PDA

View Full Version : MBB: Duke 82, Eastern Michigan 59 Post-Game Thread



JBDuke
12-28-2013, 04:08 PM
Put your post-game thoughts here.

DukeBlueHeart4
12-28-2013, 04:12 PM
I was very impressed with our defense for the most part. Good to see the break didn't cause a regression on that front! I was also pleased to see that our boys are adjusting to the zone and learning to beat it even though we clearly still favor the outside shot.

I also have to say how much I am loving having Andre Dawkins back. Watching that kid smile today...that's what basketball is about! He had a stellar game but was clearly just out there having fun, truly enjoying the game and his teammates!

uh_no
12-28-2013, 04:13 PM
Put your post-game thoughts here.

great play all around...good to see dawkins and sheed play excellently....

jabari make your free throws
rodney don't do pull ups on the rim

not much else to glean from this one....good win over an overmatched opponent....defense continues to look good

MartyClark
12-28-2013, 04:21 PM
I was very impressed with our defense for the most part. Good to see the break didn't cause a regression on that front! I was also pleased to see that our boys are adjusting to the zone and learning to beat it even though we clearly still favor the outside shot.

I also have to say how much I am loving having Andre Dawkins back. Watching that kid smile today...that's what basketball is about! He had a stellar game but was clearly just out there having fun, truly enjoying the game and his teammates!

Agree. Great to see Andre have a good game. It seems like he's having fun. He's the zone buster. Hopefully he comes up big in ACC play.

Billy Dat
12-28-2013, 04:26 PM
Eastern Michigan is not great, but they are in the 140s on KenPom so they aren't a joke.

I thought we played pretty great all around. The defense was really really good. They got a bunch of points off of bad Duke offensive possessions rather than having success attacking our defense. For the most part, we contested nearly every shot well, didn't allow a lot of drives to the rim, etc. We rebounded well. I thought we were really impressive.

I also thought that the refs were pretty much back to the old ways on calling fouls. There was quite a bit of contact on both sides on drives to the rim and they weren't blowing the whistle on those.

Anyone know why Rodney didn't start yet came in after a minute and a half?

Dawkins was great, although he was also getting wide open looks. Having Jabari on the floor will do that I guess.

mgtr
12-28-2013, 04:28 PM
I was happy to see Andre a) happy and b) do some other excellent things besides make 3s (though I loved his 3s!)

DukeDevil
12-28-2013, 04:44 PM
I was happy to see Andre a) happy and b) do some other excellent things besides make 3s (though I loved his 3s!)

Agreed. Hard to say if they were playing well because they were happy or the other way around, but everybody looked loose and in sync (with the exception of a few sloppy plays). I was especially happy to see Rasheed getting his time and making so much out of it. A lot of times I feel that our Duke teams look so good early on but seem to have peaked early in the season, and as other teams improve they get outpaced. This team has a ceiling that I still can't see, and that's exciting!

GGLC
12-28-2013, 04:51 PM
Great game. Amile was a monster on the boards, and I loved to see Rasheed and Andre do their things.

GGLC
12-28-2013, 04:54 PM
Andre's block of that three-pointer was pretty amazing.

DukieInBrasil
12-28-2013, 05:00 PM
Great to see Andre have a big-time blow-up game. Seems like most everybody played well.
Quinn had a tough day shooting, but i like that he still came up with steals and lots of assists.
Amile had a quiet day from the floor but came up big at the line (and on the boards), bringing his atrocious 30% FT% up to 40%!!!
Glad to see MP3 get some quality PT and some production to go with it. One question though: will he EVER hit a FT in his collegiate career? One would think that on pure random chance that he would have made one by now.
Rodney's FG efficiency has been in a slide for a while now, but at least today it seems like being ill may have been a part of it.
Finally, glad to see Rasheed getting back to being the effective efficient player that we know he can be. Hope to see more of it!

Henderson
12-28-2013, 05:08 PM
I think Andre and Jabari are now running neck and neck for the most points per minutes played, aren't they?

BD80
12-28-2013, 05:11 PM
... Amile had a quiet day from the floor but came up big at the line (and on the boards), bringing his atrocious 30% FT% up to 40%!!! ...

Just 6 more games like that and he'll be at 100% :rolleyes:

Cameron
12-28-2013, 05:18 PM
The addition of Andre to this year's roster gives Duke that extra dynamic off the bench that would be missed sorely otherwise, especially in light of Rasheed's unsteady and somewhat disappointing play over the course of the season thus far. I've said it before, but it cannot be stressed enough: There is not a more potent scorer in America coming off the bench for any team, anywhere, than Andre Dawkins. Once again, Andre played only slightly more than half the game, yet still notched 20 points on 6-of-10 shooting from beyond the arc. He is now averaging 26.4 points a game per 40 minutes of action. It's shaping up as one of the best seasons for a reserve I've seen in my time watching the Blue Devils.

Amile also played one hell of a game. What I admire of Amile the most is that he understands exactly what needs to be done to help this team win and he does it. He embraces that role and never tries to do more than what is needed. Today that translated into Amile working for defensive rebounds and setting up second-chance points on the offensive end by coming up with missed shots and loose balls and turning those into scoring opportunities for our shooters. It's an aspect of our offense we've really lacked in recent seasons, and Amile is playing that part beautifully. Rare is the offensive player who enthusiastically makes that sort of sacrifice without ever displaying concern for his own personal achievement. Amile is the quintessential team player, and, with a little more polish and confidence, I think Marshall can become that sort of player as well.

As for the broadcasting crew, I thought Lenny Elmore did an excellent job today of concealing his desire for Duke to win. He's the consummate pro.

roywhite
12-28-2013, 05:29 PM
On the defensive end, this Duke team look so different than they did in the first few games. Better communication, better rotation, more understanding of position.

What an offensive weapon Andre is; Duke had the lead throughout this game, but he broke it open. Loved Amile's rebounding and pleased to see Rasheed continue to progress.

BD80
12-28-2013, 05:50 PM
... I thought Lenny Elmore did an excellent job today of concealing his desire for Duke to win. He's the consummate pro.

And his level of preparation is unequalled. Example, in referring to "grad-student" Andre: "He had an up and down senior year."

How many broadcasters would research into Dre's academics last year?

summerwind03
12-28-2013, 05:57 PM
Eastern Michigan is not great, but they are in the 140s on KenPom so they aren't a joke.

I thought we played pretty great all around. The defense was really really good. They got a bunch of points off of bad Duke offensive possessions rather than having success attacking our defense. For the most part, we contested nearly every shot well, didn't allow a lot of drives to the rim, etc. We rebounded well. I thought we were really impressive.

I also thought that the refs were pretty much back to the old ways on calling fouls. There was quite a bit of contact on both sides on drives to the rim and they weren't blowing the whistle on those.

Anyone know why Rodney didn't start yet came in after a minute and a half?

Dawkins was great, although he was also getting wide open looks. Having Jabari on the floor will do that I guess.

I don't see anyone who responded about Rodney not starting, but he was announced as a starter, and then ran off to the locker room immediately before the game, so they announced Dawkins as an additional starter. Not sure what the issue was.

Native
12-28-2013, 05:58 PM
I don't see anyone who responded about Rodney not starting, but he was announced as a starter, and then ran off to the locker room immediately before the game, so they announced Dawkins as an additional starter. Not sure what the issue was.

Rumor is that he was sick. No biggie.

BD80
12-28-2013, 06:09 PM
Rumor is that he was sick. No biggie.

That theory doesn't hold water ...

dukelifer
12-28-2013, 06:11 PM
Good game. Some rust but the team got it done. Andre is playing great at home - needs to be that weapon on the road. Jabari looked mortal- missed throws- lots of turnovers- got his shot blocked- missed a spectacular one handed jam. That is what happens to other players-not Mr Parker. Other than the 23 points and 8 boards - the kid had an off night. Sheed looks to have found his way back into the lineup. Lots of energy - if he starts to hit his jumper watch out. A few good minutes from Marshall and Amile hit his throws- that is major reason for celebration. He looks like he figured something out on his mechanics. If he can be consistent from the line- Duke will be much stronger. Should have been a 30+ pt win but a good way to get the next phase of the season off to a solid start.

roywhite
12-28-2013, 06:12 PM
Rumor is that he was sick. No biggie.

Coach K's post-game presser (http://www.goduke.com/mediaPortal/player.dbml?db_oem_id=4200&id=3148045&catid=901)

Yeah, K indicated that Rodney threw up before the game, and needed IV fluids at halftime.

K very pleased with effort, defense, and some nice words for Amile, who had an impressive 14 rebounds in 21 minutes.

Furniture
12-28-2013, 06:21 PM
Josh an TT's minutes way down today. Marshall had 11 and Sheed and Amile both over 20!

mr. synellinden
12-28-2013, 06:31 PM
20 offensive rebounds. That's good.

14 turnovers. And Quinn shot 1-9. That's not so good.

I love how the team is melding right now. Great to see Sulaimon and Jefferson making big plays. And Andre is such a delight to watch.

dukelifer
12-28-2013, 06:32 PM
Josh an TT's minutes way down today. Marshall had 11 and Sheed and Amile both over 20!

With Sheed playing better- it will be hard to keep him off the court. Josh's ability to take charges is not as effective under the new rules and thus his value on the court is reduced. Tyler can be effective against some teams but he too has been affected by the new rules K likes their toughness but he will play the best players as the season moves along.

NYBri
12-28-2013, 06:36 PM
Looks like we may move up a couple poll slots with Nova and L'ville both losing.

g-money
12-28-2013, 06:39 PM
The addition of Andre to this year's roster gives Duke that extra dynamic off the bench that would be missed sorely otherwise, especially in light of Rasheed's unsteady and somewhat disappointing play over the course of the season thus far. I've said it before, but it cannot be stressed enough: There is not a more potent scorer in America coming off the bench for any team, anywhere, than Andre Dawkins. Once again, Andre played only slightly more than half the game, yet still notched 20 points on 6-of-10 shooting from beyond the arc. He is now averaging 26.4 points a game per 40 minutes of action. It's shaping up as one of the best seasons for a reserve I've seen in my time watching the Blue Devils.

Amile also played one hell of a game. What I admire of Amile the most is that he understands exactly what needs to be done to help this team win and he does it. He embraces that role and never tries to do more than what is needed. Today that translated into Amile working for defensive rebounds and setting up second-chance points on the offensive end by coming up with missed shots and loose balls and turning those into scoring opportunities for our shooters. It's an aspect of our offense we've really lacked in recent seasons, and Amile is playing that part beautifully. Rare is the offensive player who enthusiastically makes that sort of sacrifice without ever displaying concern for his own personal achievement. Amile is the quintessential team player, and, with a little more polish and confidence, I think Marshall can become that sort of player as well.

As for the broadcasting crew, I thought Lenny Elmore did an excellent job today of concealing his desire for Duke to win. He's the consummate pro.

Other than the fact that I'm not much of an Elmore fan, I thought this post was spot on. Well said, Cameron.

Bay Area Duke Fan
12-28-2013, 06:50 PM
A few minutes at point guard for Rasheed. Hope to see more of that.

Henderson
12-28-2013, 06:54 PM
Josh's ability to take charges is not as effective under the new rules and thus his value on the court is reduced. Tyler can be effective against some teams but he too has been affected by the new rules K likes their toughness but he will play the best players as the season moves along.

I agree with your overall point that TT and Josh will likely see fewer minutes as the other guys mature, but early in the season their senior captain leadership has been much needed. The concept of "best players" has to include those Josh/TT qualities early in the season with a young team that has needed their leadership. As the season progresses and the younger guys learn, those qualities might not be quite as important.

To use a military metaphor that I think K would appreciate, your best squad isn't necessarily a bunch of tough 18 year old deadeye sharpshooters without experience or leadership. Later in the campaign, those guys might develop experience and leadership, even if under the tutelage of less skilled marksmen. Which players' skills are "best" for the team is evolving, and that will continue I believe.

The fact that Sheed and Andre are coming back to form is very very good news for this team going forward.

ajaxthewonderdog
12-28-2013, 06:55 PM
Eastern Michigan is not great, but they are in the 140s on KenPom so they aren't a joke.

I thought we played pretty great all around. The defense was really really good. They got a bunch of points off of bad Duke offensive possessions rather than having success attacking our defense. For the most part, we contested nearly every shot well, didn't allow a lot of drives to the rim, etc. We rebounded well. I thought we were really impressive.

I also thought that the refs were pretty much back to the old ways on calling fouls. There was quite a bit of contact on both sides on drives to the rim and they weren't blowing the whistle on those.

Anyone know why Rodney didn't start yet came in after a minute and a half?

Dawkins was great, although he was also getting wide open looks. Having Jabari on the floor will do that I guess.

One media report said Rodney Hood was ill.

ncexnyc
12-28-2013, 07:03 PM
An all around solid game from everyone.

As others have already stated, it was especially nice to see Rasheed getting back into the flow of things.

Dre was excellent on the offensive end again, however he had several nice defensive plays and anytime you get that from him, well that's just gravy.

Nice to see some effective minutes from Marshall. He definitely is disruptive around the rim.

The only thing I wasn't happy about was our ability to take advantage of the zone defense we saw today. Yes, we had a couple of lobs, but I think we missed a couple where Marshall should have been given a shot. And I really wish Amile could burn teams when he catches the pass wide open at the free throw line. Ryan Kelly was awesome for hitting from that spot numerous times the past few seasons. I'd even be happy if Amile would take it hard to the hole once in awhile from that position, as it would keep the defense honest.

I don't have any issue with the number of threes we attempted today as for the most part they were wide open looks.

Newton_14
12-28-2013, 07:06 PM
Eastern Michigan is not great, but they are in the 140s on KenPom so they aren't a joke.

I thought we played pretty great all around. The defense was really really good. They got a bunch of points off of bad Duke offensive possessions rather than having success attacking our defense. For the most part, we contested nearly every shot well, didn't allow a lot of drives to the rim, etc. We rebounded well. I thought we were really impressive.

I also thought that the refs were pretty much back to the old ways on calling fouls. There was quite a bit of contact on both sides on drives to the rim and they weren't blowing the whistle on those.

Anyone know why Rodney didn't start yet came in after a minute and a half?

Dawkins was great, although he was also getting wide open looks. Having Jabari on the floor will do that I guess.


I don't see anyone who responded about Rodney not starting, but he was announced as a starter, and then ran off to the locker room immediately before the game, so they announced Dawkins as an additional starter. Not sure what the issue was.


Rumor is that he was sick. No biggie.


That theory doesn't hold water ...

Pretty sure Mr Hood had a bad case of the 1990 FF "Hurley Runs" at a very bad time. He was introduced as a starter, came out for the opening tip, then just before they tipped it up, he sprinted off the court heading to the locker room. So K sent Andre in. Hood came back at about the 18 minute mark or so. Seemed ok after that, but maybe not his normal self energy wise.

As for the game, the defense continues to improve. The opposing PG (lightening quick) got by Quinn numerous times to attack the rim, but the bigs did a much better job containing him once he got there. He had moderate success, but not enough to hurt us. I hate that with the new rules, we will likely see a zone 80% of the time, unless our conference foes determine they can stop us with man to man. It just makes for very long possessions, however we have the ultimate weapon in zone buster Andre Dawkins. What a game. Like others, so happy for that kid. My favorite sequence of the game came in the 2nd half. Andre hits a 3. Splash. Like a layup. Then blocks a 3 that leads to a fast break and Rasheed going to the line. Then gets the defensive rebound on EM's next possession. Andre also had 2 or 3 steals and disrupted at least 3 other plays, one of which led to a turnover. Like Cameron opined, there may not be a greater weapon off the bench than Dawkins. Very efficient scorer, and makes our offense very hard to defend.

Jabari had another stellar offensive game, and was a little better on defense. Rasheed and Amile took another step forward with their good play. Rasheed almost causing the 10 second call, but getting the steal anyway, and then drawing the intentional foul was a thing of beauty too. Had Cameron rockin. Amile was a beast on the boards, ripping one board down with a one hand cupping move that was awesome. I know everyone wants Amile and Rasheed to start, but maybe it is best to bring them both off the bench, at least for now. Let the Bruise brothers set the tone defensively and show toughness, then bring in the young guns along with Andre off the bench. It is working for now. We will see how long K sticks with the pattern.

Good to see MP3 get some quality minutes in both halves as well. I think at this point Marshall just needs to keep getting 4 to 5 minutes per half and learn how to control and channel the energy to make a positive impact.

All in all a solid performance by our Devils. One more tune up game in Greensboro (for prep for the ACC Tourney I suspect) against Elon, and Phase II will come to an end. It will then be time to lace-em up for Phase III and the first half of conference play starting with Notre Dame.

Mad props to a fellow DBR member who hooked me up with a ticket today! Very appreciative!

Go Duke!

I know everyone wants Rasheed and

4Gen
12-28-2013, 07:07 PM
Off topic I admit. But I'm watching the ACC Tip Off Special on WRAL and the Gman is rocking an earring. Who wouldathunkit?

flyingdutchdevil
12-28-2013, 07:08 PM
1) I think it's safe to say that Rasheed is officially back. His hustle on that one play where he pestered the defender and got intentionally fouled right after was amazing. Watch out, ACC. Watch out.

2) Jabari is just fun to watch. Can't wait for the triple teams to come. He'll somehow still get 20+ points, 10 rebounds, and 5 assists a night...

3) With all these teams 2-3 zone, Andre's skillset is become soooooo much more valuable. He's a guaranteed 60% when left open.

4) Speaking of Andre, this is by far his best defensive effort. It's not just that ridiculous block and plenty of steals, but his on-the-ball D was better than I've ever seen it. Better late than never!

5) Hairston is solid on D. His O is just bad. There is no coming back from that. He didn't play well at all on the offensive end. But at least he didn't attempt that mid-range J.

6) There is no hope for MP3's FT shooting this year. He was made a total of 0 FTs at his time at Duke. This is not a joke.

7) This D is getting good. It's no longer a liability. What a great way to start ACC play.

Reilly
12-28-2013, 07:45 PM
... I thought Lenny Elmore did an excellent job today of concealing his desire for Duke to win ...

It's a tough time of year for Len: people are in a good mood, wishing others happiness and health ... children got toys and are overjoyed. What's a grump to do? I'm just glad he's consistent, and stokes refereeing conspiracy theories during a Saturday 2 pm Christmastide game against a MAC opponent as well as during higher profile affairs.

Dr. Rosenrosen
12-28-2013, 07:47 PM
Off topic I admit. But I'm watching the ACC Tip Off Special on WRAL and the Gman is rocking an earring. Who wouldathunkit?
Pretty sure he's been rocking it for years.

Indoor66
12-28-2013, 08:22 PM
I agree with your overall point that TT and Josh will likely see fewer minutes as the other guys mature, but early in the season their senior captain leadership has been much needed. The concept of "best players" has to include those Josh/TT qualities early in the season with a young team that has needed their leadership. As the season progresses and the younger guys learn, those qualities might not be quite as important.

To use a military metaphor that I think K would appreciate, your best squad isn't necessarily a bunch of tough 18 year old deadeye sharpshooters without experience or leadership. Later in the campaign, those guys might develop experience and leadership, even if under the tutelage of less skilled marksmen. Which players' skills are "best" for the team is evolving, and that will continue I believe.

The fact that Sheed and Andre are coming back to form is very very good news for this team going forward.

Every squad needs at least one Sergeant.

MarkD83
12-28-2013, 08:23 PM
It appears to me that Coach K has changed the defense abit from the start of the season. In today's game, there was a lot of switching rather than the hedging out top and then chasing your man to the baseline. This meant 5 guys were almost always between the ball and the basket. There were occasional times when someone got beat but there was always 2 or 3 guys in the paint.

Anyone else notice this?

MChambers
12-28-2013, 08:37 PM
Other than the fact that I'm not much of an Elmore fan, I thought this post was spot on. Well said, Cameron.
I think the batteries in your sarcasm detector need to be replaced!

Furniture
12-28-2013, 08:37 PM
Pretty sure Mr Hood had a bad case of the 1990 FF "Hurley Runs" at a very bad time. He was introduced as a starter, came out for the opening tip, then just before they tipped it up, he sprinted off the court heading to the locker room. So K sent Andre in. Hood came back at about the 18 minute mark or so. Seemed ok after that, but maybe not his normal self.

I actually thought I saw Hood already on after a couple of minutes. Not knowing that he was Ill at the time I was actually getting a little disappointed with his play. Sheed played much better.

Now knowing that he was sick I question why K left him in so much? Or was it that K didn't really know until about half time. I didn't count but now feel like he didn't play much the second half.

Henderson
12-28-2013, 08:44 PM
I actually thought I saw Hood already on after a couple of minutes. Not knowing that he was Ill at the time I was actually getting a little disappointed with his play. Sheed played much better.

Now knowing that he was sick I question why K left him in so much? Or was it that K didn't really know until about half time. I didn't count but now feel like he didn't play much the second half.

In the post-game presser, K said Hood was vomiting before the game and took an IV at half-time.

It made me remember the interview with Rodney after the UCLA game (posted on DBP). Matt Jones asked him what he was going to do for Christmas. Hood said something like, "I'm going home to get some good Mississippi food."

richardjackson199
12-28-2013, 08:49 PM
The addition of Andre to this year's roster gives Duke that extra dynamic off the bench that would be missed sorely otherwise, especially in light of Rasheed's unsteady and somewhat disappointing play over the course of the season thus far. I've said it before, but it cannot be stressed enough: There is not a more potent scorer in America coming off the bench for any team, anywhere, than Andre Dawkins. Once again, Andre played only slightly more than half the game, yet still notched 20 points on 6-of-10 shooting from beyond the arc. He is now averaging 26.4 points a game per 40 minutes of action. It's shaping up as one of the best seasons for a reserve I've seen in my time watching the Blue Devils.

Amile also played one hell of a game. What I admire of Amile the most is that he understands exactly what needs to be done to help this team win and he does it. He embraces that role and never tries to do more than what is needed. Today that translated into Amile working for defensive rebounds and setting up second-chance points on the offensive end by coming up with missed shots and loose balls and turning those into scoring opportunities for our shooters. It's an aspect of our offense we've really lacked in recent seasons, and Amile is playing that part beautifully. Rare is the offensive player who enthusiastically makes that sort of sacrifice without ever displaying concern for his own personal achievement. Amile is the quintessential team player, and, with a little more polish and confidence, I think Marshall can become that sort of player as well.

As for the broadcasting crew, I thought Lenny Elmore did an excellent job today of concealing his desire for Duke to win. He's the consummate pro.

Great post. A key to our 2010 championship run was the monster unselfish play from Zoubek. He got many offensive rebounds which were immediately redirected to 3 point shooters like Nolan Smith or Scheyer in position. It's something this year's team could continue to develop with the shooters and unselfish team players we have. Coincidentally, Mr. Dawkins also had some key plays on that 2010 championship run. You can't zone Dawkins, which will make this Duke team very difficult to stop as we continue to grow. And I've said it before, but I love Sulaimon's game. He brings energy, unselfishness, and helps our ball movement on offense. Cook and Hood will be fine. They've shown how good they are. I like Newton's point about continuing to start Thornton and Hairston for their leadership and to set the tough defensive tone. Then bring in our dynamite bench for majority minutes. Jabari doesn't need mention - it's always nice to have the best player in the country, and to have an unselfish team player like that is surreal. Love this Duke team

g-money
12-28-2013, 09:15 PM
It's a tough time of year for Len: people are in a good mood, wishing others happiness and health ... children got toys and are overjoyed. What's a grump to do? I'm just glad he's consistent, and stokes refereeing conspiracy theories during a Saturday 2 pm Christmastide game against a MAC opponent as well as during higher profile affairs.

I just re-read Cameron's original post and realize that the sarcasm re: Elmore went over my head so quickly that I might have whiplash. Once again: Well done, Cameron.

summerwind03
12-28-2013, 09:59 PM
When was the last time Frances Reading sang the national anthem? She did it today and I can't recall the last time.

azzefkram
12-28-2013, 10:15 PM
Solid game after the break. Loved seeing the quality play from Amile, MP3 and Sheed. Good to see Quinn stay focused on the D when his shot wasn't there. Best game Andre's played in a Duke uniform. He may have scored more in other games but this game was great.

flyingdutchdevil
12-28-2013, 10:38 PM
Solid game after the break. Loved seeing the quality play from Amile, MP3 and Sheed. Good to see Quinn stay focused on the D when his shot wasn't there. Best game Andre's played in a Duke uniform. He may have scored more in other games but this game was great.

Yup. Agree with everything, although MP3 had just an okay game.

IMO - MP3 may be the worst FT shooter in Duke history. It's too early to confirm, but he's attempted 12 FTs in a Duke uniform and made zero.

azzefkram
12-28-2013, 11:38 PM
Yup. Agree with everything, although MP3 had just an okay game.

IMO - MP3 may be the worst FT shooter in Duke history. It's too early to confirm, but he's attempted 12 FTs in a Duke uniform and made zero.

It's a puzzler because it doesn't look that bad. Mason's line drive looked oodles worse. While his stats may not jump out at you, MP3 protected the rim and appeared more comfortable out there. I'm putting a low hurdle out there for Marshall.

Kedsy
12-29-2013, 12:49 AM
I wonder if K scheduled this game specifically to give us in-game experience against a Syracuse zone (EMU's coach was an assistant at Syracuse for years). If so, pretty smart idea. I thought we looked pretty good against it, overall.

Andre's best all-around game maybe ever. Two blocks, two steals, three rebounds, and pretty solid defense -- usually he loses his man to a backdoor cut once or twice a game, but I didn't notice it this game. And as others have noted, he's a good weapon to have against a zone.

Amile is becoming a monster rebounder. Since our first two games (when he grabbed a total of two rebounds combined), he's been truly outstanding and seems to be getting better every game. Marshall has shown some pretty strong offensive rebounding, although his defensive rebounding needs to get better. I think both of Marshall's assists were on offensive rebound-kickouts, a la the big Z, which was nice to see. If Rodney was ill and still had 8 boards, more power to him. That silly pull-up he did distracted from the sick o-board slam which preceded it. Overall, we clobbered EMU on the offensive glass and overall rebounding. People wanted to see how we'd look against a big front line, but once again I don't think that will be this team's problem.

Tyler and Josh going down to 14 and 11 minutes, while Rasheed, Amile, and Andre moved up to 22, 21, and 26, is what a lot of people around here were clamoring for, but until we see it a few more times I'm not convinced it'll stay that way. Marshall's 11 minutes seemed to be more of a product of garbage time. Once the real games start I'll be surprised if he's on the floor more than 5 mpg, and there's a good chance it'll be less.

I don't want to nitpick after another outstanding effort on offense and on the glass, but Jabari's one-on-one defense needs work. At least he's rotating a little better. Also, I love Quinn's steals but he needs to stay in front of his man, too.

Our overall defense looked pretty good, but it's also worth mentioning that EMU's offense is ranked 229th by Pomeroy, so if Pomeroy has any validity yet it means our defensive performance wasn't quite as good as it looked.

Nice win after the break. The players seem to be gaining confidence in each other.

PallasAthena
12-29-2013, 01:03 AM
When was the last time Frances Reading sang the national anthem? She did it today and I can't recall the last time.

I believe she last sang about two or three years ago, just once after a long absence. At that time her voice was weak. Today I thought she looked wonderful and sang beautifully. Her voice is not as strong as it once was, but she doesn't slide around the notes, and she knows how to pronounce the words. Hearing her sing today gave me chills. She was great!

Duvall
12-29-2013, 01:16 AM
Our overall defense looked pretty good, but it's also worth mentioning that EMU's offense is ranked 229th by Pomeroy, so if Pomeroy has any validity yet it means our defensive performance wasn't quite as good as it looked.

Maybe, so but it looked really good. Pomeroy projected Duke's defense to yield .94 points per possession to Eastern Michigan's offense, and they ended up giving up only .87 points per possession. A good effort.

Edouble
12-29-2013, 02:35 AM
7) This D is getting good. It's no longer a liability. What a great way to start ACC play.

I know there are a lot of new teams in the ACC, but I am pretty sure Eastern Michigan isn't one of them.

devildeac
12-29-2013, 07:09 AM
Amile JefferZon with 14 boards in 21 minutes. Young fellow had magnetic hands, good positioning, great hustle for loose caroms, or all the above yesterday.

Saratoga2
12-29-2013, 07:32 AM
We came in with the expectation of some rust due to the layoff and it showed primarily in Quinn's scoring and we had Rodney ill to boot, so the win was an excellent effort where we overcame those issues. Lots have been said about Jabari, Rasheed, Amile and Andre and they all deserve the accolades. My take is that despite the rust and lack of significant practice time, the team defense and offense are both showing development. We still have others who can contribute along the way in Matt, Marshall and Semi. This is a talented team which should be very competitive in ACC play. With Louisville losing, the team should move up a notch in the ratings on Monday.

Neals384
12-29-2013, 09:28 AM
Marshall had some quality minutes: good positioning on both ends of the floor, nice block outs, couple o-boards, and that monster dunk. He did lose two d-boards in the 2nd half: one when the Emu player swatted the ball away and another when that short guy swiped it. He needs to work on being strong with the ball.

AtlDuke72
12-29-2013, 10:11 AM
I wonder if K scheduled this game specifically to give us in-game experience against a Syracuse zone (EMU's coach was an assistant at Syracuse for years). If so, pretty smart idea. I thought we looked pretty good against it, overall


It seems to me that the high post against the 2-3 zone needs to be a scoring threat in order to make the other team play him much closer and make it much easier for the other guys to get open. I don't think having Jefferson or Hairston in that spot is effective since neither is a threat to shoot. One of them is in that spot most of the time. Getting Hood or Parker in that spot on the free throw line is something I hope they try to do. Coach K is welcome to call me if he needs any more suggestions since I have almost 50 career coaching wins in my kids rec leagues.

kAzE
12-29-2013, 11:19 AM
The addition of Andre to this year's roster gives Duke that extra dynamic off the bench that would be missed sorely otherwise, especially in light of Rasheed's unsteady and somewhat disappointing play over the course of the season thus far. I've said it before, but it cannot be stressed enough: There is not a more potent scorer in America coming off the bench for any team, anywhere, than Andre Dawkins. Once again, Andre played only slightly more than half the game, yet still notched 20 points on 6-of-10 shooting from beyond the arc. He is now averaging 26.4 points a game per 40 minutes of action. It's shaping up as one of the best seasons for a reserve I've seen in my time watching the Blue Devils.

Amile also played one hell of a game. What I admire of Amile the most is that he understands exactly what needs to be done to help this team win and he does it. He embraces that role and never tries to do more than what is needed. Today that translated into Amile working for defensive rebounds and setting up second-chance points on the offensive end by coming up with missed shots and loose balls and turning those into scoring opportunities for our shooters. It's an aspect of our offense we've really lacked in recent seasons, and Amile is playing that part beautifully. Rare is the offensive player who enthusiastically makes that sort of sacrifice without ever displaying concern for his own personal achievement. Amile is the quintessential team player, and, with a little more polish and confidence, I think Marshall can become that sort of player as well.

As for the broadcasting crew, I thought Lenny Elmore did an excellent job today of concealing his desire for Duke to win. He's the consummate pro.

Have we seen a zone in every single game thus far? It's gotta be close. Zone has been the predominant defense we've seen this season, and Dawkins is loving it, he's killing people from deep. I don't know if he's the BEST scorer off the bench (the LaVine kid from UCLA comes to mind), since he's still fairly one dimensional, but he's certainly been efficient, and playing better defense lately.

In fact, since the Alabama game, we've been very solid defensively as a team. I would say the best basketball we've played thus far were the first half of the Bama game, and the 2nd half of the UCLA game.

It seems like an 8 man rotation has begun to form, with the 5 starters, and Dawkins/Sulaimon/Jefferson as the bench players. Plumlee seems likely to receive spot minutes to provide additional front court depth, but I think those are the 8 guys coach k feels the most comfortable with. Matt Jones looks like he has moved down on the depth chart for now, and Ojeleye seems to relegated to garbage time duties (much to my disappointment).

Tough to argue with what we've seen last 2 games. We've been solid on both ends of the floor and starting to look like a team out there, as opposed to just 5 guys wearing the same jersey. Still need to prove we can do it in a hostile environment, but with all this experience against the 2-3 zone, I'm feeling better and better about our upcoming date at the Carrier dome. Hoping the team keeps it rolling.

Kedsy
12-29-2013, 11:58 AM
Amile JefferZon with 14 boards in 21 minutes. Young fellow had magnetic hands, good positioning, great hustle for loose caroms, or all the above yesterday.

Right now, Amile's defensive rebounding percentage is 25.4%, which ranks 5th in the ACC and if he keeps it up would be the best such percentage since at least '96-'97 (the earliest season for which I have data). That's better than Brand, Battier, Boozer, S Williams, McRoberts, MP1, MP2, and everyone else who has played for Duke in the past 17 seasons.

Amile's offensive rebounding percentage is currently 16.3%, which also ranks 5th in the ACC. Nobody in the ACC is better than Amile at both categories, and if he continues he would again be better than Brand, Boozer, S Williams, and everyone else except Miles Plumlee (16.6% in 2011) and Brian Zoubek (21.6% in 2010, 16.9% in 2007, 16.7% in 2009).

I'd love to see Amile's numbers not including the season's first two games (where he had 2 rebounds total). They'd be astronomical.

Interestingly enough, Marshall's offensive rebounding percentage (18.7%) is even better than Amile's, but he hasn't played enough to count. Marshall's defensive rebounding percentage (7.5%), however, is worse than Quinn's (8.4%).

And speaking of poor defensive rebounding numbers, Josh's defensive rebounding percentage (6.6%) is the worst on the team and isn't really acceptable for a guy who plays center most of the time. It's a good thing his defensive positioning and communication skills are pretty good.

roywhite
12-29-2013, 12:13 PM
I'd say Andre's performance in the last few games marks the most pleasant surprise of the season so far. We knew he could shoot, obviously, but weren't sure exactly what to expect with his return, and it took a few games for him to get back in the swing.

The thing I like best is his positive attitude and joy about being a part of this team. He seems excited, yet not overly emotional (too high sometimes and too low sometimes as had been). I think he's here to stay, in the rotation and as a very important weapon. Andre is one of the best 3-point shooters in the country, and his presence helps others on offense, too.

DukeDevil
12-29-2013, 12:15 PM
I think the batteries in your sarcasm detector need to be replaced!

what are you talking about? I think Mr. Elmore's commentary is spot on. I'm especially a fan of his ability to correct every referee call in Duke's favor...followed by the replay and his "oh...I guess he did get him on the arm there."

Indoor66
12-29-2013, 12:17 PM
I'd say Andre's performance in the last few games marks the most pleasant surprise of the season so far. We knew he could shoot, obviously, but weren't sure exactly what to expect with his return, and it took a few games for him to get back in the swing.

The thing I like best is his positive attitude and joy about being a part of this team. He seems excited, yet not overly emotional (too high sometimes and too low sometimes as had been). I think he's here to stay, in the rotation and as a very important weapon. Andre is one of the best 3-point shooters in the country, and his presence helps others on offense, too.

The joy on his face, the smile that lights up all of Cameron - that is what it is all about.

Troublemaker
12-29-2013, 12:41 PM
It seems to me that the high post against the 2-3 zone needs to be a scoring threat in order to make the other team play him much closer and make it much easier for the other guys to get open. I don't think having Jefferson or Hairston in that spot is effective since neither is a threat to shoot. One of them is in that spot most of the time. Getting Hood or Parker in that spot on the free throw line is something I hope they try to do. Coach K is welcome to call me if he needs any more suggestions since I have almost 50 career coaching wins in my kids rec leagues.

I agree that ideally we'd want Amile to be able to hit that midrange shot from the FT line area, but him being the operator from that area is allowing Jabari to wreak havoc on the baseline by catching lobs, shooting corner 3s, and shooting baseline 2s, things that Jabari can do but Amile really can't. Jabari will get his opportunities to operate from the FT line area, too, but I think it works best if it's mostly Amile there and Jabari on the backline. When Amile was on the backline against the zones of Asheville, ECU, and Vermont, he got swallowed up because he's can't do the same things as Jabari. I like the way Amile's finding shooters from the FT line area, and I believe he can turn, drive, and draw fouls on big men from there; he did it once against Tony Parker in the UCLA game. Amile's been a real pleasant surprise lately with the excellent rebounding, the operating from the FT line area against 2-3 zone, and the guarding of Kyle Anderson. I'm a big fan of Amile, but I had no idea he could do those things. Very versatile player.

Troublemaker
12-29-2013, 12:53 PM
I'd say Andre's performance in the last few games marks the most pleasant surprise of the season so far. We knew he could shoot, obviously, but weren't sure exactly what to expect with his return, and it took a few games for him to get back in the swing.

The thing I like best is his positive attitude and joy about being a part of this team. He seems excited, yet not overly emotional (too high sometimes and too low sometimes as had been). I think he's here to stay, in the rotation and as a very important weapon. Andre is one of the best 3-point shooters in the country, and his presence helps others on offense, too.

Agreed. He's destined to swing a few key games for Duke this season when he's on fire. I love how his %Shots (the percentage of Duke's shots he takes when he's on the court) is second only to Jabari. We're using him in the exact right manner, imo. Making him basically the 2nd option (or 1B option) when he's on the court, feeding him, finding out if he's got it going that day. If he does, the opponent's usually in big trouble.

So happy for Dre. There was a stretch earlier in the season where I became very concerned about what his role was going to be going forward. But he's recovered from his preseason back injury, has shaken off the rust from sitting out a year, and now appears to be kicking butt like a Duke senior typically does.

Listen to Quants
12-29-2013, 12:59 PM
Right now, Amile's defensive rebounding percentage is 25.4%, which ranks 5th in the ACC and if he keeps it up would be the best such percentage since at least '96-'97 (the earliest season for which I have data). That's better than Brand, Battier, Boozer, S Williams, McRoberts, MP1, MP2, and everyone else who has played for Duke in the past 17 seasons.

Amile's offensive rebounding percentage is currently 16.3%, which also ranks 5th in the ACC. Nobody in the ACC is better than Amile at both categories, and if he continues he would again be better than Brand, Boozer, S Williams, and everyone else except Miles Plumlee (16.6% in 2011) and Brian Zoubek (21.6% in 2010, 16.9% in 2007, 16.7% in 2009).

I'd love to see Amile's numbers not including the season's first two games (where he had 2 rebounds total). They'd be astronomical.

Interestingly enough, Marshall's offensive rebounding percentage (18.7%) is even better than Amile's, but he hasn't played enough to count. Marshall's defensive rebounding percentage (7.5%), however, is worse than Quinn's (8.4%).

And speaking of poor defensive rebounding numbers, Josh's defensive rebounding percentage (6.6%) is the worst on the team and isn't really acceptable for a guy who plays center most of the time. It's a good thing his defensive positioning and communication skills are pretty good.


Quite interesting. Thanks. I'd bet the algorithm is not available, but it would be nice to know what Amile's rebounding ranking would look like if corrected for opponents (strength of schedule is currently a bit low, it may be the opponent's average rebounding is not fierce).

My eyeball test agrees with the numbers that Josh's rebounding is poor. How much slack does he get for boxing out really really well, sometime far from the hoop? That seems a reasonable strategy if you are a below the rim rebounder playing with some above the rim rebounders.

Kedsy
12-29-2013, 01:14 PM
My eyeball test agrees with the numbers that Josh's rebounding is poor. How much slack does he get for boxing out really really well, sometime far from the hoop? That seems a reasonable strategy if you are a below the rim rebounder playing with some above the rim rebounders.

That's a good point. He may be helping our team rebounding at the expense of his own personal stats. Almost impossible to verify though, without going through the film, play-by-play.

hustleplays
12-29-2013, 01:27 PM
It seems to me that the high post against the 2-3 zone needs to be a scoring threat in order to make the other team play him much closer and make it much easier for the other guys to get open. I don't think having Jefferson or Hairston in that spot is effective since neither is a threat to shoot. One of them is in that spot most of the time. Getting Hood or Parker in that spot on the free throw line is something I hope they try to do. Coach K is welcome to call me if he needs any more suggestions since I have almost 50 career coaching wins in my kids rec leagues.

As someone with mucho rec leagues win as well, :) I agree with this. Obviously, this means that our marvelous wings can't be out on the wings as much, but they are often cutting through. Either Parker or Hood would seem to be lethal in the high post. The zone would have to sag on them, inviting good perimeter looks. Several times I thought that Amile could take it to the hoop. He's pretty good at that. I don't know about his jumper, i.e., whether he has been working on it and improving it. Hope so. Hairston hasn't shot his jumper in a while.

This team is really fun to watch. Alarmingly athletic and they enjoy playing the game and with each other. A strong leadership cadre as well.

ChillinDuke
12-29-2013, 01:31 PM
Agreed. He's destined to swing a few key games for Duke this season when he's on fire. I love how his %Shots (the percentage of Duke's shots he takes when he's on the court) is second only to Jabari. We're using him in the exact right manner, imo. Making him basically the 2nd option (or 1B option) when he's on the court, feeding him, finding out if he's got it going that day. If he does, the opponent's usually in big trouble.

Very small, amicable nit with the above in bold.

It's gotten to the point where I truly believe wholeheartedly that Andre has got it going at all times. When shots don't go in, I chalk those up to the 50% that simply don't go in.

In other words, I want them to feed him regardless.

- Chillin

Listen to Quants
12-29-2013, 01:52 PM
Very small, amicable nit with the above in bold.

It's gotten to the point where I truly believe wholeheartedly that Andre has got it going at all times. When shots don't go in, I chalk those up to the 50% that simply don't go in.

In other words, I want them to feed him regardless.

- Chillin

Yes, yes, yes. There is no hint in that general shooting stats of 'the hot hand', http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hot-hand_fallacy. Admittedly, a couple of people who did follow that pattern would not be picked up if the vast majority did not, but there is little/no reason to suppose that.

Des Esseintes
12-29-2013, 02:16 PM
That's a good point. He may be helping our team rebounding at the expense of his own personal stats. Almost impossible to verify though, without going through the film, play-by-play.

This form of stat-tracking exists at the NBA level. I read the other day that Nene has historically had mediocre rebounding numbers, while his teams' rebounding performance goes through the roof when he is on the court. In large part because he boxes out like a mother. Whether such info is publicly available for college games is pretty doubtful, but I would enjoy seeing what the more advanced stats have to say about Josh.

Des Esseintes
12-29-2013, 02:23 PM
Yes, yes, yes. There is no hint in that general shooting stats of 'the hot hand', http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hot-hand_fallacy. Admittedly, a couple of people who did follow that pattern would not be picked up if the vast majority did not, but there is little/no reason to suppose that.

It's an incredibly thorny question. The latest research I've seen suggests--and I think this is both crazy and intuitive--that the hot hand exists but may be self-negating. Basically, the researchers were able to detect a greater likelihood of shotmaking after made shots--on equivalently difficult shots. What happens is that when guys make shots, they feel good and are in fact good, but they start taking harder shots. The harder shots have a lower likelihood of going in, so overall performance stays flat. If you're hot, you'll shoot yourself not-hot. Pride goeth before a fall, etc. But there does seem to be some evidence that a guy can have a greater facility of making shots at a given time.

Cameron
12-29-2013, 02:24 PM
Have we seen a zone in every single game thus far? It's gotta be close. Zone has been the predominant defense we've seen this season, and Dawkins is loving it, he's killing people from deep. I don't know if he's the BEST scorer off the bench (the LaVine kid from UCLA comes to mind), since he's still fairly one dimensional, but he's certainly been efficient, and playing better defense lately.

In fact, since the Alabama game, we've been very solid defensively as a team. I would say the best basketball we've played thus far were the first half of the Bama game, and the 2nd half of the UCLA game.

It seems like an 8 man rotation has begun to form, with the 5 starters, and Dawkins/Sulaimon/Jefferson as the bench players. Plumlee seems likely to receive spot minutes to provide additional front court depth, but I think those are the 8 guys coach k feels the most comfortable with. Matt Jones looks like he has moved down on the depth chart for now, and Ojeleye seems to relegated to garbage time duties (much to my disappointment).

Tough to argue with what we've seen last 2 games. We've been solid on both ends of the floor and starting to look like a team out there, as opposed to just 5 guys wearing the same jersey. Still need to prove we can do it in a hostile environment, but with all this experience against the 2-3 zone, I'm feeling better and better about our upcoming date at the Carrier dome. Hoping the team keeps it rolling.

Good call on the Lavine kid. He's putting up 12.2 points per game and is an extremely athletic kid with great hops and an above average handle. Then again, Andre is also super athletic, can jump with the best of them, and has improved his play off the bounce, at least to set himself up for good mid-range looks (Lavine is admittedly better at finishing at the rim). Andre also plays almost 12 minutes less per game than Lavine, on average, yet still puts up similar offensive performances (Lavine, essentially, plays starter's minutes for the Bruins). Lavine's five best scoring outputs: 21, 19, 18, 15, 14. Andre's: 20, 18, 17, 16, 13. The numbers are strikingly similar for such a large discrepancy in minutes per game. Again, Andre is just so efficient with the time he is given, which I think sets him apart from most players coming off the bench that I've seen.

And, like others, I agree that Andre has really killed it against zones this season. He was brilliant playing behind Eastern's back line yesterday and finding open spots in the corner. I was literally screaming at the television yesterday on several occasions to try and alert our players that Andre was wide open. Luckily, a few of them must have heard me.

BD80
12-29-2013, 02:56 PM
Yes, yes, yes. There is no hint in that general shooting stats of 'the hot hand', http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hot-hand_fallacy. Admittedly, a couple of people who did follow that pattern would not be picked up if the vast majority did not, but there is little/no reason to suppose that.


It's an incredibly thorny question. The latest research I've seen suggests--and I think this is both crazy and intuitive--that the hot hand exists but may be self-negating. Basically, the researchers were able to detect a greater likelihood of shotmaking after made shots--on equivalently difficult shots. What happens is that when guys make shots, they feel good and are in fact good, but they start taking harder shots. The harder shots have a lower likelihood of going in, so overall performance stays flat. If you're hot, you'll shoot yourself not-hot. Pride goeth before a fall, etc. But there does seem to be some evidence that a guy can have a greater facility of making shots at a given time.

How about the effect of defenses? I would suppose that opposing teams and particularly the man defending the shooter in question would defend a shooter closer after a make, and particularly after a series of makes, which would make subsequent makes LESS likely. Conversely, a shooter who misses would likely face LESS defensive pressure, making subsequent makes MORE likely.

Any one who watches basketball would probably confirm at least anecdotal evidence of a "hot" hand.

Kedsy
12-29-2013, 04:03 PM
How about the effect of defenses? I would suppose that opposing teams and particularly the man defending the shooter in question would defend a shooter closer after a make, and particularly after a series of makes, which would make subsequent makes LESS likely. Conversely, a shooter who misses would likely face LESS defensive pressure, making subsequent makes MORE likely.

Any one who watches basketball would probably confirm at least anecdotal evidence of a "hot" hand.

As would anybody who's ever played basketball.

I think it's at least partially psychological. If you feel like you're going to hit the shot, you shoot more instinctively, with your best form. But when you doubt yourself, you think too much and your form suffers. Plus, if you think you're going to make it, you work harder for your shot. If your teammates think you're going to make it, they work harder to get you free and to get you the ball. And so on and so forth.

In my opinion, the studies that show there is no such thing as a hot hand are flawed in myriad ways, which are not worth discussing now. Because after arguing it many times on these boards, one thing I know for sure is there's no way to get either side of this debate to move even an inch toward the other side.

Bay Area Duke Fan
12-29-2013, 07:42 PM
In my opinion, the studies that show there is no such thing as a hot hand are flawed in myriad ways, which are not worth discussing now. Because after arguing it many times on these boards, one thing I know for sure is there's no way to get either side of this debate to move even an inch toward the other side.

I wonder ... what would Coach K say about this?

roywhite
12-29-2013, 07:51 PM
I wonder ... what would Coach K say about this?

Pretty sure he wants his teams to get the ball to a "hot" shooter.

Recent examples include Dawkins and Ryan Kelly vs Miami.

BD80
12-29-2013, 07:53 PM
I wonder ... what would Coach K say about this?


Pretty sure he wants his teams to get the ball to a "hot" shooter.

And to get a hand in the face of any opposing player having a "hot" hand

-jk
12-29-2013, 08:01 PM
And yet K has said - over and over - that he wants his shooters to keep shooting even if they're not hitting.

Not sure how to reconcile that.

-jk

Listen to Quants
12-29-2013, 08:10 PM
As would anybody who's ever played basketball.

I think it's at least partially psychological. If you feel like you're going to hit the shot, you shoot more instinctively, with your best form. But when you doubt yourself, you think too much and your form suffers. Plus, if you think you're going to make it, you work harder for your shot. If your teammates think you're going to make it, they work harder to get you free and to get you the ball. And so on and so forth.

In my opinion, the studies that show there is no such thing as a hot hand are flawed in myriad ways, which are not worth discussing now. Because after arguing it many times on these boards, one thing I know for sure is there's no way to get either side of this debate to move even an inch toward the other side.

hmm, I don't mean to drag you kicking and screaming into a discussion of it ... but ... any hint as to what *magnitude* of effect you think would exist? If an overall change of (say) 3% existed (e.g., eFG% from 48 to 51), that would be remarkably hard to hide, seems to me.

roywhite
12-29-2013, 08:14 PM
And yet K has said - over and over - that he wants his shooters to keep shooting even if they're not hitting.

Not sure how to reconcile that.

-jk

That's a good point.

It's a situational thing, I think, and the situation is whether you have a shooter who is "hot". For example, on last year's team, we could identify Ryan Kelly and Seth Curry as good shooters, who generally had a green light to shoot. There might be games where neither was hitting much, and Coach K would want them to continue to shoot. But, in a game where one of them was shooting very well, I think his strategy was to ride the hot hand, to make a special effort to run plays for that guy and get him the ball to shoot and score.

kAzE
12-29-2013, 10:54 PM
I wonder if K scheduled this game specifically to give us in-game experience against a Syracuse zone (EMU's coach was an assistant at Syracuse for years). If so, pretty smart idea. I thought we looked pretty good against it, overall.

Andre's best all-around game maybe ever. Two blocks, two steals, three rebounds, and pretty solid defense -- usually he loses his man to a backdoor cut once or twice a game, but I didn't notice it this game. And as others have noted, he's a good weapon to have against a zone.

Amile is becoming a monster rebounder. Since our first two games (when he grabbed a total of two rebounds combined), he's been truly outstanding and seems to be getting better every game. Marshall has shown some pretty strong offensive rebounding, although his defensive rebounding needs to get better. I think both of Marshall's assists were on offensive rebound-kickouts, a la the big Z, which was nice to see. If Rodney was ill and still had 8 boards, more power to him. That silly pull-up he did distracted from the sick o-board slam which preceded it. Overall, we clobbered EMU on the offensive glass and overall rebounding. People wanted to see how we'd look against a big front line, but once again I don't think that will be this team's problem.

Tyler and Josh going down to 14 and 11 minutes, while Rasheed, Amile, and Andre moved up to 22, 21, and 26, is what a lot of people around here were clamoring for, but until we see it a few more times I'm not convinced it'll stay that way. Marshall's 11 minutes seemed to be more of a product of garbage time. Once the real games start I'll be surprised if he's on the floor more than 5 mpg, and there's a good chance it'll be less.

I don't want to nitpick after another outstanding effort on offense and on the glass, but Jabari's one-on-one defense needs work. At least he's rotating a little better. Also, I love Quinn's steals but he needs to stay in front of his man, too.

Our overall defense looked pretty good, but it's also worth mentioning that EMU's offense is ranked 229th by Pomeroy, so if Pomeroy has any validity yet it means our defensive performance wasn't quite as good as it looked.

Nice win after the break. The players seem to be gaining confidence in each other.

Wholeheartedly agree with all your points there. I was thinking Dawkins had bigger games in the past, in terms of scoring, but you are probably right, this could very well have been his best all-around performance to date. Let's hope the new Dawkins is here to stay. If he keeps playing like he did last game, he will get minutes even if he doesn't have the "hot hand."

Jefferson is starting to really establish himself as a go-to guy on the boards, and he's got to start eating into Hairston's minutes going forward. Hairston's best assets are his communication and leadership, but as you noted before, his rebounding percentages are among the worst on the team, which is tough when he's the starting center.

MP3 is slowly getting better with each game, and I no longer feel horrified when he's in the game, but I agree he is likely only a 5 mpg sub, or a measure used in case of foul trouble (which could very easily happen when your main rotation centers are Josh Hairston and Amile Jefferson) The main problem I see with him is exactly the same as his brothers early in their career. He has TERRIBLE hands. Even when he gets both hands on a ball coming down with a rebound, he just can't seem to hold on to it half the time. If a guy on the other team barely touches him or the ball, it goes flying out of bounds, or into someone else's area. Don't know when this will improve, as it eventually did for MP1 and MP2, but He's going to be a dominant rebounder one day, when he finally goes through what I call the Plumlee Hand Metamorphosis (PHM). It's reminiscent of when a caterpillar emerges from it's chrysalis to become a butterfly. It's a beautiful transformation process that all members of the Plumlee tribe undergo, morphing from brick-handed klutzes into NBA first round picks.

So, despite his shortcomings, I love his potential. He's not going to be a career bench warmer. In fact, he's already gotten much better this year. He boxes out well (you can tell he's trying really hard, just watch him), and does nice big man things on offense. Check out the Parker dunk in the second half when he caught it around mid range, and just went in uncontested and dunked it. Parker was wide open because Plumlee cleared the entire lane with his massive butt. He's going to be one of the best backup centers in the nation next year, and will be a force as a senior. (Pending PHM)


It's an incredibly thorny question. The latest research I've seen suggests--and I think this is both crazy and intuitive--that the hot hand exists but may be self-negating. Basically, the researchers were able to detect a greater likelihood of shotmaking after made shots--on equivalently difficult shots. What happens is that when guys make shots, they feel good and are in fact good, but they start taking harder shots. The harder shots have a lower likelihood of going in, so overall performance stays flat. If you're hot, you'll shoot yourself not-hot. Pride goeth before a fall, etc. But there does seem to be some evidence that a guy can have a greater facility of making shots at a given time.

As a guy who played a ton of basketball, I totally subscribe to the "hot hand" theory. Sometimes, you just have it, and sometimes, you just don't, and if you're a mature player, you stop hoisting up shots and try to find other ways to contribute on offense. I'm not saying I was ever as good a shooter as Dawkins, and I'd wager he has "it" way more often than not, but sometimes, when he doesn't have it going, he's probably not going to be on the floor as much. In any case, that seems to be the way that Coach K has used him this year. He'll come in for a trial run each half, put up 2 or 3 long range shots, and if he hits one, he'll stay in the game. Like I said though, if he can consistently D-up like he did last game, this might become irrelevant.

Cameron
12-29-2013, 11:34 PM
While Andre had an excellent overall game on Saturday, one in which he contributed to the team in ways beyond just three-point baskets, he's had some other spectacular performances in the past.

The best offensive display -- and perhaps game -- of his career came against Michigan State at Madison Square Garden, when he dropped 26 points on 6-of-10 shooting, in addition to grabbing 3 rebounds and 4 steals, in Coach K's record-breaking 903rd career victory.

Against Bradley as a sophomore, Andre nailed career highs of 28 points and 8 threes, one triple shy of the all-time Duke record set by Shane Battier and J.J. Redick.

And, in my personal favorite performance, Andre scored 21 points on 7 triples against Wake Forest in Cameron Indoor as a junior, all in the first half. If ever there were an argument for the "hot hand" theory, that game was it. Andre should've put his hands in ice after that one to remove the blisters. They were boiling.

The kid has done very well for himself at Duke. He's had more than, as they say in the Major Leagues, a cup of coffee. Andre has had a career.

g-money
12-30-2013, 12:15 AM
That's a good point.

It's a situational thing, I think, and the situation is whether you have a shooter who is "hot". For example, on last year's team, we could identify Ryan Kelly and Seth Curry as good shooters, who generally had a green light to shoot. There might be games where neither was hitting much, and Coach K would want them to continue to shoot. But, in a game where one of them was shooting very well, I think his strategy was to ride the hot hand, to make a special effort to run plays for that guy and get him the ball to shoot and score.

To my eye, Coach K ascribes to the "NBA Jams" theory of hot shooting: If a guy scores twice in a row, we will get him the ball a third time, because if he makes it, HE'S ON FIRE!

Btw Andre, to me, has always been a somewhat streaky shooter. But with a current eFG%above 70% (http://forums.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/showthread.php?32634-Andre-3000-3&p=689896#post689896), I suspect it's only a matter of time before Coach K gives him enough leash to shoot through his mini-slumps. In fact, this may be happening before our very eyes. It's great to see.

SheltonBob
12-30-2013, 11:52 AM
Yup. Agree with everything, although MP3 had just an okay game.

IMO - MP3 may be the worst FT shooter in Duke history. It's too early to confirm, but he's attempted 12 FTs in a Duke uniform and made zero.

This was a fine slot for MPIII. Showed good hands on catch and the dunk. Got a few rebounds and admittedly made a few mistakes. Perfect spot for him to continue to develop. He will be needed for spot duty when we play some teams with good Bigs. Now is time for him to keep developing and making growth moves when we still win Big. It is a MARATHON, not a sprint!!

Happy New Year - 2014 will be a big year!!

gus
12-30-2013, 04:12 PM
I wonder ... what would Coach K say about this?

A good shot is a good shot, regardless of whether you missed the one before. A bad shot is a bad shot even if it goes in. He might not use those words precisely, but I think that is clearly his philosophy.

gus
12-30-2013, 04:22 PM
Any one who watches basketball would probably confirm at least anecdotal evidence of a "hot" hand.

There is also anecdotal evidence that some people are luckier at slot machines.

Do you believe that to be true?