The 2013 NBA Finals thread

[moonpie23]

thought this could use a fresh new thread....


i'm thinking this might be the best "finals" we've seen in a long time......

i'm going with Heat in 7

[luburch]

I'll have to say Heat in seven as well. The Spurs have the better team, but the Heat have the best player.

[Kedsy]

thought this could use a fresh new thread....


i'm thinking this might be the best "finals" we've seen in a long time......

i'm going with Heat in 7

I'm thinking Spurs in 6.

[wtm001]

Every prediction I've seen has either been a team in 6 or 7. Not only on DBR. Where are the 5's?

Heat in 5

[throatybeard]

Given that Shane already has a ring, I'm kind of rooting for the San Antonio AARPs to take this thing. Am I wrong?

[Des Esseintes]

Every prediction I've seen has either been a team in 6 or 7. Not only on DBR. Where are the 5's?

Heat in 5

Picking in 5 or less suggests a blowout, and people have way too much respect for the Spurs to dismiss them out of hand. Nevertheless, like you, I kind of think the Heat will have less trouble than most think, the Spurs' excellence notwithstanding. Last year heading into the Finals, the majority were picking the Thunder. OKC had won four straight against the Spurs, while Miami had barely escaped Indiana and Boston. Injuries to Bosh and Wade were the primary culprits that made those series more competitive than they might otherwise have been, but in the Finals it was a different story. A fair number of similarities to this year. I suspect Wade will look better this series, and if he does San Antonio won't have enough. Popovich is a genius coach, though, one of miniscule handful in all of sport that does his job as well as K does. Can't wait.

[dukelifer]

Given that Shane already has a ring, I'm kind of rooting for the San Antonio AARPs to take this thing. Am I wrong?

If Shane continues to ride the pine a Spurs win would show that the only reason the Heat won last year was because of Shane's play - which I believe.

[Troublemaker]

Given that Shane already has a ring, I'm kind of rooting for the San Antonio AARPs to take this thing. Am I wrong?

I would feel the same way, except Danny Green plays for them. That tips me back over to the Heat.

[Ichabod Drain]

Heat in 4.... yea I went there

[TexHawk]

Every prediction I've seen has either been a team in 6 or 7. Not only on DBR. Where are the 5's?

Heat in 5

The 2-3-2 format always messes up predictions. Unless you've got a juggernaut playing a completely overmatched opponent (Shaq's Lakers), it is always tough to see the team with home court advantage winning before games 6 or 7. (Jordan's Bulls only did it once in their 6 wins.) The home team really is put at a disadvantage for a completely decrepit rule. (Miami --> Indy is 1000 miles, Miami to San Antonio is just short of 1150. The NBA is fine with the Heat traveling to Indy twice for a series.)

"Heat in 5" means Miami wins at least 2, possibly 3 games in San Antonio, which I probably find unlikely. My gut says, if it were to end in 5, it would be the road team stealing one of games 1 or 2, then sweeping at home, as Miami did last year (but unlikely this year imo).

"Heat in 6" is where I am thinking.

[Billy Dat]

I'm in the Heat in 6 or 7 camp. The Spurs are really solid, but Duncan, Parker and Ginobili are the only players with any NBA Finals experience, and they haven't been there since 2007. Their opponent that year was the Cleveland Lebrons. Lebron has been to the finals twice since then, the last two consecutive years, and their entire team has that Championship experience. The Spurs are going to rely heavily on solid play from Tiago Splitter, Kawhi Leonard, Dancin Danny, Matt Bonner, Gary Neal, Boris Diaw, etc. The Miami role players - Chalmers, Battier, Miller, Haslem, Cole are much more tested.

From and Xs and Os standpoint, everyone seems to be keyed on how the Heat will defend Parker, how the Heat will defend in transition, and whether or not Miami will be able to play big or small. It'll be interesting to see how that all plays out. We don't have to wait long.

Also, everyone is excited for Pop's first ever NBA Finals sideline interviews - the practice was started in 2008.
http://espn.go.com/nba/playoffs/2013/story/_/id/9341250/gregg-popovich-vs-sideline-reporters

[superdave]

The Spurs will not be any more fresh this series than they will tonight. They sorta have to win one in Miami tonight or this weekend to have a shot at going to 6 or 7 games. Because if they dont, their old legs are going to betray them later in the series.

Duncan's splits are remarkably consistent, whether he's playing on no rest or 1, 2, 3 days. But they just cant keep up with Miami in the open court.

In my opinion, for the Spurs to win, they have to win 1 of 2 in Miami, keep the game a slow, half court grind and ride Tony Parker. Duncan will play well, but can maybe only carry the team a game or two. It's Parker's load now.

Kawhi Leonard guarding Lebron is intriguing as well. Here's a profile (http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nba/spurs/2013/06/04/kawhi-leonard-lebron-james-san-antonio-spurs-miami-heat-nba-finals/2390373/) of that. And here's their one matchup (http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/h2h_finder.cgi?request=1&p1=leonaka01&p2=jamesle01) from last season. Leonard just needs to keep Lebron out of the paint. No big deal, right?

I think the Spurs control the paint the first few games but give away a game they should have won, and the Heat take the whole thing in 6. I just hope it's as hard fought as the Indiana series was.

[luvdahops]

I would feel the same way, except Danny Green plays for them. That tips me back over to the Heat.

Chip Engelland ('83) is a Spurs assistant. Doesn't that offset Dancin' Danny?

[BobbyFan]

This was the Finals I was hoping for earlier in the season, and I'm excited we have it. It will be interesting to see how the Heat defend Parker. I'd probably keep LeBron off of him for the first three quarters, and allow him to roam as a help defender where I think he can have just as big an impact. Also, I don't think Splitter will prevent Miami from going with a small lineup, like West was able to do.

The one given is that LeBron will dominate this series. And I think his teammates, having escaped the length of Indiana, will take advantage of more freedom on offense and will produce better.

Miami in 6.

[jipops]

Chip Engelland ('83) is a Spurs assistant. Doesn't that offset Dancin' Danny?

Actually, it kind of...almost...does

[Newton_14]

Given that Shane already has a ring, I'm kind of rooting for the San Antonio AARPs to take this thing. Am I wrong? Yes. Two words: Danny Green

[moonpie23]

shane can't BUY a bucket.....

[luburch]

Looks like the Spurs have taken game one.

[Newton_14]

Shot selection shot selection shot selection.

Dang it. Chris Bosh shooting a 3 with the game hanging in the balance is bad basketball. The Heat's overall shot selection in the final 8 minutes cost them Game 1. This is where the 2-3-2 format just kills the team with homecourt advantage. You are down 0-1 and 3 of the next 4 games are on the road. Not a good place to be.

Heat have some work to do.

[Mabdul Doobakus]

Smarter, better basketball from the Spurs in the 4th quarter. The Heat were lucky to be within range late because the Spurs missed a ton of wide open corner 3's in the 3rd and 4th quarters. Miami was kicking the ball around and taking a lot of stupid shots for most of the 4th quarter, while the Spurs were moving the ball around and getting good looks on every possession.

Interestingly, the Heat went 11 deep and rolled out a lineup for the first 3 minutes of the 4th quarter that included neither Lebron or Wade. This is something you might do in a regular season game, but I can't figure out what Spo was thinking in Game 1 of an NBA Finals.

Not a good place to be for the Heat. I won't call Game 2 a must win for the Heat, because I do think they could take 2 of 3 in San Antonio...but they definitely don't want to be facing that situation. On the plus side, every Finals Miami has ever been in, the team that won Game 1 went on to lose the series.

[CDu]

Shot selection shot selection shot selection.

Dang it. Chris Bosh shooting a 3 with the game hanging in the balance is bad basketball. The Heat's overall shot selection in the final 8 minutes cost them Game 1. This is where the 2-3-2 format just kills the team with homecourt advantage. You are down 0-1 and 3 of the next 4 games are on the road. Not a good place to be.

Heat have some work to do.

I actually disagree on the bolded part. I think the 2-3-2 is an advantage for the team with home court advantage. It is very difficult to win three games in a row, which is what the "3" tram has to do to consolidate a road win in Game 1 or 2. So if you're the "3" team, you almost have to plan on winning 2 road games.

[CDu]

If Shane continues to ride the pine a Spurs win would show that the only reason the Heat won last year was because of Shane's play - which I believe.

That isn't the ONLY reason. I mean, San Antonio's key players have much more Finals experience than the Thunder did. That experience certainly should count for something.

[tommy]

How many shots did LeBron get up on the 4th quarter tonight? Seemed too deferential. They needed him to take it to the hoop or die trying.

[Mabdul Doobakus]

I actually disagree on the bolded part. I think the 2-3-2 is an advantage for the team with home court advantage. It is very difficult to win three games in a row, which is what the "3" tram has to do to consolidate a road win in Game 1 or 2. So if you're the "3" team, you almost have to plan on winning 2 road games.

I have heard every side of this 2-3-2 thing argued. I don't know who it helps more, but given that people come down on both sides of this, I think it's probably not a big deal and probably doesn't really favor anyone. You're still playing 7 games with 4 in one place and 3 in the other. There's no rule that says you can't close out the series on the road. Plus, I've always thought that it's desirable that the home advantage is mitigated in the Finals. Comparing records between conferences can be a little bit of an apples/oranges thing some years (including this year).

I can see that in three Finals appearances, Miami has twice won all three games at home, so it obviously can be done, and 2 of those 3 series featured a closeout game on the road in Game 6, so that can be done too.

[Mabdul Doobakus]

How many shots did LeBron get up on the 4th quarter tonight? Seemed too deferential. They needed him to take it to the hoop or die trying.

I don't think he took a shot until about the 3 minute mark. Part of this is because he didn't get in until the 9 minute mark, but I agree to a point...he needed to be taking it to the rim during that quarter.

[CDu]

I have heard every side of this 2-3-2 thing argued. I don't know who it helps more, but given that people come down on both sides of this, I think it's probably not a big deal and probably doesn't really favor anyone. You're still playing 7 games with 4 in one place and 3 in the other. There's no rule that says you can't close out the series on the road. Plus, I've always thought that it's desirable that the home advantage is mitigated in the Finals. Comparing records between conferences can be a little bit of an apples/oranges thing some years (including this year).

I can see that in three Finals appearances, Miami has twice won all three games at home, so it obviously can be done, and 2 of those 3 series featured a closeout game on the road in Game 6, so that can be done too.

Oh it is certainly possible, and I am certainly not complaining. I think the edge is squarely with the "2s" team. But it isn't a big deal.

[g-money]

I'm pulling for Battier and the Heat, but I really had to admire Parker tonight. He's the best PG in the league right now, and that is saying something with all the great PGs out there. Too bad he can't play for Coach K.

[Newton_14]

I actually disagree on the bolded part. I think the 2-3-2 is an advantage for the team with home court advantage. It is very difficult to win three games in a row, which is what the "3" tram has to do to consolidate a road win in Game 1 or 2. So if you're the "3" team, you almost have to plan on winning 2 road games.
Yeah that's cool. It is certainly debatable and I see both sides of the argument. Not saying Miami can't win 2 or more games at San Antonio, they certainly can. For me personally, I feel the format helps the road team but stats likely disprove that. The other thing is that Game 5 is such a huge game in a 7 game series and to me it should take place on the floor of the team with homecourt advantage. I think it's time they change it to 2-2-1-1-1.


I don't think he took a shot until about the 3 minute mark. Part of this is because he didn't get in until the 9 minute mark, but I agree to a point...he needed to be taking it to the rim during that quarter. I mentioned shot selection but the bold part is my second biggest issue with Game 1. Lebron needs to play every minute of the 4th qtr period. It was bad enough that he sat during that stretch. Sitting both he and Wade was just stupid. Really bad coaching there.

[jmck214]

I disagree that the 2-3-2 hurts the home team. Even if the series is tied at 1-1 it still is very difficult for the Spurs to win three straight even though all three are at home. More than likely the spurs take two out of three and now the last two games are in Miami. Now if Miami goes down 0-2 then its basically over but that would be the same case if it was 2-2-1-1-1.

[Ichabod Drain]

Despite the outcome of game one, I'm sticking with my original prediction of Heat in 4.:rolleyes:

[Wander]

I mentioned shot selection but the bold part is my second biggest issue with Game 1. Lebron needs to play every minute of the 4th qtr period. It was bad enough that he sat during that stretch. Sitting both he and Wade was just stupid. Really bad coaching there.

I'm not sure I agree, given that Miami led by 3 both at the beginning of the fourth quarter and at the 9 minute mark when Lebron entered the game. It was also Lebron's decision to sit out:

"I told [Heat coach Erik Spoelstra] I needed one," James said of his break to start the fourth. "The third was so -- I was in the paint, defensive rebounding, I was closing out ... on shooters. It took all in the tank from me in the third quarter. So I needed a little breather."

[moonpie23]

Despite the outcome of game one, I'm sticking with my original prediction of Heat in 4.:rolleyes:

you mean the NEXT 4

[Billy Dat]

I thought it was an excellent start to the Finals. The game was played at a really high level for the first 3 quarters, and the Spurs continued that for the entire 4th while Miami blinked.

I, too, was curious about Lebron sitting so much to start the 4th but apparently he asked for the rest. His game to that point had been amazing - his overall line was amazing - but he says he was exhausted. That's a potentially bad sign for the Heat, but we'll see. I thought the Miami reserves were playing well.

But, nearly as soon as he checked into the game, Miami hit the skids. Over the next 5 minutes of game time, they turned it over 4 times while San Antonio took the lead. A huge sequence was Lebron missing an open 3 that would have cut the lead to 1 and Dancin Danny immediately hitting a 3 on the other end to push it to 7. Huge.

Of course, if Parker misses the miracle twisting bouncing leaner, Miami is coming down with a chance to force OT. What a shot by Parker!

It will be interesting to see what adjustments Miami will make. This looks like its going to be a really good one to watch. Too bad Shane is out of the mix. Despite his missed 3s, he actually looked good in his 6 minutes of PT - he blocked Duncan near the rim, saved and secured a couple of loose balls, etc. If only he were shooting better.

[CDu]

Yeah that's cool. It is certainly debatable and I see both sides of the argument. Not saying Miami can't win 2 or more games at San Antonio, they certainly can. For me personally, I feel the format helps the road team but stats likely disprove that. The other thing is that Game 5 is such a huge game in a 7 game series and to me it should take place on the floor of the team with homecourt advantage. I think it's time they change it to 2-2-1-1-1.

But Miami has no need to win two in San Antonio. They just need to win game 2, win one in San Antonio, and win the last two at home.

Conversely, San Antonio either has to win 3 straight home games or they will have to win a second game in Miami.

[theAlaskanBear]

How many shots did LeBron get up on the 4th quarter tonight? Seemed too deferential. They needed him to take it to the hoop or die trying.

It was a great opening game to the series.

LeBron was making the right decisions...the Spurs defense of Leonard + double/triple teams in the lane forced him to pass and look for open shooters. Also, his energy was gone by the end of the game...his defense and rebounding really sapped his energy. 18 rebounds...holy cow. If the Heat had shot a normal 2nd half percentage he would have had 15 assists as well.

Despite a good start, Wade was a second half disappearing act, and he only had 2 ast and 2 trb for the game.

It's already been said, but if I was Spoelstra, I would sit Bosh down and tear him a new hole....NO MORE 3's. I don't care that you have been shooting a 40% in playoffs, because it completely neuters the rest of his game. If you are shooting threes, you sure as hell aren't trying to rebound, screen, establish a post presence...you know, PF and C things. It allows the Spurs bigs to triple LeBron with no consequences. The Heat don't need a Bargnani....they need Bosh - the 20 and 10 guy from Toronto who played baseline and the elbows. Bosh should be playing the elbows with his ELITE mid-range jump shot...

Bottom line is this: the Spurs have the experience and the chemistry. There is NO substitute for playing together for 10+ years like Parker, Duncan, Ginobili. If they can continue to defend without fouling, and the refs continue to call a low-key game...it's going to be really hard for the Heat to score (no FTs) and increase the pace, because the Spurs don't turn it over.

What else....Parker was masterful of course, Battier had a nice defensive impact the short time he was in the game, but was clearly rushing his 3's...I think he should see more time as the series goes on. The Heat got good bench production, and if it keeps up the series will be a long one...but watching this Heat team break down, really makes you wonder about the future...I mean, Wade will be battle knee problems for the rest of his career...is in a 4 year decline, and is 31.

The Heat come out with more energy and a sense of desperation, and take game 2. Somehow they always seem to pull a series out of their hats...hope they have one more in them!

[superdave]

How many shots did LeBron get up on the 4th quarter tonight? Seemed too deferential. They needed him to take it to the hoop or die trying.

This is spot on. Lebron either scores or fouls out the entire Spurs team in the process. Duncan is a great help defender, like as in all-time great. But he's not outleaping Lebron in the lane too often this series. And Kawhi Leonard wont get respect from the refs. Lebron has got get into the lane like a football team commits to the run. Do it over and over until the rest of the court opens up for Wade, Bosh and the rest.

If you've got the single most unstoppable skill in the league, use it.

[theAlaskanBear]

This is spot on. Lebron either scores or fouls out the entire Spurs team in the process. Duncan is a great help defender, like as in all-time great. But he's not outleaping Lebron in the lane too often this series. And Kawhi Leonard wont get respect from the refs. Lebron has got get into the lane like a football team commits to the run. Do it over and over until the rest of the court opens up for Wade, Bosh and the rest.

If you've got the single most unstoppable skill in the league, use it.

Kawhi Leonard only had two fouls the whole game, and both were on help-d situations early where he fouled a Miami player not named LeBron.

Maybe if LeBron is aggressive he gets a few more buckets and they win the game, but maybe he also turns the ball over, gets fouled but doesn't get calls (happens a often on double/triples, has to take and miss bad shots...I'm tired of James for getting lambasted for making the right basketball plays. It was a very close game, James is simply doing what made them successful up to that point.

If LeBron was getting calls taking it into the lane earlier in the game, maybe he tries to do that as the 4th Q winds down, but he shot 2 FTs in the first half and clearly felt the Refs weren't going to call contact.

[Mabdul Doobakus]

Joey Crawford is reffing tonight. Really looking forward to that storyline...:rolleyes:

[moonpie23]

ha....that IS the story line...

[Newton_14]

Note to Wade: Dancing Danny will make open 3's if you continue with the phantom D. For the love of God and Country man put a hand in his face dude. Play some freakin defense.

[_Gary]

I know Shane as been abysmal with his shots in the playoffs, but I completely disagree with removing him from the regular rotation. Miller may be hitting a solid percentage of his three's, but his defense isn't nearly what Shane's is. I think the Heat are making a big, big mistake tinkering with the rotation like this in the Finals.

[moonpie23]

maybe shane will get some burn now that it's a blowout....he needs to get the lid off somehow.....maybe they just need to feed him until he can hit some..... REALLY wish he would get it going...


with that said.... (throwing up in my mouth a bit ) danny green has really stepped up his game......ugh..

[theAlaskanBear]

maybe shane will get some burn now that it's a blowout....he needs to get the lid off somehow.....maybe they just need to feed him until he can hit some..... REALLY wish he would get it going...


with that said.... (throwing up in my mouth a bit ) danny green has really stepped up his game......ugh..

Battier hits a three on the second to last possession ;)

[moonpie23]

finally........maybe the monkey is off....

[tommy]

I know Shane as been abysmal with his shots in the playoffs, but I completely disagree with removing him from the regular rotation. Miller may be hitting a solid percentage of his three's, but his defense isn't nearly what Shane's is. I think the Heat are making a big, big mistake tinkering with the rotation like this in the Finals.

Well, after two games, Miller is 5 of 6 overall shooting, including 4 of 5 from 3-point land. He's giving them what they've needed from that spot, which is knocking down shots when LeBron draws all that extra attention.

[_Gary]

Well, after two games, Miller is 5 of 6 overall shooting, including 4 of 5 from 3-point land. He's giving them what they've needed from that spot, which is knocking down shots when LeBron draws all that extra attention.

No doubt. And when it's a game like tonight where a blowout is taking place late, it doesn't matter. But if it's tight and a defensive stop is needed, I'd take Shane over Mike no matter how well Miller is shooting the ball. But that's just me.

[BobbyFan]

I know Shane as been abysmal with his shots in the playoffs, but I completely disagree with removing him from the regular rotation. Miller may be hitting a solid percentage of his three's, but his defense isn't nearly what Shane's is. I think the Heat are making a big, big mistake tinkering with the rotation like this in the Finals.

Miller is shooting the ball better and is a far more skilled offensive player. He is also much healthier than he was last season, and is moving very well, including on defense where he has been pretty good with rotations, diving for loose balls, etc. I don't think it's a mistake at all by Spoelstra, and am actually surprised it took him as long as it did to give Miller more minutes considering he played very well at the end of the regular season.

[tommy]

No doubt. And when it's a game like tonight where a blowout is taking place late, it doesn't matter. But if it's tight and a defensive stop is needed, I'd take Shane over Mike no matter how well Miller is shooting the ball. But that's just me.

Don't disagree that I'd go with Shane if it's late and the team needs a key defensive stop. But the mid-size players that Shane has traditionally excelled at stopping are not the types of guys that San Antonio primarily hurts you with. So yes, he can lock up Leonard or Diaw or somebody, but he won't matter much vs. Duncan or Parker. So sure, have him in there in late game defensive situations, but if you're talking the big picture, the lion's share of the minutes at the 3 off the bench, it does seem like Miller, with the way he's shooting, is a pretty good option too.

[Billy Dat]

Miller is shooting the ball better and is a far more skilled offensive player. He is also much healthier than he was last season, and is moving very well, including on defense where he has been pretty good with rotations, diving for loose balls, etc. I don't think it's a mistake at all by Spoelstra, and am actually surprised it took him as long as it did to give Miller more minutes considering he played very well at the end of the regular season.


Don't disagree that I'd go with Shane if it's late and the team needs a key defensive stop. But the mid-size players that Shane has traditionally excelled at stopping are not the types of guys that San Antonio primarily hurts you with. So yes, he can lock up Leonard or Diaw or somebody, but he won't matter much vs. Duncan or Parker. So sure, have him in there in late game defensive situations, but if you're talking the big picture, the lion's share of the minutes at the 3 off the bench, it does seem like Miller, with the way he's shooting, is a pretty good option too.

I agree with BobbyFan and tommy. In 2011, I was rooting like crazy for the Mavericks. Since then, I have been rooting like crazy for the Heat, pretty much only because of Shane (although I love watching Lebron). It kills me that he is not in the rotation, but the results speak for themselves. In fact, Miller's sudden robust health and play is an amazing turnaround, no one expected him to be ready to perform at this level. The Heat click on all cylinders when Lebrons kick-outs result in 3s. Miller and Allen are hitting theirs, Shane is not. And, as the prior posters noted, the defense is just fine. In fact, the Heat's decisive run last night cam with both Allen and Miller on the floor with Bird, LBJ and Chalmers and Wade and Bosh on the bench. I think Shane has officially lost his spot save for an injury to Miller or Allen. Maybe he's get put in if San Antonio has a one possession shot at a tie or win in the closing seconds of a game.

As for the rest of the game, the Lebron block on Splitter literally made me jump off the couch, run three steps toward the TV, stop and put my hands on my head as I stared in slack jawed awe as he then ran down, drew the D, and kicked out for another open 3. As the TV guys noted, he was not himself for the first 30 minutes of that game, but then he started to orchestrate on both ends and it was amazing. The Heat's defense was INSANE during that last 4 minutes of the 3rd and the first half of the fourth. Parker would come off that high screen and the screeners man was jumping out with Parker's defender and a hugely aggressive double, but then the big was racing back to recover and San Antonio couldn't solve it. But, even when they got it inside, it seemed like Lebron and Birdman were everywhere, and Chalmers blocked a shot and was being hugely disruptive.

Let me take a sec to praise Chalmers. That dude is a HUGE part of the Heat. He played a great all around game last night, and, as Bill Simmons kept repeating on the post game show, his pick and roll action with Lebron really got the Heat cooking.

Overall, though, the Heat's defense was the story of the game for me. The amazing thing is that Dancing Danny and Kawhi Leonard were the story of the first 30 minutes of the game. At the start of the series, I doubted whether or not they'd perform well in the series. They are playing a lot better than Manu, who can't seem to get going.

Before the Heat went on their run, it was a fantastic back and forth game, brimming with excitement and energy. Hopefully it will keep rolling like that, I'd love to watch these teams battle for another 5 games.

[weezie]

At least we haven't heard (yet) and belly-aching from the spur about flopping. Seems to me they might be a classier, and more dangerous bunch than to cry and moan like the poor, sad grudging little toot-toot pacer.

[Mabdul Doobakus]

Pretty lackadaisical half from the Heat again. This has been their worst effort on the defensive boards since the middle of the Pacers series, and they've been very slow to close out on Spurs shooters. The Heat have been getting pretty good shots for the most part, though...the offensive execution and ball movement has been fine for the most part.

Lebron is again struggling to put the ball in the basket...I think the Spurs defense on both an individual and team basis has been terrific in that respect, and you can see Lebron is thinking a little more out there than he usually does. It's in his head a little bit at this point. The announcers will get on him for not trying to score more or whatever, but I actually preferred the way he played in the first quarter when he wasn't forcing the issue and was getting his teammates good looks. He started to press a bit in the second quarter, and the Heat offense suffered as a result. I don't care if Lebron scores 20, as long as he's helping set up his teammates with good looks.

The Heat weren't able to go to pick and roll action with Chalmers and Lebron very much because Chalmers was on the bench with foul trouble for a lot of the time, but it will be interesting to see if they work that in the second half.

Miami can definitely take this game if they can ratchet up the intensity, but you never know when they're going to choose to do that.

[jipops]

Spurs about to turn this into a blowout. The Heat look lost on both ends.

[_Gary]

Right now this series is like deja vu with the Dallas series two years ago. The Spurs, like the Mavs in 2011, just are so hot from the outside that it seems there's little the Heat can do about it. I will not be shocked to see S.A. finish this series in Texas. Seriously, they are shooting out of their freakin minds right now from distance - just like the Mavs did when they won. Very similar situation, imho.

[Mabdul Doobakus]

That sequence where San Antonio missed two wide open 3's, got 2 uncontested offensive rebounds, and then hit a wide open 3 says everything you need to know about this game.

The Heat just aren't competing at the level they need to in an NBA Finals game. Without Mike Miller, this game would be awful. It's pretty much awful anyway. Reminds me a lot of Game 6 against Indiana where hot 3 point shooting kept the Heat in it for awhile, but the way they competed they basically had no chance to win. Lebron is having as bad a game as I've ever seen.

[Mabdul Doobakus]

I mean...San Antonio is the worst offensive rebounding team in the league and they have 15 offensive rebounds.

[jipops]

Looks like another one of those "must wins" for the Heat coming up in game 4. Though it will likely be a 2-1 Spurs lead, it might seem like more of a commanding lead.

Oh yea, and the Spurs are doing this right now without Parker.

[_Gary]

I'm going to reiterate it again: This is just like the Mavs a couple of years ago. They got so ultra hot at times, that they just were NOT going to lose the series. Right now San Antonio is playing exactly the same way. They are so on fire it's just a hopeless cause tonight. Miami simply has to hope they cannot duplicate this performance in Game 4. If they are able to duplicate it (especially guys like Neil shooting like his life depended on it), then the Heat will be losers again in the Finals.

[Mabdul Doobakus]

Well. Tough night to be a Heat fan. Credit to the Spurs. Their "Big 3" didn't even play that well, but the role players have been off the charts. Neal is having the game of his life. Leonard's defense on Lebron has completely gotten The King off his game. Green continues with the hot shooting.

I don't want to even talk about the Heat's effort any more because it's just going to make me angry. We'll see if this has any carryover. The Heat are always best with their backs against the wall, but this isn't the Bucks, Bulls, or Pacers. At some point, a good, hungry team isn't going to let you impose your will on them, and if you only go 100% in your "must wins" one of these days that might not be enough.

[Mabdul Doobakus]

Why am I still watching this? Why is Lebron just standing there watching as Green shoots a 3 right in his face?

[g-money]

I know Shane as been abysmal with his shots in the playoffs, but I completely disagree with removing him from the regular rotation. Miller may be hitting a solid percentage of his three's, but his defense isn't nearly what Shane's is. I think the Heat are making a big, big mistake tinkering with the rotation like this in the Finals.

After watching the Spurs bomb away from 3 tonight, I'm starting to see Gary's point on this. Wouldn't Shane be a better defender than half the guys in Miami's current rotation? I know Miller's hot, but three point shooting is only part of the game.

Another way of putting it would be: Can't anyone on Miami stop Gary Neal or Danny friggin' Green???

Edit: Shane clanks two 3's as I type. Aargh.

[moonpie23]

very ugly game for the heat........guess we'll see how they respond on thurs...

[sporthenry]

Amazing how a guy like Danny Green can become a great NBA role guy. Credit him for working a ton on his game but also shows that the guy who does 1-2 things great is probably better suited for the role than the better all around player.

[jipops]

After watching the Spurs bomb away from 3 tonight, I'm starting to see Gary's point on this. Wouldn't Shane be a better defender than half the guys in Miami's current rotation? I know Miller's hot, but three point shooting is only part of the game.

Another way of putting it would be: Can't anyone on Miami stop Gary Neal or Danny friggin' Green???

Edit: Shane clanks two 3's as I type. Aargh.

Yea, Miami needs guys that can make shots. And Shane is just not one of those guys.

[jipops]

Amazing how a guy like Danny Green can become a great NBA role guy. Credit him for working a ton on his game but also shows that the guy who does 1-2 things great is probably better suited for the role than the better all around player.

Also shows that he got some great development in the D league. This is not the same player that was drafted in the 2nd round.

[Mabdul Doobakus]

I love Shane and all, but he can't hit a shot right now. And, so, no he shouldn't play. The Spurs have been unbelievable from 3, but the Heat were so late on their closeouts tonight, that a of these shots were uncontested. And, frankly, in his handful of minutes, Shane was guilty of this as well. Shane was cheating way too far into the lane, and Matt Bonner got two wide open corner 3's. He missed them, but that was just lucky...you cannot leave him open in the corner. And then, somehow, a couple plays later, Bonner...yes, Matt Bonner...blew right past Shane, forcing him to foul. Shane may have played too many minutes this season...I don't know. But his tank is just empty.

[g-money]

I love Shane and all, but he can't hit a shot right now. And, so, no he shouldn't play. The Spurs have been unbelievable from 3, but the Heat were so late on their closeouts tonight, that a of these shots were uncontested. And, frankly, in his handful of minutes, Shane was guilty of this as well. Shane was cheating way too far into the lane, and Matt Bonner got two wide open corner 3's. He missed them, but that was just lucky...you cannot leave him open in the corner. And then, somehow, a couple plays later, Bonner...yes, Matt Bonner...blew right past Shane, forcing him to foul. Shane may have played too many minutes this season...I don't know. But his tank is just empty.

I think you make fair points in most cases. The one thing I'm not buying is that he's worn out - he's barely played in two weeks. Unless he's hurt (which we have no indication of, but you never know), I think Shane's problem is a lot more mental than physical. There's no way the Battier of a month ago would have let Matt Bonner blow by him, and he's more rested now than he was then.

To me he's suffering from the "smart player's curse" - he's thinking too much.

I guess we can only hope that with the limited minutes he's getting, he'll find a way to play through this funk. I think it's good that Spoelstra is at least giving him a few minutes each game to see if he can get it going. But time is obviously running out.

[Mabdul Doobakus]

I think you make fair points in most cases. The one thing I'm not buying is that he's worn out - he's barely played in two weeks. Unless he's hurt (which we have no indication of, but you never know), I think Shane's problem is a lot more mental than physical. There's no way the Battier of a month ago would have let Matt Bonner blow by him, and he's more rested now than he was then.

To me he's suffering from the "smart player's curse" - he's thinking too much.

I guess we can only hope that with the limited minutes he's getting, he'll find a way to play through this funk. I think it's good that Spoelstra is at least giving him a few minutes each game to see if he can get it going. But time is obviously running out.

The part about him being worn out I got from Heat beat reporters. I forget if he directly admitted he was worn out or what, but the theory was that after a season of playing small ball, meaning Battier has generally had to match up with guys who are bigger than him, he is just out of gas at this point. He's 34 and he's played maybe as many minutes this season as he ever has, if you account for the long playoff run, and most of those minutes, as I said, matching up with bigger players.

Of course, that may all be nonsense, and he may just be suffering mentally, or hurt, or just randomly ice cold. I don't know.

[Mabdul Doobakus]

An interesting subplot over the next couple days, while we're all busy dissecting Lebron James, will be Tony Parker's hamstring. MRI tomorrow. Tonight's results notwithstanding, I don't think the Spurs can win this series if Parker isn't close to his normal self. I hope he's OK.

[CDu]

I was very impressed by the Spurs' spacing and passing. A lot will be made of how well the Spurs shot from 3-pt range, but a big part of that shooting was a result of fantastic ball movement that resulted in wide open looks. The Spurs (assuming Parker is able to play) should provide a stiffer test to the Heat than the Pacers, because the Spurs can play defense like the Pacers but also have a very good offense.

The Heat simply can't allow Leonard and company to dominate the glass like that, and they can't afford to pack it in defensively and leave shooters open. It's going to take a lot more discipline and a lot more effort than they showed last night.

Game 4 becomes a virtual must-win for the Heat. If they lose that one, I don't see them winning 3 straight over the Spurs (unless there is an injury).

[_Gary]

I was very impressed by the Spurs' spacing and passing. A lot will be made of how well the Spurs shot from 3-pt range, but...


As well it should be. And there's not a big need for the "but" after it. Yes, a majority percentage of the Spurs three point attempts were good looks, but not all of them. Heck, the two they hit just before intermission (one by Parker fading to his right on the baseline) and the other just before the horn were defended quite well and were NOT traditional "good looks" by any stretch. The fact is the game was won because the Spurs went nuts from the outside. Plain and simple. Any other additional notes/comments on why the Heat lost are secondary to the ridiculous hot shooting.

[theAlaskanBear]

I was very impressed by the Spurs' spacing and passing. A lot will be made of how well the Spurs shot from 3-pt range, but a big part of that shooting was a result of fantastic ball movement that resulted in wide open looks. The Spurs (assuming Parker is able to play) should provide a stiffer test to the Heat than the Pacers, because the Spurs can play defense like the Pacers but also have a very good offense.

The Heat simply can't allow Leonard and company to dominate the glass like that, and they can't afford to pack it in defensively and leave shooters open. It's going to take a lot more discipline and a lot more effort than they showed last night.

Game 4 becomes a virtual must-win for the Heat. If they lose that one, I don't see them winning 3 straight over the Spurs (unless there is an injury).

Right on. When the Spurs starting clicking you could see the Miami defense melt down. Also, I might adjust the starting lineup -- Bosh Haslem James Wade and Chalmers really struggle to get going. Why not try a Bosh Miller James Wade Chalmers opening, or a have Wade and Haslem come off the bench as an energy/play-making spark after the 5 minute mark?

Clearly, Lebron has to get going earlier....

Of course, you have to tip your cap to the Spurs too, they are playing great defense. Miami only shot 10 FTs last night, you can tell it's bothering them that they won't get shooting fouls when they go into the lane.

Honestly, I have to think there has been a directive from the top to cut down on foul calls. I have really enjoyed the pace of the past three games as a result, but there are clearly cases for both the Spurs and the Heat where they should be shooting free throws.

Kawhi Leonard...he is going to be a beast in 2-3 years...I can't believe the quality of his defense on LeBron so far....they are both built the same way...most 6-7 SF are longer/slender...

[theAlaskanBear]

As well it should be. And there's not a big need for the "but" after it. Yes, a majority percentage of the Spurs three point attempts were good looks, but not all of them. Heck, the two they hit just before intermission (one by Parker fading to his right on the baseline) and the other just before the horn were defended quite well and were NOT traditional "good looks" by any stretch. The fact is the game was won because the Spurs went nuts from the outside. Plain and simple. Any other additional notes/comments on why the Heat lost are secondary to the ridiculous hot shooting.

It's true, but the Miami defense also started to melt down a little...several times they moved the ball so quickly and so well it freed up the shooter...when the run started the Miami defense was in disarray and stayed that because of the quick passing during switches....

[CDu]

As well it should be. And there's not a big need for the "but" after it. Yes, a majority percentage of the Spurs three point attempts were good looks, but not all of them. Heck, the two they hit just before intermission (one by Parker fading to his right on the baseline) and the other just before the horn were defended quite well and were NOT traditional "good looks" by any stretch. The fact is the game was won because the Spurs went nuts from the outside. Plain and simple. Any other additional notes/comments on why the Heat lost are secondary to the ridiculous hot shooting.

I disagree. Yes, the Spurs hit SOME contested 3s. But they also got a TON of wide open 3s. That they hit wide open 3s is to be expected.

But to suggest that the Spurs blew Miami out simply because they had a ridiculous shooting night is completely missing the target. The Spurs dominated every facet of the game.
- they hit 50% of their 3s (note that Miami hit 44% of theirs)
- they outrebounded Miami by 16, including 19 offensive rebounds
- they forced turnovers and got out in transition, while limiting Miami's transition opportunities
- they made the SF position a wash (thanks to a monster game by Leonard) while winning the PF and SG matchups

To suggest that everything else was secondary to the hot shooting just seems like sour grapes. San Antonio played fantastic basketball all the way around and outplayed Miami in every way in that game. The 3pt shooting was just a function of the process. There were only a handful of made 3s that were not wide open looks.

[BobbyFan]

LeBron needs to shoot the jumpers that the Spurs are daring him to take. The space they are giving him is making him uncomfortable and throwing him off, but he has to stop overthinking and just let it fly. Also, in the first half, there were a few instances in which he caught the ball in great post position, but was too slow in making his move and allowed the Spurs' help to coral him.

Miami's defensive intensity on the perimeter was night and day last night as compared to game 2, which gets highlighted when playing a team as fundamentally sound and precise as the Spurs. LeBron has actually been subpar in this aspect as well, ever since his dominating defense in the 1st half of game one. He can't allow Leonard to dominate him on the boards.

[CDu]

Why not try a Bosh Miller James Wade Chalmers opening, or a have Wade and Haslem come off the bench as an energy/play-making spark after the 5 minute mark?

The best lineup Miami has had has been the lineup with James at PF and Miller on the floor, so I would agree that this lineup should see more time. Miller is the one guy on Miami who is consistently hitting his 3s. I mean, seriously, he's 10-11 from the field (9-10 on 3s) in the series. He should be playing as much as his body will let him.

[Wander]

As well it should be. And there's not a big need for the "but" after it. Yes, a majority percentage of the Spurs three point attempts were good looks, but not all of them. Heck, the two they hit just before intermission (one by Parker fading to his right on the baseline) and the other just before the horn were defended quite well and were NOT traditional "good looks" by any stretch. The fact is the game was won because the Spurs went nuts from the outside. Plain and simple. Any other additional notes/comments on why the Heat lost are secondary to the ridiculous hot shooting.

No way. Going into the 4th quarter, the Spurs were "only" 10-23 on threes and led by 15. That's an extremely good percentage, but it's not some out of this world, oh-my-god-the-Heat-are-just-so-unlucky percentage. The Spurs would have led even if they had shot their season average on threes. In fact, not only is the three point percentage not the only reason the Spurs won, I wouldn't even say it was the primary reason - that would be the Leonard-Lebron matchup.

[wtm001]

My "Heat in 5" prediction is down the drain. :p

[CDu]

Miami's defensive intensity on the perimeter was night and day last night as compared to game 2, which gets highlighted when playing a team as fundamentally sound and precise as the Spurs. LeBron has actually been subpar in this aspect as well, ever since his dominating defense in the 1st half of game one. He can't allow Leonard to dominate him on the boards.

I think this is an issue Miami needs to address. They have been able to "out-talent" teams throughout the season. The Indiana series was the first time in these playoffs that they faced a team good enough defensively to make them work. But Indiana wasn't a very good offensive team.

The Spurs, on the other hand, are a very good defensive team AND a very good offensive team. So Miami is going to have to put forth more effort than they did against Indiana if they want to repeat as champions.

[_Gary]

Did the Spurs ball movement have the Miami defense running last night? Yes. Did that same ball movement result in open looks? Yes. But if anyone is going to tell me it's "normal" for Danny Green to hit 7 of 9 threes - even if he was wide open for a majority of them - and it's "normal" for Neil to hit 6 of 10 threes, and it's normal for Leonard to hit 2 of 3 threes, then I'm going to have to disagree. It's not normal. And that 50% 3-point percentage was with Bonner missing both his and guys like McGrady missing them late just as junk shots finishing out the game.

Where I do agree is that San Antonio played great defense, keeping the Heat from penetrating as much as they'd have liked. And they are clearly whipping Miami on the boards. No doubt about those areas. But to suggest the hot outside shooting wasn't the biggest factor in the game? No way, Jose. It WAS a big, big deal in that game last night.

[CajunDevil]

Did the Spurs ball movement have the Miami defense running last night? Yes. Did that same ball movement result in open looks? Yes. But if anyone is going to tell me it's "normal" for Danny Green to hit 7 of 9 threes - even if he was wide open for a majority of them - and it's "normal" for Neil to hit 6 of 10 threes, and it's normal for Leonard to hit 2 of 3 threes, then I'm going to have to disagree. It's not normal. And that 50% 3-point percentage was with Bonner missing both his and guys like McGrady missing them late just as junk shots finishing out the game.

Where I do agree is that San Antonio played great defense, keeping the Heat from penetrating as much as they'd have liked. And they are clearly whipping Miami on the boards. No doubt about those areas. But to suggest the hot outside shooting wasn't the biggest factor in the game? No way, Jose. It WAS a big, big deal in that game last night.

I absolutely agree Gary. Setting an NBA Finals record for 3s isn't normal... However, I think the Spurs set the tone on the first possession - going inside to Duncan and then lived in the paint (off reb and 2nd chance points), which opened things up for Neal, Leonard and Green. Go back and watch Spo's interview after the 1st Qtr where he mentions the Spurs having their way in the paint. And, then once a team starts hitting treys like the Spurs were doing the score can get out of hand rather quickly (Duke has been on both sides of these types of games).

There is no need for panic for the Heat... just as there was none after the Spurs got blown out in Game 2. With that said, the Heat are facing another "must win" game and this is when the Heat are at their best. Expect LeBron to hunt his shot early to get in a groove. Also, expect the defensive intensity to be Game 2-like, the Heat's last "must win". I can't wait to see Game 4...

[Wander]

Did the Spurs ball movement have the Miami defense running last night? Yes. Did that same ball movement result in open looks? Yes. But if anyone is going to tell me it's "normal" for Danny Green to hit 7 of 9 threes - even if he was wide open for a majority of them - and it's "normal" for Neil to hit 6 of 10 threes, and it's normal for Leonard to hit 2 of 3 threes, then I'm going to have to disagree. It's not normal. And that 50% 3-point percentage was with Bonner missing both his and guys like McGrady missing them late just as junk shots finishing out the game.


Which do you think is more abnormal - the Spurs shooting 50% or more from long range, or Lebron having zero free throw attempts?

[rsvman]

Which do you think is more abnormal - the Spurs shooting 50% or more from long range, or Lebron having zero free throw attempts?

I'm not Gary, but I'll chip in to say that both of those things are an aberration. But if you're LeBron James, you generally shoot free throws when you look to attack the basket. The Spurs apparent defensive strategy of essentially daring LeBron to beat them with mid- to long-range twos seems to have thrown him off of his usual game.

We'll see how good a coach Spoelstra is by seeing how he adjusts to this. He made some outstanding adjustments in the series against Indiana (especially when he decided to post LeBron up pretty much all game long); now he'll have to reach into his bag of tricks and come up with a new wrinkle. The series is certainly not over, but if the Heat can't come up with a victory tomorrow night it will be.

[Mabdul Doobakus]

I agree that 3 point shooting was a large part of the story, but I also don't think it was the biggest part of the story. San Antonio outplayed Miami in every aspect of the game, and as Coach Spo said over and over, Miami got what they deserved. Zach Lowe's article this morning on Grantland does a great job of going through several plays where San Antonio flat outcompeted Miami to get offensive rebounds and open looks. He's particularly unkind to Wade, Lebron, and Mike Miller, when it comes to their effort, decisions, and body language on defense and/or protecting the glass. I saw that game very much the way he did, and it does a great job of explaining why I was so frustrated with that performance.

There's a pretty strong argument to be made at this point for giving more of Wade's minutes to someone else, particularly in the second half. Battier, for instance, would probably actually provide more spacing, even if he's struggling with his shot, while providing much more hustle and better decision making on defense. The advanced metrics with Wade on the floor this postseason have been pretty alarming.

A couple tweets from the last couple days...

"The Heat have been 8.9 points better per 100 possessions when Wade is on the bench this postseason"

"LeBron w/Wade on-court in playoffs: Heat are +3.3 points per 100 possessions. LeBron with anyone else? Heat +21.8."

And this is just regarding the offensive side of the ball. Wade has been the primary culprit when it comes to slow closeouts on 3 point shooters. There's so much blame to go around with the Heat right now, though. And, yes, plenty of credit to the Spurs who won by 36 last night despite only getting 25 points (25!) from their "Big Three".

[TheItinerantSon]

As well it should be. And there's not a big need for the "but" after it. Yes, a majority percentage of the Spurs three point attempts were good looks, but not all of them. Heck, the two they hit just before intermission (one by Parker fading to his right on the baseline) and the other just before the horn were defended quite well and were NOT traditional "good looks" by any stretch. The fact is the game was won because the Spurs went nuts from the outside. Plain and simple. Any other additional notes/comments on why the Heat lost are secondary to the ridiculous hot shooting.

No. San Antonio shot the exact same percentage from three in both games 2 and 3. In game 3 for whatever reason* miami couldn't be bothered to fight through screens or execute other parts of their defensive gameplan which let the spurs get an extra twelve three point attempts fly.


*Some of this might be because miami was cheating out to the corners in game 2 and the spurs adjusted by relocating their shooters to other areas.
**the rest of this might be because dwyane wade was way too 'cool' to actually stay with danny green instead of roaming at will.

[CDu]

Did the Spurs ball movement have the Miami defense running last night? Yes. Did that same ball movement result in open looks? Yes. But if anyone is going to tell me it's "normal" for Danny Green to hit 7 of 9 threes - even if he was wide open for a majority of them - and it's "normal" for Neil to hit 6 of 10 threes, and it's normal for Leonard to hit 2 of 3 threes, then I'm going to have to disagree. It's not normal. And that 50% 3-point percentage was with Bonner missing both his and guys like McGrady missing them late just as junk shots finishing out the game.

The Spurs shot 38% from 3 this year (in both the playoffs and regular season). Applying that average to the 32 attempts they had means they "should" have hit 12 (all else being equal). And on top of that, they were just 10-23 going into the fourth quarter, yet led by 15. That 10-23 number is just one 3 better than their season and playoff average for attempts. Considering how much more wide open they were than normal, I don't think there was anything ridiculous about their shooting percentage. Slightly better than normal? Sure. Wildly out of character? No.


Where I do agree is that San Antonio played great defense, keeping the Heat from penetrating as much as they'd have liked. And they are clearly whipping Miami on the boards. No doubt about those areas. But to suggest the hot outside shooting wasn't the biggest factor in the game? No way, Jose. It WAS a big, big deal in that game last night.

Of course it was a big deal that they were hot from the outside. But to suggest hot shooting was the biggest factor in their win is just wrong. Put them at just 8-23 (i.e., below their average) after 3 and they are still up 9. Put them at just 10-32 for the game then and they still win by double digits.

The 3-pt shooting was just part of the story. They held Miami to just 33 points in the second half. They dominated the boards. They limited James to 7-21 shooting, and held Wade and Bosh to under 50% shooting as well. And aside from the otherworldly shooting of Mike Miller, they took pretty much every Heat player out of their game offensively.

The Spurs' work on the defensive end and their dominance of the glass was the reason they won. The 3 point shooting was just icing on the cake. Without the extra 3s, it's maybe a 10-15 point win. With the 3s, it's a 36 point win.

[Billy Dat]

I enjoyed reading everyone's perspective on last night's beat down. I had a few meetings today so I also caught sports radio's take on the game.

I really thought the two threes that the Spurs hit in the last 30 seconds of the first half were enormous. They had dominated the game yet were about to head to the locker room tied. Those two shots, including one buzzer beater, were stomach punches to the Heat. Ditto for Splitter's dunk off of that insane no-look pass from Manu at the 3rd quarter buzzer. Miami had just cut the Spurs lead from 20+ to 13 with a flurry of Lebron hoops. That bucket cut the momentum. While I agree that Miami showed very little last night, I thought those 3 baskets were the biggest of the game.

It is interesting that after all he accomplished last year with the NBA title and the Olympic Gold, Lebron is basically back to where he was before Game 6 against the Celtics last year - everyone doubting him and him needing to silence the critics. As I heard many say today, the story will always be about him, no matter how well the Spurs play or how bad Wade and Bosh play. That should make for a really interesting Game 4.

[Billy Dat]

Shane gets a few paragraphs in the Lowe piece:
http://www.grantland.com/blog/the-triangle/print?id=65225

"A lot of Miami's defensive breakdowns in this game, and especially the miscommunications, involved Miller. It's worth noting Shane Battier logged nearly 900 more minutes than Miller this season. Spolestra said at shootaround earlier Tuesday that he had Miller in his back pocket as a possible wild card as early as the Chicago series. Battier, to his credit, said he was happy for Miller. "He’s been a true pro,” Battier said, “and he’s seizing the opportunity.” He also noted that he was losing some of his power forward minutes to LeBron, which is kind of true, since LeBron has to guard power forwards without Battier to take that ugly job. "Last I checked, LeBron has a slight basketball advantage over me," Battier quipped. “If this were Jenga, I’d be kicking his I'm a real wanker for saying this.I'm a real wanker for saying this.I'm a real wanker for saying this..” I wonder if Spoelstra, looking for solidity on defense, might reinstate Battier in Game 4."

[theAlaskanBear]

NBA Finals leaders in stat categories:

http://i.imgur.com/Hi9Jw5t.jpg

Courtesy of macgarnickle on r/nba.

[_Gary]

I really thought the two threes that the Spurs hit in the last 30 seconds of the first half were enormous. They had dominated the game yet were about to head to the locker room tied. Those two shots, including one buzzer beater, were stomach punches to the Heat. Ditto for Splitter's dunk off of that insane no-look pass from Manu at the 3rd quarter buzzer. Miami had just cut the Spurs lead from 20+ to 13 with a flurry of Lebron hoops. That bucket cut the momentum. While I agree that Miami showed very little last night, I thought those 3 baskets were the biggest of the game.


I couldn't agree more. The two threes at the end of the half were, imho, the biggest buckets of the game. It was, as you so aptly put it, a punch to the gut for Miami. And in both those instances the shots were well defended and difficult - not wide open. They were just killer shots. Same with the dunk at the end of the third. Big momentum shift. I don't remember exactly how each quarter has ended in these finals, but my impressions are that the Spurs have hit big shots several times thus far in those situations. I distinctly remember Duncan hitting a ridiculous turnaround at the end of the half in either game 1 or 2 with no time on the clock. So my hat is off to the Spurs for really being clutch and poised as the veteran team.

I'm still surprised that some don't see the 3-point shooting in that third game as being the key. When you eliminate the shots from the less significant bench players and focus on the 3 starters and key reserves (Ginobili & Neal primarily) you get this: 16 out of 27. If you take Ginobili's out it's 16 out of 23. And that's clearly an abnormal percentage.

[CDu]

I couldn't agree more. The two threes at the end of the half were, imho, the biggest buckets of the game. It was, as you so aptly put it, a punch to the gut for Miami. And in both those instances the shots were well defended and difficult - not wide open. They were just killer shots. Same with the dunk at the end of the third. Big momentum shift. I don't remember exactly how each quarter has ended in these finals, but my impressions are that the Spurs have hit big shots several times thus far in those situations. I distinctly remember Duncan hitting a ridiculous turnaround at the end of the half in either game 1 or 2 with no time on the clock. So my hat is off to the Spurs for really being clutch and poised as the veteran team.

I'm still surprised that some don't see the 3-point shooting in that third game as being the key. When you eliminate the shots from the less significant bench players and focus on the 3 starters and key reserves (Ginobili & Neal primarily) you get this: 16 out of 27. If you take Ginobili's out it's 16 out of 23. And that's clearly an abnormal percentage.

Why are you taking Ginobili's shots and the "less significant bench players" out though? They all shot below their averages. That happens sometimes. So does better-than-average shooting nights. I mean, if you take away LeBron James, Bosh, and Chalmers, then Miami shot 7-11 on 3s. That's also abnormally high, no? You just can't cherry pick particular individuals.

No one is saying that the 3s weren't a big factor. Obviously they were. But the threes were just part of the story, and to a large degree those threes were wide open. San Antonio also dominated the glass, forced a bunch of turnovers and transition buckets, and held LeBron, Wade, and Bosh to pretty poor nights. That's just as, if not more, important as their hot 3pt shooting. Especially when you consider that they weren't abnormally hot until the 4th quarter, when the game got out of hand. At the end of 3 quarters (when the Spurs were up 15), the Spurs were "only" 10-23 from 3. That's not at all ridiculous.

If you want to say that the 3s were the biggest factor in the 4th quarter, then I'd absolutely agree. But by that point, the game was largely out of hand. Through the first 3 quarters, San Antonio shot well but not otherworldly well (in fact, Miami was shooting a higher percentage on 3s through 3 quarters). They built a comfortable lead on rebounding, defense, and solid shooting. They extended that comfortable lead into a blowout on ridiculous shooting.

[_Gary]

I included Ginobili's threes initially as one of the key reserves. I was simply pointing out that had he not been ice cold it would have been even worse. But perhaps I didn't express that well so I'll let that one go. What I'd like to know is if anyone else would concede what Billy and I saw - that the two 3's (neither of which were "wide open") hit at the end of the first half - were the biggest shots of the game. Momentum is a huge thing in every sport, but basketball in particular. And those two shots to finish off the half after Miami, playing subpar, had tied the game were monstrous as far as I'm concerned. Thoughts?

[CDu]

I included Ginobili's threes initially as one of the key reserves. I was simply pointing out that had he not been ice cold it would have been even worse. But perhaps I didn't express that well so I'll let that one go. What I'd like to know is if anyone else would concede what Billy and I saw - that the two 3's (neither of which were "wide open") hit at the end of the first half - were the biggest shots of the game. Momentum is a huge thing in every sport, but basketball in particular. And those two shots to finish off the half after Miami, playing subpar, had tied the game were monstrous as far as I'm concerned. Thoughts?

Those two 3s at the end of the half were indeed huge. They completely turned the momentum. They didn't decide the game, but they certainly stopped Miami's momentum. On that, I completely agree. I don't see that as any sort of concession.

But "ridiculous, out of their mind" shooting is certainly not the biggest reason why San Antonio won the game.

[Des Esseintes]

Those two 3s at the end of the half were indeed huge. They completely turned the momentum. They didn't decide the game, but they certainly stopped Miami's momentum. On that, I completely agree. I don't see that as any sort of concession.

But "ridiculous, out of their mind" shooting is certainly not the biggest reason why San Antonio won the game.

Miami: 77 points. I think the events that led to that number are probably pretty important, and probably unaffected by San Antonio threes.

[JasonEvans]

Miami: 77 points. I think the events that led to that number are probably pretty important, and probably unaffected by San Antonio threes.

Well, that just isn't true at all. When you start to get blown out you take more chances on offense because that is what you need to do to get back in the game. You shoot more threes and more rushed shots than in a close game. You cannot afford to work the clock and get the best shot possible. This says nothing of the general effort a team puts out when the score gets to be lopsided and they know they are going to lose.

Yes, Miami had a bad game offensively, but to imply that San Antonio's offensive onslaught did not affect Miami's entire game is just plain wrong in my opinion.

-Jason "in the off-season, I think Miami needs to trade Chris Bosh for someone with a low-post game who can rebound... rebounding is a huge problem for this team" Evans

[Wander]

-Jason "in the off-season, I think Miami needs to trade Chris Bosh for someone with a low-post game who can rebound... rebounding is a huge problem for this team" Evans

I don't know. I sort of agree, but looking at the "advanced stats" for Miami during the playoffs, it seems pretty apparent that the Heat's biggest problem is just that Dwayne Wade has been pretty bad in the postseason.

[CDu]

Well, that just isn't true at all. When you start to get blown out you take more chances on offense because that is what you need to do to get back in the game. You shoot more threes and more rushed shots than in a close game. You cannot afford to work the clock and get the best shot possible. This says nothing of the general effort a team puts out when the score gets to be lopsided and they know they are going to lose.

Yes, Miami had a bad game offensively, but to imply that San Antonio's offensive onslaught did not affect Miami's entire game is just plain wrong in my opinion.

-Jason "in the off-season, I think Miami needs to trade Chris Bosh for someone with a low-post game who can rebound... rebounding is a huge problem for this team" Evans

I disagree. After three quarters, the Heat had just 63 points. At that point, the Spurs hadn't really gone off from 3pt range (that happened in the 4th). The Spurs defense most certainly preceeded the barrage of 3s. Things certainly got worse for Miami in the 4th, but they were already pretty bad by that point.

[pfrduke]

I disagree. After three quarters, the Heat had just 63 points. At that point, the Spurs hadn't really gone off from 3pt range (that happened in the 4th). The Spurs defense most certainly preceeded the barrage of 3s. Things certainly got worse for Miami in the 4th, but they were already pretty bad by that point.

The Spurs were 10-23 after 3 quarters. That's pretty darn good. San Antonio's defensive strategy (packing the paint on James and Wade and forcing them to shoot jumpers) still gets the lion's share of the credit, but there was some desperation starting to become evident in Miami's offensive strategy even in the third quarter, in part because SA kept hitting shots.

[CDu]

The Spurs were 10-23 after 3 quarters. That's pretty darn good. San Antonio's defensive strategy (packing the paint on James and Wade and forcing them to shoot jumpers) still gets the lion's share of the credit, but there was some desperation starting to become evident in Miami's offensive strategy even in the third quarter, in part because SA kept hitting shots.

10-23 is just one made 3 above their season average. No doubt that it's good, but it isn't uncharacteristically good. The Spurs are simply a very good 3pt shooting team. It wasn't until the fourth (when San Antonio went 6-9) that the 3pt shooting got ridiculous.

It's interesting that you mention the desperation in the third quarter, because the Spurs actually shot "only" right at their season average (3-8) that quarter.

The third quarter run was not fueled by unexpectedly good 3pt shooting. It was fueled by turnovers (Miami committed 5 in the third) and offensive rebounds (the Spurs got 6 in the quarter).

[Billy Dat]

My take, based on my own eyes and everything I have read and listened to, is that Miami's poor defense the entire series, save for the stretch of amazing defense they played during the 3rd and first half of the 4th quarter of Game 2, is the primary reason they are down 2-1. I'd rank Miami's inability to attack San Antonio's various defensive looks with the proper strategy as the second most prominent reason, and then, in third place, I'd put San Antonio's offensive execution. All 3 pieces are important. I guess point #2 could simply be praise for San Antonio's defense, but I feel like Miami could be beating it if they, in Jeff Van Gundy's words, took what they were being given.

There is a lot of speculation that the talk about "I feel like I am back in Cleveland" and "Lebron can't play like he is in Cleveland - we all need to contribute" talk from the end of the Pacers series has left Lebron in second guess mode. As a person who aims to please, he doesn't want the criticism of his peers and is therefore being too deferential. This isn't my original thought, but I guess it's the kind of chatter that breaks out once the stats angles and X and O angles have been exhausted. The headline - "MJ never cared what anyone thought, he did whatever needed to be done to win!!!" I mean, are Kawhi Leonard and Danny Green as the frontline of a wall of San Antonio defenders going to continue to keep LBJ off the line, the rim, and out of the lane?

I am in Miami for work tonight and will try and watch the game out among the people. It should be a doozy.

[theAlaskanBear]

My take, based on my own eyes and everything I have read and listened to, is that Miami's poor defense the entire series, save for the stretch of amazing defense they played during the 3rd and first half of the 4th quarter of Game 2, is the primary reason they are down 2-1. I'd rank Miami's inability to attack San Antonio's various defensive looks with the proper strategy as the second most prominent reason, and then, in third place, I'd put San Antonio's offensive execution. All 3 pieces are important. I guess point #2 could simply be praise for San Antonio's defense, but I feel like Miami could be beating it if they, in Jeff Van Gundy's words, took what they were being given.

There is a lot of speculation that the talk about "I feel like I am back in Cleveland" and "Lebron can't play like he is in Cleveland - we all need to contribute" talk from the end of the Pacers series has left Lebron in second guess mode. As a person who aims to please, he doesn't want the criticism of his peers and is therefore being too deferential. This isn't my original thought, but I guess it's the kind of chatter that breaks out once the stats angles and X and O angles have been exhausted. The headline - "MJ never cared what anyone thought, he did whatever needed to be done to win!!!" I mean, are Kawhi Leonard and Danny Green as the frontline of a wall of San Antonio defenders going to continue to keep LBJ off the line, the rim, and out of the lane?

I am in Miami for work tonight and will try and watch the game out among the people. It should be a doozy.

I am a big believer in point # 2. Spurs Defense. They saw the Bosh-Wade struggle in the Indiana series, and they set the defense accordingly. Kawhi Leonards defense has been fantastic -- he has not been called for a foul on LeBron James the entire series. He is playing, tough, clean defense, and gets tons of help from his team when James takes it into the lane.

The idea that LeBron simply has to flip an aggression switch and the Heat will win is crazy. When he is shooting over 2-3 defenders in the paint (esp Duncan, Splitter, and Leonard who are all long and very good defenders) it's going to be difficult and its going to be a low percentage. As a result James has been passing to the shooters because its the right basketball play and because that is how Miami plays -- that's the way they played all year.

He's not getting lanes to basket and they are giving him open looks outside. Now, he shot a really great percentage from those kind of jumpshots during the season....but its the playoffs...you take your chances on those shots. The Spurs game plan has been close to flawless.

I think, I hope, the Heat come out and win tonight with a big game from LeBron, but we will have to see...that's why they play the game folks.

[pfrduke]

10-23 is just one made 3 above their season average. No doubt that it's good, but it isn't uncharacteristically good. The Spurs are simply a very good 3pt shooting team. It wasn't until the fourth (when San Antonio went 6-9) that the 3pt shooting got ridiculous.

It's interesting that you mention the desperation in the third quarter, because the Spurs actually shot "only" right at their season average (3-8) that quarter.

The third quarter run was not fueled by unexpectedly good 3pt shooting. It was fueled by turnovers (Miami committed 5 in the third) and offensive rebounds (the Spurs got 6 in the quarter).

It's not just percentage, it's also volume. The Spurs make 8.5 3's a game, so they should be at just over 6 through three quarters. Instead, they were at 10. Making 10 3's through three quarters - and shooting at a high percentage while doing so - is a lot.

Again, I'm not arguing that their defense isn't the primary reason that they held the Heat to 77 points. All I'm saying is that their effective offensive performance, including better than usual outside shooting, helped make their defense better.

[CDu]

It's not just percentage, it's also volume. The Spurs make 8.5 3's a game, so they should be at just over 6 through three quarters. Instead, they were at 10. Making 10 3's through three quarters - and shooting at a high percentage while doing so - is a lot.

Again, I'm not arguing that their defense isn't the primary reason that they held the Heat to 77 points. All I'm saying is that their effective offensive performance, including better than usual outside shooting, helped make their defense better.

Volume is a function of what is available. The 3s were what Miami was giving the Spurs. So the 3s are what they took. It doesn't matter what the volume is. It matters that the volume is comprised of good attempts within the flow of the offense.

Through 3 quarters, the Spurs shot well from 3 pt range. They didn't shoot excessively well. They took more 3pt attempts than normal (in part because they got a TON of offensive rebounds and in part because Miami had poor floor coverage on defense) and they probably took fewer 2s than normal.

And I don't think it's really accurate that their effective offense made their defense notably better - at least not until the 4th quarter, where Miami was clearly in desperation mode. The Heat were certainly effective offensively in spurts even into the third quarter. And one of those spurts came after the Spurs started pulling away in the 3rd quarter.

It's just that San Antonio forced Miami out of their comfort zone offensively by packing in their defense and preventing driving angles, and the Heat didn't respond well to that approach.

[Billy Dat]

Man, tinkering with the starting line-up in the Finals? I don't think that's a good sign.

I have been listening to Dan LeBatard show for the past hour. It's funny, I am used to sports radio shows that are dominated by callers, but these guys do a lot of talking amongst themselves. LeBatard is chastising his listeners for getting rattled.

[Billy Dat]

Shane on Heat woes:
http://blogs.palmbeachpost.com/heatzone/2013/06/13/what-does-shane-battier-see-in-heat-offense-and-defense/

Offense:
“We have not been able to create space effectively, so as a result we are allowing them to have multiple guys in the paint,” Battier said. “We just haven’t found an effective way to space them, to allow our attackers driving lanes. And it seems like a lot of the shots we get are tough shots. We are asking a lot without those lanes. The way we get those lanes is we have to run our offense at a higher pace, get into it quicker, move the ball side to side, and then we are able to run more effective offense.”

Defense:
“That was their best game of ball movement,” Battier said. “And it starts with our ball pressure. If we allow drives and a lot of penetration, then we’re forcing the help situation. And every time moves the ball better at home, but this team especially. We have to contain the ball, keep it out of the paint, and that will flatten them out a little bit more.”

[Des Esseintes]

Volume is a function of what is available. The 3s were what Miami was giving the Spurs. So the 3s are what they took. It doesn't matter what the volume is. It matters that the volume is comprised of good attempts within the flow of the offense.

Through 3 quarters, the Spurs shot well from 3 pt range. They didn't shoot excessively well. They took more 3pt attempts than normal (in part because they got a TON of offensive rebounds and in part because Miami had poor floor coverage on defense) and they probably took fewer 2s than normal.

And I don't think it's really accurate that their effective offense made their defense notably better - at least not until the 4th quarter, where Miami was clearly in desperation mode. The Heat were certainly effective offensively in spurts even into the third quarter. And one of those spurts came after the Spurs started pulling away in the 3rd quarter.

It's just that San Antonio forced Miami out of their comfort zone offensively by packing in their defense and preventing driving angles, and the Heat didn't respond well to that approach.

I'm mostly with you, but pfr raises a good point I'd overlooked. Volume absolutely matters. In fact, most available evidence suggests it trumps quality. Someone did a study a while back, which of course I can't remember right now, but the results were fascinating. Just as in baseball where it turns out that a pitcher has oddly little control of opponent batting average on balls in play, a basketball defense has oddly little control over opponent three percentage. The study found that lots of bad defenses had low opponent three % and lots of good defenses had high opponent three %. What actually mattered was limiting attempts. The best Ds managed to discourage opposing offenses from putting up threes, and it was this discouragement that had a decisive effect.

Now, a one-game sample is obviously not the same as a season's results. But I think pfr makes a strong point that merely getting up so many three balls was a huge win for San Antonio's O and indicated something special was taking place beyond a slight overperformance of expected results. I still agree with you that deep shooting was not the whole story of the game, but I'm closer to the center on this issue than I was when the conversation started.

[Des Esseintes]

Man, tinkering with the starting line-up in the Finals? I don't think that's a good sign.

I have been listening to Dan LeBatard show for the past hour. It's funny, I am used to sports radio shows that are dominated by callers, but these guys do a lot of talking amongst themselves. LeBatard is chastising his listeners for getting rattled.

Maybe not, but it might have won the Thunder a title last year.

[g-money]

Call me crazy, but I think this is the game where Battier turns things around. Just have a feeling.

If I'm wrong, hopefully the mods will be kind enough to wipe this post - preferably before Google's web crawler finds it and etches it in digital stone. :)

[_Gary]

All I know, early on in game 4, is that inserting Miller into the starting lineup has been a H-U-G-E mistaken gamble by Spoelstra. He's been lost on defense (no shock) and contributed to one or two turnovers already on offense. And of course, the Spurs are 3 for 3 in threes to begin. But of course that's to be expected. [insert sarcastic eye roll here]

[CDu]

Good first quarter from the Heat, both offensively and on the defensive glass. Wade appears to have put on his big boy pants tonight

[_Gary]

Shane getting some good minutes here and delivering on everything except his shot, which is unfortunately still ice cold.

[_Gary]

Unbelievable. The Spurs are just MONEY at closing out quarters and especially the half in each of these Finals. If the Heat lose this game the last 2 1/2 minutes of the first half will be a big reason why.

[Mabdul Doobakus]

Vintage D Wade. Where has this been? Making plays on both defense and offense, making good decisions, making his jumper, even getting some easy shots for his teammates. I can't remember the last time D Wade was the best player on the floor. Hardly a knock on Lebron tonight, but this has been largely D Wade's game. All of the Big 3 have been excellent, though. Bosh has been a presence in the paint tonight.

Spurs still hitting a ridiculous clip form 3, but they're getting less open looks tonight. 8-16 is better than 16-32. Make them put in on the floor.

Ginobli, meanwhile, is killing his team. He's been awful.

6 minutes. Can the Heat close?

[Billy Dat]

Vintage D Wade. Where has this been? Making plays on both defense and offense, making good decisions, making his jumper, even getting some easy shots for his teammates. I can't remember the last time D Wade was the best player on the floor. Hardly a knock on Lebron tonight, but this has been largely D Wade's game. All of the Big 3 have been excellent, though. Bosh has been a presence in the paint tonight.

Spurs still hitting a ridiculous clip form 3, but they're getting less open looks tonight. 8-16 is better than 16-32. Make them put in on the floor.

Ginobli, meanwhile, is killing his team. He's been awful.

6 minutes. Can the Heat close?

Well said all around...Wade, Bosh, Lebron, Team D. This is what the Big 3 is supposed to do. Interesting that aside from Game 1, each game has been a decisive victory.

[BobbyFan]

Vintage D Wade. Where has this been? Making plays on both defense and offense, making good decisions, making his jumper, even getting some easy shots for his teammates.

It was there during the regular season. It hasn't been there during the playoffs because of his injury - a bone bruise. Or so we're told... I've seen the guy move and leap on occasion like he has in his best days even before this game in this year's playoffs. I don't mean to speculate, but I just did.

Either way, the bottom line is if Wade really is near healthy (and, perhaps more importantly, willing to give it his all), then the Heat can resume their regular season dominance and they will win the title. If not, then we still have a series.

[Des Esseintes]

Vintage D Wade. Where has this been? Making plays on both defense and offense, making good decisions, making his jumper, even getting some easy shots for his teammates. I can't remember the last time D Wade was the best player on the floor. Hardly a knock on Lebron tonight, but this has been largely D Wade's game. All of the Big 3 have been excellent, though. Bosh has been a presence in the paint tonight.


I assume it's because D. Wade is Spawn (http://www.thespawnsite.com/spawn_powers.aspx). He has a limited amount of necroplasm at his disposal, which he can use to accomplish basically anything (i.e. shapeshift, resurrect the dead, eurostep Danny Green, etc). However, when it runs out, it runs out, and he will be pulled down to H*ll. If that were the case, I'd husband my powers carefully, too.

[theAlaskanBear]

Did anyone else vomit in their mouths at the Roy Williams camera shot? Why is it when I see Danny Green on the screen I get tense and angry and hateful just like those Duke-Carolina games?

[tommy]

I just couldn't believe how many on this board and elsewhere were so ready to write the Heat off after Game 3. Nobody seemed to remember that two nights earlier, in Game 2, they had put a 33-5 beatdown of a run on those same Spurs. 33-5! And somehow everyone seemed to forget that this is a team that, when healthy, put together a 27 game winning streak, second longest in the history of the league. Whatever deficiencies they have or have had, whether they be rebounding or turnovers or consistency of defensive intensity or post presence, somehow they managed to go 37-2 in their last 39 regular season games and 12-4 in the playoffs coming into the Finals. Somehow.

The media and many fans have just been lurching back and forth after every game from "the Heat is too good, Lebron is too good, it's inevitable they'll win it, it's over" to "the Heat has been exposed, the Heat is too old, it's just a Big 1 now, it's over" and back again. The Heat's Big 3 is no more? What about the Spurs' Big 3? Manu Ginobili has been a non-factor in this series. Were it not for the shocking performances of Dancing Danny Green and Gary Neal, the Spurs would've been in very deep doo doo earlier in this series.

Games 3 and 4 have both been described as "must wins" for the Spurs and Heat, respectively. Nonsense. These are both savvy, experienced, diverse, talented teams with championship experience, and both have won plenty of tough games, plenty of difficult games on the road, and neither would have been dead had they lost these "must" games 3 or 4. Now Game 5 is a different story. That is a "must" for the Spurs. They could win one back in Miami, but it'd be hard, real hard, to see them winning two more back there.

[ice-9]

I'm mostly with you, but pfr raises a good point I'd overlooked. Volume absolutely matters. In fact, most available evidence suggests it trumps quality. Someone did a study a while back, which of course I can't remember right now, but the results were fascinating. Just as in baseball where it turns out that a pitcher has oddly little control of opponent batting average on balls in play, a basketball defense has oddly little control over opponent three percentage. The study found that lots of bad defenses had low opponent three % and lots of good defenses had high opponent three %. What actually mattered was limiting attempts. The best Ds managed to discourage opposing offenses from putting up threes, and it was this discouragement that had a decisive effect.

Now, a one-game sample is obviously not the same as a season's results. But I think pfr makes a strong point that merely getting up so many three balls was a huge win for San Antonio's O and indicated something special was taking place beyond a slight overperformance of expected results. I still agree with you that deep shooting was not the whole story of the game, but I'm closer to the center on this issue than I was when the conversation started.

I believe you saw that from KenPom: http://kenpom.com/blog/index.php/weblog/entry/the_boeheim_exception

[Mabdul Doobakus]

I just couldn't believe how many on this board and elsewhere were so ready to write the Heat off after Game 3. Nobody seemed to remember that two nights earlier, in Game 2, they had put a 33-5 beatdown of a run on those same Spurs. 33-5! And somehow everyone seemed to forget that this is a team that, when healthy, put together a 27 game winning streak, second longest in the history of the league. Whatever deficiencies they have or have had, whether they be rebounding or turnovers or consistency of defensive intensity or post presence, somehow they managed to go 37-2 in their last 39 regular season games and 12-4 in the playoffs coming into the Finals. Somehow.

The media and many fans have just been lurching back and forth after every game from "the Heat is too good, Lebron is too good, it's inevitable they'll win it, it's over" to "the Heat has been exposed, the Heat is too old, it's just a Big 1 now, it's over" and back again. The Heat's Big 3 is no more? What about the Spurs' Big 3? Manu Ginobili has been a non-factor in this series. Were it not for the shocking performances of Dancing Danny Green and Gary Neal, the Spurs would've been in very deep doo doo earlier in this series.

Games 3 and 4 have both been described as "must wins" for the Spurs and Heat, respectively. Nonsense. These are both savvy, experienced, diverse, talented teams with championship experience, and both have won plenty of tough games, plenty of difficult games on the road, and neither would have been dead had they lost these "must" games 3 or 4. Now Game 5 is a different story. That is a "must" for the Spurs. They could win one back in Miami, but it'd be hard, real hard, to see them winning two more back there.

You're definitely right about way too much knee-jerking, but that's the nature of sports conversation these days, and maybe it always has been and I just can't remember that far back.

I think the term "must win" is used way too much. They're all important games, but we've definitely diluted the meaning of that term. As a Heat fan, I didn't even see tonight as a must win, because I have no doubt this team can win 3 games in a row, 2 at a home, even against the Spurs. You don't want to have to do that, but they can do it.

The Heat made a much more concerted effort to close out on shooters and protect the glass and I think that made a big difference. I agree with whoever said upthread that starting Miller was a mistake. When I heard that they were thinking about doing that late in the afternoon, I didn't think it was a good idea then. I think Miller still has a role coming off the bench, but I want to see more defense out there with my starting unit. In fact, I think I'm coming back around to the idea of starting Battier. I liked the minutes he gave Miami. He still can't hit a shot, but he'll make the right decisions on defense. I'm sure Miller had some impact in terms of spacing, and it's up to the people who watch game tapes to decide how important that is, but he didn't give the Heat much else. Then again, maybe I'm just guilty of knee-jerking here. Hell, before this game I was ready to start giving some of Wade's minutes away.

It's getting late in the series now, so we'll see if the Heat can finally maintain some intensity coming off a win. If they do, and if San Antonio doesn't play a great game Sunday, they could put a stranglehold on this thing.

[CDu]

Miami held San Antonio to just 5 offensive rebounds after allowing 19 offensive rebounds in game 3. And they got monster performances from their big 3, unlike in game 3 when all three were below average. If that continues to happen, Miami will continue to win.

San Antonio is going to have to defend better, get back to winning the boards, and get Manu Ginobili going. He's been a non-factor in these Finals so far, and I don't think San Antonio can expect to win 2 of 3 without more contributions from him.

Game 4 was a "close-to-must-win" for Miami. But Game 5 is a must-win for San Antonio.

[theAlaskanBear]

Miami held San Antonio to just 5 offensive rebounds after allowing 19 offensive rebounds in game 3. And they got monster performances from their big 3, unlike in game 3 when all three were below average. If that continues to happen, Miami will continue to win.

San Antonio is going to have to defend better, get back to winning the boards, and get Manu Ginobili going. He's been a non-factor in these Finals so far, and I don't think San Antonio can expect to win 2 of 3 without more contributions from him.

Game 4 was a "close-to-must-win" for Miami. But Game 5 is a must-win for San Antonio.

The only must-wins are elimination games.

I will say, the Heats offense is reliant on turnovers. It's amazing how much more efficient and aggressive the Heat can be on offense when they are forcing turnovers on D. It's amazing how great of a defender Dwayne Wade can be when he plays with effort. He needs to come out with the same level of play on Sunday.

Btw, Battier was +13 in just 8 minutes for the Heat. Despite not hitting a shot, he played great defense (block on Duncan!), was really blocking out. He was getting so low into the Spurs bodies he was falling over while accomplishing the box-outs. He should probably be seeing 10-15 minutes a game offense or not....

[_Gary]

Btw, Battier was +13 in just 8 minutes for the Heat. Despite not hitting a shot, he played great defense (block on Duncan!), was really blocking out. He was getting so low into the Spurs bodies he was falling over while accomplishing the box-outs. He should probably be seeing 10-15 minutes a game offense or not....

Absolutely agree. Shane was more than solid while he was in the game with his defense. I hope he sees a few more minutes going forward.

[rsvman]

It's the nature of sports commentary (and perhaps sports marketing) to vacillate wildly with made-up absolutes between games in a series. It raises more interest in the series, which, in turn, raises more money. And that's what the NBA is all about, after all.


I saw a totally different Wade out there last night than in the prior games, as did all of you. I don't know why he turns it off and then turns it on, or whether his injury waxes and wanes, or what. Bosh played a lot harder, too. When all of the big three play well, you're going to lose to Miami.

I believe it was Pat Riley who so succinctly stated, "No rebounds, no trophy." That message apparently got through, because rebounding by the Heat was miles better than it had been in the prior game.

I think the outcome of the series is still in question, but my original prediction was Heat in six. They may still accomplish that, or they may require seven, but I stick with the Heat as the eventual winners.

[CDu]

It's the nature of sports commentary (and perhaps sports marketing) to vacillate wildly with made-up absolutes between games in a series. It raises more interest in the series, which, in turn, raises more money. And that's what the NBA is all about, after all.

To be fair, realistically speaking, a loss to the Spurs in game 4 would have all but eliminated them. The Spurs haven't lost 3 straight games with their "big 3" playing all season. Heck, they haven't lost back-to-back games with their "big 3" playing since December. So while Miami is a very good team, to expect them to beat the Spurs 3 straight times might be asking too much. Possible, but unlikely.

Similarly, Game 5 is not literally a must-win for the Spurs. But realistically it is. If they lose that game, they'll have to win twice in a row in Miami to win the series. Miami hasn't lost twice in a row at all since January, and the haven't lost twice in a row at home all season.

So while it's not literally a must-win game for the Spurs (just like it wasn't literally a must-win game in Game 4 for Miami), it might as well be. Because if Miami had lost game 4, they weren't winning the title. And if San Antonio loses game 5, they aren't winning the title.


I saw a totally different Wade out there last night than in the prior games, as did all of you. I don't know why he turns it off and then turns it on, or whether his injury waxes and wanes, or what. Bosh played a lot harder, too. When all of the big three play well, you're going to lose to Miami.

I believe it was Pat Riley who so succinctly stated, "No rebounds, no trophy." That message apparently got through, because rebounding by the Heat was miles better than it had been in the prior game.

I think the outcome of the series is still in question, but my original prediction was Heat in six. They may still accomplish that, or they may require seven, but I stick with the Heat as the eventual winners.

Yeah, the VASTLY improved showing by the Heat's stars (especially Wade, but also James and Bosh), along with VASTLY improved defensive rebounding and improved effort on chasing down Spurs shooters was the difference in Game 4. When Miami gets star production from their three stars and are able to limit offensive rebounds, they are a dynamite team. It will be interesting to see if they keep it up in Game 5 or if they take their foot off the gas again like they seem so willing to do at times.

[Troublemaker]

Will these two teams cease alternating wins now? I'm leaning towards yes. That felt like a series-changer for Miami, for a few reasons.

1. Confirmation that Wade and Bosh are healthy enough, which we weren't sure about until Game 4 happened. Maybe they can't play like that every game, but they can at least draw from the well for the crucial games (like Game 7 vs Indiana), and every game is crucial from here on out. The Spurs have Miami's complete attention at this point, I believe. And with Wade, if his "where did this come from" level of play last night was related to a cortisone injection, maybe he WILL have enough to finish out the season at a consistently high level. So much of sports just comes down to injury luck and injury management, like the timing of when to use the dreaded cortisone shot.

2. Miami may have figured something out gameplan-wise. I like that they deployed James and Wade full-time on San Antonio's hot shooters instead of spending any time on Parker, and that the Heat emphasized extending the defense and closing out strong, reducing San Antonio's 3-pt attempts to a mere 16. The flipside of that emphasis is that the Spurs got more shot attempts near the rim, which led to an increase in fouls for Miami, an increase in FTs for the Spurs, and an increase in blocked shots for Miami since those at-the-rim contests occurred more frequently. Miami played small the entire game, with Haslem being used purely as Bosh's backup. But Miami can do that. That's kind of what made them special in the first place, that they can play small-ball, contest shooters, but still recover to protect the rim using the athleticism of the Big 3 and Shane's defensive instincts (Shane was +13 in 8 minutes of play). I think Miami should continue with the emphasis on shutting down San Antonio's three-pointers, and maybe, just maybe, Duncan and Ginobili don't quite finish the 2-pt attempts near the rim like in their heyday and this will continue.

3. The Spurs young shooters with no NBA Finals experience are going to have a bad shooting day at some point. Game 4's margin of victory of 16 was arguably misleadingly close. Miami controlled the game basically from beginning to end, the Big 3 played awesome simultaneously, and usually this would've been a 20+ point victory except the Spurs once again were hitting 50% from three. I think this stops in Game 5. The pressure's on now. Like I said, this was the first game that Miami controlled (even Game 2's "blowout" was a game the Spurs controlled until late in the third quarter). Now is the first time San Antonio has any reason to believe they aren't the better team in this series. The Spurs' young shooters were able to let it fly freely and confidently prior to this upcoming Game 5, but now this is a "must win." With perhaps a little bit of doubt creeping in about who's the better team, and knowing that they are now marked men by Lebron and Wade, et al on closeouts and that they may have to do more than just spot-up on offense, and then add the pressure of not going down 3-2 heading back to Miami, I think the young role players finally crack. I predict at some point in Game 5, ABC will put up a graphic of how the Spurs shot 50% (or whatever) from three in Games 1-4 but are only 2 for 13 (or something) in Game 5. And unless Duncan and Ginobili finish at a higher rate around the rim and/or get Miami's Big 3 into huge foul trouble, San Antonio indeed will go back to Miami down 3-2.

[Mabdul Doobakus]

Sounds like Ginobli is starting tonight? It will be interesting to see how that works out, because after 4 games in this series, I wouldn't have made the argument that more Ginobli is a good thing. He's been awful. But after Wade's Game 4, I'm not counting anyone out. Wouldn't surprise me at all to see Ginobli get hot tonight.

I'm hopeful we'll see another strong 48 minute effort from the Heat tonight. We all know this game is more critical for the Spurs, but the Heat have to look at that and say, ok, if we win, everyone's going to be saying this series is over (whether that's true is an argument we can have later, if the Heat win). The pattern for the Heat the past 2 years has been to start the series slow and then turn it on late. I'm pretty sure they've been behind in a majority of series the last two years, but on the flip side, I'm pretty sure they haven't lost a single close out game. This isn't a close out game, but they ought to play like it is. The Spurs, on the other hand, are a smart and composed veteran team who are probably looking at this game as their last stand. I'm expecting a very intense one tonight.

On a side note, I'm a little disappointed in Hootie, singing the national anthem in the Spurs building. He's a huge Dolphins fan. No Heat love?

[Mabdul Doobakus]

Stop the presses. Battier made a shot.

Spurs playing at a very high level so far.

[TheItinerantSon]

Stop the presses. Battier made a shot.

Spurs playing at a very high level so far.

battier completely embracing the dark arts...back to back possessions with calculated shoves leading to fast-breaks for miami.

[jipops]

Can any of these games be close? Spurs on the attack early in the shot clock. Can San Antonio continue playing this pace with Miami? Heat need to make some perimeter shots.

[TheItinerantSon]

wow battier not looking good on these replays...

not much else to say...

[Mabdul Doobakus]

The Spurs score at the end of every quarter. It's ridiculous.

I don't think the Heat are in too bad of a place. Down only 9 when they were shooting under 28% midway through the 2nd quarter, and the Spurs have been over 60% all game. I think the effort for Miami has been fine for the most part, especially Bosh, who had at least 2 or 3 offensive rebounds and putbacks. Wade and James seemed to really pick it up midway through the 2nd. Miami had about a 5 minute stretch at the end of the first where they stopped passing the ball, and that's pretty much the difference in the game right now.

The Spurs are playing great, and sometimes it's about what the other team is doing than what you're doing. We'll see if they can keep that up in the 2nd half...between age and injuries, will they be able to come out of halftime and give the same performance? One thing's for sure...Danny Green is not missing any 3's. Ever. I'm seeing that guy in my nightmares these days.

I do have to say, though, that the point guard play for Miami was horrendous. Chalmers, in particular, was awful on both ends of the floor. Taking low quality shots and missing them; doing that play where he runs towards the baseline realizes he's about to run out of room and then tries to desperately throw the ball past 3 defenders to the shooter waiting on the wing; stopping under the basket while Danny Green runs right past him for a wide open 3. Meanwhile, Parker has figured out that Cole can't stop him, and for some reason Miami's post players aren't coming over to help when Parker gets by Cole. I don't really need to see either point guard for the rest of this game. Battier gave good minutes, hit a couple of shots, and should be in line for another 15 minutes or so in the 2nd half. I think he's earned his way back into the rotation.

[Mabdul Doobakus]

Oh no. The Spurs screaming lady is back. Like just screaming her head off during halftime for no reason.

[Newton_14]

For the love of God will someone please guard Danny Green. This is unbelievable. He is shooting at Ray Allen levels. I guess Wade did not go to Gernany to see Dr Feel Good before this game.

The Heat can still win this but their defense has got to improve. Parker is slicing them up and Green is flat killing them with the 3 Ball.

[g-money]

For the love of God will someone please guard Danny Green. This is unbelievable. He is shooting at Ray Allen levels. I guess Wade did not go to Gernany to see Dr Feel Good before this game.

The Heat can still win this but their defense has got to improve. Parker is slicing them up and Green is flat killing them with the 3 Ball.

Is there any doubt that Battier would do better on Green than Miller? Spoelstra should give it a try.

[darthur]

For the love of God will someone please guard Danny Green. This is unbelievable. He is shooting at Ray Allen levels. I guess Wade did not go to Gernany to see Dr Feel Good before this game.

The Heat can still win this but their defense has got to improve. Parker is slicing them up and Green is flat killing them with the 3 Ball.

Yeah it's crazy. I guess the Heat are having trouble getting set with the constant ball-pushing, but I don't know why they would help off Green ever. He may not be as good as Parker in general, but nobody's more dangerous when helped off.

[Mabdul Doobakus]

Is there any doubt that Battier would do better on Green than Miller? Spoelstra should give it a try.

I think he's saving Battier for the last 15 minutes or so. Mike Miller played the first 8-9 minutes of the first half, and I'm expecting the same here. Miller hasn't done anything these last 2 games except provide spacing, and I'm sure Spo recognizes that.

Didn't like Lebron's body language/hustle after he missed those layups there. Gotta run back on D. Next play. Bosh is the one guy who continues to treat this like a Game 7. Very impressed with him the last two nights.

Only four down, but they gotta keep pushing.

[jipops]

Looks like another double digit finish coming. Can Miami win 2 games at home?

[Mabdul Doobakus]

That 30 footer by Green touched off 3 minutes of very bad basketball by Miami...bad shots, turnovers. I'm sure the Heat are getting frustrated by the ridiculous percentages he's putting up, but you just gotta play through those.

[TheItinerantSon]

That 30 footer by Green touched off 3 minutes of very bad basketball by Miami...bad shots, turnovers. I'm sure the Heat are getting frustrated by the ridiculous percentages he's putting up, but you just gotta play through those.

as a team spurs are 7/18 from three...

if one guy happens to be hitting a disproportionate number of those and it leaves you discombobulated...thats just a lack of mental toughness.

[CDu]

We have seen a glimpse of the old Manu tonight. The off-balance leaners - just vintage stuff. It is looking like Miami will need all 7 if they are going to repeat.

[Mabdul Doobakus]

as a team spurs are 7/18 from three...

if one guy happens to be hitting a disproportionate number of those and it leaves you discombobulated...thats just a lack of mental toughness.

I completely agree with you, but the Heat have quit on this game again. Maybe I'm just imposing my own narrative on this game, but they really seemed to lose their composure right at that point. The next shot was a Dwyane Wade fade away 18 footer with 10 seconds left on the clock, and then Ginobli got that 3 point play, and before you know it the Spurs are on a 19-1 run, or something like that.

[TheItinerantSon]

I completely agree with you, but the Heat have quit on this game again. Maybe I'm just imposing my own narrative on this game, but they really seemed to lose their composure right at that point. The next shot was a Dwyane Wade fade away 18 footer with 10 seconds left on the clock, and then Ginobli got that 3 point play, and before you know it the Spurs are on a 19-1 run, or something like that.

That's completely fair.

I was reacting more to mike breen's commentary during the game which suggested that 3 point shooting was carrying san antonio.

I think the three point shooting will carry over for the duration of the series because san antonio is good at getting good looks and miami gambles a lot and gives up a ton of them.

For San Antonio i worry more about their ability to sustainably convert so many twos. They really struggled against miami's athleticism and shotblocking and physicality in games 2 and 4. I wonder if san antonio relentlessly pushing the pace wore lebron/wade out?

[Mabdul Doobakus]

FG PTS
Danny Green 8-15 24
Tony Parker 10-14 26
Tim Duncan 7-10 17
Manu Ginobili 8-14 24
Kawhi Leonard 6-8 16

The Spurs were very good tonight. This is starting to remind me a lot of the 2011 Mavericks series, unfortunately. We'll see if the Heat can win two in a row for the first time in a month.

[Troublemaker]

Man, the Spurs played one of the best offensive games I've ever seen. They are a great team, a better version of last year's team which at one point was considered the heavy favorite to win the title, and they played with the "heart of a champion" tonight. No blinking under extreme pressure. Controlled the game from start to finish. I was especially impressed with how the Spurs' Big 3 played the first quarter. They were aggressive and put the game in their own hands, converted almost all their 2-pt shots, staked San Antonio to a 13-pt lead and allowed the crowd to roar and the role players to relax. Hell, Danny Green started his night by shooting an airball but after that display of leadership by the Big 3, and with the San Antonio offense rolling, he was able to get into a rhythm.

If I'm Miami, I'm still heartened that Wade and Bosh looked healthy and that Shane started hitting some threes. They'll need everyone to win the two games at home that they need to now. And I still think the Spurs will have to attempt to win through a bad shooting night at some point, but it wasn't tonight.

[moonpie23]

the Heat left a ton of points on the rim last night......shane had a glimpse of a spark......actually hit a 3 after a whistle as well....birdman on the milk carton...


will danny green continue to be unconscious from 3? if he does, make some room for that MVP trophy over at the dome....


heat are not looking good....two games in this series, even at home, looks daunting.....

[tommy]

I completely agree with you, but the Heat have quit on this game again. Maybe I'm just imposing my own narrative on this game, but they really seemed to lose their composure right at that point. The next shot was a Dwyane Wade fade away 18 footer with 10 seconds left on the clock, and then Ginobli got that 3 point play, and before you know it the Spurs are on a 19-1 run, or something like that.

Quit? I'm sure the Spurs didn't feel like the Heat quit when they cut a 19 point lead down to nine and had Wade driving down the lane for a thunder dunk, getting fouled by Duncan, and the dunk went off the rim. That dunk goes and he hits the FT it's down to six with over a minute and a half to go. Instead he hits only one of two, gets the lead to eight, and that's as close as they could get.

Just because a team doesn't play well doesn't mean it didn't play with effort, it wasn't focused, it didn't try, or it quit, which are all accusations lots of fans make when a team doesn't play well, even for stretches. If the Heat had quit, they don't make that run -- on the road, mind you -- that had plenty of Spurs fans, coaches, and players plenty nervous.

[PSurprise]

the Heat left a ton of points on the rim last night......shane had a glimpse of a spark......actually hit a 3 after a whistle as well....birdman on the milk carton...


will danny green continue to be unconscious from 3? if he does, make some room for that MVP trophy over at the dome....


heat are not looking good....two games in this series, even at home, looks daunting.....

Can they hang it from the rafters like they do everything else?

[Wander]

.
Just because a team doesn't play well doesn't mean it didn't play with effort, it wasn't focused, it didn't try, or it quit, which are all accusations lots of fans make when a team doesn't play well, even for stretches. If the Heat had quit, they don't make that run -- on the road, mind you -- that had plenty of Spurs fans, coaches, and players plenty nervous.

I normally am in very strong agreement with you, and it's a huge pet peeve of mine that so many fans point to effort just because a team loses or loses badly. However, I think effort issues may be a legitimate gripe with this Heat team. They might be the whiniest team I've ever seen in all of sports - and I say that as someone who likes all the Heat players minus Wade and Birdman. I just can't remember another team having that many instances of complaining about foul calls while the play is still live (and in a much more minor example, Lebron refusing to try a half court shot at the end of the quarter).

[Billy Dat]

Man, the Spurs played one of the best offensive games I've ever seen. They are a great team, a better version of last year's team which at one point was considered the heavy favorite to win the title, and they played with the "heart of a champion" tonight. No blinking under extreme pressure. Controlled the game from start to finish. I was especially impressed with how the Spurs' Big 3 played the first quarter. They were aggressive and put the game in their own hands, converted almost all their 2-pt shots, staked San Antonio to a 13-pt lead and allowed the crowd to roar and the role players to relax. Hell, Danny Green started his night by shooting an airball but after that display of leadership by the Big 3, and with the San Antonio offense rolling, he was able to get into a rhythm.
If I'm Miami, I'm still heartened that Wade and Bosh looked healthy and that Shane started hitting some threes. They'll need everyone to win the two games at home that they need to now. And I still think the Spurs will have to attempt to win through a bad shooting night at some point, but it wasn't tonight.


Quit? I'm sure the Spurs didn't feel like the Heat quit when they cut a 19 point lead down to nine and had Wade driving down the lane for a thunder dunk, getting fouled by Duncan, and the dunk went off the rim. That dunk goes and he hits the FT it's down to six with over a minute and a half to go. Instead he hits only one of two, gets the lead to eight, and that's as close as they could get.
Just because a team doesn't play well doesn't mean it didn't play with effort, it wasn't focused, it didn't try, or it quit, which are all accusations lots of fans make when a team doesn't play well, even for stretches. If the Heat had quit, they don't make that run -- on the road, mind you -- that had plenty of Spurs fans, coaches, and players plenty nervous.

I think you guys nailed my feeling pretty well. I thought San Antonio played a nearly perfect game. Despite that, Miami missed a few chippies that would have put a lot more game pressure on the Spurs in the third quarter. Miami just couldn't get a lead, and they had many chances to make lay-ups right before that 19-1 run.

The thing about Green being so hot from 3 is that he starts drawing insane amounts of defensive attention which opens things up for everyone else. With two guys essentially watching him at all times, it makes it a lot easier for Parker and Ginobili to go one on one, and leaves Duncan in single coverage on the block. Kudos to the Spurs for going up tempo to not allow the Miami halfcourt D to get set.

I don't think San Antonio can play better than they did last night because I feel like, unlike game 3, the Heat gave a maximum effort. Was it the last stand of the Spurs - giving their fans something to cheer for - or a prelude to a Championship? Winning 2 on the road to close it out aint going to be easy at all.

It has been a really interesting series. While the games, in hindsight, haven't been barn burners, because it's been a series of runs, it's never over until its over. As tommy said, last night's game was really interesting with 2 minutes left.

Finally, I am glad to see Shane back in the mix. I wonder if we'll now see Birdman for slumping Haslem. I also expect the Miami point guards Rio and Cole to play much better at home.

I really can't call who is going to win the title.

[BobbyFan]

Amazing game by the Spurs offensively. Ginobili being on just puts them on another level. His craftiness and vision allows him to make plays that few in NBA history could make.

Wade's getting a lot of props for his play last night. But he decided not to show up on defense. His activity on that end was borderline pathetic, unlike that of most of his teammates.

[TheItinerantSon]

Danny green hitting 2 more threes last night than his average suggests he would, should not be a reason to change your D. Miami was a bottom five 3pt defense all year, they should be able to take this in stride. Miami has actually bene quite fortunate to hit a higher percentage from three than the spurs in 3 out of 5 games - that really is not what's swinging this series.


In my eyes, this series is about Miami's point guards being completely unproductive (this is not new, rondo and westbrook destroyed them consecutively last year). If those guys play 30 combined minutes again Miami will lose.

Miami likes this trapping style of defense...and if the other team can throw skip passes and avoid live-ball turnovers they are going to get dunks and threes. Miami's defense requires incredibly high energy expenditure from lebron, wade, bosh and the point guards (I've grudgingly admired how well Chalmers and Cole have come down to dig the ball away from tiago and duncan, even though i think a lot of those are fouls). Using that kind of energy twenty games into the season has left them with a soggy, and amorphous offense with little movement. Miami isn't running any of the stuff they ran in the regular season which such verve and crispness. So at this point, unless Miami can get into transition, they're very average and very beatable.


From a spurs perspective I'm terrified of the lineups that don't have Cole and Chalmers (and my god is he some kind of dadaist statement on flopping/flailing). Battier is the only Heat player willing to throw theaggressive, physical, forearms-up screens that will let this offense breathe. If miami plays bosh, wade, lebron with battier and ray allen - that's the lineup that scares me.

[Billy Dat]

Battier is the only Heat player willing to throw theaggressive, physical, forearms-up screens that will let this offense breathe. If miami plays bosh, wade, lebron with battier and ray allen - that's the lineup that scares me.

Your sentence reminded me of two plays last night:

-Shane, as you say, threw two forearms basically into Manu's throat to clear him off for a 3 setting up behind them, and Manu got called for a foul

-Later, Shane seemed to purposely lock arms with Leonard as he (Shane) was running through the lane to space the floor and he sold a flop and flail and got a foul called on Kawhi

Shane has built up a lot of equity with these refs over his career and he's cashing in his chips to try and help Miami win.

[theAlaskanBear]

I normally am in very strong agreement with you, and it's a huge pet peeve of mine that so many fans point to effort just because a team loses or loses badly. However, I think effort issues may be a legitimate gripe with this Heat team. They might be the whiniest team I've ever seen in all of sports - and I say that as someone who likes all the Heat players minus Wade and Birdman. I just can't remember another team having that many instances of complaining about foul calls while the play is still live (and in a much more minor example, Lebron refusing to try a half court shot at the end of the quarter).

I agree on the whining, I don't like it either. I do think LeBron had a point though -- several times he took it to the rim, absorbed contact for the foul -- he feels the physical contact mess up his shot, but from the refs perspective he is still strong enough to finish his move so it doesn't matter.

That said, quit yelling at the refs and go play D. It's the coaches job to scream at the refs ;)

Even thought the Spurs didn't have a gangbusters night from 3-pt range, they shot very well overall -- and Greens 3's all came at big moments to help with momentum. Chalmers has looked mediocre this series, he really can't guard Parker -- cole does a better job on parker -- but struggles on switching because the other Spurs G/F are too big for him. So it's a dilemma for Spoelstra. Also, a bit surprising to see Anderson get hardly any PT two games in a row. Of course, Bosh has been playing much better.

[BobbyFan]

will danny green continue to be unconscious from 3? if he does, make some room for that MVP trophy over at the dome....

I'd agree that at this point, it would have to be Green, mainly for his shooting, but he's also playing excellent defense and has been active on the boards. Duncan isn't far behind though.

[tbyers11]

Danny green hitting 2 more threes last night than his average suggests he would, should not be a reason to change your D. Miami was a bottom five 3pt defense all year, they should be able to take this in stride. Miami has actually bene quite fortunate to hit a higher percentage from three than the spurs in 3 out of 5 games - that really is not what's swinging this series.


In my eyes, this series is about Miami's point guards being completely unproductive (this is not new, rondo and westbrook destroyed them consecutively last year). If those guys play 30 combined minutes again Miami will lose.

Miami likes this trapping style of defense...and if the other team can throw skip passes and avoid live-ball turnovers they are going to get dunks and threes. Miami's defense requires incredibly high energy expenditure from lebron, wade, bosh and the point guards (I've grudgingly admired how well Chalmers and Cole have come down to dig the ball away from tiago and duncan, even though i think a lot of those are fouls). Using that kind of energy twenty games into the season has left them with a soggy, and amorphous offense with little movement. Miami isn't running any of the stuff they ran in the regular season which such verve and crispness. So at this point, unless Miami can get into transition, they're very average and very beatable.


From a spurs perspective I'm terrified of the lineups that don't have Cole and Chalmers (and my god is he some kind of dadaist statement on flopping/flailing). Battier is the only Heat player willing to throw theaggressive, physical, forearms-up screens that will let this offense breathe. If miami plays bosh, wade, lebron with battier and ray allen - that's the lineup that scares me.

Danny Green hit almost 4 more threes last night than he typically should. He hit 177-413 in the 2013 regular season over 80 games or 2.21-5.16 per game. So his average game this year was ~ 2-5 from 3PT and he was 6-10 last night. His unreal 3PT shooting in the finals makes the D have to account for him more. However, they might be better off covering others and hoping that the law of averages finds his shooting stroke.

[CDu]

I'd agree that at this point, it would have to be Green, mainly for his shooting, but he's also playing excellent defense and has been active on the boards. Duncan isn't far behind though.

It an interesting question. In the Finals, here are the stat lines of the four top players for the Spurs (note: Ginobili has been omitted because of his struggles in the first 4 games):

Parker: 16.2 ppg, 6.6 apg, 49.3 fg%
Duncan: 15.6 ppg, 11.2 rpg, 1.8 bpg
Green: 18.0 ppg, 4.0 rpg, 1.6 bpg, 65.8 3pt %
Leonard: 12.2 ppg, 10.2 rpg, 2.0 spg, 49.0 fg%, terrific defense on James

Ginobili and Neal are also averaging double-digit scoring, with Neal shooting 50% from 3.

Basically, it's been an incredibly balanced effort from the Spurs. Green has made the most of his opportunities for sure, and he stands a good chance of winning the award if the Spurs win the series. I'd say it's between Green and Parker, with Parker's chances relying on a dominant performance in the series clincher and Green having a quiet night.

In any case, I'd say that Parker and Duncan have been the two most important players for the Spurs. Green has basically benefited from the Heat's focus on the Spurs two stars, and he's taken full advantage of the open looks he's gotten. So if I were voting, I'd go with Parker. But I suspect that the award would go to Green.

That being said, there's still a very good chance that the Heat win this series. In that case, I think it's a no-brainer that James would win it. In fact, he probably should win it regardless (21.6 ppg, 10.8 rpg, 6.8 apg, 2.2 spg, 1.0 bpg), but ever since Jerry West the award has always gone to someone on the winning team.

[g-money]

I normally am in very strong agreement with you, and it's a huge pet peeve of mine that so many fans point to effort just because a team loses or loses badly. However, I think effort issues may be a legitimate gripe with this Heat team. They might be the whiniest team I've ever seen in all of sports - and I say that as someone who likes all the Heat players minus Wade and Birdman. I just can't remember another team having that many instances of complaining about foul calls while the play is still live (and in a much more minor example, Lebron refusing to try a half court shot at the end of the quarter).

Yeah. I'm pulling for the Heat, but one thing I agree they need to improve on is getting back on D after not getting a call. Both Lebron and Wade have been exhibiting this nasty little habit for the past few weeks.

On one play last night, I seem to remember Wade and Green getting tangled up after a Wade turnover (with no call) on the Heat end of the floor. Green beat Wade down the floor - as Wade jogged back - and hit a transition three, which if memory serves was a pretty big momentum changer.

This is one thing you have to respect about Popovich - he would never put up with that from his players. Neither would Coach K. It must be something about those military guys.

All that said, I still think Miami can win this series. They will obviously need to exhibit maximum effort from here on out. The Spurs have been so balanced that defending them is a little bit like playing whack-a-mole. I think Spoelstra should give Battier a shot against Green, because A) other than the big three, he's the best defender Miami has; and B) if he's successful in shutting him down at this point, it will go down in Duke-UNC lore. :) Anyway, it should be a great Game 6.

[CDu]

Yeah. I'm pulling for the Heat, but one thing I agree they need to improve on is getting back on D after not getting a call. Both Lebron and Wade have been exhibiting this nasty little habit for the past few weeks.

On one play last night, I seem to remember Wade and Green getting tangled up after a Wade turnover (with no call) on the Heat end of the floor. Green beat Wade down the floor - as Wade jogged back - and hit a transition three, which if memory serves was a pretty big momentum changer.

This is one thing you have to respect about Popovich - he would never put up with that from his players. Neither would Coach K. It must be something about those military guys.

There are only two things I ultimately dislike about the Heat: (1) the amount of time they spend whining to the refs - most notably Wade; and (2) the fact that they only seem to try hard when it behooves them - again, most notably Wade. From purely a talent perspective, they have some phenomenal pieces. I just wish they'd bring it every night. If they did so, they might have dispatched Indiana much more quickly, and they might not have their backs against the wall against San Antonio.


All that said, I still think Miami can win this series. They will obviously need to exhibit maximum effort from here on out. The Spurs have been so balanced that defending them is a little bit like playing whack-a-mole. I think Spoelstra should give Battier a shot against Green, because A) other than the big three, he's the best defender Miami has; and B) if he's successful in shutting him down at this point, it will go down in Duke-UNC lore. :) Anyway, it should be a great Game 6.

Oh, the Heat can certainly win this series. They have (with Wade seeming to have returned from his slumber/pouting/whatever) probably the two best players in the series, and they have a variety of guys capable of supporting those two guys on any given night. And they are playing at home the rest of the way, which gives them an edge. I would say that it's probably a 50/50 situation right now as to who will win the title.

[HaveFunExpectToWin]

I'd agree that at this point, it would have to be Green, mainly for his shooting, but he's also playing excellent defense and has been active on the boards. Duncan isn't far behind though.

All this Danny Green talk made me throw up a little in my mouth.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/early-lead/wp/2013/06/17/who-is-danny-green-oh-maybe-the-nba-finals-mvp-for-the-spurs/?hpid=z10

[Mabdul Doobakus]

Quit? I'm sure the Spurs didn't feel like the Heat quit when they cut a 19 point lead down to nine and had Wade driving down the lane for a thunder dunk, getting fouled by Duncan, and the dunk went off the rim. That dunk goes and he hits the FT it's down to six with over a minute and a half to go. Instead he hits only one of two, gets the lead to eight, and that's as close as they could get.

Just because a team doesn't play well doesn't mean it didn't play with effort, it wasn't focused, it didn't try, or it quit, which are all accusations lots of fans make when a team doesn't play well, even for stretches. If the Heat had quit, they don't make that run -- on the road, mind you -- that had plenty of Spurs fans, coaches, and players plenty nervous.

Well, I guess we'll just have to disagree on this one. For one, you're reading this after the game, but I wrote that when the Heat were in the midst of that 19-1 run, and it was a stretch of play where they stopped playing aggressively on defense and stopped working the ball around to get good shots off. They quit on their game plan, and they quit on doing all the things that had kept them in the game to that point. That late game run was fueled by Ray Allen getting off a bunch of open 3's, probably because the Spurs let down their guard a little, but it was way too late.

[Mabdul Doobakus]

I agree on the whining, I don't like it either. I do think LeBron had a point though -- several times he took it to the rim, absorbed contact for the foul -- he feels the physical contact mess up his shot, but from the refs perspective he is still strong enough to finish his move so it doesn't matter.

That said, quit yelling at the refs and go play D. It's the coaches job to scream at the refs ;)


Lebron and Wade have been the last player down the floor way too many times because of this, and it has cost the Heat on a few occasions. These games are too important to be giving up points like this, in what is clearly a completely useless exercise. I want to say this happened at least 4-5 times last night. It frustrates me so much.

[pfrduke]

Well, I guess we'll just have to disagree on this one. For one, you're reading this after the game, but I wrote that when the Heat were in the midst of that 19-1 run, and it was a stretch of play where they stopped playing aggressively on defense and stopped working the ball around to get good shots off. They quit on their game plan, and they quit on doing all the things that had kept them in the game to that point. That late game run was fueled by Ray Allen getting off a bunch of open 3's, probably because the Spurs let down their guard a little, but it was way too late.

It struck me watching the game last night that the Heat shot a lot more early shot clock and out of flow mid-to-long range jumpers than the Spurs did. Wade and Chalmers, in particular, were offenders, although James doesn't get a total pass here either. The Spurs either got high-percentage looks in transition (shots at the rim or from 3) or ran their offense - either way, they made Miami try to stop them. The Heat had a few too many possessions where, as the guy was rising to shoot the ball, I was saying to myself "that's a really stupid shot to take" - effectively, they gave the Spurs a pass on defense and stopped themselves.

[Troublemaker]

The Heat had a few too many possessions where, as the guy was rising to shoot the ball, I was saying to myself "that's a really stupid shot to take" - effectively, they gave the Spurs a pass on defense and stopped themselves.

Yeah, agreed. With the Spurs putting on an offensive clinic, Miami needed to be at a 95%-100% "good-decision-making" rate, and they were probably more around 75%. Those two 2-on-1 fast breaks that Lebron and Wade blew were really bad. On both occasions, one of them just had to make an extra pass to the other for an easy layup or dunk but instead took it in themselves for a challenged layup and missed.

[elvis14]

It struck me watching the game last night that the Heat shot a lot more early shot clock and out of flow mid-to-long range jumpers than the Spurs did. Wade and Chalmers, in particular, were offenders, although James doesn't get a total pass here either. The Spurs either got high-percentage looks in transition (shots at the rim or from 3) or ran their offense - either way, they made Miami try to stop them. The Heat had a few too many possessions where, as the guy was rising to shoot the ball, I was saying to myself "that's a really stupid shot to take" - effectively, they gave the Spurs a pass on defense and stopped themselves.

One of the main differences between game 4 and game 5 was that the Heat had quite a few of these shots fall in game 4. There were quite a few times where Wade, in particular, and sometimes James were taking long 2 point shots in game 4. I was happy since I want the Spurs to win and having Wade/James taking a long two point shot early in the shot clock is definitely something I want to see. Unfortunately the shots fell in game 4 (not to mention that the Heat played quite well in other facets of the game as well).

Really enjoyed the way the Spurs moved the ball last night and how balanced their scoring was. It was also nice to see Manu come back from the grave (the same way Wade was resurrected in game 4). If Ginobli can continue to be effective the Spurs have a great shot at closing this out. Hopefully they show up focussed and sharp for game 6 and can avoid a game 7 in Miami.

Not to change the subject but...the way the Spurs drive and dish, space the floor and move the ball is something I could see next year's Duke team being successful doing. Of course there are similarities as well with the way the Heat attack with James and Wade and use their 3 point shooters (and Bosh when he shoots good, open 2's).

[TheItinerantSon]

lebrons mistakes while 'defending' danny green:

http://www.cbssports.com/nba/blog/eye-on-basketball/22453038/breakdown-danny-green-is-historically-taking-advantage-of-bad-defense

[CDu]

lebrons mistakes while 'defending' danny green:

http://www.cbssports.com/nba/blog/eye-on-basketball/22453038/breakdown-danny-green-is-historically-taking-advantage-of-bad-defense

To be fair, LeBron is at fault in fairly few of these mistakes. Wade is the guy who most often is the culprit, with Allen also "ahead" on the list:

"By my count, Dwyane Wade was responsible for eight of Green's threes, Ray Allen was responsible for five, LeBron James was responsible for four, Chris Bosh and Udonis Haslem were responsible for two each, Mario Chalmers was directly responsible for one and so was Mike Miller. Green also hit two threes off of broken plays."

[Mabdul Doobakus]

It struck me watching the game last night that the Heat shot a lot more early shot clock and out of flow mid-to-long range jumpers than the Spurs did. Wade and Chalmers, in particular, were offenders, although James doesn't get a total pass here either. The Spurs either got high-percentage looks in transition (shots at the rim or from 3) or ran their offense - either way, they made Miami try to stop them. The Heat had a few too many possessions where, as the guy was rising to shoot the ball, I was saying to myself "that's a really stupid shot to take" - effectively, they gave the Spurs a pass on defense and stopped themselves.

Chalmers had that one possession where he shot a floater from about 18 feet very early in the shot clock, the Heat got the offensive rebound, the ball ended up in Chalmers' hands out at the 3 point line, and he went ahead and shot that one with a guy in his face very early in the shot clock. Lebron was standing right next to him, and he just looked at Chalmers in disgust. So did I. The only Wade shot I remember being truly bad was the one right after Green hit that 30 footer to go up 4. Wade took a contested turn around fade away 18 footer early in the shot clock and the ball never got close to the rim. It was very bad timing to have a possession like that. I don't think Lebron's shot selection was bad...but he missed a ton of close shots, and after a while those started to add up. I counted up his shot chart last night after the game, and I believe he was 3-12 inside the paint. You'd normally expect him to be about 8-12, so that's ten points right there. Savvy defense had something to do with that, but still...Lebron missed some he'd usually make.

[JayBean]

Chalmers had that one possession where he shot a floater from about 18 feet very early in the shot clock, the Heat got the offensive rebound, the ball ended up in Chalmers' hands out at the 3 point line, and he went ahead and shot that one with a guy in his face very early in the shot clock. Lebron was standing right next to him, and he just looked at Chalmers in disgust. So did I. The only Wade shot I remember being truly bad was the one right after Green hit that 30 footer to go up 4. Wade took a contested turn around fade away 18 footer early in the shot clock and the ball never got close to the rim. It was very bad timing to have a possession like that. I don't think Lebron's shot selection was bad...but he missed a ton of close shots, and after a while those started to add up. I counted up his shot chart last night after the game, and I believe he was 3-12 inside the paint. You'd normally expect him to be about 8-12, so that's ten points right there. Savvy defense had something to do with that, but still...Lebron missed some he'd usually make.

Well, he hasn't been shooting a good percentage in this series, so I think it is more than a one-off shooting night.

I'm of the opinion that LeBron and the Heat are just worn down as evidenced by all the open 3s Green is getting.
That may change with the move to a more Heat-friendly environment.

[BobbyFan]

Basically, it's been an incredibly balanced effort from the Spurs.

It has, which is why it would almost seem wrong to have to pick one, should the Spurs win.


I agree on the whining, I don't like it either. I do think LeBron had a point though -- several times he took it to the rim, absorbed contact for the foul -- he feels the physical contact mess up his shot, but from the refs perspective he is still strong enough to finish his move so it doesn't matter

The refs may have missed one or two, but for the most part I thought they called LeBron's drives just fine. The Spurs help defenders are fantastic in positioning and therefore don't foul often. They are always in the vicinity of the ball, but rarely initiate contact.

[Newton_14]

Yeah, agreed. With the Spurs putting on an offensive clinic, Miami needed to be at a 95%-100% "good-decision-making" rate, and they were probably more around 75%. Those two 2-on-1 fast breaks that Lebron and Wade blew were really bad. On both occasions, one of them just had to make an extra pass to the other for an easy layup or dunk but instead took it in themselves for a challenged layup and missed.

I thought both of those plays were key as well. Big big misses. In fairness Danny Green darn near beheaded Lebron on the one play but still had Lebron dumped it to Wade it would have been an easy score.

As for other comments in the thread, I thought Miami competed but just did not play smart enough, and did not value each possession. The two plays noted above were just two of several. At any level of basketball shot selection is just such a key in my book. Miami took too many bad shots. At the end of the day though, I think Miami's defense or lack thereof was the real key to why they lost. Miami scored more than enough points to win the game despite the offensive issues noted above. They just did not play the same level of swarming defense as in Game 4. San Antonio made them pay for it in a big way. San Antonio is a well oiled offensive machine if you let them get into a rythym and run their sets with good ball movement. They can just hurt you in a variety of ways with a variety of players.

My final comment is to agree with whomever stated upthread that Miami's point guards were awful last night and for much of the series. Just putrid awful last night on both sides of the ball.

It is going to be very interesting Tuesday and then possibly Thursday. I still believe Miami can win it but they are out of mulligans. For the first time in the series they have to play two good games back to back. It starts and ends with defense. Let's see what transpires. Go Shane!

[tommy]

Yeah, agreed. With the Spurs putting on an offensive clinic, Miami needed to be at a 95%-100% "good-decision-making" rate, and they were probably more around 75%. Those two 2-on-1 fast breaks that Lebron and Wade blew were really bad. On both occasions, one of them just had to make an extra pass to the other for an easy layup or dunk but instead took it in themselves for a challenged layup and missed.

And yet if LeBron had made the pass and it didn't work out, he would then have been criticized for being too deferential, for not taking over, for not imposing his will, or whatever the cliche of the moment is. With some folks, it doesn't matter what the guys does, it's never going to be good enough. The guy has an off night, for him, still gets 25-6-8, and people still search for things to criticize him for.

Bottom line to me is that when you have three Hall of Famers -- which Miami does NOT have -- all of whom are playing very well, and you add to that a guy like Danny Green who is making three pointers at absolutely historic rates, you're going to lose. Anyone would. The guys are just too good. If you have 4 players playing at that high of a level simultaneously, it's pretty tough to lose.

[greybeard]

One of the main differences between game 4 and game 5 was that the Heat had quite a few of these shots fall in game 4. There were quite a few times where Wade, in particular, and sometimes James were taking long 2 point shots in game 4. I was happy since I want the Spurs to win and having Wade/James taking a long two point shot early in the shot clock is definitely something I want to see. Unfortunately the shots fell in game 4 (not to mention that the Heat played quite well in other facets of the game as well).

Really enjoyed the way the Spurs moved the ball last night and how balanced their scoring was. It was also nice to see Manu come back from the grave (the same way Wade was resurrected in game 4). If Ginobli can continue to be effective the Spurs have a great shot at closing this out. Hopefully they show up focussed and sharp for game 6 and can avoid a game 7 in Miami.

Not to change the subject but...the way the Spurs drive and dish, space the floor and move the ball is something I could see next year's Duke team being successful doing. Of course there are similarities as well with the way the Heat attack with James and Wade and use their 3 point shooters (and Bosh when he shoots good, open 2's).

I am not so sure that Wade's "comeback" was, shall we say, on the up-and-up. What happened to all those grimaces? Did Wade suddenly develop a stone cold exterior devoid of pained looks when his knee threw shots of pain to his brain, as it has for months, or were the shots of pain suppressed by another kind of shot? I think that more than even money says that it was the latter, that Wade had been shot up with a prescription pain killer and an anti inflammatory that permitted him to play pain free. That, I believe, though do not know for sure, is an improper use of prescription drugs, and should be against the rules of the sport. Recent disclosures of the rampant misuse of such drugs all but pushed upon players by management argues for vigilance; at least an asterisk should be placed next to Miami's Championship this season should it win one.

I didn't catch much of game 5 but noticed that Wade put up an awful lot of shots. If there were no grimaces, the kind associated with pain, not misses, I should be surprised. We can take guys "playing hurt," at least some of us can, but is the game not diminished when "playing hurt" is devoid of heroic meaning because well, misuse of drugs makes the ouch and performance-inhibiting swelling "go away."

Whether Wade has been "using" is almost beside the point. How come no one is asking? They do in baseball.

[TheItinerantSon]

Bottom line to me is that when you have three Hall of Famers -- which Miami does NOT have -- all of whom are playing very well, and you add to that a guy like Danny Green who is making three pointers at absolutely historic rates, you're going to lose. Anyone would. The guys are just too good. If you have 4 players playing at that high of a level simultaneously, it's pretty tough to lose.

miami does not have 3 hall of famers - they have 4. Chris Bosh pre-miami accomplishments are strong, even if he had gone to houston instead and had his toronto experience again, he'd be a sure hall of famer.


http://www.basketball-reference.com/leaders/hof_prob.html?redir

[Mabdul Doobakus]

I am not so sure that Wade's "comeback" was, shall we say, on the up-and-up. What happened to all those grimaces? Did Wade suddenly develop a stone cold exterior devoid of pained looks when his knee threw shots of pain to his brain, as it has for months, or were the shots of pain suppressed by another kind of shot? I think that more than even money says that it was the latter, that Wade had been shot up with a prescription pain killer and an anti inflammatory that permitted him to play pain free. That, I believe, though do not know for sure, is an improper use of prescription drugs, and should be against the rules of the sport. Recent disclosures of the rampant misuse of such drugs all but pushed upon players by management argues for vigilance; at least an asterisk should be placed next to Miami's Championship this season should it win one.

I didn't catch much of game 5 but noticed that Wade put up an awful lot of shots. If there were no grimaces, the kind associated with pain, not misses, I should be surprised. We can take guys "playing hurt," at least some of us can, but is the game not diminished when "playing hurt" is devoid of heroic meaning because well, misuse of drugs makes the ouch and performance-inhibiting swelling "go away."

Whether Wade has been "using" is almost beside the point. How come no one is asking? They do in baseball.

Whoa.

1. I think we all assume Wade has been receiving pain treatment, likely including steroid injections into the joint and possibly Toradol. It's a huge assumption to say he's receiving these medications in some sort of illegal manner.

2. It's an even bigger leap to say that Miami deserves some kind of asterisk if they win. Whatever Wade is doing--even if it goes above and beyond what, say, a normal person would do when they're working a desk job--it's being done in the name of pain relief, which, to me, is different than performance enhancement, like you would get with illegal anabolic steroid use. Wade is almost surely taking legal medications prescribed legally by certified team doctors.

3. If you still think what Wade is doing is WRONG, and you think your speculations are deserving of an asterisk, you may as well slap an asterisk on every team in this past decade, because every team has guys who are playing hurt, and if you don't think the Spurs team doctors are doing everything they can to keep their guys playing at a high level, I think you're kidding yourself.

I guess I don't understand what it is specifically about Wade's medical treatment has you a) so suspicious, and b) outraged to the point where you're arguing that a potential Miami championship would be illegitimate.

[tommy]

miami does not have 3 hall of famers - they have 4. Chris Bosh pre-miami accomplishments are strong, even if he had gone to houston instead and had his toronto experience again, he'd be a sure hall of famer.


http://www.basketball-reference.com/leaders/hof_prob.html?redir

Yes, I forgot about Ray Allen. He's a Hall of Famer, but he's a guy playing off the bench and almost at the end of his career. And before you say but Manu plays off the bench too, he's been much more central to the Spurs' success this year than has Ray Allen to Miami's.

The chances of Chris Bosh reaching the Hall of Fame are somewhere between slimski and noneski.

[TheItinerantSon]

Whoa.

1. I think we all assume Wade has been receiving pain treatment, likely including steroid injections into the joint and possibly Toradol. It's a huge assumption to say he's receiving these medications in some sort of illegal manner.

2. It's an even bigger leap to say that Miami deserves some kind of asterisk if they win. Whatever Wade is doing--even if it goes above and beyond what, say, a normal person would do when they're working a desk job--it's being done in the name of pain relief, which, to me, is different than performance enhancement, like you would get with illegal anabolic steroid use. Wade is almost surely taking legal medications prescribed legally by certified team doctors.

3. If you still think what Wade is doing is WRONG, and you think your speculations are deserving of an asterisk, you may as well slap an asterisk on every team in this past decade, because every team has guys who are playing hurt, and if you don't think the Spurs team doctors are doing everything they can to keep their guys playing at a high level, I think you're kidding yourself.

I guess I don't understand what it is specifically about Wade's medical treatment has you a) so suspicious, and b) outraged to the point where you're arguing that a potential Miami championship would be illegitimate.

i prefer the idea that wade greatly exaggerated the extent of his injuries. did anyone else notice that his grimaces often came after he made mistakes? how many times have we seen players on the heat on their back and limp around only to make explosive plays on the next possession.

[CDu]

I am not so sure that Wade's "comeback" was, shall we say, on the up-and-up. What happened to all those grimaces? Did Wade suddenly develop a stone cold exterior devoid of pained looks when his knee threw shots of pain to his brain, as it has for months, or were the shots of pain suppressed by another kind of shot? I think that more than even money says that it was the latter, that Wade had been shot up with a prescription pain killer and an anti inflammatory that permitted him to play pain free. That, I believe, though do not know for sure, is an improper use of prescription drugs, and should be against the rules of the sport. Recent disclosures of the rampant misuse of such drugs all but pushed upon players by management argues for vigilance; at least an asterisk should be placed next to Miami's Championship this season should it win one.

I didn't catch much of game 5 but noticed that Wade put up an awful lot of shots. If there were no grimaces, the kind associated with pain, not misses, I should be surprised. We can take guys "playing hurt," at least some of us can, but is the game not diminished when "playing hurt" is devoid of heroic meaning because well, misuse of drugs makes the ouch and performance-inhibiting swelling "go away."

Whether Wade has been "using" is almost beside the point. How come no one is asking? They do in baseball.

I think it's incredibly callous to jump to the assumption that Wade is doing something illegal. I'm more inclined to believe that Wade went through a "pouting" period earlier in the playoffs. There were still time when he could summon his game in the earlier rounds. I also do suspect that Wade is guilty of "playing up" how injured he is.

But regardless, I don't think it is appropriate to assume that he's cheating.


miami does not have 3 hall of famers - they have 4. Chris Bosh pre-miami accomplishments are strong, even if he had gone to houston instead and had his toronto experience again, he'd be a sure hall of famer.


http://www.basketball-reference.com/leaders/hof_prob.html?redir

I think the point was that Miami doesn't have three players playing at Hall-of-Fame caliber. Bosh isn't currently doing so, though he certainly was a borderline case from his Toronto days. And while Allen is certainly a Hall-of-Fame guy, he is at the end of his career now. It's sort of like saying the Mets had a Hall-of-Fame player in Willie Mays.

Of course, the same argument can be said of the Spurs, as Ginobili (until Game 5) had been far from a Hall-of-Fame caliber of player.

I'd say that both the Spurs and Heat have 2 players playing at Hall-of-Fame caliber and one additional player capable of playing at that level. The Spurs seem to have the next 2-3 most productive guys in the series, while the Heat are more reliant on their big 3 for production.

[TheItinerantSon]

Yes, I forgot about Ray Allen. He's a Hall of Famer, but he's a guy playing off the bench and almost at the end of his career. And before you say but Manu plays off the bench too, he's been much more central to the Spurs' success this year than has Ray Allen to Miami's.

The chances of Chris Bosh reaching the Hall of Fame are somewhere between slimski and noneski.

Manu averaged 12 ppg (to 11 for Ray) and played 23 mpg (to 27 for Ray) in 60 games (to 79 for Ray).

Even with his performance in game 5 manu is averaging 13 points on 18/43 shooting for the finals while Ray is putting 15 ppg while shooting 11/17 (65%) from three.

My point is that, this miami team is absolutely loaded. There is no other all-star in the league that lebron should want to trade rosters with. If they lose this, its because of a sense of entitlement that makes it OK for them to take games off and not get back on defense.

[TheItinerantSon]

If bosh isn't playing at a hall-of-fame level, its because, by choice, Miami has taken away his postups and faceup touches all season and relegated him to play a stretch 5 role. Bosh once dropped 40 on a much younger Tim Duncan.

[duke09hms]

If the Heat lose this, it's on the coaching. Their team is so much more talented, but the Spurs run beautiful offensive sets that exploit the Heat defense's overaggressiveness and insistence on doubling/trapping/pressuring the ball. The Heat defense is predicated on ball pressure and generating turnovers with traps, which works against the bottom/middle tier teams of the league. But the upper echelon teams that patiently work the ball around with off-ball movement and entry passes to the post can exploit the Heat defense. Spurs are shredding them with great sets and Parker's stellar PG play, getting any shot they want, resulting in wide open 3s because they run plays where the 1 rotating Heat defender has to decide which of 2 Spurs standing at the 3pt line to run toward. Even the Pacers worked over their defense; the Pacers' mediocre PG play was offset by good plays to get the ball to their strong post players.

That's probably why theres been so many blowouts this series. Heat gamble on forcing turnovers. When the Spurs turn it over, Heat win in blowout. When Spurs dont turn it over, Spurs win in blowout. Spurs still had 19 TOs in Game 5, but I think theyve adjusted to the Heat pressure throughout the series, as great PGs and great teams are able to do. And so even if they end up giving the ball away like in Game 5, they're able to run their offense well enough to get any shot they want. For this reason, I think Spurs win in 6 and might even win going away. A lot depends on how being in Miami affects both teams.

On offense, the Heat are doing alright, scoring enough that a smarter defensive strategy should ensure wins. I think it could be a lot better though - still too much isolation play, not enough weak-side movement especially when they go to their 5-out set. Have no idea why Spoelstra doesnt see to it that Bosh is in the post. He used to be a beast there in his Toronto days. Having James and Bosh work the high/low post would be beautiful.

I think most of the responsibility if the Heat lose falls on the coaching. Defense is getting shredded by the Spurs, and even the offensively-challenged Pacers were putting up big numbers on them.

[sagegrouse]

Just to stir the pot and create (or stop) some discussion: I didn't think the Game 5 outcome had a darned thing to do with coaching, character, or effort. I thought the difference was shooting and that both teams defended well, giving the edge to the Heat because it's their game.

Despite the Heat defense, the Spurs shot 68.8 percent from two-point range; the Heat shot 41.3 percent. 3-pt. shooting and FT's actually favored the Heat. Moral of the story: Some times you're hot, and sometimes you're not.

Nothing displayed the discrepancy better than the determinative 20-1 run after the Heat had pulled within one point and seemed poised for victory. The Heat couldn't buy a shot for the next several minutes; the Spurs couldn't miss. Game over. I can't blame Spoelstra for anything except the spelling of his name.

sagegrouse

[duke09hms]

Except that Miami's defensive woes are a recurring pattern for the last two playoff series. The Heat aggressive/trapping defense and lack of sound positional defense have been exploited by the Pacers and Spurs. The Spurs high 2pt-FG percentage actually points defensive breakdowns, especially because they aren't jacking up long 2s. The Spurs are working the ball around, spreading Miami out, waiting for the defense to fly around on rotations, and hitting open guys in the paint. This and Miami's higher 3pt percentage probably argue against being "it's just shooting." Remember when Miller was unconscious from 3 the first few games? Especially when considered over the whole series. The Spurs can get any shot they want.

Miami's offensive woes do compound the issue, especially when they go away from what works and play iso. Like Wade wanting to be the hero and air-balling the fadeaway after Green hit the 30ft. three to put the Spurs back up 78-74. Before you know it, it's 94-75. Ballgame.

[JayBean]

http://espn.go.com/blog/truehoop/miamiheat/post/_/id/18138/is-exhaustion-affecting-lebron-james

Just read this article and it touches on an idea that I've been contemplating: LeBron could be exhausted.

[Mabdul Doobakus]

Between the compressed schedule last year + an NBA Finals run, then the Olympics, and now another NBA Finals run, Lebron has probably played more professional basketball in an 18 month span than anyone else, ever. No one can say what Lebron is feeling right now, just like no one can say what Wade, Ginobli, or Parker are feeling. It's fair to question, but I doubt it's a major factor and certainly shouldn't serve as any kind of excuse.

I think in Game 3 you could legitimately question the Heat's effort on D, but for the most part this series it's been Tony Parker's elusiveness, the Spurs' player and ball movement, and fantastic shot making that have made the Heat's defense look pretty mediocre. The Heat players are having to make a ton of quick decisions on every possession and it seems like it's just a matter of time before someone makes the wrong decision, and it's these mental mistakes as much as anything that is killing the Heat. Mike Miller hasn't played much this season, and it's showing on defense. He is consistently out of place. I'd be surprised if he starts tonight. My preference would be to start Battier in his place, but my suspicion is you'll see Haslem out there, even though he was -20 in about 9 minutes the other night (for whatever that's worth). The Spurs are going to get points, but if the Heat can cut down on these mental mistakes and put forth the effort to close out on shooters, then they should have a good shot to win.

I know a lot of Heat fans are hoping the home court will save us, but I don't know how much any of that really matters to the Spurs. Their Big 3 have been in this spot, and succeeded in this spot so many times, I just don't see how a Miami crowd is going to affect them. Most of you have probably seen that stat that the Spurs are 14-2 in road close out games since 2003. Danny Green is the one guy who's not accustomed to this moment, and I've had my fingers crossed all day that maybe--just maybe--he'll make less than 50% of his 3's tonight. Crazier things have happened. And Bosh today made an announcement that they plan to guard him tonight, so we'll see how that strategy works out.

[NSDukeFan]

Yes, I forgot about Ray Allen. He's a Hall of Famer, but he's a guy playing off the bench and almost at the end of his career. And before you say but Manu plays off the bench too, he's been much more central to the Spurs' success this year than has Ray Allen to Miami's.

The chances of Chris Bosh reaching the Hall of Fame are somewhere between slimski and noneski.

Are they related to Paul Mokeski?

[CDu]

I think in Game 3 you could legitimately question the Heat's effort on D, but for the most part this series it's been Tony Parker's elusiveness, the Spurs' player and ball movement, and fantastic shot making that have made the Heat's defense look pretty mediocre. The Heat players are having to make a ton of quick decisions on every possession and it seems like it's just a matter of time before someone makes the wrong decision, and it's these mental mistakes as much as anything that is killing the Heat.

I think this is key. The Spurs are perhaps the most organized, disciplined offense in the NBA. It all starts with the creative brilliance of Parker and Ginobili, but everyone knows their role and sticks to that role. With the exception of Game 4, the differences between San Antonio and Indiana have been striking. Where the Pacers were sloppy with the ball and often looked out of sorts, the Spurs are rarely out of sync. That puts a lot more pressure on a defense, especially a defense that likes to ball-watch and cheat the passing lanes for steals.


Danny Green is the one guy who's not accustomed to this moment, and I've had my fingers crossed all day that maybe--just maybe--he'll make less than 50% of his 3's tonight. Crazier things have happened. And Bosh today made an announcement that they plan to guard him tonight, so we'll see how that strategy works out.

That's all well and good to say, but I'm not sure what that means for the game. So they're going to not help off of Green. Does that mean they'll leave Parker to go one-on-one? That they won't double Duncan? That they'll force Leonard and Ginobili to beat them? And can they even be disciplined enough defensively not to lose track of Green? I mean, a lot of what makes them effective defensively is their ability to force turnovers by crashing the passing lanes. If they are more focused on staying in front of Green, will that limit their effectiveness overall defensively?

Ultimately, I don't know that I'd change things up too much. For one thing, they've won two games decisively and nearly won the opener as well. For another, while Green has had two monster games and has shot a high percentage throughout the series, he's only been a game-changer in Games 3 and 5. In Games 1, 2, and 4, he was just pretty good (13 ppg, 13-23 fg, 12-19 3pt). He's due for an off-night. I'm just not sure it makes sense to get away from their defensive gameplan just to focus on San Antonio's third/fourth option.

[Mabdul Doobakus]

That's all well and good to say, but I'm not sure what that means for the game. So they're going to not help off of Green. Does that mean they'll leave Parker to go one-on-one? That they won't double Duncan? That they'll force Leonard and Ginobili to beat them? And can they even be disciplined enough defensively not to lose track of Green? I mean, a lot of what makes them effective defensively is their ability to force turnovers by crashing the passing lanes. If they are more focused on staying in front of Green, will that limit their effectiveness overall defensively?

Ultimately, I don't know that I'd change things up too much. For one thing, they've won two games decisively and nearly won the opener as well. For another, while Green has had two monster games and has shot a high percentage throughout the series, he's only been a game-changer in Games 3 and 5. In Games 1, 2, and 4, he was just pretty good (13 ppg, 13-23 fg, 12-19 3pt). He's due for an off-night. I'm just not sure it makes sense to get away from their defensive gameplan just to focus on San Antonio's third/fourth option.

I was just joking about the Bosh quote (I just thought it was a funny thing for him to say), but still, I know what you mean and get your point. I'm completely speculating, but I don't think he was implying they're going to radically change their game plan. Mental mistakes have led to many of his open 3's...things like quintuple teaming Tiago Splitter in the post, or cutting under picks, or just bad rotations...and my take on his quote was the Heat are going to stop screwing up. Of course, that's all well and good to say.

To some extent, though...if you're the Heat, you have to be okay with Green knocking down 30 footers sometimes. Him and Neal have both done that this series. Those are bad shots, and if they beat you on those shots, then so be it, but you can't overreact to those shots, and you can't let those makes take you out of your game. It's a 48 minute game, and if you play sound basketball for 48 minutes...if you can get better percentage shots than they do, then you ought to come out ahead in the end, even though it might not be the smoothest ride. To that effect, NO MORE WHINING to the refs after you miss a layup. If you can't whine and run at the same time, then just run. Save the whining for later. You have to make the Spurs earn every point.

[Mabdul Doobakus]

I'm going to singlehandedly flood this thread because for the next 17 minutes I have nothing better to do. Anyone else think it's kind of insane that Vegas still has the Heat as the favorite to win this series? I think tonight is basically a tossup, with the Heat having a decent edge in a potential Game 7, but even if you thought the Heat had a 70% chance of winning each game, they'd still be the slight underdog. Obviously, I understand that Vegas isn't really saying who they think is going to win, but just trying to set odds based on what they think the people think, but still...if I weren't a Heat fan, and if I ever actually bet on sports, I'd be all over that bet.

[Mtn.Devil.91.92.01.10.15]

http://espn.go.com/blog/truehoop/miamiheat/post/_/id/18138/is-exhaustion-affecting-lebron-james

Just read this article and it touches on an idea that I've been contemplating: LeBron could be exhausted.

I'm sorry, but I don't care how many 48 minute games LeBron has played, bringing in fatigue is a cop out. He's one of the most physically fit athletes in the history of sports, and he is at the height of his career. The idea that playing two to three games a week can wear a man of that age out is ludicrous.

The Heat might be mentally fatigued, injured, etc., but calling LeBron physically tired sounds like strange pretext for something else.

-Go Duke!

[CDu]

I was just joking about the Bosh quote (I just thought it was a funny thing for him to say), but still, I know what you mean and get your point. I'm completely speculating, but I don't think he was implying they're going to radically change their game plan. Mental mistakes have led to many of his open 3's...things like quintuple teaming Tiago Splitter in the post, or cutting under picks, or just bad rotations...and my take on his quote was the Heat are going to stop screwing up. Of course, that's all well and good to say.

To some extent, though...if you're the Heat, you have to be okay with Green knocking down 30 footers sometimes. Him and Neal have both done that this series. Those are bad shots, and if they beat you on those shots, then so be it, but you can't overreact to those shots, and you can't let those makes take you out of your game. It's a 48 minute game, and if you play sound basketball for 48 minutes...if you can get better percentage shots than they do, then you ought to come out ahead in the end, even though it might not be the smoothest ride. To that effect, NO MORE WHINING to the refs after you miss a layup. If you can't whine and run at the same time, then just run. Save the whining for later. You have to make the Spurs earn every point.

Couldn't agree more with all of this post. Miami has been an aggressive, trapping, ball-hawking team all season. They've been susceptible to the 3-ball all season. Their defensive game is predicated on turnovers and long rebounds leading to fast breaks. It just doesn't make sense to get out of that game just to pay extra attention to Danny Green and his long-distance shooting.

I also was amused by the quote from Bosh, who isn't exactly known for his defensive prowess.

[Billy Dat]

It is amazing how the narrative of the series has been the whomever lost the last game is doomed. Granted, the Spurs being 1 game from the chip may increase their intensity in the second half if the game is close. I remember when the Heat beat the Mavs, guys like Zo, Twon Walker and Gary Payton were playing out of their minds down the stretch of the deciding game when the finish line was near.

Still, I expect the Heat to win tonight, and then I expect the story to change to "The Spurs Missed Their Chance". I expect the Miami role players will play much better at home, and I expect the Spurs role players won't play as well as they did at home.

I have no idea what will happen in Game 7.

[CDu]

It is amazing how the narrative of the series has been the whomever lost the last game is doomed. Granted, the Spurs being 1 game from the chip may increase their intensity in the second half if the game is close. I remember when the Heat beat the Mavs, guys like Zo, Twon Walker and Gary Payton were playing out of their minds down the stretch of the deciding game when the finish line was near.

Still, I expect the Heat to win tonight, and then I expect the story to change to "The Spurs Missed Their Chance". I expect the Miami role players will play much better at home, and I expect the Spurs role players won't play as well as they did at home.

I have no idea what will happen in Game 7.

I would put the Heat as the favorite in each of Game 6 and (even moreso) Game 7. So if you look at it as two isolated games, I'd favor the Heat. It's only on aggregate probability that San Antonio would have the edge.

That said, I do think the Spurs' best chance is to get out to a good start in Game 6 and get Miami doubting themselves. If Miami wins Game 6, I think they'll be up to the challenge in Game 7.

[JayBean]

I'm sorry, but I don't care how many 48 minute games LeBron has played, bringing in fatigue is a cop out. He's one of the most physically fit athletes in the history of sports, and he is at the height of his career. The idea that playing two to three games a week can wear a man of that age out is ludicrous.

The Heat might be mentally fatigued, injured, etc., but calling LeBron physically tired sounds like strange pretext for something else.

-Go Duke!

Here is another article about the game tonight.

http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/9398854/could-game-6-end-lebron-james-miami-heat-magical-season

Spoiler alert: The article does make a reference to "physical exhaustion". If this causes consternation or headaches, I apologize.

[g-money]

Great start to game 6. Shane actually banked in a three! (Although he also lost Green on a 3.) I think we're in for a classic.

[jipops]

Did anybody outside of San Antonio pick the Spurs in 6? LeBron is looking far closer to ordinary than what have been used to seeing.

[Wander]

Did anybody outside of San Antonio pick the Spurs in 6?

I think several people on this board did (not me). Spurs go on a run at the end of the first half... again.

[Mabdul Doobakus]

Disastrous end to the half for Miami. Things looking a little perilous.

[arnie]

Somebody earlier said Bosh was a hall-of-famer! What a joke - the guy doesn't rebound, can't guard bigs and has at best a fair-to-good shot. He is long but that's not enough.

[Mabdul Doobakus]

Did anybody outside of San Antonio pick the Spurs in 6? LeBron is looking far closer to ordinary than what have been used to seeing.

Yeah, he's just not playing well. Whenever I see him do that thing where he starts backing further and further away from the hoop with 7-8 seconds on the shot clock, I know he's not in the flow of the game, thinking about things too much. I hate when he does that.

Heat missed a lot of wide open jumpers at the end of that half, and they seemed to get discourage by that.

I don't have any answers for Miami. The Spurs continue to grind away, good possession after good possession, and I'm not sure the Heat have the discipline to keep up with this savvy Spurs team. I'm not ready to throw in the towel, but if they thought they were going to come out and dominate with their big game swarming defense and high energy, apparently they were mistaken.

[Mabdul Doobakus]

Not sure why the Spurs have gone away from Duncan here. Good energy from the Heat so far this half. 6 minutes to go in the 3rd...this is right around the point that most of these games have been decided by a huge run.

[Mabdul Doobakus]

Sure enough. Spurs run again.

[jipops]

I was just about to post it, Spurs about to blow this one open, then they score 7 points in about 30 seconds. Miami can't defend these guys and has nothing going on offense.

San Antonio getting to the lane whenever they want and Miami can't make jump shots.

[_Gary]

I think we can just about stick a fork in the Heat. They are probably done. This entire series, imho, has been about someone on the Spurs team just playing through the roof. It's been Green on some nights. Neal on others. Ginobili the last game. And now Duncan just playing flawlessly tonight. Through it all has been Parker. If the Spurs win tonight he's got to be the series MVP. His ability to get in the lane at will has influenced everything. On top of that, the Spurs have been money at the end of quarters and the half in just about every game.

[Mabdul Doobakus]

Lebron and Wade on consecutive possessions again choosing to posture and whine rather than play defense. Frustrating as a fan. Spurs playing with much more poise. Foul calls snowballing on Miami, but they're not responding well at all.

[jipops]

Finally LeBron gets to the line. That should be the focus the entire 4th, although he seems to have problems finishing. Anybody else think he's lacking his normal lift in these past few games?

[Mabdul Doobakus]

I think we can just about stick a fork in the Heat. They are probably done. This entire series, imho, has been about someone on the Spurs team just playing through the roof. It's been Green on some nights. Neal on others. Ginobili the last game. And now Duncan just playing flawlessly tonight. Through it all has been Parker. If the Spurs win tonight he's got to be the series MVP. His ability to get in the lane at will has influenced everything. On top of that, the Spurs have been money at the end of quarters and the half in just about every game.

Yeah, this could be the final quarter of the Big Three Era. I guess I'm just gonna try to enjoy it. It's really hard for me to see the Spurs giving back a 10 point lead. They seem to have an answer for everything.

[g-money]

Is it just me, or is this the polar opposite of the NBA from 5-10 years ago in terms of officiating? It seems like James and Wade are getting whacked on every drive without a whistle, and as a consequence the Spurs are up 18-10 on the FTA count.

I guess I'm torn - I like to see the visiting team get the calls as often as not, but I also feel like the more aggressive team should be rewarded.

Anyway, let's see what the fourth quarter holds.

[_Gary]

If I were in the Arena tonight I'd have given a big Bronx jeer to the refs as well at the end of the 3rd when they finally called a foul after Lebron had gone inside. That's the one element of this game 6 that hasn't been even. The Spurs have gotten away with multiple offensive fouls on breakaways and been given 3 point opportunities on them when they should have been called for fouls themselves with points being taken off the board. On the other end, both Lebron and Wade have gone inside and gotten banged around a bunch with no whistles. I'm shocked because this game, the last time I checked, was being played in Miami. But if I didn't know better I'd think they were still in San Antonio tonight.

[g-money]

OK - that play by Miller was just awesome.

[tommy]

There go those Heat, showing no heart and quitting again. Not.

[jipops]

Could the one sneaker 3 have saved the series?

[elvis14]

A couple of big 3's to start the quarter for the Heat. We just have to hope the Spurs can respond and expand the lead again!

[g-money]

I think Lebron may have just had his "F--- you Jobu, I do it myself" moment.

[elvis14]

As painful as it's been to watch the Spurs give up such a big lead in the fourth quarter, at least we can put the rest all the Dancin' Danny for MVP foolishness. He's been awful.

[g-money]

Parker might win an Oscar for that one.

[elvis14]

Parker might win an Oscar for that one.

Parker might win an MVP for that one.

[_Gary]

At this point I think the MVP award should go to the entire Spurs team for their performance over this entire series at the end of quarters, the end of halfs, and the end of games. They have just been money and look like they are going to do it again.

[elvis14]

These 20 seconds can't come off that clock fast enough. I really hope the missed FT by Ginobli doesn't cost the Spurs.

[subzero02]

It's not over yet... Lebron hits a 3... What's left in the tank?

[El_Diablo]

Jesus Shuttlesworth!!!

[_Gary]

Big time stuff by the Heat to get this to OT. They are still alive!

[elvis14]

Up by 3 I would have fouled Chalmers when he was dribbling the ball around before he gave it to James for that missed 3. I'd rather have a 1 point lead and the ball than give up 2 three point shots.

[subzero02]

I guess there was something left in Ray Allen's tank...

[g-money]

WOW. Ray Allen!

(That review was bogus, btw.)

And yes, I will agree, elvis14 - Parker made some huge plays at the end of regulation.

Time for another beer.

[elvis14]

No matter who wins how am I going to get any sleep after this?

[jipops]

Looks like it should have been a foul on Green to me. He clearly slaps down on LeBron's left hand preventing him from dropping the ball to that hand.

[FerryFor50]

Looks like it should have been a foul on Green to me. He clearly slaps down on LeBron's left hand preventing him from dropping the ball to that hand.

Yep. And the Van Gundy axe to grind act against the Heat is getting old. It's like listening to Len Elmore call a Duke game.

[CDu]

Looks like it should have been a foul on Green to me. He clearly slaps down on LeBron's left hand preventing him from dropping the ball to that hand.

They made up for it on Manu on the other end.

Heck of a game by James and heck of a finish by Bosh.

[jipops]

Yep. And the Van Gundy axe to grind act against the Heat is getting old. It's like listening to Len Elmore call a Duke game.

And Ray Allen does the exact same thing to Manu on the other end and Van Gundy thinks it's clearly a foul.

The big question for Game 7, will LeBron sport the headband?

[millerecu]

Must be our hatred of Danny! Looked like a foul on James but Van Grundy says its a great defensive play....same play on the other end is an obvious foul on Allen....what a homer

[#1Duke]

As painful as it's been to watch the Spurs give up such a big lead in the fourth quarter, at least we can put the rest all the Dancin' Danny for MVP foolishness. He's been awful.

How so? I mean just curious what you saw in his performance for you to say He's been awful?

He was 1 for 5 and the Heat was concentrating on shutting him down. He played excellent defense and got some rebounds...... how was he awful?

He was also fouled on his last shot attempt at the end of the game.

[FerryFor50]

Two reasons Van Gundy shouldn't call Miami games:

3424

3425

[FerryFor50]

They made up for it on Manu on the other end.


Before or after his 3rd step?

[Ichabod Drain]

Jesus Shuttlesworth strikes again!

[Duvall]

Yep. And the Van Gundy axe to grind act against the Heat is getting old. It's like listening to Len Elmore call a Duke game.

They're just telling the American sports fan what he wants to hear. It's the ESPN way.

[sagegrouse]

Before or after his 3rd step?

Manu.........................Ginobili............. ...................took........................... ...........five................................... ..steps

sage

[FerryFor50]

Manu.........................Ginobili............. ...................took........................... ...........five................................... ..steps

sage

4th and 5th steps were attributed to Daniel Ewing.

[#1Duke]

Manu stunk up the floor tonight. Turnovers and very poor ball handling/passing.

[Mabdul Doobakus]

I watched that whole overtime in disbelief that it was even happening.

I didn't think the Spurs would let Miami back in it, but they missed shots that they've made all series. Green missed two wide open ones, and I think that was huge for Miami's psyche. I called home when it got to 5 with 28 seconds left, and we were all saying our condolences. I'm still kind of shocked. Huge plays by Allen and Bosh down the stretch, and a monster 4th quarter from Lebron. Ray Allen's shot is officially the biggest shot in Heat history.

And, in defense of Van Gundy, sometimes I don't agree with him, and maybe he's a big Spurs fan or something, but of all the talking heads out there he's probably the only one I can think of who's consistently been complimentary of the Heat. I'm gonna give him a pass.

[Mabdul Doobakus]

Manu.........................Ginobili............. ...................took........................... ...........five................................... ..steps

sage

I know...that was crazy...like a running back heading for the end zone.

[jipops]

There are always gripes about calls in tight games like this. The Spurs had this one won and let it slip. Credit Miami for tightening up their D and not giving up any open looks from the perimeter. The Heat seemed to try to give it back with all of the turnovers. The Spurs missed free throws were huge though. And where was Duncan in the 4th?

[g-money]

Some random thoughts after Game 6:

- If the Heat win the series, that Ray Allen shot will go down in NBA history as one of the most clutch ever. Even though I'm bummed Shane didn't play at the end of the game, you can't argue with Spoelstra's decision to put Allen in there instead. He's one of the all-time money-time shooters.

- As an armchair quarterback, for the first time in this series I have to question Popovich a bit. Why was the best point guard in the game on the bench at the end? He's not that much of a liability on defense.

- For Game 7, I would not be surprised at all if San Antonio wins. They are resilient, and they will not be intimidated. Plus the Heat have been prone to letting up when they feel they are secure - an easy trap to fall into in Game 7.

- I personally am just psyched that I get to watch one more NBA game this year! Baseball stinks.

[#1Duke]

The Spurs lost that game due to poor coaching. Taking Duncan out for two defensive plays gave the Heat the offensive rebounds they needed..... kicking the ball out for James to get another attempt at a three.
Leaving Manu in the game when he was turning the ball over so much and making poor decisions.
Parker forced some shots tonight at key times.
Spurs gave that one away.

[luburch]

He was also fouled on his last shot attempt at the end of the game.

Just watched the replay a few times and it was great defense. No foul. Clean up top, clean down low.

[#1Duke]

Just watched the replay a few times and it was great defense. No foul. Clean up top, clean down low.

I disagree. Clean up top but he got him with the body..... 9 times out of 10 that's a foul.

I just watched it again and he got Green with his body big time.

[FerryFor50]

I disagree. Clean up top but he got him with the body..... 9 times out of 10 that's a foul.

Like when Danny Green got James with the body with no call? Maybe 8 out of 10 times, then?

[Ichabod Drain]

I disagree. Clean up top but he got him with the body..... 9 times out of 10 that's a foul.

NBA Finals game 6 OT... that's never a foul

any other game it's 50/50

[Mabdul Doobakus]

Yeah, I agree with the sentiment that the Spurs can definitely bounce back from this. As surprising as it was to see them choke away this game, this is still an experienced team that knows it has another chance to win this title. And all the points made about Pop's coaching decisions are on point. ESPN talked about the terrible lineup he had out there at the start of the 4th, which may have been the biggest mistake of them all. I mean, it went on for 3 minutes. That was definitely go for the kill time.

[tommy]

All the griping about fouls and nobody mentions how on Ray Allen's huge 3, Tony Parker totally undercut him and stuck his chest out into Allen's legs, cutting his legs out from under him. No call.

It's just amazing to me how much punishment LeBron has to absorb before he can get a call against these guys. Way, way more than anyone else on the floor. Totally getting the Wilt Chamberlain treatment.

[tommy]

Bottom line is: win or lose on Thursday night, there can no longer be any doubt whatsoever that LeBron James has the heart of a champion. And the will of a champion. To go along with his otherworldly skills. The latter he's had for some time, but he's now proven beyond any doubt at all that he has a heart to match his skill set and his body.