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View Full Version : MBB. Duke v Syracuse Pre-Game and In-Game Thread



gofurman
02-21-2014, 12:09 AM
Need to get my mind off UNC ! Thoughts?

SirBlueDevil
02-21-2014, 05:27 AM
I'm trying to do the same thing GoFur but even as i type this post, my thoughts still are on last nights upset and more importantly why the storming of the court?

I will say this for the record, the blue devils will come out much differently come saturday evening at home against the orangemen. I'm not saying we'll blow the cuse away by double digits (although we have the team to do it) but i do trust and believe besides coach and his staff laying into the guys after last nights blown lead loss.

The blue devils will play with a focus come saturday and no doubt avenge both the cuse loss tomorrow and unc loss in our rematch!

dukelifer
02-21-2014, 05:54 AM
Need to get my mind off UNC ! Thoughts?

Timing is again horrible. It will be interesting to see how Duke plays with Syracuse the second time after seeing their zone. Of course the same is true with Syracuse after playing Duke's interior or lack of interior D. The short turnaround and Syracuse having much more time to get ready puts Duke at a huge disadvantage for the second half where the game will be won. Foul trouble is a major concern. The crowd will need to give Duke energy- but this has been a brutal week for a relatively young Duke team.

CLW
02-21-2014, 05:56 AM
I have concerns the team will be absolutely GASSED (K noted in his postgame last night that the team looked tired). Plus the way we lost last night could also affect the team's confidence. This game was HUGE and it's even bigger now as we need it to hold onto a 3 seed in the ACC tourny. If we fail to beat the Cuse we could easily slip to 4th or 5th by the end of the season and potentially lose the bye in the ACC Tourny.

Should we be fortunate to win this game I pray that the students do NOT rush the Court.

moonpie23
02-21-2014, 06:42 AM
Crazies need to bring IT to the game to help the team……they are going to need a big boost after last night..


Cuse has been skating on thin ice of late….i'm sure they're not overly confident either….

Saratoga2
02-21-2014, 07:11 AM
I believe that we have been getting tired in the second half of competitive games and that both our offense and defense has suffered as a result. Coach K admitted that he was rightly upset and unfocused due to his brothers passing. He mentioned that his assistant coaches asked him to use more of his players due to the depth and quality of the bench. When he did, the results were remarkable. Fresher players, more pressure on the opponents, etc. What we have seen of late is a reversion to a shorter bench and that is not helping, particularly when we play 4 games in 8 days. My suggestions for improved play going forward are as follows:

1. Use Marshall more. He clearly did well against UNC and should be getting at least 15 minutes a game if not more. His use would lighten the load on Jabari and Amile making them fresher down the stretch. I also believe that Marshall has some upside offensively. Try to set him up for dunks inside. Few teams have someone of his size and athleticism.

2. Split up Quinn and Tyler, giving each PG duties. Who starts depends on who runs the offense the best. Allow for Rasheed and Matt to play the SG position with Rasheed getting the majority of those minutes. Keep the defensive pressure on the opponents. Encourage Matt to become a part of the offense. He has ball handling and shooting skills but needs positive feedback rather than fear of being pulled.

3. Use Andre to sub for Rodney. Rodney has appeared tired again in the second half against UNC and has been getting into foul trouble.

4. Use Semi also for short periods to spread the load for the bigger guys. Maybe a few minutes a half would give our top players the rest they need. I put Semi ahead of Josh after seeing Josh have poor foul numbers and essentially no rebounds and no scoring. Semi is the superior athlete of the two.

We still need to play Jabari, Rodney, Amile, Cook and Rasheed for extended minutes, but lets give these guys breaks during the game to reduce foul issues and to improve both their offense and defense while in the game.

I remember the Syracuse game where Fair, Grant, and Ennis hurt us. We need to stay fresh against these guys.

SirBlueDevil
02-21-2014, 07:26 AM
Clw, trust and believe when we beat cuse this saturday duke fans have more than enough class to know the "W" wouldn't warrant our storming of the court.

After all it's our homecourt, we should be able to protect it!

DukieInBrasil
02-21-2014, 07:45 AM
I have concerns the team will be absolutely GASSED (K noted in his postgame last night that the team looked tired). Plus the way we lost last night could also affect the team's confidence. This game was HUGE and it's even bigger now as we need it to hold onto a 3 seed in the ACC tourny. If we fail to beat the Cuse we could easily slip to 4th or 5th by the end of the season and potentially lose the bye in the ACC Tourny.

Should we be fortunate to win this game I pray that the students do NOT rush the Court.

seems like that is something that he could have addressed during the game. i agree with those in the UNC post-game thread who said K got out-coached by Roy, which is something i never would have thought i would say. Boeheim is a great coach, who knows K's tendencies, so K will have to do a MUCH better job in this coming game to not get out-coached again.
I hope K doesn't play an even shorter bench vs. the 'Cuse cuz we'll lose again, for many of the same reasons we lost vs. UNC. When the assistant coaches convinced K to play the bench more, the results were positive, immediate and a huge improvement in team play, chemistry, defensive intensity and offensive efficiency. All of those positive factors were absent late in the 2nd half vs UNC. Hopefully K will have learned something from that.

sagegrouse
02-21-2014, 07:57 AM
Clw, trust and believe when we beat cuse this saturday duke fans have more than enough class to know the "W" wouldn't warrant our storming of the court.

After all it's our homecourt, we should be able to protect it!

I look forward to tut-tutting our fans for a ridiculous loss of cool,

superdave
02-21-2014, 07:59 AM
I believe that we have been getting tired in the second half of competitive games and that both our offense and defense has suffered as a result. Coach K admitted that he was rightly upset and unfocused due to his brothers passing. He mentioned that his assistant coaches asked him to use more of his players due to the depth and quality of the bench. When he did, the results were remarkable. Fresher players, more pressure on the opponents, etc. What we have seen of late is a reversion to a shorter bench and that is not helping, particularly when we play 4 games in 8 days. My suggestions for improved play going forward are as follows:

1. Use Marshall more. He clearly did well against UNC and should be getting at least 15 minutes a game if not more. His use would lighten the load on Jabari and Amile making them fresher down the stretch. I also believe that Marshall has some upside offensively. Try to set him up for dunks inside. Few teams have someone of his size and athleticism.

2. Split up Quinn and Tyler, giving each PG duties. Who starts depends on who runs the offense the best. Allow for Rasheed and Matt to play the SG position with Rasheed getting the majority of those minutes. Keep the defensive pressure on the opponents. Encourage Matt to become a part of the offense. He has ball handling and shooting skills but needs positive feedback rather than fear of being pulled.

3. Use Andre to sub for Rodney. Rodney has appeared tired again in the second half against UNC and has been getting into foul trouble.

4. Use Semi also for short periods to spread the load for the bigger guys. Maybe a few minutes a half would give our top players the rest they need. I put Semi ahead of Josh after seeing Josh have poor foul numbers and essentially no rebounds and no scoring. Semi is the superior athlete of the two.

We still need to play Jabari, Rodney, Amile, Cook and Rasheed for extended minutes, but lets give these guys breaks during the game to reduce foul issues and to improve both their offense and defense while in the game.

I remember the Syracuse game where Fair, Grant, and Ennis hurt us. We need to stay fresh against these guys.

Ah substantive basketball discussion!


I agree on splitting Quinn and Tyler. We give up too much size. I'd even be ok with the hockey substitutions at the first tv timeout just to keep things shook up.

The offense runs well through Cook. That is our ideal set - Cook at wheel, setting guys up. However, Rasheed coming off a ball screen is very good at getting into the paint and drawing fouls. Rasheed did little of that last night, but it could be good for getting into the paint tomorrow. Instead of a ball screen Rasheed would have to get a screen on one of the zone defenders to create a gap.

Will we see Jabari and Rodney parked at the free throw line a lot tomorrow? That will keep the zone pulled in some and create space for shooters, or it will get those two the ball in a threatening position. Also, Amile should look to flash to the block if someone penetrates so he can get an easy bucket.

Cracking the Syracuse zone is tough but we will be prepared.

Now about our D....that's what concerns me. We have to guard their bigs straight up to avoid foul trouble. No reaching or shoving. Just force them to hit their shots.

I am glad our turnaround is short. I'm still bitter about last night.

jipops
02-21-2014, 08:55 AM
The biggest game of the year to date with very large implications. I felt great about this one before last night. I've cooled not because of the fact that we lost, but because some level of fatigue became an obvious issue last night. I know it's cliche' at this point, but it's there. I still feel good about it, we usually shoot well in our own gym. But if our legs aren't there, this one won't be close like last time.

Quinn may be one of the more encouraging pieces in this one. Overall he showed a positive spark that I think could carry through, and we'll need him to exploit the Cuse zone. I'd like to see us drive into the teeth a lot in this one.

I'm counting on fouls being an issue once again.

flyingdutchdevil
02-21-2014, 08:58 AM
The biggest game of the year to date with very large implications. I felt great about this one before last night. I've cooled not because of the fact that we lost, but because some level fatigue became an obvious issue last night. I know it's cliche' at this point, but it's there. I still feel good about it, we usually shoot well in our own gym. But if our legs aren't there, this one won't be close like last time.

Quinn may be one of the more encouraging pieces in this one. Overall he showed a positive spark that I think could carry through, and we'll need him to exploit the Cuse zone. I'd like to see us drive into the teeth a lot in this one.

I'm counting on fouls being an issue once again.

For both sides. Boeheim is again gonna make his players attack the rim - especially Jabari and Amile. And I'm positive Coach K will do the same with Jabari, Hood, Sulaimon, and UNC-style Cook. There are gonna be lots and lots of fouls. My guess? At least 2 of Jabari, Hood, Amile, Thornton, Grant, Christmas, and Fair will foul out.

jipops
02-21-2014, 09:04 AM
For both sides. Boeheim is again gonna make his players attack the rim - especially Jabari and Amile. And I'm positive Coach K will do the same with Jabari, Hood, Sulaimon, and UNC-style Cook. There are gonna be lots and lots of fouls. My guess? At least 2 of Jabari, Hood, Amile, Thornton, Grant, Christmas, and Fair will foul out.

I agree, and I think K is going to have to provide Hairston some minutes in this one to offset the foul issues. Maybe, just maybe, he can draw a couple charges. That would be HUGE in this one. Plumlee has certainly earned his minutes at this point.

flyingdutchdevil
02-21-2014, 09:10 AM
I agree, and I think K is going to have to provide Hairston some minutes in this one to offset the foul issues. Maybe, just maybe, he can draw a couple charges. That would be HUGE in this one. Plumlee has certainly earned his minutes at this point.

Plumdog 3.0 is fantastic against big teams, like UNC. Against more mobile teams, he's not as effective. I think we'll see MP3 for a few minutes, but I'm not sure his impact will be the same as against UNC. Syracuse is quick, mobile, and not that beefy. I remember a few plays where Fair terrorized Plumdog 3.0. I hope we're able to utilize Plumlee against Syracuse, but I'm not as sold on this.

And I agree with Hairston. If this is gonna be a blood bath, we're gonna need Hairston to play 10 mins.

nocilla
02-21-2014, 09:25 AM
Plumdog 3.0 is fantastic against big teams, like UNC. Against more mobile teams, he's not as effective. I think we'll see MP3 for a few minutes, but I'm not sure his impact will be the same as against UNC. Syracuse is quick, mobile, and not that beefy. I remember a few plays where Fair terrorized Plumdog 3.0. I hope we're able to utilize Plumlee against Syracuse, but I'm not as sold on this.

And I agree with Hairston. If this is gonna be a blood bath, we're gonna need Hairston to play 10 mins.

Well if Plumlee can stay on Christmas I think it's an okay matchup. He can't stay with Fair, but another big will surely be needed. Maybe Josh does get more minutes just being a little quicker.

El_Diablo
02-21-2014, 09:31 AM
This one is actually pretty simple:

Give Parker the ball at the high post --> ? --> win.

Matches
02-21-2014, 09:41 AM
Well if Plumlee can stay on Christmas I think it's an okay matchup. He can't stay with Fair, but another big will surely be needed. Maybe Josh does get more minutes just being a little quicker.

Hairston and MP3 are both problematic against that zone, because neither of them can really handle the ball. If we're not using the 5 to handle the ball in the high post, it begs the question of where to put them on the floor. You don't want them just taking up space in the lane because that negates the ability for Jabari (who presumably is then in the high post) to drive to the basket.

I know everyone gets hives when we start talking about Jabari playing the 5, but this might be the game to do it (at least for whatever amount of time Amile needs to rest). When Amile's on the bench, use Jabari at the 5 and bring in another shooter (probably Dawkins).

Troublemaker
02-21-2014, 10:03 AM
I'm still so traumatized by last night's 2nd half. We all dislike UNC, but I'm probably in the 99th percentile of Duke fans for outright LOATHING UNC. So, I'll toss in some thoughts about the UNC game after this weekend. (One quickie perspective though: I'm still very positive about the rest of the season, and Duke is going to give UNC a beatdown in Cameron).

But for now, NEXT PLAY.


The short turnaround and Syracuse having much more time to get ready puts Duke at a huge disadvantage for the second half where the game will be won.

Relax. Cuse had a whole extra day to prepare, and both teams know each other from the first meeting already. We'll be fine.


I have concerns the team will be absolutely GASSED

But if our legs aren't there, this one won't be close like last time.

The crowd will give us energy. Tonight Coach K is probably going to have a "team meeting" with the K-ville kids. He'll let them know that tomorrow, Duke will be running the last leg of 3 games in 5 days, and that the team will need the crowd's energy to push us to great heights. These kids who have been camping out all this time will be frothing at the mouth to help our team. We'll be fine.


Boeheim is again gonna make his players attack the rim - especially Jabari and Amile. And I'm positive Coach K will do the same with Jabari, Hood, Sulaimon, and UNC-style Cook. There are gonna be lots and lots of fouls. My guess? At least 2 of Jabari, Hood, Amile, Thornton, Grant, Christmas, and Fair will foul out.

It just depends on the officiating crew. There's been no consistency across crews. If we get one that calls things loosely, foul trouble might not be an issue.


Plumdog 3.0 is fantastic against big teams, like UNC. Against more mobile teams, he's not as effective. I think we'll see MP3 for a few minutes, but I'm not sure his impact will be the same as against UNC. Syracuse is quick, mobile, and not that beefy. I remember a few plays where Fair terrorized Plumdog 3.0. I hope we're able to utilize Plumlee against Syracuse, but I'm not as sold on this.

Plumlee should be fine against Syracuse. He needs to stay on the backline and go for offensive rebounds. The high post should be handled by Amile & Jabari.


If this is gonna be a blood bath, we're gonna need Hairston to play 10 mins.

Unfortunately, I don't think I like Josh at either the high post or the backline.


This one is actually pretty simple:
Give Parker the ball at the high post --> ? --> win.

It's not QUITE that simple. There needs to be a mix of Jabari and Amile there. Jabari looks to score. Amile looks to get our 3-pt shooting going. Syracuse's team is smart enough to adjust depending on who's there. Pressure Jabari, back off Amile. So if the choice is between Jabari shooting challenged midrange shots vs Amile looking to find 3-pt shooters, all basketball analytics will point to Amile being the more efficient option. Remember, we put up 131 Offensive Efficiency against Cuse in the Carrier Dome with Amile being the primary high-post guy. Now if Jabari is able to pass like Amile and help his teammates get open 3-pt shots, and if Jabari can drive from the high-post for scores and fouls, then the advantage tilts to him.

Troublemaker
02-21-2014, 10:15 AM
Also, if anyone isn't confident about tomorrow's game, I'll be happy to bet you that Duke will win. I'll give you the point spread to be fair as well. It'll be something like Duke -4.

The stakes can be drinks or maybe dinner in Durham the next time we're both there. Something like that.

Duke will rebound from this loss and win tomorrow. I'm confident about that.

CDu
02-21-2014, 10:28 AM
I have concerns the team will be absolutely GASSED (K noted in his postgame last night that the team looked tired). Plus the way we lost last night could also affect the team's confidence. This game was HUGE and it's even bigger now as we need it to hold onto a 3 seed in the ACC tourny. If we fail to beat the Cuse we could easily slip to 4th or 5th by the end of the season and potentially lose the bye in the ACC Tourny.

Should we be fortunate to win this game I pray that the students do NOT rush the Court.

We don't actually need the Cuse game to be #3. We need the UNC rematch. If we lose to Cuse but win out from there, we are the #3. If we beat Cuse and lose to UNC again, we fall to #4 unless UNC finds another two losses on their schedule.

Not that I want to lose tomorrow, but it doesn't make a huge difference in our seeding. It is going to come down to the last regular season game.

sagegrouse
02-21-2014, 10:30 AM
We don't actually need the Cuse game to be #3. We need the UNC rematch. If we lose to Cuse but win out from there, we are the #3. If we beat Cuse and lose to UNC again, we fall to #4 unless UNC finds another two losses on their schedule.

Not that I want to lose tomorrow, but it doesn't make a huge difference in our seeding. It is going to come down to the last regular season game.

I don;t car ethat much about ACC seeding, except inasmuch as it reflects a really good conference record. I care about being a #1 seed in the Big Dance. If we win out, including the ACC championship, we will get one.

flyingdutchdevil
02-21-2014, 10:31 AM
We don't actually need the Cuse game to be #3. We need the UNC rematch. If we lose to Cuse but win out from there, we are the #3. If we beat Cuse and lose to UNC again, we fall to #4 unless UNC finds another two losses on their schedule.

Not that I want to lose tomorrow, but it doesn't make a huge difference in our seeding. It is going to come down to the last regular season game.

But what did yesterday do to our NCAA seeding? If we win out, I think we're a 2 seed. If we lose to Syracuse and win out afterwards, I think we're a 2 seed. If we win until the finals of the ACC tournament, I think we're a 2 seed. If we drop 2 more games (including losing the ACC Tournament), I think we're a 3 seed. Essentially, we're a 2 seed barring a breakdown.

18258
02-21-2014, 10:32 AM
I have concerns the team will be absolutely GASSED (K noted in his postgame last night that the team looked tired). Plus the way we lost last night could also affect the team's confidence. This game was HUGE and it's even bigger now as we need it to hold onto a 3 seed in the ACC tourny. If we fail to beat the Cuse we could easily slip to 4th or 5th by the end of the season and potentially lose the bye in the ACC Tourny.

Should we be fortunate to win this game I pray that the students do NOT rush the Court.

that's what Im worried about, not only physically gassed, but mentally out of it also, we'll see, play the dang bench players a little more K

gofurman
02-21-2014, 10:42 AM
I agree, and I think K is going to have to provide Hairston some minutes in this one to offset the foul issues. Maybe, just maybe, he can draw a couple charges. That would be HUGE in this one. Plumlee has certainly earned his minutes at this point.

yep - Cook and Plumlee played v well last night. Great even. And thats a good take away from a loss. Cook was aggressive and Plumlee too. So if Cook is 'on' you have Cook and Rasheed and maybe Thornton for PG ... but the key is Plumlee giving Parker and Amile more fouls and rest. If mp3 played vs cuse they way he played vs UNC we would have beat the Cuse ... Parker and co would have been able to stay in the game.

Good job Cook and Marshall last night !!!!!!!

jipops
02-21-2014, 10:42 AM
Plumdog 3.0 is fantastic against big teams, like UNC. Against more mobile teams, he's not as effective. I think we'll see MP3 for a few minutes, but I'm not sure his impact will be the same as against UNC. Syracuse is quick, mobile, and not that beefy. I remember a few plays where Fair terrorized Plumdog 3.0. I hope we're able to utilize Plumlee against Syracuse, but I'm not as sold on this.

And I agree with Hairston. If this is gonna be a blood bath, we're gonna need Hairston to play 10 mins.

I agree with this as well regarding Plumlee. I don't know what effectiveness he would have at all against a zone and the quickness of Syracuse's front court would most likely cause problems here. I remember him being burned often in the Carrier Dome. Still, we're going to need him out there for a few sequences, hopefully he can cause some disruption. I think that's as much as we can ask from our front court bench anyways.

Troublemaker
02-21-2014, 12:44 PM
Here's an article with stats supporting what I was saying about Amile doing just fine in the high post: http://espn.go.com/blog/statsinfo/post/_/id/85076/how-duke-can-beat-the-syracuse-zone

The article also points out that on smaller samples, Duke performed well when MP3 caught in the high post and not so well when Jabari and Rodney caught there.

Because of the small samples, I wouldn't draw any conclusions about that, though. IMO, Amile & Jabari should do most of the high-post catching, with a slight edge to Amile. MP3 should stay on the backline. Rodney should stay on the wing.

Saratoga2
02-21-2014, 01:01 PM
I agree with this as well regarding Plumlee. I don't know what effectiveness he would have at all against a zone and the quickness of Syracuse's front court would most likely cause problems here. I remember him being burned often in the Carrier Dome. Still, we're going to need him out there for a few sequences, hopefully he can cause some disruption. I think that's as much as we can ask from our front court bench anyways.

I do remember Marshall going out on Fair in the corner and having Fair dribble by him. That was once. I don't remember others that I would call other times being burned, but I do think both Jabari and Rodney were often out of position with Fair and Grant absolutely killing us. Based on what I have seen, Marshall would be no worse than the others and possibly would reduce their fouls and allow them to be fresher when they were in the game.

Rodney was great last night when fresh as was Jabari. They just seemed to lose their offensive efficiency in the second half, which I believe was sheer exhaustion.

gumbomoop
02-21-2014, 01:05 PM
We don't actually need the Cuse game to be #3. We need the UNC rematch. If we lose to Cuse but win out from there, we are the #3. If we beat Cuse and lose to UNC again, we fall to #4 unless UNC finds another two losses on their schedule.

Not that I want to lose tomorrow, but it doesn't make a huge difference in our seeding. It is going to come down to the last regular season game.

Yep, CDu's got it right. A few more details from what I posted on UNC thread:


I'll ... predict that Duke will get 3d seed for ACCT. I'm guessing we might lose one more, either to 'Cuse or @Wake. That Wake game is a wild-card, as our guys will be rested - finally - but an 8-day layoff is odd at season's end, and Wake can be dangerous over there. I hope Heels lose @NCSt, but sure don't count on it. So I could see the March 8 game in CIS as 13-4 UNC v. 12-5 Duke. As long as Duke wins that finale, Duke gets 3d with tiebreaker over UNC, as Heels are 0-2 v. 'Cuse and UVa, whereas Duke will be either 2-1 or 1-2. Should Pitt win out and finish 13-5, both a 13-5 Duke and 13-5 UNC hold tiebreaker over Pitt, which would get 5-seed.

Duke still has outside chance at 2-seed, as 'Cuse has tough final 5 games, 4 on road. Should Duke win out and get to 14-4, while 'Cuse loses @Duke and @UVa and either @Md or @FSU, Duke - having defeated UVa - holds tiebreaker over 'Cuse.

We're good for 3-seed, possibly 2-seed, if Devils beat 'Cuse and UNC.

wk2109
02-21-2014, 01:10 PM
Here's an article with stats supporting what I was saying about Amile doing just fine in the high post: http://espn.go.com/blog/statsinfo/post/_/id/85076/how-duke-can-beat-the-syracuse-zone

The article also points out that on smaller samples, Duke performed well when MP3 caught in the high post and not so well when Jabari and Rodney caught there.

Because of the small samples, I wouldn't draw any conclusions about that, though. IMO, Amile & Jabari should do most of the high-post catching, with a slight edge to Amile. MP3 should stay on the backline. Rodney should stay on the wing.

I saw the article too and was surprised that the offense was so efficient with Marshall in the high post (but it was a small sample size as you mentioned).

I like the idea of Jabari in the high post, but if I remember correctly, he was wreaking havoc on the baseline in the last Syracuse game. I think that as long as Amile/Marshall can make good passes out of the high post, Duke shoots the way it normally does in Cameron and Jabari can be aggressive on the baseline, the offense will be very efficient. Sure it's great if the guy in the high post can make the bottom defender step up to respect the foul line jumper, but I'll take our perimeter guys shooting 3's and Jabari attacking on the baseline over foul line jumpers.

jv001
02-21-2014, 01:39 PM
I do remember Marshall going out on Fair in the corner and having Fair dribble by him. That was once. I don't remember others that I would call other times being burned, but I do think both Jabari and Rodney were often out of position with Fair and Grant absolutely killing us. Based on what I have seen, Marshall would be no worse than the others and possibly would reduce their fouls and allow them to be fresher when they were in the game.

Rodney was great last night when fresh as was Jabari. They just seemed to lose their offensive efficiency in the second half, which I believe was sheer exhaustion.

This is the way I saw it. By the middle of the 2nd half last night, Jabari was exhausted. Coach K took him out for a short rest, but it didn't seem to help. He played poor defense in the 2nd half. I don't have any idea about Rodney being exhausted, but he did not get one single rebound. I believe his poor rebounding is from not boxing out and his attitude toward rebounding. GoDuke!

CLW
02-21-2014, 01:55 PM
We don't actually need the Cuse game to be #3. We need the UNC rematch. If we lose to Cuse but win out from there, we are the #3. If we beat Cuse and lose to UNC again, we fall to #4 unless UNC finds another two losses on their schedule.

Not that I want to lose tomorrow, but it doesn't make a huge difference in our seeding. It is going to come down to the last regular season game.

I'm not privy to the ACC's tie breaker rules but presuming a L tomorrow and Ws the rest of the way and assuming UNC wins out other than the rematch wouldn't they be tied in the standings with a split in the regular season.

What is the tiebreaker? Overall record? (we'd have 1 less L than UNC).

rasputin
02-21-2014, 01:56 PM
I'm not privy to the ACC's tie breaker rules but presuming a L tomorrow and Ws the rest of the way and assuming UNC wins out other than the rematch wouldn't they be tied in the standings with a split in the regular season.

What is the tiebreaker? Overall record? (we'd have 1 less L than UNC).

Tiebreaker between two teams is first, head-to-head, and then, how each team did against the conference # 1 team, # 2 team, and so on.

CDu
02-21-2014, 01:57 PM
I don;t car ethat much about ACC seeding, except inasmuch as it reflects a really good conference record. I care about being a #1 seed in the Big Dance. If we win out, including the ACC championship, we will get one.


But what did yesterday do to our NCAA seeding? If we win out, I think we're a 2 seed. If we lose to Syracuse and win out afterwards, I think we're a 2 seed. If we win until the finals of the ACC tournament, I think we're a 2 seed. If we drop 2 more games (including losing the ACC Tournament), I think we're a 3 seed. Essentially, we're a 2 seed barring a breakdown.

I was merely responding to the issue of our ACC tourney seed. Obviously ANY losses the rest of the way will hurt our NCAA seed.

If we win out, I think we'll be a 1 or 2 seed. Any more losses and we run the risk of falling to the 3 line or worse.

CLW
02-21-2014, 01:59 PM
Tiebreaker between two teams is first, head-to-head, and then, how each team did against the conference # 1 team, # 2 team, and so on.

Well if that is in fact the case doesn't the #3 seed depend on if Cuse or UVA wins the regular season?

We are 1-0 v. UVA and would be 0-2 against Cuse (assuming an L tomorrow)

UNC is 0-1 v. UVA but "only" 0-1 against Cuse.


0-1 would arguably be better than 0-2 and UNC could slide to the #3 if Cuse wins the crown due to being "better" against the Cuse due to the unbalanced schedule.

CDu
02-21-2014, 02:00 PM
I'm not privy to the ACC's tie breaker rules but presuming a L tomorrow and Ws the rest of the way and assuming UNC wins out other than the rematch wouldn't they be tied in the standings with a split in the regular season.

What is the tiebreaker? Overall record? (we'd have 1 less L than UNC).

As Rasputin said, it then goes to record versus the top team of the ACC. We have that tiebreaker guaranteed as we beat UVa and UNC did not. So if we split with UNC and tie them, we are the 3. If we lose again to UNC then we have to beat their ACC record to be the 3 (which would require 2 more UNC losses). So in terms of ACC seeding, beating UNC is basically a must in order to be the 3 seed.

UrinalCake
02-21-2014, 02:01 PM
I think we should flash a different guy into the middle of the zone each possession. Make the defense have to work to figure out what to do, and try to catch them on a mistake. If it's Jabari or Hood they'll have to collapse on him to prevent the open foul-line jumper. If it's Amile or MP3 they'll have to stay on their men to prevent the passes out to the shooters. Also, if Amile wants to magically learn a 12-foot jump shot in the next 24 hours, that would be great 8-)

CLW
02-21-2014, 02:03 PM
As Rasputin said, it then goes to record versus the top team of the ACC. We have that tiebreaker guaranteed as we beat UVa and UNC did not.

Well presumably Cuse could win the crown too then its 0-1 UNC verus 0-2 Duke (under the hypo of Duke losing tomorrow).

CDu
02-21-2014, 02:06 PM
Well presumably Cuse could win the crown too then its 0-1 UNC verus 0-2 Duke (under the hypo of Duke losing tomorrow).

0-1 equals 0-2 in the formula (0% winning percentage). They don't penalize you for playing twice. So if Cuse is #1 then we tie UNC again and move to record vs #2 (UVa).

CLW
02-21-2014, 02:08 PM
0-1 equals 0-2 in the formula (0% winning percentage). They don't penalize you for playing twice. So if Cuse is #1 then we tie UNC again and move to record vs #2 (UVa).

Well at least the unbalanced schedule doesn't do a double whammy on you in a tiebreaker scenario. Good to know.

davekay1971
02-21-2014, 02:21 PM
Thoughts on Cuse

1) Next play. Losing to UNC sucks. Always. But, in the grand scheme, this Duke team has too much potential to define it's season as a success or failure based on the results of the UNC games (although we had better beat their sorry butts in Cameron). UNC, on the other hand, can go ahead and make us their National Championship game because, since Roy's program-building academic advisor left and AFAM courses became suddenly unpopular among the mens hoops team in the 2009-2010 season, the program in Chapel Hill has taken a decidedly back seat to the one in Durham. But for Duke, they need to realize that the game last night was a loss that they shouldn't have allowed to happen, they need to play the Heels with a vengeance in Durham, and they need to move on to a very important game against a very good team tomorrow.

2) Zone zone zone. We got out of offensive synch when UNC switched up a bunch of zones on us. That's been a recurrent problem for our guys. Interestingly, our game against Syracuse up in the Carrier Dome was probably our best execution against the zone. That may be due to K's familiarity with Boeheim's zone scheme. If so, that speaks well to our ability to play against it tomorrow. Unless Dawkins/Sulaimon/Cook/Thornton/Hood are having one of those nights where the rim is huge from 25 feet out, beating any zone requires penetration via dribble or pass to collapse the zone, then look for the open shooter or cutter. We didn't do that well against UNC. Time for another round of practice against the zone tomorrow.

3) Speaking of Andre...come on Dre, light it up when you get in there. I don't think I've enjoyed any basketball moments as much in the last few years as those, this season, when Dre is hitting and smiling.

4) Sheed and Cook: they have had their great moments, and both have shown signs of being critical cogs in a potentially dominant backcourt. If those two can consistently produce down the stretch, this team has no ceiling.

5) Defense defense defense - we keep improving, but keep having sloppy spells in games. To win tomorrow, that can't happen.

6) Fatigue - normally I don't give much credit to the idea of fatigue bothering 18-21 year old world-class athletes. Especially not when they average 2 games a week in college ball. But this is the 4th game in 8 days, with two of the previous 3 being intense/down to the wire, and two being on the road. These guys have got to be tired. Syracuse will have an advantage there. I'm sure K would LOVE to use his bench...which means the bench guys have GOT to produce their first time on the court. If our bench can bring it from the moment they get in the game, it will make our chances of winning much better.

sagegrouse
02-21-2014, 02:47 PM
But what did yesterday do to our NCAA seeding? If we win out, I think we're a 2 seed. If we lose to Syracuse and win out afterwards, I think we're a 2 seed. If we win until the finals of the ACC tournament, I think we're a 2 seed. If we drop 2 more games (including losing the ACC Tournament), I think we're a 3 seed. Essentially, we're a 2 seed barring a breakdown.

There are only seven teams that will win their conference tournament from the major conferences: AAC(?), ACC, Big 12, Big East, Big Ten, SEC, and PAC12. If Duke wins out, it will be higher ranked than the winners [highest ranked teams listed] of the AAC (Cincy or Lville), Big East (Creighton or Nova), and Big Ten (Mich State). That puts Duke in the same category as undefeated Wichita State, the SEC winner (Fl or Ky), the PAC12 winner (Zona), and the Big12 winner (Kan). Duke currently ranks ahead of Kansas. And I don't see any conference getting two #1 seeds. Moreover, there will be further losses and tournament upsets.

Therefore, in the somewhat unlikely event Duke wins out, it seems likely to me that a #1 seed will result.

Atlanta Duke
02-21-2014, 02:53 PM
Nice SI.com article on the friendship between Coach K and Coach Boeheim

Mike Krzyzewski beamed as he walked on the Team USA bus after a 156-73 blowout of Nigeria at the London Olympics. Carmelo Anthony had torched the Nigerians for 37 points on 10-of-12 three-pointers in 14 minutes and Krzyzewski couldn't resist a joke.

"Now you know what happens," Krzyzewski said, "when I become the shooting coach."

The Nigeria game followed a day in which Team USA canceled practice and didn't break down film of a blowout win against Tunisia. USA Basketball assistant Jim Boeheim immediately fired back at Krzyzewski.

"No," Boeheim said. "Now you know what happens when we don't practice and don't watch film."

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/college-basketball/news/20140221/jim-boeheim-mike-krzyzewski-syracuse-duke-usa-basketball/#ixzz2tzYrSSDn

jipops
02-21-2014, 03:10 PM
I do remember Marshall going out on Fair in the corner and having Fair dribble by him. That was once. I don't remember others that I would call other times being burned, but I do think both Jabari and Rodney were often out of position with Fair and Grant absolutely killing us. Based on what I have seen, Marshall would be no worse than the others and possibly would reduce their fouls and allow them to be fresher when they were in the game.

Rodney was great last night when fresh as was Jabari. They just seemed to lose their offensive efficiency in the second half, which I believe was sheer exhaustion.

Well, Marshall did give us 2 defensive rebounds in 10 minutes that game so I guess that is something. I don't think I made an overstatement though because Marshall is more effective defending a post player anyways than defending a front court player on the drive, and that is what Syracuse primarily features. I just don't think we can assume that Marshall will have the same effectiveness against the makeup of Syracuse this time around as he did against UNC. I suppose K could put him on Christmas and come over for help since Christmas' usage is very low for Syracuse.

jipops
02-21-2014, 03:18 PM
Thoughts on Cuse

1) Next play. Losing to UNC sucks. Always. But, in the grand scheme, this Duke team has too much potential to define it's season as a success or failure based on the results of the UNC games (although we had better beat their sorry butts in Cameron). UNC, on the other hand, can go ahead and make us their National Championship game because, since Roy's program-building academic advisor left and AFAM courses became suddenly unpopular among the mens hoops team in the 2009-2010 season, the program in Chapel Hill has taken a decidedly back seat to the one in Durham. But for Duke, they need to realize that the game last night was a loss that they shouldn't have allowed to happen, they need to play the Heels with a vengeance in Durham, and they need to move on to a very important game against a very good team tomorrow.

2) Zone zone zone. We got out of offensive synch when UNC switched up a bunch of zones on us. That's been a recurrent problem for our guys. Interestingly, our game against Syracuse up in the Carrier Dome was probably our best execution against the zone. That may be due to K's familiarity with Boeheim's zone scheme. If so, that speaks well to our ability to play against it tomorrow. Unless Dawkins/Sulaimon/Cook/Thornton/Hood are having one of those nights where the rim is huge from 25 feet out, beating any zone requires penetration via dribble or pass to collapse the zone, then look for the open shooter or cutter. We didn't do that well against UNC. Time for another round of practice against the zone tomorrow.

3) Speaking of Andre...come on Dre, light it up when you get in there. I don't think I've enjoyed any basketball moments as much in the last few years as those, this season, when Dre is hitting and smiling.

4) Sheed and Cook: they have had their great moments, and both have shown signs of being critical cogs in a potentially dominant backcourt. If those two can consistently produce down the stretch, this team has no ceiling.

5) Defense defense defense - we keep improving, but keep having sloppy spells in games. To win tomorrow, that can't happen.

6) Fatigue - normally I don't give much credit to the idea of fatigue bothering 18-21 year old world-class athletes. Especially not when they average 2 games a week in college ball. But this is the 4th game in 8 days, with two of the previous 3 being intense/down to the wire, and two being on the road. These guys have got to be tired. Syracuse will have an advantage there. I'm sure K would LOVE to use his bench...which means the bench guys have GOT to produce their first time on the court. If our bench can bring it from the moment they get in the game, it will make our chances of winning much better.

Winning tomorrow will certainly take the sting out of losing to Chapel Hill Elementary. I hope we continue with the half court traps. We've had good success lately. I don't know if this will be employable due to a possible fatigue factor. But if K really wants to use his bench I think this is where Matt Jones comes in. We can afford fouls in our back court a lot more than the front court so pressure the ball immediately and make them have to work to start their offense.

Troublemaker
02-21-2014, 04:10 PM
Duke opens as 5-pt favorites.

That's how KenPom has it as well, projecting a 70-65 game.

Bob Green
02-21-2014, 04:14 PM
Here are my keys to the game plus a question and/or observation:

1. The high post! Creating good looks against the Orange Zone starts with ball movement into and out of the high post. My always fickle memory tells me we had success with Parker and Hood operating out of the high post in the Carrier Dome. Jefferson will need to be successful as well.

2. Energy on defense! Syracuse has been struggling to score in recent games. Since scoring 91 points in the overtime victory against Duke, the Orange have scored: 61, 57, 58, 56 and 59 or 58.2 ppg, which is 11 points below their season average of 69.6 ppg. Our defense needs to challenge their offense for 40 minutes and make them work hard for every single point.

3. Shoot the ball > 40% on 3 PT FG! This is a standard key for me. If we shoot good, we win. If we don't shoot good, we struggle.

Question/observation: Is this team healthy? We know Coach Krzyzewski doesn't discuss minor injuries so I have to wonder if some of the reduced playing time, smaller rotation is due to players being banged up. Food for thought...

TruBlu
02-21-2014, 04:16 PM
I will start worrying if we have a 10 - 12 point lead midway in the second half.:mad:

CR9
02-21-2014, 04:38 PM
Can't see Duke winning this. They're a drained team, mentally and physically. If they'd have beaten Carolina, I'd have given them a punchers chance, purely by being buoyed by the result but not now. I can see another second half collapse because of a tightened rotation and all-arm jumpshots.

Atlanta Duke
02-21-2014, 04:41 PM
Can't see Duke winning this. They're a drained team, mentally and physically. If they'd have beaten Carolina, I'd have given them a punchers chance, purely by being buoyed by the result but not now. I can see another second half collapse because of a tightened rotation and all-arm jumpshots.

C'mon - turn that frown upside down

DukieinSoCal
02-21-2014, 06:46 PM
Here are my keys to the game plus a question and/or observation:

1. The high post! Creating good looks against the Orange Zone starts with ball movement into and out of the high post. My always fickle memory tells me we had success with Parker and Hood operating out of the high post in the Carrier Dome. Jefferson will need to be successful as well.

2. Energy on defense! Syracuse has been struggling to score in recent games. Since scoring 91 points in the overtime victory against Duke, the Orange have scored: 61, 57, 58, 56 and 59 or 58.2 ppg, which is 11 points below their season average of 69.6 ppg. Our defense needs to challenge their offense for 40 minutes and make them work hard for every single point.

3. Shoot the ball > 40% on 3 PT FG! This is a standard key for me. If we shoot good, we win. If we don't shoot good, we struggle.

Question/observation: Is this team healthy? We know Coach Krzyzewski doesn't discuss minor injuries so I have to wonder if some of the reduced playing time, smaller rotation is due to players being banged up. Food for thought...

I know in recent years, our success has been closely tied to our 3-point shooting but I feel like we shouldn't be as vulnerable to this with this year's team. We have several other options on offense. Sheed and Rodney can drive the ball against almost anyone and either get a high percentage look for themselves or find open teammates. Jabari is almost unguardable down low. And Amile can be effective when he gets the ball in good spots. Especially with the way games are being called tighter this year, we should drive and post up more. One of the keys to our success should be getting to the free throw line. We have good FT shooters and we'll cause foul trouble for the opposition. Our offense should not have to rely on 3s every night. And if we're creating offense in other ways, it will open up the floor so we get better looks from 3. When we take good shots, we almost always shoot a high percentage.

Bob Green
02-21-2014, 07:05 PM
Our offense should not have to rely on 3s every night.

I agree with you the offense should not have to rely on the 3, but when you look at game box scores we shot poorly in four out of six losses. Sometimes the facts are just frustrating.

UrinalCake
02-21-2014, 07:58 PM
I agree with you the offense should not have to rely on the 3, but when you look at game box scores we shot poorly in four out of six losses. Sometimes the facts are just frustrating.

It's a chicken-and-egg question. Did we lose because everything else was the same and we just randomly shot poorly? Or did we shoot poorly because we weren't doing the other things in the game that lead to shooting well (i.e. creating good shots, sharing the ball, keeping players rested, not playing from behind)?

NSDukeFan
02-21-2014, 08:16 PM
I agree with you the offense should not have to rely on the 3, but when you look at game box scores we shot poorly in four out of six losses. Sometimes the facts are just frustrating.

Wasn't one of those poor shooting games a 38% shooting game, in which case we really only shot poorly from 3 in half the losses? I consider 35% a decent shooting game.

DukeDevilDeb
02-21-2014, 08:28 PM
Ah substantive basketball discussion!


I agree on splitting Quinn and Tyler. We give up too much size. I'd even be ok with the hockey substitutions at the first tv timeout just to keep things shook up.

The offense runs well through Cook. That is our ideal set - Cook at wheel, setting guys up. However, Rasheed coming off a ball screen is very good at getting into the paint and drawing fouls. Rasheed did little of that last night, but it could be good for getting into the paint tomorrow. Instead of a ball screen Rasheed would have to get a screen on one of the zone defenders to create a gap.

Will we see Jabari and Rodney parked at the free throw line a lot tomorrow? That will keep the zone pulled in some and create space for shooters, or it will get those two the ball in a threatening position. Also, Amile should look to flash to the block if someone penetrates so he can get an easy bucket.

Cracking the Syracuse zone is tough but we will be prepared.

Now about our D....that's what concerns me. We have to guard their bigs straight up to avoid foul trouble. No reaching or shoving. Just force them to hit their shots.

I am glad our turnaround is short. I'm still bitter about last night.

You say that the offense runs well through Quinn, and I think there was a time when that was true. But Quinn continues to make egregious errors in judgement when he is at the point. These errors can be grouped as follows:


Shot selection: Quinn's shot selection, instead of getting better, has gotten worse. I was horrified last night when he would dribble way into the shot clock, then pass the ball to someone else (like Tyler) with 2 seconds left or toss up an airball. Bad news.
Finding the open man: This wasn't as big a problem last night as it has been in the past. I go to every game in Cameron and watch Andre stand alone in the corner doing everything but whistling at Quinn to get him to pass the ball.
Passing: Quinn has made some absolutely BRILLIANT passes this year. He has also made some boneheaded ones. Those tend to be bounce passes in the paint for the most part.
Looking at the Coach: I vividly remember the Jason Williams play where he turned to look at K for the play, and Terrapin Steve Blake stole the ball from him. I think we lost that game. Quinn seems to take significantly longer to read K's signals and turn back into the game.
Appearance of energy: Again, this may not have happened last night, but Quinn sometimes seems to be dragging himself and the ball down the court. It doesn't seem to be that he's tired; he just doesn't ooze energy. As a defender, there is NOTHING I'd rather see than a slow and easy point guard.


Quinn is an important part of the team who has been streakier than anyone else. Coach K sat him before the BC game, and Quinn responded. I think he can do it, but his heart just hasn't seemed in his play. Although I haven't been thrilled with Rasheed's lack of finishing his drives when he goes into the lane, I much prefer his energy and effort.

And after all that, I still can't believe we lost last night.

Go Devils. We MUST beat Syracuse!

jv001
02-21-2014, 10:02 PM
I listened to Coach K on Mad Dog this afternoon. Mad Dog told the audience that it was really unfair that they scheduled Coach after such a grueling week for the Coach. The subject of Duke looking fatigued in the 2nd half last night was brought up by the host. He asked Coach K if it was like being in a regional game in the NCAAT. Coach told him not really because you don't have to travel and get home around 3am the next day. You play the next game at the same site you just played at. In other words playing the games so close together is not what's so bad. It's the travel time and disruption of your schedule. He also said that the unc game or any game for that matter is not over until the team goes over the video in a team meeting. So the team met this morning and completed the unc game. After that they went over the defensive scheme for Cuse. Then tonight they would meet again and go over the offensive scheme. As a fan, I didn't realize what goes into getting the team prepared for each opponent. I have a brand new respect for the coaches and players. On top of that, these kids are student athletes, not like the ones down the road, :cool: Coach did say that practice was light and not tiring for the team. That tells me that he understands that even though these players are young, they still get tired. I look for more minutes for the bench tomorrow. Some have posted that maybe Josh get's more minutes. I hope those minutes don't come at the expense of Andre, Matt and Marshall. All three bring more to the table than Josh. GoDuke!

Furniture
02-21-2014, 10:55 PM
On top of that, these kids are student athletes, not like the ones down the road, :cool:GoDuke!

Not picking on you but to me these kind of comments ( there have been others) are that of a bad loser. Our great coach K shows how to lose with dignity and teaches the Duke kids to do so as well. You can't win them all!
With all of the great wisdom and experience on this board I would hope that we can set an example to the Duke team that we ourselves hold to such high standards. That means on the court and off it.

Furniture
02-21-2014, 11:01 PM
Can't see Duke winning this. They're a drained team, mentally and physically. If they'd have beaten Carolina, I'd have given them a punchers chance, purely by being buoyed by the result but not now. I can see another second half collapse because of a tightened rotation and all-arm jumpshots.

I agree and I am worried. I also wonder how the team feel after the K has told them that they had no "life" or "it" in the second half. Will that worsen the "drained team, mentally and physically" team or kick start them?
We shall see!

jipops
02-21-2014, 11:48 PM
I listened to Coach K on Mad Dog this afternoon. Mad Dog told the audience that it was really unfair that they scheduled Coach after such a grueling week for the Coach. The subject of Duke looking fatigued in the 2nd half last night was brought up by the host. He asked Coach K if it was like being in a regional game in the NCAAT. Coach told him not really because you don't have to travel and get home around 3am the next day. You play the next game at the same site you just played at. In other words playing the games so close together is not what's so bad. It's the travel time and disruption of your schedule. He also said that the unc game or any game for that matter is not over until the team goes over the video in a team meeting. So the team met this morning and completed the unc game. After that they went over the defensive scheme for Cuse. Then tonight they would meet again and go over the offensive scheme. As a fan, I didn't realize what goes into getting the team prepared for each opponent. I have a brand new respect for the coaches and players. On top of that, these kids are student athletes, not like the ones down the road, :cool: Coach did say that practice was light and not tiring for the team. That tells me that he understands that even though these players are young, they still get tired. I look for more minutes for the bench tomorrow. Some have posted that maybe Josh get's more minutes. I hope those minutes don't come at the expense of Andre, Matt and Marshall. All three bring more to the table than Josh. GoDuke!

Well if the disruption of travel is such a major part of it then the fact we only had to drive a few miles down the road shouldn't provide too much disruption for the Cuse game.

I feel good about this game. I didn't feel so hot about the UNC game as I expressed in its pre-game thread. I think we take care of business here.

Kedsy
02-22-2014, 12:20 AM
My always fickle memory tells me we had success with Parker and Hood operating out of the high post in the Carrier Dome. Jefferson will need to be successful as well.

Earlier in (I think) this thread, Troublemaker linked to an article that showed that when Amile or Marshall operated out of the high post we were very successful but when Jabari or Rodney operated out of the high post we were not so successful. I have to admit I had a similar recollection as you did, but the numbers say otherwise.


Can't see Duke winning this. They're a drained team, mentally and physically. If they'd have beaten Carolina, I'd have given them a punchers chance, purely by being buoyed by the result but not now. I can see another second half collapse because of a tightened rotation and all-arm jumpshots.

Yeah, good point, we have no chance, because Duke almost always loses the game after a tough loss. Wait, no, I misspoke. We've only lost two games in a row once in the past five years.

Bob Green
02-22-2014, 05:37 AM
Wasn't one of those poor shooting games a 38% shooting game, in which case we really only shot poorly from 3 in half the losses? I consider 35% a decent shooting game.

We shot 38.9% on 3 PT FG in the loss to Kansas so it appears I overstated my case. A more accurate statement would be we shot below our season average on 3 PT FG in four of six losses. Factoring in the Carolina game, our season average is now 40.9%.

A strong performance from the Bonusphere against the Syracuse Zone remains one of my keys to the game. We made 15 of 36 (41.6%) in the previous meeting and came up short.

NSDukeFan
02-22-2014, 05:51 AM
We shot 38.9% on 3 PT FG in the loss to Kansas so it appears I overstated my case. A more accurate statement would be we shot below our season average on 3 PT FG in four of six losses. Factoring in the Carolina game, our season average is now 40.9%.

A strong performance from the Bonusphere against the Syracuse Zone remains one of my keys to the game. We made 15 of 36 (41.6%) in the previous meeting and came up short.

I agree that we need to shoot well from 3 to beat Syracuse, or any top 15-20 team. I think 33-35% can be ok if the team is playing well.

kAzE
02-22-2014, 06:17 AM
Our offense has been mostly fine all year. We missed a bunch of open shots at UNC, but more often than not those fall. I'm more interested to see if we can move our feet on defense and keep our fouls under control. We did for the most part at GT 2 games ago, but really looked tired on defense against UNC. I'm not too worried about the offense. I think we win this game by playing smart D and controlling the glass.

Amile Jefferson needs to step up and have a really good game. He's the key guy on offense. Most importantly, he needs to take advantage of any offensive rebounding opportunities, and get us some extra possessions. Jabari seems to prefer to operate near the baseline against the zone, so Amile at the high post is going to need to make good decisions with the ball. If he plays well, then I believe we have a good chance to win.

Saratoga2
02-22-2014, 07:27 AM
You say that the offense runs well through Quinn, and I think there was a time when that was true. But Quinn continues to make egregious errors in judgement when he is at the point. These errors can be grouped as follows:


Shot selection: Quinn's shot selection, instead of getting better, has gotten worse. I was horrified last night when he would dribble way into the shot clock, then pass the ball to someone else (like Tyler) with 2 seconds left or toss up an airball. Bad news.
Finding the open man: This wasn't as big a problem last night as it has been in the past. I go to every game in Cameron and watch Andre stand alone in the corner doing everything but whistling at Quinn to get him to pass the ball.
Passing: Quinn has made some absolutely BRILLIANT passes this year. He has also made some boneheaded ones. Those tend to be bounce passes in the paint for the most part.
Looking at the Coach: I vividly remember the Jason Williams play where he turned to look at K for the play, and Terrapin Steve Blake stole the ball from him. I think we lost that game. Quinn seems to take significantly longer to read K's signals and turn back into the game.
Appearance of energy: Again, this may not have happened last night, but Quinn sometimes seems to be dragging himself and the ball down the court. It doesn't seem to be that he's tired; he just doesn't ooze energy. As a defender, there is NOTHING I'd rather see than a slow and easy point guard.




Quinn is an important part of the team who has been streakier than anyone else. Coach K sat him before the BC game, and Quinn responded. I think he can do it, but his heart just hasn't seemed in his play. Although I haven't been thrilled with Rasheed's lack of finishing his drives when he goes into the lane, I much prefer his energy and effort.

And after all that, I still can't believe we lost last night.

Go Devils. We MUST beat Syracuse!

1.)It appears to me that Quinn doesn't look to fast break but instead concentrates on getting the ball down the court safely. He is good at that. Then he goes into the mode of dribbling into the left side, not far over the base line and looks for a play call from the bench. He continues to dribble and looks for the guys to get aligned in the proper way for the play to commence (now 15 seconds or more into the play clock). If the defense turns away the first attempt, we have used 25 seconds and have 10 to get a shot away. Then we go into the helter skelter routine.

The approach seems to occur on a fair number of plays with little ball movement and little of the freedom you would expect from the motion offense. Too much dribbling and too little of forcing the defense to react quickly. I believe Tyler to be worse at PG in that he doesn't seem to get us into scoring situations as well as Quinn.

2.) Does Quinn lack focus at times. Yes, but then most people do. His seem to result in what some would typify as bonehead plays. Passing lazily across the middle or into the corner, dribbling into a double team or not seeing an open team mate. He was much better against UNC, except at the very end of the game. Quinn does need to watch out for this tendency in himself as otherwise he is a very capable PG.

3.) Shot selection has been a problem, partially due to excess dribbling and running the clock down too far and then having to force a shot. I have no problem with Quinn taking the 3 when it is in the flow of the game. He is a decent 3 point shooter.

4.) One thing that several of us noted when Austin and Quinn joined the team is how both seemed to be negatively impacted by bad plays on their part. The hanging head, negative expression on their faces and the tendency to overcompensate the next time up or down the floor. Trying to do too much or fouling gratuitiously were indications to me. He has to accept a bad play was made and get on to the next play.

Despite some negatives, I thought Quinn showed how valuable he is to the team against UNC. He is our best PG and play with confidence in that knowledge.

arnie
02-22-2014, 07:28 AM
Duke opens as 5-pt favorites.

That's how KenPom has it as well, projecting a 70-65 game.

Various Vegas lines now at 5.5-6 pts. I don't understand why the betters think we'll win by more than 6. Orange tends to keep games very close and we will be tired. Hope they're right.

Kedsy
02-22-2014, 07:32 AM
We made 15 of 36 (41.6%) in the previous meeting and came up short.

I think it's a lot more complicated than that. Winning and losing is not just about three-point shooting percentage. I agree it will be tough to win if we shoot in the 20s like we did against UNC (and against Maryland, I believe, though admittedly Maryland isn't Syracuse), but to imply we have to shoot in the mid-40s to win is overstating the case, IMO.

hillsborodevil
02-22-2014, 07:51 AM
Here are my keys to the game plus a question and/or observation:

1. The high post! Creating good looks against the Orange Zone starts with ball movement into and out of the high post. My always fickle memory tells me we had success with Parker and Hood operating out of the high post in the Carrier Dome. Jefferson will need to be successful as well...

I agree with you Bob. When Duke played Cuse anytime Amile or MP3 caught the ball @ the high post they never looked to shoot, drive, or dish. They only passed out. Most occasions they wouldn't even turn to the basket. Cuse never collapsed on them.

Only Hood and Parker have the length and offensive skills to receive the ball @ the high post against Cuse.

Troublemaker
02-22-2014, 08:04 AM
Various Vegas lines now at 5.5-6 pts. I don't understand why the betters think we'll win by more than 6. Orange tends to keep games very close and we will be tired. Hope they're right.

The vast majority of bettors actually don't think that at all. On sites that track these things, I'm seeing the vast majority being on Syracuse, as one would expect given the spread. And according to ESPN, half of America doesn't even think Duke will win (http://espn.go.com/espn/fp/flashPollResultsState?sportIndex=sportsnation&pollId=4195877).

And yet the point spread is sitting still or even getting larger, as you mentioned. Duke is the side of the sharp bettors & books tonight. I'm happy to be with them (though obviously it doesn't guarantee anything.)

CoachJ10
02-22-2014, 08:06 AM
Syracuse really played only 6 players against BC (one other guy got in for a min or so) and only got called for 12 fouls the entire game. That is a luxury that I don't think we should extend them in Cameron. We need to keep the pressure on them the entire game. They rely so much on Fair and Ennis...if we take one or both of them away...it would give us a huge advantage.

Troublemaker
02-22-2014, 08:23 AM
Only Hood and Parker have the length and offensive skills to receive the ball @ the high post against Cuse.

Yes, if you really want to take challenged midrange jumpshots that badly (considered by basketball analytics to be the worst shot you can take). I'll post the link again that says Amile (and MP3) did great facilitating an efficient offense from the high post: http://espn.go.com/blog/statsinfo/post/_/id/85076/how-duke-can-beat-the-syracuse-zone

My guess is the majority of Duke fans think Duke only went to Parker and Hood a total of two times in the high post in the last Syracuse game. One time where Jabari drove, did a beautiful drop step, and scored over top of Syracuse's big men. The other time where Rodney hit the midrange jump shot. These plays were commented on by the ESPN announcing team so they stood out.

But according to the article I linked, Jabari and Rodney actually got 16 high-post touches in that game, and Duke did not score efficiently from them. I can't remember all 16 plays myself. But I remember the 2 described above, and I also remember 2 from the first half where Jabari caught there, Syracuse's zone adjusted and jumped out at him, forcing him to take a fadeaway midrange jumpshot that he missed both times. If Jabari's going to do that, I would much prefer Amile to be in there.

However, since the first Syracuse game, I feel like Jabari has gotten much better at making sudden, aggressive drives that result in finishes and fouls. I think he can catch and attack from the high post now. But Amile needs to get the high-post touches as well because he facilitates Duke's 3-pt attack, which should be efficient versus Syracuse, as it was last time.

jv001
02-22-2014, 08:24 AM
Not picking on you but to me these kind of comments ( there have been others) are that of a bad loser. Our great coach K shows how to lose with dignity and teaches the Duke kids to do so as well. You can't win them all!
With all of the great wisdom and experience on this board I would hope that we can set an example to the Duke team that we ourselves hold to such high standards. That means on the court and off it.

No, I'm not a bad loser, I just hate Carolina. GoDuke!

Troublemaker
02-22-2014, 08:27 AM
Syracuse really played only 6 players against BC (one other guy got in for a min or so)

The "other guy" is Keita who had been injured for a few games but returned against BC. His minutes will probably increase against Duke, so I think Syracuse will be playing the normal 7 players they've played for most of the season.

Troublemaker
02-22-2014, 08:35 AM
I believe Tyler to be worse at PG in that he doesn't seem to get us into scoring situations as well as Quinn.

Quinn is definitely a better PG than Tyler, but Tyler barely plays PG. On defense, he guards off-the-ball, and on offense, he'll bring the ball up sometimes, call a play, then hand off to Sheed to initiate while he goes stand in the corner or on the wing waiting for a kickout opportunity.

Sheed and Quinn have been our PGs in recent games, with only a light dusting of Tyler, who has been playing the 2.

jv001
02-22-2014, 08:36 AM
Well if the disruption of travel is such a major part of it then the fact we only had to drive a few miles down the road shouldn't provide too much disruption for the Cuse game.

I feel good about this game. I didn't feel so hot about the UNC game as I expressed in its pre-game thread. I think we take care of business here.

I get what you're saying about the preparation for the Cuse game, but Coach K was talking about the travel back home from the GT game. The team got in around 3am if I'm not mistaken. The quick turnaround coupled with the travel could have been a problem in getting the team prepared and rested at the same time(for the tarheels). GoDuke!

jipops
02-22-2014, 09:28 AM
I get what you're saying about the preparation for the Cuse game, but Coach K was talking about the travel back home from the GT game. The team got in around 3am if I'm not mistaken. The quick turnaround coupled with the travel could have been a problem in getting the team prepared and rested at the same time(for the tarheels). GoDuke!

I got that too. I doubt the team got back from Chapel Hill at 3am yesterday. But they probably didn't get to bed until well after midnight and then up again yesterday morning for classes and film. Somewhere in there they got in a light practice. Probably not as brutal as the in-between after the GTech game, but certainly not much time to prepare and gain their legs. A win today would just be huge after the kind of schedule Duke has had this week.

Wildling
02-22-2014, 09:52 AM
I'm still reeling from the bad loss against a bad team on Thursday. For the sake of my cardiovascular system, this has..........to............be..............a...... ......"w"!

Bob Green
02-22-2014, 09:57 AM
I think it's a lot more complicated than that. Winning and losing is not just about three-point shooting percentage.

You're absolutely correct, which is why my number 1 key is High Post Offense. We need to create open 3 PT FG looks by working the ball into and out of the high post. The outside shot opportunities have to be created through offensive flow and good ball movement. Pass that ball one more time, folks.


Only Hood and Parker have the length and offensive skills to receive the ball @ the high post against Cuse.


Yes, if you really want to take challenged midrange jumpshots that badly (considered by basketball analytics to be the worst shot you can take). I'll post the link again that says Amile (and MP3) did great facilitating an efficient offense from the high post: http://espn.go.com/blog/statsinfo/post/_/id/85076/how-duke-can-beat-the-syracuse-zone

It isn't just about taking midrange jumpshots, it is also about driving to the basket or dishing to a player cutting backdoor when the zone is stretched by the threat of a dangerous 3 PT FG shooter. I believe we will see Jefferson at the high post a lot tonight, so I hope he forces Syracuse to actually guard him when he has the ball. Jefferson possesses the requisite offensive skills to both score and pass. I also think we will see Parker and Hood in the high post at times. All three (and MPIII if he sees some action) will need to be effective for Duke to break Syracuse's vaunted zone defense.

dukelifer
02-22-2014, 10:00 AM
I got that too. I doubt the team got back from Chapel Hill at 3am yesterday. But they probably didn't get to bed until well after midnight and then up again yesterday morning for classes and film. Somewhere in there they got in a light practice. Probably not as brutal as the in-between after the GTech game, but certainly not much time to prepare and gain their legs. A win today would just be huge after the kind of schedule Duke has had this week.

It is not clear to me that the performance this week is an indication of how good this team is or the schedule. But tonight's game will have a huge impact on post season seeding. This Duke team has shown they can play with anyone- but winning is more about performance at the end of games. Duke has not been great so far in clutch time. This, however, could change in a dime. But right now the schedule is working against Duke in a big way. Hopefully they will be better for it at the end of the season.

jv001
02-22-2014, 10:10 AM
I got that too. I doubt the team got back from Chapel Hill at 3am yesterday. But they probably didn't get to bed until well after midnight and then up again yesterday morning for classes and film. Somewhere in there they got in a light practice. Probably not as brutal as the in-between after the GTech game, but certainly not much time to prepare and gain their legs. A win today would just be huge after the kind of schedule Duke has had this week.

Coach K said this on Mad Dog radio yesterday. A game is not concluded until the team has seen the game just played on video and gone over it. Yesterday morning they did that for the unc game. They also had a light practice yesterday morning on the defensive game plan for Cuse. They were to get together again last night to go over the offensive game plan. Sounds like Coach K is giving the team time to rest and get ready for a tough game tonight. GoDuke!

brauf33
02-22-2014, 10:20 AM
I think playing at home will help a lot. Players being able to feed off the energy that's going to be in Cameron will be crucial, and because of that, I don't know if physical fatigue will play as big a factor. I'm more concerned about the team's mental fatigue. They need to be able to recover from the emotion of the UNC game and refocus with the intensity level needed to beat a team like Cuse. But again, with it being at home, I don't think it'll play too big a role.

You can read the rest of my predictions for the game here in my preview:
http://www.chatsports.com/duke-blue-devils/a/Duke-vs-Syracuse-Preview-amp-Predictions-Can-it-Live-Up-to-the-Hype-Again-10-20-389

dukelifer
02-22-2014, 10:42 AM
I think playing at home will help a lot. Players being able to feed off the energy that's going to be in Cameron will be crucial, and because of that, I don't know if physical fatigue will play as big a factor. I'm more concerned about the team's mental fatigue. They need to be able to recover from the emotion of the UNC game and refocus with the intensity level needed to beat a team like Cuse. But again, with it being at home, I don't think it'll play too big a role.

You can read the rest of my predictions for the game here in my preview:
http://www.chatsports.com/duke-blue-devils/a/Duke-vs-Syracuse-Preview-amp-Predictions-Can-it-Live-Up-to-the-Hype-Again-10-20-389

The crowd will be a huge help for energy. Cuse rarely dominates on O so Duke should be in the game throughout. The key is end of game performance. Cuse is very good- Duke not so much - in crunch time. Duke will need to make plays at the end of the game.

jv001
02-22-2014, 10:56 AM
I think playing at home will help a lot. Players being able to feed off the energy that's going to be in Cameron will be crucial, and because of that, I don't know if physical fatigue will play as big a factor. I'm more concerned about the team's mental fatigue. They need to be able to recover from the emotion of the UNC game and refocus with the intensity level needed to beat a team like Cuse. But again, with it being at home, I don't think it'll play too big a role.

You can read the rest of my predictions for the game here in my preview:
http://www.chatsports.com/duke-blue-devils/a/Duke-vs-Syracuse-Preview-amp-Predictions-Can-it-Live-Up-to-the-Hype-Again-10-20-389

Thanks for the link and your take on the Cuse game. I'm not going to tell who you predict as the winner. I'll let our readers take a look for themselves. The Syracuse guy stated he thinks the Big East was a better league. Do you feel that way? GoDuke!

killerleft
02-22-2014, 11:01 AM
Clw, trust and believe when we beat cuse this saturday duke fans have more than enough class to know the "W" wouldn't warrant our storming of the court.

After all it's our homecourt, we should be able to protect it!

Actually, I feel that the storming of the court was fine from a 'class' perspective. The students aren't responsible for the various scandals, and they beat their 5th-ranked archrival. And I'd be very fine with Duke students rushing the court after our win over Syracuse today;). They can hold their Grey Poupon in the air for 'class', if you need it. This would be a great win to cap off the week.

Acting like we've 'been there, done that' suggests to me that there isn't much point in being at the game at all. Like, yawn?

CR9
02-22-2014, 11:18 AM
C'mon - turn that frown upside down

It's not a big frown, and I still have money on Duke to win but I can just seem all these games on such a short amount of time taking their toll. If it wasn't tiredness that cost them against Carolina, it will against Syracuse.

moonpie23
02-22-2014, 11:27 AM
who are the refs today?

Troublemaker
02-22-2014, 12:15 PM
Can't see Duke winning this. They're a drained team, mentally and physically. If they'd have beaten Carolina, I'd have given them a punchers chance, purely by being buoyed by the result but not now. I can see another second half collapse because of a tightened rotation and all-arm jumpshots.


It's not a big frown, and I still have money on Duke to win but I can just seem all these games on such a short amount of time taking their toll. If it wasn't tiredness that cost them against Carolina, it will against Syracuse.

What's up with this ridiculous back-and-forth flippity-floppity hedging? Have a story and stick with it. You obviously don't think Duke has a chance. Heck, you may even be right. But show some cajones.

rsvman
02-22-2014, 12:42 PM
A lot of talk about the idea of having Jabari catch the ball in the high post, but if I recall correctly, Coach K's approach in game one was to put Jabari deep on the baseline. From that position he did get several uncontested dunks.

I think to properly attack the zone you should have somebody who be effective either shooting or passing from the high post, and somebody who can be explosive to the basket deep on the baseline just to the side of the lane, and some people who can hit 3-pointers scattered around the 3-point line.

Maybe Hood at the high post with Jabari below the low blocks makes the most sense, at least until it is proven it isn't working? If Jabari goes to the high post I would put Jefferson deep on the low block, I guess.

Might be interesting to give Semi some game time on that low block; when the defense collapses on either Hood or Parker driving from the high post, shuffle it off to Semi for the thunder-dunk! Semi would also give us a few more fouls without losing our best offensive players.

davekay1971
02-22-2014, 12:49 PM
A lot of talk about the idea of having Jabari catch the ball in the high post, but if I recall correctly, Coach K's approach in game one was to put Jabari deep on the baseline. From that position he did get several uncontested dunks.

I think to properly attack the zone you should have somebody who be effective either shooting or passing from the high post, and somebody who can be explosive to the basket deep on the baseline just to the side of the lane, and some people who can hit 3-pointers scattered around the 3-point line.

Maybe Hood at the high post with Jabari below the low blocks makes the most sense, at least until it is proven it isn't working? If Jabari goes to the high post I would put Jefferson deep on the low block, I guess.

Might be interesting to give Semi some game time on that low block; when the defense collapses on either Hood or Parker driving from the high post, shuffle it off to Semi for the thunder-dunk! Semi would also give us a few more fouls without losing our best offensive players.

I remember Amile getting to the high post and passing out of that spot previously. He had good passing instincts from that position. Even better, you have to defend Amile when he catches the ball at the high post because he does have the ability to drive and finish from there (even though his 15 foot jumper is not, yet, a fear-inspiring weapon). But I agree with rsvman's post in that Rodney would be another good choice to have flash to the high post. He's a great finisher, has a nice mid-range jumper, and is smart with the ball. K may prefer, however, to have someone else catch in the high post to leave Rodney free to spot up for an open 3 or cut the baseline for a catch-and-finish.

CR9
02-22-2014, 01:20 PM
What's up with this ridiculous back-and-forth flippity-floppity hedging? Have a story and stick with it. You obviously don't think Duke has a chance. Heck, you may even be right. But show some cajones.

Well, I have them +2, so I was slightly disingenuous but I had 3 when they played at the Dome and won $5. Considering Syracuse penchant for close games, I feel as though I have a chance to win again.

DtrainBuckshot
02-22-2014, 01:33 PM
Saw the Orangemen last night at the Angus Barn. Lots of wine and cheese tarheel fans wishing them luck.
Hopefully they got their fill of cheese and crackers and feel a little lethargic today!

Bob Green
02-22-2014, 01:34 PM
Current consensus has Duke as a 6.5 points favorite with the over/under set at 135 so Vegas is looking for a score in the neighborhood of 71-64.

davekay1971
02-22-2014, 01:37 PM
Well, I have them +2, so I was slightly disingenuous but I had 3 when they played at the Dome and won $5. Considering Syracuse penchant for close games, I feel as though I have a chance to win again.

So you win when Duke loses, if Duke loses by little enough? GET OFF MY LAWN!

DukieInBrasil
02-22-2014, 01:38 PM
What's up with this ridiculous back-and-forth flippity-floppity hedging? Have a story and stick with it. You obviously don't think Duke has a chance. Heck, you may even be right. But show some cajones.

Cojones, not cajones. Cojones= slang for male anatomy, cajones= big boxes. Language lesson over.
I always think Duke will win every game, and am sad when we lose. I get CR9's anxiety, i think Duke can (and should) win vs. 'Cuse, but it seems like this team's psyche is mercurial, and that it wouldn't take much to throw them off stride causing us to lose. There's no way this team should fail to put up lots of points, but they do with some frequency, when they fail to play as a team with lots of good passing and instead go 1-on-1 hero ball. Maybe they will have internalized that lesson from the UNC game, pass the ball and help your team and teammates make winning plays all night long.

DukeAlumBS
02-22-2014, 01:47 PM
Well, I have them +2, so I was slightly disingenuous but I had 3 when they played at the Dome and won $5. Considering Syracuse penchant for close games, I feel as though I have a chance to win again.

We have an pissed team that almost beat them. The UNC game was a joke. We lost.
We will win at home with Syracuse and UNC CH.
My concerns are there area lot of Cook fans. He may not fair well here in Durham. He was 1 of 8 from the 3 at Syracuse game. 1 of 3 at Pitt.
We need to allow the others have their day. Dawkins/ Soulomon/ and the rest of the team.
With the Syracuse game it was the combination of both that almost did it!
My feeling, is go with the bigger/defensive guys. That make their 3! In this game rather have the other guards than Cook.
In the big game, he is weak.
In the winning game Dawkins has won for this team!
Duke by 10.
Wheat we will kick your butt in Durham. I love the floor thing.
That elevates Duke above your team.
I take pride that your team, with serious issues. APPRECIATES and RESPECTS my Duke!
Alright, time op[en my game bottle!
Later

Bob Green
02-22-2014, 01:51 PM
Alright, time op[en my game bottle!

You sure you haven't already opened it?

Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15
02-22-2014, 01:51 PM
I remember Amile getting to the high post and passing out of that spot previously. He had good passing instincts from that position. Even better, you have to defend Amile when he catches the ball at the high post because he does have the ability to drive and finish from there (even though his 15 foot jumper is not, yet, a fear-inspiring weapon). But I agree with rsvman's post in that Rodney would be another good choice to have flash to the high post. He's a great finisher, has a nice mid-range jumper, and is smart with the ball. K may prefer, however, to have someone else catch in the high post to leave Rodney free to spot up for an open 3 or cut the baseline for a catch-and-finish.

I'd like to see Amile catching the ball at the high post against the zone, with Parker on the baseline if they double in from underneath, and Hood on the wing if the collapse in from the outside. Amile has good decision-making skills, and if he can make a step towards the goal and force the issue, he's got great options. MP3 also performed this role admirably against the Orange last game, though he doesn't present the scoring threat of Amile, and this limits how much the zone will collapse and leave some opportunities.

I like our chances tonight. UNC showed this afternoon that they are still the real deal. If we can knock off (still) #1 Syracuse at home, win the next few, and then meet a UNC team at home for the last game of the season against one of the hottest teams in the nation, we can still be riding a really nice wave of momentum into the tournament schedule.

How Duke responds to the (massively) disappointing second half in Chapel Hill 46 hours earlier will tell us a lot about the mental toughness of this team. I don't buy any of the "tired legs" arguments, but I do buy that it is really difficult to psych yourself up for that many games in a week. If our boys come out strong, attack the zone, shoot well, and play tenacious defense, we have a chance to bury Syracuse and make a statement win. If we come out deflated and unfocused, we might be on the wrong side of a whoopin.

Go Duke!

jv001
02-22-2014, 02:50 PM
You sure you haven't already opened it?

My thoughts exactly. :cool:GoDuke!

roywhite
02-22-2014, 04:26 PM
You sure you haven't already opened it?


My thoughts exactly. :cool:GoDuke!

I abstained from alcoholic beverages in watching the Duke--UNC game. Won't make that mistake in watching Duke--Syracuse this evening. ;)

gofurman
02-22-2014, 05:05 PM
I have concerns the team will be absolutely GASSED (K noted in his postgame last night that the team looked tired). Plus the way we lost last night could also affect the team's confidence. This game was HUGE and it's even bigger now as we need it to hold onto a 3 seed in the ACC tourny. If we fail to beat the Cuse we could easily slip to 4th or 5th by the end of the season and potentially lose the bye in the ACC Tourny.

Should we be fortunate to win this game I pray that the students do NOT rush the Court.

The top 4 places in acc all get a bye ( of two days ) in acc tourney right?

Emerrick
02-22-2014, 05:08 PM
Took a shower, poured a beer, sitting in my favorite chair at 5:55 pm, ready for the game at 6.

Started scanning the channels, not in a real rush b/c I know it is being recorded, but panic starts to set in when I can't find the game (thinking another blackout--- but that would be impossible).

Until I learn the game is at 7. When did they change the time??? Lol... Original time on the calendar was 7.

Glad I'm not playing - all that adrenaline just drained out of me!!!


Let's go boys. Another hour to warm up!

Bob Green
02-22-2014, 05:09 PM
The top 4 places in acc all get a bye ( of two days ) in acc tourney right?

Yes, seeds one through four automatically qualify for the quarterfinals via a double bye. Seeds five through nine receive a one game bye, with seeds 10 through 15 having to play five straight days to win it all.

slower
02-22-2014, 05:11 PM
We have an pissed team that almost beat them. The UNC game was a joke. We lost.
We will win at home with Syracuse and UNC CH.
My concerns are there area lot of Cook fans. He may not fair well here in Durham. He was 1 of 8 from the 3 at Syracuse game. 1 of 3 at Pitt.
We need to allow the others have their day. Dawkins/ Soulomon/ and the rest of the team.
With the Syracuse game it was the combination of both that almost did it!
My feeling, is go with the bigger/defensive guys. That make their 3! In this game rather have the other guards than Cook.
In the big game, he is weak.
In the winning game Dawkins has won for this team!
Duke by 10.
Wheat we will kick your butt in Durham. I love the floor thing.
That elevates Duke above your team.
I take pride that your team, with serious issues. APPRECIATES and RESPECTS my Duke!
Alright, time op[en my game bottle!
Later

Jimmy just might want to focus on the contents of his bottle and stop making predictions. But Jimmy is apparently a big "Next Play" kind of guy, so I guess prior results do not slow him down. Cheers! And yes, Wheat, watch out for the floor thing. You have been warned, my friend!

riverside6
02-22-2014, 05:44 PM
Live tempo-based stats for Duke/Syracuse, starters posted...

http://www.scacchoops.com/ViewHDGame.asp?hSchedule=20130

nyesq83
02-22-2014, 06:16 PM
That is all!

snewman92
02-22-2014, 06:22 PM
That intentional foul against Dre may have been the WORST call in the history of organized sports. I mean dating back to the first Olympics.

devilnfla
02-22-2014, 06:24 PM
Already feel like terping.......these refs, wow!

CLW
02-22-2014, 06:24 PM
Same ole same ole. When the shots don't fall this team plays even worse on the defensive end than when they do. Giving the Orange anything they want in the paint of course they are going to make a high percentage from inside 10 feet. Parker forcing the issue on the offensive end. HORRIBLE start.

nyesq83
02-22-2014, 06:28 PM
They are mind-jobbing us.

CLW
02-22-2014, 06:29 PM
MP3 bringing more energy/effort than the rest of the team COMBINED. Made the one bad pass but otherwise he's gotta be getting close to becoming a starter the way he has played this week.

wavedukefan70s
02-22-2014, 06:30 PM
Gotta give some live to mp3.hes playing his tail off.

LBF
02-22-2014, 06:30 PM
I hope someone steps up besides Plumlee.

arnie
02-22-2014, 06:30 PM
Same ole same ole. When the shots don't fall this team plays even worse on the defensive end than when they do. Giving the Orange anything they want in the paint of course they are going to make a high percentage from inside 10 feet. Parker forcing the issue on the offensive end. HORRIBLE start.

Also not getting loose balls- Thornton struggling. Who'd have thought Plum would have to carry us.

sporthenry
02-22-2014, 06:33 PM
MP3 bringing more energy/effort than the rest of the team COMBINED. Made the one bad pass but otherwise he's gotta be getting close to becoming a starter the way he has played this week.

If you are going to play this type of defense and TT gets to play b/c of his D, then not sure why MP3 doesn't get the same benefit. Especially when MP3 can get offensive rebounds and protect the rim.

devilnfla
02-22-2014, 06:36 PM
Jabari, 5 fumbles....

LBF
02-22-2014, 06:37 PM
We have to put them in foul trouble

_Gary
02-22-2014, 06:38 PM
Oh, if only our players (especially Jabari) would get even a little love when they go down low and get hacked. Either our guys have the weakest handles of any team in the nation or Syracuse is getting away with murder. We've already had several "strips" of the ball down low that I think were fouls but we aren't getting any of those calls.

sporthenry
02-22-2014, 06:39 PM
Oh, if only our players (especially Jabari) would get even a little love when they go down low and get hacked. Either our guys have the weakest handles of any team in the nation or Syracuse is getting away with murder. We've already had several "strips" of the ball down low that I think were fouls but we aren't getting any of those calls.

This is just nuts. And Hood gets called a foul for boxing out.

CLW
02-22-2014, 06:41 PM
MP3 checks out the Orange start KILLING us on the glass...... coincidence? Me thinks not.

ChrisP
02-22-2014, 06:42 PM
Love Jabari but he's just not with it tonight :(

Really going to have to hit some shots. Our shooting has been off since MD game

Duke76
02-22-2014, 06:42 PM
This is just nuts. And Hood gets called a foul for boxing out.


i long for the day when our guys learn to pass when someone 6 inches is hovering over them

_Gary
02-22-2014, 06:43 PM
This is just nuts. And Hood gets called a foul for boxing out.

I've noticed a distinct difference recently where boxing out means nothing any more. Refs allow guys to go over the back so often that it honestly doesn't seem to pay to use traditional box outs where you create a wide base because guys just jump up your back and get easy putbacks, even though technically it should be a foul.

sporthenry
02-22-2014, 06:45 PM
Well I've noticed a change in Duke's defense since the timeout. However, they are overextending themselves and giving up a ton of OR's. Not sure how MP3 doesn't get 20-25+ tonight.

_Gary
02-22-2014, 06:47 PM
Our foul shooting has been atrocious tonight. Can't believe how many points we've already left at the line.

snewman92
02-22-2014, 06:48 PM
throwing FT elixir?

devilnfla
02-22-2014, 06:50 PM
FT shooting, ugh.

CLW
02-22-2014, 06:50 PM
Considering how POOR we played we are lucky to be tied at the half.

MP3 needs to play the ENTIRE 2nd half b/c we need him on the glass and as a rim protector.

_Gary
02-22-2014, 06:52 PM
Are we looking at another game where we basically only go 7 deep? We've seen only a minute or so of Andre in the first half (admittedly he didn't do much), and no Matt again. On the plus side, we are seeing plenty of Marshal, which was going to be a must tonight with all of Syracuse's length.

lotusland
02-22-2014, 06:52 PM
Glad cuse can't shoot straight tonight. Need to keep hood in the high post and hopefully the FTs start falling. More MP3! Need a little sprinkle of are too. Quinn needs to step up too.

sporthenry
02-22-2014, 06:53 PM
Apart from either team hitting shots, game will be decided upon Duke's response to offensive rebounding and Cuse's response to Hood in the high post.

arnie
02-22-2014, 06:53 PM
FT shooting, ugh.

I thought we played very hard, but played poorly. Syracuse got most loose balls, killed us on the offensive boards, and we missed a lot if open shots. I'm afraid the reason we're tied is a testament to Syracuse's inept O.

Duke76
02-22-2014, 06:54 PM
Are we looking at another game where we basically only go 7 deep? We've seen only a minute or so of Andre in the first half (admittedly he didn't do much), and no Matt again. On the plus side, we are seeing plenty of Marshal, which was going to be a must tonight with all of Syracuse's length.

well considering jabari and cook can't do a thing and we don't know how to box out i'd say it is a minor miracle we are tied...think we will play better in second half...gotta a feeling about Andre if he can just get back in and make the first one otherwise it will be a quick hook, unfortunately

moonpie23
02-22-2014, 06:54 PM
they are grabbing jabari as soon as he gets the ball inside…..stripping the ball has been frequent lately

ChrisP
02-22-2014, 06:56 PM
MP3 and Hood playing well, along with TT, I think but...not much else in this 1st half. Jabari did make a couple 3's later though and has no fouls (I think) so he should feel free to turn it loose in the 2nd half.

sagegrouse
02-22-2014, 06:57 PM
Gritty performance in the first half. I am impressed that we clawed our way back into the game. And we have done it with very little offense. I give our D a lot of credit for the Orangemen's poor shooting (28%).


Go Duke!

arnie
02-22-2014, 07:01 PM
Gritty performance in the first half. I am impressed that we clawed our way back into the game. And we have done it with very little offense. I give our D a lot of credit for the Orangemen's poor shooting (28%).


Go Duke!

We've played good D, but Syracuse can shoot atrociously. Just realized none of our bigs have more than 1 foul, and as noted above Parker can be aggressive with 0 fouls.

gwlaw99
02-22-2014, 07:01 PM
Need to keep hood in the middle of the zone. He's doing a great job attacking.

Wildling
02-22-2014, 07:02 PM
Need to keep hood in the middle of the zone. He's doing a great job attacking.

Agreed!

And MP3 needs the same amount of minutes in the 2nd half!

TheDuckStore
02-22-2014, 07:03 PM
Keep passing it into the middle...

Good things have happened (especially with Hood) when we get it inside the zone. Throwing it around the perimeter and screening the ball have been less effective thus far. Hopefully the team keeps the middle a priority in the second half. Jabari flashing to the top of the key would be good to see, as well.

bluebeagle
02-22-2014, 07:03 PM
Drive, Drive, Drive, and please hit some FTS

Selover
02-22-2014, 07:07 PM
Kind of crazy that they have us doubled up on offensive boards, but we have more second chance points.

hustleplays
02-22-2014, 07:10 PM
Need to keep hood in the middle of the zone. He's doing a great job attacking.

Agreed. Hood's doing a great job in the middle. Kudos to MP3. I like TT's hustle. While we are getting hacked going to the rack, IMO, Jabari has to be tougher and smarter. He's not guarding the ball well. I also noticed that when he was stripped of the ball and Syracuse broke out on transition, Jabari just jogged. That's awful. Both Sulaimon and Hood have gotten bumped pretty hard on the drive, and they made their shots anyway.

As K said, as did many of us posters, we do need more "it" -- that steely heart that maintains composure, no matter what. We have too many good perimeter shooters for all of them to be susceptible to off-night, bad shooting contagion. I hope we show heart and smarts -- we can win this thing. Toughness!

CLW
02-22-2014, 07:15 PM
that parker dunk attempt foul call was nearly IDENTICAL to the non call on Hood (@ the Dome). NCAA officiating is so...... inconsistent its PATHETIC.

Faison1
02-22-2014, 07:16 PM
Is anyone else bothered by the camera work tonight?

It's almost as if they have a rookie in the production booth who is trying too hard to catch the atmosphere for College Gameday.

LBF
02-22-2014, 07:16 PM
There is so much opportunity for us. Open 3's, high post, and drives to the basket. We should win this game

Emerrick
02-22-2014, 07:20 PM
Why is Jefferson in the game right now? First on Ennis then Fair. Come on!!!!!

ChrisP
02-22-2014, 07:21 PM
There is so much opportunity for us. Open 3's, high post, and drives to the basket. We should win this game

I agree. Should being the key word!

CR9
02-22-2014, 07:26 PM
Wow refs.

nyesq83
02-22-2014, 07:26 PM
QC - if you are gonna touch a man, hit him.

devilnfla
02-22-2014, 07:27 PM
Phantom foul call on Cook when Ennis was using off hand to create space.

CLW
02-22-2014, 07:27 PM
cook i so..... dr. jekyll/mr. hyde it drives me nuts.

ChrisP
02-22-2014, 07:28 PM
Phantom foul call on Cook when Ennis was using off hand to create space.

No, Q clearly shoved him in the chest. Boneheaded play!!!

bbosbbos
02-22-2014, 07:28 PM
4 fouls on their bigs. If we do not know what to do, and keep shooting from 3, I do not know what to say.

arnie
02-22-2014, 07:29 PM
I agree. Should being the key word!

Yes our individual players are better, but can the team be better.

sporthenry
02-22-2014, 07:29 PM
No, Q clearly shoved him in the chest. Boneheaded play!!!

Huh?

ChrisP
02-22-2014, 07:34 PM
Did Jabari sign a pledge to NEVER put his hands up when his man shoots the ball or something? ??

CLW
02-22-2014, 07:39 PM
Christmas has a knack of getting in Jefferson's head and/or drawing a ton of fouls on him.

Selover
02-22-2014, 07:40 PM
I think we need to try to get it to Jabari down low and get Christmas out of there.

sporthenry
02-22-2014, 07:45 PM
For a poor start, Jabari has certainly turned it on as well.

CR9
02-22-2014, 07:45 PM
Where is plums?!

ChrisP
02-22-2014, 07:45 PM
Where is plums?!

Wondering the same thing!

Selover
02-22-2014, 07:45 PM
That had to have been a foul on Jabari's putback.

CLW
02-22-2014, 07:46 PM
took the air out of the ball WAY TO EARLY!

CR9
02-22-2014, 07:48 PM
Refs have been bad on both ends. All I want is consistency, dammit.

LBF
02-22-2014, 07:49 PM
We really need to tighten up the D and finish this thing.

bbosbbos
02-22-2014, 07:49 PM
Very interesting game, all of opponent bigs are with 4 or 3 fouls, we keep shooting 3 or making jump shots, avoid body contact. It is my 0.02 that we need to foul all their bigs out.

Utley
02-22-2014, 07:49 PM
The orange are so ripe for a loss here. Hate the delay and not going down low. Just keep playing

Emerrick
02-22-2014, 07:50 PM
Too late for plums. Free throw time possibly, wish he would've been in much earlier though.

vick
02-22-2014, 07:50 PM
Where is plums?!

Announcers haven't mentioned it much, but the beat writers on twitter say he was working with the trainer away from the bench for some time.

Utley
02-22-2014, 07:51 PM
Just passing along the perimeter AGAIN

CR9
02-22-2014, 07:51 PM
took the air out of the ball WAY TO EARLY!

This. Christmas has 4 and they're pounding the ball flat and settling for a 3.

nyesq83
02-22-2014, 07:51 PM
Just saying

Maybe too much Red Bull?

ChrisP
02-22-2014, 07:52 PM
Why is Dre not in there to take all these 3's Cook has been bricking???

18258
02-22-2014, 07:52 PM
duke cant figure this zone out for nothing, run the clock down and brick a 3

Channing
02-22-2014, 07:52 PM
Our best offense can't be cook and she'd passing back and forth for 30 seconds

LBF
02-22-2014, 07:53 PM
Where has that play been?

CR9
02-22-2014, 07:54 PM
Announcers haven't mentioned it much, but the beat writers on twitter say he was working with the trainer away from the bench for some time.

Just what they needed with Amile having 4.

sporthenry
02-22-2014, 07:54 PM
duke cant figure this zone out for nothing, run the clock down and brick a 3

This is just wrong.

18258
02-22-2014, 07:54 PM
Duke has been lookin tired all game, so has syralose

18258
02-22-2014, 07:55 PM
This is just wrong.

no you are wrong

#1Duke
02-22-2014, 08:03 PM
Whew!! NO complaints about the refs tonight!!

PSurprise
02-22-2014, 08:04 PM
Wow.

ChrisP
02-22-2014, 08:05 PM
What in eff is Bilas talking about the Hood charge being "questionable"???