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View Full Version : MBB: Northwestern 65, Wisconsin 56; Collins win a tough road game



Mal
01-29-2014, 09:42 PM
Still building on a 15 point lead vs. No. 13 (though still overranked) Wisconsin, with under 4:00 to go. More impressive is that it's at the Kohl Center, where Bucky almost never loses.

NashvilleDevil
01-29-2014, 09:45 PM
Why couldn't this post wait until 30 seconds left?
That's 5 straight points for Bucky

Dukehky
01-29-2014, 09:46 PM
Come on bro!!! There is another jynx free thread.

Duvall
01-29-2014, 09:47 PM
15-point lead down to ten, and fading fast.

Like clockwork.

Duvall
01-29-2014, 09:49 PM
Wisconsin now getting Dean Dome comeback no-calls. Think there were three separate Wisconsin tackles on that last possession.

Duvall
01-29-2014, 10:01 PM
Well.

NashvilleDevil
01-29-2014, 10:02 PM
I'm actually upset that this thread exists.

Mal
01-29-2014, 10:05 PM
Get a little backbone. Enjoy a nice upset. It's over.

NashvilleDevil
01-29-2014, 10:05 PM
I notice you were silent as Bucky made their run.

Newton_14
01-29-2014, 10:06 PM
Congrats to Chris. Well done buddy. Big win!

Troublemaker
01-29-2014, 10:08 PM
Northwestern's first win at Kohl Center since 1996

Henderson
01-29-2014, 10:09 PM
I can't imagine how Chris must feel right now. Good on ya.

dukelifer
01-29-2014, 10:38 PM
Collins has his team believing. They are playing well right now.

burnspbesq
01-29-2014, 11:02 PM
With tonight's win, northwestern moves into sixth place in the Big Integer.

We all knew this was coming.

Sure we did.

kAzE
01-29-2014, 11:31 PM
Wow, What a great first season Coach Collins is having at NU. I don't think anybody expected a .500 season in the toughest conference in basketball with the type of talent on that roster. He's really getting the most out of the talent that he has, and doing a nice job recruiting as well. If he keeps this up and builds NU into a real contender in the B10, I gotta imagine he will be on the short list for the Duke job when it becomes available.

BD80
01-30-2014, 01:10 AM
With tonight's win, northwestern moves into sixth place in the Big Integer. ....

That places them in the top half? Top 1/3? Top 1/4? Its tough to keep track.

Henderson
01-30-2014, 09:54 AM
Just for fun, I watched a couple Collins press conferences last night. I came away even more impressed. This guy is going places. People will buy what he's selling.

Faustus
01-30-2014, 10:05 AM
With Chris's Chicago upbringing and background, maybe this IS where he wants to go -- and stay -- to create and then sustain a program and legacy of his own.

As a coach, would you rather have been John Wooden at UCLA, or the many coaches succeeeding him trying desperately and often impossibly to uphold the expectations of the local press and the fans? Evanston is a very nice place too (besides the winter weather, of course...)

But time will tell. Remember Quin Snider made a big splash at Mizzou his first year or two, and his career has taken some interesting twists since. But I'm very pleased at how year one is turning out for Chris. And indeed, before long many more established programs may come calling for his services. He waited a long time to take a coaching job, however, and ended up choosing NW. It may be his dream job.

jv001
01-30-2014, 10:06 AM
Just for fun, I watched a couple Collins press conferences last night. I came away even more impressed. This guy is going places. People will buy what he's selling.

Could you see Chris Collins as one of the top four or five candidates to succeed Coach K at Duke? I can. GoDuke!

I see kAzE has the same thoughts. I didn't look close at all the posts, my bad. GoDuke!

flyingdutchdevil
01-30-2014, 10:18 AM
Could you see Chris Collins as one of the top four or five candidates to succeed Coach K at Duke? I can. GoDuke!

I see kAzE has the same thoughts. I didn't look close at all the posts, my bad. GoDuke!

Top four or five? Try top 2-3 (who have a Duke pedigree). Unfortunately, I don't see Johnny Dawkins as a candidate, especially with how Stanford is coming along and his so-so recruiting efforts. Mike Brey is a choice, but he also isn't great at recruiting and his teams are rarely, if ever, in the top 10. Amaker is doing wonders at Harvard, but the Ivys are a completely different ballgame than the BCS schools.

I would like to see Capel get another gig. He is great at recruiting and got a raw deal at Okla, IMO. Collins is doing a fantastic job thus far in only half a season (recruiting and changing the culture).

All in all, no one is ready yet. I think in 3-4 years, we'll have a much better understanding of the landscape (and closer to K's retirement).

kAzE
01-30-2014, 10:20 AM
Could you see Chris Collins as one of the top four or five candidates to succeed Coach K at Duke? I can. GoDuke!

I see kAzE has the same thoughts. I didn't look close at all the posts, my bad. GoDuke!

There's still a long way to go for Coach Collins. As great as the vibes are for his program right now, he's only .500 at the moment. Given his level of talent, that's an accomplishment in itself, but over the 4 or 5 years, we're going to see what he's really capable of when he gets his own guys and establishes his system and culture. If he can get this Northwestern program to 20 wins in the next 3-4 years, at that point, I'd say he'd have put himself ahead of Johnny D and Jeff Capel. I think Wojo will be in the mix for the job even if he's an assistant until the day Coach K retires, but Collins is the type of guy with the background and basketball mind to be a potential successor for sure.

Honestly, I had been secretly hoping and wishing that Brad Stevens was holding out for the Duke job, but I guess that's no longer an option with the success he's had in the NBA already. That guy can coach.

jv001
01-30-2014, 10:22 AM
Top four or five? Try top 2-3 (who have a Duke pedigree). Unfortunately, I don't see Johnny Dawkins as a candidate, especially with how Stanford is coming along and his so-so recruiting efforts. Mike Brey is a choice, but he also isn't great at recruiting and his teams are rarely, if ever, in the top 10. Amaker is doing wonders at Harvard, but the Ivys are a completely different ballgame than the BCS schools.

I would like to see Capel get another gig. He is great at recruiting and got a raw deal at Okla, IMO. Collins is doing a fantastic job thus far in only half a season (recruiting and changing the culture).

All in all, no one is ready yet. I think in 3-4 years, we'll have a much better understanding of the landscape (and closer to K's retirement).

You named my two top choices of ex-players in Collins and Capel. I think they can recruit and have good in game coaching skills. But like you say, in 3-4 years we'll have a much better understanding of the coaching landscape. GoDuke!

Mal
01-30-2014, 03:05 PM
I notice you were silent as Bucky made their run. Apologies. Was watching the game rather than refreshing all the time, and didn't suspect I'd be catching flak in the meantime! :) For what it's worth, I've seen a lot of choke jobs and miracle comebacks, but I swear I had no sense that that was happening here. Wisconsin couldn't hit the broad side of a barn the entire game, and all NW had to do was figure out how to inbound the ball and the game was over. I trusted Collins to make that happen.

NashvilleDevil
01-30-2014, 03:10 PM
Apologies. Was watching the game rather than refreshing all the time, and didn't suspect I'd be catching flak in the meantime! :) For what it's worth, I've seen a lot of choke jobs and miracle comebacks, but I swear I had no sense that that was happening here. Wisconsin couldn't hit the broad side of a barn the entire game, and all NW had to do was figure out how to inbound the ball and the game was over. I trusted Collins to make that happen.

It did seem that the last 4 minutes took a half hour.

sagegrouse
01-30-2014, 05:15 PM
Honestly, I had been secretly hoping and wishing that Brad Stevens was holding out for the Duke job, but I guess that's no longer an option with the success he's had in the NBA already. That guy can coach.

Being an NBA coach is not a decades-long job. Pat Riley, upon leaving the Lakers, said that the players just tune you out after a while, and you have to move on. Here's an NPR discussion that obliquely mentions Riley:


RACHEL MARTIN (HOST): But I would imagine that there is also some benefit to just changing it up after a while. I mean, you have the same coach for a long time. Maybe you need new blood.

MIKE PESCA (BYLINE): That's it, that's it. Players tune you out. It's a cliche, but it's true, as actually most cliches are. They're just boring. But players say this, and Pat Riley said this, and after a while the players do tune you out. So, if you get a new coach with just slightly different ways essentially saying the same thing, sometimes that new coach works out or at least it's acknowledged that it was time for the old coach to go. With Lindy Ruff, many desperate fans in Buffalo had been saying this for a while.

MARTIN: Is it any different, Mike, with college athletics? I mean, there's some long coaching legacies when you think about Bobby Knight in Indiana, Joe Paterno. I'm sure there's a lot of others.

PESCA: Right. So, in college, there's the opportunity for the coach sort of to become a fiefdom and become one of the more powerful men on campus, you know. It's not the strict employer-employee relationship when it comes to the kind of power that a college coach can accrue. And it's just impossible for a professional coach to do that, especially if it's not a combination coach and GM, and that kind of combo position is becoming more rare as time goes on.

Four years is a long time in the NBA, so maybe Brad Stevens will become available for a multi-decade assignment at Duke.

-jk
01-30-2014, 06:33 PM
It's all part of the Pagliuca conspiracy.

-jk

Dukehky
01-30-2014, 08:39 PM
Yup, may as well turn this into future Duke coaches thread. It's where I wanted to go with it anyway.

I think Dawkins is kind of out of the running, especially considering he's probably going to lose his job after this year unless he turns things around a bit and makes the tournament.

Stevens: I think this would be awesome, but for the first job after K, Mike would throw a s*** fit if they went outside the fam for that first hire.

Collins- We'll see how he continues to do at NW. He got a top 100 recruit in Law, for next year, so we'll see how he keeps up on that front because that's key. Was he the defensive guru? Maybe

Capel- Personally, I think the job is Capel's. He was the primary recruiter for both Jabs and Okafor. He has good head coaching experience- a No 2 seed in the tournament, better than any other former Duke assistant. There are many great choices, I just believe that it will be Capel, and I'm good with that.

kAzE
01-30-2014, 10:41 PM
Yup, may as well turn this into future Duke coaches thread. It's where I wanted to go with it anyway.

I think Dawkins is kind of out of the running, especially considering he's probably going to lose his job after this year unless he turns things around a bit and makes the tournament.

Stevens: I think this would be awesome, but for the first job after K, Mike would throw a s*** fit if they went outside the fam for that first hire.

Collins- We'll see how he continues to do at NW. He got a top 100 recruit in Law, for next year, so we'll see how he keeps up on that front because that's key. Was he the defensive guru? Maybe

Capel- Personally, I think the job is Capel's. He was the primary recruiter for both Jabs and Okafor. He has good head coaching experience- a No 2 seed in the tournament, better than any other former Duke assistant. There are many great choices, I just believe that it will be Capel, and I'm good with that.

Why? Coach K was an outside hire himself. That turned out pretty well. How many of the best coaches in the country were alumni hires? Bill Self didn't go to Kansas, Sean Miller didn't go to Arizona, and Tom Izzo isn't a MSU alum. You gotta go for the best guy for the program, regardless of where he came from. Coach K will have a huge say in who gets the job when he's done, but he's not going to be the one making the decision, and I'd be shocked if he didn't endorse someone like Brad Stevens. That said, I don't think Stevens is going to be available. A lot of NBA coaches get tuned out after awhile, but in some rare cases, that doesn't happen. Greg Popovich has been the Spurs coach for ages, and he's still getting great results. Granted, comparing a newbie like Stevens to a legend like Pop probably isn't really logical, but The way Stevens has been able to work with guys like Avery Bradley and Jordan Crawford and turn them into great players in his first year leads me to believe he's the real deal.

Dukehky
01-30-2014, 10:48 PM
Why? Coach K was an outside hire himself. That turned out pretty well. How many of the best coaches in the country were alumni hires? Bill Self didn't go to Kansas, Sean Miller didn't go to Arizona, and Tom Izzo isn't a MSU alum. You gotta go for the best guy for the program, regardless of where he came from. Coach K will have a huge say in who gets the job when he's done, but he's not going to be the one making the decision, and I'd be shocked if he didn't endorse someone like Brad Stevens.

Just what I think. Also, as good as Bill Foster was, he wasn't the coach for 30+ years with 900 wins at Duke. Calhoun wanted an inside guy, Dean wanted an inside guy, K will want an inside guy. It rewards those who were loyal to him and the program, and it also makes him look good if his successor does well and is one of his proteges. Ollie may be the answer and Guthridge ended up not being the answer, nor was Doherty, but Roy was a family guy too and as much of a clown as he is, he does have 2 ships. Also, Pennell was the coach immediately after Olson, the other two were outside hires, but none of those programs outwardly speak about the importance of the family atmosphere like Duke does. That is the main point under the K regime. Duke is a family. Maybe that's the case at other schools as well. Heathcote and Roy also didn't have the success or longevity that K has. Indiana also replaced Knight with an inside guy in Mike Davis. There are plenty of examples of people going in house to fill head coaching positions after legendary head coaches leave

I'd be willing to bet Duke goes with a Duke guy after K retires. I think Stevens is one of the best coaches in the world right now. I also think he's going to stay with the Celts for a while. This is just my opinion. Even if he was available, I think Duke would go with a Duke guy, and would be willing to bet on it as well, and I think the smart money right now is to take Capel.

Great win for CC. He is doing a hell of a job with the Wildcats and I think that program will be a frequenter of the dance under the direction of Chris Collins.

throatybeard
01-30-2014, 11:22 PM
The main thing that makes me think Brad Stevens will never coach at Duke is that so many Duke people think we can get Brad Stevens.

BD80
01-31-2014, 08:41 AM
Why? Coach K was an outside hire himself. That turned out pretty well. How many of the best coaches in the country were alumni hires? Bill Self didn't go to Kansas, Sean Miller didn't go to Arizona, and Tom Izzo isn't a MSU alum. ...

Family doesn't necessarily mean alum. Izzo was the ultimate family hire, a Michigan native and Northern Michigan alum, who was Jud Heathcoate's assistant for over ten years.

Self had been an assistant under Larry Brown, the only KU coach ever who cared less about education than roy williams. But it required some hair splitting to make that call.

sagegrouse
01-31-2014, 12:44 PM
Just what I think. Also, as good as Bill Foster was, he wasn't the coach for 30+ years with 900 wins at Duke. Calhoun wanted an inside guy, Dean wanted an inside guy, K will want an inside guy. It rewards those who were loyal to him and the program, and it also makes him look good if his successor does well and is one of his proteges. Ollie may be the answer and Guthridge ended up not being the answer, nor was Doherty, but Roy was a family guy too and as much of a clown as he is, he does have 2 ships. Also, Pennell was the coach immediately after Olson, the other two were outside hires, but none of those programs outwardly speak about the importance of the family atmosphere like Duke does. That is the main point under the K regime. Duke is a family. Maybe that's the case at other schools as well. Heathcote and Roy also didn't have the success or longevity that K has. Indiana also replaced Knight with an inside guy in Mike Davis. There are plenty of examples of people going in house to fill head coaching positions after legendary head coaches leave

I'd be willing to bet Duke goes with a Duke guy after K retires. I think Stevens is one of the best coaches in the world right now. I also think he's going to stay with the Celts for a while. This is just my opinion. Even if he was available, I think Duke would go with a Duke guy, and would be willing to bet on it as well, and I think the smart money right now is to take Capel.

Great win for CC. He is doing a hell of a job with the Wildcats and I think that program will be a frequenter of the dance under the direction of Chris Collins.

Dean Smith and John Thompson made a has of succession by retiring suddenly, giving the school no choice but to anoint a favored assistant as head coach. Mike Krzyzewski is too much of a chief executive to act that way. There will be an orderly process and a nationwide search (Duke always says that, whether or not it's true).

It would be pretty hard IMHO for K to say "No" to Brad Stevens.

Henderson
01-31-2014, 05:29 PM
It would be pretty hard IMHO for K to say "No" to Brad Stevens.

For K to say "yes" to Brad Stevens, he'd have to say "no" to some others. And I'm not convinced that doing to would be in Duke's long term interest. I'm not sure Brad Stevens is committed. Anywhere. Jumping to the NBA at the age of 37 might have been a good career move for him, but I'm not sure what it says about his stickiness. Would we be wondering after 2 or 3 years whether he will stay, as his name comes up repeatedly for all those NBA jobs that come open every year?

We've benefited mightily from a coach willing to stay year after year to build a program. The programs I've admired most have always had that attribute.

Dukehky
01-31-2014, 05:45 PM
For K to say "yes" to Brad Stevens, he'd have to say "no" to some others. And I'm not convinced that doing to would be in Duke's long term interest. I'm not sure Brad Stevens is committed. Anywhere. Jumping to the NBA at the age of 37 might have been a good career move for him, but I'm not sure what it says about his stickiness. Would we be wondering after 2 or 3 years whether he will stay, as his name comes up repeatedly for all those NBA jobs that come open every year?

We've benefited mightily from a coach willing to stay year after year to build a program. The programs I've admired most have always had that attribute.

Okay, so I think that Brad Stevens is in Boston to stay. If he were to come back to college, I think it would be for good because it would be the decision that college is where he wants to be, rather than the NBA. So I disagree with your stickiness argument. Also, IF he were to get the Duke job, where would he leave to go to in the college ranks? No where right.

And to Kedsy's comment, I agree that K wouldn't leave the school in the situation where they would have to take an assistant; however, I think that he would say no to Stevens to get one of his guys the job. This is just my opinion, and hopefully, we're like 7 years away from even having to discuss it. I reiterate, I think the Duke job will eventually go to a Duke guy. Dawkins was the heir apparent for a long time, and I personally think that position has been taken by Capel. K hasn't said that like he said about Dawkins, but it is simply what I believe.

sagegrouse
01-31-2014, 06:14 PM
For K to say "yes" to Brad Stevens, he'd have to say "no" to some others. And I'm not convinced that doing to would be in Duke's long term interest. I'm not sure Brad Stevens is committed. Anywhere. Jumping to the NBA at the age of 37 might have been a good career move for him, but I'm not sure what it says about his stickiness. Would we be wondering after 2 or 3 years whether he will stay, as his name comes up repeatedly for all those NBA jobs that come open every year?

We've benefited mightily from a coach willing to stay year after year to build a program. The programs I've admired most have always had that attribute.

It's not K's call. The decision will be with the AD and the President of the University. If I were K, I would stay far away from the selection process, except maybe to answer questions and sell candidates, because whoever is chosen will suffer from comparison.

Besides, it's not the Army way: generals who retire don't pick their successors.

If K decides to retire, the AD logically will ask, "What role do you want to play in the search process?"

Possible answers:

None, except to meet with candidates and answer questions about the job.
I'll be happy to give you my views on candidates, but it is the University's decision, not mine.
I have a recommendation.

I think #1 is by far the most likely response. But the AD may ask him to advise as in #2. I think K would be nuts to go with option #3, especially since he has a lifetime job at Duke.

But what do I know? The only time I remember being right on DBR out of 5,000+ posts was in predicting that All Day Dre would go off against Pitt.