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View Full Version : 2013 East (DC) Region Discussion (Marquette/Cuse)



hurleyfor3
03-17-2013, 05:53 PM
This thread is for discussion of impending and potential matchups in the East regional. Regional finals are Thursday/Saturday at the Wizards' arena in Washington.

hurleyfor3
03-17-2013, 06:21 PM
Indiana is the #1 and is the third-strongest #1. Regional winner plays the South winner in the Final Four.

CR9
03-17-2013, 06:25 PM
Miami walks this region IMO.

hurleyfor3
03-17-2013, 06:26 PM
I don't think our draw is particularly hard, but I would swap positions with Miami in a heartbeat.

Bluedog
03-17-2013, 06:27 PM
Yeah, Marquette as a 3? I'm surprised by that. Definitely a good draw for Miami. Although IL in second round could be tough if IL decides to show up. They've been inconsistent this year for sure.

pfrduke
03-17-2013, 06:27 PM
I don't think our draw is particularly hard, but I would swap positions with Miami in a heartbeat.

Yep. I don't think much of either Illinois or Colorado. Same with Marquette. Or Butler, really.

OldPhiKap
03-17-2013, 06:27 PM
Miami should be smiling.

BlueDevilBrowns
03-17-2013, 06:28 PM
Miami vs. NCSU is my elite 8. Miami to Atlanta.

CoachJ10
03-17-2013, 06:29 PM
And Miami matches up very well with Indiana. The bigs of Miami could clean up on the boards. I like Miami's draw a lot. Let's see if the senior citizens of the "U" can take care of business with the big lights on them.

CoachJ10
03-17-2013, 07:19 PM
And while I am not crazy about Lorenzo Brown's decision making at times...NC State could provide a scare against Indiana. NC State can hit the boards. As a #1 seed, I'd be a little more worried about this 8/9 matchup than others.

davekay1971
03-17-2013, 07:32 PM
Indiana should come out of this region, but if NCSU plays it's best (i.e.: CJL finally comes out to destroy, Howell stays out of trouble and muscles around Zeller, Wood is hitting, and Brown plays well, State could beat Indiana and actually take this region. State could also lose to Temple. By double digits. That is the essence of NC State.

DukeAlumBS
03-18-2013, 12:17 PM
My friends, looks like we got a Duke / Miami final from what I am gathering.
Good! I will win the 50K at ESPN as well.

Have nice day my friends,

Jimmy

superdave
03-18-2013, 01:34 PM
I like Indiana coming out of this region. They have some NBA talent in Zeller and Oladipo, as both are projected top 10 picks. I did not think Miami closed the season strong, until they won the ACCT. But they did not have to go through Duke to do it, so it's hard to tell just how solid they are right now. They took Unc's best shot and won, while IU blew it vs. Wisco.

My sleepers in this region would be UNLV and State. If State starts rolling like last year, they could beat anyone in the tourney. Or they forget to get off the bus. Vegas has Bennet who is a legit talent on the wing.

My hunch is Indiana survives some close games vs. State and UNLV, then rolls over Miami. I think the Hossiers can win the title.

PumpkinFunk
03-18-2013, 01:49 PM
Indiana should win this region, but they got a much harder path to the Elite 8 than Miami did. If Calvin shows up instead of CJ, State could beat Miami. Temple's been inconsistent but they've beaten some good teams (like Syracuse). And Syracuse will give Indiana a tough game, too. I don't see Miami having trouble with anyone in their half of the region, unless Butler or Marquette are just lights-out.

I'm picking Indiana to get out of this region, but it'll be a challenge for them.

Dev11
03-18-2013, 05:05 PM
Not that it should have a big effect on who moves to Atlanta from this region, but an interesting tidbit: James Madison is playing in the play-in game for the right to be clobbered by IU, and yesterday their leading scorer was arrested for some obstruction of justice and disorderly conduct. The punishment from JMU is that he is suspended from the first half of their play-in game against LIUB.

I have no opinion on JMU in general, but this looks terrible for that program. I get that you're trying to win a tournament game which you never get to do, but either suspend the kid or not. The half-game suspension is such a cop-out.

sagegrouse
03-20-2013, 08:40 PM
James Madison U. has beaten LIU-Brooklyn 68-55 and will play Indiana on Friday. -- sagegrouse

devildeac
03-20-2013, 09:28 PM
James Madison U. has beaten LIU-Brooklyn 68-55 and will play Indiana on Friday. -- sagegrouse

Ahh, another Duke(s) vs Hoosiers match-up;).

kmspeaks
03-21-2013, 02:17 PM
Bucknell giving Butler a game right now. Can only listen in periodically at work but it's tied at 39 with 8:00 to go. Butler had gone on an 8-0 run to take a 2 point lead before Bucknell tied it back up.

sagegrouse
03-21-2013, 05:21 PM
Davidson up 49-42 with 5:00 left. -- sagegrouse

Bob Green
03-21-2013, 05:52 PM
Extremely frustrating loss for Davidson as they handled Marquette's fullcourt pressure with ease throughout the game before throwing the ball away with 6.5 seconds remaining. It really was an unforced error. I feel for the Wildcats, they were one errant pass away from a 14-3 upset.

Chicken Little
03-21-2013, 09:48 PM
UNLV/Cal might be the worst game I've seen all year.

moonpie23
03-21-2013, 09:56 PM
i have nightmares with jason kidd in that uni

Wander
03-21-2013, 10:00 PM
UNLV/Cal might be the worst game I've seen all year.

Yeah, I think UNLV might be the dumbest/worst-coached team in the field...

moonpie23
03-21-2013, 10:08 PM
that fou/no foul up 3 worked out for them.....but it coulda gone south just as easily...


that was ugly

sporthenry
03-21-2013, 10:16 PM
Yeah, I think UNLV might be the dumbest/worst-coached team in the field...

That was a terrible game from so many perspectives. One terrible flagrant, one questionable one. UNLV missed 15 straight FGs at one point yet was still only down 6. UNLV's defense was pretty terrible when Cal decided to attack as they gave up something like 4 straight uncontested dunks.

Then the end of the game happened. Missed FT's, rebounding said missed FT's when your team didn't even put a guy on the blocks. The ref not calling a blatant foul. I wanted some March Madness and instead was just annoyed at the quality of that game.

uh_no
03-21-2013, 10:20 PM
That was a terrible game from so many perspectives. One terrible flagrant, one questionable one. UNLV missed 15 straight FGs at one point yet was still only down 6. UNLV's defense was pretty terrible when Cal decided to attack as they gave up something like 4 straight uncontested dunks.

Then the end of the game happened. Missed FT's, rebounding said missed FT's when your team didn't even put a guy on the blocks. The ref not calling a blatant foul. I wanted some March Madness and instead was just annoyed at the quality of that game.

I picked cal.
I thought it was a great game :)

ns7
03-21-2013, 10:24 PM
UNLV/Cal might be the worst game I've seen all year.

Two bad offenses met two one good (Cal) and one great (UNLV) defense. UNLV looked awful on offense. At least Cal could score with some point blank shots and dunks.

sporthenry
03-21-2013, 10:25 PM
I picked cal.
I thought it was a great game :)

Fair enough. I actually had Cal in a few brackets although not the majority so perhaps that came through in my response. I'm not sure why I'm so worked up. I guess I just want buzzer beaters and bad basketball is just frustrating. Watching UNLV make no adjustments to Cal's offense and missing wide open shots was just annoying.

uh_no
03-21-2013, 10:48 PM
Fair enough. I actually had Cal in a few brackets although not the majority so perhaps that came through in my response. I'm not sure why I'm so worked up. I guess I just want buzzer beaters and bad basketball is just frustrating. Watching UNLV make no adjustments to Cal's offense and missing wide open shots was just annoying.

to be fair, though

all the close games have been awful basketball....the harvard game looks promising, though

HaveFunExpectToWin
03-21-2013, 11:55 PM
Montgomery's decision to foul twice when up three in the last minute was terrible. He's lucky that UNLV didn't take advantage, they were just too incompetent to do so. Just a weird and unsatisfying end. At least I picked Cal in my bracket.

uh_no
03-22-2013, 12:09 AM
Montgomery's decision to foul twice when up three in the last minute was terrible. He's lucky that UNLV didn't take advantage, they were just too incompetent to do so. Just a weird and unsatisfying end. At least I picked Cal in my bracket.

why was it terrible? they won the game...and did exactly what they wanted to....prevented them from scoring three points a possession.....

now...if cal hit even a couple more FTs it would have looked even better...but you can't second guess based on thefact that they didn't hit FTs.

ns7
03-22-2013, 12:15 AM
why was it terrible? they won the game...and did exactly what they wanted to....prevented them from scoring three points a possession.....

now...if cal hit even a couple more FTs it would have looked even better...but you can't second guess based on thefact that they didn't hit FTs.

It's generally a bad idea to increase the variance of the outcomes when you're winning. That's what Montgomery did by fouling at the end, especially with more than 10 seconds left in the game. Memphis was missing free throws as well, maybe not as many as Cal, but they could have easily made those, leading to a possession where they were only down two.

uh_no
03-22-2013, 12:42 AM
It's generally a bad idea to increase the variance of the outcomes when you're winning. That's what Montgomery did by fouling at the end, especially with more than 10 seconds left in the game. Memphis was missing free throws as well, maybe not as many as Cal, but they could have easily made those, leading to a possession where they were only down two.

fair enough. I think the time left is the compelling factor here. I am generally in favor of fouling up 3 when you get down to about 8 or so seconds, but I will agree with you thattehre was too much time left

TNDukeFan
03-22-2013, 03:05 PM
...says they want to play smooth, win without sweating.

juise
03-22-2013, 03:07 PM
State dug themselves a pretty enormous hole, but they are showing some fight and giving themselves a chance. They don't have foul trouble, so hopefully their big guns can hold it together.

luburch
03-22-2013, 03:35 PM
I'd turn to TBS now if you haven't already. NCSU making things interesting.

ChrisP
03-22-2013, 03:42 PM
State just got hosed - ref called a foul on a clean block by Brown.

ChrisP
03-22-2013, 03:44 PM
I thought State would be able to win at least ONE game. I'm sure someone else here will come up with a better example, but I can't remember a team with more talent/potential that's under-performed like the Wolfpack this year. Way to spot Temple a 16 point lead at the half, State! Thanks for screwing up my bracket!

davekay1971
03-23-2013, 10:07 PM
Butler and Marquette putting on the game of the tournament so far. This is close, intense, high quality, with great defense AND guys making great passes and shots.

moonpie23
03-23-2013, 10:09 PM
this butler/marq game is BRUTAL!!!!

the refs have just abandoned the "foul".......

sporthenry
03-23-2013, 10:11 PM
Butler and Marquette putting on the game of the tournament so far. This is close, intense, high quality, with great defense AND guys making great passes and shots.

Brad Stevens is a remarkable coach. Amazing how he can continue to get the guys he wants and the system just works. Granted, these close games are probably coin flips but I don't think its a coincidence that they win a lot of them.

davekay1971
03-23-2013, 10:15 PM
Brad Stevens is a remarkable coach. Amazing how he can continue to get the guys he wants and the system just works. Granted, these close games are probably coin flips but I don't think its a coincidence that they win a lot of them.

Yeah. We need a DBR fundraiser for either of two purposes: to help entice him to come to Duke if Duke wants him to take over once K retires...or to pay him to NOT go to UNC when Roy retires.

dukelifer
03-23-2013, 10:18 PM
Brad Stevens is a remarkable coach. Amazing how he can continue to get the guys he wants and the system just works. Granted, these close games are probably coin flips but I don't think its a coincidence that they win a lot of them.

Butler kids play so well in money time. This is a great game

sporthenry
03-23-2013, 10:22 PM
Yeah. We need a DBR fundraiser for either of two purposes: to help entice him to come to Duke if Duke wants him to take over once K retires...or to pay him to NOT go to UNC when Roy retires.

Have to think with Drew Cannon on their bench that he already has the ties to Duke. Most UNC fans seem to be penciling in Smart already. It'll be interesting to see how he does when he starts to go after and get better recruits.

Dukeface88
03-23-2013, 10:28 PM
Yeah. We need a DBR fundraiser for either of two purposes: to help entice him to come to Duke if Duke wants him to take over once K retires...or to pay him to NOT go to UNC when Roy retires.

I'm pretty sure the AD's office has a phone with Brad Steven's number on speed dial and a note saying "in case of retirement, push 1".

And Butler forces a TO with 2 seconds left. Holy crap, this game is amazing.

dukelifer
03-23-2013, 10:32 PM
I'm pretty sure the AD's office has a phone with Brad Steven's number on speed dial and a note saying "in case of retirement, push 1".

And Butler forces a TO with 2 seconds left. Holy crap, this game is amazing.

Had a chance but the close out forced a bad shot. Best game of the day by a mile

1 24 90
03-23-2013, 10:50 PM
The Duke/UNC rivalry this year has nothing on the new Butler/Marquette rivalry to continue in the Big East. Breathtaking game.

jipops
03-23-2013, 11:36 PM
Yeah. We need a DBR fundraiser for either of two purposes: to help entice him to come to Duke if Duke wants him to take over once K retires...or to pay him to NOT go to UNC when Roy retires.

For some reason I don't think Brad would be too hip to the whole no-show class thing. Plus I think they have it all setup for Hubert.

BlueDevilBrowns
03-23-2013, 11:59 PM
For some reason I don't think Brad would be too hip to the whole no-show class thing. Plus I think they have it all setup for Hubert.

Hubert over Shaka or Brad? Hubert would be a distant 3rd on that list.

But I do think UNC wants to keep Roy's successor in the family.

luburch
03-24-2013, 03:41 PM
Wyatt has 20 of Temple's 24 points right now.

pfrduke
03-24-2013, 03:52 PM
Wyatt has 20 of Temple's 24 points right now.

Amazingly, he has 20 points on 14 shots, while his teammates have 9 points on 20 shots. Clearly, he should be calling his own number more often.

luburch
03-24-2013, 04:28 PM
This is turning out to be a pretty good game.

sporthenry
03-24-2013, 04:29 PM
This is turning out to be a pretty good game.

IU will pull away as Temple's defenders are rendered useless against Zeller at the rate the refs are calling fouls.

MChambers
03-24-2013, 04:57 PM
IU will pull away as Temple's defenders are rendered useless against Zeller at the rate the refs are calling fouls.

Like Hansbrough, Zeller loves to jump into the chest of the defender and the refs let him get away with it. Drives me crazy.

77devil
03-24-2013, 05:02 PM
IU will pull away as Temple's defenders are rendered useless against Zeller at the rate the refs are calling fouls.

Refs are not calling it evenly for sure, but the Owls are hanging in there.

And Clark Kellogg is such a BIG homer it's pathetic.

luburch
03-24-2013, 05:03 PM
Big plays by Oladipo down the stretch. The kid can play.

RoyalBlue08
03-24-2013, 05:06 PM
Apparently IU only committed 4 fours in the entire second half.

_Gary
03-24-2013, 05:09 PM
Apparently IU only committed 4 fours in the entire second half.

Yep. Both Indiana and Ohio State had better include a little something extra in the officials envelopes after today's proceedings. I feel like Iowa State and Temple were both robbed.

CoachJ10
03-24-2013, 05:11 PM
Apparently IU only committed 4 fours in the entire second half.

Indiana called for 8 fouls the entire game...they easily "committed" over 20+ fouls.

Really a shame how the refs have given the B1G these games today. Temple should have won by 10+ with fair and competent refs.

Fran Dunphy didn't do himself any favors by not getting in the refs faces about how poorly they were treating his team.

jipops
03-24-2013, 05:13 PM
Yep. Both Indiana and Ohio State had better include a little something extra in the officials envelopes after today's proceedings. I feel like Iowa State and Temple were both robbed.

I disagree. IU made winning plays down the stretch, this is what championship teams do. As did Oh St with Craft's shot at the end. I hardly see how a ref put that in the basket for him. Yes there was a controversial call near the end of the OSU game, but it was an extremely difficult call to make. The ref probably did get it wrong according to the rule but it's incredibly difficult to make the judgement of his foot being above the line in real time action. Also, if Craft doesn't make that shot, it's a moot point anyways.

If it were Duke winning like this, and we have won big games with close calls in the past, would you be making similar judgments?

_Gary
03-24-2013, 05:15 PM
Is it just me, or does the entire CBS network (minus Sir Charles) have a huge man crush on the Big Ten teams? Seems like the announcers for these games, and the guys in the studio, are just in love with the Big Ten teams. I guarantee you that if Duke had only been whistled for 8 fouls in a game that would be the only thing you'd hear about for days.

_Gary
03-24-2013, 05:19 PM
If it were Duke winning like this, and we have won big games with close calls in the past, would you be making similar judgments?

Probably not since I'm a Duke fan. But since I'm not a Big Ten fan I think I can see these type of things with more objectivity than I would were it my team playing. Anyone that thinks Indiana only committed 4 fouls in the 2nd half of that game just... I have no words for that. And the call in the Ohio State game was a huge call that absolutely affected the outcome. At least that's my opinion. But feel free to disagree. That's what makes the world go round. ;)

Mal
03-24-2013, 05:30 PM
Probably not since I'm a Duke fan. But since I'm not a Big Ten fan I think I can see these type of things with more objectivity than I would were it my team playing. Anyone that thinks Indiana only committed 4 fouls in the 2nd half of that game just... I have no words for that. And the call in the Ohio State game was a huge call that absolutely affected the outcome. At least that's my opinion. But feel free to disagree. That's what makes the world go round. ;)

Agreed. I didn't see OSU/ISU so can't comment on that, although I wouldn't be surprised to hear that Ohio State bulled their way through and the rugged B1G style wasn't a disadvantage with the refs. But Indiana got a significant amount of favorable calls - Gary's not talking about just one. It was the entirety of the game.

DU82
03-24-2013, 05:37 PM
And they just missed a blatant block in favor of the Heels. No comments from the announcing team, as they're too busy plowing the snow outside.

_Gary
03-24-2013, 05:51 PM
Agreed. I didn't see OSU/ISU so can't comment on that, although I wouldn't be surprised to hear that Ohio State bulled their way through and the rugged B1G style wasn't a disadvantage with the refs. But Indiana got a significant amount of favorable calls - Gary's not talking about just one. It was the entirety of the game.

Thank you.

Philsfan
03-24-2013, 06:00 PM
Temple alum here. I rarely complain about the refs but yes, we were robbed. Taking away nothing from Indiana. Go Blue Devils! Make me feel better tonight!

Mabdul Doobakus
03-24-2013, 10:42 PM
Miami has been completely taken out of their offensive game by Illinois. Generating absolutely nothing off the pick and roll. Pretty good D being played by both sides. And Miami is starting to build up an advantage in the fouls column, which could be important, if Miami can hit some free throws. They're 2 for 7 from the line, I think.

Durand Scott took a blow to the eye early in the game and has been verrrrry quiet. Though he just put home a dunk to cap a 4 pt possession for Miami.

pfrduke
03-24-2013, 10:44 PM
Two huge shots for Rion Brown.

Mabdul Doobakus
03-24-2013, 10:46 PM
Two huge shots for Rion Brown.

One them following a very impressive Superman impression by an Illinois player trying to pick up a foul on the offensive boards.

luburch
03-24-2013, 10:48 PM
Turned to the Illinois/Miami game at halftime. Man this is a slugfest.

Mabdul Doobakus
03-24-2013, 10:58 PM
Miami is currently incapable of finishing up a defensive possession by grabbing a rebound. Absolutely killing them right now. Tie game, less than 4 minutes left.

pfrduke
03-24-2013, 10:59 PM
Miami is currently incapable of finishing up a defensive possession by grabbing a rebound. Absolutely killing them right now. Tie game, less than 4 minutes left.

The Canes haven't been beat on the glass this bad since the Arizona game. Which obviously did not end well for them.

moonpie23
03-24-2013, 11:00 PM
canes are facing some hungry boys...

Mabdul Doobakus
03-24-2013, 11:02 PM
Yeah, Illinois is really going after it, great effort. Miami not quite matching them, and missing a bunch of makeable 3's late in the game here. A couple of those go in and it's a different game, but isn't that always the case...

Mabdul Doobakus
03-24-2013, 11:06 PM
OMG. Larkin. Huge 3. Onions!

Mabdul Doobakus
03-24-2013, 11:08 PM
And a TERRIBLE call gives possession to Miami after a missed 3 by Illinois.

pfrduke
03-24-2013, 11:19 PM
Great for Miami - on to the Sweet 16.

uh_no
03-24-2013, 11:20 PM
And a TERRIBLE call gives possession to Miami after a missed 3 by Illinois.

very possibly cost them the game.

Mabdul Doobakus
03-24-2013, 11:53 PM
Haha, love this: http://www.thebiglead.com/index.php/2013/03/24/jim-larranaga-danced-in-the-locker-room-after-miami-survived-upset-minded-illinois-gif/

Coach K is the best. But Jim Larranaga is a close second.

pfrduke
03-25-2013, 12:15 AM
Julian Gamble's photo-bomb during Shane Larkin's interview was incredible. Bosh-esque.

pamtar
03-28-2013, 07:42 PM
A real snoozer in DC. Well, just as I type that Marquette picks it up. Still, only ~30 points combined so far. I was expecting a slightly faster pace with Larkin pushing the tempo. I'd be scared if I were a U fan...

Lunchab1es
03-28-2013, 09:21 PM
Sad to see the only other ACC school fall...better luck next year when we expand! The ACC's hopes now rest on Duke alone!

MCFinARL
03-28-2013, 09:42 PM
Sad to see the only other ACC school fall...better luck next year when we expand! The ACC's hopes now rest on Duke alone!

Yes, I was shocked by how non-competitive this game was. Makes me a little concerned for Duke, since it suggests something about the overall quality of ACC competition, though obviously Duke has a bit of a psychological advantage over Miami in that they have been here before.

Marquette is the best team that nobody has paid any attention to.

rsvman
03-28-2013, 09:50 PM
....

Marquette is the best team that nobody has paid any attention to.

And yet they were extremely lucky to make it out of the first round. Imagine that the Davidson player, rather than turning the ball over, had just held onto the ball and been fouled. Then, Davidson would've won the game. And people would be talking about how the Big East was overrated because Marquette, which tied for the regular season championship, couldn't even get out of the first round.

I think people tend to forget how arbitrary the tournament can be.

Newton_14
03-28-2013, 09:59 PM
Yes, I was shocked by how non-competitive this game was. Makes me a little concerned for Duke, since it suggests something about the overall quality of ACC competition, though obviously Duke has a bit of a psychological advantage over Miami in that they have been here before.

Marquette is the best team that nobody has paid any attention to.

Except they should have lost in the first round. And then the 2nd. The miracle of March Madness. I feel bad for Miami. They just could not make shots, especially in the first half, and a normally terrible shooting Marquette could not miss. As the game wore on, hot shooting team gains confidence, cold shooting team loses confidence, it eventually impacts cold shooting teams intensity, and end result is lopsided loss by higher seed. They could play again tomorrow night and Miami could win by 15-20 by hitting shots while Marquette shoots it the way they normally do. College basketball is such a finicky game. Especially in today's game. That's why in the regular season I caution people to not read too much into one individual game, especially on a non-neutral court. Over the course of 30 games you find out how good or bad a team is.

Come tourney time though, one game can send you home. Say Davidson does not commit the bad turnover. They win. Marquette is on the couch watching either Butler or Davidson play Miami tonight. Totally different game. Who wins? Who knows?

The madness of March Madness. Let's hope the Blue Devils are the hot shooting team tomorrow night and Sparty can't hit the side of a barn! :)

El_Diablo
03-28-2013, 10:09 PM
I feel bad for Miami.

Not me. As long as we are still in it, they are basically just another team in our way.

Also this:

3310

Mudge
03-28-2013, 10:20 PM
I guess you can mark Miami MIA-- Missing In Action, tonight... the ESPN abbreviated scoreboard tickler had this game as MARQ MIA-- and Miami was Marqued as MIA pretty much all night.

On a related note, ESPN has the late game as LAS WICH... almost sounds like NBA Hispanic night at arena- if they just made Wichita State WICHS, then we could have LAS WICHS... but nothing probably beats the Bradley Pittsburgh matchup of a few years back: BRAD PITT

roywhite
03-28-2013, 10:28 PM
None of our conference court-stormers left, eh?

Better to celebrate in March and April than in February.

dukelifer
03-28-2013, 10:37 PM
What is the deal with these low scoring halves. Setting basketball back 80 years!

duke96
03-28-2013, 11:19 PM
Wow. Seems like cuse is going to let this game slip away, minute by minute....

dukelifer
03-28-2013, 11:24 PM
Wow. Seems like cuse is going to let this game slip away, minute by minute....

Seems like a pattern with them

luvdahops
03-28-2013, 11:37 PM
Hoosiers are not playing well at all, but officiating has also been terrible. Cuse has gotten away with bumps, shoves and hacks all night. They have 9 blocks officially, maybe 3 of them have been clean.

duke96
03-28-2013, 11:48 PM
Such an ugly game. Looks like cuse can hold on after all, unless IU finally warms up...

-bdbd
03-28-2013, 11:59 PM
Gotta root for the underdog in this one, who is also a soon-to-be ACC squad. Given the Big10's theft of MD a few months ago and the generally haughty behavior that I've encountered by many Big10 fans this March -- "we've got 4 teams in the Sweet 16, how many does YOUR conference??!" -- I'm totally anti-Big10 the rest of this tournament!

So I'm loving it now! Orange by 14 under 2 minutes.....

superdave
03-29-2013, 12:41 AM
Gotta root for the underdog in this one, who is also a soon-to-be ACC squad. Given the Big10's theft of MD a few months ago and the generally haughty behavior that I've encountered by many Big10 fans this March -- "we've got 4 teams in the Sweet 16, how many does YOUR conference??!" -- I'm totally anti-Big10 the rest of this tournament!

So I'm loving it now! Orange by 14 under 2 minutes.....

Indiana finishes with 7 losses on the season and two also-ran NPOY candidates. This was the media's team. They all wanted Cody and Victor to be great. Didnt happen. I look forward to their admission of foolishness.

http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/8569125/cody-zeller-indiana-hoosiers-unanimous-all-america-pick
(http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/8569125/cody-zeller-indiana-hoosiers-unanimous-all-america-pick)
http://www.newsobserver.com/2012/10/30/2448708/indianas-zeller-tops-preseason.html
http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/8555195/indiana-hoosiers-top-ap-preseason-hoops-poll
(http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/8555195/indiana-hoosiers-top-ap-preseason-hoops-poll)
http://aol.sportingnews.com/ncaa-basketball/story/2012-10-17/college-basketball-preseason-coaches-top-25-espn-usa-today
(http://aol.sportingnews.com/ncaa-basketball/story/2012-10-17/college-basketball-preseason-coaches-top-25-espn-usa-today)


And now for the experts who all picked Miami
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/basketball/ncaa/men/2013/ncaa_tourney/brackets/experts/index.html

and the experts who all picked Indy.
http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/tournament
(http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/tournament)

Super "Good night, Indiana. Good night, Miami. Good night, alleged media experts" Dave

luburch
03-29-2013, 12:52 AM
Indiana finishes with 7 losses on the season and two also-ran NPOY candidates. This was the media's team. They all wanted Cody and Victor to be great. Didnt happen. I look forward to their admission of foolishness.


I'm not sure how much Indiana basketball you watched this season, but I think it's safe to say Zeller and Oladipo both had outstanding seasons. Obviously with Zeller coming in as pre-season NPOY he has no where to go but down, but he still averaged 17 and 8 for the team that won the B1G regular season outright. Both play basketball the right way. It's not their fault if ESPN showers them with love. Many would argue the same happens to Duke.

superdave
03-29-2013, 07:08 AM
I'm not sure how much Indiana basketball you watched this season, but I think it's safe to say Zeller and Oladipo both had outstanding seasons. Obviously with Zeller coming in as pre-season NPOY he has no where to go but down, but he still averaged 17 and 8 for the team that won the B1G regular season outright. Both play basketball the right way. It's not their fault if ESPN showers them with love. Many would argue the same happens to Duke.

And I still think Oladipo wins an award or two.

I just think we need to remember to look back at everyone's Final Four picks and pre-season prognostications when they go bad o remind people that experts arent really all that accurate in their jobs.

Saratoga2
03-29-2013, 07:54 AM
Except they should have lost in the first round. And then the 2nd. The miracle of March Madness. I feel bad for Miami. They just could not make shots, especially in the first half, and a normally terrible shooting Marquette could not miss. As the game wore on, hot shooting team gains confidence, cold shooting team loses confidence, it eventually impacts cold shooting teams intensity, and end result is lopsided loss by higher seed. They could play again tomorrow night and Miami could win by 15-20 by hitting shots while Marquette shoots it the way they normally do. College basketball is such a finicky game. Especially in today's game. That's why in the regular season I caution people to not read too much into one individual game, especially on a non-neutral court. Over the course of 30 games you find out how good or bad a team is.

Come tourney time though, one game can send you home. Say Davidson does not commit the bad turnover. They win. Marquette is on the couch watching either Butler or Davidson play Miami tonight. Totally different game. Who wins? Who knows?

The madness of March Madness. Let's hope the Blue Devils are the hot shooting team tomorrow night and Sparty can't hit the side of a barn! :)

I think it was more about an athletic team that played aggressively and found a way to stop all Miami penetration. Just good defense. Many of the three point shots were contested and those that weren't didn't go in due to poor shooting or just lack of confidence. Marquette was also able to pound the ball inside and hit their shots plus were quicker to the rebounds. They were just the better team last night as Miami didn't put up much of a struggle. Maybe the Miami center being out impacted the game a little but I doubt that much.

Is there a lesson for Duke here. We play mainly half court. We have limited penetration and probably will have trouble rebounding. If we take bad shots or if the 3's just won't fall, will we have enough? We will soon find out.

flyingdutchdevil
03-29-2013, 08:34 AM
And I still think Oladipo wins an award or two.

I just think we need to remember to look back at everyone's Final Four picks and pre-season prognostications when they go bad o remind people that experts arent really all that accurate in their jobs.

But isn't that the whole point of the tournament - anything can happen? This isn't the NBA playoffs where 9/10 times the best team advances. Experts are still experts: they are more knowledgeable and provide their most complete analysis. They definitely know more about the game than any of us.

NashvilleDevil
03-29-2013, 08:35 AM
But isn't that the whole point of the tournament - anything can happen? This isn't the NBA playoffs where 9/10 times the best team advances. Experts are still experts: they are more knowledgeable and provide their most complete analysis. They definitely know more about the game than any of us.

Some do. I'd say Digger and Doug do not provide much expert analysis.

MChambers
03-29-2013, 09:58 AM
I'm not sure how much Indiana basketball you watched this season, but I think it's safe to say Zeller and Oladipo both had outstanding seasons. Obviously with Zeller coming in as pre-season NPOY he has no where to go but down, but he still averaged 17 and 8 for the team that won the B1G regular season outright. Both play basketball the right way. It's not their fault if ESPN showers them with love. Many would argue the same happens to Duke.

I don't think anyone was saying Zeller and Oladipo aren't very good players, just that they aren't great. I think that's the case. I'm really not impressed by Zeller. He's not very good defensively; on offense, he seems to get away with a lot of offensive fouls. Don't misunderstand me: he'd start on any team in the country. But he's a little overrated, at least to my eye. (I watched more Big Ten games this year than I have in decades, since my son is at MSU and my daughter is, for no good reason, an Ohio State fan.)

Ichabod Drain
03-29-2013, 10:06 AM
I don't think anyone was saying Zeller and Oladipo aren't very good players, just that they aren't great. I think that's the case. I'm really not impressed by Zeller. He's not very good defensively; on offense, he seems to get away with a lot of offensive fouls. Don't misunderstand me: he'd start on any team in the country. But he's a little overrated, at least to my eye. (I watched more Big Ten games this year than I have in decades, since my son is at MSU and my daughter is, for no good reason, an Ohio State fan.)

I believe Oladipo is great, more so than Zeller for sure. The kid just makes great basketball plays. And there's this too.

3311

http://godismyjudgeok.com/DStats/aspm-and-vorp/ncaa-advanced-statistical-plus-minus-and-vorp/

superdave
03-29-2013, 10:10 AM
But isn't that the whole point of the tournament - anything can happen? This isn't the NBA playoffs where 9/10 times the best team advances. Experts are still experts: they are more knowledgeable and provide their most complete analysis. They definitely know more about the game than any of us.


I don't think anyone was saying Zeller and Oladipo aren't very good players, just that they aren't great. I think that's the case. I'm really not impressed by Zeller. He's not very good defensively; on offense, he seems to get away with a lot of offensive fouls. Don't misunderstand me: he'd start on any team in the country. But he's a little overrated, at least to my eye. (I watched more Big Ten games this year than I have in decades, since my son is at MSU and my daughter is, for no good reason, an Ohio State fan.)

In my mind, the only saving grace for all the expert analysis is that some of these people in the business had been warning all season that there were no great teams. They were right, but they still confidently picked Final Four teams and whiffed. I find some measure of joy in that. It makes March fun to see upsets, but also to see how wrong the experts got it. I just hope they get their Lousiville picks wrong too.

Also, as far as post-season awards go....I really dont know that I would vote for anyone to be national player of the year this year. Is none of the above an option? Can they skip handing out an award? No one played great ball from November through March. All the really good players had some good stretches and some bad stretches. Zeller disappeared some games, as did Mason. Oladipo came on strong later in the seaosn but could not rally his team during two post-season losses. Burke and McDermott similarly have fallen short at times. It reminds me of the year Jameer Nelson won some of the post-season hardware. He was a solid player but does not stack up well historically to other winners. I think we'll feel the same about wheoever wins this year as well.

MChambers
03-29-2013, 10:13 AM
I believe Oladipo is great, more so than Zeller for sure. The kid just makes great basketball plays. And there's this too.

3311

http://godismyjudgeok.com/DStats/aspm-and-vorp/ncaa-advanced-statistical-plus-minus-and-vorp/

Thanks for sharing this. Very interesting. I've focused more on Zeller, because of all the preseason hype.

luburch
03-29-2013, 10:21 AM
I don't think anyone was saying Zeller and Oladipo aren't very good players, just that they aren't great. I think that's the case. I'm really not impressed by Zeller. He's not very good defensively; on offense, he seems to get away with a lot of offensive fouls. Don't misunderstand me: he'd start on any team in the country. But he's a little overrated, at least to my eye. (I watched more Big Ten games this year than I have in decades, since my son is at MSU and my daughter is, for no good reason, an Ohio State fan.)

I think the problem here is that "great" is a term thrown around far too easily. I would argue that there isn't a great player in college basketball year in and year out, certainly not this year. I just think Zeller is looked down upon, because he started out the season with so much hype. The kid's a winner. Living in Indiana I've had the benefit of watching almost every IU game this year. The way teams plan for Zeller, is much of the same way teams plan for Mason. His defense leaves something to be desired, but I think that may stem from some coaching issues, or maybe they told him to stay out of foul trouble.

Newton_14
03-29-2013, 02:34 PM
Closing this thread. Please use the new Elite 8 thread to discuss the game and the East Region in general. Thanks