English Premier League 2013-2014

[luburch]

So with the English Premier League starting this weekend I thought it would be a good time to start a new thread for the upcoming season. I'm not sure how many people on here follow the PL, but I know there are a few. I think this season is shaping up to be one of the most unpredictable and exciting in recent memory.

The Favorites

Man City- City have been picked by a large number of pundits to win the league. Mancini is gone and so is the bad air surrounding him. In steps a terrific manager of Pellegrini set to reform the team who finished second last season. They have done good work in the transfer market bringing in Navas, Fernandinho, Jovetic and Negredo, to add to an already talented squad.

Chelsea- Chelsea also face the challenge of operating under a new manager with Jose Mourinho returning to the helm. I can't think of any signings they made this summer, but they continue to chase Wayne Rooney. They bring back a very talented squad with Mata and Hazard leading the way.

Man United- Funny that all three of the favorites have all had a manager change since the end of last season. Moyes moves from Everton to replace SAF in what seems an impossible task. United have struggled this transfer window, missing out on Fabregas and Thiago, but Kagawa should be settled in his second season in Manchester and RVP returns. The Rooney saga continues to leave a dark cloud over the camp.

The Chase Pack

Arsenal- Arsenal had another classic "Arsenal" summer in the fact that they made no new signings other than a young injury-prone Frenchman. The Arsenal camp did a fantastic job of offloading deadweight and are still in the hunt to sign Suarez and Gustavo. Cazorla looks to improve on an outstanding first campaign and Wilshere has had his first injury free pre-season in a long time.

Tottenham - Spurs have done a decent job in the summer market bringing in Paulinho and Soldado, but their season hinges on the fate of Bale. If he moves to Madrid, which seems likely, they are likely in for another season of 5th-6th.

The Surprises

West Ham- Big Sam is in charge for another campaign with the Hammers and it should be an interesting one. After finishing tenth last season, they brought Carroll in on a permanent deal and he looks to help them improve. With players like, Nolan, Vaz Te, and Jarvis they could surprise a few people this year.

Southampton- I was impressed with Southampton finishing 14th last season, because I thought they would surely be relegated. The Saints have been extremely active during the summer, making improvements to their current squad. They very likely could finish on the top half of the table.


It's hard to make full predictions when the transfer window is still open, but with the current squads here is how I season unfolding.

1. City- I think Pellegrini inherits a squad with something to prove after last season.
2. Chelsea- With Torres/Ba (I think Lukaku needs one more year to be completely ready) upfront I don't think they have enough to win the title. If they land Rooney then they very well could take it all.
3. United- Moyes first season at the helm could be a rough one, especially with the Rooney drama.
4. Arsenal- If they can add Suarez/Gustavo they could challenge for a title.
5. Tottenham- If they lose Bale they could slip even more.
6. Liverpool- Finished strong last season, need to get the Suarez situation sorted.
7. West Ham- Starting to fill out a quality squad.
8. Everton- Will miss having Moyes managing.
9. Swansea- Expect another mid-table finish.
10. West Brom- will miss having Lukaku
11. Southampton
12. Fulham
13. Newcastle
14. Aston Villa
15. Stoke
16. Cardiff
17. Sunderland
18. Norwich
19. Hull City
20. Crystal Palace

I'd love to hear how everyone else thinks this season will shake out and see your predictions!

[PSurprise]

Well, I follow ManU in the EPL, which makes me feel kind of bad in some ways, but when I was a teenager, they were playing in the first true soccer game I ever watched, and from then on, I've been following them. I think they've got all the pieces this year to win again, (they haven't lost anybody from last year-Rooney notwithstanding), and I like the way Zaha has been playing. I wish they could have picked up Fabregas. With him, I think they are a lock for a top-2, but I think you're right that they are probably going to finish 2 or 3 behind Chelsea and/or ManCity.

I haven't really found another team to root for, it's usually like Duke and UNC basketball, in which case I always root for Duke (ManU), and always root against UNC (Chelsea/ManCity). I used to like Spurs with Dempsey and I still have a little bit of a feeling for Tim and Everton, but otherwise, I'm mostly meh outside of ManU. I do hope that Jozy does well at Sunderland. Maybe that's a middle-of-the-pack team I can get behind.

[JohnGalt]

Is it worth merging this with the other thread in hopes of reviving a little non-WCQ soccer related discussion?

I know blazin will want to hear/speak about La Liga and the truth is that this year is a really interesting one in a number of ways. The coaching turnover - especially at big clubs - around Europe has been humongous, Ferguson leaving and Guardiola returning being the two largest, but far from isolated examples...Pep's decisions will be particularly interesting at Munich since he is inheriting probably the most accomplished German side of all time. But he does have a philosophy, after all. I imagine his and Klopp's press conferences will be particularly amusing.

For Americans, Stoke city is turning into the new Fulham and as someone before alluded, Sunderland has to pleased with its incoming striker as Jozy appears to be on the form of his life, Bedoya is in France, Johannsson is Jozy's replacement, Brooks in the Bundesliga with Jones, Parkhurst, and Fabian...Bradley's in Serie A.

Idno...thought it was worth a shot since it seems there is plenty of discussion to be had.

[blazindw]

Is it worth merging this with the other thread in hopes of reviving a little non-WCQ soccer related discussion?

I know blazin will want to hear/speak about La Liga and the truth is that this year is a really interesting one in a number of ways. The coaching turnover - especially at big clubs - around Europe has been humongous, Ferguson leaving and Guardiola returning being the two largest, but far from isolated examples...Pep's decisions will be particularly interesting at Munich since he is inheriting probably the most accomplished German side of all time. But he does have a philosophy, after all. I imagine his and Klopp's press conferences will be particularly amusing.

For Americans, Stoke city is turning into the new Fulham and as someone before alluded, Sunderland has to pleased with its incoming striker as Jozy appears to be on the form of his life, Bedoya is in France, Johannsson is Jozy's replacement, Brooks in the Bundesliga with Jones, Parkhurst, and Fabian...Bradley's in Serie A.

Idno...thought it was worth a shot since it seems there is plenty of discussion to be had.

I wouldn't mind combining everything into a single thread at this point. There are only 4 more matchdays for CONCACAF WCQs before the playoff and the draw. But, with discussions of EPL, La Liga, MLS and other soccer matches from around the world, there will be plenty of discussion. What we can do is create separate threads later on for the World Cup draw and then the World Cup.

What say you all?

[JohnGalt]

I wouldn't mind combining everything into a single thread at this point. There are only 4 more matchdays for CONCACAF WCQs before the playoff and the draw. But, with discussions of EPL, La Liga, MLS and other soccer matches from around the world, there will be plenty of discussion. What we can do is create separate threads later on for the World Cup draw and then the World Cup.

What say you all?

Yea I guess I didn't articulate that well, but I meant getting a "general" soccer discussion thread going again since, like you said, there's not a ton of WCQ to go and the Spanish and English leagues get going tomorrow.

[NSDukeFan]

Well, I follow ManU in the EPL, which makes me feel kind of bad in some ways, but when I was a teenager, they were playing in the first true soccer game I ever watched, and from then on, I've been following them. I think they've got all the pieces this year to win again, (they haven't lost anybody from last year-Rooney notwithstanding), and I like the way Zaha has been playing. I wish they could have picked up Fabregas. With him, I think they are a lock for a top-2, but I think you're right that they are probably going to finish 2 or 3 behind Chelsea and/or ManCity.

I haven't really found another team to root for, it's usually like Duke and UNC basketball, in which case I always root for Duke (ManU), and always root against UNC (Chelsea/ManCity). I used to like Spurs with Dempsey and I still have a little bit of a feeling for Tim and Everton, but otherwise, I'm mostly meh outside of ManU. I do hope that Jozy does well at Sunderland. Maybe that's a middle-of-the-pack team I can get behind.

I am struggling with the ManU-Rooney saga as I root for ManU and Rooney is my favorite player. I wish he would stay and be happy, but it doesn't sound like that will happen, so it may be better if he is off to Chelsea. That, of course, leaves Chelsea as a much more likely champ or top 2 finisher.

[burnspbesq]

As of today, Time Warner subscribers cannot access NBC Sports Live Extra.

Have I mentioned recently how much I hate Time Warner?

[OldPhiKap]

I wouldn't mind combining everything into a single thread at this point. There are only 4 more matchdays for CONCACAF WCQs before the playoff and the draw. But, with discussions of EPL, La Liga, MLS and other soccer matches from around the world, there will be plenty of discussion. What we can do is create separate threads later on for the World Cup draw and then the World Cup.

What say you all?

Oy oy oy!

[Tommac]

Does anyone know which Direct TV channel will be carrying the Premier League games? I get an NBC Sorts Network channel on #220 but I'm not sure that is the specific channel that the Premier League will be on.

[awhom111]

Does anyone know which Direct TV channel will be carrying the Premier League games? I get an NBC Sorts Network channel on #220 but I'm not sure that is the specific channel that the Premier League will be on.

Most of the games will be on 220 (The early game plus Arsenal-Aston Villa tomorrow, the two Sunday games, and the Monday game). Norwich-Everton is on 491, Sunderland-Fulham is on 492, West Ham Cardiff is on 493, and West Brom-Southampton is on 494. The late game tomorrow will be on your local NBC affiliate.

[blazindw]

Yea I guess I didn't articulate that well, but I meant getting a "general" soccer discussion thread going again since, like you said, there's not a ton of WCQ to go and the Spanish and English leagues get going tomorrow.

We've had separate soccer threads in the past and they eventually get merged as the discussions start to flow between each other. We can always create one-off threads and then link them back in. But, asking us to keep 2-3 threads active is hard work ;)

On another note, happy start of the EPL AND La Liga seasons today to everyone!

[A-Tex Devil]

This kind of access to EPL is beyond cool. I hope it catches on.

[luburch]

Some atrocious calls by the ref in the Arsenal/Villa game.

[blazindw]

These games have been spectacular thus far today. Leading off with Liverpool-Stoke was pure excitement from start to finish.

[burnspbesq]

The promotion chase is on. My boys are all alone in first after three weeks. Nine points, no goals conceded. C'mon you Reds!

[awhom111]

The promotion chase is on. My boys are all alone in first after three weeks. Nine points, no goals conceded. C'mon you Reds!

My club is a little bit far from thinking about promotion right now. I think we are in a death spiral. I just do not know whether it will be a quick one or the slow variety.

[killerleft]

Nothing more need be said.

[JohnGalt]

These games have been spectacular thus far today. Leading off with Liverpool-Stoke was pure excitement from start to finish.

The absolute best part about that game is that Liverpool DO NOT win it last year, the year before, or the year before that. That is exactly how we have played for several years now...overwhelming possession and chances created only to run into a keeper playing out of his mind...until the final few minutes when either a defensive error or quick counter results in the 88th minute stomach punch...and we drop 2 or 3 points.

But it didn't happen and we have won the first league opener at Anfield for the first time since 2001-2002. Keep it up you Reds.

YNWA,
...JG

[JohnGalt]

Manchester City are loaded. Pure and simple. Did anyone watch them shellack Newcastle today?

Navas and Fernandinho were two of the three best players. And the third was Edin Dzeko, the man that most thought would be the odd striker out...which isn't necessarily an insult when Aguero, Negredo, and Jovetic are also in the squad. But Negredo barely saw the field and Jovetic didn't make the bench (there's probably a reason for that). Anyhow, both Navas and Fernandinho look to be excellent buys that really round out City's squad.

Chelsea/City should be some serious clashes of talent this year.

[blazindw]

Manchester City are loaded. Pure and simple. Did anyone watch them shellack Newcastle today?

Navas and Fernandinho were two of the three best players. And the third was Edin Dzeko, the man that most thought would be the odd striker out...which isn't necessarily an insult when Aguero, Negredo, and Jovetic are also in the squad. But Negredo barely saw the field and Jovetic didn't make the bench (there's probably a reason for that). Anyhow, both Navas and Fernandinho look to be excellent buys that really round out City's squad.

Chelsea/City should be some serious clashes of talent this year.

Pelligrini is used to having plenty of useful options, which he did well at Real and again at Malaga. He'll be able to keep almost everyone happy. Plus, with the League Cup, FA Cup and Champions League, all of them are going to get their playing time. But they are going to be scary good. Jesus Navas is the real deal and is going to flourish this year.

[OldPhiKap]

Watching UEFA Dinamo Zagreb v. Austria Vienna. Brutally ugly.

[burnspbesq]

Barring some unimaginable catastrophe, Spurs and Swansea will be joining Wigan in the group stage of the Europa League.

Dinamo Tblisi 0-5 Tottenahm

Swansea 5-1 Petrolul Ploiesti

[OldPhiKap]

Arsenal starting now. Fenerbache is an unknown to me.

[JohnGalt]

Arsenal starting now. Fenerbache is an unknown to me.

Fener is one of the largest clubs in Turkey and maintains a heated rivalry with Galatasaray...and to a lesser extent with Besiktas. I have a friend from Istanbul that is as passionately Yellow Canary as anyone for any team I've ever met. Because of him and Dirk (AND because I'm beyond sick of Arsenal) I was definitely hoping they would get a result, but unfortunately it was pretty ugly. Fener looked terrible. Raul Meireles in particular disappointed and Kuyt looked his age. Too bad.

As an aside, Fenerbahce organized an interesting anti-hooliganism move a couple years ago by banning all men from the stadium. Only women/children were allowed in:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/14998237

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1norC4txlTc

[duke74]

Fener is one of the largest clubs in Turkey and maintains a heated rivalry with Galatasaray...and to a lesser extent with Besiktas. I have a friend from Istanbul that is as passionately Yellow Canary as anyone for any team I've ever met. Because of him and Dirk (AND because I'm beyond sick of Arsenal) I was definitely hoping they would get a result, but unfortunately it was pretty ugly. Fener looked terrible. Raul Meireles in particular disappointed and Kuyt looked his age. Too bad.

As an aside, Fenerbahce organized an interesting anti-hooliganism move a couple years ago by banning all men from the stadium. Only women/children were allowed in:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/14998237

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1norC4txlTc

Not criticizing, but why the animosity towards my Gunners? Anything in particular? (I think you follow the Reds if I remember previous posts...) I'm sick of them too, but only over their transfer inactivity under Wenger. Enough of throwing the proverbial spaghetti against the transfer "wall" and seeing what sticks.

[JohnGalt]

Not criticizing, but why the animosity towards my Gunners? Anything in particular? (I think you follow the Reds if I remember previous posts...) I'm sick of them too, but only over their transfer inactivity under Wenger. Enough of throwing the proverbial spaghetti against the transfer "wall" and seeing what sticks.

I'm just a little sick of the press...which isn't overly fair to you all, I know. The stagnation surrounding the club is a little annoying to me (as a Liverpool fan) because you all have such a tremendous advantage over us and Spurs in terms of matchday revenue...and for whatever reason Wenger has decided that he's above spending real money to try and turn Arsenal into a genuine league title contender. I refuse to believe that he would take all the abuse he is if the owners were being dishonest about their willingness to free up funds. He had to know that 40.000001 million pounds was going to be thrown aside by Liverpool and the half-attempts at Higuain and Rooney were nothing but just that...half attempts. Excuses for inactivity.

There used to be a saying "1-0 to the Arsenal" that poked fun at how boring Arsenal was to watch because of their ultra-defensive, reactive tactics. Well, Wenger changed that but has now replaced it with an entirely new and altogether worse sort of boring.

[awhom111]

Fener is one of the largest clubs in Turkey and maintains a heated rivalry with Galatasaray...and to a lesser extent with Besiktas. I have a friend from Istanbul that is as passionately Yellow Canary as anyone for any team I've ever met. Because of him and Dirk (AND because I'm beyond sick of Arsenal) I was definitely hoping they would get a result, but unfortunately it was pretty ugly. Fener looked terrible. Raul Meireles in particular disappointed and Kuyt looked his age. Too bad.

As an aside, Fenerbahce organized an interesting anti-hooliganism move a couple years ago by banning all men from the stadium. Only women/children were allowed in:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/14998237

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1norC4txlTc

I have not sat down and actually tried to rank rivalries, but Fenerbahce-Galatasaray has to be right up there, especially given how it extends into other sports.

[luburch]

I'm just a little sick of the press...which isn't overly fair to you all, I know. The stagnation surrounding the club is a little annoying to me (as a Liverpool fan) because you all have such a tremendous advantage over us and Spurs in terms of matchday revenue...and for whatever reason Wenger has decided that he's above spending real money to try and turn Arsenal into a genuine league title contender. I refuse to believe that he would take all the abuse he is if the owners were being dishonest about their willingness to free up funds. He had to know that 40.000001 million pounds was going to be thrown aside by Liverpool and the half-attempts at Higuain and Rooney were nothing but just that...half attempts. Excuses for inactivity.

There used to be a saying "1-0 to the Arsenal" that poked fun at how boring Arsenal was to watch because of their ultra-defensive, reactive tactics. Well, Wenger changed that but has now replaced it with an entirely new and altogether worse sort of boring.

The only reason they bid 40.000001 million pounds is because they were given bad information about a clause in Suarez's contract.

[OldPhiKap]

Fener is one of the largest clubs in Turkey and maintains a heated rivalry with Galatasaray...and to a lesser extent with Besiktas. I have a friend from Istanbul that is as passionately Yellow Canary as anyone for any team I've ever met. Because of him and Dirk (AND because I'm beyond sick of Arsenal) I was definitely hoping they would get a result, but unfortunately it was pretty ugly. Fener looked terrible. Raul Meireles in particular disappointed and Kuyt looked his age. Too bad.

As an aside, Fenerbahce organized an interesting anti-hooliganism move a couple years ago by banning all men from the stadium. Only women/children were allowed in:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/14998237

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1norC4txlTc

Appreciate the response. I enjoy futbol but I am still on the learning curve regarding Euro club teams beyond the obvious ones. Glad the level of tv exposure has gone up, more fun to watch than baseball by far these days (which was my favorite to watch for decades).

[duke74]

I'm just a little sick of the press...which isn't overly fair to you all, I know. The stagnation surrounding the club is a little annoying to me (as a Liverpool fan) because you all have such a tremendous advantage over us and Spurs in terms of matchday revenue...and for whatever reason Wenger has decided that he's above spending real money to try and turn Arsenal into a genuine league title contender. I refuse to believe that he would take all the abuse he is if the owners were being dishonest about their willingness to free up funds. He had to know that 40.000001 million pounds was going to be thrown aside by Liverpool and the half-attempts at Higuain and Rooney were nothing but just that...half attempts. Excuses for inactivity.

There used to be a saying "1-0 to the Arsenal" that poked fun at how boring Arsenal was to watch because of their ultra-defensive, reactive tactics. Well, Wenger changed that but has now replaced it with an entirely new and altogether worse sort of boring.

Your analysis is spot on. You sound like a Gooner! :). We're tired of inactivity, or worse, being a farm team for the teams willing to spend for our players...RVP, Cesc, Nasri (still a jerk though).... And when we spend on established players (not babies), they don't work out....geesh.

[luburch]

Arsenal seem to have bounced back nicely. Up 2-0 on Fulham at half.

[JohnGalt]

I have not sat down and actually tried to rank rivalries, but Fenerbahce-Galatasaray has to be right up there, especially given how it extends into other sports.

As far as "proper" soccer derbies go...meaning true soccer derbies where both clubs actually play in the same city (i.e. NOT Barca/Madrid, Liverpool/United, etc) I think you'd have to say in no particular order it's:

Celtic/Rangers
Boca/River
Fenerbahce/Galatasaray

I admittedly don't know as much about Fla-Flu, anything in Sao Paolo, or Nacional/Peñarol, but I imagine some devoted fans of those clubs would take exception with my list above. My perception of Inter/Milan is that because (a) they both use the same stadium and (b) the existence of Juve in North Italy (thus creating more of a North Italian derby) that il Derby della Madonnina is not quite all that it could be. But, again, I imagine some Milanese would disagree vehemently.

Benfica/Sporting, Ajax/Feyenoord....Cases can be made for many which is why the sport so great!

YNWA,
...JG

[duke74]

Arsenal seem to have bounced back nicely. Up 2-0 on Fulham at half.

3-1 full time. 1 by Giroud, 2 by Podo. AV still hurts but at least a nice win at Craven Cottage.

[OldPhiKap]

Tough day for Altidore, I thought Sunderland was going to hang on for the win. Entertaining finish though.

[blazindw]

As far as "proper" soccer derbies go...meaning true soccer derbies where both clubs actually play in the same city (i.e. NOT Barca/Madrid, Liverpool/United, etc) I think you'd have to say in no particular order it's:

Celtic/Rangers
Boca/River
Fenerbahce/Galatasaray

I admittedly don't know as much about Fla-Flu, anything in Sao Paolo, or Nacional/Peñarol, but I imagine some devoted fans of those clubs would take exception with my list above. My perception of Inter/Milan is that because (a) they both use the same stadium and (b) the existence of Juve in North Italy (thus creating more of a North Italian derby) that il Derby della Madonnina is not quite all that it could be. But, again, I imagine some Milanese would disagree vehemently.

Benfica/Sporting, Ajax/Feyenoord....Cases can be made for many which is why the sport so great!

YNWA,
...JG

The Madrid derby is very intense, though obviously overshadowed by El Clasico.

[burnspbesq]

I'd say Spurs/Arsenal, United/City, and Liverpool/Everton all belong on that list.

Nottingham Forest/Notts County has never blossomed into a proper rivalry, because the clubs haven't been in the same division in at least 50 years.

Someday (although probably not in any of our lifetimes) the Goats will be good enough to give the Galaxy a game on a regular basis. When that happens, the LA derby will get interesting. Until then, Sounders/Timbers will remain the best that MLS has to offer. Sounders have a shot at breaking the league's single-game attendance record on Sunday night. The current record of over 69K was set by NY and LA on the league's very first weekend in 1996. I think I still have the t-shirt around somewhere.

[blazindw]

I'd say Spurs/Arsenal, United/City, and Liverpool/Everton all belong on that list.

Nottingham Forest/Notts County has never blossomed into a proper rivalry, because the clubs haven't been in the same division in at least 50 years.

Someday (although probably not in any of our lifetimes) the Goats will be good enough to give the Galaxy a game on a regular basis. When that happens, the LA derby will get interesting. Until then, Sounders/Timbers will remain the best that MLS has to offer. Sounders have a shot at breaking the league's single-game attendance record on Sunday night. The current record of over 69K was set by NY and LA on the league's very first weekend in 1996. I think I still have the t-shirt around somewhere.

I'd argue that the DC/NY rivalry matches the Portland-Seattle one at the very least. But, I know JG was focusing on the city derbies and not rivalries between cities.

[TheTrain]

As far as "proper" soccer derbies go...meaning true soccer derbies where both clubs actually play in the same city (i.e. NOT Barca/Madrid, Liverpool/United, etc) I think you'd have to say in no particular order it's:

Celtic/Rangers
Boca/River
Fenerbahce/Galatasaray

I admittedly don't know as much about Fla-Flu, anything in Sao Paolo, or Nacional/Peñarol, but I imagine some devoted fans of those clubs would take exception with my list above. My perception of Inter/Milan is that because (a) they both use the same stadium and (b) the existence of Juve in North Italy (thus creating more of a North Italian derby) that il Derby della Madonnina is not quite all that it could be. But, again, I imagine some Milanese would disagree vehemently.

Benfica/Sporting, Ajax/Feyenoord....Cases can be made for many which is why the sport so great!

YNWA,
...JG

As a diehard Ajax supporter, Feyenoord is in Rotterdam not Amsterdam
Der Classiker is still a great rivalry though

[luburch]

Deadline day. Things could get interesting.

[burnspbesq]

Deadline day. Things could get interesting.

Way beyond interesting. After the dust settles, the story of the day is going to be the unauthorized impostors who showed up in Bilbao and tried to negotiate the transfer of Ander Herrera from Athletic to Man United. Just too bizarre for words.

In other news:

The Bale deal finally goes through, but Real seem to feel they have to lie about the price in order not to hurt CR7's feelings. News flash: the dude can read English, and the London papers will get the facts right.

Mesut Ozil is a Gunner. Gooners, go wild. You're going to love this guy.

The best hair in European football now calls Old Trafford home. Toffs also offload Victor Anichebe, but they get Romelu Lukaku, James McCarthy, and Gareth Barry as reinforcements. Net-net, that looks like an improvement, even though I love The Best Hair's game. (aside: now we know why MLS worked so hard to get the Donovan deal done last week; if he had remained unsigned, Everton probably would have come after him, and he might have gone).

Liverpool and QPR spend like a busload of Japanese tourists on Rodeo Drive. We'll see whether they spent wisely. QPR's haul includes the second-best hair in England, Benoit Assou-Ekotto from Spurs.

[JohnGalt]

Mesut Ozil is a Gunner. Gooners, go wild. You're going to love this guy.

In my opinion, this is the biggest news of the window. Other teams may have filled needs more directly, but Mesut Ozil coming to the EPL is perhaps the biggest transfer of its kind (i.e. incoming) in a long, long time. And it is supremely ironic that it is the Arsenal that have broken the EPL transfer record (and obviously shattered their own) to bring him in. I'm going to be frank here and I think this is sweet irony hitting me over the head after my Arsenal rant further up the thread: Mesut Ozil is my favorite player in the world. By most metrics, he is the most creative player in Europe. The sabermetrics guys have begun to be able to quantify his influence on the game more concretely than just throwing assist numbers around (which Ozil excels at) and he's at (or near) the top of Key Passes per 90 in all of Europe and created nearly 30 more chances than anyone on Madrid last year. There's a reason Ronaldo's pissed he's gone. He's 24 and his numbers have been improving on a yearly basis.

I'm excited to watch Ozil play more regularly in the EPL (since I watch it more than La Liga), but upset that it will be for Arsenal. Fewer players manipulate pockets of space to receive and distribute as effectively as Mesut Ozil and I can only hope he's off for the Liverpool matches. "Playing between the lines" is phrase used too often, but I think it is what makes Ozil such a devastating creator. Watch how many times he receives the ball and is positioned perfectly in between several defenders.

I was told Ancelotti simply prefers the Isco/Modric combination to Ozil which certainly seems plausible, even if it's a sort of different operation. Modric was fantastic for spurs a couple seasons ago and the little I've watched of Isco showed me he's a fantastic talent...I just still can't believe that they let someone like Ozil go. He's [I]entering his prime and already one of the top players in the world.

Maybe a rundown from the resident Madridista?

[duke74]

I'm excited to watch Ozil play more regularly in the EPL (since I watch it more than La Liga), but upset that it will be for Arsenal.

May I respectfully disagree? :). I am thrilled with the move. This should give us a great passing midfield and help up front. I am still wary of our defensive strength, but maybe the Spurs result is a portent of things to come? (I don't pretend to know anywhere as much as the folks on this thread, but just love my Gunners, and Juve for that matter.)

[blazindw]

In my opinion, this is the biggest news of the window. Other teams may have filled needs more directly, but Mesut Ozil coming to the EPL is perhaps the biggest transfer of its kind (i.e. incoming) in a long, long time. And it is supremely ironic that it is the Arsenal that have broken the EPL transfer record (and obviously shattered their own) to bring him in. I'm going to be frank here and I think this is sweet irony hitting me over the head after my Arsenal rant further up the thread: Mesut Ozil is my favorite player in the world. By most metrics, he is the most creative player in Europe. The sabermetrics guys have begun to be able to quantify his influence on the game more concretely than just throwing assist numbers around (which Ozil excels at) and he's at (or near) the top of Key Passes per 90 in all of Europe and created nearly 30 more chances than anyone on Madrid last year. There's a reason Ronaldo's pissed he's gone. He's 24 and his numbers have been improving on a yearly basis.

I'm excited to watch Ozil play more regularly in the EPL (since I watch it more than La Liga), but upset that it will be for Arsenal. Fewer players manipulate pockets of space to receive and distribute as effectively as Mesut Ozil and I can only hope he's off for the Liverpool matches. "Playing between the lines" is phrase used too often, but I think it is what makes Ozil such a devastating creator. Watch how many times he receives the ball and is positioned perfectly in between several defenders.

I was told Ancelotti simply prefers the Isco/Modric combination to Ozil which certainly seems plausible, even if it's a sort of different operation. Modric was fantastic for spurs a couple seasons ago and the little I've watched of Isco showed me he's a fantastic talent...I just still can't believe that they let someone like Ozil go. He's [I]entering his prime and already one of the top players in the world.

Maybe a rundown from the resident Madridista?

I am mad we got rid of Ozil. All of the praise you mention is exactly what we feel and more. There's a reason why when Bale was introduced, Uncle Flo had to silence the crowd that was chanting "Ozil no se vende!" ("Don't sell Ozil!") Selling him for 50M euros is a ton of money, but he's worth every bit more. He has more assists than anyone in Europe the past 3 seasons, and it's not even close. In the end, Isco was preferred (and he's been worth every penny thus far) and with Bale entering the mix, there was no room in the starting lineup for Ozil even out of position on the right where he had been playing before Bale's arrival. I wished we had kept him (and Higuain...both were among my favorites on the team).

I think Ozil's going to flourish in the EPL and can't wait to watch him play for Arsenal. Kind of shocked it was them that broke the bank to get him.

[JohnGalt]

I am mad we got rid of Ozil. All of the praise you mention is exactly what we feel and more. There's a reason why when Bale was introduced, Uncle Flo had to silence the crowd that was chanting "Ozil no se vende!" ("Don't sell Ozil!") Selling him for 50M euros is a ton of money, but he's worth every bit more. He has more assists than anyone in Europe the past 3 seasons, and it's not even close. In the end, Isco was preferred (and he's been worth every penny thus far) and with Bale entering the mix, there was no room in the starting lineup for Ozil even out of position on the right where he had been playing before Bale's arrival. I wished we had kept him (and Higuain...both were among my favorites on the team).

I think Ozil's going to flourish in the EPL and can't wait to watch him play for Arsenal. Kind of shocked it was them that broke the bank to get him.

Only 10 minutes into his English career and Mesut Özil takes a lovely touch to slide it across the box for the first of many assists to come.

I am so jealous.

YNWA.

[A-Tex Devil]

Only 10 minutes into his English career and Mesut Özil takes a lovely touch to slide it across the box for the first of many assists to come.

I am so jealous.

YNWA.

Jozy absolutely owned Sagna and should have had a goal, but the ref, wrongly, didn't allow the advantage. Sunderland has no one to get Jozy the ball, but he looked better when Gardner came in.

[JohnGalt]

Jozy absolutely owned Sagna and should have had a goal, but the ref, wrongly, didn't allow the advantage. Sunderland has no one to get Jozy the ball, but he looked better when Gardner came in.

That really was terribly managed and Ramsey's goal shortly afterward essentially ended the game. Di Canio and Jozy have plenty of reason to be furious over that.

[burnspbesq]

There is no truth--I repeat, no truth-- to the rumor that Karl Hess was the referee for Sunderland-Arsenal.

[OldPhiKap]

There is no truth--I repeat, no truth-- to the rumor that Karl Hess was the referee for Sunderland-Arsenal.

Although does anyone really know what Lenny Wirtz was doing then?

[burnspbesq]

English teams went 5-1-1 in the opening week of play.

ManU, Man City, and Arsenal all won in the Champions League. Chelsea stunk up the joint and lost at home to FC Basel. I will be wearing my FCB hat, a souvenir of a long-ago trip to St. Jakob's Park, all weekend.

In the Europa League, Spurs cruised at home and Wigan ground out a draw on the road. In arguably the biggest surprise of the week, Swansea rolled into the Mestalla and blew away Valencia.

League play resumes tomorrow. Manchester derby on Sunday.

[throatybeard]

My wife, who can probably identify two soccer players in the entire world (the other is Miroslav Klose), refers to Özil as "Turkish Stewie."

[OldPhiKap]

WSJ had a funny article today on the reception of the Premier League in America (written by an Englishman) -- worth looking for. Last page IIRC.

[JohnGalt]

English teams went 5-1-1 in the opening week of play.

ManU, Man City, and Arsenal all won in the Champions League. Chelsea stunk up the joint and lost at home to FC Basel. I will be wearing my FCB hat, a souvenir of a long-ago trip to St. Jakob's Park, all weekend.

In the Europa League, Spurs cruised at home and Wigan ground out a draw on the road. In arguably the biggest surprise of the week, Swansea rolled into the Mestalla and blew away Valencia.

League play resumes tomorrow. Manchester derby on Sunday.


I found it pretty annoying that the Chelsea/Basel and Barca/Ajax games were played over the Dortmund/Napoli match. Granted, Chelsea/Basel turned into quite a match even though the storyline was STILL about Chelsea (and how poor they were...versus Basel's efficiency)...and Barca/Ajax has the historical context with the added tidbit of Bojan's return to the Camp Nou...but, come on guys, Dortmund/Napoli was definitely the best matchup of the day. First place in Italy vs first place in Germany. Rafa's system of narrow efficiency vs Klopp's energetic counterattacking. Both managers regarded as preeminent tacticians. I was posted up at my favorite little BYOB cigar bar ready to watch a different kind of game for once and got stuck watching Barca pummel Ajax and then Mou try and organize 9 different managers' worth of signings. I guess whining about what brings in the most money is really a pointless endeavor, but...well...that's my soapbox.

Citeh really needs to beat United this weekend or Pellegrini will be under pressure EARLY.

[A-Tex Devil]

Looks like Platini and Blatter were paid more than I realized --- UEFA signing off on the 2022 World Cup being (http://msn.foxsports.com/foxsoccer/worldcup/story/european-countries-vote-for-2022-winter-world-cup-in-qatar-091913) in the winter.

Let's set aside the logistical miracle required to allow for the world cup to work in Qatar, as I'm sure they will pull in the "cheap" (read indentured) labor to pull it off. But let's think about the aggrieved parties....

- Every club that plays an August to June schedule who may have to start earlier, and play later, to allow 8 weeks off, creating issues not just for the 2021-2022 season, but 2022-2023.
- Every country cup, which may have to compact its schedule
- Every continental club cup which may need to invite less teams, play less games, etc.
- Fox, who spent $1B on the world cup to see half their investment compete against the NFL and basketball
- The 2022 Winter Olympics, potentially.
- The World Cup qualifying schedule, assuming they are talking January 2022.

Oh.... I'm sure there is more. So why again was Qatar a good idea?

[Deslok]

Interesting news indeed. But note that none of the details were really discussed, where significant differences will come into play(have it post Christmas and top clubs will be ticked off about major changes to Champions league structure and Winter Olympics are conflicting, have it before Christmas and many domestic leagues are unhappy with major disruption of their league, etc). One major detail that will play out, is that I'm pretty sure that Fox made their $1 bn bid for a summer World Cup and they have the right to reopen the contract which could be interesting(and could cost FIFA 3-400 million).

Interesting times indeed.

[throatybeard]

If Fox is covering the 2022 World Cup, does that mean we'll get to see a lot of Erin Andrews?

[burnspbesq]

If Fox is covering the 2022 World Cup, does that mean we'll get to see a lot of Erin Andrews?

Fox will almost certainly be sharing resources and production costs with Sky, so we're more likely to get some right-wing misogynist's idea of a saucy Brit.

[gus]

Looks like Platini and Blatter were paid more than I realized --- UEFA signing off on the 2022 World Cup being (http://msn.foxsports.com/foxsoccer/worldcup/story/european-countries-vote-for-2022-winter-world-cup-in-qatar-091913) in the winter.

Let's set aside the logistical miracle required to allow for the world cup to work in Qatar, as I'm sure they will pull in the "cheap" (read indentured) labor to pull it off. But let's think about the aggrieved parties....

- Every club that plays an August to June schedule who may have to start earlier, and play later, to allow 8 weeks off, creating issues not just for the 2021-2022 season, but 2022-2023.
- Every country cup, which may have to compact its schedule
- Every continental club cup which may need to invite less teams, play less games, etc.
- Fox, who spent $1B on the world cup to see half their investment compete against the NFL and basketball
- The 2022 Winter Olympics, potentially.
- The World Cup qualifying schedule, assuming they are talking January 2022.

Oh.... I'm sure there is more. So why again was Qatar a good idea?

Excellent question. What's worse, playing the Worldcup in 130 degree heat, or distrupting nearly every other soccer related event for a span of a year? I still don't know how Qatar won the bid*.





* yes I do.

[burnspbesq]

There was some delightful football this weekend. Swansea-Arsenal and Sunderland-Liverpool were immensely watchable. Spurs-Chelsea was two evenly matched teams going at each other with 2x4s and brass knuckles. West Brom richly deserved its win at Old Trafford.

Shame that the weekend had to end with a horrifically bad call by an assistant referee that cost the Galaxy a deserved point.

[duke74]

There was some delightful football this weekend. Swansea-Arsenal and Sunderland-Liverpool were immensely watchable. Spurs-Chelsea was two evenly matched teams going at each other with 2x4s and brass knuckles. West Brom richly deserved its win at Old Trafford.

Shame that the weekend had to end with a horrifically bad call by an assistant referee that cost the Galaxy a deserved point.

As a Gooner, I loved this weekend. Both Mans lose and we beat Swansea in an exciting game. Both sides passed well and controlled the ball. I am nowhere near the expert that others on this thread are, but to me, it was a well played game..punch...counterpunch, with a late Swansea goal making it interesting.

Ozil didn't seem on his game, but others played well. (BTW, when did I miss the Gunners crossing the Maginot line EASTWARD and becoming German-dominated vs French? Very interesting evolution...Per, Mesut, Serge Gnabry...) With Wilshere, Ramsey, Gnabry, Theo and others so young, unless we (continue) to lose developed/ing players, the future is way brighter than a year or so ago.

(And my other side, Juve, also won the Turin Derby v Torino.)

[JohnGalt]

1. Arsenal
2. Liverpool
3. Spurs
4. Chelsea
5. Soton
6. Citeh
...
13. United

How many of you all had this at the end of September?

As a Liverpool supporter, the flexibility in Rodgers' system(s!) has been the nicest surprise. That, and the Alpha & the KolOmega, Kolo Toure, of course.

The 3-5-2 we've used the last two games has been interesting to watch in that it semi-solves the injury issues, our abundance of CBs, and how to pair Suarez and Sturridge up front. Coutinho's absence continues to hurt though...Moses looks awkward in the hole and I suppose Luis Alberto isn't quite ready for the job. The Lucas/Gerrard double pivot is still not gelling either. I don't understand why Rodgers is so reluctant to push Gerrard - a proven goal-scorer/creator - further up the field. Something is going to change this weekend though because Lucas is out via yellow-card accumulation. I'm hoping Henderson gets pushed inside and one of the teenagers - Sterling/Ibe - gets a run out on the wing.

Either way, the EPL is as wide open as I can remember it. Odds are City and Chelsea's new managers will continue to learn and massage their teams in order to find the right combinations. Their top 18s are clearly the best squads though. Arsenal's top 11 is probably close, but I imagine with all the competitions that fatigue/injuries will catch up with them. It will be interesting to see what Moyes does. The truth is that the way he's lining up is awfully Hodgsonian...caution at Everton is one thing but United supporters won't stand for it just like Liverpool's wouldn't stand for Roy's.

------------
In other news...Atleti beat Madrid in the league derby for the first time in 14 years. Diego Costa continues to play superbly for Diego Simeone who is quietly but steadily pushing Atletico into the Catalan/Galactico duopoly. As Simeone himself likes to comment...his resources are finite in comparison to Madrid and Barca so he's had to compete organizationally. Atletico is a well-organized, counter-attacking side that retreats quickly to narrow, compact positions when not in possession. It's really interesting to watch too as it extremely different than Barca and even Madrid. Either way...it's no small surprise that Di Maria, in my opinion, was Madrid's most effective player in the match. As a natural wideman, he had space to operate whereas Illaremendi, Khedira, and Isco (playing LW) were troubled in the middle. In any case, big and deserved win for my colchoneros.

Finally...The 4-4-2 has really enjoyed quite the renaissance this year! Maybe Hodgson and England will win the World Cup after all? (hardy har).

[burnspbesq]

Actually, it's Arsenal, Liverpool, Spurs, Everton.

For the first 45 minutes against Toon, Romelu Lukaku approached a Nate James-ian level of bad-assedness.

Martinez has to figure out a way to get Mirallas and Deufoleu on the field at the same time. Those are two scary guys out wide.

The first Merseyside derby on 11/3 is going to be EPIC.

[JohnGalt]

Actually, it's Arsenal, Liverpool, Spurs, Everton.

For the first 45 minutes against Toon, Romelu Lukaku approached a Nate James-ian level of bad-assedness.

Martinez has to figure out a way to get Mirallas and Deufoleu on the field at the same time. Those are two scary guys out wide.

The first Merseyside derby on 11/3 is going to be EPIC.

Yea I wrote that before the match today was over.

You have to admire Newcastle's 2nd half response after being completely shellacked in the first half. I've heard varying reports that Lukaku asked to be sent on loan and that he asked NOT to be sent on loan but either way It seems odd Mourinho would send him out...even with Ba, Torres, and Eto'o. Seems to me if Rafa couldn't get Torres playing well again no one can, Eto'o is 32 and Ba is...well Ba. Ah well They'll probably buy someone else in January. Maybe Liverpool can pick up Mata?

Oh and Barkley looks like Rooney 2.0.

[luburch]

What does that make it for Arsenal now, 18 wins in the last 20 games? Ridiculous form, especially considering that they are missing ten(?) first team players. They have a rough patch of games coming up, starting tomorrow, but I wouldn't bet against them

[duke74]

What does that make it for Arsenal now, 18 wins in the last 20 games? Ridiculous form, especially considering that they are missing ten(?) first team players. They have a rough patch of games coming up, starting tomorrow, but I wouldn't bet against them

Santi, Podo, Ox, Arteta, Ros, Vermaelen, and Diaby immediately come to mind.

[JohnGalt]

Santi, Podo, Ox, Arteta, Ros, Vermaelen, and Diaby immediately come to mind.

Is it really worth expecting Diaby to ever be off that list?

[duke74]

Is it really worth expecting Diaby to ever be off that list?

Well...I just read a few days ago that he offered to forego his salary while out....

[luburch]

My word Arsenal. 2-0 up on Napoli before the 15 minute mark.

[duke74]

My word Arsenal. 2-0 up on Napoli before the 15 minute mark.

The way it ended. Ozil and Giroud in the first half....Ozil got the assist on Olivier's goal I believe. Nice run so far this year after the Villa loss.

[BlueDevilBrowns]

OK, for a long time I've watched quite a bit of international soccer(i.e. World and Euro Cup as well as the US matches) but haven't paid much attention to professional soccer.

This is the first year I've really watched the Premier League closely and I have to say, it's a blast! My knowledge of "Football" is limited but, still, I'm the type of viewer that needs to have a rooting interest in a Team.

So my question to those that follow the EPL closely is - Who should I root for?

I thought about MU because I know more of their players than other teams but that just seems too "bandwagon" for me.

Manchester City seems cool but they use that repulsive "lighter shade of blue" so I don't think I can bring myself to follow them.

I was thinking Chelsea or Liverpool - solid teams, good tradition, without being too trendy.

Who do you guys pull for and why?

[CoBlueDevil]

OK, for a long time I've watched quite a bit of international soccer(i.e. World and Euro Cup as well as the US matches) but haven't paid much attention to professional soccer.

This is the first year I've really watched the Premier League closely and I have to say, it's a blast! My knowledge of "Football" is limited but, still, I'm the type of viewer that needs to have a rooting interest in a Team.

So my question to those that follow the EPL closely is - Who should I root for?

I thought about MU because I know more of their players than other teams but that just seems too "bandwagon" for me.

Manchester City seems cool but they use that repulsive "lighter shade of blue" so I don't think I can bring myself to follow them.

I was thinking Chelsea or Liverpool - solid teams, good tradition, without being too trendy.

Who do you guys pull for and why?

I pull for Liverpool. Have been for almost 10 years now. Like you said great history and tradition. Just listening to the crowd at Anfield singing "You'll Never Walk Alone" gives me chills and I have never been to Anfield nor did I grow up loving them.

They have been down and out for a while now, but are really on the rise with manager Brendan Rodgers leading the way. They have some great young talent, and the absolutely insane Suarez. (Both talent wise, and mentally. The dude is bonkers). But definitely an enjoyable team to watch.

[duke74]

OK, for a long time I've watched quite a bit of international soccer(i.e. World and Euro Cup as well as the US matches) but haven't paid much attention to professional soccer.

This is the first year I've really watched the Premier League closely and I have to say, it's a blast! My knowledge of "Football" is limited but, still, I'm the type of viewer that needs to have a rooting interest in a Team.

So my question to those that follow the EPL closely is - Who should I root for?

I thought about MU because I know more of their players than other teams but that just seems too "bandwagon" for me.

Manchester City seems cool but they use that repulsive "lighter shade of blue" so I don't think I can bring myself to follow them.

I was thinking Chelsea or Liverpool - solid teams, good tradition, without being too trendy.

Who do you guys pull for and why?

I'm an Arsenal guy. The Gunners to me play a crisp passing cerebral game when they're on. Frustrating how we find excellent players, only to act as a development league team for the big money teams, but the purse seems to have been opened with the signing of Ozil and rumblings about future deals.

Watch the original movie "Fever Pitch" with Colin Firth to capture a Gunners' passion. (not the remake about the Bosox)

[luburch]

OK, for a long time I've watched quite a bit of international soccer(i.e. World and Euro Cup as well as the US matches) but haven't paid much attention to professional soccer.

This is the first year I've really watched the Premier League closely and I have to say, it's a blast! My knowledge of "Football" is limited but, still, I'm the type of viewer that needs to have a rooting interest in a Team.

So my question to those that follow the EPL closely is - Who should I root for?

I thought about MU because I know more of their players than other teams but that just seems too "bandwagon" for me.

Manchester City seems cool but they use that repulsive "lighter shade of blue" so I don't think I can bring myself to follow them.

I was thinking Chelsea or Liverpool - solid teams, good tradition, without being too trendy.

Who do you guys pull for and why?

I'm an Arsenal man through and through. I always felt that they go about business the right way. That and I fell in love with Thierry Henry when I was a child.

[JohnGalt]

Manchester City seems cool but they use that repulsive "lighter shade of blue" so I don't think I can bring myself to follow them.

I was thinking Chelsea or Liverpool - solid teams, good tradition, without being too trendy.

Who do you guys pull for and why?

It's really interesting to me that you place Liverpool and Chelsea together in that category with no mentioning of Arsenal at all. I think it speaks volumes for Abramovich's 'first mover' status...i.e., the first billionaire to wake up one day and decide to buy a European club. The truth is that Arsenal and Liverpool ooze 'tradition' where Chelsea is almost purely a byproduct of one rich Russian's egomania. Ferenc Puskas, a famous Hungarian who played for Real Madrid when they won the first several European Cups and someone many argue as being the greatest #9 of all time once said, "I well remember as a boy, growing up in Hungary, there was only one club for me - Arsenal." The truth is that City, Newcastle, Everton, Villa, West Ham, and others all arguably (but probably) have more 'tradition' than Chelsea will have for quite some time. I've attended a match at Stamford Bridge and although a generally pleasant experience, it has zero comparison to Anfield or Celtic Park or Upton Park or some of the other historically-notable British grounds (specifically, Highbury, which I will regrettably never attend). Londoners actually call Chelsea supporters "The Plastics" both to poke fun of Chelsea being located in a "posh" area and also at the many stunts done at the stadium to artificially enhance the lame atmosphere.

Liverpool and Arsenal have specific jabs at Chelsea because of Roman: Arsenal has a banner at the Emirates that reads "You Can't Buy Class" and Liverpool has a song (naturally) poking fun at Chelsea's historical lack of trophies (it's vulgar so I won't post). Ironically though, it was Liverpool's intense traditions that led it to fail to adapt to the changing soccer landscape in England in the way that Arsenal and United did...specifically in building a larger, more modern stadium. Liverpool has maintained most of the deeply-rooted Scouse culture and the mystique of Anfield because of its refusal to adapt, but at the enormous cost of falling down the pecking order of dominant clubs in the EPL (the small spell with Rafa notwithstanding). Arsenal lost what was supposedly a truly special experience at Highbury for what is routinely called a "soulless, corporate" Emirates...but they did this at the enormous benefit of becoming a financially sustainable and [relatively] competitive club. Ferguson and Wenger had a thing to do with their respective successes, as well.

So after that spiel...I'm a Liverpool supporter. A few years back I did UK soccer trip where I got to see an Old Firm at Celtic Park and go to Anfield, Old Trafford, Stamford Bridge, Craven Cottage, Upton Park, and the Emirates (although only stadium tours at Emirates and Upton Park). The Old Firm is exceptional in every sense of the word, both positive and negative. I cannot explain adequately how it is more than a soccer match to those people. But Anfield was something different. All of the bad blood that surrounds the Old Firm doesn't exist around Anfield. It had the feel of a genuinely local club where the people supported and attended the game because it's what they love to do. Not because they hate the other side. And I think this is legitimized by the Merseyside Derby's nickname being the "Friendly Derby." They're blue-noses, but still Scousers at heart that only lost their way, after all. Anyways, the atmosphere around the stadium leading up the match was a blast (lots of hilarious 'you're American and you like football?' talks). It's packed with bars and Fish & Chips joints and just. pure. Scouse. "Because they're not English, they're Scouse." You literally walk right off the street into the turnstiles to enter and the Kop is actually pretty terrifying - both because of the noise and the darkness as you get higher up.

So...in summation: FOR THE LOVE OF GOD, DO NOT SUPPORT CHELSEA. They began all this "rich-guy-uses-club-as-plaything" trend and I can't stand them for it. I was not allowed to bring my "zoom" lens (55-200mm, nothing super-duper) into Stamford Bridge because the (admittedly polite) guard said, "Mr Roman would prefer you buy pictures at the store." When they won the Champions League it was a real annoyance because now the rest of England can't poke fun at London for never having won a European Cup. Ugh. Chelsea. Ruining everything since 2003.

My pitch for Liverpool is that we have a young, energetic manager still trying to prove himself and a [relatively] active ownership group that seems genuinely intent on expanding Anfield in the coming years as well as continually investing in the club...even after they were bit pretty hard by Kenny and Comolli's initial poor use of resources. Liverpool is still fully in "project" mode but we have sufficient history/tradition to be able attract top players (please don't bring up Mkhitaryan. I'm still upset about that) and a hugely entertaining asset in Luis Suarez (at least for the rest of the fall). Steven Gerrard is one of the few single club players still around, especially as far as players of his caliber go, and the fanbase is fantastic as I've mentioned. I'd point you to The Anfield Wrap articles and podcasts to catch a good snapshot of the Scouse thought/ways of doing things.

And if that pitch isn't enough, there's always this (considered to be the greatest European Cup final ever by many). Enjoy:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tPEmC3vN-bQ



Watch the original movie "Fever Pitch" with Colin Firth to capture a Gunners' passion. (not the remake about the Bosox)

The book is even better!

[throatybeard]

OK, for a long time I've watched quite a bit of international soccer(i.e. World and Euro Cup as well as the US matches) but haven't paid much attention to professional soccer.

This is the first year I've really watched the Premier League closely and I have to say, it's a blast! My knowledge of "Football" is limited but, still, I'm the type of viewer that needs to have a rooting interest in a Team.

So my question to those that follow the EPL closely is - Who should I root for?

I thought about MU because I know more of their players than other teams but that just seems too "bandwagon" for me.

Manchester City seems cool but they use that repulsive "lighter shade of blue" so I don't think I can bring myself to follow them.

I was thinking Chelsea or Liverpool - solid teams, good tradition, without being too trendy.

Who do you guys pull for and why?

I was going to posit, in my ignorance, that Chelsea was also very bandwagon, but JohnGalt just explained why.

Which is too bad, since they have the dark blue going on.

I have asked the same question that you have--which EPL team should I root for? The answers I get are usually confusing and I wander away unconvinced. I think maybe I should get me a Bundesliga team.

[gus]

I was going to posit, in my ignorance, that Chelsea was also very bandwagon, but JohnGalt just explained why.

Which is too bad, since they have the dark blue going on.

I have asked the same question that you have--which EPL team should I root for? The answers I get are usually confusing and I wander away unconvinced. I think maybe I should get me a Bundesliga team.

I'm an Arsenal supporter, but please don't take this the wrong way.

I think you would probably be most at home supporting the Spurs. They're very good, but you wouldn't be jumping a bandwagon right now. In other words, you have a good chance of actually seeing them play. They really, really like to sing, which I think you'd enjoy. They still play in their historic stadium, the Lane (though they're building a new one): a tight stadium where the boisterous fans are right up on the pitch. And they're in London, which is immensely more reachable for an American than places like Liverpool or Manchester.

[burnspbesq]

I'm hoping that the team I have supported since childhood, Nottingham Forest, will be back in the Premiership next year. In the meantime, I appreciate Arsenal and root for Everton.

[duke74]

I'm an Arsenal supporter, but please don't take this the wrong way.

I think you would probably be most at home supporting the Spurs.

Arghhhh! Treason. :)

[A-Tex Devil]

I was going to posit, in my ignorance, that Chelsea was also very bandwagon, but JohnGalt just explained why.

Which is too bad, since they have the dark blue going on.

I have asked the same question that you have--which EPL team should I root for? The answers I get are usually confusing and I wander away unconvinced. I think maybe I should get me a Bundesliga team.

The masochist in me has me rooting for Sunderland this year because I wanted to see Jozy do well. I try to watch other games, and I think I might be able to start shifting toward Aston Villa or Everton. But if I watched one of those teams play Sunderland right now, I think I'd find myself rooting for Sunderland.

In the end, I don't think I'll ever really have a Premiere League team, just whatever team has the most American players, and when Americans play Americans, I'll probably root for the team that has the guy in the most forward position.

[JohnGalt]

Which is too bad, since they have the dark blue going on.

I have asked the same question that you have--which EPL team should I root for? The answers I get are usually confusing and I wander away unconvinced. I think maybe I should get me a Bundesliga team.

If the blue is a sticking point I'd point to Everton. They've historically been a big club who've won plenty of trophies so the 'tradition' category can be checked off. The problem is the ownership is currently broke so they're probably at or close to their ceiling. They haven't won anything in quite some time and probably won't for the foreseeable future.

The Bundesliga is really a good idea. IMO, Munich just started what will be one of the biggest dynasties ever in the sport. They have 0 debt, like 150 million Euros in the bank and just walloped what is probably the best EPL team. Dortmund is the latest rage because their supporters are nuts (but a cool, creative nuts) and it's really, really hard to not like Jurgen Klopp, their coach. Plus they punch way above their financial weight. Their colors are just awful though.


I'm hoping that the team I have supported since childhood, Nottingham Forest, will be back in the Premiership next year. In the meantime, I appreciate Arsenal and root for Everton.

Still dreaming about the Clough days, eh? I read somewhere that Forest is the only European Champion not playing in its country's top division. Ouch.



I think you would probably be most at home supporting the Spurs. They're very good, but you wouldn't be jumping a bandwagon right now. In other words, you have a good chance of actually seeing them play. They really, really like to sing, which I think you'd enjoy. They still play in their historic stadium, the Lane (though they're building a new one): a tight stadium where the boisterous fans are right up on the pitch. And they're in London, which is immensely more reachable for an American than places like Liverpool or Manchester.

Spurs are a very good choice. No supporters sing "oh when the [insert name] go marching in..." like Spurs. White Hart Lane against Inter a few years back was incredible.

I wouldn't say London is "immensely" more reachable though. A 2 or 3 hour train ride to Liverpool/Manchester is no big deal especially if you're on a pilgrimage to see your club. And the truth is the tube doesn't go to White Hart Lane so it's kind of a pain to get there even when you're finally in London. The northern cities are cheaper with a much more locally distinct culture, as well. If you're going specifically for soccer those are the places to go.

[throatybeard]

Nottingham Forest is an awesome name for a team. So much better than Wake Forest. Is there a team called Hundred-Acre Wood?

Aston Villa is pretty sweet too. That sounds like where Daniel Craig parks his Aston Martin.

I am fond of Munich but I've been told you can't root for Bayern because that's like rooting for Man U or the Yankees. And they have Robben, whom I detest. A girl from Bosnia was trying to convince me to root for Schalke.

I root for the German national team for two reasons. Three actually. One is, if you're from the US, you need a secondary rooting interest that can, y'know, actually win the darn thing. Everybody else's is Spain, because all of a sudden five years ago Spain got good. I'm oppositional. Second, my wife teaches German. I got my kid a Klose jersey. And third, the Germans actually try to score, which cannot be said for a lot of the national teams. I wish I'd had money when the WC was in Germany.

[BlueDevilBrowns]

Thanks to one and all for your thoughts. Having had time to reflect on everyone's opinion, I'm down to Arsenal, Liverpool, and Everton. I think I'll try to follow all three this year and whichever one I make an emotional connection with, I'll choose.

I'm hoping to make my decision in the Spring after taking official visits to all three and will SKYPE my decision to the winning team.:rolleyes:


Nottingham Forest is an awesome name for a team. So much better than Wake Forest. Is there a team called Hundred-Acre Wood?

Aston Villa is pretty sweet too. That sounds like where Daniel Craig parks his Aston Martin.

I am fond of Munich but I've been told you can't root for Bayern because that's like rooting for Man U or the Yankees. And they have Robben, whom I detest. A girl from Bosnia was trying to convince me to root for Schalke.

I root for the German national team for two reasons. Three actually. One is, if you're from the US, you need a secondary rooting interest that can, y'know, actually win the darn thing. Everybody else's is Spain, because all of a sudden five years ago Spain got good. I'm oppositional. Second, my wife teaches German. I got my kid a Klose jersey. And third, the Germans actually try to score, which cannot be said for a lot of the national teams. I wish I'd had money when the WC was in Germany.

I can't pull for Aston Villa as their owner, Randy Lerner, was the Cleveland Browns owner for many years. To put it mildly, he was THE. WORST. OWNER. EVER. That's all I will say about that.

Hundred Acre Wood FC would be a pretty good team. Tigger would be the next Pele.

My "backup" national teams are England, Scotland, N. Ireland, and Ireland(just because those countries are my ancestry).

[JohnGalt]

In case any of you missed Arsenal's first goal on Saturday, it's about as good of a team effort as you'll see...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=04szyTEXlFA

You get the impression that after a 10 year rebuilding process following the Invincibles, Wenger has Arsenal playing how he wants again. Arteta, Wilshire, Cazorla, Ozil, and even Ramsey on the field at the same time doesn't seem possible. But it's humming for the Royal Arsenal at the moment. Dortmund tomorrow should be great.

[duke74]

In case any of you missed Arsenal's first goal on Saturday, it's about as good of a team effort as you'll see...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=04szyTEXlFA

You get the impression that after a 10 year rebuilding process following the Invincibles, Wenger has Arsenal playing how he wants again. Arteta, Wilshire, Cazorla, Ozil, and even Ramsey on the field at the same time doesn't seem possible. But it's humming for the Royal Arsenal at the moment. Dortmund tomorrow should be great.

John, you know way more about football than I do (based on reading your past analyses). Can you explain what you mean by the bolded statement? Is it because of incompatible styles/strengths, etc? I love Santi and Ozil together, and was happy to see Santi back after injury.

Thanks.

[JohnGalt]

John, you know way more about football than I do (based on reading your past analyses). Can you explain what you mean by the bolded statement? Is it because of incompatible styles/strengths, etc? I love Santi and Ozil together, and was happy to see Santi back after injury.

Thanks.

I say that because in my mind Arteta, Ozil, Cazorla, and Wilshire are all creative-type central midfielders. Arteta was rebranded somewhat at Arsenal as more of a defensive-minded CM, but his roots at La Masia and time at Everton were very much in the attacking CM role. Having those four in the match at one time doesn't seem like it could work...especially when the FBs are supposed to get forward in the way Wenger demands. And especially now that Ramsey can't stop scoring goals. Who covers the defense? Who covers the flanks?

I thought that match yesterday against Dortmund was a really, really interesting one because in my opinion Klopp is sort of Wenger 2.0, or the next evolution of Wenger's coaching philosophy. He's incorporated the intense forward pressing along with Wenger's possession-based style. I read an article a couple days ago calling it a match between two "thoroughly modern football sides." Anyways, it was no surprise that two of the goals came from excellent crosses by the FBs toward the center forward position since both sides rely so heavily on the FBs getting forward to support the attack. Dortmund's 1st was a direct result of its pressing, as well, another important component to the game. Interestingly, Dortmund's pressing lead to late, tired legs and when Arsenal were forward looking for the winner, Dortmund caught them on the counter. It was a fantastic match to watch, imo.

And I'm still upset we didn't get Mkhitaryan.

[awhom111]

PSA that the clocks in Europe switch a week earlier than they do in the United States so plan Sunday through Saturday accordingly.

[duke74]

I say that because in my mind Arteta, Ozil, Cazorla, and Wilshire are all creative-type central midfielders. Arteta was rebranded somewhat at Arsenal as more of a defensive-minded CM, but his roots at La Masia and time at Everton were very much in the attacking CM role. Having those four in the match at one time doesn't seem like it could work...especially when the FBs are supposed to get forward in the way Wenger demands. And especially now that Ramsey can't stop scoring goals. Who covers the defense? Who covers the flanks?

From an Gunners site I read: "Per Mertesacker has warned Arsenal's creative stars they need to concentrate on solidifying their defence before working their midfield "magic"." Consistent with your view, I think.

[burnspbesq]

Back at it after the international break. Merseyside derby at 0-dark-45 on Saturday.

Bad news for everybody except Jay Heaps: Juan Agudelo was denied a work permit, so his January transfer to Stoke is off.

[JohnGalt]

...and I'm curious to know where BlueDevilBrowns sits wrt the big club selection process:

Arsenal finish 2013 in 1st, where they've spent the majority of the season thus far...although with the caveat that they aren't playing quite as seamlessly as in Oct/Nov. Wenger's horrid record at Old Trafford is added to: the Theatre of Nightmares for Arsene, indeed. Two [painful] defeats to end the year see my Liverpudlians drop below the bluenoses to fifth, although still only 6 points off the top. We've played away at the entire top half of the table (minus United and So'ton) so that's encouraging. The "Big 8" (lol) mini-league is only separated by 9 points which is remarkably congested for this time of year. It should be a thoroughly entertaining winter/spring for title/champions league charge.

On the other end, Sunderland followed a HUGE win at Goodison (via a questionable sending-off of Timmy) with a 95th minute equalizer to steal a point from the 'evil' Vincent Tan-led Cardiff City bluebir...red dragons? With those 4 points, Sunderland have firmly jumped back into the relegation 'battle,' itself pretty congested with the bottom 10 teams separated by only 9 points. No Sunderland 02/03 or Derby 07/08 teams in this bunch, although the preliminary statistics indicate West Ham, Fulham, and Sunderland - recent points notwithstanding - deserve their places in the bottom 3.

Injuries are piling up, the January transfer window is heating up, and there's very little rest between matches. Fun times in the EPL.

[luburch]

I was actually getting ready to bump this as well, so I guess great minds thing alike. :cool:

Arsenal - 39 points
Man City - 38 points
Chelsea - 37 points
Everton - 37 points
Liverpool - 36 points
United - 34 points
Spurs - 33 points
Newcastle - 33 points

Each team has some faults (Arsenal only one real striker, City are struggling to win on the road) so things should be pretty interesting in the second half of the season. If I had to predict the finishing order now I would say:

City
Arsenal
Chelsea
United
Liverpool
Everton
Spurs
Newcastle

The January window could shake some things up, but generally not a lot of big names move then. So it will likely be more important to the bottoms teams, than the top.

[BlueDevilBrowns]

...and I'm curious to know where BlueDevilBrowns sits wrt the big club selection process:



Glad you asked! As I mentioned earlier, this is my first year really watching the EPL and, man, is it fun!

As far as what team I like, I find myself gravitating towards Everton. I'm a big fan of Lakaku(spelling?) and I like their goalkeeper(Howard, right?). The fact that Royal Blue and White are their colors doesn't hurt, either.

I still like Arsenal as well but haven't watched as many of their matches.

I find Suarez(sp?) REALLY annoying so I've eliminated Liverpool from my list, at least until Suarez is gone.

So, for now, it's Toffees all the way!

[blazindw]

Glad you asked! As I mentioned earlier, this is my first year really watching the EPL and, man, is it fun!

As far as what team I like, I find myself gravitating towards Everton. I'm a big fan of Lakaku(spelling?) and I like their goalkeeper(Howard, right?). The fact that Royal Blue and White are their colors doesn't hurt, either.

I still like Arsenal as well but haven't watched as many of their matches.

I find Suarez(sp?) REALLY annoying so I've eliminated Liverpool from my list, at least until Suarez is gone.

So, for now, it's Toffees all the way!

It's Lukaku (almost all the way there...just one letter off)

Funny thing is, when I decided to try and pick an English team back in the day, I always found myself between Chelsea and Everton because they were royal blue and white. I never decided between the two as I enjoy watching both teams, but the colors of the team were definitely a factor when I was attempting to choose!

Real Madrid is known as Los Blancos, but their badge has royal blue in it and their secondary color (which is only used on occasion as a trim on the home whites or as a road jersey like this year) is royal blue.

[JohnGalt]

I'm a big fan of Lakaku(spelling?) and I like their goalkeeper(Howard, right?). The fact that Royal Blue and White are their colors doesn't hurt, either.

I find Suarez(sp?) REALLY annoying so I've eliminated Liverpool from my list, at least until Suarez is gone.

So, for now, it's Toffees all the way!

Ha. Yea, Luis Suarez is one of the most polarizing figures in recent EPL memory. If you can believe it, his behavior is WORLDS better this year than his previous couple seasons with Liverpool. He hardly ever dives, mouths off much less frequently, and his all-round petulance is more or less gone (relatively speaking).

He's also firmly cemented himself in the 2nd tier of world talent, IMO. Cristiano and Messi occupy their own space, but Luis deserves mention in the next grouping - with Zlatan, Ribery, etc.

ANYWAYS...you should also know that Lukaku is on loan from Chelsea to Everton. He'll be back at Chelsea next season unless Chelsea sell him...and I doubt Everton will be able to afford him. I read Everton are spending around 10 million pounds for the Lukaku/Barry loans which is risky business this year. If Martinez can get them into the Champions League it could be worth it, but otherwise that's a lot of wasted cash with nothing to show for it (on top of the Deulofeu loan).

[luburch]

Theo Walcott out six months with a torn left ACL. Big loss for Arsenal and England.

[burnspbesq]

Theo Walcott out six months with a torn left ACL. Big loss for Arsenal and England.

That sucks for everybody except Serge Gnabry, who has been handed an unbelievable opportunity.

[PSurprise]

I find it interesting that in soccer, the coach it seems, is the one who goes out and gets players for his team. I know there are scouts and others working the transfer windows and all that, but where baseball and other sports have a general managers doing a lot of the negotiations with trades and all, that they don't have this kind of setup in soccer. Or maybe they do and the coaches get all the credit/blame when players join new teams and play well/crappy. Anyone have any insight into the history of why this is?

[duke74]

Theo Walcott out six months with a torn left ACL. Big loss for Arsenal and England.

Bad news for the Gunners. Makes the January transfer window way more important for Wenger. Need strikers badly. Olivier and Podo not enough. As another poster noted, great opportunity for Serge.

[blazindw]

I find it interesting that in soccer, the coach it seems, is the one who goes out and gets players for his team. I know there are scouts and others working the transfer windows and all that, but where baseball and other sports have a general managers doing a lot of the negotiations with trades and all, that they don't have this kind of setup in soccer. Or maybe they do and the coaches get all the credit/blame when players join new teams and play well/crappy. Anyone have any insight into the history of why this is?

A lot of these teams do have GMs or presidents of some sort (or technical directors), but they operate at the discretion of the coach. They won't get players and tell the coach to adapt to them for the most part. They will get the players that the coach thinks will help him succeed the most. It's also the reason why coaches are held more accountable for transfers than here in the Big 4 sports. It's also why when there's a new coach, the turnover rate of the team goes up quite a bit.

[luburch]

So Mata moves to United for $61m. Pretty heavy price if you ask me.

[duke09hms]

Just started following soccer. Became a Liverpool fan. Huge game on Tuesday. Whose fault is it that the roster is so thin?

[duke74]

So Mata moves to United for $61m. Pretty heavy price if you ask me.

Desperation move by a team worried about Europe? Will Moyes last the season?

[luburch]

Desperation move by a team worried about Europe? Will Moyes last the season?

Moyes' job is safe for all of this season and I'd say at least half of next season. I actually think he'll do well there once he gets his feet under him.

[PSurprise]

Moyes' job is safe for all of this season and I'd say at least half of next season. I actually think he'll do well there once he gets his feet under him.

I think you're right. Next year better see a turnaround or the fans will start to get a little antsier. I know they have some guys that should step up, but ManU has played a significant portion of their season without clearly their 2 best players. If/when vP and Rooney get healthy, they have the offensive firepower to score a number of goals and go on a pretty good streak.

[blazindw]

I would think the Glazers are smart enough to let Moyes get his feet under him and not succumb to the pressure of the fans who want him out. But, fans are fickle and when you get used to winning all the time, it's hard to ask for patience from them.

[JohnGalt]

Just started following soccer. Became a Liverpool fan. Huge game on Tuesday. Whose fault is it that the roster is so thin?

Welcome to Liverpool! If you'd asked me this question about a month ago I'd have said it isn't anyone's fault so much as a streak of exceptionally bad injury luck for Liverpool. Against Bournemouth we played essentially our 3rd choice FBs and both 2nd choice CBs not because it was the FA Cup 4th round against Bournemouth, but because we literally have no other fit options (aside from quasi-choices like Hendo or Sterling). And aside from Moses, we started essentially our top squad (or, at least, what seems to be what Brendan sees as our top squad). For all of the gushing over the physio team's work last year to keep injuries out of the squad, this year has been the complete opposite. The rebuilding project continues and without Europe we simply don't have the depth that some of the other clubs around us have, so the amount of injuries has been particularly hurtful to us.

Now, though, I'm starting to question the tactics of the Committee and FSG. Establishing a player value (an inherently subjective measure mind you) and not paying over the top is fine, but it needs to be coupled with swift business, especially when we don't have the pockets of the Chelseas or the Arsenals or the Uniteds. We've lost essentially our top 4 targets in this and the last transfer windows by what appears to be either (a) poor negotiating skills (b) a lack of urgency in closing or (c) both. It's extremely frustrating and I can't for the life of me understand why we aren't actively looking to get in another FB and DM. Brendan is big on 'mentality' which might be why M'Villa isn't already in a red shirt, but surely there are other options? The most important game of the season is Tuesday - A MERSEYSIDE DERBY of all things - and Henderson, Skrtel, Kolo, Sturridge, Suarez, and Gerrard all went a full 90...and Countinho went 83ish...against Bournemouth in the FA Cup. A good chunk of that is questionable squad selection by Brendan, but he's also only working with what he's got.

Anyways...rant over. The skinny: I'm starting to question Ian Ayre's suitability in his current role.


Moyes' job is safe for all of this season and I'd say at least half of next season. I actually think he'll do well there once he gets his feet under him.

I actually disagree. I think Moyes' time at Everton is overstated in terms of what he achieved (very little) versus what he was given to operate (more money than people care to admit). Plus, the United job is in many ways the complete opposite of that. He needs to be able to manage big egos, the press, and the public much more delicately than he ever had to at Everton. Ferguson's United of last year is looking increasingly like the work of a managerial genius in terms of motivation and tactical arrangement. Sure, Moyes has battled injuries, but RVP's last couple years of healthiness are anomalies in his otherwise injury-riddled career; and Moyes, at least in my opinion, is trying to coach United like he did Everton (the dude loves crossing). He seems to show a lot of the deer-in-headlights faces that Hodgson used to show at Liverpool. Moyes at least has some money at his disposal though (re: Mata).

The injury argument is a valid point, but it must be equally noted that up until now United have had an incredibly favorable Champions League draw. Without it, they would surely be out of the competition by now. They're a team full of expensive, aging players that frankly looks as though it will need a major overhaul this summer in order to get back to being close to competitive with the top 3.

I for one hope that United stick with him as I don't think he's got the charisma or cache to run a club that size. But then again I'm a Liverpool supporter so I've ample reasons to root against him. ;)

[duke09hms]

Hard not to become a Liverpool fan after watching this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tPEmC3vN-bQ

Reminds me of Miracle Minute or down 20 in the Final Four. Plus in their current state, there's some shades of Duke pre-2010. Glorious history, recent title-less spell, very difficult time "recruiting"/transfer market. Being Duke Class of 2009, it kind of resonates.

Steven Gerrard seems to be a class act, high character captain, no off-field shenanigans, and I respect him staying at one club his entire career. Obviously, I haven't seen his behavior prior to this year, but Suarez seems to have changed; he's a great teammate, unselfish in setting up young players like Sturridge and Sterling, and seems to take a lot of uncalled fouls. Plus his work-rate and passion are unmatched.

I'm new to the whole transfer process, but I'm mystified as to why there hasn't been a defensive midfielder signing. It's also a mystery as to who is responsible for the thin roster. Surely Brendan has a say, but then why bring in all these players who don't get time and send out lots of players on loan? Alberto has looked half-decent yet gets no time against weak competition. It's not simply a youth/experience thing because Flanagan has played big minutes, and Brendan wasn't hesitant to put in that even younger kid against Chelsea.

Lol, here we have shades of the "why won't K play his young players argument."

Anyway, with tomorrow's big game, it's good that Everton has their own injury problems as well. Manchester United may be our chief competitor for the 4th spot given their strong January signings. Also, hard to believe Tottenham is tied with us after the 5-0 beating.

[duke09hms]

Also, I might be reaching, but how do you not see a little Coach K in Brendan Rodgers. Young up-and-coming coach while Jose Mourinho plays Dean Smith, the old established winner coach of big bad Chelsea.

[JohnGalt]

Daniel Sturridge and Luis Suarez now have 31 goals in 23 matches played together.

Comprehensive win and performance from the Redmen today. It's a long walk across Stanley Park for the blue-noses.

[burnspbesq]

I hate Man City almost as much as I hate Carolina, but it's hard to see anyone derailing them.

[PSurprise]

Anyone have any thoughts on the sacking of Moyes (btw, I love that term and think we should adopt it instead of firing). Personally, as a MU fan, I think he severely underachieved, especially with motivating the players. I think not keeping at least some of the coaches from last year definitely hurt him. I hope they can find someone who has the support of all of the players next year, and maybe a decent midfield as well.

[JohnGalt]

Anyone have any thoughts on the sacking of Moyes (btw, I love that term and think we should adopt it instead of firing). Personally, as a MU fan, I think he severely underachieved, especially with motivating the players. I think not keeping at least some of the coaches from last year definitely hurt him. I hope they can find someone who has the support of all of the players next year, and maybe a decent midfield as well.

The longer United continues without Ferguson, the more it's plainly seen the dude was a genius. His ability to get what he got out of the players at this disposal over his final two seasons was remarkable. PDO is a metric that was developed around hockey, but has recently made its way into the soccer realm. It essentially indicates whether a team is performing above or below the fundamental shots numbers; it's just save% + scoring%. It also has a tendency to regress heavily to the mean (of 1000) over a season so the stats folks are using it more and more to try and determine whether a team's performances were more attributable to luck/variance versus actual quality. Ferguson's PDO over the last two years was out of this world high (~117%). Moyes' is a little above average for less than a full season (~104%).

Any number of conclusions can be made: Ferguson is a genius, Moyes is not a genius, Moyes is unlucky, Ferguson was very lucky, etc, but either way it makes for some interesting conversation. My personal opinion is that whether he'd admit it or not, Ferguson realized he wasn't close to competing with Munich, Madrid, or Barca and wasn't going to be getting the funds necessary to attract the players he'd need to challenge on the continent. But because he was an incredible team/individual motivator and supremely adaptable, he was able to continue winning in England. A very reasonable argument can be made that the guy was pretty lucky as well though. Robin Van Persie has never been known for his dependability in terms of fitness, but he played in over 90% of EPL games last year for only the 2nd time in his career...he also led the league in goals. Arsenal fans will never hesitate to state that Wenger probably sold the league to United for 22.5 million pounds. In comparison, he's only played 17 times this year (about half, in other words).

It's hard not to agree though that he appeared overwhelmed. Some managers are built for less ambitious clubs or those with a lower ceiling due to finances or ownership or whatever. Moyes appears to be one of those. I have no doubt he'll eventually find success again.

[BlueDevilBrowns]

Anyone have any thoughts on the sacking of Moyes (btw, I love that term and think we should adopt it instead of firing). Personally, as a MU fan, I think he severely underachieved, especially with motivating the players. I think not keeping at least some of the coaches from last year definitely hurt him. I hope they can find someone who has the support of all of the players next year, and maybe a decent midfield as well.

I think the performance of Moyes' old club, Everton, this season also looks to be quite damning. All Roberto Martinez, Moyes' successor, has done is lead the Toffees to their highest point total ever in Premier League play with 3 games left. Also, He has them in position to possibly finish in the Champions League field for next year, something Moyes only did once in the decade he was there.

Probably didn't help that Everton swept MU for the first time since 1970, either, this year.

Ironically, it wouldn't surprise me if MU looked at Martinez as a replacement if some of the "top tier" names decline the job.

[duke09hms]

So, this Sunday's game/match (still working on proper vocabulary) between Liverpool and Chelsea. Any thoughts?

Shades of 1992 Final Four between Duke-Indiana? K vs Knight. Brendan Rodgers vs Jose Mourinho.

Jose is playing his mind games saying he'll put out a weakened squad bc of the Champions League semi on Wednesday. But given the billions spent, even Chelsea's second 11 would contend for the title.

I've been impressed by Rodgers throughout this season. Projects a very calm, classy, humble vibe.
Link to the press conference: http://press.lfc.vn/rodgers-pre-chelsea-presser-s14-w36/

[BlueDevilBrowns]

So, this Sunday's game/match (still working on proper vocabulary) between Liverpool and Chelsea. Any thoughts?

Shades of 1992 Final Four between Duke-Indiana? K vs Knight. Brendan Rodgers vs Jose Mourinho.

Jose is playing his mind games saying he'll put out a weakened squad bc of the Champions League semi on Wednesday. But given the billions spent, even Chelsea's second 11 would contend for the title.

I've been impressed by Rodgers throughout this season. Projects a very calm, classy, humble vibe.
Link to the press conference: http://press.lfc.vn/rodgers-pre-chelsea-presser-s14-w36/

I would say, in this case, Liverpool is "NC State" and Chelsea is "Duke" in the sense that Liverpool is a traditional power that hasn't won much real hardware in many years(much like State) while Chelsea has had much more recent success and is more used to these pressure situations(like Duke).

But, this year, Liverpool is the better squad(at least in the standings) but Chelsea has more experience. Plus, Liverpool doubtless is feeling the pressure of it's massive fanbase to finally bring an EPL Title home.

Also, Chelsea is in the more comfortable position of "Underdog", hence Mourinho playing up the "just happy to be here / really no big deal" angle.

If I had to guess, I'd say a draw is likely.

If I had to pick a winner, I'd give the slight edge to Chelsea.

[duke09hms]

I would say, in this case, Liverpool is "NC State" and Chelsea is "Duke" in the sense that Liverpool is a traditional power that hasn't won much real hardware in many years(much like State) while Chelsea has had much more recent success and is more used to these pressure situations(like Duke).

But, this year, Liverpool is the better squad(at least in the standings) but Chelsea has more experience. Plus, Liverpool doubtless is feeling the pressure of it's massive fanbase to finally bring an EPL Title home.

Also, Chelsea is in the more comfortable position of "Underdog", hence Mourinho playing up the "just happy to be here / really no big deal" angle.

If I had to guess, I'd say a draw is likely.

If I had to pick a winner, I'd give the slight edge to Chelsea.

Well with billions spent on their roster but still choosing to play anti-football, Mourinho's Chelsea is probably closer to Dean Smith's 4 Corners at UNC. Seriously, their 2nd choice roster cost almost twice as much as Liverpool's starting 11.

Tough tough loss today. Maybe Brendan should have come out playing for the draw, forcing Chelsea to come forward and launch counterattacks of our own. Shades of K sticking to man-to-man even when it's not working??

[JohnGalt]

Well with billions spent on their roster but still choosing to play anti-football, Mourinho's Chelsea is probably closer to Dean Smith's 4 Corners at UNC. Seriously, their 2nd choice roster cost almost twice as much as Liverpool's starting 11.

Tough tough loss today. Maybe Brendan should have come out playing for the draw, forcing Chelsea to come forward and launch counterattacks of our own. Shades of K sticking to man-to-man even when it's not working??

I'm crushed over that loss. Chelsea time-wasted from the 1st minute resulting in 3 minutes of first half stoppage providing the time for Stevie to slip and gift a goal to Demba Ba in the 48th minute. There really is no justice in this world.

Listen, I understand and appreciate the game is meant to be won and fundamentally it's the manager's job to do what he needs to win the match. But there's something distinctly ordinary about spending close to £600 million pounds over the course of your managerial career only to set up negatively in the biggest matches. I'm a completely biased [and emotional] observer, but that amount of money for that style of play is characteristic of a thoroughly mediocre football mind. He complains when lesser sides do it to him, but then doesn't hesitate to do it against greater sides.

*sigh*

Sócrates is rolling in his grave.

YNWA.

[killerleft]

Mediocre mind? I've seen Jose play it whichever way he thinks will produce the desired result. He was right again. He usually is. Sure, it helps to have a great roster to choose from, but many managers have had that and not produced. The Special One didn't start out with those killer rosters. He earned his way to the top. Just like Coach K and virtually any high profile coach, he's not been perfect, of course. But like Phil Jackson and others, he knows how to massage the big egos and get them to play together and believe in his vision.

That Gerrard was the goat is sad, Stevie was playing catch-up once he didn't control the ball in the first place, and the slip sealed it. I was rooting for Liverpool, by the way. They hardly have a poor roster. On another day they may have put up three or four goals on Chelsea. They had the ball plenty, and should have been peppering the goal with shots. But Sunday, Suarez & Co. couldn't figure out the Chelsea defense.

[Mudge]

I'm crushed over that loss. Chelsea time-wasted from the 1st minute resulting in 3 minutes of first half stoppage providing the time for Stevie to slip and gift a goal to Demba Ba in the 48th minute. There really is no justice in this world.

Listen, I understand and appreciate the game is meant to be won and fundamentally it's the manager's job to do what he needs to win the match. But there's something distinctly ordinary about spending close to £600 million pounds over the course of your managerial career only to set up negatively in the biggest matches. I'm a completely biased [and emotional] observer, but that amount of money for that style of play is characteristic of a thoroughly mediocre football mind. He complains when lesser sides do it to him, but then doesn't hesitate to do it against greater sides.

*sigh*

Sócrates is rolling in his grave.

YNWA.

You DO recall how Mourinho first won the Champions League-- and with whom, don't you-- not exactly a pile of money at his disposal at Porto... and Inter, while certainly not poor, is not owned by a billionaire lavishing Chelsea/Man City/Man United/Madrid/Barca/Bayern/PSG-like sums on the roster... moreover, I doubt that the squad left to him last weekend, without his first choice GK and Center Fullback/Captain or a reliably scoring striker, could be viewed as dominant in talent, going into that match (and I doubt that the crew he actually put out there on the weekend cost more than Liverpool's)...

[duke09hms]

(and I doubt that the crew he actually put out there on the weekend cost more than Liverpool's)...

Oh but it did cost more, much more actually. Almost double. Liverpool's starting 11 was ~125m pounds. Chelsea's supposedly reserve 11 that started on Sunday was ~200m pounds. By the way, Man City/Chelsea have spent more than double of Liverpool/Man United on their current roster.

Anyway, extremely unlucky mistake by Gerrard. If it had gone into HT 0-0, I believe Rodgers would have accepted the draw, but we ended up having to force the issue. I still wonder what would have happened if we came out to play counterattacking. Would Chelsea have actually come forward, or would both sides have stayed back to play stalemate?

I admire Brendan's devotion towards attacking football, but sometimes you have to be pragmatic.

[Mudge]

Oh but it did cost more, much more actually. Almost double. Liverpool's starting 11 was ~125m pounds. Chelsea's supposedly reserve 11 that started on Sunday was ~200m pounds. By the way, Man City/Chelsea have spent more than double of Liverpool/Man United on their current roster.

Anyway, extremely unlucky mistake by Gerrard. If it had gone into HT 0-0, I believe Rodgers would have accepted the draw, but we ended up having to force the issue. I still wonder what would have happened if we came out to play counterattacking. Would Chelsea have actually come forward, or would both sides have stayed back to play stalemate?

I admire Brendan's devotion towards attacking football, but sometimes you have to be pragmatic.

I'd like to see the player-by-player accounting of those tallies you cite... and you conveniently ignored the other points I made-- should I assume you agree that going into that game, Liverpool was fielding a far more dangerous squad than the crippled one that Chelsea had/has available at this stage? Mourinho, much as I dislike him, has more than proven himself capable of beating bigger teams which have had far more talent (and salary budget) available-- anyone who wants to say that he is mediocre-minded, when it comes to football strategy and tactics doesn't seem to get that the object of the game is to win-- Calcio is/was incredibly boring/stultifying-- but the Italians have more World Cup Championships than anyone but the Brazilians, to show for it-- and nobody was accusing the Italians of being mediocre football minds-- or Juve, AC, or Inter of being "mediocre-minded" when they won the European Cup 12 times between them...

[JohnGalt]

Mediocre mind? I've seen Jose play it whichever way he thinks will produce the desired result. He was right again. He usually is. Sure, it helps to have a great roster to choose from, but many managers have had that and not produced. The Special One didn't start out with those killer rosters. He earned his way to the top. Just like Coach K and virtually any high profile coach, he's not been perfect, of course. But like Phil Jackson and others, he knows how to massage the big egos and get them to play together and believe in his vision.

He's not a mediocre mind. That was overstatement...like I mentioned, I was upset. He's actually probably a genius with regard to man management techniques. I remember Brendan saying in a press conference that he used to sit and watch Jose during his press conferences to learn how he manipulated the reporters. My problem with Jose is that he represents the antithesis of what FFP is supposed to be. He spends HUGE amounts of money and leaves player development to other clubs. He feels no pressure to scout and purchase younger kids (i.e. under 18) because he knows he'll be allowed to purchase whatever 18-21 year old he wants, loan them out to another club for their development, and then push them directly into the first team when he feels they're ready. A team of his current loanees would challenge for a UCL spot in most countries:

http://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/en/chelsea-fc/verliehen/verein_631.html


You DO recall how Mourinho first won the Champions League-- and with whom, don't you-- not exactly a pile of money at his disposal at Porto... and Inter, while certainly not poor, is not owned by a billionaire lavishing Chelsea/Man City/Man United/Madrid/Barca/Bayern/PSG-like sums on the roster... moreover, I doubt that the squad left to him last weekend, without his first choice GK and Center Fullback/Captain or a reliably scoring striker, could be viewed as dominant in talent, going into that match (and I doubt that the crew he actually put out there on the weekend cost more than Liverpool's)...

I would never take anything away from a Champions League winner because winning it is a huge accomplishment.

However...it needs to be stated that in 2003-2004 Porto finished 2nd in the 2nd least competitive group (on points accrued)...behind Madrid and above Partizan and Marseille. They then drew United (admittedly tough) in the R16, Lyon in the quarters, Deportiva La Coruña in the semis, and Monaco in the finals. That's not exactly running the gauntlet.

Inter is very much owned by a billionaire. His name is Erick Thohir and he's the founder of Mahaka Media, an Indonesian media company. And he had to come in because the financial situation at Inter had become so dire. Since Jose left, Inter have gone through 6 managers while they try to sort out their finances. The two years Jose was in Milan saw him accrue a cumulative net loss for the club 3x that of AC Milan (223M vs 76M) while sporting a wage bill comparable to Manchester City's (and equal to Juve and Roma combined). In the subsequent three years (after Mourinho's departure), they had the 2nd highest net negative transfer spending in Serie A while they tried to balance the books. Spending over 120 million in two years does that to most clubs not named Real Madrid or Chelsea. I will say that selling Zlatan to Barca negates a fair amount of his 120mill spent.


I'd like to see the player-by-player accounting of those tallies you cite... and you conveniently ignored the other points I made-- should I assume you agree that going into that game, Liverpool was fielding a far more dangerous squad than the crippled one that Chelsea had/has available at this stage? Mourinho, much as I dislike him, has more than proven himself capable of beating bigger teams which have had far more talent (and salary budget) available-- anyone who wants to say that he is mediocre-minded, when it comes to football strategy and tactics doesn't seem to get that the object of the game is to win-- Calcio is/was incredibly boring/stultifying-- but the Italians have more World Cup Championships than anyone but the Brazilians, to show for it-- and nobody was accusing the Italians of being mediocre football minds-- or Juve, AC, or Inter of being "mediocre-minded" when they won the European Cup 12 times between them...

It's behind a paywall so I can't give you too many specifics, but Paul Tomkins (of the Tomkins Times) calculated an inflation-adjusted "Top 100 transfers in EPL history" in January (i think?). Surprise, surprise that Mourinho signed 4 of the top 10 (and also #11) and 3 of the top 5 in his [first] time at Chelsea. I've seen all kinds of numbers surrounding Liverpool's top 11 value vs Chelsea's reserve 11 and I honestly haven't spent the time calculating it myself, but the fact Mourinho is able to bring on a £30 million signing (Willian) and a £50 million one (Torres) whereas Rodgers goes to a £7 million (Aspas) and £12 million (Sturridge) speaks enough for me. It's inarguable that the guy has enjoyed a tremendous amount of managerial success...however it's equally as important to acknowledge that a tremendous amount of said success has been attributable to his seemingly infinite transfer kitty.

And although it's a complete non-sequitur, two of Italy's World Cup wins were in 1934 and 1938. It's widely acknowledged that following the war years (i.e. beginning with 1950), the World Cups were much more competitive (as transportation and physical rehabilitation greatly improved). Italy did - to their credit - knock out Sócrates' 1982 Brazilian side, the side most consider the greatest team not to win the World Cup.

[duke09hms]

I'd like to see the player-by-player accounting of those tallies you cite... and you conveniently ignored the other points I made-- should I assume you agree that going into that game, Liverpool was fielding a far more dangerous squad than the crippled one that Chelsea had/has available at this stage? Mourinho, much as I dislike him, has more than proven himself capable of beating bigger teams which have had far more talent (and salary budget) available-- anyone who wants to say that he is mediocre-minded, when it comes to football strategy and tactics doesn't seem to get that the object of the game is to win-- Calcio is/was incredibly boring/stultifying-- but the Italians have more World Cup Championships than anyone but the Brazilians, to show for it-- and nobody was accusing the Italians of being mediocre football minds-- or Juve, AC, or Inter of being "mediocre-minded" when they won the European Cup 12 times between them...

http://www.transferleague.co.uk/

Liverpool's gameday squad ~138m
Chelsea's "crippled" gameday squad ~205m

I believe Chelsea played 9 of the 11 players in the Liverpool game against the UCL semi today against Atletico. So not exactly a weakened/crippled team. Nor were they the "kids" that Jose said he'd be fielding with the exception of Kalas, who was a revelation though and did a tremendous job. Of course the cost is closer with the exclusion of 32m Hazard, 18m Ramires, and 26m David Luiz, who typically make gameday rosters.
Liverpool was clearly not fielding a far more dangerous squad against Chelsea, essentially playing without the crucial Jordan Henderson and Daniel Sturridge, who came on at 60' and was clearly still bothered by his hamstring injury. In fact, throughout the course of the season, Liverpool has been far more affected by injuries, exacerbated by a thin squad. Suarez, Gerrard, and Coutinho have missed significant time, and Sturridge is often injured.

Anyway, Chelsea did win, so credit to them. I don't think anyone actually thinks Mourinho is a mediocre coach. Mediocre? No. Lacking class? Yes. Time-wasting from the beginning, disgraceful behavior at press conferences, that one time he poked the referee's eye. Probably most bothersome to Liverpool fans is his hypocrisy regarding defensive football. When they drew against West Ham parking the bus, he made a big stink and accused their coach of playing 19th century football. It's honestly absurd when he complains about having a thin squad and no strikers given their cash and their loaning out expensive and elite strikers like Lukaku.

Ultimately, Liverpool got rattled due to the Gerrard mistake and departed from their tactical strengths as we chased the game and forced the issue. This guy was happy to see Chelsea get destroyed by Atletico Madrid today. Cmon Everton!

[duke74]

Cmon Everton!

As a Gooner, no offense, but I hope not!

[gumbomoop]

Cmon Everton!

Everton are in a dicey situation. They have almost certainly blown their hopes for 4th and next season's CL. Of the 3 teams now fighting for the Europa League, Everton probably want it the most, and they need but a single point to assure 6th place. But both Spurs and ManU have easier run-ins, and are likely to win out. [Unless either of those 2 teams somehow tanks, to avoid the much-discussed Thurs-Sun nightmare that is the EL......]

Meanwhile, Everton's run-in starts with tough Man City, now in control of their own fate. Everton finish away at Hull. Everton nurse multiple injuries at center half, have lost Mirallas, are without Barry this weekend, must play an exhausted McCarthy for 90 minutes every game. They must have a point to secure at least 6th place.

Everton looked a 50/50 chance for CL 2 weeks ago. They could well slide to 7th. Probably not, only need a point, but if they end up losing 4 of final 5, including 2 at home, sending Moyes packing may be scant consolation for a big psychological disappointment.

[JohnGalt]

Everton are in a dicey situation. They have almost certainly blown their hopes for 4th and next season's CL. Of the 3 teams now fighting for the Europa League, Everton probably want it the most, and they need but a single point to assure 6th place. But both Spurs and ManU have easier run-ins, and are likely to win out. [Unless either of those 2 teams somehow tanks, to avoid the much-discussed Thurs-Sun nightmare that is the EL......]

Everton looked a 50/50 chance for CL 2 weeks ago. They could well slide to 7th. Probably not, only need a point, but if they end up losing 4 of final 5, including 2 at home, sending Moyes packing may be scant consolation for a big psychological disappointment.

This is the great conundrum wrt the Europa League though. I've never seen the statistics run, but the overwhelming consensus is that playing Thursdays makes playing on Sundays exceedingly more difficult...especially if you have to travel to Moscow/St Pete or Donetsk (just an example here) or somewhere distant like those areas. And the financial payoff for succeeding in the Europa League isn't close to commensurate with what you generally give up in your league position.

Everton are an interesting case because Martinez made a relatively big gamble when he decided to bring in Barry, Lukaku, and Deulofeu on loan. Those three have pretty hefty loan fees that are essentially sunk costs when the loan deals are over...and Everton's finances aren't exactly robust. So because it doesn't look like Everton will make the Champions League and they'll neither own those players for continual use nor own them for their sell-on value, it looks like Everton might have wasted some pretty important funds. Top that with them qualifying for the Europa League and Everton are in a really risky situation...especially playing an up tempo style like Martinez wants. They'll likely have a lot of matches next year without a few of their most important players...AND they'll need to strengthen/deepen the squad to have a chance at much of anything.

Swansea City is the latest example of this problem. Reeeeally hoping for a bluenose result today though!

COME ON THE TOFFEES

[gumbomoop]

The question of whether Everton might collapse and not even make the EL is now settled, with Spurs' loss today.

Toffees still have long, long shot at 4th and CL, but highly unlikely. So, like it or not, they're bound for the misery and/or glory of the EL. Should they stay ahead of ManU and finish 5th, they'll be the second biggest story of the season. The biggest will be Liverpool, unless Man City win the league.

Actually, to take even the worst-possible-case scenarios for the two Merseyside teams -- Liverpool fall to third, Everton to 6th -- Merseyside will still be the most inspiring story of the 2013-14 EPL.

[gumbomoop]

Update -- ManU lose, having played almost as uninspiringly today as Spurs. That assures Everton of 5th.

Both Spurs and ManU will be suspected of tanking, in order to avoid EL. We'll see how ManU play at Old Trafford on Tues v. Hull. Tank. No tanks?

Big game coming up now.....

[gumbomoop]

Liverpool might work magic, if Everton were less tragic.

[JohnGalt]

Update -- ManU lose, having played almost as uninspiringly today as Spurs. That assures Everton of 5th.

GIGGS OUT!


Liverpool might work magic, if Everton were less tragic.

That was quite a shame the bluenoses couldn't come up with a result for us.

My support is being thrown in the Villains corner now...

[awhom111]

What I can say for certain right now is that burnsbesq and I will still not have teams in the 2014-15 version of this thread.

[duke09hms]

Welp that's probably it for Liverpool's title challenge. Like Duke this year, you can't win with an atrocious defense. Huge choke job, up 3-0, then giving up 3 goals in 9 minutes. Need a miracle on Wednesday or Sunday now.

[blazindw]

Welp that's probably it for Liverpool's title challenge. Like Duke this year, you can't win with an atrocious defense. Huge choke job, up 3-0, then giving up 3 goals in 9 minutes. Need a miracle on Wednesday or Sunday now.

Still not over yet, but that is a damaging blow for Liverpool. You can't give up a 3-0 lead to Palace if you want the title in your hands.

Liverpool fans here should be pulling for one Brad Guzan to pull a magnificent save or 20 on Wednesday.

[A-Tex Devil]

So Crystal Palace having a shot to tie for 10th (11th on GD, but you get my point) is the most amazing story in the PL this year, right? I only half kid.

[JohnGalt]

So Crystal Palace having a shot to tie for 10th (11th on GD, but you get my point) is the most amazing story in the PL this year, right? I only half kid.

Liverpool's incredible run excepted, there's really very little reason to kid about Crystal Palace.

2013/2014 Crystal Palace without Tony Pulis: LLWLLLLLLLDW
2013/2014 Crystal Palace without Tony Pulis: LWWLLWLDLWWLWLDLDLWWWWWLD

That is an incredible turnaround for a club most people pegged to go right back down even before it played a match.

[luburch]

Lolerpool.

[JohnGalt]

Lolerpool.

I'll just use one of your previous comments to respond to this silliness:


If I had to predict the finishing order now I would say:

City
Arsenal
Chelsea
United
Liverpool
Everton
Spurs
Newcastle

It's not over. YNWA.

[A-Tex Devil]

I'll just use one of your previous comments to respond to this silliness:



It's not over. YNWA.

I've really enjoyed watching the Premiere League regularly this year and noting the absolute hyperbole of the British media with each swing of the pendulum. It's like (without getting PPB) our 24 hour news. I mean either of Villa or West Ham beating Man City is more likely than CP beating Liverpool, right? But it's all over, I guess...... I have no skin in the game, but Villa hard tomorrow so that I know there is something to play for this weekend. Thing is, even if City win tomorrow, West Ham can still screw everything up for them. Oh.... and Liverpool have to beat Newcastle. There's that.

[luburch]

I'll just use one of your previous comments to respond to this silliness:



It's not over. YNWA.

Well, I was right about who was going to win the title and Chelsea finishing third.

Sure I missed on Liverpool, most people did. Will they replicate this success next season? I doubt it. They'll have CL to worry about next time around. Not to mention another another Suarez saga when Madrid come knocking. But who knows, that's why they play the games.

[blazindw]

Well, I was right about who was going to win the title and Chelsea finishing third.

Sure I missed on Liverpool, most people did. Will they replicate this success next season? I doubt it. They'll have CL to worry about next time around. Not to mention another another Suarez saga when Madrid come knocking. But who knows, that's why they play the games.

We're not going after Suarez...the BBC will remain intact for at least another season.

[JohnGalt]

Thing is, even if City win tomorrow, West Ham can still screw everything up for them. Oh.... and Liverpool have to beat Newcastle. There's that.

NBC has done really well, IMO. It's incredible to be able to watch all the games.

Newcastle's last 7 results have gone: L-L-L-L-L-L-W. After blowing a 3 goal lead against Palace I suppose anything is possible, but with Hendo back and at home I would be surprised if we lost.


Well, I was right about who was going to win the title and Chelsea finishing third.

Sure I missed on Liverpool, most people did. Will they replicate this success next season? I doubt it. They'll have CL to worry about next time around. Not to mention another another Suarez saga when Madrid come knocking. But who knows, that's why they play the games.

I thought I remembered you being a devout Arsenal fan is all. The fact that the north london crowd (spurs and gooners alike) feels the need to poke fun at Liverpool is exceedingly self-defeating in my opinion. And I'd wager approximately 95% of all predictions had Chelsea and City in the top 3. As Evil Kagawa recently tweeted: "this is no science of rocket"


We're not going after Suarez...the BBC will remain intact for at least another season.

I think it's simply a matter of trophies. If yall don't win at least 1 of La Liga/UCL then I'm confident Uncle Flo comes knocking. Speaking of which...what do you think about Suarez for Di Maria and 50mill?

;)

[blazindw]

I think it's simply a matter of trophies. If yall don't win at least 1 of La Liga/UCL then I'm confident Uncle Flo comes knocking. Speaking of which...what do you think about Suarez for Di Maria and 50mill?

;)

4115

[JohnGalt]

We're not going after Suarez...the BBC will remain intact for at least another season.

In all seriousness though, Morata, Benzema, and Khedira are all entering their final contractual year, no? How many of them do you think will still be around next year? There's a lot of discussion on twitter this morning about Morata...his stats are absurd. DO NOT LET THAT MAN GO.

(unless it's to Liverpool)

[duke74]

In all seriousness though, Morata, Benzema, and Khedira are all entering their final contractual year, no? How many of them do you think will still be around next year? There's a lot of discussion on twitter this morning about Morata...his stats are absurd. DO NOT LET THAT MAN GO.

(unless it's to Liverpool)

I thought my Gunners were in the lead for Morata...but I've learned to discount all transfer rumors (an incomprehensible system to me...)

[blazindw]

In all seriousness though, Morata, Benzema, and Khedira are all entering their final contractual year, no? How many of them do you think will still be around next year? There's a lot of discussion on twitter this morning about Morata...his stats are absurd. DO NOT LET THAT MAN GO.

(unless it's to Liverpool)

I think Khedira leaves and I think we keep Morata and Benzema around another year, especially because Jese (who was dominating at a point) is out for up to 7 months. I think once Jese comes back, if he's the same, we sell Morata. Benzema has thrived in the BBC lineup this year, and it will be hard for Uncle Flo to sell him and break that up. My thought is that Benzema wants to stay at the Bernabeu and he signs some sort of extension early next year.

[gumbomoop]

Not a lot of mystery left for Sunday.

Liverpool highly likely to crush Newcastle, but hard to imagine ManCity not getting at least a point at home.

A minor drama re 6th place and Europa League. Seems both ManU and Spurs might prefer to decline, but can they afford to tank too obviously? Will be interested to see who plays for ManU and Spurs on Sunday.

Am I correct that EPL gets 3 spots in next year's EL - 5th and 6th plus Hull City?

Sunderland amazing.

[blazindw]

Not a lot of mystery left for Sunday.

Liverpool highly likely to crush Newcastle, but hard to imagine ManCity not getting at least a point at home.

A minor drama re 6th place and Europa League. Seems both ManU and Spurs might prefer to decline, but can they afford to tank too obviously? Will be interested to see who plays for ManU and Spurs on Sunday.

Am I correct that EPL gets 3 spots in next year's EL - 5th and 6th plus Hull City?

Sunderland amazing.

Sunderland's last month has been nothing short of miraculous. They were 7 points from safety and now stand in 14th and officially clear of the drop. Just remarkable.

[JohnGalt]

Not a lot of mystery left for Sunday.

Liverpool highly likely to crush Newcastle, but hard to imagine ManCity not getting at least a point at home.

A minor drama re 6th place and Europa League. Seems both ManU and Spurs might prefer to decline, but can they afford to tank too obviously? Will be interested to see who plays for ManU and Spurs on Sunday.

Am I correct that EPL gets 3 spots in next year's EL - 5th and 6th plus Hull City?

Sunderland amazing.

If it weren't for Tony Pulis' exploits at Palace, Sunderland's resolve would surely get more press. It is an impressive, impressive run to finish the season (and to safety). I'll miss Norwich though...there's not enough yellow in the league.

Maybe Stu Downing and Andy Carroll can win Liverpool some silverware next weekend, eh?! #theresyournarrative!

[A-Tex Devil]

If it weren't for Tony Pulis' exploits at Palace, Sunderland's resolve would surely get more press. It is an impressive, impressive run to finish the season (and to safety). I'll miss Norwich though...there's not enough yellow in the league.

Maybe Stu Downing and Andy Carroll can win Liverpool some silverware next weekend, eh?! #theresyournarrative!

Unfortunately for our man on Sunderland, Altidore, their resurgence correlated with his quasi-permanent benching. He got on the last 2 games and played decently, but missed a sitter yesterday. I'll be interested to see where he ends up next year, but I'm not sure the Premiere League is for him.

[blazindw]

Unfortunately for our man on Sunderland, Altidore, their resurgence correlated with his quasi-permanent benching. He got on the last 2 games and played decently, but missed a sitter yesterday. I'll be interested to see where he ends up next year, but I'm not sure the Premiere League is for him.

The good thing for Jozy: there's a World Cup coming up. He does well there, Sunderland either thinks twice about unloading him or some other team swoops in to get him.

[blazindw]

For those of you keeping track of who could be making the leap to the Premiership next season, the Championship 3rd place playoff is now down to QPR and Derby County. For QPR, a win will return them to the top flight after being relegated last season to the Championship. For Derby County, it will be the first time back in the top flight since that terrible 2007-08 season that saw them relegated with the lowest point total in Premiership history (1 win; 11 points).

One of them will be joining Leicester City and Burnley in facing the big boys next season. The loser will welcome Norwich City, Fulham and Cardiff City to the Championship.

[gumbomoop]

For those of you keeping track of who could be making the leap to the Premiership next season, the Championship 3rd place playoff is now down to QPR and Derby County. For QPR, a win will return them to the top flight after being relegated last season to the Championship. For Derby County, it will be the first time back in the top flight since that terrible 2007-08 season that saw them relegated with the lowest point total in Premiership history (1 win; 11 points).

One of them will be joining Leicester City and Burnley in facing the big boys next season. The loser will welcome Norwich City, Fulham and Cardiff City to the Championship.

I'd watch it, if it were anywhere on US TV. But so far, I can't find it. Fox national network has Athletico-RM that aft (Sat May 24), but the 10 am EDT Championship playoff at Wembley doesn't seem to be on US TV. Surprises me, as I've occasionally seen a Championship game. But can't find it on FS 1, FS 2, beIn, NBCSN, ESPN group, GOL TV. Nada.

Help?

Wait. Maybe you could get to Wembley, Skype it to me. Probably tough for you to catch a flight to Lisbon in time for the start of the CL final. You could do like that guy in the Heineken commercial. It would be close to impossible, but I'd appreciate the effort. Or, just skip Lisbon and head to Madrid. That's doable, right? The fiesta will last all night in Madrid, anyway. Piece of cake.

[blazindw]

I'd watch it, if it were anywhere on US TV. But so far, I can't find it. Fox national network has Athletico-RM that aft (Sat May 24), but the 10 am EDT Championship playoff at Wembley doesn't seem to be on US TV. Surprises me, as I've occasionally seen a Championship game. But can't find it on FS 1, FS 2, beIn, NBCSN, ESPN group, GOL TV. Nada.

Help?

Wait. Maybe you could get to Wembley, Skype it to me. Probably tough for you to catch a flight to Lisbon in time for the start of the CL final. You could do like that guy in the Heineken commercial. It would be close to impossible, but I'd appreciate the effort. Or, just skip Lisbon and head to Madrid. That's doable, right? The fiesta will last all night in Madrid, anyway. Piece of cake.

The final is supposed to be on beIN Sports. They've been the ones carrying the Championship playoffs (saw both legs of QPR-Wigan). And as for Lisbon or Madrid, I checked it out to see if I could go on points. Sadly, I don't have enough to make the trip and with no job and the World Cup approaching, my bank account is in the red. It will be fun to watch on TV though!

[gumbomoop]

The final is supposed to be on beIN Sports. They've been the ones carrying the Championship playoffs (saw both legs of QPR-Wigan). And as for Lisbon or Madrid, I checked it out to see if I could go on points. Sadly, I don't have enough to make the trip and with no job and the World Cup approaching, my bank account is in the red. It will be fun to watch on TV though!

I thought maybe it might be carried by beIn, but when I checked my DirecTV schedule grid, they were listed as showing some La Liga replay in that slot. I should have suspected it was just bad info, yet to be updated.

Anyhow, thanks for the tip!

[awhom111]

I thought maybe it might be carried by beIn, but when I checked my DirecTV schedule grid, they were listed as showing some La Liga replay in that slot. I should have suspected it was just bad info, yet to be updated.

Anyhow, thanks for the tip!

BeIN is the worst at scheduling ever. Anything more than 3 days from now is not set in stone. Last year they carried all 3 Football League Playoff Finals live, so I would assume they would do the same this year. It is not like they have much other inventory after this weekend.

As a supporter of a club who finished in the top half of the Championship with some lingering promotions hopes for next season, should I be pulling for QPR?

On the flip side, the Manchester City title means that our little modern era league winners club is still exclusive.

[blazindw]

BeIN is the worst at scheduling ever. Anything more than 3 days from now is not set in stone.

They are THE worst. They announced all week that they would do whiparound coverage of the 3 La Liga matches that everyone was hoping to see. On Sunday, they just went with the Atletico match and the Barca match on the 2 channels they have, canceling any whiparound coverage. They're notorious for changing schedules at the last minute without notification.

[JohnGalt]

There's still time to say, No, Cesc. Don't do it.

[gus]

Is this thread for all football?

the timing of this (http://www.espnfc.us/paris-saint-germain/story/1863244/paris-saint-germain-star-zlatan-ibrahimovic-open-to-future-mls-switch) might work out well for NYFC, if I choose to support them... (they need to have their own stadium though. I have no interest in watching soccer in Yankee Stadium).

[Blue in the Face]

Is this thread for all football?

the timing of this (http://www.espnfc.us/paris-saint-germain/story/1863244/paris-saint-germain-star-zlatan-ibrahimovic-open-to-future-mls-switch) might work out well for NYFC, if I choose to support them... (they need to have their own stadium though. I have no interest in watching soccer in Yankee Stadium).
I don't think YS is a very good long-term home (even ignoring the viewing experience for fans) so I assume eventually they'll have their own stadium (or fold), but it's going to be an awfully long time.