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MarkD83
06-02-2014, 12:54 PM
I read the "Lack of Speed Kills" article up on DBR and it triggered an issue I have long worried about with basketball.

No one seems to find good defensive basketball entertaining.

Good defense in the NFL is entertaining, good defense in the NHL is entertaining, good defense in MLB is entertaining.....why is good defense in basketball NOT entertaining.

Maybe we should just make defense illegal in basketball. No one on defense can be in the 3-point lane. If you get within 2 feet of an offensive player with the ball it is a foul. Let's have 40 minute games with scores in the 120's.

That would get boring really fast.

lotusland
06-02-2014, 08:39 PM
I read the "Lack of Speed Kills" article up on DBR and it triggered an issue I have long worried about with basketball.

No one seems to find good defensive basketball entertaining.

Good defense in the NFL is entertaining, good defense in the NHL is entertaining, good defense in MLB is entertaining.....why is good defense in basketball NOT entertaining.

Maybe we should just make defense illegal in basketball. No one on defense can be in the 3-point lane. If you get within 2 feet of an offensive player with the ball it is a foul. Let's have 40 minute games with scores in the 120's.

That would get boring really fast.

I enjoyed watching UVA and Cuse this year. I can't say I enjoyed watching Clemson but that has more to do with how Duke played.

MarkD83
06-02-2014, 08:43 PM
I enjoyed watching UVA and Cuse this year. I can't say I enjoyed watching Clemson but that has more to do with how Duke played.

Lotusland,

I get the feeling you and I may be in the minority.

MarkD83

mbwalker
06-02-2014, 11:01 PM
Shot clock.

Don't you think that if ACC ratings fall and low scoring or boring games is felt to be the issue, then the solution would simply be to adopt a 30 second shot clock?

It would place more of a premium on good defense, but would also speed up the game.

Of course, if the ratings continue to be acceptable, then it doesn't matter how boring the games are.

Dukeface88
06-03-2014, 12:53 AM
Good defense in the NFL is entertaining

Given the number of recent rule changes favoring offenses (and in particular, pass-heavy offenses), this seems to be a minority opinion. I understand some of those changes have been caused by safety concerns, but there's been no attempt to maintain a balanced approach to the game.

Des Esseintes
06-03-2014, 01:51 AM
I read the "Lack of Speed Kills" article up on DBR and it triggered an issue I have long worried about with basketball.

No one seems to find good defensive basketball entertaining.

Good defense in the NFL is entertaining, good defense in the NHL is entertaining, good defense in MLB is entertaining.....why is good defense in basketball NOT entertaining.

Maybe we should just make defense illegal in basketball. No one on defense can be in the 3-point lane. If you get within 2 feet of an offensive player with the ball it is a foul. Let's have 40 minute games with scores in the 120's.

That would get boring really fast.
The argument isn't *against* defense. It's *for* scoring. Think of it this way: if ACC teams averaged 80ppg as a whole, there would still be a best defensive team. There would still be a team we could appreciate for its acumen in positioning and staying tough in the post. It would just be that on average games featured more scoring, which I don't think I am being controversial in saying would be an improvement. I mean, is anyone stumping for the old days of playing 30-26 games and taking in all that "glorious" defense? Calling the game in such a way as to increase scoring does not punish great defense. It merely provides a different environment in which it can excel. Witness the Seattle Seahawks, justly praised for terrific D at a time when the NFL is undergoing a scoring explosion. The rules give quarterbacks and receivers an advantage, but that hasn't stopped Earl Thomas and Richard Sherman from becoming household names. Similarly, Duke had wonderful man-to-man defenses back in a more brilliant scoring era of the ACC. Do you think the defense was shoddy then? I don't. I'd love to experience a similar environment again.

MarkD83
06-03-2014, 06:39 AM
My thought is the higher scoring in the past was due to not penalizing pressure defense. You could trap outside and if someone turned the corner and ran into the trap it was a charge. This meant players thought twice about dribbling a lot and would do more passing rather than dribbling. Good denial defense meant more steals leading to fast breaks and more scoring. In addition, since players thought about getting called for charges and passed more, the offenses were crisp. The other benefit of rewarding good defense is since offensive players could not rely on getting to the rim to score they actually were better shooters.

I am torn about the 30 second clock. If players can't shoot then a shorter shot clock will mean even less passing, more rushed shots and worse scoring.

lotusland
06-03-2014, 08:05 AM
My thought is the higher scoring in the past was due to not penalizing pressure defense. You could trap outside and if someone turned the corner and ran into the trap it was a charge. This meant players thought twice about dribbling a lot and would do more passing rather than dribbling. Good denial defense meant more steals leading to fast breaks and more scoring. In addition, since players thought about getting called for charges and passed more, the offenses were crisp. The other benefit of rewarding good defense is since offensive players could not rely on getting to the rim to score they actually were better shooters.

I am torn about the 30 second clock. If players can't shoot then a shorter shot clock will mean even less passing, more rushed shots and worse scoring.

Well Cal joined Andy Katz and Seth Greenberg on the latest ESPN Basketball podcast and pretty much interviewed himself. His point I think, amongst his fever pitched rant, was that physical play not tempo is the issue resulting in less scoring so "holding and mugging" for 30 seconds won't be an improvement. He liked the way the game was called early in the season last year vs later. I actually agree with him. A cognitive dissonance exists imo between making the game less physical and allowing unlimited fouls as suggested by Vitale and others though. I think maybe I'd shorten the shot clock and call the hold and push fouls on the perimeter. Defenders don't have to stay in front of their guys as long and the offense has freedom of movement. What I don't want is matador defense in the lane every time guy beats his man off the dribble. I think you should have to drive under control and defenders shouldn't have to get out of the way just because they're not standing in a perfect charge position when someone flies into the lane as if no one is there. I'd like to see more no calls on body contact inside the circle when the offensive player goes flying at the rack. I know dunks are exciting but you can change speed, change directions, pull up for a jump shot or a tear drop. Kyrie is a master of changing speed and direction in the lane and rarely dunked the ball and Nolan developed a sweet tear drop.

I also agree with Cal on his common sense suggestions on treatment of athletes i.e. providing insurance, meals and travel arrangements for student athletes to return home twice a year and immediate families to attend games periodically. While those may "benefits" that other students don't get, it's not the same as being paid imo.