, deeper group like Chicago.

Realistically, the only way they get a max guy is if Bosh returns.

[kAzE]

The problem with this is that they'd have to convince somebody to take a lot less. With McRoberts and Granger and Cole taking up cap space (remember, in order to get Anthony, they'd need to be substantially under the cap, which means Granger and McRoberts are no longer exceptions but instead part of the cap), they'd have to renounce Bosh and Wade. They'd only have about $29 million in cap space (James+Granger+McRoberts+Cole+Napier+7 empty roster spots = $34 million). So they'd have to talk Anthony and Wade into taking BIG pay cuts to make it happen. And if you're getting Anthony to take such a big paycut, seems like he would be better served going to a younger, deeper group like Chicago.

Realistically, the only way they get a max guy is if Bosh returns.

It's all speculation, but I think when LeBron figured out that teaming with Melo in the East wasn't going to happen, that was when he began to seriously think about Cleveland. They can give LeBron the best possible supporting cast while still giving him max money. You don't get the chance to play with 3 other overall number 1 picks (2 who are still on rookie contracts) just anywhere. Having a veteran supporting cast costs money.

[theAlaskanBear]

What baffles me is that Lebron apparently has no interest in accepting a max offer from Houston to play with Howard & Harden - they are both in their prime and are both arguably top 4 at their respective positions - if Lebron wants 5 more titles he should go to Houston

I actually think the PHX Suns have the most potential. With Frye leaving, they need another big, they have space to max both James AND Bosh. They are young, and have depth at all positions. Dragic and Bledsoe to take the ballhandling duties off of LeBron. Young athletic big who can run and dunk and defend (Plumlee) and complement Bosh. Depth at all positions. Its a different style of ball than James has played with Cleveland and Miami....I think he would have a lot of fun on more of a run and gun fastbreak team.

Houston and the Bulls would be next. I think Bulls would be better solely due to Thibs, but Bulls have more question marks. Outside shooting? What does Rose look like? Health?

But that being said, would LeBron be more revered for bringing a championship to a long suffering city like Cleveland, the Knicks....or Phoenix? No question there.

[ice-9]

Sure, it's doable. With LeBron able to play any position, almost anything is doable.. But I don't think it's a good idea. For one, that means you're asking James to defend either a PF or a C full-time. That can't sound appealing to him. For another, McRoberts is even softer defensively than Bosh. So you are now going to ask James to take the toughest post assignment defensively, or you're putting McRoberts on the toughest assignment and getting abused there. It also means LeBron is your only good rebounding presence, as again McRoberts is less of a rebounder than Bosh.

Basically, if they went this route, they'd be putting even more burden on James. I can't see that being a good sales pitch.

Yeah, I hear you, the team doesn't seem good to me either. Basically, the Heat is stuck between a rock and a hard place, unless Bosh and Wade take HUGE pay cuts.

[CDu]

I actually think the PHX Suns have the most potential. With Frye leaving, they need another big, they have space to max both James AND Bosh. They are young, and have depth at all positions. Dragic and Bledsoe to take the ballhandling duties off of LeBron. Young athletic big who can run and dunk and defend (Plumlee) and complement Bosh. Depth at all positions. Its a different style of ball than James has played with Cleveland and Miami....I think he would have a lot of fun on more of a run and gun fastbreak team.

Houston and the Bulls would be next. I think Bulls would be better solely due to Thibs, but Bulls have more question marks. Outside shooting? What does Rose look like? Health?

The Suns don't actually have the cap space to sign two players to max contracts. They only have about $34 million in cap space, and that is assuming that they renounce Eric Bledsoe, PJ Tucker, and all of their draft picks. So at that point, you're looking at a roster of Dragic, Plumlee, Alex Len, the Morris twins, Archie Goodwin, and Gerald Green. Does that roster look appealing enough for one of the two to take a pay cut? Especially to play in the Western Conference?

I think Houston offers Bosh the best opportunity. He can go there, get the max, be the second scorer alongside Harden, and not have to worry about defense. Howard/Harden/Bosh is a pretty formidable trio. As the Spurs get older, it might contend.

I think the Bulls offer the best opportunity for Carmelo, but getting there is trickier (either he has to take a substantive pay cut or the Bulls have to work out a sign and trade deal).

I think Houston (if Bosh didn't go there) would work similarly well for LeBron, with Cleveland offering the next best chance. But I just can't see him considering Cleveland. The Bulls would work too. But again the issue of contract is a problem, and there's no way that Riley would do a sign-and-trade with the Bulls.

[budwom]

No big time free agent will choose to go to Cleveland, the only thing they can hope for is to keep a star draft pick for a long time because they can offer the most money. That being said, I am still SHOCKED Kyrie signed an extension there. 'Bron isn't going back to Cleveland. It's a PR politeness move to make them feel good about themselves because they almost got LeBron back.

Among those who claim to know, Cleveland is VERY much in the LeBron sweepstakes, Mrs. LeBron reportedly favors it. Never misunderestimate (sic) that.

[johnb]

No big time free agent will choose to go to Cleveland, the only thing they can hope for is to keep a star draft pick for a long time because they can offer the most money. That being said, I am still SHOCKED Kyrie signed an extension there. 'Bron isn't going back to Cleveland. It's a PR politeness move to make them feel good about themselves because they almost got LeBron back.

I wonder about this. While NY and LA remain media hubs (and so could enhance visibility), is it particularly advantageous financially to stay in a second-tier media city like Miami (with a lame fan base) rather than move back to Cleveland if the nuts and bolts of the contracts are equivalent? If LBJ sees Wiggins+Kyrie>>Bosh+Wade, and if he believes the Cavs could make deep playoff runs, then what would be the negative? He's as visible as he can get, and he'd be able to add in the bit about returning home. Leaving aside the issue of not being able to spend all his money anyway as well as the issue of wanting to spend the season near his home, what would be the financial negative?

Having said that, I imagine he'll simply sign whatever contract pays the most...

[budwom]

He may not leave much money on the table, but I think he wants to win above all else and will not necessarily take the highest offer.

[Duke3517]

I think LeBron needs to stop teasing the fans of Cleveland and tell them point blank he is not coming back. Right now he is like the hot girl you dated for a while and she broke up with you after a couple of months. Then two years later that same girl starts calling you again giving you false hope only to find out she is sleeping with your buddy and you are heartbroken again.

[greybeard]

This happens in two days or not at all. As I've said earlier, Wade is done, maybe he could get a gig somewhere coming off the bench, if he can go, he contributes, if not, he sits back down, but, more than that, over. He had the contract, but was forced to opt out once Lebron did, I am sure after discussions, and then Bosh. Bottom line, Wade signs an extension deal at numbers that, with a little help from each of the other three, is sufficient to bring Melo (that number was set long ago), during training camp, Wade announces that he is retiring effective immediately on orders from his doctors who tell him he'll be a cripple in no time if he keeps going, the league experts agree because, well, it happens to be true, Riley holds a press conference stating that this resignation is the proudest and saddest day in Heat history, proudest because he is there to announce that Wade will be starting as his special assistant in charge of "S"--it will be a real job which will get Wade started on his next career, aka Dominique, not a hand-shaker. Wade is happy as hell because his knees are killing him, and with his new salary as executive added to his contract salary, the number is starting to look pretty much in the range of what a guy of his stature with playable but impaired knees would draw.

Wade has been dragging his feet, probably over what his duties and perks and salary will be on his new job, but time waits for no one, especially now that Lebron has begun walking dead I'm a real wanker for saying this.I'm a real wanker for saying this.I'm a real wanker for saying this. to the edge. Deals always get down at the 11th hour; the 11th hour done passed. It happens by this time Thursday or Wade is toast.

Just one scenario but you have to admit it fits oh so well with the wise guys who run the hotels in Miami.

[Dev11]

I think LeBron needs to stop teasing the fans of Cleveland and tell them point blank he is not coming back. Right now he is like the hot girl you dated for a while and she broke up with you after a couple of months. Then two years later that same girl starts calling you again giving you false hope only to find out she is sleeping with your buddy and you are heartbroken again.

Just as in 2010, LeBron hasn't said anything. He's going to make the best decision for him and for his family, yada yada yada. It's everybody else who make all the noise.

LeBron is beholden to no writers and no fans. He'll do what he wants when he wants to do it.

I hope he ends up in Cleveland or Houston. Those would be the the most interesting basektball teams, in my opinion.

[Duke3517]

Houston won't have the cap space to bring in him and bosh

[Duvall]

This is less than surprising, I guess. (http://sports.yahoo.com/news/hornets-pursuing-marvin-williams-as-possible-replacement-for-josh-mcroberts-002155659.html)


After losing free agent Josh McRoberts to the Miami Heat, the Charlotte Hornets are pursuing free agent Marvin Williams to take over the power forward slot, league sources told Yahoo Sports.

The Hornets and Williams have discussed parameters of a deal, but no agreement is imminent, sources told Yahoo Sports.

Williams, 28, is perhaps the best available power forward left on the free-agent market and it could be paramount to the Hornets to secure him.

Er, wouldn't that be Bosh?

[NashvilleDevil]

This happens in two days or not at all. As I've said earlier, Wade is done, maybe he could get a gig somewhere coming off the bench, if he can go, he contributes, if not, he sits back down, but, more than that, over. He had the contract, but was forced to opt out once Lebron did, I am sure after discussions, and then Bosh. Bottom line, Wade signs an extension deal at numbers that, with a little help from each of the other three, is sufficient to bring Melo (that number was set long ago), during training camp, Wade announces that he is retiring effective immediately on orders from his doctors who tell him he'll be a cripple in no time if he keeps going, the league experts agree because, well, it happens to be true, Riley holds a press conference stating that this resignation is the proudest and saddest day in Heat history, proudest because he is there to announce that Wade will be starting as his special assistant in charge of "S"--it will be a real job which will get Wade started on his next career, aka Dominique, not a hand-shaker. Wade is happy as hell because his knees are killing him, and with his new salary as executive added to his contract salary, the number is starting to look pretty much in the range of what a guy of his stature with playable but impaired knees would draw.

Wade has been dragging his feet, probably over what his duties and perks and salary will be on his new job, but time waits for no one, especially now that Lebron has begun walking dead I'm a real wanker for saying this.I'm a real wanker for saying this.I'm a real wanker for saying this. to the edge. Deals always get down at the 11th hour; the 11th hour done passed. It happens by this time Thursday or Wade is toast.

Just one scenario but you have to admit it fits oh so well with the wise guys who run the hotels in Miami.
Where do you come up with this stuff? This scenario has zero chance of happening. Zero.

[niveklaen]

This is less than surprising, I guess. (http://sports.yahoo.com/news/hornets-pursuing-marvin-williams-as-possible-replacement-for-josh-mcroberts-002155659.html)



Er, wouldn't that be Bosh?

Is G Henderson a free agent this summer? what are the odds he is included in a sign and trade or straight up trade for Marvin Williams?

[FerryFor50]

Great article by Zach Lowe on the unfairness of the current CBA:

http://grantland.com/features/nba-miami-heat-double-standard-contract-sacrifice-lebron-james-chris-bosh-houston-rockets-free-agency/

[theAlaskanBear]

The Suns don't actually have the cap space to sign two players to max contracts. They only have about $34 million in cap space, and that is assuming that they renounce Eric Bledsoe, PJ Tucker, and all of their draft picks. So at that point, you're looking at a roster of Dragic, Plumlee, Alex Len, the Morris twins, Archie Goodwin, and Gerald Green. Does that roster look appealing enough for one of the two to take a pay cut? Especially to play in the Western Conference?

I think Houston offers Bosh the best opportunity. He can go there, get the max, be the second scorer alongside Harden, and not have to worry about defense. Howard/Harden/Bosh is a pretty formidable trio. As the Spurs get older, it might contend.

I think the Bulls offer the best opportunity for Carmelo, but getting there is trickier (either he has to take a substantive pay cut or the Bulls have to work out a sign and trade deal).

I think Houston (if Bosh didn't go there) would work similarly well for LeBron, with Cleveland offering the next best chance. But I just can't see him considering Cleveland. The Bulls would work too. But again the issue of contract is a problem, and there's no way that Riley would do a sign-and-trade with the Bulls.

You are right, I must have misinterpreted an article about the Suns having enough room to sign them, as having enough to max them out.

Where are you getting your numbers? What I have just looked up is that the Suns have ~23 in guaranteed contracts, ~32 with Bledsoe and draft picks. That would leave ~31 in cap space.

Here is an article that states the Suns pitch to LeBron was being able to max or near max both James/Bosh or James/Melo by trading the Morris twins and Alex Len, while keeping the Dragic/Bledsoe/Plumlee core together:

http://www.cbssports.com/nba/eye-on-basketball/24611140/decision-20-what-if-lebron-james-joined-the-suns

So the Suns would definitely lose some of the depth, but that is still an impressive lineup.

[awhom111]

Is G Henderson a free agent this summer? what are the odds he is included in a sign and trade or straight up trade for Marvin Williams?

Not a free agent. 6 Million this year and and a player option for the same amount next summer.

[CDu]

You are right, I must have misinterpreted an article about the Suns having enough room to sign them, as having enough to max them out.

Where are you getting your numbers? What I have just looked up is that the Suns have ~23 in guaranteed contracts, ~32 with Bledsoe and draft picks. That would leave ~31 in cap space.

Here is an article that states the Suns pitch to LeBron was being able to max or near max both James/Bosh or James/Melo by trading the Morris twins and Alex Len, while keeping the Dragic/Bledsoe/Plumlee core together:

http://www.cbssports.com/nba/eye-on-basketball/24611140/decision-20-what-if-lebron-james-joined-the-suns

So the Suns would definitely lose some of the depth, but that is still an impressive lineup.

I was looking at shamsports, which is the premier source for cap info. The Suns have $23 million in guaranteed active players, $2.3 million owed to Beasley, and cap holds for empty roster spots that total to about $29 million. That is excluding Bledsoe and picks. Basically, the difference in numbers is the Beasley money and empty roster spot holds.

I guess they could get enough cap space if they make trades for draft picks, though that is a lot of trades to make. But yes, if they could shed some of the fluff (it would take more than just Len and the twins), they could get the $42 million in cap space needed to sign both to max deals while keeping Bledsoe.

[Turk]

Speaking of dead cap money, I can't resist mentioning to all two of you Sixers fans out in DBR land that Jason Richardson exercised his player option for next season at $6.6 million a couple weeks ago. It got lost in all the current McBob / Lebron / Bosh / Wade "Waiting for Godot" excitement...

(Wait a minute, I fell victim to one of the classic blunders - the most famous of which is "never get involved in a land war in Asia" - but only slightly less well-known is this: never use "Jason Richardson" and "exercise" in the same sentence). Mea culpa.

Oh yeah, and if by some strange simple twist of fate Lebron winds up in some other city than Miami, he shoudl fax the info to Pat Riley before announcing "The Decision Part Deux."

Bonus link: applying decision trees to the various LBJ / Bosh / Wade permutations using the "Prisoner's Dilemma". I loved it.
http://grantland.com/the-triangle/the-miami-heat-and-the-prisoners-dilemma/

[nocilla]

This is less than surprising, I guess. (http://sports.yahoo.com/news/hornets-pursuing-marvin-williams-as-possible-replacement-for-josh-mcroberts-002155659.html)

"Williams, 28, is perhaps the best available power forward left on the free-agent market"

Er, wouldn't that be Bosh?

Or maybe it's Gordon Hayward?

http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/11193887/gordon-hayward-charlotte-hornets-agree-63-million-offer-sheet

[JasonEvans]

Or maybe it's Gordon Hayward?

http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/11193887/gordon-hayward-charlotte-hornets-agree-63-million-offer-sheet

Utah has to match. Hayward is a fabulous player though and would be a great signing for Charlotte if Utah does not match. I can't imagine a workable sign-and-trade as Utah is not going to want to take back $14 mil or so in salaries from Charlotte.

-Jason "Hayward gets the max -- good for him!" Evans

[superdave]

Utah has to match. Hayward is a fabulous player though and would be a great signing for Charlotte if Utah does not match. I can't imagine a workable sign-and-trade as Utah is not going to want to take back $14 mil or so in salaries from Charlotte.

-Jason "Hayward gets the max -- good for him!" Evans

Good for Gordon but bad for the NBA. Average to above-average guys like him making max money is why teams get bogged down in salary cap muck for years, never able to eclipse 45 wins. It is also the reason why guys like Lebron wind up taking less money to help get the Udonis Haslem's and Josh McRoberts of the world.

I dont know what the answer is, but I cannot see Hayward making the Hornets a contender. He is an upgrade, but he is worth 15-20% less.

Did Cleveland back off its max offer? I guess Lebron flirted enough with them to halt everything else.

[FerryFor50]

Good for Gordon but bad for the NBA. Average to above-average guys like him making max money is why teams get bogged down in salary cap muck for years, never able to eclipse 45 wins. It is also the reason why guys like Lebron wind up taking less money to help get the Udonis Haslem's and Josh McRoberts of the world.

I dont know what the answer is, but I cannot see Hayward making the Hornets a contender. He is an upgrade, but he is worth 15-20% less.

Did Cleveland back off its max offer? I guess Lebron flirted enough with them to halt everything else.

Gordon Hayward: The source of the world's problems? :-P

[superdave]

Gordon Hayward: The source of the world's problems? :-P

Interesting take on the issue from 538: http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/when-to-sign-an-nba-player-to-the-max/

The average player from this group produces about $75 million worth of market value in his extension seasons — about $20 million less than his team would need to pay him.

and

According to our model, in fact, players in the 90th through 94th percentiles are expected to produce a significantly negative return on investment when signed to max extensions, receiving almost $20 million more in salary than their production is worth.

As discussed previously regarding the Cavs potential max offer to Hayward, Charlotte is likely paying the "No free agent would want to come here" premium. I would be interested in seeing the expected number of wins with and without Hayward from the advanced stats guys. I am guessing it is nowhere near worthy of max money.

[FerryFor50]

Cavs trade Jarret Jack and Sergey Karasev to the Nets; Marcus Thornton and Tyler Zeller and a first rounder go to the Celtics.

http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/11194467/jarrett-jack-cleveland-cavaliers-headed-brooklyn-nets-boston-celtics-part-trade

[BlueDevilBrowns]

Did Cleveland back off its max offer? I guess Lebron flirted enough with them to halt everything else.

It may be more than just flirting...

http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/11194467/jarrett-jack-cleveland-cavaliers-headed-brooklyn-nets-boston-celtics-part-trade


The Cavs have traded Zeller, Jack, a 1st round pick, and last year's 2nd round pick to Boston and NJ for nothing back but a future 2nd rounder.

They have about 24 million cleared now to offer Lebron the Max.

Time will tell....

[kAzE]

Good for Gordon but bad for the NBA. Average to above-average guys like him making max money is why teams get bogged down in salary cap muck for years, never able to eclipse 45 wins. It is also the reason why guys like Lebron wind up taking less money to help get the Udonis Haslem's and Josh McRoberts of the world.

I dont know what the answer is, but I cannot see Hayward making the Hornets a contender. He is an upgrade, but he is worth 15-20% less.

Did Cleveland back off its max offer? I guess Lebron flirted enough with them to halt everything else.

Cleveland offered him 60 over 4, but didn't bother further pursuing him after it became evident that they were in the running for LeBron. The Jazz are pretty dumb, in my opinion. Hayward never would have gotten to restricted free agency if talks between Hayward and the team over an extension didn't break down over a measly 1 million dollars a year. Hayward wanted $13 mil a year, but the Jazz refused to go over 12. Now he's going to sign the Hornet's offer sheet for 15.75 (63 over 4), so the Jazz pretty much have to let him leave. They'll look like idiots if they match. They stated they would match any offer, but I guess they didn't think anyone would offer more than 12? What kind of league do they think they are in?

[kAzE]

Cavs trade Jarret Jack and Sergey Karasev to the Nets; Marcus Thornton and Tyler Zeller and a first rounder go to the Celtics.

http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/11194467/jarrett-jack-cleveland-cavaliers-headed-brooklyn-nets-boston-celtics-part-trade

I'm not thrilled about the move. Unless they have some sort of knowledge that LeBron is absolutely willing to join the team, this seems like a desperate gamble, giving up a lot of good assets to create space. I liked Karasev, he's going to be a rotation player in this league. He's a big wing and he can really shoot it. Zeller was never spectacular, but he was an above average backup big who could play the 4 or 5, and is capable of knocking down open 18 footers. We're already stretched up front, so this move just depletes the front court even more. Not sure which first rounder they gave up, but giving up any first rounder just to create cap space is pretty bad. Still, if it gets us LeBron, it's 1000% worth it. Fingers, toes, and eyes crossed.

[FerryFor50]

I'm not thrilled about the move. Unless they have some sort of knowledge that LeBron is absolutely willing to join the team, this seems like a desperate gamble, giving up a lot of good assets to create space. I liked Karasev, he's going to be a rotation player in this league. He's a big wing and he can really shoot it. Zeller was never spectacular, but he was an above average backup big who could play the 4 or 5, and is capable of knocking down open 18 footers. We're already stretched up front, so this move just depletes the front court even more. Not sure which first rounder they gave up, but giving up any first rounder just to create cap space is pretty bad. Still, if it gets us LeBron, it's 1000% worth it. Fingers, toes, and eyes crossed.

Agreed. Plus they set up even more LBJ vitriol if he doesn't sign there.

[BlueDevilBrowns]

I wonder about this. While NY and LA remain media hubs (and so could enhance visibility), is it particularly advantageous financially to stay in a second-tier media city like Miami (with a lame fan base) rather than move back to Cleveland if the nuts and bolts of the contracts are equivalent? If LBJ sees Wiggins+Kyrie>>Bosh+Wade, and if he believes the Cavs could make deep playoff runs, then what would be the negative? He's as visible as he can get, and he'd be able to add in the bit about returning home. Leaving aside the issue of not being able to spend all his money anyway as well as the issue of wanting to spend the season near his home, what would be the financial negative?

Having said that, I imagine he'll simply sign whatever contract pays the most...

Apparently johnb, you haven't been reading much of the posts on this forum lately regarding the Cavs and the city of Cleveland.

If you had, then you'd already know that Cleveland is the world capital of Poverty, Injustice, Racism, Hunger, Leprosy, Scurvy, Rickets, and, even worse, Dan Gilbert.

I mean, if Attila the Hun, Genghis Kahn, and the entire cast of "300" walked into a bar and saw Dan Gilbert sitting there, they'd run the other way and/or fall down and beg for mercy. What a dispicable man he is.

So, believe me, there is NO WAY anyone will ever move to Cleveland again.

Hell even says that place sucks.

[JasonEvans]

Agreed. Plus they set up even more LBJ vitriol if he doesn't sign there.

Yup, I thought the same thing. If he does not sign with them, they just gutted their roster for nothing.

It is worth noting that with 24 mil in cap room, the Cavs have room to sign Lebron and someone else (for a couple mil a year). There is buzz that they are talking to Ray Allen.

-Jason "is there any way Deng comes back on a 1 year $2-3 mil deal with the wink-wink promise Cleveland will sign him for real money next summer?" Evans

[FerryFor50]

Yup, I thought the same thing. If he does not sign with them, they just gutted their roster for nothing.

It is worth noting that with 24 mil in cap room, the Cavs have room to sign Lebron and someone else (for a couple mil a year). There is buzz that they are talking to Ray Allen.

-Jason "is there any way Deng comes back on a 1 year $2-3 mil deal with the wink-wink promise Cleveland will sign him for real money next summer?" Evans

Why Ray Allen? He's on the verge of retirement and can't really play meaningful minutes anymore, playoff performance notwithstanding. Plus, you think Dion Waiters was a problem before? Wait till he starts losing minutes to Ray Allen...

[Duvall]

Agreed. Plus they set up even more LBJ vitriol if he doesn't sign there.

I mean, I would at least hope the media would be less indulgent of petulant Cleveland fans the second time around. Maybe not.

[FerryFor50]

I mean, I would at least hope the media would be less indulgent of petulant Cleveland fans the second time around. Maybe not.

Hate sells.

[BlueDevilBrowns]

Yup, I thought the same thing. If he does not sign with them, they just gutted their roster for nothing.

It is worth noting that with 24 mil in cap room, the Cavs have room to sign Lebron and someone else (for a couple mil a year). There is buzz that they are talking to Ray Allen.

-Jason "is there any way Deng comes back on a 1 year $2-3 mil deal with the wink-wink promise Cleveland will sign him for real money next summer?" Evans

IF Lebron does return, the two things Cleveland will need next year is spot-up 3-point shooting and a shot-blocking/rebounding big.

So, the Ray Allen thing makes since(especially since Allen has already stated he wanted to play another season with Lebron).

While having Deng sure would be great for depth and would help as the stretch-4 if Bennett isn't ready to step up, I don't see it as more important than shooting and size.

[BD80]

Yup, I thought the same thing. If he does not sign with them, they just gutted their roster for nothing.

It is worth noting that with 24 mil in cap room, the Cavs have room to sign Lebron and someone else (for a couple mil a year). ...

If the city is willing to take back Lebron after the furor his leaving created, why not sign Carlos Boozer for a couple of mil after Chicago amnesties him?

[FerryFor50]

If the city is willing to take back Lebron after the furor his leaving created, why not sign Carlos Boozer for a couple of mil after Chicago amnesties him?

We're getting the band back together??


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dzOHq5WbQ8k