Latest Updates on UNC-CH Academic Scandal - National Media hammers UNC

[CameronBornAndBred]

Latest indictment goes to Julius Nyang'Oro.

[grad_devil]

...now this could get more interesting, no?

[DukeWarhead]

Latest indictment goes to Julius Nyang'Oro.

Who's he going to try to take down with him???

[Olympic Fan]

My question ... is he back in North Carolina?

My understanding was that he was hiding out in Nigeria.

[mgtr]

My question ... is he back in North Carolina?

My understanding was that he was hiding out in Nigeria.

That is probably the fellow who has been sending me letters offering to share $20 million!

[sagegrouse]

My question ... is he back in North Carolina?

My understanding was that he was hiding out in Nigeria.

Seriously? He's from Tanzania. -- sage

[BD80]

Seriously? He's from Tanzania. -- sage

That's in Cali - NE of LA?

[OldPhiKap]

You can't go back to Constantinople. Now, it's Istanbul.

[alteran]

My question ... is he back in North Carolina?

My understanding was that he was hiding out in Nigeria.


Seriously? He's from Tanzania. -- sage

Maybe he learned where Tanzania is in his own class.

[Gewebe14]

Maybe he learned where Tanzania is in his own class.

Good thought, but I HIGHLY doubt it!

[alteran]

Good thought, but I HIGHLY doubt it!
It would certainly explain how he ended up in Nigeria, though. :cool:

[devildeac]

From Dan Kane at the Raleigh N&O, updated about an hour ago:

http://www.newsobserver.com/2013/12/02/3426437/former-unc-ch-african-studies.html

[devildeac]

And from wral.com:

http://www.wral.com/former-unc-chapel-hill-professor-indicted-in-academic-scandal/13172648/

[wilson]

You can't go back to Constantinople. Now, it's Istanbul.Meh. That's nobody's business but the Turks.

[devildeac]

Meh. That's nobody's business but the Turks.

And I'm not even sure this Turk (or his family) would care too much either;):rolleyes::

http://forums.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/member.php?3245-Turk

[NSDukeFan]

Meh. That's nobody's business but the Turks.

Even old New York was once New Amsterdam

[OldPhiKap]

From Dan Kane at the Raleigh N&O, updated about an hour ago:

http://www.newsobserver.com/2013/12/02/3426437/former-unc-ch-african-studies.html

I hope this gets into the right hands at the NCAA. If such hands existed.

[CameronBornAndBred]

I hope this gets into the right hands at the NCAA. If such hands existed.
No more room, those hands are stuffed with money.

[devildeac]

I hope this gets into the right hands at the NCAA. If such hands existed.


No more room, those hands are stuffed with money.

And tied behind their backs.

[ajaxthewonderdog]

As much as I dislike the Tar Heels, I have always thought that there are SOME over there that believe in institutional integrity and academic honesty. Surely, there are some voices over there that will want to get to the bottom of this.

The UNC faculty are undoubtedly embarrassed and angry about this entire episode. They are hard-working, skilled professionals committed to teaching who have their reputations besmirched by all of this.

[wilson]

As much as I dislike the Tar Heels, I have always thought that there are SOME over there that believe in institutional integrity and academic honesty. Surely, there are some voices over there that will want to get to the bottom of this.I've had a number of big carolina fans (several grads, some not) tell me recently that they flat-out don't care and that the average person's perception of the university hasn't changed anyway. I've genuinely lost respect for a handful of acquaintances as a result of this attitude.

[BD80]

The UNC faculty are undoubtedly embarrassed and angry about this entire episode. They are hard-working, skilled professionals committed to teaching who have their reputations besmirched by all of this.

Hrumpf, hrumpf, hrumpf.

If anyone was truly outraged, wouldn't they come out and tell the truth about what was going on? A whistleblower might harm the athletic programs as they endure justified sanctions, but it would rid the athletic department of the transgressors and rid the academic institution of the "smirch" on its reputation.

They are very much the "committed professionals" that Captain Renault was in "Casablanca" when he was "shocked, shocked to find that gambling is going on in here!" They deserve to be embarrassed and their reputations besmirched.

[sagegrouse]

Hrumpf, hrumpf, hrumpf.

If anyone was truly outraged, wouldn't they come out and tell the truth about what was going on? A whistleblower might harm the athletic programs as they endure justified sanctions, but it would rid the athletic department of the transgressors and rid the academic institution of the "smirch" on its reputation.

They are very much the "committed professionals" that Captain Renault was in "Casablanca" when he was "shocked, shocked to find that gambling is going on in here!" They deserve to be embarrassed and their reputations besmirched.

I believe the problems were not widely known among the faculty. My time at universities tells me that 10 percent of the faculty -- at least -- are born-again whistleblowers, eager to stir up trouble.

sagegrouse

[jdj4duke]

I've had a number of big carolina fans (several grads, some not) tell me recently that they flat-out don't care and that the average person's perception of the university hasn't changed anyway. I've genuinely lost respect for a handful of acquaintances as a result of this attitude.

I wrote the following as part of a longer post in July of last year on the same topic:
"NONE of them though seems the least bit exercised over any of the academic questions and the most rabid of the group basically will not even admit to knowing about it..... Therefore, I assume that the UNC faculty not rising in unison is really not surprising, since there has not and won't be any kind of hue and cry from the alums or the most ardent fans. Why would a French or history professor make a public fuss over what to even a casual observer appears to be some sort of academic shenanigans? I suppose from an inherent sense of outrage, ethics or responsibility, but that may not be enough shield from the ostracism certain to come from all parts of the university community. Bookish folks just ain't sportish folks, you know. "

That was 17 months ago. I don't think it will be much different in another 17 months.

[Reilly]

From Dan Kane at the Raleigh N&O, updated about an hour ago:

http://www.newsobserver.com/2013/12/02/3426437/former-unc-ch-african-studies.html

Butch Davis has released a statement: Just as he could not keep tabs on 27,000 students, he also could not keep tabs on 3,200 faculty members.

Really the worst luck imaginable that his time coincided with these shenanigans ...

[ForkFondler]

On my round-trip bus ride to Kenan from the Friday center last Saturday, it did strike me that most of the passengers didn't seem to be run-of-the-mill white collar criminals. So, maybe I'll consider restoring their New Carlyle Cup eligibility at some point in the future. Just thinking.

[SoCalDukeFan]

And from wral.com:

http://www.wral.com/former-unc-chapel-hill-professor-indicted-in-academic-scandal/13172648/

The prof whose department gave good grades to athletes who did no work and went to no classes was arrested for getting paid for teaching a class that he did not teach.

Is that it?

SoCal

[ForkFondler]

The prof whose department gave good grades to athletes who did no work and went to no classes was arrested for getting paid for teaching a class that he did not teach.

Is that it?

SoCal

Well, yeah. He did what he was paid to do and he got caught. Put him in jail.

[moonpie23]

let's discuss options, counselor !!

[OldPhiKap]

The prof whose department gave good grades to athletes who did no work and went to no classes was arrested for getting paid for teaching a class that he did not teach.

Is that it?

SoCal

You forgot the part where the NCAA apparently determined that academic fraud to keep athletes in school is somehow beyond its purview.

[OldPhiKap]

let's discuss options, counselor !!

I doubt the DA is looking for him to roll on anyone. Given that he has already paid restitution as I see it, I bet he pleads nolo in exchange for probation and maybe an extra fine or community service.

[sagegrouse]

The prof whose department gave good grades to athletes who did no work and went to no classes was arrested for getting paid for teaching a class that he did not teach.

Is that it?

SoCal

As Ira Gershwin penned, "Nice Work if You Can Get It." But isn't this more of a Gilbert and Sullivan plot?

sagegrouse

[JasonEvans]

Here is the maddening question that has never been answered...

Why?

Why did Nyang’oro stage these fake classes?

Despite the indictment yesterday, it was not for money. He was holding the no-show classes for years before UNC insisted he get paid to teach one of them. Was it to enhance his career? Seeing as he was already the head of an academic department at UNC, I hardly see how this could have benefited him professionally.

Why?

Though the NCAA has never bothered to ask or answer this question, I am sure all of you can. It is clear that the only answer is that Nyang’oro did it to help out the athletes who enrolled in the classes. He wanted to make it easier on the many academically-challenged (and unmotivated to learn) players coming into Carolina's football and basketball programs. He wanted to help their grades, as evidenced by the many grades he changed as well as the easy As and Bs he handed out in his own classes.

So, that obvious clear answer to the "why?" question leads us to another question. How can the NCAA not see this as an athletic scandal? Sigh.

-Jason "if I were a NCAA enforcement person, I would find my organization's conduct here utterly embarrassing" Evans

[OldPhiKap]

-Jason "if I were a NCAA enforcement person, I would find my organization's conduct here utterly embarrassing" Evans

Well, you have integrity and a desire for equal treatment for all. So may I suggest that this line of work is not for you.

It does make you wonder, as this stull comes out (I imagine the NCAA must be aware of these types of articles and indictments) that the basketball team is getting a much closer look now with the PJ/LM thing than they otherwise would have. While the NCAA embarrasses itself on a regular basis, it cannot like having an institution blatantly flaunt it.

[BD80]

... So, that obvious clear answer to the "why?" question leads us to another question. How can the NCAA not see this as an athletic scandal? Sigh.

-Jason "if I were a NCAA enforcement person, I would find my organization's conduct here utterly embarrassing" Evans

You think the "moral" machinations were easy? They hired ethical contortionists specifically for this decision.

They couldn't even find a LAWYER who was willing to stoop so low.

[JasonEvans]

By the way, here is a real good summary (http://www.newsobserver.com/2013/12/02/3427642/6-reviews-and-investigations-have.html) of all the investigations into UNC's academic fraud.

-Jason "a good refresher on what is known and what isn't" Evans

[Reilly]

The prof whose department gave good grades to athletes who did no work and went to no classes was arrested for getting paid for teaching a class that he did not teach ...

Well, if this is what happened, I can understand the NCAA's stance: nobody did anything, so why should they?

[JBDuke]

The felony charges for Julius Nyang'Oro seemed to provide a good breaking point in this thread, and the old one had become unwieldy. It's here (http://forums.dukebasketballreport.com/forums/showthread.php?28827-More-info-on-UNC-academic-scandal), for posterity's sake, but let's put new posts in this thread.

[rasputin]

You think the "moral" machinations were easy? They hired ethical contortionists specifically for this decision.

They couldn't even find a LAWYER who was willing to stoop so low.

Gratuitous cheap shots at lawyers aren't necessary.

[Kedsy]

Gratuitous cheap shots at lawyers aren't necessary.

BD80 is a lawyer, so he's allowed.

[Merlindevildog91]

BD80 is a lawyer, so he's allowed.

Did you know there are only three lawyer jokes? All the rest of the lawyer stories are true....

(Duke Law grad here.)

But back on point: I see this going away with a whimper. The money was apparently kept out of Nyang'Oro's last paycheck ($12,000 seems a lot to be kept out of one professor's paycheck, but I digress). This will be a no harm, no foul situation. He'll plead nolo contendere and get some probation. No active time. And no one will ask him about where the bodies are buried.

[Olympic Fan]

Here is the maddening question that has never been answered...

Why?

Why did Nyang’oro stage these fake classes?

Despite the indictment yesterday, it was not for money. He was holding the no-show classes for years before UNC insisted he get paid to teach one of them. Was it to enhance his career? Seeing as he was already the head of an academic department at UNC, I hardly see how this could have benefited him professionally.

Why?

Jason,

Is half a million dollars enough of a reason?

Professor Nyang'oro runs a charity called Carolina for Kibera -- supposedly for African relief. It just happens that Nike made a $500,000 donation to his charity. I'm not sure how mych of that ended up in Nyang'oro's pocket.

It's also true that he's a jock sniffer -- an uber-fan who has often traveled with the team and often walked the sidelines during football games.

I don't think the question is all that hard to answer.

[nyesq83]

He is a con man.

"I will pretend to teach a class and guarantee all student athletes will pass with good grades.
No need to pay me [directly].
Just let me hang around the program, maybe get half a mil from Nike for my "charitable organization", and we all win!"

[moonpie23]

Gratuitous cheap shots at lawyers aren't necessary.

there is no such thing as a "cheap" shot at a lawyer….

[OldPhiKap]

there is no such thing as a "cheap" shot at a lawyer….

True. I bill at $475/hr.

[moonpie23]

there's an old story about a plumber that was summoned to a home on a weekend. The homeowner had a pretty bad leak in the basement and water was building up.

The plumber waded down into the basement and assessed the problem as a semi-special curved piece of pipe. He went back to his truck and fashioned a similar piece, turned off the water and installed it. The home owner was jubilant when the water was turned back on and the leak had been fixed.

The plumber presented the bill of $800 to the homeowner and he responded with shock. "man, that didn't take you but about an hour." said the homeowner. "I'm a lawyer and i don't charge $800 buck and hour!"

The plumber, packing up his tools, quipped, "well, i didn't charge $800 and hour when I was a lawyer either!"

[davekay1971]

True. I bill at $475/hr.

As long as I don't get a $47.50 bill for the 0.1 hours spent to respond to my inane DBR posts...

[moonpie23]

you DID get billed, you just don't know it yet……wait till you get your statement….

[BD80]

you DID get billed, you just don't know it yet……wait till you get your statement….

And don't call to argue about the bill, you could be put on hold and charged another $47.50 just waiting!

This is a joke!

[BigWayne]

Uncle Julius' mug in the N&O again today....

http://www.newsobserver.com/2013/12/09/3446490/no-makeup-offered-for-many-suspected.html

[fidel]

Jason,

Is half a million dollars enough of a reason?

Professor Nyang'oro runs a charity called Carolina for Kibera -- supposedly for African relief. It just happens that Nike made a $500,000 donation to his charity. I'm not sure how mych of that ended up in Nyang'oro's pocket.

It's also true that he's a jock sniffer -- an uber-fan who has often traveled with the team and often walked the sidelines during football games.

I don't think the question is all that hard to answer.

This is the first I've heard this. What a smoking gun! Maybe the reason the NCAA isn't digging deeper? This would show the money not coming from two-bit felons and sports agent wannabes, if true.

Why else would Nike care about an af-am professors charity?

[JasonEvans]

This is the first I've heard this. What a smoking gun! Maybe the reason the NCAA isn't digging deeper? This would show the money not coming from two-bit felons and sports agent wannabes, if true.

Why else would Nike care about an af-am professors charity?

Hmmm, I can think of many reasons Nike would support any number of charitable activities. Cozying up to a professor who appears to be doing something worthwhile from a charitable standpoint and who teaches a lot of athletes seems to make sense for Nike from a business standpoint. I see nothing nefarious in that activity.

But, the real question is, did Nike make the donation to somehow help the UNC teams or athletes cheat? Why would Nike want to help UNC athletes cheat in their classes? That is a much tougher thing to make sense of, I suspect. Just because we have found money present in the nexus of all this it does not mean that the money was linked to any of the wrongdoings going on.

If Nike was going to help an athletic program cheat, I suspect the program in question would be Oregon ;)

-Jason "I do think the Nike donation gives Nyang'Oro motivation to connect himself to athletes through whatever means possible, something his sham classes allowed him to do" Evans

[BigWayne]

Hmmm, I can think of many reasons Nike would support any number of charitable activities. Cozying up to a professor who appears to be doing something worthwhile from a charitable standpoint and who teaches a lot of athletes seems to make sense for Nike from a business standpoint. I see nothing nefarious in that activity.

But, the real question is, did Nike make the donation to somehow help the UNC teams or athletes cheat? Why would Nike want to help UNC athletes cheat in their classes? That is a much tougher thing to make sense of, I suspect. Just because we have found money present in the nexus of all this it does not mean that the money was linked to any of the wrongdoings going on.

If Nike was going to help an athletic program cheat, I suspect the program in question would be Oregon ;)

-Jason "I do think the Nike donation gives Nyang'Oro motivation to connect himself to athletes through whatever means possible, something his sham classes allowed him to do" Evans
I researched this some after the previous post.

Nyang'Oro's connection to this charity is pretty limited and dated. He was an original board member, but beyond the first year of it, he doesn't seem officially involved. Tying Nike's cash to him would be difficult at best.

[Indoor66]

I researched this some after the previous post.

Nyang'Oro's connection to this charity is pretty limited and dated. He was an original board member, but beyond the first year of it, he doesn't seem officially involved. Tying Nike's cash to him would be difficult at best.

Let's not let some nasty facts get in the way of a good meme. :confused: :cool:

[fidel]

Hmmm, I can think of many reasons Nike would support any number of charitable activities. Cozying up to a professor who appears to be doing something worthwhile from a charitable standpoint and who teaches a lot of athletes seems to make sense for Nike from a business standpoint. I see nothing nefarious in that activity.

But, the real question is, did Nike make the donation to somehow help the UNC teams or athletes cheat? Why would Nike want to help UNC athletes cheat in their classes? That is a much tougher thing to make sense of, I suspect. Just because we have found money present in the nexus of all this it does not mean that the money was linked to any of the wrongdoings going on.

If Nike was going to help an athletic program cheat, I suspect the program in question would be Oregon ;)

-Jason "I do think the Nike donation gives Nyang'Oro motivation to connect himself to athletes through whatever means possible, something his sham classes allowed him to do" Evans

I'm thinking 500k is a bigger deal than you are, I guess, for a professor at a school not named Oregon. But as I said, I know nothing of the charity or the connection of Nyang'Oro to the charity to know if there was anything to it. Certainly falls under the 'suspicious' category for me…

Seriously, I can think of a lot of scenarios where Nike and its big money could be used to wash nefarious gift-giving. Helping people with access to kids who may drive revenue in a few years. Nike doesn't have to know anything about the classes, they just need to be willing to throw money somewhere for, lets say, a worthwhile charity.

But, happily, this seems to be an old issue (I did say I never heard of it before), so there you go. Back to CSI:UNC.

[Acymetric]

Its not that hard for me to think Nyang'Oro did it for the same reason(s) the tutor did.

[fidel]

Its not that hard for me to think Nyang'Oro did it for the same reason(s) the tutor did.

Me either. Similarly, I'd ask the same questions if the tutor got a 500k donation from Nike for a charity she ran.

[Chard]

A good read regarding Coach Davis (http://www.cbssports.com/collegefootball/writer/bruce-feldman/24372078/despite-being-cleared-in-unc-scandal-davis-still-waiting-for-next-gig). Some particular sections I found interesting:


"There was the academic aspect and people were saying players were cheating and then that the honor court was corrupt. The honor court found one player was innocent, but then NC State fans get a hold of a paper that the kid turned in and there was plagiarism, and so the whole honor system that had been in place for 250-some years was under attack. The chancellor was under attack. It was unrelenting. We're in the midst of trying to stop a tsunami on the football team and there's this media perception and we're still trying to play Florida State and Clemson and Miami and win games. Then, the [Raleigh} News & Observer had all these editorials saying they should fire the chancellor. And I guess he panicked and so he fired me."


Another independent investigation, led by former Gov. Jim Martin, investigated irregularities in the African and Afro-American Studies department after an earlier campus probe found 54 problem classes between 2007 and 2011. Martin determined the problems in the African studies department began in 1997. "This was not an athletic scandal," Martin said. "It was an academic scandal, which is worse. But it was isolated. There was no coach that knew anything about this. They didn't need to know. That was not their job."


"That entire thing was set up back in the 1990s," Davis said. "None of the academics were run through the athletics department, which I was very appreciative of. The only involvement that I had with academics as a football coach is that I asked if we could have access to our players from 2-6 [p.m.] during the week. They handled everything. Set up their classes. Their tutoring. Their mentoring programs. They ran everything through the Arts and Sciences, and I thought it was a brilliant idea because that way there would never been any conflict of interest. We had a great relationship with the professors and the deans and the people on campus. And many, many kids -- hundreds -- took those classes, and the results after Gov. Martin did his investigation and the NCAA did its investigation is the fact that there was a significant amount of regular students in those classes that they called Paper Classes. That had been going on since the 1990s.

Whoa! Hello! Looks like that UNC diploma may not be all its cracked up to be!?

Also of note since DBR wondered about the relationship between Davis and Blake:


My relationship with John is varied over 25-30 years," Davis said. "I knew him when he was in high school as a player and when he was in my biology class. I basically had no contact with him until he came as a minority intern coach as a request from Barry Switzer to Jimmy Johnson with the Dallas Cowboys. And then Jimmy hired him to be the defensive line coach when I was the defensive coordinator.

"When I got the UNC job, [Blake] called and said he was interested in leaving Nebraska. We were putting together a staff. His reputation to me at the time had been that he was a good recruiter and a good staff member, and was a very good teacher of defensive linemen. And, so just like we did with every single member of our staff, we vetted every one of them. Our compliance people called the NCAA and asked if there were any red flags and they reached out to Nebraska, Oklahoma and Mississippi State and no one came back with any red flags. So we hired John. The thing that we clearly underestimated was the time that he had coached at Oklahoma and the time that he got back into coaching, which was about two-and-a-half years, he had actually worked for an agent, training defensive linemen and defensive personnel for the draft. No one really speculated that there was any major connection between he and [agent] Gary Wichard. No one knew that that relationship actually went back to the 1970s when he was a player at Oklahoma. We had no idea that they had a financial relationship between Mississippi State and Nebraska and all that. I guess you could say we dropped the ball on that. Maybe we should've speculated or looked into it more, but we didn't do it."

Davis said he and Blake have not spoken since he left North Carolina.

Worth a read.

[Henderson]

If Nike was going to help an athletic program cheat, I suspect the program in question would be Oregon ;)


No way that would ever happen. Players from SoCal are lining up for the academics at Oregon. That and the weather.

[Ima Facultiwyfe]

I believe the problems were not widely known among the faculty. My time at universities tells me that 10 percent of the faculty -- at least -- are born-again whistleblowers, eager to stir up trouble.

sagegrouse

Oh puh-leeeze! I live here in CH. You may be correct about the 10% but that leaves the other 90%. The whole bunch of them have been neighbors and friends for well over thirty years. They weren't born yesterday. And although I even hold many of them dear, I've only heard ONE local housewife who has EVER voiced any disgust or even disappointment in the way this has all been handled.

Some are ready to ditch ol' Roy from time to time for other reasons, but NObody, save this ONE, has ever voiced anything that approaches blame for any of it on anyone in the university. These people have been around the block but have been wearing blinders while making the trip.

The emperor is wearing no clothes.
Love, Ima

[Native]

Oh puh-leeeze! I live here in CH. You may be correct about the 10% but that leaves the other 90%. The whole bunch of them have been neighbors and friends for well over thirty years. They weren't born yesterday. And although I even hold many of them dear, I've only heard ONE local housewife who has EVER voiced any disgust or even disappointment in the way this has all been handled.

Some are ready to ditch ol' Roy from time to time for other reasons, but NObody, save this ONE, has ever voiced anything that approaches blame for any of it on anyone in the university. These people have been around the block but have been wearing blinders while making the trip.

The emperor is wearing no clothes.
Love, Ima

3744

[DukieInKansas]

Oh puh-leeeze! I live here in CH. You may be correct about the 10% but that leaves the other 90%. The whole bunch of them have been neighbors and friends for well over thirty years. They weren't born yesterday. And although I even hold many of them dear, I've only heard ONE local housewife who has EVER voiced any disgust or even disappointment in the way this has all been handled.

Some are ready to ditch ol' Roy from time to time for other reasons, but NObody, save this ONE, has ever voiced anything that approaches blame for any of it on anyone in the university. These people have been around the block but have been wearing blinders while making the trip.

The emperor is wearing no clothes.
Love, Ima


3744

Ima does have a way with words!

[fisheyes]

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/01/01/sports/as-for-athletes-but-charges-of-tar-heel-fraud.html?ref=sports&_r=0

"The university provost, James W. Dean Jr., said in an interview that there had been no way to anticipate such behavior on a large scale in an institution that relies on the professionalism and basic good will of its employees.

“Universities for a very long time have been based on trust,” Mr. Dean said. “One of the ramifications of this is that now we can no longer operate on trust.”"

[JasonEvans]

While the recent NYTimes story brought little new to the table and came up far short (IMO) because it failed to ask a lot of serious questions about this scandal, all that has been rectified by a story today in Bloomberg News (http://www.businessweek.com/articles/2014-01-02/the-scandal-bowl-tar-heels-football-academic-fraud-and-implicit-racism). It may not be quite the vaunted news source that the NYT is, but Bloomberg is no slouch.


•UNC and the NCAA are trying to conceal that the fraud was specifically designed to pad the transcripts of varsity athletes.
Even though athletes made up a disproportionate percentage of the suspect class rosters, the presence of a few non-athletes has prompted UNC and the NCAA to play down the sports-related nature of the corruption. UNC has sought to limit the release of information that would shed more light on that connection, the News & Observer reported in November. The university “has refused the N&O’s request, for example, for basketball and football enrollments in the earliest known fraudulent classes.” It is past time for UNC to bare all and clean house.

The column goes on to question the underlying racism of this scandal.


•Implicit racism colors this entire episode. One of the most horrifying aspects of the exploitation of high-level college athletes, especially football and basketball players, is the vastly disproportionate impact on African-American “students.”

The first three classes confirmed to have been fraudulent, according to the News & Observer, pretended to offer students training in the Swahili language. An old-time Carolina Klan member couldn’t have conjured that detail in his most virulent day dream.

I wonder if the NCAA will ever decide it is tired of sticking its head in the sand and really do a meaningful investigation (along with meaningful penalties) into this mess?

-Jason "the linked column says the UNC mess is actually worse than what happened at Penn State... wow!" Evans

[Wander]

While the recent NYTimes story brought little new to the table and came up far short (IMO) because it failed to ask a lot of serious questions about this scandal, all that has been rectified by a story today in Bloomberg News (http://www.businessweek.com/articles/2014-01-02/the-scandal-bowl-tar-heels-football-academic-fraud-and-implicit-racism). It may not be quite the vaunted news source that the NYT is, but Bloomberg is no slouch.

-Jason "the linked column says the UNC mess is actually worse than what happened at Penn State... wow!" Evans

I say this as someone who reads the NYTimes regularly, but when you've that clueless fool Joe Nocera as an NYT author writing about how UNC has been treated too HARSHLY by the NCAA, I'm not sure how much I trust their take on this issue.

Just in case anyone mistakenly jumps on you/the article, the writer doesn't claim that the UNC stuff is worse than Penn State, exactly; just that it's more relevant because this type of scandal is more likely to be more common on other campuses.

[CameronBornAndBred]

-Jason "the linked column says the UNC mess is actually worse than what happened at Penn State... wow!" Evans
That is a serious slap in the face to the victims at Penn State, and a sure fire way to get the rest of the article instantly discredited, no matter what facts are inside it.

[CameronBornAndBred]

Just in case anyone mistakenly jumps on you/the article, the writer doesn't claim that the UNC stuff is worse than Penn State, exactly; just that it's more relevant because this type of scandal is more likely to be more common on other campuses.


That is a serious slap in the face to the victims at Penn State, and a sure fire way to get the rest of the article instantly discredited, no matter what facts are inside it.
Wander is correct. Jason, I think you could re-word your statement more accordingly. This is the quote in the article.

The impact could be–and ought to be–far broader than that of the Penn State child-rape debacle.Big difference between "broader" and "worse".

[MulletMan]

While the recent NYTimes story brought little new to the table and came up far short (IMO) because it failed to ask a lot of serious questions about this scandal, all that has been rectified by a story today in Bloomberg News (http://www.businessweek.com/articles/2014-01-02/the-scandal-bowl-tar-heels-football-academic-fraud-and-implicit-racism). It may not be quite the vaunted news source that the NYT is, but Bloomberg is no slouch.



The column goes on to question the underlying racism of this scandal.



I wonder if the NCAA will ever decide it is tired of sticking its head in the sand and really do a meaningful investigation (along with meaningful penalties) into this mess?

-Jason "the linked column says the UNC mess is actually worse than what happened at Penn State... wow!" Evans

The comments section of the article that Jason has linked are phenomenal.

[BD80]

While the recent NYTimes story brought little new to the table and came up far short (IMO) because it failed to ask a lot of serious questions about this scandal, all that has been rectified by a story today in Bloomberg News (http://www.businessweek.com/articles/2014-01-02/the-scandal-bowl-tar-heels-football-academic-fraud-and-implicit-racism). ...

I wonder if the NCAA will ever decide it is tired of sticking its head in the sand and really do a meaningful investigation (along with meaningful penalties) into this mess?

-Jason ...Evans

Good one! The build up was a bit slow, but GREAT punch line.

In the vein of such hilarity, maybe we could conduct a poll of which poor college would be saddled with those penalties?

[OldPhiKap]

Good one! The build up was a bit slow, but GREAT punch line.

In the vein of such hilarity, maybe we could conduct a poll of which poor college would be saddled with those penalties?

I hear that Cleveland State has already been stripped of scholarships for 2014-2015.

[JasonEvans]

Wander is correct. Jason, I think you could re-word your statement more accordingly. This is the quote in the article.
Big difference between "broader" and "worse".

Yup, sorry about that. Still, comparing the Carolina mess to Penn State is a very powerful statement.

-Jason "mea culpa" Evans

[JasonEvans]

The comments section of the article that Jason has linked are phenomenal.

Oh man! Must read!!!

Interesting that the UNC defenders are pretty much mute. It is just an endless stream of Carolina bashing. LOVE IT!

-Jason "I think some Pack Pride regulars are descending en mass upon that article" Evans

[BigWayne]

Response from Jim Martin in the N&O. (http://www.newsobserver.com/2013/01/02/2579556/jim-martin-we-found-what-we-could.html) He makes a few points, but completely avoids the topic of not uncovering the emails that tie the athletic advising folks to Crowder and Nyang'Oro.

[Duvall]

Response from Jim Martin in the N&O. (http://www.newsobserver.com/2013/01/02/2579556/jim-martin-we-found-what-we-could.html) He makes a few points, but completely avoids the topic of not uncovering the emails that tie the athletic advising folks to Crowder and Nyang'Oro.

Where "not uncovering" means "not conducting even a cursory search for."

Surprising to see a retired politician burn his credibility to the ground over a relatively minor task, but here we are.

[Jarhead]

Response from Jim Martin in the N&O. (http://www.newsobserver.com/2013/01/02/2579556/jim-martin-we-found-what-we-could.html) He makes a few points, but completely avoids the topic of not uncovering the emails that tie the athletic advising folks to Crowder and Nyang'Oro.
Governor Martin's committee report should have concluded with a statement to the effect that they were not allowed to dig deeper for the truth. Such a statement would have sheltered the committee from the criticism it has received, but not the University. Perhaps a true investigation would have taken place.

[BigWayne]

Response from Jim Martin in the N&O. (http://www.newsobserver.com/2013/01/02/2579556/jim-martin-we-found-what-we-could.html) He makes a few points, but completely avoids the topic of not uncovering the emails that tie the athletic advising folks to Crowder and Nyang'Oro.

Actually, it turns out this was a year ago today. Link from the Bloomberg article fooled me.

[CameronBlue]

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/01/01/sports/as-for-athletes-but-charges-of-tar-heel-fraud.html?ref=sports&_r=0

"The university provost, James W. Dean Jr., said in an interview that there had been no way to anticipate such behavior on a large scale in an institution that relies on the professionalism and basic good will of its employees.

“Universities for a very long time have been based on trust,” Mr. Dean said. “One of the ramifications of this is that now we can no longer operate on trust.”"

Good lord, straight out of the "plausible deniability" handbook. Dean must've missed all those conspiracy planning meetings at Gimghoul Castle. UNC folks please stop for a moment and just use a little common sense your provost can NOT be that obtuse. Shockingly embarrassing.

[77devil]

Oh man! Must read!!!

Interesting that the UNC defenders are pretty much mute. It is just an endless stream of Carolina bashing. LOVE IT!

-Jason "I think some Pack Pride regulars are descending en mass upon that article" Evans

I wonder how differently the UNCCH alumni and non-alumni fans perceive and react to all the scandals. As the "flagship" institution of the state system, UNCCH football and basketball attract a huge non alumni following who probably couldn't care less about the academic reputation of the university. Practically all of the UNCCH graduates that I know well, which isn't very many, are embarrassed and appalled. (A few remain in denial.) The ones earlier in their careers express concern about adverse impact on the perceived value of their degree. While most, if not all, had been vocal fans of the athletic program, now UNCCH sports and the Duke rivalry are rarely discussed.

[sagegrouse]

While the recent NYTimes story brought little new to the table and came up far short (IMO) because it failed to ask a lot of serious questions about this scandal, all that has been rectified by a story today in Bloomberg News (http://www.businessweek.com/articles/2014-01-02/the-scandal-bowl-tar-heels-football-academic-fraud-and-implicit-racism). It may not be quite the vaunted news source that the NYT is, but Bloomberg is no slouch.



The column goes on to question the underlying racism of this scandal.



I wonder if the NCAA will ever decide it is tired of sticking its head in the sand and really do a meaningful investigation (along with meaningful penalties) into this mess?

-Jason "the linked column says the UNC mess is actually worse than what happened at Penn State... wow!" Evans

The New York Times article from January 1 is #3 on the Times' list today of "most-emailed articles."

[BD80]

While the recent NYTimes story brought little new to the table and came up far short (IMO) because it failed to ask a lot of serious questions about this scandal, all that has been rectified by a story today in Bloomberg News (http://www.businessweek.com/articles/2014-01-02/the-scandal-bowl-tar-heels-football-academic-fraud-and-implicit-racism). ...

The article suggests that Nyang’oro “is going to have an opportunity to present his side” as opposed to the way unc has left him twisting in the wind. And suggests he will have incentive to do so. Could be a fun New Year.

The comments are sensational, tracking the start of the AFAM program in 1992 coinciding with 4/5 of the 1993 championship team declaring AFAM majors; ALL players of the 2005 championship team being AFAM majors (except the 3 that did not graduate and did not declare majors), including 15 enrollments in fake classes by the 2005 team; and 23 enrollments in fake classes by the 2009 championship team.

My favorite:

UNC accepted players that CLEMSON said "son, you are too stupid to play for us". And when CLEMSON says you're too stupid to play for them, you are one dumb monkey-farmer.

[Olympic Fan]

My favorite:

UNC accepted players that CLEMSON said "son, you are too stupid to play for us". And when CLEMSON says you're too stupid to play for them, you are one dumb monkey-farmer.

While this is true, I'm pretty sure we're talking about a football player -- WR Dwight Jones, who was turned down by Clemson and accepted by UNC. I don't think this has happened to basketball, although back in the mid-1980s when UNC fans were sneering at NC State for taking the semi-literate Chris Washburn, the sainted Dean Smith took Kevin Madden, who had even a lower SAT than Washburn.

[JasonEvans]

The article suggests that Nyang’oro “is going to have an opportunity to present his side” as opposed to the way unc has left him twisting in the wind. And suggests he will have incentive to do so. Could be a fun New Year.

I'm not so sure about that. I would love for many month in prison to be hanging over Nyang'oro's head as a strong incentive for him to rat out everyone at UNC who knew about this, but that simply is not the case. When he was indicted, numerous articles pointed out (http://www.heraldsun.com/news/x339032656/Former-UNC-professor-to-plead-not-guilty-to-fraud) that, if convicted, there was a pretty small chance he would actually go to jail.


Orange County District Attorney Jim Woodall said Nyang’oro is accused of taking $12,000 for classes he didn't teach at the university. He said that if convicted, Nyang’oro has a low chance of prison time, with a minimum of four months of probation and maximum of 30 months in prison.

Maybe something has changed. Maybe details will come out that make it likely Nyang'oro would face 6 months or so in jail -- enough time so that he might consider actually spilling the beans. But, I suspect that will not be the case and we will get a tepid defense from him. He has already paid back the $12k he was paid for the class. At this point, he might even be inclined to plead guilty and take 4 or 6 months of "probation" as his penalty.

-Jason "We will see how it develops, but I am not holding my breath waiting for Julius to tell the truth" Evans

[BD80]

Mary Willingham, former tutor for UNC athletes, writes in her blog:

"A cohort of 17 of our [unc] top football players appearing in the bowl game today (on TV) have an overall gpa of 2.3, they accumulated 10 semesters of academic probation (below a 2.0), together they have 29 F’s and 53 D’s on their unofficial transcripts. More than half read below grade level. Two are most likely non-readers. Together they took a total of 48 drama classes while not a single one majors in drama. ..."

[Mal]

Together they took a total of 48 drama classes while not a single one majors in drama. ..."
[/I]
Hey, maybe they're just inspired by Eddie George: http://artsbeat.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/12/30/and-now-the-starting-lineup-as-othello-a-63-running-back-no-27-eddie-george/?hpw&rref=theater&_r=0 ;)

I was rather disappointed the Times article didn't once make the simple point that (a) it is utterly impossible that Nyang'oro was just some kind of rogue, operating outside of anyone's knowledge, and (b) even if that was what was happening, it's an indication of a complete institutional failure. Like it's plausible that no one in the Athletic Department or anywhere else ever heard about this. As if a bunch of 19 year-olds didn't joke around about their fake classes and homework in the locker rooms, and their academic advisors and tutors never got wise to the fact that one or more of their charges' classes didn't actually exist. C'mon. The statements by the provost about trust and how shocked they all are by the existence of this kind of thing is so insulting I find it infuriating the Times didn't absolutely skewer the guy instead of let his little plea for pity about how they can't go forward trusting in anyone and isn't it just all so sad, stand as the end of the article. Pathetic. The fact that UNC is likely to lose less prestige and standing in general, unknowledgable public opinion than Duke did in the wake of the lacrosse fiasco, mostly due to the lack of sensationalism at issue here, is really pretty telling about our media environment.

[sagegrouse]

Darn it, I can't find the reference from a few weeks ago. When long-time academic advisor Wayne Weldon left UNC in 2009 (he had also worked with Roy at Kansas), there was a new appointment -- a woman. She reportedly was aghast at the no-show, no-teach classes and steered basketball players away from them, leading to a sharp decline in AAM majors on the basketball team..

The point not made in the article -- which may reflect somewhat favorably on basketball -- is that the no-show classes were widely known and used by the athletic department's academic advisors. So much for this whole mess being the creature of a rogue professor and an administrator.

[oldnavy]

I'm not so sure about that. I would love for many month in prison to be hanging over Nyang'oro's head as a strong incentive for him to rat out everyone at UNC who knew about this, but that simply is not the case. When he was indicted, numerous articles pointed out (http://www.heraldsun.com/news/x339032656/Former-UNC-professor-to-plead-not-guilty-to-fraud) that, if convicted, there was a pretty small chance he would actually go to jail.



Maybe something has changed. Maybe details will come out that make it likely Nyang'oro would face 6 months or so in jail -- enough time so that he might consider actually spilling the beans. But, I suspect that will not be the case and we will get a tepid defense from him. He has already paid back the $12k he was paid for the class. At this point, he might even be inclined to plead guilty and take 4 or 6 months of "probation" as his penalty.

-Jason "We will see how it develops, but I am not holding my breath waiting for Julius to tell the truth" Evans

He may want to try and clear or mitigate the damage as much as possible to his reputation if in fact he feels he was wronged and unfairly sacrificed by UNC...

I would think that most people in his place would want to get as much info out as they could to show that they were not just a rouge outlaw, but part of a culture that encouraged this behavior from the top down.

IF that is the case....

[77devil]

Hey, maybe they're just inspired by Eddie George: http://artsbeat.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/12/30/and-now-the-starting-lineup-as-othello-a-63-running-back-no-27-eddie-george/?hpw&rref=theater&_r=0 ;)

I was rather disappointed the Times article didn't once make the simple point that (a) it is utterly impossible that Nyang'oro was just some kind of rogue, operating outside of anyone's knowledge, and (b) even if that was what was happening, it's an indication of a complete institutional failure. Like it's plausible t
hat no one in the Athletic Department or anywhere else ever heard about this. As if a bunch of 19 year-olds didn't joke around about their fake classes and homework in the locker rooms, and their academic advisors and tutors never got wise to the fact that one or more of their charges' classes didn't actually exist. C'mon. The statements by the provost about trust and how shocked they all are by the existence of this kind of thing is so insulting I find it infuriating the Times didn't absolutely skewer the guy instead of let his little plea for pity about how they can't go forward trusting in anyone and isn't it just all so sad, stand as the end of the article. Pathetic. The fact that UNC is likely to lose less prestige and standing in general, unknowledgable public opinion than Duke did in the wake of the lacrosse fiasco, mostly due to the lack of sensationalism at issue here, is really pretty telling about our media environment.

Well, it is the New York Times. As far as loss of prestige, the rest of the UNC story hasn't been written yet.

[allenmurray]

I'm not so sure about that. I would love for many month in prison to be hanging over Nyang'oro's head as a strong incentive for him to rat out everyone at UNC who knew about this, but that simply is not the case. When he was indicted, numerous articles pointed out (http://www.heraldsun.com/news/x339032656/Former-UNC-professor-to-plead-not-guilty-to-fraud) that, if convicted, there was a pretty small chance he would actually go to jail.



Maybe something has changed. Maybe details will come out that make it likely Nyang'oro would face 6 months or so in jail -- enough time so that he might consider actually spilling the beans. But, I suspect that will not be the case and we will get a tepid defense from him. He has already paid back the $12k he was paid for the class. At this point, he might even be inclined to plead guilty and take 4 or 6 months of "probation" as his penalty.

-Jason "We will see how it develops, but I am not holding my breath waiting for Julius to tell the truth" Evans

Isn't Nyang'oro a lawyer? A conviction could costhim his law license - that may be his incentive to cut a deal.

[77devil]

Isn't Nyang'oro a lawyer? A conviction could costhim his law license - that may be his incentive to cut a deal.

He has a law degree. Whether he passed the bar or has an active license is unreported.

[MarkD83]

He has a law degree. Whether he passed the bar or has an active license is unreported.

His law degree is from Duke so be careful with this path in the discussion.......

[BD80]

He has a law degree. Whether he passed the bar or has an active license is unreported.

Well, if the nc state bar examination follows the lead of its flagship university, it was probably a paper only, no attendance no actual exam required.

[MartyClark]

Well, it is the New York Times. As far as loss of prestige, the rest of the UNC story hasn't been written yet.

This is just a well orchestrated move by Duke, with a huge number of graduates in the N.Y.C. areas, to falsely accuse UNC.

See IC for details.

[MarkD83]

The comments are sensational, tracking the start of the AFAM program in 1992 coinciding with 4/5 of the 1993 championship team declaring AFAM majors; ALL players of the 2005 championship team being AFAM majors (except the 3 that did not graduate and did not declare majors), including 15 enrollments in fake classes by the 2005 team; and 23 enrollments in fake classes by the 2009 championship team.


Is this perhaps the reason the UNC administration is handling this so poorly. Could they be blinded by the fact that they would have to admit some wrong-doing in their basketball program and perhaps have to do the unthinkable (see Michigan, U Mass and Memphis).

[-jk]

Hmm.. I couldn't find him in the NC Bar (http://www.ncbar.gov/gxweb/mem_search.aspx) search.

-jk

[FerryFor50]

He may want to try and clear or mitigate the damage as much as possible to his reputation if in fact he feels he was wronged and unfairly sacrificed by UNC...

I would think that most people in his place would want to get as much info out as they could to show that they were not just a rouge outlaw, but part of a culture that encouraged this behavior from the top down.

IF that is the case....

If that is the case, he will be dragged through the mud, much like Tim Donaghy (disgraced NBA ref/game fixer) and Brian McNamee (Roger Clemens steroid cohort) were. Hopefully he has fewer skeletons in his closet...

[77devil]

His law degree is from Duke so be careful with this path in the discussion.......

Really, do pray tell. In fact, I was well aware but my post made no pejorative reference. It was a response to another post that a law degree does not mean there is a law license at risk as prosecutorial leverage.

[devildeac]

His law degree is from Duke so be careful with this path in the discussion.......

"I am not a crook."

[arnie]

Hmm.. I couldn't find him in the NC Bar (http://www.ncbar.gov/gxweb/mem_search.aspx) search.

-jk

No, but I did see one Michael B. Nifong listed - of course his bar status is nothing to be proud of.

[Newton_14]

Mary Willingham, former tutor for UNC athletes, writes in her blog:

"A cohort of 17 of our [unc] top football players appearing in the bowl game today (on TV) have an overall gpa of 2.3, they accumulated 10 semesters of academic probation (below a 2.0), together they have 29 F’s and 53 D’s on their unofficial transcripts. More than half read below grade level. Two are most likely non-readers. Together they took a total of 48 drama classes while not a single one majors in drama. ..."


So in other words, nothing has changed. At all. They just shifted the athlete's from AFAM to Drama and other basket weaving classes. I do fear though, that as our friend Moon Pie has opined many times, the hammer will never drop. True punishment will never come and the cheating will never stop. Winning means to much to them. Especially as long as Duke or State is having success (thus the Loaf Bread Championship banner after our 2001 Title). I have to imagine the success and attention Duke Football is having/getting now is burning them to their core. I have to laugh that Duke is having more success in Football without rampant cheating than UNC has had recently with rampant cheating.

[Indoor66]

So in other words, nothing has changed. At all. They just shifted the athlete's from AFAM to Drama and other basket weaving classes. I do fear though, that as our friend Moon Pie has opined many times, the hammer will never drop. True punishment will never come and the cheating will never stop. Winning means to much to them. Especially as long as Duke or State is having success (thus the Loaf Bread Championship banner after our 2001 Title). I have to imagine the success and attention Duke Football is having/getting now is burning them to their core. I have to laugh that Duke is having more success in Football without rampant cheating than UNC has had recently with rampant cheating.

I agree with you. But always remember, everything is temporary if you give it enough time and, the sun don't shine on the same dog's butt every day.

[FerryFor50]

I agree with you. But always remember, everything is temporary if you give it enough time and, the sun don't shine on the same dog's butt every day.

Yea, but usually the dog has to start walking backwards for that to happen...

[-jk]

I agree with you. But always remember, everything is temporary if you give it enough time and, the sun don't shine on the same dog's butt every day.

Alas, there are a whole lotta dogs' butts out there. Doin' what they do. And not being watched closely enough - or ignored too much. (Just ask my neighbor with the heavy ground cover...)

The NCAA has a really bad habit of turning away when it suits 'em.

-jk

[moonpie23]

another media outlet spiting indignant………meh…..

it's not going to mean anything….

[ricks68]

"I am not a crook."

Yeah. But look what happened to the guy that said that not that many years down the road. He became the POTUS! (Then, of course, he got caught again.) Says a lot for our society------which is why UNC is still getting away with it, and may never get punished for it. :mad:

ricks

[MarkD83]

Really, do pray tell. In fact, I was well aware but my post made no pejorative reference. It was a response to another post that a law degree does not mean there is a law license at risk as prosecutorial leverage.

Devideac made the reference to Nixon in the post after this which was one direction the conversation could go and the other was that it would give IC folks a reason to blame this whole mess on Duke. Either way would be a distraction from the seriousness of the issues.

[jdj4duke]

another media outlet spiting indignant………meh…..

it's not going to mean anything….

Only folks outside UNC care about this stuff. I realize that's a wide net but basically true. My niece is a junior at UNC. I asked her about the NYT article. Her reply was that UNC had erred in not having the right public relations team in place to counter the negative reports. She was optimistic though that they were getting better PR officials and they would be able to put matters in proper context (ignored or under the rug or just finessed, I suppose).

I'm with Moon Pie- it won't mean anything over there.

[sagegrouse]

Only folks outside UNC care about this stuff. I realize that's a wide net but basically true. My niece is a junior at UNC. I asked her about the NYT article. Her reply was that UNC had erred in not having the right public relations team in place to counter the negative reports. She was optimistic though that they were getting better PR officials and they would be able to put matters in proper context (ignored or under the rug or just finessed, I suppose).

I'm with Moon Pie- it won't mean anything over there.

Do you think the UNC folks see that, with a front-page blast from the NY Times and a hammer from Bloomberg Business Week, the new PR team is a total disaster? Oh, wait! Mebbe the assignment for the new guys was to bamboozle the NCAA, not shape public opinion.

The only answer for the newly energized public critics is to eliminate the academic corruption, root and branch, and do it in a visible way. I doubt a PR firm can do that. :rolleyes:

And BTW, the validation of the N&O reporting by national media, although late in coming, will encourage more of the same. And UNC athletics is a feast for reporters.

[OldPhiKap]

Do you think the UNC folks see that, with a front-page blast from the NY Times and a hammer from Bloomberg Business Week, the new PR team is a total disaster? .

"Yankees just don't get #TheCarolinaWay"

[jdj4duke]

Do you think the UNC folks see that, with a front-page blast from the NY Times and a hammer from Bloomberg Business Week, the new PR team is a total disaster? Oh, wait! Mebbe the assignment for the new guys was to bamboozle the NCAA, not shape public opinion.

The only answer for the newly energized public critics is to eliminate the academic corruption, root and branch, and do it in a visible way. I doubt a PR firm can do that. :rolleyes:

And BTW, the validation of the N&O reporting by national media, although late in coming, will encourage more of the same. And UNC athletics is a feast for reporters.

Of course I hope you're right. I just don't now, and have never seen, much if any distress from most Carolina faithful about any of this. That it's seen by many in that community as a PR issue, not as the ethical cluster bomb that it is, says a lot to me.

I hope the torture of one thousand cuts continues. I just doubt it will result in any real contrition or confession.

[Mal]

I hope the torture of one thousand cuts continues. I just doubt it will result in any real contrition or confession.

I tend to agree, unless the NCAA determines it needs to get in on this, and reverses its cowardly reliance on non-athlete involvement as an excuse to avoid it thus far. As a native Minnesotan, the prospect of UNC getting away with this, when it appears for all the world as though the same basic flavor of academic fraud was going on there as in Clem Haskins' program, but more of it, more fraudulent in nature, and for a lot longer time, really aggravates me. What we need is for Deadspin or someone similar to dig deep enough to get some transcripts and verify big name UNC athletes (ie, someone who plays/played in the NBA or NFL) took phantom classes, and unearth some disgruntled former tutors or academic advisors willing to speak out about what a sham it all was. I think that may be the only way this will get the traction it deserves.

If there were really some large amount of Duke alum influence in the media, as the IC faithful seem to think, then the story line would currently be about the NCAA, skewering them from the hypocrisy angle, with plenty of folks with ties to Ohio State and USC complaining about how well UNC's being treated in the face of something potentially far more serious than what occurred at those institutions. That there's effectively zero public pressure on the NCAA over this is pretty telling, though.

[Duvall]

I tend to agree, unless the NCAA determines it needs to get in on this, and reverses its cowardly reliance on non-athlete involvement as an excuse to avoid it thus far. As a native Minnesotan, the prospect of UNC getting away with this, when it appears for all the world as though the same basic flavor of academic fraud was going on there as in Clem Haskins' program, but more of it, more fraudulent in nature, and for a lot longer time, really aggravates me. What we need is for Deadspin or someone similar to dig deep enough to get some transcripts and verify big name UNC athletes (ie, someone who plays/played in the NBA or NFL) took phantom classes, and unearth some disgruntled former tutors or academic advisors willing to speak out about what a sham it all was. I think that may be the only way this will get the traction it deserves.


I highly doubt Deadspin has anything to offer that the N&O and other actual journalists haven't already done. If there were potential whistleblowers with direct knowledge of the UNC academic fraud, the press would have found them by now. So it's tough to make comparisons to the Minnesota case, where there *was* a willing whistleblower.

[Newton_14]

I highly doubt Deadspin has anything to offer that the N&O and other actual journalists haven't already done. If there were potential whistleblowers with direct knowledge of the UNC academic fraud, the press would have found them by now. So it's tough to make comparisons to the Minnesota case, where there *was* a willing whistleblower.

I agree. Deadspin isn't the answer. It needs to be some entity like Yahoo Sports for example.

Also agree on whistleblowers. They have either been silenced with money or with not wanting to see their beloved university disgraced to that level.

[Tappan Zee Devil]

This time on the editorial page

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/01/06/opinion/acing-the-course-at-chapel-hill.html?ref=opinion&_r=0

[sagegrouse]

This time on the editorial page

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/01/06/opinion/acing-the-course-at-chapel-hill.html?ref=opinion&_r=0

Money quote:


Another shameful lesson in the multibillion-dollar entertainment industry euphemistically referred to as collegiate sports is playing out at the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill. A former professor was indicted on fraud charges last month after running dozens of bogus and no-show courses heavily enrolled with student athletes looking for easy academic credits.

[CameronBornAndBred]

This time on the editorial page

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/01/06/opinion/acing-the-course-at-chapel-hill.html?ref=opinion&_r=0
Unfortunately, there is nothing new in the article, it seems to merely serve as a "hey, they are cheating" reminder to anyone that cares to listen. Which, unfortunately once again, isn't the NCAA.

[Tappan Zee Devil]

Unfortunately, there is nothing new in the article, it seems to merely serve as a "hey, they are cheating" reminder to anyone that cares to listen. Which, unfortunately once again, isn't the NCAA.

Yeah - but it on the very highly read editorial page of one of the most influential newspapers in the country. The mess is attracting attention.

[77devil]

Yeah - but it on the very highly read editorial page of one of the most influential newspapers in the country. The mess is attracting attention.

There was more national coverage this afternoon on the NPR afternoon drive show All Things Considered. It's an interview with N&O reporter Dan Kane. Nothing new per se simply more national publicity.

http://www.npr.org/player/v2/mediaPlayer.html?action=1&t=1&islist=false&id=260265169&m=260265170&live=1

[diablesseblu]

I agree. Deadspin isn't the answer. It needs to be some entity like Yahoo Sports for example.

Also agree on whistleblowers. They have either been silenced with money or with not wanting to see their beloved university disgraced to that level.


Agree about having Yahoo Sports or some other outlet focus on this. The "crickets" from Bristol are deafening. Guess it helps to have an alum, John Skipper, as the president of ESPN. Guess that also explains Stuart Scott's continued tenure there

[Newton_14]

Agree about having Yahoo Sports or some other outlet focus on this. The "crickets" from Bristol are deafening. Guess it helps to have an alum, John Skipper, as the president of ESPN. Guess that also explains Stuart Scott's continued tenure there

Yep and yep.

In fairness though, it isn't just the UNC connection that keeps ESPN silent. They typically will not report heavily on scandals, and refuse to investigate them properly, no matter the school. That is the main reason Pat Forde gave when asked why he left ESPN for Yahoo. He wanted to be an investigative journalist asking the tough questions when needed, digging when needed, etc, and ESPN would just not let him do it. So he left for Yahoo where he recieved free reign to do those type things.

The UNC Scandal would be a good one for Pat to jump on. Somebody needs to.

I finally got a chance today to speak with a coworker who works out of the office a lot, and is the most down to earth, reasonable, UNC grad and fan I have ever known by far. He stated he was thoroughly embarassed by the entire ordeal, and feels like Roy has checked out. He made not a single excuse and the guy is a passionate fan of his school's sports teams. It was refreshing to find one graduate from there that actually cares about it. He stated that he found it appalling that athletics had dragged the academic side of the house into the toilet and it needs to be fixed.

Evidently it is going to take a whole lot more pressure and bad press than what we have seen to date, to bring about change. I am not counting on it at this point.

I will say this though. Were all of this going on at NC State, the hammers of the NCAA and every major media outlet in this state would have dropped long ago. They would have either gotten the death penalty or at a minimum hit with Lack Of Institutional Control. I am confident of that.

[sagegrouse]

Did you see this Dan Kane piece in the N&O in November 2012, that talks about the new academic coordinator for UNC basketball in 2009. She took one look at the no-go/easy A classes in AAM and said, no way! Now, Jennifer Townsend is the associate director of academic support programs at UNC. And, after she stopped basketball players from taking these fraudulent courses, the football players kept on going -- even though the lack of any learning was clearly obvious to everyone in academic support.


• Members of the men’s basketball team took no-show classes until the fall semester of 2009, when the team was assigned a new academic counselor. The new counselor was appalled to learn of the classes, and wanted no part of them. University records show the enrollments stopped that semester for basketball players, while they continued for football players....

Last month, The N&O questioned men’s basketball coach Roy Williams as to why his players stopped enrolling in no-show classes by the fall of 2009. Williams offered no explanation other than a suggestion that players may have decided on their own not to take them.

Willingham said a new academic counselor assigned to the team in summer 2009 told her she would not enroll the players in the no-show classes. “She said, ‘I didn’t come here ... to do this. Everything has to be on the up and up,’ ” Willingham recalled.

In interviews, Willingham declined to name the new counselor, but university records show that Jennifer Townsend was hired as an associate director in August 2009 and took over the role of academic counselor for the men’s basketball team. She replaced Wayne Walden, whom Williams had described as one of the most important people in his program.

Credit to UNC for getting someone in academic support with scruples. But it makes clear there were no secrets about the awful education being foisted on UNC athletes and a handful of other students.

[Olympic Fan]

Note that Roy Williams brought Wayne Walden with him from Kansas and, as sage notes, he described Walden as one of the most important people in the program,.

Through the 2009 season, UNC basketball players overdosed on AFAM classes (and at least one bogus Navy ROTC course). Six of the top seven players on the 2005 national title team majored in AFAM (except freshman Marvin Williams, who had not declared a major). Not sure of the breakdown of the 2009 national title, but almost every player on that team took AFAM courses -- including Tyler Hansbrough.

Then in the summer of 2009, the AFAM free ride for basketball is shut down by Ms. Townsend -- Mr. Walden's replacement.

Amazing how much less successful the UNC basketball program has been in the post-AFAM years compared to the AFAM years.

Just a coincidence?

[howardlander]

Note that Roy Williams brought Wayne Walden with him from Kansas and, as sage notes, he described Walden as one of the most important people in the program,.

Through the 2009 season, UNC basketball players overdosed on AFAM classes (and at least one bogus Navy ROTC course). Six of the top seven players on the 2005 national title team majored in AFAM (except freshman Marvin Williams, who had not declared a major). Not sure of the breakdown of the 2009 national title, but almost every player on that team took AFAM courses -- including Tyler Hansbrough.

Then in the summer of 2009, the AFAM free ride for basketball is shut down by Ms. Townsend -- Mr. Walden's replacement.

Amazing how much less successful the UNC basketball program has been in the post-AFAM years compared to the AFAM years.

Just a coincidence?

Probably not a coincidence. One thing I do wonder though, is at what point this Chinese water torture begins to have a significant impact on recruiting. Doesn't seem to have happened yet, but I think eventually the parents of recruits will notice, or have it pointed out to them by competing recruiters.

Howard

[sagegrouse]

Probably not a coincidence. One thing I do wonder though, is at what point this Chinese water torture begins to have a significant impact on recruiting. Doesn't seem to have happened yet, but I think eventually the parents of recruits will notice, or have it pointed out to them by competing recruiters.

Howard

To what does "water torture" prefer?

[grad_devil]

To what does "water torture" prefer [sic]?

I'm assuming you meant 'refer', no?

I don't want to speak for Howard, but I believe he's referring to the trickle of article after article on UNC-CH's scandal, in increasingly bigger markets. It's hard to live in the US and not have heard something about what's going on in Chapel Hill. Where there's smoke, and all that...

[howardlander]

I'm assuming you meant 'refer', no?

I don't want to speak for Howard, but I believe he's referring to the trickle of article after article on UNC-CH's scandal, in increasingly bigger markets. It's hard to live in the US and not have heard something about what's going on in Chapel Hill. Where there's smoke, and all that...

Yes, that is exactly what I meant, sorry for not being clearer. Thanks for the clarification. Imagine the scene: Coach Williams walking into the living room of a recruit and introducing himself to the parents: "Hi, I'm Roy Williams", parents reply: "Yes, we know who you are ..."

Howard

[ArnieMc]

There's more than one way to look at it.


Yes, that is exactly what I meant, sorry for not being clearer. Thanks for the clarification. Imagine the scene: Coach Williams walking into the living room of a recruit and introducing himself to the parents: "Hi, I'm Roy Williams", parents reply: "Yes, we know who you are ..."

Howard"Our boy is not too bright. He needs to stay eligible to get to the NBA. Will there be an academic problem? Will classes interfere with his practicing? Coach Calipari said not to worry about it if he goes to UK."

[Skitzle]

Probably not a coincidence. One thing I do wonder though, is at what point this Chinese water torture begins to have a significant impact on recruiting. Doesn't seem to have happened yet, but I think eventually the parents of recruits will notice, or have it pointed out to them by competing recruiters.

Howard

It already has! The Wear twins committed in 2009 and transfered in 2010. I hear they were really interested in Swahili.

[Kfanarmy]

I'm assuming you meant 'refer', no?

I don't want to speak for Howard, but I believe he's referring to the trickle of article after article on UNC-CH's scandal, in increasingly bigger markets. It's hard to live in the US and not have heard something about what's going on in Chapel Hill. Where there's smoke, and all that...

Shoot. I thought someone had finally come up with a method to get to the bottom of this whole academic fraud thing.

[alteran]

Yeah - but it on the very highly read editorial page of one of the most influential newspapers in the country. The mess is attracting attention.

And getting coverage outside of the UNC-graduated regional media bubble. A lot harder to bury the bodies when people actually turn on the flashlights.

[oldnavy]

The way I look at it is that the damage is already done. The emperor has no clothes and now everyone knows it. That makes me smile. :D

[Duvall]

UNC athletics, where literacy is optional. (http://www.cnn.com/2014/01/07/us/ncaa-athletes-reading-scores/index.html)


Early in her career as a learning specialist, Mary Willingham was in her office when a basketball player at the University of North Carolina walked in looking for help with his classwork.

He couldn't read or write.

"And I kind of panicked. What do you do with that?" she said, recalling the meeting.

Willingham's job was to help athletes who weren't quite ready academically for the work required at UNC at Chapel Hill, one of the country's top public universities.

But she was shocked that one couldn't read. And then she found he was not an anomaly.

Data from other public universities, including UNC. (http://www.cnn.com/interactive/2014/01/us/college-scores/index.html)


From Mary Willingham's research, based on Scholastic Aptitude Test for Adults:

-- Of 183 athletes in revenue-generating sports admitted to UNC between 2004 and 2012:

-- About 60% were reading between the fourth and eighth grade reading levels.

-- Between 8% and 10% were reading below a third grade level.

[JasonEvans]

Wow... that CNN story with the UNC whistleblower is tough. Carolina is rapidly becoming the poster-child for shepherding ill-prepared athletes through college. I'd say The Carolina Way is dead and buried.

-Jason "whew, the crisis PR folks at Carolina must be polishing up their resumes" Evans

[TruBlu]

I'm assuming you meant 'refer', no?



This is UNC-CH we are speaking about. Perhaps 'reefer' would be more appropriate.

[Gmadaduke]

UNC figures very prominently in this article. Very troubling, I think...

http://www.cnn.com/2014/01/07/us/ncaa-athletes-reading-scores/index.html?hpt=hp_t1

[chaosmage]

the author of the piece, has some interesting things - Sara Ganim - including that kids would make progress, then forget it (concussions), and also that one recruit, per Mary Willingham, was promised he could learn to become a barber at UNC.

Her twitter feed with the info she has is just shocking, especially to me (teacher). It's unreal. I can remember students I taught that played sports and would get into (somehow) a 4-year school... and they were so low in high school the only classes they had outside of their special-ed classes were music/art/PE. Then they'd get into the school.. play one semester, and flunk out. Or transfer back home because "they missed home."

Sorry for the stream-of-consciousness writing, rough day.

[-bdbd]

UNC figures very prominently in this article. Very troubling, I think...

http://www.cnn.com/2014/01/07/us/ncaa-athletes-reading-scores/index.html?hpt=hp_t1

Yep, extremely ugly for UNC.... Just don't see how they squirm out of this one. :confused:


As a graduate student at UNC-Greensboro, Willingham researched the reading levels of 183 UNC-Chapel Hill athletes who played football or basketball from 2004 to 2012. She found that 60% read between fourth- and eighth-grade levels. Between 8% and 10% read below a third-grade level.

"So what are the classes they are going to take to get a degree here? You cannot come here with a third-, fourth- or fifth-grade education and get a degree here," she told CNN.

The issue was highlighted at UNC two years ago with the exposure of a scandal where students, many of them athletes, were given grades for classes they didn't attend, and where they did nothing more than turn in a single paper. Last month, a North Carolina grand jury indicted a professor at the center of the scandal on fraud charges. He's accused of being paid $12,000 for a class he didn't teach.

When Willingham worked as a learning specialist for athletes from 2003 to 2010, she admits she took part in cheating, signing her name to forms that said she witnessed no NCAA rules violations when in fact she did. But the NCAA, the college sports organizing body, never interviewed her. Instead, it found no rules had been broken at Chapel Hill.

[Duvall]

Yep, extremely ugly for UNC.... Just don't see how they squirm out of this one. :confused:


UNC will squirm out of this the same way they squirm out of everything - nobody wants them to be the villain, so they aren't.

[dukie’s_daughter]

UNC will squirm out of this the same way they squirm out of everything - nobody wants them to be the villain, so they aren't.

I want them to be the villain...I'm just sayin'...

[BD80]

Wow... that CNN story with the UNC whistleblower is tough. Carolina is rapidly becoming the poster-child for shepherding ill-prepared athletes through college. I'd say The Carolina Way is dead and buried.

-Jason "whew, the crisis PR folks at Carolina must be polishing up their resumes" Evans

I would suggest that the true meaning of "the Carolina way" is finally being revealed.

[OldSchool]

She found that 60% read between fourth- and eighth-grade levels.

Perhaps UNC should schedule all their games against fourth-to-eighth graders.

[Turk]

Note that Roy Williams brought Wayne Walden with him from Kansas and, as sage notes, he described Walden as one of the most important people in the program,.

Through the 2009 season, UNC basketball players overdosed on AFAM classes (and at least one bogus Navy ROTC course). Six of the top seven players on the 2005 national title team majored in AFAM (except freshman Marvin Williams, who had not declared a major). Not sure of the breakdown of the 2009 national title, but almost every player on that team took AFAM courses -- including Tyler Hansbrough.

Then in the summer of 2009, the AFAM free ride for basketball is shut down by Ms. Townsend -- Mr. Walden's replacement.

Amazing how much less successful the UNC basketball program has been in the post-AFAM years compared to the AFAM years.

Just a coincidence?

First time I heard a reference about a bogus Navy ROTC course. That's really shocking to me. How did they pull that off?

[OldPhiKap]

First time I heard a reference about a bogus Navy ROTC course. That's really shocking to me. How did they pull that off?

Apparently, it was a 200-level course discussing the lyrics to "In the Navy" by the Village People.


"But I'm afraid of water . . . ."

[oldnavy]

How do you get into High School if you can't read???

Why not take a look at the public schools that are passing these kids along in the first place?

Sure, College athletics has MAJOR issues, but clearly the problem/corruption is occurring way before time to apply for college.

[gus]

UNC athletics, where literacy is optional. (http://www.cnn.com/2014/01/07/us/ncaa-athletes-reading-scores/index.html)

Maybe JR really couldn't.

[OldPhiKap]

Maybe JR really couldn't.

That's pretty funny.

Difference is, though -- and this is what really hurts the Carolina fans if they think about it -- Dean would not have pulled this crap. Roy did.

#CarolinaWayIsDead #WinAtAllCosts #DeanWasBetter

[JBDuke]

That's pretty funny.

Difference is, though -- and this is what really hurts the Carolina fans if they think about it -- Dean would not have pulled this crap. Roy did.

#CarolinaWayIsDead #WinAtAllCosts #DeanWasBetter

Well, the AAS department at Carolina was started in 1992 and by 1993, three of the five starters on the Heels' '93 champions majored in AAS, and a fourth minored in it. George Lynch, who was a senior in '93, graduated with an AAS degree despite the fact that the department only started in '92.

Dean Smith would continue to coach until 1997.

[OldPhiKap]

Well, the AAS department at Carolina was started in 1992 and by 1993, three of the five starters on the Heels' '93 champions majored in AAS, and a fourth minored in it. George Lynch, who was a senior in '93, graduated with an AAS degree despite the fact that the department only started in '92.

Dean Smith would continue to coach until 1997.

So Dean was a hypocrite?

I can live with that, too.

[chaosmage]

How do you get into High School if you can't read???

Why not take a look at the public schools that are passing these kids along in the first place?

Sure, College athletics has MAJOR issues, but clearly the problem/corruption is occurring way before time to apply for college.

and I'll try to stay off my soapbox. There are multiple reasons, a few of which do occur with the staff of a school. Apathetic district staff, administrators more interested in power and money than the students, teachers who are tenured and entrenched that are cruising to retirement. The unions fight for the teachers, and that's a good thing, until you fight for teachers that no longer care. That's on the one hand.
On the other, I teach middle school in a low-income, high-poverty area of SoCal. I've taught for 13 years, in rural NC and out here. The poverty cycle continues because it's become a generational thing. Kids see the parents surviving on welfare or working low-income jobs, and see nothing wrong with it. I am at one of the better schools in my area, and we still have about a 20-25% passing rate. I taught a tutoring course in math for 20 students last year. We went over fractions, basic math, solving equations, and a few other things. By and large, about 3 of those 20 kids could keep up. The rest had little success.

It starts at the elementary level, when a child falls behind. Then they can't catch up. The parents blame the teacher, the school, or something else, so they move to a new school. That puts the student further behind. It also comes from teachers being forced to teach to the low-end, to bring them up. We then lose the middle kids that are almost there, and the high kids move to other districts to get ahead instead of getting nothing.

The system is broken... charters can't fix it, vouchers don't fix it. It requires a great many parents realizing that their kid isn't as ahead as they think, and taking responsibility for it. Schools are afraid to fail children because of the lawsuits that WILL happen. No more social promotion and recognizing students for actually learning to think instead of bubbling in the right guess.

So much for staying off my soapbox.

[FerryFor50]

I clicked on the "CNN Analysis" link associated with that article:

http://www.cnn.com/interactive/2014/01/us/college-scores/index.html?hpt=hp_t1

This was pretty telling, IMO:


University response:

We asked UNC to comment specifically on Mary Willingham's research and they told us they were not aware of it, and that it wasn't part of her job to do research. But then we showed them emails between Willingham and university officials that show she had approval to conduct the research and shared her findings with university officials. UNC then told CNN they plan to meet with her to discuss what she found.

CNN also talked to UNC Athletic Director Bubba Cunningham.

Cunningham said he's confident in the admissions process at UNC, and that the university is making sure that only students who can do the work are admitted.

"I think our students have an exceptions experience in the classroom as well as on the fields of competition," he said.

Cunningham became the athletic director in November 2011, following an academic scandal at UNC, and since he said the university has put into place many reforms. Of them, he said is an "academic working group," which will "take a look at every process we have that touches a student, from recruiting to admissions enrollment to registrations to counseling to advising. I think it's going to be a wonderful process that the entire university can embrace."

"I think that we admit students who can do the work," Cunningham said. "I have great confidence in our faculty committee that reviews our applications, ... Now we also are highly competitive, and our students have to compete Monday through Friday as well as they do on Saturday and I think the ones who are really committed to being outstanding students, they are."

The cover up continues...

Maybe UNC should follow FSU's lead - don't keep records so no one can find them:


Florida State says it does not keep records regarding entrance exams of athletes, reading specialists who work with athletes, or the number of specially admitted student-athletes.

In 2009, the NCAA sanctioned Florida State after an investigation found that tutors were writing papers for athletes and giving them test answers.

Or, use the MSU "privacy law" tactic (not sure that general scores count as privacy at a state-run university):


Michigan State denied our request for scores based on privacy laws. CNN is appealing that decision, and will update this page if we get information. Michigan State did say that it has one learning specialist.

Or, stall, like UConn:


A spokesperson for Connecticut says the university is still working on the request from CNN. University officials could offer no timeline on when it might have a response.

[BigWayne]

First time I heard a reference about a bogus Navy ROTC course. That's really shocking to me. How did they pull that off?

http://www.newsobserver.com/2012/10/02/2386415/naval-weapons-systems-class-at.html

[Kfanarmy]

Mr Hansbrough seems to have a very curious nature, what with taking such a varied course curriculum...Swahili and Naval Weapons Systems. Give me a break.

[Ichabod Drain]

http://www.newsobserver.com/2012/10/02/2386415/naval-weapons-systems-class-at.html

Mischievous and deceitful. Chicanerous and deplorable.

[flyingdutchdevil]

Mr Hansbrough seems to have a very curious nature, what with taking such a varied course curriculum...Swahili and Naval Weapons Systems. Give me a break.

Don't bug eyes equal curiosity? ;)

[wilson]

Mr Hansbrough seems to have a very curious nature, what with taking such a varied course curriculum...Swahili and Naval Weapons Systems. Give me a break.


Don't bug eyes equal curiosity? ;)I think he at least took a couple of lab courses.
3784

[BigWayne]

There was more national coverage this afternoon on the NPR afternoon drive show All Things Considered. It's an interview with N&O reporter Dan Kane. Nothing new per se simply more national publicity.

http://www.npr.org/player/v2/mediaPlayer.html?action=1&t=1&islist=false&id=260265169&m=260265170&live=1

Didn't watch the video, but the transcript is here:

http://www.npr.org/2014/01/06/260265169/unc-may-have-passed-football-players-with-phantom-classes

It's in the vein of mainstream media whitewashing the problem away. The concluding discussion is about whether UNC made changes and implies that since they supposedly aren't running the sham classes anymore, all is well.

[Duvall]

Sports fans distinguish themselves yet again. (http://www.wncn.com/story/24396814/unc-counselor-receiving-death-threats-following-report-on-athlete-literacy)


On Wednesday, a day after the report aired, Willingham, who works in UNC's Center for Student Success and Academic Counseling, told WNCN that she's received several death threats and hate mail.

"I've definitely had positive feedback," Willingham said. "However we have a lot of people who feel it necessary to send hate mail and some death threats.

"I think it's because the entertainment of college sports and athletics is so important to us. But I think it's completely inappropriate for people to act this way."

[rasputin]

I clicked on the "CNN Analysis" link associated with that article:

http://www.cnn.com/interactive/2014/01/us/college-scores/index.html?hpt=hp_t1

This was pretty telling, IMO:



The cover up continues...

Maybe UNC should follow FSU's lead - don't keep records so no one can find them:



Or, use the MSU "privacy law" tactic (not sure that general scores count as privacy at a state-run university):



Or, stall, like UConn:

FERPA (privacy) doesn't apply unless the info is personally identifiable. If it contains info (even without a name, etc.) that would enable somebody to put 2 and 2 together and figure out who it is, it's personally identifiable. Otherwise, if it's just numbers, there's likely no violation.

[FerryFor50]

FERPA (privacy) doesn't apply unless the info is personally identifiable. If it contains info (even without a name, etc.) that would enable somebody to put 2 and 2 together and figure out who it is, it's personally identifiable. Otherwise, if it's just numbers, there's likely no violation.

Kind of what I figured. So if they released a set of numbers such as "this % of athletes at our school read at a 4th grade level" that wouldn't be personally identifiable, right?

[rasputin]

Kind of what I figured. So if they released a set of numbers such as "this % of athletes at our school read at a 4th grade level" that wouldn't be personally identifiable, right?

Right.

[MChambers]

Right.
If it was 100%, it would be personally identifiable!

[alteran]

Wow... that CNN story with the UNC whistleblower is tough. Carolina is rapidly becoming the poster-child for shepherding ill-prepared athletes through college. I'd say The Carolina Way is dead and buried.


You're missing it-- The Carolina Way is doing just fine. It's just that the Carolina Way isn't what people thought it was.

[BluBones]

the author of the piece, has some interesting things - Sara Ganim - including that kids would make progress, then forget it (concussions), and also that one recruit, per Mary Willingham, was promised he could learn to become a barber at UNC.


I've got a new logo for UNC:

http://i.imgur.com/Y6Qe1UY.jpg

[roywhite]

I've got a new logo for UNC:

http://i.imgur.com/Y6Qe1UY.jpg


A legendary poster enters the game and gets off a shot that hits nothing but net!

[hudlow]

Sports fans distinguish themselves yet again. (http://www.wncn.com/story/24396814/unc-counselor-receiving-death-threats-following-report-on-athlete-literacy)



... "However we have a lot of people who feel it necessary to send hate mail and some death threats...


Now we're getting down to The Carolina Way....

[Ima Facultiwyfe]

and I'll try to stay off my soapbox. There are multiple reasons, a few of which do occur with the staff of a school. Apathetic district staff, administrators more interested in power and money than the students, teachers who are tenured and entrenched that are cruising to retirement. The unions fight for the teachers, and that's a good thing, until you fight for teachers that no longer care. That's on the one hand.
On the other, I teach middle school in a low-income, high-poverty area of SoCal. I've taught for 13 years, in rural NC and out here. The poverty cycle continues because it's become a generational thing. Kids see the parents surviving on welfare or working low-income jobs, and see nothing wrong with it. I am at one of the better schools in my area, and we still have about a 20-25% passing rate. I taught a tutoring course in math for 20 students last year. We went over fractions, basic math, solving equations, and a few other things. By and large, about 3 of those 20 kids could keep up. The rest had little success.

It starts at the elementary level, when a child falls behind. Then they can't catch up. The parents blame the teacher, the school, or something else, so they move to a new school. That puts the student further behind. It also comes from teachers being forced to teach to the low-end, to bring them up. We then lose the middle kids that are almost there, and the high kids move to other districts to get ahead instead of getting nothing.

The system is broken... charters can't fix it, vouchers don't fix it. It requires a great many parents realizing that their kid isn't as ahead as they think, and taking responsibility for it. Schools are afraid to fail children because of the lawsuits that WILL happen. No more social promotion and recognizing students for actually learning to think instead of bubbling in the right guess.

So much for staying off my soapbox.

Thank you.
Love, Ima

[Duvall]

Roy Williams comments (audio). (https://audioboo.fm/boos/1840201-coach-williams-comments-regarding-negative-cnn-story?playlist_direction=forward) He wants everyone to know that he thinks its unfair that people are saying things about University of North Carolina athletics that he does not want to be true.

[Dr. Rosenrosen]

Roy Williams comments (audio). (https://audioboo.fm/boos/1840201-coach-williams-comments-regarding-negative-cnn-story?playlist_direction=forward) He wants everyone to know that he thinks its unfair that people are saying things about University of North Carolina athletics that he does not want to be true.
Good god. That is the droopy doggiest, aw shucksiest thing I've ever heard him say. The denial of reality is just astounding.

Perhaps the most hilariously sad element of this is UNC saying they cannot substantiate the claim because they have not seen the data and their request for the data has "not been met." Uh, are you frickin kidding me? Whose data was is that was reviewed and analyzed.

[porkpa]

Are you surprised? What else would you expect him to say? To paraphrase Paul Simon "Where have you gone Dean Smih?".

[porkpa]

No grandchild of mine is going to be baby sat by P J Hairston.

[plimnko]

No grandchild of mine is going to be baby sat by P J Hairston.

i found that to be a VERY odd statement too. you see how graves house sitting turned out.

[wsb3]

Roy Williams comments (audio). (https://audioboo.fm/boos/1840201-coach-williams-comments-regarding-negative-cnn-story?playlist_direction=forward) He wants everyone to know that he thinks its unfair that people are saying things about University of North Carolina athletics that he does not want to be true.

One senior since he has been there that did not graduate. Well when you get grades for fake classes graduating might not be such a challenge.

[OldPhiKap]

One senior since he has been there that did not graduate. Well when you get grades for fake classes graduating might not be such a challenge.

I thought that was pretty funny too.

Roy sounds really, really, really tired. And I think they have Syracuse next.

Of course, they'll probably win that one. Odd team.

[oldnavy]

I thought that was pretty funny too.

Roy sounds really, really, really tired. And I think they have Syracuse next.

Of course, they'll probably win that one. Odd team.

Odd is right!

I have gone from thinking this team wouldn't make the NCAA, to thinking that they could be a FF team, back to thinking that they will be in the NCAA but as a pretty low seed....

Good grief!! They are driving me crazy, I can't imagine what the fan base is thinking (nor do I really want to know what that bunch of sanctimonious hypocrites think about anything!)

[miramar]

In other words, it can't be true because this is the University of North Carolina.

It reminds me of the good old days when millions of people would tell pollsters that they didn't believe that Nixon did all those things because he was the president and presidents simply don't do that. Of course, even those people weren't dumb enough to want Nixon to baby sit their kids.

[OldPhiKap]

In other words, it can't be true because this is the University of North Carolina.

It reminds me of the good old days when millions of people would tell pollsters that they didn't believe that Nixon did all those things because he was the president and presidents simply don't do that. Of course, even those people weren't dumb enough to want Nixon to baby sit their kids.

"But even the President of the United States
Sometimes must have
To stand naked."

-- Robert Zimmerman

[oldnavy]

In a response to the reported aired by CNN, UNC spokesperson Karen Moon said the University can not comment on the claims because they have not seen the data.

"We do not believe that claim and find it patently unfair to the many student-athletes who have worked hard in the classroom and on the court and represented our University with distinction. Our students have earned their place at Carolina and we respect what they bring to the University both academically and athletically," Moon said.

Wait, what? We can't comment on the claims because we have not seen the data, but we think that it is unfair??? What???

Am I going nuts, or did she just comment on the claim she said she couldn't comment on????

Those folks are just nuts.

[OldPhiKap]

In a response to the reported aired by CNN, UNC spokesperson Karen Moon said the University can not comment on the claims because they have not seen the data.

"We do not believe that claim and find it patently unfair to the many student-athletes who have worked hard in the classroom and on the court and represented our University with distinction. Our students have earned their place at Carolina and we respect what they bring to the University both academically and athletically," Moon said.

Wait, what? We can't comment on the claims because we have not seen the data, but we think that it is unfair??? What???

Am I going nuts, or did she just comment on the claim she said she couldn't comment on????

Those folks are just nuts.

"I cannot comment on that false and unfair story."

You are seeing top notch PR spin right here. Slow clap for Ms. Moon.

[miramar]

In a response to the reported aired by CNN, UNC spokesperson Karen Moon said the University can not comment on the claims because they have not seen the data.

"We do not believe that claim and find it patently unfair to the many student-athletes who have worked hard in the classroom and on the court and represented our University with distinction. Our students have earned their place at Carolina and we respect what they bring to the University both academically and athletically," Moon said.

Wait, what? We can't comment on the claims because we have not seen the data, but we think that it is unfair??? What???

Am I going nuts, or did she just comment on the claim she said she couldn't comment on????

Those folks are just nuts.

There are a couple of interesting claims here:

"We do not believe that claim and FIND IT PATENTLY UNFAIR TO THE MANY STUDENT-ATHLETES WHO HAVE WORKED HARD IN THE CLASSROOM AND ON THE COURT AND REPRESENTED OUR UNIVERSITY WITH DISTINCTION. OUR STUDENTS HAVE EARNED THEIR PLACE AT CAROLINA and we respect what they bring to the University both academically and athletically," Moon said.

First, "it is unfair to the many student-athletes who have worked hard in the classroom." In other words, those few who have actually worked hard will now be tarheeled with same brush, which is true. People will think that all players is dumb even though there is a few who ain't.

Second, "Our students have earned their place at Carolina." Unfortunately, that place is on the team and in phantom classes, but that's the Carolina way.




f

[Turk]

In a response to the reported aired by CNN, UNC spokesperson Karen Moon said the University can not comment on the claims because they have not seen the data.

"We do not believe that claim and find it patently unfair to the many student-athletes who have worked hard in the classroom and on the court and represented our University with distinction. Our students have earned their place at Carolina and we respect what they bring to the University both academically and athletically," Moon said.

Wait, what? We can't comment on the claims because we have not seen the data, but we think that it is unfair??? What???

Am I going nuts, or did she just comment on the claim she said she couldn't comment on????

Those folks are just nuts.

Turk the Editor can help out. As Miramar noted above, sentence #1 is factually true and they can believe whatever they want. No quibbles there. For sentence #2, my edits in BOLD.

"Our students have earned their place at Carolina one way or another and we respect what they bring to the University either academically OR athletically,"

[oldnavy]

There are a couple of interesting claims here:

"We do not believe that claim and FIND IT PATENTLY UNFAIR TO THE MANY STUDENT-ATHLETES WHO HAVE WORKED HARD IN THE CLASSROOM AND ON THE COURT AND REPRESENTED OUR UNIVERSITY WITH DISTINCTION. OUR STUDENTS HAVE EARNED THEIR PLACE AT CAROLINA and we respect what they bring to the University both academically and athletically," Moon said.

First, "it is unfair to the many student-athletes who have worked hard in the classroom." In other words, those few who have actually worked hard will now be tarheeled with same brush, which is true. People will think that all players is dumb even though there is a few who ain't.

Second, "Our students have earned their place at Carolina." Unfortunately, that place is on the team and in phantom classes, but that's the Carolina way.




f

Yea but to say you cannot comment on the claim because you have not seen the data, then to dismiss the claim as being untrue in the next breath tells you how interested UNC is in actually investigating the claim.

I disagree that this is good PR, to me it is amateurish and totally transparent to anyone who reads it.

To paraphrase: "we don't have any data, but we don't believe anything bad happened" OK. Fine, but don't say it is unfair if you have no idea what the data says....

[DukieInKansas]

What Ms. Moon failed to point out about the "many student-athletes who have worked hard in the classroom and on the court and represented our University with distinction. Our students have earned their place at Carolina and we respect what they bring to the University both academically and athletically" was that they are on the fencing team, swim team, golf team, and various other non-revenue sports.

[alteran]

Yea but to say you cannot comment on the claim because you have not seen the data, then to dismiss the claim as being untrue in the next breath tells you how interested UNC is in actually investigating the claim.

I disagree that this is good PR, to me it is amateurish and totally transparent to anyone who reads it.

To paraphrase: "we don't have any data, but we don't believe anything bad happened" OK. Fine, but don't say it is unfair if you have no idea what the data says....

Especially when it's THEIR FRIGGIN' DATA.

I mean, it's not like they have to have to complete the Labors of Hercules to get the info. They have to send send an intern down the hall. And they don't have to deal with UNC stonewalling like everyone else who is trying to figure out what is going on in that sorry excuse for a public institution.

[oldnavy]

Especially when it's THEIR FRIGGIN' DATA.

I mean, it's not like they have to have to complete the Labors of Hercules to get the info. They have to send send an intern down the hall. And they don't have to deal with UNC stonewalling like everyone else who is trying to figure out what is going on in that sorry excuse for a public institution.

Wasn't it reported that the data was shared with UNC by the academic adviser? I believe the adviser is still working for UNC... I would bet the data is easily available if they choose to review it.

The problem with being as arrogant as UNC is, they truly believe that everyone else is stupid and they say asinine things like Ms. Moon said.

"I have not see the data, but the data that I haven't seen is unfair".... These folks are better suited to run for political office than to run a public university.

You have to laugh at this.... it is beyond ridiculous.

[dpslaw]

From the CNN analysis:

"We asked UNC to comment specifically on Mary Willingham's research and they told us they were not aware of it, and that it wasn't part of her job to do research. But then we showed them emails between Willingham and university officials that show she had approval to conduct the research and shared her findings with university officials. UNC then told CNN they plan to meet with her to discuss what she found."

[Duvall]

i found that to be a VERY odd statement too. you see how graves house sitting turned out.

To be fair, Graves and Hairston have done some foolish things, but nothing that would make them bad people. Which gets to one of the odd things about Williams' comments - he insisted that his players had good character and that he was proud of them, but this isn't about their character. The issue is whether UNC football and basketball brought in students that were academically unprepared, which has nothing to do with their character.

[plimnko]

To be fair, Graves and Hairston have done some foolish things, but nothing that would make them bad people. Which gets to one of the odd things about Williams' comments - he insisted that his players had good character and that he was proud of them, but this isn't about their character. The issue is whether UNC football and basketball brought in students that were academically unprepared, which has nothing to do with their character.

i agree, but i couldn't resist taking a shot at the tarholes. maybe the grand kids could help them with their reading skills.

[OldPhiKap]

From the CNN analysis:

"We asked UNC to comment specifically on Mary Willingham's research and they told us they were not aware of it, and that it wasn't part of her job to do research. But then we showed them emails between Willingham and university officials that show she had approval to conduct the research and shared her findings with university officials. UNC then told CNN they plan to meet with her to discuss what she found."

'Oh, THAT damning evidence. . . ."

[sagegrouse]

Especially when it's THEIR FRIGGIN' DATA.

I mean, it's not like they have to have to complete the Labors of Hercules to get the info. They have to send send an intern down the hall. And they don't have to deal with UNC stonewalling like everyone else who is trying to figure out what is going on in that sorry excuse for a public institution.

Well how about the one where Hercules cleans out the Augean stables -- a real mess, as I recall -- by diverting the River Styx? Sounds comparable.

[BD80]

Especially when it's THEIR FRIGGIN' DATA.

I mean, it's not like they have to have to complete the Labors of Hercules to get the info. They have to send send an intern down the hall. And they don't have to deal with UNC stonewalling like everyone else who is trying to figure out what is going on in that sorry excuse for a public institution.

Well, they would have to find someone who could READ the data.

Yeah, I'm painting them all with the same broad brush; unc alums DESERVE it until they demand the investigation that identifies who cheated their way through school by taking no show classes. What is more important to them, their academic reputation or their basketball championships? As long as unc alum enable those trying to cover up what happened, they deserve to be treated as if they attended an easy community college.

[Henderson]

Well, they would have to find someone who could READ the data.

Yeah, I'm painting them all with the same broad brush; unc alums DESERVE it until they demand the investigation that identifies who cheated their way through school by taking no show classes. What is more important to them, their academic reputation or their basketball championships? As long as unc alum enable those trying to cover up what happened, they deserve to be treated as if they attended an easy community college.

Um, I think we know the answer to this one now.

[UrinalCake]

A couple weeks ago when the Graves/PJ stuff was still in the news, Roy went to great lengths to describe how the academics of his players are handled by a whole different department, so that he doesn't have to get involved at all and can focus only on basketball. Now he's claiming to know that these claims about his players' reading equivalency levels are inaccurate. Which is it? He's contradicting himself the same way the UNC spokesperson is... either you have the data and can verify that the claim is untrue, or you don't have the data and thus you have no idea if it's true or not.

[devildeac]

And the local writers engage in the hammering. From the Raleigh N&O today:

http://www.newsobserver.com/2014/01/08/3516832/academic-performance-of-athletes.html

[moonpie23]

death threats…….you stay classy tar holes…

http://www.cnn.com/2014/01/09/us/ncaa-athletes-unc-response/index.html?hpt=hp_c2

[Henderson]

death threats…….you stay classy Tar Heels…

http://www.cnn.com/2014/01/09/us/ncaa-athletes-unc-response/index.html?hpt=hp_c2

Broken link?

[Newton_14]

Broken link?
The link worked fine for me in IE9. Give it another shot.

Death threats for telling the truth and sharing the cold hard facts that unc is a fraud and a joke.

Stay classy indeed.

[Jarhead]

The link worked fine for me in Firefox. By the way, does the Attorney General of the State of North Carolina have jurisdiction in things of this nature? Maybe he should be taking a look.

[slower]

The link worked fine for me in Firefox. By the way, does the Attorney General of the State of North Carolina have jurisdiction in things of this nature? Maybe he should be taking a look.

Do you mean UNC (undergrad and Law) alum Roy Cooper, who will be running for governor? We shall see.

[jafarr1]

The link worked fine for me in IE9. Give it another shot.

Death threats for telling the truth and sharing the cold hard facts that unc is a fraud and a joke.



It doesn't matter if she's lying through her teeth. Death threats over anything involving college sports is a joke, and a sick one at that.

Some people need to find a new hobby, or at least a little perspective.

[BD80]

It doesn't matter if she's lying through her teeth. Death threats over anything involving college sports is a joke, and a sick one at that.

Some people need to find a new hobby, or at least a little perspective.

Maybe she is lying about the death threats ... ?

But who has the incentive to lie? An administration covering up serious wrong doing that should require the forfeiture of national championships? An educator hired to oversee the EDUCATION of "student"-athletes?

[porkpa]

I'm no great Dean Smith fan. But I can't help but thinking that this would not have happened, nor would it have been tolerated under his regime. Ole Roy - Quite another story.

[DU82]

I'm no great Dean Smith fan. But I can't help but thinking that this would not have happened, nor would it have been tolerated under his regime. Ole Roy - Quite another story.

There's some indication with the timeline of classes, in particular the AAS program, that this started while Saint Dean was the coach. Don't buy into the same PR machine.

[Lar77]

You know, this just gets worse everyday. Aside from the statistics, we have a report that the University is not even trying to provide an education. I think we understand that athletes may get a break from entrance requirements, may take courses with lesser requirements, may not complete degree requirements if they leave to go pro, and sports are close to a full time job.

But how do you not try, as a university, at least to get reading levels and other skills up to speed when you are demanding that the athlete works for you on a [cough] scholarship? Especially if you bill yourself as a top tier academic institution. And state universities, for better or worse, are representatives of the state and its work force.

If you live in NC, email the governor and the AG (loyal UNC alum as he is) and ask them if they are comfortable with the now national media attention to a problem and the apparent obfuscation and evasion of public officials in addressing it.

[Kfanarmy]

Wow the Chairman of the Board of Governors suggesting that "struggling" athletes be allowed to take community college courses? Is that like being sent down to the minors? Take your classes at the local CC but we'll let you play on the State University's team. That's a scary sollution. How about just let them enroll and play on the community college team until they are acadmically eligible?

[CameronBornAndBred]

It doesn't matter if she's lying through her teeth. Death threats over anything involving college sports is a joke, and a sick one at that.

Some people need to find a new hobby, or at least a little perspective.
I'm putting the chances of the threats coming from a non alum, and probably from someone who didn't go to any school, at a pretty high percentage. ("I didn't go to college, but I live in NC, therefore I bleed baby blue; you should be shot for saying mean things about my school.")

[Atlanta Duke]

I'm putting the chances of the threats coming from a non alum, and probably from someone who didn't go to any school, at a pretty high percentage. ("I didn't go to college, but I live in NC, therefore I bleed baby blue; you should be shot for saying mean things about my school.")

Agreed - for those of us in SEC country the most rabid fans usually are those who did not attend State U but bond with the Ball Team as the official State representative. Harvey Updyke, the lunatic Bama fan who poisoned the trees at Auburn (and named his children Bear Bryant Updyke and Crimson Tyde Updyke) went to a JUCO.

http://si.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1189175/1/index.htm

[Duvall]

I'm putting the chances of the threats coming from a non alum, and probably from someone who didn't go to any school, at a pretty high percentage. ("I didn't go to college, but I live in NC, therefore I bleed baby blue; you should be shot for saying mean things about my school.")

Perhaps, if only because there are more non-alum fans than alumni fans. But given the frequency with which outspoken women receive threats in the Internet age, it wouldn't surprise me if both alums and non-alums sent threats.

[BD80]

Wow the Chairman of the Board of Governors suggesting that "struggling" athletes be allowed to take community college courses? ...

That wouldn't work for unc, the classes are MUCH harder at a community college than those athletes take at unc ...

[oldnavy]

I'm no great Dean Smith fan. But I can't help but thinking that this would not have happened, nor would it have been tolerated under his regime. Ole Roy - Quite another story.

William Friday would have stopped this or gotten fired trying.

[allenmurray]

To be fair Graves and Hairston have done some foolish things, but nothing that would make them bad people.

Perhaps on Graves you're right, but driving around in a car loaned to you by a convicted felon while in possession of a loaded gun doesn't exactly make you a "good" person either.

[CharlestonDevil]

Perhaps on Graves you're right, but driving around in a car loaned to you by a convicted felon while in possession of a loaded gun doesn't exactly make you a "good" person either.

Don't forget without a license. And in possession of a controlled substance.

[Duvall]

There's some indication with the timeline of classes, in particular the AAS program, that this started while Saint Dean was the coach. Don't buy into the same PR machine.

Unless there's more "indication" than the fact that players were taking AAS classes in the 90s, I think we're going to need more than that.

[CharlestonDevil]

The University of No Class is pulling out all the stops now. "Hey look over here!! It's Michael Jordan!!!!!"

http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/10274561/michael-jordan-recruiting-letters-found-storage-locker-auction

[ChrisP]

The University of No Class is pulling out all the stops now. "Hey look over here!! It's Michael Jordan!!!!!"

http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/10274561/michael-jordan-recruiting-letters-found-storage-locker-auction

While I am ALL for piling on those in Cheater Hill, this story really has nothing to do with UNC. I realize it's about auctioning off some Jordan stuff and that's he's an alum but...this just doesn't seem at all relevant to the shenanigans that have been happening at the Dump on the Hump.

[DukieInKansas]

While I am ALL for piling on those in Cheater Hill, this story really has nothing to do with UNC. I realize it's about auctioning off some Jordan stuff and that's he's an alum but...this just doesn't seem at all relevant to the shenanigans that have been happening at the Dump on the Hump.

Of course, two of the items discussed as being up for auction are his diploma and college transcript. Doesn't that relate?

It should be noted that the transcript shows that he took Portuguese and not Swahili. There was an acting class for non-majors.

[Olympic Fan]

William Friday would have stopped this or gotten fired trying.

I once thought the same ... but Friday (who died in the fall of 2012) was around for the UNC football scandal and to my amazement, when asked about the reports of agents funneling money to players and tutors doing their work, he mouthed the "nothing to see here ... move along" mantra. It was shattering to someone who always thought he was a bastion of integrity.

As for Dean ... I want to believe he was clean.

It's hard -- Nyango'oro was in place and Dean's players began majoring in African-American studies as early as 1993. On there other hand, there is reason to think the real criminality (the fake classes, the grade changes, the Wheels for Heels program) began with the arrival of Roy and Wayne Walden from Kansas.

Unfortunately, because the Martin report was such a whitewash (he admitted that the illegal practices were ongoing before 2007, but he wasn't charged to look past that date) we'll never know whether Dean was a part of it or not.

[oldnavy]

I once thought the same ... but Friday (who died in the fall of 2012) was around for the UNC football scandal and to my amazement, when asked about the reports of agents funneling money to players and tutors doing their work, he mouthed the "nothing to see here ... move along" mantra. It was shattering to someone who always thought he was a bastion of integrity.

As for Dean ... I want to believe he was clean.

It's hard -- Nyango'oro was in place and Dean's players began majoring in African-American studies as early as 1993. On there other hand, there is reason to think the real criminality (the fake classes, the grade changes, the Wheels for Heels program) began with the arrival of Roy and Wayne Walden from Kansas.

Unfortunately, because the Martin report was such a whitewash (he admitted that the illegal practices were ongoing before 2007, but he wasn't charged to look past that date) we'll never know whether Dean was a part of it or not.

Wow, that is surprising about Friday. He was once so adamant about the integrity of the student/athlete. I guess he either softened as he aged or just got tired of fighting the wave of big money pressure to win at any cost.

[devildeac]

Not sure whether this has been linked here yet:

http://www.businessweek.com/articles/2014-01-10/unc-officials-lash-out-at-academic-fraud-whistleblower#r=hpf-s

[ChrisP]

Of course, two of the items discussed as being up for auction are his diploma and college transcript. Doesn't that relate?

It should be noted that the transcript shows that he took Portuguese and not Swahili. There was an acting class for non-majors.

It's not like the university is behind the auction - it's just some dude selling off some of Jordan's stuff. In the grand scheme of things related to the UNC scandal(s) - or is it Scandal Du Jour? - this just doesn't seem like any sort of big deal to me. Plus, the way the OP wrote it, he kinda made it sound like UNC was doing something here to divert people's attention, but I don't see that UNC has anything to do with it so it just seems out of place to me. Anyway, just my $.02

[BD80]

Not sure whether this has been linked here yet:

http://www.businessweek.com/articles/2014-01-10/unc-officials-lash-out-at-academic-fraud-whistleblower#r=hpf-s

Wow.

In a written statement issued Wednesday, Jan. 8, UNC said of Willingham’s account of illiterate varsity athletes: “We do not believe that claim.” In other words, her employer accused Willingham of making it up. Why on earth would she do that?

"Willingham ... is always careful to break down UNC’s roughly 800-person varsity student-athlete population ... about 150 to 200 are underperforming—some of them badly underperforming. Most of the last group are playing football or men’s or women’s basketball."

"Willingham ... researched the reading levels of a sample of more than 180 UNC-Chapel Hill varsity athletes from 2004 to 2012; 85 percent of them were football and basketball players. Her findings: About 60 percent read at between a fourth-grade and an eighth-grade level. Nearly 10 percent read below a third-grade level. In sum, 70 percent were in no position to succeed academically at a college level.

[sagegrouse]

Wow.

In a written statement issued Wednesday, Jan. 8, UNC said of Willingham’s account of illiterate varsity athletes: “We do not believe that claim.” In other words, her employer accused Willingham of making it up. Why on earth would she do that?

"Willingham ... is always careful to break down UNC’s roughly 800-person varsity student-athlete population ... about 150 to 200 are underperforming—some of them badly underperforming. Most of the last group are playing football or men’s or women’s basketball."

"Willingham ... researched the reading levels of a sample of more than 180 UNC-Chapel Hill varsity athletes from 2004 to 2012; 85 percent of them were football and basketball players. Her findings: About 60 percent read at between a fourth-grade and an eighth-grade level. Nearly 10 percent read below a third-grade level. In sum, 70 percent were in no position to succeed academically at a college level.

Moreover, she has been demoted from her position as assistant director of student academic assistance and given an office in the basement telling students how many credits courses they need to graduate. She -- no surprise -- has filed a greivance.

[devildeac]

Wow.

In a written statement issued Wednesday, Jan. 8, UNC said of Willingham’s account of illiterate varsity athletes: “We do not believe that claim.” In other words, her employer accused Willingham of making it up. Why on earth would she do that?

"Willingham ... is always careful to break down UNC’s roughly 800-person varsity student-athlete population ... about 150 to 200 are underperforming—some of them badly underperforming. Most of the last group are playing football or men’s or women’s basketball."

"Willingham ... researched the reading levels of a sample of more than 180 UNC-Chapel Hill varsity athletes from 2004 to 2012; 85 percent of them were football and basketball players. Her findings: About 60 percent read at between a fourth-grade and an eighth-grade level. Nearly 10 percent read below a third-grade level. In sum, 70 percent were in no position to succeed academically at a college level.


Moreover, she has been demoted from her position as assistant director of student academic assistance and given an office in the basement telling students how many credits courses they need to graduate. She -- no surprise -- has filed a greivance.

I thought that might open some eyes even wider. Astounding.

[tbyers11]

Moreover, she has been demoted from her position as assistant director of student academic assistance and given an office in the basement telling students how many credits courses they need to graduate. She -- no surprise -- has filed a greivance.

Wow that is harsh. Did they take away her red Swingline stapler too? ;)

[BD80]

Wow that is harsh. Did they take away her red Swingline stapler too? ;)

Hmmm, yeah, that was because she didn't put the cover sheets on her TPS reports.

[OldPhiKap]

Wow that is harsh. Did they take away her red Swingline stapler too? ;)


Hmmm, yeah, that was because she didn't put the cover sheets on her TPS reports.

I just wonder if anyone will end up in ####~%%%% prison.

[77devil]

Wow.

In a written statement issued Wednesday, Jan. 8, UNC said of Willingham’s account of illiterate varsity athletes: “We do not believe that claim.” In other words, her employer accused Willingham of making it up. Why on earth would she do that?

"Willingham ... is always careful to break down UNC’s roughly 800-person varsity student-athlete population ... about 150 to 200 are underperforming—some of them badly underperforming. Most of the last group are playing football or men’s or women’s basketball."

"Willingham ... researched the reading levels of a sample of more than 180 UNC-Chapel Hill varsity athletes from 2004 to 2012; 85 percent of them were football and basketball players. Her findings: About 60 percent read at between a fourth-grade and an eighth-grade level. Nearly 10 percent read below a third-grade level. In sum, 70 percent were in no position to succeed academically at a college level.

Looks like they are circling the wagons in Chapel Hill. You would think the tenured faculty would be more outspoken but apart from the occasional voice such as quoted below they seem to be sheep.


"Smith has the best sort of self-interested motivation for making sense of what has happened on his campus: He’s writing a book about the whole mess, based in part on statistics and personal experiences proffered by UNC instructors assigned over the years to assist varsity athletes. To me that sounds like a page-turner—and even the basis of an HBO movie."

The UNC faculty rep for athletics quoted in the link below seems unperturbed however.

http://www.chron.com/sports/college/article/UNC-still-dealing-with-3-years-of-academic-scandal-5132212.php

[ncexnyc]

Pack Pride going into hyperdrive as there is a new Dan Kane article out tonight.

Mary Willingham has just fired a 16" salvo over Ol' Roy's bow. Claiming she will sit down with him and show him exactly who the player was that couldn't read. She also puts a major dent in the bogus, "I care so deeply for my players" routine. She claims he never once came to any of the sessions she held for these students.

Ball's in your court dude. Time to put up or shut up.

[BD80]

Looks like they are circling the wagons in Chapel Hill. You would think the tenured faculty would be more outspoken but apart from the occasional voice such as quoted below they seem to be sheep.



The UNC faculty rep for athletics quoted in the link below seems unperturbed however.

http://www.chron.com/sports/college/article/UNC-still-dealing-with-3-years-of-academic-scandal-5132212.php

"We evaluate students for admission and we decide whether the students are capable of succeeding academically at UNC. That's about as plain as I can make it."

So they make up "courses" so easy that even kids that can't read can pass, or even get As and Bs. unc has NO academic standards.

That's about as plain as I can make it.

[DukieInKansas]

It's not like the university is behind the auction - it's just some dude selling off some of Jordan's stuff. In the grand scheme of things related to the UNC scandal(s) - or is it Scandal Du Jour? - this just doesn't seem like any sort of big deal to me. Plus, the way the OP wrote it, he kinda made it sound like UNC was doing something here to divert people's attention, but I don't see that UNC has anything to do with it so it just seems out of place to me. Anyway, just my $.02

I don't think it is a big deal either. I just think it is funny that, given the academic dishonesty going on at unc, his diploma and transcript are up for auction.

[OldPhiKap]

Pack Pride going into hyperdrive as there is a new Dan Kane article out tonight.

Mary Willingham has just fired a 16" salvo over Ol' Roy's bow. Claiming she will sit down with him and show him exactly who the player was that couldn't read. She also puts a major dent in the bogus, "I care so deeply for my players" routine. She claims he never once came to any of the sessions she held for these students.

Ball's in your court dude. Time to put up or shut up.

Damn, this may drive Roy to refer to himself in the fifth person. Serious stuff.

[jipops]

Damning stuff here...

http://media2.newsobserver.com/smedia/2014/01/10/20/19/meXTu.So.156.pdf#storylink=relast

[oldnavy]

I thought that might open some eyes even wider. Astounding.

If in fact she has been demoted (not saying she hasn't just haven't seen anything official), this would be about the DUMBEST thing UNC could possibly do.

Basically they are inviting legal action that has the possibility of igniting a firestorm that until now was just a smoldering mess.

First, Roy says she is lying or more precisely that "he" doesn't believe her. I guess you could look at that as Roy is just an idiot, but I get the sense Roy is implying she is lying... either way, not good for UNC, because she obviously isn't lying. In fact she has called Ol Roy out and basically challenged him to take her on.... my guess is that Roy will shut up for awhile or just continue to turn the focus of this mess on himself and how difficult it has been on poor "Ol Roy".

I learned a long, long time ago that you do not seek vengeance on employee's for any reason when you are in a position of management. You can fire or take punitive action only after attempts to correct performance/behavior and only when it has been well documented that you did so.

To do anything as knee jerk or reactionary that could be taken as punishment is both unfair to the employee and basically stupid on the behalf of management.

That goes triple or quadruple in THIS case... geez, if this is true then UNC just did about the worst possible thing imaginable. Pride and arrogance is what will bring this all down on UNC's head if it happens. Too proud to believe their mess stinks, and too arrogant to think that they can be challenged.

Stand by for heavy seas....

[bbq-devil]

"Pride goes before destruction, a haughty spirit before a fall."

Oh and what a fall it will be. Pass me the Popcorn!!

[Indoor66]

If in fact she has been demoted (not saying she hasn't just haven't seen anything official), this would be about the DUMBEST thing UNC could possibly do.

Basically they are inviting legal action that has the possibility of igniting a firestorm that until now was just a smoldering mess.

First, Roy says she is lying or more precisely that "he" doesn't believe her. I guess you could look at that as Roy is just an idiot, but I get the sense Roy is implying she is lying... either way, not good for UNC, because she obviously isn't lying. In fact she has called Ol Roy out and basically challenged him to take her on.... my guess is that Roy will shut up for awhile or just continue to turn the focus of this mess on himself and how difficult it has been on poor "Ol Roy".

I learned a long, long time ago that you do not seek vengeance on employee's for any reason when you are in a position of management. You can fire or take punitive action only after attempts to correct performance/behavior and only when it has been well documented that you did so.

To do anything as knee jerk or reactionary that could be taken as punishment is both unfair to the employee and basically stupid on the behalf of management.

That goes triple or quadruple in THIS case... geez, if this is true then UNC just did about the worst possible thing imaginable. Pride and arrogance is what will bring this all down on UNC's head if it happens. Too proud to believe their mess stinks, and too arrogant to think that they can be challenged.

Stand by for heavy seas....

As was so aptly said: "Pride and arrogance goeth before the fall." Well said, oh oldnavy.

[cspan37421]

Damning stuff here...

http://media2.newsobserver.com/smedia/2014/01/10/20/19/meXTu.So.156.pdf#storylink=relast

Pretty damning. But even Ms. Willingham could stand a course in remedial English grammar. I know it's only an e-mail, but still, her first paragraph has a couple mistakes. One could just be a typo, but the other is the cringe-worthy use of "idea's" as a plural noun.

[oldnavy]

Not sure whether this has been linked here yet:

http://www.businessweek.com/articles/2014-01-10/unc-officials-lash-out-at-academic-fraud-whistleblower#r=hpf-s

The best I can gather from this article is that she was demoted after a review last spring??? I wonder why? It would be interesting to see on what grounds UNC made the decision to "demote" her. MW claims it was for speaking out earlier...

I wonder what paper trail she may have to support that claim?

Lots of info yet to come I suspect, this should be entertaining.

[roywhite]

Pretty damning. But even Ms. Willingham could stand a course in remedial English grammar. I know it's only an e-mail, but still, her first paragraph has a couple mistakes. One could just be a typo, but the other is the cringe-worthy use of "idea's" as a plural noun.

Of course, we should remember that she's just a UNC administrator, not a DBR poster. Standards are different.

[BD80]

Damning stuff here...

http://media2.newsobserver.com/smedia/2014/01/10/20/19/meXTu.So.156.pdf#storylink=relast

How does the NCAA keep ignoring this?

"Of the 183 students, 45 (about 24%) had UNC GPA’s under 2.0, thus putting
them at risk of academic disqualification. Ninety-four of the 183 students, over half, had GPA’s under
2.3. Keep in mind that the bogus system of eligibility - UNC's paper class system - was assisting these
players to stay on the court/field. That system no longer exists."

[77devil]

Damning stuff here...

http://media2.newsobserver.com/smedia/2014/01/10/20/19/meXTu.So.156.pdf#storylink=relast

Back in the day the paper shredders would be humming at UNC. But today those pesky emails never really disappear.

With the national media now seemingly focused on UNC as the narrative for systemic abuses in big time college sports and Dan Kane pursuing the story like a pit bull, I'm beginning to believe that the Heels won't weasel out of this mess.

[53n206]

Of course, we should remember that she's just a UNC administrator, not a DBR poster. Standards are different.

Could be she uses a voice recognition system. And didn't check for errors. Let's give her some space.

[devildeac]

How does the NCAA keep ignoring this?

"Of the 183 students, 45 (about 24%) had UNC GPA’s under 2.0, thus putting
them at risk of academic disqualification. Ninety-four of the 183 students, over half, had GPA’s under
2.3. Keep in mind that the bogus system of eligibility - UNC's paper class system - was assisting these
players to stay on the court/field. That system no longer exists."

You beat me to this quote by about 30 minutes. I just read that email and the same section caught my attention. Astounding.

Dan Kane's hammering away again this AM in the Raleigh N&O: Here's his latest:

http://www.newsobserver.com/2014/01/10/3522277/unc-whistleblower-stands-firm.html

Wonder if ol' roy and the athletics department at unc have cancelled their subscription/s to the N&O yet. :rolleyes:

[timmy c]

You beat me to this quote by about 30 minutes. I just read that email and the same section caught my attention. Astounding.

Dan Kane's hammering away again this AM in the Raleigh N&O: Here's his latest:

http://www.newsobserver.com/2014/01/10/3522277/unc-whistleblower-stands-firm.html

Wonder if ol' roy and the athletics department at unc have cancelled their subscription/s to the N&O yet. :rolleyes:

They can't cancel their subscription. If they did, they wouldn't know what is happening at their institution!

[ChrisP]

Back in the day the paper shredders would be humming at UNC. But today those pesky emails never really disappear.

With the national media now seemingly focused on UNC as the narrative for systemic abuses in big time college sports and Dan Kane pursuing the story like a pit bull, I'm beginning to believe that the Heels won't weasel out of this mess.

DUDE! Shhhhhh - you'll jinx it! :D

If there's one thing there's no shortage of in Cheater Hill, it's weasels!

[arnie]

Back in the day the paper shredders would be humming at UNC. But today those pesky emails never really disappear.

With the national media now seemingly focused on UNC as the narrative for systemic abuses in big time college sports and Dan Kane pursuing the story like a pit bull, I'm beginning to believe that the Heels won't weasel out of this mess.

An incredible summation of the Carolina fraud. Forget the NCAA, this email will likely be published through many media outlets; could see 60- minutes picking it up. How long will Roy and UNC admin continue to lie, deceive, pillage and hide? Would think some higher- up would remember Watergate and end all the deception now.

[mgtr]

I'm guessing that UNC's next move will be to state that "everybody does it."

[OldPhiKap]

You beat me to this quote by about 30 minutes. I just read that email and the same section caught my attention. Astounding.

Dan Kane's hammering away again this AM in the Raleigh N&O: Here's his latest:

http://www.newsobserver.com/2014/01/10/3522277/unc-whistleblower-stands-firm.html

Wonder if ol' roy and the athletics department at unc have cancelled their subscription/s to the N&O yet. :rolleyes:

Uh oh -- it says they're working on a full article for publication. This may be out there for a good long time . . . .

[moonpie23]

i am wavering, (slightly) in my FIRM belief that all of this still just rides off into the sunset……


as Newt said, in Aliens when told "these people are here to help you." she responded, "It won't make any difference"..



they're going to skate unless 60 min walks in, or the NCAA publicly announces their intention of a new (or extended) investigation.

[Reilly]

http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/10274561/michael-jordan-recruiting-letters-found-storage-locker-auction

[hudlow]

http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/10274561/michael-jordan-recruiting-letters-found-storage-locker-auction

I'd like to see a Duke Alum snatch this up for the sake of posterity.....:)

....and opportunistic display.

hud

[devildeac]

I'd like to see a Duke Alum snatch this up for the sake of posterity.....:)

....and opportunistic display.

hud

Or, in moonpie's case, for his posterior;):rolleyes: .

[Newton_14]

Damning stuff here...

http://media2.newsobserver.com/smedia/2014/01/10/20/19/meXTu.So.156.pdf#storylink=relast

Wow! Damning indeed! So UNC is full of lies. Ms Willingham had shared all of her data and findings to the new head of the committee charged with cleaning up the mess over there as far back as August 28 of this year! UNC has had her findings for months!!


For those that have not seen it, the link above shows an email from Willingham to Lissa Broome. Below is how she ends the email, speaking on the low performing UNC athlete's in Football and Basketball she states:


If they had applied to any NC Community College, they would have had to, prior to their full acceptance and starting a course of study, complete one to three semesters of developmental reading coursework. 20-25% of these students would have to complete a general competency course prior to the three semesters of reading. Of the 183 students, 45 (about 24%) had UNC GPA’s under 2.0, thus putting them at risk of academic disqualification. Ninety-four of the 183 students, over half, had GPA’s under 2.3. Keep in mind that the bogus system of eligibility - UNC's paper class system - was assisting theseplayers to stay on the court/field. That system no longer exists.